Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
Episode 157- James Earl Jones and Jedi.
107 Plays1 month ago
Welcome to The GALactic Podcast! In this episode, Andrea and Lauren chat about the passing of James Earl Jones and what he meant to them both. They also discuss their feelings on the Jedi. What has changed in their thoughts on the Order? They discuss and much more.
Reminder to rate and review where available! And as always, May the force be with you!
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and NFL Chat
00:00:11
Speaker
All right, well, hello, everyone, and welcome to The Galactic Podcast. I am Laura Romo, and with me, as always, is my cousin and fellow nerd, Andrea Gutierrez. Yo, yo, yo. Right, sons? What's going on? Nothing. Actually, a lot is going on. Nothing and everything. Yeah, like literally a lot is going on. I don't even I can't even believe I squeezed this in, to be honest.
00:00:37
Speaker
We did squeeze this one in for sure. Man. It's Sunday. It's NFL season. If you guys don't know, we've talked about it before. Andrea and I are huge NFL fans. So we say go Lions and go Packers every Sunday. But yeah, the whole season has begun. And then I see not a lot of Star Wars news per se.
Podcast Focus and The Acolyte's Cancellation
00:01:04
Speaker
A lot of them, yes. Yeah, a bunch of people giving their opinions on things. Things and they shouldn't been like it. Well, oh we didn't we didn't. So what's your take on ah the acolyte not getting renewed? Because I mean, we didn't we haven't recorded our statement. We'll we'll definitely hit that for sure. Well, there's a few things we're going to talk about for sure, people. um And that will, but we can really we touch on that real quick. Yeah, just slight. We will go very brief, very brief on that. And then we got a bigger conversation. James Earl Jones, obviously we're going to talk about him. And then our bigger conversation is just the Jedi Order overall and kind of our thoughts, opinions that have maybe evolved, changed ah with new content and everything. So we'll talk about that. But
00:01:57
Speaker
Before we get into all the good stuff, guys, if this is your first time listening to us, welcome. We are Star Wars Podcasts to discuss anything and everything within that galaxy far, far away. In each episode, we will dive into one or two topics and have a general discussion on them. Topics could be movies, TV series, books, comics, a specific character, you name it, and we talk about it.
Support for Molly and Alex Damon
00:02:20
Speaker
Okay, so first off, real quick, fandom is ridiculous.
00:02:27
Speaker
We, I will say this. We support Molly and Alex Damon. Uh, with all that BS going on with the fandom and that is so messed up. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, again, I don't want to dwell on that too much. I know neither do you, but no, we definitely support Molly and Alex. Uh, they are probably the two of the nicest people you will ever meet.
00:02:52
Speaker
They are genuinely, yes, the kind of people you will ever meet. They're very smart and intellectual when it comes to Star Wars. They have fun talking about Star Wars. They do deep dives. They have a very variety of different Star Wars creators, podcasters, arthurs authors, authors. They have a lot of different interviews. They do some really great stuff in the Star Wars space, specifically I think YouTube, right?
00:03:21
Speaker
And then you have dumb YouTube Star Wars, Star Wars people that just do hate and they get paid for it because it's monetized and it's freaking ridiculous. And YouTube refuses to change that, which is, Hey, that's their call. That's their business. It's dumb. It's idiotic.
The Acolyte's Cancellation and Fan Impact
00:03:38
Speaker
It's.
00:03:40
Speaker
should be changed but they're not going to change because guess what they are getting money as well as the creators are making that hate bigotry racist bs videos on star wars they get paid for its youtube doesn't care because they drive so many views to it so anyway that's my real hot quick take on that crap Andrea, yes, real quick statements on Acculite not being renewed. We talked about being excited for season two at the end of Acculite. Come to find out it's not being renewed. Your thoughts on that situation.
00:04:20
Speaker
Yeah, we were told many times by Leslie Hedlund throughout the first season, the only season for now, that season two was not set in stone, that if she could have a season two, she has a story for it, but if not, she feels like this ah season could stand alone.
00:04:41
Speaker
um I kind of disagree with her. I feel like she's left some really good nuggets that you you you you yearn for. You want to know what is going on with our our new Sith friends, and of course Darth Plagueis as well too, and that cliffhanger with Yoda at the end with Ernesto Rho.
00:04:59
Speaker
So, when I heard that the second season is not green lit or canceled or however some people wanted to describe it, I was super bummed. I was so bummed. I wish knew yeah i really was.
00:05:18
Speaker
ah There's a lot of reasons. But I'm not too surprised when I would like peruse around on like Twitter or Instagram or Facebook and I would read comments like if you were looking at like a show trailer or a show like clip. ah They were.
00:05:39
Speaker
There was so much like vitriol. There was so much just hatred and and just garbage um spewed ah towards that show that was so uncalled for. People that didn't even watch the show or give the show a chance.
00:05:54
Speaker
So I wasn't too surprised that the louder voice somewhat won, but I don't even know if they won, right? We don't know the whole story. But right now that's the way it feels like is that the the dark side of the fandom got a win. And I hate that they celebrated that win as well too. I just hated that. So um yeah, really bummed.
00:06:19
Speaker
You know, this this show just had life. There's so much room to breathe. It needed um more time in its ah first season and it definitely needed a second season. So I wish everybody can kind of get their crap together around a streaming ah TV shows because it seems like we're just not giving shows a chance anymore.
James Earl Jones' Legacy in Star Wars
00:06:45
Speaker
ah We all know first year first seasons, pilot seasons are not necessarily the strongest. So I don't know why they're not allowing um multiple TV shows to breathe and and you know keep ah building the story. Sucks.
00:07:04
Speaker
No, it does suck. And you and I talked about how kind of we're excited based on those nuggets that you were talking about. Plagueis, where does the Sith go, right? Where does all of that lead to? Vernestra, Yoda, even just even we talked about the Senate and the Jedi stuff was super interesting. Yeah, coming off the heels of the High Republic.
00:07:32
Speaker
Huge like that's fascinating and that's stuff that you and I love so yeah, there's a bunch of different Storylines threads that really were Good stuff and I i really wish we were getting more of it Am I surprised? Unfortunately, I'm very I'm with you. I'm not I But I think there's so many variables I think went into this decision, right? I think part of it maybe is that stupid you know backlash, if you wanna call it, because of those louder voices. I agree with you there. i Maybe that played a part of it, maybe not, right? It feels that way as fans who who really loved the show, liked a lot of it,
00:08:26
Speaker
It feels because of like you're saying things that were said online that were just spewed and any posts spewed on actors post of the show. Ridiculous. I mean, again, that's that's just different levels of just absurdity and bigotry and rate and like they can say that they're not, but they are. OK, you are when you're saying when you're saying it's stupid crap that you are in common section of an actor of a show.
00:08:55
Speaker
You could say that it wasn't, you know, it's not them, it's the show. No, you're blaming them. And oh, by the way, it's a person of color. That's big shock. Big shock that they would be going after a person of color. Wow. Shocking. Shocking. Yeah, I'm so. Yeah. So shocked considering one of the biggest gripes off the beginning of the show was where are all the white males? Exactly. I just I didn't. Oh, God, I thought that we could do a whole two hours on that anyway. But again, keeping it condensed because there's some other stuff we we really do want to talk about.
00:09:31
Speaker
I think there's a lot more that goes into it like I like I was saying I think studio Disney played a lot I think played a huge part in it honestly Lucasfilm maybe maybe not right I mean hey that's all all same thing but I think it really really is more of a higher up decision Right. And if you think about it, I know a lot of a lot of other podcasters have talked about this, too. Again, this isn't like original original stuff that we're talking about. But I think a lot of people have pointed out that again, when Bob Iger came back, what did he talk about? He talked about shrinking content.
00:10:16
Speaker
And Disney Plus. And they really are pushing. Movies, right, theatrical releases. And it kind of this tracks that. Like thought process of his right. Maybe the numbers weren't great. And maybe they saw OK.
00:10:40
Speaker
it's not It's not worth the the money to put into if the viewership is not there. It's a business decision, guys, and that sucks. It does. It's a business decision, and it sucks. Because there are a lot of people that really got into this show, and because of the show, their love of Star Wars blossomed, and because they felt seen in this show, right? Yeah. so i And that sucks that it's being taken away from those fans.
00:11:05
Speaker
Right, interest in fans and overall that really enjoyed the show. But really, I just want to talk about like specifically the fans that felt seen in this in that show. That sucks. Right. That sucks that they are not renewing this show for those type of fans. Right. But again, I think this is more of a business decision. This is a dis because think about this. And again, people have brought this up.
00:11:34
Speaker
Mandalorian season four is literally turned into a movie now. yeah So, I mean, this is one of your biggest shows on Disney Plus, the Mandalorian, right? For three seasons was on Disney Plus. And now all of a sudden it's a movie. You can say it's not season four, and they're not calling it season four, but let's be realistic. It's season four theatrical movie.
00:12:03
Speaker
Yeah, hands down. I mean, so yeah, this is this is just the where we are in the times of streaming like you're talking about Andrea in the times of media. This is where we are. This is where we're at with it, and it sucks. It does. It sucks. I hope we are able to see these stories get told somewhere somehow because I want to know.
Ethical Use of James Earl Jones' Voice
00:12:31
Speaker
What happens to you know the the mystery man that Manny plays? right What happens to a mandala's characters, the twins? like I want to know all that. I do, because I was invested. I think we all were at least invested into the story that they were telling. Not only as characters, but as actors as well too.
00:12:52
Speaker
you know in their livelihood and and their commitment that they put into that show and the characters and solely like doing it for the fans as well too and being fans themselves. That's the part that up so upsets me the most is like the humanness that ah is disappointed throughout ah this decision.
00:13:14
Speaker
Yeah, no, I agree, because again, it again, it affects so many people, not just again, fans of right fans, but like the people behind the camera. Right. All the people that are in like the, um you know, product and all like everybody that does set pieces and all like everybody involved in the show.
00:13:37
Speaker
They would have claimed back for season two, most likely. And that's a job. that's that That's them getting paid. And now that got taken away, right? So it does. It sucks. It's business, not to say that that like kind of offhandedly, but it's its business, right? It sucks.
00:14:00
Speaker
I hope they reconsider. You never know, right? Do you think they will? Do you think this decision could be changed? I mean, anything's possible, right? I mean, Clone Wars came back. True. But again, that's apples and oranges, right? I mean, Clone Wars was how many seasons? And there that was so beloved. But you never know, right?
00:14:28
Speaker
You never know, it it can it can give us hope for sure. I do, I hope. um Obviously we are, we talked about it you know um in our news episode, our last episode that we did. There's a lot of content coming around the Acolyte. We're getting books and comics and things like that. So that's great, but I would love more live action stuff. I think like everybody else, so.
00:14:55
Speaker
And any final thoughts on Accolade? Renew it. I agree. I agree. I hope I hope they do. We'll see. I mean, cross fingers, but we'll see.
Changing Perceptions of the Jedi Order
00:15:08
Speaker
We'll see. um OK, so our next thing, our next topic we want to talk about is the unfortunate passing of one Mr. James Earl Jones.
00:15:20
Speaker
Obviously as Star Wars fans know him the voice of the one and only Darth Vader One of the most iconic I think villains Yeah, I mean hands down and He was the voice of him, right? So when I think of Darth Vader I always thought of The voice, the guy, James Earl Jones. The breathing and the voice, yeah. Right. And again, we know there's a lot of people, there's people behind the suit and everything. We want to give all those people flowers too, because it's important that his voice and then the acting coincided and it did always. But again, I think it's fair to say when you think of Darth Vader, you think of that iconic voice. And that is one Mr. James Earl Jones, right?
00:16:13
Speaker
Big loss. I mean, let's just huge just in the the acting world and I think just in overall like you see so many um posts by celebrities just talked about how he was just one of the most genuine human beings like hands down right and he was so much more than Darth Vader which is crazy to think about right because this is the space we live in and is Star Wars and it's Darth Vader and it's James Earl Jones, but he was a part of so many different iconic roles. It's insane, right? I mean, the voice of Mufasa.
00:16:54
Speaker
So good. Right. He was in Coming to America, which is one of my favorite comedies of all time. So good. He was in Field of Dreams. oh what would be my i that would write That would be my next favorite performance um outside of Darth Vader is him in Field of Dreams.
00:17:14
Speaker
He is so freaking good in that. And then in Sandlot, again, Sandlot, Hugh Sandlot, the guy, the former like major league baseball player, he was so good in any role. Then he's made so many different cameos on TV shows, one that comes to my mind is Big Bang Theory. you made He was in an episode of that. hes He was just one of those people, the voice,
00:17:42
Speaker
just was so iconic. It was just, he was an and incredible, right? And anything he did, he was incredible. Not just voice acting, right? Like Darth Vader or Mufasa or any other, the voice, um voicing acting he did in his career, but yeah just his overall acting, right? Feel the dreams, right? Saying a lot. All those other just iconic movies he's done. It's a big loss, and it's a big loss for sure. What's what's your kind of overall thoughts as well?
00:18:13
Speaker
Yeah. That's like one of the, Darth Vader's voice is like one of the first sounds you remember. It's like the first, right? The first sound. Like what's the first sound do you remember as a kid? Uh, James Earl Jones speaking as Darth Vader. Right. It's going on right up there. Dantheum 4, whatever. Like it's crazy.
00:18:35
Speaker
And um just that they were able to utilize him, ah not just in the original trilogy, but like later on in Star Wars Rebels, and then also in ah Rogue One as well, too, is just um the commitment. And I think, did he... Was there something else I thought he might have done recently? I think he might have done Kenobi, too, a little bit, I think, yeah possibly.
00:19:01
Speaker
Yeah, I think so. um Just his commitment to the role, just his understanding of you know that like deep, bare tone is like what made that menacing part of Darth Vader come to life. It was just so amazing. A lot of people just had some really good heartfelt statements about him ah in these last couple of days. Kathleen Kennedy,
00:19:30
Speaker
ah ah also Mark Hamill and ah George Lucas as well too and ah just George Lucas saying that he had the most unique voice ah both in art and spirit um and that James will be missed by so many of us friends and fans alike is just absolutely right on like he will he will be missed the but the way he is captured in time is it's timeless really so um I didn't know that. Did you know when he was a kid and he was growing up that he had a stammer and he had speech therapists and he had to ah really get past ah all of that meant to think like later in life he would be noted as one of the greatest voices and most ah like identifiable voices that you would ever hear.
00:20:27
Speaker
so Yeah. And Mufasa too. I mean, o right? Again, just classic. like Any role you think of him, it's just he was the best, right? I mean, he was just so good. And that's interesting yeah ah that you brought up about his small speech impediment, it sounds like.
00:20:52
Speaker
That's insane to think that being young, having that, and then to overcome it, or however you want to say it, and then to become one of the most iconic voices in cinema, either voice acting or just acting, just, you know, when you heard that man talk, you knew exactly who it was hu in any role. And it was just so good, like, it's,
00:21:20
Speaker
He will be, he will be missed for sure. Right. I mean, it definitely in the star war space, obviously, but just overall, and like we're talking about just the overall acting space, uh, and just overall, just overall, just a great human being too. Right. Like it's just the big loss. It's a huge loss for, for fans alike of his, you know,
00:21:43
Speaker
Do you think that Lucasfilm will continue to utilize his likeness, his voice in some AI capacity? So that that's a big question, right? Yeah. It's huge. i Here's the thing for me. If his family, estate, whatever, if they give the okay, then that's fine. You know,
00:22:14
Speaker
As long as that is agreed upon and they get some type of residuals for it, obviously, the continued use of his voice, then yeah. And if they're okay with it, yes. Would it be weird to hear his voice in future projects when we, you know... Yeah, it would feel a little weird. I'm not gonna lie, it'd feel a little weird.
00:22:45
Speaker
But yeah, that's one of those man. It's, it's a tight rope to walk on, right? Especially for Lucas film or any, again, just even if they're doing like more of the Lion King stuff, right? Like he was Mufasa. Like, do you use his voice in certain like things? Like it's just,
00:23:14
Speaker
That's a tough thing, especially nowadays, right? That's the whole thing with technology today. it's what What do you do? Where do you draw the line of it's acceptable versus you've crossed the not acceptable line, right? I guess, again, for me, I will go with if his family estate gives the okay on the project, right? Like if whoever wants, if they go to them and say, hey, we want, we would love to use his voice for this reason. And if they give the okay, then I think it, it should be all up to them, right? It should be left up to their, to his family to decide whether they want future studios or whatnot to use his voice.
00:24:04
Speaker
Where do you fall? it's ah It's a slippery slope, man. Yeah, it is. Uh, I agree with you. Like, uh, the, the family in the state, uh, should be, should have a say in, in things like that. And should be able to control the, the usage of it or, um, and then be paid accordingly for it as well too.
00:24:30
Speaker
I think of like, remember in, uh, Force Awakens when they had Alec Guinness's voice say, right? Yeah. Like that's kind of like what it reminds me of. Um, and you got to wonder like.
00:24:44
Speaker
What is the future for these iconic characters? Have they ah like met the test of time and we're, we're over them. Will we need more content ah with these? That's a really good point. These specific things or are they just, are we just, should we keep them in the, in the time capsule that they're in right now? So.
00:25:08
Speaker
I, uh, I don't know. I like the voice. I've always loved his voice. I mean, I just love hearing it. It's, um, one of the the things that draws me to that character, you know, so he will be missed. Yeah. No, huge, huge, huge loss. And I, that's a great point by you as far as like.
00:25:33
Speaker
What do they do with like the character? Do we even need more from Vader, right? Yeah. And live action. I mean, we have Hayden Christensen, you know, so there's, there's opportunities to maybe expand a little bit, but I think maybe we're, I'm not going to say the Wells ran dry, but You know, at least for a while, I don't think we need to hit that note, hit the Vader note anytime soon. I mean, they could do a lot of like, if he's mentioned, they could just do the breathing. But again, does that, does that qualify as right or not? Right. Like, are you using his breathing or is it like a manufacturer's like?
00:26:25
Speaker
thing i like I don't know if that i like I don't know I don't know if his breathing was actually like him or was it just like a an effect right that they use so it's a slippery slope man it really is um but I I like that's a really good point though and of Or do we even need anything that would require them to reach out to his family in the estate, right? To be like, hey, we need to, you know, would it be okay if we use this voice in this specific reason? You know, maybe not, at least for a while, maybe not, right? Like, and I thought I, i
00:27:13
Speaker
I had to research this and I should have, but I thought a while back there was something ah about him, like James Earl Jones and like using his voice like via AI. This was a while ago. This was like, like a few years ago. There was some like conversation about him being asked about it or something. I can't, again, this was,
00:27:41
Speaker
and a very, very, a very long time ago when there's that conversation about using and doing that, like what we're talking about, like using it after his passing. So I don't, yeah, I don't, that's a slippery slope, man, slippery slope. Any final thoughts, though, Ange? Mr. James Earl Jones.
00:28:02
Speaker
No. um Rest in peace. Definitely. Yeah, definitely. ah Thoughts, condolences to his family and all the friends and the fans of Mr. James Earl Jones, man. Big, big loss in the Star Wars fandom. ah Big, just again, iconic, just an iconic, iconic actor. And he will be definitely sorely missed. All right. Last topic of the day.
Evolution and Flaws of the Jedi Order
00:28:31
Speaker
going from the Sith to the Jedi, the Jedi Order, Ange. A lot has changed over the years with how I think we look at the Jedi Order overall, all right? I mean, from the first movie to, you know, through the prequels, through the sequel trilogy, and then with all this new content, right?
00:29:01
Speaker
My I think perception of the Jedi Order has changed a lot i for me. What do you mean? So here's the thing. So like it when did it change? How long have you been thinking about this? Well, I don't know if I think I don't know if I've been thinking about it, but I think it's just something that I especially I think with Acculite. OK, OK. I think it really maybe hit home a little harder. OK.
00:29:31
Speaker
But I think once like when the original trilogy came out, right, i I feel like the overall thought of what the Jedi were and maybe this was because I was younger. Right. But even as I as you get older.
00:29:44
Speaker
I think the idea of the Jedi Order was like these peaceful people right that did good around the galaxy and now were really the the the hope. right i mean This is kind of what Obi-Wan was telling Luke. right They were you know protectors and all that stuff. right And a little bit of like a superhero status, don't you think? Oh, right. right yeah yeah Like a hero status. And everybody loved them. right Everybody looked up to these these Jedi.
00:30:13
Speaker
right That's throughout the, you know, out through the original trilogy, right? That's the feeling. Prequel trilogy comes out. I don't think much changes, but I think the i idea of what they were definitely changed, right? With the prequels. Yeah, they didn't seem as cool as I thought they were going to be. They were very like yeah hesitant, bureaucratic,
00:30:41
Speaker
ah like single-minded. But I still feel, and I 100% agree with you on that, right? I think the idea of what the Jedi were definitely changed with the prequels. But I think that thought of just like you brought up like this superhero-esque type of people, I think it was still there, right? They were still like the good guys, right? They were still these people that protected the rest of the galaxy. A little more like you're saying bureaucratic stuff behind the scenes, but nothing that really changed
00:31:15
Speaker
I think the overall thought of what the Jedi Order were about, right? But I think as time went on, right, through Clone Wars, through Rebels, through all the animation, through all the new live action stuff, I think the idea of the Jedi Order started, I think, shifting for me. And not to say they were bad. I'm not saying the Jedi Order are bad or anything like that.
00:31:40
Speaker
but I think just how they operated is not what I, I think, thought of when I originally think of the Jedi, right? Like, again, I say the Acculite hit this more harder for me. It's just the presentation of them going to these different planets, right? in And not imposing their will, but like kind of doing what they felt was right but not really thinking of the, I don't wanna say consequences, but not really thinking of what it might look like from the other lens, like from the the witches, right? From the coven.
00:32:26
Speaker
and taking children, right? And then that's a whole other thing, right? When we get, as more content came out, we learn about what happens, how they find these padawans, right? And they're taking from their families. And that seemed kind of weird, right? But like, it was okay, we're okay with it, right? And I think that,
00:32:55
Speaker
whole thing has really changed too for me like just the the overall understanding of how they find these little you know these small children right and then they take them from these families and I don't I'm assuming the obviously the families are okay but again within the oculi it was very like they push that on to them and they you know again
00:33:23
Speaker
soul specifically wanted to save, you know, the, the twins, but the coven didn't really want them to mess around with them. So like how, how many of those types of stories were out there, right? How many families didn't really want the journey to take their children, but not that they did forcefully, but they, they maybe just because they're Jedi, right? Because they were like the superhero-esque type of figures, these families were just okay with it, right? So it's just, I don't know, it's weird. It's just, the whole thought of the Jedi Order is,
00:34:10
Speaker
Different for me now than it was I think when I was younger and then I think just new content overall has changed it So what what about you has that this a Jedi order changed? For you the thought process and anything like that as the years have gone on as the content has come out Um
00:34:35
Speaker
I think ever since the prequels came out, I was always kind of not the biggest. like i ah It was hard for me to be all in on the Jedi.
00:34:51
Speaker
And even as I became like a more in-depth fan around the Clone Wars and novels, I also just, not the way that They were teaching apprentices, padawans, around the the ah the the capabilities of your feelings and which ones you use, and and all of that always seemed ah problematic, which obviously it is.
00:35:26
Speaker
I think the Accolade did a ah really good job spotlighting that as well, too, when the senator was speaking to Vanessa Rowe and she said, you know, the the Jedi do not control the force. And he says, I'm talking i'm not talking about the force, I'm talking about your emotions.
00:35:45
Speaker
um
00:35:48
Speaker
So, what has been nice is reading the High Republic books and seeing ah Jedi in their like expected behavior of they are heroes. They have conversations about good. ah They strive to help others. ah They ah continue to ah teach and like pass on knowledge. ah They talk a lot about um anger and resentment and and those types of things. and
00:36:28
Speaker
um how they the ah normal way of feeling and and how a Jedi deals with them, it's it's you know more descriptive and I'm not doing it justice whatsoever. But um in the High Republic books, it makes me see like, oh, the Jedi like actually were down a good path. What changed? And then you start to see when there's disruption and the Jedi can't, you know,
00:37:00
Speaker
they're not looked at as the the ah like they have opposition. right right We've always thought like everybody was just cool with the Jedi, and then we realized that no, they have adversaries.
00:37:13
Speaker
And when they do, that's like when their hubris comes around because they also have this arrogance about them thinking like we're Jedi, we're good. We use the force in the light side. Everybody should be cool with what we're doing. ah And they start to have tunnel vision. And you start to see that in phase three of the High Republic as well too.
00:37:41
Speaker
And ah just recently, I finished The Living Force, ah which was written by John Jackson Miller, who also wrote Kenobi. I think he might have written a couple other Star Wars novels, novels but um it's based on like ah like Coming like right into the fan Phantom Menace and coming out of the High Republic. It's really close to where the Acolyte is as well too. There's a Jedi Council, um there's Senate mandates, there's there's like all this stuff and you learn that they
00:38:22
Speaker
have regressed right back onto Coruscant because of what happened throughout the High Republic with ah the Nighill and Marcheon Row. that's not finished That story's not finished yet, but anyway. Right, remember right, right, right.
00:38:36
Speaker
yeah And you learn how they lost their way and they have this last moment of going to this sector in in the galaxy where they are starting to remove people like Jedi from Outpost and they're starting to be occupied by more pirates again.
00:38:55
Speaker
And you you learn, one, you get to get in great detail in descriptions of all the 12 council members, which is something I've never really experienced before, because when you see them in like Clone Wars, they're kind of just standing there. We kind of know like a little bit about Kiadi Mundi and stuff like that. But this book is like a great way to get to know um Jedi that you just had no exposure to.
00:39:24
Speaker
And it's really funny. It's a funny book as well, too. But ah what I find fascinating about this book is it gives you these moments showing you that Jedi namely that the biggest one of them all the most ah Respected and the one that everybody looks up like to which is Yoda still has flaws and still like grapples with the reality of being a living being and It's just really fascinating because you can see the the turn so
00:40:07
Speaker
Sorry, that took it took me a long time to get to where I'm going. No, i like no this is really good. Go ahead. Keep going. keep go So yes, the Acolyte did bring to light that the Jedi ah need to be inspected and validated. There needs to be checks and balances around what they do because they have lost their way.
00:40:30
Speaker
And if you want to see the full progression of that in detail, you know, read the High Republic, watch the Acolyte, read the Living Force, watch the Phantom Menace, and and you see it happening.
00:40:45
Speaker
I don't think Jedi are bad people. I think when George Lucas wrote the original trilogy and the prequel trilogy, he had a very um vague, ah not vague. this so If someone hears this, they're going to tell me I'm stupid, but anyway.
00:41:04
Speaker
ah The way he represented the Jedi in the prequel trilogies, he was trying to get a point across, but not with as much detail detail that is provided in the novels. So it can be a little bit misled of what the Jedi were meant to be. But he at George lu Lucas absolutely wanted to show that they had flaws.
00:41:32
Speaker
And it just wasn't as obvious as it is now um from watching the Acolyte or um you know watching the Clone Wars and and all of that as well too.
00:41:47
Speaker
So, but I'm gonna say this, I felt like the Acolyte did kind of trash them a little bit. i did i I did. I thought they went a little hard on the Jedi, but I think that it was the timeline that it fell in, it was appropriate.
00:42:03
Speaker
But there are tons of people that have not read the High Republic and that is what kind of cleanses your palette of like, of flawed g Jedi. And if you aren't like up to date on those types of things, yeah, I think you can, you're like, what is going on with the Jedi? They're like, they're not like what they're supposed to be.
00:42:27
Speaker
No, that's again, great, but great points. Cause I think, no, no, no, no, no. I think what you, what you said is a hundred percent. I think what I think fans may be in general, right? That aren't deep lore, like yourself or even me can see that the progression, right? We've talked about that. Like we know from the Phantom Menace and from other,
00:42:56
Speaker
Material like you're saying like it's the fall of the Jedi, right? From where they were like you're saying in the High Republic to where they fall to The Phantom Menace, right? And there's a lot there's a lot like you're saying there's a lot that goes into that right? Mark can row the nighill and then the Sith returning right which is I think what the aculate was trying to maybe Show that the return of the Sith is Again, clouded the the Jedi Council judgment. We know that from the prequel trilogy, right? So it's just I it's still like you're saying, even though as a fan. I know that it's a fall from grace, right? Like it's in it's still it sucks, but it's just I think.
00:43:50
Speaker
And maybe you're right, maybe because of how the acolyte did show it and kudos for, you know, that whole team to maybe take it this way, right? Because the, and have these conversations like you and I are having, right? Like, man, the Jedi order wasn't as squeaky clean as we thought. Yeah, they round the down, like, there's a lot going on, right? I mean, it's totally, I get what you're saying where as far as like,
00:44:16
Speaker
things that happened I would see push them into the path that they went right and a lot of it was again I think I agree with you arrogance hubris we talk about that all the time with the Jedi right but I think it's just it's The little things I think maybe be that we are learning for me, like you're saying, like the teaching of the, ah the taking and the teaching of the padawans, right? To not, again, to deal with like emotions or not really like even think about doing that, right? Basically like we can't even acknowledge emotions, right? Like that, how they are teaching the padawans
00:45:00
Speaker
that is something that I think we have been learning about, I think fairly recently, right? Books, comics, things like that. And that was a huge misstep. I think you and I have talked about that before, right? Where it's like, they really shouldn't have, you know, they really should teach The Padawans and Jedi overall better about how to deal with anger. It's okay. And I think you've said this before, Anj, it's okay to accept the anger, but how do you deal with it? Right? Like, how do you process that anger and not let it get the best of you? Right? That's where I think they need to do a better job of. And I think that's where,
00:45:46
Speaker
Maybe some of my frustration is like, man, they they were they were good. like Like you're saying, they were you know at a time, they were dealing with that stuff, right? And then somehow it felt.
00:45:59
Speaker
And it's just, it's just interesting. I guess maybe he just as a fan to see, and to see like, just how this whole organization, this whole order, like just went from high to low. Right. With all these smart Jedi, like Yoda, right? Like Mace Windu, like Obi-Wan, like, you know, again, insert any of the Jedi name that we feel that we're smart, right?
00:46:26
Speaker
It's just it's fascinating and I feel like again the acolyte really did put a spotlight on it I think for the better though, right? I feel like for the better. I think these are fun conversations to have like Where you know, where does the Jedi Order go from here now to even like with the and the new Rey movie?
00:46:48
Speaker
Do we get a new version of the Jedi Order? Does she even bring it up? like That's all fascinating now, too. right so yeah What else you got, though? I know there's so much to the Jedi Order itself. It reminds me, honestly, of like when you grow up and you start to get family secrets that you never knew.
00:47:07
Speaker
about. air and that's fair You're like, Oh, I didn't know that I thought like everything was cool. Like I didn't know that ah not i rainbows. I thought everything was fine. And I feel like that also is reflected you You bring up ray you talk about the last Jedi when ray approaches Luke like hey the Jedi are the light like we need them and then he's like no actually the Jedi were this and it It's it's all in like the same vein like we're starting to learn about the the Jedi
00:47:41
Speaker
uh like that we believed were our heroes are are flawed and it's it's coming out and it's changing our our perspective on how we think about them but it's uh and it it can be like really disappointing at first and i okay so i was watching the acolyte ah The Acolyte was, you know, we're all watching the Acolyte. And then I was reading this book as well to the Living Force. And there was this part, it was right at the end of the Acolyte where we got to see Yoda and everybody was like, bro, Yoda's in on it too. And he like didn't say anything. And then I'm reading ah the Living Force. And there's this part in this book where I don't want to give anyone spoilers, but ah
00:48:26
Speaker
And it's it's fair the book is very like anecdotal. I don't really think I'm like giving away like too much. But ah there's this guy is dying and Yoda is at his side for for the end of his his life and his son had done something wrong. And ah later when Yoda is walking away and he is with um another person, I think it's another Jedi, um they ask like, did you tell them about like what his son did? And he said, no good, it would have done. There are times when the truth will not help. And I was like, what? Dang Yoda, dang. And I was like, that that one sentence like literally slapped me across the face. And I was like, are you serious?
00:49:19
Speaker
And the the ah Jedi that was with him said, be mindful, Master Yoda, a lie for the greater good is still a lie. And he says, I know, he looked up, live with it, I will.
00:49:34
Speaker
So it's like, oh it reminds me of like him and everyone else knowing about Anakin and Padme and just thinking they can like sweep it under the rug. And then the repercussions that that had, um, you know, put in an entire galaxy at Jeopardy. And these are all fictional characters and this is, these are all stories. We always want to point out fictional characters. Uh,
00:50:02
Speaker
but it was it was interesting how like that scene from the end of the acolyte and then that part of the book I was reading around the same time so it had so much more like context and weight to it when when I read it and then to think like it's also like at the beginning of acolyte when you when you see the one side of the story and it seems like in dara is lying to the sisters and I was like dude jedi lying like that that seems so unforgivable to me as as ah as a fan of them or as someone that is invested and into Jedi. So like me seeing this and seeing like Yoda is hiding truths from people, like how did how did we get here you know and and and what is going on with that?
00:50:52
Speaker
But yeah, that book is um The Living Force by John Jackson Miller. it is It is really good. If you are a prequel fan or even and like a Clone Wars fan or a High Republic fan because there's even like a little bit of mention coming out of that as well too, it's just really great to read. Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan are in it as well too and it's just, ah their adventure part of it is is really fun to read.
00:51:19
Speaker
And again, it's like really funny. Like I didn't know Yarl Poof was like a funny guy, you know? But he was. But he was. So, um, yeah, there's just so I mean, we could We could explore, the Lucasfilm could keep exploring that, right? It's very true. The hubris of the Jedi. but i But a lot of people don't want to hear it. I mean, it's part of the reason why a lot of people, there was a big uproar about the last Jedi.
00:51:53
Speaker
So, and maybe again, uproar around the accolade, these people are heroes, we're supposed to have heroes, um but I think we need to get away from that and and have like mentors and humans that we look up to and beings that have um thoughts and emotions and feelings. I think what, I i mean, there's so much that you said that was great. i i I feel like you're right. A big part of it is maybe, and i'm and I might and i'm probably have followed it, this is the is just wanting to see our heroes be a heroes. Right, yeah. right like I don't wanna know the dirty details, but then once you start hearing them, you're kind of you wanna know the dirty details. right like why you know Like you're saying, what really happened
00:52:47
Speaker
that just changed everything. I mean, obviously there's so many events. You talked about that, you know, beautifully, like there's so many events within the High Republic era that lead to the downfall, right? But man, it's just like, who was, like for me, my head goes like, all right, who was the guy or person and the Jedi Order was like, all right,
00:53:10
Speaker
We got to change all of this. And this is what we have to do. We have to teach everybody that, you know, not to embrace their emotions, right? To shove them away. All right. Like. Who was that guy? I think that's coming up at the end of my Republic phase, honestly, because you can make sense, right? You can see like a breaking point and things that some people are doing that, um, could have consequences. So.
00:53:38
Speaker
I would guess that that would almost be how we transition into what we know. Right. And then i that's what I that's one piece of it that I would be absolutely like like I would love to read or see or whatever. Right. Like who what happened? Who or what group? What whoever was like, you know what? What we've been doing for X amount of years, decades, but whatever, right? It's not working anymore.
00:54:13
Speaker
But their actions are based off of what has happened recently, right? So they're trying to adapt to people like the Nihil, Marqian Ro, and then obviously the Sith, right? With Khaimir and ah May, and like you, they are trying to adapt to their times, which, hey, makes sense. I mean, that's a smart kind of business decision, but like,
00:54:40
Speaker
someone should have been like, should we be doing this? Or like, what, let's let's give like a really good round table discussion and not just be like, this is what we're doing, everybody agree with it, cool, let's do it. Like, that's what I really wanna know though, like what discussions were had. Like that's the nerdy Star Wars and like for me, I wanna know that, right?
00:55:01
Speaker
Like, that's the stuff I want to know. And then, like, again, that plays into, like, the Senate and the Jedi, like, kind of, uh, interactions, right? Where's the line? Where's the line of it all? Like, that, all of it is fascinating. But I think that's why, like you're saying, I think a part of it though, I think you're right. I think, and again, I'm probably guilty of this is I just want the Jedi to be good. ah just i And I'm not trying to say that they're not, right? We're not saying that they're bad people or whatever, but it's like,
00:55:35
Speaker
knowing the dirty secrets or just knowing the behind the scenes stuff, it does change your mind, right? Like with anything, like if we knew the behind the scenes of Lucasfilm and Disney Man, that probably would blow our mind and change everything. If we knew the conversations, the the Zoom calls, the whatever, right? The meetings. If we knew all the details of what went into choices, it would change a lot, right?
00:56:03
Speaker
So it's one of those like, I don't want to know, but I want to know. Does that make sense? Like I don't want to know what really happened, but I really do want to know like what, what really changed and who changed their mind. Because you want to, you want to make a well-informed decision, right? And I want to understand their decisions, right? Yeah, yeah absolutely. So yeah I just, yeah, i mean it's, I think you're right. I think it's the understanding of it.
00:56:29
Speaker
You know, so the understanding of what, what made them do what they did. And then that again, yeah, I think that would help me grasp what would, what transpires later on. Right. And I mean, to say too, Ang, obviously we are getting a lot of this stuff out of, or not out of order, but like, we know certain things already happened or we know events. Right. We know what shapes sometimes or what, what, what the outcome is. Right.
00:57:00
Speaker
But I think that plays in it too, you know? Like I think knowing things that we already know, but they're trying to tell stories before those events. That's I think tricky though too, right? Like that probably pays a part of it for me too, of just like, well, I do know what happens. And I know the Jedi, like, I know the Jedi are good, but like telling that story kind of in like the reverse way,
00:57:26
Speaker
and I don't know if that really plays a big part, but I think it plays a part though, don't you think? Like having those things like kind of reversed almost. Yeah. But it's also like, uh, like I said, like learning something new about your family. Like as a kid, there's this night naiveness, naivety that you have.
00:57:47
Speaker
and then later on you like learn something and you're like moon but um right right right right not saying i'm not talking about our family but but but no i give you safe we'll talk offline no no no
00:58:06
Speaker
But I, right, they're they're the heroes and we have bad guys and we have heroes and you're you're challenging my thought process around the good guys. I don't like it. ah You know, it makes me feel uncomfortable too.
00:58:21
Speaker
So in I think at us, we're able to the process this. We have pretty great conversations about it. And ah we go on living our lives, like doing the next right thing. So yeah ah so we we want to um have understanding around these characters that were once flawless to us and are now being showed as flawed. There are people that cannot grasp it.
00:58:51
Speaker
i I mean, they have YouTube channels and they, they sure do. They're people that just can't grasp it. Like my hero is a bad guy or my hero messed up laws. Yeah. Right. Mistakes. Yeah. I'm excited to read, uh, you know, the novels that are coming out with Vernestra and Dara. Um, I'm really fascinated around what was the term with Vernestra as well too, because you know In the High Republic, she was this ah highly renowned, like ah up-and-coming Jedi. ah She became a Jedi Knight at a very young age, so um what happened? what All of a sudden we see this finestra that's um hiding things and not telling half-truths and all that stuff. so
00:59:46
Speaker
I think the future is gonna keep ah giving us what we want ah to continue to have more knowledge about what we think a hero is and and is not. You're right. And then what what happened in the past that led to future events, right? And then, especially like, I mean, Luke tried to start it again, right?
01:00:11
Speaker
Didn't go so well as we know. Yeah, he didn't really, he didn't have a guys. So, right. So now- That's another episode. Honestly, mark that down. That would be a really good, like, let's have a conversation. Did Luke Skywalker really know what was going on? Well, that's a whole different conversation. But that'd be a fun one, though, too. But again, like, from that, you know, again, from his failure, right, again, it's kind of the whole Star Wars-y story, right?
01:00:38
Speaker
Failure and then coming back from it redemption and you know all that stuff now. It's Ray's turn right what but But that's what I think I'm excited though Being a fan of the Jedi is okay. We have Rey who's one of our favorite characters, where does she go with it? What does she do? Does she change things? Does she just follow what has been gone in the past? How does that you know start up again? That's one thing that I'm excited about in the future. And like you're saying, future content too, for sure.
01:01:17
Speaker
I think it'd be really fascinating. How do you feel about, again, the the future of, you know, obviously going beyond what we've been talking about, about the bad, kind of talk about the good. Like, where where do we see the Jedi Order going? Like, what would you like to see it change to? Or what, like, what would be your kind of thoughts on that?
01:01:40
Speaker
I would like to see it ah change to being more inclusive, not being so dogmatic, ah allowing people to go through their emotions and feelings and and all of that. i I go back to when The Rise of Skywalker came out, and that was like what, like five years ago? Yeah, 19, right? Yeah.
01:02:10
Speaker
And how um my nephew Alex said one of his favorite parts was when Ray crossed the lightsabers and she said, and I'm all the Jedi, like people want to see those things. That is what fires them up. Jedi being heroes, ah and but also.
01:02:31
Speaker
being being heroes in the correct way, right? Not being perfect. So, do you think that project is gonna keep moving along? I mean, I don't see why. I mean, I don't see why I wouldn't. I haven't, honestly, if there's new, like, rumors going on, I haven't checked on it. Yeah, I haven't heard any rumors, but... But, yeah, I don't see why I wouldn't, right? I mean,
01:02:59
Speaker
Unless those stupid voices win But there shouldn't be again, this is something I think Is needed though, right I think I think so too it's it's At this point in time as excited I am for a skeleton crew right which is gonna be a fun ride like I'm excited for just a very Fun adventure I want, and I'm looking forward to getting back to, not the Skywalker saga, I don't want to say that, but to this rate like the storyline of Rey and what she does with the Jedi Order. That's intriguing to me. yeah That's where I want to see where do they go from here.
01:03:47
Speaker
And more Jedi. I want more Jedi. Right. Right. Does she have an Academy? Is, is Finn a part of that? Like where do we like, that's what I want to know. Yeah. Like how, where does she, like, I just want, I can't wait to see like Rey's characters interpretation or what she believes is right.
01:04:10
Speaker
for her time period, right? Because I think that's part of it too, is the different time time periods. That's maybe who the Jedi needed to be, right? Maybe as flawed as they were, but that ah could be part of it. Again, the Sith play a lot into that as well as we know, right? Palpatine, all that stuff. But now that's, again, as far as we know, now that that whole thing is taken care of,
01:04:39
Speaker
Where do they go from here? And what is the adversary that is against the Jedi Order now? Is it the Sith again? Are they still in the background? They could be, maybe, or is there something new? Like that's what I'm excited to see too. What's new for the Jedi to face now? Right, what is the- Palpatine.
01:05:04
Speaker
clone 3.0 or whatever, maybe ah like, right. But what, where do we go? What is the adversary? What is the, the event or whatnot that is pushing maybe people wanting the Jedi order back? Cause maybe Ray doesn't want to do it, but maybe there's something that happens that she, that they're like, you know, you have to start it. We need the beacon, right? We need the hope. We need the Jedi back.
01:05:33
Speaker
What pushes all that? like That's what I'm looking forward to, too, as a Jedi fan, a Jedi Order fan, right? like Where does it go from here? right And we know there are still a lot of Jedi out there, even around her time. I'm trying to think age-wise, Ahsoka, maybe?
01:05:54
Speaker
um
01:05:58
Speaker
Tal Kestis, I don't know how old he would be or even Ezra. Grogu. Grogu? No, your husband ran out of that. Grogu. So being ran. Right. Like where they, you know, tie again. I'm not out the top of my head. I didn't know what the timeline is, but they could be right. Like who are the other, like you're saying, who are the other Jedi? Who was going to help Rey? If that's what she wants to. Broom boy. Broom boy, right. Like.
01:06:28
Speaker
There's a lot that they could pull from. Yeah. Well, that excites me. Like, I think the future of what it could be excites me. So. ah And final thoughts, should I order anything else you want to bring up or mention or just overall, what do you got? I'm not I'm not going to give up on them. I will say that my faith in them ah was wavered for a little bit during the acolyte and some of the things I was reading. Fair. But but ah I look forward to i mean it's their thought process and the and the things that they hold dear to ah what makes them ah help others and find the light and all of that is just an inspired way of living. So that's what draws me to them. right They're good. You want to do good? I also like the Sith flow too. I also like dark and creepy. in um
01:07:30
Speaker
I'm kind of mad. ah Characters as well, too. I can go either way. I'm a Jedi. No, that's fair. there
01:07:42
Speaker
Yeah, know I know. I am looking forward to, I think, the future, right? And where do we go with the Jedi Order? As fun as it is to see, again, kind of the rise and fall of it, right? Like we have talked about, like,
01:07:55
Speaker
It's still hurtful, I think, to see, again, your heroes have flaws, but that that's good storytelling, though, at the same time, right? And like you said, George Lucas, probably, why like, I could see this is all on what a George Lucas-y thing to do with the Jedi, right, to show the flaws. Because like you're saying, kind of what the point of the prequels was, right, is to show that, hey,
01:08:23
Speaker
Yeah, they're still good, but like they're flawed. Not perfect. Right. But I think that's the point. Like you're saying, that was the point of it. That was the point of it. So some people miss the point. A lot of people. It's the point.
01:08:41
Speaker
uh probably me uh right off the bat i think we all at some point missed the point of here like what is that why is this kid so whiny what is going on what are we doing mean menacing figure i know ah complaining right right oh god ah we should have a luke skywalker discussion i was talking about uh anakin skywalker and anakin i think yeah andnigan sky i think a skywalker men discussion that's really interesting but because let's be honest a little emo pencil is the is the one with the most common sense
01:09:26
Speaker
Did you watch the, uh, uh, Lego rebuild the galaxy? No, not yet. Not yet. Not yet. Is it funny? It's got some pretty, it's got some pretty good LOL moments in it. That's one thing like they, they do really good job was just yeah do having fun.
01:09:44
Speaker
With the with that universe for sure. Yeah. No, it's on my list to watch for sure So our kids that's a show. I hope you guys enjoyed our little fun discussion on the Jedi Order James Earl Jones all that fun stuff so if you Want to hear more of us you can follow us on all the social media platforms at the galactic pod Again, on all social media, and then you can follow our shows on all the major platforms up a pod, Google Play, Spotify. And then you can follow me, Lauren Romo at low row nose on all those social media platforms. You can follow me, Andrea Guti Erez at r2d2step on Twitter, Instagram threads, uh, Namjoon.
01:10:30
Speaker
Most people know him as RM of BTS dropped a track with Megan Thee Stallion. It's a great one. It's great one Oh, that's your BTS update kids. Go hit that track. Yep. Love it Alright, and as always may the force be with you always always