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S2 Ep34: Cockygate Breakdown, Part 1
31 Plays7 months ago
Heather and Veronica dive into the cockygate legal matter: the time when an author tried to trademark the word 'cocky'. This is part 1 where they provide the lead up to the lawsuit and a breakdown of the issues at play.
A podcast from 1852 Media.
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Listener Requests
00:00:09
1852media
Hello, hello, and welcome back to For Books Sake. I am Heather Roberts.
00:00:13
Veronica Adams
And I am Veronica Adams and we are 1852 Media.
00:00:17
1852media
Yes, and we have heard you loud and clear, at least your listening ears have been speaking for you.
00:00:23
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:00:26
1852media
You want more legal breakdowns. You want us to talk about legal stuff, and we're here for it.
00:00:31
Veronica Adams
Yep.
00:00:32
1852media
We're fine with that.
00:00:33
Veronica Adams
Absolutely.
00:00:35
1852media
We're gonna do it. So, I mean,
00:00:37
Veronica Adams
Nothing I love more than giving my unsolicited opinion about something I may or may not have competent knowledge on, right? Like, I went to law school, sure, I'll give it a whirl.
00:00:43
1852media
Exactly. Like, i I am here for this.
00:00:50
1852media
Yeah.
Cockygate: A Firsthand Account
00:00:52
1852media
This one, though, we were actually present and accounted for during Grant Rose's seats.
00:00:55
Veronica Adams
Front row seats to this one, baby.
00:00:58
1852media
We lived it.
00:00:59
Veronica Adams
Yep.
00:01:00
1852media
um We have had to go back and, you know, refresh our recollections, as it were.
00:01:05
Veronica Adams
Yes, it's been six years.
00:01:08
1852media
It's been six years. And what are we talking about today? This is part one of Cockygate.
00:01:14
Veronica Adams
That's right.
00:01:15
1852media
Yes, we are going there. For those who've recently entered the industry, you probably have no idea what the fuck I'm talking about. But oh, boy, howdy.
00:01:23
Veronica Adams
Lucky you.
00:01:25
1852media
ah Yeah, lucky you. Back in 2018, something called Cockygate happened and...
00:01:32
Veronica Adams
Picture it. Romancelandia. 2018.
00:01:35
1852media
Yeah.
00:01:39
1852media
Yeah, swing to a vision of small town romance book.
00:01:41
Veronica Adams
Yes. That's right. That's right.
00:01:45
1852media
um Okay, so we were in the land of you know, everybody's publishing, publishing was just ah independently publishing was getting started to become saturated,
Indie Publishing in 2018
00:01:57
1852media
but still not as saturated as as today for sure.
00:01:57
Veronica Adams
Yeah. Yes.
00:02:00
1852media
um You know, back when indie books could still make the USA Today, New York Times bestsellers list without a distribution agreement in play.
00:02:06
Veronica Adams
Absolutely. Yep.
00:02:11
Veronica Adams
Yep.
00:02:12
1852media
And everybody was publishing a lot, like all the time.
00:02:16
Veronica Adams
Yeah. Yeah. So many things we didn't know yet.
00:02:19
1852media
Yeah, and so many things. And the costs of publish were not as high as they are today.
00:02:23
Veronica Adams
True.
00:02:24
1852media
So the cost of entry was lower and people were putting out quality books and, and you know, what a time to be alive.
00:02:31
Veronica Adams
Yeah. Yes.
00:02:32
1852media
um So back in 2018, we're gonna, we're gonna bring you back to Cocky 8. So Felina Hopkins is the name of the author who started Cocky 8.
00:02:41
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:02:45
Veronica Adams
You may see her now branded as just Felina.
00:02:46
1852media
And
00:02:49
Veronica Adams
I believe that her brand has dropped the Hopkins for the most part, maybe entirely at this point.
00:02:50
1852media
Yes.
00:02:56
1852media
Okay. Okay.
00:02:58
Veronica Adams
For reasons that will become clear when this series is over.
The 'Cocky' Trademark Controversy
00:03:01
1852media
Yes. And so this is part one. Today, we are just going to talk about the background and how we got to the lawsuit.
00:03:10
Veronica Adams
Yeah, this is ah this is a complicated and lengthy discussion. So we figured we'd break it into two bites because we're not going to ask you guys to sit still for an hour and a half, two hours while we go over all of it.
00:03:17
1852media
yeah
00:03:22
1852media
Yeah, we did it once um with the two-hour breakdown, and well, maybe we'll do it again. We're gonna break this into slightly more digestible pieces for you.
00:03:30
Veronica Adams
Absolutely. Yeah.
00:03:31
1852media
So um let's start at the beginning. So there are, the word cocky was attempted to be trademarked, okay?
00:03:41
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:03:41
1852media
Not just, I mean, Folina did trade successfully trademark the word cocky.
00:03:45
Veronica Adams
Yes. Yes. She filed an application with the USPTO and was awarded a registration for the mark and all of that.
00:03:51
1852media
Yes, she actually had two she had two trademarks.
00:03:53
Veronica Adams
She was successful.
00:03:56
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:03:56
1852media
So she had the the trademark of the word cocky in all romance series, you know ah period, full stop.
00:04:02
Veronica Adams
Mm-hmm.
00:04:05
1852media
And then she also had a cocky series. She had cocky trademarked in a particular font as ah as a word mark um as well on the cover of books.
00:04:14
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:04:18
1852media
However, there's an issue. There's a separate issue with that one. I don't know if we ever really get to that in the the lawsuit. We'll see. i I don't remember. But I recall there being an issue um where the actual creator of that font basically was like, hey, you can't trademark this font because you don't own it.
00:04:39
1852media
I own it.
00:04:39
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:04:40
1852media
And you're not allowed to trademark that.
00:04:43
Veronica Adams
You have a license to use it on your covers and in your marketing material and as part of the visual branding of your work, but the actual font itself is mine.
00:04:43
1852media
That's against my, yeah.
00:04:51
1852media
You cannot trademark that.
00:04:54
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:04:55
1852media
So that was the issue with one of the the trademarks, but that's not even the one that we're talking about. The one that we're talking about is the one where it's the word cocky in a romance series full stop.
00:05:00
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:05:07
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:05:07
1852media
And so she filed that trademark in 2017.
00:05:14
Veronica Adams
Correct.
00:05:15
1852media
um And she was issued that trademark in May of 2018.
00:05:20
Veronica Adams
Also correct.
00:05:22
1852media
So that's where we're at. Let's go back a little bit though.
00:05:26
Veronica Adams
Yes, yes. she look So much history here that leads up to the point where she files this application, right?
00:05:27
1852media
So, how much history?
00:05:33
1852media
Yeah, yeah.
00:05:35
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:05:35
1852media
So she first published a book with the word khaki in the title, okay? Very, we have to separate this. Titles, I just want to be clear from the beginning. Titles cannot be trademarked.
00:05:48
Veronica Adams
Yes, as of the recording of this episode, the law is clear.
00:05:53
1852media
Yes, that titles cannot be trademarked. Also, since we're still at the beginning of this episode, and we did not do it before, just throwing that out there, that Veronica and I, what were we thinking?
00:05:57
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:06:03
Veronica Adams
Oh my God, what were we thinking?
00:06:07
1852media
Veronica and I are attorneys. We are not your attorneys. Go find your own attorney. None of this is legal advice.
00:06:11
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:06:12
1852media
This is for entertainment.
00:06:12
Veronica Adams
This is all editorialization. There's not a single kernel of legal advice in this episode or the one that follows for that matter.
00:06:15
1852media
Yes.
00:06:20
1852media
Correct, so that is always the case with us, but just throw, no problem.
00:06:23
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:06:25
Veronica Adams
Thanks for saving our bacon.
00:06:28
1852media
Okay, back into it. So she, Hopkins publishes a book called Cocky Roomie, a bad boy romance novel, The Cocker Brothers of Georgia, volume one.
00:06:35
Veronica Adams
Yes. Yes.
00:06:40
1852media
Okay, that is the full government name title, okay.
00:06:44
Veronica Adams
Yes. Cocky roomy.
00:06:45
1852media
um no
00:06:46
Veronica Adams
And then the series is The Cocker Brothers of Georgia. and And that's it.
00:06:48
1852media
Yes.
00:06:49
Veronica Adams
I mean, correct.
00:06:50
1852media
And that's it. That was published on June 15th, 2016. And then after that, she published a whole bunch of books that contain, you know, that had cocky in the title, you know.
00:07:02
Veronica Adams
Yes. She went on to be very prolific in that particular series.
00:07:06
1852media
Cocky Cowboy, Cocky Biker, Cocky Senator, et cetera, et cetera.
00:07:08
Veronica Adams
Yes. The cocks everywhere.
00:07:12
1852media
Cocks everywhere. Now you might be thinking, wow, that's really interesting. I haven't seen a lot of books with the word cocky in the title. Well, that's because you didn't live in 2016 in romance landia because you could not,
00:07:24
Veronica Adams
Or maybe you're not familiar with ah
Impact on Authors and Community Response
00:07:28
Veronica Adams
but Penelope and Phi either, like, whoa.
00:07:30
1852media
right.
00:07:31
1852media
You could not swing a dick to without hitting a cocky book.
00:07:38
Veronica Adams
The jokes are free, guys.
00:07:38
1852media
Okay. They are great just for you. But you really couldn't. I mean, they were everywhere. It started with um the biggest one. It didn't start with them, but the biggest book was V.
00:07:50
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:07:53
1852media
Keelan and Penelope Ward wrote a book together, Cocky Bastard.
00:07:55
Veronica Adams
Cocky bastard.
00:07:58
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:07:58
1852media
And then that hit the New York Times bestsellers list. And after that, every book had Bastard or Cocky in the title, like literally.
00:08:06
Veronica Adams
Yeah. And that book, that book predates Selena's first attempt at a cocky titled book by like a year, I think.
00:08:14
1852media
Yeah, I think...
00:08:15
Veronica Adams
Um, not that other authors weren't using the word cocky in their titles or their subtitles or their series titles for years prior to all of this happening.
00:08:20
1852media
Right.
00:08:24
Veronica Adams
I mean, right.
00:08:26
1852media
Sure, they they are not necessarily the progeny of it, but there were two that...
00:08:30
Veronica Adams
But one of, yeah, no, I was just going to say one of the earliest really super commercially successful cocky titled books was Cocky Bastard, which is again, a year older than Felina's Cocky Roomie.
00:08:32
1852media
Sorry, go ahead.
00:08:39
1852media
Yes.
00:08:44
1852media
On the same day, so they on August 15th, 2015 is when that was released.
00:08:49
Veronica Adams
Talk to you bastard, yeah.
00:08:49
1852media
On the same day, Lane Hart released the first of a nine-book romance series named Cocky Cagefighter.
00:08:55
Veronica Adams
Hmm.
00:08:58
1852media
And that was a series name.
00:09:01
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:09:02
1852media
So Cocky Bastard was a standalone novel that had, that was just, that was the title. There was no series, it was standalone.
00:09:08
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:09:10
1852media
um Back when authors could do that and hit the New York Times last summer list. Now you need a standalone series that could, yeah, interconnected standalones.
00:09:19
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:09:21
1852media
But Cocky Cagefighter was an actual series name that had the word cocky in it.
00:09:25
Veronica Adams
sir Yeah.
00:09:26
1852media
also released on August 15, 2015. So all of these predate Felina's first publication of a cocky book by almost a year.
00:09:38
1852media
um Then there's a ton more that were released prior to the, you know, there's just so many, yeah.
00:09:39
Veronica Adams
Yes. Yeah. yeah I mean, what 10, 15, 20 titles cited in the in the legal pleadings that were filed in the lawsuit will eventually get to.
00:09:55
1852media
Yeah.
00:09:56
Veronica Adams
Just examples upon examples upon examples of authors successfully using the word cocky in their titles years before Felina's application for her trademarks.
00:10:02
1852media
Mm-hmm.
00:10:07
1852media
Correct. And years before it became super popular to do so.
00:10:08
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:10:10
Veronica Adams
Right. Right.
00:10:12
1852media
The popularity, like we said, mostly came from Cocky Bastard that then suddenly everybody had, you know, Cocky in their title.
00:10:16
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:10:20
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:10:21
1852media
um And Felina just decided that she wanted to own it. I mean, there's no other words. I mean, she decided she wanted to own the name Cocky.
00:10:30
Veronica Adams
Pretty much.
00:10:31
1852media
Um, she was only using it and in her titles though. She never use it in her series name.
00:10:37
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:10:38
1852media
Um, but, so she filed.
00:10:39
Veronica Adams
Until after she got her her applications approved.
00:10:41
1852media
Correct, correct.
00:10:43
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:10:44
1852media
Um, so she filed in September, 2017, uh, through her company. Her company was called hop hop productions, Inc, which is, yeah, very adorable.
00:10:51
Veronica Adams
Which is cute, by the way.
00:10:54
1852media
Um, and she filed that. to register the word Kaki in connection with a series of downloadable ebooks in the field of romance and a series of books in the field of romance.
00:11:06
1852media
So just as a reminder, when you're filing a trademark, you have to file it in a specific category.
00:11:12
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:11:13
1852media
You're not just, you know, saying I own the trademark for you know, the word cocky in all things in all the world.
00:11:21
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:11:21
1852media
No, you have to file it in a specific category. So that's the category that she was filing in it, which was a series of downloadable eBooks in the field of romance and a series of books in the field of romance.
00:11:28
Veronica Adams
Right. Yeah.
00:11:31
1852media
um The more categories you file in, the more expensive your trademark gets.
00:11:36
Veronica Adams
Of course.
00:11:36
1852media
And so, you know, as it were. um So yeah, she claimed that she had a purported first use of June 16th, 2016 for her first use of the word cocky.
00:11:51
Veronica Adams
and Okay. So roughly the publication date of that cocky roomy book.
00:11:52
1852media
Okay.
00:11:55
1852media
Yes. um Notably, again, it was just within the title of her book. Okay. um And then she filed it for use in commerce, right um June 15th, 2017.
00:12:13
1852media
So but it was a stylized use of the word cocky for use in commerce.
00:12:17
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:12:19
1852media
um And they note again here that she may have filed that one in violation of its license agreement with Set Sales Studios, which is the entity that developed the font shown in that mark.
00:12:31
Veronica Adams
Yeah. Yeah.
00:12:32
1852media
Um, so they do, I guess, talk about that a little bit in this lawsuit and we'll get to that.
00:12:37
Veronica Adams
Bex the question, was she doing this?
00:12:37
1852media
We're excited to do that.
00:12:40
Veronica Adams
Like, was she DIY-ing? Was this like legal self-help on her part? Or did she pay an attorney to do this? Because what IP attorney doesn't stop at the font and go, do you own that?
00:12:51
Veronica Adams
Or is it just licensed? Like, whoo,
00:12:52
1852media
Oh, she paid an attorney to do it. Jonathan Pollack was hop hop production inks attorney and he declared, um, Yeah.
00:13:00
Veronica Adams
okay.
00:13:03
1852media
he He did that.
00:13:03
Veronica Adams
All righty then.
00:13:06
Veronica Adams
and I'm not going to step in it because I never practiced IP when you know I was still litigating.
00:13:07
1852media
He did that.
00:13:11
1852media
But if you do practice IP, don't you think that that would be one of like the things you ask or think of?
00:13:17
Veronica Adams
Well, right.
00:13:18
1852media
like
00:13:18
Veronica Adams
I've sort of picked that up by osmosis, um doing this work for the last you know long time. um A license is not ownership.
00:13:28
1852media
Yeah.
00:13:32
1852media
No.
00:13:32
Veronica Adams
There's a lot of stuff you got to be careful with when that's all you've got. And I don't know how that's on a red flag for an IP attorney, but you know, maybe somebody will weigh in in the comments and and educate us on that point.
00:13:44
1852media
I don't know. Yeah, I feel like that that would be, I think perhaps the latter.
00:13:45
Veronica Adams
or Or maybe it was a mistake and some bad lawyering.
00:13:50
Veronica Adams
Yeah, maybe so.
00:13:51
1852media
Because I just feel like you have to think about that. Like when if someone were to come to you for asking for ownership of something, you have to make sure they own the thing, right?
00:13:57
Veronica Adams
Yeah, for real.
00:14:01
1852media
um So how did the lawsuit start? What what happened?
00:14:08
Veronica Adams
Someone got a little cocky, I think is the only way to describe what happened here.
00:14:13
1852media
Yeah, so she gets the trademark, right?
00:14:17
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:14:17
1852media
And then so Australian indie authors TL Smith and Melissa Jane had sold Audible, we all know who Audible is, the audio rights for their collaboration entitled Cocky Fiance.
00:14:27
Veronica Adams
yeah Yes. Yes.
00:14:32
1852media
Everything was going well, and then Audible emailed them to say that it received a notice that they were infringing on someone else's trademark. um This was like right after the, I think this was in June of 2018, right after she got the trademark.
00:14:45
Veronica Adams
Right. We're about halfway through. Yeah. She gets her registrations back and she's like, okay, now it's time to start ceasing and desisting.
00:14:51
1852media
Yes.
00:14:52
Veronica Adams
Everyone I can think of who's using this word belongs to me now.
00:14:55
1852media
So two days after, yeah, two days after they get Audible's email, they get an email from Hopkins herself.
00:15:00
Veronica Adams
Uh-huh.
00:15:03
1852media
This is not through Hopkins legal counsel. This is from Hopkins herself.
00:15:06
Veronica Adams
Not through the LLC or her corporation. Like it's just her personally out here swinging for the fences.
00:15:08
1852media
Yeah.
00:15:11
1852media
Yes. Her first email briefly explained that she had the trade work trademark on the word cocky and told them to you know take down their title before she takes further action.
00:15:19
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:15:24
1852media
And then about 30 minutes later, they get another email from her saying that she had already sent the infringement notice to Amazon. um So there was like no time to act whatsoever.
00:15:38
Veronica Adams
Like, you need to do this.
00:15:38
1852media
um
00:15:40
Veronica Adams
Oh, wait, it's too late. I already jumped to the gun and have set in in motion the process by which it will be done, whether you agree or not.
00:15:48
1852media
Yeah. So they decided to just re-title their book, right?
00:15:51
Veronica Adams
Yeah, yeah.
00:15:52
1852media
They were like, we're not, we're not dealing with this. Um, they titled their book.
00:15:54
Veronica Adams
I mean, can you blame them?
00:15:57
1852media
No, I, yeah, they decided to list it on Amazon free shout out.
00:15:57
Veronica Adams
Like, what a pain in the ass this is.
00:16:03
1852media
It's called arrogant fiance. Go check it out.
00:16:04
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:16:05
1852media
Um, so that was fine. They, you know, it was a, it was a pain in the ass though. Like, cause the, The thing that I'm reading that is helping me with some of this information, because I don't remember it all, um you know, they remind us that they had to change the interior text of the novel, upload a new file, commission a redesign cover.
00:16:18
Veronica Adams
Right. Yeah.
00:16:25
1852media
um And while they were working on doing that, Amazon alerted their paperback distributor about the infringement claim. So then they had to prove that their owners of the work proved their identities and, you know, a whole thing.
00:16:36
Veronica Adams
Right. Because Ingram or whoever is actually distributing the paperbacks for them is going to, is going to, you know, take it down and, and perhaps even disable their account for infringement and stuff like.
00:16:44
1852media
yeah
00:16:47
1852media
Right.
00:16:48
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:16:48
1852media
They also had to change all their swags that they already had all of the paperbacks that they had made for book signings already printed.
00:16:54
Veronica Adams
This is the shit you don't think about, right? like you you do You just think it's a little it's a little title dispute.
00:16:56
1852media
Yeah, like it's right.
00:16:59
Veronica Adams
But these women were getting ready for launch. like They had the all their ducks in a row because you title the book. Nine times out of 10, 99 times out of 100 before you release it.
00:17:11
Veronica Adams
So like, everything's set in stone before it's supposed to be available, including this shit, the swag, all the stuff on their websites.
00:17:21
Veronica Adams
I mean, come on now. So involved, so much extra work to, I don't know, maybe it would have been better if they'd fought it.
00:17:25
1852media
Absolutely crazy.
00:17:31
Veronica Adams
You know what I mean?
00:17:33
1852media
Yeah, but they were in Australia. They didn't feel like dealing with this. I mean, I get it.
00:17:37
Veronica Adams
Sure.
00:17:38
1852media
I get it.
00:17:39
Veronica Adams
Well, and it's expensive.
00:17:40
1852media
So yeah.
00:17:41
Veronica Adams
Super expensive.
00:17:43
1852media
So they're not the only ones that got takedown notices, okay?
00:17:47
Veronica Adams
No, they are not.
00:17:48
1852media
Tara Cresson, she had a bunch of books, ah the Her Cocky Doctors, Her Cocky Firefighters, et cetera, and so forth.
00:17:53
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:17:56
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:17:57
1852media
She also received a letter from Amazon suspending her sales. She did not get a letter from Hopkins just from Amazon.
00:18:04
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:18:05
1852media
um Her books then got reinstated. And then Jamila Jasper, this is my favorite. She's the author of Cocky Cowboy.
00:18:13
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:18:13
1852media
She received a similar takedown notice from Amazon. She changed her title to the cockiest cowboy to have ever cocked.
00:18:25
1852media
Jamila, you are my people. um Yeah, she just basically said, fuck yourself.
00:18:30
Veronica Adams
Why don't I have a prop crown to hold up and be like, you know what? Somebody dropped this. Like, huh.
00:18:34
1852media
I know, like, shout out to Jamila, like, that you are my people, you are my people.
00:18:37
Veronica Adams
Girl. Like, for real.
00:18:42
1852media
um So then there are, then Felina, this starts, this starts taking romance lady by storm, okay?
00:18:50
Veronica Adams
Yes, by ah by this point, romance landed is on fire over this.
00:18:54
1852media
On fucking fire.
00:18:56
Veronica Adams
Yes, everybody has an opinion about Cockygate. It becomes hashtag Cockygate, because ah you know it's taking on a life of its own.
00:19:01
1852media
Yes.
00:19:04
Veronica Adams
It's sort of snowballing in an avalanche styles. It's rolling downhill, right?
00:19:08
1852media
Yeah.
00:19:08
Veronica Adams
Yeah, and everybody's up in arms about it. And then and then the anthology happens, I do believe.
00:19:15
1852media
Well, yeah, but you had to write, so we should pull, for next episode, I'll go pull some tweets.
00:19:19
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:19:21
1852media
So Felina was very, very prolific on Twitter, you know, ex formerly known as.
00:19:21
Veronica Adams
Oh my god, yes.
00:19:26
Veronica Adams
Yeah. Super active. Mm-hmm. Yeah.
00:19:30
1852media
um She, you know, she was saying, I received letters from readers who lost money thinking they bought my series, I'm protecting them and that's what trademarks are meant for.
00:19:41
1852media
She also said she wasn't targeting books published before she published the first volume of her series in 2016.
00:19:47
1852media
so
00:19:47
Veronica Adams
So nobody who had published something cocky prior to her cocky roommate got a takedown notice from Amazon or any sort of infringement cease and desist from her or her team.
00:19:56
1852media
Correct. That's what she says.
00:20:01
Veronica Adams
Fascinating.
00:20:02
1852media
so
00:20:03
Veronica Adams
That's a little tidbit that did not register in my brain from, from the past.
00:20:03
1852media
so then
00:20:08
1852media
Yeah. I didn't, I forgot about that too, but that is what she said.
00:20:11
Veronica Adams
Yeah. Okay.
00:20:12
1852media
So two things. So two things happen then.
00:20:15
Veronica Adams
Yes.
Legal Challenges and Community Solidarity
00:20:16
1852media
So then there's a indie author named Kevin Nuffer. I think that's how you say his last name.
00:20:19
Veronica Adams
Yes, God bless Kevin.
00:20:21
1852media
God bless Kevin. Kevin is also an attorney and he, um, decided to challenge her, her US trademark.
00:20:24
Veronica Adams
Yes, he is.
00:20:32
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:20:32
1852media
he filed an actual challenge to the trademark through the Patent and Trademark Office through their process um because she did not use the term cocky in a series prior to having the trademark.
00:20:35
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:20:48
1852media
And when you are filing a trademark, you have to say first use, right?
00:20:49
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:20:52
1852media
And we we talked about when she said she had first use, but she had...
00:20:53
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:20:55
Veronica Adams
She claimed it was that first book she published in 2016, but it it was just the title, not the series, and the whole mark is based on it having been the series.
00:20:57
1852media
Yes.
00:21:02
1852media
Correct. Correct. And so Kevin's like, whoa, I think that this s slipped through the cracks.
00:21:05
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:21:10
1852media
I'm filing an actual, he began a petition and he filed an actual, you know, a challenge.
00:21:12
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:21:18
Veronica Adams
A challenge, yeah.
00:21:20
1852media
Thank you. My brain decided to not bring.
00:21:20
Veronica Adams
This doesn't mean what she thinks it means. She's confused about her usage here.
00:21:25
1852media
Right.
00:21:26
Veronica Adams
It's only in her title.
00:21:27
1852media
Yeah.
00:21:27
Veronica Adams
She didn't start using it in her series titles until after she got the approval for the trademarks.
00:21:33
1852media
Correct.
00:21:34
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:21:35
1852media
So then, because everything has been so, you know, insane, right?
00:21:43
Veronica Adams
Somebody's going to capitalize on it.
00:21:45
1852media
Yes.
00:21:46
Veronica Adams
and And also take a stand. I mean, it's not just a money-making thing, obviously. In fact, I think maybe it was a charity, right, that it was a charity setup here.
00:21:50
1852media
it was It was a charitable thing. Yes. Yeah. so
00:21:54
Veronica Adams
But also, like, where'd the money go? What did it go to?
00:21:59
1852media
they There actually was a breakdown of that.
00:21:59
Veronica Adams
We'll get into that. Yeah, I know.
00:22:01
1852media
So yeah, it was valid.
00:22:02
Veronica Adams
I know. But it was it was used to challenge what was happening, of course.
00:22:03
1852media
but
00:22:06
1852media
Yes, so there was a collection of stories published under an anthology called Cocktails, the Cocky Collective, okay?
00:22:13
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:22:19
Veronica Adams
Yes. That's right.
00:22:22
1852media
And this was a group of authors that came together, wrote short stories in order to essentially publish the anthology and just, you know, raise money.
00:22:36
Veronica Adams
It's middle finger to Felina is what it is.
00:22:38
1852media
Yeah, it was.
00:22:38
Veronica Adams
It's ah it's a fuck you, Felina.
00:22:41
1852media
Yeah.
00:22:41
Veronica Adams
You can't do this. And we're all going to stand up against you trying to do it.
00:22:45
1852media
Correct. And major fuck you to Felina. And also it was an attempt to raise money for the legal fees that they knew that they were going to have to fight.
00:22:53
Veronica Adams
Yes. Yes.
00:22:55
1852media
Okay. So that was what the, the anthology was, was used for. And they did use that for legal fees. I believe that was all ended up being donated to the RWA specifically for legal fees for this situation.
00:23:08
Veronica Adams
Right. Yes. Because they eventually get involved in this too. One of the few things in recent memory they've done well.
00:23:13
1852media
Right.
00:23:16
1852media
Yeah. Yes. Shout out to RWA for doing something good.
00:23:20
Veronica Adams
so Showing up and being on the right side of history for a change.
00:23:20
1852media
Okay. Yes.
00:23:25
1852media
So that's what happened. And then because of this anthology, that is when Felina filed this lawsuit.
00:23:30
Veronica Adams
ah
00:23:35
1852media
So she filed the lawsuit against three people, Kevin, Tara Crescent,
00:23:35
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:23:40
Veronica Adams
Kevin?
00:23:43
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:23:45
1852media
And Jennifer Watson.
00:23:47
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:23:48
1852media
So je just Jennifer Watson ends up getting dismissed from this lawsuit for rightly so, okay.
00:23:53
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:23:56
1852media
She's, yeah.
00:23:56
Veronica Adams
She's only tangentially related to cocktails at best.
00:24:00
1852media
She was the publicist, she was doing the promotion and marketing for Cocktails. She was doing it for free.
00:24:08
1852media
um She, Penny Reed, who was, yes.
00:24:08
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:24:10
Veronica Adams
One of her clients was involved in the anthology, maybe in organizing it or something, and had asked her to help out, and she agreed.
00:24:15
1852media
penny yeah Penny Reed of Smarty Pants Romance was publishing the the um anthology and asked her to help with the promotion and marketing.
00:24:17
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:24:20
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:24:26
1852media
Felina for some reason thinks that Jennifer Watson is the publisher. um And so that's why she included her into this.
00:24:33
Veronica Adams
S-H-E-R is not C-I-S-T.
00:24:37
1852media
Correct. Um, so anyway, Jennifer Watson does get dismissed from this lawsuit later. Um, rightly so, because she has nothing to do with any of this.
00:24:44
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:24:47
1852media
Um, but obviously getting sued is like, as a publicist, you'd be like, what the actual fuck.
00:24:54
Veronica Adams
I would shit my pants.
00:24:54
1852media
Um, yeah.
00:24:55
Veronica Adams
I'm sorry. There's no polite way to put it.
00:24:56
1852media
I'm like, you're just
00:24:57
Veronica Adams
Like, this was not my idea. Like, I'm not responsible for this intellectual property, you know?
00:25:03
1852media
Right. And as they say that, you know, Miss Watson was not the orchestrator. She, in fact, had nothing to do with the conception, creation, authorship, decision to publish or publication of this anthology.
00:25:08
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:25:13
Veronica Adams
There you have it.
00:25:15
1852media
So, yeah, no involvement.
00:25:17
Veronica Adams
She's just doing and some charity work. like She showed up and volunteered to help out, and now she's named in a federal lawsuit.
00:25:20
1852media
Literally. Yeah. Yeah, ah exactly.
00:25:26
Veronica Adams
No good deed, man.
00:25:29
1852media
So, Velina is asking in this lawsuit that um there's a temporary restraining order on the publication of cockyate of the book, I'm sorry, Cocktails of the Anthology.
00:25:40
Veronica Adams
Right. Yes.
00:25:43
1852media
um She's trying to block publication.
00:25:44
Veronica Adams
we We needed a temporary arrest restraining order for Cockygate too, let's be honest.
00:25:48
1852media
We sure did. Oh my God. um
00:25:51
Veronica Adams
But yes, she's she is suing um to, among other things, stop or at least temporarily pause the publication of Cocktails until all of these claims can be sorted out.
00:26:03
1852media
correct.
00:26:04
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:26:04
1852media
So it's my understanding, and I'll correct myself next time if I'm wrong, but um it's my understanding that the Authors Guild hired an attorney on behalf of Tara Crescent to represent Tara Crescent.
00:26:18
Veronica Adams
I believe you're correct. Yes.
00:26:19
1852media
Tara was a member of the ah um ah member of the Author's Guild and they don't generally get involved with litigation, but they felt that that it was important for this particular thing.
00:26:23
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:26:33
1852media
So they decided to hire alt outside counsel to represent Tara Crescent.
00:26:34
Veronica Adams
yeah
00:26:40
1852media
um And then I believe RWA ended up hiring outside counsel on behalf of Kevin and Jennifer.
00:26:43
Veronica Adams
yeah
00:26:49
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:26:50
1852media
Um, and so essentially people started referring that to this as like the author's guilt and RWA lawsuit, um, even though they weren't sued.
00:26:58
Veronica Adams
Correct.
00:27:01
Veronica Adams
Yes, which is
00:27:01
1852media
So I just wanted to clarify that.
00:27:03
Veronica Adams
ah which is very important.
00:27:05
1852media
Yeah.
00:27:05
Veronica Adams
she's She's doing that because as we were prepping for this episode, I was actually confused about that because I was like, wait a minute, was there a second lawsuit?
00:27:11
1852media
Mm-hmm.
00:27:13
Veronica Adams
No, it's just that the the public discussion, it got renamed from Folina's lawsuit to the author's Guild RWA lawsuit somehow, so yes.
00:27:21
1852media
Right. um But it was not. It was Hop Hop Productions and Felina Hopkins. She sued from her company and individually um versus Kevin, Tara, and Jennifer individually.
00:27:26
Veronica Adams
Yes, and individually, right, right.
00:27:33
1852media
So that's what happened there. And yeah, now we are now we are up to the time of the lawsuit and whether she was able to block
00:27:41
Veronica Adams
yeah Yeah.
00:27:46
1852media
the publication of cocky Cocktails, the Cocky Collective, which was to be published I think on May 26th.
00:27:51
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:27:58
1852media
That can't be right. I'm gonna have to get the timeline better. May 26th of 2018. That might be, that might be true.
00:28:07
1852media
Yeah.
00:28:08
Veronica Adams
I don't recall specifically and I don't know that I saw it in my show prep either.
00:28:13
1852media
I'm gonna have, I'll double check on the publication of those dates.
00:28:14
Veronica Adams
it all Well, it all happened so fast.
00:28:16
1852media
It did.
00:28:17
Veronica Adams
The registration came back from the USPTO, and Felina gets what she thinks is permission to be cocky about what she owns.
00:28:22
1852media
Yeah.
00:28:25
Veronica Adams
And she starts esing and you know sending out these cease and desist letters and filing these trademark takedown infringement notifications with Amazon and Audible and all these other retailers.
00:28:35
Veronica Adams
And she's like you know she's really putting the screws to people who have come after her in the use of cocky.
00:28:43
1852media
Oh yeah.
00:28:43
Veronica Adams
right um while herself also not you know completely shoring up her claim to use it, especially since her covers never did not immediately get changed in any way, shape, or form to represent that like cocky was now her mark.
00:28:58
1852media
Oh, yeah.
00:28:59
Veronica Adams
you know um
00:29:01
1852media
Oh, but it was published May 26, 2018, Cocktails, the Cocky Collective.
00:29:05
Veronica Adams
okay so the yeah It like bing, bang, boom.
00:29:06
1852media
Yeah.
00:29:07
Veronica Adams
We're talking about like a six-week window here right between the registrations coming back and this
00:29:09
1852media
Yeah, I mean, this was...
00:29:13
Veronica Adams
anthology getting published and then the lawsuit being filed and like it so fast.
00:29:20
1852media
Yeah, it was it was crazy.
00:29:20
Veronica Adams
So fast.
00:29:22
1852media
um And they had put, even in the description, as you can still see in the description on Amazon, all net profits will be donated to, one, authors already impacted by creative obstruction, 10%.
00:29:34
1852media
Two, romance writers of America, 90%, as a general donation intended for their advocacy fund.
00:29:36
Veronica Adams
There you go.
00:29:40
1852media
um This anthology is not conducted on behalf of RWA nor does RWA endorse this anthology or effort. They have, however, graciously agreed to accept the funds. um And so, yes, it was the goal of Cocktail's anthology is to raise funds to fight against obstruction of creative expression.
00:29:52
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:29:59
1852media
So that was specifically because they didn didn't know how much money they were going to make.
00:30:04
Veronica Adams
Well, sure.
00:30:04
1852media
And they didn't know how much money they were going to need to use um for the defense.
00:30:07
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:30:10
1852media
So they made it very general. um But the understanding was that we knew that the proceeds were going to go fighting against cocky gate.
00:30:18
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:30:19
1852media
And then anything else would legally be allowed to use in the future to protect creative expression.
00:30:26
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:30:27
1852media
So I thought that that was very smart with how that they did or how they did that.
00:30:30
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:30:31
1852media
But yes, that was May 26th, 2018 was the scheduled release date of cocktails. Authors came together. I mean, one thing about romance landia is that authors can come together so freaking quickly to you know put out this stuff.
00:30:48
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:30:49
1852media
Um, I remember, I mean, we did free promotion of that too. We included in all of our newsletters. We put it out to everybody. Like literally everybody who had a list was sending it out to everybody.
00:30:59
Veronica Adams
Yeah, yeah. It it was of it was like sort of a beautiful moment of everyone coming together to be like, wait a minute, this isn't right, you know?
00:31:01
1852media
Like, yeah.
00:31:08
Veronica Adams
The rising tide and all of that. I mean,
00:31:11
1852media
It was literally Felina Hopkins versus Romancelandia.
00:31:14
Veronica Adams
Felina versus the world, baby.
00:31:15
1852media
Like, it it was. I mean, she there was no one that I recall being like, oh, but she has a point. No, no.
00:31:27
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:31:28
1852media
Everybody was like, no, you stepped over the line.
00:31:31
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:31:32
1852media
um People couldn't even believe that it was real at first.
00:31:36
Veronica Adams
Right. Right. Well, it it it's as we will get into next episode, such a stretch legally. um You know, it it seemed outrageous that someone would die on the hill of something this
00:31:44
1852media
Right.
00:31:52
Veronica Adams
insubstantial, right?
00:31:54
1852media
Right. Yeah. And I mean.
00:31:56
Veronica Adams
this This far afield of what everyone knows is subtle law, at least when it comes to trademarking individual words.
00:32:03
1852media
Right.
00:32:04
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:32:04
1852media
And the far reaching effects that her action would have on an entire community.
00:32:08
Veronica Adams
Uh-huh.
00:32:12
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:32:12
1852media
And it was just insane.
00:32:14
Veronica Adams
Right.
00:32:14
1852media
So yeah, now you're caught up to the lawsuit.
00:32:19
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:32:20
1852media
And next Friday, maybe next Friday, you're gonna be away. Are you still gonna be able to record?
00:32:25
Veronica Adams
Oh yeah, absolutely.
00:32:26
1852media
Okay.
00:32:26
Veronica Adams
We'll set aside, we'll set aside some time next week to go ahead and finish this one.
00:32:29
1852media
Okay.
00:32:30
Veronica Adams
Cause yeah.
00:32:31
1852media
This'll be good, yeah. We'll dive into the legal documents and tell you the legal theories on both sides at the insanity that of what happened, what happened next.
00:32:33
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:32:42
Veronica Adams
ahha Yeah.
00:32:45
1852media
So I hope we've let your appetite for a cocky gate, because it really was a wild time in the romance industry.
00:32:46
Veronica Adams
It's crazy.
00:32:48
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:32:52
Veronica Adams
Oh my God. And what a walk down memory lane it's been, like revisiting it.
00:32:54
1852media
I know, I know.
00:32:56
Veronica Adams
You know, youre if you're listening and you recall it yourself, it's just, how can you not just shake your head and go, what was she thinking?
00:33:04
1852media
I mean, just absolutely crazy.
00:33:06
Veronica Adams
Yeah.
00:33:09
1852media
Yeah, there's so many, I'm thinking of the memes. There was so many memes. There was so many, I'm gonna have to try to pull some of them up because it was, everybody was, literally, I can't believe anything got done.
00:33:17
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:33:23
1852media
Everybody was talking about it for weeks, for weeks, so.
00:33:25
Veronica Adams
I know. Yeah. Summer 2018, it was all about it.
00:33:31
1852media
all about it, cocky gate.
Trademark Trends Post-Cockygate
00:33:33
1852media
So, and then I recall other people trying to trademark other things like right after it as well.
00:33:37
Veronica Adams
Yes, there was a whole so there was a whole spate of like copycat, cocky stuff like if Selena can do this, then I'm going to go, you know, trademark.
00:33:43
1852media
Yeah.
00:33:49
1852media
Whatever.
00:33:49
Veronica Adams
Whatever. Yeah.
00:33:50
1852media
Yeah.
00:33:51
Veronica Adams
Second chance.
00:33:52
1852media
Right. Those got slapped down pretty quickly.
00:33:54
Veronica Adams
Alpha.
00:33:55
1852media
Yeah. Oh my God. Oh my God. Absolutely nuts.
Next Episode Teaser
00:34:00
1852media
So tune in next time for Cockygate part two, where we, yeah, we're going to dive into the actual legal documents and tell you what happened in the court case and and go from there and what actually happened afterwards, because this does take a random turn then.
00:34:01
Veronica Adams
a
00:34:04
Veronica Adams
Yes, absolutely.
00:34:10
Veronica Adams
Yep.
00:34:14
Veronica Adams
Yes.
00:34:17
Veronica Adams
It really does, yeah. if or If you are unfamiliar, if you didn't live it the first time, you will appreciate the twist.
00:34:18
1852media
ah
00:34:25
1852media
Yeah, absolutely, absolutely wild. So until next time, this has been for Brooke's sake.