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Episode 5: "My Favorite Nerd Shit" - Buffy with Logan (Part 2)
28 Plays8 months ago
We're still getting the hang of this podcasting thing, but one thing we ARE super good at is talking about Buffy the Vampire Slayer. Even though we will probably find any excuse to talk about our dear Chosen One, we had to do her proper justice with a dedicated episode and our fellow Scooby, Logan! If you're interested in learning more about Flaming River Con, head over to their website here: https://www.flamingrivercon.com/
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Transcript
Introduction and Technical Difficulties
00:00:01
ryanzymler
Welcome back to real hot nerd shit. ah The episode once more with feeling which has now become fourth more feeling like I'm gonna scream.
00:00:09
Logan Dorado
it
00:00:12
ryanzymler
um So we intentionally cut the last one we're trying to split these into like, you know, two, two smaller chunks to make it easier for like releasing and, and and editing. um But it also happened that my Wi Fi dropped out. So Here we are
00:00:29
Shauna _she_her_
we're still here.
00:00:29
ryanzymler
mother
00:00:29
Logan Dorado
Oh, oh.
00:00:30
ryanzymler
oh We got it.
00:00:32
Shauna _she_her_
hey
00:00:32
Logan Dorado
Okay.
00:00:36
ryanzymler
I'm hanging on by my and toenails, friends.
00:00:39
Logan Dorado
but
00:00:41
ryanzymler
All right, so we're just going to keep going and not even acknowledge all the technical difficulties.
00:00:45
Shauna _she_her_
Nope, I'm trying to keep walking through the fire.
00:00:46
Logan Dorado
okay
00:00:47
ryanzymler
Just keep walking through the fire.
00:00:48
Logan Dorado
Yeah. yeah
00:00:49
ryanzymler
Because honestly, where else can I
Underutilized Characters Discussion
00:00:50
ryanzymler
turn? um So we were picking up with the characters that we thought were wasted. We talked about our faves. We know Xander is the worst.
00:01:00
ryanzymler
Who are the characters that you would have liked to have seen more from?
00:01:04
Shauna _she_her_
I think the one character that got wasted was Kal Penn and beer bad.
00:01:04
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:01:09
Logan Dorado
There.
00:01:11
Shauna _she_her_
OK, no, but.
00:01:11
ryanzymler
Well, he did. Come back as um Fez guy in ah an Angel. He's the one that sends Cordelia of those gross painful visions in season three.
00:01:18
Logan Dorado
Oh, yeah.
00:01:18
Shauna _she_her_
That is true.
00:01:21
Logan Dorado
It's true.
00:01:22
Shauna _she_her_
You know.
00:01:23
ryanzymler
Four, three.
00:01:24
Shauna _she_her_
I would have liked to see more, not necessarily of Clem specifically, but I really like this idea of these kind of like benevolent or at least just like chaotic neutral like brand of demons that like is playing with in the later seasons.
00:01:35
Logan Dorado
You did.
00:01:38
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:01:41
Shauna _she_her_
Like I kind of dig that as a like part of where they're like, no, i' like they're actually a bunch of us. We're just existing as people.
00:01:47
ryanzymler
Right.
00:01:47
Shauna _she_her_
Like, you know, like, like cause I love those scenes. Like we're like spikes carrying groceries. The Crip is like,
00:01:51
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:01:52
ryanzymler
protect Right.
00:01:53
Shauna _she_her_
That's what you do, like this slice of life, you know, moments.
00:01:57
ryanzymler
Very that.
00:01:57
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:01:57
Shauna _she_her_
I think that's where I would like to see more of that.
00:02:00
Logan Dorado
Yes, I would absolutely watch a whole series of of that.
00:02:05
ryanzymler
Of what it's like for the demons in Sunnydale.
00:02:07
Shauna _she_her_
It's like the, like, as the Slayer's fighting in the background, like, like the, like the Zeppo episode, like.
00:02:07
Logan Dorado
Yeah, just like their day. da
00:02:11
ryanzymler
Right. Yes, yes.
00:02:13
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
Problematic Characters and Representation
00:02:15
ryanzymler
Um, I Obviously, I think my number one waste of character is Kendra. um I mean, first of all, Bianca Lawson could still play a high schooler period right now.
00:02:21
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:02:28
Logan Dorado
jesus
00:02:29
Shauna _she_her_
That is true.
00:02:29
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:02:29
ryanzymler
But it was just so fun having a black girl slayer and making her
00:02:37
ryanzymler
from some unknown island um because we don't want to recognize how problematic it was that she was trying to do that Caribbean accent, whatever it was.
00:02:48
ryanzymler
um So instead, we'll just pretend that that's where Kendra was from. Wherever Kendra was from, that was the natural accent and Bianca Lawson did it perfectly.
00:02:56
Shauna _she_her_
well
00:02:58
Logan Dorado
Yeah, naturally.
00:03:00
Shauna _she_her_
Honestly, though, that is ah a thought that I had, like legitimately of a character that I wish I got more of is, you know, Mr. Trick. I thought like he was such a, Arsenio Hall was such a great villain for that.
00:03:07
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:03:07
ryanzymler
ah
00:03:12
Shauna _she_her_
Like, wait, was it? All right.
00:03:13
ryanzymler
No, I don't think it was Arsenio Hall.
00:03:13
Shauna _she_her_
Wait, no, wait. No, no, no, no, no. I'm thinking of a different show that he was the villain on.
00:03:17
ryanzymler
Yeah. um
00:03:18
Shauna _she_her_
It was, um, I'm blanking on the name because I've seen him in other things, but you're right. That was a mistake on my part.
00:03:22
ryanzymler
ah Todd Freeman.
00:03:23
Shauna _she_her_
Wait. Oh.
00:03:24
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:03:25
Shauna _she_her_
Todd f Freeman. Yes, Todd Freeman. Oh, no. Wait, Todd because Todd Freeman is that's what it is. He shows up in the um unfortunate a series of unfortunate events as the like bumbling like always sending him off lawyer.
00:03:40
Shauna _she_her_
That's where I was. just Yeah. Gosh, I need to rewatch Buffy.
00:03:42
ryanzymler
Yeah, he's gross point blank. He was in Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Cider House Rules. Nothing that I'm super familiar with.
00:03:50
Shauna _she_her_
Who am I? Wait, which show am I thinking of?
00:03:53
ryanzymler
I mean, he does, ah it's not surprising that he he inspires an heir of Arsenio Hall. He's definitely not him, but I could see sort of back, back fitting.
00:04:03
Shauna _she_her_
No, I was like trying to think of where I was like, what show I'm thinking of that you it's going to.
00:04:06
Logan Dorado
It'll come to you as soon as we're finished doing this, you know?
00:04:08
Shauna _she_her_
That's where I was like.
00:04:09
ryanzymler
Right, yeah.
00:04:10
Logan Dorado
That's how it always is.
00:04:12
ryanzymler
Who else were our wasted characters or characters?
00:04:13
Shauna _she_her_
like but
00:04:16
Logan Dorado
I definitely...
00:04:17
Shauna _she_her_
But, but no, but like he was such a, like he was in for half that seat, but like but my point really being he was in for half that season and then was quickly like was such an interesting villain.
00:04:17
ryanzymler
Go ahead.
00:04:27
Shauna _she_her_
And you don't usually see vampires with this kind of bigger picture. It's a business baby kind of vibe that I really liked that I think.
00:04:34
ryanzymler
Right, right.
00:04:35
Logan Dorado
Yeah...
00:04:39
Shauna _she_her_
Joss Whedon's this use of black characters in, especially in Buffy is something, there's something to be said for that.
00:04:41
ryanzymler
Yeah. Yeah, very much so.
00:04:47
Logan Dorado
I agree. I mean, I think I would have liked to see a little bit of a bit better closure for some characters.
00:04:50
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah.
Unresolved Character Storylines
00:04:53
Logan Dorado
I wouldn't say they were completely wasted, but I do think like Oz's send off wasn't the best.
00:04:56
ryanzymler
Right.
00:04:59
ryanzymler
Right.
00:05:01
Logan Dorado
That one's success me of the other ones that haven't been mentioned because I do.
00:05:04
ryanzymler
Anya, obviously.
00:05:06
Logan Dorado
Oh, so unceremonious at the end.
00:05:09
ryanzymler
the ah in the comics in the first round, um maybe it was Dark Horse, they they start to resurrect her and then it kind of ends when she still goes.
00:05:17
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:05:18
ryanzymler
um Yeah, definitely characters that deserved more of a fitting end. I know that Oz comes back in season eight of the comics and he like houses the slayers that are on the run for a little bit.
00:05:31
ryanzymler
um But yeah, i I don't like that.
00:05:32
Logan Dorado
and No.
00:05:37
ryanzymler
you know, not don't like, but obviously the complication of Willow being queer when he does return, like for his sort of like proper goodbye, um finding out, you know, that Willow's with Tara and all that stuff, like he doesn't respond great. um And I think i Coincidentally enough, Seth Green is probably...
00:06:05
ryanzymler
Seth Green probably has so many ex-girlfriends that ended up being lesbians, and he's probably so cool about it because Seth Green seems like that kind of person. You'd be like, yeah, cool.
00:06:14
Shauna _she_her_
Seth Green does absolutely seem like the kind of boyfriend a future lesbian would have.
00:06:20
ryanzymler
Yes!
00:06:20
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:06:20
Shauna _she_her_
He does have that vibe at the end.
00:06:22
ryanzymler
Tea!
00:06:22
Logan Dorado
so It's so true.
00:06:23
ryanzymler
Tea!
00:06:24
Shauna _she_her_
That is what it is.
00:06:24
ryanzymler
Absolutely. That's why they cast Seth Green. That's why they cast him as...
00:06:28
Shauna _she_her_
Like I was like, and now I was like, and it's funny because so many lesbians dress like Seth Rogen.
00:06:29
ryanzymler
yeah.
00:06:32
Shauna _she_her_
Like I was like, like, I feel like those, was like the shirt, like I was like, it's like the very, like, you know, like envy, like, like modern, like I was like,
00:06:33
Logan Dorado
Oh, yeah.
00:06:33
ryanzymler
I heard Seth Green.
00:06:40
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:06:42
Shauna _she_her_
Seth, you know, ah the prototype for that future, like funny little guy, like kind of.
00:06:45
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:06:45
Logan Dorado
Mm hmm.
00:06:47
ryanzymler
The funny little guy.
00:06:49
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah, I love it.
00:06:49
ryanzymler
my My pronouns are funny little guy.
00:06:50
Shauna _she_her_
funny I love a funny little guy. It's a great like work type of character.
00:06:51
ryanzymler
Yeah, yeah. I do think that that was a ah ah bit that we had going the other night, Shauna, but my pronouns are funny little guy. Oh, when we were at TK's house, yeah.
Ranking and Discussing Buffy Seasons
00:07:02
ryanzymler
um Okay, so ah rank the seasons from best to worst in your opinion.
00:07:02
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah.
00:07:11
ryanzymler
um Logan, you said yours had changed a little bit.
00:07:16
Logan Dorado
i Well, I didn't write it down. I i feel like it'll be about.
00:07:18
ryanzymler
Oh, right.
00:07:19
Logan Dorado
It'll be because it's ever changing.
00:07:21
Shauna _she_her_
I was going to say, have like I'm curious if mine will change.
00:07:24
Logan Dorado
but I feel like something inherently because season two is still I think the we went through this last time but like I'm not a Buffy Angel fan like I but I love that storyline I love season two it was nothing I see nothing like it obviously since I'm like on rewatches I'm like this is still really great and there were so many great character moments and episodes so I still think season two
00:07:32
ryanzymler
Right here.
00:07:49
Logan Dorado
objectively is my favorite, even though I think my favorite episodes are in other seasons.
00:07:54
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:07:55
Logan Dorado
And I do love season three. I just i think it's just hard because four four and seven are definitely at the bottom for me.
00:08:04
ryanzymler
I want to come back to why but to why you don't like seven, but Shauna, go ahead.
00:08:10
Shauna _she_her_
So I agree that I'm not a big 7, like I'm not a big season 7 fan.
00:08:14
ryanzymler
like got We got to talk through it. We got to talk through it.
00:08:16
Shauna _she_her_
Okay, we'll talk through it.
00:08:16
ryanzymler
But give give me your rankings first.
00:08:17
Shauna _she_her_
But okay, so my rankings, I think Season three is my favorite. I think it's just the best, the best villain arc. It has the best side characters.
00:08:28
Shauna _she_her_
All the majority of my favorite characters are all in season three. It is where the the rest of the the like this is what makes a great Buffy season like was made.
00:08:39
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:08:41
Shauna _she_her_
And then I would probably have to say probably season five just because it's It's so difficult to watch for me because there's so many big emotional hits on it, but ultimately it is very good.
00:08:57
Shauna _she_her_
And it's, it's, but it does it, most of it so well, even if Tara, Tara, an underutilized character, cause ultimately yeah I, at least she died to further a woman's plot.
00:09:03
ryanzymler
yeah
00:09:10
ryanzymler
Right.
00:09:10
Shauna _she_her_
It's progress.
00:09:11
ryanzymler
Wait, so that's six. So is it three, five, six?
00:09:12
Shauna _she_her_
I'd bury your gaze. I think it's three, five. four, two, six, seven, one.
00:09:25
ryanzymler
Wow. Okay.
00:09:26
Logan Dorado
Yeah, I guess I had one in my bottom two.
00:09:26
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah, like that was the, I think one and seven.
00:09:28
Logan Dorado
I was, yeah.
00:09:31
Shauna _she_her_
I think one is still the worst season, but seven is right there after it.
00:09:36
ryanzymler
All right.
00:09:36
Shauna _she_her_
And I know, and this is where something where I, I love, I love season four more than both of you because I'm a big fan of the like, look, it's where Willow discovers her gayness.
00:09:36
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:09:37
ryanzymler
We're coming.
00:09:43
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:09:45
ryanzymler
Adam, the initiative, Riley.
00:09:48
Shauna _she_her_
I, well, I love Spike's turn to being a good guy.
00:09:49
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:09:51
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:09:52
Shauna _she_her_
Like I think Spike's arc of getting defanged and what he does where he's like, you know, odd coupling it with Giles where like, I love all of that kind of like,
00:09:53
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:10:02
ryanzymler
Yeah. Or Xander.
00:10:04
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah. Or Xander for that matter. Like it's such a nice, like, I think that's a real fun thing.
00:10:06
Logan Dorado
Mhmm.
00:10:07
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:10:10
Shauna _she_her_
Like Anya gets to be involved and joins as part of the gang for the first time.
00:10:14
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:10:15
Shauna _she_her_
Like, but season two is, is, it's close.
00:10:15
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:10:20
ryanzymler
All right, mine are three, five, seven, two, six, one, four. Same thing for season three, I think season
00:10:31
Shauna _she_her_
Wow, that you have, I'm surprised you have four lower than season one even.
00:10:36
ryanzymler
Well, because I don't know, I would maybe switch that. I haven't gone back and and watched season one in a in a while.
00:10:40
Shauna _she_her_
I was like.
00:10:43
ryanzymler
I think I probably would switch that because there are a lot of great points in season four.
00:10:44
Logan Dorado
Hmm.
00:10:47
ryanzymler
There are a lot of great points in season four. Season one, yeah.
00:10:50
Shauna _she_her_
like Like Adam really brings it brings the season down, I think. I think he looks weird, but like I love like the,
00:10:56
ryanzymler
The initiative was kind of a cool concept.
00:10:58
Shauna _she_her_
Delicious is a cool thing.
00:10:59
Logan Dorado
Yeah, it was.
00:10:59
Shauna _she_her_
And I think where they turn on Buffy is a real cool plot line.
00:11:03
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:11:03
Shauna _she_her_
And I like that. like you know the like you know And of course, like Hush is on the list, obviously, of greatest episodes like in a way that I don't think they're...
00:11:08
ryanzymler
yes Yes.
00:11:11
Shauna _she_her_
like I think the season finale is a great episode of season one, but really season one is missing those kinds... There's like three, maybe four episodes I tell people to watch of season one when I'm recommending Buffy.
00:11:24
ryanzymler
Yeah, that's true.
00:11:24
Shauna _she_her_
Buffy is the like the original, okay, but just get past the first season like show of which there's, and I think this is a future episode of ours, of like shows that you just need to get past the first season of because they're so good, because like I'm a big fan of a few of those, but like Buffy I think is at the top of that list.
00:11:28
Logan Dorado
Yes, yes.
00:11:28
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:11:29
ryanzymler
A hundred percent. A hundred percent.
00:11:42
Logan Dorado
Yes, it is definitely the original.
00:11:42
ryanzymler
Yeah, totally.
00:11:45
ryanzymler
I mean, I will, season one has just, it's it's definitely, I'm gonna switch four in one and say that one is last because one has just now, I need to rewatch it and I think it would be really fun to rewatch it together because it is so bad that it's campy.
00:11:58
Logan Dorado
Mmm.
00:12:03
ryanzymler
It's full blown camp. It's like,
00:12:04
Logan Dorado
It's so camp.
00:12:05
Shauna _she_her_
I mean, it's got the, the puppet L episode, but not even like ah they get turned into puppets because I love it.
00:12:05
ryanzymler
Wow, we this was on TV. There's a puppet episode. Again, we, you know, I, Robot, you, Jane.
00:12:15
Shauna _she_her_
They get turned into puppets episode, but a ventriloquist puppet episode less so.
00:12:16
ryanzymler
Smile time, yeah.
00:12:17
Logan Dorado
Yeah?
00:12:20
ryanzymler
Seeing the characters that we never get referenced again, um that girl, Darcy, that turns invisible, that is played by none other than a lesbian icon.
00:12:25
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:12:27
Shauna _she_her_
Oh my gosh. But like, you know, but like.
00:12:32
ryanzymler
Fuck, what's her name? Come on.
00:12:33
Logan Dorado
Oh, um, oh my God.
00:12:34
Shauna _she_her_
Oh, um, isn't it, um, from, from the, what's it called?
00:12:38
ryanzymler
the The faculty.
00:12:39
Logan Dorado
The faculty, I can see her face.
00:12:40
ryanzymler
um
00:12:43
Logan Dorado
Oh my God.
00:12:43
ryanzymler
there are There are gay people screaming at us right now.
00:12:43
Logan Dorado
What?
00:12:45
Shauna _she_her_
Claire, it's not Claire Danes.
00:12:45
Logan Dorado
I know.
00:12:46
ryanzymler
Who plays?
00:12:46
Logan Dorado
I feel like Ryan, I feel like our mutual friend Lauren is like, onenie is is like, ears are ringing so loudly right now.
00:12:48
Shauna _she_her_
No.
00:12:49
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:12:52
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:12:53
Logan Dorado
Oh my God.
00:12:54
ryanzymler
um it's And it's not Veruca.
00:12:54
Logan Dorado
What is?
00:12:56
ryanzymler
What's her character's name?
00:12:57
Shauna _she_her_
Faruka Salt.
00:12:59
ryanzymler
No, Veruca is in...
00:12:59
Shauna _she_her_
No.
00:13:01
ryanzymler
um She's the other werewolf.
00:13:02
Shauna _she_her_
No, she's the other werewolf.
00:13:05
Logan Dorado
Clea Du Vall
00:13:06
ryanzymler
Clea Duvall!
00:13:06
Shauna _she_her_
Clea Duvall. Yes. Okay. No, but it is.
00:13:09
Logan Dorado
So mad, I couldn't remember that.
00:13:10
Shauna _she_her_
Clea Duvall is, no, that is, I'm thinking the, um, but I'm a cheerleader.
00:13:11
ryanzymler
you
00:13:14
Shauna _she_her_
Isn't that also, but I'm a cheerleader, Clea Duvall?
00:13:14
ryanzymler
Yes, yes, correct.
00:13:15
Logan Dorado
Yes, yes with Natasha Leon, yep, yep.
00:13:16
Shauna _she_her_
Thank you. I was like, I wanted to say it, but I've already screwed up one name reference. So I didn't want to go through it.
00:13:21
ryanzymler
And also Veep, she plays a hysterical, she's the straight man as a queer woman um in Veep to Julia Louis-Dreyfus' character to, I mean mostly to Julia Louis-Dreyfus'
00:13:22
Shauna _she_her_
Like.
00:13:24
Logan Dorado
Oh yeah.
Critique of Caleb and Season Seven
00:13:36
ryanzymler
character.
00:13:37
ryanzymler
character um Okay, so what don't you all like about season seven?
00:13:45
Shauna _she_her_
I don't like Caleb. I think he has a dumb haircut and I think he's just like, doesn't do it for me.
00:13:48
ryanzymler
Okay.
00:13:54
Shauna _she_her_
Like I like Nathan Fillion, but I think Caleb's stupid.
00:13:57
ryanzymler
I always thought Caleb was on.
00:13:57
Logan Dorado
He had the...
00:13:58
Shauna _she_her_
And so like, like he does like, I'm like, oh cool, like blowing up the Watchers Council is like a big move, but like, but I'm like, but he's just like this like priest dude who's like, and I don't know, it's just
00:13:59
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:14:05
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:14:09
Shauna _she_her_
with his dumb haircut, like it got, it's a very, like, why does he have a bowl cut? Like, what are we doing here?
00:14:14
Logan Dorado
but we
00:14:14
Shauna _she_her_
You have Nathan Fillion and you're like, let's make a, let's give him the Bill Squire, like look across like, she's.
00:14:21
ryanzymler
Read him, Shawna. I've never heard you go in on someone like that over their appearance, and it's valid. Because they really made.
00:14:27
Shauna _she_her_
Also, I'm absolutely going to say, Bill Squire is a friend and I'm going to absolutely message him and be like that when he had to get the dumb haircut is literally the haircut that Caleb has in Buffy.
00:14:34
ryanzymler
Yeah. That's historical.
00:14:37
Logan Dorado
ah
00:14:37
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah. It was like, yeah, but he has the kind of haircut that you lose a bet and have to get a haircut for. What are we doing?
00:14:43
ryanzymler
Got it.
00:14:43
Shauna _she_her_
The costume is so great.
00:14:43
ryanzymler
Right, right.
00:14:44
Shauna _she_her_
You're like, he's a pretty anyways, but yeah.
00:14:46
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:14:46
Shauna _she_her_
And I think, but okay, back to seriousness though. It's so, it's just such a dark season. It's such a downer of a season. It's just, and as we've we've talked in one of our other iterations of this episode, so I have a hard time watching season five because my rewatches tend to get stifled there because I've never seen the episode where Joyce dies.
00:15:08
Logan Dorado
And then I have.
00:15:08
ryanzymler
Yeah, of course.
00:15:09
Shauna _she_her_
And as someone who lost her mom at a very similar age to when Buffy was, it hits me way too hard. So I always get stopped.
00:15:15
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:15:16
Shauna _she_her_
And it's like, you know what? I think since I'm running out of time, maybe that's going to be, I'm going to re pick up because I literally started. I've got to rewatch it all through and get to get through season five, watch all the episodes.
00:15:29
Shauna _she_her_
But yeah, I think the down endings of season seven.
00:15:29
ryanzymler
um i'll watch I'll watch it with you. I i haven't watched it since my mom died.
00:15:32
Shauna _she_her_
Okay.
00:15:34
ryanzymler
And um I'll be your emotional support viewer because...
00:15:38
Shauna _she_her_
Thank you. Yeah, we'll do the, um, the Aubrey Plaza in Parks and Rec, where she's like, and we have to wear a lot of mascara so we know if you cry.
00:15:39
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:15:44
Logan Dorado
it's Yeah, it's it's a lot.
00:15:45
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:15:45
Shauna _she_her_
like the
00:15:48
Logan Dorado
It's a tough one. I i often do not rewatch it on rewatches.
00:15:49
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:15:54
Shauna _she_her_
Right? Like, but that's where I'm like, and I, I should have seen it the first time through, but it was like, again, it was like 10 years ago, it was closer and like, yeah.
00:15:56
ryanzymler
Mom?
00:16:04
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:16:05
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:16:05
ryanzymler
Logan, what's, what's your beef with season seven?
00:16:08
Logan Dorado
I hate that they kick Buffy out of her own house, and I know that it's such like a basic thing to hate.
00:16:11
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:16:13
Logan Dorado
um
00:16:13
ryanzymler
It's one specific moment that really, I just saw someone on Twitter being like, that's my village, villain origin story. Like that's where you turn people.
00:16:21
Logan Dorado
one hundred percent
00:16:22
Shauna _she_her_
I just saw that too, like probably because you liked it the wasted character.
00:16:23
Logan Dorado
100%.
00:16:23
ryanzymler
Yeah. Yeah.
00:16:27
Logan Dorado
I also agree. I think Caleb could have been a better villain. um I think there was no pun intended, or I guess pun intended, a lot of potential for the idea of that character. um but
00:16:37
Shauna _she_her_
Wasting Nathan Fillion.
00:16:38
Logan Dorado
it wasting yeah wasting ah Nathan Fillion. But there are really great moments in that season too. I just think overall it felt very hodgepodgey somehow.
00:16:49
Logan Dorado
I don't know. Maybe I do need to go back and and be a little bit more kind to it on a rewatch. um Just there are some things that I just don't understand. Like I'm cheering on Buffy so quickly.
00:16:59
ryanzymler
yeah
00:16:59
Logan Dorado
Like this is the woman who literally has died how many times to save the world and then you' you're doing this. And I think it it it kind of suffers from the last season of Game of Thrones kind of mentality, where it feels very rushed to get to that point of them wanting to kick her out.
00:17:09
Shauna _she_her_
Mm.
00:17:13
Logan Dorado
I won't give any spoilers for that show, but I just feel like that kind of, that that's reminded me of quite a bit.
00:17:16
Shauna _she_her_
No, I. They did kind of, I get where you're saying where they kind of jump to that conclusion, you're like, well, this is the only answer, Buffy's wrong, so go fuck yourself. Like after everything, like what are we doing?
00:17:27
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:17:28
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:17:28
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:17:29
ryanzymler
I will, I touch, I absolutely hate that part of season seven.
00:17:30
Shauna _she_her_
Come on.
00:17:33
ryanzymler
I like see that season seven because there's a lot of payoffs. I love a long-term payoff um in in ah selfless when Xander,
00:17:39
Logan Dorado
Mm hmm.
00:17:47
ryanzymler
or when Buffy finally calls out Xander for lying about the moment in season two when Willow says, tell her I'm going to try to re-insoul him, and instead he tells
00:17:52
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:17:56
ryanzymler
Buffy that Will said kick his ass and we get this like three second moment with these three people that we've known for seven eight years now and you're like He didn't, she never said that.
00:18:07
ryanzymler
Like, like it really, that was a moment I made.
00:18:08
Logan Dorado
yeah yeah
00:18:10
ryanzymler
I, you know, my ex would, would end up watching random episodes with me. And I went back and like, I showed him that scene where they're arguing over like, she's like, I killed Angel, blah, blah, blah.
00:18:22
ryanzymler
And then um I went back and showed him the reference and he was like, these people deserve Emmys. Like, they the payoff of it is so good and i think we get a lot of that in season seven especially with faith coming back who again is my favorite character um but there are some down moments i i just think it's a great series finale and to me even though there are some blunders in season seven i look at it with like
00:18:31
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:18:50
ryanzymler
these great moments of like incredible season finale or series finale, Faith coming back. um You know, all of these moments that really make up season seven, even if it's rushed at times and it's just so good.
00:19:04
Shauna _she_her_
I, it's like, I kind of like Andrew. I think Andrew gets like, I think Ryan, like, and really like being like this, like, says this like storyteller exaggerator and like getting to use like that to then tell the story of Anya.
00:19:08
ryanzymler
Oh God, Andrew getting his fucking like his time to shine queer representation.
00:19:14
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:19:18
ryanzymler
Yeah.
Favorite Villains and Characters
00:19:22
Shauna _she_her_
Like, I thought it was such a cool, like, but like also, you know, like, also I love that the actor is, is of us and it's just an impression.
00:19:22
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:19:30
ryanzymler
Yes.
00:19:30
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:19:32
ryanzymler
So, storyteller.
00:19:33
Logan Dorado
Yeah, I love the whole episode that he gets to the story.
00:19:33
Shauna _she_her_
Well,
00:19:36
Logan Dorado
Oh, it's one of my favorites.
00:19:36
Shauna _she_her_
yeah
00:19:37
ryanzymler
Yeah, so good.
00:19:38
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:19:38
Shauna _she_her_
I think it's ah that is a cool one.
00:19:40
Logan Dorado
Hello, gentle viewers.
00:19:40
ryanzymler
Honestly, one of my favorite Anya moments is in that when ah he like cuts to her and people when he's telling a story in the bathroom and it cuts to her and she goes,
00:19:52
ryanzymler
If you're masturbating, just go in your room and do it quietly like ah like the rest of us do or something. And then she's wearing this, like, baby doll sweater and these, like, ah you know, it was, like, 2004-ish, so the seam of her jeans was cut off on the top.
00:20:07
ryanzymler
She looks so hot.
00:20:08
Logan Dorado
Mm hmm.
00:20:08
ryanzymler
Oh, my God. um Okay, so we're we're pressed for time. um You know, quick ranking. Who are your favorite villains?
00:20:19
Logan Dorado
The mayor.
00:20:20
Shauna _she_her_
I, the mare, the mare, yeah, the mare and faith and like, yeah, I think the mare and faith and then it's okay.
00:20:21
ryanzymler
Oh, mayor in faith, specifically.
00:20:23
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:20:29
Shauna _she_her_
So I was thinking about this for the seasons where I think I have to tear them. So like, like tear up, like, I think I would tear the mare, like in his own, and then just below that I would put glory and the whirlwind, like the triumvirate between Drusilla and Spike and, and Jealous.
00:20:47
ryanzymler
Yeah, yeah.
00:20:49
Shauna _she_her_
And then probably after that,
00:20:52
ryanzymler
Dark Willow.
00:20:53
Shauna _she_her_
Dark Willow, absolutely. Yeah, honestly, even in that tier, I would put Dark Willow.
00:20:57
ryanzymler
Yeah.
00:20:58
Shauna _she_her_
like Almost brought down a tier by that trio. that like But yeah, and then probably the mass.
00:21:03
ryanzymler
Yeah. It was a good bait and switch though. Like we're building this whole season.
00:21:08
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah.
00:21:10
ryanzymler
That was one thing that Buffy did so well was they would build towards the villain. And then you're like, man, what's going to happen? And then boom, plot twist. That's not the big bad.
00:21:22
ryanzymler
Um, then who's left?
00:21:23
Logan Dorado
Mm hmm.
00:21:24
ryanzymler
Logan, where?
00:21:24
Shauna _she_her_
The plot to it big bad is addiction.
00:21:27
Logan Dorado
Yes.
00:21:27
ryanzymler
Yeah. The Big Bad is life.
00:21:28
Shauna _she_her_
Sorry.
00:21:29
ryanzymler
That's what they all say about season six.
00:21:30
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah.
00:21:30
ryanzymler
The Big Bad is life.
00:21:31
Logan Dorado
they're not They're not wrong. Yeah, I think that the Drusilla Spike Angel, I love that dynamic. I love Drusilla. I wish we would have gotten more of her. I'm such a great actress.
00:21:43
Logan Dorado
I will absolutely adore her. And then, yeah, The Mayor is definitely up there. i will i I would have watched a whole like sitcom with him and Faith and Trick.
00:21:53
ryanzymler
Mm-hmm.
00:21:54
Logan Dorado
I think that would have been great.
Conclusion and What's Next?
00:22:01
Shauna _she_her_
now. You're back.
00:22:02
Logan Dorado
Oh, you're back.
00:22:02
Shauna _she_her_
You're back. We're done.
00:22:03
ryanzymler
Yeah, yeah, ah sorry about that. So we're we're gonna we're gonna wrap up. um We didn't get to the, the bang Joel spy fucking all of the ships that we, it's not Biley.
00:22:16
Shauna _she_her_
It's not Biley. it's Spuffy Angel Bylee.
00:22:19
ryanzymler
Everyone knows it's not Biley.
00:22:23
ryanzymler
um Okay, so the most, the most important question of real hot nerd shit.
00:22:23
Logan Dorado
It's not Biley.
00:22:24
Shauna _she_her_
Never Bylee. Red Flag.
00:22:30
ryanzymler
Logan, who is the hottest character on Buffy the Vampire Slayer?
00:22:32
Logan Dorado
Oh man, I knew you were gonna ask me that. Faith.
00:22:35
ryanzymler
hu
00:22:38
Logan Dorado
Probably Faith.
00:22:38
ryanzymler
Correct answer. Correct answer, Shauna
00:22:39
Logan Dorado
yeah
00:22:40
ryanzymler
Who's yours?
00:22:41
Shauna _she_her_
I think my my very bisexual ass has a very hard time deciding between Faith and Spike.
00:22:48
ryanzymler
o
00:22:48
Logan Dorado
that's That was the conundrum for me.
00:22:49
Shauna _she_her_
Like, and it's the, it is really and truly, it's a 1 and 1A. Like, I'm going to go with Spike because at the end of the day, I mean, well, they both exhibited consent issues, really.
00:23:04
Shauna _she_her_
So yeah, you know what?
00:23:04
ryanzymler
True. Oh, shit.
00:23:05
Shauna _she_her_
like
00:23:05
Logan Dorado
Yeah.
00:23:05
ryanzymler
True. True. What does that say about us, you all?
00:23:09
Logan Dorado
i um
00:23:09
ryanzymler
That our two favorite people are people who have demonstrated histories of sexual violence.
00:23:13
Shauna _she_her_
Well, apparently we're into some real hot nerd shit.
00:23:15
Logan Dorado
Yeah, apparently.
00:23:16
ryanzymler
Yeah. Yeah. And also, obviously, Buffy is the other hottie.
00:23:18
Shauna _she_her_
Well, that's a note.
00:23:20
Logan Dorado
Mm-hmm.
00:23:21
ryanzymler
um
00:23:22
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah, but also.
00:23:23
ryanzymler
Anya. Smoke Show.
00:23:25
Logan Dorado
Oh, yeah.
00:23:26
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah.
00:23:26
ryanzymler
Giles.
00:23:27
Logan Dorado
Ripper.
00:23:28
Logan Dorado
and Ripper is ripper.
00:23:28
ryanzymler
Ripper.
00:23:28
Shauna _she_her_
Ripper, oh, it's Ripper.
00:23:31
ryanzymler
Case settled. Case settled. Ripper is the hottest character on Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
00:23:36
Shauna _she_her_
Yeah, if these might cancel each other out in bisexual fever dream, yeah.
00:23:38
ryanzymler
Quickly. Yes, exactly. Yes. ah Logan, thank you so much.
00:23:43
Logan Dorado
Perfect.
00:23:45
ryanzymler
Before we wrap up, where can folks find you on social media if they want to learn more?
00:23:51
Logan Dorado
um So you can always follow f Flimming Rivercon on Instagram and Facebook. I also sporadically post ah on Instagram as Logan in the Wild. I do some art things as well, but it's mostly if you wanted to just see me occasionally pop off in my Instagram stories about whatever random nerd shit that I have decided that I wanted to let the world know about because I'm scared of Twitter.
00:24:14
Logan Dorado
So that's where you can find me.
00:24:14
ryanzymler
Yeah. Thank you. Shawna, where can folks find you?
00:24:19
Shauna _she_her_
Uh, you can find me, um, at @hellinpastels and I'm on Instagram and Twitter. Cause I will only dead name that platform.
00:24:26
ryanzymler
And it's so good. ah at, you can find me an at intuitiveblurred or at realhotnerdpod. Thank you all so much for joining us.
00:24:36
Shauna _she_her_
Yes.
00:24:37
ryanzymler
um You will catch us on our next episode where we'll be discussing our final installment of our favorite nerd shit. We'll be talking about our video game legacies with our friend Ryan.
00:24:50
ryanzymler
We can't wait to see you then. Stay nerdy cuties. Bye.