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Coping with Colic: Tips and Tools for Parents POSTPARTUM SERIES (feat. Alice @cozybabysleep)
234 Plays2 years ago
In EPISODE 58 I am joined by Alice @cozybabysleep. She is a mum of two, Lily (3) and Isabel (11 months). She is a certified infant and child sleep consultant, taking additional courses for newborns. Alice teaches families with children aged 0-4 how to encourage better sleep without a one-size-fits-all approach. Alice speaks from experience, having struggled with sleep and colic/reflux.
Alice discusses tips for parents dealing with colic and reflux in babies. She talks about different techniques to soothe a fussy baby, such as holding them upright, feeding them directly upon waking up, trying different burping techniques, changing their diapers on the side, and using a mantra to help calm yourself down. She also dives into the different spectrums of parenting, including purple crying and the witching hour. She empathizes with parents going through the difficult experience of dealing with a fussy baby and urges them to try different tips and know that it will eventually end. Tune in to learn more about dealing with colic and reflux in babies.
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Transcript
Introduction to Podcast and Guest
00:00:00
Speaker
Of course it would feel that way. It's relentless. It's horrible. Nobody wants to... Nobody would be able to get through that and not be somewhat affected, you know?
00:00:12
Speaker
This is a Therapy for Dads podcast. I am your host. My name is Travis. I'm a therapist, a dad, a husband. Here at Therapy for Dads, we provide content around the integration of holistic mental health, well-researched evidence-based education, and parenthood. Welcome.
00:00:32
Speaker
Welcome, welcome everybody to this week's episode of the Therapy for Dads show. I'm very excited to continue the postpartum prep series. I already have had two prior to this. The first, if you haven't listened already, go back and check it out. It's two moms sharing their experience about what to plan for, how to plan for baby,
00:00:55
Speaker
postpartum phase, questions that they would ask this time versus the first time around. The previous episode was on how do we navigate sleep deprivation, what that is. And this week, this week, I'm very excited to have Alice on. And we have a really exciting topic, one that affects quite a bit of families, and she's gonna share a bit more about that. But without further ado, welcome, welcome, Alice. How you doing this evening? Thank you, doing great. Just after, I'm not used to being up this late, I'll be honest.
00:01:25
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Should we do the hashtag? Like I always think of Justin Timberlake on that, the SNL skit. Hashtag hashtag from everything. It's an old, I think that's really dating me. That's old, right? I know Justin Timberlake. I'm from that age. I'm from that period, that time period.
00:01:47
Speaker
Um, parent life, you know, by the time kiddos are down, a lot of us can relate to either you're so exhausted that you just pass out on the couch or you stay awake because you're like, Hey, everyone's down and I could have maybe some either alone time or time with my, my partner. Right. Um, so it's kind of like this battle. Do we sleep or, or do we actually connect? And I relate to that totally. It's the daily battle, the daily battle.
00:02:13
Speaker
It is a daily battle and I think it's ever changing, ever evolving depending on the day. Um, but anyway, that's not this episode. That's a different topic, but another topic for another day. But, but who, who is Alice? Can you just tell us a bit about yourself?
Alice Bloomfield's Journey and Expertise
00:02:28
Speaker
Well, I'm Alice Bloomfield. I'm a mum of two girls, Lily and Isabelle. Lily is three and Isabelle is 11 months now. And I am a certified infant child sleep consultant.
00:02:42
Speaker
And I got into that after Lily was born and did not sleep long story short. I, here I am today. And yeah, I'm certified in pediatric sleep and I have done additional trainings for newborns right actually before Isabelle was born. I just thought, you know, I want to share my story. I want to up my.
00:03:06
Speaker
knowledge a little bit more. So I took a couple more courses to get specifically certified in newborns. Um, I really loved it. Honestly, it's, they're like one of my most fascinating that I just find it fascinating. Newborns are really interesting and to say the least, but yeah, I teach, I teach families.
00:03:30
Speaker
from ages zero to four years, how to encourage better sleep, not perfect sleep, but better sleep, um, in a way that makes you feel comfortable. Um, it's not one size fits all. That's really my sleep philosophy. And, and yeah, I've, I love it. I love to share and, and be real about it. Cause I've struggled myself with, with sleep and with colic and reflux, which we'll talk about more, but yeah, that's what I do. That's me in a nutshell, really.
00:03:57
Speaker
Yeah, well it's you know getting into this postpartum series and finding this you know we didn't we didn't have a sleep consultant or a coach and you know part of me I guess I could you know hindsight is 2020. Right.
00:04:13
Speaker
And maybe that would have helped us, but we also had difficulty for sure. Right. It's hard. That's different for everyone. That's the thing. It really is a difference. Some people really have an easy time with it. Yes. And so you'll chat with them. And they'll be like, well, I just did this. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know? Oh, yeah. You know, and that's always so hard as a parent. I remember, especially as a first-time parent, when that was happening, I'd be like, what's wrong with me? What am I doing wrong?
00:04:41
Speaker
Oh yeah. We, I relate to that first time. And, um, and I think the, you know, the topic tonight that we both relate to personally, it's something that's needed to be talked about to help parents is colic as well as reflux, which those can go, but not always hand in hand. And so, you know, just jump it in. Let's just first make a definition.
Understanding Colic
00:05:00
Speaker
So what is colic essentially for those that may or may not know.
00:05:03
Speaker
So my husband told me to go straight in with like statistics or like the way it's defined because he said that's the easiest way. Yeah. But it's defined by crying for three or more hours a day for three or more days a week for three or more weeks.
00:05:21
Speaker
but really it's just inconsolable crying where everything seems to be fine. You've fed them, you've done all the things, you fed them, you changed them, you've given them a bath, you've cuddled them, you tried to get them to sleep and they're just crying and you don't know what to do and it's very stressful. It's very stressful for the parent.
00:05:41
Speaker
And for anyone involved, but there isn't any other like decent definition. That's really, that's what colic is. It's crying that is unexplained almost. There's been lots of, and we'll talk about this a little bit later, but there's lots of different theories of why it is the way that it is, but really it's just continuous crying for three or more hours a day, three days a week or more for three or more weeks. It usually begins around, it's kind of starts to
00:06:10
Speaker
It begins around three weeks. I often find people will always say, well, the baby's just so sleepy the first three weeks and that is really common. They're just kind of like, they eat and they sleep and they wake up a lot, but they eat and they sleep. And that's kind of all that they do. But after three weeks when they sort of start to wake up, that's when it can begin, peaks around six weeks or so.
00:06:30
Speaker
and then starts to taper off around 12-ish weeks. And that's when it gets better. So that is the first thing that I think is important to share. Yeah. Because I didn't know that when I, because I didn't know when it was going to end. I think that made it a lot worse. I would agree. We also did not know when. Is it going to be a year? Is it going to be two years?
00:06:50
Speaker
Is it six months? I don't know. I don't know what defines newborn at this point. You're just sleepless. You're just sleepless and you feel hopeless and you feel depressed and like overstimulated because there is nothing like more stressful than a screaming baby like in your face that you can't seem to do anything, especially as a parent when, you know, it's our job, right?
00:07:15
Speaker
to make things better. Yeah. And you'd be very defeating when you try to. I remember feeling very defeated a lot trying to help and nothing seems to be soothing and that it really, you know, days of that he starts to wear on you. Yeah. Right. Cause you're just like, am I not a good enough mum? Am I not a good enough dad? What are we doing wrong? Are we, were we made for this? You know, you ask yourself all of these deep dark questions, um, because it's a mix of things. It's not just that it's not just, you know, a baby crying in your face. It's,
00:07:43
Speaker
You haven't slept in a while. You just gave birth or you've been up supporting somebody that has just given birth. You are breastfeeding or, you know, there's just so many different factors that make it a highly sensitive and emotional time. Maybe on its own, it would be, it wouldn't be so bad, but.
00:08:02
Speaker
I think that's why it's always nice to have somebody else to come in and help like a grandma or something if that's possible because it's not as hard for them because they don't have all the other factors in that put it into play they can cope a lot easier but yeah that's that's colic it's not nice but it is yeah a lot of people deal with it
00:08:20
Speaker
Yeah. Any idea what the, as you were looking stuff up, what was the numbers or roughly rough percentage of maybe babies that have college? No, I actually don't know. I haven't looked that up. I should have looked that up, but it's more than people, it's more than people will say. So many people they'll say, you know, I'll see them post on Instagram or Facebook and they'll just say, everything is amazing. And then I'll get messages or they'll be my friend and I'll be calling them and they'll just say, this baby is just crying.
00:08:47
Speaker
for hours. And so we see other people thinking that everything's okay.
00:08:53
Speaker
Well, it's actually, they're probably dealing with it too, but they don't want to say it because they feel ashamed about it. So it's definitely more, more people experience it than they let off. Definitely. I was actually trying to look it up right now. Like they say internationally, colic effects 10 to 30%. Well, that's a huge gap. Geez, 10 to 30% of infants worldwide. Okay. Well, that's like 10 to 30%. It's the same with like, there's a lot of people won't report it cause they be, they feel ashamed. Like,
00:09:19
Speaker
Yeah, so it's probably even higher than that is my guess or people don't know what it is. They're just like, what's wrong with my baby? And it's they don't know. And so it's my guess is probably 40, maybe 50, depending on you get all that non-reported stuff that's just reported. So my first two boys had it. My daughter did not. So which is interesting.
00:09:38
Speaker
And it's interesting when you experience that as a parent, because at first you're just like, this is just the way that babies are. Right. And that was our experience of babies. Right. And then you have another one. You're like, wait, they're not crying for hours? This is nice. Yeah. It was like, oh, oh, no, I remember. I remember with our daughter, it was a.
00:09:56
Speaker
Very different experience with her. We were prepped for having a third baby with colic. That's what we knew was a baby with colic. And our second, it was less than our first. I feel like our first, his colic was just out of off the charts. Our second, it was there, but much more manageable, I feel like, in a way. I think part of it was we knew what to expect, we knew what to do. But then also, I feel like just intensity-wise, it was less.
00:10:25
Speaker
right and then daughter she it was like oh this is just chill like this is different and that's why i always say this you don't know until you know you just don't know until you know like if you if you didn't have it first you know i remember having you know people would come up to me and be like oh yeah my baby cries a lot too it's really hard and i would just be like oh okay you seem to be coping well with it
00:10:50
Speaker
And then, you know, a couple of years later, they'd have another baby and be like, why Alice? Like, why is this happening? This is kind of like, I thought they cried a lot before. Yeah, you don't know until you know. There's definitely different spectrums. Like, as you said, your second is a little bit less.
00:11:06
Speaker
It was us. My first, again, my first was, and that's the thing, there's a lot of contributing factors. I'm sure my anxiety in general as a first-time parent played a part in that, but it was just, yeah, off the charts, really, really hard. It's a very dark time. I think about it often. I try and get myself back into that place so I can serve, honestly. That's like, my God was like, okay, I have to never forget that because there are other people going through that and they need to know that they're not alone. But then my second, she definitely had a witching hour.
00:11:35
Speaker
which is another name for it. There's lots of names, colic, purple crying, witching
Impact of Colic on Parents
00:11:40
Speaker
hour.
00:11:41
Speaker
crying time. That's what my mum always called it, crying time. But witching hour is, I think, more common for the other half of the babies that don't technically have colic. They just have a fussy period of time, usually in the evening, like after 4pm to 11pm. And that was my second. She would just have her crying time kind of for a couple of hours in the evening. And it was still really hard.
00:12:05
Speaker
But it wasn't, you know, several hours. It wouldn't be technically defined as colic or anything. But yeah, there's definitely different spectrums. Yeah. And so with colic, what are some of the other impacts colic has on baby? What are some of the other ways that it has an impact on baby or on the family or parents? Well, so interestingly, there's no like medical issue typically.
00:12:31
Speaker
There is some thought that it's got something to do with the immature digestive system, which makes sense. I think that makes a lot of sense, but there's no medical problem. Typically, colic doesn't produce a medical issue or
00:12:50
Speaker
short term or long term. So that's why it's kind of such a mystery because they don't have any data to like nothing really truly explains it. There's just kind of theories around it. Yeah. Which is probably the most frustrating thing. A lot of people say they just put a name on it so they can like shut parents up because their parents think something's wrong. Yeah. But to be honest, I think that, you know, from my experience, the biggest the biggest issue that comes from it
00:13:18
Speaker
is the toll that it takes on parents, the toll that it takes on mom and dad emotionally and physically because obviously there's like a lot of tactics to try and help that take a toll physically on mom and dad and that would say I think is the biggest detriment.
00:13:33
Speaker
from colic is the effect that it has on parents. And that's, to be honest, that's quite comforting to know, I think for parents is that they're necessarily, there technically isn't anything wrong other than, you know, digestive issues, which is, which makes a lot of sense. They're brand new, you know, it's more common in premature babies, which makes, again, makes sense. But yeah, I think a lot of it is to do
00:13:56
Speaker
I think this is like my opinion. It's just overwhelmed. I think it's overwhelmed overstimulation, the immature bodies, they're getting used to milk. It could also be intolerances. There's a lot of different factors that put it into play. And I think for the same for parents, that's how it goes for baby. And that's why some get it worse than others because there are other things contributing. All babies cry because life is overwhelming and they don't know what else to do.
00:14:24
Speaker
Right. Right. But some babies cry more because they have, you know, a dairy intolerance or, and some other kind of intolerance that is actually causing discomfort. Some babies will have sensory discomfort. That's another, another thing that I have. Another tip is one of the tips I'll share later is, is just stripping them down. Cause sometimes it can be sensory discomfort. Cause if you think about it, they're naked. They're like naked in the womb all the time.
00:14:50
Speaker
Yeah. Well, I guess before we go there, are there any other common causes that could, you know, I know that we don't know a lot, a lot. We don't know. It's kind of, and that's the research I found when I was looking at one of our babies head colic is like, what, you know, on Google, trying to figure it out and a lot of running different theories and ideas. But I guess what are some of the common, some of the common ones, some of the common theories or causes of it that we're seeing?
00:15:12
Speaker
A premature, like premature digestive system, imbalance of healthy bacteria is another one. Like in the digestive tract, that's why prebiotics and probiotics are often suggested. Food allergies or intolerances, overfeeding and underfeeding, lat tissues can often cause that.
00:15:35
Speaker
infrequent burping, so gas literally, which is very painful. If you've ever had it, it's very painful. I've also read that it is thought to be, it could be an early form of childhood migraine, but I don't actually know the credibility of that. It was just listed in the study. And then family stress and anxiety.
00:15:56
Speaker
And that's where I think often first-time parents will get hit or worse because I think babies, not children, babies will play off our anxieties. So if you're anxious and tense, they're going to feel that like you're connected, you know, as parents, as mama's dad, you're connected and they're going to feel that stress and anxiety. And I can often escalate and make what may have been just a bacteria
00:16:20
Speaker
imbalance and is now you know feeding off being stressed out and it's making it all worse and it's late and it's
00:16:27
Speaker
And another one is overtired. They could be overtired. A lot of families actually that think they're experiencing colic will kind of discover just simple sleep hygiene practices like wake times or sleepy cues, because that is something that I did not know. I would keep my newborn like five weeks. I would keep her awake for like five hours because she'd just be awake.
00:16:53
Speaker
And then she would cry for hours and hours and hours. She was really overtired. And so I think overtiredness can really contribute to inconsolable crying. Definitely.
00:17:06
Speaker
rigid, you know, that rigid, uh, fit, you know, clenching of the fists and arching of the back, things like that. Um, and then once that's resolved, sometimes it can really, it can really drastically improve. For in my experience, learning about sleep helped a lot. It did not dissipate. So I don't, I don't want to say there are a lot of people out there will be like, oh, it's colic. Isn't real. It's just they're overtired. And I don't believe that.
00:17:32
Speaker
Yeah, I don't either because I don't just from my own experience. They obviously just don't know. You don't know until you know. I'll be interested to hear kind of some of the remedies or ways we can help treat it. You know something we found with our first who had more I think severe colic is it definitely impacted his ability to sleep.
Coping with Colic: Teamwork and Tips
00:17:53
Speaker
I would say he did not sleep.
00:17:56
Speaker
like whatever the minimum hours that a human being could possibly sleep for, that was him. He was so alert, so awake, but he wouldn't sleep. His naps were like, you know, after the first three weeks, like he was, what you said, it was typical. But then after that, it was like, you know, 20, 30 minute naps, would just be awake, be screaming, you know, and I remember the only way to get him to really sleep, and we've talked about this offline was,
00:18:23
Speaker
You know, I'm looking at my kitchen island right now and the you know We got to a point where like he just needs to sleep because he's so retired We knew that that was one thing probably make exacerbating some of the symptoms And so we would just take shifts walking around our kitchen island
00:18:38
Speaker
you know, two-hour shifts, you know, I'd have some random, you know, friends on or some show in the background as I'm walking around the island from, you know, two to four in the morning or, you know, 12 to two in the morning, and then my wife would take over, then I'd take a sleep. I mean, because that's how severe it was. Right, you've got to survive, right? You have to survive. Like, my husband and I did the same, we took shifts. Yeah. Because, you know, and it gets better if anyone is taking shifts right now. It does get better. It gets so much better and sooner than you think, but in the moment it,
00:19:07
Speaker
But I will say in the moment at the dark at the hardest point it was very just debilitating Oh, yeah, and just just really just tearing you down. I remember I Really have a vivid memory of like it was so bad, you know coming in and I'm hearing my wife crying We're both exhausted. She's on the floor and he's in the crib and it's just like cuz she's so tight and I'm like, okay I'll take and just I
00:19:31
Speaker
you're in this fog because you're so sleep deprived because you know that's how that was like most nights and during the day he would wouldn't sleep either so it's like no one was sleeping right and so it was just it was rough and you know all of our other friends at the time that we knew but their babies you know when they slept the typical you know
00:19:51
Speaker
through the night and then, you know, three hour naps and then they're like, yeah, energy. I'm like, what? You know, we were, we were finding ourselves like, what is that? Like, why? And that makes it a lot worse because it's, you want to know that you're not alone in it. Yeah. And I think, yeah, that was honestly one of the biggest reasons why I started my page while I got certified. It's, I just wanted people to know that there was someone out there that really, I get. Yeah. I wish I would have found you then.
00:20:17
Speaker
Right, I know. That was like six years ago. I didn't know anything about it back then. I knew I had to research, but that was about it. But no, my mum always says, oh, I wish you could have helped me. I'm like blessed. And I have so much empathy now when people say I'm like, I get it. I was there. I remember how hard it was. And so I'm like,
00:20:39
Speaker
And I really, you know, at the end of the day, I want all the, I want all families to sleep. Like if I could, you know, if I could give a free gift, I would give it to everybody, but I know it's not the reality. And I remember just that was, that was so, I've never, it's an experience I'll never forget. And, but like you said, the good news is it did get better. And I remember when it went away and it was like,
00:21:02
Speaker
It's just, whoa, you know. My life's back. Yeah, we're getting a rhythm line. You see the light, like it really is light and darkness, like you're in the darkness and you see the light for the first time and you're like, oh my gosh. Yeah, it was rough.
00:21:18
Speaker
I'm going back there like I'm having flashbacks. I know really though because we do that a lot. We often will just sit there and just be like, I'll be really here with our kids to sleep. I know. Sleep's great. Right. It's like so nice. It's so nice. It's so nice. But so, so we know the cause is we know what colic is. We know what there's like, it's kind of like this,
00:21:39
Speaker
you know, people, they made a term, different terms, but we know it's real, I know it's real, and I know that there's different things, we know, you know, some possible causes, but what are some remedies, what are some things that have been found anecdotally, and I'll share some things that we did, but what are some of the things that you see that we can help our babies with trying, if we haven't tried already?
00:22:01
Speaker
This is my favorite part because it's the most helpful. The thing that I always suggest first is baby wearing. Especially during the day because number one, it helps get those naps in. Number two, it just helps with the closeness. A lot of the time, even for the hardest sleepers, a wrap at the right time
00:22:28
Speaker
can be like the, the, the off switch. It can just like, they will immediately fall asleep. Um, and although obviously that can be really hard on mom or dad having that all the time, but it can really take the edge off because sleep is happening throughout the day. You can then work on better sleep overnight. Um, but it's also just less time not crying. They're sleeping. Um, so they may still struggle with, and that was the case with me and Lily is that she still had her crying time.
00:22:58
Speaker
But getting her to sleep in the wrap is the first step really is and that's and it's easy you can get your your hands your hands free dad can try and do it mum can do it and You can switch off a little bit. It does get hot though. There are it is really hot It doesn't have to be the only thing so because I know that some people like but I hate baby wearing or it's really hard It hurts my back things like that and that is one of my things
00:23:25
Speaker
things that I'm just like, don't be afraid of baby wearing. It's not going to be like this bad habit. Right. It's just need it. Like it's the fourth trimester. That's a whole topic for another day, but the fourth trimester they still want to be in the womb and that it brings that kind of comfort to them. Yeah. And so it can be sweaty and uncomfortable. Yeah. And it's still pretty exhausting for the parents, but it does provide some relief. Another two movement rocking, as you said, walking around that can, that can help.
00:23:54
Speaker
don't worry they're gonna be more they get better as it as it goes on yeah no no it's funny because i did we did both those we did one into like the what baby the sauli wrap or sulei i don't know how you're saying it's so good sauli wrap it's so good it just hands free and i was fine with it because i'm like hey at least like he'll pass out right and it does help like it prevents that over tiredness which makes the colic escalate
00:24:16
Speaker
Yeah. But then moving way to constantly move. That was one thing that was hard because man, I'll talk about you don't need a CrossFit gym membership. Like I was always bouncing or moving because I couldn't stop moving. That was the thing because I stopped.
00:24:30
Speaker
But don't worry, you could, if this is where it's at, if it helps, you can work on getting away from the moving. Totally. Later. Yes, exactly. But it's kind of a temporary help. Um, because they like movement because if you think about it, when baby's in the womb, my baby's mum is pregnant and moving around constantly. Like, yeah.
00:24:47
Speaker
That's why they're kind of nocturnals because they're rocked to sleep all throughout the day. And then you'll find that mama is woken up by a wiggling baby all night. And I don't know if I'm jumping ahead. You might have this on your list, but one thing we found since baby liked movement, one way we knew guarantee T would sleep is we would do car rides.
00:25:05
Speaker
car rides or stroller rides, anything like that. As soon as you start moving though, eyes would bing open. That's always the hardest part. And the thing about the car, this actually kind of transitions nicely to a sound machine or any sound that like hums. So this is why you'll hear stories of, back in the olden days,
00:25:27
Speaker
They'll, well, not the older days, but our parents would put their babies like in the car seat on the dryer or the washing machine because it would be movement and like that low hum. That's why often babies will do quite well on airplanes, in cars, they used to noise. And so that can be really calming. It can really trigger a calming reflex.
00:25:50
Speaker
cluster feeding if you're fit. And I think this is not exclusive to breastfeeding. I think just offering a feed if maybe it's bottle fed as well. Like I said, I just don't, I don't think it's mutually exclusive. I think if baby is hungry, they're hungry. Um, but cluster feeding can help. Often cluster feeding happens in the evenings. Um, some people say it's them tanking up right before bed, but that can be helpful to soothe.
00:26:15
Speaker
baby, getting outside on a walk, changing the scenery, getting some fresh air if possible. I know that isn't always possible depending on seasons and what state you're in, but if possible getting outside. I remember when Isabel was little, it was summer here in Phoenix.
00:26:30
Speaker
So it was tricky. We would get out in the mornings when I could, but if she was fussy, I would walk around with her at night and it was really hot, but I would just have a spray bottle that I would bring with us on a walk and I would just spray her and we had like a fan and stuff like that. That would help. But getting outside, I think always really helps because it helps you as a parent.
00:26:52
Speaker
I think just get some fresh air, change the scenery, and the same for them. I mentioned this earlier, but changing clothes to reduce any sensory discomfort can be really helpful. A good quality probiotic, if breastfeeding, diet changes can help. Dairy sometimes
00:27:09
Speaker
Quitting dairy can be helpful, which is really depressing for some people. It was really depressing for me when I quit dairy. And then a warm bath. That's with or without a parent. If parent wants to get in, I actually, I tried to have a warm bath with my first and she did not like it. She did not want me. She just screamed even more and it made me stressed out. But it really helped my second born. I would have a bath with her during her crying time and she loved it. And then like a pacifier.
00:27:38
Speaker
you know sucking can really help same as like cluster feeding they get that sucking reflex if they're not actually hungry um but giving them a pacifier can be helpful too but those are my oh an infant massage getting the foot the foot the feet ones right that's what we did we found the feet yeah i like there's um another one called the guppy guppy toes which is like whenever you put their i'm not gonna do it but but basically their neck kind of extends
00:28:08
Speaker
Uh-huh. And you give them a shoulder. I have a video on my Instagram. I can give you the link to that one. Yeah, send the link. I'll drop it in the description. It's like a really nice, like, neck extension and shoulder. Because if you also, another reason that they may be uncomfortable is that they've been squished, like, for a long time. And they've also been through trauma, going through the birth canal or a C-section. Like, that's traumatic for a baby. Oh, yeah. So there's issues that come with that.
00:28:38
Speaker
So a lot of the time, if you think about colic in a logical way, it makes more sense than why they just crying. They have everything they need. If you're just like, well, they were in this dark place and now they're in bright lights and noise and people and cold and naked and got, they've got clothes on them now and they're, you know, they have to, they have to feed. They don't, they used to just be.
00:29:01
Speaker
Okay, always. They had an umbilical cord there in this 24-hour Jacuzzi and everything was great. If you think about it more logically, it kind of helps you be like, okay, that does make sense and they will get used to it. But yeah, those are my best tips for colic specifically. Well, the other thing I did too, just to add to those tips is something else we found that did reduce it a bit when it was really severe. We did the gas drops or gripe water.
00:29:27
Speaker
Oh, yes. Oh, yeah. I was going to mention that. It's two different. They're very, very similar to two different brands. So one's called gas drops. The other one's called. Yeah, yeah. It's called gripe water, which I think has some charcoal in it. They have like different herbs, different. I'm sure they have different herbs. Sometimes they'll have.
00:29:47
Speaker
There's some differences there. I think rip water worked better for our first and I think gas drops worked better for a second. But we did find that helped alleviate his, cause I think he did have gas too. Cause he would really, I think on top of the clock, I think it created some gas, the tension, I think, cause he was so tense. And I think it.
00:30:07
Speaker
cause gas was then made, exacerbated the pain. And so it, you know, it's almost like they kind of domino effect, but that's something else we found to be helpful for us. Again, it wasn't, didn't solve it, but we started using it. We're like, Oh, and we did notice a difference. Again, you gotta try it with your baby. You know, try it out. I mean, the worst thing is see what works really. Yeah.
00:30:28
Speaker
Cause we had gripe water worked well temporarily for Lily, but to be honest, I never, I never actually tried it with as well. Cause she wasn't, she wasn't nearly as, as fussy. Um, and that brings me actually, I've forgotten to add this as a possible cause, but, um, tongue and lip ties can contribute to feeding issues, which then can contribute to colleague or, um, you know, the kind of like can lead into it.
00:30:56
Speaker
And I think I've, I did experience that with Lily, sorry, Isabelle. My second is she was extremely fussy and grunty for a long time. We ended up getting her tongue tie and lip tie released.
00:31:09
Speaker
And it drastically improved her latch and her feeding, therefore she didn't get as gassy, which decreased her crying a lot. I definitely found that that was a helpful solution. And it's definitely worth looking into because I didn't even ask about that with Lily. I mean, it was COVID time, so no one could have looked at it anyway. But that was another thing that I think is quite, people are only just really started to talk about tongue ties and lip ties now, but they can contribute to feeding issues
00:31:39
Speaker
and tummy issues as well yeah we had um ours all had that so they had um they had those release as well which helped with latch um especially early on so again something that you don't know until someone says something you know and you're like oh you're like you never want to hear you never want to hear that you never want to hear i need to laser my
00:31:58
Speaker
babies, like you never want to hate that. No, but it didn't make a difference. It helped both of our kids, our boys had it and it really made a big difference for their latch and which helped for sure. So that's something we did for both of boys.
00:32:13
Speaker
So those are great tips and those are things I feel like I did all those things and I think for us You know, and I think is like you said, like we said earlier that every family situation every baby is unique And you have to treat them uniquely and individually to what's working and not working for them. I think for us we tried Everything that we did on this list and it helped But it didn't it didn't go away right until like
00:32:41
Speaker
For my like four months we started seeing a difference But it was you know, it didn't those things helped alleviate it because when we would do them we notice it helping But he would still you know struggle and I think I think the hardest thing to emotionally for me And I as I said earlier was just is just feeling helpless at times and yeah
00:33:01
Speaker
That's the, I think it was the emotional toll it took as a parent, as a new parent and feeling helpless and like, you're trying to figure something out, trying to help and it's just like, you just keep hitting walls. And I think that's when it can really affect us because that emotional drain can be, take a toll over days and weeks and a month in and you're like, is there, you don't know there's an end and you're like, you know, you're just kind of, and then you're sleep deprived and I'm thinking the last episode with,
00:33:29
Speaker
you know with Yasbin we talk about sleep deprivation like you're sleep deprived so you can't think and so then you're just like you're just in this cave of despair right that's really a despair that is the word at least in my experience i felt a lot of deep dark despair
00:33:47
Speaker
And it's quite hard to say that on a platform. It's hard to say. I had a baby and I became very depressed because of how relentless it was. It was very relentless.
00:34:01
Speaker
Well, it does get better. It really does. And I had another bet. You had two more babies. So it's got to be good. It's got to be that good, at least. It's got to get better. Yeah, it's very, I like it for that. Yes, we did have two more babies. But the despair is real. And I think, you know, all the parents going through right now, like I
00:34:23
Speaker
I get it. Alice gets it. It's hard, it's rough, and if you're the only one going through it, and no one else is, not that, it's no one else's fault, but it can feel very isolated, because I never feel that isolated. Like what? No one could relate, because all of our friends' babies, it's like they're the typical sleep. No colic, you know, they're sleeping, and you're just like, you know.
00:34:45
Speaker
It's easy to get into your head, easy to start blaming yourself because that's what starts to make sense because, you know, you're not, you're tired so you start to find, you're trying to find a solution. It's not your fault. That's first and foremost. It's not your fault. It's not your baby's fault. But like you said, it's trying to, how can we help? And if you know these tools and these tips and know that it just, it happens,
00:35:09
Speaker
And you could try different things to eliminate, to help alleviate, know you can navigate through this, and know there is an end. There is an end. That's the good news. So much so that you might want to have more kids, and who knows, you're saying, maybe not me, and I have colic. Again, my third, my daughter did not have it. And it was kind of like, whoa, this is...
00:35:27
Speaker
It was your reward. This is why people have 10,000 babies. Like, okay, I could see why you have a dog. I have more kids, right? Because it's a very, I will say, not to feel guilty for saying this, but it's a different infant experience.
00:35:40
Speaker
It is. And that's honestly, that's a hard pill to swallow. I think as a parent as well, because you feel like a little bit robbed of the joy that you were expecting. I think at least I was, I was like, I wanted to be a mother my whole life. That was what I dreamed of. Like that was my calling in life. And then I was like, wow, there are moments right now that I hate, I hate this more than I like it.
00:36:06
Speaker
And then it switches, you know, the script is flipped and everything works out, but it's like hard to feel that, to feel that way. And to admit it, honestly, it's hard for me to say it knowing that like other people will hear that, but I did feel that in those moments. But it's, but of course I would feel that way. If you listen to everything we've just listened to or everything we just talked about, sorry, it, of course we would feel that way. It's relentless. It's horrible. Nobody wants to, nobody would, nobody,
00:36:36
Speaker
would be able to get through that and not be somewhat affected, you know? And now for a short break. So if you're looking for ways to support the show and my YouTube channel, head on over to buy me a copy.com forward slash therapy for dads. There you can make a one time donation or join the monthly subscription service to support all that I'm doing at the intersection of fatherhood and mental health.
00:37:00
Speaker
And all the proceeds go right back into all the work that I'm doing into production and to continue to grow the show to bring on new guests. So again, head on over to buy me a coffee.com forward slash therapy for dads. Thanks. And let's get back to the show. So let's talk about reflux. Um, what is that? What are some causes and how do we help treat it to help parents with their little kiddos?
Understanding and Managing Reflux
00:37:22
Speaker
So, so reflux actually, my, my first had reflux also. So it was, it was a lot, it was a lot, but reflux, to put simply is heartburn, which is painful. If anyone has had heartburn, if you've been pregnant, I know you know what heartburn feels like. Um, and again, there's different spectrums. Some babies will just be like happy spitters and they'll, you know, they spit up and they're just like,
00:37:50
Speaker
I'm fine, they're like happy. And then other babies will spit up and seem like they're in pain. And then there's silent reflux, which is similar. It's still reflux, but there's just no presence of spitting up. There's no actual spit up. So it just hurts. I didn't know that. Silent reflux. Yeah, silent reflux. That's what Lilly had. That's what my eldest had maybe because he was on a spitter upper at all.
00:38:19
Speaker
it manifests with often you'll see baby will have a really hard time feeding. Like so often most babies are okay to like be fed to sleep, like nurse to sleep babies that have reflux. It's not like relaxing because it hurts. They can have a hard time feeling. You'll notice that they arch their back when they're feeding, they'll go rigid. Um, and it can make it very traumatic, especially, um, I mean, honestly with, with bottle fed or breastfeeding,
00:38:49
Speaker
It can fit. It can be very traumatic for the person feeding because this is supposed to be the one thing that's supposed to pacify your baby. And at least that's how I felt as a, as a first time breastfeeding mother. I was just like, she hates me. And, um, Oh, that honestly, that was probably the most like emotionally like mind, like a mind flip. Like it was just, I was just like, what is, why isn't, why isn't this working? I'm supposed to help him.
00:39:19
Speaker
Yeah. Um, so that's usually how a reflux is manifested and it's, there's more, there's more symptoms and it's less, uh, less mysterious. Less mysterious. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Because it's, it's quite simply, it's just that they're again, premature, digestive systems. And it's, it's common because babies are on a mainly liquid diet, just breast milk or formula. That's often why introducing solids are six months.
00:39:48
Speaker
it can dissipate by then because having solids just naturally kind of relaxes that. So what are some of the signs of reflux, whether silent or the other two that you mentioned?
00:40:01
Speaker
Um, so obviously spitting up or, um, but see that, see, that's where silent reflexes is tricky. But, um, the thing that made me learn a little bit more about silent reflux was she was hiccuping a lot and hiccuping is a sign of it. Um, especially when feeding, uh, being unsettled during feeding or watching their back, um, swallowing and gulping, like a lot of air.
00:40:25
Speaker
doing feeding, crying and not settling. And then some babies, especially if they are spitting up, can struggle to gain weight. So some people will think that they may have a low supply. In actuality, their baby has reflux and then just not able to keep down what their mother is supplying. And just the general fussiness, stiffness is really going to be the telltale signs. That's something. And that's definitely when you should go in and visit a doctor.
00:40:54
Speaker
And see if there's, they have it because there's medicines to help as well. My daughter went on a metrozole in the end because she, we'd kind of exhausted every other thing. So after a few weeks, she went on a medicine to help, but just short for a few weeks. And it did help. So it's an option. It's not for everyone. Some people don't like to go for medicines and that stuff. I understand that.
00:41:18
Speaker
Well, it sounds like my eldest, like I said earlier, it sounds like he probably had silent reflux that we didn't even know on top of his colic. So, yay for us. Hearing that, I'm like, oh, that sounds like him because he didn't spit up. But everything else you said, I'm like, oh, that was him. So, what are some remedies, ways we could help treat it? Obviously, you mentioned medicine as an option, but what are some other natural ways we can do to help with the reflux? So, I have a few of these. I made a list because... Great.
00:41:44
Speaker
This I really went through, I went through it. I mean, I did with colic as well, but, um, one of the best things is holding upright after a feed. So that could be like looking outwards. It could be in a bath seat.
00:41:57
Speaker
It could be on baby wearing. It doesn't have to be up and about looking around. It doesn't have to be on the shoulder. You can be creative with different ways of holding it upright for 10, 20 minutes after a feed. That can just help have that milk settle before you lie them down. If you're not holding them upright, they're going to be lying flat somehow. Holding upright for naps, so naps in the carrier. Again, this is another way baby wearing can be really helpful.
00:42:22
Speaker
is that it just keeps them upright. So that's probably why a baby was so much with my first. It's because she had reflux and I just found that it not only got her the daytime sleep, which kind of alleviated her pain so that she could be okay overnight, a little better overnight.
00:42:37
Speaker
But yeah, it just keeps her upright. So that is a really helpful tip feeding directly upon waking instead of right before they go to sleep, because when they sleep, they're typically lying flat. So, um, so obviously baby wearing the day can be, can be helpful, but parents really want to have baby sleeping in their crib. If they, if possible, a lot of parents.
00:42:58
Speaker
And so if you feed on waking rather than right before sleep, that again can give some time for the tummy to settle. Right before bed, so people often ask about this because you want to have, maybe you want to have a nice big feed right before bed, right? So they can get their longest stretch of sleep. People, you know, they all say, I want to fill them up and get them to sleep. But you can still do this, but I just suggest feeding
00:43:18
Speaker
before bed, like right before bedtime routine or just switching, switching up. So feed right before you give them a bath or right before you read them a book or you'd give them again. So it has time for them to sit up right for a while. Burping your baby often trying different techniques.
00:43:34
Speaker
There's loads of different tips. I have a few of them on my Instagram of different ways of burping, creative ways, and you can find a ton of them online. But just getting creative, not just kind of like doing the patting of the back, but burping effectively can be helpful. Encouraging your baby's head to be above their stomach as they're feeding. So feeding on an angle. So often, especially bottle feeding, often people will feed like this.
00:44:04
Speaker
Um, where it's actually best to kind of do like a side feed where you feed them on the side as if they were breastfeeding, like on the side. And then breastfeeding mothers, it's kind of helpful to kind of get into a position where you're feeding them and you just pull them up on whichever side you're feeding them on. So it just, it just provides it an angle. So it just, again, gives another opportunity for it to settle. Yeah. Another, this isn't just a little tip that kind of be helpful, but when you're feeding, sorry, when you're changing a diaper or a nappy,
00:44:33
Speaker
You can kind of move them to the side to change it rather than pulling their legs up and therefore squishing their tummies, which can then kind of cause a little bit discomfort. Just kind of put it on the side instead. And that can be, that can be helpful, but it's hard regardless of all the tips. And that's what I'd want to share because regardless of all tips with Collic or reflex, you could do everything and it can alleviate it a little bit, but it's okay. You're not necessarily doing anything wrong.
00:45:00
Speaker
if it doesn't, you know, work, quote. Yeah, yeah. And that's where the whole business comes in. Yeah, it is hard. And I guess as we kind of come to, you know, close before we wrap up, like, you know, encouraging parents, like what's one or two things that you do as a way to help them support each other during this phase if they have a baby with colic or reflux or both? Like, what are some things you
00:45:26
Speaker
remind them one or two main important things to help them help each other.
00:45:31
Speaker
Well, first things that we talked about this earlier, taking shifts helps. And it's especially at the beginning when they're really, all you really want to do is kind of make it better. Um, it's not a long-term solution. So I don't want you to worry about that because a lot of people are like, I can't do this for the rest of my life. It won't be the rest of your life, but take shifts, go outside and take a breath when possible. When you're not on shift, um, or just, you know, in a different room, even if you just sitting in the garage or out just outside your front door on a balcony.
00:45:58
Speaker
if you're and this is honestly this is probably what a lot of people need to hear if you're both very stressed at the same moment it's okay to put baby down in their crib and just give yourself a second like you're not you're not leaving them to cry out or anything like that you're just putting them down in their crib so you can contain yourself you can breathe you can relax you can support each other for a second give each other a hug
00:46:23
Speaker
Um, and not feel guilty about that because what they need in that moment is for you to be collected and for you to be okay. They want you to be okay so that they can be okay. And so I think giving yourself permission to do that when that at times get like that is really important. Um, if needed, sometimes it's not needed, but you know, sometimes it is, uh, be open.
00:46:47
Speaker
Talk about when you're stressed to your partner or your husband, your wife and have a mantra. I love mantras. We, with especially the second time around, obviously we just didn't really know what the heck we were doing. Um, first time around, but this time around we had a few mantras. We always said, we are a team. We are a team. So when, cause when you're in that moment, when a baby is crying or upset, you can like turn on each other and be like, stop it.
00:47:16
Speaker
This is your fault. What are you doing? And in those moments, one of us usually would
00:47:23
Speaker
You step back and just be like, we're a team. We're on the same team. We're here to help each other. Um, we can get through this. This is temporary. Um, and I always say tomorrow is tomorrow's a new day, tomorrow's a new day. And just repeating that together and reminding yourself of that every day. Those are the things that I found invaluable the second time around and has definitely contributed to it being a lot easier, I think. Yeah.
00:47:51
Speaker
I think people forget to have their own mantras and all couples mantras, family mantras. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's so, that's so key. So needed. And it sounds a lot like what we did is that we're on a team, you know, we're, we're fighting against these things, not each other, you know, this is, we need to be united front. We support each other. Um, and we will get through this reminding ourselves of like,
00:48:16
Speaker
Okay, yeah, like we, this is sleep deprivation, you know, that's the enemy, you know, we made other things the enemy. Right, yes. Not each other, you know, and it really does help to reframe that and finding those little moments of pause and, you know, or tag teaming, you know, tapping each other out and, you know, or like you said, having moments just to hug and just take 10, 20, 30, 40 seconds, a minute, 60 seconds just to regroup, I think is so key.
00:48:41
Speaker
And so before we close, where can we find you if mom's dad's looking for support or just whether to look at your page or to actually reach out for, you know, more coaching? I guess where are you? Can you please share? My main platform is Instagram at Cosy Baby Sleep. I am under the same handle on TikTok as well. I'm not as
00:49:04
Speaker
I'm not as good on TikTok. I'm not as hip and with the kids, but I am on there. Um, and, um, and then I have my, my website, www.cosybabysleep.com. And that's where I have my blogs and links to, I have three freebies.
00:49:19
Speaker
two of which would be helpful to families in this stage, a night waking email course that's free, and then also a sleep progression mini course, which is also free. I'll link all those things, the specific links in the... And then I have more in-depth classes, but honestly, a great start. And for a lot of people, all that they need is by free content, and that's a great place to go.
00:49:47
Speaker
I'll link all those things. So, you know, Alice, I think it is this episode really resonated with me because this was my experience and yours. That's why I wanted to do it because it's like, I know other moms and dads are going through this that probably felt how we felt the first time and don't know, um, and get stuck. It's like, Hey, if we can help spread this, give good, um, tips, normalize it. You're not alone. It is hard.
00:50:13
Speaker
but it does get better and reminding the couples to work together as a team. Like these are things that would have been helpful to hear back then with our first. And you're not doing anything wrong. You're not doing anything wrong. There are tips to help, absolutely, but you're not doing anything wrong.
00:50:32
Speaker
Because I think that's our biggest fear as parents, is what am I doing? Yeah, it's because we care. You want your babies to thrive and be okay. And what we tend to do is we look at ourselves as the problem. What am I doing? Well, you know, we're missing, must be missing something. And so no, you're doing it right. Listen to your baby. Listen to your gut.
00:50:49
Speaker
and know that it is the reality is it is hard. You will get through it. But Alice, thank you so much for being on. I'm just excited to release this. Everyone go check Alice out. Really good, a lot of good, very helpful tips to help with your baby. And we'll have to have it on again soon. So thank you. Yeah, definitely. Thank you.
00:51:12
Speaker
Thanks for joining and listening today. Please leave a comment and review the show. Dads are tough, but not tough enough to do this fatherhood thing alone.