Transcript
Heather Roberts: Hey, everyone, and welcome back to For Books Sake. I am Heather Roberts.
Veronica Adams: I am Veronica Adams and we are 1852 media.
Heather Roberts: An 1852 literary.
Veronica Adams: That's true. We are now also 1852 literary. I gotta start throwing that in.
Heather Roberts: Yes, I know.
Veronica Adams: Thank you.
Heather Roberts: We are the 1852 conglomerate, but if you will.
Veronica Adams: Yes, yes.
Heather Roberts: um So yeah, 1852 everything.
Veronica Adams: It was 1852 everything.
Heather Roberts: We are excited about it today. So I want to share this up front so that you know what you're getting with this episode. but
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: ah We're going to be doing sort of a yearly roundup. We're going to reminisce about some things from this year. And then this is going to be our final episode of 2024.
Veronica Adams: yes
Heather Roberts: We're going into the holiday season. So it's going to allow Veronica and I to take some much needed Friday recording time to prep for that and finish up end of year stuff.
Veronica Adams: yeah Yes. Yes.
Heather Roberts: And then we will be back in January of 2025.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: And we are excited about that. We're going to be planning out, hopefully, Crossing Fingers, um some really good episodes with some guests um on the episode.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: So we're going to be changing up the format a little bit.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, maybe not every episode, but like, it's not just going to be the two of us every time going forward.
Heather Roberts: um And yeah.
Heather Roberts: Right. We have a ton of content. If you are just joining us for the first time, there are two seasons of episodes.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: I love that.
Heather Roberts: Uh, this, this is our four.
Veronica Adams: We're living our life in seasons now.
Heather Roberts: I know this is our 41st episode in season two.
Veronica Adams: Shut up!
Heather Roberts: Yes. So we did 41 episodes this year.
Veronica Adams: How?
Heather Roberts: I'm not sure how many we did in 2023. I'd had to go back and look, but now
Veronica Adams: It wasn't nearly as many, but still.
Heather Roberts: because we started in the middle of the year.
Veronica Adams: That's true.
Heather Roberts: Um, so yeah, we did 41 episodes this year.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: That that's a lot of episodes. There's also 2023 content. So there's plenty go back and listen to that.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Um, get caught up.
Veronica Adams: Get caught up.
Heather Roberts: Uh, there's, there's plenty to go back and hear from.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: So we're going to try to change up the format a little bit in 2025.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: and bring on some guests that we can talk to you about some topics that are trending and popular right now.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: So yeah, so we're really excited about that.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Heather Roberts: Wanted to let you guys know upfront before you got into this episode. So if you want to turn it off now, that's why I know.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Peace out. We'll see you in January.
Heather Roberts: He's out. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, I also didn't want to leave you guys hanging for without telling you what we're doing.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Right.
Heather Roberts: It's just a there's no episode and yell that.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Right.
Heather Roberts: So yeah, it's been quite a year. I mean, let's talk about our accomplishments this year, because I think it's important when you look back, you know, like accomplishments, and then you have to
Veronica Adams: Hasn't it?
Veronica Adams: Okay.
Heather Roberts: think about like, what could we do better, right?
Veronica Adams: yeah For sure.
Heather Roberts: There's always so much that we could do better. And I feel like if everybody looks critically at their own business, there's always so much they could do better.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: um But we had a huge accomplishment. I mean, opening 1852 literary, huge, huge thing, a huge goal.
Veronica Adams: The big. Yeah. Yes.
Heather Roberts: Um, we've been wanting at least on, you know, I've been wanting, um, Mikey, my husband has been wanting to open that. Almost since we started the marketing company, like literally eight, eight, nine years.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Veronica Adams: Yes, and expanding the business into the publishing side of things one way or another has always been at the top of his list. And I think on the back burner for you just because of the day -to -day with the marketing side, but like, for as long as I've been involved with y 'all, it has definitely always been part of the future plan and the, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: overarching plan. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: So where it just, we didn't have the pieces lined up to slot incorrectly until this year.
Veronica Adams: Right. Yeah. It just worked out beautifully.
Heather Roberts: And yeah, it was time
Veronica Adams: It it was time.
Heather Roberts: And you know this this goes to timing. Timing is everything.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: And just because you have an idea and a have and you have a goal, could we have forced this before?
Veronica Adams: Sure.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, we could have, but would we be as poised to be as successful?
Veronica Adams: No.
Heather Roberts: No, no, we would have been floundering.
Veronica Adams: No.
Heather Roberts: We wouldn't have been able to give as much attention to our marketing clients as we need to.
Veronica Adams: yeah Yes.
Heather Roberts: um And this has just worked out so beautifully and has really put us in a position to to be successful.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes.
Heather Roberts: So we already have some things in the works.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: that I can't talk about, but I really am excited about.
Veronica Adams: Very excited though.
Heather Roberts: And trust me, um if you follow me on socials, I will be screaming about the deals as soon as they are done. Like like you will you will get annoyed by me.
Veronica Adams: You guys are gonna be sick of Heather tooting her own horn.
Heather Roberts: I don't care. Yes. Right. But, you know, I'm just I'm really excited and things are things are happening.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: So that's great. um But yes, that's that's a big win, a big win for this year.
Veronica Adams: Mm -hmm.
Heather Roberts: And I know, Veronica, you have some things coming. You're lining things up to to start to start moving some things on your side as well.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes. Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: The agents say.
Veronica Adams: I will, I'm sure trail behind you, but I'm coming. We're getting started.
Heather Roberts: You're coming.
Veronica Adams: It's, it's yes.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: Yes. So it's been great. um And we love having Becky on board. That that really has been such a key you know thing for the business.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: um So yeah, that's been really great. And then the marketing side of things, you know it's been good. it's It's certainly been good. We love all of our clients there. This is not like a client.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: We hate our clients. No, I'm talking about business side of things.
Veronica Adams: Oh my, oh my God, no.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, like I just don't want this to be misinterpreted. ah The business side of things, it's been pretty good. We could have done better about marketing ourselves in different ways.
Veronica Adams: We're too busy marketing everybody else.
Heather Roberts: um Yeah, so that's one thing ah that we had being a marketing firm, we're very good at marketing other people.
Veronica Adams: I mean, yeah.
Heather Roberts: But when it comes to ourselves, it's like when you're a therapist, right? Or like anything else, you're good at giving advice to other people, but maybe not always for yourself.
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Veronica Adams: Well, not only not only like not giving yourself or taking your own advice, but also like finding the bandwidth to do self promotion because it it changes a little bit like the way you look at things.
Veronica Adams: It's harder to be objective about your own business.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: That's why we have clientele because authors are typically not really very self promotional or struggle to juggle
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: creativity, writing, editing, plotting, et cetera, with promotion and advertising and marketing.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Like they just, you know, two sides of the brain that you're using here. So it's kind of the same thing for us, right? Like having to stop and think about what we're doing with the business and maybe how do we put ourselves out there more and push 1852 media or 1852 literary for that matter.
Heather Roberts: yeah
Heather Roberts: Right, right.
Veronica Adams: And it's different when you're looking at your own interests rather than somebody else's. Completely different.
Heather Roberts: It is. It's completely different. So that's something that we've we've definitely done more of this year, but not as much as we should have done.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Veronica Adams: For sure.
Heather Roberts: And it's not in a consistent way that makes me feel like, oh, we nailed that.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: yeah know So that's a goal for 2025 is to be more consistent about our own promotions, our own marketing, um and pushing that out there.
Veronica Adams: Mm -hmm.
Heather Roberts: So
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Heather Roberts: um'm I'm thinking proactively instead of being in the moment and being swirled around.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Uh -huh.
Heather Roberts: um But I feel like I'm finally in a place where I can do that too. You know what I mean?
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: like These past several years have just been wild. I mean, you moved, I moved.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Heather Roberts: um finding you know I moved twice.
Veronica Adams: Uh -huh.
Heather Roberts: ah Settling yourself into a house. My son went off to college. Your son went to preschool.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah, it's it's been ah it's been a whirlwind.
Heather Roberts: you know
Veronica Adams: Like, honestly, it's the pandemic, really.
Heather Roberts: So and yeah, right.
Veronica Adams: Like, and maybe even a little bit before, because I got pregnant before the pandemic and that was unexpected. But um yeah, I mean, you know, like, the last five years, I would say, huge.
Heather Roberts: Right, right.
Heather Roberts: yeah Yeah. Yeah, it's been really an upheaval, an upheaval.
Veronica Adams: um
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yeah, because you guys packed up and moved right after my son was born. So like, it was
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: I had a baby then you guys left where you were and moved to a completely new place. But it was like a temporary situation because you guys rented for a little while while you worked worked out where you were permanently going to stay and where you wanted to be, where you're at now and found the right property and all of that.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: And then you had to go through the process. doing the the final move into the permanent home and then we got the wild idea to pack up where we were and move all the way across the country too and it's just been yeah it's been weird and wild and but this has been kind of the most stable normal year we've had in the last four or five for sure.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. and sir It's been wild. turn turn Turbulent. There was the word I was looking for.
Heather Roberts: It has, it has. um And now, you know, my son went off to college, so it's actually a little bit more stable because we're not having, you know, after school programs and like, yeah, yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, you're not doing high school high school parenting stuff.
Heather Roberts: And now we're doing college parenting stuff, which is, you know. something else, but different, different.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Heather Roberts: And it gives, it gives more time, you know, gives us more time, gives me more time during the day.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: I'm not thinking about, Oh, he's coming. I mean, you're a parent, everyone, everyone who's listening, who's a parent understands what I'm saying. Like your child comes home, you're thinking about what time are they coming home? What are their activities for the evening?
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Heather Roberts: What, did what are we going to do for dinner on the table?
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Heather Roberts: You know, like,
Veronica Adams: him Yeah.
Heather Roberts: making sure that their needs are met before your own needs are met.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: And when that priority is in place, oftentimes other things get pushed to the back burner, right?
Veronica Adams: Sure.
Heather Roberts: And some people are able to balance that really, really well and some people aren't.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: and you know And some people do it well in certain days and some people don't do it well in other days. And that's really me.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Some days I was i excelled and some days I did not.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: um And thankfully, I have a spouse who's ah very much ah an involved parent and very much helpful around the house, but still very challenging.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Heather Roberts: so And when the kids are younger, it's even more challenging. So, I mean, this is not a parenting podcast, but y 'all get what I'm saying.
Veronica Adams: For sure.
Heather Roberts: Um, so my point being priority shift, right? When you're a business owner, your priority shift, when you have personal things going on.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: Um, I imagine if you're a caretaker for a parent or a family member or something very similar, anytime you're in that caretaker role, um, it changes things.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: So 2025, my son's at college. Hopefully we all keep our health to knock on wood.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: it should allow me to be a little bit more proactive about certain things and you know have more bandwidth for for the business, yeah, for all of the businesses.
Veronica Adams: More bandwidth for the business.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: But yeah, and I hope that you're listening to me speak and thinking, oh, what could I be doing with my business? Was I like this too?
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Because that's really what this is about. Like, yes, of course I'm talking about myself and Veronica is talking about herself and about our business, you know, but at the same time, you should be looking back at your own business as well for this past year.
Veronica Adams: Right.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. where Where has your energy gone?
Heather Roberts: Where did,
Veronica Adams: What what did you pour yourself into?
Heather Roberts: yeah, how could you do better?
Veronica Adams: what what What were those things, your priorities, or were they things that were simply necessities and maybe you're clearing the calendar or those responsibilities are ending and you can pivot or add more things to your plate.
Veronica Adams: Or maybe you know something's coming up and you need to start planning to reduce the amount of responsibilities that you have.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Like this works in reverse too, for sure.
Heather Roberts: It does. It does.
Veronica Adams: You know, we've we've both had to spend some time these last couple of years focusing on being our best in ah so in in and stable for our active current clientele rather than on growing the business.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Veronica Adams: We're getting ready to to be able to do both of those things now.
Heather Roberts: Exactly.
Veronica Adams: um
Heather Roberts: Um, yeah. Cause it always felt like, well, I could go out and try to recruit new clients, you know, and try to grow the business, um, and, or offer different services or, you know, do something else.
Veronica Adams: Right.
Heather Roberts: But I also didn't want to take away from what I was providing the clients because that's our number one priority is quality of service.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Yes. Yes.
Heather Roberts: So yeah.
Veronica Adams: And if it means staying in a lane for a while and, you know, just focusing on doing what you do and doing it well, there is nothing wrong with that. Like, you know, it, you can be in reduction mode, you can be in growth mode.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Veronica Adams: You can also just be in stay in your lane mode and there's nothing wrong with that.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. Yeah, so I really feel like this past year was, till towards the end, um was a bit of you know continuing to stabilize, you know like let's stabilize and see where we're at.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: And then we did feel mid -year, okay, it might be time that we can start moving towards growth. We can start a growth model approach as opposed to just a stability approach.
Veronica Adams: yeah Yep.
Veronica Adams: Mm hmm.
Heather Roberts: um And that's where, you know, the literary agency started to to come alive and um and all of that.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Everything has just lined up beautifully for that so far.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: I know. No notes like
Heather Roberts: So it's been good. Yeah. And the thing is with your own business, there could be something you want for years. Like I'm not kidding. We've wanted this for nine years and it might just not have happened yet.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: So don't give up hope that it's not going to happen. Don't be like, Oh, that's never gonna happen.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Just, you know, it might be that the timing hasn't lined up for you yet. You have to keep your ears open. You have to keep your eyes open. and wait for these things to market conditions to be correct, whatever it is.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: Just don't give up hope on that dream because it very well could happen.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, I think. And it can be anything, right? Like a co -write, a reader signing event that you've never been to, that you want to, you know, that you want to have a spot at, a table at, whatever, like, um, audio book, translations, a new creative project, social media, video goes viral.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: I mean, whatever it is, right?
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: It can be anything.
Heather Roberts: You can be banging your head against the wall for years. I know this actually sounds a little sad now, but no, but for real, you're banging your head against the wall for years.
Veronica Adams: here
Veronica Adams: hey This is a motivational speaker, guys, I promise.
Heather Roberts: And ah now I I know, but it can open, you know, like it can happen.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Heather Roberts: You don't want to throw all your energy into the thing that's not working.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: You know, that, that's not useful, but you do want to allow yourself to be open for the opportunity if it does arise for you.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Right. Right.
Heather Roberts: So that that's my takeaway, um, for this year. And I'm really excited about next year. ah I mean, tentatively, I mean, well, yeah.
Veronica Adams: Well, I mean, it's all it's all still possibilities right now, right? Like we're here it is. It's the end of November. We're talking about it. It's five weeks around the corner, right? The kickoff of this six weeks at most.
Veronica Adams: So it's all still perspective, right? Like we're not in it yet. Of course we're excited about it.
Heather Roberts: yeah Yeah.
Veronica Adams: And you guys should, listening should be excited about whatever you have planned out and or ah are intending to achieve in 2025 too. Like this is the time to really be thinking about that.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, those are my intrusive thoughts reminding me about real life that's happening in 2025.
Veronica Adams: I mean, sure.
Heather Roberts: And so like, yeah, there's there's things that are going to potentially damper your success or your ability to be successful. But the best part about being a business owner is that you get to learn how to pivot around those things.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes.
Heather Roberts: That's literally your job as a business owner. How do I pivot to get around hurdles that come at me?
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: So that's the way I'm choosing to look at any changes that may come in 2025 and beyond. And I'm choosing to be excited about the business. I'm choosing to be mindful and to make plans that I believe will be successful.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: So, and you should do the same with your own businesses.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: Because as a reminder, I know we've been saying this for 41 episodes, but your books are your business. You are a business owner and you need to treat your writing career as a business.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Veronica Adams: Well, and anyone who's listening who hasn't yet really had that mindset shift, spend some time with that because it it's true.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: it It may just be a creative outlet that you've monetized or attempted to monetize.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: It may just be a hobby and you're doing it for the sake of the art, but still
Heather Roberts: that's fine That's fine.
Veronica Adams: uh, publishing and attempting to sell or maybe publishing and selling well, despite the fact that it's really not something that you've taken seriously. How many authors have you worked with who were like, I just sort of fell into this.
Veronica Adams: Like I decided to write the book I always wanted to read.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: And then I was, you know, making five grand a month in KU accidentally, you know, like, ah yeah.
Heather Roberts: I fell in love with this and here I am.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. It does happen. It does happen. And then they don't know what to do because they're they're chasing their tail because they didn't start, they started backwards.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah. Right. And they have day -to -day responsibilities. They're stay -at -home parents or they have a day job or a night job or whatever.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: like They have a career or work that they do to you know for their regular income. And they're like, oh shit, what do I do with this money that's coming from Amazon?
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Do I write another book? do i you know Where do I go from here?
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: um That's a business, babe.
Heather Roberts: to business.
Veronica Adams: Whether you like it or not, that's a business.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: So you got to do something with it.
Veronica Adams: Treat treated it like treat it like one. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, you got to do something with it. So, and that means taxes and expenses and all of the things that come with being a business and making sure that you're protected and all the businessy things.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: ye Yes, absolutely.
Heather Roberts: It's going to be a little crash course now to run a business.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: But that's something that we're good at helping you with. And we are not tax advisors that we'll send you to someone. We'll suggest somebody for you you know for that.
Veronica Adams: happily send you some referrals and recommendations.
Heather Roberts: Yes.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: But we can at least give you you know some direction as to what you should be doing to make sure that you're you're positioning yourself correctly in this industry.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: um But yeah, treat yourself, treat your books as a business. And I feel like the biggest mistake, I was just ah at the Green Mountain Book Festival. I think I mentioned this before, but it was just so shocking to me. Like when I was on the publishing panel and we had people in the room and this, you have to remember this is a general um but festival of all so this is not a romance-spec book festival.
Veronica Adams: book festival. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: festival.
Veronica Adams: Right, right.
Heather Roberts: And most people there are thinking about traditionally publishing or doing some type of, um you know, publishing in that way, agenting, whatever, ah some self publishing talk, but not as prevalent.
Veronica Adams: Of course. Sure.
Heather Roberts: And, um you know, I mentioned that, you know, I have clients that they'll release a book, you know, every six weeks and they're making, you know, mid six fingers.
Heather Roberts: There was audible gasps in the room because when a lot of people in the general publishing world think about publishing, they think one to two books a year.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, yeah.
Heather Roberts: And that's prolific.
Veronica Adams: Max. Yeah, Max. Well, and there are there are some very well established authors who have always just been traditionally published who only write one book every couple of years, like, and they're doing quite well because they've been doing it for a long time.
Heather Roberts: yeah
Heather Roberts: Right. Like we gave a Lifetime Achievement Award to and um to a wonderful writer. I have no bones about this this writer.
Veronica Adams: the award, right?
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: No, Archer Mayer. I mean, I'm happy to share who it was. Archer Mayer, he writes detective novels. They're based in Vermont. He himself is a medical examiner, so he provides a fantastic perspective.
Veronica Adams: Look at that, like real life imitated in his art.
Heather Roberts: The books are great. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Love it.
Heather Roberts: Love it. Great. The books are fantastic.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Um, but his publishing schedule is not a, I mean, in my opinion, not aggressive, but when they were giving him the award, the person who was talking, you know, talking about him was like, you know, Oh my God, look at how many books he's written.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: And I was just like, you know, that's pretty good. But it's not like these romance.
Veronica Adams: like I'm not impressed.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, I mean, like he certainly has a great backlist. Don't get me wrong, but I think it's like 40 to 50 bucks.
Veronica Adams: now
Heather Roberts: Great backlist. But um um um yeah.
Veronica Adams: I mean, that that's no small achievement. That's a lot of writing. And and you're not denigrating that.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Veronica Adams: But like at the same time, we also work day in and day out with people who are publishing 12 to 15 a year sometimes.
Heather Roberts: Not at all.
Heather Roberts: Yes, yes. So he was writing I think at most like two a year. So because he's been writing for like 25 years or something like that.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: um Yeah, two to three a year at most.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Mm -hmm.
Heather Roberts: And like we're we're working with people who are writing 12 books a year.
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Heather Roberts: That's not uncommon.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Sometimes more than that if you're counting in novellas and things like that.
Veronica Adams: Yes. For sure. Or box sets and like all of the other things that go into special editions and yeah.
Heather Roberts: Do you? Right.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. Now, do you have to write that much?
Veronica Adams: Of course not.
Heather Roberts: Of course not. But there are people, the people who are hustling in this industry who are making the money and making bank are publishing almost a book a month.
Veronica Adams: Bank. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yes, they they are agented and are getting traditional deals for primary and or secondary rights, or they are publishing on their own every 30 to 45 days.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: And they're making six to seven figures in most cases, doing that.
Heather Roberts: Right. And then then then they're often getting agented to get secondary rights or you know for a print distribution, um translations, audio rights, all of that.
Veronica Adams: Print distribution, or yep, yep. Translations, yep.
Heather Roberts: they you know so
Veronica Adams: Yeah, because once you prove you can sell well on your own, there are publishers out there who will gladly help you sell in the markets they specialize in.
Heather Roberts: Absolutely.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: And that's not a bad deal for you to do at that point.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, sure.
Heather Roberts: But my point being, there are many ways to do this industry.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: And if you are looking at this like a hobby, which is totally fine, a creative outlet, that's absolutely fine. um You know, you're not going to think about it in the same way, but if you find yourself in the position, like Veronica was saying, where suddenly you're making money and you don't know what to do with it, you I hope you heed this lesson and remember, okay,
Veronica Adams: Sure.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Hit the pause button. Think about it as a business.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. Think about it as a business, um, because lots of people are, and you can find amazing authors who can give you some great advice, um, as well to help you out.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Well, for sure.
Veronica Adams: You can go back and listen to every episode of this podcast.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: There are some nuggets in there that will be helpful to you as well.
Heather Roberts: No kidding.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. We've talked about a lot of stuff.
Veronica Adams: Send us an email. We answer questions in real life.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, we do.
Veronica Adams: You don't have to, you don't have to be a client. You can buy our time by the hour.
Heather Roberts: Absolutely.
Veronica Adams: We still do that.
Heather Roberts: I actually, my realtor who helped us buy this house listens to our podcast. So hi, Tammy, if you've gotten this far.
Veronica Adams: Hey, Tammy.
Heather Roberts: Hey, Tammy. ah We love Tammy. I guess her daughter is thinking about writing a book or or publishing. And so she's been listening to our podcast and I enjoy that.
Veronica Adams: Love that.
Heather Roberts: So you don't, she's not in the publishing industry, but she has learned so much.
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Heather Roberts: Um, as she, at least she's told me that she has. ah So that's great. And that, that's the whole point. You can go from zero to knowing things, right?
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: You don't have to know anything to come into the podcast, um, to start learning.
Veronica Adams: Yep.
Heather Roberts: So anyway, it's my pitch on the podcast.
Veronica Adams: That's the same thing for publishing, too, though. I mean, it's it's the Wild West.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: You can just do whatever you want to. That's not really advisable, but it's possible.
Heather Roberts: ah It is possible.
Veronica Adams: and how you end up in a position where your hobby is now earning money and you don't know what to do about it.
Heather Roberts: Right. Exactly. Exactly. And now it's very cool. And I would encourage you to take a look back on this year.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: What were your successes and what can you do better?
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Where where did you maybe fall a little short? What do you want to focus on in 2025?
Veronica Adams: do Do you even want to expand and grow in terms of like authoring, writing? right like we We have a lot of friends and acquaintances in the industry who've taken writing and leveraged it into something else by becoming you know by selling courses or starting retreats or events.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: or merchandising, you know, kickstarters, all sorts of things that you can do.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Veronica Adams: I mean, you know, um Patreon, Substack, just all kinds of things that you can take this career, this business and expand it a little bit wider.
Heather Roberts: So much. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: I mean, you don't have to, don't have to just write books all the time.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, exactly.
Veronica Adams: So.
Heather Roberts: Or is this going to be a consistency year? Is this going to be a year where you're just, okay, I'm going to just try to stay stable because of all the other things that are going on in my life.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: And if that's that's if that's you, that's okay.
Veronica Adams: For sure.
Heather Roberts: You just have to recognize that and recognizing it will help you accept it and will help you sort of deal with that sort of FOMO feeling that inevitably is going to come when you're looking at other people doing things and you're like, why am I not doing, you know, like I wanted to, you've already decided this is not your year for that.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Yep. Just come up with a plan.
Heather Roberts: And that's okay.
Veronica Adams: Come up with a plan to stay on task and and stay in your lane and just do the things that you know you need to get done.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Right. And know that your time will come to do something else in the in maybe 2026 and plan for that.
Veronica Adams: Yep. Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Sure. Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: So just wherever you are, Think about it and make a plan.
Veronica Adams: I saw somebody's, I saw somebody's writing schedule this week. This is totally as an aside.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: She has tabs on her spreadsheet out to 2030 and I was like, just I'm just in love with the idea of thinking that far out about where you're going and what you're doing, right?
Veronica Adams: And not everybody has to be that ambitious or that organized for that matter.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: But like that that's the mentality to try and slip yourself into right now at a minimum for 2025.
Heather Roberts: yeah
Veronica Adams: Like, where am I going? I got 12 new months coming.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Veronica Adams: They start they start soon. It's a little murky. What can I sort out for myself now? Is this a year where I can grow? Is this a year where I need to stay put? Is this a year where I need to kind of batten down the hatches and scale back a little bit?
Veronica Adams: That's okay too.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: What does that look like for you?
Heather Roberts: And you know, I've, I've one client who every year she wants to potentially publish less, right?
Veronica Adams: so
Heather Roberts: Every year she's like, I don't want to necessarily, right.
Veronica Adams: Who doesn't? I want to write fewer books, but make more money.
Heather Roberts: Make more money.
Veronica Adams: How many times have you heard that?
Heather Roberts: Yeah. a million times. But the problem is every time she comes to me with like a schedule of something that she wants, she keeps adding things to the schedule.
Veronica Adams: I love that.
Heather Roberts: I'm like, well, this is not, this is not writing less.
Veronica Adams: This is not writing less.
Heather Roberts: This is not gonna happen.
Veronica Adams: i i love I love the determination to create though, right? like Because that's what it is.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: It's a commitment to creation, and that's awesome.
Heather Roberts: Well, so whatever, whatever this, right.
Veronica Adams: But ahs it's sacrificing writing less to create more. That's just that's just the the bottom line.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. So I just always had to remind her when she says that I'm like, you you do this to yourself every year. This is what you do. And it's because you have this drive inside. It's not a bad thing, but like, you have this drive inside you to do more and to hustle more.
Veronica Adams: me
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: And that's okay. But you know, yeah, it's just funny. You know, some author, everybody's in a different place. I just hope everyone remembers that because some authors have written books for the next four years and are like are done and they're writing.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Oh my God, we had that conversation this week too, didn't we?
Heather Roberts: Yeah, we did. um We know of an author who literally has books done and written for the next four years.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: And um so if God forbid something should happen to her, her but her her estate could
Veronica Adams: um but Her business is is set up to publish posthumously.
Heather Roberts: Her business for four years and new books, new titles, everything's done.
Veronica Adams: Like, yeah, yeah. Yep.
Heather Roberts: um Not everybody is that amazing, okay? You don't need to be at that level.
Veronica Adams: Right, and and do not hold yourself to a standard that you're a failure if you can't write ahead.
Heather Roberts: Right.
Veronica Adams: like if you're If you can just write the book in front of you that needs to be published by whatever pre -order date you've set up or whatever arbitrary deadline you've made for yourself, that's perfect. Just focus on the book in front of you.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, so there are authors like that. And then there are authors where like it is by the skin of their teeth in which they get the book uploaded by the deadline that is set by retailers.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: And yeah, in some cases we have to push it out like a month.
Veronica Adams: and And in some cases, they don't even do that.
Veronica Adams: Yep, it happened.
Heather Roberts: um Yeah, it happens a lot. So my point being strive to be somewhere in the middle. if That would be ideal, right?
Veronica Adams: yeah Yeah.
Heather Roberts: To be like maybe a...
Veronica Adams: Yeah, those are those those are the extrements of the curve here. You want to be somewhere in the middle of the bell.
Heather Roberts: Yes. Yeah.
Heather Roberts: yeah
Veronica Adams: Yeah. somewhere between writing four years ahead and pushing your release out four weeks every time.
Heather Roberts: so
Heather Roberts: So...
Heather Roberts: That's the goal there. That's the goal.
Veronica Adams: yeah
Heather Roberts: So, um and listen, we've worked with both types of people and, you know,
Veronica Adams: Yes, and everyone in between.
Heather Roberts: and everyone in between.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: So if you need help in the new year, sort of figuring out your life and figuring out what your schedule is going to be, feel free to reach out to us. We are more than happy to have that conversation.
Veronica Adams: Yep, give us a shout. Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: be I love the planning phase. I love the planning time of year. I just had a planning call with a client the other day.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: She's like, I need to vomit everything that's in my brain to you. And I was like, all right, let's go.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes.
Heather Roberts: um And so
Veronica Adams: Sometimes they just need a little cheerleading, positive feedback. Sometimes they want to brainstorm.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Sometimes they want us to organize everything for them, like, and whatever the need is, it's exciting for us.
Heather Roberts: We're there.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, absolutely.
Heather Roberts: Yeah. Cause it's so fun. Cause it's like, all right, you vomit out your thoughts and then we get to organize them and figure out, okay, this is where your priorities should lie for XYZ.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Yes.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: This is what you should be doing right now. This is what you should be doing in a month from now, et cetera, et cetera.
Veronica Adams: Mm -hmm. Yep.
Heather Roberts: So it can be very helpful.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: We also are going to look back a little further in the coming weeks and see you know what we could be focusing on more and planning more um with these podcasts.
Veronica Adams: For sure.
Heather Roberts: So like I was saying, we do have a new format that we're planning to try in 2025, bringing some guests on and all of that. um If there's somebody that you want us to interview, if you want to see on our podcast, please let us know, reach out.
Veronica Adams: Yeah. Yeah. First story.
Heather Roberts: um you know If you want to be on our podcast, please reach out.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: um we We'd love to have that conversation.
Veronica Adams: Yeah, pitch us. Let us know why you'd be a good guest or what it is you have to offer.
Heather Roberts: Yeah.
Veronica Adams: Absolutely.
Heather Roberts: So that's ah that's, we're going to be trying to be a little more focused in 2025.
Veronica Adams: Super exciting.
Heather Roberts: That's our goal.
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: Be a little more proactive, planned and focused. So hopefully you can pick some goals for yourself that are realistic and achievable.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: That is the the mark of a good goal is that you can actually
Veronica Adams: Yeah.
Heather Roberts: you know, do it and achieve it and also that you can track it.
Veronica Adams: Right.
Heather Roberts: That's very important too.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: You need to be able to track the goal.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Being being able to measure it and and see how well you've done achieving it or how close you are to achieving it or what portions of your plans to achieve it are working or are not working.
Veronica Adams: Pretty important.
Heather Roberts: Yeah, so make some goals, start planning, start figuring out how you're going to achieve them and measure them.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Veronica Adams: Yes.
Heather Roberts: and we will see you in 2025.
Veronica Adams: Yes. Come join us next year.
Heather Roberts: Yes.
