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Single White Female
98 Plays9 months ago
This week on the Erotic Thriller Club Kit and Garrett have a hard time figuring out who is actually the villain in the 90's classic Single White Female. Bowl cuts, Stephen Tobolowsky, freeze frame penis, THE INCINERATOR ROOM??
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Transcript
Introduction to The Erotic Thriller Club
00:00:00
Speaker
Ladies, gentlemen, folks beyond the binary, grab your husband, wife, partner, mistress, punch character actor Steven Tobolowsky in The Dick and gather around your radio. It's time for this week's meeting of The Erotic Thriller Club.
Plot Overview of 'Single White Female'
00:01:09
Speaker
It's 1992 and you're a small-town girl moving to the big city. You respond to a newspaper listing from a single white female looking for a roommate. She's just gotten out of a bad relationship and assures you she has no plans of getting back together with her ex. You move in and start a beautiful friendship. She lies! Gets back together with her boyfriend and is gonna kick you out of your sick new Upper West Side apartment. There's only one thing to do.
00:01:39
Speaker
ruin that bitch's life. This week on the Erotic Thriller Club, single white female.
Core Questions Explored
00:01:46
Speaker
Hey everybody, welcome to this week's episode of the Erotic Thriller Club, Garrett Callender and Kit Ryan here.
00:01:52
Speaker
And this is where we answer the genre's three most important questions. Was I aroused? Was I thrilled? And would I ruin my life for this person? Garrett, I'm so glad that you saw this movie, apparently, from the same perspective I did, which is there needs to be justice. Justice for the beheadi. Headi? Is that the name? But it's not really her name, because actually that was a fake name.
00:02:21
Speaker
Well, it was her name until this roommate renamed her. She gave her a different name. It's like, you're heady now. Oh, yeah. Yeah. She gave her the nickname. Kit, I didn't know if we were going to be on the same page on this one. It turns out we are on the same page. I'm so glad. As discussed last week, you don't have a very strong sense of vengeance. And I do.
00:02:48
Speaker
ah hu And in this movie, Bridget Fonda, who is the lead, yes, caught, guilty, I made the main character the bad guy. I put that in quotes for the opening. Quotation marks please, bad guy. But movie stars Bridget Fonda, Jennifer Jason Lee. Bridget Fonda, she ain't no saint.
00:03:14
Speaker
she ain't No, honestly, they had to literally have the antagonist kick a puppy because otherwise you were going to be on her side completely, right? like Did you not feel the same way? I did, but I think the problem And I wanna say, there's very I have very few problems with this movie in general. I had a goddamn blast with single and female. I really, really had fun with this movie because as the movie starts, it seems like it's gonna be a movie about a beautiful friendship. And if you cut, yeah, you cut the last 40 minutes, it's ah it's almost a lesbian romance.
00:03:57
Speaker
I was- I could- Honestly, I think it should have been. Listen, am I supposed to be rooting for Bridget Fonda's relationship with scumbag Sam? The guy who cheated on her after proposing marriage? Like, no. I'm not on her side for that
Pacing and Engagement of the Film
00:04:16
Speaker
relationship. I don't want that to succeed.
00:04:20
Speaker
This movie does such a good job of right at the top, like just kind of getting me full invested. Like this movie doesn't really waste a lot of time like some of the others. There's not a lot of downtime. Like each of the beats just work so well in the escalation, the setup.
00:04:38
Speaker
Cuz yeah, like you said her boyfriend is Sam who is Steven Weber from wings and you know at this point? Wings is a hit sitcom. It's been on the air for two years at this point Like he is the the the lovable guys the comedic relief on win well, he ain't lovable here Here he is an absolute trash fire that she should have left behind There is no reason she should have gotten back together with him honestly It's amazing how quickly like this movie starts with Bridget Fonda and Stephen Weber in bed. And it's very sweet. They're talking about like, if we got married someday, where we would it be? How many kids will we have? It's a real white picket fence and you're like, oh, this seems like a sweet couple.
00:05:26
Speaker
And then immediately they get a phone call to the apartment from his ex-wife in the middle of the night. They declined the phone call. They're like, we're not talking about this. She calls back. They ignore it. Goes to voicemail. She's like, you can't just fuck me and and not talk to me through the voicemail. And as we hear this, we're looking at Bridget Fonda's butt.
Realism in Portrayal of Nudity
00:05:50
Speaker
So we're getting nudity pretty close to the top.
00:05:53
Speaker
I honestly appreciated that this movie was kind of realistic in the way it shows people post-coitus, like they didn't do the whole, you you know, the woman is has has the sheet that goes above her breasts and the man for some reason that sheet only goes up to the waist and like, or somehow they get out of bed and they have way too many clothes on. No, like she just gets out of bed and wanders around her house naked, which felt extremely realistic in real life to me.
00:06:19
Speaker
But yes, it does mean that she's wandering through her house naked when she overhears ex-wife say, you know, how dare you come over and sleep with me and then not call me. This movie is very casual with nudity. It's not always sexual nudity, but it is clearly two actresses, and eventually a Stephen Weber, who both seem comfortable enough with it to just kind of be, which we knew that from Jennifer Jason Lee. like we've She was in Fast Times original high for Christ's sake.
00:06:48
Speaker
So yeah, she overhears the voicemail and as she goes back in and her and Steven Weber are having this fight, what a piece of shit. Like it is so funny. He's like, well, she's depressed and I went over to her house.
00:07:08
Speaker
I wrote that like in my notes, I put down the quote. She was depressed. What? And you thought that there's um antidepressants in your dick. Like, was that the only way to help her out was to to to fuck her? Like, oh, my God. Can you? It was an accident. Oh, you accidentally slept with your ex wife. You know, like we all do from time to time. Can you imagine?
00:07:37
Speaker
if we all got hall passes for sleeping with our sad friends and exes? Listen, they're depressed. How else am I supposed to cheer someone up? What do you think I'm supposed to do? Send them an edible arrangement? No, it's my dick or nothing. That's the only way to cheer depression. Honestly, I don't know why Big Pharma has been ah sitting on this information the whole time.
00:08:01
Speaker
I mean, they know coming makes you smile. And so does Bridge at Fonda, but at this point, we're still on her side in the movie. So you like she's like, all right, no, coming makes you smile. But I am leaving you because this sucks. Get out. This is my house. Get out. This is my rent control apartment. You're on the street. But then she goes upstairs to to see her gay best friend, Graham. And Peter Friedman from Succession.
00:08:27
Speaker
I did not. Who is a fucking babe in 1992? Yeah, he's really cute. He's extremely cute. And I loved him. Harry Bradshaw would have gone on multiple dates with 1992 Peter Friedman. That guy, I thought he like before you even know, he would not have, you know, he's gay immediately. There was never a doubt.
00:08:53
Speaker
She basically introduces him as my gay best friend. Like three scenes later. ah When she just goes up to this guy's house, I'm like, oh yeah, I'm going up and fucking beat her Friedman too. No, I thought it was pretty clear. He mentioned being an actor and I was like, actor, yeah New York, 90s, gay best friend.
00:09:17
Speaker
ah But she's so, few she's so futuristic. She's such a modern woman. she does some kind of software thing. I love her job, this vague software job. I'll tell you exactly what this software does in 1992. She has to meet up with Steven Tobolowsky, amazing character actor who's usually kind of lovable other than maybe in Groundhog Day kind of annoying. ah Yeah, I wrote him down in my notes as Ned because all I could think of him was was for him in in Groundhog Day, which is excellent.
00:09:54
Speaker
Yeah, it's Steven Tobolowsky and he's in everything. I mean, he's even been in, he's actually been in a movie we did an episode for, but never released. So just so you guys know, there is an unreleased basic instinct out there. We'll redo it and talk Tobolowsky again. But she presents him with this software that basically there's a virtual mannequin and it puts digital clothes on it. That's it. As far as I could see, and then maybe some accounting. and Yeah, there was definitely some accounting software in there as well. I don't know if you were able to like buy the clothes online. It didn't look like that was a thing. It was just like you could put different little paper doll clothes on your and hunt your website, I guess. I understood her software. I didn't understand why he was buying it.
00:10:47
Speaker
That's fair. I mean, I did in about 1992 have a a paper doll software thing where you can download the little person and and put a little clothes on them. And it was great fun when I was, you know, a small child. um There was almost certainly a sick pervert version of that, too. Oh, there was. And I saw it.
00:11:10
Speaker
You're like, I had it. I had it. It was an accident. i I tastefully always just put underwear back on them because I was a good child. Wait, where did you have that? Where did you find it? Did your dad have it? No, um it was called Play F Kiss. And it was like, I don't even remember where I learned about it, but they had like so many different ones that you could download that were from like different cartoons and anime and things like that. And so like you download your little sailor moon. and you'd put on her different little outfits and every now and then you would get one where she's got full on like visible bush and nipples and um you can put a little i just put the clothes back on her wait so and yes i was like 11 at the time this is mary fucker kill but play f kiss
00:12:00
Speaker
No, I mean, that's just what the software was called. I have no idea. It was just like ple- shit, you know, I never realized that like that is part of the title. Oh, man. No, I mean, like it was it was a perfectly normal paper doll software. 80 percent of the time and 20 percent of the time you would see weird shit. And I was able to just compartmentalize and be like, oh, I'm probably not supposed to be looking at that. and But anyway, she's got paper doll software, not with visible nipples and bush. Sorry. And I guess he...
00:12:40
Speaker
It doesn't specify what his company does. I assume it's a fashion place. It doesn't really matter. All we need to know, Tobolowsky is an asshole in this movie. He treats her poorly. He's underpaying her. But he promises her that if I underpay you and you do such a good job, I'm going to get you so many clients. What's the magic word? Exposure. I'm doing this one for exposure.
00:13:10
Speaker
Oh, that's the excuse for why you're deeply underpaying me. And they implied that like she had had some sort of ah business breakup with another ah business partner and that that's why she was out on her own and needed clients very desperately. Which at the time you assume she's the good one, but at least she's the good one. I'm convinced that it's possible that she is such a shitty friend that she fucked over her business partner and that she got this rent-controlled apartment out of the deal as part of um fucking this person over.
00:13:51
Speaker
So she needs a roommate, right? she She needs someone else to live with. ah And she we get our little montage of possible roommate choices. And honestly, she fucking knocked it out of the park with the very first one and then didn't pick her. And I am bewildered.
00:14:13
Speaker
Because the the like Rosie O'Donnell looking biker gal? The tools lesbian is what I wrote her down in is because she was a lesbian with tools who was like, you know, we can fix this and this and this. And I was like, you live in a rent controlled apartment that clearly your landlord fixes nothing in because he's really hoping you'll leave. And so you get this woman in, she's going to fix up this place. It's going to be nice.
00:14:39
Speaker
Like, maybe you'll own an actual bed frame for once in your fucking life, you absolute maniac who does, just has mattresses on the floor. That was me for a long time, like my whole twenties. Garrett.
00:14:57
Speaker
What? Just because I don't have a fancy software. Steven Tobolowsky is gonna try an army over. She is a business woman. She is a professional. She should have a fucking bed frame. This is not her bachelor pad, okay? This is not the guy that I had sex with when I was 20 years old. and She should have a bed frame.
00:15:24
Speaker
Well, she didn't go with biker lady. She didn't go with very skinny, hot model. I didn't understand what was wrong with that one. Why didn't she? She was too pretty? Because that's all it was. is She was pretty and she made a lot of eye contact. And apparently that put her in the montage of bad choices. Well, I mean, it honestly might have been racism because this movie is based off a book called Seek, Single White Female Seek Same.
00:15:53
Speaker
Oh, shit, which would which would rule her out because I believe she was either black or Latina. I could. Yeah. But. Wow. I didn't think of that. I my assumption is that she is an insecure person and that girl was too pretty and she didn't want to share a house with her because it would make her feel insecure.
00:16:14
Speaker
Honestly, all we saw her do was not talk and make eyes, and maybe she didn't talk the whole time, and she's like, this is just fucking weird. That's a perfect roommate, Carrot. I don't know what you're talking about. Someone who's not gonna talk too much is ideal. Well, the next one's Jessica Lundy, who is in, like, The Stupids and Rocket Man, and movies from our childhood.
00:16:36
Speaker
Is that the one who is talking about how she's ah in therapy and ah has a lot of childhood trauma that she doesn't remember, but the therapist is going to help her remember that one of the weird ones. One of the first things she says is.
00:16:55
Speaker
I'm an incest survivor. I don't remember it, but I'm pretty sure it happened. But I didn't hear that on my first viewing. I noticed it on the second with subtitles that she said incest survivor because the way she's talking is very like, I don't know, like it's a little too chipper. It's a little too like Gilmore girls. I don't know, to me that says that she's working through it and she would actually be a perfectly fine roommate. Maybe she over shares, but like she seems to be handling her shit.
00:17:25
Speaker
Damn it. She just had too many things about the apartment and like things that we're going to need to be done. I don't know. Sometimes you need to give somebody a chance, but that's a lot of baggage up front. Yeah. And then there's the one that she almost chose, which is like lady in ankle length skirt, I guess. Like I, I didn't really get any vibe. I don't know why she wanted that one more than the tools lesbian. Cause this lady was norm core.
00:17:53
Speaker
Yeah, she was extremely norm core. And so that was the one she was going to pick but until she gets distracted by the weirdest photo of Stephen Weber. It looks like a photo.
00:18:10
Speaker
like you would have taken of your 10 year old son he's like hanging from the fence of like a little league park and looking sideways real cute i think it was supposed to be like a dramatic shot um but you're right it doesn't it doesn't read that way But honestly, that in the 90s, that was Steven Webber's vibe. Like he was the funny guy and stuff. So I'm not used to not liking him other than ah down the line, he was Jack Torrance in the Shining remake. That's Steven King directing. Oh, yeah. I forgot about, first of all, that that even existed, but also that that was the same guy. Interesting. um So yeah, instead in walks ah the new girl, Mousey Little Brunette.
00:18:58
Speaker
Jennifer Jason Lee. like Nothing about her looks weird. She looks great. She seems nice enough. She's helping her. She's comforting her. comforting her yeah that think She's helping.
00:19:11
Speaker
Yeah, Bridget Fonda is like despondent on the floor crying and ah this mysterious new girl who's come in to look at the apartment immediately starts taking care of her, like makes her some tea in a kitchen that isn't even hers and like is calming her down and trying to help her through it. It's very sweet. Great meet cute with the broken sink, water sprays all over them. They laugh. That was another moment where I was like, if you had picked the tools lesbian, this wouldn't have happened. Tools lesbian would have fixed that for you.
00:19:41
Speaker
So you described Jennifer Jason Lee, but something we should have pointed out immediately, because when this movie started, my eyes got so wide-kit. Bridget Fonda's haircut in this movie um is the same haircut Ben Stiller has in Tropic Thunder as Simple Jack.
00:20:00
Speaker
It absolutely is. It is the most unfortunate bowl cut that I like. You're right. I can't believe we didn't mention this earlier. But yes, our lead, who is supposed to be the extremely stylish and pretty and put together business woman who dresses nice. Bridget Fonda has just the worst hair that I've ever realized on.
00:20:24
Speaker
a favor kit, open up Google, type in simple Jack hit images and just remind yourself of what Ben Stiller looked like as simple Jack and dropping thunder. Oh my God. Yes. It's even the same color. It's even the same color. It's the same. Yeah. Yeah. It's the same. But here's the thing that haircut fucking grew on me as the movie went at the beginning. I thought kind of goofy.
00:20:50
Speaker
Oh yes, it did. It worked for her. It did work for her. You're wrong. She's hip, she's stylin', she's on the Upper West Side, it's 1992, you don't know shit. You were still a little kid watching- So were you. Oh, I'm but probably a little older.
00:21:11
Speaker
Not by enough that it suddenly makes you more hip to cool fashion in the 90s than me. Fair. Fuck you. So, yeah, just for Jason Lee's ah a kind of awkward girl um and Ali, which is a Bridget Bondus character, is showing her around the place, um shows off the laundry room, the incinerator room, whichever apartment has kit is there walking by the laundry room and in the background you see
00:21:50
Speaker
Incinerator Room, I screamed. I screamed, Kit. I screamed out loud, alone watching this movie. The Incinerator Room? In all ah the whole movie, I'm just like, let's get back to the Incinerator Room. Can't wait for a big finale in the Incinerator Room. Where's my Incinerator Room? Come on, come on.
00:22:18
Speaker
ah dad which did have us which did have a sign next to it that said, fuck where did, let me look at my notes, sorry. excited Okay, so next to incinerator room, it says, NYC ordinance prohibits use of incinerator. Why is she there?
00:22:38
Speaker
what what I'm sorry, why did you not take the incinerator out? Why did you not lock up the room so that people can't get in it? This unseen landlord, I have so many questions for, honestly.
00:22:56
Speaker
Incinerator room, guys. Never forget it. It's in the bids in the basement. in The incinerator room. Lurking in the back of your mind through the entire movie, just whispering, incinerate her. Incinerate her. Do it.
00:23:16
Speaker
um ah Then we get to our first ah thing where I'm immediately on, I am against our protagonist, Bridget Fonda, which is, Ally just snoops through her shit. She is in her roommate's room just looking through her stuff, tries on her perfume, and looks through her which one is supposed to be the creepy one.
00:23:49
Speaker
Well, and yeah, earlier, just know in dialogue, Jennifer Jason Lee has already said, you guys aren't going to get back together, right? Like this is if I move in here. you're not gonna get back together in like a month and I have to find a new place. She assured her that would not happen. Within two days, she's fucking snooping in a room, trying on earrings. It's weird. Nice, nice roommate is like, if you want these earrings, you can just keep them. Just keep the earrings. I'm so nice. She gave them to her as a gift because they painted a lamp together. Yeah, yep, yep. ah Don't, the meet cute, the like montage of them just getting along.
00:24:28
Speaker
She takes it shopping and she's like, I know I, Bridget Fonda, am the stylish professional lady and you dress like a hick from the stick. So I'm going to take you out shopping and teach you how to look good.
00:24:42
Speaker
She just kind of dressed like Elaine
Roommate Dynamics and Tension
00:24:44
Speaker
Bennis. Like there was stuff that she was dressed like Elaine. Like nothing about her seemed like she doesn't need to be a new person. The person she is is fine. I accept you for who you are, Hetty, even though I don't remember your real name. I believe it was Ellen? Well, Hedra.
00:25:05
Speaker
hey dad is the name she gave. But that is the fake name that she gave. um But her chosen name and we don't. Yeah, we're not going to. We're not going to use ah her her old name that she does not go by but dead name and sons of bitches over here. Yeah, we do not do that. ah So she goes by Hedra and then Hedy is what our girl Allison Ali calls her. So Hedy and Ali BFFs forever and ever and ever like it's sweet. You see Ali erase a message left by shitty boyfriend. And I thought
00:25:46
Speaker
good for you good for you like she doesn't need this shit that guy kept calling and calling and calling honestly it was bordering on harassment and like she's trying to protect her girl from this manipulative sob who keeps calling her no problem I have no problems with her Jennifer Jason Lee does do something that's pretty problematic as a roommate whose name is not on the lease. Like you can be thrown out at any point. Very bold move to show up to the house with a puppy. Yes. And she also paid like $400 for it and then hid that receipt and pretended she got the dog for free. So is that a bit of a red flag that she didn't adopt?
00:26:34
Speaker
Oh, good point. Maybe, but at the same time. Maybe that wasn't as big of a thing in 92. I don't think that was as big of a thing. And, you know, she brought home a puppy to cement their friendship so that they could become lesbians who have a dog together in their apartment in New York. And I think that's wonderful. Did she come on a little strong by maybe getting the dog too early in the relationship? Maybe. We've all heard of U-Haul lesbians.
00:27:05
Speaker
They move fast. They move fast. And so it's like going around in the bed. It's. Yeah. So Ali's like, you got your dog. And she's like, definitely. And then perfect manipulation moment leaves the dog to cry so that Ali has to be the one who goes and cuddles it and makes it feel better and brings it back to bed. And so now, of course, she loves the dog. She can't possibly get rid of it. The dog. The dog is theirs.
00:27:36
Speaker
And if anyone listening to this podcast as a child, for some reason, just know this, this same tactic actually works on any Midwest dad. It doesn't matter how much a Midwest dad says they don't, they don't want a dog. This works a hundred percent of the time. It's actually going to be my dog dog after this. Yeah. Yeah. My dad twice. Everybody it's worked on everybody's Midwest dad more than once. Absolutely. Uh, so.
00:28:05
Speaker
You know, even the dog I did not see is a huge red flag. The thing that I am most confused about. Yeah. Is how the fuck did Sam get back into the damn apartment?
00:28:20
Speaker
he so He says he barged in, but i I mean, at this point in the movie, Hetty is very timid and shy, and like as the movie goes, you kinda see Stella get her groove back. But as the movie starts, she doesn't have a lot of groove, and he's pretty smooth and handsome, and I don't think it would've been hard for him to talk his way.
00:28:45
Speaker
into that apartment. She definitely like he, he says barged. And I took that as him telling Bridget Fonda like, she let me in. But that was him like trying to take responsibility for like, she didn't do this. It was all me. But I think she was just too not assertive enough to keep him out in the hallway. You know who wouldn't have let Sam the scumbag in?
00:29:10
Speaker
Holy shit, Rosie O'Donnell tools lesbian would not have let him in. She would have drawn a line and said, No, sir, you leave this girl alone. You broke her heart. You get the hell out. Yeah.
00:29:25
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, this seems weird because Jennifer Jason Lee, Hetty goes out into the hallway to give them some privacy. And the one and only time we see the grandma from Happy Gilmore in this movie is she walks by her in the hallway dressed like she just came back from a funeral. I hope she has some scenes on the cutting room floor ah because she didn't get a damn line in this movie.
00:29:50
Speaker
But immediately, Jennifer Jason Lee from the window she's looking out of can see Caddy Corner into their apartment. Mm hmm. All it looked it literally took three minutes with this man for them to be back together. It took one conversation. He doesn't even he doesn't even have that much to say. He just says that he's like, sorry. I said he's like, I sent you a letter. Why and get the letter? Well, forget about the letter. I'm sorry. I love you.
00:30:19
Speaker
Oh, okay. i've We've all had a friend though, right? that Like just take somebody back too quickly. And now you were stuck with having to see this person more times and pretend like. Especially because you were the one who had to be there while your friend was heartbroken and tell her over and over again, he's such a piece of shit. You can do so much better. And you, you know, you spend all this time hyping her up to make her feel better.
00:30:45
Speaker
and ah you were reiterating what a scumbag he is and now after you've spent weeks calling this dude a piece of shit now she is back together with him and you're supposed to what just accept it you're supposed to just be okay with it after you saw how distraught she was you saw you were the one who had to you were the one who had to pick up the pieces as the best friend you had to deal with it you had to take care of her where was he off fucking somebody else probably And he just wanted a sad person. Yeah, you know, it is I forgot that that's actually community service. Yeah, that's you fuck a sad person. You actually go to heaven. I think if you believe in it, that's yeah. Yeah, I've absolutely been the friend in.
00:31:33
Speaker
Jennifer Jason Lee's place and it is if if my housing situation was also in the balance, I cannot imagine how fucking pissed and upset I would be about this because like you did all You did all of this to help her, right? And then she's just gonna kick your ass out and take back the scumbag who cheated on her after he what? Said, sorry, you bought her a puppy. Did he buy her a puppy? No, he did not.
00:32:08
Speaker
but he does take her back to his place and have sex with her. Or on thank god tell if they go back to dode they I couldn't if they go back to her place or the gay best friend's place. Cause she's watching his cat and stuff. So they may have just gone upstairs. But she's definitely in somewhere else having sex with him. And Hetty is left alone with the dog.
00:32:32
Speaker
eating a pint of ice cream, being pissed, kicks the dog. And this is the first like, twinge of like, oh no. Oh, I'm not supposed to like her. She kicked a puppy. But if you cut out the things she does to the dog, she is a perfectly correct, aggrieved party who has every right to be upset. Every right. She has done nothing wrong.
00:32:56
Speaker
The second we see Bridget Fonda and Steven Webber fuck, I out loud again said, kill them Hattie, kill them both.
00:33:12
Speaker
And she rightly points out later like you told me you weren't going to get back together with him and that my living situation was secure. You promised me that. And Virgil found out has the gall to be like, why are you so mad?
00:33:31
Speaker
Not only do are they back together, this three-minute apology led to a night of fucking and them being engaged. Yeah, she puts the ring back on. She puts the ring back on. And she's like, yeah, now we're engaged again. Like, she is unwell. She is unwell. And I guess that's probably why Steven Webber is having sex with her.
00:33:53
Speaker
So yeah, Hetty's sitting in Ally's room in the dark with the dog ah and is like, where the hell were you? And this is another time when ah we're supposed to be, I guess, on Ally's Bridget Fonda side, being like, what the fuck are you doing sitting in my room in the dark with the dog, like monitoring how long I've been gone? But hey.
00:34:15
Speaker
Um, girls look out for girls. If my roommate was gone for 24 hours with a man that I knew had been stalking and harassing her, I would also be worried. be worried and I would be pissed that she didn't even think to call to let me know she was alive. Like, that's completely legit.
00:34:37
Speaker
I am guilty of, I had a friend who was in college was ah missing and i we check we would check in and I couldn't get a hold of her. So I'm like calling all of our mutual friends, trying to be like, where is this person? Where is she? And I'm driving around. And it it turned out she had spent the evening with somebody I didn't know about. So really all that let I did was like,
00:35:03
Speaker
put on a community bulletin board like they are fucking. So what started as a good deed ended up is I don't know who I was in that situation. I guess I'm I'm kind of the healing on the baby face. I don't know.
00:35:20
Speaker
The point is that you were trying to make sure someone's not dead, and that does not make you a bad person, okay? Like, she's not a bad person for worrying that her roommate was gone for 24 hours with no fucking, like, call or notice, with, by the way, a man you do not trust.
00:35:38
Speaker
um I think like it would be a shame if we breeze over one of the couple actual sex scenes in this movie and not kind of give the people, because up to this point, we've seen Jennifer Jason Lee naked a couple times that we haven't even mentioned. She's very casually naked a lot. She changes in front of Ali very comfortably. Takes a bath.
00:36:00
Speaker
yeah But this is like, we see Bridget Fonda writing Steven Webber. It's a very short scene. So not a lot to write home about there as far as the eroticism. It looked like they're having fun though, but- Did the sex look good enough to get back together with him and accept his engagement? to take him back, not the other way around.
00:36:29
Speaker
I guess like I was more worried about him and his performance. like he I'm guessing his ex doesn't have a bowl cut. You're like, that's why cheated on her? Yeah, he can't tell her that bowl cut kind of sucks. Was he hoping that after like a month it had grown out? I don't know what you do with that to fix it.
00:36:56
Speaker
Uh, wear hats. You wear hats until it grows back. It's like not necessarily a mullet, but it is longer in the back. It is longer in the back. It, it likes the peaks out from the bull in the back. That's going to take points off on the eroticism.
00:37:16
Speaker
I'm going to go ahead and tell you that right now. I think that, I mean, she has the same haircut as my child.
00:37:32
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, you're not wrong. And I also hope he doesn't have that when he's 30. I mean, same, but also it would probably still look better on her than on him. Like she you're the one who said you got used to it and. You're the one who said it grew on you. Well, OK.
00:37:54
Speaker
but the most erotic scene in the movie does come up. Stephen Weber's sleeping over. They've been having sex. Bridget Fonda walks out of the room. She hears the noise. And Jennifer Jason Lee is having her way with herself. Yeah, she's masturbating. And again, I wrote down. With the door open. Which of you is the weird one? You're the one who went and secretly watched your roommate masturbate. She stood there for a while.
00:38:23
Speaker
Open door policy though, like the door's open. That's not how that works. No, no, Garrett. No, Garrett, that's not how consent works. If we are roommates and I am open door masturbating, you can stand there and look at me as long as you want um see because it's my job to close that door.
00:38:46
Speaker
No, no. I would say if the door is open, you can be forgiven for a short accidental. Oh, whoopsie. Look, you do not get to stand there as long as you want,
Voyeurism and Consent Issues
00:38:59
Speaker
Garrett. That is not how that works. Arabella.
00:39:03
Speaker
Black Angel taught me otherwise. Mama walked for like three minutes. Is there wheelchairs on? And it wasn't cool when mom did it either. It was very, very cool. It was worse when mom did it, but that's what I'm saying. Like a roommate's like, honestly, if I, if one of my roommates in college had been masturbating with the door open, I might've leaned in the doorway and just stood there and watched until they noticed I was there so that they'd be like, ah!
00:39:30
Speaker
makes you the bad person. They are guilty, no, no, they're guilty of a simple error, of a mistake. You are guilty. I'm a bad roommate. Of voyeurism. Ooh. Just like that man in body double. You went on a journey. Yeah, I didn't like it when he did it either. And you know what? You watch somebody masturbate, it leads to ghouls.
00:40:03
Speaker
You know who else loves to watch other people masturbate? Ghouls. Are you a ghoul? I always, I always assume that there is some sort of spirit watching me as I do it. Yes, it's God and he's disappointed.
00:40:19
Speaker
He knows what you're doing in there. Okay, so, and so Ally's the one who's acting weird in the morning because she saw Hetty masturbating. And again, like,
00:40:33
Speaker
Hetty's acting completely normal. She's chatting with Scumbag Sam. She's like making everybody breakfast. And Ally's the one being weird. Like she had caught Hetty doing something wrong somehow. Are we still calling him Scumbag Sam? I thought we established that he's doing community work. and Okay, sorry. This might even be considered philanthropy. He might get tax breaks for what he's doing at this rate.
00:40:59
Speaker
Yeah, actually, all of those condoms are, in fact, tax exempt. You can write.
00:41:12
Speaker
So, yeah, I guess we're calling him a philanthropist, Sam, ribbed for Uncle Sam's pleasure. um So then she thought yeah, she she throws the dog out the window.
00:41:26
Speaker
Kit, this is insane. At this point in the movie, I'm just like, I am sitting here, I'm like, Hetty, I'm thinking of ways we can start ruining these people's lives. And I'm- You're already plotting. I'm already plotting. We're gonna start small, like really annoying roommate shit. But we're gonna do a slow build and escalate until these people are insane. And Hetty, really,
00:41:57
Speaker
Here's the thing, like as I'm telling her to do things, I realized I didn't set the parameters for her in my mind as to where to start. and So I felt a little responsible of how quickly we escalated. Which was, throw a puppy off the 12th floor of a building. That dog splats, it's it is a cute puppy. kit Do you wanna know something? I'm gonna tell you something insane.
Screenwriter's Tragic Themes Connection
00:42:28
Speaker
And I don't, so this movie is based off of a book by John Lutz. But the other writer of this movie of the screenplay is Don Roos, who wrote the screenplay for Marley and Me. No, that man that man killed a puppy.
00:42:52
Speaker
He killed two puppies. Two! Marley looked the same as this dog. He killed both of those dogs. Do you think this is where it got the idea? I think that it was not that far in the back of his mind as he was writing Marley and me. He's like, you know what? Really upset people in my ah my my my fucking movie. It is it is such a you're correct. Huge escalation. um big and And it's too it's far too big. And she's like trying to blame it on
00:43:29
Speaker
uh the the fiance because he didn't fix like the part of the window that the dog fell out of it's it's it's stupid it's just like the the way she gradually starts to escalate it seems like a lot of these things could have come first, like where she starts dressing the same as her roommate, gradually buying more clothes that make her look like the roommate. This, though, seemed like killing the dog was a way for her to like initiate contact with Steven Webber, because the end result of this- Oh, she's trying to get sympathy from the fiance and be like, oh, I'm so sad and it's all my fault.
00:44:19
Speaker
And then, like, she's clearly trying to get him to, like, kiss her and, uh, he does not. Yeah, kill the dog, fuck Steven Webber, cut his dick off. That would have been, like, the end of my escalation if we were going high. Garrett! Garrett, I love you. There is no... There is no form of revenge that should start with killing a dog. Well, I'm saying, like, dress the same as first. I'm saying, like, you start sweet.
00:44:50
Speaker
it's the It's the third to last escalation. She so she skipped like 19 steps. There's so many steps. Like she skipped like drink most of the milk and put it back in the fridge with like um just a half inch left. Like that is, yeah. Like in nine and a half weeks you just cover the floor in honey. Yeah, that was terrible roommate shit. That's terrible roommate shit. That would have been perfectly fine.
00:45:18
Speaker
So, yeah, Ali realizes that ah this girl's been buying identical clothes to her and it freaks her out a little bit. But like, I don't feel like it should really. I mean, yeah, it's a little annoying when somebody's copying your style, but you were the one who specifically were like, hey, girl, I'm going to help you level up your style game. And she doesn't know a lot about how to dress chic for New York.
00:45:47
Speaker
And so, uh, I just took the country bumpkin shopping. Of course she's going to go shop at the place you took her. Yeah, she's dressing like you because that's how you taught her to dress. And I want to point out another thing of another example of Ali being a really shit friend.
00:46:06
Speaker
after Hetty is like, you promised you weren't going to get back with this guy and leave me out on the fucking street. She also says, and you're in a different league than me. Like you're gonna be, you're so beautiful and I'm nothing. And Ally says fucking nothing. That's fine. No, no. Yes it is. This girl is so upset and she's very pretty and you didn't say, no, come on girl, you're really pretty.
00:46:35
Speaker
Maybe she's not good at handling sad people. Like now I am taking this ah taking her
Insecurity and Friendship Dynamics
00:46:40
Speaker
side on this. Like you've known this person a month. Like how much emotional responsibility do I have? She was there for you when you were crying on the floor. You are soul bonded now. That's small town shit in New York City. People are gonna spit on you. They're gonna step on you. She hasn't even stepped foot in the meat and fire district. This city's gonna eat her alive.
00:47:05
Speaker
I'm just saying, like, I've had a roommate who was too much with the fishing for compliments and always being like, hey, I'm so fan in this, so the so that you then have to say, no, no, you look great. You're so pretty. And it's like, this is the hundredth time you've made me say this. But like, we don't get that. Hedy has said anything like this before. She's clearly in an emotional state. She she knows you're going to throw her out of this apartment.
00:47:32
Speaker
and you don't have a single nice thing to say to her. Not even an I'm sorry, by the way, for kicking you out soon. Nothing. Really? Hetty does, like even even as she slips into insanity, does show still signs of being a good bro. So, Ally has to go to Steven Tobolowsky's to discuss the the final pieces of her program and everything.
00:48:02
Speaker
and he loves how everything's going she gets there he's like there's actually one thing left before you get paid uh he's basically like i'm going to fuck you yeah you're gonna give me a beach or we're gonna fuck it's gonna be something because that's the final step steve tobes is coming tonight is what he says and and you're not getting paid until then so at this point Full hate, Stephen Tobolowsky. Oh, absolute like horrible person. And Ali comes home and she confides in her roommate about like how horrible this was and how upset she is and how this is ruining everything.
00:48:44
Speaker
and for the record nothing she punches his dick and she punches him in the dick and runs away she she she's weird about that though later she's like oh it felt like something else took over my body and i can't believe i did that and she's like upset that her self-defense mechanism kicked in and she saved herself from getting assaulted like why are you mad about that be mad that you were getting assaulted not that your body thankfully protected you Hey, you know, your brain thinks it had just happened. You know, I think it's fine for her to like feel different ways about what had happened. Like, you know, there give her, give her time, give her time. That was a lot. But Eddie then is like, but what about how are you going to make him pay? And she's like, Oh, the software, uh, will self destruct if he doesn't pay me. And she's like, no, no, no, no. How are you going to make him?
00:49:37
Speaker
Hey, and then she immediately calls his house and blackmails him.
00:49:46
Speaker
Baller like she was cool. It was so cool. She's such a good friend. That is a bro till the end. What a good person. She blackmailed that guy for you so that he won't ruin your reputation around town and so that he's not going to to like make a thing out of this because you've just threatened to tell everybody, including his wife. Perfect.
00:50:08
Speaker
But this, this is the first time though that we kind of get a sense of her personality disorder. Uh, cause you know, a lot of these fucking movies from the nineties are like people with borderline personality and disorder. And this is the first time that she goes from being like this mousy, like kind of. Oh, mousy or angry to being like confident to do something to fuck somebody over other than like, obviously throwing the fucking Dog dog out the window. You don't think that was showing enough initiative? Is that and enough for you, Garrett? Enough confidence? Well, it was confident, but in the wrong way. And this was confident in like a more correct way. Still illegal. Like it's still blackmail. It's not any more illegal than what he did. Right. I am on her side. Absolutely in the right. And, uh, Ally's like, boy, I hope I never make you mad. Um, spoiler alert.
00:51:04
Speaker
So, uh, then she gets the identical haircut. Yeah. She, so Hetty is let my treat. Let me take you to a hair salon. We're going to pamper you. Let's, you're going to lay there. They're going to rub the fingers in your hair. Maybe you're going to get a color. a dy I don't know. It's going to be nice.
00:51:24
Speaker
but Hetty walks down the stairs with the craziest surprise, which is, surprise, we both look like simple Jack now. And I'm wearing the same clothes as you, the exact same clothes. I put these clothes in my bag so I could change upstairs and fuck you up when I walked down that we look the same. I love when they look the same in this movie. This movie kicks into a new gear. We go places.
00:51:53
Speaker
We do go places and there are multiple times where I had to like check and be like, wait, which of them? Like I genuinely would get them mixed up. um But yeah, Ali kind of makes it clear that like, hey, that's not cool. And I feel like she should have been a little more communicative, you know, here and been like, actually, that kind of makes me uncomfortable. And I feel like really, you need your own style. Like, you know, I don't think this hair color even suits you that much. Why don't we try to find you your own thing? Because it's just like, I don't like that you're kind of taking my thing.
00:52:33
Speaker
Making new friends in your 30s is hard. It is, thank you, Carrot. So instead, she goes and takes a shower and ah Allie goes through all her shit again and finds all of her secrets in that convenient shoebox full of secrets that we all keep in our closet. Yeah, the secrets. Hey, Carrot, what's in yours? and My secret box, I don't.
00:53:01
Speaker
We've got some newspaper clippings, I'm sure. Well, this point, everybody's secret box is digital, right? Like it's like a little secret hard drive or a little something that... Yeah, it's labeled under to something that nobody would look at like taxes 2021.
00:53:19
Speaker
You gotta go more boring than that. You have to do something. More boring than taxes? Yeah, somebody could click that. It has to be something that seems like some nonsense in the hard drive that was just like, Doc X file. That's where you're just like, that doesn't mean anything. It's obviously not going to be in there. And that's where you keep your newspaper clipping about your dead twin.
00:53:44
Speaker
About your dead twin, yeah some old nudes you've taken of yourself, ah some blackmail information you have on others. Other people, yeah. um But in and this, the movie did open with something we didn't mention. It's a really quick thing of two twin girls putting makeup on each other.
00:54:03
Speaker
and putting lipstick on. And we find out in this box that, uh, that Hetty is a twin. She, her other twin died when they were nine in some sort of accident. That's all. it Like a drowning. Uh, and she had said earlier that she had a twin, but the twin died like in uterus that she was stillborn. And now Ali finds out that in fact, uh, they were nine when that twin died.
00:54:30
Speaker
And she also finds in there the letter from Sam that she never received. um So she's a little freaked out by this. But Hetty is getting ready to head out the house. yeah And Hetty leaves and she follows her very fucking closely. Like so closely on a completely empty street that if she had turned around one time, she's right there. yeah But I love this scene. These are the places we need to go in these type of movies. She walks down an underground tunnel where we immediately hear Gregorian chant set to drum beats.
00:55:07
Speaker
And I'm just like, get it going. This club is going to rule. and And this club does rule.
00:55:17
Speaker
I don't understand this club. It is a club of people and leather. People are being sexual. I don't think that it's a gay club, but I don't think that it's not. No, it's an S&M club. It's an S&M club. Okay, but there's a lady as she's walking through that looks at her and it's almost as if they recognized each other.
00:55:41
Speaker
But it's not she thinks that it's Eddie. Oh, that it's because he's been coming here and pretending to be Ali. So this has gone on a lot longer. So when this girl has had this haircut for three days, if that i looked like she just got it that day, honestly, but the vibe. Yeah. Yeah. So ah she sees Eddie sitting at the bar and she looks so confident, so happy.
00:56:10
Speaker
She's wearing identical clothes and the identical haircut. And then the bartender calls her Ali. And it's clear that Hetty has been pretending to be Ali at this weird S and&M club place. And the dude she's with looks exactly like Steven Webber.
00:56:28
Speaker
Yes, she is also flirting with a guy who looks just like our favorite philanthropist, Sam. our Yes, philanthropy, Sam. But she I have to ask you this. so they' it is Fine, it's an S and&M club. People like to get dominated, whatever. I'm confused about, there was a man in a cage, and I don't think he was dressed in S and&M stuff, but he like wasn't dancing or anything, but he like reaches out and strokes her face,
00:56:58
Speaker
What's his job? Is he naughty? Like what did he do to get in the cage? I think he was naughty. No, he was naughty and he got put in the cage and he's reaching out because he wants to do sex things, but he's not allowed because he was naughty. All right. That's all the explanation I need. I i wanted to go. This club looked fun.
00:57:18
Speaker
It did look a like a lot of fun. the the The sick beat with the Gregorian chant was really lovely. And honestly, I feel like Ally vastly overreacted to this. Eddie got her hair done, and new clothes, and she wants to go out to a nightclub. I don't think it's that weird. No, it's not a crime. Is that a crime? No.
00:57:43
Speaker
She goes home to like tell a gay best friend upstairs everything, and he's like, call the police. And I was like, call the police for what? Do you know what one crime she has committed so far here? She opened someone else's mail. That is true. That is true, and that is that is a federal offense.
00:58:06
Speaker
that Which I feel like if you wanted to make the case like no she actually told me to she didn't want to see mail from this guy because he had cheated on her like if I were a judge I might let it slide. Okay. In this scene where she's talking to gay best friend, Hetty can hear them through a vent. And while she had at the beginning when she was having a fight with philanthropy, Sam.
00:58:38
Speaker
ah sam Philanthropy Sam, like they, the neighbor could hear it. So this is a two-way situation and she hears everything that's being said. And as this is happening, Hetty is also sneaking into gay neighbor's house. I got so nervous during this scene, Kit, because as they're talking, before we even before they know Hetty's in the room,
00:59:01
Speaker
It is revealed that he has a cat like you actually see the cat it is mentioned before. But now you see a cat and you already know what she did to the dog. And that was at the beginning of her being crazy. She's like full blown banana balls now. And I was so worried.
00:59:20
Speaker
I didn't know if it was gonna get stuck in the garbage disposal and blend it up. There was any number of horrible things this woman could have done to this kitty. But instead- Turns out she's a cat person, I guess. And kind of like a weak ass criminal. because Because the gay neighbor's like, hey, I'm gonna get you some help. And then she just gives him the most gentle beating.
00:59:49
Speaker
He's a little bonk, she just bonks him. Like if I'm gonna get bonked, I want it to be like this. Yeah, that's how you wanna get bonked. It's like a really light bonk, but it did put him out. It almost like, it was like a sleeping pill. And you definitely think he's dead. It was a low dosage edible, but it did take him fully out.
01:00:14
Speaker
Yeah, that is the kind of bonk that it was. Ali, uh, call, finds out how to, I don't know how she did this. I guess she does have a computer and maybe somehow she used that, but somehow she finds out how to call, uh, uh, Hetty's parents back in wherever the fuck and tell them like, Hey, I'm she's, you know, doing some weird shit and I'm a little worried and you should, you should call back.
01:00:42
Speaker
But while this is happening, ye Hetty is sleeping with the phone next to her, just waiting for it to ring. So philanthropy Sam calls immediately, Hetty's here. She's like, oh, he just got home from his business trip. And she tells her that Ally's gone. This scene, this scene, this scene, Kit. Yeah, you have thoughts? Is amazing.
01:01:09
Speaker
Something like, you know, we've seen a fair amount of sexual assault in these movies we've watched and it's typically pretty upsetting. We had never seen a man sexually assaulted yet. This is true. This is new. And I feel bad laughing and I don't know if it's just because it's Steven Webber and like I have years of and join him as a comedic relief on wings? But a man.
01:01:46
Speaker
realize that he's being sexually assaulted in the midst of coming? Yeah, yeah, yeah. In the midst of coming, he realizes that that is not his actual fiance. It is the fiance's roommate who looks exactly like her because she apparently got her hair done while you were gone. Well, she looks the exact same from top down. So he's asleep. She walked through the front door Takes off her sick silver robe coat. That's a really good coat. It's such a good coat. Like that coat. Ali had it earlier in the movie. Made note of like this is a sick coat. This is a futuristic coat. Pulls it off. Full nude climbs into bed and watching this man like wake up from sex. Has that ever like is I mean, it's way worse for a lady than it is a man for sure. Woken up for sex.
01:02:39
Speaker
Well, to be woken up as you you're having sex as you wake up, like that's ah absolutely different for a lady than yes I hope to God that hasn't happened to you. No, it has not, thankfully. I feel like if you have an agreement with your partner that that's an okay thing to do, i go for it. ah don't Don't do that on someone who doesn't have that agreement.
01:03:06
Speaker
This guy though is like full asleep. Like Rimcycle is a ticket. He is in it. And he's just like, Ali, what are you doing? Oh my. And she just puts his flaccid penis in her mouth. And like he's still pretty asleep.
01:03:24
Speaker
and while this is happening and he wait like he's starting to enjoy it he's waking up and then he looks down and i mean it looks like the same simple jack haircut so he shouldn't be that surprised but then he's like ally She looks up and goes, no, it's Hedy. And then furiously sucks his dick kit. Like she is like, she is going so hard on it. And he goes, no, no. And then like he starts to hit his vinegar strokes as he's yelling no. I'm sorry, his what?
01:04:03
Speaker
Vinegar strokes? What the fuck is that? I'm sorry, it's like it's a thing from the league. Like it's the face you make before you come. Oh, OK. Yeah. It looks like you're smelling vinegar as you. Yeah. He is incapable of of stopping this. And you know what? I'm not going to shame people who have experienced sexual assault for not being, you know, in especially if you've just been fucking woken up for not being in the right state of mind to physically stop someone. And Dan doesn't look like he's been assaulted afterwards. Like and the look on his face is haunted.
01:04:43
Speaker
Absolutely. And there is no time that a man is more useless than when he's coming in about 15 seconds after. yeah There is nothing like he is he is fighting as hard as one who's about to ejaculate can.
01:05:02
Speaker
yes yes he is which is Which is a confusing thing, I think. i don't know if you you're you I don't know if you could mentally process everything that's happening, but yeah you're right. When those 15 seconds pass and like the the pure bliss is left him, when the poison's left his body,
01:05:24
Speaker
No one has ever looked more sexually assaulted in one of these movies we've watched than that man when he rolls over and stares into the middle distance. Yeah, absolutely. It is so clear that he is not okay with what just happened on any level. And she's like, haha, I knew you were a cheater and I'm going to tell Ally that you had sex with me and she's going to know that, you know, men like you don't change. And he's like, fuck you. I'm just going to tell her myself because like you raped me. You raped me like they don't use the those words. But like it's pretty clear that he assumes the alley is going to understand that like this was not wanted on his part and like ah so yeah it's the 90s. So like
01:06:12
Speaker
I don't you know, they weren't real cool about um sexual assault back then um for even female victims, but he seems pretty confident that like ah his girl is going to understand what happened here and be OK with, you know, blaming it on the correct person. She's been pretty understanding of a lot of things. That's a good point. She's been understanding of him doing actual bad things.
01:06:40
Speaker
Steven Weber though, yeah knocks this movie up like 10 points for me. Like full erotic numbers go higher because of something Steven Weber does. So yes,
01:06:55
Speaker
as He gets up and walks away, and as he's walking, you see his ass, and you see both balls hanging between his legs. Full nuts, scroat, hanging a little low, to be honest. I was actually a little surprised. It looks like he's gonna flash the camera the way he's getting out of bed, and you're gonna see peen, but you I didn't. He moves real quick, but the nutsack, oh my god, are you about to show me his nuts? You did not take a picture on your phone.
01:07:25
Speaker
Oh shit, you caught it. You caught the moment of truth. There's the peen. Look at that. He is, if you pause this movie, and I'm a sick fuck. So I did. Kit right now can't see my face through Zoom. She is only looking at Steven Webber's penis. You can only see the penis, you're correct. And then, just so that Kit remembers,
01:07:53
Speaker
yeah How much? Wait, hold that steady. Yeah, they hang low. I wonder if these are fake balls almost because they're so thin in the middle with the ball. Well, they are recently emptied. That's true.
Steven Weber's Full Frontal Scene
01:08:10
Speaker
That's crazy. That's crazy. This guy shows penis and honestly like he's a butthole away from giving us a hat trick.
01:08:22
Speaker
And you know what? I'm glad because there's plenty of incidental female nudity in this movie. To have some incidental male nudity feels correct and appropriate. And Steven Webber was kind enough to bless us with most of him.
01:08:38
Speaker
What does he get for his troubles? A fucking high heel right in the eyeball, like ah almost as if it were delivered as a karate chop. Yep, straight to the eyeball. And ah now you can now you can frame Ally for murder because everyone saw Ally, quote unquote, leaving the crime scene. The doorman, the doorman set even says like, see you later, Ally. Yep, so you're fucked. You're super fucked.
01:09:08
Speaker
This next scene, Kit, I laughed so hard. Which part was it? Which bit? She, Ally comes home and Hetty is in the shower. And as she's in the shower, Ally looks over and just sees bloody murder clothes. Like the bloodiest murder clothes sitting in the sink. And Ally's response is, I'm not feeling well. Mine always comes when I'm wearing something nice. And I lost it. I was a dolphin on the floor just to see.
01:09:46
Speaker
at the idea that she's covering up this absolute like pints load of blood and claiming that it was her period and that it got all over that dress it was like and it's a short dress so you wouldn't think that how did you get period blood ah all over this damn dress well Oh, she would have been like Veruca Salt and like Willy Wonka. She got juiced like a blueberry. And she is ill. Like would feel ill. Yeah. And yeah,
01:10:24
Speaker
and yeah like so yeah, she she I don't know. It's really stupid that she even bothered to try to wash it to be honest when you know there's an incinerator room just waiting for all your evidence.
01:10:38
Speaker
Like, I feel like this is, so somebody can look at that and be like, see, she's on her period and that's what happened. And this is why there can't be a female president.
01:10:51
Speaker
yeah This is what happens to you one period and she kills the gay neighbor, which in this scenario would be Canada.
01:11:03
Speaker
That's my favorite gay neighbor. I love them too. I keyed, I keyed. ike um But yeah, this is also the point where you start to realize just how truly fucked Ally could potentially be because this girl isn't on the lease and she's been trying to not be seen by the neighbors so that nobody knows the shit there's a second person living in the apartment. ah She's using a fake name. It's like she has all identical clothes and here she is right now redying her hair a different color like you're fucked.
01:11:38
Speaker
You're fucked, no one's gonna, this girl could ghost right now if she had wanted to, if she weren't super bananas. If she had wanted to, she could have skipped town and Ally would have gone to jail forever. No question. And she's trying to make that happen. She's, she is- Well, she wants them to leave together to go all Thelma and Louise and like go on the run together. That's what she wants. Otherwise she would have just left and been like, who's gonna fucking find me? No one knows my name.
01:12:08
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, that's true. with this No, my weird roommate who dyed her hair to look exactly like me and then wore clothes identical to mine. She did it. Okay, hon. Sure.
01:12:24
Speaker
I only find out from the news. She finds out from the news that philanthropy Sam's dead and she does some barfin and Hetty immediately knows this isn't sick barfing. This is set this is a grief barf. It's a grief barf. And she also sees then the stiletto with the blood on the heel. It got in there. It got in there like you can measure the inches from. the Yeah. There's brain in there.
01:12:51
Speaker
So, our girl had you tapes your BFF to a chair, like you do with your BFF. Yeah, she has to run some errands, keeps her in there, says, watch a little tube. yeah And I love that we get some MTV. Yeah, she leaves the TV on for her and gives her remote within reach. That's super nice. And then she has the very smart idea, Ally does, to try to get a noise complaint by kicking up the loudest a TV channel she can find at the loudest volume so that someone will go get the goddamn super and force their way in. Mm-hmm.
01:13:29
Speaker
doesn't work. She gets back just in the nick of time, which as far as the way all of that was shot presented, I loved the turning the TV up, getting that. That was actually super suspenseful. It was very tense.
01:13:43
Speaker
Like this is another one of the movies that is competently shot. And once we get to the third act, the suspense is very good. It is actually like very effective. They get into an argument and she's holding a blade to her throat. And this is like, oh, it's a little, it's so cringy. Cause it's like at the, what do you call that? It's a serrated knife.
01:14:05
Speaker
you It's got all these pokekies going little pokey holes in her neck. Oh yeah. And even the makeup made it look like those went in a little deep. Yes. Like because they have the little blood spots in those and that's just such a nice little detail that a shittier movie would have and absolutely skipped over.
01:14:24
Speaker
Yes. And so ah she's she's thinking about killing Ali and Ali says, no, no. ah Don't don't make me leave you. And then this is her.
01:14:38
Speaker
Yeah, finally, see, this is the game romance we could have had fucking an hour and a half ago. You make us wait this long. And honestly, how we get to this point too, because like, you know, after all this, it doesn't, she tries to escape through the internet. It doesn't work. They're so proud of themselves. Like you can book a flight on the internet and pay with a credit card. Really?
01:15:06
Speaker
oh Yeah, it was a really good commercial for the internet. It did make me interested to use Right? um And then you see the the software over at at ah the... Another great... Steven Tobolowsky. Yeah, I've just kept writing him down as Ned from Groundhog Day. But yes, ah his computers are going nuts because she put in a fail safe that if she didn't get paid, it would delete all the data. And it's like you have 24 hours to pay. And so he's desperately trying to get in contact with her.
01:15:40
Speaker
and he ends up showing up at the apartment and I was like please don't let this fucking creeper be the one who saves the day this cannot be this cannot be how this movie ends it cannot be that this this fuckwad is the hero of the hour but how great is it though that he is the one that shows up where this girl's here, he did fight her a little bit. and He's like, don't worry, neutralized her. And he is now on top of taped up Ally, which this is the person that could blackmail him. He could have just left and let this murder happen.
01:16:20
Speaker
No, because his data would have been lost forever. Oh, what? He couldn't picture what the fucking Barbie doll with the swimsuit on. no it was all the It was all the vendor information and all of the like accounts and stuff. This is the accounting stuff that was going to go away. And he needs that.
01:16:38
Speaker
he And and like he's like just quickly trying to shove a check for four grand and That'll just make it and that make can fix it But no Ned does not get to save the day he does not get to save the day um because ah ah Hetty once again ah Looking out for Ally. It's like get the fuck off of her Hello to the face, gun. Yep. Gun and done.
01:17:09
Speaker
And that's when we realize who is still alive, but gay neighbor and the both alive. When you see that they're in the bathtub, there is a moment where you're like, oh, fuck. Because the cat also looks dead. Honestly, the cat looks more dead than he does. Yeah, I mean, the cat cat really never moved, but they they're both fine. Yeah, the cat was just like very sweet, ah sleeping on ah her owner's a passed out body.
01:17:38
Speaker
very, you know, looking out for him. So then a gay neighbor gets to save the day. I have to, I have to have you help me parse this line. When she explains to, I believe she's explaining it to Graham, the gay neighbor, about like how she's actually been good for Ally this whole time. She says, I never met anyone so scared of being a woman.
01:18:07
Speaker
and like as if look at one of the but all the benefits I gave to Ally and how I helped her and how she shouldn't want me gone from her life. What the fuck do you think she meant by that statement? I actually said the same sentence out loud in the first five minutes when I saw that haircut.
01:18:34
Speaker
So scared of being a woman that she has a terrible bowl cut. Oh, Gary. Well, now it all makes perfect sense. I hope that helps. Yeah, no, that is all. It's all you've you've tucked it away like. Done, we're good.
01:18:52
Speaker
Like, because the only things I can think of were like, she wasn't comfortable with the idea of getting revenge on the guy she punched in the nuts and getting the blackmail. Like, she didn't like that idea. And to just leave Sam like she's getting walked on. She even at her job, like she took a lower amount of money when she's worth more than that.
01:19:15
Speaker
Absolutely. And so it's sort of interesting. And it shows that like, if the two of them had actually gotten together, they were both actually good for each other. They were both helping build each other's confidence up, you know, one can help with the style and the, you know, the the confidence and how you look.
01:19:33
Speaker
and the other one can help with the confidence to like stand up for yourself at work and don't let yourself get bullied by a client and, you know, blackmail people who are going to attempt to sexually assault you.
01:19:48
Speaker
what though happens I agree. I agree. There is a version of this movie that's a lovely lesbian romance, but she still has a mental disorder, which I think this movie does do too much. and that I didn't need all of that. I like the simpleness of She fucked her over and now she has to look for a new place and I'm going to ruin her life. I didn't need the twin. I didn't need the mental disorder. It's just a lot extra tacked on. It is is. Because of that mental disorder, something else was going to eventually trigger this. Like it was a doomed relationship or friendship anyway because of who she is.
01:20:33
Speaker
um maybe she could have gotten some help she could have gone into therapy as they you know raised their dog together yeah but at what point when she there's too many lies there's too many lies she has a dead sister who She blames herself for but it really isn't her fault. We kind of find like we never find out that she worried. Are you worried that Hetty's parents are going to show up to their lesbian commitment ceremony because it's 1992 and they don't have gay marriage and and they're going to reveal that she has ah that that her name is not really her name. I do not think so.
01:21:12
Speaker
She's gonna find that box eventually. She's still got a trinket box hanging around the house. Well, that is a big mistake. Should have thrown that in the incinerator room, to be honest. yeah we've all At this point, we've incinerated the doubles of the clothes. we have a little we We're heading down to the incinerator room, finally. like This deep into the movie, we're finally heading down there. We have a great elevator fight.
01:21:35
Speaker
Yeah, oh, the elevator fight is very good. Especially since they established that this elevator kind of sucks. And, you know, they really make good use of the the cramped space for this fight choreo. I very much enjoyed it. It's my second favorite elevator scene next to Fatal Attraction. The, like, sex fight.
01:21:56
Speaker
The sec, yeah, that's fair, yeah. So now- I loved this whole end finale. Yeah. Other, like I, it was done like an action movie more than a slasher. Like it goes back and forth between slasher and action movie.
01:22:12
Speaker
Absolutely. And never once is it like ah a serious drama thriller. It is, it is only action or slasher. And oddly enough, Ali, our protagonist, is the one you think is dead and then the camera comes back and she's not there anymore. She is Freddie. She is the one who you thought was dead and is not actually dead.
01:22:34
Speaker
Which I think goes back to our reframing of this movie as being, like, from Hetty's perspective. I agree. And I love that she ends up in the ducts. She throws a rat at Hetty. And Hetty doesn't know she's got rat scratches on her face. Hetty ends up with, like, I know what you did last summer, Hook, and is chasing her around.
01:22:58
Speaker
thinks she's in this like little armoire thing, opens it up, she's not there, and Ally, in the craziest fucking move that this particular woman could do. Absolutely. Flies from upside down, hanging by her knees, stabs her in the back with this pokey thing she stole from the elevator earlier.
01:23:20
Speaker
She pops out of the fucking ceiling to stab Heady in the back, which I want to point out is not usually the way the good guy ends a fight scene. It's not usually how that goes.
01:23:37
Speaker
Well, she did stab her in the back like metaphorically earlier in the movie by getting back with her ex after the promise. Yeah, and then getting her out, like kicking her out of the apartment. Absolutely. She did stab her in the back metaphorically and then later literally.
01:23:53
Speaker
I was so stuck on the incinerator though, this whole movie where I was convinced somebody's getting incinerated. And at this point I said, okay, well, you can kill somebody in self-defense, but I don't know how the court looks at incinerating somebody in self-defense. I was like, you already stabbed her. I thought she was gonna, I kicked into the incinerator.
01:24:14
Speaker
Yeah, that would have been fucking
Expectations vs. Movie Outcome
01:24:16
Speaker
rad. But no, we did not get that. The incinerator was a looming threat, but but not ever actually used on a person only for that payoff. I didn't get the incinerator payoff. I had really, really want Set my heart on from the beginning I think there's a better version where she swings from the pipe kicks her in the ass And she dives forward into the incinerator, but the incinerator holds so small how they such That would fuck her though like then you've gotten rid of the body of the real killer you now Yeah, well, you know I
01:24:59
Speaker
They didn't satisfy my incinerator needs, but I was overall happy with what happened. Yeah. And that is, uh, I mean, like it into this little, little monologue where she's just like, and I forgive Eddie. Yeah.
Critique of Ending Monologue
01:25:15
Speaker
Yeah. If you don't forgive yourself, how the hell are you going to forgive anybody else? Some something about that. ah It's a weird little last minute, like, and here's the moral of the story and bye.
01:25:30
Speaker
It felt like I don't know what to do with this and I don't want to just roll credits. Yeah. I mean, so many movies, though, that we've watched are perfectly happy to be like, and then the police show up and credits. This one did not want to do that. This one wanted to leave you with a little something to think about. You got to forgive people and forgive yourself. That's.
Length and Engagement of the Movie
01:25:52
Speaker
that's beautiful yeah some of these you're right they don't give a message though here you go just in case you needed one i did love this movie though i you know i as much as i am taking the killer side absolutely i think it was a competently made movie it was super fun and it's not even one you really have to goof on like obviously like we were joking around taking the killer side which at the beginning fully on fully on her side honestly no yeah no yeah i feel like uh they've done dirty by her but it is a good movie uh it's a little i like there were definitely times where i'm like there's an hour left in this fucking movie uh but i was never bored
01:26:38
Speaker
When the knife was at the throat, I thought we were at the end. And I remember I paused it to look and I was like, there are 20 more minutes. This thing is like the the, it's like Return of the King, the number of times you think this movie is over and it isn't. Like Ned shows up, the you know the the creeper shows up, you think the movie's gonna be over. It turns out the gay roommates not or gay neighbor's not dead. You think the movie's gonna be over. Elevator fight, you think the movie's like,
01:27:06
Speaker
and It's hard though because everywhere, everywhere it went, I was still interested in and the movie is under two hours. So it's not like extraordinarily long. Um, I mean, I guess there's like a little few places you could trim it up, but overall like very satisfied on this one. I would even put this one like high on the list of movies that I've enjoyed the most that we've watched.
Casual Nudity: Appeal and Ratings
01:27:30
Speaker
Well, Garrett, um, would you say though, that you were aroused scale of one to five?
01:27:39
Speaker
Steven Weber, philanthropy Sam. And his charity dick. And the thing is, he he never showed his butt in any of the sex scenes. he There was no nudity from him. So you really thought we made it all the way through. And then and you do all of it. the The true climax of the movie. It's.
01:28:06
Speaker
like shit gets real wild like it goes from animal death to like human death and I mean the fact that he's like here's a little penis here's my butt here's my weird balls come on come on is it is it like does it actually arouse me No, like it's not I'm not going to pleasure myself to it later, but I'm so happy it happened. I'm so happy for you and for me. I'm happy for everyone on that.
01:28:39
Speaker
The sex scenes like leave something to be desired, but there's so much casual nudity. yeah And honestly, the casual nudity sometimes in these is a little sexier. yeah It's not as as forced, it's not as, I don't know, there's just something um nice about that. So actually we'll, you know what? I'll go four out of five. I'll go four out of five because I like the- You can't possibly mean four out of five. Why, should I say five?
01:29:05
Speaker
No, it should be like a one. Come on. Do not give this four out of five for like two or three casual nudity bits. Come on. Have higher standards.
Celebrity Crushes and Viewing Experience
01:29:19
Speaker
I had a huge crush on Bridget Fonda and high in Junior High because of the movie Jackie Brown. her Jennifer Jason Lee, I was a fan i was ah ah coming of age movie kid. Fast Times at Ridgemont High is a big one. So even though I'd already seen her in that, you know this is that's still fun. And then this one, it's not even in sexual context other than the masturbating scene, which was quite hot. It was pretty hot, I'll give you that.
01:29:46
Speaker
And I think we've established from the beginning of this podcast that a dude has to at least show cheek. Stephen Weber went up above and beyond with a balls and peeing. And what, like maybe I would have given it a three, but he deserves a star on his own for doing what most leading men won't do in these movies.
01:30:12
Speaker
Listen, I could give the guy props and still say though that I was not aroused because I wasn't. I got like a one out of this, like a one for the masturbation, a little bit of the there was some nice casual nudity um that is very well shot. It's well lit. It's it's pretty, you know, looks good. No, I'm not putting it above a one. I am. I cannot go with you on this journey.
01:30:40
Speaker
Go with me on this. You have to hop into a time machine with me. Go to 1992. Wings is a hit show. I've never watched that. It's a great show. There's Frasier crossover episodes where Frasier exists within the Wings universe.
Steven Weber's Bold Move in Film
01:30:59
Speaker
It's a funny show and Steven Webber's great in it. So that's why you know like Thomas Hayden Church started on Wings. Tony Shalhoub started on Wings. I don't see how that's supposed to be. Monk isn't showing.
01:31:10
Speaker
you are You just keep saying like Tony Shalhoub as if that's gonna turn me on. No, it isn't. We gotta find, I'm sure Shul Lube has shown me something in a movie down the line. But I'm just saying, Seinfeld wasn't showing me cheek. No, no. At the height of wings, not even, I guess not the height, it went a lot of years, and this is like two years in. But he's a big star, he's a big TV star, and his jump to film, he showed us his penis, he showed us his balls, he showed us his butt. He probably would have shown us whole.
01:31:45
Speaker
If you wanna give him a gold star, we can give him a gold star, our so a special um you know award from our podcast, but I'm not rating it any higher. I simply won't, I'm sorry. You wanna give him a special sure above and beyond the call of duty sticker? Go for it. I'm not changing my mind. Do I need to pull the picture up again? Do you need to see?
01:32:13
Speaker
I wish I could share these to the Instagram. I'm gonna show you again. You cannot. This is not Instagram safe. Damn it. You can show me. Garrett, you can put this man's dick in my face as much as you want. Oh, at that. Oh, and there's butt cheeks. It's not doing it. I'm sorry. Full pubes, full bush. You can put that penis in my face as much as you want. Shockingly, like most women, I'm not just turned on by you showing me a picture of someone's dick.
01:32:48
Speaker
All right, move on. We're just going to have to agree to disagree on this. i And I hate doing that because I feel like I should fight for his hog harder. I feel like he did a public service. yeah A lot of people wouldn't do it. Do you think that it was because he was a TV star?
01:33:08
Speaker
And that like, because it was like, you know, being a TV star back then was a little shameful. Like it's not as big of a deal now, like where movie stars go to TV. But back then, like making the bump from TV to movies, do you think? It was much harder. Yeah. Yeah. Do you think the director, uh, Barbette, which I thought was a woman until I saw a photo, uh, look like a very stern German man.
01:33:31
Speaker
Do you think he's like, no, you will show your penis. You will show your penis to the world and the world will love your penis. The world you will you won't barely even see the penis unless you pause the movie at just the right time. I did not see it until you showed you're not because I'm not. Do you even care about doing this podcast? I do. I do. I'm just not going to change my goddamn rating. You cannot bully me into this.
01:34:02
Speaker
Have you not paused any of these movies to try and get a little extra treat? Of course I have! Just not on that guy, because I didn't have the special connection to him that you do. We'll watch Wings next time we're together. And then we'll come back and we'll give it another try. We'll see if you restore. It's not gonna change. All right, move on. All right, were you thrilled? Scale of one to five.
01:34:31
Speaker
It was, I think that the the serrated blade to the throat was good. The dead dog was like absolutely unexpected. suspect like and hold yeah, we saw a kick it. No, it wasn't unexpected.
Thrilling Scenes and Execution
01:34:42
Speaker
We knew that dog was doomed, come on. That dog had real fun here and all over it. We saw a kick it, but like.
01:34:49
Speaker
But that mode of just like 12 floors down and splat, that's brutal. Yeah, ah agreed. Like when you and then they showed it like, you know, you don't the murder, the death is off camera, but like the corpse is laying there on there. Yeah, I think the final act is just really well done to like the MTV thing. The number of times, um yeah, that she almost gets out of this danger, but doesn't. It's very it's very very tense.
01:35:19
Speaker
It's kind of hard for me to not rate it high. I do kind of want to go four again. That's what I was going to think, actually, is that I was going to give it a four. See, we can agree on some things. OK, I do think that's fair. I think that that bit is well done and honestly made me kind of want to read the book. um All right. And ah would you ruin your life?
01:35:42
Speaker
for, you know what, I'm gonna say, would you ruin your life for philanthropist Sam? Because it is the fact that she takes back philanthropist Sam that sets all of this in motion and ruins her
Realism of Character Motivations and Flaws
01:35:55
Speaker
life. So, is it worth it to ruin your life for his charity dick? The version of the character that we've created in our head, yes.
01:36:06
Speaker
good
01:36:09
Speaker
Like our...
01:36:12
Speaker
our fictional version of a fictional character. Yes, I would ruin our life for him. But real life, like the character that I am presented with, I mean, he's laughably fucking terrible. Like, i that's so funny though, to be like, she was sad. What do you want me to do? Did you want me to not fuck her? She needed it. She was sad. She missed me. She's depressed.
01:36:40
Speaker
It was an accident. That's so funny. That's so good. I mean, no, no, I'm not. But Steven Webber, like your dick, like your balls. Are you ruining your life for that dick and balls, Garrett? I don't know. He just he seems like he's he's down. Steven Webber, though, not philanthropy. Not philanthropy, Sam.
01:37:05
Speaker
The man's and don't even ask me about that simple jackass haircut. You know it's not happening. Yeah, yeah, I'm not ruining my life for any of these people, I'll be honest. Yeah, maybe the the neighbor.
01:37:20
Speaker
Yeah, you know what? But it wouldn't ruin your life to be with him. He seems like a perfectly lovely guy. He's got a cat. ah He has a very nice apartment, way nicer than hers in terms of decoration. Especially for an actor. Oh man, his decorating, he had some great shit in that apartment. There was a crazy painting over his bed that looked like maybe he's into magic, which is a little bit of a red flag to me. but I want to point out he had an actual bed frame, not just a mattress on the floor. So that's already like some points in his favor. Okay. Um, man, we're so deep into this episode. It's gone so long. Like I'm sure we'll cover another movie ah at some point with somebody with a personality disorder.
Teaser for Future Topics
01:38:07
Speaker
But I did, have I ever discussed on the show yet? I don't, I honestly don't remember that I did have a bipolar roommate.
01:38:15
Speaker
No. I got appointed a roommate. like It was a situation where there were four of us going to stay at a place. what Somebody dropped out so last minute that they just like shoved a rando in with us. And he was schizophrenic bipolar and off his meds. But that's a story for another time. Oh, that's tantalizing. I know. If we had not gone so long, I would have absolutely told it. but We'll definitely cover a schizophrenic bipolar person at some point in one of these. And it is a common trope in in the genre, I would say. ah Yeah. That is handled with varying amounts of ah delicacy.
Closing and Listener Engagement
01:38:58
Speaker
All right, everybody. Thanks for tuning in. Thanks to all the new listeners. Thanks to all the old listeners. Thanks for telling your friends. Thanks to the YouTube algorithm. ah give us ah Send us an email, pre-determined podcast, pre-determined. Fuck, that's my other show. Yeah, listen to pre-determined. EroticThrillerClub at gmail dot.com if you have any questions, comments, concerns. EroticThrillerClub on Instagram. It's on the socials. Go look for us, we're there.
01:39:28
Speaker
Thank you for listening. We love you. Punch Tobolowsky's dick. Look at Steven Webber's dick. We want to eat you naked. knee so We want to shake you naked, meet you alive. You want to give that one one more go?
01:39:43
Speaker
i like