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Prioritizing Home (feat. Kelly Jean-Philippe)
233 Plays2 years ago
In EPISODE 55 I am joined by my good friend Kelly! He is the first guest to be on the show 4 times and I am really excited about this episode. He shares how his priorities have been evolving and shifting since he had his first son. He and his wife are expecting their 2nd boy and he is making some big life decisions that go against the typical traditional "masculine" norms. Tune in, share your thoughts, and leave a review!
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Transcript
Challenging Traditional Gender Roles
00:00:00
Speaker
So for those that are thinking and listening that might say, well, that's not very, very manly of you to stay at home with your kids. What would be your response to that?
Introducing 'Therapy for Dads' with Guest Kelly
00:00:13
Speaker
Cool.
00:00:16
Speaker
This is a Therapy for Dads podcast. I am your host. My name is Travis. I'm a therapist, a dad, a husband. Here at Therapy for Dads, we provide content around the integration of holistic mental health, well-researched evidence-based education, and parenthood. Welcome.
00:00:36
Speaker
Well, good evening. Good morning. Good afternoon. Whenever you're listening to the show, welcome to the therapy for dads podcast.
Celebrating Kelly's Milestone Appearances
00:00:43
Speaker
Um, this is a first Kelly, my good friend is the first one to break the glass ceiling of being a guest on the show for the fourth time, which is very exciting. Welcome Kelly.
00:00:56
Speaker
Thanks for having me bro. Absolutely. Um, I love having you on so much that I had you on the fourth time. Um, and you're the first. So how's it feel? It's a huge honor to be honest with you. Uh, the fact that you've wanted to have a chat with me on four separate occasions, even though one time was in a group setting with some other guys that we know, um, yeah, it's, it means that we have great conversation. So I'm looking forward towards this one also.
00:01:23
Speaker
Yeah. And I always love our conversations even offline. Um, those that don't know, we, we often talk offline. We become good friends over the past. I don't even know how long it's been year and a half, something like that.
00:01:37
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, that sounds about right. And those who want to maybe jump back and listen to other episodes Kelly has been on, his first was episode seven and then episode 26, which was called the holiday special, which we did a holiday season of 2021. Yeah. And then episode 36. And then now today.
00:01:59
Speaker
So if you're interested, there are three very different episodes, but all very powerful, good conversations.
Life Shifts and Breaking Norms
00:02:06
Speaker
Um, Kelly and I were talking the other day and about some changes that are coming up in his life. And I thought, you know, let's, let's record that and talk about it because I think it's a, it's a, it's a great just topic that I don't think is talked about enough. And.
00:02:25
Speaker
I think especially for being a dad, a man, I think it's definitely not the typical classic norm that you would think. And so I'm like, let's talk about it, record it, and maybe this will be helpful for moms and dads to hear and listen to. So I guess with that, I kind of intro'd it, but you're kind of in this season, Kelly, and I guess if you were to put a word or phrase into the season that you're currently in, what would you,
00:02:53
Speaker
What would you say a word or a phrase?
Reflecting on Priorities and Work-Life Balance
00:02:55
Speaker
That's a good question. I think I would describe the season that I'm in as Re-shifting priorities
00:03:05
Speaker
And that's been something true to my experience literally since my son was born. Everything changed. Over the years though, it's become a lot more evident to me that the way in which my life is currently structured when it relates to work, going to work and spending an amount of time at work and then coming back,
00:03:32
Speaker
Like that's just not it just doesn't feel like it's helping me in any of the ways that I would want having a job to fit in my life, especially after my son was born. So my son is going to be three in May and I have another one on the way due in
00:03:55
Speaker
either late February or early March, whenever he decides to come. So excited. Sorry, I'm not a woo girl, but I wanted to do that because it's been a journey, my friend. And I'm so excited for you and Michelle and Juki. Yeah, thank you. Yeah. I mean, anyone who listens to the last time I was on here would completely understand the context of why you're excited, why this is a big deal. It's such a big deal. So I can't wait.
00:04:25
Speaker
But yeah, when Juki was born, I was able to take three months off to be home with him. And I really did not want to go back to work after those three months.
00:04:40
Speaker
So that was the beginning. That was like in seed form what I am feeling more intensely now.
Value of Time with Family
00:04:49
Speaker
Because after that, it just didn't make any sense for me to leave home to go to work and not be with my son and witness the things that he's doing and so far and so forth.
00:05:02
Speaker
So over the past, you know, almost three years now, that's just been what's bouncing around in my head. So I guess that's a long winded way to respond to the question. But I would say definitely it's a matter of re-shifting priorities. I know that I know that this won't be
00:05:24
Speaker
the long term thing, although if it turns out to be a long term thing, then so be it. I'm not opposed to it, but definitely for now, like these first several years of Juki's life. I mean, I'm already two years behind in his, but for my next son coming on.
00:05:44
Speaker
I want to be I want to be home. I want to be with my boys. I want to spend as much time with them. I want to instruct them. I want to see their milestones. I want to, you know, hang out. I want to do all of those
Realizing the Importance of Being Home
00:05:59
Speaker
things. And so if I can do that while also working from home, you know,
00:06:05
Speaker
or some hybrid setting that allows me more flexibility to spend more time home than I do at work pouring into or kind of representing somebody else's values while that employee or employer is not necessarily catering to my values. Like to me, that's where the disconnect comes.
00:06:27
Speaker
So this has been brewing, like you said, since your first son was born, so almost three years ago. Yeah. And it's been kind of a evolution. Yeah. Like you said, a seedling, it was planted and it's been evolving and growing. And so I guess what was the point for you where there is this shift of
00:06:48
Speaker
Oh, what I need to do is actually be home full time with my boys so I could be there for the milestone. So like, what was the aha moment or the light bulb of like, Oh, that's what I'm really looking for. That's what I'm after. I think it was a combination of things.
00:07:03
Speaker
Um, the first part being just how much I really enjoyed spending those 12 weeks with Juki after he was born. I mean, it was just he and I. Um, Michelle had gone back to work and it was just he and I at home. And the things that we did, I mean, I could show you my phone, bro. I have
00:07:26
Speaker
I mean, just so many pictures of us on a daily basis. And I loved going out on walks with them. And so this was, you know, pandemic 2020. So there weren't many places that we could have gone, right? But just to walk outside in the neighborhood or to stay home. And I loved reading to him. So now he has a love for reading.
00:07:54
Speaker
You know, so just kind of seeing how good that felt. I mean, I felt close to my son. Finally, after three months of him being more so dependent on my wife, you know, so around that time, it was like, yo, this is just me.
Parental Influence in Early Years
00:08:11
Speaker
It's just me and him. My wife is not around. It's just me and him. When he's hungry, I'm feeding him. I put him to sleep. I changed his diapers.
00:08:21
Speaker
I burp him, you know, I play with them. I take a nap with them. I mean, it was just us and that was just so cool. So I'm like, yeah, I want to I want to do that, you know, more long term. I think the other part of it too is that there is a sense of
00:08:44
Speaker
there's something unsettling for me in the way that I view the world with the way parts of our culture and society is shifting and headed. And so I just feel like it's my responsibility first and foremost to educate my son, my sons. And I want to be as influential in this early phase of their lives
00:09:11
Speaker
So that when they do go to school and they start interacting with other kids and You know who come from homes that see the world in similar but different ways than I do I'm setting a strong foundation right and I just feel like some of the discourse and our modern society some of the
00:09:38
Speaker
decisions that are made in the higher up places. Some of the trends just leaves me feeling very unsettled.
00:09:50
Speaker
I want to, to the best of my ability, you know, shape my children's minds before I hand part of that responsibility over to somebody else. There's two things that stand out to me as you're talking and I want to address both.
Evolving Perception of Gender Roles
00:10:09
Speaker
The first one is more of a
00:10:11
Speaker
gender stereotype question. So for those that are thinking and listening that might say, well, that's not very, very manly of you to stay at home with your kids. What would be your response to that?
00:10:30
Speaker
Cool. Short and sweet. Expand on that cool. Because obviously the traditional gender stereotypes is that's not a manly, quote unquote manly thing. I love your response, but if we were to expand it a bit deeper, what would you, you could sit someone down and talk, what would you say further? I mean, I honestly don't know.
00:10:55
Speaker
what else I could say or I would say beside that. I guess I would want to know what the person thinks my responsibility as a man is, which is interesting because today, earlier today, I was browsing through IG and I came across this video
00:11:17
Speaker
of this young lady who was sharing a point of view that I was like, you know, I think there's some merit to it. And I'm not going to try to rehearse what she was saying because I'll butcher it and I don't want to I don't want to be I don't want to say something that she didn't say. But what she was saying, though,
00:11:38
Speaker
was very much so a different perspective from the current way that we perceive gender roles. I think it's fair to say that nowadays we don't necessarily, we don't necessarily see gender roles the way that our parents and grandparents saw, right? Like no one nowadays would say it's a man's
00:12:07
Speaker
responsibility to go to work and provide and protect. And it's the woman's responsibility to stay home and be a homemaker and nurture and you know, all of that stuff. Like we understand the implications of that and we know that it's not a man or woman thing.
00:12:24
Speaker
both parents, both genders, any gender can do that, right? But what she was saying was more so on the, let's not look at those norms, the man being the one who provides and protects, the woman being the one who is more the emotional nurturer
00:12:42
Speaker
and the softer one. Her point was like, let's not look at those as if they're bad. Let's actually embrace the fact that that is a difference or that could be a difference between man and woman. And so instead of trying to China or paint them frame these two differences in a negative light so that now the woman would look for a man who is not the provider and protector and he's the more
00:13:12
Speaker
emotional guy and she's like well then a woman might not might be turned off by that because now the guy's too emotional or the guy might be turned off by the fact that the woman is too like her her masculine energy is turned up way too high and so he's repulsed by that and you know she drew some conclusions and stuff but I'm listening to that and I'm like you know I think I think there's some merit there
00:13:37
Speaker
I think there's some merit there. I mean, why it's not necessarily a bad thing for me to want to, you know, protect and provide for my family. It's not necessarily a bad thing for my wife to want to, you know, be the one who stays home. And but on the other hand, if I want to be the one who stays home, there shouldn't be, you know, some sideways look or, you know, some
00:14:05
Speaker
eyebrow raising, some head scratching, or someone coming out of the normal way of behavior to be like, why the hell would you do that? You know what I mean? Because that's just what I want to do. At the end of the day, Travis, I take full responsibility for raising my children.
Prioritizing Family over Work
00:14:29
Speaker
I mean, they're my children for a reason. And if
00:14:34
Speaker
If within the confines of my home and my relationship with my family, we make a decision, I make a decision that I thank for the benefit of our family. It would be better for me to stay home with my kids than anyone's opinion, anyone's curiosity is their own and can't stop people from, you know,
00:15:02
Speaker
feeling or thinking those things. But at the end of the day, that's just the decision that we made as a family, whether it appears manly to someone else or not.
00:15:12
Speaker
So the other question I was having is this shifting in priorities of choosing to, you know, I want to be home full time. What is the why? What is like the core why for you? Aside from the fact that I really love my kids, which of course I think every parent does. So I'm not saying, you know, that as like, I love my kids more than any other parent loved their kids.
00:15:41
Speaker
I also think part of part of this shift is because they're not going to be they're not going to be young forever. Right. Like they're not going to be young forever. Once once they start going to school and once they start having friends and once they start on that trajectory, the nature of the relationship is going to be different.
00:16:07
Speaker
how I'm available to them and they're available to me is going to be different and we're going to have to figure out what that is. But I really enjoy this phase right now that Juki is in. I mean, since he was born, we haven't sent him to daycare because again, he was born during the pandemic. My wife and I have been very blessed that
00:16:33
Speaker
Her parents don't live too far away. I also have a sister who lives in Philadelphia. So we've had family to help us. Hey, could you watch them for a couple of hours? Could you watch them for a weekend while Michelle and I, you know, go on vacay or whatever the case
Balancing Work and Family Commitments
00:16:50
Speaker
is? So we haven't had to send him to daycare or any of that stuff. We just love having our son around. I mean, he's,
00:17:00
Speaker
He's annoying, he is cool, he is funny, he loves our company. He loves our company. There's gonna be a day where he's gonna be like, dad, bro, I just need my space. So, you know, it's just, I'm having a hard time,
00:17:25
Speaker
coming with legitimate reasons for why it makes more sense to leave my home and go somewhere else to spend a huge chunk of time and then come home and pretend like I'm not tired as hell and then have to like give to my children
00:17:54
Speaker
the what's left of my energy after having spent the good choice part of it during the day somewhere else, for somebody else. To me, that just doesn't make any sense. And particularly after the whole working from home dynamic as a result of the pandemic,
00:18:20
Speaker
and seeing how businesses didn't collapse, people were not less productive in their jobs. I'm like, oh, dude, it just seems to make a lot more sense. Like if I'm gonna be tired and frustrated,
00:18:37
Speaker
and annoyed and all of that stuff, then let me use that, like the prime cut of my time with my family. Like to me, that makes more sense. I'm not, I just don't, what's interesting is that prior to,
00:18:58
Speaker
becoming a dad and prior to COVID, that wasn't even a question in my mind. You know what I mean? It was not a question at all. But sense, man, it's like, yeah, it makes more sense. And you know this about me, and I think people who have
00:19:18
Speaker
followed your podcast and have heard our conversations. I think we've spoken about this in one or two conversations, episodes. The setting where I work at, which is a children's hospital, it's emotionally draining. And there are times when I can't, I do my best, and I think I've gotten very good at it, to leave work at work. I don't even leave work outside
00:19:46
Speaker
the door of my home. I leave work at work. And when I get home, I get home. But there's certain things that come in the car with me on the drive home.
00:19:59
Speaker
And so even though I try to leave those things outside the door to my home, before I close the door, they end up coming in also. And so now I have to, you know, embrace my son who when he sees me coming through the door, you know, screams at the top of his lungs, daddy's here, daddy's here. And I got to embrace him and hug him and kiss him and he wants to play and he wants to tell me what he's done, you know, during the day and all of that stuff. And I got to,
00:20:27
Speaker
be there and pour into him and be available to him while pretending like I didn't just leave a very devastating situation or devastating situations.
Questioning Job Loyalty vs. Family Presence
00:20:41
Speaker
You know, so that's, that takes out a lot of energy, you know, that, that, um, that takes out a lot of focus. So why am I doing that four or five days a week?
00:20:57
Speaker
from the moment I wake up and I have all this energy, I'm gonna give that to somebody else. I'm gonna give that to some other place who if I were to get sick, they're not gonna be taking care of my family. You know what I mean? Like if I were to be out for an extended period of time, once my FMLA runs out, my job ain't secure no more.
00:21:24
Speaker
You know what I mean? Like I know people at where I work at right now who've been working there for almost as long as I've been alive, bro. And they're like thinking about retiring and this and that and
00:21:39
Speaker
they ain't making like no parades for them and thanking them for their, so to me, it just, that structure just doesn't make sense. If something that does make sense is I still have to work because I have financial responsibilities, but if I can do that while also being available for my family,
00:22:04
Speaker
then that makes more sense to do it in my home setting. And, you know, when the kiddos get older and they start going to school, then we'll revisit what the plan is going to be. But for the time being, I just want to be here for my kids. Yeah. I love what you said. It just stuck with me. It's the prime cut.
00:22:32
Speaker
the prime cut that I want to give that to my kids especially especially in this phase of life as a young because like you said and I agree I mean my kids are not much older but
00:22:46
Speaker
They're only young once and it goes quick. And again, my eldest is going to be six this year. And then I will almost four year old. And then my daughter's turned one and it blinks. And I know my kids are not that old, but it does go quick. Like I feel it. Um, and the more kids I've had, I feel it. It's like, wow, this, it's a really sweet moment to have. And.
00:23:11
Speaker
You know, I remember with my first, um, I was working more and I had a longer commute to work back then. And, you know, I would get home, I'd leave and it took me about an hour, almost one way, both. So almost two hours on the road and.
00:23:31
Speaker
man, the first year of my first son's life, I'd be getting home as he's going to bed most nights. And I remember really just feeling that and not liking it and feeling like I was missing out on just this young phase. And I would do my best to get home. I'd read books with him and I would do all this stuff and on the weekends, super present and
00:24:01
Speaker
By the weekends, I would feel that whole day and how much time I had and more space and I wasn't just rushed right before bed. And after that, when we had our second, I was working kind of one and a half jobs, so I pulled back on that second job so I could be home more. And then the pandemic hit and then I was home a bit more, which was great being home. It was amazing. I'd be able to see these moments and be available.
00:24:28
Speaker
I had way more time with my second son than I did with my first and I was like man I really like having these moments so the prime cut just I love that image I'm also a little hungry for steak right now but you know I'm thinking too I read I read your recent and shared your recent blog post
00:24:52
Speaker
And I'm wondering I'm wondering because you were doing some reflections there with kind of your own journey Reflections of your father and kind of your journey your personal journey and stuff with your son. So I'm wondering
00:25:07
Speaker
you know, just to bring it into this conversation. Did that have any, was that part of this decision? That kind of reflection of what you saw, you know, your relationship with your father and kind of where you are now in your phase of life as a father and what you want to give away to your kids. Did that play a piece? And if it did, can you speak a little bit on that?
Reflecting on Fatherhood Journey
00:25:29
Speaker
I don't know if it did. Okay. On the conscious level. Okay. Subconsciously I wouldn't
00:25:36
Speaker
put it past it in what ways? I'm not sure. Um, because most of my upbringing, my father was not there. So, and that definitely shaped who I am today. And, um, the big aha moment that I re that I talked about or wrote about in the blog was that,
00:26:04
Speaker
Once I started parenting Juki, I realized that I was parenting from a space of comparing myself and my relationship to my son with my father and me from a time long ago.
00:26:26
Speaker
not knowing, not having all of the details or not having many details, not even all, not having many details and so me having to fill in the gaps.
00:26:36
Speaker
so that the details that I did have would make sense for why he wasn't around, why even when he was around, he didn't take interest in me and my siblings and anything, right? So once I came to that realization, it was like, whoa, this is not about trying to outdo him or anything like that.
00:27:06
Speaker
It's about who is Juki and who am I in relationship to Juki. And that has been the driving force of our relationship since that discovery. So I'm sure in some way, shape or form,
00:27:27
Speaker
there's something there to respond to your question. But to be honest with you, I don't think is that active or active at all. It's more so, man, I love my son and I love being a dad. And there is nothing in the world that means more to me than my son and to be a father to my son.
00:27:58
Speaker
Yeah, it's just forced me to recognize just how, it's interesting that as parents, excuse me, as people who are responsible people, we have to work. So I'm not saying that I don't ever wanna work and just stay home and not do anything and just play with my kids. That's not what I'm saying at all.
00:28:27
Speaker
We have to work. And I want to work. I mean, I'm an able-bodied man who can work, so I want to work. Thinking about providing for my family solely on the basis or through the lens of capitalism, so just money, that's where that structure begins to fall apart.
00:28:58
Speaker
Um, and while money and, you know, is necessary, we got a mortgage to pay. We got bills to pay. We got car insurance to pay. We got stuff to pay. All right. Before we hopped on, on this conversation, I was telling you today, we spent part of our day in the emergency department because my son was not feeling well. So that bill is going to come and.
00:29:26
Speaker
If we didn't have good insurance, we would have had to find a way to pay. So the financial piece is absolutely crucially important because we need money to survive. But I'm not what I'm what I'm saying is that I'm at a place where I no longer want to
Misalignment of Job Structures and Family Values
00:29:47
Speaker
let
00:29:47
Speaker
that be the only drive for or the only definition for how I provide for my family. So the the structures as they presently are know that as responsible people, as responsible parents and families, we have to work. And so, of course, I found a job.
00:30:17
Speaker
They hire me. They say in exchange for my service, they will give me not just monetary compensation, but they'll give me insurance. They'll give me a couple of days off per year for vacation. I have some time off for emergency situations. But bro, one of my colleagues at work,
00:30:47
Speaker
experienced a death in her family. And she only had three days as per policy for grieving three. And it was a close relative. It wasn't like, you know, a hamster who died, but even if it was a hamster three days, and then you got to come back.
00:31:15
Speaker
and jump right back into work. And so it just doesn't, once I started to realize that, oh man, this job wants me committed to it, but this job is not committed to me in the same way that it wants me to be committed to it. Oh, we got a problem there. We definitely got a problem there. So it's more about that than,
00:31:44
Speaker
then the stuff with my dad, that's separate, as separate as it can get. I have not thought about how it might or might not influence any of that. But the drive is definitely there. I have to provide, I have to be a financial contributor to my family. And now for a short break.
00:32:11
Speaker
So if you're looking for ways to support the show and my YouTube channel, head on over to buy me a copy.com forward slash therapy for dads. There you can make a one time donation or join the monthly subscription service to support all that I'm doing at the intersection of fatherhood and mental health. And all the proceeds go right back into all the work that I'm doing into production, into
00:32:33
Speaker
continue to grow the show to bring on new guests. So again, head on over to buymeacoffee.com forward slash therapy for dads. Thanks and let's get back to the show.
00:32:44
Speaker
Well, and something you said earlier, which kind of expanding against the, you know, the, the, the traditional gender norm or the capitalist ideals of, you know, like you said, like you're, you're committed to it, the job and the job is not really committed to you in a way that you're committed to it. And what I heard earlier on in early on in the conversation, you said, you know, with everything going on in the world, you know, I, my influence,
00:33:13
Speaker
over my sons, especially at this age, is short because they're not going to be this age anymore. So my influence, my power that I have as a father is incredibly important. Could you speak to that a little more? Yeah. Um, and saying that doesn't mean that as they get older and even when my sons become adults,
00:33:38
Speaker
God willing, I'm still alive to see them when they become fathers so that I can become a grandfather. It doesn't mean that my influence won't be as important then. But right now their minds are like empty vessels. And I just think if there is anyone who should take full responsibility and accountability for
00:34:08
Speaker
filling that empty vessel, those empty vessels, I volunteer myself to be the one to do that. To me that just makes a lot more sense. You know, these early years set the foundation for what they will end up building the rest of their lives on. So,
00:34:34
Speaker
I'm not here implying that I want to indoctrinate my kiddos or that I want to brainwash. It's not even, that's not it. If that's what somebody has heard or is hearing, that is not at all what I'm saying. That's not what I'm hearing at all either. Awesome. But I just wanted to clear that. What I'm hearing, and this is part of, I mean, this is,
00:35:02
Speaker
similar to the decisions we made in our family was if if you can do this because not everyone can do this but if you can no one can replace you or your wife not a single person you know full stop no one yeah no I mean the next this the next best would be I guess a loving family member
00:35:23
Speaker
Yeah, and we have plenty of bills around. And then maybe like a friend and then maybe like a daycare worker. But a daycare worker, if you compare a daycare worker, and I'm saying this, everyone listening, I have nothing, daycare workers, they have a job and they're providing a service and there's a need, right? And we're thankful for that. Very thankful. So I'm not, when I say this, I am not putting down a daycare worker, but what I am saying,
00:35:50
Speaker
And this is my opinion. Take it or leave it. Is it mom? You kill. You know, Kelly Michelle. Do not compare to daycare worker. Not not even close.
00:36:02
Speaker
And your influence, your consistent influence, again, not even close to a daycare worker. And your influence, especially at this age of studying such a solid foundation that will build upon when they get into their elementary school years, tweens, teens, young adults, adult, that this is a foundation. I love that you said that, setting the foundation.
00:36:29
Speaker
And this is something you can't get back, because by the time they are teens, well, you can't go backwards. You know, you could build from teenage years, you could build from young adulthood and adulthood, you could build, but you can't go back. And, you know, I chose my wife, you know, just whatever people want to know. You know, we made a decision because we wanted one parent to stay home, at least in the young years, to be full-time. And if she didn't want to do it, I would have done it.
00:36:56
Speaker
Because I valued that and we were gonna do whatever sacrifices we would have had to make to make that happen. And do we make sacrifices now to do that? Oh, heck yeah.
00:37:07
Speaker
You know, one income. There's sacrifices there. Now, are we blessed to be able to do it? Absolutely. But there's sacrifices financially. There's things that we don't do because of that. But we value that, similar to you, of like the influence we have. And my wife is not replaceable. I am not replaceable. Kelly's not replaceable. Any of you parents listening, you are not replaceable. You are important in your kid's life.
00:37:36
Speaker
Again, I'm not saying that if you're not there, you have a daycare worker, you're somehow not influenced, but I don't want to split hairs here. You are still valuable no matter what role you take in your kid's life, no matter if you're full-time working and have a daycare worker or a family helping out or if you're full-time, it doesn't matter. You are so important in your kid's life. And I think what Kelly is doing is realizing a little something deeper about, hey, I want to give my prime cut. And for me personally, Kelly personally, is I was giving my prime cut to my job and my kids were getting my seconds and I didn't like that.
00:38:07
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. That just didn't make it. It still doesn't make any sense. And for you, it's like what makes sense is I want my kids at prime cut for me. Absolutely. And this is this is my prime cut. Absolutely. Yeah.
00:38:22
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And you know, I want to give I want to give a voice to a single parent.
Challenges Faced by Different Family Dynamics
00:38:31
Speaker
Yeah. Right. Yeah. I want to give voice to folks that even.
00:38:38
Speaker
two income households are not able to make ends meet. So I want to give voice to the variety of different circumstances, family circumstances that might make this sound so arrogant, ludicrous, just completely inconceivable,
00:39:05
Speaker
So yeah, 100%. I want to give voice to those experiences, to those realities, and to those dynamics.
00:39:14
Speaker
Yes, sir. I second that. And I think of this pretty much daily, if I'm honest, me and my spouse have a great relationship. And I'm not saying that to like, you know, tout this off like, oh, we have a great relationship. No, we have a really good relationship. And I'm very thankful for that. Very thankful that our relationship is solid and strong. You know, we're going on 13 years of marriage this year, which is crazy to think about.
00:39:38
Speaker
and congratulations broski thank you um lucky number 13 man yeah i'm very excited in fact i gotta look to see what the year is i know last year i think was linen which we got linen sheets so there you go um but i think of you mentioned single parents and man i'm i'm saying this that parenting with a partner where we have a really solid relationship and parenting three children
00:40:07
Speaker
while is amazing and awesome and I love my kids on the same side of the coin, the opposite side of the same coin is it's incredibly difficult, incredibly exhausting. It takes everything of you. You have to, you know, you're regulating your own emotional states and your kids and trying to model every second and like healthy dynamics, healthy communication, and it's really hard.
00:40:35
Speaker
And I have a partner that we can kind of tap each other in and out if we see each other kind of struggling. And then I think of single parents and I'm like, oh my lord. Like the work you guys are doing is incredible. Like truly incredible. Truly incredible. Because there's no backup.
00:40:57
Speaker
I get to witness it every day because my sister is a single parent. And I mean, I have so much more love and respect, a deep, deep, deep respect for her as a person, as a single mom.
00:41:18
Speaker
who is doing the best that she can. And for her as an icon of single parents, mom or dad.
00:41:27
Speaker
who are really trying to make something out of very little in a lot of circumstances. I have this saying that I say for me, it doesn't make sense, but it makes perfect sense to me. There's a saying that when life gives you lemons, you make lemonade.
00:41:49
Speaker
single parents, when life gives you lemon, they're making mango juice. Totally. Oh my gosh, I love that. Absolutely. That's what I see day in and day out with my sister. So yeah, big, big, big, big respect to single parents.
00:42:12
Speaker
And I think something with this conversation where I'm thinking now is I think in the end is really, and this is really, it kind of ties into this, but it's getting to know the person in front of you, gaining the mom, the dad in front of you. And what is their story to have empathy and understanding for their circumstance? Absolutely. And not that anyone's better or worse or right or wrong, but
00:42:43
Speaker
getting invited in and like your sister, it's like you got to witness this and see a single parent make mango juice daily out of lemons. And it changes you how you see people of just like, wow, you see the, I think the incredible strength, perseverance, tenacity, patience, grace, all these things that people possess.
00:43:08
Speaker
and out of very different circumstances. And the empathy meter goes up and the understanding goes up. And I think that just is incredible. Yeah. Yeah.
Gratitude and Joy in Fatherhood
00:43:21
Speaker
mango juice, that's going to sit with me. I love that. To close out, I want to say thank you for having the conversation and for sharing this shift, this priority shift for you and how it does brush up against some typical gender norms, what men do or don't do. We talked about capitalism in here and what we want to give our prime cut to.
00:43:50
Speaker
and different family dynamics of raising children and also the difficulty of having kids and also the joy and not wanting to miss out. And if you were to kind of frame this conversation and kind of how we started, how we're kind of ending this conversation, as you think about the decision of making a choice and having the capacity to choose, as you said, blessed to choose, that I could choose to be home more often,
00:44:19
Speaker
Um, I'm wondering what, you know, what emotion does that fill you with? Knowing that you can be home and be with your boys and, and cherish these, these moments. Um, the one that comes to mind the first is gratitude. Um, man, I didn't think I was going to be a dad at some point in my life.
00:44:50
Speaker
And then I became a dad and then I'm becoming a dad again. And so, you know, today while my wife and I were back in the, we got, we had gotten checked in the emergency department and we're in the room. The doctor had already come and talked to us. My son has started to perk up and he just,
00:45:21
Speaker
became himself again. And I'm sitting there and I'm just watching him. And all he was doing was eating a popsicle. And I'm just watching him. And I was just so overwhelmed with not just gratitude that he was feeling better, but I'm like, yo, I get to, I get to have him as a child.
00:45:47
Speaker
Like how, and then I said to my wife, you know, I'm really having a difficult time thinking about how it's gonna be possible for me to love our other child as much as I love this kid. You know, because number one, little man number two is not here yet. So I haven't seen him, even though I love him so much already, but I haven't seen him, but I'm looking at Juki and I'm just like,
00:46:17
Speaker
Holy crap, like I get to parent this child, you know? And I'm just really thankful, I'm grateful that I'm even in a position to be able to think about
00:46:35
Speaker
not even think about it. I'm in a position where I can make that choice to want to give myself even more so fully to parenting him in a way that
00:46:51
Speaker
know he's going to I Know he's going to benefit from and appreciate and you know, not because I'm an awesome dad, but because I am an awesome dad Yeah, come on. Yeah, come on awesome. Yeah, absolutely So yeah gratitude And along with that man is really it's really humbling. Yeah, it really is humbling My parents
00:47:16
Speaker
My parents came from nothing, whether or not I have a relationship with my dad, but he has, I don't think life afforded him the opportunity to attain some of the things that I've been able to attain. And it would be foolish for me to not say that, or to say that I did this by myself. No.
00:47:46
Speaker
The man helped. He provided in some way, shape or form some opportunity for me to be able to attain the things that even, even the lack of a relationship and his lack of presence, his absence was
00:48:06
Speaker
equally a motivator for me, right, to wanna attain a certain level of academic success, of personal success, so that my family, I would give something to my family, something that I didn't receive from him, right,
Lessons from Parenting Experiences
00:48:25
Speaker
so. Well, there's your why.
00:48:27
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, so, you know, I remember being in college and I went to a really small, small liberal arts, but really prestigious school, liberal arts school. And I'm in class with kids from all sorts of, you know, walks of life and economic backgrounds and
00:48:54
Speaker
And this was a sociology class, and we're having a conversation. Long story short, this kid was addressing the question, why do a certain group of students always sit together in the cafeteria and not mingle with the rest? And so everyone is giving their responses. And this young man says,
00:49:15
Speaker
you know, if I were of that a certain group of students, I would feel intimidated because most likely my parents would not come from
00:49:30
Speaker
a level of success or economic bracket as the majority of the students on this campus. And that really stayed with me. And I raised my hand and I was like, well, I would agree except the fact that my mom at the time was working at a nursing home and she was wiping butts. My father was working as a taxi driver
00:50:01
Speaker
And I'm like, but look where I'm sitting in the same classroom as your hedge fund kids. And when we get a degree,
00:50:11
Speaker
your degree is going to say the same school name as my degree. So, you know, I would not have had that opportunity had it not been for my parents sacrifices, making their own mango juice with the lemons life gave them. Right. And so now here I am at a more, much more comfortable space as a parent to my sons.
00:50:42
Speaker
Man, it's incredibly humbling to be in a position like that. Yeah, so those are the two primary ones, just gratitude and...
00:50:58
Speaker
feeling very humble that I'm even in this position to have these two options in front of me and to say, yeah, this one is the one that I want. Yeah. I want to say a very healthy, mature outlook.
00:51:19
Speaker
And I also wanted to say, going back to what you said, and we'll close with this, is that, you know, you love Juki so much, the question of, how am I gonna love a second?
Love and Growth with More Children
00:51:28
Speaker
And I'll say, you will. It's great, it just happens. I thought the same thing with our first and having two, and then I had two, am I having a third? I'm like, how is this gonna, it just, it just happens, I don't know what to say. You just have this capacity to love these people.
00:51:47
Speaker
Yeah. Because until you have it, you're like, oh, you can. But before you're like, how I can't even fathom that. Like, I love this person so much. And then you love this other one. In fact, my thing I say to my kids is I always tell them you're my favorite one.
00:52:02
Speaker
But I say it to all three. It's just a phrase. Because they are. They're all my favorite one. Each one of them is my favorite one. And I've been saying it to them since they were like newborns. And so it's just your capacity to love grows. And I cannot wait to hear from you when you get to welcome your second boy into the world.
00:52:30
Speaker
I cannot wait to meet him virtually and to see your love grow as a dad and to see that kind of capacity get bigger and bigger and bigger. You're doing a great job. And I can't wait to see you keep being awesome as a dad of two, so. Thank you, bro. Yeah. Really appreciate that. Thanks for coming on.
00:52:53
Speaker
and I'll have you on for a fifth time. I mean, you gotta keep going at this point, you know? Gotta get double digits. Gotta get double digits. Maybe next time I'll have little man, you know, newborn in my arms and just we'll have a, he'll make a special appearance. Let's do it. I'd be down, cries and all, man. I'd be in. But thanks again, Kel. Have a great night, man. Thank you, brother. You do the same.
00:53:24
Speaker
Thanks for joining and listening today. Please leave a comment and review the show. Dads are tough, but not tough enough to do this fatherhood thing alone.