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Red Rooms
58 Plays1 month ago
Today on These Guys Got Juice, the guys are reviewing the latest Pascal Plante vehicle, Red Rooms, starring Juliette Gariepy! (Available for rental and purchase!)
This one has the guys pumped! Has serial killer fandom gone too far? Did Pascal Plante give serial killers "back to the fans?" But most importantly, does this film have any juice? Listen and find out!
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Transcript
Initial Impressions of 'Red Rooms'
00:00:18
Speaker
I'm Doug Davenport. I'm Nicky Yours. And we're These Guys Got Juice. And we saw red rooms. In a white room with black curtains in the station. Black roof country, no gold pavements, tired starlings.
00:00:41
Speaker
They should have written a song called Red Rooms. In the Red Room. I don't know what you were- Most of this movie is in a white room. So it's kind of a bullshit title. Zero Stars. A white room. There's a lot of like blue in the movie too when it's like night. It's very blue or like, you know, the crack of dawn. It's very blue. The actual amount of red screen time is maybe like five minutes, 10 minutes if I'm rounding
Ironic Movie Ratings
00:01:07
Speaker
up. play. Yeah, I guess it's false advertising. Movie sucks. Anyway, rate us five stars or two? Yeah, zero out of ten. We hate this movie. Doug's wearing a red shirt. I didn't even plan that. I just threw this on because it fits and I like it.
00:01:38
Speaker
yeah i'm wearing wearing my red room merch yeah i mean i don't know what to say spoiler free about this movie we should say we don't hate the Unless you rated it, you gave an ironic review. Yeah, that one was ironic. I'm going back to do the real no star. I've never given a movie no stars or whatever. The lowest you can do is like half a star, right? Yeah. Yeah. I've never done that for anything. I've done that for like four movies, I think. I usually when I'm going something low, I usually stop at two. i I probably have gone lower, but I can't think of like for which ones.
00:02:22
Speaker
Yeah. Well, since we're like doing light spoilers on not the movie itself, but the review, our reviews of the movie, I gave it four and a half stars and Doug gave it five stars spoilers for our letterbox review.
Film Festival Buzz and Storytelling
00:02:36
Speaker
I mean, yeah, I still got to read your review, but I because i just put up setting stuff here.
00:02:41
Speaker
Okay, i could I just put a quick nothing review sometimes I like being surprised by what just like I don't know what Nick's gonna think of this and it adds attention to Going in but um I'm really glad you I this this movie really surprised. I mean, I, I think it had been like, done some like film festival circuits in Canada and maybe a couple in the US last year, because it was filmed in like 2022, I think, but like, and then this year, I started just seeing like, occasional hushes and whispers of certain critics, probably they saw it at some festival and were like,
00:03:17
Speaker
Yeah, Red Rooms is fucking good. And then now that it's like available on demand, I've been seeing more and more people being like, yeah, this this this movie fucking rips and I'm inclined to agree. I mean, yeah, this is this is up there with with my favorites this this year. It's ah without getting into like specific detail, it just it's it's Interesting subject matter, but then it's just the way that it's explored and the intensity of
Juliet Guppy's Performance
00:03:50
Speaker
it. It really puts you in this off-kilter, uncomfortable POV. It's like there's this tension in watching that this character and and the performances is really excellent by
00:04:07
Speaker
believe her name is juliet payy or I don't know if I'm pronouncing that last name of right. but larry yepe yeah yeah I'm sure Gary Epi is how it's spelled. Juliet Guppy. yeah But she she's fucking phenomenal. ah In my Letterbox review, I compared her to Scarlett Johansson under the skin because at at times there is very little recognizably human about like how she's like processing and reacting to stuff that I'm like, I feel like I'm watching someone who's like not of this world. like how And in her, it's it's all
True Crime Fascination
00:04:45
Speaker
from her perspective. So it's not like you're you're like seeing, I mean, there is a part of the movie where you pair her with a,
00:04:51
Speaker
I don't know if I call her more normal, but I guess comparatively compared to her more normal normal person and you do get like a juxtaposition of like, oh yeah, she's actually really fucked up. Well, she starts off as like the weirdo, like this like secondary character who tags along with Armanca, at least for me. I'm like, God, this girl like is a whack job. Then you're talking about female, Rami Malek. Yeah. So she looked like to me as soon as you see her in that hoodie, I was like, Oh, Mr. Robot is here.
00:05:24
Speaker
yeah she she looks like someone i think who's on the cast of snl right now too maybe um she she has like good eyes though but um yeah very really intense i express especially for one scene in particular where you're like really watching her eyes it's like yeah damn at first i'm like Oh, this girl's weird. Get her away from the main character. But, you know, things happen. Yeah, we'll talk. I think I think that's intent because like on the surface, you're like, well, she's she's fucking crazy. the the The secondary supporting character. And then, yeah, as you go on, it's it's really more about what it reveals about our main character.
Ethics of True Crime Obsession
00:06:02
Speaker
And just, yeah, with ah again, I don't want to get into specifics, but just so you could see from the general description of it, it it does examine
00:06:10
Speaker
our relationship and fascination with true crime. I feel like there's been a lot of stuff kind of, even even when the movie isn't like, movies aren't explicitly about that, like Terrifier 3 even like touched on this, Joker, Folly Ado is definitely ah about that. ah It's funny that that's also a courtroom drama, ah but that that's like, why are we so fascinated with this stuff? And not just, cause I've watched the occasional like true crime documentary or something that's like a dramasization of real things like I love the show Mindhunter probably one of my favorite shows but less so because of this I mean the subject mattered I'm compelled by but it's more of like oh this is Fincher and it's this is really well made in with these performances is what makes it compelling so it depends on the presentation of like the ones that I watch but like I
00:07:02
Speaker
i I do understand this fascination with like basically like peering into the void but like that like the that drives people to like really, really dig into this stuff. But the movie is really a question of, OK, so what point does that become? like When does fascination become obsession? And when does that become fetishization? When is this becoming weird that you're like this into this stuff?
Personal Discomfort with True Crime
00:07:32
Speaker
I agree. um Sorry, I had something in my throat. um for this movie Somehow I didn't know this movie existed until you brought it up to me. um It wasn't on my radar at all, which is weird because almost everybody I follow on Letterboxd has seen this movie, so I don't know what it is. but um at first when i read the description for this movie i wasn't too stoked on watching it i find like the serial killer obsession like really tiring i find people who are
00:08:08
Speaker
Really interested in the serial killer things and like who listened to serial killer like podcasts and all of that serial and I'm kind of and Interesting as people, you know if that's like your whole personality. Yeah, it's not Just not really the kind of person I hang out with or I've had a good time hanging out with in a lot of ways. I'm not saying people who have like a light interest in this, but people who only watch serial killer things. like That's all they do. it's I find it kind of annoying. So I was like, is this movie just going to annoy me?
00:08:44
Speaker
bru know um Appropriately so. I did find myself having a very angry experience watching this movie, but um not anger directed towards the movie, more so and character the the character, um this whole serial killer obsessed culture, just how involved they feel like they need to be in this kind of stuff.
Emotional Reactions to 'Red Rooms'
00:09:12
Speaker
And I know there have been cases where these people have like,
00:09:15
Speaker
done some good. But hey, chances are you're probably not going to do that much good. Like, right? Just because a couple times some Redditors have like actually helped an investigation statistically, that's mostly not happening. And then also what's that HBO one, the Jinx, they did get him confessing on camera, but that's most of these documentaries or obsessed people are not actually helping them. Like these are real people, real victims, real families that are suffering from this thing. And and it's been turned into like, there's basically like a whole industry that like milks this the suffering for like, for us to gawk at, you know, like to make content and entertainment out of this out of suffering. Yeah, no, I don't I don't love it. And I've I've known people throughout my life, too, who had would go as far as to watching like really upsetting videos on the Internet, you know, things from all around the world that like watch this beheading like, yeah like, yeah, this this hostage execution. It's like, i I know it's bad. I don't need to see it. yeah I had have no interest, no desire to watch any of that. It's too real for me. And so
00:10:29
Speaker
This movie left me feeling um such intense emotion watching it. i would ah I don't know if other people are defining this movie as this, but I, for me, would call this one of the feel-bad movies of the year. 100%. That's why it's got the 4.5 stars. It would get the 5, I think, if I was like,
00:10:51
Speaker
driven
Criticism of Serial Killer Idolization
00:10:52
Speaker
to really re-watch this, but I'm like, this might be a one-time watch. I bought it though, so who knows? um But I was just like, man, this like left me just angry, just sour, just at specific like kinds of people. And you know sometimes I feel bad for you know feeling that way about an entire like kind of person, but man, it's just- This movie kind of just survives feeling that yeah This is not a lifestyle um i of somebody who's well. and right like And again, we're not talking about casually, like you've watched one, you like you watched a season of making a murderer and then, you you know, you you watch others. Like this is not that's not the kind of person we're talking about. We're talking about like, You eat and breathe this stuff. You're like doing your own per outside of the content or documentaries made. You're doing like your own research. Going to the trials. It's like that. Like once you're doing that, that's like.
00:11:58
Speaker
what's going on here yeah because the whole time I was like there's two characters we follow who are attending the show but there's other people sitting back there and like what's their deal like what are these guys doing here not even taking it like even to the furthest extreme just like that but the people like writing love letters to like the serial killers or who like Find themselves idolizing serial killers or being like I love Ted Bundy Which is a real thing these guys get fucking fans like groupies. There's groupies for these incarcerated proven guilty Convicted killers they
Obsession and Violence in 'Red Rooms'
00:12:36
Speaker
get fan mail people are like I love this guy
00:12:40
Speaker
I've met people in my life who do truly, like all they do is they spend their time looking up famous serial killers, every detail about the crimes. church just All their life is just looking up these serial killers. So even that level is something that I like can't understand or don't even honestly like
00:13:04
Speaker
respect might be the wrong word, but like, it's just not for me in any way. Well, you're describing that kind of, it made me want to just like, just hit a red button to go, whoop, whoop, and then someone will take them away. It was like, I don't know, give them help. Yeah, get out of here. Go hang out with someone else, you know? It's like, I would, I would much rather listen to like a crazy conspiracy theory that I don't agree with Yeah, because those are entertaining sometimes. I mean, and i and again, like I'm I'm someone who watches and consumes lots of fucked up stuff. But for me, there's a very distinct difference between like a gruesome horror movie in real world violence. Like I'll watch the goriest shit ever. I had a great time watching Terrifier 3. That movie's a hoot. But but like if once you want to start talking about like actual murders and dead like that shit's fucking
00:13:56
Speaker
I'm getting like shivers, like just like thinking and of about, cause it's like, that's really disturbing to me. Like I'm, it's not not and not in a way that, like I said, I can understand the fascination to an extent where you're like, I, I want to see like, this is part of the humanity is a full spectrum of like beautiful and ugly and like the of like, there's really,
00:14:21
Speaker
great beautiful things in the world and then there's the worst things and I want to see a glimpse of what this worst is just so I understand of like kind of try to make sense of like how is this possible how is this also part of this of this this whole experience that I know can be beautiful that there's such like suffering and like ugliness, you you want to like look at it and try and make sense of it.
Boundaries with Fictional Violence
00:14:44
Speaker
I can kind of understand that to a degree, but when it becomes all-encompassing, that's like your whole world, and um then I'm a little scared. or even just seeing it in real life. Like a ah fictional portrayal of it is something that's more my speed. I don't really have an interest in seeing like ah a body go from living to not living anymore or like. Like real footage of a murder? No, thank you. I don't want to see that. only fictional depictions please. right and it's like like You mentioned Terrifier 3. I actually found this movie um more upsetting than Terrifier 3. Yeah. I had that thought too because I'm like, you see way more in Terrifier in terms of how graphic it is. The screams. man i know we're like tiptoeing into spoiler territory but it's like the stuff you don't it's just the sounds you hear are worse than what they show you in terrifier three i think i mean you see some pretty messed up things in terrifier three but you're aware that you're watching something like fiction it this feels like there's a reality there's a dark side of
00:15:52
Speaker
reality that this movie is kind of like letting you peek into. Yeah, no, I 100% agree. Because like, and like, you know, there's always a debate of like, what counts is horror versus thriller. And I saw a lot of some friends referring this as the best horror of 2024. And I was wondering, like, will I feel that same way going in? i I definitely was more disturbed by this than any other horror movie I've seen this year, probably.
00:16:19
Speaker
like and Like there's, there's grosser, like more, probably more visually shocking things I've seen depicted this year. But in terms of like, like, yeah, this just felt so real. Cause this is, you know, this, it's not like, ah like based on, on a, like ah a specific real case, but it's like this, this happens, you know, this, this is, this feels very real.
00:16:42
Speaker
i it's It's hard because I did say in our substance review that movie could have possibly made me throw up. um So it's really hard. These were um both ah upsetting in different ways, but the substance was fun.
00:16:59
Speaker
I'm, I'm laughing at parts of the substance. Whereas this, uh, like I said, like this right now is like the feel bad movie of the year. Nosferatu, I'm hoping it might top it, but, uh, yeah, this long legs, um, actually long legs might be the feel bad movie of the year, but that movie does have a bit more moments of levity.
Questioning Dark Subject Matter Interest
00:17:20
Speaker
There's hum humor and there's still an abstraction there because it's like the devil and like, right. Yeah, this feels too real. It feels like.
00:17:29
Speaker
ah Honestly, at a certain point, like near the end, I started to feel like I was watching something I should not be watching. I started to feel a sense of guilt and paranoia for because of the movie I was watching. I i think that's intense, and the movie does a really good job of almost like implicating you. it was like Hey, are you into this? I felt i felt like i'm doing some I'm committing a crime along with this person right now. I felt like ah a little bit of guilt, and that's kind of why I had to rate this movie so so high, because it's just the way it made me feel from beginning to end. It opens with like a really long one-er that just sucks you in. and Oh, yeah, with like the intro and the court, yeah.
00:18:14
Speaker
And I'm a sucker for a courtroom drama and I was kind of hoping it was going to be that it isn't. There are courtroom scenes, but it's not really ah about the trial. The trial is this person's life is being centered around this big murder trial that's happening, but the movie's not about the
Realism and Believability
00:18:33
Speaker
trial.
00:18:33
Speaker
Yeah. It's, um, yeah. So surprisingly little time was actually spent in the courtroom, but it, uh, what's it called? Um, it does it does get you like set up and ready for, uh, what's gonna, it's a good mood setter. Definitely gets gets me locked in really early. Yeah, they're paying attention. Like they're going to try and sway you in one direction or the other. It's very interesting. There was a point I was trying to make, but I like lost track of it. But, um, yeah, feel bad movie of the year.
00:19:05
Speaker
Yeah, I heard it. And as someone who the seeks out those kind of feel bad movies, I I heartily recommend this if if like in I almost feel weird saying if you can stomach it because like we said earlier, it's not great. It's not. It's definitely not a terror. Like you don't.
00:19:21
Speaker
quote, quote, see anything like that. But it is very disturbing. And it will make you feel uncomfortable. So like, like, yeah, if that sounds like that might be too much for you, then maybe maybe this movie isn't for you. But if if if you're into feel bad stuff like that, then definitely check this out.
00:19:40
Speaker
Yeah, and it's also it's very ah fairly like and believable, I would say in its depiction of these things. um Yeah, nothing rang is like, like a heightened like movie thing of like, oh, well, that's just the movie cliche of this, like this this all felt too believable yeah these there are people in this where you feel like you could know them people where you feel like you could see them on the news it's a very i don't know if lived in is the right word but this feels like
00:20:16
Speaker
an adaptation of true events, basically. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, definitely check it out. You have to purchase it right now, but purchase it, rent it, Fandango now or Apple TV, I think are the two places you can get it from. Yeah, I don't think it's on Amazon. Not in the U.S., because like when I pulled up the Amazon page, it was like, go to Amazon.com to see what's available in your country or something. So like the distribution, it's like just now getting like distribution in the U.S. So maybe it probably will be on Amazon eventually for purchase. But yeah, like you said, like Voodoo, Fandango, Apple, like you can you can rent or buy it. And i it's it's it's worth watching.
Audiovisual Style Comparisons
00:21:00
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. What happened to spoilers? Yeah, let's do it.
00:21:36
Speaker
And we're back. That was a sort really tense and unnerving spoiler bumper. The score for this movie. It just goes wild from the beginning. Yeah. It's fucking great. That's when I knew I was watching a a French film or the Phantom Thread.
00:21:56
Speaker
You know, it's like it's either a French film or the Phantom threat. I can't tell but now I loved ah I'm pretty sure it's like violin, but it was just They're just wailing from the beginning. Yeah, and and and especially in certain scenes. It really drives home how uncomfortable these these these moments are like in in my letterbox review like I kind of compared it to uh the score and under the skin and even parts of annihilation that really hammer home this like unnatural feel like this is not human what you're seeing right now and like that's kind I felt that watching scenes of this of like this like I shouldn't be watching this right now
00:22:39
Speaker
Under the Skin is a good comparison point. I know, like, the Under the Skin score isn't as, like, doesn't go as big as this one does, but there's a nice, like, violin piece that's super creepy that's like... When she, like, seduces the guys into the, like, the the black void of the home, you know, yeah. There's like, yeah, there's one that has, like, a rhythm. so It's like... Yeah, I think we're talking about the same one. It's kind of hypnotic.
00:23:08
Speaker
It goes like kind of, it's really cool. It sounds like um it's probably like a digital violin, maybe, i but it's got like a really cool sound
Hypothetical Scenarios and Performances
00:23:16
Speaker
to it. but God damn, yeah, Under the Skin was a good comparison point. I read that in your review. um Did this movie get any kind of an American theatrical run at all? Would it be ah able to be an awards contender? I think for a couple weeks it got a very limited run. So I think that's all you need, right, to technically be. I think they had just two weeks.
00:23:39
Speaker
Yeah, I think I think it it met at least that. So if it got a score, nom that would be I mean, honestly, ah you know, I don't know if this has the buzz to like reach that low, but like the lead. I mean, all the performances are really good, but like she is fucking so chilling in this. And like I probably it's going to be one of the performances from this year that sticks with me the most, I think like she she is excellent. of The Kelly, the actress plays Kellyanne.
00:24:08
Speaker
yeah she's got it's kind of like hypnotic in a way her her performance too um not fully similar but it it reminds me of uh the actress in raw like there's just something where it's like even just watching her when she's not talking, she's just very compelling on screen. And I didn't mean to go straight to a French film either. It was just like, there's something about them. I was thinking just hypnotic performances in pretty upsetting films, and yeah, Ra was where my mind went immediately. That's a good pull. That leaves performance in that.
00:24:47
Speaker
uh my ah reference point isn't like from an upsetting thing but these characters or my reaction to these characters felt similar in the way of like towards the end of uh i won't get into you know there's i guess still people who've who never watch Breaking Bad but there's moments in the fight towards the final seasons where you're just watching well and i'm like what are you doing man you know i'm just like yeah you you You need to walk
Tense Poker Scenes
00:25:13
Speaker
away. And and and there's i there's a lot of that uneasiness and tension watching this character in in red rooms where I'm like, please stop. She's like, you don't need to do this. I mean, but we do see she is like a gambler, though, like the the risk, the thrill, like it. I don't know.
00:25:37
Speaker
I know people who are pretty deep into Bitcoin, and they ah take it very seriously. And you know they they don't know when to quit. that they They really don't. And this character, she's deeply into Bitcoin. I was just watching. I'm like, hot you're just like my friend, not like into this for the... My friend doesn't take it to this degree, but I'm like,
00:26:03
Speaker
no there your friend does the same thing never knows when to fucking get out while he's ahead i i like know nothing about crypto so i looked up i i'm jumping all ahead but after that that big scene where she's she's like betting it all and she's trying to bid on on this this stuff video she pays 21.5 Bitcoin. and i looked up I don't know what the exact value was in 2022, but it was that's at least $60,000. That's a lot of fucking money to to drop on the most fucked up thing you could buy. hey guys like Besides child porn, I guess, it's like that child porn stuff films that's Yeah, that's like the worst things you can that's crazy seek out. I figured it was a hefty amount since she was gambling on, you know, doing online poker with Bitcoin. I was like, she's probably dealing with the serious amount of money. And you could see the stress mounting as she's like, check she has her two screen set up where she's like, one side is the bid for the video, the other side's the post. Did she have to do both at the same time? Because she got the money ready
Gambling Scenes Analysis
00:27:09
Speaker
before the bidding? I i mean i guess.
00:27:11
Speaker
I guess she doesn't set the terms for when the bidding, the auction happens. We see earlier on in the movie, like when she first goes to her back home to her apartment, she's a multitasker. she's always's It seems like efficiency is her thing. I have to optimize my time. I have to always be doing the most at every second, which I don't fully understand the sleeping outside. well Let's talk about that in a little bit, but um what's it called? She does. In those final moments, though, when she's gambling, break kind of her approach to gambling where she's like, you can't be emotional about it. and You have to go after the emotional. to invest it in that, in that, that poker match or whatever. She's getting sloppy and her percentage, I kind of wish that it showed you all of like the hands and cards that were on screen. I really wanted to know a split screen or something. well Like even the cards that like were dealt out already, like
00:28:13
Speaker
some of them were whited out and I'm like, Oh, I can't tell if like she's actually got a good hand, but they would show the percentage of her to the other people. I'm like, she's got it. She's going out on like a bluff, you know, she's really risking it here. And she ends up getting out ahead. But yeah, you can see her frustration like intensifying. I was like invested in that, especially because I really do like poker. I've never played poker for money or any kind of like stakes, really outside of like one time for like chump change. But I'd like really have a lot of fun with poker. And I was right there with her. That's why I wish I could see all the cards. I was like, oh, my God. There's there's something that's like almost more than like cinematic depictions of sports. Like when I see
00:28:58
Speaker
ah betting depicted in film, like uncut gems, I'm like so invested. I mean, I guess that is sports betting. So I'm invested in the outcome of that game because of how much he has writing and on it in uncut gems. And it's like that same kind of intent and that same mentality of like how he does not know when to walk away.
00:29:19
Speaker
Uh, but, but like, yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm invested and like, there's kind of this vicarious through where you're like, all right, come on, man. You could, you could, you could pull this, pull this off. I'm not, I wouldn't say I'm like rooting for Kellyanne in this, but there is a thrill to watching her.
00:29:36
Speaker
do that tightrope and act, it it walk in in that scene of like, oh, fuck, you really were pushing it,
Character Motivations
00:29:43
Speaker
lady. Yeah. I mean, and poker in general, I feel like it's just cinematically compelling. I mean, you're losing a little bit of context because she's playing online poker, but it's like you there's a little bit of chance to it. And there's also um human decision making.
00:30:02
Speaker
And the motion present it's there's a lot happening that could control the outcome of a hand of poker. And so, yeah, it's but this movie did a really good job. It might be the only time where I've seen interesting and like tension building online poker before.
00:30:21
Speaker
I can't really think of other examples, yeah. But going back to what you said about like the emotion and human element of poker and in cards, like there's a scene ah between her and and and clement and Clementine where she's kind of explaining her whole system and methodology in in the game she plays. And she's talking about how she really thrives and enjoys on that emotional manipulation aspect. and she like she And specifically saying she wants to take them for all they're worth. like and And Clementine's like, wow, you're evil. And her response is like, well, that's the fucking game or something like that.
00:30:58
Speaker
i mean she kind of is evil because what is her goal in this whole serial killer thing she's really trying to like damage and hurt the fucking family it seems like but she also assists in taking down the serial killer himself by giving the footage of the daughter and whatever else, like the Bitcoin like transactions on that flash drive to them. But it's like, she's also like, I want like, she's a chigger. She's you're trying to like figure out like everybody to suffer in this fucking situation.
Unsettling Character Dynamics
00:31:33
Speaker
That's that's a good that's a good pull. I think her leaving that evidence or the Joker maybe something unnerving about Kellyanne. ah But but I think her leaving that ah flash drive with the the video at the end was not her plan originally. I think I think my interpretation of Elise is like she is you know getting deeper and deeper into this fangirlism and like wanting to ah because before she does that, she's like,
00:32:03
Speaker
taking a picture of herself like on the bed of the girl dressed up as her yeah races anytime they call back to the braces I just fucking disturb I know cuz they like ripped her teeth out with the brick did they rip out like the roof of her mouth it was like attached to the teeth the braces they found upsetting it's it's one of the first things you see in the movie like Trial related when you're seeing the screens like of the computers They're showing the evidence and it's not even really in focus when you when they like it comes up But you could tell what it is. Yeah
00:32:39
Speaker
Uh, the scene where she's fucking putting them on in the court or she's like, she's already has her hair yellow, like the the the the victim. And then she's putting these contacts in, putting the braces in. Like I felt so uncomfortable. That's one of those scenes where I'm like, i um am I committing a crime watching this right now? And the mom notices her pretty quick and then they all start talking about ah her back then I'm like, that's probably how it would play out in real life. Everyone would be like, do you see what's happening? Like I'm not hallucinating that, right? Like she's really but doing that, right? Yeah, that that would be fucking insane. Are there cases of that happening in real life? i Of like showing up to the trial in cosplaying like that? like Yeah, that's like that.
00:33:30
Speaker
I've never personally heard but i it that. I didn't know that's what she was doing when she had the blonde wig either. I like didn't know where I thought she was just like, yeah, this wiggle get me into this trial. And I'm like, guys, she just looks like the same girl with like the fucking
Societal Questions and Realism
00:33:45
Speaker
wig on. She was a very distinct face, you know. Yeah. That's why you asked her in the movie. She looks like she's in a movie.
00:33:53
Speaker
She looks like a model or something. Yeah. But then when you find out what she's actually doing with that wig, very good. I got uncomfortable as soon as I saw the blonde wig, just because I remembered from earlier talking about, they they there's a lot of conversation about the killer's type. And then when I was like, so why is the yellow hair? And then I just kept getting more uncomfortable. Why do you look like Goku? You're going Super Saiyan? Yeah.
00:34:20
Speaker
uh no but what you said like i don't know what specific cases where someone like a group killer groupie or fangirl like did that but like i said this movie feels so real and raw that i wouldn't be surprised that something like that's happened i was listening to part of an interview with the director of where he was he wasn't taking direct inspiration from any one trial but there's i ah just from googling it there were a couple of high profile like uh, Canadian murder trials that were specifically, like, brutal kills that had been filmed. I don't think it was for the purpose of specifically, like, they were, like, you know, auctioning and and selling these these videos, but the fact that there was there was available video evidence of this horrific thing, uh, and, like, really graphically, you know, and like, not just killing someone, but when once you start dismembering people and stuff, it is, like,
00:35:15
Speaker
I mean, that that' a lot it's a lot. yeah Yeah, it's a bit much. I also didn't know Canada doesn't have a death penalty. So like, no matter what you've done, you can't get sentenced to death.
00:35:29
Speaker
Should we debate the death penalty here? Should we do this right now? I wasn't sure. i I don't want to make that the the the whole thing of of the episode, but I i just, I'd never thought, cause I'm always, you know, I'm a dumb American and watch crime ah shows or depictions through through that lens. So I was just like, oh, right. I didn't even think that that was allowed to not not have a death penalty. Like I didn't even can consider that.
00:35:55
Speaker
I mean, yeah, again, I've ah i've tried to ah debate the whole thing. I just thought that was and interesting to to note because that was my thought when when she gives that video at the end and they said that the killer then changes that like he pleads guilty. I was like, oh, because he's fucking worried he's going to get the gas chamber because it's so damning this new video. So he's like if if he does a guilty plea, maybe he can you know, just get like, I was like, Oh, well, that wasn't even the execution is not even on the table for him then. and So I was thinking of that just from like a motivation standpoint of like, but if you're on trial for like, he gets out of solitary confinement.
00:36:35
Speaker
No, just that sometimes if you confess to the thing and agree to certain terms, you can avoid ah the death penalty. No, I understood what you were saying, but so if they don't have the death penalty, what would his plea be then? Is he trying to get ah out of solitary confinement? What's the furthest extreme they would put him in that he would try to plead down from? Because otherwise, why plead guilty? Just stay on trial. I'm fucking fighting this. I'm going to be like, that video is deep faked. There's no plea if you're not going for a lesser degree. Why? Well, that's
Real Trials and True Crime Connections
00:37:09
Speaker
what I'm saying. Like, because I assumed it was to avoid being executed. But now then I now I don't really know what the severe because like.
00:37:18
Speaker
For someone of the crimes that he's committed, I would assume he's just solitary for life. like yeah There's no talking down whatever sentencing you're getting at this point. you know Maybe you don't get death if it's America, you know but it's like it's not even an option here. so like to mean you You've got like three life sentences at the least on your hands. He's just like, huh, the gig's up. the videos are like I had a good run. Yeah, maybe Canada's like very lenient with their, their sentence. He's actually going to be on the street in five years. At first when they were speaking French, I was like, wait, this doesn't look like anatomy of a fall. But then I had to remember it was a different country.
00:38:03
Speaker
These French language crime courtroom drama. Wait a minute. I thought anybody was allowed to speak. Why is he in a box? I like the box. I'm like keep all of our murderers in a box. it makes me Yeah, it seems like so like a super villain you like put in a box. Yeah, like Ethan Hunt at the end of Mission Impossible Rogue Nation. When he puts Solomon Lane in there, yeah. Yeah.
00:38:27
Speaker
Yeah, that's that's where they belong. Put them in a box. Yeah, exactly. ah Make it look like Ethan Hunt captured everybody. but We didn't see leading up to this guy's arrest. Ethan Hunt, me I normally, he's like in other countries or, you know, stopping threats abroad. He could have been in Canada. He could have taken this guy down. Yeah, very re- he's- every movie usually begins with him like in the middle of something or kind of end in something. So maybe, you know,
00:38:54
Speaker
Like, in between movies, then at the beginning of the next movie, if there's if you notice that there's been some time kind of time jump, you're like, what was Ethan doing during that? He was catching this guy. Like, that's that's what he was up to. Or, like, you could just say maybe, like, that's what Luther was doing in Ghost Protocol, you know?
00:39:12
Speaker
That's why he only shows up at the end, yeah because he was yeah he was busy. Yeah, he was catching this guy. In 2011 when that movie came out, he was catching this guy. we don't Mission Impossible could take place in the future very easily. They really don't ever like date it in that way, which which I like. But anyway, back to Red Rooms.
Courtroom Drama Portrayal
00:39:33
Speaker
ah Yeah. of all the like in It's a testament to this movie that like it is just not am i only on my edge just because of how unnerving and intense the topics of what they're discussing and and like showing these images of that you're only getting like little glimpses of. But it's just visually compelling in the way they're shooting the whole movie, but especially like the the the courtroom stuff. you know
00:40:03
Speaker
i've I've heard some people say that like courtroom dramas are un-cinematic. that That's basically like a play. And I'm like, I disagree. You could make them very cinematic. Yeah, I feel like the history of filmmaking has proven that wrong. I mean, there have been accolades given to movies that take place in courtrooms, like Joker, Folly, and Deux.
00:40:23
Speaker
as which, you know, current front-runners. I mean, Anatomy of a Fall came out last year. Didn't that win awards at the Oscars? Like... It could have been a play. No of angry men. You know, 12 angry men. A few good men has courtroom scenes that are iconic that, like, get referenced still, like... Yeah, exactly. Who are making... Who's making these claims? They need to be sent somewhere else. They need to be put in a box. Send them into space. Yeah, put them in a box.
00:40:51
Speaker
that's That's my new solution. to average but Just put them in a box. Yeah, put them in a box. ah But no, i'm ah speaking of visuals, it really will stick with me. ah There's a lot of, anytime that we're seeing the light reflected on the that red light when they're watching the videos, I love those sequences. But then there's also that sequence when they're watching, maybe this is a real Canada program. To me, it kind of seemed like of Canada equivalent of like Bill Maher or something like some kind of can like Comedian who's like willing to say anything and like I'll go there and we're gonna talk about whatever like we don't care We're not holding back like the the show that Clementine calls into ah yeah And there's like an image of like it's a side shot of Her face and you also see it because not only is it on the TV? It's also on Kelly Ann's like computer monitor. So you see the computer motor be like
00:41:48
Speaker
behind Clementine's face and I just thought there was just something so compelling and evocative about that specific shot and image of of like Yeah. So something there about, I mean, this whole movie is about like how culture engages with these horrific things, but like right there in that moment. And there's another moment later where she's like, Kellyanne sits her down and like, you
Character Transformations
00:42:13
Speaker
fight it out. Like, no, she, she has the first two videos. Like she's had had access to that the whole time, which I fucking, I was not surprised when she'd like,
00:42:21
Speaker
relayed that to clementines like yeah of course you fucking do he's free but before that with the phone call though it is like kind of a crushing moment even though i've been very annoyed with this character up until this point and i'm like god ditch this wacko when they like call her crazy and they tell her to talk to your therapist and one person on the panel of the show or whatever Is like starts like pleading with them like hang up the phone or whatever get help or something Yeah, and and in it really humanizes because like you said the initially you're like this. She's a lot like she she's she's ah But but then and like even listens to an extent she like absorbs the information there like not information but she absorbs what's being said to her and it's like you feel for her whereas the main character we're following just
00:43:11
Speaker
Doesn't give a shit. It's like all of this applies to her and it just doesn't even faze her at all Yeah, like for Clementine she and she she's obviously like Under this, you know, she's like fallen for for for the this killer and it's blinded her but you realize that she doesn't it's not like she has zero self-awareness like and that's where it starts to kind of like It doesn't fully crystallize until she's shown the videos where she's like, oh, this guy is guilty. Like this guy that I was in love and obsessed with, like, he's a fucking psychopath who like butchered and raped these these girls. Like you can you see her face like process all that in real time. Kelly Ann, like you said, she doesn't give a shit. She really she's just worried about when she starts having career rep, rep or cut it because like like we alluded to her being a mo like, he's like, yeah, bitch, you're going to this highly public trial like
00:44:03
Speaker
Are you surprised that you're like losing gigs and like people are seeing you at this at this thing? but but like Clementine actually has a line before she says sees the videos which actually got me like mad where she was like, all those videos sound horrific.
Serial Killer Fandom
00:44:19
Speaker
I hope they catch the person who did that. And I was just like, God, you suck.
00:44:24
Speaker
and But then like shortly after she sees the videos and like her reality is like shaken and she's like, I'm just going to go home. I'm not going to sleep outside tonight. And I did really like that change. I'm like, oh, this is a person who has like humanity. it's like you know Maybe they ah do have you know a little things up with them, but they are still affected. And like that she's getting the message. She's hearing what people are saying. she's like Taking an information and she's learning she's growing as a person you know it it's interesting but um
00:45:01
Speaker
Yeah, it's ah it's a very interesting juxtaposition, because even with her final actions of when Kellyanne gives that evidence over at the end, I don't think she has the same kind of change in heart as Clementine. Like, I'm not sure what's going through her head, but now that I'm kind of thinking through it, is it maybe just a little more of like, well, I've taken this as far as I can. And i she's she's getting increasingly more paranoid as the movie goes on. So is she just worried about Reaper? Like, she's like, I don't want to go to jail. I need to stop. Well, they're honestly like two different kinds of people like Clementine is almost like obsessive like someone who obsesses ah obsesses over a celebrity like a person who has
00:45:46
Speaker
ah the posters of somebody all over their wall and it's applying that to just a really strange person to apply that to and it's like you find her just defending reprehensible actions just because and don't know she's under this weird spell that like people do like find themselves under with like celebrities. I've never really been that kind of person. Like there's this band as like dying. Their singer put a hit out on his wife or whatever and he ended up going to an undercover cop, getting sent to jail. I was like, all right, fuck that dude. That's like reprehensible. I'm not supporting them. He came back, was redeemed, ah quote unquote. Well, now he's going through some shit again and the band is falling apart. Everybody in the band just laughed and they're like, yeah, because we can't defend his actions, which
00:46:34
Speaker
haven't come to light yet, so. It's probably really, really bad.
Psychological Depth of Characters
00:46:38
Speaker
um Yeah, it's, ah you know, but people jump back on board and I'm like, you know, I don't understand how you can just, you know, defend how you can just because you idolize them in some way or you find something you really like about them, how you can really stick around and like defend their actions and say like, oh, they're changed, they're different, like it's all good.
00:47:03
Speaker
And so it's almost like that same kind of idea, except but with Kellyanne, I can't really define fully what's up with her, but it's um it's more than just obsessive fan. there's There's something else there. Hey, Nathan, how's it going? is this Sorry, we're in the middle of record. We can talk later, though.
00:47:33
Speaker
Hi, Nathan. you see
00:47:37
Speaker
That'll be a bonus content. Yeah, ah yeah right. I'll do the bloopers in the crowd. We'll hang out later, buddy. That was a ah my nephew guys. If we keep that in the podcast, my nephew came home.
00:47:52
Speaker
Yeah, special cameo. Yeah. ah But what were you saying? Like, oh, Kellyanne. Yeah, because that's the the whole movie. I'm like. Yeah, what would you say she is because she's not obsessive fan. She's something else. Then she starts. Yeah, because that. that that Or is she obsessing over the dead girl? Is that what she, it's obsessed, obsession over her. Like she wants to be her. i'm That's what's, it's so undefinable and and unnerving about
Unsettling Motivations
00:48:21
Speaker
her. And I, and I like that ah you definitely get the sense of when when Clementine's rattling off all these like statistics about false, uh, imprisonments or like you can fake.
00:48:31
Speaker
These kind of videos and stuff. I think she's definitely when she's striking up this friendship with Kelly She's assuming that Kelly Ann also thinks he's innocent, you know, he's like you're like me We love we you know, we're we're we're you know obsessed with this guy, but he's he's clearly innocent She never says anything to indicate that she thinks he's innocent yeah In fact, she is arguing the evidence when she's like, well, what about the braces were attached to the teeth. Clementine's trying to be like, well, girls take their braces off, or retainers and stuff, so maybe she took it off at school, and that's how it ended up, the and so she's like, they were attached to the teeth. She gets asked too why she's there um pretty early on, and her reasoning is I just wanted to see what he looks like, and I was like, oh, that's kind of like a nothing answer, but maybe there's more to it than that.
00:49:19
Speaker
ah I don't really know, because that sounds like something like a victim's family member would say. At a certain point, I was like, is it it like going to be his daughter or something? Right. There was a point where they're like, if you don't have any attachment to the case or anything like that, leave. And I was like, is she going to stay seated? We were like, she's still there. What? Yeah, but that didn't happen. and I thought that for for a second too, but no, she's just a fucking freak. Yeah, she's the worst of the worst, but she just doesn't show it like everybody else does. And she definitely thinks she's ah above people like Clementine. like She's she's being ah extending this charity, letting her stay there, kind of like humoring her, I guess to an extent.
00:50:04
Speaker
There's almost probably a little bit of sadistic pleasure that she gets from showing this to Clementine and crushing her. I mean, she tries to warn her of like, yeah, this is not your world. You don't want to see this. and it But when she's putting on the video, because there's the moment. Civil War kind of. Yeah, but basically. Yeah. Basically the same movie. But there's that moment between the first video And she's about to start the second one. Clementine's like, hold on. I need a minute.
Societal Reflections and Human Nature
00:50:34
Speaker
You know, like this is really fucking my the whole reality is coming undone. Give me a moment. And she just starts it. She just starts it because like she I think she wants to like like, OK, you need you need to. We're going to break. She's like, you think you really know what's going on here? You think you're in on it?
00:50:56
Speaker
you can't handle what's real You can't handle the truth. You're not a real fan like me. Name five songs. yeah Your five favorite kills. You weren't there from the first album. Yeah, you're fucking a fair weather fan.
00:51:12
Speaker
um Did she like want to be a victim of this guy because that's why I keep going back to the why did she dress up like the victim that part was so Disturbing not just because of what she's doing but the music built like building up to that and then the sound design of like they're putting the screams in as she's being carried out of the courtroom and then it cuts back to him and he gives this little wave to her it's so fucking i'm getting like chills right now it's so unsettling yeah is it just the thrill of it the thrill of getting close that close to the murder on that level like i'm dressing up
00:51:50
Speaker
as your victim. Is she auditioning for theme practical jokers? She's like a Harley Quinn kind of thing. This is like scare tactics or something. yeah you know It's like what is happening here? It's really fucked up in practical jokers. Yeah, John Peel took it too far with this season he's producing.
00:52:10
Speaker
I knew he was going to make it dark, but damn. Yeah. Maybe that's exactly what she wanted to like that wave and acknowledgment, like some kind of Harley Quinn mentality where it's like, I want you to see me, you know, like you're talking about the Folly Adil Harley Quinn or the Suicide Squad Harley Quinn. Which Harley Quinn are we talking and animated series? Harley Quinn, I guess. Yeah, I get it.
00:52:35
Speaker
It's hard to tell. I really, you know, no of todd phillips was he i want I want to sit next to Todd Phillips while he watches this like Kelly and watching Clementine's reaction. I want to just look at his face while he we see the the glow of the screen ah on his face while I'm watching him watch red rooms. I'm like, yeah, how you feel about that, buddy?
00:52:56
Speaker
so So the dressing up as the daughter, so what what we know, what she does when she's dressed up as the daughter, we know she takes the picture of her in the bed and we know she waves at the killer. None of the dressing up as the daughter is for the family at all. That's just, they're just getting a little bit, they're catching a little, you know, little side from that. I think you said earlier, if like she wants that suffering, there could, she,
00:53:25
Speaker
It's all around suffering. It doesn't seem like she's she's not not a sadist, you know? like I'd be the worst person in this scenario somehow. Like worse than the killer who belated and raped the girls, yeah. How can I be more fucked up than everybody in this room?
00:53:43
Speaker
It's like main character syndrome or someone's like, I need to be the most psychotic person here. Exactly. He's like, you think he's crazy? I'm dressing up like the victim. I'm fucking cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. Yeah, it's. ah I guess that is the real drop. What is this character's intentions?
Character Paranoia and Consequences
00:54:05
Speaker
I'd really like to know what the actor thinks. Like how did she play that? You know, like because that's what I do. I'm really compelled about care. You know, I made the Walter White comparison earlier. He's compelling because he's full of all these contradictions. And there's moments where you're like, why are you doing this? And and and like that, that's similarly
00:54:27
Speaker
there's There's there's something about Kelly and where you're just trying to like, like solve or like some kind of puzzle more so than like, like how some true crime people. I i would assume their fascination is they want to understand why this killer could be cable and why they do this. I'm think having those thoughts about her. I'm like, why are you doing this? You know, why was she sleeping outside?
00:54:52
Speaker
I think that was just, she was just trying to be there right, you know, like when people camp out for PS5 launch at GameStop, they want to be first in line that she's just, that's, she's like, I'm fucking being the first, I'm getting a C. I gotta to get the Wii right now.
00:55:08
Speaker
doesn't need it Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah. Okay. That that makes sense. Well, cause I knew that's why the other girl was doing it, but I was just introduced to her being outside. So at first I was like, is she homeless? And I, Clementine virtually is homeless, but she doesn't have, like she came from a town where she lived, but she doesn't have any money or anywhere to stay at that point.
00:55:33
Speaker
But the first shot of the movie, yeah, I guess it is Kellyanne outside and she gets up and then she enters the courtroom and then we get the long monologue. Yeah, okay, so. Yeah, she's just camping out. She wants, she's like, i'm getting I'm getting the seat I want. Yeah, man, jeez.
00:55:48
Speaker
she just takes it too far yeah like when she's like bidding on that video and then it's like sold to whatever it's like yeah congratulations you're fucking creep like what the hell right like she she I like she just I hope you feel accomplished by all this yeah she is very robotic or like i said alien through a lot of it and hard to read but she she's genuinely like celebratory and excited that she wins the bid but i love how that's immediately undercut because it's been introduced that she has like this kind of like ah
00:56:21
Speaker
Amazon Echo or Siri device that she like custom program because like comes in AI Yeah, that that but that she trained herself like like unlike any of those other devices which are listening to you and and that are ah you know, just trained on just like what the internet feeds and she's like I taught it, you know ah gave it the capability for itself to to learn. And so there's this recurring thing where ah Clementine starts asking her to tell a joke and she asked, ah I don't even know how to pronounce the name of the device, to tell a joke after she wins the bid. And I wrote down the the quote, it was like,
00:57:02
Speaker
something about like ah a ghost being why ghost so such bad liars because you can see right through them something like that yeah it's exactly that and there's like an immediately because she was like so excited from Wayne but she immediately has this drop and I don't my interpretation was it's like Because there's more and more lingering looks the longer it goes
Societal Issues and Moral Questions
00:57:25
Speaker
on. She's just noticing other people in the courtroom noticing her. Because there's that one guy looking at her, I'm like, is that guy a cop that's looking back at her? And she's probably having that thought. I was like, is that a cop? And then after she wins the bid and her just putting her device in the blenders, did she get free? Because what she's doing is very illegal. It's also like, ask it another joke, you know? Ask it a follow up joke, see what it says. If it doesn't repeat the same thing, then it's like the magical eight ball. You got to just double check. Yeah. See if it's, you know, working correctly. You know, I was just like, you just rush in to destroy this thing. Ask it another joke.
00:58:09
Speaker
she could make her buy a new, I don't know, she's good enough, like I'm not ah worried about her, even though her modeling career seems to to be over, like she'll probably be okay. She spent all her money on a snuff film.
00:58:23
Speaker
yeah that should be like She's now actually homeless, because she like spent everything. Could probably earn her money back, though. like she I like the scene where she's like, I earned enough money to pay for our lunch right now, and she's like, this is new money.
00:58:38
Speaker
and and And she also has some some things she says where it's like, money is just numbers in a computer or something. She's like, um I'm pretty good with numbers. She's really resourceful. Like when she gets the Wi-Fi password for... um Oh, so when she hacks like the door.
00:58:55
Speaker
Yeah, but like her like process of like going through email. She has all the people's emails with like login. She's trying to find the wifi password. Yeah. Yeah. It's, she's very resourceful. So I could fit, see her getting things back on track, but it's like also, I mean, she will probably get caught for the crime she's committed.
00:59:17
Speaker
Because like ah like we keep saying, what she's doing is extremely illegal. like the the kind of film like They're talking about this marketplace where you know it seemed like he's filming these murders with the intention to sell them on the... you know they They have a ah tech ah analyst in the courtroom who's explaining that like, yeah, the dark web is used for all this illegal stuff like snuff films, child porn, but like, there is a legitimate like, whether you're like a journalist or you live in a country where like, you know, all information and the internet suppress and you're just trying to not get caught with that there are
00:59:54
Speaker
not unethical reasons to want to like be in an untraceable, like, you know, like the shady back alleys of of the internet. But like, what she is specifically doing is so illegal. Yeah. Yeah, again, like you said, it's like,
01:00:11
Speaker
second to anything involving children, basically. And I mean, technically, it does involve children. These are three high school children. They specifically said this was sexual. You're watching maybe the worst thing possible. you Aside from committing the crime, you're like doing the second worst thing, right? Yeah. God.
01:00:31
Speaker
Maybe she's- And it was so fucked up in the messaging too where someone's like, I'll just watch the leak online or whatever. It's like- It's like how someone talks what about a Marvel trailer or something like, ah, whatever, I'll just wait
Consequences and Moral Implications
01:00:44
Speaker
for the leak. It is crazy that there are people like this in the world and I do wonder like- Are these people just living among us? Or is this someone who ah you would recognize as strange on the street and you avoid in your everyday life? Or is this like a coworker or like someone you could sit next to at, you know, on the train or like, you know, or they could just be ah same quote him whatever on the outside, quote unquote, normal ah people like, you know, unless you really took the time to like,
01:01:15
Speaker
I feel like if I did sit down and spend a little bit of time with Kellyanne, I would feel something, even if she didn't divulge, like, her interest and stuff, I'd be like, oh, there's a weird vibe here, I'm gonna go.
01:01:26
Speaker
but I would like to think I at least have that kind of intuition or ability to to read read people but she does but she blends in more than Clementine who is the overtly crazed fangirl. She at least up until the point where this movie starts is able to like she has a, you know, seeming pretty successful career and, you know,
01:01:47
Speaker
ah Her agent says something at one point about like, I know your brand is like being edgy. So maybe she kind of has that like built in protection of like, well, if she's doing something that's seen as a little eccentric or weird. She's like, that's just she's just a fucking provocateur, man. She's just like, she's just that's how edgy she is. But yeah, I think you she's beyond it. And she rightfully so when she starts when she's you know let go. It's like, yeah, you cross the line here.
01:02:19
Speaker
Across a couple of lines. She should be in jail. Definitely. She should be in a box. Put her in a box. She will probably end up in a box. That's Red Rooms 2. It's Red Rooms 2 is her trial.
01:02:35
Speaker
You think people were on to her those that van outside of the house you think that was actually for her those people talking outside after her before she made the purchase looking up at the window like she. Pause the camera feed for a little bit was that for nothing like i think.
01:02:53
Speaker
I could go both ways on a lot of those little things that she's interpreting and being, I think her putting her Sierra or whatever in the blender, she's just being paranoid at that point. I don't think they bugged her home AI assistant. Especially if she's protected it in the way I think she said she did. It's like not connected to the cloud or the internet at all, so it's like how would they have even access to it. And it's like, I don't, you know, not that law enforcement doesn't have research, but I'm like, I don't think the cops have that high level of hackers that they're like, you know, getting into that. But like, there are definitely like undercover cops or feds on the dark web. So like she if she keeps going, and maybe there's like another case she starts trying to get
01:03:38
Speaker
like footage or shit of like she will get caught probably. Well, she's made herself pretty known um at the trial already. already She's on camera on on the news like at this thing. Yeah. So, I mean, a lot of signs are probably going to be pointing to her. And so I guess the big thing is, can she dodge at all?
01:03:58
Speaker
She'd be like, hey, I left the one video. ah You should be giving me a medal. I don't know if she's quite capable of dodging at all. I don't know. It seems like she'll get caught eventually. But who knows?
01:04:11
Speaker
Yeah, it just seems like someone like that, they don't know when to, cause like, like I said, I don't interpret her leaving that evidence as like turning over a new leaf where she's like, well, I'm never going to do anything.
Real vs Fictional Violence
01:04:24
Speaker
kind of Like closing the book on that. Like maybe if the trial ends, they'll fucking stop looking at me. Right. you know Yeah. But then she, she's probably gonna get interested in another grizzly thing at some this point. Probably isn't the first, her first rodeo.
01:04:39
Speaker
Yeah, if like check her hard drive. Has she downloaded other stuff films or whatever? like like i i yeah It seems like it's hard. like What's the gateway drug for something like that? i mean Yeah, she was very experienced. She knew what to do at every moment. This is probably like her fifth time at least doing this. you know Because i mean even looking for like the codes that she needed, she was like, code for this, code for smart house, code for Wi-Fi. And then she goes to the Wi-Fi.
01:05:09
Speaker
she just She knows what to do at every turn. she doesn't There's no roadblock that stops her. there was That sequence was really unnerving, not just because of the score. It's it's crazy how intense just someone staring at a computer screen can can be it with the right filmmaking choices. but But yeah, I had that thought while she was doing all this. I'm like, you've have you done this before? you're like you're very very if It's not like,
01:05:35
Speaker
is it you didn't have to look up tutorials for any of this i you seem like you you know what you're doing here yeah i think you're probably right that she has done this before and will probably likely continue to yeah i think she eventually gets caught though that's my i just feel like eventually this operation crashes and burns it can't if if it didn't already just like real serial killers who often can't help themselves, whether it's like they just, you know, seek out another victim even after they've already been getting away with it, or a lot of them statistically, at least the ones, caught ones that we know of, they'll just like strip be going to the crime scenes or trying to like talk to law enforcement. Sometimes they insert themselves into the investigation, like talking to the lead cop and stuff. I mean, she kind of is inserting herself into the investigation. but
01:06:26
Speaker
If anything, more eyes might be on her now that she left this because they're going to be like, where did this come from? You know, and exactly. um There was a point I was going to make. um I don't know. We can move on. This is a very interesting movie, though. I liked it a lot.
01:06:46
Speaker
um Yeah, I feel like just talking about, I feel like I need to take a shower. It's just gross to think about this stuff. Like, like I know I keep saying it, it's like, i've I've never had the interest of like, where it's like, oh, there's a beheading video that's going viral or people should like, no, scroll pad, no, thank you. I do not want to see it, you know, in and and just ah thinking or hearing about like,
01:07:16
Speaker
real violence and murder like so the the most depraved stuff because like we said it's not just murder's already really bad but like you're you're I don't even know what order that stuff happened in, was he?
01:07:30
Speaker
having sex with the bodies ever? I don't know. I don't want to
Film's Emotional Impact
01:07:33
Speaker
think about it. i I thought I read something, maybe it was in the subtitles at the beginning. I thought I quickly read something where they said that he was having sex with the bodies like after post-mortem. Yeah, it's upsetting. Really, really fucked up stuff. I'm glad they didn't really show much at all. But the the screams that you hear are are still pretty, pretty bad. The the the screams are disturbing the most like like like we said before that out of focus shot of like the the braces and the teeth and then you see when she's showing Clementine the videos we see it cut to one of them after the killings already happening he goes to the camera to shut it off and you just see a lot of blood in that room. boom
01:08:20
Speaker
Yeah, but then, you yeah, you get a good look at his eyes too. And I'm like, they would probably be able to one for one, like this guy's eyes. You see a good enough around, like there's good enough around. It's not like the video quality is bad. it's yeah like you could There's like,
01:08:38
Speaker
I, but you know, we're like almost at minority report now with fucking eye recognition. And his face is like right in the camera when he's almost like, it's like, he's like signing up like, Hey, look at my eyes. Yeah, he's like a fucking YouTuber or something. He just got some. Don't forget to subscribe. Yeah, just got an overview of Terrifier 3, you know. That's why there's all the blood.
01:09:03
Speaker
What if he watched Terrifier and he's like, ugh, that's too much. He could be a bit squeamish, who knows. I don't know. People are full of contradictions, who knows, yeah. Yeah. um You got any final thoughts on the movie?
01:09:20
Speaker
just uh what a fucking movie man it's so oh and we we talked about clementine's like self-realization that she does have humanity i do like that little scene at the end where she's being interviewed and like basically coming forward of like yeah i was like and entranced by this guy, but it was all a fucking lie. What she's describing, you kind of do under like obviously she was very naive, but when she's talking about she saw this sadness in him that she may be identified with. I'm like, that makes sense, that like someone especially someone who's probably really sad and going through stuff like her, that then she sees this public figure who looks really sad. She's like, oh no, he's being persecuted.
01:10:04
Speaker
yeah Well, I agree. And also, now that you mention it, she could very well take down Kellyanne. She was. She wanted to. She was there and she'd be like, yeah, this is this this bitch has stuff films like. Kellyanne is her real name. That's because she only that's how she introduced herself to Clementine. Does her general id does her agent call her ah Kellyanne?
01:10:32
Speaker
Uh, I think so. Okay. Yeah. Maybe that is her name. Yeah. Cause I was trying to figure out her deal at the beginning. And when she's like arranging her schedule and everything, I think I heard her get called Kellyanne a few times. Cause I was like, wait, she was sleeping outside. Is she breaking into someone's house? Like what is this character's deal? But, um,
01:10:53
Speaker
Quick i was able to kind of pin together i'm like oh she's just about like fucking efficiency she's doing like chris hemsworth like level workouts while reading up on the case of the serial killer whatever and watching news footage of the mom and all of this. There was that was another really disturbing part of how she could so quickly go from I think it was in the same sequence of after she's looking up the Wi-Fi password to like of the the the family's house and there's that news footage playing of the mom and and then she just quickly get goes from one thing like you said she's like maximizing her efficiency like some kind of machine she just gets up and then puts on the exercise video and starts working out I'm like what's wrong with you Yeah, I thought that same thing I was like geez and she's like not doing an easy workout too It's like a physically like intensive thing and she just hops right into it. She's drinking her shake before she does that too I'm like god I would fucking puke I think if I just went into that level of full-body physical activity after drinking a shake and while ingesting all of this heavy information on the serial killer. Yeah, it's she's she's a lot. She's a lot to take in. Not on on the surface. It doesn't seem like it, but she seems like a bad hang. She could play. Now that I made the machine comparison, like she could play a Terminator. She also eats on the floor, too. She doesn't have like much furniture. Yeah, I did clock that at her plate. And again, she hasator like behavior she has could afford to kind of reminds me of like some obsessive Michael Mann protagonist. How like De Niro's place in like he is just, there's there's a bed. That's it. Like he doesn't have anything in his, his, his place is very nice, but it's like nothing is in it. Or she, she's, could be like a villain in a mission impossible movie. Like that's probably the character who gets kicked out the window and ghost protocol. And that's probably how she sleeps just like on a floor. lay a a do ah sad do yeah Yeah, exactly. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, these French women. Well, one's from France and one's French Canadian. Same difference. They're all evil. so Just kidding. Love the French. I love French fries and ah ah John Luke Picard from Star Trek. That character's French somehow. Por favor, okay.
01:13:28
Speaker
okay At one point, ah some character, I forget when someone's asking like how or or what or something. And I just heard Como. I was like, that's Spanish. Yeah, they're stealing from our neighbors. Well, I guess Canada's also our neighbors. They're stealing from the other side of our yard. Yeah. Like, it's your own language, man. Yeah. Mexico's our friends.
01:13:57
Speaker
Not yours.
01:14:01
Speaker
I mean... It's like our two friends are hanging out behind our back. Were you guys talking about me? Yeah, the Mexicans and the French Canadians are hanging out with the Americans. Just walk into a room and they're whispering and then they just stop? Yeah. Okay, that was a little weird. Maybe. Whispering in Spanish? Some combination of Spanish and French. Some fusion, new fusion language.
01:14:26
Speaker
yeah Even more dangerous than the last one.
01:14:35
Speaker
I can't remember what happened the last time we fused together a language. Nearly ended the full whole world. Not since the events of Dragon Ball Z Fusion were born. Have we seen a fusion like this? Janimba's back. Shout out to Janimba.
01:14:52
Speaker
jenimba in a box. Yeah.
01:14:57
Speaker
It's our early days of the podcast. One of our early episodes begins with the whole Dragon Ball Z conversation. oh Right. And we were just talking about before ah we recorded to put boo in a box. Yeah, put boo in a box. Well,
01:15:11
Speaker
Kid boo, put kid boo in a box. Majin boo can go in a box. Well, super boo, I mean. Majin boo's the good one. Super boo's the skinny one, right? The tall one. The lean one. Yeah. Yeah, lean muscle.
01:15:27
Speaker
The one who, if if I'm remembering that episode, chris he has an attack called human extinction or extermination, where he just like kills every, I mean, they wish everyone back because it's Dragon Ball, but there's a moment where he just kills all the non like main characters on earth. Everybody who's not in the hyperbolic time chamber, except for Tien. Yeah. I don't know, Tien like dodges him, they like cut to him and he's like, Chao Tzu, no. And then like,
01:15:54
Speaker
30 episodes later, Tien comes in and like gets his ass beat or gets absorbed or something. I think he gets absorbed, yeah. Why did you give him a lie? um you know but he Yeah, it happens like right after Gohan gets like the fucking snot beat out of him. Boo just beats his ass. He's like, here, would you like this ass back?
01:16:18
Speaker
If I was one of the lower tier, like non-saying characters and I saw a Saiyan lose, I was like, all right, I'm just gonna, oh, I should find another planet to go to or something. I don't know. It was like, I'm out of here. Exactly. We should cancel Boo, cancel Super Boo at least. Yeah, I think killing everyone on the earth is grounds for cancellation. He did human cancellation.
01:16:46
Speaker
and filled the earth. Yeah, exactly. ah That's really what this movie is about. They were trying to cancel Kelly Ann and whatever the killer's name was. They were just, they were just after after him. yeah Cancer culture is toxic.
01:17:02
Speaker
ah yeah I like that Clementine was basically saying fake news about the evidence video. She's like, I don't know, you could deep fake that stuff. yeah You could could do anything with computers now until she immediately when seeing the actual video, she does not question. them It's like ah immediately she is clocking the severity and how real this is. It's like you clearly can't handle that. You're you're named after a fruit. Like you were never you weren't born for this.
01:17:32
Speaker
This is the main character named Apple in this? Yeah, no. Not to my knowledge. Not in my movie.
01:17:41
Speaker
so Gwyneth Paltrow or some celebrity, they have a kid named Apple. Celebrities always give their kids weird names. Not in my movie. Well, that's why she got kicked out of the Marvel universe. Doing stuff like that. yeah She does not even remember she was in this movie. You can't have that level of privilege.
01:18:01
Speaker
Anyway, um good movie good movie. Yeah Great great movie. It's it's very extremely well made. I want i'm interested I think this director has done a couple of features before Uh, I might I might check. I mean, I know it sounds like they're very different, but i'm just interested to see what he does Uh next because of this left such a strong emotional impression on me but then also the the actors like the actors playing kelly ann i'm really want to Because like sometimes a performance, is especially like when we import actors from that would like kind of popped in a in another country's movie, they get locked into like a type, you know, like how Christoph Waltz just played the same kind of character forever. And ah it kind of kind of happened to Mad Mickelson in American movies. I hope she doesn't just become like steely robotic villain in everything, because like maybe she does have a lot of before. Let's put her in a rom com. She's like like really warm and and delightful or something. Caster is Dr. Doom. Every actor should play Dr. Doom. Caster is Dr. Doom. Caster is the Joker. Make this movie a part of the MCU. I mean, it definitely could be part of the JCU, the Joker Cinematic Universe. It could be.
01:19:26
Speaker
You're on the earpugs. Yeah, I don't want to be the Marvel thing. No, I episode this. Yeah, not the time. Not on the red rooms episode. But anyway, you could follow the show's ah Twitter at guys got juice. And then there's my personal Twitter at Doug or not underscore two. And then check out ah my YouTube. It's ah the Doug or not to 91. I'm going to be.
01:19:54
Speaker
uh covering like some some various uh tv things like i'm i'm gonna be uploading probably tonight uh episode i did with my buddy chris where we were watching talking about the penguin it's from the episode ah a couple weeks ago but we will most likely be be doing something on on the rest of the the season too. And there's also been a couple horror shows that I watched recently. There's this James Wan produced horror show on Peacock called Tea Cup that I'm really digging. I think I'm probably going to record something on that for my YouTube. So yeah, just ah check that out.
01:20:30
Speaker
Um, you can follow us on Instagram at these guys got juice pod. Um, keep an eye out in a couple of weeks from when this episode comes out, uh, I have a podcast with my friend Mercedes called children of the gore. We're going to be doing, uh, just talking about horror movies that the other hasn't seen. We started with psycho. We just recorded our misery episode and next up is green room. Um, so we're. Still figuring out the kinks of the podcast, but keep an eye out for that. um We're gonna be, you know...
01:21:02
Speaker
going to be figuring it out soon, hopefully. I'm, I'm, I'm stoked to, to
Blind Spots in Horror Movies
01:21:07
Speaker
listen to that. And I have so many, I know I'm like constantly referencing a billion movies, but I have so many blind spots. So I feel like there's going to be definitely be so of of ah at least just from the couple of things you told me you guys are going to be doing. I'm like, Oh, that's a good excuse for me to now watch all of these, you know, like,
01:21:25
Speaker
Like i i'm I'm looking forward to listening to the show, but also now i have I'll be able to watch along with with with some of these of horror blind spots. So that that's pretty exciting. Looking forward to
Guest Appearances and Cinema Influences
01:21:38
Speaker
that.
01:21:38
Speaker
Yeah. And hopefully you'll be able to come on for a couple of episodes too. oh Sure. Yeah. If you guys are gonna have guests, I'd love to like, yeah. And any of, any of those kinds of movies, especially older, i you know, I, I think, but you know, you've talked a lot this year, how you've gotten more and more into like,
01:21:56
Speaker
like 70s cinema and like that probably still is my favorite era of of film at least like for ah American filmmaking but uh I've just been watching more like older horror movies like like even stuff from like the 40s or 50s and think some of them like actually like like yeah this is getting to me or like and or even just seeing the DNA of like oh shit David Lynch must have seen this when he was younger or something because there's like so much in this that like seems to parallel stuff he did so like yeah I love I love all horror but especially going back and like ah older horror and discovering that stuff is is really ah is such a joy
01:22:38
Speaker
Yeah, if you've got one that you're sure both of us haven't seen too, like that would be a good episode, then I've got some ideas too for um possibly having you on.
Podcast Title and Farewell
01:22:48
Speaker
Hell yeah, I got a couple of the pitch here. Nice, hell yeah. And so keeping an eye out for that, Children of the Gore. I think that's the the name. i It's a mouthful, so i I think I got it right. I mean, it's a good title. Yeah, it is.
01:23:02
Speaker
and You can follow me on Letterboxd at Nicholas Ewers. I haven't been doing too much of like a lengthy review thing over there, but um I'm going to probably be getting back into it. I've just been watching a lot of horror movies, but um yeah, I haven't had too many insane thoughts about what I've been watching. But, you know, give me a follow over there. There might be something interesting coming up that I post. And I'm Nick Ewers. I'm Doug Jamport.
01:23:32
Speaker
we these guys had you have a good one naive
01:23:55
Speaker
Where?
01:24:00
Speaker
These guys got juice. Have a good one.