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Helping Children Process Grief: "Are You Here?" with Jenny Robinson Clark and Travis Clark
29 Plays15 hours ago
Jenny Robinson Clark is an author, former dancer and actress, and homeschooling mother of four. Inspired by motherhood, healing, and mindfulness, she wrote Are You Here?, a heartfelt children’s book exploring connection, grief, and the magical signs that remind us we are never alone. Jenny is passionate about meditation, creative living, and building meaningful moments with her family. When she’s not writing or baking sourdough, she can often be found in a hip-hop dance class with her husband, Travis Clark, her biggest supporter.
Travis Clark is best known as the lead vocalist, guitarist, and founding member of the pop-rock band We the Kings, whose music has connected with fans around the world through heartfelt lyrics and high-energy performances. Throughout his career, he has remained passionate about creating music that brings people together and tells meaningful stories.
While his accomplishments in music have shaped much of his professional journey, Travis considers his most important role to be that of a devoted husband and proud father to his four children. Family is at the heart of everything he does, inspiring both his life and his creativity. Balancing life on the road with life at home, he strives to lead with love, gratitude, and purpose — believing that his greatest success is found not on stage, but in the memories and moments shared with his family.
Order your Book here www.jennyrobinsonclark.com
Song by We the Kings "Are you here?"
Connect with Kendra Rinaldi to be a guest on the podcast or for information about Grief Coaching and Grief Education Workshops
In this episode, we cover:
- The Inspiration Behind the Art: Jenny shares the emotional journey of moving back to Florida to care for her mother, Debbie, during her cancer treatments. She recounts the profound peace of her mother's passing at home, accompanied by a beautiful sign: three deer that laid outside her window for three days and walked away just as she took her last breath.
- A 3 A.M. Divine Message: After attending a Joe Dispenza retreat with the intention of reconnecting with her mom's spirit, Jenny woke up in the middle of the night and channeled a beautiful poem.
- Turning Grief into a Song: Travis (lead singer of We the Kings and Jenny's husband) shares how he took Jenny's late-night poem and turned it into the emotionally resonant companion song, Are You Here?,.
- Creating a Toolkit for Children: Jenny and Travis explain how the poem naturally evolved into a children's book. With stunning, hopeful illustrations by Elisabetta Fantone (who was also grieving the recent loss of her father), the book serves as a "toolkit" to help kids understand grief, process the unknown, and look for signs from their loved ones.
- Healing the Inner Child: We discuss how this book is not exclusively for children. For adults experiencing "grief brain" who cannot focus on a novel, this book offers simple, grounded beauty. It also provides an opportunity for adults to heal their "inner child" if their own childhood grief was never acknowledged or processed.
- A Mission over Ego: Jenny shares her ultimate mission for the book: to get it out of the stores and directly into hospitals, grieving centers, libraries, and schools to help families navigate their darkest seasons with hope and connection
Recommended
Transcript
Opening the Conversation on Grief
00:00:00
Speaker
death is so taboo and no one wanted to talk about it you know when we were growing up. And I'm hoping for that to change. And I think the way to do that is just to open the conversation and um have these events where people know that they're not alone. and they're seen and they're heard and it's okay to feel whatever emotion you're feeling.
00:00:20
Speaker
But my goal would be for people not to sit, to stay in that um emotion if it is one of sadness and anger, but to feel it and get through it so that they can experience the life that universe and God wanted them to have and their loved ones.
00:00:37
Speaker
Welcome to Grief gratitude and the gray in between podcast. I'm your host Kendra Rinaldi. This is a space to explore the full spectrum of grief from the kind that comes with death to the kind that shows up in life's many transitions.
00:00:55
Speaker
Through stories and conversations we remind each other that we're not alone. Your journey matters and here we're figuring it out together. Let's dive right in to today's episode.
00:01:18
Speaker
Let's start with a quick disclaimer. This podcast includes personal stories and perspectives on topics like grief, health, and mental wellness. The views expressed by guests are their own and may reflect individual experiences that are not meant as medical advice.
00:01:36
Speaker
As the host, I hold space for diverse voices, but that does not mean I endorse every viewpoint shared. Please listen with care and take what resonates with you.
Welcome Jenny Robinson-Clark and Travis Clark
00:01:47
Speaker
Hi, welcome to the podcast, Jenny Robinson-Clark and Travis Clark. Jenny is an actress, dancer, and now she can add author to her resume as she is the author of Are You Here?, which is a heartfelt debut inspired by the passing of her dear mother, Debbie. and the signs that keep us connected to those we love. And when she's not writing or acting and mothering, she is baking sourdough. And you might find her in a hip hop class dance with even Travis, who is her husband. So Travis Clark is the lead vocalist, guitarist, and founding member of We the Kings. known for music that connects through honesty and heart.
00:02:32
Speaker
And beyond the stage, he has a devoted husband and father of four. And he wrote the song that accompanies Jenny's book. And this has just turned into this beautiful collaboration that brings love and and loss into art. So welcome, both of you.
00:02:52
Speaker
Thank you for having us. Yeah, thank you. That was an awesome introduction. I felt like... i took I took your bios and just made it... Oh, I felt inspired. Yeah, yeah. Trying to make it flow there. But so nice to have you both. And I know that one of your biggest...
00:03:08
Speaker
I think accomplishments is that of your family life and what you guys have created as your family and your home. I know that that is the biggest, the biggest blessing in the four kids that you guys have. So I don't want to forget that. So before we go on and share a little bit more, for those of you listening, Jenny was on the podcast the first year that I started the podcast.
00:03:30
Speaker
That was in it's September 2020 is when that episode aired. And it had only been two years since your mom came. Yes, Jenny. I cannot believe it. And now here we are recording in 2026.
00:03:43
Speaker
A lot has happened. You didn't have Kingston then. You didn't even have your... There's like no time and space, I feel like. it It just goes by so fast. And you look the same. You sound the same. You're so beautiful.
00:03:56
Speaker
It's been six years. I know. it's if Kids really give us that perspective of time, don't
Family Bonds and Parenting Insights
00:04:03
Speaker
they? Like when you look at kids is when you're like, oh wait a minute. This is how many years it's been since that. They grow so fast. And it's so wild when you have multiple kids, you see the you know the old the oldest child who was your first, right? Who was a baby. And as they're growing and then you have another kid that is then the baby and then They start growing. Then another kid that's the baby, you kind of forget that they're not all just babies.
00:04:28
Speaker
And then as the youngest gets a little older, like our youngest now, King is four and Kinsley's 10. And it's almost like, oh my gosh, Kinsley's not four. She's 10. It's like no you get trapped in this loop of, of being a parent to like very, very young kids. And then one day you just kind of blank. You're like, oh my Lord. Like we are, we have kids.
00:04:50
Speaker
young children like like young adults like young adults like yeah it you're no longer in the toddler years pretty much almost oh we're like so we're out of it and it's special and i agree completely with all of my soul that this is the greatest accomplishment um we've done i feel this way i felt this way when when we had our first i feel this way now you know 10 years into it um i know i'll feel this way on my dying day and It's just, it's so special.
00:05:23
Speaker
And you guys are for sure the greatest joy of your own parents as well. I know you guys have both really strong bonds with both sides of your families. You guys have really strong family values on both of your sides and very connected with your, your moms. I know that for you, Travis, your, your mom played also a part in the in your process as well, Jenny, with your mom as well because of her. Your mom also had cancer story as well at one point as She did, yeah. And their names are Debbie.
00:05:57
Speaker
They're both Debbies. Oh, at that part I did not realize that your mom was also Debbie, Travis. They're they're both Debbies. They loved each other deeply. um And I had such a beautiful bond. I still have that this beautiful bond with with Jenny's mom. I just felt like immediately after day one, I felt like I was her son.
00:06:16
Speaker
And it was such a, like just such a warm welcome because i am i feel like I am a black sheep of a person. Like, you know, ive i'm I walked into their house. I have crazy tattoos. I have crazy hair. I'm a lead singer of a rock band. Like,
00:06:30
Speaker
I feel like maybe i was nervous that she wouldn't like me because family is such a big part of, of who, like why I choose the the person that I want to spend the rest of my life with. I want, like, I want someone who is devoted to their family because I wanted to have family and all these different things. And,
00:06:46
Speaker
When I met her, she was just like, she was she wasn't turned off at all by anything. She just asked me questions. It was so, so awesome. So I had this beautiful bond and I saw so much of my mom in her.
00:06:57
Speaker
and and i'm I'm such a mama's boy. i was with Mama Bear with with Jenny's mom and I am with my mom. But when the parents got to meet each other, it was like our our parents are very similar to each other, even in their parenting methods, like different different things. Like we see a lot of similarities between the two.
00:07:15
Speaker
And, uh, and yeah, my mom and, and mama bear had just such a beautiful friendship. Can I say that yesterday on a podcast that I was doing, I was telling them how much my mom loved you and what a bond you guys had and how connected you are. Sometimes I get jealous and angry because i feel like he is so connected and sees these signs um and receives these signs just so sporadically and randomly. He doesn't even have to ask for them and they just show up for him. And um so I know that I was saying my mom was definitely his biggest fan.
00:07:47
Speaker
I mean, his mom is his biggest fan too, but yeah. Yeah. But, but knowing that you guys have that bond and I know that in, in our past conversation, you were mentioning when you guys met, you guys met in California, if I'm not mistaken, but that you're both from Florida. So it was like, Oh wait, we can actually, and your dream of being able to go back home to, to visit families. You didn't have to compete as to which state you were going to go to go visit families in the holidays, you could go to the same state and visit. God was working in it.
00:08:19
Speaker
God was working in it. And I think that was probably part of it. I mean, for me, it definitely was. I wanted to you know i wanted to meet my half orange that was ah from, I really was hoping from the same state.
00:08:34
Speaker
that our families could get together. i i love that her parents were still married, like happily married. My parents are happily married and still. and And so like I looked for these things and the woman that I wanted to spend the rest of my life with. And and apart from just my instant, just like falling deep in love with this person, i then found out that all these things were like just checked boxes that,
00:08:55
Speaker
that I would have wanted to, you know, I think, I think everybody like subconsciously has like a little checklist box box of, like, Hey, okay. So if I'm going to dive into this relationship, here's a couple of things that I would, you know, at least here's breaking points. Like I would really love her to, to have a relationship with God. I would really love her parents to be um happily married. I would really love her to have siblings. I would really love her to be from Florida. I would really love her to have this deep connection with
Connecting with Memories and Creating a Book
00:09:20
Speaker
her family. And like all these things were,
00:09:22
Speaker
were checked boxes um and it just it it felt so good. And then and then meeting her mom was just the the best thing ever, because as a mama's boy, like obviously I just craved the validation and the love from her mom.
00:09:37
Speaker
um and And I think that plays a part even with with how the song was written. I just took so much care to it because in so many ways I feel like she is my mom. and um We need to get into that, how that feels about it. It's the closest person I've never met in the past. I love it.
00:09:54
Speaker
it it's like I was jumping the gun. No, and I love that. No, it so this is a conversation. So wherever it takes us, we go. So Jenny, let's go into that. You...
00:10:05
Speaker
have had this connection with your mom that you've had to translate into now signs, just messages, memories, because it's been six years. No, how many? 2018. Eight.
00:10:18
Speaker
eight Now have to calculate. eight march yeah Eight years. Eight years. So March 17th, which will be the, day the official debut of e the, of the book, the, you will, um, that is your mom's anniversary. So, It's been eight years, so in these eight years that you've developed this different way of connecting and communicating with her.
00:10:42
Speaker
take us into the creation of this book. Because you had to create also ways in which the kids would remember and connect with their grandmother, since some of them were just babies. The youngest was just a baby when you were pregnant. Yeah, my second was six months old. Yeah. Sorry, the middle one, there's no middle one, there's four. There's the second one. It was just a baby when your mom died. Then you had your third one and fourth one after. So you'd have to find ways of connecting.
00:11:14
Speaker
So take us into that journey, Jenny, as to how it was that you started to find little things and then the inspiration for the book. Yes, absolutely. I can give you some backstory here for your listeners. um I never thought I would be a children's book author, to be honest with you. I was raised as a dancer. My mom was my first dance teacher, so she put me into dance class and it was um I loved it. i you know what i don't know I say i don't know if I would have chosen dance, but my mom made me choose dance. And I'm glad that she did because I made a career out of it. and we're also very like naturally gifted at dance. like you
00:11:55
Speaker
Yes, you learned how to dance, but I also learned how to dance and you dance much better than I do. so so Well, thank you. Give your mom credit for that for dancing, but like I think there's some God gift gifted talent within your dance. Oh, okay. Well, thank you. Yes. So I'm i'm grateful that God placed that gift in my heart. And, um you know, as as a kid, i was very fearful of death and my parents never really spoke about it much. And so I would just like sit in my room with these crazy thoughts. um And the unknown was what really scared me. So I was afraid of everything when I was little. um And it didn't serve me as I was growing up. It it it kind of stuck with me. um
00:12:37
Speaker
And it wasn't until I moved away from home where I finally kind of found my own truth, my own spirituality. I was a little bit more connected. um And I read a book called A New Earth by Eckhart Tolle. And that really grounded me. And I became super present. I was not fearful.
00:12:58
Speaker
um I just embraced life. And the first person that was close to me that passed was my grandma. And um I had to decide if I wanted to go back for the celebration of life or funeral. And You know, growing up, my parents never took us to funerals or celebrations of life. They kind of thought that that they were protecting us, you know, not showing us that side of life.
00:13:22
Speaker
And I am... I'm pretty sure like now raising my kids that um I don't want to do it that way for them because I could see how it brought me a lot of fears around it. um And so I chose to go and embrace it. And i think I was the only one of my siblings that went and I'm so grateful that I did because I could see, you know, I could say goodbye, first of all. i could I could see her in the open casket and know that this is just a shell. like We are just a shell. And I knew that her soul was still all around me because when they buried her, there was a beautiful gust of wind that came. And there was no wind before, no wind after. And I just had chills all over my body. And I just knew that was like the first time that I felt like a sign from somebody. um And that was really powerful for me and my evolution and growth. And um getting over this fear that I had.
00:14:16
Speaker
And so, yeah, when my mom was diagnosed with cancer, it was scary and I didn't know what to do. I lived in California, so it was kind of like out of sight, out of mind. But then when I met Travis and we got pregnant, we decided to move back to Florida to be with her and it was the best decision we had ever made because It really grew us closer. i think my mom and I had a lot of resentment towards each other when I moved to California because of um you know I knew she didn't really want me to go. she i think she would have rather me stay and you know be around the family and live close by and all those things. And so um it was hard for me. And um I kind of resented her for that. And so when when I moved home, it was the most beautiful thing I could have ever done. And our relationship just grew so close.
00:15:00
Speaker
So I'm really grateful for that time because my first child or our first child, Kinsley, was able to go to every doctor's appointment with us, um all of her chemo and radiation and all the things that she had to do ah So it brought her so much joy. I could see it in my mom's eyes. And like I said, very grateful for those that time with her. Mm-hmm.
00:15:19
Speaker
She loved being like a grandmother as well. as like she, Jenny's sister had had two children um before we had kids. And so like, she really took that role of, you know, Gigi was that the kid's nickname for her. So she was, you know, anytime that she was around the kids, you just saw like life, you know, just, just like envelop her.
00:15:40
Speaker
So even when we're at these ah doctor's appointments and things that, that we're in cold rooms and it's sterile and it's it feels lifeless. Having this Kinsley that was just always there was such a beautiful thing to see in her eyes, just like like life. And and also, like I want more of this. So like I'll do what it takes. yeah She fought so hard. and um And I think a lot of that was because of her love for her family, for her love for her husband. And
00:16:11
Speaker
um and And so that was a beautiful thing that we very very easily could have been like, let's keep Kinsley away from this because it's doctors and and and and death and this. and And she was losing weight and lost her hair and all these things. Yeah. And just making that that conscious choice of like, this is something that, you know not necessarily cancer, but death comes for for us all. you know and And understanding the teaching of you know this is your your body is the thing that gets sick and your body is the thing that dies and your body is the thing that does not go on.
00:16:46
Speaker
But you have something more more beautiful and that's your spirit and your soul and that's something that is eternal. So it it was one, a teaching lesson, but also it was valuable because we got to, you know, to see your mom go through these like horrible treatments and still have like this positive outlook um on her on her face, whether it was her just putting on the show or whatever, you could see that it was better having us there and having Kinsley there. course. Yeah. And even Kaya too.
00:17:19
Speaker
But you know as as she was dying, um there were were some beautiful moments and signs that were sent to us. And um they were and a big inspiration in the book, Are You Here? And I'll just give one briefly is is the deer. There was three deer that came and laid right in front of her window in her room. um She chose not to go to the hospital. She didn't want to...
00:17:42
Speaker
die anywhere else but our family home. So she this was- This also the hospice point and and the the treatment. So um she had chosen that she wanted to be in the comfort of her home, surrounded with family. and We knew there was only a couple of days. Yeah. so So yeah, these three deer just came and showed up and laid outside her window for the last three days until she took her last breath. And then they were gone. And we've never seen deer laying in that same spot ever again. um And she had a smile on her face as she took her last breath. And I just remember calling Travis because he wasn't able to be there.
00:18:17
Speaker
And I was just
Processing Grief and Finding Inspiration
00:18:18
Speaker
crying. And it's I don't know for you too, Kendra, because I know you lost your mom too, but telling the story and reliving it just kind of brings up some of that emotion that was there. And I haven't cried on a podcast actually yet, but this is the first time. And ah so, yeah, so um i had I knew that she was no longer um tied to her body that was you know not serving her and that her soul was all around us and I could feel it and I was looking up and I was thinking, God, I'm like, thank you, God, thank you, God. And so- um And like Jenny had mentioned, years before she had lost her grandmother, ah she had lost her aunt and then her her mom's best friend, which was kind of like Aunt Connie. She was you know very close to the family as well.
00:19:03
Speaker
And these three deer that were just laying outside, which in the 40 years that they've lived at this house, they've never seen anything like it. And then as her mom takes her last breath in those last moments, the three deer- ah just get up and walk away.
00:19:18
Speaker
and it's as if, you know, like God was like, Hey, we're, you know, Sue and, and and the the three that had gone before that had passed before. Hey,
00:19:30
Speaker
go welcome you know my daughter into and to eternal life. And that, I mean, what a beautiful sign is perfect for your mom. Your mom loved wildlife. you know she loved just She loved her house. She loved her home, yeah loved her family. And it was just such a ah peaceful,
00:19:50
Speaker
um Transition. Peaceful transition. That's so beautiful. And in that overwhelm, as you were saying, that you just put your hand up in the sky and were just really like more like, thank you. It was like this thank you and this right to God to some extent that yeah right that it's, wow, it just happened also as your mom wished with you guys there and in her home and just seeing her already leave the pain behind, right? Yeah.
00:20:18
Speaker
Yeah. It was a really powerful moment for me and in my grief journey and the healing too, I think. Because I i tell a lot of people that my grief, like the anger and and the resentment and the sadness was before she passed, like, because I knew it was coming, you know, and Travis still had his mom healthy. And, um you know, I saw grandparents at the parks with their kids playing and stuff. So that was where my grief really was hard. um So then after she passed, like I had a weight lifted off my shoulder and, you know, I've always been a glass half full type of ah girl, optimistic, you know? And so I just always believed that there, you know,
00:20:56
Speaker
like I didn't want to choose to stay in that sadness and that anger and that resentment. I wanted to choose to move through it and feel those emotions, but know that my mom would rather me live in beauty and love and happiness and joy. and so anyways, a couple of years later, I was feeling a little disconnected from her and I was just praying to God to please connect me. like i I want to feel you, mom. um And so I went to a ah retreat by Dr. Joe Dispenza who links spirituality and science and I set two intentions to connect to my mom and heal my IBS that I had been dealing with um for quite some time. And I did both of those. um And I connected to my mom like I had never connected before. And that was really what sparked the whole book process and Are You Here? Because there's so many signs and synchronicities from um that retreat to leading up to to the fruition of Are You Here?
00:21:49
Speaker
That's so beautiful. Now, do I remember correctly? Because I know we spoke before. release Was it in the middle of the night? Yes. Okay. So take us into that moment in which you just basically feel this conversation.
00:22:05
Speaker
Absolutely. it was a conversation really, right? And an answer. Please share. absolutely. So after the retreat, I had never felt so connected. And I say this too, that after my mom passed, I had felt the same connection. I saw colors that I'd never seen before. i heard sounds that I'd never seen before. I don't know. like I was so present after. i say that to me. I say that grief. It's like,
00:22:26
Speaker
It heightens like these other senses. Yeah, that we write yeah never tap into. i don't know. so It was so amazing. And so after that retreat, I felt the same thing.
00:22:36
Speaker
And so I knew that I was connected. And so I knew I needed to stay in my creative space. And so that night before, i went to a dance class and I had dedicated the dance class to a friend of mine whose partner had passed. And I was just very connected and I went to sleep that night and that night was when I woke up at 3 a.m. and was in between wakefulness and sleepfulness and i just kept writing these words um because you know I had set that intention to feel connected to my mom and I feel like after i had said that, like she sent me this message early one morning to tell me that she was with me all around me and everything and everywhere and um I just wrote this, kept writing, writing, writing, and then finally fell back to sleep. And in the morning I woke up and that's when I showed Travis it and he turned it the words into the most beautiful song that healed me in so many ways that I didn't necessarily know that I needed. and um yeah, we had we have this beautiful song that we first called Dragon Flies because that was the first line of the the song. And I'll let Travis say a little bit more about that process.
00:23:41
Speaker
Well, i was just going to- I was just going to add that, um you know, after the, I think where you were coming from after the event with Joe Dispenza, you came home and you kind of had this like new found, like you were remembering that, Oh my God, I can ask my mom, I can be connected. It's a choice. I can choose to, to, to ask my mom for these signs. So I think you just had this like new found realization that you'd had before.
00:24:10
Speaker
um yeah stemming back from even when you know you went to your grandmother's celebration of life with the wind. like that was When the wind came, you weren't like, oh, that's cool. That's wind. You know you were you're like, oh, like I feel you.
00:24:24
Speaker
you know Oh, I can ask for signs. I can feel the signs. It's like our connection isn't limited just to our earthly presence. So I think coming back from that retreat, you kind of had this like you remembered. You remember that you could just ask and that could feel. And we can all access it. Yeah. And that it's accessible. So once that door is now open, you have this night where you dedicate this dance to your mom.
00:24:52
Speaker
who, and so many levels, like she's the one who taught you how to dance. It's this full circle. i dedicated it to my friend's partner in the past, Matt. Oh, that's right. but but it' still, it's in a connection of the grief. You knew what it felt like. So you were you're expressing the grief of what your friend is going through, but with a grief that's very personal to you because you've also experienced it. So it comes out in dance, you do that, then you go to sleep, then this- yeah So there's doors open so many and you are, you are now realizing that like, okay, I want to ask for these signs. I want like, mom, I know you're there.
00:25:28
Speaker
um Show me, tell me. And you wake up in the morning and you write this beautiful thing and you go to sleep. And in the morning we we all wake up, the kids, and you i remember you showing me and it's like this, this it's a masterpiece. It's like so beautiful.
00:25:46
Speaker
um This very divinely guided what what looked like a poem, right? And even in the way that she repeated some of the things, it was like, it was just a ah beautiful poem that was, it was awesome. Jenny's never written a song in her life.
00:26:01
Speaker
um I'm a songwriter now. you've You've never really written poetry. Like this was just like, and not something that you normally would do. And so, so that in and of itself is a beautiful sign. So I was like, in my head, i was like, Oh, I could take this and make it a song.
00:26:17
Speaker
yeah i love doing that anyways, as far as songwriting. So I took it upstairs and started writing and it just, it was so easy to put together because it was so beautifully crafted and And I remember even in the making of it, I was like, you know, I had a grateful heart for this connection that Jenny had made with her mom again and put together the song in a couple hours and brought it down and showed her. And um and that was just like waterworks for like the next two or three days.
00:26:45
Speaker
And then we kind of, had we had this poem, we had this song, we didn't really know, you know, what to do. It was enough. It was enough that we just had it. And that we had the connection with her mom that Jenny wrote this poem that she she could read and feel
From Song to Children's Book: A Healing Journey
00:26:59
Speaker
that connection. She could remember that connection that she had with the mom in the middle of the night. We had the song that we could listen to and and feel her mom. And it wasn't it wasn't the song that's so sad you just can't listen. you know It's a song you want to let's do again and again because it's hopeful and it reminds you of of the beautiful qualities of your mom.
00:27:17
Speaker
and um And then we just kind of had this thing, like it feels selfish to keep for ourselves. um And and you know we are not the only ones experiencing grief. We're not the only ones who love music. We're not the only ones who are sitting there like wondering, like, what do we do now? so we decided to do a couple of things. One, we decided, and with Jenny's blessing, I was like, can I put this song out? and And we even the album artwork was a ah picture. It was a ah newspaper clip of her mom from her softball.
00:27:50
Speaker
It was the cutest picture ever. She looked like an actress. And she looked so beautiful. That picture looks like as if she's an actress. I know you're an actress. Your mom was a dancer. She was not an actress? She was in pageants and she was very smart, very intelligent, won so many awards. She's so beautiful. But it has a smirkiness. That figure is like little smirk and just like, yeah. She had confidence. It's so cute. And I think that's what it takes to be those things. What's that softball movie? That softball movie with all the – League of Their Own. League of Their Own. With the women? Yes, yes, yes. She could have played a part in that.
00:28:25
Speaker
Easily. Hi, I just had to come on and just kind of interrupt right now this episode that you're hearing. Thank you so much. I'm so grateful that you guys are listening to this conversation. And every single time i hear a guest, there's something new that I learn and something else that ends up showing up within me that I realize I still have to work on.
00:28:47
Speaker
And if by chance, as you're listening to this conversation, you're feeling the same, that there's parts of you that are being stirred up, and you are navigating a life transition right now that feels just heavy and stressful and just layered with grief, I want you to know that you do not have to do it alone.
00:29:05
Speaker
I invite you to connect with me for a free 15 minute discovery call, and we'll explore what's coming up for you and see if working together feels like the right fit.
00:29:16
Speaker
Just check the show notes below for my email and reach out for details. I'd really love to support you in integrating these transitions with more ease and clarity.
00:29:29
Speaker
Can't wait to hear back from you. Okay, let's keep on listening to the episode.
00:29:35
Speaker
so So anyways, we you know we had this kind of realization like, hey, this is this is kind of selfish if we keep this to ourselves, even though that was enough for us. That was enough that we had this thing. And when we wanted to release a song, I kind of asked Jenny and asked kind of her family, is this okay? you know if if and ah of course, everybody said yes.
00:29:54
Speaker
um We released a song and and then you know Jenny took it to a ah deeper – because the We the Kings fan base is kids from 6, 7, 8, 9 years old to you know to seventy you know and there was a demographic that was like that Jenny was remembering. like I remember sitting in my room and being scared to death. like Is there something that I could do that could could maybe help the world and be of service to the world? And and that's where the idea of the children's book came from. So we that that idea starts and it it already starts with like little scribbles. you know She already has this beautiful poem that
00:30:32
Speaker
translated to a book so easily, which is like a copy paste, like, okay, the writing's done. Let's here's all the signs that, that I've asked my mom to come. Here's the things that I've seen in my life that, that, that maybe people could relate to. And maybe people could identify like, oh, those are the signs that you see. I can ask for signs or maybe, Hey, this thing that keeps happening.
00:30:50
Speaker
Maybe that's the thing. maybe that's Maybe my door has always been open and there and she ends up wanting to to do a children's book because she felt for those kids who are sitting in the room scared of the unknown and scared of what happened. And I think that's um where I'll let you talk about it be because it's just it's so it is obviously unbiased because you know I'm Jenny's number one fan and I love the book. I genuinely do. I think objectively it's just, it is so gorgeous and it will be so helpful.
00:31:24
Speaker
Um, But i it it is so exciting because on on my side from We The Kings, I've had fans come up and be like, your song saved my life.
00:31:34
Speaker
Your song got me through a really challenging time that I didn't know I was going to get out of. And I have had that that conversation with fans countless times, like hundreds if not thousands of times.
00:31:47
Speaker
Yeah. this book will do that exact same thing. And I cannot wait for people too to come up to her and say, thank you for writing this. like And even though it's like, she doesn't even feel like she wrote it. She just feels like you know this was a ah gift from her mom. Yeah. And so people coming up to her, I know this is going to happen. Thank you for just getting me through a hard time and challenging time. And you genuinely made my life better.
00:32:14
Speaker
And that is like, you feel like at that point, it's like your responsibility now. Like, oh oh my God, I'm like, this gift from my mom is able to like expand outside of my household and is able to genuinely make somebody else's life better. It's so special.
00:32:29
Speaker
I love it. Jenny, the the process of creating this, because you had that then in this paper, then the song comes out and then you're like, okay, let's do this into the into a book So deciding to go into that part and then really the choosing also of the artist then to the illustrator, that is a whole other
Illustrating Grief and Hope
00:32:53
Speaker
process. So share how that came about, that that finding of the perfect person to put these words into this
00:33:02
Speaker
beautiful illustration together. Okay. Thank you. yeah It's like lyrics and harmony, right? It's like having the lyrics of a song and having the melody. Like you can have the amazing lyrics, but then they really, the melody is also there that, so that's what this, this book has that the beautiful writing and then the beautiful artistry. They need to compliment each other because if they don't compliment each other, then the message could get lost or the meaning could get lost or the, the will to want to help could get lost. Yes. So then in this, tell us the process. Yes. Yeah. So again, so many synchronicities and it was divinely guided. um
00:33:39
Speaker
Even just meeting my publisher who was introduced to me through the friend that I danced for their partner that one night, she introduced me to the publisher um And then i had to find an illustrator and I knew in my heart who I wanted it to be, but I knew that she had had some challenges that were going on in her life at that moment. So I didn't want to, you know, fill her plate up and ask, but I ended up asking her and she was like, no, I would love to do it. And she committed. um We had met on a on a commercial set um in Miami ah in 2020, I think it was too. um
00:34:18
Speaker
and had been friends ever since. She's the most talented woman I have ever met. She's from Canada. She's an actress. She's an artist. She does all the things. Her daughter is so amazing too and is just following her for the footsteps. She's a little actress now. And um I just knew that she would bring this book to life.
00:34:38
Speaker
But more importantly, she was in like a similar season as you where she had passed her She's a mom. Oh, well, yeah, she's a mom too, but her dad had passed away um six months prior to me asking her. So it was a really powerful, I i believe if she was on this ah call too, that she would say it was a really it was really powerful in her healing as well because her dad came through in dreams while she was doing the illustrations and you know it ever like From the beginning, i always knew what I wanted. like Seeing this book, wasn't um it wasn't exciting for me because i it's like I already knew that it existed in my mind. i don't know. It's very crazy to say. But um like even to the illustrations, you know I knew in the second half I wanted it this way. And then the first half, I wanted it this way. And I tried to draw it out as best as I could to show Elisabetta. And she really, you know, obviously amplified my drawings um and made this beautiful piece of art, which is what I wanted from the beginning to a piece of art artwork that, you know, you could have on your shelf and look at. and
00:35:43
Speaker
um And also something that was like, yes, artistic, but also something that that um translated to to lightness and to beauty and to celebration.
00:35:53
Speaker
Because when you're talking about something like this, it it is very easy to to be dark and sad and just filled with grief instead and live in that sadness and live in that grief while you're reading this thing to the point where you don't want to finish it because you're just like, it's too much.
00:36:09
Speaker
But there's this very delicate balance where you're like, the even the colors that were chosen are just... they feel organic and natural and authentic and the, and the girl in her face, she looks hopeful. And that's like not easy to capture because the lyrics and, and the, the writings, the, the, they are those things.
00:36:32
Speaker
So like having that balance of like, Hey, here's the message, here's the thing, they need to compliment each other was like such a, like she kept sending stuff and Jenny and I were just like, this is the most beautiful thing I've ever seen. Like it just, and, and, and illustration after illustration, was just like, how are these getting better and better? This is insane.
00:36:50
Speaker
Yeah. She's so talented. I, so I visualize her doing art galleries and we, you know, blowing up these photos and, you know, her telling her story because she, she is very talented and was a big part of, of this whole process.
00:37:05
Speaker
I love it. So yeah, Elisabetta Fantone. So should we say it like Italian? Elisabetta Fantone. What's nice is that the the illustrations are like when you can read this book, you can read it and you can just focus on the the words and then you can read through it and just look at the illustrations and you can get a mixture of both. And I think you could honestly read it 20 times and you know get something different from each time that you read it And with kids, and and Jenny and I have talked about this a lot, but with kids, as you're reading, maybe they're looking for the ladybug or maybe they're looking at the illustration or maybe they see a word that they recognize and and they might not be following along the lyrics exactly the way maybe an adult would, but it's giving their subconscious these tools of of how to handle grief when it inevitably comes.
00:37:58
Speaker
And those are maybe tools that that Jenny or even myself that we we didn't have growing up, which led to a fear of the unknown and led to being scared of of death and what that meant. um So i just I love that this is kind of like it's a book, but it's also kind of like ah a toolkit for are these kids, these these people that we love more than anything in this world to to be able to handle things after we're gone.
00:38:26
Speaker
You know, i I want to say that because I did have copies early on because I ordered beforehand too, and you also sent me one. the I ended up giving one of my copies to my friend whose mother died, even though she's an adult and she has adult kids. I i gave her that and I gave her my book Signs, which I had read because also my sister passed it along after you had recommended And and then another book that it was a mothers without ah for mothers without daughters type daughters without mother's type of book. But I gave her those three, but I said, right now with grief brain,
00:39:05
Speaker
Honestly, in those moments, you sometimes do not have the the, you know, to sit down and read a whole book. You can't sometimes even focus. So this is not a book only for children. It really is also for somebody that's fresh in their grief as well. Like it's just a way of being able to feel that hope, like you mentioned, Travis, stay you know, focus and present and and kind of, it's kind of that little tap on the shoulder to be looking around and a remind yeah reminder for us to just be looking around. So I want to say that as if you're listening to this and you don't have kids, you still can get this book and have it on your shelf. Because again, it's just a, it's like,
00:39:48
Speaker
perfect thing to pick up in those moments in which you really do want to feel connected. Right. Yeah, connected. Yeah. I mean, that's the beautiful thing because Jenny, again, she did this book for her own healing.
00:40:01
Speaker
And she's 40-year-old woman. and she's a forty year old woman like when that just happens to be happens to, for her as a mother of four young, young children want, wants to give them something that they can, that they can understand grief and understand all these things. So it just happens to be one of these things that's going to be very helpful for children. But like when, when we read it as adults, it's like, it is a work of art. It's so beautiful. The illustrations are so beautiful. The words are so meaningful and simple and,
00:40:30
Speaker
Like you said, like when you are in that grief brain, you're not really ready sometimes to pick up a novel. Sometimes you just need to like open a page and see some beauty and lightness and connectedness. And that is so valuable to at any age you know to to just settle your brain down.
00:40:48
Speaker
Yeah. And you know one of one of the guests I had, Randy, what's her name? She calls herself a little griever. She's an an a a grown adult. But because the grief she experienced, with experience the loss of her father was when she was 10 years old, she still calls herself a little griever because a lot of times, if you were a child and your grief was not ah acknowledged at that time. Now as an adult, you can even read, I'm getting chills in this moment, thinking as an adult that your grief as a, if you grieved as a kid and it was never really even talked about in your home, for so many people that's kind of,
00:41:25
Speaker
Kind of put on the back burner. yeah Yeah. This is like a great book as well to tap into that part of you that was neglected as a child. And, yeah you know, as well. so So reading it and connecting to your inner child and really giving that love and you're healing really this relationship that you have with death from 20, 40, 50 years ago. That's so well said. That is so well said. so So it's just for everybody. I'm like, look, I'm not joking when I tell you I'm getting goosies as I'm saying. I have goosies too. Because it is. It's like, imagine how many people that their their grief was never relieved.
00:42:11
Speaker
Yeah, addressed. Addressed, yeah. Or seen, know, or heard when they were going through it, I know. And it's never too late to, like you mentioned, it's never too late to to to dive back in and to heal that inner child, which I think is what a lot of adults do anyways. you know You're trying to identify where trauma is coming from that's making you feel a certain way. So you are doing this to heal that thing, not really to heal your present moment. You're healing this past thing so that your present can be okay. Exactly. um So just the fact that Jenny's able to do that with this book is such a beautiful service to the world.
00:42:44
Speaker
That's beautiful. Now I want to hear how the kids reacted, how your kids reacted when they first saw the book.
Involving Children in Creative Processes
00:42:52
Speaker
So when it was printed, you did you the the story, the song they had, her I know, I mean, I know the song because I've been listening to the song for, it's been a year, I think, since it released, right? March of 2025. So I've been singing and humming that. um And so i know I know that. And I send it to people, you know, i'm like, listen, if you want a good cry sometimes, but in that soulful kind of way, listen to this. And now it's the same thing with the book. So tell me for the kids, how was it for them?
00:43:22
Speaker
holding the book. Well, they were such a big process in it. Like when Elizabeth would send me illustrations or I would get um a copy back from the printer, I would always ask them yeah like like what this yeah like, what do you think coming from a child, like in your eyes, even like the the dragonfly at one point. Oh yeah. They gave me notes on the illustrations. And so I remember they said like one of the legs or one of the eyes or the legs were furry, like, like they actually are and in real life. Yeah. Very. And so, and they're like, that's a little scary. And so, so we changed it and then, and then made the eyes like a little more friendly, friendly or whatever. And, and Elizabeth was able to take all these notes and be like, got it. And then adjusting and be like, Oh my God, that's yeah. That's they love it now. You know, like, so they were, they were such a huge part in the making of the book that it wasn't really a big surprise when they got the, you know, the final product. But I'd have to say Kaya, my second, yeah she really the proudest of me. yeah She's so sweet. I mean, I think they're are all very proud. But we did that an event called Sparkle of Hope in August or September, actually. um And she was there with me while I spoke and signed copies for this gala luncheon. And she was just right beside me handing out bookmarks to everybody. she saw this line of people.
00:44:40
Speaker
all ages, um you know, waiting in line to get a book signed by Jenny and and Kaya, just the way that she looked at Jenny was so like, so inspiring. it and I, I love that. Like,
00:44:54
Speaker
you know because they've seen that in you. they've seen They've seen dad on stage all the time. And this is new for them to all of a a sudden see the spotlight on mom too, right? To see that. they like Exactly. and the And the thing is, is for them, and I've thought about this a lot. i've given this so much thought because I think we're it's such a, we don't know that we're giving them this, but this tool and this service to them, but like i I wanted to be a rock star. you know I wanted to to sing on stages to thousands of people. like that That was my dream.
00:45:27
Speaker
I get to live my dream. Jenny has been in movies and TV and she's got her yoga practice and nutrition license. She's got all these things. Anytime that she had a dream, she went and did it. She started a business with her sisters that was was healing in a way. and Now,
00:45:41
Speaker
you know, later on in life where other people could be like, well, I'm just a mom. It's taking up everything, which is the biggest job you could do. She's still found a way to, to realize her dreams. So these kids are growing up in a household where both parents I've said, this is my dream to, so to some or most, it might sound crazy, but I'm going to do it. And, and then they actually, but they get to see the, the actualization. So there is nothing and this world that they're going to be able to say like, Oh, I can't do that because we we are doing it. And it's such a cool thing for them to, so to, to see their parents do. And I love like,
00:46:22
Speaker
I love when they're on the side of the stage watching me. I love when when they're at an event with Jenny because they're seeing it from both sides and it's not just one. it And then at the same time, we're also trying our best to be the the the best father and mother that we can. So it's not just about...
00:46:37
Speaker
her authorship or not just about my musicianship. It's about following your dream and knowing that um that you have the power within you to chase that dream if you want to. um And to also leave space to to be great parents, which is genuinely, and we both would say the same, is the...
00:46:55
Speaker
That is our our number one priority. It's our number one passion, our number one love and number one job is to do that. This just happens to be something that they support us the whole way through. So we we are allowed to do it because they they make it so easy for us to want to follow our dreams because we get to show them, hey, whatever it is in in life that you want to do, you you can do. And there's nothing too great, nothing too big.
00:47:19
Speaker
But my little sister, my um youngest, she knew in her heart that she wanted to be a mom. And that's what she wanted to do, that she wanted to marry a husband that can make enough money that she could stay home and be a mom. And I think that is so beautiful too, because she thought that's a dream, right? dream yeah That is a dream. And that's what I'm saying. like I hope this is an inspiration for them to know that whatever dream God placed in their heart, that they can follow and achieve that.
00:47:43
Speaker
And and to to answer your original question, like... they are so proud. They are, they, they see the book they hold in. And I think the bigger thing is that they just see that, that it's happening. And it's not something that's like only right now, like we're getting ready to, you know, in in a week or so we're getting ready to take off on a little book tour where we're going to go have these events and there's going to be more lines of people wanting to have their mommy's signature on this this beautiful piece of art that you know that that was that they saw created over time.
00:48:13
Speaker
So is it's such a cool thing.
Supporting Others Through Grief
00:48:15
Speaker
It's not just this one time, oh, you made a book. I'm very proud of you. And then it's on to the next day. like This is this ever-evolving slow burn like where it's going to grow and grow and grow into this beautiful thing and where they're able to come along with us for the entire thing.
00:48:29
Speaker
I love it. the I wanted to talk about, you mentioned Spark spark of Hope. but spark of sparks Sparkle of Hope. So you guys are now based in Tennessee. That was a big change. And we could have a whole other podcast about that part Yeah, because it it just even moving, all these things are huge, huge grief in that, especially, yeah, leaving your families behind back in Florida when you were just, you know, it's a big change there. But you've also then now linked arms with organizations that as well that help people in their grief journey. Can you share about that as well? I mean, that's a big goal for me is to connect with grief organizations and again, have this be a tool for them to use with their um families that are going through something similar to again, inspire and um uplift them in a way that maybe they're not, they're not feeling in that moment. But yeah,
00:49:26
Speaker
Yeah. Our goal would be to create these events where, you know, we go and I could do a read aloud. Travis could sing the song. We could do a craft with the kids afterwards and have an open discussion about it because that's where it starts is the conversation, right? And death is so taboo and no one wanted to talk about it, you know, when we were growing up and I'm hoping for that.
00:49:50
Speaker
to change. And I think the way to do that is just to open the conversation and um have these events where people know that they're not alone and they're seen and they're heard and it's okay to feel whatever emotion you're feeling. um But my goal would be for people not to sit, to stay in that um emotion if it is one of sadness and anger, but to feel it and get through it so that they can experience the life that, you know,
00:50:18
Speaker
universe and God wanted them to have and their loved ones. It's funny because Jenny's like the least typical author maybe ever. like She's had these conversations like, I really i don't care about like if people buy the book or not. I just want people who are in that season to have to to get it one way or the other, like whether it's gifted to them or they find it But I really want to just bring stacks into ah grieving centers and stacks into hospitals and stacks into schools and stacks into ah libraries so that that kids have the ability to just grab it when when they can. And every every time that we talk to somebody within PR, she's like, I'm really not worried about that. I just, I want to kind of give it to everybody. And and they're like, well...
00:51:03
Speaker
Okay, well, let's do this. and And it's just, it's so cool to see um her, hurt keep her integrity through the whole thing. um and And keep that mission um kind of soul focused and morale focused where,
00:51:18
Speaker
the The dream was to have this book to heal her. And then the dream expanded into have this book to help heal other people that are feeling the same way. And that has not been lost. And it's it's very cool because so easily, and I've seen it in my industry, you you have this thing you're able to hold now. And then the ego kind of gets in the way. And then you're battling your ego of like, oh, I'm awesome. I'm this and that.
00:51:40
Speaker
um And so I just love that. Yeah. you know, where we're at, the the book is almost out and and her and and her mission is still the same of like, let me try to help heal people who are hurting right now.
00:51:54
Speaker
So the the book, let's talk about that of the, when people can have it in their hands. As we're recording this, it has not been released yet. As I released the episode, it probably would have already been released. So March 17th is the official launch. So where will people be able to find it on March seventeenth Yes. Well, right now you can pre-order it on my website, www.jennyrobinsonclark.com, on Amazon, on Barnes & Noble, on Books A Million, anywhere you find your books. um
00:52:25
Speaker
And then yes, on March 17th will be the release date. So then it will be shipped out so that you can have it in your hand. um And I really ah want to support the indie bookstores do too. So if you have a ah bookstore in your area that you love, um please let them know about the book. And um hopefully we can get some copies in these beautiful indie bookstores that are all around the country.
00:52:49
Speaker
Yeah. I would also like to encourage like the the people listening right now, like if there's maybe an organization, like we mentioned, um where you feel like a lot of these books could be helpful in in the healing process and the grieving journey um to find Jenny on ah anywhere on social media or on our website or email or whatever it is um and reach out. And um I just encourage everybody to, if if there is an area where you think that this could do a lot of good um to um just try to let us know. And um Jenny's website is very good, but it also has all her social and she tries to be good about being a mom and occasionally checking her emails and and social media stuff. So yeah.
00:53:33
Speaker
Yeah, I feel so grateful and and so excited for the journey. and um you know As her number one fan, I'm so grateful for anybody that does you know go to the the website and and gets the book and and maybe it orders one for a friend who who is going through a tough time um because I really genuinely think that it it will be of value and um of service and so helpful.
00:53:56
Speaker
Thank you. Absolutely. I agree 100%, 100% with that. Before we wrap up, well, also your song, they can listen on anywhere you with We the Kings, anywhere you can hear yeah It's the same book title, Are You Here?
00:54:10
Speaker
Are You Here? And you can hear it and you can listen to it alongside as you're reading if you want to. So that way it's double whammy there and bring the tissue box, bring the tissue box. So before we wrap up, is there anything I have not asked either of you that both can reply if you have something else you want to leave with the audience?
00:54:31
Speaker
My thing would just be that if you do get a book in your hand and you do read it, that you are not um stuck in your sadness, that you will be left with hope, love, light, and this connection that you can feel deeply with your loved one.
00:54:50
Speaker
I can't top that. That's really good. aye Beautiful. Thank you so much again, Jenny Robinson-Clark and Travis Clark for being on the show. And again, the book, Are You Here? and the song, Are You Here? You can find them anywhere. I'll make sure to link in the show notes where you can connect to buy the book. Thank you.
00:55:11
Speaker
Thank you. Thank you guys.
00:55:20
Speaker
Thank you again so much for choosing to listen today. I hope that you can take away a few nuggets from today's episode that can bring you comfort in your times of grief.
00:55:33
Speaker
If so, it would mean so much to me if you would rate and comment on this episode. And if you feel inspired in some way to share it with someone who may need to hear this, please do so.
00:55:49
Speaker
Also, if you or someone you know has a story of grief and gratitude that should be shared so that others can be inspired as well, please reach out to me.
00:56:01
Speaker
And thanks once again for tuning in to Grief, Gratitude, and the Gray In Between podcast. Have a beautiful day.