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Abused, Abuser, Addicted, Adopted
154 Plays1 year ago
In this episode of the Shame(less) Podcast, Ken Freire sits down with Joe Masek, founder of The Freedom Group, to discuss his journey from addiction and abuse to redemption. Joe shares his story of childhood trauma, struggles with pornography, and the deep shame that followed—along with the practical steps that led him to freedom in Christ.
This conversation is for men who feel trapped in addiction, isolated by shame, or unsure if true transformation is possible.
What You'll Learn in This Episode
- Joe’s testimony: from childhood abuse to finding freedom in Christ
- How shame isolates men and why breaking free starts with confession
- The difference between cravings and temptation in addiction recovery
- Practical tools to rewire the brain and overcome pornography
- The role of brotherhood and daily accountability in healing
- How suffering can shape you into the man God has called you to be
Key Quotes
"Porn isn't the problem. It's the solution we've used to cope with deeper wounds." – Joe Masek
"Shame isolates you, but God calls you into community for healing." – Ken Freire
"Freedom isn't just possible—it’s promised in Christ." – Joe Masek
Resources & Links
Connect with Joe Masek & The Freedom Group:
- Website: TheFreedomGroup.co
- Instagram: @FreedomCoach_Joe
- Facebook: The Freedom Group
- March 2025 Freedom Intensive in Estes Park, CO
Books & Programs Mentioned:
- Dangerous Men by Lowell Seashore
- Steps to Freedom Retreat
Take the Next Step
If you’re struggling with shame, addiction, or feeling stuck in your spiritual walk, you’re not alone. Find an accountability partner, and start the journey to freedom today.
Help Others Break Free:
- Leave a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify
- Share this episode with a friend
- Follow @KenFreire on all major social media platforms for more encouragement
Recommended
Transcript
Intro
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:29
Ken Freire
All right, everybody. Welcome back to another great episode. I am so excited about the podcast interviewer I have today, Joe Masik. Some things you've got to know before we jump into this conversation. Joe has had a deep past.
Joe Masik's Personal Journey
00:00:48
Ken Freire
We're going to go through a a lot of it about overcoming shame, rediscovering his God-given identity,
00:00:54
Ken Freire
And he is the founder of the Freedom Group. And Joe's story is are going to be extremely moving. He's going to talk about addiction, abuse, just a lot of the things that he went through and how God has redeemed him. So I'm super excited for all of you to know him. So Joe, welcome to the podcast, man.
The DJ Career and Creative Expression
00:01:12
Ken Freire
you have an amazing testimony of how God redeemed your life, man. we're going to go into that. But before we go too deep and too heavy, man, just tell people something fun about you that they should know if were just starting to get to know you.
00:01:27
Joe Masek
Yeah, something fun about me. I've been a DJ since I was a seventh grader. I was homeschooled up until high school. Most people, when they meet me, that's the first thing they think is weird, awkward homeschool kid. so so I was homeschooled up until high school, so we used to drive to this co-op with me and a buddy had two dreams. One was to be DJs and the other other other other was to start a garage band. I would say that in my life, the DJ pursuit has worked out a lot better than the garage band. We didn't get much farther than our garage with the garage band we started, but we started both. The DJ stuff LLC I ever started. I started it and when I was in eighth grade because we started making money.
00:02:11
Joe Masek
DJing weddings for some of our relatives and then some of their friends started requesting us because we were cheap And then I started building that business all the way to the point.
00:02:19
Ken Freire
I love it.
00:02:22
Joe Masek
I think I peaked Probably around my junior year was an actually amazing part of really Rediscovering how much God loves me as his son and sees my heart which is too long for the question that you're asking That side of the story, but I had the opportunity to DJ for Red Bull crash dice So like middle of January 20 degrees outside 7th Street
Early Struggles with Abuse and Shame
00:02:42
Joe Masek
down in St.
00:02:43
Joe Masek
Paul, 15,000 people in a tricked out fire truck that Red Bull had built.
00:02:47
Ken Freire
That's awesome.
00:02:48
Joe Masek
And it was the inspiration later in my life. I built my own mobile DJ booth that I still own and operate just for fun now. So that's, yeah, I guess that's the most fun side of me.
00:02:59
Joe Masek
And I always get the itch like once a quarter, like I got to go, I got to go play some music somewhere. So, and God's given me opportunities to keep doing it.
00:03:07
Ken Freire
That's awesome. So how did, you know, typically you don't think homeschooler and DJ. So like, how did that happen? That you like just got hooked into DJ?
00:03:16
Joe Masek
Honestly, because of how lame the stuff I would go to was, if I'm being completely honest, like my distinct memories or thoughts about getting into it was like, this can't be this lame.
00:03:28
Joe Masek
Like we can't have this little fun as Christians when the people out there are look like they're having so much fun, we gotta be able to raise the bar. So that's honestly like as a seventh, eighth grader, I was just like energetic, boisterous, like trying to find my own way in life, like love being outgoing and creating experiences for people and frankly being the center of attention. I didn't mind that so much. And so as I i saw, we had this,
00:03:51
Joe Masek
I don't want to defame him, but his name was DJ Bill. and was just not really good at doing anything much than what you would imagine from a classic homeschool dance. like you picture it, that that's what it was.
00:04:02
Joe Masek
It was like corny line dances, punching the the air to an NSYNC song. My experience was like, we got to be able to do better than this.
00:04:11
Ken Freire
Oh.
00:04:12
Joe Masek
ah I love hip hop, rap, EDM, like energetic music.
00:04:17
Joe Masek
And really, when I walked away from the Lord, which we'll get into a little bit like that music and the darker side of that music really had a place in my life. And so as I rediscovered my faith, I wanted to find redeeming music, talking to producers and other people that were making this stuff.
00:04:35
Joe Masek
And then my favorite kind of music is taking stuff that's out there, that has been remixed into not just a clean version in the sense that they don't curse, so there's no references in it, but really like amazing music that has a twist that people hear something they're familiar with.
00:04:50
Joe Masek
One of my favorite remixes, Christian remixes, is another in the fire.
00:04:54
Joe Masek
And I think it's Billy Dean, I think his name is, but he has this amazing EDM remix to that song. That's just like that song has so much meaning for my wife and I especially the season that we're walking through right now and I I turn that on and I just get like it's inspirational and I get amped up all at once.
00:04:55
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:05:12
Joe Masek
So anyway, that's that's sort of the short story The the the funny reason why i I think I got into it because we we got to be able to do it It's can't be that lame Christians can't be that lame.
00:05:20
Ken Freire
yeah
00:05:27
Ken Freire
So my brother, he was a DJ for a while and he's about eight years older than me.
00:05:30
Joe Masek
Cool.
00:05:32
Ken Freire
So when you said his name was the DJ for your dances was DJ Bill, I'm like, yeah, that's not going to work.
00:05:43
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:05:45
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:05:46
Joe Masek
Yeah. That's a heck of a moniker. Yeah. Yeah.
00:05:46
Ken Freire
We have to find something.
00:05:49
Ken Freire
awesome Okay, Joe, I think you and I could talk about music all day long. You're gonna have to send me the the song because I'm now so curious to listen to the Billy Dean one.
00:05:57
Joe Masek
Absolutely.
00:05:58
Ken Freire
There's a couple other guys that I know that on Instagram that I follow that do remixes and they do a really great job. I'm sure you probably follow them because that's your world.
00:06:07
Joe Masek
Yeah, yeah.
00:06:07
Ken Freire
But when I find them, I'll send them to you. OK, that, let's let's get into today's topic because we could talk about DJing and music probably for hours. That's a fun passion of mine.
00:06:18
Joe Masek
Yeah, I love it. Yep.
00:06:18
Ken Freire
But what we're going to talk about is your story.
00:06:22
Ken Freire
Right. And when you and I first met, we shared stories and it was very similar to, in a lot of ways.
Breaking the Cycle Through Faith and Community
00:06:28
Ken Freire
walk us through your journey at the beginning, your childhood, what happened and and what did God start to, or not God, but the enemy really started to affect your life.
00:06:40
Joe Masek
Yeah, so i grew up in a pretty typical Midwestern family, just north of the Twin Cities here, grew up in a faithful church community. But so much of my experience when I was young was colored by the fact that I was introduced to sexuality very, very early in my life, seven, eight years old.
00:06:59
Joe Masek
There was another person relatively close in age to me, but older than me. So somebody I saw as you ah ah big brother, if you will, that started doing what a psychologist would say is child sexual experimentation.
00:07:14
Joe Masek
But I experienced, frankly, as abuse, like being introduced to things I wasn't comfortable with, that made me feel dirty, that made me feel shameful. And I had no outlet to talk to anybody about that stuff or didn't feel like I did.
00:07:27
Joe Masek
My parents weren't super emotionally expressive.
00:07:27
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:07:29
Joe Masek
It's one of the three hallmarks that they talk a lot about in people who struggle with sexual addiction as emotionally distant parents. And that's a reality of the world that I grew up in and not feeling like I had that outlet or older people to go and confide in.
00:07:43
Joe Masek
And I found right around that same time my older brother and my uncle built a computer that we had outside of our room and threw lime wire on that computer.
00:07:54
Ken Freire
Oh yeah.
00:07:54
Joe Masek
I thought I was downloading MP3 files for some of that rap music I talked about earlier that my brother was introducing me to and one of them was pornography. And from that moment, got that same rush and that same thrill and that same experience of dirtiness, shame, hide, don't tell anyone that I had through some of these early sexual experiences with this older guy. And so through all of that, I mean, porn became my everything, right? It was the only thing that I needed to cope with in life. I hated it.
00:08:27
Joe Masek
but i loved it at the same time and in mean so early in my developmental life seven eight nine years old it became deeply rooted is the place that i went for emotionally escape.
00:08:38
Joe Masek
So i seek it out as frequently as i could i mean i wasn't good at hiding so you don't get caught and then you know what about you know what i thought i wasn't me i didn't do i didn't do that there was somebody else you don't forget to delete the files on the computer some was still pulled up or whatever and i always.
00:08:44
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:08:53
Joe Masek
I'd always be able to escape somehow and so it never really got like truly pinned on me all the way throughout my life. And so that really created a foundation for that colored all of my experience, colored a lot of the, think what early on I was experiencing is dislike or distaste for myself, feeling dirty, feeling that sense of worthlessness, feeling deep shame, like something was wrong with me, which is not uncommon for somebody who's been abused
The Turning Point in Faith
00:09:20
Joe Masek
or who has had that happen to them.
00:09:20
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:09:23
Joe Masek
And in addition to that, shortly after, I mean, it was a few years, probably five, six years after that time, I started to act out with others, particularly one sibling that was younger than me.
00:09:37
Joe Masek
that really became the thing I was most deeply shameful for. I mean, again, a a a psychologist would call this child sexual experimentation. there There was a level of innocence to it that I was below, to some degree, the age of reason or whatever, that I was just acting out what had been done to me. But I realized that I was perpetrating the same thing, especially later on in life.
00:10:02
Joe Masek
the same kind of, I don't want to say force, because it wasn't forceful, but the same kind of pressure to be able to engage that activity with somebody who was innocent.
00:10:14
Joe Masek
And so I buried that stuff deep within me.
00:10:14
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:10:16
Joe Masek
You know, it was one thing to have experienced pornography that I didn't feel like I had permission to talk to others to have had these experiences with other people, or particularly this other guy outside of me, and not be able to talk to anybody.
00:10:28
Joe Masek
But this was the stuff that I was deeply wrong for. even if it is, again, some level of innocence in the activity itself that adults would understand if I had gone to a therapist that they could have helped me work through the weight of all of that. But I didn't have any of that. And so I buried that stuff to the point where honestly, until young adulthood, I had forgotten most of it because of how deeply I buried some of those core memories.
00:10:53
Ken Freire
Yeah. Well, first, Joe, for those who are listening, that is some deep stuff. And thank you for sharing that, right?
00:10:59
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:11:00
Ken Freire
Because you where just communicated, and correct me if I'm wrong, you went from abuse.
00:11:00
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:11:05
Ken Freire
So someone sinned against you, and and they took your innocence.
00:11:07
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:11:09
Ken Freire
And then you got addicted to pornography, and then you started to abusing others.
00:11:10
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:11:14
Ken Freire
Right. and And again, you are still trying to figure out what's going on. And you are just doing what you learn from others. You're like, this must be... It's crazy. And and tell me if I'm right or wrong here.
00:11:24
Ken Freire
Like, you're like, in some ways, this is all you kind of knew. But deep down inside, your conscious was telling you this is wrong.
00:11:27
Joe Masek
Yeah. Yeah.
00:11:32
Ken Freire
Is that kind of how you were feeling?
00:11:34
Joe Masek
Yes, certainly with all of it. and be honest, it was just, I mean, I think at that age, most of my experience was confusion and disassociation.
00:11:42
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:11:43
Joe Masek
If I'm being totally honest, is I don't think I put a lot of it together.
00:11:46
Ken Freire
Hmm.
00:11:47
Joe Masek
I don't think I could have articulated
Embracing Vulnerability and Healing
00:11:49
Joe Masek
it. 10% of what I just articulated to you of what was going on, what was happening to me, because I didn't even really understand what I was doing or what was, it felt so out of control.
00:12:00
Joe Masek
It felt so not me. And on both sides both when it was being done to me when I was participating in something like pornography or when I was pressuring somebody else to do something or trying to elicit that experience from somebody else that It just was all like I was propelled into it and searching and trying to find that high or that same pleasure, that same fulfillment again. Really, i it did what I experienced for so many years after is it just colored all of my life as gray.
00:12:34
Joe Masek
and agitated and emotionally unwell unless i was getting that peak experience so i would answer your question by just simply saying that most of my experience is frankly just simply confusion and dissociation and i also want to add like i shared that in my heart is to share that for two reasons is because one ah ah You know a counselor in college when I started to finally get help told me that somewhere around 55 to 60 percent of young people in America today will experience childhood sexual experimentation so I know I'm not alone and People have so much shame I mean I've met I've met hundreds of people doing this work for even just a ah few years I mean it's been over ten years now, but
00:13:09
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:13:21
Joe Masek
Yeah, I want people to know that they're not alone in that because I think many people say, oh yeah, you I struggle with porn. like It's easier and easier to say.
00:13:30
Joe Masek
think that's good and healthy and that we're lowering the barrier on shame to be able to admit that now. I think there's a lot of guys that still have a lot of resistance around that, but going to those deep places
00:13:37
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:13:41
Joe Masek
Like I just wanted, I i also say it for for reason that I want to be understood, first and foremost, and it's part of a therapy process for myself to be able to put it out there and say, this is me, this is what I've walked through, this is who I am. And the redemption that God has worked in my life has been so fulfilling as a result of being able to experience that kind of hell as a young man early in my life.
00:14:05
Joe Masek
And for people to know that they're not alone in that in that experience of feeling not just like someone abused me which again i think the me to movement or other things have made it easier to buy i have been perpetrated against.
00:14:19
Ken Freire
out.
00:14:20
Joe Masek
but to acknowledge the shame, which again, nobody was telling me I should bury that stuff and forget those memories. I just did it, which to your point, I just buried that stuff in me because I had such deep shame that I had to completely disassociate from its existence.
00:14:36
Joe Masek
Versus just oh came up like all that memory flashed across my mind i feel bad about that let me go medicaid like that stuff and didn't even allow that stuff for a very long time to come up i just want people to know that you're not alone in that did see you i know what it feels like and especially if you've not done the work to get beyond that like.
00:14:55
Joe Masek
You can do it.
00:14:57
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:14:57
Joe Masek
I mean, certainly it started as a free gift from God in my life to be able to introduce me to the things that I needed to be able to help me work that stuff out.
00:15:06
Joe Masek
it's never too late. It's never too late to start that process.
00:15:10
Ken Freire
100% man, and I love how you were just talking about it because most people that I've talked to. they feel like they're completely alone and they're isolated. And that's what shame does, right?
00:15:20
Ken Freire
It isolates you to think you're the only one who has this struggle.
00:15:25
Ken Freire
And if you were to share this, one, they're gonna reject you. And two, you're gonna be like exiled.
00:15:29
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:15:31
Ken Freire
And then three, God is gonna hate you forever. But the reality is it's the complete opposite, right? When you share this, especially within a ah gospel, God-centered community, right?
00:15:36
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:15:41
Ken Freire
You're going to see the love of God and you're going to see people kind of come to you and be like, thank you for sharing it. And you're right, man. Like when I think about statistics, I remember people would say like one in every three
00:15:52
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:15:53
Ken Freire
women would be sexually abused, and one in every four guys would be sexually abused.
00:15:53
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:15:56
Ken Freire
And I was like, when you do the math, I'm like, that's like 50%.
00:15:59
Ken Freire
I'm like, that's like half of the room.
00:15:59
Joe Masek
Right.
00:16:00
Ken Freire
So I remember sharing my story, and I would go, I would get in a group of people, you know, it's 50 to 100 people, and I would say something like, one in every three and one in every four of you, ah ah statistically, and this was back in like 2010, right, has been abused.
00:16:01
Joe Masek
Right.
00:16:11
Joe Masek
Right. Right. Right. Right.
00:16:14
Ken Freire
So I know I'm talking to at least half of you right now, but none of you are going to say it.
00:16:17
Joe Masek
Right.
00:16:18
Ken Freire
None of you are going to raise your hand, so I'm not even going to bother asking you.
00:16:21
Joe Masek
Right. Right.
00:16:22
Ken Freire
I'm just going to go with that assumption.
00:16:22
Joe Masek
Yeah. Yeah.
00:16:24
Ken Freire
And time and time again, man, I would have people at the end when I'm done talking and sharing my testimony, they would just come up to me just in tears because they're like, you're the first person and especially a guy who vocalized their pain and their emotions.
00:16:38
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:16:39
Ken Freire
And then the hope, they saw the hope and my the joy. They're like, how are you so joyful? Because they're like, I do not have what you have. And they've been going to church for years.
00:16:45
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:16:47
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:16:47
Ken Freire
you know, they've been a believer for years and they're like,
Overcoming Addiction and Finding Freedom
00:16:49
Ken Freire
well, I need help.
00:16:50
Ken Freire
And it's beautiful to see that.
00:16:50
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:16:52
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:16:52
Ken Freire
So Joe, for you, man, how then?
00:16:55
Ken Freire
Well, first, let let's talk about the depth of the shame, right? Because you talked about you know, especially when you think about the disassociation that you had, all of a sudden you grow up.
00:16:58
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:17:06
Ken Freire
And at what point does it just kick in and you realize, oh, my gosh, look at all the things that have happened to me and look at all the things that I've done to others.
00:17:15
Joe Masek
Yeah. Again, like I said, Ken's for so long, I didn't, I didn't stop long enough to think about it.
00:17:22
Joe Masek
Most of my life was geared towards keep numbing or keep moving in order to not have it to face it.
00:17:22
Ken Freire
Hmm.
00:17:27
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:17:30
Joe Masek
And, you know, I, I developed what was diagnosed softly diagnosed at one point, uh, by a psychologist as trauma induced ADD. because I think I had spent so long.
00:17:42
Joe Masek
I mean, I think I had certain proclivities personality wise to that, but there was so much energy in my life geared towards escape, escape, escape, move, move, move that, that I just became wired like that.
00:17:46
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:17:58
Joe Masek
And so I went for a very long time not facing it, learning frankly, how to not face it, that that became,
00:18:05
Ken Freire
Yeah, you coped with it in different areas, in different ways.
00:18:08
Joe Masek
Yeah, yeah. Whether it be just being with people all the time. My parents used to joke that the front door was revolving. They stopped locking the front door because buddies of mine would be knocking on the door like all day, every day.
00:18:22
Joe Masek
You know, and stuff like just filling my life with stuff, with people, with buying stuff, with eating, and then with pornography. And that really colored my experience all the way through high school.
00:18:38
Joe Masek
And it how I was doing emotionally, the weight of my life ebbed and flowed. I mean, wasn't all dark. I wouldn't say I was deeply depressed throughout all high school or out all middle school.
00:18:44
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:18:48
Joe Masek
It was far more the roller coaster of high highs and low lows going in and out of those experiences and just keep moving, just keep numbing, being really how I went about my stuff.
00:19:01
Joe Masek
So I didn't really acknowledge it at any point. Until i got to college when i went to college i remember making a conscious choice if i had lived a very two faced life. At high school i never really be largely i think because of all of this stuff.
00:19:17
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:19:18
Joe Masek
And had been homeschooled up until then i had no idea how to fit into social peer groups. And so I went to high school and immediately, even though I went to a private Christian high school, that whole system became inaccessible to me. So I spent four years, I mean, oftentimes going to to entire days where I didn't say a word, even though my personality is pretty outgoing, pretty comfortable, pretty ah ah able to make relationships and have conversations with people. So that was excruciating. And I just felt such a shell of myself at high school.
00:19:50
Joe Masek
I could never I never learned how to break out of that and then I go to my youth group and then it was like once a week it was like let loose time and I was the class clown boisterous loud outgoing talking to everybody there making a fool of myself just trying to fill my bucket.
00:19:53
Ken Freire
Right.
00:20:07
Joe Masek
of all of the social engagement I wasn't getting, in my nine to five, if you will, in in in high school.
00:20:14
Joe Masek
And so those two experiences, so and I really chased godlessness in high school and was whoever anybody wanted me to be.
00:20:23
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:20:23
Joe Masek
And so I had, I had sexual relationships with girls and was acting out and trying to get into the party scene and trying to have fun and do whatever. And there really was no moral code over here with, with limits of being a good little Christian boy. And then over here, there was, was be a good person, do everything, be really faithful, be involved on the court team, be the guy. Right. And so when I got to college, it was like, I don't want any of that. I just want to be me.
00:20:54
Joe Masek
And so I threw myself into the party culture because I was a DJ. I knew how how to have energy and fun and and experience life through that. My brother was a senior in college at that point. He had a house, so I was the cool freshman kid who knew where to go to have a party. And so I just threw myself into that lifestyle. And by the grace of God, I only lasted about eight months before I hit my personal rock bottom. I gave my virginity away, you the one thing a good little Christian boy is supposed to hang onto.
00:21:21
Joe Masek
And I woke up the next day and it was one of three times in my life that I feel like I've heard audible voice to me and he said, is this the life that you want? And it wasn't a voice of condemnation or a a shame or like, what the hell is wrong with you?
00:21:28
Ken Freire
Hey.
00:21:31
Joe Masek
How could you do this to me? Look at everything I've given in in your life and you threw it all away. Like you're the prodigal son. Like, no, he didn't pile on me in that way. He says, is this what you want? Because you can have it.
00:21:41
Joe Masek
Like you can go have it. And I just knew in that moment, it's like, that's not what I want. I want you, but I don't know how to get you. So I went to the church down the street and I got on my knees and cried out to a God I barely knew for a life I didn't know I could have and went out the next weekend and and did did it all again. And then I went back there. I was like, no God, I'm actually serious. Like I really need help. And it was the first time in my life that next month, month and a half that I started to meet men who weren't walking in crippling shame.
00:22:10
Joe Masek
that were walked like they knew who they were, that seemed comfortable in their own skin, that were normal, average, likable, attractive dudes that I wanted to be like. But more than all of that, they loved Jesus and were following him with all of their life. And I was like, whatever you have, I want that. To answer your original question as I circled the water of both the questions that you wanted to to go down is my experience up until that point was disassociation because of the deep shame And then having to face the deep shame because this spiral life early in college was created was creating me was so unsustainable to continue to exist.
00:22:52
Joe Masek
That that i eventually fell flat on my face sometimes literally like like just fate just face with how broken and how numb i had become.
00:23:01
Ken Freire
Oh yeah.
00:23:04
Joe Masek
And really, if I'm being totally honest, that's when I started to actually begin to face the weight of shame, to face how much I disliked myself. You know, one of the memories I have from freshman year of college is I'd go play basketball, pick up basketball in the gym, and I'd play really poorly or poorly for what I considered poor play.
00:23:23
Joe Masek
And I'd go back to the room and I'd look myself in the mirror and I'd say, I effing hate you.
00:23:29
Ken Freire
Wow.
00:23:29
Joe Masek
I hate you. And I'd say that out loud to myself, because I'd be so angry with how I didn't perform in that moment that this thing would just come out of me. And it was almost like surprise, but like, where did that, like, I don't think I do.
00:23:42
Joe Masek
But it was like this vitriol towards myself that was starting to emerge at that point in my life when I started to get independence and I started to use it to spiral out of control.
00:23:43
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:23:53
Ken Freire
what's crazy is that it wasn't the basketball that you were upset of your performance, right? It was all the other stuff that's just trying to come out and just like, it's the shame and the guilt and all of it is just like, this is who I really hate.
00:23:58
Joe Masek
Right.
00:24:01
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:24:06
Ken Freire
Dude, I remember having those moments too of just like, Who the heck am I? I remember manipulating women, I remember like I hit my rock bottom, I was 16, I almost committed suicide and I was just like, I hate this life and I hate myself for this.
00:24:12
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:24:22
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:24:24
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:24:24
Ken Freire
And just wanting to be done.
00:24:27
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:24:27
Ken Freire
And, and I remember God just had a, had a break me and it sounds like you started to have that breaking moment.
00:24:32
Ken Freire
And it's funny cause I did, we didn't talk about this, but like similarly, I remember saying, Lord, I need you.
00:24:39
Ken Freire
And then a month later like a week later, I'm falling back into the things and I'm going back and forth.
00:24:40
Joe Masek
Yeah. Yeah.
00:24:43
Ken Freire
I'm like, God, I need you. I didn't know how.
00:24:44
Joe Masek
No, like I'm serious. Yeah. Yeah.
00:24:46
Ken Freire
Yeah. Like I'm serious.
00:24:46
Joe Masek
Yeah. No, i I had to be
00:24:47
Ken Freire
So, so yeah.
00:24:48
Joe Masek
yeah i had had nothing. I had nothing to offer. I had nothing to give. I was done performing. I had nothing at that point. That's what I said earlier by the grace of
00:24:59
Joe Masek
He started to bring guys into my life who had started to do the work. who could be like, hey, come over here.
00:25:03
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:25:04
Joe Masek
And they didn't know any of that stuff. Actually, a lot of the guys that started to minister were the guys who have very similar stories.
00:25:07
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:25:12
Joe Masek
And it was just by coincidence, or God's act in bringing them into my life that allowed me to ext start experiencing you're not alone.
00:25:20
Ken Freire
Yeah, 100%.
00:25:21
Joe Masek
We've been there before.
00:25:22
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:25:23
Joe Masek
We've done that too. We know what that feels like, which that felt like, like I told you on our call earlier, that like the 10,000 pound gorilla coming in off my back.
00:25:32
Ken Freire
Yeah. So then what was the stuff that they started walking you through that you started to find healing and you're like, oh my gosh, I can i see one, hope, and two, transformation.
00:25:37
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:25:43
Joe Masek
Yeah. So some of those earliest relationships introduced me to a book in a small group for process called Dangerous Men, written by Lowell Seashore, who's here, local in Minnesota, but is a ministry that's extended across the world. But often on college campuses,
00:26:01
Joe Masek
And it was a small group that the first chapter is about identity and the second week you share your story With what he calls lust and monies sharing your story with sexual sin It's the first time I'd ever looked anybody else in the face and said any about anything about that You know, I think I remember having one time in high school. I like asked two buddies of mine if if Looking up horn and jerking off was a sin I think I asked them that, and they were like, yeah, you should confess that.
00:26:27
Joe Masek
And then I'd never brought it up again. was the only time that I'd ever had a conversation in my life, even though this was like the predominant experience or lens that I looked at life through.
00:26:30
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:26:38
Joe Masek
Never had one conversation about it. And that time I shared 60% of my story because everybody else seemed like they were sharing 100% of theirs. So I shared what I could access at that point or what I was willing to get out. And I
Holistic Healing and Neuroscience
00:26:51
Joe Masek
walked out of that room feeling like the 10,000 pound gorilla was off my back. like was like, holy cow. That was amazing. And those dudes from that moment became brothers. They saw me, they accepted me, they were me in a lot of ways.
00:27:05
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:27:06
Joe Masek
and they didn't, they weren't repulsed. Not that I thought they were going to be, but I didn't know what, I had no context for what that would be like for me. And so really it was like a kind of exposure therapy to have to face that racing heartbeat. Holy cow, am I about to do this experience? And then to get through it and like body, brain, spirit, like, oh my gosh, like that's what I needed.
00:27:33
Joe Masek
And so from that moment, there there there are six other weeks where we walk through different stuff about sexuality and the way that God sees our sexuality versus the way that it's been taught to us by the world and then goes into spiritual warfare and how to actually take authority back of your life and how to fight as a man. And then you go on this steps to freedom retreat where you do basically a life inventory confession. And I went through 80% of my life then.
00:27:59
Joe Masek
and like felt way more free and for three months after that I was like completely off the sauce.
00:28:04
Ken Freire
Thank you.
00:28:05
Joe Masek
I was like I felt like a free man didn't think once about porn didn't even I maybe I'm over exaggerating now because it's been so long but I honestly don't think I had one temptation in that three months I just felt so free so locked in like new life this is amazing like this is what I've been after and then it came back into the picture.
00:28:27
Joe Masek
And from then forward for about another 13 years, it was this one to three week cycle of trying to get free, going back to it as this thing that are reflexively needed. And I struggled with that for a long time until a couple of years ago.
00:28:44
Ken Freire
Yeah. You know, it's fascinating that moment where you're like, I felt like I wasn't sinning for three months, right? Where you're just like, everything was great. And and love how God does this, right? Because sometimes we feel like our freedom is going to be this 100% moment, right?
00:29:01
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:29:01
Ken Freire
Where everything is going to be gone, but you're like, no, no, first it was 60%.
00:29:03
Joe Masek
Conversion moment, baby. Yeah.
00:29:05
Ken Freire
Yeah. But then you were like, like 60%, then 80%.
00:29:06
Joe Masek
Yeah. Yeah.
00:29:08
Ken Freire
Then after a couple of years later, now you're like, okay, I'm i'm fully there. Now I've given everything. I'm fully known. I think that's just the process of of salvation and sanctification, right?
00:29:19
Ken Freire
Of you slowly giving little by little and all of a sudden God's like, hey, I'm going to work with whatever you give me.
00:29:20
Joe Masek
Right.
00:29:26
Ken Freire
He's not condemning us. He's like, I'm proud of you. I know this is as much as you can go right now, but that's okay.
00:29:29
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:29:33
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:29:34
Ken Freire
And then once you feel that freedom, you're going to have the empowerment to keep sharing the other stuff.
00:29:34
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:29:39
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:29:40
Ken Freire
So you went through this whole process.
00:29:42
Ken Freire
Talk to me about like, you know, fast forward now to today, right? You've been off the sauce for several years now, right?
00:29:46
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:29:50
Ken Freire
You are helping men. What's kind of like your framework or what are the ways that you're helping men overcome just as the sin and the shame of lust and in pornography?
00:30:00
Joe Masek
Yeah. Yeah. It's what I discovered that finally set me free. And it's ah at at the core of it is the difference between craving and temptation and the way that it manifests in the brain. You can think about it like addiction versus like being tempted to look at a girl or something. Like I didn't realize that my brain had been hijacked and wired to need this stuff when I experienced Tension discomfort pain in my life because I had done that in my whole life and I think many men don't think they are I think they just feel like they're undisciplined or they're not trying hard enough or they're not praying hard enough or they haven't prayed the right prayer and that's how I felt for a very long time until I realized that this fight-or-flight center of my brain was the thing that was being activated and when your fight-or-flight center of your brain it's being activated you react not act and
00:30:38
Ken Freire
Get up.
00:30:50
Joe Masek
So I was no longer making a conscious decision or choice to use or to not use. I was reacting to whatever would keep me safe. And what felt like would keep me safe is using this thing to alleviate the tension that I was carrying. And I had never learned and allowed my brain and body to learn how to work that stuff out.
00:31:08
Joe Masek
So I learned about the neuroscience of craving and I got super excited about it and I deployed a new process in my life that was relatively simple that required activating my appraisal cortex or my thinking brain through reframing, learning to practice being present, to slow down. I use a lot of breath work techniques to be able to slow myself down and calm down when I'd start to get activated, which was such a comment multiple times a day, many times a day when I first started that, that I didn't even realize.
00:31:38
Joe Masek
And then I started to work with another guy calling him every single day, like not being accountable of like, have you fallen today? But what are you carrying today? Because we know that porn isn't the problem. Porn is the solution to the problem.
00:31:53
Joe Masek
It's the thing that I need to solve my problems, my stuff for me when I go to it. And it's not even primarily for most of us a matter of sexual arousal. The fact is is that sexual arousal has overtaken that more deep true experience.
00:32:09
Joe Masek
and just allowed us to have a cheap alternative to go to, to alleviate it without having to do the deep interior work of how am I actually doing? What am I carrying? Where am I carrying it? What does that feel like? And then learning how to be able to work that stuff out of you. And so really how I experienced it was a holistic approach, body, mind, and spirit, taking all of who God created me to be into consideration.
00:32:32
Joe Masek
And within three months, that one to three week cycle that I had been trying to work myself out of for over 13 years, I went from that one to three week cycle. I fell once, used porn once within that three month period. And then from that time forward, that was a couple of November's ago, I think two, two, two November's, or three November's, I'm losing track now, think two November's ago. I haven't experienced a single craving to pornography since then.
00:33:00
Ken Freire
Yeah, God.
00:33:00
Joe Masek
It was the most amazing edification for me of rewiring is actually possible. What we've all heard about neuroplasticity and your brain's ability to rewire, your brain can become unaddicted. It takes work. It takes conscious effort. It it takes intentionality, but I don't have to manage an addiction for the rest of my life. you had told me that a month before I started to do the work, I would have told you we were full of crap because yeah would have just been like, you don't know me.
00:33:27
Joe Masek
I don't know what I've walked through. You don't know my whole story. But the reality is it's so true, and that's what we do in the Freedom Group now. That's what heart burns for, is to be able to introduce those guys to other men to that same experience of knowing what craving is, being able to visualize it when it happens, and then to deploy the couple tools that I just shared and many others. So when they're living real life, they can uncouple sexual arousal.
00:33:51
Joe Masek
from the stuff that they're carrying, confront the stuff and learn to welcome it rather than to fight or flee from it, and then see pain as the path and discomfort as your teacher. And as I've shared with you, that was two years ago. My son now has cancer. For the past couple of months, we've been dealing with getting him the treatment that he needs. It's the toughest thing I've ever faced. I tell people all the time, if this had happened to me two years ago, I would have been flattened.
00:34:14
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:34:14
Joe Masek
I would have needed porn multiple times a day again because of how much pain this has been but because god by the grace of god my life has been reordered to actually not just see like like because i think positively see pain is the path of discomfort my teacher but to actually experience it.
00:34:31
Joe Masek
pain, good for me, suffering, an invitation, trial, tribulation, as as an invitation to be fashioned into the man God wants me to be, rather than an aversion of something to be able to just figure out how to get more comfortable in life.
00:34:47
Joe Masek
through food, porn, alcohol, anger, being the four things that we most times experience when we get this limbic activation that we go to for the alleviation we're after, that I don't have to go to those things anymore. And that's completely changed my life. And so that's what the work that we do in the Freedom Group is trying to replicate that. we We lead small group cohorts of guys that are doing that work that are serious about
Empowering Others Through the Freedom Group
00:35:09
Joe Masek
it. and We're serious about it, serious enough.
00:35:12
Joe Masek
That i think we're the only people the marketplace right now that put a guarantee behind what we do we say if we're gonna get you free from the creating the porn in the year or less or work with you completely free until you are because we believe that the sign supports that god tells us that we're supposed to be free.
00:35:28
Joe Masek
for freedom's sake, and that science supports that that is a between three and 12 month process that your brain needs to actually rewire.
00:35:35
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:35:37
Joe Masek
And again, I think so many of us have heard, hey, you can rewire your brain. And my mission and my heart is to show guys actually how to do it.
00:35:45
Ken Freire
Yeah, 100%. Because the reality is most people don't see it, right? And and then for some people who are listening to this, they're like, can you really rewire your brain? Well, Romans 12 talks about this, like it says, therefore, offer yourself as is living sacrifice with the renewing of your mind, right?
00:36:00
Ken Freire
Like that renewing of your mind, I love when, when the science, you know, matches with the Bible, like it finally caught up.
00:36:01
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:36:04
Joe Masek
Yeah. Just backing up what we know for a long time. Yeah.
00:36:08
Ken Freire
Yeah, we've known for a long time, and it's just like, oh, we can do this. And I love how you were just talking about that. Like, we can. It's possible. Let's make the effort. And for those who are listening, and I know, Joe, I know you well enough that you're not saying, hey, we're going to do this on our own. Like, it's our own effort. It's God working through us. It's the grace of God empowering us. And one of the things that I always used to do is, when I did my breath work and just slow my life down, I would just say, Lord, how are you redeeming this moment?
00:36:36
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:36:36
Ken Freire
Like, in this season of life right now, what are you trying to do? What's going on? Why am I acting like
00:36:41
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:36:43
Ken Freire
ah Because sometimes I can't see my blind spots. But I love how Psalm 36, 4 says, in the light you shall see light. Like, when you are in presence, he's just going to reveal things.
00:36:51
Ken Freire
And I would just be like, God, reveal to me, why am I craving this thing so much? And even today, right? Fast forward, I've been free for 15 plus years now. But whenever there's like that lustful desires or like sinful flesh kind of starts to kick in, I ask myself like, God, what's going on?
00:37:02
Joe Masek
Let's go.
00:37:09
Ken Freire
And I'm like, oh, I really just feel lonely or I'm really stressed.
00:37:14
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:37:14
Ken Freire
So my fantasy life or these things that I want to attach to,
00:37:15
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:37:18
Ken Freire
I could just say, God, I don't need that.
00:37:19
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:37:20
Ken Freire
I need you. And I come to you and separate and I'm like, oh, thank you, God.
00:37:21
Joe Masek
Yeah.
00:37:24
Ken Freire
You know, and move forward. But Joe, you know, as we wrap up here, what's one quick in like 30 seconds, if there is an encouragement you could give to men who are like, I hear you, Joe.
00:37:37
Ken Freire
I know I need help. I want to. But I just don't know where to start. What's a good first step that they could do in a few seconds?
00:37:45
Joe Masek
My number one advice, because it's over and over again, the guys that we're coaching say is the most practical and transformative habit that they've deployed in their life by by by running our process, is to start working with another guy every single day. You call each other every single day, five, 10 minutes a day, and all you're trying to answer is where am I experiencing discomfort today?
00:38:09
Joe Masek
You're not talking about sexuality. You're not talking about, have I fallen? Have I not fallen? You're not trying to give each other a therapy session. You're simply trying to answer the question, where have I been uncomfortable today?
00:38:20
Ken Freire
Hmm.
00:38:20
Joe Masek
And that exercise of self-awareness
Practical Steps for Healing and Conclusion
00:38:23
Joe Masek
will expose the stuff in you faster than you can imagine and create connection with yourself that you didn't know was possible.
00:38:32
Joe Masek
and is going to, like you said, I think breath is one of the best ways to develop a deep prayer life. like isn't detached from God. This is tapping into the way that God wired us, the way that He made us.
00:38:44
Joe Masek
to use the tools that he's given us, our body, our brain, our spirit, to be able to bring ourselves back to him, to experience restoration in him because he first loved us. And so that's where I would start. And that's where I tell any guy who's saying either you the coaching process is isn't right for me or just like what you just said, what's the one thing you would tell me to do?
00:39:05
Joe Masek
Three months at least persist every single day five to ten minutes a day. Talk to somebody a lot of times guys in our process do voice memos back and forth you don't even need an immediate sound or i just need to get my stuff.
00:39:14
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:39:18
Joe Masek
out verbally in front of me and then notice where I'm carrying it. It feels like tension in my chest, like a bowling ball in my stomach, like weight on my shoulders. It feels like I had this massive hard neck a couple of days ago that was like a nine out of 10 painful. And I did five minutes of breathing and then recall just process real briefly what it was like to hold that and it was one.
00:39:44
Joe Masek
three years ago would have been all I needed to be able to need to release sexually. But it took me three minutes, four minutes to be able to do the work, to be able to get it out of me in a way that was actually deeply healing, restorative for me and took me back to level headed ground zero, not fight or flight, just deep rest and digest state of being.
00:40:05
Joe Masek
So do it, because it might just change your life.
00:40:07
Ken Freire
I love it, man. I love I'm assuming when you tell them, hey, do the audio note or whatever, it's in the moment where you're probably... Are you they doing it when they're most stressed out or it could be any time of the day?
00:40:19
Joe Masek
Doesn't matter, any time of day. I would do it at 4 p.m. most days. I would either do it at the beginning of my day, like talking about yesterday, or I'd do it at 4 p.m. on my drive home from work. and it was just trying to process or articulate real briefly like, what did I experience today?
00:40:30
Ken Freire
Nice.
00:40:34
Joe Masek
And that's where I started. Maybe most guys that are listening to like, I already know what I go through on a daily basis. I feel it very well. I don't think that's true because i I don't think that's true of the vast majority of men. But me articulating it was the first time oftentimes I noticed that it existed.
00:40:49
Joe Masek
I noticed that it was there.
00:40:49
Ken Freire
Yeah.
00:40:51
Joe Masek
So it was bringing into my awareness the the what i actually was. And that's what i meant by earlier saying it'll draw such deep self awareness in you for me that's what it did i see so many other guys in our coaching program benefit from that because they start to see themselves. Clearly in a way that they never knew existed even though i never like oh my gosh i actually i felt this way for.
00:41:14
Joe Masek
Ten years i've always felt this way but i never i never even noticed it which is a crazy dichotomy that you could always be experienced it's something to never be aware of it. But this process is the tool necessary to be able to actually grow in practical self awareness.
00:41:31
Ken Freire
Sweet, man. I love it. Joe, for those who are like, I want to know more about what you do. I want to follow you a little bit more and just gain more trust and even work with you.
00:41:40
Ken Freire
What's the best way to get a hold of you?
00:41:43
Joe Masek
Yeah, you can go to our social media, The Freedom Group, pretty much anywhere, or Freedom Coach underscore Joe on most platforms. I guess Instagram and Facebook are the ones I use most frequently, and then thefreedomgroup.co.co.
00:41:58
Joe Masek
is our website. You can find our intensive that's coming up in March that we're doing to capture all of this stuff in a real succinct, deep way. Over the course of five days in Estes Park, Colorado, we got a couple of adventure wilderness excursions. Next year, we're only going to be taking four or five guys.
00:42:14
Joe Masek
out on with another coach that works with our team. And then there's a link on the website to schedule a discovery call with me. Free 30-minute discovery session. I'd love to get to know you and your story. It sends you straight to my calendar you can pick a time that works for you to chat. I'd love to chat with you.
00:42:32
Ken Freire
I love it. Joe, thank you so much for sharing your story and using your story to bring redemption for others and and that God would be glorified, man. I love it. So thank you, thank you, thank you again. For those of you who are like, oh, I didn't get all those website links, don't worry, it's gonna be in the show notes. So go check out Joe again. Thank you, Joe, so much. And for those of you who keep listening, I say this every single time, but remember, you're not alone.
00:42:58
Ken Freire
And as men, okay, the purpose of this podcast is to help you kill shame, stand strong, and be on mission. Until next time, hope you guys have a great day and God bless.