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187- Amazon Prime Video launches undercover animal experimentation lab exposé
100 Plays1 month ago
It's in Spanish, so Ant, Carlos, Julie & Paul don't know what they're saying, but thanks to the incredible feat of going undercover in an animal lab for TWO YEARS, Infiltrada en el Búnker (Undercover Inside the Bunker) is now available to stream on Prime Video.
We also look at nine other stories from the vegan & animal rights space from the last week or so.
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Enough of the Falafel is a community of people who love keeping on top of the latest news in the world of veganism & animal rights. With the Vegan Week podcast, we aim to keep listeners (& ourselves) informed & up-to-date with the latest developments that affect vegans & non-human animals; giving insight, whilst staying balanced; remaining true to our vegan ethics, whilst constantly seeking to grow & develop.
Each week we look through news stories from the past 7 days in the world of veganism & animal rights.
If you spot any news stories that might catch our fancy, or have an idea for a discussion topic, get in touch via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com.
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This week's stories:
https://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2025/07/02/jersey-move-to-allow-charter-fishing-for-bluefin-tuna-criticised-by-uk-animal-rights-group/
https://www.farminguk.com/news/rspca-assured-unveils-stricter-poultry-welfare-rules-for-2025_66818.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/vegan-diet-mediterranean-weight-loss-diet-inflammation-b2778007.html
https://www.scotsman.com/lifestyle/food-and-drink/burger-king-is-giving-away-free-vegan-burgers-to-meat-lovers-to-show-them-how-tasty-they-are-5201538
https://www.c21media.net/news/prime-video-launches-covertly-filmed-doc-on-animal-cruelty-at-spanish-lab/#
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1m5vqNPLekg
https://www.huntsabs.org.uk/one-less-hare-hunt-as-south-west-beagle-packs-merge/
https://www.countryside-alliance.org/news-content-type/animal-rights-activists-sentenced-over-dairy-blockade
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cwyrnlj5632o
https://www.newscientist.com/article/2486509-vegan-cheese-could-be-about-to-get-a-lot-closer-to-the-real-thing/
https://www.theanimalreader.com/2025/06/27/mexico-votes-to-stop-dolphin-and-umarine-animal-shows/
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Thanks everyone for listening; give us a rating and drop us a message to say "hi"; it'll make our day!
Carlos, Julie, Paul & Ant
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Transcript
Introduction to Vegan Week
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everyone, welcome to your one-stop shop for vegan and animal rights news. I'm Anthony, joining me for this episode are Carlos, Julie and Paul. But that is enough of the falafel, it's time for Vegan Week.
00:00:14
Speaker
So I think vegans go looking for trouble even when they're not looking for trouble. That's not what butter's used for. Brrrr! Take your lab-grown meat elsewhere. We're not doing that in the state of Florida. What about your protein and what about your iron levels? Should I call the media and say, hi, sorry? They're arguing like, oh, poor woe is me.
00:00:34
Speaker
Hang on a minute. You always pick
00:00:41
Speaker
of social injustice has connection another. That's just what people think vegans eat anyway. As long as you didn't get the wee brunions with the horns you'll be alright. Does veganism give him superpowers?
00:00:57
Speaker
I cannot fly around the city. I don't have laser vision.
Vegan Misconceptions and Fishing Debate
00:01:01
Speaker
Hello, hello, you lovely listeners. My name is Carlos and you're much welcome to Enough of the Falafel podcast and thanks so much for being here.
00:01:09
Speaker
Hello, everyone. This is Paul. For all new listeners out there, just to let you know that this is our new show. This is where we look at the week's news for vegan and animal rights news.
00:01:20
Speaker
And that's about it. Hello, everybody. Julie here. But that's enough of the falafel. Let's hear what's been going on in the news this week.
00:01:34
Speaker
For more details on the upcoming news stories, including links to our original source material, check out our show notes for this episode, available on your podcast player.
00:01:47
Speaker
Okay, we have got a very eclectic group of news stories this week all over the globe, all different types of stories. We are starting off right in between France and the south coast of England, the island of Jersey, where the headline from the Jersey Evening Post says, Jersey move to allow charter fishing for bluefin tuna criticised by UK animal rights groups.
00:02:13
Speaker
So this is the news that um despite lots of Seemingly positive progress for for bluefin tuna coming back into Jersey's waters and things like this. Some catch and release charter trips are due to take place in the island for a three-month period between August and October.
00:02:33
Speaker
This news came from Environment Minister Steve Luce. I think that's how you say it, Luce. Steve, anyway, the Environment Minister Steve. told politicians at the most recent state sitting. Up to five businesses would be given permits, with two having already expressed interest.
00:02:51
Speaker
But, as the headline ah suggested, Animal Aid ah said that they were dismayed by the plans. Rob Hill, who's a campaign manager for them, said rather than being quick to re-exploit these incredible fishes whose population numbers only recovered through strict restrictions on commercial fishing, including sport angling pressures, we say leave them be.
00:03:16
Speaker
And really, Julie, that has to be the the stance from a vegan or an animal rights point of view. It's it's leave them be. And gosh, isn't it pathetic that people can't just, they don' they're not even eating them, are they? They're catching them, throwing them back and giving them a bit of torture along the way. It's horrid. So firstly, shout out to Rob Hell of Animal Aid for picking up on this.
00:03:35
Speaker
And boo to Steve Luz. You deserve to get your name mispronounced, but it is in fact Luz, the Environment Minister. Catch and release charter trips.
00:03:47
Speaker
Do you know, we have got a lot of entertainment options these days, so let's not be primitive here, huh? Catch and release charter trips. despite what it's called, still kills fish very frequently through suffocation and it harms all fish that are you and abused through it. The hooks go through their sensitive mouths and And fishies' mouths are like, there they're not just their mouths, they're their arms. They're the way they experience their environment. They're the way they communicate and check things out and all the rest of it.
00:04:26
Speaker
And once they've had a big sharp hook, through there and then removed skillfully or otherwise they're scarred and injured for life as i said they can still be suffocated in the process of being pulled out of their environment for a length of time and Their beautiful, sensitive bodies are covered in scales, which are very easily damaged by us clumsy humans.
00:04:55
Speaker
And that leads them to a be at risk of fungal infections. If you look online, there's a lot of steps to take to, you know, to do this catch and release with best practice.
00:05:10
Speaker
But how many people are realistically going to do all that that are on a jolly on their holidays, you know? And the bottom line in my book is you wouldn't get away with doing this to children or adults, hooking them through the inside of their mouth for fun.
00:05:26
Speaker
So please do not do it to animals either. You know, if there's anybody out there who it's only their absolute lust for fishing that is coming in between them and being a reasonable, non-violent person,
00:05:42
Speaker
lovely vegan person if they just can't quit it they've just got this craving to do it I have some alternatives to suggest that I think you're gonna like firstly if you want to to sort of enact the whole fishing experience a quick google will let you see some wonderful things online with magnetic fishing and you can fill up a paddling pool and hook things and there's all kinds of fun to be had. They're amazing looking things. There's some kind of wee aqua play water park thing that even I felt quite tempted by.
00:06:20
Speaker
So there we go. That's there for you, but also more kind of closer to the whole experience. if you want to fish for something out of the sea or out of a river why not pull out things that shouldn't be there in the first place there's quite a lot of plastic in the sea and there's shopping trolleys and things in rivers now that would be very clever very skillful very rewarding and useful
00:06:55
Speaker
And if you happen to be male and fishing is the thing that ticks your proving your manliness box, I don't think there's anything more attractive or more manly than hooking a whole load of trash out of the sea with your fishing rod.
00:07:10
Speaker
I think that would be marvellous. Yeah. Amen to that. there's There's a future that we can aspire to. And like you say, Julie, it's just habits, isn't it? Like, I think if we had a vegan world and then someone said, oh, can I still just go and hoik these fish out and put them back? You'd just be like, what are we talking about? why Why would you do that? That's just absurd.
00:07:32
Speaker
You know, you're not even going to eat it. So, yeah, let's let's indulge in these different
Diet Comparisons: Plant-Based vs. Mediterranean
00:07:37
Speaker
hobbies, too. I saw I don't know if any of you saw there was a BBC and there's a a fishing program with. Oh, gosh, I can't think of the comedians now. Bob Mortimer and Paul Whitehouse.
00:07:48
Speaker
And and one of them was ill and they got Lee Mack on it instead. And Lee Mack identifies as vegan and he used one of those magnetic techniques. fishing things julie and he was doing that instead oh oh my goodness the the comment section was full of gammons who are not happy with this but uh it's the future so get with the time fishers anyway thank you for that one julie like i said we are gonna bop around a whole range of different stories so we are going to a study now that has been publicized this week it's been publicized in the independent newspaper amongst other places and
00:08:22
Speaker
um It was published in the journal called Frontiers in Nutrition. And whilst health studies about plant-based diets aren't necessarily directly about animal rights, we do know that ah the kind of health benefits of a plant-based diet can often attract people to try it out. And then when they're not engaged in the oppressive behavior on their plate anyway, um they can come round to accept that what they were doing to animals um to to eat before was perhaps horrid and maybe they ought not to go back to it.
00:08:55
Speaker
Anyway, what did the study say? Well, they were comparing a plant-based diet with the so-called Mediterranean diet, one that includes moderate amounts of fish, poultry, dairy and eggs.
00:09:06
Speaker
And in fact, it's is one of those where a lot of people will say, oh, you know, i know know I should reduce my red meat, but but actually, you know, I do still have eggs because they are good for you. Anyway, the summary of this was basically that the the plant-based diet did much better in terms of helping to promote weight loss and creating a healthy gut microbiome.
00:09:30
Speaker
That is according to Hannah Kaleova, who was a co-author of the study. There's a link in the show notes for those of you who are interested in all the all the details of of studies like this, but there was an interesting focus on making the body less acidic and more alkalized. So eating foods like broccoli, beets, asparagus, garlic, carrots, cantaloupe melons, and the like. And as I've already said, there was a noticeable weight loss difference. Obviously, weight loss is not always a good thing, but um in this study, participants who were following the plant-based diet
00:10:08
Speaker
lost up to 5 kilograms compared with no change on the Mediterranean diet. Carlos, you've had a little look at this one, the kind of focus on acidic versus alkali did did make me think like people who see this and think, oh I'm going to follow this. It sounds like the kind of diet that that folk might do for a little bit and then then just go back to whatever they were doing before. Because to to me, it seems a bit convoluted, but maybe I'm quite ignorant. I don't know.
00:10:35
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, there's more to it than it first looks. I mean, For starters, the the vegan diet that they they had was a specifically low-fat vegan diet. I'm always very wary when when there's commentary on news about a vegan diet because I know so many vegans and we all eat different eat different things. And some are fat, some are thin, some are athletic, some are...
00:10:56
Speaker
couch potatoes, others, you know, are maybe not in the best of health. Some are incredibly healthy, you know, it's just, you know, there's like all sorts of vegan diets out there. As long as it's based on plants, it doesn't include animal products. That's a vegan diet, as far as I'm concerned.
00:11:11
Speaker
This study was specifically for a low fat vegan diet. And yeah, all that you said was true. So the the fact that over those 16 weeks, the vegan group did lose weight which in the context of this article is seen as a good thing because that was kind of part of, let's say, the intentions.
00:11:28
Speaker
And there was a big change in the the balance between alkaline and acidic contents of the food and and the gut and so and so forth. Generally, it's seen that having ah balance a pH balance more towards alkaline is a better thing.
00:11:44
Speaker
So that was good as well. I'll also interject that having been born in a so-called Mediterranean country, A lot of this stuff about the Mediterranean diet is an invention of people who who who don't live in the Mediterranean and like to imagine all these very slim and and and athletic and nice looking, swarthy, permanently tanned, um beautiful Mediterranean people going about when in fact, you know, there's like huge, you know, kind of obesity levels in Southern Europe are
00:12:19
Speaker
pretty much like for like with Northern Europe, cancers, et cetera, like exactly the same as you'd expect in any other kind of country with a similar GDP and healthcare care coverage. So a lot of it is kind of you know kind of the idea of a mediterranean diet is not even Something i would I would say is correct. But yeah, this is this is good news. And I think it's another study.
00:12:39
Speaker
We know that, I mean, in an ideal world, we'd convert all the vegans to be vegan through the animal argument, animal liberation and welfare argument.
00:12:49
Speaker
But a lot of people do worry about their health when they convert to a plant-based diet. and this is just another study that kind of that we can quote as well yeah absolutely and i i thought it was quite nice that it was uh deliberately comparing and contrasting between that diet that's often cited as a yeah plant-based is good but actually that mediterranean diet yeah that's that's better because it it lets me have more of the things that i want yeah the mediterranean diet supposedly the most the healthiest of all the kind of let's call them
00:13:23
Speaker
omnivo diets but if even that one is not as healthy as a plant-based diet as a low fat Yes, yes, indeed. Indeed.
Film Review and Animal Testing
00:13:31
Speaker
And like I say, link in the show notes for all of you who would like to follow up and read more about that one.
00:13:36
Speaker
Right. Before we go into the next story, Paul, can I just ask, do you speak any Spanish? ah Merci. Well, it's that level of acumen that led me to think that it would be great to send Paul the trailer for a Spanish speaking film with no subtitles ah to have a look at that has been given a worldwide release this week. It Amazon-owned Prime Video who have put it out.
00:14:02
Speaker
It features covertly filmed footage from a Spanish laboratory. um it's cut The translation is undercover inside the bunker. I'm not going to try and pronounce it in Spanish because I'll insult people.
00:14:15
Speaker
um And it tells the story of undercover investigator Carlota Saoza, who is now a protected witness, who the the blurb says sacrificed everything, risked her life to show the world the harsh reality she experienced over two years inside the animal testing lab.
00:14:35
Speaker
We put a link to this little press release. and to a YouTube video of the three and a half minutes or so ah trailer. It is in Spanish. I tried to put subtitles on and I just got Spanish subtitles.
00:14:48
Speaker
But you can nonetheless, Paul, see the horror of what has been going on, has been documented. And what an incredible feat for somebody to go undercover for that amount of time and and collect this. Goodness me.
00:15:02
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think the first thing here to mention, I think it's good to see that you've got streaming services like Amazon Prime. And as we've, I think, with Netflix as well, supporting yet another documentary that's pro animal rights. I think we've seen quite a few now in the past, which is really good.
00:15:18
Speaker
So that's that's ah' a really good thing. Perhaps not so much we've seen in the past on traditional yeah UK events. TV stations. yeah and Yet again, it's taken an individual, a brave individual, to go undercover to work and expose these horror and horrors that are hidden away from the from the public.
00:15:37
Speaker
I suppose the question I've got is you know ah are people going to watch it? Because I wondered if it might be too graphic. But having looked at the three minute or so um YouTube clip, it his it was a bit difficult to follow because of the Spanish. It seemed very much like a first person Blair Witch Project type camera work but you saw the animal holding facilities which were obviously not nice and some of the treatment that you're seeing dished out to the animals is is very aggressive but it it wasn't gory I suppose my question is I wonder what the rest of the footage is going to be like because if it's
00:16:13
Speaker
If it goes to its kind of ultimate end, which I assume yeah would be the actual testing, that's going to be pretty horrific. And I know that you know some people who are vegan or not vegan will not watch that because of that sort of content. So I'm quite interested to see where they go with it. Would they aim for the more sanitized version that might be upsetting but not like graphic? Or would they go for sort of full on it to so really show actually what happens? So very interested to see where the full documentary goes.
00:16:42
Speaker
um And yeah, as I say, it was difficult to gauge where that's going to go, given that the relatively short clip. I wonder, I completely get where you're coming from with that.
00:16:54
Speaker
If it was animal ag, I think I would be more inclined to think that people would put their head in the sand. but i but But because it is directly saying, you know, that thing that you ate for your lunch. Well, yeah. how Yeah. there Whereas i I think there could almost be a little bit of denial from somebody to think, oh, you know, the same kind of people who are into true crime and like exposés and things like that. i I wonder whether you would get quite a large audience that's like, oh man, let's let's see some of the crazy stuff that's going on in in labs, like conspiracy theory to type type type things, and be at the outset, maybe a little bit disassociated
00:17:33
Speaker
from that and kind of think well i'm not involved in that you know i don't contribute towards that hopefully by the end of the documentary folk would be educated to realize how if if at all they are complicit in these things and they might be supporting it but um yeah yeah i thought it was interesting i saw on like the taglines of the trailer that they'd kind of like called it a horror like that it was it was being put down in like the horror genre and i mean it's interesting how you could market these things as a as a true crime thing or as a true horror or something like that it might get a much bigger
00:18:07
Speaker
audience and i know somebody that watched earthlings before they became vegan thinking that it was about aliens they're like oh i i like watching films about aliens i'll watch this and they say that turned them vegan i don't know whether that's true but that's what they told me interesting but yes that one should be out uh now for people who have prime videos so uh anyone wants to give that a watch and let's know what they thought of the full version and indeed of this uh English subtitles for those of us without conversational Spanish, then do get in touch.
00:18:40
Speaker
Right. Julie, your next story. I've clicked the link. I'm on Farming UK. The headline says ah RSPCA Assured unveils stricter poultry welfare rules for 2025.
00:18:52
Speaker
And then there's a lovely picture of all these chickens outdoors. They're in the grass. They're under a big tree. So i I assume the story is saying that that That's it now. All poultry, outdoors, in the grass, big trees, free range.
00:19:07
Speaker
that's That's what the story
RSPCA and Poultry Welfare
00:19:08
Speaker
is saying, right? Yeah, that's what the story is saying. And the story also opens with the phrase, RSPCA cracking down on chicken welfare.
00:19:20
Speaker
i hope it's not just a crappy pun they're using, but i think it probably is. But there is very bad journalism because usually you crack down on something that's undesirable. People talk about cracking down on crime, but they're giving themselves away by saying that they're cracking down on chicken welfare. We're not having any more of that nonsense anymore. Yeah, exactly. There's not a hope of any chicken welfare going on here.
00:19:49
Speaker
And um and they they follow that statement up with the the explanation that they're bringing in tougher new standards.
00:20:00
Speaker
to reshape how poultry are cared for from September 2025. Tougher new standards. It's not going to be difficult because the current ones are so low as to be non-existent. So that's not very ambitious, but there you go.
00:20:17
Speaker
Not going to be a big change, really. I wondered what you thought about that that. There were some bits in there that were predictable, I thought, in terms of you know, antibiotic use and oh now you've got to have verandas or or things like that. So the usual talking about size and you need an etc extra square inch now and and things like that. The bit that kind of surprised me, worried me, Carlos and i we've spoken about this before on a vegan talk episode, was that there seemed to be a big focus on AI and kind of it almost seemed to be saying what we're going to do is use lots of artificial intelligence. Now um they kept saying to detect welfare issues in real time during processing. I mean, read that during them being killed, but done through artificial intelligence. And like, in a sense that, that draws attention to the inhumanity of it, doesn't it?
00:21:11
Speaker
That it's, it's basically, we're going to be asking robots to check information. if these animals are okay, um that's going fine. We don't even have to look now. We don't even have to Is that how you read it or am I being a bit?
00:21:23
Speaker
Well, I thought, you know, all these things that are just recommendations, they may as well just save their breath and their typefaces for that.
00:21:35
Speaker
But this and more use of cameras while these little innocent beings are being abused and then killed, that's not going to make any difference to these wee animals.
00:21:49
Speaker
You know what i mean? You don't make an abuse better by filming it more, you know? Absolutely not. No, no, no. It just sounds like, well, you know, they've maybe got a bit of ah but money coming their way to use some AI or jobs for the boys or something.
00:22:07
Speaker
So, yeah, that's not helping. And just kind of going back to the whole antibiotic thing, Yes, that will perhaps make a difference for the chickens thumb themselves, but the main beneficiaries of that change in policy will be people, be humans. It's better for the people ingesting these little animals that there isn't some level of antibiotic resistance going along with their chips anymore.
00:22:36
Speaker
you know, and whatever. So that's going to benefit the consumer, I would say. And the whole thing about verandas as well, again, just a recommendation, it doesn't sound, you know, like these birds are in a very natural environment. And going back to your comment about the photograph that's probably been photoshopped, where they're all under a kind of hawthorn tree or something like that,
00:23:05
Speaker
where's the veranda and that you know they're outside so I just think it's kind of trying that it seems like this RSPCA assured scheme are just trying to get people on board with them and on their side look we're doing our job everybody and And keeping in with the consumer and keeping in with the chicken abuser rearing people, you know, it's like, oh, yeah, we'll we'll make you look good and encourage people to buy your product if you join our RSPCA Assured scheme. It's marketing this, I think.
00:23:46
Speaker
Yeah, and a a very clear-cut case of it, I think, of all the stuff I've seen from ah RSPCA Assured. This is the most... blatant humane washing and the gall of some of the phrases they're using.
00:23:58
Speaker
Oh, we're improving the lives of millions of farmed animals. It's like, you're not. You're not. You're sanctioning them to be, well, maybe not sanctioning, you're allowing them to be killed. You're rubber stamping it, aren't you? The AI stuff is a bit of a nonsense as well, because um if that's going to maybe identify birds that haven't moved for a particular amount of time, it still relies on human action to go and look at that. And we know looking at sheds that are out there now, chickens are just left to die and rot on the floor anyway. So it's still, it doesn't mean that people are going to act on that.
00:24:29
Speaker
And I would say that that sort of technology is probably going to be used more efficiencies for profit rather than welfare. Yeah, absolutely. But the bottom line is, you know, this is the RSPCA and the C stands for cruelty and all the rest of it.
00:24:45
Speaker
And I think we can all agree that to bring any little being into the world as nothing more than a commodity... and give them an existence where their needs are secondary to ours, or just completely ignored in many cases, and where their wee bodies are violated, and, you know, whichever way suits us, and then our lives, sorry, their lives are ended,
00:25:17
Speaker
That can't be anything other than cruelty. Doesn't matter how you do it. Doesn't matter what cameras you do or don't use. Doesn't matter what antibiotics you give them or don't or whatever living conditions.
00:25:29
Speaker
If that's your purpose, then that is cruelty. Important to get that message out there as many times as possible, isn't it? Because people need to hear it amidst the amidst the humane washing.
Burger King and Vegan Marketing
00:25:41
Speaker
Now, normally when I'm researching for the show and finding news stories, I do have quite a strict policy on not featuring stories from multinational companies who are releasing a new product and it's being put out there as news and it's just a press release. I just kind of think...
00:25:57
Speaker
Do you know what? They've got advertising budgets themselves that they can spend. I'm not going to do more free marketing for them. However, this one has popped up in a few places this week and it feels a little different to me. And I've asked Carlos to have a look at it. I respect Carlos's opinion on these sorts of things. So I'm wondering what he's going to say. It comes to us from the Scotsman, amongst other places, and they report that Burger King is giving away free vegan burgers to meat lovers to show them how tasty they are. This is their squad of plant-based persuaders, led by the Only Way is Essex legend and proud vegetarian,
00:26:39
Speaker
ah Pete Wicks. um So basically the whole piece is ah ah you know a PR piece and there's Pete looking all manly and, oh, I've got my Burger King. And he's got his plant-based persuaders, little thing for his motorbike.
00:26:52
Speaker
And the the way that you can get this, they're not just sort of going out and finding meat eaters and saying, do you want one of these? If you spend £20 on Uber Eats or Just Eat, so it's for their delivery stuff,
00:27:05
Speaker
you get offered ah totally free vegan royale, which is is one of their burgers. If you're listening to this show in a timely fashion um in the UK, you've got until tomorrow to to get this done because the offer is only available until July the 8th.
00:27:22
Speaker
But nonetheless, Carlos, I thought this was a little different to Greg saying, oh, look, the no steak bake is back. Well, I'm not interested. That's that's fine. But this one's an interesting one because there's there's almost, obviously it's Burger King. Obviously they profit from animal exploitation, but there's almost a bit of advocacy going on saying, look, it actually tastes all right. Come on, try it.
00:27:43
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, what ah imagining we went out as a vegan company and wanted to do something but to encourage people to try vegan burgers, we'd probably do something similar.
00:27:56
Speaker
And, you know, if you're a vegan already and for some reason you're ordering the vegan option from Burger King, you get you're just get a free burger. but So you yeah you get more vegan food from Burger King. Obviously, you know, you know there's always like this dilemma about, you know, if if you it's just marketing, is Burger King actually interested? We we know, you know let's you know, let's be honest, most...
00:28:19
Speaker
almost all the times no company's interested in doing something for the good of it. They just like some sort of marketing angle or some sort of shift in production, or maybe the profit margins are bigger on the vegan burger than on their meat-based products.
00:28:32
Speaker
Really hard to tell, but we can almost be sure that they're not doing this from the goodness of their hearts or any care for the animals. But what this will do is that it's a massive advertising budget on a campaign that most vegan companies would not have this sort of advertising and capacity to give potentially tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of free vegan burgers across the country.
00:28:54
Speaker
Imagine if it was a vegan company doing that, we'd all be, you know, singing their praises. um I don't think but Burger King needs needs us to sing their praises, but, um you know, by all means, yeah, great. It will mean a lot of people trying vegan burgers. Maybe they will go, well, this is all right, actually.
00:29:11
Speaker
And that kind of sets them on their journey. We've as part of this show, the Enough of the Falafel, we've had lots of different stories about how people became vegans. And for some for some of us, it's been, you know, i I just happened to try this thing and I thought, oh, this is all right. There's no difference to won won' impact my life negatively to have this instead of meat. So I will just kind of try become a vegetarian, then a vegan and so on. So this I would say is a good thing. And I wish other non vegan fast food companies did the same.
00:29:43
Speaker
will just say that there's also buried in the article that this is a collaboration partnership with the vegetarian butcher. So that means more money is going into the vegetarian butcher, which can only again, can only be a good thing.
00:29:55
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I'd take something you were saying a bit further. You were saying that, you know, the they' they're cynical, they're money grabbers, they don't care about the animals. I'd say actually they probably don't care that much about burgers or meat and it actually that they're a capitalist company. And if you told Burger King, well, actually you can make more money from plant-based burgers.
00:30:16
Speaker
I don't think they'd care. they that that like as as in They wouldn't care dropping the meat. No, absolutely They just want to make as much money as possible. if If they found out that they could make more money by selling protractors and um cleaning fluids and toothbrushes, then they'd swap to that. I think they're a money-making business. And actually, if things like this help them see that there's a feasible market, that They'll just follow the money.
00:30:42
Speaker
The shareholders will not let them get away with it if if there was more money to be made in as a plant-based company rather than mostly animal-based company, animal product-based company. The shareholders will definitely go, no, you you missing you're missing a trick just because of being meat absolutists.
00:31:01
Speaker
Yeah, I think that's that's why these options are ah are appearing in all these menus everywhere. Yes, absolutely. And my guess would be that they're trying to appeal to manliness and and things like that with their with their picture of what's his face,
Beagle Hunting and Its Decline
00:31:16
Speaker
Pete Wicks. But I mean, just look through Instagram, Burger King, there's plenty of manly looking men that could pose with you with your thing that are vegan.
00:31:24
Speaker
And then they'll make a quote about going vegan because ah his he did make a quote saying, oh, you don't even have to go veggie or whatever. It's like, stop saying veggie. It's vegan. It's a vegan burger. Anyway, anyway, good stuff. We'll take it. I think we'll take it.
00:31:39
Speaker
Last little story that I've made mandatory for the folk to talk about before we hear their picks for the week is coming to Paul and it's from the Hunt Saboteurs Association. We've already reported on, I think, three or four similar such stories in the last few months.
00:31:54
Speaker
This is the news that the Clifton and Infantry Beagles is a new beagle hunting group. and you might think, well, why is that good news? Well, it's because the two Southwest Beagle Packs have merged to form this one.
00:32:11
Speaker
So basically the two original Beagle hunting packs. that This is the Wiltshire and Infantry Beagles and the Chilmack and Clifton Foot Beagles.
00:32:21
Speaker
We can infer from this that both of them were struggling so to form together is the only way that they can keep doing their sordid habit which shows that it's on the decline that there is pressure and all of these things um the hunt sabs say they've been hearing rumors that all was not well at the wiltshire and infantry beagles and that they were seeking an amalgamation the loss of a large part of their country on the salisbury plain due to the ministry of defense stopping licenses for hunts to use their land and the constant worry of Sabs turning up are thought to be major factors.
00:32:56
Speaker
Paul, obviously it's not great that these things are still happening. I mean, we'd we'd like to say that they've amalgamated to form zero ah hunting groups, but nonetheless, it does seem like it's part of a trend and part of the process that we want to see.
00:33:11
Speaker
Yeah, I think we've seen, i I think probably the last time was on the show, there was a similar story like this where um maybe maybe even like three people Three hunts had amalgamated or something like that and others had closed and like you say, it's all, it's not stated but assumed to be that they're struggling perhaps with resources that could be money, membership, etc.
00:33:31
Speaker
So yeah, good news story certainly on the on the face of things. I guess... My only thought is that if you've got two packs that are merging like this, obviously the later on in the article, it says that the area they cover, and it sounds pretty, pretty big.
00:33:48
Speaker
And I don't know if that then makes hunt sub activity more tricky in terms of tracking them down and finding and trying to stop, stop them or even just monitor. So there's that bit as well.
00:34:00
Speaker
And whether, you know, emerging, they then become more successful down the line possibly. yeah, that There's a danger that they're not just gonna it's not going to be necessarily a downward spiral We hope it is but it it might it might mean that they gain some success from it, and which is obviously what what they hope to do. So yeah, hopefully positive, but um yeah, I don't know. um Others might have a comment on whether it's more difficult when they um have to cover such a ah ah large area for for the actual subbing activity on it.
00:34:27
Speaker
Yeah, i've I've subbed a few Beagle Packs before. i wouldn't worry about that. I mean, the only danger of with Beagle Pack or the only difficulty in subbing a Beagle Pack is finding out where they are because they're not on horseback, so they're very hard to spot. Like, you know, imagine like hilly terrain.
00:34:43
Speaker
And if you've got somebody on a horse, they're much easier to see from afar than then somebody on foot. Also, there's fewer ah people and you and there's no field. So there's nobody kind of watching the Beagle Pack do its work except for the huntsmen themselves, usually.
00:34:57
Speaker
So they're just much harder to spot. So the you just really need to know where they are. And then it doesn't matter if the they kind of have twice as many possible lands to hunt on or not.
00:35:09
Speaker
Usually amalgamations happen. I mean, sometimes it's and these amalgamations are not real amalgamations. It's just that one of the packs was completely, you know, people just lost the will to hunt or just got too old for it, which on a beagle pack is a real concern because they're really old people most of the times.
00:35:30
Speaker
And it's it's seen as a sort of saving face exercise where you say, oh, we amalgamated when in fact it's you know it's a one pack so it's completely packed in you know literally just packed it in and it says, no, no, we amalgamated with this other one. We're still but still going, they're keeping the tradition going. But in fact, you know there's like maybe one person from the previous hunt that's now defunct now goes with the other pack or maybe like five dogs were brought into the pack from the other pack or something like that. it it's usually not It's usually a bad very bad sign when they amalgamate. And we've seen multiple cases where it's like two hunts amalgamate and then another third hunt amalgamates and then they they just disappear the following season. It just kind of just kind of snowballs from there. So this is undoubtedly good news. I should say, though, that beagle backhunting has no legal loopholes like the Hunting Act gives to trail hunting.
00:36:25
Speaker
So it's always a crime a crime and very easy to prove. The problem is finding them and you know as soon as we arrive i say we we the huntsabs arrive they always pack up they never even pretend to be doing something legal there's nothing legal there's no way to make legal what they do or hide what they do so um this is uh this is an activity that um you know we're just careful monitoring and showing up you know it could end very soon i hope sounding like that it's sounding like that they're uh getting
00:36:56
Speaker
herded into a corner to use their own language. um Right, listeners, make yourself a cup of tea, have a look out the window, do something like that for a few seconds. we're going to take a quick break. When we come back, we're going to hear Julie ampo and Paul and Carlos's pick for the week.
00:37:11
Speaker
As well as producing these audio-based shows, our podcast hosts at Zencaster also provide the written transcript for each show. This is AI generated, so it might not always be 100% correct, but nonetheless, we
Animal Rights Activism and Legal Challenges
00:37:27
Speaker
hope that this will increase the accessibility of our show. So to access any of these written transcripts, head over to zencaster.com forward slash...
00:37:38
Speaker
vegan week. going to spell it all for you. Zencastr is z-e-n-c-a-s-t-r.com and then a forward slash and then the word vegan, v-e-g-a-n, then a hyphen and then week.
00:37:53
Speaker
Zencastr.com forward slash vegan hyphen week and then each transcript is embedded with any of the shows that you click on.
00:38:05
Speaker
Okay, let's come to you, Carlos, first, if that is okay. um We've taken this story from the Countryside Alliance because sometimes it's interesting to hear from the other side, but it is related to Animal Rising, specifically some protesters. And I think it's fair to say that it's not good news.
00:38:22
Speaker
Yeah, so this is the news that six activists from Animal Rising, which some listeners might have known as Animal Rebellion, which was its old name, were sentenced in June 2025 for their role in a high-profile 2022 protest that shut down Mueller-Derry site in Droitage.
00:38:41
Speaker
Each was sentenced to 60 hours of unpaided community work in order to pay over fifty six thousand pounds in compensation. It was part of a broader campaign called Stop the Supply, aimed at disrupting the dairy industry's operations to highlight the cruelty and environmental damage inherent in animal agriculture.
00:39:00
Speaker
So this is a pretty extraordinary case because they were originally acquitted and then there was an appeal and then they were um considered guilty by the appeal which was then you know ah recently It caused also kind of shows how courts might act when there's a disruptive but non-violent activism happening, like a direct action ah that targets the food system that has actual monetary implications. So you know there was actual, their operations kind of shut down while the protest and this action was happening.
00:39:38
Speaker
And so there's like a measurable financial loss. And that's what then ended up being being the charge laying on the activists. It's very harsh, ah not the 60 hours of unpaid community work, but the £56,000. Clearly, this was one of those cases where the judge felt very comfortable or confident in saying, well, this is how much money they lost because of your activity. So this is how much money you'll pay as compensation.
00:40:04
Speaker
It does set the precedent that hopefully doesn't deter ah further activists from acting, but it needs it really needs to be borne in mind when when actions are planned.
00:40:16
Speaker
Well, I mean, you can definitely see how and why it would put somebody off. And I assume that's why they've, they've presumably, Mueller's lawyers have gone in so hard for it. I mean, um'm Carlos and and Kate and myself have recorded a show that will be out next week on Vegan Week where we're talking about different punishments for animal-related crime, um but but not you know not things where people are are protesting and actually comparing some of those figures and victim surcharges. I mean, these are more then than the fines that are being handed out to people who are doing unspeakable things to animals.
00:40:55
Speaker
Yeah, it's it's pretty sickening to to read, really, isn't it? Yeah, it just, ah I mean, you could you could literally abuse animals and get, and get you know, the fines will be less. You know, we' so we so we've talked about recently about, you know, fox hunters guilty of basically setting their dogs' river part of fox.
00:41:16
Speaker
and that's And usually what they pay in fines is something like £600. So, you know, just that, just... the And in this case, no animals were harmed, no humans were harmed, crucially. And it's ah quite a lot of money and a criminal record, of course, which kind of deters people from, will stop people from you know seeking lots of kinds of jobs and you know will show up when they apply for a mortgage and or apply to rent a place, et cetera, et cetera. So it kind of know kind of marks their lives.
00:41:44
Speaker
for something which essentially home only had financial impact. Yeah. I wonder whether the name of the campaign made it harder to defend in court. You know, it's literally called Stop the Supply.
00:41:56
Speaker
So their intentions are clear. You know, it's it ah maybe that makes it harder to sort of argue, well, you know, we're just which peacefully resisting or whatever. You know, is is it was just an accident. We didn't really mean to but uh yeah it was pretty hard to defend yeah i mean as most of these actions are well yeah but but that said i mean animal rising this is their bread and butter isn't it and of course all all of us will make mistakes that we'll learn from and we're we're all trying our best with the information we've got um they'll certainly know a lot more than me about what you know what makes a good strategy for a campaign or a bit of direct action but um
00:42:35
Speaker
Yeah, real shame for these activists who are just doing their best to make the world a better place and and have the courage to try and do so directly. hope the um Hope the impact that has been handed out from those sentences won't affect them too adversely.
00:42:52
Speaker
And for too long. Thank you for that one, Carlos. Julie, let's move on to your pick for the week. We are going to have a yeah ah positive one from Paul to finish off with, but your one isn't particularly positive either. it's it's It's from the BBC, from the RSPCA saying that animal cruelty reports have risen and risen by a third over the course of a year.
00:43:14
Speaker
Yeah, so this is the RSPCA kindness index for 2025.
00:43:23
Speaker
And it's taking stats that have been gathered by the RSPCA, which covers England and Wales. and the SSPCA, which is in Scotland, and the USPCA, which is in Northern Ireland.
00:43:38
Speaker
So their findings, first of all, were that 71% of Brits see themselves as animal lovers, up from 69% from 2024, 89% from twenty twenty four eighty nine percent among young people and children.
00:44:00
Speaker
So you would think with those figures, you know, we're all getting kinder and you would expect that the and reported animal...
00:44:11
Speaker
sort of cruelty cases and and things like that would drop. But no sadly, that hasn't been the case. And, you know, as you will see from the report, these crimes against animals have increased this year.
00:44:27
Speaker
ah don't know, they haven't given any particular... reason for this to be the case. Animal cruelty cases are more, the reports of them are higher over the summer as a whole apparently because more people are out and about and these crimes are more visible.
00:44:45
Speaker
There is also a theory which is really quite frightening that Animal cruelty in general towards pets, because that's what we're talking about mainly here, I think, from the RSPCA, goes up in the summer because people who are parents are coping with children at home.
00:45:02
Speaker
And they're under more pressure and that might mean that they're more cruel to their pets. And you think, that's horrible. What a frightening thought that is. Well, it did make me think that actually when you were talking about the the survey of people who identify as animal lovers, surely people who are having companion animals in their lives in in the first place would would identify as animal lovers.
00:45:27
Speaker
And it's just a case of people getting in over their head, them not realizing how their temperament would respond to it, how other parts of their life like it's to me, I think it's the real problem is people just seeing it as a disposable thing that they can buy and they can just have instantly.
00:45:47
Speaker
without really thinking through the consequences. i would I would have thought that covers most cases that are reported. But I mean, the the figures are frightening, absolutely frightening.
00:46:01
Speaker
So I mean, this is kind of quite good PR for the RSPCA, this article, and or reading the report itself, because It does show them doing something for animals. You know, we we we don't like their RSPC assured stuff, but they're saying here they received 34,401 cruelty reports between June and August.
00:46:28
Speaker
in 2024 up from 25,787 the same period the year before. mean, that is a lot of cruelty cases to be following up from from a fairly small population. You know, England, we're just talking about England and Wales now for the RSPCA, their work.
00:46:50
Speaker
That's a lot of animal cruelty. It's massive. The government is alleged to have said, All cases of animal cruelty are unacceptable. Well, m some of it is completely legislated for and endorsed and celebrated and all the rest of it, I would say. When we're talking about cruelty, there are three main kinds according to the RSPCA.
00:47:15
Speaker
Neglect is the biggest one, 65,545. Animals left unattended or abandoned, people...
00:47:26
Speaker
and intentional harm you know people battering animals or doing these kind of horrible things that's 15,524 cases it's it cases ah is absolutely shocking and it flies in the face of these stats about people identifying as animal lovers I was just gonna say I do wonder with these questions whether they whether they should really follow up that question about animal lovers directly with one that says do you pay for people to slaughter animals for you
00:47:56
Speaker
Yeah, oh absolutely Absolutely And also that there's another stat come out That 61% of people Think that the RSPCA Should prioritise protecting Wildlife Interestingly as well So and total Just no mention, nothing at all about animals and agriculture.
00:48:19
Speaker
It seems to be about pets and about wildlife. Animal welfare is apparently the British public's third most important issue.
00:48:31
Speaker
But again, I bet that's about pets and wildlife, not about animal agriculture. Anyway, I suppose to summarise or to to round it up, the thing that is the sort of hypocritical bit of this, well, there's quite a lot of it and that's hypocritical, but this survey does measure the number of people who are reducing their purchasing of animal products, you know, and that has, that's gone down.
00:49:03
Speaker
So there are more people out there saying they're animal lovers, but that there are more people out there buying the products of animal cruelty and slaughter and so that's a bit strange so it just shows you we've got a huge amount as if we didn't know to do to help people to make that link between what they believe in what their values are what kind of person they see themselves as being and the choices they make when they're shopping or in a restaurant or whatever
00:49:40
Speaker
I think there's another irony here as well. It's worth mentioning is that you look at the massive increase in calls to the RSPCA and you often read articles and people saying, oh, i tried to phone the RSPCA. They wouldn't come out or couldn't come out for a week or something like that. But they've got no appreciation that in in like where I live in Worcestershire, there's a massive area, huge area, and there's only funding for any two to three offices at any one point in time.
00:50:07
Speaker
So their caseload is massive. And when you say to these people, they say, but I think they expect it to be an emergency service and you know, well, it's not funded by a tax. So I do kind of sometimes think people, people want something for nothing. So if you want more than are you giving money to the RSPCA? Cause if you want that,
00:50:26
Speaker
then fund it. Well, so what or if it is voters third most important issue, then then have it funded by tax faith. what what Why don't we take the subsidies that go to Animal Act and just divert
Vegan Cheese Innovations
00:50:39
Speaker
that? Yeah, that'd be good. Why not? Yeah, that'd be good, isn't it?
00:50:42
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, indeed. I'd like to, I mean, i sometimes will come up with pie in the sky thoughts or hopes or or something like that. There is another alternative explanation to these this hike in figures and reported cases. And I'm not saying I think this is what is the case, but I would just put it out there.
00:51:00
Speaker
It could be that people are becoming less and less tolerant of abuse. And so when they see it, they're more likely to report it now that RSPCA... did a big campaign that I think we commented on in a story the at the the respect one where they had the Aretha Franklin R-E-S-P-E-C-T thing playing in the background that could be an explanation too maybe people are becoming less tolerant of certain types of animal abuse whilst of course still paying I'm sure there will be an element of that in the mix as well hopefully
00:51:34
Speaker
which is really really good yeah thank you for that one julie right as promised let's try and find something a bit more positive to talk about after featuring those two very important but not necessarily positive picks for the week paul has been looking at a story from new scientists i've heard that that this is a richard dawkins quote he is ah was told apparently by the editor of New Scientist, that their policy at New Scientist was science is interesting and if you don't agree, you can fuck off.
00:52:05
Speaker
So, Paul, what have New Scientist been saying about vegan cheese? It sounds like if you're ah if you're still wanting that cheesy fix, but you know it's not good and you're not having the dairy stuff,
00:52:16
Speaker
ah could be good news right yeah i mean yeah new scientists uh very esteemed publication i guess you know it's one that it's probably the one that most people call out that they've heard of um so it's good to have it in in that sort of um publication there's two two bits to this i think really there's a There's a sciencey bit and there's a sustainability bit.
00:52:37
Speaker
And then at the very tail end, there's a little tiny bit about animal welfare. um So, yeah, basically what this is saying is there's some scientific developments that I'm not going to go into too much detail about, but essentially...
00:52:49
Speaker
there has been research to produce a certain protein that used in dairy cheese production that has been a bit of a unattainable thing in the in the past but they now seem to have developed that so that would give us a chance of vegan cheese being well it's it's in this article it's billed as its kind of main benefit isn't to do with taste it's to do with the environmental impact it will reduce the ah c a element of it.
00:53:17
Speaker
But it's interesting in the article that it says, if you love cheese but feel guilty about its huge environmental impact. And I was thinking, I don't know anyone who likes cheese that thinks about the environmental impact. I can't think of anyone who's ever said that.
00:53:30
Speaker
So it seems like a slightly odd one. Not saying it's a bad thing, but I just can't say anyone saying, oh, um I might be giving up cheese because of its environmental impact. Weird one, I think. It does talk about how this, the sort of science behind producing this, this protein And it's not very pleasant, actually, because it talks about using bacteria and specifically e coli bacteria, which doesn't sound a great thing.
00:53:54
Speaker
So I think that might be slightly off-putting. E. coli, not typically associated with positive outcomes, I'm aware let the Daily Mail get hold of that one.
00:54:05
Speaker
Yeah. We've got it in our bodies anyway. It's all good. Oh, is it? All right. Okay. That's fine. You heard it here. Dr. Julie says fine. It's in the resuscitation room. Yeah. So, yeah, doesn't sound like a kind of yummy...
00:54:22
Speaker
kind of ah situation there but yeah it's all very much about science to produce it and the and the um and the then the saving in terms of sustainability and then very nearly at the very end of the article it says as well as eliminate animal welfare for issues I don't think it eliminates them but it sort of ah might help a little bit so yeah it's kind of an okay article fairly positive but not particularly not not particularly wholly vegan I think at the end of the day But at the end of the day, like cows don't care how their oppression stops. They just need it to stop, don't they?
00:54:57
Speaker
um Yeah. And um it's it's interesting, actually, in terms of like we've talked before on the show about the different kinds of activism that you can carry out. And there's there's someone, I mean, they're not necessarily vegan. There's probably a team of them.
00:55:11
Speaker
But what they're doing is could improve outcomes for animals because of their work looking at bacteria. You know, it's that there's all all different ways we can come to the party and and help the movement, aren't they?
00:55:25
Speaker
Fantastic stuff. Right. Well, thank you for that one, Paul. So that's been Paul's and Julie's and Carlos's pick for the week. We obviously really care about what you listeners think, though. So whether it's an opinion on something we've said, a new story that we've missed or just a completely different angle or you just want to say hello, here is how to get in touch with us.
Mexico's Dolphin Show Ban
00:55:47
Speaker
To get in touch with us, just send us an email at enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com. We see ourselves as a collective. our listenership stretches all around the world and everyone's opinions, questions, feedback and ideas are what helps shape the show.
00:56:06
Speaker
Go on, send us a message today. enough of the falafel at gmail dot com OK, just time for one last story. It comes to us from the Animal Reader and the headline is Mexico votes to stop dolphin and marine animal shows. That sounds like a black and white cast iron win.
00:56:27
Speaker
ah They voted to ban shows with dolphins and other marine animals on Thursday last week. So ah the Thursday before June the 27th, whenever that was.
00:56:39
Speaker
It says all lawmakers approved the law. I'm not sure of the details of Mexico's judicial system or or how these votes went through, but it sounds pretty unanimous. And now it goes to the president to sign. When you scroll further down there,
00:56:52
Speaker
article it says the president of mexico will now decide when to sign the law like just do it now mate just do it now it's fine everyone agrees i'm not quite sure why he needs to pick a specific i'm assuming so he why they need to pick a specific time in case you're wondering what's the scale of this then why does it matter is there just one dolphin like what's the crack there well mexico has about eight percent of the world's captive dolphins, which is certainly disproportionate to its its size and population.
00:57:22
Speaker
Around 350 animals, according to the Mexican Congress, are part of either dolphinariums, as they're called, where dolphins are kept in tanks and forced to perform, or presumably other animals.
00:57:37
Speaker
sea parks and things like that. So that the downside, the new law still allows dolphins and other marine animals to be caught or bred only for conservation or science, but they can no longer be used for shows or tourism.
00:57:54
Speaker
I mean, we'll get onto this as a discussion. How you can catch something and breed it for conservation. I don't quite understand because surely if you're catching it, it's already out in the wild doing fine, isn't it?
00:58:07
Speaker
I don't know. Maybe I'm missing something. um The 350 captive dolphins that are being liberated because of this legislation must be moved to sea pens, which are big areas in the ocean.
00:58:21
Speaker
where dolphins can live more naturally. um It will obviously take time, money, planning to move them, care for them in these sea pens. um And it seems like there's some logistics and planning to be done for that.
00:58:36
Speaker
But seems like a positive story. Who wants to weigh in? What are our thoughts about this one in general? It looks like good news. um i think I think we had a story similar to this a while ago and I can't remember if it was someone like Barcelona or someone like that that adopted this. um But with I think with less of the population or less of the numbers which is significant here. It's not a done deal. As you say, a President's still got to sign it so i don't know if that means it could come unstuck.
00:59:05
Speaker
um The article says about of eventual closure. There's no sort timeline on this so um and And I did a bit of research on some of the countries that are in the midst of plant banning them. Belgium is another example.
00:59:17
Speaker
That's not happening 2037. So that's quite a lead time. You know, I don't know if it's kind of like, oh, well, there'll be ah maybe some kind of expectation of natural deaths or something like that. I don't know. But it's it a long lead time.
00:59:32
Speaker
Hopefully this is not of that nature. I'm very skeptical about the bit you've pointed out there, Anthony, about yeah being caught only for conservation or science, because I think we've seen with whaling and what's going on in Japan with with that sort of statement.
00:59:47
Speaker
And you know I'm wondering if when whether some of these parks could say, OK, they're not going to perform. You can come and have a look at them. And it's all for science because we're studying them or something like that. So I'm worried that there might be a kind of loophole that might get used there. That means maybe things won't change as much as what we hope. So that's that's quite a worry.
01:00:08
Speaker
And also as reference to these C pens. They sound expensive and I don't know. i don't know if that means they'll be in them forever or what. It doesn't really say. I don't know young and how big they are, whether it's just a contemporary state.
01:00:19
Speaker
i don't I don't know. But yeah, looks are good news, but um i'd I'd want to see more detail, I think. Yeah, I'm going to optimistic about this one and say that, ah you know, overall, it's a good news. And I think this is something that's ah one of those causes, animal rights causes, that's kind of been in the public eye more and more.
01:00:38
Speaker
And it's it's it's just something that I think the pendulum has swung towards animal liberation as far as this kind of a um aquatic mammal shows are concerned.
01:00:50
Speaker
There's been quite a but lot of backlash about about it before. In this case, I think one of the relevant points is that what started this off was, as usual, as there seems to be something about a specific animal,
01:01:03
Speaker
which was kind of anthropomorphized to stand for the cause of a hero. You know, this taking instead of it's it's much easier to get people to rally behind a specific animal that's suffering rather than say, you know, there's a thousand dolphins suffering.
01:01:18
Speaker
It's much easier to have that story of Mincho, which was a dolphin that was quite old and was still performing and and was mostly blind due to its abuse and age. And it and you know did a flip and it kind of landed on concrete and hurt itself severely.
01:01:36
Speaker
And that kind of went viral and that causes people to then, you know, going from a specific very specific case of abuse to generalize about all the abuse that goes on. And these kind of stories are are generally ah very powerful. We know this, for example, from the work that sanctuaries do, where all the animals have names and they feed they do stories about the abuse, the animal suffering, or jumped off a truck and and a lorry that was carrying live animals and then hurt itself and then it recovered in the sanctuary. Look how happy it is.
01:02:06
Speaker
And then contrast that to the life you would have, the short life you would have had, this animal would have had somewhere else as part of the animal agriculture. So I think it's another example of how these kind of very specific stories about individual animals kind of get much closer to the public, the general public being compassionate about them Yeah, shout out to Switzerland, Costa Rica, India and Croatia and the UK who have already banned these shows and this form of entertainment.
01:02:41
Speaker
It was banned in the yeah UK in 1993, thankfully, so quite a long time ago. i and And well done, Mexico, for seeing the light, definitely.
01:02:53
Speaker
I googled this and tried to watch one of these dolphin displays. I hope that doesn't mean that I'll get all kinds of things popping up on the internet thinking that I'm a fan of them. But anyway, I just wanted to see what the heck anybody would get out of watching one of these.
01:03:11
Speaker
And and the The video I saw, the music was blaring, the animal handlers, for want of a better word, voices were just shrill and awful.
01:03:27
Speaker
And I just thought, even without any other cruelty being involved, that must be murder for these wee sensitive creatures, just that level of noise.
01:03:38
Speaker
But it it really made me feel sick. It really, really did. And it was such a kind of... On the surface, you could imagine some not very imaginative and...
01:03:52
Speaker
whatever limited people looking at the dolphin and thinking oh but look they're having fun and they're showing off and it's funny and they're splashing the audience with their tail and la la la la la but it actually made me cry just watching these beautiful animals and imagining what reward and punishment must have gone in to the precise nature of their performance.
01:04:24
Speaker
I cannot, I don't know how they train them to do the things they do exactly on time the way that they do them, but I cannot think, you know, that it's done purely on a reward basis.
01:04:37
Speaker
There must be something that those animals are trying to evade, to perform so precisely, I think. And just the horrible sort of irony of of everyone thinking that they look happy, you know, and just i awful, really sickening.
01:04:59
Speaker
Cruelty is awful in all its forms, but there's something really... terrible when when the humans involved are telling themselves a story about the animal enjoying something that clearly they cannot be you know Yuck.
01:05:17
Speaker
Really, really repulsive. Yeah. so Yeah. Yeah. Sinister stuff, isn't it? And um I think another factor, like completely agree with everything you've said there, the amount of time as well. So yeah, reward, punishment, what you're trying to evade, but also like you're not, you're not learning the choreography of that in,
01:05:36
Speaker
in a day are you that's that's their existence day after day after day for weeks and months to to get to the stage where you can be be made to do that performance on a regular basis and people think anyway i've just i've just brought the good news story down to low point so i will just say it's good it's good it's not happening anymore well that makes I've got a pedant point, I think, just to say. So no i' I'm happy to be shut down with this one. But when I when i add had a look, Julie, um it's in the UK, it said that the last place we had closed in 93.
01:06:12
Speaker
But it I read somewhere that it said that actually... It hasn't been legally banned, but there's a kind of de facto ban on the basis that it but the the and the welfare rules are in place kind of would stop it happening.
01:06:26
Speaker
But I think there's been other articles I've seen where people have been trying to just establish that legal ban as well to kind of almost close the door completely on it. um That might be out of date. I might be wrong, but that was just a point I thought I'd mention because I think it's ah there's a slight nuance between it's not likely to happen versus banned. So, yeah, I...
01:06:44
Speaker
ah but I'll go and check that myself, but that's kind of something I picked up on. And we still have these awful aquatic places anyway. Do know what mean? Even if there aren't performing dolphins, we still have deep sea world and all these nonsense things where children and other people get taught a load of crap about it's fine for keeping these lovely things in big tanks and staring at them, you know, and oh God, all of that.
01:07:12
Speaker
But yeah, good news story. Well done, Mexico. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Right. Thank you for listening to everything we've had to say in this show.
01:07:23
Speaker
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01:07:39
Speaker
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01:07:55
Speaker
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01:08:06
Speaker
All right. Thanks, everybody, for listening. And if you want to join us again, the next Enough of the Falafel episode is a Going Vegan episode. It's available from Thursday, the 10th of July, and it involves Anthony and Freedom talking about Freedom's vegan journey, which has taken place over in Namibia.
01:08:32
Speaker
Anyway, that's enough of the falafel for this episode. Thanks to Julie, Anthony and Carlos for your contributions. Thanks again, everyone, for listening. I've been Paul and you've been listening to Vegan Week from the Enough of the Falafel Collective.
01:08:52
Speaker
This has been an Enough of the Falafel production. We're just a normal bunch of everyday vegans putting our voices out there. The show is hosted by Zencaster. We use music and special effects by zapsplap.com.
01:09:07
Speaker
And sometimes, if you're lucky, at the end of an episode, you'll hear a poem by Mr Dominic Berry. Thanks all for listening and see you next time.
01:09:33
Speaker
This episode may have come to an end, but did you know we've got a whole archive containing all our shows dating back to September 2023? That is right, Dominic. There's over 100 episodes on there featuring our brilliant range of different guests, people's stories of going vegan, philosophical debates, moral quandaries, and of course, around a dozen news items from around the world each week. So check back on your podcast player,
01:10:00
Speaker
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