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Kraven the Hunter
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Today on These Guys Got Juice, the guys are reviewing Kraven the Hunter, starring Aaron Taylor-Johnson!
Is this the best the SU-MC have to offer? Should these things be stopped? Do any of these even have juice? Listen and find out!
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Transcript
Introductions and 'Kraven the Hunter'
00:00:18
Speaker
I'm Doug Davenport. I'm Nick Ewers. And we're The Sky's Got Juice. And we saw Kraven the Hunter. Nowadays, everybody want to talk like we got something to say, but nothing comes out when they move their lips. Just a bunch of gibberish. Motherfuckers act like they forgot about Krai. Ooh, I stumbled a little bit, but I'm going to keep that.
00:00:35
Speaker
No, keep that in. That was good. Yeah. and then I want to run around talking about crossbows like I ain't got none. I think I sold them all. That's good. I like that. Well, we'll have to rewrite the whole song. ah though That should be the episodes. I was just like trying to figure out the lyrics to this.
Dr. Dre and Pop Culture Jokes
00:00:52
Speaker
Dr. Dre hit us up, man. You know. What's he doing? He's just making headphones right now? like He makes them personally, right? yeah You know, I think allegedly domestic abuse issues, you know, at some point in time. Yes. Talk about Beats by Dre.
00:01:12
Speaker
Damn. Yeah. Come on and hot this on the Craven episode. Merry Christmas, guys. Merry Christmas. And and it's my mom's birthday. Damn. Disrespect. Did you take her to see Craven? I did. And she because she was like, well, she doesn't even care about Spider-Man. I know. I know your mom pretty well. And but she's like Craven. That's my guy. Yeah, she was like, I'm a big fan of Craven's Last Hunt. She has a poster blown up in her room. But, like, the Spider-Man on the cover is, like, blurred out. Like, she's cutting him out of the bitches. Just a picture of Aaron Taylor-Johnson's face over Spider-Man's face.
00:01:53
Speaker
There's double the craving. No, for the listeners, I didn't take my mom to see this. I'm taking her to see White Christmas tomorrow, though. Oh, that's a good... Yeah, hell yeah. Yeah, it'll be really sweet. Honestly, that'd be a good... Bails, like all the women in my life. I'm kidding. They don't bail. Like Christian bail. They're very good women in my life. Is that creepy to say on Mike? you have Do you have binders full of them? What politician said that? ah and Some creepy guy. I don't know.
Spider-Man Comics and 'Kraven's Last Hunt'
00:02:26
Speaker
um Anyway, Craven the Hunter. Based on Craven's last hunt, I assume. I haven't read the literature.
00:02:36
Speaker
I've read, okay, I was just talking about this with ah with a friend about like Spider-Man comic books. My main Spider-Man comic that I got into is like right along, it was kind of like right before the first rainy movie is when the ultimate Spider-Man started. So that was like my hopping on point. i like stayed with that for that like ultimate Spider-Man, ultimate X-Men I fucked with. And then I would check in on other, spider like amazing Spider-Man had certain storylines where I'm like, oh, civil war is happening. You just check in to make sure he's okay. Yeah, are you? Oh no, he revealed his identity. Oh, okay, nevermind, they reversed it. Yeah, spoilers for civil war.
00:03:19
Speaker
Or, oh no, oh, he got married to Mary Jane? Oh no, nevermind. He sold his marriage to Mephisto and they undid it. that's That's good writing. Mephisto, he's very good at like bartering. If I know one thing about Mephisto, he's a good deal. In very specific, like concepts, abstract concepts, like the concept of someone's marriage yeah is up for sale with Mephisto. I heard Mephisto was finally confirmed for the MCU.
00:03:49
Speaker
After years of every project, people being like, is that yeah were like were you looking online during WandaVision at all? Like episode by episode, people are like. I think that's Mephisto. Mephisto confirmed. Something weird, slightly weird happened and it was like, well, that's clearly Mephisto. And then the show's like, no, it was Wanda. The witch the show is about made the thing work. There were some people, they're like, it's nightmare. And then it's like, no, just Wanda. It's just her. You don't need a thing behind it.
00:04:23
Speaker
Spoilers for WandaVision. And even multi-mercivandice, there was no like entity. but It was just her doing the shit, right? ah Yeah, I'm pretty sure. Because she just want her kids back. It wasn't Agatha all along anymore. aga well I guess i got I'll never know what happened to her unless I watch that show. People say it got good at the end, but I just... Aubrey Plaz is in it. Man, I watched the first episode and struggled to stay awake. And then I think I fell asleep at the end because I was in the middle of the second episode and didn't realize it at a certain point. I was like, what is happening right now? yeah I was like, this is a long pilot. But, ah yeah, then I just fell off. I was like, I can't. I don't trust Disney Plus just meander anymore. Like, the I'll watch season two of Andor.
00:05:13
Speaker
And especially since there's not going to be another acolyte.
Marvel Movies on Streaming Services
00:05:15
Speaker
Like, I feel like after Andor season two, I'm kind of done with Disney Plus, because I'm like, what else would I even watch? Yeah, I always keep it because I'm like, well, what if I want to like rewatch something eventually? it The only reason it's here is so my like, or the only reason I have it is so my parents can like watch shows with my nephew or something. Well, they have the Netflix stuff on there now. Like if you want to rewatch Daredevil or Punisher season one or two, that's on Disney Plus. Yeah, I don't know if I'm ever going to do you any of that, though. um The Sony Marvel movies, I think, are all on there or going on there.
00:05:51
Speaker
the some i would I thought it was going to get its own streaming service. The Sony universe of Marvel characters, you know, just rolls off the tongue. Yeah, no, Disney had to have that, which leads me to believe that they're going to include all of these Sony villains in Dr. Doomsday or whatever, the Avengers Doomsday. I think it's going to zoom out at the end of Doomsday.
00:06:13
Speaker
and craven i I was gonna say, like you think it was doomed behind all of it, but then it's fucking Craven just leaning in and he's just like, he's not even sitting in it. He's like having like an angle hanging draped off of it. Not even like a practical lean, it's like bad for your back. You're like, why are you sitting like that? Yeah, he's gonna be sore the next day.
Ranking Sony's Marvel Movies
00:06:35
Speaker
And that's the next movie is that he has even though he has these super reflexes and like uh shit that like Yeah, he has to deal with back problems now. and It's just like a series of doctor visits. Yeah, you know one thing that These movies never do. They never show how the fucking these people get jacked, how all of them are just ripped out of their minds. Aaron Taylor-Johnson's got big fucking arms, but that teenager that we see in this movie is not big. What's up? I said the teenager that we see playing him isn't that big, but it's like, he's fucking, yeah just not even like a decade later or whatever. however How many years pass between little guy, little, aired also that actor, it seems to consciously not be trying to play Aaron Taylor. Like I had to look up to confirm that that's, Oh, Sergei. So that's, he's going to be craven.
00:07:30
Speaker
because he doesn't... serogate Yeah, I didn't know which one was gonna be craven. I was like, I'll let the mystery, the filmmaking mystery take me in. I was trying to think of who he felt like more like a younger, like if I try to get ahead of smart movies, Doug. Yeah.
00:07:46
Speaker
I guess just the way the actor was playing young Sergei, just such a memorable character, ah that like if you would cut to 10 years later and it was Austin Butler, that would make more sense. And specifically Austin Butler in The Bike Riders. He's just like, I just want to ride my bike. Not since Inora have we seen a more just fully fleshed out Russian on film. There is a lot of Russian in this movie.
00:08:13
Speaker
but Yeah, Russell Crowe, very oh believ like Russian Russell Crowe. His accent work, like, I don't know if we're listening to any Pope's Exorcist fans out here, but, like, Russell Crowe's accent work recently has just been, like, on another level. I'll also throw, I don't like the movie, but the two minutes he's in as Zeus and and Thor 4 are pretty funny, so ah he's he's Greek, I guess, in that, because Zeus is Greek and whatever, sure.
00:08:43
Speaker
We'll say that. He has a Greek accent. That's how he sounds in Thor. He's also Russian. and He's the same. He's like dressed the same as Craven's dad. I would argue he's always had good accent work. You know, he's American in most movies people see him in. And there's probably a lot of people that don't realize that he's not American. His American accent is fucking phenomenal. He's just a terrorist.
00:09:08
Speaker
its invading our country, stealing our acting roles. He's Australian, right? I think so, yeah. That's fucked up. i what Explain. I just saw Australia as a concept. Like, I don't know if you've seen the Mad Max. It's a place where everything wants to kill you. Yeah, have you seen Mad Max movies? Like, it's kind of crazy over there. Those are documentaries, I assume. That's happening right now. Right now, yeah.
00:09:34
Speaker
Furios is the only one that wasn't like currently happening. Well that was a prequel so like yeah and that already happens but it's better over there. Yeah um so fucking Craven. Oh, should we get into the bare bones of it? Did you like it? Well, but you've seen Webster's dictionary defines like, as yeah, what is good?
Critique of Sony Marvel Movies
00:10:01
Speaker
You know, um good's like a frame of mind, a state of mind. So first up, you've seen Venom one, two, you've seen Morbius and you've seen Madam Web. I've seen Venom one, Venom three and Madam Web going. OK. Here, let me give my definitive sum ranking. Like I have I still missing Venom three. I assume it'll be number. You're going to rank Craven right now, too. Yeah, rank Craven with it. Yeah. I'll do mine after you're starting with one. Number one is the top one. Yeah. Madam Web with a bullet. Putting Madam Web at number one. it's ah it a why It fucking folds the laundry, folds all the other ones like laundry. like the like Venom is so boring. Venom is unbelievably boring. And even saying that, I'm like, I guess Venom number two, like first Venom one would be second, I guess by default.
00:10:58
Speaker
ah these are all boring movies is the thing like yeah Morbius isn't even like I watched it and I don't regret watching it because the how this kid made like live thing I went to was fun and like that was like a really cool experience and but like the movie itself is not and I enjoy watching bad movies like I like consciously do that with some friend like of like let's find this movie that has terrible reviews and watch I mean I don't know a good B movie is like pretty can be pretty good like sometimes creative these movies are are none of that they're like lethargic and like creatively bankrupt yeah if anything which is like I like feeding off the scraps of the MCU
00:11:42
Speaker
and And people want to hype these up in a way of like, I guess just to like stick it to the MCU. And it's like, I don't like the establishment either. I'm no, Michael Mouse is no friend of mine, but like. Took me a second. I was like, who is what? like mike Michael Mouse, the producer on all those, those movies, yeah he signs all their checks. ah But like,
00:12:07
Speaker
These the idea and defense I've seen of all these is like, oh, these are like early 2000 superhero movies before they took them seriously. And they were all kind of trashy. But like those movies felt like they were made by people. though I couldn't tell you who made any of these fucking Sony movies. They're trendy circus. Those were trashy in like a more human way, I would say. Those 2000 movies people are referencing these don't.
00:12:36
Speaker
feel like a person made them. Anything that is resembling real humanity in them is kind probably incidental and ended up in them by accident. Yeah, Madam Web by default was the most entertaining one just because it's the weirdest one in terms of like like there's such bizarre, I don't even know if I'd call them choices because that's a strong word. Just like the way that this thing shape and form that this that thing took is interesting whereas the other ones are dull and more they're just they just they're just boring like i don't know yours is madam web oh madam web venom morbius then venom too i'm john'm trying to craven i'm like is craven better or worse than morbius because morbius is really
00:13:26
Speaker
not good. I mean, Craven's not good either, but- I mean, Aaron Taylor Johnson is, I'd argue, better to look at than Jared Leto. Yeah, exactly. And also, Russell Crowe is in like five minutes of Craven, so this that's five more minutes than he's in Morbius. this Not in any minutes of Morbius, I'll tell you that.
00:13:46
Speaker
ah Craven offers the best eye candy I feel like yeah and you're off and like Madam Webb is up there too with Craven you know equality I'm all about that but but yeah we're feminists here I think we've established that yeah um but yeah I forgot what I was gonna say No, I get what you're saying, too. And Craven also has a Russell Crowe. I don't feel like any of the other movies have ah you feel safe in these actors, and which is that's I want to give everyone up top the in the non spoilers. Like people were thinking. of
00:14:21
Speaker
just seeing this for fun because you enjoy Russell Crowe in the same way that I do especially this era like I'm pretty much down to see whatever he does he's in very little of this movie so like if you're going in thinking like okay he's got a weird new accent he's gonna fucking tear this shit up it's in shockingly little But when he is on the screen, you're like, it's like water in the desert. You're like, oh, give me more. You're like, you're like lapping it up quickly and then it fades because it's a mirage and you're still in the desert. So water is Craven three then? i Craven beats Morbius because, yeah, like Morbius stars Black Hole of Charisma, Jared Leto. ah And then ah Venom 2 is right after that.
00:15:09
Speaker
And then what are the other? And then, yeah, I haven't seen Venom 3 yet. So Venom 2 is at the at the bottom. Yeah. So mine, I'm going to put Craven up top. Number one, baby. Craven is my number one of these fucking god awful Sony movies. I don't know if it's following up fucking Venom 3 and just how like not a movie that was. That movie sucked so hard, but like.
00:15:37
Speaker
And I don't know what it is. I rated Craven two stars on Letterboxd. This might be my one of my first modern, like, bad movies that I like, you know? Okay. I like...
00:15:55
Speaker
found a weird comfort in watching Craven. We'll like yeah because he we'll talk through it. like i don't I've never been an Aaron Taylor Johnson hater like a lot of people have been. I i keep quiet when he gets talked about. but like He's interesting. He's got good arms. he's in your real and You see a lot of them in this. I've been going to the gym so i'm looking at i'm what looking at these like Jacked dudes like really looking at their like bodies. Yeah, and Yeah, so it's like it had that you know venom Tom Hardy really wasn't offering a whole lot like in the body Department and hill Johnson's like showing it in this one so I got to like appreciate that and like I I don't know. Like the action sucked in a lot of this movie, but they suck in all of them. It kind of had the best of the worst action. By default, none of these have good action. I mean, I guess I could make the case sometime.
00:16:56
Speaker
on the position of defending Madam Web. That like the way- I didn't set on Madam Web. No, no, no, no. it It just feels weird to like be listing like a quality of that move of like, well, you got to give it to Madam Web. I think I'm going to be doing some craven defending in this up. I mean, we'll see, because I might join in on some of it. ah i had a I kind of enjoyed my time with this movie. it Even though I'll acknowledge it's not a good movie. It's not, but.
00:17:24
Speaker
Most of it didn't drag for me. There were parts where I was like, come on, let's get to some craving, you know, but like when once the craving started kind of like you're kind of in I guess there is like one part where it does slow down. He has to go into some office building to talk to Academy Award winner Ariana. ah Oh, the boat who's in this. I felt bad for her. buy I got actively bummed out. I was like, every line fell 80 yard out of her mouth. I couldn't like tell.
00:17:54
Speaker
I was like, is her voice just that magnificent, that it sounds like it's all ADR, just as on top of the mix in that way? Or... She didn't do any singing or dancing in this one. I mean, I've only seen West Side Story, so I assume she sings and dances in every movie. Yeah, they really... Lady Gaga fully did the shit out of her in this one. She did, you know, sing better than Joaquin Phoenix in this movie, though. Yeah, she did. Yeah. That CGI leopard sang better than Joaquin Phoenix.
00:18:24
Speaker
I do I did want to say that I do kind of blame you a little bit for me enjoying this movie I was thinking about it because I was in like yeah I mean I don't know if we talked about this in like our last episode but like after the Wicked review I was you know
Character Analysis in 'Kraven the Hunter'
00:18:39
Speaker
I wasn't in a right way I was going through kind of a little bit of a rough patch oh yeah sure in life doug off mike ah kind of pulled me out of that i think like the day after or before
00:18:54
Speaker
our um the order review it was sometime around the order review ah Yeah, you you and I had like hung out and you really like pulled me out of this funk I feel like if I was in that funk, I would have like walked out like fuck craven I didn't want I don't want anything to do with the but it like damn this is my fault. I think yeah, it kind of was like um and But I like Sat down and did like because there were parts hours like this is fucking nonsense. I'm like, I know it's it's really dumb Like I'm not gonna defend that on that
00:19:28
Speaker
I hate the vibe of it. And there are parts of this movie as I think about it. I'm like, oh, I do genuinely like hate the feeling I had when I was watching it. Like Ariana DeBose. Those scenes bummed me out. And there's also everything with flashbacks when she was a kid. yeah Like that scene was so awkwardly shot and like like any of that. Any time they invoked or see him Remembering the mother that shit sucks. ah But and there's like an action sequence that's like so fucking bad. It's really short. We'll get into it in spoilers. But so like is it the slowest car chase ever when they're like the the going through the streets of London? Is that the city there? I think it's in the jungle. It's the first fight that we see. Okay. But it like.
00:20:18
Speaker
There's multiple scenes where he runs after a car. Maybe it's a second fight. i don't I don't know if you know this about cars. They can go pretty fast. And but then in this, they look like they're going like 10 miles per hour. Yeah. So he can like run to catch up to them yeahre like, oh, shit, it's craving. And they don't speed up at all. I don't think it's that one. I. ah What's it called? I.
00:20:45
Speaker
I don't know if it was like maybe the 20 minute mark or the 30 minute mark, but there was just a certain point where I was like, we're through a lot of bad, bad beginning and like we're kind of in the movie. He's already basically like craven and uh,
00:21:03
Speaker
Yeah. There was a point where I just started to feel like a light comfort where I was like, how did this get made? Might cover this. I'm probably going to hear that from that. I was like, we're going to talk about it on the pocket. And I just started to like feel kind of good. And I was like, you know, as I started to live with the movie a little bit, I was like, even though I don't fully like it's Yeah, it's not a good movie. There are parts of it that I really didn't like, but it was oddly comforting. It was a really odd, oddly comforting, bad movie. Now that I'm thinking about it and you are kind of convincing me in real time, where I'm like,
00:21:41
Speaker
Fuck Venom, this is number two on my- Yeah, Venom sucks, man. I'd much rather rewatch this. like This would be a comfort watch, rewatch ah more than Venom, yeah which- My list is basically like yours, except it's basically the same order. I think Craven, Metem, Web, Venom, Venom 3. Yeah. Yeah, just minus Morbius.
00:22:03
Speaker
but so fingers I know the state of the sump is in in question, like there's been but some talk in the media about, was this was this the end? And then like a day or two later, Sony was like, maybe not, question mark. ah So who's this, maybe they'll rise, rise from the dead, like Craven himself. I mean, spoilers, I guess he does. Nevermind, I'm not gonna talk anymore about that.
00:22:33
Speaker
Yeah. Well, do you want to hop into spoilers? That seems like a good note to leave people. We did. Sorry, guys. We like kind of let out spoilers here and there a little bit. Who gives a shit? It's Craven. It's Craven. If and hopefully some of that made it sound more interesting, just so you're aware of what you're getting into but like yeah also don't rush to the theater to see it you know spend time with your family there's better movies go see interstellar in theaters the order is still playing near you go see that yeah um so would you recommend people see it then
00:23:06
Speaker
If they've already seen the order, they've already seen like all the real stuff, then yeah, you can go watch Craven. What's your star ranking? Cause I'm at, I have it a two on letterbox. I feel like that's what it deserves. Maybe less than that. I'm going to bump it up to two and a half. I was, I was maybe thinking two and a half. I might be a two and a half by the end. I'm going to put it on my ah favorite bad movies list. I think I it was it caught me off guard how like at peace I felt watching this thing again. If I ever watch this rewatch this, I might just skip 30 minutes into it every time. Just yeah get through all the fucking bullshit beginning, even though you're missing a lot of Russell Crowe, if you're doing that. Well, you don't want to. Yeah, it's tricky because a lot of the origin flashback stuff is not good.
00:23:58
Speaker
like aggressively the most boring stuff in the movie, but you get like precious crows screen time. so You got to, you got to make that calculation for yourself. Yeah. This is kind of the best movie to watch at home on streaming when you can like scrub through or honestly, I've always been against what, when people say they watch things at like 1.5 or two speed, I'm like, you could throw this to 1.5 or two. Like once it's on Netflix, well, you can watch it at a higher speed. That's fine. Yeah, just slow it down when Crow is talking. You really want to save, like, sli make it slower than one time speed. Make it like 0.75 or 0.5 speed for the Crow parts. In Mother Russia.
00:24:43
Speaker
He says Mother Russia a lot. Wanna happen to spoilers? Yeah, let's do it.
00:25:19
Speaker
I was trying to think of a song to sing, but I guess we're in the spoiler section now. I was gonna try to think of a... Who's gonna do like a... I was trying to think of a Craven version of that. Honestly, I was just shitting on this whole universe and franchise.
00:25:38
Speaker
I don't think they've done the thing, or maybe Madam Web did it, i'm like where they play basically how everything after Guardians of the Galaxy is like, let's do a pop song to like an action scene or something fucked up.
00:25:50
Speaker
Like, I don't think any of these movies have done that, right? Did this movie have a Johnny Cash song in it? or No, just the trailer. Just the trailer. The trailer had like a remix of, and they just kept going, and the man comes around. And you see him like stab someone in the neck, and then Johnny goes like, and the man comes. They don't even, I don't even think he they do those parts in the trailer song. He just keeps going. And when the man comes around, just craving killing people.
00:26:18
Speaker
the Is the best use of that song in Zack Snyder's Dawn of the Dead, James Gunn's Dawn of the Dead? I like it in that. I think my favorite is Terminator Sera Chronicles, uses it for very creative action scenes. The reason I thought Genesis was the word that was going to come out of your mouth. I don't remember a goddamn thing that happened in Genesis other than smartphones lead to the apocalypse, I think. We can't talk about Genesis. I feel like I just got an ulcer when I heard you say the words Genesis back to me. I was like, did I just start this? Here's the thing about J.K. Simmons and Genesis. No, I couldn't tell you what the thing is because I erased it from my brain. Here's the thing about J.K. Simmons and Saturday Night. He pulls his dick out.
00:27:07
Speaker
he He doesn't do that in Genesis, which is interesting interesting. Yeah, he should. He should. Whiplash would be the movie. You would expect that to happen. When the man comes around, and then that plays when he does it. So, crazy. The movies are, he like kills people.
Marketing and Humor in 'Kraven'
00:27:30
Speaker
Are they all are? No, this was the first one. Surprisingly, Venom is not are really in. He like bites people's heads off, but then there's no blood in it. So that's how they get around that. Or they cut around to be like, oh, you didn't actually see the moment he bit the head. You just see the shadow of him biting the head off or some shit.
00:27:50
Speaker
There was a Craven ad I saw on Instagram. They're just spoiling the shit out of this movie and the marketing. And the marketing sucks too. All these ads I've seen since the movie's been in theaters. But it was a, they're just showing all the action scenes and it's like, got some cheesy caption. And one comment was like,
00:28:12
Speaker
Brown. All this trailer has is brown. All this movie has is brown. Brown everywhere. That's, and then they said like something about how like the only reason they do that is so they could get ah away with, uh, having blood and ads and not having to deal with sensors. And I don't know. I was just like, is that how that works? Coming off is weird. And now I'm talking about you on my podcast. What are you doing?
00:28:36
Speaker
I don't know. That wasn't as interesting as I thought it was going to be once I started saying it. No, I thought about it, and I was like, that doesn't even make sense. Mostly when I talk about how bad the marketing was, that like thought about that comment kind of sparked that. but i think i don't think i What would be good marketing for this movie, though? You know what I mean?
00:28:56
Speaker
Just craven on the poster and tell people Spider-Man's in it. Just lie. Yeah, just a lie. Like they're basically done in all of these movies. There's spiders. These movies are hinging on a lie. Like a fucking false hope that Spider-Man will eventually show up. People have to know he's not showing up walking into these movies, right? By this point, I feel like they still were actively trying, like Morbius trailer had scenes where you walked by posters of, it wasn't even one of the movies, Spider-Man. It was just like the cover art from the PS4 Spider-Man game. It was like Spider-Man at large. You're like, what universe are you in right now? Just as he's a menace. Yeah, but it's the it's the PlayStation Spider-Man. The Daily Bugle is in all of these movies, right?
00:29:47
Speaker
Right, yeah, and they mentioned Eddie Brock being from New York. They're like, after that shit in New York. And you're like, what? What happened in New York? Tell us about it. Well, that's what Venom 3 is, is like, we have to get to New York. Do they mention the bugle?
00:30:03
Speaker
Uh, I think the bugle is just a newspaper that's at like the bar or something, but they're like trying to just get to the statue of Liberty. I don't know. There's like a weird immigration like metaphor going on. Yeah, it's kind of odd, but yeah, they're trying to get to New York and spoilers for venom three. Um, I don't think they make it to New York. I don't remember that movie sucks. Maybe sucks so bad. Venom three on demand now. the lasting Yeah, god damn it. Craven, I don't know. Masterpiece compared to Venom 3. Okay, so let's- What parts did you hate? The parts that I hated?
00:30:45
Speaker
Well, what were you going to say? Was your direction going to be more interesting than my question? No, I was thinking about it because it's not the Ariana de Beau. Am I saying it right? her I'll just bring up her memorable character named Calypso. Everyone's favorite Calypso. America herself. I think in.
00:31:05
Speaker
the 90s cartoon, I just remember her being like Craven's girlfriend. Like, like Craven showed up to hunt Spider-Man and Calypso was also there and helped him hunt. Like, I feel like that was the extent of what I know about that character. What I know about her from this movie is, uh, she, her grandma had magic powers and brought Craven back to life as a kid or as a younger guy. And that's all you're ever going to know because there will never be more. She actually has a line where she was like, her I've got a past two that you don't know about or something. And it's like, we're probably also never going to know about that, too. So why would you bring it up? The Calypso movie.
00:31:51
Speaker
Yeah, we're getting that 100%. It's out now. now They released it at the same time. That was a very Madam Web line to have in the movie. Yeah. I have a past that you don't know about too. Actually, it's the opposite of Madam Web. The interesting thing they could have done with her character, since all I think all her scenes are kind of actively disastrous, is that the she brings up pretty early, like just the first meeting as adults. She's like,
00:32:21
Speaker
So you're using me to find people to kill. That's like, ethically at odds with my whole thing as a lawyer. And so like, there should have been conflict from that. Like she brings that up, but then the next time she's like, here's some more people for you to kill. She's like, I'm going to do my thing. And then you're going to do your thing. There should have actually been like a dilemma of like, I don't know if I can help you because I'm like,
00:32:47
Speaker
You seem kind of evil. It seems like you're just like murdering people. They should have made him be worse also. I'm learning all of this information about her character for the first time. I don't remember any of that in the movie. but So she was selling people or like capturing people. No, she was a lawyer and and he was like, some of the people you represent aren't so nice. And because she had like some of her clients had connections to these mobs or something.
00:33:13
Speaker
And so he was like using that intel to find people on his kill list to kill. And she only brings us up one meeting where she's like, you you you used me to find someone to to kill. And like I don't know how I feel about that. Why does she know Aaron Taylor Johnson?
00:33:29
Speaker
her grandma saved him with the magic and just stay connected all these years. No, she did not say she was like, oh, how did you find he just shows up like they also play up that like she should be scared of him and be like, What are you doing here? They feel like they're very familiar with each other. Well, I like missed all that I don't know what I was doing All of her scenes just man fully checked out I do feel like I did slip into a minor depression whenever her scenes were playing. They were a bummer. yeah there was just something about it the vibe they all felt like shitty reshoots adr exposition dump I not even just her scenes but scenes with like her character i don't know yeah like uh the fucking little kid version of her too well i don't I mean, it felt very off and weird. They tried to explain some of that, I guess, but explain in quotation marks. I guess I've never really understood Craven as a Spider-Man villain. He's like, I like to hunt. You don't really need to know. You just know he hunts and he shows up to hunt Spider-Man. It's kind of like most dangerous game, but with Spider-Man. He's like, I've hunted all the animals. Oh, there's a Spider-Man. That's interesting. Yeah, I should kill him.
00:34:52
Speaker
Yeah, let me hunt this guy, you know, hunt the ultimate beast. That's all I needed to know, because I was always it is weird that spid I mean, it's such an interesting character, Spider-Man for Craven to be hunting. But like within the world of the MCU, like the Hulk or something you'd think would be the one the like more difficult hunt. Yeah, if you want the most dangerous game.
00:35:17
Speaker
the unkillable guy i mean spiderman is quote unquote unkillable gentlemens most interesting i feel like you craing the gogainst especially just because like the implication and like the brutality that could come with like ah hunter like hunting and killing spider-man the goal is to kill him and spider-man is a guy who goes out of his the way to even his worst villains not unkillable kill guy. so then to go against the guy's like no his goal is literally just kill you I mean, Spider-Man yeah he's is quote unquote unkillable hunting to a degree. his object not even like he's not gonna capture you and do like a villain monologue he's there to hunt you he has tools to murder you dead yeah his goal is to kill you when you don't notice and spider-man is the spider senses to like you know go along with that so he's got a slight advantage but it's like
00:36:04
Speaker
It's a very interesting character for Kraven to face off against, but he's not in this movie. I do... Yeah, I do... It is weird. Yeah, the villain they choose just sucks so much, not the Rhino. I do kind of enjoy the Rhino and his deal a little bit. And I enjoy the chameleon that we may never see again.
00:36:29
Speaker
okay this has like the it this feels like the amazing spider-man no a hundred percent it did in a way that like Okay. The thing with the chameleon shit at the end, I was like, why are you just doing this now? Because I think the more interesting movie would have been the brother against his brother, like Craven versus the chameleon. Like have that be the movie. Yeah. And like, you can keep the Rhino in there too. He's like a side villain. Get rid of the like three countdown guy, whatever. Mr. Minutes. What's his name?
00:37:05
Speaker
then He's literally a i power I think this is from the comics. He's just called the foreigner. So when they say get the foreigner, you're like, what the fuck are you talking about? And it's like, no, that's literally the guy is like,
00:37:20
Speaker
code name and he talks about that some hitman that I don't even think Craven killed on screen you just see the paper of like Craven faces off against they just say Craven versus hitman they phrase it that way that's because the villain in the comics that trained the foreigners name is hitman it It's like Sony didn't, you know, take the same hints from them, see you. And they're like, we should make these like a less racist and offensive a little bit. No, it's like, no, let's just. They're like, Fu Man Chu is the villain. It's like, what? And they don't explain his deal. Christopher Abbott, the wolf man himself, shows up in this.
00:38:01
Speaker
but he's not the wolf man he like hypnotizes you with his eyes it's ridiculous his whole deal is ridiculous he looks ridiculous like i feel bad for him i hope he didn't feel good about this movie because if he did then that says a lot about him did anyone feel good about this movie I mean Aaron Taylor Johnson probably made a lot of money. Yeah, made a lot of money just to like ah just look attractive on screen basically that that works out well for him. um Yeah, that villain sucked though. well He's terrible. He's like a hired hand brought in because like the real really.
00:38:43
Speaker
the real villain is fatherhood and not wanting to become your father. Was it set up? i didn't the When his brother's like, I've always been a chameleon, I was like, have you? Was that set up? Did you guys talk about this before? This is how brilliant the script is. It's the real two-face situation going on, Harvey two-face.
00:39:05
Speaker
They kind of basically do. like Throughout the movie, he's like imitating their dad like doing the Russell Crowe Russian accent, and like he answers the phone as his dad, and they laugh. He's like, haha, you know me, I've always been a chameleon. Oh, yeah. Oh, that sucks. That also feels like Russell Crowe ADR, not him doing an impression. He like hides his mouth every time he does the impression.
00:39:28
Speaker
And then Russell Crowe also says about him at the at the jazz club that he sings at. That's in such a weird location that I wanted more of the movie to be like, let's go back to the weird jazz club that the brother sings at. Like, what's going on there? That seems like that place has a vibe like.
00:39:47
Speaker
Because everywhere else looks kind of, there's a lot of generic look, especially all the Russia stuff. You're like, the jungle could be such a visually interesting and like lush environment. And it just feels like the most generic settings i for most of it. I always want the clubs now to look more like the one Vanessa Kirby is singing at and Mission Impossible Fallout. Oh yeah. I did want to say his brother singing, though. So at the very end, I didn't catch it for the first time he's singing. But the second time, it's a very weird rendition rendition of Ozzy Osbourne's changes. And instead of like a cover and or like having the actor, maybe they purposely use Ozzy Osbourne's voice because of the whole to play into the chameleon. Oh, because he had already gotten the chameleon surgery. or It was like.
00:40:37
Speaker
It was just Ozzy Osbourne's voice and I was like, this is ridiculous. What is happening here? But then they show him having literally Russell Crowe's voice before he has power. So it's like really weird depiction of this. skill Like you they can't have Andrew Garfield in here unless they have two rhinos. I just realized that.
00:40:59
Speaker
Whatever, just have it be. Yeah, they should. Another one. I don't know. All of the stuff with the Chameleon and the Rhino, though, did feel like a good use of the worst parts of the Andrew Garfield Spider-Man stuff. It's like, OK, let's lean into the weird Mark Webb-ness of it all. And if we're going to do it, have it in a brutal rated R action movie. Like, well, in trying no, I get what you're saying and having it all like I kind of get the minds, even though it's dumb to be like, well, Craven Hunt's animals what other spider-man characters are like animal I mean chameleon was never
00:41:35
Speaker
but Isn't he like really good at disguises and maybe has like Mission Impossible level mask or something? Like, but he's not like physically, I think at least, like the original versions of Chameleon, like he's not like with powers changing his appearance. What is Scorpion's deal? Because they introduce him in like Homecoming and they plot characters from those movies. Is he in Morbius? He's not. He has not showed back up.
00:42:03
Speaker
um I mean, because I think originally and be somebody he could fight. I mean, James, his origins kind of tie the Jameson unless you just make that not part of why can't he just hunt Morbius? Hunt a vampire. Once Morby starts crossing over with too many other people, though, you'll start questioning of like, doesn't Marvel have like a vampire hunter? What about a venom?
00:42:29
Speaker
Yeah, he could. Well, I mean, I think Venom's done though. Spoilers for Venom 3. Fuck. Yeah, I think Venom's done. It was his last dance. It was, yeah.
00:42:40
Speaker
Um, he should hunt the other ones that would make more, it would make him make more sense that he's opposed to, uh, not just right. Cause there's not really any tension when he's going after these thugs and assassins where you're like, well, he, you've shown me that he's can climb on walls and he's like dodging moving faster than bullets. So like, I'm not worried that like,
00:43:06
Speaker
one of these guys. I mean, yeah, Rhino has like powers and is invulnerable or whatever, but like until other than that, like you're like not worried. I guess miss hypno eyes. The foreigner gets one over on Craven for a little bit. I feel like we shouldn't be calling him the foreigner. It sounds wrong every time it's said. Sounds like hurtful and offensive to somebody. i't The foreigner, when he shows up,
00:43:36
Speaker
So this illegal crosses the border and he like should have come through normal channels and like, you know, gotten citizenship the right way. He just like fucking comes after Craven and it's fucked up. And and we just have no control on our borders. Oh.
00:43:57
Speaker
The really like bad fight scene that I was talking about um It's um I think the second one because the movie opens with a fight I think but uh, it's one where Craven just basically goes in like bursts into these dudes cars and like kills the driver and then hops over and kills the passenger or whatever and Is it when he's in the city or the one where he's at? No, it's in the jungle, I'm pretty sure. It's like okay one of the first ones we see that isn't... like I think it's the first action movie that or action sequence that isn't at like the very beginning of the movie.
00:44:36
Speaker
But ah yeah, it's like very boring and pretty fucking bad. Like the camera work is just uninteresting and just, yeah I was like, is this the tone that we're setting for this movie with the action? And overall the action is pretty underwhelming and like not that well shot. Which is surprising because the director can do cool action. My pulse was, my my heart rate elevated slightly at some points though. Or parts.
00:45:04
Speaker
I think it was when he was running in the city, barefoot. I was like, what if he steps on glass? That's dangerous. He gets tetanus. Yeah, I don't like running barefoot. Does he have his vaccinations? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I don't know. It was very, yeah, uncomfortable. Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't be running barefoot through the city like that.
Anti-Hero and Moral Stakes Discussion
00:45:25
Speaker
So like he's, that's what makes him crazy. They keep saying he's Ariana DeBose says he's crazy multiple times and then he's like,
00:45:33
Speaker
makes I'm like, the people he's killing are bad guys, so this is fine. Like it's never not even to like a Punisher a level degree where I'm like, whoa, he's kind of going too far. Like he should be doing shit like another movie. We saw this your kill. Like once he's getting his revenge, he's like stringing up bodies and shit. Like that's what Craven should be doing. That's a good point. I didn't even think about that, but that's so true. He should be skidding people alive. then you're like, holy shit, Craven, calm down. It would take like half a day of writing to come to that idea, like, what if he strung up the dead bodies? Yeah, he's doing like psychological warfare in the jungle. Animals being used as trophies or rugs is like a thing that's regularly happening in this movie. Why not like flip that on its head and it's like he's leaving decapitated like human heads on trees or something. Leaves a poacher head on its stick Yeah, you know do something like showcase like the humans that you've killed or you know Does that make him does that make him too bad then you know?
00:46:56
Speaker
why can't he pin you not are villains you i'm not a thing i can't root for Well do the execs at Sony believe that these are villains that they're selling us right now well cuz none of them are like if you look at Morbius who's a fucking vampire he does not drain anyone's blood like he has like this synthetic blood because he's a genius that he created so he's like i'm just gonna do this yeah so he's not doing anything bad or like the the only the only one who's doing actual vampire shit is matt smith on this why nothing i like what you said about morbius yeah well
00:47:37
Speaker
It's so dumb in their work around. It does seem like they're afraid to make these characters be even just anti-heroes because that would just be like a basic monster movie story where he's like, he doesn't want to hurt people, but he can't, he has, he'll like fucking die if he doesn't drink blood. So like he needs to do it. And that's like the conflict or something like, like, but there is no conflict because he just fucking invents of work around for it. So it's like, there should be some kind of,
00:48:05
Speaker
if you If you can't make there be physical stakes where I'm worried Craven's gonna like be bested by someone, make there be like a moral or ethical like conflict internally for him where maybe he starts the question like, yeah, am I going too far or something? That would be interesting.
00:48:24
Speaker
I mean, these movies are just, and Craven is the least of this statement that I'm gonna say, but these movies are fucking toothless. That's what I realized when I was watching Venom 3. Oh, yeah. I'm like, the action sucks. The violence sucks. It's like, they think they're edgy because Venom is like ripping people's heads off. But you don't see shit.
00:48:49
Speaker
that Yeah, and that's his only move. It's fucking old. It's not cool. We saw him do it like a decent amount of times in the first movie. And now that's all we see him do. They made that like his trademark. Like that's his name. They say it's funny. It's not. They're not funny. They don't have funny situational humor. They're not putting Tom Hardy and they're not making him look dumb in like the ways that the movie claims to like the I don't know.
00:49:17
Speaker
and like the quote unquote jokes that they're saying are like the most inoffensive like non jokes that like these action movies these superhero movies could possibly have and it's like i hear people in the theater like laughing at these like at these movies and And I'm just thinking, like oh what what is this person's life? like what What do they enjoy? What is their IQ? What do they do when they go home? like What are their interests? or lifes during What is a conversation with someone that like laughed at a joke in one of these movies? I couldn't tell if the laughter I was hearing during Craven was like at or with the movie.
00:50:04
Speaker
Until there were parts at the end where the laughter, I was like, okay, you're laughing at this moment because it's fucking corny. But then other parts, I was like, I think you're laughing because you're like, fuck yeah, Craven. Like, like some of them sounded more like, like, like when you have the reveal of the guy who was pinned to the wall with the crossover behind the door, someone's like laughing and like it was in a tone of like, fuck yeah, crazy. That's not a good joke. And that might be one of the smartest things the movie does is that bit. But I'm like, that's not like a good or a creative joke anymore. That's like played out. It's done. It's fucking hacky.
00:50:41
Speaker
yeah You know, the reveal of like, oh, there's the other guy. He was there the whole time. And it's like, he was hanging by the door. It's like, okay, we just saw Halloween ends do that or whatever, you know, that's true in a better way.
00:50:57
Speaker
Yeah, we've seen copied fucking Halloween and Halloween's done it like six times within that franchise He should be doing micro Michael Myers shit like it like like Craven should be routinely Doing bits with the people he kills in a way. That's like a little disturbing in your and you're already rated R He should be like cutting off fingers be like hey Where's the fucking thing at and then he cuts off a finger and he's like, you know And you're seeing it or like, you know, he removes a dude's tongue or something or like he's like taking trophies. Mm-hmm or like bites a guy's like jugular out with his teeth and Like he is supposed to be kind of terrifying like the other gangsters are like he's like he's an urban legend to scare people it's like
00:51:46
Speaker
Is he doing things that scary? He's just shooting people with a crossbow. yeah Have him rip somebody's heart out of their chest. And eat it. Like, I mean, you could have him eat it, but like, have him do something as ridiculous as that, you know? Like, yeah, ripping someone's heart out of their chest feels like a move this movie should be making. Magrooper rips someone's throat out. Craven can't do that. And then you think like, oh my god, that's what Spider-Man has to deal with? This guy?
00:52:13
Speaker
Yeah. Spider-Man, who definitely exists in this universe, is going to go up against this guy. That's crazy. I'm thinking I'm liking the movie less now that we're talking about it. There's things I enjoy like the Chameleon and Rhino of it all. I feel like we haven't even really touched on that shit in terms of how goofy it is, but like there's some, I mean, I, I kind of liked, I'm forgetting the actor's name, like how he plays Rhino of like, you know, he's got the, you know, who would have been fucking good and dreamcast version of this. paul giomadi Yeah. You would have crushed it. No, it should have been fucking, uh,
00:52:52
Speaker
fucking Nicholas Holt. Dave Batista. Dave Batista. Yeah. And because he could do the gentle big guy part before the the transformation where he's just carrying around the book bag and he has glasses on. He's just like, oh, I just don't want I don't bother nobody. And then he unhooks his like, you know, rhino hose thing and he's like, I'm a monster.
00:53:13
Speaker
day Batista knows better though.
Rhino and Practical Effects
00:53:15
Speaker
If this movie had a more interesting director backing it, I could probably see Batista coming in and i mean butist's still doing a role like this and taking it seriously. On paper with a different project, wouldn't this director be kind of a thing certain actors would want to, he's worked with high profile things before in the past. Is this director somebody, what has he done?
00:53:36
Speaker
Uh, most violent year triple frontier, uh, most violent year. He wrote, he co-wrote, uh, Oscar Isaac, Jessica Chastain movie. Yeah. I was just thinking about that yesterday when I was seeing inner seller. That movie is really good. I like it a lot. Have you seen it?
00:53:53
Speaker
Uh, I haven't, but I saw triple frontier and I really liked it. Yeah. JC Chandor. He, uh, did margin call. Oh, hope is lost. Those are just the things he directed. He wrote, co-wrote, uh, or no, I'm thinking of someone different. Damn. I thought he worked with, uh, Catherine Bigelow on something, but I'm wrong. No, but those ones that I listed are pretty good. Why am I, why do you think he was connected to Catherine Bigelow somehow someone else?
00:54:25
Speaker
And I did enjoy the rhino a little bit though was the makeup. It was a mixture of CG and practical, right? When he was like full rhino, there were some times where I was like, I think that's a dude in a suit or like with makeup on him.
00:54:41
Speaker
And if that's the case, it sucks that the dude had to be in that much makeup. That seems like the worst thing imaginable is being in that makeup chair and being covered in all that prosthetic shit. It seems so claustrophobic. Hopefully he got properly compensated, why not but, uh, yeah, probably not, but good on this movie for doing a practical effect. It looked, it looked interesting. Like it was, it wasn't just, um,
00:55:11
Speaker
yeah like ah an anonymous CG block like he turns into like a CG thing and when he's like fully transformed but like even though there it seemed like there were shots of his face where I think it was actually him yeah I think it was like a combination which was interesting Yeah, it it it didn't look how you would expect, but it looked like uncanny in a way that like felt intentional. Like, oh, you're trying to make this look a little like body horror-esque in terms of like, this is fucked up. His body does this. He says he's in pain the whole time, too. I liked that touch. i Yeah, that like he's like, I want it to be powerful. I got the surgery, but then it's like so much pain when he's doing it. It was like, oh, that's...
00:55:56
Speaker
Really interesting, actually. Yeah, he was just, I think, in pain the whole time that he was as a rhino. And then him getting stabbed in that little hole, I was like, God, that just sucks, man. That seems like it would hurt so much. In that scene, though, the water buffalo, everything involving those buffalo, I just found to be fucking ridiculous. I rolled my eyes a little bit. Like the one that stopped when they were all running at him.
00:56:21
Speaker
It was like, that's so lame. It would almost be cooler if they all just ran around him, not if one stopped in front of him. It would be funny if they all trampled the one that stopped. Okay, so in terms of the stampede and the other animals he interacts with, what are Craven's powers? Can he like control animals with his mind? I think they just all respect him a lot. They're just like, yo, this is Craven, listen up. Yeah, he hunts the people that hunt us.
00:56:50
Speaker
I don't know, cause that like lion sees him, that fucking jacked lion that just- Yeah. Royden up, I was like, do they make him that big? Holy shit, that's a big lion. That one, like they make eye contact and sees him and it's like, you've got a friend in me. And then their blood like combines. And then that mixed with the juice that he drinks, he like basically becomes Aquaman of like, you know, poached animals.
00:57:20
Speaker
Now Aquaman is African animals, but they're in like Russia this whole time. I keep forgetting. That's where they are. It's such a generic looking forest that like, it doesn't feel like it's anywhere. Most of the movie doesn't like, that's why I was like, go back to that jazz club. Like, wow, I don't know what to do. Something going on there. I was also like, I don't know if there are lines in Russia. You could tell me that and I'll believe it. I guess.
00:57:48
Speaker
Yeah, sure. This movie seems like it's telling me, or were they in Africa hunting lions? Were they going back and forth between both continents? Did you tell me lions and people are coaching them? I think Africa, but I don't know. I don't know where they are when they're there.
00:58:07
Speaker
Yeah, I'm like, are there lines in more than just Africa? I don't know, I guess. I really don't know. I also didn't give this movie enough attention to really find out where they were on a scene to scene basis.
Geographical Setting and Conclusion
00:58:22
Speaker
Line experts weigh in, you know? Yeah, where are they from? Where do they live? And are they always that jacked? And how big are their dicks?
00:58:33
Speaker
These are questions tweet dog and ah the dog or not to underscore underscore to DM me some blind dick pictures and let me know. Yes. Keep them at dog on blue sky. I think he's dug or not underscore one on that one. I don't think he's been bumped up to two yet. promoted over there yet Yeah. Um,
00:58:59
Speaker
What else could they have done this movie? Would it have been too far if he fucked an animal? Yeah, I was, this movie is very sexless and honestly. I was like, i wouldn't want him and Ariana, they have nothing. There's yeah nothing there. And I wouldn't want her to stoop to that level of having sex in a movie like this. He should be like banging a hooker or something, you know?
00:59:26
Speaker
Off-screen you don't even see the actress just so you know, no one has the disrespect of Having to have been part of that. Yeah in this movie But if we need to like fucking give this is going to be odd, but give Craven a fucking testosterone boost or something like he should feel desirable. I think he from the what i this feels probably weird to talk about 90s cartoon, but I feel like he had some of that in that spider 90s Spider-Man where it's just like.
01:00:01
Speaker
not sexy is not the right word but like he like has some kind of magnetism about an animal magnetism if you will like you know like how people describe people who just have this like ineffable quality of like, you're like, Oh, there's something going on with this dude. Like, I don't know what that is. He just rizzed up, man. There should be one character in the movie though, male or female, who just really wants to suck him off though. You know, just really is just craving that craving pain. You know? Yeah. No pun intended.
01:00:34
Speaker
ah Sorry to get so gross on the pod. But we started pretty blue here. It ah but it is, yeah, R rated movie. It's already R is the thing. That's why I'm the only reason why I'm throwing these pitches out there. Because it's like, why wouldn't you just do that? I mean, it's just with how much I mean, they I guess it's all Aaron Taylor Johnson's face. They're not even showing off him like shirtless.
01:01:03
Speaker
It just- That's true. You see like an open vest thing. Can you like not show shirtless anymore in like movie theaters? It's like why are we getting- Unless it's The Rock and Zac Efron and Baywatch. Why are they doing so all these roids and getting jacked if we can't even fucking see it? Yeah, I just- I don't know why I'm hung up on this, but this movie just feels like actively sexless.
01:01:26
Speaker
I would say the whole sump is, I mean, superhero movies nowadays don't really, like, what's the sexiest MCU movie? I mean, but I can even think back, the first thing that comes to mind, like Peggy Carter, Chris Evans Kissing at the end of any game, there's like fucking sparks there with these two, you know? They have chemistry.
01:01:48
Speaker
ah But not, I mean, it's not it's not sexy. Like, but it's like chemistry though. Yeah. There's like a longing, you feel, at least like with Chris Evans and like, uh, that movie and then, um, fucking.
01:02:07
Speaker
Robert Downey Jr. with Pepper Potts. It's like there's a chemistry there. They have like a nice banter, especially in those Iron Man movies. Like, it's like kind of cute. There's there's not even cute in this movie. I want, I want fucking. I want Superman jumping in a bathtub, fully clothed. You know, fucking freak. No, I, I don't even think Batman returns. I want like.
01:02:37
Speaker
I'm thinking like Brokeback Mountain. For which character? ah Isn't Luke with Martinino going to be doing like a DC movie? Is that true? He's doing American Psycho. um No, but didn't he like also kind of get attached to like a random DC thing? like DC's kind of been grabbing like some like bigger directors to do like not even like known things. Just like, yeah, this random character is going to get a thing.
01:03:03
Speaker
Maybe I'm not too sure. I'm, I'm trying to think of a good movie comparison for this though. Uh, nothing's really coming to mind, but craven yeah, but I'm thinking like, you know, fucking hot and like animalistic, you know, fucking, I don't know.
01:03:26
Speaker
Say something. It feels weird, the dead air after me saying that. I'm thinking about the, uh, the hot and animalistic, uh, movies. I was like, Daniel Craig Bond. I haven't seen those. You haven't seen any of those, like Casino Royale? No, I tried watching it on a plane. I couldn't get into it. Damn.
01:03:47
Speaker
Planes are more of re-watch territory for me. I guess so, I haven't. I can't really ever get into a new movie on a plane. I haven't been on enough plane rides to have... From so physically uncomfortable the entire time on a plane that I just... I'm like, I can't expect to enjoy anything. I just need something to distract me from the fact that I'm uncomfortable on a plane. They're not built for people our size, Doug. Yeah, I probably... it would not be getting on one anytime soon. I'll say that. Yeah, planes. Because there's a, you're worried about Homeland Security. Well, I do have like all these things strapped to my chest. It might like look kind of, I'm like constantly adjusting them and like might look like I'm like fucking. Oh no, I was saying you were worried about a threat happening. No, I was saying like, I'm the threat. Well, at least Mark Wahlberg won't be there to stop you.
01:04:46
Speaker
Hmm. You might be though. He's everywhere. Um, any more Craven Craven talk. I feel like we touched on a lot of the movie. Russell Crowe bites it by a bear. That's so fun. Like when he walks away, it's framed the same way. A scene where someone like walks away from an explosion would be, but instead is just out of slightly out of focus behind him. A bear jumps Russell Crowe and kills him. It's pretty funny.
01:05:16
Speaker
Yeah, I didn't pick up on the fact that he was there to hunt a bear. I just wasn't paying attention to the plot, I guess, so at this movie. Cause at first I was like, why is he on a cold mountain? And then at a certain point I was like, why is there a bear? Oh, he's hunting the bear. That's why he's there. Okay. Why was the bear so fucking crazy though? Was that cocaine bear?
01:05:39
Speaker
Well, that's what I'm asking him. Is he like mind controlling the animals? Because like it looked up like more than I'm just doing this out of respect for my boy Craven. Craven asked me to take out his dad, so I'm doing it. I was expecting Russell Crowe to pull out a cartoonish T-bone steak from his back pocket that Craven slipped in there. like Isn't he funny?
01:06:04
Speaker
Oh no. Yeah. Cause you already have the reveal. Like, Oh, he took the bullets out. And then he also slipped like a rock. He bones steak, but it's animated for some reason when he takes it out. That'd be funny.
01:06:21
Speaker
Yeah. Fucking. I don't know. Russell crow though. You loved him. He was your favorite part. Oh, easily, just not not a ton of I'm i because I was trying to think of like, how you could restructure this in a way that would just maximize the good stuff in it, like Russell Crowe, like the chameleon, like, I think chameleon conflict being at like brother versus brother and then have it be because of the dad or so. Because that's basically what the end is like being like, oh, they're going to like be fighting over who inherits their dad's empire or something. they Like make that more of it. And also like the crime that dad was doing, that Crow's doing felt so nebulous. It's like, you sell drugs, dad. It's like, do does he? I didn't see his like crime network.
01:07:09
Speaker
Yeah, just also let us let your brother take over, you know? Yeah, like why? It was so dramatic. He's like, I can't let you do that. I was like, why? Like, I thought your opposition to the dad was that he's like abusive and not good person. I didn't i didn't know you were like disagreeing to it because crime is immoral or something. Like, you you kill people pretty easily and don't seem to have like moral screws. Arguably, you've done worse things than someone who sells drugs.
01:07:39
Speaker
Yeah, murder's, like, pretty bad. Also, I have a little faith in your brother. Maybe he'll run things differently than your dad did. Maybe he'll be good. Yeah, maybe he'll be good. You don't know. He'll be like, what if crime was good? Yeah, you're you're a bad brother, Craven. He's not supporting him in a way that he should. I do wonder what this movie looked like a year ago before they were, like, working on just in re-shoot. Were there any re-shoots, or was it all just re-edits?
01:08:05
Speaker
I think there was rewrites, so that probably means there was research. I've heard about different drafts of it, but I don't know what the previous drafts were. I never knew why they delayed it. I think it was, yeah, just so they could like... I heard like the strikes. People were like, oh, they won't be able to promote because of the strikes. And then the strikes ended before this movie was supposed to come out.
01:08:30
Speaker
I don't know. I never fully looked into it though. probably't really care enough I just assumed I'm like, they are making it just a better movie. They're making a perfect movie even better than they did an eight star movie into a 10 star movie. We got any final thoughts on Craven? Uh, I eagerly await whatever the sump has coming.
01:08:54
Speaker
Yeah, I'm kind of fine if they ended here. You know, or honestly, just do Craven. You should have started with Craven and just done Craven. More Craven. Yeah, Craven, Craven. Keep investing in Craven. You want to wrap up here or anything you want to? Yeah, I think I'm good. and Okay. Want to get in your pugs.
01:09:16
Speaker
Uh, yeah, you can follow me at Doug or not underscore two on Twitter or the shows Twitter at guys got juice. Uh, also check out our Patreon. There's a sale going on through the holidays. It's basically like a buck, like a dollar 25, 50% off. And there's, we have everything that we've upload from last month. I still have stuff that I recorded that I got to get around to. I've been dealing with some health stuff, so I've haven't gotten around to put everything up, but that'll be up soon. So today just check it out. We're going to be ah using that space a lot for a lot of fun stuff. So check out the Patreon.
01:09:51
Speaker
Oh yeah, i check out the Patreon. Write and review us five stars on Apple Podcasts. I don't remember if we said that already. Write us wherever you can, wherever you're listening to this five stars. It'll really help us out. um If you leave us a review too on Apple Podcasts, we'll read it on air. um Give me a follow on Letterboxd at Nicholas Ewers. Go subscribe to my YouTube page or my YouTube channel at Nicholas Ewers. I'm dropping some music on there. I've already got Three songs nothing too crazy, but you know maybe as I work on more music. I'll just start dropping ah full songs on there and Well, I'm Nick Ewers. I'm Doug Dampour. And we're these guys got yous. Have a good one Craven. Craven. Craven. I don't know. It's just like tune of eminent art venom venom venom