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174- Remember that cool vegan cafe we told you about...? LISTENER MAILBAG SHOW!
93 Plays28 days ago
In this episode, Kate & Ant discuss emails and DMs that YOU listeners have sent in to us. We feature...
* More vegan and ethical pension info
* A vegan cafe we recommended that we're definitely not recommending any more
* What subjects we'd not want to ever discuss on the show
* Potential different formats for the show
* Our vegan/animal rights heroes
We love hearing your views on the topics under discussion (or anything else!) so to tee up your questions for the next listener mailbag show, do drop us your thoughts via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com
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Enough of the Falafel is a community of people who love keeping on top of the latest news in the world of veganism & animal rights. With the Vegan Talk podcast, we aim to develop listeners' (& our own) thoughts around key issues affecting veganism & the animal rights movement; giving our opinions, whilst staying balanced; remaining true to our vegan ethics, whilst constantly seeking to grow & develop.
Each week we home in on one topic in particular and pick it apart in more detail. If you have a suggestion for a future show, do get in touch via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com.
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Thanks everyone for listening; give us a rating and drop us a message to say "hi"; it'll make our day!
Ant & Kate
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Transcript
Introduction and Episode Format
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello, everybody. What is that underneath the letterbox? Why, it's a big pile of letters and emails and all sorts from you lovely listeners. And that is what we are talking about today. I am Anthony.
00:00:14
Speaker
And for this mailbag episode, I'm also joined by Kate. So I think vegans go looking for trouble even when they're not looking for trouble. That's not what butter is used for.
00:00:25
Speaker
Brrr! Take your lab-grown meat elsewhere. We're not doing that in the state of Florida. What about your protein and what about your iron levels? Should I call the media and say, hi, sorry? they They're arguing like, oh poor woe is me.
00:00:38
Speaker
Oh, no. Hang on a minute. You always pick the
00:00:47
Speaker
of social injustice has connection another that's just what people think vegans eat anyway as long as you didn't get the wee brunions with the horns you'll be all right does veganism give him superpowers
00:01:02
Speaker
i cannot fly around the city i don't have laser vision and Hi everybody, is's Kate here.
Understanding Vegan Talk and Vegan Week
00:01:09
Speaker
um Welcome ah thank you for joining us for this episode of Vegan Talk.
00:01:14
Speaker
Yeah, I hope you enjoy it. Indeed. Hello everyone, I'm Anthony. You already know that from the top of the show. This is one of our Vegan Talk episodes. We also do a vegan news show that we call vegan week uh that one covers the news so this one we pick a topic and we focus in and chat about it for about half an hour 45 minutes and there's loads of other ones back in our back catalog wherever you're getting this podcast from go back to there and you'll you'll have oh nearly a hundred other episodes like this they never go out of date
00:01:49
Speaker
um and more accompaniment, education and entertainment with a vegan or animal rights bent is there for you too. So do check that out. Gosh, that's amazing. Really, as many as that. Wow.
00:02:02
Speaker
what ah Wow.
Listener Engagement and Ethical Investments
00:02:04
Speaker
Amazing. So this one is about your emails and your comments and messages. So thank you so much for those people that have have sent their messages into us. And we're going to read out a few of them today. Absolutely. we are Yeah, it's really important to us that you have an opportunity to be part of the conversation if you want.
00:02:24
Speaker
You don't have to. You don't feel guilty if you're not sending us texts or Instagram messages or whatever. That's absolutely fine. But we want everyone to be able to have the opportunity to. Obviously, some of us like myself and Kate, we're happy to put our voices out there.
00:02:39
Speaker
But some of you might want to have your voice expressed in the form of a ah typed or or written message rather than actually being broadcast on the airwaves. So you are very much part of this community and discussion too. Should we get the ball rolling, Kate, with our first...
00:02:56
Speaker
listener email or it's a bit of a different kind of listener because we could put this person in a different category too, couldn't we? Yeah, we could because this is from our very own Paul and he has said to us, great episode with the focus on pensions and investments. I wish I was on this.
00:03:14
Speaker
few things that spring to my mind if we ever do a follow-up and he's given us beyondinvesting.com And he says, I've been looking at these guys and was going to get an ETF with them.
00:03:29
Speaker
But turns out at the moment, you can only do this from the USA M. But they are trying to change this. I thought I was being smart, copying their investment profile myself and investing in individual companies. Gosh, that's brave.
00:03:47
Speaker
Then Trump's tariffs happened and can we call Tesla ethical now? Anyway, so consideration that for pensions you might be able to invest in an alternative vehicle.
00:04:02
Speaker
Ones were touched upon, but there are also, for example, property-based schemes. Although, of course, the question of how vegan some of these are could be a further question. yeah The group I work for offers one of the most ethical investment funds going, and they're called Eden Tree.
00:04:22
Speaker
They have a statement about avoiding animal cruelty. This is where my pension is cited, sits. But um their fifth biggest investment is AstraZeneca.
00:04:36
Speaker
Sigh. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting stuff. Well, thank you for that one, Paul. And it were it was was a really interesting conversation with with Richard and and Dominic that I was lucky enough to be part of.
00:04:50
Speaker
I don't know if this is something that that you've thought about too, Kate. it's It's obviously something that we thought would be interesting but for listeners and and Paul has got in touch too about it. but But looking at these different ways that you can invest your money oh or indeed just the the problems with the de facto standard ones the standard default pensions or banks and things like that it's more complicated than we'd think it really is and it's something that i never oh i always thought was really really boring but as i'm cracking on a little bit i realize it is actually pretty important and um
00:05:26
Speaker
Yeah, where we put our money it actually really matters, doesn't it? It really matters where we where we choose to spend it, you know, where our investment funds are for pensions and stuff like that.
00:05:37
Speaker
And it is really difficult. Yeah, I guess most people, they they don't think about it at all, do they? They just add to this whatever scheme is. And, you know, but now we know some of the terrible things that these companies are invested in.
00:05:56
Speaker
And wouldn't it be great if we had access to funds that were supporting the world we want to see, a vegan world, you know? Well, Paul has mentioned in his email beyondinvesting.com, and I'm on their website now. I mean, i've I've only just touched the surface looking at this. We'll obviously put the link in the show notes.
00:06:18
Speaker
But one of their straplines on their homepage is zero animal exploitation, and climate conscious portfolios for all investors. I mean, it's a starting point. and That sounds great, doesn't it? That sounds more like it. Yeah, it really does. um you know And it is sad that this isn't available in the UK, like he says, at the moment. And I wonder if it will be. I don't know.
00:06:43
Speaker
I guess I haven't actually got a pension either, like Dominic says. Yeah. and So i kind of, umm I'm going to hopefully live off carrots and mentals as I get older.
00:06:57
Speaker
And I ah don't plan on stopping working either. way I look at it, I try to invest my money now in what's important and support vegan businesses now.
00:07:10
Speaker
You know, if if you're not in a position to to have a pension, It's very sensible to have one, everybody, if you can, but not everyone can. um So... I think it's important to to put out there that there are different ways about going about these things because, I mean, we're...
00:07:28
Speaker
we're seeing increasingly over the latter half of the 20th century and the start of the 21st century that these kind of standard norms that that we've kind of lived our society by, some of them have been proven to be wrong or to be problematic or whatever.
00:07:44
Speaker
And having a pension and and investing, you know, in a standard bank saving way of doing things, of course, it can work for lots of people, but it doesn't work for everybody. And it might not be the only way. And I think it's just good to question these things and to to know that there might be alternatives, weather that whether you're thinking that way because of your circumstances or because you you think to yourself, well, I'm really not comfortable with with giving ah huge chunk of my earnings to so people who I know are going to be doing horrible things with it. I don't want that to be my legacy. I don't want that to be
00:08:26
Speaker
where I'm investing you know we do have choices over these things yeah we do and because of the way money has worked in the past we're now seeing climate change and there's a part of me that wonders if actually everything is going to collapse anyway you know what's happening politically in the world is is getting pretty unstable will will any of us have pensions by the time you know we get there Keep it in a sack under your mattress. That's what I say. Well, yeah. No, but you know. I don't say that. No, no. I think like the alternative culture, sharing, upcycling, repurposing, all of that, not just buying stuff.
00:09:10
Speaker
You know, i think all of that's important as well. But pensions, let's hope we get some decent ones that are, you know, are investing in the world that we want to see. Yeah, but absolutely.
00:09:22
Speaker
Yeah. And i'm I'm really glad that, well, initially for Richard's particular knowledge and and research that he's done. on this and Paul has contributed to that as well um and do do anyone listening that can contribute more information on this sort of thing do do send it in to us and we will share it and disseminate the knowledge because it feels like it's sort of slim pickings at the moment but actually the more we can share our knowledge about these things, then actually, you know, if you want to live in a really, I don't know, sociocratic and sharing way that might not involve pensions, then that's your choice. But actually, if you do want to do things in a more traditional way, but that is, that also feels ethical too, then at least you've got that option.
00:10:10
Speaker
And in the same way that, I don't know, if you take a food analogy, it perhaps in in the 70s, if you wanted to be vegan, like it was lentil loaf, steamed vegetables or whatever, but now you can have plant-based fast food if you want to.
00:10:28
Speaker
it's It's not just a binary choice, is it? that's I think that's the vision that we need to aim for for all parts of life and all parts of vegan culture, if there is such a thing.
Sponsorship Dilemmas and Vegan Integrity
00:10:39
Speaker
That's what I reckon anyway. That's what I reckon. Well, thank you again,
00:10:42
Speaker
Paul for sending that one in. On to our next story. Oh goodness this is a controversial one but are we glad it's been sent in. This is from Georgia. Thank you for your message Georgia.
00:10:54
Speaker
Georgia says hey guys love the show. I hate to be the bearer of bad news or perhaps you already knew but I'm afraid on my latest visit to your previous show sponsor Fire and Flow Coffee they had a very eggy menu on offer at their roastery. It looks like their own products are still 100% plant-based um as it's a pop-up who are serving the eggs and dairy, but still disappointing and unfortunately not true to say that their cafe is completely vegan anymore.
00:11:28
Speaker
Just thought I'd let you know in case you wanted it to tweak your old episode intros, et cetera. Sorry to be a downer, Still love the pod, of course. Thank you, Georgia. Kate, what an absolute pain in the butt that is. i was so disappointed to read that.
00:11:43
Speaker
Has she actually, so she did she physically visit in person? i didn't ah That's what she said on my latest visit. On my latest visit. Yeah, they're in Sirencester. I've been once before.
00:11:55
Speaker
Oh, yeah, that is so, gosh, it's just like another stab to the heart, isn't it, really? when When this happens, um you know, I guess, yeah, it's not the the company, it's their pop-up. But even so, i don't know.
00:12:11
Speaker
Well, they're letting them in. Yeah, they're letting them in. oh dear I did have a look at the website and, yeah, it's order extra eggs with your eggs and stuff. and yeah yeah ah yeah Have you ever had that happen? have you ever gone to a vegan place and then all of a sudden they're not vegan? Oh, yeah.
00:12:27
Speaker
Oh, God, it's so disappointing. They're some somewhere not a million miles from me and they started out with... 100% all their cakes were vegan and they were absolutely fantastic they were splendid and um and now they've kind taken they had like cat calf's milk for for anyone that actually asked for it but otherwise they just served it all with plant-based milk but they themselves are not vegan and I think that was a bit of an issue and now they're serving they're serving
00:13:04
Speaker
bacon and goodness knows what and and the last time I went in there I I did say they still had quite a few lovely looking cakes and I went oh so so all your cakes are vegan then still yeah and they went oh no that one is and that one is and I'm like why did they even do they didn't need to even do that you know don't know it's just it's just so disappointing but I think yeah the fact that they weren't vegan themselves didn't help the Yeah, I will say that has been something that I think where where I've experienced this, because I've i've had the same thing. one but My favourite place in the whole world once was a ah cafe chain in Berlin, in Germany, that was, everything was plant-based and they were they were based inside these little vegan supermarkets. So Vegans is the supermarket brain and and this cafe chain, Goodies, was inside each of their
00:14:02
Speaker
locations there's supermarket locations as well as there being a few on the streets too and it's my favorite place in the world and then all of a sudden the goodies the cafe just completely changed um the the vegan supermarket kicked them out but their stalls that were still on the street were were really eggy and fishy as well and and i think there again it was a It was a non-vegan business owner who kind of got in cahoots with another vegan company and sort of plant-based everything up for a bit.
00:14:34
Speaker
But then when things went sour, they kind of then went back. And it does seem to be a ah slippery slope thing, doesn't it? people People get really extreme about it. Like you say, there's no need for someone to start saying, well, actually, none of our cakes are going to be vegan anymore. But it it does seem to happen. My mind's going to Tim Sheaf. do you remember Tim Sheaf? like he He went from like being completely vegan and and completely everything...
00:15:01
Speaker
And then you like, had one bit of fish. And then all of a sudden he's, like, raw carnivores. I don't know. ah People have to go from one extreme to another, don't they? I know. They couldn't have been really vegan in the first place. I just don't think... Oh, don't know.
00:15:18
Speaker
Yeah, it's just... It's really sad. It's very sad. But I suppose... I don't know what's worse when... I don't know. I don't... Somehow, if a cafe isn't vegan and they have, but they do have some vegan options. I don't get so cross about that.
00:15:37
Speaker
I don't go, this vegan, this cafe should be entirely vegan, but they've just got a few options. But it's just, yeah, it's like when you say, it's the slippery throat when they just stop, stops, you know. i suppose so even worse than that is when they actually close. I don't know. but Yeah.
00:15:52
Speaker
but I mean, my mind is going to, do you remember that episode we did? I think Julie was involved in it too. And we were talking about, the whole thing of the media saying, oh, the vegan bubble has burst. And we were looking at other things like video games or like the internet where it has that initial surge and then the bubble kind of subsides a little bit and then it comes back again.
Media Influence and Sponsorship Challenges
00:16:14
Speaker
And its thats that's the way it goes.
00:16:17
Speaker
But because we're living moment to moment, when things recede a little bit, it can hurt. And I guess, you know, George has brought this to our attention, not because it's just any old cafe, but it's one that we've had an association with.
00:16:32
Speaker
as as a show before I mean do you do you have any feelings about that Kate in terms of I don't know what what we should do about that I know I'm putting you on spot here yeah I don't know is well people maybe will be perhaps going along thinking oh a vegan cafe or something and are going to be disappointed they told us it was vegan I'm never listening to that show again i don't know um Hmm, interesting. i'm I'm not entirely sure what to do because I ah guess they were the sponsors.
00:17:07
Speaker
Can you put a little, can you can you change it, put a little thing on there? By the way! If time was was not a ah ah problem, um then absolutely I'd want to because I... you know, it's important that we're advocating for the right things, isn't it? And I certainly don't want to get personal or start, you know, slagging anyone off for the decisions they feel is right for their business or whatever, of course, we'll disagree.
00:17:36
Speaker
But I don't feel a need to make a you know, a public song and dance about it. But at the same time, I'm not happy that there's, I don't know exactly how many shows it would have been. It probably would have been about 30 or 40 at the maximum, where we've either got a jingle at the very end of the show, or we used to open the show by mentioning them and and saying, you know, this is our show sponsor and you can visit their vegan community.
00:18:01
Speaker
cafe and blah blah and here's a discount code and stuff like that so i'm i am going to look into how easy it is to to splice these things and get rid of them like say without getting too techy on it the ones where it's at the very end of the show that's very easy i'll just cut that no problem but you know there'll be some where one of us just in the middle of what we're saying we'll start talking about them and then that becomes a bit more difficult so I will look into it and I will not promise that it will be done by the time you listen to the next episode because that will not be the case.
00:18:35
Speaker
But I don't know, we can we can slowly erode things. and mean any um soliciting of of people visiting there their cafe. And as Georgia says, I mean, I had a good look through their website and it does seem like Fire and Flow's products remain plant-based.
00:18:55
Speaker
Although it's from, I mean, I've not been since they've been doing eggy things there, but actually their roastery is within the same building as their kitchen.
00:19:07
Speaker
So actually, you you're roasting coffee beans in the same airspace that loads of eggs are being fried. So help how completely plant-based is that? Depends depends to what degree you want to go, I suppose.
00:19:21
Speaker
But yeah, shame. Shame. It is a shame. Maybe they'll... maybe they'll um kick them out and get a vegan caterer in instead or something who knows i mean i don't know i mean ah that i don't know sort of what the makeup of their business is at the moment but when when i first got to know the guys that there are there were three of them directing the business and and two of them you know identified as as vegan and that's how we got to know one another and that's why they supplied my cafe that's why we started having them as a
00:19:56
Speaker
um as ah as a partner with the show initially. And i can only imagine that times are a bit hard for them and it's not a decision they wanted to make, but they felt it was that or...
00:20:07
Speaker
or the business might fold. I'm certainly not excusing it. I'm certainly not saying it's what I do, but that's what I'm guessing. But who knows? And to be honest, I don't really want to engage in the conversation with them about it because i think there's, I'd rather focus on things that are going well and and give time and attention to businesses that are aligned with how I'd like to do things. But any listeners that want to get in touch with them, please feel free.
00:20:34
Speaker
But yeah, I think I'll just focus on focus on the positives and things that we want to give time and energy to, hey? Yeah, no, that sounds like a plan. Well done.
00:20:44
Speaker
And in that vein, let's move on to another email. Do you want to read this one out, Kate? Yeah, okie dokie. this is from an anonymous listener. Really? Yeah.
00:20:56
Speaker
Really enjoying the range of subjects for discussion on both the news show and on the Vegan Talk episodes. I was wondering if there are any topics you wouldn't discuss on the show.
00:21:08
Speaker
I only because I was surprised by the Animal Sanctuaries episode. I thought it was really thought-provoking, but as you said, questioning these things is a bit of a taboo.
00:21:22
Speaker
Yes. Yeah, for listeners that aren't aware, oh gosh, I should probably know exactly what episode number it is. I haven't done my homework there, but it was ah was an episode where we were discussing, are Animal Sanctuaries too resource-heavy?
00:21:35
Speaker
Do they require too much effort from vegans? Do they require too much money? And so we were kind of addressing that, knowing that it was a bit controversial. Yeah, just on the anonymous point, like the I know who this person is, they've emailed in, but they they were happy for this to be shared, and but they preferred their name wasn't used. Kate, are there any subjects that if I said to you, oh, coming up you know on on this week's show, we're going to record the news bit,
00:22:03
Speaker
And then for the vegan talk bit, we're going to talk about this. Can you imagine anything where you'd say, okay, if that's the case, I'm probably not going to be involved in that conversation, if that's okay. I can't imagine you actually putting up a subject that is so terrible I have got nothing to say on.
00:22:19
Speaker
Or, I don't know, something I'd just be... Well, I don't know. There's loads of things I know nothing about. And there's things that we've done which...
00:22:32
Speaker
you know, which I've been involved in, which I haven't enjoyed at all, just been, because they've just been so difficult, i.e. watching, you know, hard, really tough to watch films, you know, say, when we did Pignorant, I found that really hard. I did it, and I did enjoy the discussion afterwards.
00:22:52
Speaker
But I think if you if you were going to say, right, this week we're going to be discussing Earthlings or Dominion, which I haven't watched and I don't want to watch, and I dare say there's other films which are equally as absolutely horrible, then I think I would just find that too tough myself.
00:23:13
Speaker
And um I mean, do I do have a some other things. it's things like... um I would feel very uncomfortable and and I don't think you'd ever ask me to do this but it's not my place to talk about what it's like to be say a black or a trans or a gay vegan and stuff like that I know nothing about these things and I would like say that's great let's have somebody who like like we have the going vegan episodes you know talking people talking about their experiences and stuff like that.
00:23:46
Speaker
So, you know, anything like that. and I don't know. What about you, Anthony? I mean, I do have a filter that I employ with regards to news that we cover.
00:24:00
Speaker
So if you if you sort of Google search vegan news, for example, that's not the only way that we research for the show, I should point out. But if you are to do that, a big proportion of what comes up are recipes, so new recipes, and also press releases for new products that are coming out.
00:24:22
Speaker
And for me, that's not news. That's a company doing PR. Now, of course, if there's something completely innovative um that's never been done before, or indeed, ah you know, a monolith of a company, I mean, let's say, you know, that the first time the McPlant burger came out from McDonald's I would argue that that that's a significant event and that would be worth reporting on but I'm not including in the show notes Greg's latest plant-based offering
00:24:55
Speaker
because I don't see that as news. I see that as just doing PR for Greggs, which I'm not interested in doing. So I definitely employ a filter for that. Sometimes we'll discuss a story that has been covered in a lot of places,
00:25:12
Speaker
That again, I wouldn't consider news. I'm just thinking like celebrity stuff or sort of scandal stuff like I don't and know. I mean, we record we're recording this this episode now 24 hours before we're recording the um the news show.
00:25:27
Speaker
but this week though the order that you'll be hearing them listeners is is back to front but there's a story in that one about an activist getting their megaphone smashed in the middle of an asda and that's not really news i don't think but it's been covered in so many places that i think it's worth discussing because of the way that different news outlets are talking about it so i think for me that there's that sort of thing in terms of like what we consider to be news and what what is newsworthy in terms of the vegan and animal rights movement, if that makes sense.
00:26:03
Speaker
Interestingly, um' I'm sure you remember, Kate, because you know the person who sent us the email and I've forgotten her name now, but she does, um is it called in a nutshell? Yeah, Daisy.
00:26:14
Speaker
Daisy, thank you. Yeah, Daisy sent us at and an email sort of at one point saying that she didn't like the way that it felt like we were being critical. about certain people's activism or or or their efforts. And I guess that's, again, it's it's just a personal thing, isn't it? But I think for me, and I'm sure every everyone on the show, there could be certain ways that we covered certain topics that might feel distasteful.
00:26:44
Speaker
I mean, you've mentioned us sort of appropriating or all kind of speaking for groups of people that we don't represent that would feel in poor taste.
00:26:55
Speaker
But actually, we could still cover something that doesn't relate to us personally, but we could still reflect on it to a degree. And so I think...
00:27:07
Speaker
My general stance would be that there's not anything that I'd categorically not want to cover or talk about, but it depends how you're talking about it. So if you're just completely criticizing somebody or you're completely making generalizations, i don't know, does that make sense?
00:27:26
Speaker
Yeah, it does. Do remember the one we did on Earthling Ed and his book, the latest book, which was the one about... How to Argue with a Meat Eater and Win. Win, that's it, yeah.
00:27:38
Speaker
I remember sitting there listening, thinking, it's Earthling Ed! He's God! How can we criticise him? But then, you know, actually, it is, a it we we is's like you say, it's good to be sort of kind of constructively critical on things isn't it and and it's more interesting to have a discussion but do sometimes think you you are you do play devil's advocate sometimes too don't you Anthony me just admit it just for interest yeah yeah I yeah I prefer the word reflective rather than critical because it's
00:28:17
Speaker
though sometimes we will just blanketly criticize something, I think 99% of the time we're just reflecting and pondering and wondering and like you say, playing devil's advocate rather than completely just slandering somebody.
00:28:34
Speaker
Oh yeah, no, Yeah, I think other than sort of salacious celebrity gossip or, you know, so there's this new recipe or Nestle have brought out a new plant-based product that won't exist in a month's time because they're just cashing in on Veganuary other than things like that that I would just snobbishly say well I just don't think that's news I don't think there's anything but um hey listeners challenge us see if there's uh see if there's something out there that uh that we wouldn't cover because I I can't think of anything yet but maybe there is who knows who knows should we move on
00:29:14
Speaker
Okay, this one is from Instagram and it's from another Kate. So we've had an email from the Paul that is the Paul that you know and love from Enough of the Falafel.
00:29:24
Speaker
This is from a Kate, but not the Kate that you know and love. It's a different Kate that you can grow to know and love perhaps. And Kate on Instagram says, would you consider talking about fewer news stories, but for longer?
00:29:39
Speaker
So like everyone has two picks for the week. Currently people have one pick for the week. but no general stories. I just like it when things are done in depth. What do you reckon, Kate?
00:29:50
Speaker
Should we give it a go? Yeah. I think that's really lovely of her to say that, actually. um You know, i'll just like blather on in my ignorant way.
00:30:03
Speaker
She can't be me, I don't think. But yeah, I mean, I do. kind of love kind of researching a little bit into some of these stories, I have to admit.
00:30:16
Speaker
and ah But I am prone to going down dark rabbit holes. But it's interesting what you find out. And it's lovely to bring some of these things back to to our group and to our listeners and perhaps share things that other people don't know, maybe, that I've learned anyway.
00:30:35
Speaker
i But I kind of, I like both really. I think it's quite nice to bring some of the short shorter news things, so keep up to date with more general stuff. But I don't know.
00:30:46
Speaker
What do you think, Anthony? Which do you prefer or do you not have a preference or...? Well, if it were up to me, the show would have a different format each week. I love just experimenting with things and seeing what it's like. But out of respect for for Kate and all the other contributors from Enough of the Fluffle, I do try and keep things consistent for for a period anyway.
00:31:08
Speaker
But i'm I'm well up for going into fewer stories in and a bit more depth. We've had some vegan week shows where we just pick one story. Or one general theme. And generally, again, to be a bit boring and tedious and technical, that will generally be be because we're recording a show well in advance. So we're not going to know what the news is for that week. There might be a week where we're not able to record, but we might talk about something that's been in the news lately.
00:31:36
Speaker
for the last few months and just focus on that one thing. So we have had some shows where we just focus on one theme. I think we did one on lab grown meat. And in fact, I think that one where we're talking about has the vegan bubble burst.
00:31:49
Speaker
I think that was one where it was a vegan week show. But we just focused on one type of story, I guess. And that is interesting. I wouldn't want I know that's not quite the extreme that that Kate is suggesting here, but I think we would lose something if we just focused on one story per week. um It's nice to hear.
00:32:09
Speaker
things but I will I will say here and now at some point in the next month we will try a show where we do fewer stories and we focus on them in a bit more depth i I also like the idea of kind of taking things the other way and having a ah show where we cover 20 stories and we do each one for like 60 seconds and that's it and a little bell goes off after 60 seconds and we have to move on even if we've not finished saying what we're saying I don't know. Yeah. Don't, don't ask me to come up with different ideas for um what the show could sound like. Cause you'll, you'll regret it. that It'll, it'll be mad. There'll be something different each week.
00:32:49
Speaker
um I love having a little tinker, but yes, thank you for your message. Yeah. was going to say that does sound like ah quite a nice idea. Lots of short things. It's also nice to see, to to hear rather um how different themes in the world out there are developing and, you know,
00:33:08
Speaker
say like uh you know what's happening in the huntsab world and the latest on that you know just seeing yeah seeing seeing how things are developing i think that's quite nice and you couldn't necessarily well you couldn't really do that if you just covered like one big story each week or something really could you so yeah it's quite nice to it to mix it up for sure and we very much i've i've really liked our messages thus far in in this mailbag episode because we've had someone telling us some news that we didn't want to hear somebody following up on a show that we've done and given us some more information somebody saying actually would you consider doing the format in a different way I really like that folk feel comfortable suggesting things and and or critiquing or you know telling us things we don't want to hear it's good it's good we like it
00:33:59
Speaker
Okay, so this is somebody called eco-warrior1992 on Instagram. Hello, eco-warrior. on instagram ah eco warrior do you think they were an in or do you think that's when they were born It's got to be one of those two. It's got to be one of those two. Yeah, for sure. How old are they? If they're 1992, that's 25, 30, what? 33. 33. Yeah, my maths. Terrible, terrible.
00:34:27
Speaker
Anyway, so who are your own inspirations within the animal rights and vegan community? Of course, everyone is a hero, but you know what I mean. Wow.
00:34:41
Speaker
Well, Anthony, I'd love to know who your hero hero's hero Oh, golly. So i think there is a danger in just having one.
00:34:53
Speaker
I had to choose one, I think I know who I'd choose. But I think there is a danger in choosing one because we're a social justice movement. And so it shouldn't be about one person. and And as we have seen...
00:35:05
Speaker
Folk can change. And goodness, imagine if your vegan hero decides one day to eat a fish and then has a wet dream and then all of a sudden becomes somebody who's not not vegan anymore and is called Tim Sheaf or whatever. now I never thought he was that great anyway. But like it happens because people are human, aren't they? And they err.
00:35:27
Speaker
And they they wander from what you might like. Can I list loads of people, Kate, and say why? is that allowed? Yes. Many as you like. Yeah. for what So I will say, i will say when I have done outreach, I have met some fantastic people, everyday normal folk, just like on this podcast.
00:35:49
Speaker
who have a really calm, inspiring way of talking to people or they will make sacrifices in their life. They'll go against the grain. They'll they'll do things a bit differently.
00:36:02
Speaker
Such is their passion for animal rights and or their passion for making veganism more mainstream. And that I find brilliantly inspiring when you when you meet folk.
00:36:16
Speaker
doing that And generally speaking, I've met such people when doing vegan activism, whether it's, you know, street outreach or doing the animal saves where you you go and you stand at the slaughterhouse gates as there as the trucks come in.
00:36:33
Speaker
um or Or any number of other things too. I really do like Earthling Ed and the way that he speaks and the ways that he chooses to spend his time and energy.
00:36:47
Speaker
You know, he's not a one trick pony. To use a ah non-vegan phrase, he sort of uses diverse different ways to to get things across. i've I've met him once um and that was really, really lovely. Spent a bit of time with him. He he came to the cafe that I was running.
00:37:05
Speaker
And there are others who are out there in the in the vegan sphere that that ah that people will know ah about. we We reviewed George Monbiot's book, well, one of his books.
00:37:17
Speaker
um What was it called? It was about the soil, wasn't it? so Yes, Regeneration. Regenesis, yes. Yes, yes. yes So, yeah, the the way that he writes so so eloquently and and how farsighted he's being and how global, I guess.
00:37:34
Speaker
I also really have admired the work of, and I suppose and kind of trying to emulate it with this podcast. um There's a guy called Andy Tabar who runs...
00:37:45
Speaker
ah Compassion Co which is a vegan clothing line but he also co-hosted and produced a podcast called The Bearded Vegans that did a run of 300 episodes and has stopped doing so for a few years now but I feel like I owe a lot of my outlook on on vegan things and animal rights things ah to him and i had a lot of my existing ways of looking at the world challenged i think by him and i was really grateful for that and there's loads there's loads more i really ah really like having lots of lots of different inspirations um i think that's that would that would be my answer i think and probably i'm gonna when we stop recording i'll think of at least 10 more people that i want to mention but that would that would be it for now what about you kate
00:38:39
Speaker
Wow, well, i agree with all the people you've you've said as well. Not that I've met that all the outreach people that you've met, but I've equally met some amazing outreach people, just brilliant, wonderful people.
00:38:52
Speaker
And I'm going to mention a friend who I saw out again the other day. She's been vegan for quite a while. And she's not on social media. She doesn't go to my meetups.
00:39:03
Speaker
But everywhere she goes, she has a load of leaflets and like Viva or wherever, and she pushes them through people's doors. everywhere, everywhere she goes.
00:39:15
Speaker
And, not you know, I just, she's a hero, you know. So, you know, as well as people who are doing all the activism and all that, you've got, also you've got some amazing people who are um kind of putting themselves into really uncomfortable positions, who are, um you know, standing up to all the entrenched systems and trying to work within those systems to change the world to to improve the terrible lives of animals and i'm thinking of like so um you know alice bruff is it who you know the pig pig vet girl
00:39:56
Speaker
She's working. Yeah, she's working. She was in I Could Never Go Vegan. She's been a few other things. She's like still working within the system to advocating for pigs and to trying to change the system. standing up They don't like her being there, but she's still there turning up at conferences and things.
00:40:16
Speaker
And I think of people like ariele Dr. Arielle Griffiths, who's a vegan vet, and Andrew Knight, of course, But, you know, going to vet shows, we're surrounded by companies pushing raw meat for dogs and cats, you know, where they're cooking bacon butties and, you know, all the rest of it. And and she's there trying to, giving a talk on vegan pet food, you know, this little lone voice, know,
00:40:49
Speaker
you know, are just so brave, brave, brave. i mean, yeah, and and people, and I i have to mention though the health professionals, you know, Shireen Kassam, who's the head of health professionals and all the other health professionals, working within the system, trying to change the systems, plugging away. So there's people plugging away day after day after day after day, you know, kind of never giving up, just working, working.
00:41:18
Speaker
Robbie Lockie, you know, he's, I think he's amazing. And he's lead, I forget the name of his organisation, you know, the one where now where they're trying to combat the misinformation and lies and stuff coming from animal agriculture, you know, lovely Paul Ude, who's 87, vegan runner and advocating for the animals and does everything he does for the animals, trying to do 100 ultramarathons by the time he's 100. He's amazing.
00:41:51
Speaker
I don't know. There's so many. There's so many. I love all the comedians. I love all the – there's some amazing people on, like, Instagram and stuff doing things which are funny.
00:42:03
Speaker
and really smart and they really make you think I mean there's I don't know there's just so many brilliant people out there doing incredible things yeah Chris Packham Dale Vince I don't know loads of people what do you yeah yeah so something you said there may made me think more broadly. You were talking about people working within the system.
00:42:26
Speaker
And I think what's really important to recognize, and ah I'm not just saying this to be to be trite or or anything like that, but actually anyone who is vegan at the moment, anyone who is is believing in animal rights in a world where the dominant ideology is not one that believes in animal rights,
00:42:49
Speaker
That's crucial. And we can't all be the poster boy or the, you know, the influencer who's got millions of followers and she's, you know, gorgeous and blah, blah, blah. Like we can't all be that.
00:43:05
Speaker
And, and of course, many of us don't want to be either, but it it doesn't work as a movement without folk who were just doing the do every every day as well and supporting those people. I mean, you know, I mentioned Earthling Ed.
00:43:23
Speaker
He, I don't know um how he sustains himself financially, but I do know he's had a Patreon fur for several years. And I imagine that the people who are putting into that Patreon and paying towards his work will be everyday vegans who are, and and some of those people will be people who are well-known vegans but i reckon most of them are just everyday folk um and so that the whole kind of vegan animal rights ecosystem if you like does just need normal quote normal people keeping it going too and actually doing so in 2025 or let's face it in 2035 it will still be unusual to be vegan hopefully not
00:44:11
Speaker
not as unusual as it is now, but it it will probably still be um a thing that is not the majority yet, but still persisting through that and sustaining yourself through that is an incredible thing.
00:44:24
Speaker
And most people aren't bold or brave enough to do that yet, you know, but all of us, all of us doing it now have to be bold and brave enough to be different.
00:44:37
Speaker
And as social creatures, know, Like being different is a threat, isn't it? So anyone doing that, like flipping brilliant, isn't it? Flipping brilliant.
00:44:47
Speaker
Yeah, amazing. i ah Yeah, everyone is amazing and wonderful. And we need everybody, you know, and however, however, that what it just what is yours to do?
00:45:00
Speaker
you know, it ain' however small, however large, you know, it doesn't matter all of us together. We're all pushing for the same thing, really. aren't we? We may have our odd differences here and there, but basically we're pushing for the same thing and we're all, we are making a difference.
00:45:17
Speaker
So yeah, definitely. Absolutely. Good question. Eco warrior 1992. Let's hope you're still an eco warrior now. I hope that's when you were born. um Anyway, anyway, enough on that. Enough on that.
00:45:31
Speaker
Thank you everyone for listening to this episode. I think we've said lots of times that we love hearing from you. We haven't told you how to get in touch. Enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com.
00:45:43
Speaker
I'm going to say that is our preferred way of doing it. I do check the Instagram and Facebook messages occasionally, but I don't have alerts and things like that. So if you really want your message to get through, send it to enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com.
00:45:57
Speaker
But there's also something else you could do for us that you might not have done yet. Here is what we're asking. If you've enjoyed today's show, we'd love it if you could take just a few seconds to share it with someone else who you think might enjoy it too.
00:46:14
Speaker
We don't have a marketing team or a budget to spend on advertising, so your referrals are the best way of spreading the free Enough of the Falafel Joy further still. And if you haven't already, we'd be really grateful if you could leave us a rating on your podcast player.
00:46:30
Speaker
That will also help the show pop up when people search for vegan or animal rights content online. Thanks for your help. Well, thank you, Kate from the past, as well as Kate from the present.
00:46:44
Speaker
um I have a question for you, Kate. You're wearing a shirt that I used to have that shirt as well. not and I doubt it was that exact one. um for For listeners, it's a black shirt and it has a white speech bubble on the front of it. And it says, talk to me, I'm vegan.
00:47:01
Speaker
um I have a question. Has it ever worked? Has anyone ever? ah Sadly not. No, no one's ever. No, it never did for me either. It was one of my favourites. It's one of my favourites. I've also got one that I wear, which is ah vegan because I give a shit, you know. And I've had a few interesting looks from that one as well.
00:47:20
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I've got a feeling it used to be a campaign, Talk To Me I'm Vegan. And I'm wondering whether they just produced like a run of shirts and would wear them when they were doing it.
00:47:35
Speaker
But then the campaign stopped and then they just had a load of shirts to sell. I don't know. I could be making that up. So don't quite know. But it's a good shirt. I liked it. And I'm glad you still have yours. mine yes and i don't know where mine is now, but I don't think it's in my wardrobe.
00:47:50
Speaker
Anyway, thank you so much for listening, everybody. And thank you so much to those of you that have written in. It's been really great. Thank you. um And you may want to listen to our next episode, Enough of the Falafel, which is coming out on Monday the 12th of May. And it will be a Vegan Week episode, which is our usual weekly roundup of the latest videos.
00:48:16
Speaker
vegan and animal rights news. Anyway, that's enough of the falafel for this episode. Thank you, Anthony, so much for your contributions. And thanks again, everyone, for listening.
00:48:30
Speaker
I've been Kate, and you've been listening to Vegan Talk from the Enough of the Falafel Collective.
00:48:42
Speaker
This has been an Enough of the Falafel production. We're just a normal bunch of everyday vegans putting our voices out there. The show is hosted by Zencaster. We use music and special effects by zapsplap.com.
00:48:56
Speaker
And sometimes, if you're lucky, at the end of an episode, you'll hear a poem by Mr Dominic Berry. Thanks all for listening and see you next time.
00:49:23
Speaker
This episode may have come to an end, but did you know we've got a whole archive containing all our shows dating back to September 2023? That is right, Dominic. There's over 100 episodes on there featuring our brilliant range of different guests, people's stories of going vegan, philosophical debates, moral quandaries, and of course...
00:49:44
Speaker
around a dozen news items from around the world each week. So check back on your podcast player to hear previous episodes. And remember to get an alert for each new episode, simply click like or follow and also subscribe to the show.
00:49:58
Speaker
Thanks for your ongoing support wherever you listen to us from.