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00:00:01
Smile for the Camera
0 Plays2 seconds ago
We discuss both Smile movies
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Transcript
00:00:01
Kevin Dougherty
Oh no.
00:00:04
Kevin Dougherty
yeah I was waiting for your shot and the intro to start playing again.
00:00:05
Keck
well that happened
00:00:13
Kevin Dougherty
Welcome back to Fright Central. As always, I'm Doc back here again with Keck and
Introduction and Overview of Smile Movies
00:00:18
Kevin Dougherty
we're going to talk about Smile 1 and 2 since we were talking about smiling people.
00:00:23
Keck
yeah I mean like yeah yeah oh yeah yeah the last cast we did was from and they I mean yet all smile print
00:00:23
Kevin Dougherty
Let's just get into some smiling things.
00:00:31
Kevin Dougherty
They smile? Yeah.
00:00:33
Keck
all those creatures smile, right?
00:00:36
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:00:37
Keck
Every single one of them.
00:00:37
Kevin Dougherty
They're all.
00:00:38
Keck
I'm trying to think because they're, they're dressed in like real weird outfits. Some of them, like the one guy that's dressed as the milk man, he's always got a smile, but I feel like, yeah no, they all smile.
00:00:51
Kevin Dougherty
They all smile, yeah.
00:00:52
Keck
Yep.
00:00:53
Kevin Dougherty
And do you think they're all smile creatures from the smile movies?
00:00:53
Keck
They all smile. ah smell um just Maybe like that's what happens like
Origins and Themes of Smile Creatures
00:01:00
Keck
what happens to your soul like you basically uh apparently impregnate someone that's there and then you get reborn in you know your full clothing that you're wearing
00:01:06
Kevin Dougherty
you get transport to the town from. from
00:01:16
Keck
And, um, you know, that's just how, uh, that's just how it goes. So basically when the smile monster kills you and makes you kill yourself, your soul is then commuted into one of those smiley beings and you stalk out the fucking people of the town.
00:01:38
Keck
so Can you imagine if fucking the ah creators like actually did some shit like that? Like that's like they were like just totally fucked and they like contact it like the fucking department or you know whoever owns the copyright for smile and it's like yo could we use your shit?
00:01:58
Keck
Like we're in a really fucked up position here.
Creative Challenges and Comparisons in Horror Series
00:02:04
Kevin Dougherty
Well, what if like and from they were like already had planned to go in like a certain direction and then the smile movies came out and they were like how to throw away the entire season four script because they're like fuck they already did it Yeah
00:02:04
Keck
MGF is threatening us so.
00:02:16
Keck
yeah oh yeah like overlap yeah yeah that would be fucking that'd be fucking crazy but anyway tonight well hold on first what at ah ah ah
00:02:24
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, let's get to the ah plot first of the smile movies it's basically
00:02:32
Keck
We have one news item, Crystal Lake News, Crystal Lake Series.
00:02:34
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, we have one newsletter. I'm sorry. I hadn't heard of these live. It's gonna be a season. Yeah.
00:02:42
Keck
ah Currently there is no news, except a claim that it will be aired on Halloween.
00:02:54
Keck
2025 which i do not believe i put no wild credence or merit into that whatsoever so there is no news and that is the crystal lake news anyway yeah
00:03:08
Kevin Dougherty
Well, thank you for our known news Crystal Lake news. ah
Mechanics of the Smile Curse
00:03:11
Kevin Dougherty
Smile. So basically, when somebody um witnesses like a traumatic ah murder or death in front of them,
00:03:19
Keck
no it's a it's a suicide they witnessed
00:03:22
Kevin Dougherty
ah not always.
00:03:24
Keck
not Well, we'll get into that.
00:03:25
Kevin Dougherty
We'll get into that. That's why I say tragic death or or suicide.
00:03:27
Keck
what
00:03:30
Kevin Dougherty
i Yes. And then after it's said they say up to so nobody's lived past seven days, so you can die anytime before them.
00:03:30
Keck
It's actually a very simple premise.
00:03:34
Keck
yeah
00:03:41
Kevin Dougherty
um You get haunted by this creature who fucks with your fucking head until eventually you either kill yourself in front of somebody else or you.
00:03:52
Keck
but Don't get into the complexity of it, but basically in in a nutshell, you're just some person walking down the street.
00:03:54
Kevin Dougherty
You know.
00:04:01
Keck
There's this creature that possesses people in a really gnarly fashion too. As the movie progresses, like the first film I was not the biggest fan of, although I enjoyed,
00:04:16
Keck
Um the story of the creature because I actually think that that's a pretty fucking far out thing And I always thought when I was watching it I kept having flashbacks to parties where like me and you were drinking and looking over and seeing your grin
Character Experiences and Hallucinations
00:04:34
Keck
and knowing that you have like the worst intentions remember like I like walk by like what's up with doc and i'd be like he's over there grinning like You know and I always I think about your smile and I was thinking about that I kept having flat.
00:04:50
Keck
It was actually really bugging me out um but at any rate um in a really gnarly fashion this thing takes you over and what happens is is Once you witness someone commit suicide.
00:05:05
Keck
This is what they go and
00:05:06
Kevin Dougherty
They're smiling at you when they do this.
00:05:09
Keck
they're smiling at you they've been totally possessed by this thing that basically it like opens up their mouth real wide and this thing's like a huge beast yeah like
00:05:09
Kevin Dougherty
yeah yeah
00:05:18
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, I love the design of the creature too.
00:05:21
Keck
Yeah, the creature's like real badass and I'm jumping to the end but like it like basically like you're paralyzed and you're like at all looking at it and it like grabs like with two of its hands or whatever and like opens up your mouth like real wide and the whole thing climbs inside down the throat and it's really cool it's towards the end of the movie like if you're not feeling the movie like in the beginning just fucking ride it out like because it does have a really fucking cool ending and it gives you a really great second movie but yeah so basically you see these things uh fucking you see somebody that's possessed when they kill themselves
00:05:22
Kevin Dougherty
right
00:05:25
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:05:51
Kevin Dougherty
you know um Yeah.
00:06:07
Keck
this spirit if you are in eyes length of this death this spirit is going to I guess not directly possess you but it's going to start stalking it's attached itself oh yeah yeah yeah elaborate on that doc it did hallucinations
00:06:16
Kevin Dougherty
No, like. it stalks you and like, and like, it does fuck with your head. It definitely, yeah. know yeah And you'll see it smile. Yeah, you'll see it smile and and you'll see the smile everywhere on different people, ah whether that person's actually there or not is is kind of like, ah Oh, no, was that person really smiling at me? Or is that, or is that part of the creature?
00:06:47
Kevin Dougherty
Like, yeah, and then, uh, then, yeah, it really can make you think things are happening when they aren't happening and it's just you doing it or they don't happen at all.
00:06:55
Keck
Yeah, intensely for days it can be that.
00:06:55
Kevin Dougherty
So yeah. Yeah. For days and until you basically, and nobody else can see what's happening to you and nobody like really believes you. And, uh, well, and then, yeah, it, uh, it eventually consumes you until you have until it takes over you and you, and then you pass it along to somebody else and you die.
00:07:14
Keck
Yeah.
00:07:15
Kevin Dougherty
So, uh, but. So we were really.
00:07:17
Keck
Do you want to explain the deeper intricacies that we find out now or do you want to get that later about how that ah can be altered?
00:07:17
Kevin Dougherty
grateful
00:07:28
Kevin Dougherty
Yes, so we find out in the first movie, the way it can be altered, there was one person who survived, and the but he's in prison. And when we go visit him, he had survived by brutally murdering somebody else in front of somebody else.
00:07:45
Kevin Dougherty
And so they pass the trauma it's like a trauma spirit, basically. It passed that drama on to somebody else.
00:07:49
Keck
Yeah.
00:07:52
Kevin Dougherty
And then in the second movie, we find out that if you can kill yourself, well, we don't know if this part is even true, if it if it happens, because we don't actually get to know if it's
00:08:01
Keck
Yeah, it stands to reason.
00:08:04
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, that if if you can like kind of you know stop your heart or whatever for you know enough time and then
Survival Theories and Origins of the Smile Curse
00:08:11
Kevin Dougherty
revive yourself, maybe that will get rid of it as well. But we don't know if that actually works.
00:08:15
Keck
Yeah, but well the other idea was the ultimate sacrifice when you find out what you're up against You say I'm just gonna go commit suicide ah Alone where no one is witnessing you you off yourself to stop this fucking thing however Like you elaborate it we don't know if that would actually still work the spirit could just like linger there or something like that we actually know very little about these things it doesn't really explain like it's root we have no idea of how old this ah spirit is this whatever it is um
00:08:26
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, you could do that too.
00:08:38
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:08:57
Keck
We have no idea if there's more than one. um I know the man in prison says that he found out about this when he was researching it from a case in Brazil where someone else did the same thing he did and that he killed someone and he he pointed out, he said, you need to kill them and you need to make it as bloody and as messy as possible.
00:09:22
Keck
because the more trauma that you inflict on this person not like necessarily like even the trauma you're inflicting on the person you're killing but the witness to the trauma the one that's you know not getting physically injured but witnessing this horrible bloody end and you know absorbing that like that that's what it's all about and
00:09:22
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:09:35
Kevin Dougherty
Yes.
00:09:49
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, we find out through the both movies that it's gone back. Like they've been able to trace all these cases back to like, like, I don't know, years.
00:09:57
Keck
but I got the i got the ah idea that it really wasn't like it was like far back in the sense that they found like certain cases of it but it didn't seem like the cases went back that far it seemed I think they mentioned the 1980s maybe but I got the idea it was like he found out about this more like just a few years ago
00:10:12
Kevin Dougherty
I don't remember how far back they found, but maybe. Yeah. and
00:10:24
Keck
Like and they really do not give you a good sense of time in terms of like the events.
00:10:26
Kevin Dougherty
Oh yeah. Yeah. They just know that it's like they can trace it back to like, they're like, okay, we can go at least this far.
00:10:35
Keck
It's on the internet.
00:10:35
Kevin Dougherty
and and It could go further. Yeah. We don't, we don't really know that we know very little, which I really like how will they don't like, I really don't want
00:10:37
Keck
Yeah.
00:10:40
Keck
Yeah, I like that too.
Impressions and Performances in Smile Movies
00:10:43
Kevin Dougherty
an origin.
00:10:44
Kevin Dougherty
Uh, fucking like it let it be just some fucking demon. You know what I mean?
00:10:47
Keck
ah
00:10:48
Kevin Dougherty
Like not every fucking demon needs an origin movie.
00:10:48
Keck
I can't... It can be, it can be, uh, it can not have like necessary an origin, but I think it would be cool if they could find out maybe like a little bit more about like how old it is and maybe find out some specifics about it. But like then have it be at an end, you know, there's only so much we could like, you know, maybe they trace something back to like, you know, it's like the egyptians have like a version of this or something you know what i mean like just to give it make it like ancient or you know but necessarily how it got here or you know whatever you can kind of you know leave that out so you know you're never going to know totally um
00:11:20
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's fine. Yeah.
00:11:34
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:11:38
Keck
But it's very unique in what it does in terms of like other you know spirits that would leech on, like um like in the exorcist the like type demon that just seems to want to use out the body and you know spread terror and trauma.
00:11:58
Keck
basically like you know that's what uh happened in the exorcist is you know you see your daughter masturbating with a crucifix and a demon face and projectile vomit and shit like that and uh you know and that inflects trauma to all who witness it but you know that's pretty much it this thing makes you smile
00:12:08
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:12:21
Keck
the biggest, most horrible, shit-eating grin, and it makes you, you know, basically, I guess the most easy method it figures to travel from one point to another quickly is by immediately murdering the host that's to inhabit it, and it just... I mean, yeah, they don't, I mean, they don't go into great detail exactly how that happens. You just see it like climbing into the person. So yeah, there's a lot of mystery there and I agree with you. It kind of goes, it bodes well. I thought it worked.
00:12:59
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. um we I could say we probably didn't talk about the first one when it first came out because ah when I first saw the first one, I was just like, it was like it was an okay movie.
00:13:09
Keck
You told me to avoid.
00:13:09
Kevin Dougherty
it like Yeah. And I was like, yeah, it's not it's not really that great. And then when the second one came out, I was like ah it was like, it looks a little better. I'm not that excited for it, but I had nothing to do.
00:13:19
Kevin Dougherty
So I was like, fuck it. I'll go see. I ended up loving the second one. I thought the second one was fantastic.
00:13:23
Keck
Yeah, you called me right afterwards in Yeah
00:13:24
Kevin Dougherty
And I was like, you know what? you can un like I said there was enough in the second one that you could actually not watch the first one and get your full context of everything in the second one.
00:13:35
Kevin Dougherty
And then if you liked the second one, you could go back and see where that for that character that you see in the opening ah and the opening move and the opening ah shot, you can see where he came from.
00:13:45
Kevin Dougherty
But like I love how the second one starts all the way to the fucking end. like like that That movie was great.
00:13:51
Keck
yeah
00:13:52
Kevin Dougherty
And then I had gone back and re-watched the first one again into the second one. and And I did find more things I liked in the first one on this on my second viewing. But still, I thought it was kind of like it was still kind of mid overall.
00:14:06
Kevin Dougherty
But yeah, like some of the things in the first one that I didn't think were I didn't think I mean, she was good as an actress in the first one, but I know.
00:14:15
Keck
Yeah, she't no, she she was good as an actress.
00:14:16
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:14:18
Keck
She just really didn't have much to work with. The writing wasn't very good.
00:14:21
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:14:23
Keck
I mean, it was, it was kind of like just dull and not really that much happens.
00:14:31
Kevin Dougherty
yeah i mean like yeah i mean the best parts were probably like it when she like is in the therapy at the very beginning that the therapy at the tour is probably almost towards the end where like the doctor's not really there and she gets the call then it's like okay then i got interested you're like oh shit like how long has it been fucking with her and shit um and then the very end yeah and then
00:14:31
Keck
but Like, if that makes sense, like very beginning.
00:14:53
Keck
And then the very end.
00:14:58
Keck
And by the way, we were talking about the movie ah Strange Darling, a couple casts back maybe.
00:14:58
Kevin Dougherty
but
00:15:06
Keck
And we were talking about how like um I had not seen that actor. I'm not sure if we mentioned this in another cast since then.
00:15:13
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah, we did.
00:15:14
Keck
we did yeah well yeah he's a classic actor that's been in fucking shit for fucking decades like he's had like yeah like 120 credits or something like that was crazy but anyway um that was something i missed in the second film was his absence i would have liked it you know obviously they're going to wall
00:15:15
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. That's fine. Yeah.
00:15:43
Keck
They're most likely going to make a third one. Is there?
00:15:45
Kevin Dougherty
Oh yeah, absolutely. The third the second one made it to the line.
00:15:46
Keck
Well, is there any official word on that?
00:15:49
Kevin Dougherty
I don't know, I did not lock that up before we started.
00:15:52
Keck
Well, if you want to check, but um I mean, it's going to be fucking crazy because we have no idea.
00:15:53
Kevin Dougherty
but
00:16:01
Keck
I mean, I guess we should talk a little bit about the movies. One thing I want to ask you about is ah Smile Part 2 casting.
00:16:13
Keck
Your thoughts, I knew very few actors in that.
00:16:17
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, I mean, besides that guy in the beginning that was in the previous one, I didn't know who any of them were. and
00:16:25
Keck
The guy, they called him Morris, the actor that played Morris, who turned out to be just a hallucination. um
00:16:34
Kevin Dougherty
But how long was he hallucination for?
00:16:37
Keck
I have no idea. Uh, I don't know.
00:16:39
Kevin Dougherty
that's enough I think he was in the car.
00:16:40
Keck
I'm just saying that the, the actor that played him was probably the only other actor that was familiar to me.
00:16:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yes, he was he from there. Yeah.
00:16:49
Keck
And, uh, I thought it was, wait, I'm sorry. Oh, wait, no, that was the first one was her, her mother.
00:16:59
Keck
I knew her in the first one. Yeah.
00:17:01
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, OK.
00:17:01
Keck
I don't, I don't know if I know, uh,
00:17:03
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:17:07
Keck
Yeah, i I can't name a single actor in Smile 2, and I just wanted to ask you about what you thought of the performances of a largely unknown cast of actors.
00:17:23
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. ah
Memorable Scenes and Character Development
00:17:24
Kevin Dougherty
Well, the first one I did take, I was just found some notes that I thought
00:17:27
Keck
I'm only talking about the second.
00:17:29
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, when i took some I took some notes from the first one that I thought i thought were kind of funny.
00:17:33
Keck
Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:17:33
Kevin Dougherty
like ah for someone who For someone who witnesses her mom die as like at a young age and works in a psych hospital, she's still easily traumatized and startled.
00:17:45
Keck
right Good observation.
00:17:46
Kevin Dougherty
And then oh the scene where she yeah she killed the cat and brought it as a present, I was like, I'm pretty sure she just traumatized a bunch of children. Do they all get chased by the Smile Monster now?
00:17:56
Keck
Oh, get that's a seat that's a scene worth talking about.
00:18:02
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:18:02
Keck
that was a That was a good one. And I knew there was going to be something. We're describing a child.
00:18:10
Kevin Dougherty
It was her sister's ah child's birthday.
00:18:10
Keck
I think it was her best friend or was it her sister?
00:18:16
Keck
Yeah, so she goes to a birthday party and, you know, she's already that we're talking about the main character here, of the girl that ah witnesses the smile in the beginning and then the suicide.
00:18:17
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:18:30
Keck
And she's going through the hallucination stage, I guess you'd call it.
00:18:34
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Rose, I guess, was her name?
00:18:36
Keck
And ah she ah it was it it was their cat too, right?
00:18:37
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:18:44
Keck
It was her sister's cat.
00:18:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. She was like, she couldn't find the cat while she was like rapping present wrapping a train that that she was going to get for her niece.
00:18:47
Keck
yeah
00:18:51
Keck
Yeah, and it appeared that she murdered the cat and wrapped it up as a gift and gave her dead sister's kid the cat that she murdered.
00:18:52
Kevin Dougherty
And she couldn't find the cat.
00:18:56
Kevin Dougherty
have
00:18:59
Kevin Dougherty
No.
00:19:03
Kevin Dougherty
no Gave her sister's kid a dead cat.
00:19:06
Keck
Yeah, a dead cat, but it was, was it third cat?
00:19:06
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah.
00:19:10
Kevin Dougherty
It was their cat.
00:19:10
Keck
what
00:19:11
Kevin Dougherty
She murdered the cat and gave her a third dead cat.
00:19:14
Keck
No, I mean, was it the gift giver's cat or the gift receiver's cat?
00:19:21
Kevin Dougherty
The gift giver's cat.
00:19:22
Keck
Like, okay.
00:19:23
Kevin Dougherty
It was her and her her and her soon to be husband.
00:19:25
Keck
It was her own cat then.
00:19:26
Kevin Dougherty
It was her own cat.
00:19:26
Keck
I wanted to know if it was the little kid's cat.
00:19:27
Kevin Dougherty
She was like looking for her. oh
00:19:30
Keck
Like, yo, I killed your cat. hey here Here's your gift, your cat dead that I murdered.
00:19:36
Kevin Dougherty
yeah Yeah, and then she has like ah that i was I Put like I don't remember what I was really after that scene I was like, that's not an anxiety attack. I put she should be checked into a mental hospital.
00:19:53
Kevin Dougherty
Well, I was a fiance and I was like, it was a black guy. So I wrote a fiance thinking crazy white bitch. I heard that I would guess the marriage is off.
00:20:05
Kevin Dougherty
I did like when she was out in the car and her sister came out and then like I heard her. She did the bent neck thing. And I immediately made me think of how to house the bent neck lady.
00:20:17
Keck
yeah
00:20:18
Kevin Dougherty
I thought that was a good thing. um The therapist scene was good. um Oh, she had that, uh, that dream where she went into the hospital and fucking, Oh, that was a cow pen.
00:20:25
Keck
Yeah.
00:20:32
Kevin Dougherty
I recognized him where, uh, she, uh,
00:20:33
Keck
The idea of the dream or she went into the hospital and well, this, uh,
00:20:41
Kevin Dougherty
her, her boss is like, he's been in a bunch of stuff.
00:20:44
Keck
yeah ah Oh, Harold and Kumar.
00:20:45
Kevin Dougherty
Like he's aged.
00:20:47
Keck
Yeah.
00:20:47
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
00:20:47
Keck
Okay. Yeah.
00:20:48
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah.
00:20:48
Keck
um
00:20:49
Kevin Dougherty
heard The dream was the face peeling dream.
00:20:53
Keck
Yeah.
00:20:53
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, that was a good sequence too. And then yeah, that at the end, she like, you know, goes to her mother's house that like her sister was trying to sell or whatever.
00:21:03
Kevin Dougherty
and She was like, Oh, we can't sell our house, even though it was like decrepit and like, down or whatever. It was like, I don't know why you're still keeping this around. um She goes to like burn the house down and and you know confront her demons and thinks she can get gets rid of it.
00:21:19
Kevin Dougherty
But then her ex, the cop, who she like goes to for like help or whatever like comes in and doesn't even like try to save her or run, just like watches her fucking like burn in the house.
00:21:33
Keck
I think he was just because up until that point he was ah he was at the point where he was beginning to believe her but at the same time he still had to be like
00:21:45
Kevin Dougherty
yeah yeah
00:21:51
Keck
part really a fucking demon that possesses you and makes you people smile you see people smiling that may or may not be there and like all this crazy shit like is that really what's going on you know what I mean like yeah
00:21:52
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:22:10
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, Yeah, he was definitely just trying to help. and like yeah But like even then, like when you see your fucking lighter self on fire, you're not going to try to put her out.
00:22:21
Keck
I think I would have dove at her before she lit.
00:22:21
Kevin Dougherty
earline check out
00:22:25
Kevin Dougherty
yeah yeah or if like she Or if I walked in and she like just lit herself on fire and didn't have a chance to.
00:22:31
Keck
When she was pouring accelerant on her body is when I would have tackled her.
00:22:34
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:22:37
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, exactly.
00:22:38
Keck
She would not have had that lighter yet. I mean, that that's something that I'm quite certain of.
00:22:41
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:22:45
Keck
But yeah, I guess there would have been some initial shock.
00:22:49
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. ah then And then going right in to see ah a Smile 2, which picks up what what, seven days later?
00:22:56
Keck
wait One thing I just want to mention before we really transition in.
00:22:58
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:23:01
Keck
at the end of the first smile uh... in the scene we were describing when um... her ex walks in who well she had just hallucinate it it seems like they could hallucinate for days where shit's just not really real but she had gone through a long hallucination and at the end you find out that this spirit which is what we'll call it
00:23:17
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:23:27
Keck
is also very sadistic in that it genuinely tried to let her believe that she had found a way to defeat it, but the spirit seems very resilient. like It is and incredibly difficult.
00:23:45
Keck
to uh defeat in any conventional sense unless you're prepared to murder someone else really brutally and uh it lets her believe that she has found a way of conquering it only to then jump back in and be like bitch you've done nothing i know what i mean and it it didn't brag like i cannot be defeated but it basically said you're nothing like
00:24:06
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, that whole scene.
00:24:14
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, because like she goes in to face her trauma, which is like her mother killing herself.
00:24:20
Keck
Yeah.
00:24:22
Kevin Dougherty
And like her mother was like really abusive. And like she when she turns to that like giant thing comes out and comes after her, she thinks she's defeated her past trauma, and only to find out, like nope.
00:24:25
Keck
Yeah.
00:24:28
Keck
yep
00:24:33
Kevin Dougherty
the it
00:24:34
Keck
Yeah. Yeah, it's like, yeah like what? Did you see this in the movie? Like you think like, oh, like this is all going to end because you found like a way to defeat your trauma and you're a stronger empowered human right now.
00:24:39
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:24:46
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:24:50
Keck
ah I just thought it was funny.
00:24:50
Kevin Dougherty
yeah yeah you think this is about Yeah.
00:24:53
Keck
You're done. I'm tired with you I've enjoyed wearing your skin it says not So I just thought that bit of context like as to what we do and don't know about the spirit we know is Really?
00:24:55
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:24:59
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. and then
00:25:09
Keck
Yeah, it wants people to suffer it really enjoys suffering kind of like um the creature from the outsider
00:25:19
Kevin Dougherty
Yes, yeah.
00:25:20
Keck
feeds on trauma so in that you know it's very I mean Stephen King would probably dig he would probably be pumped about origin and ideas of the creature but anyway I'm sorry into a smile
00:25:31
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, maybe. But yeah, I was just going to dive right into Smile 2 because it does pick up, it's like seven days right after the first one.
00:25:42
Keck
that's why i chose to watch smile one because i was like alright so you're saying i could just watch smile two and you're like yeah i'm like but is there like a time difference and you're like nah it's like right at the end and that's why
00:25:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:25:56
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, ah but yeah, like it picks up with the cop who now is being chased by the smile monster. He thinks he's gotten away to, you know, pass it on by by going in and murdering some ah drug dealers.
00:26:12
Keck
mentioned the burn
00:26:12
Kevin Dougherty
And
Direction and Themes in Smile 2
00:26:13
Keck
scene before when he's walking up yeah who like raging fire like you know totally engulfed like burning to death like
00:26:13
Kevin Dougherty
yeah I was just saying, like ah was like as soon as he's like walking up, there's just the lady on fire. it's just like And he just kind of like ignores it. So like if youre that was your first movie you're watching, you're watching this guy go into this house. and And it's just like, yeah, please ignore that burning woman off to the side. Just don't worry about it. Yeah.
00:26:37
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, was' I was not talking about all the second watch. I was like, please please ignore the burning woman. like don't but Don't worry about it. I'm going to go in ahead and murder these drug dealers real quick, which yeah, which he was trying to murder one and pass it on to the other and ends up accidentally killing both of them.
00:26:47
Keck
That was a great scene.
00:26:55
Kevin Dougherty
And then that's when we find out that there was somebody else in the room as well. And, um, yeah.
00:27:00
Keck
Yeah, uh, uh, witness buying drugs, like kinda in the back hiding.
00:27:04
Kevin Dougherty
And he's like, oh, um he's like, he's like, I'm sorry. I didn't like, this wasn't meant for you.
00:27:09
Keck
Yeah.
00:27:09
Kevin Dougherty
Like, uh, I'm sorry that you have to deal with it. And then, uh, The drug dealers, like they were like Russian mob or whatever. theyre His boys were all, but he's trying to escape. And you think he gets away only to get fucking brutally run over by that fucking car.
00:27:23
Keck
but Back up just a little bit, because I want to say I thought like ah the choreography in that scene was a real standout in terms of direction.
00:27:30
Kevin Dougherty
Yes.
00:27:36
Keck
ah There was nothing like that in the first movie.
00:27:39
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, the first season, there were some good transitions, but like not like and everything else is real based.
00:27:42
Keck
yeah It won the first, not season, and the first in the first film, but both
00:27:44
Kevin Dougherty
I should mention the director of writer-director Parker Fanny did both movies, so he really stepped up his game in the second one.
00:27:50
Keck
movies. It starts really, I mean, after he explains to him, he's like, look, I know you guys are both murdering scumbags. He mentions, you know, he's a cop.
00:28:02
Keck
He knew that both of those guys were cold-blooded murderers. So that was how he made like some kind of like moral thing where like, yo, I don't deserve this shit.
00:28:06
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:28:13
Keck
But um the scene that I'm describing starts after everything is all fucked up and he wants to leave. is the sequence where he tries to escape.
00:28:24
Keck
I thought that was really well done in that confined space. The camera angles, the music, his desperation. Like, I really, really like that sequence and could be easily overlooked.
00:28:39
Keck
Anyway.
00:28:39
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, that whole that whole beginning sequence was already like, oh, alright, I'm in. This movie's already way better than the first one immediately off the bat.
00:28:44
Keck
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:28:47
Kevin Dougherty
I thought it was just a ah much better setup to the story. That's how the first one should have started. You know what I Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:28:54
Keck
And one actor, no, I said that I didn't know any other actor aside from Morris, but it turns out that I do know the actress that played her mother.
00:29:05
Keck
I believe she's been in like a whole bunch of shit, like John Malkovich, and ah she was in like a lot of like, I think early John Cusack movies too, like she's been around for forever.
00:29:09
Kevin Dougherty
mean?
00:29:18
Keck
i So I knew her.
00:29:18
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:29:19
Keck
Aside from that though,
00:29:19
Kevin Dougherty
and And Andrew Barrymore makes a makes an appearance.
00:29:24
Keck
Drew, oh so yeah, she got his own like Drew show as herself.
00:29:26
Kevin Dougherty
As yourself. he's That's like our interest.
00:29:29
Keck
Yeah, I forgot about that.
00:29:30
Kevin Dougherty
and That's our introduction to the main actress. ah Sky Riley, who is a pop star. And she's like just coming back after being in in like a horrible accident.
00:29:41
Kevin Dougherty
And she's like a recovering addict as well.
00:29:43
Keck
Yeah.
00:29:44
Kevin Dougherty
She's about to go on a tour again. So she comes on a Drew Barrymore show to kind of talk about it.
00:29:49
Keck
trying to think of who she'd be in real life. She would be like a Millie Cyrus type of, because she kind of looks like Millie Cyrus, like with the new hairdo.
00:29:53
Kevin Dougherty
She's kind of an album nation.
00:29:59
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, I think I think it's like in
00:30:00
Keck
I got that vibe.
00:30:01
Kevin Dougherty
an amalgamation of like, uh, Mylar Cyrus, Britney Spears, and Lady Gaga.
00:30:06
Keck
Amy Winehouse.
00:30:08
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. It's like an amalgamation of those. Cause there was definitely influences to like the costumes and stuff from like Lady Gaga. You could see that like, yeah.
00:30:13
Keck
Yeah, that's wha- Yeah, her final outfit was like something a Lady Gaga would like, you know, her pleasure herself over.
00:30:14
Kevin Dougherty
i like Yeah. yeah
00:30:21
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. So it's not necessarily, it's just like, you know, based on a bunch of like, you know, different pop stars, you can really tell.
00:30:25
Keck
Yeah, yeah.
00:30:28
Kevin Dougherty
I did like how they shifted from like how the the first one was like a psychiatric nurse and like this one's like a, you know, a pop star and having to deal with the, you know, all the the the shit that comes with fame and addiction and stuff like that as well.
00:30:41
Keck
Yeah. And it was great for the creature who, you know, that's where you get the classic line at the end, like, I've enjoyed wearing your skin.
00:30:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:30:49
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:30:50
Keck
Like, you know, I mean, because, you know, it's not every day that he gets like, you know, I mean, I just like, uh, if like he got inside Donald Trump, he's so wild.
00:31:03
Kevin Dougherty
but
00:31:06
Keck
It would just be so buck like his behavior like oh and Fuck like would he just stay there a lot longer to have that kind of power?
00:31:07
Kevin Dougherty
but
00:31:11
Kevin Dougherty
uh yeah i don't know i i i kind of would rather just like be like it every seven days it moves on or whatever i think it makes
00:31:15
Keck
That's what I want to know how long can that creature like could it stay longer if it likes it or That's something. I guess it's not going to be explained.
00:31:27
Keck
We'll never know and
00:31:33
Keck
Yeah, like i'm top but its ah it said he didn't find anybody. It's not that no one we know of. Someone could have lived a lot longer. They could have figured something out, but it just wasn't recorded.
00:31:45
Kevin Dougherty
Maybe.
00:31:47
Keck
He was saying that like pretty much locally, because he was ah following the chain.
00:31:47
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:31:54
Keck
like um at first some like school teacher had murdered himself and he was just saying that like in the reports in that chain block he couldn't find anybody going back that had lasted longer than a week someone could have
00:32:10
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah. That's true.
00:32:12
Keck
But, you know, so I don't know, but like, I would just think if it had like, um, it had the skin of someone that had like a lot of power, like, you know, the most powerful person in the world, like, would it want to stay?
00:32:14
Kevin Dougherty
All right.
00:32:28
Keck
I'm just, I'm wondering, I don't know, maybe that, I mean, because based on the ending, a lot could happen.
00:32:30
Kevin Dougherty
Maybe.
00:32:36
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, so yeah, um basically, um so Scott Riley, then she adorned one of her routines, like she kind of hurt her back again, but like nobody's going to give her pain medication.
00:32:47
Kevin Dougherty
So that's how she calls the drug dealer from the first one to go.
00:32:51
Keck
who she went to high school with it's a great scene too what you didn't think that scene was funny
00:32:52
Kevin Dougherty
move Yeah, that she went to high school with just so she can get some like back pain medicine. and And then that dude ah you know murders himself in front of her with ah with a weight, which was pretty brutal.
00:33:06
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah. ah One of the things I thought was funny in that ah in the movie, not not that scene, but ah you noticed throughout GSA. I mean, no, that's being funny, but I was thinking about.
00:33:19
Keck
No, i I was joking.
00:33:20
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:33:20
Keck
I didn't think that was funny at all.
00:33:21
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. yeah
00:33:22
Keck
It was horrific. fucking yeah
00:33:25
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, he just smiled at her, just smashing the weight in his face. I thought it was pretty funny.
00:33:29
Keck
Yeah, dude, I think i I want to ask you this before moving on. If you were her and he started doing that,
00:33:40
Keck
Would you have done what she did and freeze up? Would you have reacted and tried to stop him? Or would you have just bounced, like made a beeline for like, I guess it's easy to say you would have like reacted and like tried to help or left, but like, or like you would be just so shocked.
00:33:59
Kevin Dougherty
You'd be afraid he's going to smash your face in with that way.
00:34:06
Keck
especially because, you know, she's like, you know, going through, she's in a lot of pain and, you know, still struggling with substance a abuse.
00:34:07
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:34:13
Kevin Dougherty
I probably would have reacted the same way she did.
00:34:16
Keck
Yeah.
00:34:16
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:34:18
Keck
Yeah, I don't know. I just don't know. After he hid himself the second time, I think I would have reacted in either intervening
Handling Trauma and Fame in Smile 2
00:34:30
Keck
with him or leaving.
00:34:32
Keck
I don't think I'm staying for the full like four or five blows.
00:34:35
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. like Yeah, all right. All right, dude, you go ahead with that. I'll be over here.
00:34:40
Keck
yeah What about you?
00:34:40
Kevin Dougherty
I got what I need. You enjoy that.
00:34:43
Keck
I mean, would you?
00:34:44
Kevin Dougherty
Wait, toothpaste.
00:34:45
Keck
Would you have done the same?
00:34:47
Kevin Dougherty
I probably would have been in shock like Sheila. It's like, I don't know what I would have been able to do.
00:34:51
Keck
yeah i'm just and i'm just wondering like what happens yeah true yeah true that but what what happens if you bounce and
00:34:52
Kevin Dougherty
yard It's not like the burning person scene where you know what you can do. If the person lights a thermal fire, you can try to put them out. It's kind of hard to stop.
00:35:03
Kevin Dougherty
you know way
00:35:10
Keck
he's still alive and like would the spirit like run after her with the weight like no you need to see this or like does like he kill like does he die and then the spirit's just like caught in limbo
00:35:16
Kevin Dougherty
have Ahhh, how's that? it's
00:35:26
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. yeah
00:35:29
Keck
Like, you know what I mean? Because if, like, she never actually saw him drop dead, he was just, you know, had some blunt force trauma. Like, you know, I'm...
00:35:39
Kevin Dougherty
Hey, hey, did you hear what happened to Sosa? I mean, I saw him like hit himself in the face once with a weight and I was like, all right, let this dude's too fucked up for me.
00:35:45
Keck
so so
00:35:48
Kevin Dougherty
He was on so many drugs.
00:35:49
Keck
a
00:35:50
Kevin Dougherty
like got I just got the fuck out of there for something to happen to me.
00:35:50
Keck
yeah yeah if you're talking to the cops like yeah like I don't know nothing about him dying but yes I was over there like literally you know minutes to where you said he died he start hitting himself in the face with a weight like a 50 pound dumbbell weight like he was just clubbing himself and i was just like alright man have a good time with that and i left so i really can't tell you anything like oh fuck yes
00:36:09
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah.
00:36:22
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I understand why she didn't call the gods because she was a famous pop party would have ruined her fucking career. But like, yeah, you would you would have walked out and been like, fucking as soon as you'd like, even if you witnessed the whole thing, if you had left, I would have called the cops and be like, yo, ah my buddy was acting real fucking weird.
00:36:41
Keck
why your mother should never be your agent like I would have called my glee all stars like that would have big-time legal rafts attorneys that they have on retainer like you would have run and called your fucking attorney immediately you know what I mean like
00:36:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah.
00:36:52
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:36:59
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah, because she's like searching. as Can they find DNA and puke or whatever, like later on?
00:37:04
Keck
Yeah, which is not what you want to be doing on your phone browser like sir.
00:37:08
Kevin Dougherty
and No, yeah.
00:37:09
Keck
She's making big mistakes She would call their attorney her attorney about like get a new phone like do shit like this I'm also kind of surprised that she wouldn't have had like a better hookup for The Vikes or something like that, but then again It's somebody she knew since high school and I guess she knew she could trust him.
00:37:27
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:37:30
Keck
So that made sense Yeah
00:37:31
Kevin Dougherty
to be to be discreet and stuff too. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. Oh, I was going to say that, um, that, that hit the whole movie was kind of one big ad for that Voss water. The amount of fucking will Voss water.
00:37:43
Keck
Is that real?
00:37:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:37:45
Keck
Oh, I didn't even, I thought that was just me.
00:37:45
Kevin Dougherty
That's a real ah you know ah walk thing.
00:37:48
Keck
Damn, dude, they were pushing that shit hard.
00:37:53
Kevin Dougherty
she drank it. Then she would fucking really open that fucking mouth. There's a golf that shit down.
00:38:00
Keck
Yeah, I mean, she explains it as like ah like an anxiety thing.
00:38:00
Kevin Dougherty
I was ah like um they like that's a fucking it's a helper call yeah yeah it's like whatever I start getting like to yeah like yeah but but yeah it did seem like they were really pushing that water yeah yeah
00:38:13
Keck
Yeah, it's like something that helps her with like panic attacks, you know, and yeah, something like that. I didn't even know if that that was real, like, ah but yeah, she was drinking mad of it.
00:38:29
Kevin Dougherty
Uh, some of the other things I noticed were like, uh, I, the assistant that's trying to be like real buddy, buddy with her. Like I, I couldn't stand him. Uh, I mean, I thought it like when he was like smiling after like, when it was like the monster pretended to be when it like destroyed her ah dressing room or whatever.
00:38:46
Kevin Dougherty
And like, he like walks by and like gives her that fucking real real ridiculous smile.
00:38:50
Keck
Oh, the, um, the, the he's like a light skinned black guy or like, um, uh, like, uh, Hispanic, maybe.
00:38:50
Kevin Dougherty
and She fucks out.
00:38:59
Keck
Is that who you're talking about?
00:39:00
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:39:01
Keck
but It kind of looks like Manny a little bit.
00:39:02
Kevin Dougherty
It's like the mother is really more of the mother's assistant than her assistant, but like yeah.
00:39:07
Keck
Yeah. Yeah. He's extremely friendly though. I mean, annoying, but friendly.
00:39:10
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. He was like, I'll be your girlfriend since her and her bestie had like a fallen out ah prior to ah like her her coming back but when she was back on drugs.
00:39:19
Keck
yeah yeah that was um i was just about to say that i was gonna be like um just the scene i want to mention the girl oh
00:39:24
Kevin Dougherty
um The other thing I thought was great was when she was taking pictures with everybody in line.
00:39:34
Kevin Dougherty
But the the the little girl, I was going to talk about that fucking creepy fucking dude. He should really get that rash.
00:39:38
Keck
i was talking about the girl that had this smile that was totally silent the entire time
00:39:39
Kevin Dougherty
I can check now.
00:39:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, she was great, too. But I thought that dude was like super creepy, probably something fucking pop stars have to deal with all the time. But the main takeaway from that was like, that dude should get his rash checked out.
00:39:55
Kevin Dougherty
He was fucking breaking out like a motherfucker.
00:39:56
Keck
yeah he had some kind of skin scene going did he have like acne or like it looks fucked up yeah yeah seriously yeah he did not seem well
00:39:59
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. I don't know what it was. but I've been like, nah, you can't fucking go near her for a fucking picture, dude.
00:40:10
Kevin Dougherty
You're gonna fucking spread some fucking shit.
00:40:15
Kevin Dougherty
I was watching something from like some J pop star like they had guys around her ah around the guy um for like so he was he was like signing stuff but the person wasn't allowed to touch them because like if that if they get sick or anything that fucks up like their whole fucking schedule and all this other stuff it's like they can lose like a ton of fucking money and that's like they're so afraid to get fucking sick or stuff so like they're not allowed to like get near like
00:40:35
Keck
Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:40:42
Keck
Yeah, no, that's a good yeah that's a good point.
00:40:43
Kevin Dougherty
an
00:40:45
Keck
That's a good point.
00:40:46
Kevin Dougherty
So I was surprised they let that happen in that one.
00:40:46
Keck
Interesting.
00:40:50
Kevin Dougherty
But oh, and then when like the when that dude like shows up in her fucking apartment, and like and she's like phone she like hears the noise, and like she's like, oh, it's shit, somebody broke in.
00:41:03
Kevin Dougherty
And she sees like all the fucking clothes in his fucking thirty state dirty stained underwear.
00:41:05
Keck
oh yeah she stripped by that snake it oh yeah it was real fucking filthy yeah I took no that
00:41:13
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, yeah. that was That was pretty fucking horrifying and I really liked later on when um all the people, I guess they were part of her choreography team, were all like standing in their apartment and they'd do like that choreography through the fucking hallway and shit and they're standing around and fucking moving. All of that was really fucking dope too.
00:41:33
Keck
yeah yeah yeah that was that was good now from what we understand that was like one of her last points of real consciousness was when she no she never was she never was well i i
00:41:45
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, because I was thinking I was like, I don't think Gemma was ever there. Her friend. She was never there. Because I noticed on the second view when her mom shows up, they never like she says hi, but they never look at each other or say anything that she because the mother was like, hey, you should call her and get her to come back.
00:42:03
Keck
yeah
00:42:04
Kevin Dougherty
So if if she had walked in and seen her there, she would have been like, oh, my God, thank you for fucking coming back. Like my daughter really needs you at this time.
00:42:09
Keck
yeah yeah she never saw her yet she flings out at the end yeah
00:42:12
Kevin Dougherty
But there was like nothing in between there. So I was like, And then later on, she was like, yeah, she finds out at the end that when she's actually on the phone with her, when she thinks ah her friend is driving, she's on the phone with her and she's like, yeah, why?
00:42:25
Kevin Dougherty
Like you were fucking mean to me. Why would I fucking answer you and shit like that? And that's when you're like, oh, shit. So, yeah, that was one like the last time she was like fully positive.
00:42:32
Keck
And she's in that outfit. Like, she's in that outfit that says she didn't want to wear. She was bitching about the outfit Lady Gaga outfit.
00:42:39
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:42:43
Keck
And it seemed like from that point on, she just really wasn't there. Like, because she was in the outfit in the final scene. when Like, after the spirit says, go out and break a leg, you know what I mean?
00:42:52
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, and she woke up. Yeah. yeah
00:42:56
Keck
Like, after I enjoyed wearing your skin. go out there and break a leg and she's in that same outfit and then something really cool happens.
00:43:05
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. ah Some of the other scenes I liked is when she had to go do that speech for the fucking the children.
00:43:12
Keck
yeah Oh yeah.
00:43:14
Kevin Dougherty
good Shit gets really all the rails there. And we find out that's when we first see a really good look at her ex. Uh, who had died in the car crash.
00:43:25
Kevin Dougherty
That's when we find all that out.
00:43:25
Keck
Yeah, that's something I wanted to mention.
00:43:26
Kevin Dougherty
And when we find out that that's Jack Nicholson's son, that played my guy.
00:43:30
Keck
Well, I did not know that, but I want to say that was...
00:43:33
Kevin Dougherty
You didn't, you didn't notice from his smile?
00:43:35
Keck
no. ah What I noticed was a truly horrific scene.
00:43:36
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:43:41
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:43:41
Keck
That car crash was powerful.
00:43:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:43:44
Keck
like they really beefed up the graphic traumatic events that that would have on anyone to you know i like the sound of the crash and then how it went deadly silent to nothing but the sound of like her blood trickling and her screams, and then the graphic death of like her partner.
00:44:12
Keck
like That was hard to watch, frankly.
00:44:15
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, we only get like little snippets of it up until that full reveal point and like the whole yeah Yeah Yeah, I hope she gets a fucking nominated for an Emmy or an Oscar or something as well Like because it's a tough choice between her and something.
00:44:16
Keck
and but i mean It was high-caliber acting, and that is you know what this movie was filled with, and what made it
00:44:33
Keck
I mean, the movie, it deserves something.
00:44:37
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely
00:44:37
Keck
It deserves some recognition, um I think. um Because, I mean, I'm assuming we're going to be giving our best ah films of 2024 pretty soon in the new year, hopefully.
00:44:56
Kevin Dougherty
yeahly ah bob
00:44:57
Keck
And I would say Smile 2 would be on my list of of Best of 2024, easily.
00:44:57
Kevin Dougherty
then
00:45:01
Kevin Dougherty
oh
00:45:03
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, absolutely.
00:45:07
Keck
i might I might even rank it up in like the top five, possibly.
00:45:07
Kevin Dougherty
absolutely
00:45:11
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, I would definitely, I think it might be in my top three. I could probably name my top three right now. This is before Nosferatu comes out.
00:45:16
Keck
Yeah.
00:45:18
Kevin Dougherty
So that could change. Nosferatu could be in my top three, but right now it's probably.
00:45:20
Keck
Yeah.
00:45:22
Kevin Dougherty
substance strange darling and uh and smile too oh yeah the whole hospital scene with her mother the mother cares more about like her fame than than does about her daughter and then she she's talking like yeah all that but that part was like a phenomenal as well
00:45:26
Keck
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, great. and But um, yeah, I mean, that's pretty much all I have to add on smile. Um, do you have any other notes you had taken any thing?
00:45:45
Keck
Yeah, that was great. And stabbing the death and
Franchise Future and Audience Engagement
00:45:52
Keck
yeah,
00:45:53
Kevin Dougherty
And then, yeah, then, uh, well, I guess we just talk about the, at the very end where she like, um, she, again, she thinks she's in the car with her friend and then she, and then, uh, then she finds out it's her actually fucking driving.
00:46:01
Keck
oh Yeah, I guess I should I guess I should say yeah More than Morris it's all bullshit and yeah On stage we're in the same outfit like full packed concert and
00:46:09
Kevin Dougherty
And, and, uh, then she's trying to meet up with that guy she met at the bar too. Yeah. ah Yeah, it ends up being the monster fuck with her that she when she wakes up again, she's in the thing on stage.
00:46:30
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, full like stadium fucking.
00:46:33
Keck
Yeah.
00:46:33
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:46:33
Keck
And then the thing walks up real gnarly. She is obviously paralyzed. She's, you know, like we described in the first film, like you're basically subservient.
00:46:45
Keck
Like you're totally immobilized. Like, you know, what you it gives you a some kind of parapletic where your muscles are just nothing.
00:46:55
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. And it like crawls out of like a version of her.
00:46:56
Keck
it And does this really cool entering.
00:46:59
Kevin Dougherty
It crawls out like a a version of her into her.
00:47:00
Keck
Yeah.
00:47:03
Keck
into like a gigantic yeah.
00:47:03
Kevin Dougherty
at that and yeah And then everybody witnesses. So let's go.
00:47:09
Keck
She takes her fucking microphone and jabs it through her eye hole into her brain and everyone there witnesses it and it was recorded on TV.
00:47:17
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:47:24
Keck
So does the spirit have like other minions?
00:47:28
Kevin Dougherty
Well, I don't know. We don't know if that concert was we don't know if the concert was filmed live. So we don't know if that ever got out ah if it got leaked or anything. But people definitely were filming on their phones.
00:47:38
Keck
i't know well I mean, yeah, we don't know if it was film live.
00:47:43
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:47:43
Keck
True.
00:47:44
Kevin Dougherty
And do you think the people that were sitting up in the nosebleed could see this could see well enough that do you think they got strong heres play on the big screen?
00:47:44
Keck
but
00:47:50
Keck
Yeah well I mean and there's also the question of do you have to definitely see it or do you just have to be in close proximity?
00:48:00
Keck
I guess they never really explain that but I see it as a visual thing. You have to witness the
00:48:09
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, I think you have to wait to be up and be there.
00:48:10
Keck
because it's a traumatic event yeah it's all about trauma so to go along with that theme it's not like you could just kill itself in the next room and like you're in like uh 10 square foot proximity so it passes to you yeah you have to see it it needs you to witness so um but yeah that scene was fucking gnarly at the end i mean
00:48:11
Kevin Dougherty
You can't just watch it on TV. Yeah. Yeah.
00:48:27
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:48:34
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, and now it's gonna be a lot of, he's gonna have a lot, the Smile Demon's gonna have a lot of work to do.
00:48:39
Keck
what we all know can it only go into one or can it go into all of them is it a spirit that like can like do that and possess them does it doesn't have an ability now where like it can like yes because
00:48:46
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:48:53
Kevin Dougherty
It's gotta call his boys up from fucking hell and be like, yo, I got mad people for us to fucking possess. Yeah.
00:48:59
Keck
It would have to break down exponentially. to everything that So it would have to be able to implant itself. Could they all be seeing the same thing then? Could every person be witnessing a different version of the spirit?
00:49:16
Keck
And when they die, then are they going to create it more? Because this would actually give the spirit the ability to populate itself and create more of itself if it had that ability.
00:49:30
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah, we don't know, yeah.
00:49:30
Keck
You know what I mean?
00:49:31
Keck
Because it would and then it would start like an exponential increase to the point where the whole world was taken over by this thing.
00:49:43
Kevin Dougherty
yeah Yeah, yeah.
00:49:43
Keck
That would be some crazy shit for Smile 3, but I mean that's re- I mean that's getting expensive if you're gonna try to make a-
00:49:50
Kevin Dougherty
Maybe Smile 4 is like an almost apocalypse. ah that It's just everybody's possessed.
00:49:55
Keck
Yeah, I mean I would pretty much like yeah like ah like the fucking ah Beginning of like I don't know World War Z or As much as I dislike the quiet the newest quiet place movie I did think it was one a lot better in the second one and it had like some really cool effects and So would it be like, you know, Smile 3, the opening scene, it's the same as that.
00:49:56
Kevin Dougherty
but help
00:50:21
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, yeah.
00:50:27
Keck
Like just something like Real Buckwild, the whole world is breaking down.
00:50:31
Kevin Dougherty
The the end of smile three is fucking the end of Dr. Strangelove. That dude is just fucking business right in the fucking day bomb down.
00:50:42
Keck
it Say are you gonna have K starred or I don't know if it's K star I can't remember who sings it, but we'll meet again don't I'm not sure who who actually sings that but um Yeah, I mean smile to fucking really cool movie Massive improvement over the first one my only I wish that that cop
00:50:51
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. yeah
Conclusion and Social Media Promotion
00:51:09
Keck
was in Smile 2 until the end and then kill him off you know because obviously but it would have been cool if he like survived and like got like the spirit away from him but then got the spirit back again or something like that you know you could have had some shit like that happen
00:51:28
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, yeah. sort of an interesting Like, like if he was like, if he managed to pass it on, but then he ended up at her like concert trying to help her and then ended ended up witnessing it it again at the end.
00:51:39
Keck
Yeah.
00:51:41
Kevin Dougherty
But I don't know.
00:51:42
Keck
Cause if he got it back, I think he killed himself right away.
00:51:42
Kevin Dougherty
I kind of like how he, uh, they, they like this.
00:51:47
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, baby. Yeah.
00:51:49
Keck
I'm sorry. What, what, what was your, what was your idea?
00:51:51
Kevin Dougherty
If he was, if he was at like, if he, you know, at the end, ah when she's doing it that's when he gets it back like maybe he was trying to help her out he found out that like oh I passed it on to this kid now let me go oh shit like this pop star now has it let me go try to help her so he ends up like at her concert and he witnesses again but then do you think he would immediately turn and and murder somebody there
00:52:11
Keck
i get Yeah, I get it. Yeah, that'd be interesting.
00:52:19
Keck
No, I think he'd immediately seek isolation while the spirit was still, because it seems like it needs to build up power with the trauma.
00:52:29
Kevin Dougherty
but but But at that point, if he's in the stadium with everybody else, that means everybody else. So like him going to keep.
00:52:37
Keck
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Well, yeah. If everybody else already saw it, I'm, I'm saying that he was able to absorb it himself, slowly himself.
00:52:41
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:52:44
Kevin Dougherty
Oh, yeah, just by himself. No, no, no.
00:52:46
Keck
Yeah. I think he would.
00:52:46
Kevin Dougherty
You know, I'm talking about like if he was there at the end and he witnessed as well and he was like, oh, fuck, not only do I have it back, but I can't just pass it on again because now all these other fucking people have it back.
00:52:49
Keck
Yeah.
00:52:56
Keck
Yeah well I mean whatever the storyline I just like that actor and you know after seeing him recently in Strange Darling that would have been cool but hey it was cool that they had like a lesser known cast so I thought that added to it for me.
00:52:57
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:53:01
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:53:11
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:53:12
Keck
I always like to see like newer actors so yeah I and thought it was awesome and uh
00:53:15
Kevin Dougherty
And I like how we got dispatched. I thought it was pretty well done.
00:53:18
Keck
yeah
00:53:18
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah. Yeah.
00:53:19
Keck
And i I did not think that we were going to talk this long on the Smile movies.
00:53:19
Kevin Dougherty
well
00:53:26
Keck
Like, I was considering talking about Alien Romulus, which we're obviously not going to do tonight, but I mean, the fact that we've talked about it so much just, I think, adds to, um you know,
00:53:26
Kevin Dougherty
and
00:53:30
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:53:33
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:53:39
Keck
that these were fucking decent flicks and you should definitely check them out and yeah, I mean, I think that there's a lot of potential for a third and maybe even a fourth one.
00:53:44
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:53:53
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah, I can see the franchise.
00:53:54
Keck
Um, you know what I mean? Because this did decent in, uh, theaters and if it wins some award, we know we're definitely seeing a third one.
00:53:55
Kevin Dougherty
go yeah
00:54:02
Kevin Dougherty
yeah yeah
00:54:03
Keck
ah But I mean, this could lead to a fourth one. I mean, shit, it could become a fucking franchise for all we know.
00:54:09
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:54:10
Keck
So, uh, yeah, definitely check them out if you haven't, but that's all I have for tonight.
00:54:15
Kevin Dougherty
ah The only other thing I wanted to mention was the um the music. I thought the Naomi Scott, ah she actually helped write and she performed all the all the songs and stuff.
00:54:25
Keck
I did hear, I did hear that.
00:54:25
Kevin Dougherty
And I think they were really wonderful.
00:54:26
Keck
Yeah, I missed, I missed that.
00:54:27
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:54:28
Keck
Yeah, that, that, that's something.
00:54:29
Kevin Dougherty
And they and if you go back and actually listen to the songs, they like they are talking about like trauma in her life and like, and like, ah Hey, doctor, I need a new brain or whatever, you know, like, she's like, I'm going crazy.
00:54:35
Keck
Yeah.
00:54:39
Keck
Yeah.
00:54:40
Kevin Dougherty
Like, so I thought they really.
00:54:41
Keck
Well, for a recovering addict and stuff like that.
00:54:42
Kevin Dougherty
felt Yeah, they fit the movie really well, too. And yeah, but but that's actually a soundtrack you can get and listen to on the regular because they're like pop songs. So yeah,
00:54:52
Keck
Actually kind of reminded me like in terms of like her addiction kind of reminded me of Eminem a little bit um and about how he came back and told his fans how he felt so appalled by his own behavior when he was using and how he felt that he had been cheating his fans by showing up high and advocating for you know them to take illicit drugs themselves
00:54:56
Kevin Dougherty
I
00:54:59
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:55:21
Keck
and how disgusted it he was with himself. you know ah You know what, you got that sense from her that she was, yeah, and that's what this thing loves to feed on.
00:55:34
Keck
So yeah, she was like a great five course meal for him.
00:55:39
Kevin Dougherty
yeah yeah yeah the the thing yeah yeah uh yeah definitely check it out and uh follow us on uh you know the social medias in the facebook group that's where i'm mostly active at uh sharing what the fuck is extrusion oh no i'm not a fucking ex i'm not that new blue sky either uh
00:55:40
Keck
Or it, I should say.
00:55:43
Keck
ah Yeah, good flick.
00:55:55
Keck
Are we on excretion or no?
00:56:00
Keck
X. Wow, good. Good for that. All right.
00:56:06
Keck
Oh, I'm actually interested in blue sky, but that's not...
00:56:09
Kevin Dougherty
I'm not on threads. um not I mean, i'm technically, I am on Instagram, technically. People always ask me on Instagram, I go, technically.
00:56:15
Keck
All right. We um we we all need to talk about what social networking we are. Yeah, whatever.
00:56:21
Kevin Dougherty
I mean, we do if we want people to fucking and follow us and listen to it, but yeah.
00:56:24
Keck
Hey, everybody. um Have a great, safe, and happy holiday. um And also a ah great, safe, and happy new year. Especially especially new year, man. I don't know what's coming in the new year, but fuck.
00:56:46
Kevin Dougherty
Yeah.
00:56:46
Keck
And on that optimistic note doc any ah any words for Fucking the holiday season and each year you wanna Yeah
00:56:56
Kevin Dougherty
No, no, no, you pretty much summed it up. I mean, just know no, it ain't Christmas until ah we see Hans Gerber false in Nakatomi Plaza.
00:56:59
Keck
that
00:57:04
Keck
Yeah true true true that true that but fun fact you consider changing your name the Hans Gruber at one point you said you were serious we never knew how serious you were but and then yeah it is a lot of well anyway Merry Christmas Happy New Year everybody take care and good night and good luck
00:57:12
Kevin Dougherty
okay
00:57:18
Kevin Dougherty
lot of paperwork man
00:57:21
Kevin Dougherty
yeah
00:57:26
Kevin Dougherty
right
00:57:29
Kevin Dougherty
peace
00:57:41
Kevin Dougherty
It's a lot of paperwork, man.