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S3E15: Tuesday the 28th
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Series spoilers abound! We’re watching Season 3, Episode 15 “Tuesday the 17th” and the iconic horror movie it’s based on, “Friday the 13th”. Our first TRUE HOMAGE!!! Everything from the title sequence to the counselors’ uniforms reference the classic slasher movie. Even Shawn realizes that they are stuck in a different genre as the boys get invited to (the very Camp Crystal Lake) Camp Tiki Hama. When they get there, nothing is quite as it seems as Annie has gone missing, Jason is seemingly a different person, and everyone is acting very confused. Suddenly, Mr. Potato-Sack-Man comes out of nowhere and the boys must figure out what is going on. We’re talking about the thriller genre, divorce, and having balance. So grab your favorite piñata and join Kylie and Skyler on this new episode of Phsysics 101!
Want to keep up with us and new episode drops? Join us on Instagram and Tumblr @phsysics101podcast.
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Transcript
00:00:20
Speaker
All right.
Introduction to the Psy6101 Podcast
00:00:21
Speaker
Hi, everyone, and welcome to Psy6101, where we discuss everything about the world of Psyche and the antics of Sean and Gus in sunny Santa Barbara. I'm Crazy Ralph, and this is my partner, Crazy Old Erwin. And today we'll be talking about Season 3, Episode 15 of the famed TV show Psyche.
00:00:40
Speaker
Perhaps the most classic episode. Oh, yes. Of all time. Indeed.
Discussion of Season 3, Episode 15: 'Tuesday the 17th'
00:00:46
Speaker
Tuesday the seventeenth
00:00:50
Speaker
bomb bow And we did watch Friday the 13th. Yes. to Prime Us, which it really did. It is true. This is an homage to Friday the 13th. Yeah.
00:01:03
Speaker
It's even referenced in the episode, which i mean obviously the entire episode is a reference, but yeah Sean says Friday the 13th in the episode.
00:01:14
Speaker
Something that I thought was really fun with how
00:01:18
Speaker
because Well, there's it's a very meta thing because they're like, it's an episode, but they're also playing a game that's based on horror. that's like So it's really fun to play with, especially Sean, knowing what movie he's in, which in horror movies oftentimes...
Sean's Awareness of Horror Tropes
00:01:37
Speaker
I see people say like you can't judge a character for not knowing what genre they're in. Yes. But Sean really knows. Yes. And I love his like his impatience with it. Like one of my favorite bits is when um Jason is walking away with the doll and Sean's just like, what's with the doll?
00:01:56
Speaker
He's just like, really? What's happening here? like And Gus is like not really humoring him at all because he isn't on it right um but it's just really fun because sean is someone who lives in references and so he knows like he's looking at all this and he's or even like when our killer says the guy was my father and he's like of course he was really he's just like yeah yeah okay of course yeah
00:02:28
Speaker
Yeah, it's kind of funny to think that, like, Sean lives in this world of references, but he's not so used to other people living in this world of references. So now true when the entire world becomes a reference, he's like, what?
00:02:40
Speaker
What's going on? Yeah, it kind of plays with, like, what we're really going to see in the next episode of, like, that, the way he likes to control the situation where... yeah he He is playing a certain game all the time, but now you're right. like Everybody else is playing that game on him, kind of. Yes, yes totally. yeah Not everybody is aware they're playing it.
00:03:03
Speaker
They sort of are, but aren't. um Yes. but um But yeah, so he is really like at once like, you know, he loves this and also he's like, doesn't like it turned against him, kind of. Right, Yeah. ah Well, and especially in this case, I mean, this is terrifying.
00:03:26
Speaker
Oh my gosh. In the worst way possible, like in the middle of a, I mean, he says it all the time. We're in the middle of a slasher film. Like how did that happen? And at least when he's, when he's referencing things, it's always as a joke.
00:03:40
Speaker
Like it's not to be taken seriously. And in this case, because he doesn't know the premise of this camp that they're at, he is taking it seriously he thinks the whole thing is like yeah well he's a fighter it's kind of like you um in the in the football episode like we talked about when they were being taken up to the yes to the top of the stadium and being hazed like he is in that situation as someone who knows there's the an actual threat right and like they're actual like you murderers sort of about and people who are up to no good and stuff and like a normal person in that situation isn't really thinking like that necessarily um and this one is especially weird because
00:04:28
Speaker
Also, the premise of this game, like if you went to this camp, you would be going into it with consent.
The Camp's Consensual Horror Game
00:04:36
Speaker
Right. You know none of this is real. Right. Like, and you would, you know, be playing with yourself because, you know, I'm sure that's part of people.
00:04:45
Speaker
This is like a real thing people do with like all kinds of.
00:04:49
Speaker
Like adventure vacations and stuff, spies, whatever. and And so you know it's not real, but also you are playing. Right. um And like you're allowing yourself to like kind of live in that and stuff. But Sean has no idea that it's not real.
00:05:04
Speaker
so it's like it is real to him and he calls Jules. Right. The way she reacts to everything is interesting too because she has a completely different relationship with murder than these normies.
00:05:16
Speaker
Right. Yeah, it's true. Yeah, yeah. um So, yeah, it's just there's so many layers. And aside from it just being like a super fun slasher episode, it's also like super, there's just so many cool elements to it.
00:05:33
Speaker
Yes. Yeah, i love that part of part of the episode is like the game a slasher film, which is always, I think,
00:05:46
Speaker
trying to like get you when you don't know you're going to be got, if you know what i mean, which we watched Friday the 13th and that like second to last scene with Jason coming out of the water.
00:05:59
Speaker
oh my That was the one time i got got. and um That was the one time. all the other ones I was like well like oh you did they definitely build anticipation like yes because kind of similar we talked a bit about like it being similar to black christmas yes um and very much being in the killer pov and stuff and and so like watching like you could really tell when something was about to happen so in that sense but when we yeah when jason's Nope. Decomposed body puffs out of the water?
00:06:32
Speaker
You did not know that was coming. No. I was like, oh, we're good. Like it's all beautiful. Yeah. and yeah no I mean, it is creepy and weird. I didn't know what was up with her either. Like, cause they, I think they say when she's in the hospital like that, we they thought she was dead.
00:06:50
Speaker
Right. Like, so in that moment, like she sits up and she's got this weird smile on her face and, and, and it's like, it's weird, but like, it does seem like everything's over. And then. Yeah.
00:07:01
Speaker
So bad. So bad. but so That was a real scary movie. That was. Oh, and there was a lot of, There was a lot of like gore that I wasn't anticipating. like you know We literally see someone's like throat get slit in half. You see like yeah the hand reach up from behind the bed, grab someone's mouth, pull them onto the bed, and then stab them through the front. It was a lot.
00:07:26
Speaker
yeah I was not expecting to actually see... I don't know why, because it's a horror film, but I wasn't expecting to see like the death and Yeah. I do feel like when we – yeah, when we watched Black Christmas, like, we – I feel like we talked about, you know, what they were able to do.
00:07:45
Speaker
Yes. Versus not. And, like, they didn't show everything. um Yeah, they showed very little, really, because of that. And, yeah, so maybe ah it had evolved enough by this time.
00:08:00
Speaker
Yeah. That they could really show things in a realistic way. A more realistic manner. I mean, it's still like 1980. Yeah. yeah So there's, but it was some scary stuff.
00:08:14
Speaker
Yeah. and And they were still very good at like the spook factor of like, here's a little hand creeping around the shower curtain when you're not looking. like You know, all that stuff, that anticipation building was really great.
00:08:28
Speaker
So what I love about the psych episode is that, you know, we play the game. And then we think it's over. Like they even start playing all of the like, you know, happy-go-lucky psych music yeah at the end. you So you think it's done and like, oh, that's the, that's the, you know, jump. Right.
00:08:47
Speaker
And then, oh no. Yeah. Holy shit. yeah There's an actual murderer. And that's kind of fun that like, it's not this, we're going to terrify you, like jump out at you, Jason coming out of the water.
00:09:02
Speaker
But it's just something that you weren't anticipating happening in the episode, I think was really fun. Yeah. Yeah, you have this like false sense of security, but there is more going on. Yeah.
00:09:14
Speaker
And there's ah like, it's interesting because trying to think is our clo no Should we spoil everything? Yeah. You've seen it.
00:09:26
Speaker
Yeah, that that's why you're here. yeah Clive and Jason are wearing like the same outfit as they're killing as they're doing their deeds, right? Yes, that, like, bag over the head. Yeah. i don't even know what we call him. Potato sack man.
Psych as a Procedural Crime Show
00:09:40
Speaker
That'll make me feel better.
00:09:41
Speaker
I know. It's interesting because on the one hand, like, it does feel so familiar and, like, like all these figures, but it's also completely its own thing. Yes. um But, because, like, we get these, like, scares. Like, oh, my gosh, Annie, that opening scene.
00:09:57
Speaker
Well, okay, so another thing. um With that whole lead up with Annie... After the flashback, then we go to Annie. That also, it's like horror, but also like a true procedural, which we don't often see psych structure this way.
00:10:15
Speaker
But in a typical crime show, you do often see the murder first. Right. And then you see the solving of it. And so that was kind of fun that like –
00:10:26
Speaker
Almost to like go back to the basics of the format they are yeah in order to serve this one that they're playing with is kind of fun. um And yeah, that whole buildup is is terrifying. Oh my god. again...
00:10:44
Speaker
So many fake outs is I think what I wrote down. ah The window, the kettle, the oh my gosh freaking door, that like everything was a fake out. And i was like, you cut it out now.
00:10:57
Speaker
Just get him in here. Do it. Yeah. Just kill her already. I know. i know And I felt like that a couple times. There was another point. um I don't remember when it was, but another point towards the end of the episode where I was like, oh when when, again, back to Annie. Now this time she's actually going to die.
00:11:15
Speaker
I was like leading up to the shower, opening the shower curtain, walking out of the shower, throwing the towel, walking into the room, you know, whatever on the window. I was like, just kill her. Poor Annie. We had to watch her twice.
00:11:27
Speaker
I know. Poor Annie. kind of three times you've got finding her in the laundry room oh my gosh i know it's creepy as heck annie are you okay love that i now that i understand it because i didn't on first you know watching this as a child now that i know what it is i'm like my god it's so exciting i'm just like tickled by it yeah um but also very creepy when ah The guy.
00:11:56
Speaker
The other guy. The kind of bro guy. Billy. but When he falls in the hole and then the feet come behind him. oh With the axe. oh Yeah. Oh my gosh. yeah So like we get scares.
00:12:10
Speaker
But then it all pays off so beautifully. And then like Sean running through the woods with Jason behind him. Yeah, the the rapid remembering. Oh, my gosh. So good. We get, like, two incredible, like, Sean, and not nutshellings, but, like, Sean figuring it out montage things.
00:12:34
Speaker
That are just so good. And I just, I feel, like, proud of him. Yes. As baby boy figuring it out. Yes.
00:12:45
Speaker
Figuring out the... facade and figuring out what's really going on under the surface. Gosh. And in like pretty quick succession too.
00:12:57
Speaker
Yeah. Because I mean the first, the first part, the game takes a little bit longer, but then once the game is over and they find an actual dead body, I mean, he figures it out within what feels like 10 minutes, like not even.
00:13:11
Speaker
Yeah. Which is really impressive. Mm-hmm.
00:13:16
Speaker
To be fair, I don't know how much our murderer was like trying to hide that he was murdering people and then you know doesn't even care that the potato sack gets pulled off of his face, but... Yeah. Well, it is.
00:13:26
Speaker
Yeah, we could talk about his motivations. He's interesting dude. Yeah. He is an interesting dude. Another great performance. Like when you when Sean does return to all those moments and like like ah what always gets me is the photo that they're taking and how he just like focuses on Clive and that stone face, empty gaze, like classic terrifying murderer look yeah he's a he's an interesting character i mean it's like he's hiding it but only so much that he can continue to do what he's doing until he gets to like he his intent is to kill everybody there so he doesn't have to hide it so much right yeah it was interesting because
00:14:12
Speaker
so in in the movie They haven't even really gotten to the point where the camp is actually opening. Like, there's counselors there, but it's not as if... It really is very similar. It is, like, the same. Yeah. Yeah. it is yeah I wrote down, like, when I was watching the episode, Jason is Steve.
00:14:36
Speaker
is Steve. bought the camp. He's fixing it up. He's going to reopen it. Yes. There are, like, a lot of... parallels and cool nods between the two but my question for clive is like so in the movie like and again hopefully you've seen them both by now in the movie the mom is like screw you guys for trying to open this camp up again and like now you're all here so i'm gonna kill you Clive, like, they all got, they've all been there.
00:15:05
Speaker
Like, what was he waiting for is my question. Now he starts killing people when two random bystanders, Gus, I mean, I guess Gus is kind of in on it because Jason asked him to, like, help convince Sean to get there.
00:15:17
Speaker
But, like, Sean didn't do anything. Jewel certainly didn't do anything. So, like, why wait until now? Was he just waiting, like, was he waiting for, like, the perfect moment? Did he want to, like, actually see that it was going to come to fruition? feel like what he was waiting for them to play the game.
00:15:35
Speaker
Ah. Like ah he says when he's in his final battle with Sean um like you're all the same. And Sean's trying to explain like I hate it here too man. Yeah. I don't even want to be here.
00:15:51
Speaker
um But and he did watch you know this all play out and also watch Sean figure it out and have fun and then they're all having fun. Ah, so maybe it's that.
00:16:04
Speaker
It's the, like, people are having fun at the expense of this very sad thing that happened here. Or, I don't, yeah.
00:16:15
Speaker
I wonder if he feels things such as happy and sad, but certainly traumatic for him. i mean, knows? Well, I feel like you can, yeah well...
00:16:26
Speaker
Well, I don't actually know how accurate this is, but like if he would be considered a psychopath slash sociopath, right? Can he still identify happiness in others? Like even if he doesn't feel happiness, can he be like, oh they're laughing and enjoying this time? Yeah. Oh, i yeah. I think he definitely sees that. Right.
00:16:43
Speaker
Right. um
00:16:46
Speaker
This a bit of sidebar, but I'm thinking of it now. Like, one of the most chilling things to me in Friday the 13th was the way the mom kept being, like, talking to Jason. Oh, my.
00:16:59
Speaker
Yeah.
Emotional Depth in Horror: Mother's Grief and Killer's Origin
00:17:00
Speaker
No. Freaked me the fuck out. Yeah. And it was, like, so sad and awful. And I mean, it's horrible. It's such a horrible story. Like, I really don't like. Very sad.
00:17:14
Speaker
yeah like i really obviously struggle with like children being involved in these kind of things it's like sure in the past in this movie so it's like it's not it's more it's like the killer origin story it's not really what's happened but like it's very real and present to her and we're with her so it's like yeah it was just like very disturbing yeah and i think the the like framing of her and how they shot her in the film they did a great job of making it feel even more disturbing like getting as close to her face as physically possible like zooming right in on her mouth like see yeah yeah it was yeah yeah i also like how they played with um
00:18:00
Speaker
how us as a viewer not knowing who it was but looking back at the end like that she just like the surface would appear as more of a comforting yes figure or perhaps a familiar figure so like that that one girl getting in the jeep and i'm just like why are we getting why are you getting in there but again well she doesn't know hitchhiked the whole way there it seems classic 80s know yeah so dangerous Yeah, and she was like, no.
00:18:32
Speaker
We'll try to warn her, but she's like, eh, it's fine. Yeah. Camp blood. Yeah. But she's just like talking to the driver and blah, blah. And then like it just... Yeah, I mean, even when she shows up at the end and Annie in that movie is like...
00:18:50
Speaker
Oh, like you have to, like what, you know, she's looking to her like someone who's actually going protect her and help her. And then whoops-a-doodles. She's trying to kill you for like 20 minutes. Yeah. And then Steve too.
00:19:02
Speaker
Like, he's like, what are you doing out here? Like he, and then just dies. Oh my gosh. Oh, so bad. Well, and you would think too, like Steve, well, I don't know if Steve was from,
00:19:18
Speaker
This area or if he just kind of came in like in the episode, Jason has experience with camp. So he's coming in. With like fond memories of the place.
00:19:29
Speaker
I don't really remember if Steve was the same or if he was an outsider. Also, I didn't realize that this took place in New Jersey, which. Terrifying.
00:19:39
Speaker
I saw that on the cemetery and I was like oh, it's apparently they filmed at an actual place. So we can oh go there if we want. Thank you. Goodness Lord. did kind of interpret it as Steve knew her.
00:19:53
Speaker
Like, the way he reacted. Yes. I think he knows her. But maybe he didn't. Yeah. The context, right? Exactly. Because i was like, what how would you not see this woman and not immediately be like, I'm so sorry. Like, I'm sure this is really traumatic for you. Like, what are you You know what i mean? Just to be like, what's going on?
00:20:08
Speaker
Like, what are you doing here? It seems like a strange reaction to someone who you know has a very traumatic connection to this place. Mm-hmm. But who knows? Who knows? We don't get all that much from Steve. Yeah, because what was it? 50... What year was...
00:20:24
Speaker
I don't remember. Was he killed? Or did he die? Yeah, did he die? Yeah. I mean, let's say 25 years ago. Yeah. Maybe she hasn't even stayed the whole time, you know? oh that's true. Yeah.
00:20:37
Speaker
And maybe that's part of her plan is to like not be to for people to not connect the dots. Yeah, yeah.
00:20:48
Speaker
Very killer of her. Yeah. Very killer her. Oh, yeah.
00:20:56
Speaker
yeah
00:20:59
Speaker
no fun yeah i feel ah yeah i mean it's very sad it's sad all around i feel like all of these are always so sad like yeah what happened to her son is sad what happens then to her obviously emotionally because of what happened to her son is sad all these people end up then dying like essentially innocent people like that's really sad i still don't like you do forget because like the genre is i don't know In popular culture, it's, like, ah such a fun thing. And it's so heightened.
00:21:32
Speaker
huh And it's, like, just, like, oh, Jason, Michael Myers. Like, they're all just, like... Freddy Krueger. Yeah. Yeah, but, like, actually watching, especially probably the first, because I'm sure as they've made, like, 10, 12.
00:21:48
Speaker
Sure. Yeah. It gets away from the, like, yeah maybe, like, emotional roots. But, like, yeah, it is a really sad... horrible story like and yeah they did and I I feel like maybe I expected it to be a little more like b-movie type like I don't I don't know if I expected that kind of depth Just knowing that there are a lot of slashers out there. A lot of... Yeah.
00:22:19
Speaker
I guess more maybe B-movie type like where it where it is just like kills and stuff. But like yeah, there's just like all this lore and some very dark subject matter.
00:22:31
Speaker
Yeah, I do find it interesting that... So my knowledge of this franchise, it's very surface level, obviously because I've never seen any of them. Yeah.
Homage to Friday the 13th
00:22:42
Speaker
I did think it was really interesting that, like, Jason Proper, as you think of Jason, um is not in this movie. Yeah. Like, so this franchise starts off as a totally separate thing.
00:22:57
Speaker
And then I guess because you've essentially killed the bad guy, like she's freaking decapitated, they have to find a different bad guy.
00:23:07
Speaker
And it just, I guess, makes sense to pick the decaying body of a person. But I thought that was so interesting I wasn't anticipating that. I was just anticipating like a crazy man with a right hockey mask or whatever he wear whatever mask is. Yeah for it to be the character that we owe.
00:23:25
Speaker
Right. But yeah it really wasn't. Especially having watched Tuesday the 17th knowing there is right a classic horror character who's like part of Friday the 13th. Yeah to really not see him at all interesting.
00:23:39
Speaker
Yeah it was so interesting. Yeah definitely made the sort the story much more sad as we Yeah, much more intense, I think, just overall. To not be like, oh, it's just this crazy man killing people.
00:23:52
Speaker
Oh, it's this mother who's traumatized from this event and clearly has not dealt with that. Yeah, and the way like Sean says, like, of course it is. like course it was your dad.
00:24:04
Speaker
i wonder if that's a trope. More of a trope than just, like, this movie. Like, someone killing on behalf of. Right. um we'll have someone else.
00:24:17
Speaker
um Yeah, students of horror, we may find that out someday. Yeah. yeah One day. Yeah, I liked that there was a lot of um like little nods to the movie. like Obviously, there's some bigger ones, like they picked Annie as one of the names.
00:24:42
Speaker
And obviously... one of the guys' names is Jason and they're at camp die, right? Like, there's a lot of very clear, right, clear homage to the original source material.
00:24:53
Speaker
But I like, too, that, like, all of their camp uniforms are, like, the original camp uniforms from the movie when Jason died. You know, I like that we got some, like, what felt kind of like classic sing-song camp music, like, leading into it, even though it was...
00:25:10
Speaker
you know Dwayne Tancana's version of Camp Tikuyama, but like still. yeah They nice little nods that if you've seen the movie, you'd really appreciate. Yeah. i mean I looked at the psych wiki to see if there were any fun facts.
00:25:27
Speaker
And one thing, i feel like we talked about um in the Tienkana episode whether we thought the song or this came first like the idea for this yes or just like the silliness of that yeah came first and I think we kind of felt it must have been just a part of that episode and then they like ran with it yeah yeah um but one thing that it said on the psych wiki is that camp tiki hama's name is a reference to the sounds heard in the iconic theme of friday the 13th either or oh which i wonder
00:26:09
Speaker
I guess they could have like interesting alluded to it being a camp movie. Right, right. Like they could have alluded to it regardless ah whether they realized that they would make a whole episode about it or not. Right, right. They could have just been like – ah wouldn't that be so funny um yeah yeah yeah um but i thought that was interesting and and the music was creepy i would be like um definitely pay attention to that especially after like halloween since that move music was so is so classic h um this one was like
00:26:49
Speaker
weirder would say yeah i didn't i didn't take any like physical notes uh about the movie just because i was watching it um so if i'm remembering correctly there was like essentially an entire freaking symphony orchestra playing like they had strings and they had an entire like band and like it was intense but then they also have these periods of like the string like screeching like when they strip the strings and it's like I'm like yeah almost like sound but just like um or not music but just sounds yes like a cacophony of just like especially when we're like in the killer's POV and it is those like weird just like it's just creepy and weird it's not it is not
00:27:46
Speaker
someone right obviously someone made the sounds but you're not like hearing the person breathing but it feels like you're hearing the person breathing right it's like because of the sound of that yeah yeah well made my skin crawl yeah and i'm that i'm sure was the intent so yeah well done well that's interesting i could yeah i could totally see them especially because james roday rodriguez was already like a part of you Kind of the behind the scenes being like, wouldn't it be so funny if they can't?
00:28:18
Speaker
Well, it did confirm that he directed this one. Oh, he did? Oh, yay. Yeah. I was like, he must have, right? I was going to look for the credits, but I was like, wasn't focused on those. But I did check on IMDb. Yeah.
00:28:37
Speaker
Let me check. Written by. o Okay. because I wouldn't be surprised. it Steve Franks is also credited here. They may have written it together. i could see that.
00:28:53
Speaker
um Yeah. So fun. Also kind of reminds me of like thinking about all those elements, like in the listening to the psychologists are in for Steve Franks's directorial debut in the season two finale with the mummy um how he was like just did everything yes threw it all at the wall yeah yeah Like having never done it before, just wanted to do everything. Yeah. And I feel like that this has a similar vibe where like James especially has just like wealth of like just like a shorthand himself with the horror genre and just like getting to throw all of that in.
00:29:40
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, there are running through the forest scenes, a pool scene, there's multiple murder scenes, there's creepy bike guy. there and Yeah.
00:29:52
Speaker
feel like he, yeah, really just... Yeah, and the whole like look out of it is very different. like It's yeah less saturated. Yes. And it almost looks like more filmy than the regular film that they're on. Yeah. like It looks so crackly and...
00:30:08
Speaker
There is something like strangely nostalgic about that, I think. I love the filmy kind of edit. But it does also hearken to like the movie and the kind of grainy filminess of the movie, which is fun.
00:30:25
Speaker
I also loved that it was freaking pouring rain. like What a better setting for something creepy and spooky than it pouring rain. Yeah, it was just all...
00:30:37
Speaker
Like when Billy went to go check the jetter and I'm like, Billy, Billy, what you doing, Billy? We even have that moment. It's, I mean, it is really interesting because they are, they are people who are aware of movies, you know, yeah or at least yes our people are, but it's like they're living in two different, you've got the camp counselors who are on the one hand like very aware that they're in a pretend thing because they are part like they're part of a murder camp. Like you guys should be extra aware of the tropes and stuff.
00:31:13
Speaker
Yes. But I guess being who they're supposed to be, they are like really not. Yeah. Well, yeah, because I guess they're also thinking, well, none of this is real. That's true.
00:31:24
Speaker
Maybe it gives them an extra false sense of security. Yes. um But then we have like Jules and Sean in particular who are like very aware. Like there's that moment where Jules is like, if half of what Sean said is true, none of you are being very smart. like Yeah.
00:31:40
Speaker
Yeah. She's like, hello, what are you guys doing? And like when Billy is going to leave, when Annie is going to leave, she's like, you need to stay here. And they're like, no, I know.
00:31:51
Speaker
i know Well, I just also. ah Yeah, I don't know. The crazy thing, like, I i guess, I don't know. I guess, yes, if you're living here at this camp, you'd be like, I want to go back to my place and take a shower.
00:32:07
Speaker
But it is freaking pouring rain. There's like no power. And there's a question mark if someone just got murdered. Why are you leaving? Why? Why do you think? I know. They're all very blase about the fact that someone just died.
00:32:20
Speaker
Died. Died. And I wonder if it's part of that is because not everyone is exposed to murder and death in the way that like Jules and Sean and. lassie and gus are so they're probably like oh it looks like this guy killed himself he probably just killed himself like it's not as big of a deal or like oh like a dead pot i was thinking no why is i am similarly at the end when like gus is just like super chill or it's just like very nice like it it seems unfazed by the fact that two people were brutally murdered in their cabins
00:32:53
Speaker
three who's the third well i guess irwin yeah we don't we don't even see annie and um billy though i know just based on the reactions it was probably horrific um but gus in particular seems unfazed by this and i'm like well i guess they spend a lot of time around death now yes but like annie and billy yeah it's like you guys should be i mean maybe they just think erwin's
00:33:20
Speaker
like just that crazy guy and they're less more just like a whoa weird than like a this is a scary thing right um but yeah yeah I don't I don't know, dude. I would have been like, I'm not going anywhere. I'll sit myself right here next to the police officer with the weapon. Thank you.
00:33:42
Speaker
Like, and when, when Jules leaves with Sean and then it's the three of them in the cabin and he jumps down the fucking stairs, I am like, nope, I'm done.
00:33:53
Speaker
I'm done. Every time i'm like, no, we're good. We're good. Why, why they let her leave? Why they didn't all go together? I still don't really know.
00:34:04
Speaker
I still don't really know. I may not ever know. I know. i mean, well, I guess Gus is in charge. Which he does a great job, you know.
00:34:14
Speaker
He protects Sissy. So, I mean, good for him. um Yeah, he definitely does what he can in that moment. But I love later when he when Sean goes to the pool and turns to who he thinks is Gus.
00:34:30
Speaker
And it's Clive. And then Gus shows up and he's like, I already beat him. can't. beat him and then he throws him a freaking like pool noodle noodle or some shit this is a pool skimmer it's so so funny so psyched it is so horrifying it's so great yeah it's like it does it all it's so funny because I'm just realizing now that Gus gus You know, we're watching the episode and there's a point where he's like, um like fearless Guster, like going into the woods and like throwing things at people. like know I'm just realizing now, like, of course he was fearless Guster.
00:35:07
Speaker
There was nothing to be afraid of the whole time. I'm like, this, Gus. Well, that is one of the reasons that Sean puts it together because he's like, when he realizes Gus... didn't react to the blood right right i mean it is funny because i feel like that is a great he is a great example of what we were talking about with like what a person going to this camp might be like because he is aware of everything being real but when yeah he's in the woods chasing down somebody like it is super creepy like even if like just putting yourself in that
00:35:43
Speaker
yeah terrifying even if you and you know that like this is not real yeah i mean just think about us watching this movie we weren't there we don't experience it we're sitting on the couch and we're freaked out like yeah can only imagine what it's like actually being there and yeah hearing and seeing and people coming close to you no thank you not for i Yeah.
00:36:05
Speaker
Well, and we can argue about if it was poor taste, but they did do an incredible job. Jason did an incredible job so yes setting up this horrifying events. it took Sean...
00:36:17
Speaker
um i mean sean It took Sean a pretty long time yeah to figure this out. Yeah. And Sean is genuinely scared. He is hiding in a closet.
00:36:29
Speaker
I know. I know. He is genuinely freaked. I mean, he calls Jules. like yeah That's not very typical for them, particularly. True. i mean, they're pretty like, ha ha, this is so funny. We'll figure it out. Like, we want the money, you know, cool, cool.
00:36:46
Speaker
But he's pretty spooked from the beginning. And then once they're actually there, he's like, this is not. Yeah. Something is wrong here. Yeah. And I guess part of it, like, he does have that sort of genre awareness. And also he has this, like, terrible, these associations with this camp as a child.
00:37:02
Speaker
Yes. Once again, we're getting to the end of the season. And our big, like, theme has been that, like, child adult self and the interplay between that in real in present day what wait i'm just next episode yeah oh my god
00:37:28
Speaker
okay just like all hit me yeah okay okay yeah we're like at the end well and thinking about where we're about to go that's why like
00:37:40
Speaker
Yeah, we're seeing these... I mean, this is a great example. Again, it's such a just, like, fun episode. It's an homage episode. It is just that. But also, like, we are seeing Sean kind of, again, reverting to this, like, traumatized child state. Yeah. and And it's interesting because, like, we see the flashback, which we we didn't really talk about, but of them being at camp, and he has this, like...
00:38:04
Speaker
kind of scorned little boy yeah baggage around this camp um just because gus chose jason as his partner in the pinata making puppet making contest or something yeah pinata yeah yeah pinata um and so we see a very moody a little sean um getting picked up from camp But then later, like, when they are looking for Annie, he makes a comment quite bitterly that, like, they call your parents to pick you up early because the electrician died in the pool. Like, so we didn't see that.
00:38:45
Speaker
But, like, that is how this his relationship, how their relationship with this camp ended. Right. I mean, that would be super freaky. Yeah. And I think you kind get that in the beginning when Sean's kind of like, I never wanted to go back to that camp. Why are we going back there?
00:39:02
Speaker
Um, And it seems like it does seem like this is a place that they they had gone to for multiple summers because it seems like they had been pinata making pears before.
00:39:14
Speaker
um But because it ended on such a bad note, like they are really, at least Sean, is pretty soured to this. Yeah, I feel like they kind of bury the lead of like what his problem actually is with it because we're given this pinata story. Right.
00:39:30
Speaker
and And so we've got that. And he doesn't really like this Jason guy. And so we've got that. But like it doesn't really get revealed until later that like, mean, it had to have been like the next year or the year after that because this was not getting picked up early, I don't think. and No, it was. They got picked up after one week.
00:39:48
Speaker
Yes. That was it? Yeah, they got picked up after one week at camp. Because in the flashback, it doesn't really feel like anything bad happened other than just like the pinata drama.
00:40:01
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I'm sure I'm sure I'm going to like over overanalyze this a little bit. I'm sure you're like from from like a camp perspective, like if you were actually running this camp, you probably wouldn't tell the kids like why they were leaving early.
00:40:21
Speaker
You would probably just be like something happened. Camp is no longer safe for us to all be here. So we're having to send you home early. And then after everyone's home and there's been an investigation and whatever, then you'd probably like send out an email to parents just be like, by the way, we're not opening ever again because someone died in the pool.
00:40:41
Speaker
So you think Sean found out later what happened? Yeah. So I think it's less somber. And I don't know if obviously they doubt they were thinking of this, but I bet, um, In reality, it would be less somber because they probably didn't actually know what happened. You wouldn't tell kids like, hey, a guy died in the pool last night. Bye.
00:41:02
Speaker
It would never fly. um So, yeah, I bet they were blissfully unaware for a little bit and then later on found out, like, oh, that's why we left early. I could see, like, kind of like Scary Sherry, like a sort of urban legend building up around it.
00:41:17
Speaker
Sure. As the years, as the time went on. And it building up in Sean's mind. Mm-hmm. um as this like ah horrible place that he never wants to see again yeah well especially if it closed after that year and then never opened again until 20 some odd years later yeah and it's easy for myth to come out of that I suppose yeah Yeah, that's true, too. Like, it must be close to Santa Barbara. Like, it's not like a really far sleepaway camp or anything because Jules comes. Like, it's just in the mountains.
00:41:53
Speaker
So um so I'm sure rumor would have continued. yeah Oh, I'm sure. Like, amongst the children. Yeah.
00:42:05
Speaker
Maybe they all went to this camp. Yeah. I mean, I feel like that makes sense. Like, the fun thing you do in the summer. Mm-hmm.
00:42:15
Speaker
Jules, I feel like, is so great in this episode. yeah She looks so pretty. She's so cute. I don't know if it's like the lighting, but I just felt like she looked exceptionally beautiful in this episode. And then the last scene, or not the last, sort of, I guess.
00:42:34
Speaker
In the final battle, just
00:42:39
Speaker
the rain and the fighting and the lightning and Sean yelling, at like, take that shot. And she was like, I don't have it. Get it. And then she takes it and she gets him in the hand.
00:42:52
Speaker
And then when Sean's like, I wrote it down, kind of. That pinpoint marksmanship from you. And he's trying to, like. Like, ah even though I was scared.
00:43:05
Speaker
Yes. One of the sexiest things that I've ever. And he's like. Well, that final scene is so interesting. feel like we got to talk about that final scene. Not the final battle, but the
Eerie Final Scene and Twin Peaks Comparison
00:43:19
Speaker
final scene. Final scene.
00:43:21
Speaker
Because they're all standing there at the waterfront. No one is looking at each other. They're all just staring into the distance, which I felt like for the rest of this episode, I was like, ah, Friday the 13th.
00:43:38
Speaker
And then we get here and I'm like, what?
00:43:41
Speaker
what is happening here? felt a little like, I'm going to say Twin Peaks-y. Yes! I always think of the Twin Peaks episode when I think of this moment. I'm glad that we we're on the same page.
00:43:55
Speaker
Because it's like a little it's a little like... What's the word I'm looking for? um
00:44:04
Speaker
disjointed, but it it's like a little... Like eerie, like spooky. Well, I do feel like in Friday the 13th, it has that eeriness.
00:44:14
Speaker
but it It does. It's just like empty. it's more The end of Friday the 13th is yeah more like the end of the flashback where we go back and we go under the water and then we see the puppet.
00:44:27
Speaker
yes And it's extremely creepy. yeah um But yeah, the end of the actual episode, we're with Our peeps, Sean, Gus, and Jules. And yeah, it really does feel like the Twin Peaks episode. Like I feel like there's... That side profile. Yeah, and the music.
00:44:46
Speaker
but Yeah, the music especially like so Twin Peaks-y. And I feel like, is there a moment in the Twin Peaks episode that is like very similar? Because I often have that same association where I'm like, I have trouble almost like placing...
00:45:03
Speaker
where that moment is which of the two episodes it's in yeah yeah they are at the waterfront a bunch in that episode but i don't know if they i can't recall if there's like a side profile shot or like a we're just looking into the distance shot yeah i guess not because the end of twin peaks the twin peaks episode is um them all in the diner Right.
00:45:27
Speaker
Also very eerie. Also weird. Yeah. Very weird. But yeah. And maybe it is just like the lake. I wonder if it's the same lake that they filmed at. Maybe. We'll have to pay attention to a little we get there shot for shot comparison.
00:45:44
Speaker
Oh, fun. yeah it's But yeah, it's like, it's very odd. It kind of feels like, okay, everything has now changed.
00:45:55
Speaker
Yeah. For us. And maybe it has. me Maybe it has. You know, the next episode is goes to also a very dark place that we have not been to before.
00:46:09
Speaker
I also audibly gasped in this episode. Hold on. When I find this.
00:46:17
Speaker
Sean figures it out. This is after he fell on the floor and he's like, don't shoot. Jason's reopening the camp, but not for the kiddies. Instead, it's a murder camp. Every other week, eight people pay to get scared to death and solve a murder mystery.
00:46:29
Speaker
And Sean says, I could feel that nothing was as it seems. And a couple of moments later, Gus says, that's how we do it. Yin and yang. I'm the spark that starts the fire.
00:46:39
Speaker
I was like, whoa. Yeah. was like, how did never notice that? Right? I was like, what? They did that? I had to have done that on purpose.
00:46:51
Speaker
I mean, they had to write. Yeah, they had them both. You know, they're writing them both. ah Yin and Yang right there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah.
00:47:02
Speaker
I don't. I mean, that's interesting. Like for him to call them, him and Sean, Yin and Yang. Yeah, because they're so not. Yeah. Well, and also like what, but is there something? Like, is there? Hmm.
00:47:16
Speaker
About the two. Well, yeah, I guess. There's like a kinship between Yin and Yang, the murderers, and Yin and Sean and Gus. Yeah. i mean, there's obvious connection because they're, Yang especially is obsessed Sean, but yes is there like something about their personalities?
00:47:34
Speaker
It's it's it's so interesting because even like when I think yin and Yang, like the concepts of Yin and Yang. Mm-hmm. Like two opposites that also kind of have a little bit or an understanding that there's always a little bit of the other inside. Right.
00:47:55
Speaker
I hear that. I'm like, Sean and Gus are the same. I'm like, they're the same human. They have the same humor. They do the same kind of stuff. But really, we've talked about Sean and Gus so much as... essential opposites of each other when you think about like being an adult and being a kid like Sean is the kid with like the little bit of seriousness and Gus is the serious with a little bit of kid yeah actually you could apply yin and yang to like like all of our theses of the show of like how they are constantly like striving for this balance between them and part of like oh being one like being or growing up is also having being able to be a bit of a kid too and like not being too much of one thing yeah and that's what this season has been like oh them negotiating yeah adulthood and childhood and like
00:48:44
Speaker
and their moments and choices and their unfinished business and all that stuff and like mean even like Henry who we didn't see in this episode at all except for the flashback like you know that's something he's been going through too with like Maddie it's like he is the past but he's also the present and like all this like interplay and and and and so is this this finale is going to be like the perfect pinnacle of the season and like everything we've discussed so far And they knew.
00:49:16
Speaker
like... Oh, my I feel like you could really watch this show and really not think about... Totally. Not engage critically with their actual narrative and the character and the growth. Yes. And still enjoy Yeah. And totally, you know, also a great way to experience it. But it's like... Yes.
00:49:36
Speaker
It really is...
00:49:39
Speaker
or it appears to be a very intentional yeah thoughtful storytelling with deep themes and that's just so fun yeah and I wonder how because this this next episode is not the only instance that we get of yin and yang we get three instances so I wonder how right three two three three
00:50:09
Speaker
We get three instances of what? Yin and yang, right? Three. Right? Okay, that's what I thought initially, and now I'm second-guessing myself. Yeah, we get three. Okay, good.
00:50:20
Speaker
So I wonder how...
00:50:24
Speaker
Like our understanding of the season and how the themes of the season are going to develop and change with each of the yin and yang episodes ending the season. So how that's going to be like a ah nice capstone of the season itself.
00:50:39
Speaker
Yeah. To go into them thinking ah each of them has the weight that this one does. and Yes. Yeah. That tying up of all the themes.
00:50:53
Speaker
It's going to be very exciting. It is. i am just reading again Gus's line. I pulled up the transcript. Like what? I don't know what he means by that. What's Sean's line before it exactly? Because I actually think there's more than what I read.
00:51:08
Speaker
um But I couldn't have done it without Gus. You were right, partner. That wasn't paint on Annie's clothes, paint dries, so does blood, but corn syrup mixed with red dye number three.
Character Dynamics: Gus, Sean, and Lasseter
00:51:19
Speaker
Not so much. And Gus says, that's how we do it. Yin and yang. I'm the spark that starts the fire. So like he's saying, I think he just like prompted the realization. Yes. on But like, I don't know what that has to do with yin and yang, really.
00:51:31
Speaker
I don't know either. um Is Gus a little psychic? Maybe. Maybe. Okay, and then... i know. Thinking about everything we just said.
00:51:46
Speaker
Shall we talk about Lasseter? I know. have to. I know. It is really kind of wild to go back and forth between... what is happening at a murder camp and what's happening for Lassie because they're yeah both very intense but in two totally different ways yeah but I i do feel like what Lasseter is going through is a horror show in itself absolutely Him going into this with ah certain expectations. I mean, kind of like what we were saying. Like, you have certain expectations and then to have them subverted.
00:52:23
Speaker
Yep. And it to be that, like, shocking. it's It is like Jason jumping out of the water. Like, when she's like, oh my god, I didn't. I don't think I communicated correctly. Yeah. I don't think I was clear enough.
00:52:36
Speaker
And poor Lasseter. Like, I really think we've grown... to love and understand Lasseter a little bit more deeply throughout this season.
00:52:48
Speaker
And, you know, i think we got to see behind the curtain a little bit and Lassie did a bad, bad thing. And you see him at the beginning or towards the beginning of this episode and he's putting so much thought and effort and energy into the flowers he's going to bring, the chocolate he's going to bring, what time he's going to get there. Like,
00:53:13
Speaker
And then for it to all crumble down around him, I'm sure is so heartbreaking, one. But then I also thought it was really interesting, his the conversation about his reaction, like how he how he reacted to the whole thing.
00:53:31
Speaker
Because I think it also comes back to kind of, What we think about Lassie and what Lassie thinks about Lassie. Like she expected him to blow up like he did two years ago and like set the thing on fire and put it in her purse or whatever he said. Right.
00:53:45
Speaker
But now he's gotten to a point where he's like, I, I just. I want you to be happy. Clearly, this isn't the thing. Makes me sad, but we're going to be better.
00:53:57
Speaker
Not in this together. It is amazing how, like, self-aware he is yeah this conversation. Like, for him to be able to talk about how he used to be. And even before she introduces the divorce papers, like, he is talking about being a better person.
00:54:13
Speaker
partner and like how how he knows that he wasn't and and like this is the long time coming and blah blah blah like he has clearly done so much thinking yeah and and we have seen him be confronted as you said with like how people how other people see him and how he like what he projects like with um Goochberg hey Gooch and um Just didn't, yeah, unless he did a bad, bad thing. And that, like, being confronted with that over and over, does force him to, like...
00:54:53
Speaker
reconsider himself and what he's putting out there and what he's doing and how he's operating and is that what he how he wants to be perceived and it seems like he has really thought about it and is coming to her and wanting to be different yeah and ready to be different and and then finding out that she is ah has already moved on it's like yeah and I think That's even more heartbreaking too to be like I i am and so giving you what I think you want.
00:55:24
Speaker
Like i've I've done all of this to say look I'm ah i'm a better person for you. And even that to quote unquote not be enough. Like that's got to be so incredibly gut-wrenching.
00:55:38
Speaker
Yeah. I mean knowing what he was separated in the pilot. So it's been like three years. Yeah. Yeah. That he's been just like wanting to get her back.
00:55:54
Speaker
Yeah. And what was it? Was it last Christmas that he sent her Oh, yeah. Little figurines or whatever. yeah And she like broke them all or something.
00:56:07
Speaker
Oh, man. So they really have like. They have evolved together, even just. Being able to sit. Yeah.
00:56:18
Speaker
In a restaurant. like So that says something, but it's like, yeah, I don't know. I mean, marriage, you know, it's like too much has happened.
00:56:29
Speaker
It's time to move on. Yes. And ultimately, all going to so goingnna work out for Lassie. He's going to be yeah more than happy.
00:56:42
Speaker
Yeah. But in this moment, it is still very It's tough. It's tough to watch. It's so tough. Yeah. Yeah, it is. It's horrible in its own way. um
00:56:55
Speaker
but and he talking about the yin and yang and like the finding this balance and stuff like we are seeing him also kind of similar to what henry's doing henry also dealing with a divorce with someone who from someone who he still loves basically like lassie's like in the same boat and also like balancing um
00:57:20
Speaker
you know, who he's going to be now and still like wanting to be that version who was married to her.
00:57:30
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. It's interesting. Like as you're saying this, I'm just realizing that I think
00:57:42
Speaker
do we meet anybody else who's divorced in the, not anyone we're with longstanding. I don't think so. It's so interesting that the two people who we know are divorced, start we're both seeing the the male side of this. I feel like often we see... is true.
00:57:57
Speaker
Right? the The female side of... Or at least I feel like that's more of my experience watching TV and movies. um So to see how it's impacting the male counterpart, like that's kind of interesting.
00:58:11
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, I think this is very much so like a... um I don't want to say a male-centered show because I don't think... don't Well, it is. Yeah. I mean, it's told from the perspective of a bunch of men. It just feels weird saying that. There are more male leads.
00:58:28
Speaker
Yeah. Well, it's a it's even written. You know, I mean, Steve Frank's... um I'm sure writing something like this for as long as you do, you probably start to, you know, think about your experience, right? So I don't know if he's married or divorced or whatever, but being a male himself...
00:58:45
Speaker
I'm sure he considers maybe how that situation would impact the male side of that duo, you know?
00:58:57
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, another, when I think of divorce, it's hard not to think about another show that I love, which is Ted Lasso, which is very much about divorce. And that, especially in the first season, you really see, like, two people, not in the same relationship, but two people dealing with divorce, Rebecca and Ted, and how that affects them in different ways. And they really parallel each other in a lot ways, but...
00:59:27
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I guess it depends. And, you know, we may not have like a fully comprehensive, like, maybe there's more emotionally, more like introspective stories about men and divorce that like I am really not seeking out.
00:59:46
Speaker
You know, like I tend to watch things about women. so Sure. Yeah, that could be too. maybe But I do feel like lot of but i do feel like a lot of times when you do see like stories about men and And divorce. Like you you get a lot of like shrewish like ex-wives and. Sure. Yeah. Yeah.
01:00:10
Speaker
And like and like bachelors like just the kind. Yes. Like we're not seeing these two like this kind of pining man. Yes. So much. That is yes sort of unusual. And we do have two on this show. Two. Yeah. Yeah.
01:00:23
Speaker
yeah So that is interesting. I have not really thought about it that way. But like I'm thinking of like Castle NCIS. So like you've got these like. crazy ex-wives like a kind of yeah i well i mean that in and of itself yeah i mean that and of itself is like a trope like the crazy ex-wife yeah ex i can't speak it's after full day of work crazy ex-wife yeah and here we very much get like we get much more of like a she was normal what did i do and yeah which is yeah it's interesting yeah
01:01:03
Speaker
Yeah, and I wonder if it is and partially, I mean, I do think you don't have to go where they go in terms of this the like pining and the yearning that both Henry and Lassie do. yeah But in terms of like them sort of being, and especially Lassie, being like the difficult one,
01:01:24
Speaker
um he
01:01:28
Speaker
We've talked before about like how the show is also kind of sitcom and and lives in kind of a sitcom form because it's a comedy. um And that makes the characters more extreme.
01:01:43
Speaker
um And Lassie is a very extreme character that would be difficult to be in a relationship with. Yeah, sure. So we kind of have that. But then in it being Andromedie, you really balance that with how deeply he feels.
01:01:58
Speaker
and How deeply he feels for Victoria. Yeah, they do it very well.
01:02:07
Speaker
And it's going to be actually kind of a while until we find suitor for Lassie. Yeah, I don't remember there's much dating that he does.
01:02:24
Speaker
It's interesting because he has been dating, sort of. like He's been sort of on the market. We've seen Jules try to find him a man on orders from the chief.
01:02:35
Speaker
Or find him a gal. Someone. um Find him a partner. yeah
01:02:44
Speaker
But yeah, we I don't remember if he does much dating. And now that...
01:02:50
Speaker
I could see maybe him putting himself out there, as you say, being more of like, I don't know, maybe it's just like something he had had to do as part of getting her back, you know, like not something that he was really invested in. And I wonder if we'll see him not try because he is now he is.
01:03:15
Speaker
It's really over. And that's like a different kind of grief. Yeah. Yeah. No one really stands out. Like not no dating really stands out to me that I can remember. Yeah.
01:03:27
Speaker
I don't think so. So, I mean, we'll see. I mean, again, we've talked about how we, you know, essentially skim the show until now.
01:03:39
Speaker
um So we'll see if maybe something else kind of pops up. But i I could see that. I could see him being like, I just need to. like take a break for a little while and if something happens something happens but otherwise i'm i'm good yeah because marlo isn't introduced until the third episode of season six Oh, dang.
01:03:59
Speaker
So, yeah, it'll be interesting. I mean, this is not the season finale, but in yeah some ways it has that feel. This is definitely a closure for Carlton. So it'll be interesting to come back in season four and see where we find him yeah after this.
01:04:17
Speaker
Yes. Yeah. And I think as much as Yang is a good a good episode to end on because it is like so big and so intense and so much is happening oh my gosh there's another thing that's next episode oh my gosh oh my I can't I can't my brain umm gonna melt I'm gonna melt um I'm gonna need to really brace myself for next episode it's gonna be a lot I sometimes when i I think we've talked about this like a long time ago but when I re-watch as like a comfort show so I just skip these two
01:04:55
Speaker
That's right because there are a lot. There's so much. There's so much. Like, next episode, I would not be shocked if I, like, cried and towards the end. Oh, my gosh. Because just too much happens.
01:05:07
Speaker
um But, like, for for as good as it is, it's kind of like a blockbuster season finale, like a big, you know, episode. Sometimes I think that, like, super high intensity makes it difficult to wrap up some of the like underlying less intense things, like Lassie, right? Like Lassie and his relationships is like something that's been kind of on the back burner for a little while. And to just throw that into ah big episode like Yang feels kind of weird. So placing it here i think makes, as you said, makes a little bit more sense as like the finale for what Lassie has been dealing with.
01:05:44
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, and when you think like it's an ensemble cast, so like... we kind of have to see everybody's closure. yeah And so to fit all of that into one, Is tough. So, yeah, this really, like, him being the sole B-plot of yeah this episode, it's like we really get to spend time in that and give it the time it deserves.
01:06:08
Speaker
um And, yeah, I want to see. I mean, I feel like he's just in the investigation in the next episode. don't think there's a whole lot else going on for him. So, this is his...
01:06:20
Speaker
his finale yeah i mean i would i would argue pretty much the same for jewels until the very end of next episode like she's pretty much just with lassie i know and then the well but that's a huge closure for her i mean that is kind of the closure for what she's been going through and i when you were saying like how that this last scene of tuesday the 17th feels like everything's changed i was thinking like maybe also for her everything has changed like They have been in some serious situations, but her and Sean are kind of teamed up here in a way that we haven't really gotten to see them be, especially in such a high intensity situation.
01:07:07
Speaker
and And I was also thinking like that moment where she is having to take the shot, And, like, she could shoot Sean. Oh, he's not even trying to duck. Like, he's only just standing there with his arms crossed. He's trying to not get stabbed or whatever the one guy's trying to do. Yeah, with a machete.
01:07:27
Speaker
His machete at this point. I don't know. Yeah, it's a good point. don't know dropped it yet. But he's he's dealing with that. and And, I mean, I wonder if that... is like a turning point for her in coming to terms with like that maybe, you know, the classic, like she doesn't have all the time in the world, you know, Sean, she and Sean don't have time to waste, or maybe she just doesn't want to waste any more time. And like, she knows what she wants and to, and to come that close to like losing him and,
01:08:06
Speaker
Being like in such an intense situation together.
01:08:11
Speaker
Trying to protect him. Trying to protect each other. like i could de I could see all of that kind of compounding for her. Into something where everything has changed. And can't really remember like the lead up for her.
01:08:26
Speaker
To that last conversation in the next episode. Right. but i I can imagine it's like. This happens. As you said. maybe she starts to consider more seriously what she's been feeling.
01:08:42
Speaker
And maybe it is like a turning point of, okay, I got to like do something. And then the very next week, freaking serious. I know.
01:08:53
Speaker
But then she's like, okay, there really is no time. Like I really can't, like, we don't know what's going to happen on a week by week basis. We live in the freaking murder capital of the world. Like we got to get going, you know?
01:09:04
Speaker
Yeah. So by the end of like, oh, and I think there's a lot too in the next episode with like family and who's important to you and and stuff like that.
01:09:16
Speaker
So I think with all of that being said, maybe Jules is like, this is it. Like my time is now. The time is nigh. i must, like I got to just do it. Like get over your fear, get over whatever you're thinking.
01:09:30
Speaker
And then of course we know they have fucking horrible timing, but- you know She finally yes says, we really, we got to do this. like what um
01:09:45
Speaker
oh Oh, this is different. In a recent book I was reading, the like two main characters, a very very standard, the two main characters love each other, but neither one of them knows that the other person loves them and whatever.
01:09:58
Speaker
And the male character was like, I'm just going to tell her. Like, even if she says no, like, it's better having tried and, like, shared how I feel than having kept it to myself forever.
01:10:10
Speaker
So I wonder if that's also, she's just like, do it. Like, it's better to share it. And if it doesn't happen, it doesn't happen. But at least I know that I was, like, true to how I'm feeling in this instance. Even if that's maybe not conscious. um Yeah.
01:10:25
Speaker
I mean, it would be kind of
01:10:28
Speaker
like whiplashy for a little bit because I feel like Sean has been pretty forward oh very so it's like her getting to the point where she's like okay let's do it then and so and then to actually say that and for him to be like could you have said this yesterday know could you have said this 15 minutes ago like could we have had any better time like that's but that's like television maybe yeah and life yeah timing indeed
01:11:06
Speaker
well i'm not even on no not at all i need anymore but but yeah i mean it all though these two episodes are just like sister yeah mega finale they just go yeah yeah they do
01:11:23
Speaker
i We haven't talked about... we didn't go scene by scene through the episode, but I feel like we got pretty much every scene um in the conversation. i mean... guess other things that I... Well, one thing we didn't really talk about Vic.
01:11:38
Speaker
I love how sincere she is when Lassie's like... When she learns that Lassie's gonna see his ex-wife and it's just like very cute.
01:11:51
Speaker
But she's also like, maybe, you know... Exercise a bit of caution. Unless you just like, what? Yes, no. Cannot process that. No.
01:12:03
Speaker
Yeah. Good advice, it turns out. Yes.
01:12:09
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. and I feel like it's, yeah, it's so hard, right? Because I'm sure, you know, I think oftentimes when you're like a third party observer, to somebody else's life, sometimes it is easier to like, see the forest for the trees, if you know what I mean.
01:12:25
Speaker
yeah I wonder if Vic is kind of, Vic kind of sees it better than better than Lassie does. But I do think it's also just good good advice, like, for, I don't know exactly how i want to how I want to phrase it, but I think that's just good advice for a friend to just be, like, protect protect yourself in this.
01:12:46
Speaker
You know, like, I'm glad that you're happy. I'm glad that you're excited. But you don't know what you're going into. Yeah. And I feel like that's kind of the Vicks personality too. Like she's not the most optimistic person probably. Or she's just more of a realist, you know. She's like not going to get ahead of herself. So,
01:13:14
Speaker
yeah. Well, I mean, sure. Like she... Again, we've talked a little bit before about how we don't really know what her relationship was to everybody else in the rest of the department before she became interim chief. But theoretically, she's known Lassie for a very long time. So she has probably seen him through all of this, right? So she, I'm sure, doesn't want to see him get hurt again like any friend would.
01:13:36
Speaker
Yeah. And she probably knows Victoria or has met her who probably has an idea of like, Or has her own opinions um of how this might go based on just what she knows.
01:13:52
Speaker
Yeah. um Yeah. And Lassie is just like so,
01:14:00
Speaker
so sure. Yeah. He's like blinded. Yeah. but it's And it's kind of like he has to go that far in order to like move through it, you know? Yeah.
01:14:12
Speaker
Yeah.
01:14:15
Speaker
yeah he does he's gotta throw everything at the wall again to yeah and also to know himself that there's nothing more he can right right exactly like there's nothing tried it all yeah he can't change for her he's now ah better version of himself he's like happy with the kind of partner he thinks he could be for her and that's still not enough so it's like it's time for it to be done yeah
01:14:45
Speaker
Yeah. And the mute the song that plays ah over that. Wait, I put that somewhere. literally think I just have cry faces. The music, all caps, cry faces.
01:14:58
Speaker
And I forget.
01:15:02
Speaker
I think the lyrics are just like, it's going to be a good day. But it sounds so sad. And I feel like it's the perfect, like it is optimistic, but it's also just like, just really sad. And it really is perfect over his like resigned, like little smile as he says goodbye to her for the last time. Yeah.
01:15:24
Speaker
It's like, know. Yeah. After the song, my note is what a tonal shift. I think it goes from the song to like. Oh, I think it's strip strip cribbage.
01:15:37
Speaker
No, I think it's like but it's further along. It's like there's going to they I think they go find oh it dry bodies and stuff like it's yes, it's terrifying. And then the next note I have is reactions, which is Jules and Lassie finding their bodies.
01:15:55
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Jules and Sean going. ah Yeah. Yeah. um yeah They go together. Yeah. Just rolls off the tongue. It does. um But and that is very clever. Like they can't show us as horrible as James Roday Rodriguez probably wants to make it.
01:16:13
Speaker
Yes. But it's all over their faces. And then.
01:16:21
Speaker
Oh, and then Sean runs into. what's her face and oh my god that's terrifying and she's just he's he's and he's like i don't understand he was in the house and then she points and then gus is struggling with the murderer by the pool and it's just like oh my gosh yeah it's so intense yeah oh my god when clive opens his eyes when sean turns him yeah terrifying Oh my gosh.
01:16:52
Speaker
Oh, I know. And Sean's like, you're okay. You're okay. You're okay. ah
01:17:02
Speaker
Jules is the hottest she's ever been. Yeah, just her her standing, like, because they're above, Gus and and Jules are above because they're in the shallow end of the pool. And Sean and Clive are in the deep end of the pool.
01:17:16
Speaker
And the wind is whipping and there's yeah lightning and rain and Jules's hair is flying everywhere and she's just, like, steady. Like we were talking about um in the the bank episode.
01:17:27
Speaker
how Jules like turns the corner and she's like, yeah, there are rules whatever. And she's just like boom. Yeah. That was this. She was just like locked in. trying to find the shot i don't have it take the shot might hit i was like so i love when she's like i don't have and he's like get it
01:17:48
Speaker
yeah just so silly for ah very intense moment yeah and then i love clan clive is like in the hand really yeah yeah don't move
01:18:02
Speaker
he's like introduced as the funny guy and he does have this like quippy he's also like there's like a similarity to sean that he has like when he makes reference that's like really obscure and sean's like you just made that reference like yes yeah and he loves an obscure reference so yeah um yeah so that's like interesting yeah he's an interesting he's an interesting dude um I also just kind of wonder, like, did Clive have tabs on this place?
01:18:38
Speaker
Like, how did he find out that was going to... Yeah, he played a long game. Yeah, he did. He to apply. Yeah. hired. Yeah. did he For whatever whatever he planned does.
01:18:49
Speaker
I don't even remember. Water. He was water. he was water.
01:18:56
Speaker
oh my God. He was telling Jason from the beginning. He's like, I'm the pool. I'm the pool. My life is the pool. Yeah. Oh my gosh. That is interesting. And he killed Erwin in the water.
01:19:09
Speaker
Oh my. Maybe he has a weird. Oh my god. Annie in the shower. my god. Billy with the mop. Oh my god. Interesting. He's connected to water somehow.
01:19:21
Speaker
Well obviously the father dying in the pool but like. Yeah. It's like a thing. mean I guess he just attacks Jason in the living room but. Well, he started the whole camp.
01:19:33
Speaker
Kill him. yeah and I mean, we really don't know how he tries to kill him because we've run out. That's true. We do see him, Jason, with a bandage on his tummy. I assumed he was stabbed.
01:19:45
Speaker
Yeah, with the machete. Wow, he really was like, me, water, pay attention. Yeah, that's fun d detail.
01:19:57
Speaker
Fun, I guess. Clever. Interesting. Yeah, clever. Gosh, yeah. I mean, did we do it all if' I think so. It's such a big episode. It's almost like we can't talk about everything, but we talked about it a lot.
01:20:13
Speaker
Yeah, I think we pretty much got it.
01:20:19
Speaker
Was there anything about the movie? I was just going to talk about how I feel so bad for Irwin, but we don't have to talk about it. know. I do feel bad for Irwin. know. Like, he was just cleaning the place up.
01:20:32
Speaker
He did. is Did he say you're all doomed? You're all doomed. Yeah, right when they come in and Sean's like, let's around now. that is now straight out of the movie too. Yeah, on the bike and everything. Yeah.
01:20:46
Speaker
um I do wonder, was he playing the game?
01:20:53
Speaker
Oh, that's a good question. Because if he was, that would make much more sense as to why Clive killed him. oh like he was aware correct like like he was the janitor sure like everyone else was you know their thing like he was in on it the idea of this being game too i'm like are these all like actors like is that what their trades are i mean i could get erwin like and an actor in community theater oh my god i love that for him i hope so
01:21:27
Speaker
like Because Billy and Annie, I feel like very much so gave kind of that vibe. Sissy, we find out, is Jason's fiance. So maybe she just kind of came along with it. But i could I could see that, especially for Erwin. Like, he really had a whole getup and, like, the bike was squeaky and creepy. Either he is that and right is just, like, a crazy guy who is just saying stuff.
01:21:51
Speaker
Or, yeah, he was just, like, in character saying stuff. And was in on it from the beginning, which... Jason didn't let everybody in so it's hard to say but maybe maybe Irwin is such a talented actor that I mean and it was spooky as all living get up so yeah he was part the introductory like yes show so maybe he had to know yeah yeah I can see it poor Irwin I know poor Irwin
01:22:26
Speaker
And at least, like, in the movie, I feel like we got a little bit more of Crazy Ralph. Mm-hmm. You know, like, he, I mean, he really seemed quite crazy. He was in the pantry. Yeah. Walking out telling everyone. That's true. That was weird.
01:22:38
Speaker
oh my. I thought he was dead. For the first second that I saw him, i thought he was going to, like, fall forward. my gosh. Yeah. Like a thing in his chest. No, he was just chilling in the pantry. And he did have a whole thing of, like, him being a messenger from God.
01:22:53
Speaker
Yes. Red flag. Yeah. Absolutely. um But he didn't die, did he? i don't remember. I don't think so. think we just didn't see him after that. Yeah.
Chilling Moments and Clive's Game
01:23:07
Speaker
But yeah, Irwin dies sadly. Yeah. That's a chilling moment too when it's just like fun, fun, fun and then Sean sees the body in the lake and it's like, oh shit.
01:23:20
Speaker
So sad. Yeah. And then they pull him out and it's very like
01:23:26
Speaker
the the mood definitely shifts but it's kind of weird because it's like everyone was just having fun we're all still kind of like haha this is a joke right there's great like ups and downs yeah i wonder if clive kill and clive kills him early yeah when he's like the game is still a foot yes when they've all separated yeah yeah at six uh-huh aha So it is interesting, like, mean, I guess he's in no rush, like, in terms of them seeing the body.
01:24:01
Speaker
Also, in Friday the 13th, similar with Black Christmas, there's this... Everybody is getting killed, but nobody knows yes that the others are getting killed.
01:24:13
Speaker
Yes. It makes them even more susceptible. They're not defending themselves from anything because they don't know anything's wrong. Right. um But like in this, so nobody knows for a while that Erwin is dead, but he doesn't try to, Clive doesn't kill anybody else.
01:24:28
Speaker
And then when we do see Erwin, it's like, it's just like a long time later. and it's Yeah, it's not until after...
01:24:39
Speaker
they figured sean's figured it out and they're back in the cabin at night but then after that once the body's found clive is clearly like we have to get pace because then yeah it's well and they start separating yes that's so maybe it's like convenient that the body is found because the fun stops yeah that could be yeah and then he well yeah But, I mean, he needed... Well... I guess he did... It's when the fun begins that he says he's not playing, right? So that's when he's gonna go... Watch TV.
01:25:16
Speaker
But that's after they find the body. It is after? When do they... Wait. They have champagne. And then they find... ermine's body they put him on the porch they come back in oh and then they play strip strip okay yeah and that's when clive is like no thanks i've got weird nipples and i'm gonna go watch tv yeah yeah so then it begins
01:25:37
Speaker
um um um i wonder if that also like just adds to his like they still aren't taking it seriously there's a dead body right in front of them oh could be let's kill some more yeah yeah But then, I mean, again, he kills Annie. No one knows. He kills Billy.
01:25:53
Speaker
No one knows. It's not until he jumps down the stairs that we're like, holy shit, who are you? Jason's right here. Yeah. Does Annie play strip whatever? Does she go right home? she goes, takes a shower.
01:26:07
Speaker
Okay. So maybe that also cues him like, okay, good. Yeah. next victim is alone. The next one. Yeah.
01:26:15
Speaker
It's a big one. And then the next one's a big one too. And are we going to watch? I feel like we have to. Yeah. think we must. I'm really not looking forward to it. but It's a star-studded cast though.
Upcoming Content and Credits
01:26:31
Speaker
It is.
01:26:32
Speaker
It's a classic movie. 2007. Oh, it would have been made like right before. So I'm sure it was their minds. So we have watch it now. Yeah. I feel like there's going to be a lot to talk about.
01:26:44
Speaker
so much yes it'll be fun it'll be a culmination of a lot of things that we've discussed yeah i think we should have some popcorn okay as popcorn plays an important part at least for a moment and yeah we'll talk about some movie talk about some psych talk about some episode possibly next tuesday who knows You'll have to wait around and see.
01:27:13
Speaker
And then it'll be our Halloween episode. These have both kind of been our Halloween season episodes. But yeah. Yeah. So if you'd like to join us back here next week, please do. We love having you. We'll be talking about season three, episode 16, the finale of the famed TV show, Psych.
01:27:38
Speaker
FSI 6101 would like to thank and credit the design efforts of Olavia Genesis, musical talents of Skane Music and Mikael Hunt, the production abilities of Kyle Dalton and Skillard Jensen, and of course, the support of our friends and family.
01:27:52
Speaker
If you enjoyed the episode, make sure to rate and pre review and join us back here next time for more FSI 6101. I don't like
01:28:00
Speaker
don't like it. I don't like it. I don't. I'll let you know if a creepy man something.