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150- Why don't vegans eat honey?
96 Plays1 month ago
Considering how straightforward the answer could be, this question comes up quite a lot. Shouldn't we be encouraging beekeeping, if bees are threatened? It doesn't hurt a bee to eat some of its honey, surely? In this episode Kate, Paul & Ant discuss their responses to this question, share reasons why you really don't want to be supporting any kind of beekeeping & discuss how to respond to those 'vegans' who make an exception for honey.
As ever, we love hearing your views on the topics under discussion (or anything else!) so do drop us your thoughts via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com
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Enough of the Falafel is a community of people who love keeping on top of the latest news in the world of veganism & animal rights. With the Vegan Talk podcast, we aim to develop listeners' (& our own) thoughts around key issues affecting veganism & the animal rights movement; giving our opinions, whilst staying balanced; remaining true to our vegan ethics, whilst constantly seeking to grow & develop.
Each week we home in on one topic in particular and pick it apart in more detail. If you have a suggestion for a future show, do get in touch via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com.
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Thanks everyone for listening; give us a rating and drop us a message to say "hi"; it'll make our day!
Paul, Kate & Anthony
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Transcript
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everybody.
Introduction and Inspiration Behind 'Enough of the Falafel'
00:00:01
Speaker
90% of vegans eat honey anyway, don't they? That waiter in that restaurant seven years ago never would have realised that that quote was going to be the start of a podcast one day. Anyway, I'm falafeling on already.
00:00:13
Speaker
I'm Anthony. Welcome to Enough of the Falafel. This is Vegan
The Vegan Honey Debate
00:00:17
Speaker
Talk. I'm also joined today by Kate and Paul. So I think vegans go looking for trouble even when they're not looking for trouble.
00:00:26
Speaker
That's not what butt is used for. Brr! Protein! Take your flat-brown meat elsewhere. We're not doing that in the state of Florida. What your protein and what about your iron levels? Should I call the media and say, hi, sorry?
00:00:38
Speaker
They're arguing like, oh, poor woe is me, oh no. Hang on a minute, you always for
00:00:49
Speaker
social injustice has connection with another. That's just what people think vegans eat anyway. As long as you don't get the wee brunions with the horns you'll be all alright. Does veganism give him superpowers?
00:01:04
Speaker
I cannot fly around the city. I don't have laser vision. Hello all, I'm Paul and welcome to everyone for this episode of Vegan Talk. Thank you for joining whether you're a new listener or someone who's joined us for every episode. Hi everyone, it's Kate here.
00:01:21
Speaker
We're here ah to talk about veganism and that well-known sweetener, honey.
Challenges of Avoiding Honey
00:01:27
Speaker
Indeed, i have got very vivid memories of my first few months of being vegan and being quizzed and being laughed at for not having a very good response when asked, well, why aren't you eating honey? I think it was at a shared breakfast and there was some sort of granola or something.
00:01:46
Speaker
Bloody granola. Someone needs to work out how to make granola without honey. It's definitely possible, but... most major companies just sling it in as the last ingredient as well. It's not necessary. Anyway, goodness, I'm falafeling today.
00:01:59
Speaker
But yeah, the way that we describe but why as vegans we don't eat honey is something that I've i've heard many different answers for. And in fact,
00:02:10
Speaker
A lot of people, I'm not going to say the majority, but that there are people out there who would describe themselves as vegan or plant-based, but may make an exception for honey. Indeed, there is a historical precedent for this too. I thought we'd start off this show by asking Kate...
00:02:27
Speaker
And Paul, and i'll I'll do the same. Do you eat honey? But also, what do you say when somebody says to you, why don't you eat honey? Or or do you eat honey? So, Kate, you happy to get the ball
Impact of Honey on Bees and Biodiversity
00:02:39
Speaker
rolling here?
00:02:39
Speaker
so So, first of all, do you eat honey? ah No. There are so many other lovely sweeteners to be had. What about maple syrup? I mean, anything other than honey, really, to be honest. um No, I don't.
00:02:55
Speaker
So what if if somebody says to you, do you eat honey? kay oh Oh, why? Why don't you? Why is it you don't eat honey? What's wrong with honey? What do you have a go to response?
00:03:06
Speaker
ah Yeah, I do. I mean, I have to say it was a long time that I didn't eat honey where I didn't have a response. And I didn't know why. I just thought, oh, to be a vegan, you must tick the box of not eating honey. And ah so I just didn't.
00:03:22
Speaker
But yeah, I've kind of... Same, same for me. Yeah, yeah. But now I do have ah reasons. And I think for... move paper some of the people that I talk to who are still eating cows and pigs and chickens and all the rest of it, for me to say, oh bees are cute and you know I don't want to steal something they work so hard for.
00:03:44
Speaker
i But I often use the... argument about honeybees taking the forage from our indigenous bees. We have so many, you know, like little solitary bees, all our bumblebees, and and a whole load of other insects that rely on various flowering plants, that if there is a be a population of bees nearby, they just kind of wolf in take the pollen and the nectar and um you know they they they can feed from many different kinds of plants, whereas you know some of our more native insects, they are but they have specific
Vegan Honey Alternatives
00:04:28
Speaker
some of their mouth parts are kind of specific to feeding from different flowers.
00:04:34
Speaker
And if the honeybee's already been there and taken all the the food, then there's nothing for them. And it's kind of helping. It's just another thing that is pushing so many of our insects into collapse.
00:04:51
Speaker
You know, it's another pressure on biodiversity. So that's the main thing, the main argument I use. with Pete. Cool, thank you.
00:05:02
Speaker
Paul, let's move on to you then. So, first question, do you consume honey? I don't consume honey with a Y at the end, but I consume honey with an E at the Y, vegan replacement honey. One of the brands that's out there is many others, and I have that almost every day because I have a bit of it on my porridge.
00:05:17
Speaker
um But fundamentally, I've never quite got the deal with honey because it is just a super strong sweetener. The replacements out there are perfectly adequate, or you can just use as Kate was saying, maple syrup or something like that, if it's in a cake or something like that, there's no need to have it. It offers no benefit.
00:05:35
Speaker
And then the in the you know like that replacement honeys, I think, are now incredibly close. I mean, really, ah ah I've ah've given it to people who are not vegan and theyve they've said, I wouldn't know. I wouldn't know it's not honey. Consistency, taste, everything.
00:05:51
Speaker
So it just seemed a no brainer to me, this one. there There's that one that's spelt honey, but it that the end of it is E-A, like T. Yeah, honey, yeah, yeah, yeah. And that, oh gosh, it's incredible. it's I mean, it's not the cheapest. It's not not exorbitant, but um my goodness, that's that's really nice.
00:06:09
Speaker
um so So if someone says to you, Paul, like, what what's wrong with honey then? what Why do you eat honey? What's what's wrong with it? Do you have a stock response? or Yeah, I mean, I think it's, just before going to that, I do think it is almost obviously veganism in like layers where it's easier for people to understand who aren't vegan. So meat is very easy because it's the obvious layer.
00:06:28
Speaker
Dairies people don't kind of get, but you have to explain about it. Yeah. he doesn't look
Ethical Issues in Honey Production
00:06:32
Speaker
look like you're killing animals on the surface but this just goes on in the background and then i think sort of honey almost sits below that because that's it's the same sort of thing but it's even less understood or less shown but yeah for me it's the fact that in the harvesting of the honey um the but bees are often killed as part of that and the queen bee can kill be killed or a wings are clipped as part of that production process and also you know if you read around it a bit more it's about the fact that in order to produce the honey we end up replacing
00:07:00
Speaker
the product that the animals produce for themselves with a weak ah sugar substitute to kind of keep them going and then in order for us to take the honey. So again, it's it's kind of stealing. It's a bit, it's but for me, I kind of do align it with with milk because you're taking a product that's designed for um an animal for their purposes and we've just decided and gone no we'll have that thanks very much um so yeah and and and you know it's just not meant for us even if we like it and if you do like it eat this other thing tastes exactly the same yeah yeah absolutely it's it
00:07:33
Speaker
It's really odd, the whole exception thing, where where people say, well, I do make an exception for honey. or It's just like it's so niche. It's just a random thing, isn't it?
00:07:43
Speaker
Like if it was oxygen, you know you'd say you' say, okay, fair enough. you know I do understand why you might make an exception for oxygen. and Or even, i mean, we we spoke um on Thursday's vegan talk, Mark and Julie. There was a hypothetical example of um a work colleague who calls themselves vegan making an exception for birthday cake. And I can see, you know, we're social animals from that point of view. You might say,
00:08:08
Speaker
well, I do make an exception for birthday cake because I you know don't want to be mean or whatever. don't agree with it, but I can understand But make an exception for honey, it's like that's so niche. well ah why Why is that your exception? If you're going to make an exception, make it something like outstanding. you know I don't know.
00:08:25
Speaker
But yeah, for for my for myself, i um I don't consume honey. I never have as a vegan. um I will have done before being vegan. not particularly avidly. In terms of what my response is, it's kind of always been the same.
00:08:40
Speaker
um Like you, Kate, there was a period where I just ah just didn't do it and I didn't really know why. i didn't really know why it was, like you said, Paul, you've you've mentioned horrific practices in organised beekeeping and and honey agriculture, I suppose.
00:08:56
Speaker
industrialised honey production. I wasn't aware of those, but it's always been about consent for me. the The time I was laughed at when I was sort of two or three months into being vegan, I just don't think I phrased it very well. I just said sort of said, well, we've not really asked their permission.
00:09:10
Speaker
to to eat the bees, which of course, ah to eat the bees, don't want to do that, to eat the honey, which is a silly way of phrasing it. But it is that fact, isn't it? That it's it's something that they have produced and we've just gone, oh, thanks for all your hard work, yoink, we'll have that.
00:09:25
Speaker
It just falls down for me as something. It's just like, you don't need it, you know? if it if it was the only source of a micronutrient, if the only way you could get iodine, let's say,
00:09:39
Speaker
was from honey and you know supplements showed that you you can't you can't reproduce that properly in ah in an artificial way and we it was a real essential thing um and there was a real bad deficiency from it, then maybe I'd think twice and I'd think, oh gosh, is there an ethical, or a humane way of getting this thing? But that's just not the case. It's just not the case. So it's just like, you know what? If I can live my life without this thing, then I will. I'll play it safe.
00:10:08
Speaker
I reckon you can they'd be able to start fermenting that one essential thing soon anyway. Even if in the past we'd had to rely on it for that particular thing, then the future is coming and you wouldn't need to, i reckon.
00:10:26
Speaker
Actually, i think also when you think about it, it's actually disgusting. You're eating v bees' vomit. Who wants to eat vomit? No thanks, you know?
00:10:38
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. It's like the yeah egg being a chicken period, isn't it? Sometimes you can phrase these things in a way that's like, oh, that's what you're eating. I mean, let's just quickly rattle through some some facts. Some people like to have a sort of fact-based approach to these things. So to to repeat things that have already been said, there are practices in most if not all beekeeping or honey production that are clearly oppressive.
00:11:06
Speaker
So I mean, very often it is more effective or and financially effective to kill off bees in the in the seasons where they're not producing honey, either by smoke or or other ways.
00:11:19
Speaker
Queen bees will have their wings clipped so they can't fly. And basically the don't know, physiology, anatomy of bees is they are so incredibly loyal to the queen bee. The rest of the the hive and the swarm is that basically if the queen's not going anywhere, they're not going anywhere. So you might think about
Environmental Harm of Honey Production
00:11:38
Speaker
bees, you know, the worker bees that fly ah away and and get pollen and things like that.
00:11:43
Speaker
Well, if they didn't like it, they're free range. They could just fly away from the the bee hub That's not the case. They are wired to be loyal to that queen and that queen is systematically treated so that she can't leave. So real, real malevolent exploitation.
00:11:59
Speaker
going on there. And I think that the numbers vary depending on where you get your data from. But in the entire lifespan of a bee, it will produce enough honey to fill either a quarter or an eighth or a twelfth of a teaspoon in its entire life. So they are producing a very, very small amount, typically the amount that's left in the jar of afterwards. um So it's it's really exploitative. And um as we've said already, it is the food for them in harsh times. So, you know, when they can't get this pollen over the the winter, um typically that is their they're stored up food, their sort of larder, if you like. That's why they're making the honey. It's not being made for us.
00:12:43
Speaker
And also it's feeding their young and it's nutritionally complete. Paul, you mentioned the fact that the the substitute that is given to the bees when the honey is taken to to keep them alive.
00:12:53
Speaker
It's basically like going into someone's house, nicking all the food that they've spent all day harvesting and making and just replacing it with a, you know, a really rubbishy, sugary powder or something, something that's not giving you everything you need, as well as environmental factors too. So these are selectively bred animals, um,
00:13:15
Speaker
So actually that that sort of leads to inbreeding, all sorts of different diseases and things like that, that then actually can mutate and affect other insects too. So it's generally speaking a very bad idea. And like you say,
Sweetener Alternatives to Honey
00:13:30
Speaker
Kate, there's many, many alternatives. I mean, can we rattle off like what what alternatives to honey have have you guys used in in the past?
00:13:38
Speaker
Agave. Yeah, maple. Just flipping ordinary table sugar, for goodness sake. anyway Dates, bananas, ah you know, if you want whole foodie versions, which is what I use a lot, like whole foods. You know, syrup.
00:13:57
Speaker
Is it molasses soup? There's a ton of stuff. it's not It's not like fat. It's what the food industry spends most of its time trying to sell us. There's all this sugary stuff. So, yeah, it's really not hard, is it? That said, we are human beings and we're irrational and we don't often do things and in a sensible or an ethical way. Thought experiment.
00:14:20
Speaker
If you had a vegan friend or someone calling themselves vegan who said, I make an exception for honey, presumably that's not making up a huge proportion of their diet do you think there is an argument for saying oh do you know what you're mainly on board i'm not going to shame you i'm not going to challenge you on this you know if you're if you're buying a jar of honey every couple of weeks but otherwise you're completely vegan is there an argument for just not rattling the cage not dying on that hill i think i'd still be tempted to say but you're actually vegetarian aren't you you know just to kind of put it back bit like with you know
00:14:56
Speaker
the The more common situation is where you have vegetarians that are eating fish and just say, well, you not vegetarian, you're pescetarian. So you get you you if you're on a label, that's what it is. But it's you're mislabelling that and it's causing confusion to people, um which is going the same case here, isn't it, really? If people are saying, I'm vegan, but eat this. There's a bit of me which thinks, OK, so you're not quite there yet. you know And maybe I'd offer a ah ah bit of knowledge that I might know.
00:15:24
Speaker
I'd certainly offer products, you know, say, have you tried this? Yeah, that's a good one. Yeah, I am thinking of certain people that have actually said that to me. I don't think I've come across anyone who's actually said that, though. It's a weird thing. Unless you're just doing it on the sly. I don't know. I think i mean, I don't think Rich Roll has ever identified as vegan. I think he's generally identified himself as ah as a plant-based person. But I'm pretty sure there was a period where either he was consuming honey or some of his like recipes and and things like that he's a sort of well-known prolific podcaster and athlete and for those that don't know he's definitely directly or indirectly advocated for honey consumption whilst also being very big on plant-based dieting but don't think he's ever called himself a vegan he does he does hang around with a lot of vegans
00:16:17
Speaker
that's a new label that we need it's like i'm not vegan but hang around with a lot of vegans yeah I wonder whether some of the problem here as well is that unlike, say, dairy or eggs, for example, honey is not marked as an allergen typically on foods, unless it's kind of, you know, you're looking for the vegan mark.
00:16:37
Speaker
But it's probably the one thing that's caught me out more than anything else, where it's either been... ah hidden in the ingredients. I've missed it when I've scanned it. I've got it home and I've gone like, ah, I think there was a Linda McCartney product once that they bought out a new one and they put honey as the last product. And was just like, why would you, why would you, who's at the end just gone? Oh yeah. And honey.
00:16:58
Speaker
Why? what What Nasser has not thought, yeah, maybe, why don't I just knock out a load of the potential custom by sticking something in that I could easily do without and have another sweetener
Historical Veganism and Honey
00:17:09
Speaker
in there?
00:17:10
Speaker
Silliness. Okay, i've I've got a website in front of me. um I'd like to hear your take on this because I think... historically i mentioned this at the top of the show the vegan society when it was formed in 1944 for nearly 50 years it was almost a bit of an unspoken let's not directly confront this and i can understand that in in an even less vegan world we're talking about then culturally it just did seem to be a thing perhaps just in the uk or i i don't know
00:17:41
Speaker
where it was a regular part of people's diet or people didn't want to be too extreme or all people think thought that there was necessary or whatever. But it wasn't until the definition that we use today, if we if we ascribe to the vegan society's definition that is, um that was coined in 1988, that specifically mentions honey, the theory being that if you directly mention it, it's kind of confronting it.
00:18:06
Speaker
um Whereas until then, it was it seemed to be ah something that people sort of i almost didn't mention or they didn't confront people on. or whatever. So I've got the Scottish Bee Company website in front of me here and um one of their blog posts is called Can Vegans Eat Honey?
00:18:25
Speaker
Now I'm going to read some bits out and let's let's hear what you both think about this. Within this article it says, Can strict vegans eat honey? No. At the Scottish Bee Company we fully respect that many vegans will not fancy eating honey. Now hold hold your interruptions, I know there's already lots to say there but ah Many vegans will not fancy eating honey.
00:18:47
Speaker
What we will say is we care about our colonies and do our best to put out a product that reflects a bee-centered approach. What do we mean by this? Well, we mean that we want to respond to the needs of the colony.
00:19:00
Speaker
One of the many interesting things about honeybees is that they make honey in surplus. That means it's possible for beekeepers to harvest honey without hurting bees or depriving them of food.
00:19:13
Speaker
Now, there's more on this, but I'm just interested. Initial responses. Kate, do you want to go first? Yeah. Do they say to those bees, oh, which bit of this honey don't you need?
Bee Intelligence and Exploitation
00:19:23
Speaker
You know, it's just really bizarre, isn't it?
00:19:28
Speaker
I mean, I don't fancy honey. I don't know about you. Can you make a 100% bee-centred, industrially produced product?
00:19:40
Speaker
Absolutely not. I mean, the whole thing is based on exploitation. And like you say... stealing honey off insects that do not want their honey stolen. You know, they need it to survive over the winter months and for their young to um grow and eat.
00:20:00
Speaker
they They do not want their honey stolen. um I actually read a a book on honeybees a long time ago. I think I was actually vegan. Somebody gave it to me because they thought I might find it interesting.
00:20:11
Speaker
And um it talked about Oh, no, maybe it wasn't in that. No, that might have been the new scientist or something. and It was about an an experiment where, um I don't know why anyone would do this, but there was a beehive and they had somebody with a mask on. I don't know if either of you heard of this, who went up to that beehive with a big stick and like bashed it.
00:20:35
Speaker
And the bees came out to attack that person with the wearing the mask and sort of drive them away. And they had people walking backwards and forwards past the beehive. Fine.
00:20:49
Speaker
But then as soon as the person where any person wearing that mask went by, the bees came out and attacked them. They actually recognised somebody wearing this mask.
00:21:01
Speaker
I mean, that's not dumb, is it? That's dumb. intelligence, I think, right there. you know And they're out there protecting their hive, protecting their young, because you know they make the honey to keep themselves and their they they their comrades alive throughout the winter and and to bring up their young. So they are going to protect that honey. They don't want their honey stolen.
00:21:26
Speaker
Simple as that. Paul, you you quite rightly pointed out that the yeah hypothetical vegan who makes an exception for honey is actually a vegetarian. You said you might sort of point that out to them. I mean, an article like this has got many, many holes in it and many things that could be corrected. I thought particularly the yeah many vegans will not fancy eating honey. No, no, no, no, no.
00:21:50
Speaker
All vegans will not eat honey. That's it's it's really as binary as that. I mean, there's a comment section here. We have the opportunity to to to comment on this. i'm I'm certainly not advocating for abuse or anything like that, of course not.
00:22:05
Speaker
But it's really interesting to to read the comments here. First one, I have such a respect for people living a vegan lifestyle, I unfortunately have to have honey. Joking aside, it's a remarkable product, nature at its finest.
00:22:16
Speaker
Another comment, that's really useful information. Most people probably know someone who is vegan and need to know if foods are suitable for them. Another one, very interesting post, as non-vegans who try to eat vegan a couple of weeks a month, we're never sure how strict to be with honey, but this has cleared up a lot of questions.
00:22:34
Speaker
I mean, there's misconceptions going out there. it's It's not useful. Like, do you think there's an argument for directly confronting things like this, or or do we kind of save our energy for for the dairy industry?
Health Misconceptions about Honey
00:22:46
Speaker
Well, I would Certainly politely he asks the person who said that they need it for their health to say ah right Which condition are you treating with honey? Is it like a broken foot or something? It's because as I'm not aware of any medical condition that requires honey um There might be some other than being an infant be there might be there there might be some ah some bloke some influencer who said that it's necessary to eat honey as part of something that isn't medical advice that's just some bloke on the internet and
00:23:15
Speaker
He probably runs a honey farm. it's Yes, yes, quite. it's um Do you think some of this is is just people have habits, they have routines, they have customs and traditions that exist and convincing ourselves doing the mental gymnastics that these things are okay.
00:23:34
Speaker
They're not harming people. Like that feels easier to do than dropping a habit, dropping a custom. Do know what I mean? Because it it it seems like such a straightforward thing to just be like, ah okay, I'll just get date syrup then. Or like, what why is it that...
00:23:52
Speaker
that we're sticking with this thing is it do people think that oh we need to look after bees we need to you know beat bees are a good thing so we should keep buying from beekeepers or what's the thing that's keeping people exploiting these animals there's some clever marketing i think as well isn't there and there has been the they kind of health washing with honey you know i've had several people oh i buy the manuka honey it's got all these amazing properties you know that, I don't know, probably cures cancer or something. I don't know.
00:24:25
Speaker
Apparently. So that there there is a lot of lot of that. And yeah, I guess people have... but some Some people do regard it as a health food that they need.
00:24:37
Speaker
You know, they've maybe been having it for years and sugar just doesn't cut it, maybe. i don't know. It's weird. I don't know. Why do people do all sorts of things? People are strange. Yeah, I think it doesn't stand up against empirical evidence if you ask for that. It's just kind of more like you say the same thing about rhino horn or, I don't know, collagen or something like that, isn't it? It's like kind of a fashion or... It reminds that Blackadder sketch, isn't it, where he's prescribing, course, leeches and he says, ah...
00:25:06
Speaker
from the guy who has the largest leech farm in Europe. but There's money to be made um rather than um ah conditions to solve. I think my takeaway is remembering that bees existed long before, long before any kind of industrial ways of exploiting them. I don't I've got to say, might I would guess that bees were around before humans, but I don't know that for sure.
00:25:36
Speaker
But anyway, they and the environment were definitely getting along fine before we started to incorporate you know systematic ways of using them and taking their products for us and whether or not we benefit from them, whether or not there are health or pleasure benefits from doing so.
00:25:57
Speaker
So I think that's the the first thing to remember is that they were okay and the environment was okay before we started doing this. We definitely don't need to do it. Like, I mean, if you think you are dependent on honey, just try it for a month without.
00:26:12
Speaker
And if terrible things start happening to you, then i will personally remunerate you with any kind of compensation you feel you need because I simply don't believe that that is true.
00:26:22
Speaker
and And thirdly, just just look at the things that happen because we are we are horrified with big animals, um things like artificial insemination, mutilation, so like cutting cutting things off, and killing.
00:26:37
Speaker
And those three things all happen, all happen to make honey. Bees are routinely killed. they have horrible things done to them. They're cut apart, bits taken off them, and they're artificially inseminated just because they're small. It doesn't mean it's not happening.
00:26:53
Speaker
The only other thing I suppose is that there is lot push isn't there by environmentalists to save bees. And going back to your original point, Anthony, for some time ago about, you know, like all the um pesticides that are out there that are potentially wiping out hives and killing them, etc. So I
Preserving Native Bee Species
00:27:10
Speaker
think people do care about bees. I think they seem to be have have ah have some kind of attraction.
00:27:16
Speaker
and But I think people associate them having nice hives is a bit like chicken have chickens having nice coops to live in almost. I think maybe this is just a but my perception that possibly that is seen as a good thing rather than an exploitative thing.
00:27:29
Speaker
People also get confused when people talk about saving the bees. They think about honeybees, you know, and actually it's we should be thinking more about the wild bumblebees and solitary bees and all the other sorts of bees. of And there are far less of them because there are so many flipping hives of honeybees, you know.
00:27:52
Speaker
And what happens like in California and other places where they ship hundreds and hundreds of hives across states which must be very traumatic and then dump them somewhere they don't even know for example you know the almond orchards and course it's only vegans they eat almonds so it's all our fault suddenly the local population of insects if there are any and those monocultures you know they've suddenly got to contend with all these honeybees as well so you know it's just it's just messed up all around really isn't it Leave them mal alone. They were doing fine beforehand.
Episode Wrap-Up and Community Engagement
00:28:28
Speaker
So that has been our summary of why vegans might not eat honey or definitely don't eat honey. But we've not covered everything exhaustively there. And there's definitely insights and opinions that the three of us have not covered. We'd love to hear from you if you have got take on this. And here is how to get in touch.
00:28:49
Speaker
To get in touch with us, just send us an email at enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com. We see ourselves as a collective. Our listenership stretches all around the world and everyone's opinions, questions, feedback and ideas are what helps shape the show.
00:29:08
Speaker
Go on, send us a message today. enough of the falafel at gmail dot com Well, thanks, Kate, and thanks, Paul, for being part of that episode. and Thanks, everyone, for listening too. Of course, we definitely wouldn't do this without you. And in fact, if you're listening to this thinking, ah do you know what? I've got someone who might be interested in hearing that or might enjoy the sort of shtick that we get involved with at Enough of the Falafel, the referrals that come from you are really, really valuable. We don't have a marketing budget. We don't have anything like that. It's all organic referrals and things like that. So,
00:29:42
Speaker
do just share what we do if you think there is someone out there who would like it or if you think there's someone out there who wouldn't like it if you don't like them send it to them as well and it'll annoy them uh just a heads up that the next enough the falafel episode is coming out and that's available from monday the 3rd of march and that is with aunt julie and mark vegan week which is obviously our usual roundup of the latest vegan and animal rights news Anyway, that's enough of the falafel for this episode.
00:30:13
Speaker
Thank you, Paul. Thank you, Anthony, for all your amazing contributions. And thanks again, everyone, for listening. um I've been Kate, and you've been listening to Vegan Talk from the Enough of the Falafel Collective.
00:30:34
Speaker
This has been an Enough of the Falafel production. We're just a normal bunch of everyday vegans putting our voices out there. The show is hosted by Zencaster. We use music and special effects by zapsflap.com.
00:30:49
Speaker
And sometimes, if you're lucky, at the end of an episode, you'll hear a poem by Mr Dominic Berry. Thanks all for listening, and see you next time.
00:31:01
Speaker
you
00:31:15
Speaker
This episode may have come to an end, but did you know we've got a whole archive containing all our shows dating back to September 2023? twenty twenty three That is right, Dominic. There's over 100 episodes on there featuring our brilliant range of different guests, people's stories of going vegan, philosophical debates, moral quandaries, and of course...
00:31:36
Speaker
around a dozen news items from around the world each week. So check back on your podcast player to hear previous episodes. And remember to get an alert for each new episode, simply click like or follow and also subscribe to the show.
00:31:50
Speaker
Thanks for your ongoing support wherever you listen to us from.