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What Are You Wearing at the End of the World? Ft. John Loafers, Conor, and Matt
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UNMASKED! Our selfless and dashing hosts, finally demystified, answering all the softball questions you submitted! No one brave or foolish enough as @leisurelyloafing would DARE to interview these FASHION GODS. In this rousing conversation we talked about the origins of the show, fishtail parkas, white whales, Anthony Bourdain, geography, photography as preservation, and so much more!
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Transcript
Introduction and Welcoming Guests
00:00:02
Speaker
What's going on, everyone? My name is John Loafer, and it is my pleasure to host this episode of Apocalypse Duds. On today's episode, we have your favorite menswear podcasters, favorite menswear podcasters.
00:00:17
Speaker
The hosts with the most, the Sultans of shitposting, Ralph Lauren's favorite nephews, the curmudgeon and the clown, the Apocalypse Buds, Connor Flower, and Matt Smith.
Role Reversal: Being Interviewed
00:00:32
Speaker
Man, it's so it's so weird being on the other side of that. Yeah, it really is. That's so funny. Yeah, yeah. like i'm definitely That was definitely great and funny, but it's also it's it's very strange.
00:00:46
Speaker
That's the hardest part of prep for this. The rest of this is easy. The rest of this is just having conversation. Yeah, yeah, a totally, totally. Well, John, thank you for for interviewing us. John of WeJohnsFame.
00:00:59
Speaker
This has been long in the works. So this is like cool that we're that we're in it now. Yeah, yeah. we've We've had many a time requested that someone interview us. and not No one has ever been brave enough to step up to the plate. Only John can do this.
00:01:19
Speaker
No, it'll be a lot of fun because you know I think you guys get to to highlight others who come on here. and and I think it's about time we we kind of hear from you guys. And so it's funny in all of this prep, I was talking to my wife about this and she actually came up with the best question of this whole kind of conversation.
Fashion Talk: Connor's Apocalypse Outfit
00:01:38
Speaker
oh ah or without Without further ado, what are you guys wearing to the apocalypse? Oh, all right.
00:01:49
Speaker
All right. we're flip a coin to go first. i I mean, I guess I, I guess that I could, cause I don't know if Matt has an answer prepared. ah i feel like fish, the fishtail parka that was mentioned, there's mentioned in the, in the pre-show here, like I would add the fishtail parka. I would have like probably jeans and I think cordovan, the cordovan Alden loafers.
00:02:18
Speaker
Oh, that's a surprise. i was I was talking to Darren about this because it's like this is going be my opening question. I was like, I bet Connor says the bean moccasins. Well, you see, because that would be what they would want me to think.
00:02:30
Speaker
But since this is the end of the world, it's like you've got to wear the weirdly waterproof ones, right? Not the water not the rubber ones. The horse butt.
00:02:41
Speaker
The horse ass shoes. I mean, you could always trade them off if you need something else, right? That's that's very true. i mean It's true. In the apocalypse, what people are going to be looking for is domestic production.
00:02:54
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. And you didn't say anything about not having a backpack, not having you know room to have ah extra things. Yeah. Well, no, i mean, it's a it's your outfit. It's your apocalypse. I mean, what do you guys, ah yeah, i mean, Connor, you bring in a briefcase? You bring in a backpack? What do you, what do
Stories of Beloved Items
00:03:10
Speaker
you bring? I think I bring the rucksack, probably. I bring that, this rucksack that I bought in Mexico City that I carry around with me.
00:03:17
Speaker
I carried it, like, for five years in the school system, so it's pretty beat up. um But it's been, like, repaired many times by different people, and so it's, like, kind of a Frankenstein bag, which I love.
00:03:31
Speaker
I mean, this just kind kind of sounds like any other Monday for you. ah Well, it is opening in right now. Yeah, that's right. It is kind of that way. And I mean, I have like, that's kind of what I was wearing when I was when I was working, basically when I've been working in the school system the whole time. It's like I'm wearing paramilitary clothing.
00:03:53
Speaker
or in michigan alatota Right, right, right. Well, it's like you never know what's going to happen. Especially in this timeline. It's true. It's true. I mean, you don't even know what kind of apocalypse it's going to be.
00:04:06
Speaker
Unfortunately,
Humor in the Apocalypse
00:04:07
Speaker
no, it definitely would be like the most banal and sad one. Yep. Yep. That is the future that we are destined for. It's going to be like everyone is going to just be inundated with so many ads that they suffocate.
00:04:25
Speaker
It's going to be the apocalypse hosted by American Express. Or by us, which would really be hell.
00:04:34
Speaker
Oh my goodness. I mean, the crazy thing too is we just kind of went through a partial apocalypse with the pandemic and everything else that's going on. yeah Right. I mean, I feel like Matt, I don't know exactly how old you are, but I think you're kind of on the elder millennial. And it's like, how many, like once in a lifetime apocalypses can we really go through?
00:04:51
Speaker
Dude, I wish that there was a fucking number. Cause I can't think of, I can't think of one being 40, almost 42 years old in this hellscape.
00:05:02
Speaker
I mean, that's when I bought those bean mock, uh, mocks was during COVID with the like pandemic money. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't get that because I'm self-employed, but, uh, you know, it's okay.
00:05:15
Speaker
Yeah.
Pandemic Business Success
00:05:16
Speaker
Well, you should, right. I mean, no one is thinking that you shouldn't, ah especially on this program. Oh yeah. Yeah. it yeah I'm not saying I don't agree with that. I'm just saying that, uh, yeah, that did not come my way. Sadly.
00:05:29
Speaker
You didn't file for the small business loans. I'm such a like, we call them it tiny businesses, which is like, basically, you know, just kind of like one step above like selling at a farmer's market or a, you know, a local flea market.
00:05:46
Speaker
So it's okay. 2020 was honestly like my my best year of business ever. I guess because everyone was fucking bored. now Everybody was just getting dressed to the apocalypse. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
00:05:58
Speaker
Well, truly, I mean, didn't you see it? You sold a ton of military. Yeah. Isn't that when I bought that the infamous Anorak from you? Yeah, yeah. That was, I want to say, like, fall of 2020.
00:06:13
Speaker
So, yeah, that was the latest once-in-a-lifetime happening was ah the basis for this show. Yeah. Well, when had Y2K, we've had a ton of things,
Past Apocalypses in Media
00:06:25
Speaker
right? I mean, we've had swine flu and mad cow disease and all these kinds of things. It's just like, it's so, it's not even challenging to tell, I guess, what is media hysteria and what is ah genuine threat. I mean, obviously with COVID, like, yeah, that was a real thing, but.
00:06:45
Speaker
I mean, at this point, it feels like we can we can handle pretty much anything. but like i mean i mean the the The apocalypse is going to come and we're going to be like, yeah you know, done this before. Been there, done that. Yes. ah You mean I have to go to all my meetings in a fucking like weird Windows program forever now? and Yeah.
00:07:10
Speaker
Okay. the reality So I guess it's my my turn with this question. Yep. What are you wearing, Matt? um I'm going to my L.L. Bean Chippewa boots that I think everyone has ever seen.
00:07:27
Speaker
First nice footwear purchase I made 2010. I'm going to um go with my Dickies canvas pants that have all the fucking patches and that I keep destroying.
00:07:41
Speaker
ah Let's see. I'm going to go... my I have a forty s um denim chore jacket. sorry I don't know the brand.
00:07:55
Speaker
It doesn't have a brand tag, sadly. That, and then I'm going to go M51 Fishtail on top because you're going to have to have it. It's pretty water resistant. It can keep you warm if it's cold. We don't know what season the apocalypse is happening in.
00:08:13
Speaker
Sadly, it's not going to be that cold, I think. Probably not. Yeah. And then, yeah, I've got ah i've got a Marlboro Adventure Gear backpack that I'll just pack full of fucking whatever else I can fit in there.
00:08:25
Speaker
Probably some Vietnam shit, some other, you know, military stuff that I have just so I can switch out layers and clean things if need be. I mean, all the shit's existed for many years prior to myself, so I think it'll handle it.
00:08:42
Speaker
Nice. right yeah i mean that's a two I'm going to miss the Cafe
Fashion Talk: Matt's Apocalypse Outfit
00:08:46
Speaker
Bastello, though. That's going to be the real bomber and when it comes to it. ah You know, though that that's stuff shelf stable, though. I mean, that's something you go into the grocery store It's true. I mean, and like coffee coffee is one of those amazing things. Like if you've got water and you've got a heat source, you can make coffee.
00:09:01
Speaker
So i'll be psyched. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we'll be definitely in the Boy Scout, person scout, Girl Scout arena of yeah a cooking shit on the on the stove.
00:09:15
Speaker
Yeah, dude. i can eat I can eat beans for days, too. I don't give a fuck. Matt is unusually well prepared for the apocalypse. yeah I think that the big downfall for you, Matt, would be how would you watch Transformers or Top Gun?
00:09:32
Speaker
Yeah, it's true, but I only watch those special occasions at this point, so, you know. And and there are no special occasions in the apocalypse. No. ah Something I've long said um since I've been doing Vendage full-time is that, like, hey, if something happens, i got shit to barter with. Like, people always need clothes.
00:09:49
Speaker
Yo, you got some peanut butter? I got a jacket for you. Here you go. Yeah. So you've be you've been planning for this like ah for forever. um not a I'm not an official prepper, but in my mind, I'm prepper, you know?
00:10:04
Speaker
You got to have a way to cope. I like that. I mean, it's comforting. And I think like if anyone has owned a fishtail parka like that, it doesn't even need to be that particular one, even then that particular one is excellent.
00:10:16
Speaker
It's the best. Yeah. It's like, you know, what's up. It's like a tent you can wear. Yeah, pretty much. Yeah, exactly. I didn't even think about that. Like if I need shelter, man, prop that thing up on a couple of sticks and I'm good to go.
00:10:29
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, because if you've seen, like, the... What I think of is the, like, Korean War Memorial, where they're, like, all, like, where they're wearing that parka, and they're just, like, soaking.
00:10:42
Speaker
Yes. They're just, like, soaking wet.
00:10:45
Speaker
I think the fishtail is one of the the greatest garments ever created.
00:10:52
Speaker
I think so. Have we talked about the fishtail part of it? Like...
00:10:59
Speaker
it seems kind of intuitive, but it's also like, is it to wrap it around yourself? it Is it functional? Yeah. So it, the like the strings that hang off the back of it and the string that, um that wrap around the waist, ah I believe, and I'm could very well be wrong, but I'm pretty sure that like in super cold climates, it was so that you could tie them together and no heat would escape or as possible. Yeah.
00:11:30
Speaker
That's brutal.
00:11:33
Speaker
But i have the liner. and I'm sure you have it, Matt. But it just is like... Yeah, I have a Vietnam liner because that's that's about as heavy as you can get in Georgia. Yeah, I couldn't imagine wearing the liner ever because it's like pretty interesting. Yeah, John's got a fish tail coming for me that's one of the early liners that is like kind of a wool cotton pile instead of the later like...
00:11:59
Speaker
um almost terry cloth type of fabric that I think was also wool and cotton, but it's like, that's the liner itself weighs like seven pounds. Yeah.
00:12:10
Speaker
It's wild. It's insane. Great for DC. Yeah. Right. Yeah.
00:12:16
Speaker
Well, so, all right, so along those lines of the apocalypse, I think I've asked you guys this a bunch of times and I always forget. what's What's the deal with the with the name? What's what's Apocalypse Duds? So, funny story.
00:12:30
Speaker
um There's a band from Sweden that's like a kind of glammy, like harder rock band. They're called Turbo Negro. And they have a record called Apocalypse Dudes.
00:12:45
Speaker
And yeah, when we were when we were kicking around the like ideas for a name but in the early days, um I don't know why, but that one, like Apocalypse Duds, duds meaning clothes, but also kind of a double entendre, like like me and Connor are duds of you know like society, essentially.
00:13:06
Speaker
yeah So, like I don't know, it it had this appeal for me and... I don't remember. It's been, it's been, you know fucking a while now, but like, I think I was pretty adamant about, yeah.
00:13:20
Speaker
Like I was just like attached to this name and thought that it was like great on multiple levels. Yeah, I do like it. I mean, ah the tagline that sort of goes along with the show that is almost never seen as like, what are you wearing to the end of the world?
00:13:34
Speaker
Which is kind of where we were with this idea. Like the apocalypse is coming. we also like clothes. Surely there's some kind of connection there.
00:13:46
Speaker
And there is, as we've sort of discovered ah over these almost 80 episodes.
00:13:55
Speaker
Yeah. It kind of morphed and like me and Connor both came up, you know, in like alt rock and punk and hardcore and metal and things like this. And so like,
00:14:06
Speaker
music has played such a significant portion of influence in our life that like, I don't know, i like musical references are always super, super important to me.
00:14:18
Speaker
And they're always something that I can, you know, I can find, i can mine something from it. And so ah think having that like kind of element, just even if it was only something that he and I knew attached to what we were doing, like it made it,
00:14:34
Speaker
Made it you know kind of kind of feel like it was right. Yeah.
Origin of the Podcast's Name
00:14:39
Speaker
And we did use yeah we did to use the intro to one of their songs for a while until like you know we weren't really technically legally using it.
00:14:49
Speaker
But Spotify and and other places started cracking down, so we nixed that, sadly. It was perfect. It was really perfect. It was pretty perfect. And now it's like, I found the song, dude. I found the song. And I was like, yeah, probably. It's the intro to the Age of Pamparius off of Apocalypse Dudes. And man, like that band is so fucking fun.
00:15:11
Speaker
I actually might put have to put that record on tonight. it's It's like, so the word epic has like been destroyed and like dragged through the streets. Right, right. Yeah, yeah. like It's truly an epic song, like, but it's very tongue in cheek, I think.
00:15:26
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. they They're a very fun, fun, interesting band for sure.
00:15:33
Speaker
Nice. Well, so, so walk me through like the original pitch on this show? Like who, who was like, Hey, we should do this podcast. And, and what was your kind of original concept?
00:15:47
Speaker
Well, I guess I pitched Matt the idea. um And it was like, I think this is something that we could do.
00:15:59
Speaker
And then it was like kind of floundering for a little bit. And then, we sort of stumbled through the recording process and the editing process as we still do.
00:16:11
Speaker
right Right. Yeah. We haven't come very far in that, that was
00:16:17
Speaker
but it's just been, um I don't know, like a personal project that like my grandmother is an artist and she, she says like, I wish the ideas would leave me alone.
00:16:29
Speaker
Like then I would just be able to die. And like, that's kind of how i feel ah wow like i i wish that like my creativity
00:16:42
Speaker
you actually don't wish that you know it keeps me going it keeps me alive it's like uh if i'm not thinking about doing this what am i really thinking about like My job? i don't know. I mean, i think this has been like a very kind of even cathartic vehicle for me. This is um my first real like creative endeavor of this scale, certainly.
00:17:10
Speaker
Yeah, it's interesting because, like, Connor and I talk about this constantly, but there's there's just no, like, roadmap to be able to do this. Like, I played in bands since I was in high school.
00:17:23
Speaker
um You know, you make a few, you make a demo, you make a couple of records maybe. If you're lucky, you you do some tours. But, like, it's especially, pre- free
00:17:36
Speaker
2010, 2011, like it was pretty intensive and like, it's a lot of word of mouth, like very early social media. um And, you know, like I've been around the clothing sphere since like the early Tumblr blog, you know, whatever the fuck days.
00:17:54
Speaker
But you never, like none of that really tells you how to like do something of this nature. Like there's no, there's no like guy. Well, I mean, I'm sure there are fucking our guides that are dummies guide to five. You know, it's just a bunch of people like me and Connor saying what's worked and what hasn't for the most part, unless it's, you know, some like fucking scheme, but yeah, just like it's very deep, like DIY, which is by intention.
00:18:26
Speaker
Um, And it's just us like talking to people that we think and whatever happens happens. Like we're not getting fucking, you know, we're not getting paid to do any of this. We just, we just enjoy it. And it's like, you know, it's a passion project.
Podcast Goals and Philosophy
00:18:44
Speaker
When you guys set out to do it, i mean, did you think you might have guests like Derek Guy on? or Or were you like, hey, you know, we'll we'll kind of find friends in the the community and shoot the shit with them for an hour?
00:18:56
Speaker
I mean, pretty much the latter. like if And if someone you know if someone notable came on, cool. But like our our goal was never originally to like have quote-unquote famous or, you know, like...
00:19:12
Speaker
people that are big in the scene on like if that happens rap but well go for it i was just gonna say it's it was the original intent was like to interview people who were normal yeah you know who just were everyday people especially people who were working people um And we still have ideas like in the pipeline, like we want to talk to like a chef, you know, sort of in an NPR kind of vein, you know, NPR, but like, not like that.
00:19:46
Speaker
ah Because it is public radio. Like, that's what we've been doing with this show is public radio. Yeah, like, like Terry Gross was one of our big influences, like just the conversational aspects of it.
00:19:56
Speaker
And You know, like keeping it to people that we think are rad, whatever they are. Like we can talk to, you know, I think we at this point we can talk to anyone about basically anything for an hour.
00:20:11
Speaker
And, you know, just have people that aren't like known quantities on the show to talk about themselves and what they think is rad.
00:20:22
Speaker
And one more thing, like this guy, Renato was involved. Renato. Oh yes. The Godfather. Yeah. Renato is ah just another Instagram friend. um Not just another anything, of course, but like just a good dude ah who has like a child and a job and like another job.
00:20:45
Speaker
so he does not have the time to do this project with us, but he did we did, we did set out to do it in that way. Yeah, we did. We did. And we have him on every year to end the year.
00:20:57
Speaker
Um, it's kind of our, our tradition and like, and it's so nice. Yeah. Yeah. It fucking rules every single time, every year it' it's fun as hell. And yeah, like we're, yeah, that's why we call him the godfather of the show. Cause he was initially a part of it.
00:21:12
Speaker
And due to certain commitments he can't do it but like is he's here in spirit all the time hell yeah yeah that's interesting to hear i didn't know that um so all right so if you guys could have like any guest on and this is a question for each of you who would you want like who's your who's your like white whale of a guest oh connor you want to go first for that one Yeah, I we have a little list here, actually. Like, I guess I would say i would want to have there's this rapper, Boldy James from Detroit.
00:21:50
Speaker
ah He's released seven albums this year. just is like phenomenal talent. And he it just is like writing, you know, like he's a writer. He's a really good writer.
00:22:03
Speaker
um And so I think I'd like to talk to him. But also, like, fucking Action Bronson, 2 Chainz, like, Guy Fieri, these kind of... so One of those is not like the others. Yeah, yeah. You lost me to Guy Fieri, my friend. They're... I think... Listen, I think that Guy gets a bad rap. I think that Guy... I agree with that. i just... i don't I don't know what the fuck... I went i don't like... I don't like food.
00:22:28
Speaker
like Where do you get your shirts from, dude? Yeah, true, true. What's the deal with your shtick? like Because I met him. oh right. I forgot about that. And he's on all the time. yeah And there's like no sense of irony about it at all. He plays this character that is like a parody.
00:22:47
Speaker
He's like a clown. And I think that that is amazing. Yeah, so I think I heard one time that like when he showed up to do the first, um whatever his original show was where he was cruising around, like that was what like the costume person was like, here, like here's like a bowling shirt or something like that. And it just stuck for him.
00:23:05
Speaker
Jesus Christ. Even if that's not really like his thing. yeah He looks like every Smash Mouth song distilled into a human being. He's committed because his sons are named Hunter and Ryder.
00:23:19
Speaker
Oh, God damn. Yeah, yeah. like ahll get anything But I mean, he's on the West Coast, right? I mean, hes he strikes me as very much like a California dude. He is. He's like a SoCal person. Yeah, he's got to be, which makes the Smash Mouth thing all that much more relevant. than I think he has done a lot.
00:23:37
Speaker
he's done a lot for food, I think, uh, for good or for worse. Uh, I think that like that style of like going to a oh greasy spoon restaurant and like just seeing what's on the menu and seeing like the, the people who actually work there, that like was kind of not really ah thing before he was doing that.
00:23:59
Speaker
Yeah. You're right about that. i kind of missed that whole like era of television. Cause I didn't have cable. Yeah. Um, so I'm not really like invested in, in whatever happened. Like I love Anthony Bourdain shit because I relate to him in a lot of levels, but, uh, yeah, the, the influx of that kind of thing on TV, I just, it passed. It's a net loss.
00:24:24
Speaker
It's a net loss. um Yeah. Yeah.
Influence of Anthony Bourdain
00:24:28
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, um Anthony Bourdain was a legend, too, because his show was... Like, I don't even know... I've never actually seen his show other than, like... Oh, man, really? I think he'd really enjoy it. but I've read a lot that he's written, and, like, I've, you know, red read and listened to interviews and podcasts and things that he did.
00:24:46
Speaker
It's cool because it's almost like he uses food to kind of explore the cultures that he's in. Oh, totally. It's almost like it's less about the food and more about the people and the adventures that he kind of got to do as part of that.
00:24:58
Speaker
Yeah. I feel like he he would categorize himself and what he did as that. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. All right, Pete. All right, Pete.
00:25:09
Speaker
let's Let's talk about you guys for a little bit. ah How did you all meet? I sold Connor a vintage polo, like, sage anorak that I found.
00:25:22
Speaker
I don't even remember where. And I think we corresponded a little bit here and there, but that was maybe our first, like, actual introduction.
00:25:34
Speaker
So, like, on, like, Instagram or, like... Yeah, yeah. I just, I found something at yard sale and posted it on my story, and hit up. It didn't occur to me that Rebels and Rogues was one person.
00:25:45
Speaker
Oh, that that's interesting. i did not know that. I mean, yeah, I just wasn't like, I didn't know if it was like a group of people running like a vintage thing. Like, oh godcha god what i mean and like I didn't know it was your personal page to the extent that it is your personal page. right like I mean, yeah, I can't separate my business and my personal.
00:26:06
Speaker
So, right. Exactly. And that's what I thought was cool. I mean, I think something that is maybe unrecognized about the show is that Matt and I are, like, very far apart.
00:26:20
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I'm in Atlanta. Connor's in Baltimore.
Challenges of Remote Podcasting
00:26:24
Speaker
And so they're just as – the guest is wherever they are, too. And that's like a time zone nightmare.
00:26:31
Speaker
We've done, what, one in-person interview with Cal? london Yep. I went up to Baltimore around Connor's birthday for almost a week and we interviewed Cal Callagher. That's a cartoonist extraordinaire.
00:26:47
Speaker
And yeah, one of Connor's like, ah you know, old longtime friends and mentors. But yeah, other than that, it's been. yeah Everything we've done has been remote with both of us and the guest, which is part of the reason why it's so goddamn difficult sometimes.
00:27:05
Speaker
yeah yeah we I don't want to harp on the the harshness of trying to record an all-remote podcast much, but Godspeed if you want to get into it.
00:27:20
Speaker
Well, it's very challenging and like, there's only really one software that, or I guess service that we, I guess it's service as a software software as a service, like that works and it doesn't work really.
00:27:35
Speaker
It doesn't really ever work. So it's like, yeah, it's a lot of challenges, but yeah, they're like telling us they're going to get back to us and they like, never do. It just is like, and we pay for this shit, you know? it's annoying.
00:27:49
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. I bet. And Connor, are you from the Maryland area originally? yeah Yeah, I'm from Reva, which is a suburb of Annapolis. yeah So you guys are both are are both kind of lifers too for for where you kind of grew up, right?
00:28:06
Speaker
Yeah. Pretty much, yeah. yeah ah ah Which I both love and hate, but it's okay. Atlanta is the best best city in the world, in my opinion. And I will rep it forever.
00:28:16
Speaker
Well, it's funny. we We both sort of are the same way about the place that we're from. Yeah, yeah. Like, there's tons of similarities between us as well. um Yeah, for sure. For sure. And, I mean, Matt, I know you're from little bit further north than Georgia, and it's crazy how – I think we may have actually talked about this before – how different Atlanta is from the rest of Georgia. And, I mean, especially, you know, north Georgia from south and central Georgia are completely different. Yeah, yeah.
00:28:43
Speaker
yeah i mean i will say like south georgia is just fucking depressing like what is that what is um like some of the cities in south shore towns uh waycross okay so it's not like there's nothing like like savannah i guess is south technically south georgia that that and brunswick are kind of the two big savannah is where scat is right Yeah, I guess it's it's kind of on the – I don't actually know if it's classified like central or south Georgia, but it's it's close enough. um I mean, you've got like Augusta, but that's not really – like east Georgia. that's east.
00:29:23
Speaker
Yeah, south georgian Georgia and central Georgia is really like pecan trees, farm fields, and then you start to get to like the kind of Florida swampiness. yeah Yeah. Oh, dear. Yeah.
00:29:34
Speaker
Yeah, I went to an estate sale like four or five years ago and it wasn't Waycross, but it Anyway, it was it was down and like the middle of nowhere, Georgia. Like it took me to be almost four hours to get there from Atlanta.
00:29:50
Speaker
um And it was like it's like the saddest suburb you could ever imagine.
00:30:01
Speaker
and like but in but in a way that like suburbs are already sad but like I'm talking about like closed down KFCs and like every other yeah every other building is vacant like sad where you can tell that like something was happening here years ago and it's just gradually go right totally gone even big businesses won't touch that shit yeah i don't think yeah I don't think a lot of people appreciate the level of poverty in the South. No, no. It's it's huge. and you know Especially like farming communities and things that have just been decimated over the years. like i just am I'm just a Yankee anyway. and like Well, technically, Maryland is not Yankees. You can take a line, aren't you?
00:30:46
Speaker
Yeah. yeah yeah yeah I'm not a fucking rebel apologist, but yes, Maryland is technically the South, motherfucker. you can You don't get to screw that shit.
00:30:56
Speaker
I'm not rewriting it. I'm saying like that as far as I am concerned, i live in the north geographically. ethically right They always say that Baltimore was the tip of the south.
00:31:12
Speaker
I believe that. Yeah. yeah that Yeah. It's kind of a weird area where nobody really, nobody really wants to claim it. Right. The mid Atlantic is kind of its own thing. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:31:22
Speaker
It's the seat of power. Like it's, yeah, it's a terrible place. It's a swamp.
Geographic Diversity of Georgia
00:31:29
Speaker
And now, and now, and now we are kind of there. Like, I think that, you know You have to see that kind of poverty like very closely to understand it even. Because it's unimaginable.
00:31:48
Speaker
And people are totally, totally, totally fucking blind to it. Because even if it's in their backyard, they don't experience it. And then even when they are experiencing it, they're like unsure why it's happening.
00:32:03
Speaker
Yeah, my hometown is kind of the same way. like It's not quite as sad um as South Georgia is to me, but like yeah there's there's one of the biggest denim mills in the entire world, Mount Vernon Mills here. That's still here. There's a little bit of carpet industry um and and things of that nature in Northwest Georgia, but...
00:32:23
Speaker
Like there's no really big state too. oh yeah it's it's's kind of you're Immediately apparent. Like it's an enormous piece of land. Yeah. yeah I mean, it's, it's like if you're driving on, on like interstate 75, which goes all the way through, it's almost six and a half, seven or so hours from top to bottom.
00:32:43
Speaker
Yeah, and there's a huge amount of geographic diversity as well, right? because Oh, totally. get more Florida swampy in the south, and then you start get into the the mountains as as you go further north. Yeah, yeah. And at this point, I feel like even the mountains are starting to get that Florida swampiness here and there.
00:32:58
Speaker
Or like, oh shit, it might rain today. Or, I don't know if it's going to rain today, and then it fucking pours. You're like, cool. There was nothing in the forecast for this. Yeah.
00:33:10
Speaker
Well, so along those lines, I feel like you can always kind of see, i mean, maybe this isn't entirely true, but I feel like you can kind of see the influence of someone's like hometown, uh, in their style.
Fashion and Political Memories
00:33:24
Speaker
Um, so with that in mind, like what's your earliest fashion memory and and how do you think like where you grew up kind of influenced your, your fashion, your style? Hmm.
00:33:39
Speaker
I had this, uh, I guess I had this like swashbuckler costume and I got really mad and like sort of ripped it open and like tore the buttons off it.
00:33:53
Speaker
That's like something that occurs to me ah is like a temper tantrum. You know what I mean? it was very beautiful though. And I think that my grandmother must've made it. It was like,
00:34:04
Speaker
velour it was like the velvet it was uh really like kind of elegant and sparkly but that's like the kind of shit that they were dressing me in which i definitely think has ah followed me into adulthood
00:34:22
Speaker
No, I mean, that's that's great. and I mean, do you think growing up in, like, the DMV has kind of... because yeah I mean, you've definitely got, like, Ivy elements to to your general style. I mean, do you think being in the kind of Annapolis, D.C.
00:34:34
Speaker
area has kind of... and influence that yeah i mean it's why i started dressing it's like well it's why i started dressing this way anyway um because i was interning for stinnie hoyer and i was like i can't like i can't have a ponytail and not be wearing a tie So, so I was wearing a suit and a ponytail.
00:34:59
Speaker
and I mean, it's like, I have a picture shaking his hand doing this and it's like, I don't know what the fuck I thought I was doing, but that definitely was like, I don't know. I thought that there was a, i I'll say this and you don't have to say anything about it.
00:35:15
Speaker
I thought that there was something worthwhile about my proximity to that place. And now i don't feel that way. You know, now I've gone to the other town.
00:35:28
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. We'll leave it at home. It really is. I'll say I think it feels a whole lot different. It feels whole lot less significant today than it did, I mean, even when I was moved up here, you know, 13 years ago.
00:35:44
Speaker
yeah it would have been It would have been really interesting to be up here during the Obama administration, you know, to feel like you're you might still be able to have some impact on the city and how you're going. And that's how it fucking was. i mean, it was like people were jamming like it was a fucking I remember like so when a I went to college in Baltimore and like.
00:36:07
Speaker
I got a parking ticket every day, my first semester, freshman year. And I'm pretty sure actually just the entire year, cause I just parked on campus. They wanted us to park in this freshman lot. And I was like, I'm not walking the, however, like of less than a mile to get to campus and they can't enforce these tickets anyway.
00:36:25
Speaker
Later I found out they can enforce the tickets. But I noticed there was one day that I didn't get a ticket. when Obama was elected and I had an Obama bumper sticker.
00:36:39
Speaker
I think that the parking person was like, you know, we give this motherfucker a parking ticket every day, but like, he's got the Obama sticker. So like let's let him, let's let him free, let him free on this parking ticket get today.
00:36:54
Speaker
And so that is truly the amount of joy that was being felt is that people were not, people whose job it is to get parking tickets were not giving parking tickets. Because of Barack Hussein Obama.
00:37:06
Speaker
I'm both, like, happy that i like I was not really paying attention to any politics for after, like, youth shit for a while during this.
00:37:19
Speaker
And every story I hear, I'm i'm more happy about that. Well, it's like, not like I was watching like, uh, the West wing, like, Oh, like, give george Oh my God. Like, I love this. I want this to be my life. Oh, for sure. For sure.
00:37:34
Speaker
But yeah, like there's just, there's there's that glorification of politicians that like, and i can't I can't abide like both my younger self and my older self now. I'm just like, I came back to the same fucking point. Well, you have to remember he hadn't killed thousands of children with drones. mean, this is true. This is true.
00:37:55
Speaker
at that time. So it was kind of like he wasn't that bad. He probably hadn't killed anyone personally even. Right, right. You know, ain he he was just... wearing it a khaki suit sometimes. yeah He was just a slightly cooler Bill Clinton from the Right.
00:38:11
Speaker
right Actually black president. yeah is that singing recall To ever recall that Bill Clinton was known as, quote, the first black president is just un-fucking-believable. And so many different kinds of people would say this about him.
00:38:27
Speaker
Right. Oh, man. Yeah, yeah that that was a tangent that I was not expecting. i I'm happy that it happened. Yeah, yeah same.
00:38:38
Speaker
I guess, John, to go back to your question about, you know,
Cultural Influence on Fashion
00:38:43
Speaker
geographical place influencing style, um I guess the past, like, handful years, as my best friend Eleanor coined, I dressed like a redneck anarchist.
00:38:57
Speaker
And that's, in many ways, ah very true. But right. It's exactly right. Yeah. I mean, like I've I've been shopping the surplus stores since I was 14 or 15. mean, I've been wearing camo military surplus like thrifting ah consistently since. Yeah, I started thrifting seriously when I was like 12.
00:39:22
Speaker
and so Yeah, I just kind of like, I guess like I'm from, you know, from the mountains, from people that hunt. I'm not a hunter, never have been a hunter. I'm vegan.
00:39:34
Speaker
um But, ah you know, like work clothes and and stuff that like gets the job done and like handles, you know, whatever stress you can throw at it has kind of always been my thing.
00:39:46
Speaker
Like, I don't dress that dissimilarly now than I did in high school. Like, Dickies, sneakers, a t-shirt, and a lightweight jacket or flannel shirt or something.
00:39:58
Speaker
I mean, i love menswear. I love a lot of different things, but like that's just what I feel the most comfortable in.
00:40:05
Speaker
it's That's a really funny description because it that does feel a lot like North Georgia, but you're definitely not like... ah you You can see the influence even though it's not at all what it really is.
00:40:17
Speaker
Yeah, totally. I mean, I like i sell a lot of or And love and... and you know tree bark and various hunting patterns like they're some of my favorite things to buy and sell um and i i just had this happen on sunday at the market like this you know gen z girl bought a real tree button-up shirt and you know i was like you know, when I was growing up, all the assholes were this.
00:40:44
Speaker
And now like every time I tell it to like a woman or a trans or queer person, like someone, you know, like I know in the gate, in the gay community, it's been a big thing of like reclaiming these patterns and things. And it's like, fuck yeah, dude. And like, I want the weirdos wearing this shit.
00:41:01
Speaker
Cause it, it shouldn't just be like for those, you know, hit assholes. And yeah, Come on, man. Rednecks are the OGs. Like actual rednecks, not not the Toby Keith version.
00:41:15
Speaker
yeah yeah Yeah, for sure. There's an important distinction. like there's you know It's storied that ah the Battle of Bear Mountain and the red bandanas that um Union miners wore are where that term initiated.
00:41:30
Speaker
no idea if that's correct or not, but like, I'll take, I think i read in specific that it was a slur against working people. Yeah, totally. Yeah. Like, I don't know the etymology, but, but I back like, right. No, I back the union, like working man, you know, fucking Southerner stereotype. Like that's, I hate that the South gets so characterized or mischaracterized about, you know, a lot of it's good shit, but like,
00:42:00
Speaker
you know, if you're from the South, a lot of times, like you're just around people that are in the same socioeconomic class that you are and they'll help you out and you help them out. And like, it's all mutual.
00:42:12
Speaker
I know there's, that's not trying to whitewash it, but like, that's just how it is.
00:42:18
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. For sure. And that's my wife. because that's my but and yeah You both are from there, you know, I mean,
00:42:28
Speaker
Yeah, it's interesting, right? So, like, my wife grew up in, like, Nebraska and and spent a bunch time in Georgia, but, I mean, her family's not really from Georgia, but, Matt, you know, I don't know it was like growing up for you, but, like, going to, like, family gatherings and, like, like and everything was so community-oriented. Oh, yeah, totally. lot of it involved, like, going to, like, church events, even though nobody in my family family was, like, really religious, but, like, you still kind of, like, went to those things as, like, a way to hang out.
00:42:55
Speaker
Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And that sense of community is it's different up here in D.C., right? I mean, it still exists, but it's a completely different vibe. Yeah, same, same. And ah like, I think my time spent in New York, like I saw that a lot, too.
00:43:09
Speaker
um You know, it's it's different everywhere. But the South really is like, in a lot of ways, you know, communal driven, which is sad to think like how most of the states and people down here have ended up.
00:43:25
Speaker
like against their self-interest and shit. But that's just, yeah. Like you go to your family, you eat a big ass meal. Like you invite a couple of neighbors over. Cool. Well, in Annapolis too, which was like a huge slave port.
00:43:39
Speaker
I mean, Annapolis is like a Southern entity as well. Right. Yeah. ah And maybe it's not clear that Annapolis is like ah half an hour from DC. Like they're,
00:43:53
Speaker
They're extremely close. And as the capital of Maryland, it's like.
00:44:00
Speaker
There's a lot of sort of and sort of hand grabbing between D.C. and Annapolis, so there's like it's a non place like there's no culture and that's deliberate in some ways, like D.C. is a place that has ah sort of revolving doors of people.
00:44:21
Speaker
Right. So though it is a diverse place in that way, everyone's trying to dress the same way for the most part. I don't know. Maybe this maybe this is and an antiquated view of DC.
00:44:35
Speaker
But from what I see often – Yeah, you know and and it's funny going back to the Obama discussion. it feels like DC has lost its cool factor.
00:44:50
Speaker
because I mean you know it was ah it was like the city really blew up in in kind of the late aughts early twenty ten and you had a lot of like really interesting people coming to the city and I feel like that's definitely changed a bit yeah yeah you could say that again i mean you know if Ian and Guy are still there and Discord is still there DC still got a check mark in my opinion That's right. We're we're holding down. no they're Even though they're in Nova.
00:45:23
Speaker
I know, but they're fucking D.C., man. You can't like you argue with that. Well, it's like it's just bizarre. I mean, it's like, I think being close to that place, it's like you're... I don't know. It's like you have a different understanding of geography, I guess, the the closer you are to it.
00:45:44
Speaker
Oh yeah, I'm sure. You know what I mean? Because like Arlington and Alexandria are are like decidedly not DC. Right. yeah yeah yeah Culturally even, especially, they are not the same place.
00:45:56
Speaker
Well, yeah, but like if you think about culturally in in the time that I'm like talking about, the like 80s, you know, 70s, 80s, punk, go-go, whatever scenes, like it it would kind of be like being from a very small suburb that's very close to any city.
00:46:15
Speaker
yeah yeah it's crazy too i mean so my my in-laws are from it's like leesberger ashburn virginia yeah when they grew up there guess in like the 60s 70s whatever like it was like like podunk like it was outside of the suburbs kind of right and like now it's very much the suburbs um of dc yeah um and yeah i mean you just i mean there was a huge variety there but yeah i mean to connor's point right the the dc virginia and maryland things are all very different flavors of life yeah i can understand that but but i guess like if you're in the underground like it's not really
00:47:02
Speaker
It sort of doesn't matter where you are, right? Like, if you're like a punk in Phoenix, right, right. You're in a different, you're in a different, completely different existence from everyone else.
00:47:12
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. For sure. I mean, I feel like it's kind of akin to like, you know, the the like, founders of the genres that that like, were in Manhattan versus the people that were like, you know, they lived in Brooklyn or Queens or whatever.
00:47:28
Speaker
Like it's all, you know, I would say to me, it's just like, it's all just, they all live in New York. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I kind of feel like, I kind of feel like those dudes get a pass because that's kind of how the world was back then.
00:47:44
Speaker
Well, along those lines, here's my my next question for you guys. And this doesn't necessarily have to be kind of style related, but but what what inspires you guys? um You know, i mean, Matt, with with your music, what inspires you? And and Connor, with with kind of your photography, what inspires you? ah Man, like music is is a whole, like music and clothes are my first two loves.
00:48:13
Speaker
Um, they're, they're synonymous to me. Um, when I moved to New York in 2011, like after I'd been working in, in like secondhand clothes for a while and I've been selling, you know, secondhand shit for almost, I guess a little over 20 years now.
00:48:29
Speaker
But, uh, my mom would always tell me about people that like I grew up with, you know, church people, whatever they were like, Oh, what's Matthew doing? And, Oh, they're in New York.
00:48:41
Speaker
ah They work in and the clothing industry. And they're like, that makes sense. And I'm like, motherfucker, why didn't someone tell me this at 17 years old? that Like, you know, I had some sort of, like, some sort of something about this thing that I could do.
00:49:01
Speaker
And that's like one of my you know wills to live essentially. And music's kind of the same way. Like I've i've grown up in a very musical household, thankfully. um Which this is so cool. Matt will never say this, but like, yeah, yeah. Also,
00:49:18
Speaker
Yeah, for the record, I took acid and like little ah like an hour and a half ago. Yeah, nice. i said We knew I had to wait for you to say it. I'm more toxic than usual. dude, and you're so perfect.
00:49:32
Speaker
Thank Like always, dude. Like always. I mean, as fucking always. Seriously. Because your answers have just been so fucking good. yeah ah Off the brain, dude. Come on. So good for you, dude. All right.
00:49:47
Speaker
Can't go there yet. Um, yeah but yeah, like, like music has always been the same thing. Um, my dad's family were all musicians. They put out a couple of gospel records in the seventies.
00:49:59
Speaker
Um, he and his brothers and their dad, ah my mom plays guitar and flute. And I always say that like, she's the reason why I love Neil Young. And my dad is the reason why i love rock and roll.
00:50:11
Speaker
Um, That's amazing. hell yeah yeah like so you you i mean You had a really nice community then, it sounds like, in your hometown. so but Yeah, definitely. and like I did grow up very Christian, um Southern Baptist.
00:50:26
Speaker
um and like I wasn't technically allowed to listen to non-Christian music when I was a teenager, but of course that didn't fucking work. So like, you know, I, uh, yeah. Like one of my earliest memories of music is me wearing the fuck out of my dad's Leonard Skinner and second helping tape, uh, like in my Walkman, you know, just like listening to the ballad of Curtis Lowe over and over and over again. And like that whole record is still one of my probably top 15.
00:50:58
Speaker
Um, but that's the precision is so, it's just so otherworldly, dude. But yeah, like from there, you know, like I heard the Ramones at nine.
00:51:10
Speaker
um My older cousin's boyfriend at the time, like played me the Ramones, played me like minor threat and black flag. And yeah, like, ah you know, back in those days, obviously like pre-internet, you didn't, you didn't always like get to connect with it the way that you do, unless you're making like a tape off of, you know, a radio station that plays or whatever, but like, who the fuck was playing the Ramones in the nineties for the most part, like um the all rock station here, nine at an X. I think John, you and I have talked about this probably. yeah
00:51:43
Speaker
Yeah. Like they, they would play it here and there, but you know, like until, until the internet came around, like a lot of this shit was just lost to me. And then, Because this is in the 80s, right? and I mean, this is like 90.
00:51:57
Speaker
Yeah, like nine. I think I heard the Ramones for the first time when I was nine. So being like 92, 93. Yeah. yeah so this is like. Oh, yeah. Like, like mid, purely mid 90s. And like, you know, I'm, I'm very much on the like, Gen X millennial cusp because.
00:52:16
Speaker
Maybe just like geographically, we didn't have the internet like widely available. And like we didn't get my family didn't get our first computer till I was like, almost junior in high school.
00:52:28
Speaker
So like, you know, a lot of the shit that I was finding and like figuring out was just stuff that like, I don't know. It wasn't accessible. And, you know, I still, i miss the days of like reading liner notes and shit to find new bands.
00:52:44
Speaker
But when the, you know, when Napster and Kazaa and all that shit came around, it was rad because I could like buy a record and then, oh shit, I've never heard of seven of these bands. Find some shit by them.
00:52:58
Speaker
Yeah, no, I mean, that's that's a great answer.
Passion for Music and Clothing
00:53:00
Speaker
and and And it's funny how something that when you're growing up can feel so inconceivable, but then in the long run, it's it's so obvious, right? I mean, there are so many things that you're just not aware of as as like possible options when you're younger, that as you get older, it's like, oh, okay, I mean, that makes perfect sense.
00:53:17
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, for sure, for sure. And like some of the happiest times of my life were when I just like... you know, had a gig job that like, I didn't have to fucking care about. And then I drove three hours to play a show in in Alabama, you know, like that, that whole, like, I don't know, I've done a couple of US tours and a lot of likes, you know, regional stuff. And like, that shit is so synonymous with like selling vintage and doing what I do now that like, it's wild to me sometimes.
00:53:55
Speaker
Connor, i don't know how you're going to follow that up. Yeah, that's harro but no no, no, no, no. And I'm glad I'm glad for it. Like,
00:54:07
Speaker
it's kind of shitty, but like, I'm in, I mean, I'm inspired by my students.
The Internet's Role in Creativity
00:54:15
Speaker
I'm inspired by people I've met on the internet. and There are some really, really amazing photographers um and like dressers and what have you, creatives of all stripes that unfortunately like Meta has given us, has given us the ability to interact with all of these people.
00:54:39
Speaker
And that's like, that's like what inspired the show, you know, is like, just people just little stuff that people do is so nice like it's stupid the like uh use a bread tie for your cuff link you know what i mean oh yeah yeah it's fucking stupid i mean like stuff like that is good it's like anything else there's tons of good shit and tons of garbage but And like, I think net positively for me at at the age that I am and like doing what I do, the internet has been a net positive from the time that like I was finding like weirdos that, you know, like the same shit that I did on some, you know, some message board or whatever, when I was like 17 or the early like makeoutclub.com.
00:55:33
Speaker
shout out to anybody that remembers that shit um also the one of the founders is in two of my favorite or i guess the founder gibby is in two of my favorite bands of all time um but you know like like i found my people that way and i i hope that that's still kind of what people are finding like there's there's a lot of minutiae to wade through but you know Kind of what we're about and and what the program is about is connecting people that are rad and that may have some shit in common and that they find the good in people as a whole.
00:56:17
Speaker
Yeah. We just try to be a vector, you know? And like, I think we've connected a lot of people. Um, and that's really nice. Like that's something that I feel good about. Like I put Matt and I both put work into this and, that's the, that's the juice.
00:56:40
Speaker
Well, so I'm, um' I'm, I'm, uh, Annoyed isn't the right word, but I'm annoyed because I feel like all my questions from here on out are just going to be downhill. Oh, shit. I feel like we have leaked from here. and like i' Yo, man, I'm riding the wave right now, so let's go for it.
00:56:56
Speaker
No, I mean, no, those are those are great answers, and it's it's always interesting to to hear what motivates people, right, in in whatever their kind of passions are um in life. Yeah.
00:57:09
Speaker
Connor, you are a teacher in Baltimore. How old are the kids that you teach? First through third grade.
00:57:20
Speaker
what do they What do they think about your style? Like you. Well, they say stuff sometimes like... So I haven't said anything about this and i and I feel embarrassed to say something about this because it sounds like it's not true, but I swear to Christ this is a true story. Yeah.
00:57:39
Speaker
they were calling me i thought they were calling me mr coon mr coon yeah and i'm like what the fuck what does this even make sense this doesn't make any sense and so i'm walking up the stairs and this girl is walking down the stairs she's like probably in the fifth grade and she's like what's up mr cool and i'm like no way no way no way not me no dude because these kids are so fucking cool of course um i mean those you get complimented for your kicks constantly yeah they don't really roast me very much at all um like sometimes it's like dude why are you wearing shorts it's like because it's uh 80 degrees and
00:58:28
Speaker
um And there's no air conditioning in the school. And you're wearing shorts too, you little fuck.
00:58:37
Speaker
Just typical kid shit. Yeah, typical kid stuff. But I don't know. I mean, they're not a uniform school. ah And so I get to see everyone, like including like the paras and the other staff, like what everyone is wearing. Like...
00:58:57
Speaker
uh it's just it's nice it's just like a it's a it's a great community and like baltimore gets so much fucking shit all the time but it's like every school that i've worked in has just been like a dream really
00:59:14
Speaker
do you think you're um think you're gonna influence your kid's style at all in the long run well this this boy last year day on was always walking around He was like, check out my bow tie. And he's he's got like he's got like a clip on tie. And I'm dude, dude Like, okay. And he's like five.
00:59:38
Speaker
And I'm like, listen, no. This is a clip on tie. So I gave him a tie. ah a he liked that, but like he wanted something one day he fucked this little tie that he had up and it was like coming apart. And so I'm like super gluing it on like back onto the cardboard form, you know, and it's to go like got a zipper confusingly. I don't know why these things have a zipper on them now.
01:00:05
Speaker
um but I don't know to the extent that I can, I mean, I, I, I try to, And that's why I dress, part of why i dress the way that I do is because I feel like um I want to show the kids that I give a shit.
01:00:18
Speaker
And at least to a kid who's like five to eight, like they see a tie and they're like, yeah, that person is an adult. Right. And that's what it's about for me is like trying to look like an adult.
01:00:31
Speaker
Unless do any of us know that adults ah don't even look like what we thought adults looked like at that age. Right. sure no and it's a and i mean it's so bizarre like yeah i mean just seeing like a new class of kids coming in every year it's just like they really are so different how are the kids when you first meet them like does does it take some time for them to like get used to connor
01:01:02
Speaker
um i think that so many of them think that i just am an alien well they tell me they've never seen a person with red hair they think that i am light-skinned which like to an extent i am but not in that way um so like there's certainly not many people who look like me and like the The people who do come through the school, like ah the school board people, it's just like they're not.
01:01:38
Speaker
Their attire is not up to snuff.
01:01:42
Speaker
And these people are, of course, super duper overpaid. ah not necessarily overpaid, but like, you know, the the CEO, so-called CEO of the school system was just given a retroactive raise.
01:01:58
Speaker
Sick. Which like, yeah I mean, come on. the Getting is really, really good for everyone but the teachers.
01:02:08
Speaker
So I know you're big on, I'll call it street photography, and you you take a lot of pictures of of Baltimore and buildings around the city, but and And I don't know if you have ah an answer for this, but what's the favorite picture you've ever taken?
Love for Baltimore
01:02:23
Speaker
um I mean, I have this picture I took of this hardware store because the only reason that I'm taking the pictures is preservation.
01:02:35
Speaker
Because like there's this house at the end of my block that was like and annoying shade of red, but it was red. And like now they're fucking painting it gray.
01:02:46
Speaker
What? Yeah, dude. Come on. Yeah. Yeah. And so I'm like, I want to remember what this place looked like when I really loved it. Because as we know, you i mean, things change and things go away. And so like I took a picture of this building.
01:03:06
Speaker
It had amazing hand lettering. um It says Johnson's Hardware in ah oh different typefaces. That boy. They painted it over.
01:03:18
Speaker
Motherfuckers. They just completely painted it over and it's still vacant. So it's like, this was years. Yeah. yeah Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, I appreciate, I appreciate you recognizing my street photography sucks that it is.
01:03:33
Speaker
I just like, I don't know. I mean, I like ah to show people what's up in Baltimore. Like, cause it's really a great place. It's my seal of approval.
01:03:45
Speaker
Yeah, 100%. Like I played there a few times back at Charm City Art Space. Like, yeah, never a bad. Because that's a vent that's a venue that Matt and I perhaps have been in. in this We very well could have.
01:03:59
Speaker
um Yeah. But yeah, like ah just from hanging out with Conant here a couple years ago and and like my experiences ah playing there, 100% great city.
01:04:13
Speaker
Yeah, it's a working class town. i mean it's like It's way cooler than it gets credit for, which I think I will say the same about Atlanta. For sure, yeah. I mean, I thought i thought that, like, um I don't know. I guess what I'm always looking for is, like, ways that things are similar.
01:04:31
Speaker
um and I don't mean that in, like, a big-headed way. I just mean, like, like when I meet somebody, I want to try to figure out what do we have in common. Yeah, totally, totally. And so that's what I thought about Atlanta, just like all the stuff that i thought was similar to Baltimore. And then like, weirdly, I met like a couple of people who are from Baltimore, like actually from Baltimore, whereas as I'm just an imposter.
01:04:56
Speaker
And were talking about Atlanta and Baltimore how similar than they were. So i was like, we're really redeemed in this. Yeah, yeah. Agreed. on But they're, i mean, they're majority black cities on the East Coast.
01:05:09
Speaker
So Connor, you've been to Atlanta? yeah Yeah, he came down ah last year? ask you Yeah. yeah yeah yeah And my cousin is from Atlanta, too. like My cousin Austin grew up in Atlanta, and and so I went there um for the Atlanta Olympic Games when the bombing happened. Right, right. Yeah, the 96 Olympics, which are still, for the Youngs in vintage, still huge. If I find 96 Olympics yet, I sell it immediately.
01:05:36
Speaker
It doesn't matter what it is. It's so funny. It's like, I don't know. It's like, yeah, I guess in the, in the way, like, I think younger people are nostalgic for a time that they didn't live through the same way that I was with like, basically all the shit that I was into as a kid.
01:05:55
Speaker
Like i didn't grow up in the sixties or seventies or eight, you know, even really the eighties, like, i don't know. We want to. yeah That's an astute observation, I think. Yeah. Like we wanted what we couldn't, what what we didn't have, but what influenced what we had then.
01:06:13
Speaker
Yeah, no, exactly right. I mean, because when I was growing, when I was in middle school, quote unquote, growing up, like there you had Nirvana shit and Hot Topic. Yeah, yeah, totally. yeah we and I don't remember exactly how I was introduced to Nirvana, but, like, it was on the radio, and it was in the mall, and it was, like, in Rolling Stone, even.
01:06:34
Speaker
yeah. yeah So it was, like... I mean, one of the... There was nothing... There was no musical era, really, that existed then, aside from, like, bad emo.
01:06:46
Speaker
Dude. we can't we can't talk about emo i'm not there no dude no no no the bad ass okay yeah like uh hawthorne heights ah yeah fuck that shit you know what i mean because that's what was really ascendant in that time period right yeah sorry either listen to that or you could listen to whatever the fuck else you know which conveniently was nirvana Yeah, one of the like, or maybe the most expensive Nirvana t-shirt, the Heart Shaped Box t-shirt that i fucking think is ugly as hell.
01:07:19
Speaker
a Like that shit was sold at Media Play. Like it was sold at same good back in the day. And, you know, like dorks are paying fucking 12 grand or whatever the newest one has sold for.
01:07:32
Speaker
like thats that thing was made in the like tens, if not hundreds of millions. I don't even think these kids would understand what media play is. i doubt it, yeah. I'm not blowing people's mind when I meet them, like younger vintage people with like media play and and that kind of thing because they're like, oh what was it? Tower Records? like Tower Records? Yeah, like Turtles Records here in Atlanta.
01:07:58
Speaker
Yeah, there was just... Like nobody understands that that kind of concept. um Well, this is maybe this is maybe a little heady, but like that small record store kind of being pushed out of business by a corporation is yet another potential community that has been taken away from us.
01:08:21
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, there were many 90s movies I think made about this. Right. know Well, I mean, even just malls. Yeah, yeah. It's wild that they're a dying breed now. The one, like, 25 minutes from my hometown is still operational. I don't even know what the fuck is there anymore. There's a buckle, whatever that store seems to keep existing.
01:08:46
Speaker
and then, like, like every i right every ad on their sign is, like, for buckle or it's for one of the restaurants in the mall. And i'm like, yeah, times have changed.
01:08:59
Speaker
Yeah, it's bizarre. and I mean what like it's been proof think there may still be a hot topic there. I think there may still be a hot topic holding on. It's like they can't even be turned into apartments.
01:09:11
Speaker
I mean, they they could. No, they can't because the plumbing. I mean, yeah And so it becomes cost ineffective to do it.
01:09:22
Speaker
Well, you know that's saying that they could be it if cost was not was not the driving factor. Well, certainly, but if cost wasn't the driving factor, then we wouldn't have to retrofit malls into apartments anyway.
01:09:34
Speaker
I mean, yeah, yeah, you're preaching to the choir with this one, but I'm i'm just saying that like it's it's able to be done, we just don't have a government or any actual person willing to do it, sadly, because it's a great idea.
01:09:48
Speaker
Yeah, because some of the malls are so large. like They're huge. Like, built-in food court? Cool. Like, a few restaurants that can, you know, hand out food to people that that want to eat it? Like, great.
01:10:02
Speaker
Right. But it always makes you wonder, like, what what like what are kids these days doing? Dude, I have no fucking idea. yeah I don't even want to say this because it feels like slander against the kids, but, like, ah playing video games.
01:10:18
Speaker
Which is, I mean, fine. Like, I played video games growing up. Yeah. I mean, sometimes next it was at my friend's house. It's huge exclusion of everything there, playing video games. And I understand, like, because my students are, I mean, they're different than your, let's say, your average public school student.
01:10:34
Speaker
um But, like, they... What did you do this weekend? Uh, nothing. They, like, a lot of the time, I mean...
01:10:48
Speaker
they don't have the vocabulary to say like here's all the shit that i did right because they are reading below grade level and they are seven you know ah so it just is like i don't know sort of torturous i guess yeah i think my only experience with anyone young is like you know late high school early college like level because of what i do selling vintage and no idea what any what anything is cool and don't really care yeah and i don't want to know i saw this fucking article yesterday it was like here's what here's a generation z thinks is not cool about millennials and i was like
01:11:35
Speaker
Don't yeah yeah give one anota of a fuck. I'm going to open that one even. yeah yeah and like i think multi-generational community is super important.
01:11:46
Speaker
like i If anything, like I think the community aspect of of what I do and how I try to live is number one.
01:11:59
Speaker
but like i don't need to know what someone that 17 years old thinks seventeen years old thinks it's cool if they If they want to buy a cool fucking camo shirt, hell yeah. like Other than that, don't think of them at all and don't need to.
01:12:14
Speaker
Yeah. theyre i mean Aside from it being my job, it's like... And I'm only the i am only with young children. like They're not like giving me the middle finger necessarily, although they sometimes are.
01:12:28
Speaker
ah They're not always giving me the middle finger as you would expect, say, a 16-year-old to be doing.
01:12:37
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know, man. ah It'll be interesting to see. I've got ah nieces and nephews who are you know kind of in that college-age era, and talking to them, like, what do you guys do? but do you guys do What are you do doing with your lives, even, right? like And I think it gets harder with each day that goes by to kind of maintain that that active social life that was the way it used to be in terms of, you know, community spaces and stuff like that. Oh, for for sure.
01:13:03
Speaker
Oh, it's definitely harder, especially like any, you know, any metropolitan city. Like yeah those spaces are disappearing rapidly and it. Yeah.
01:13:15
Speaker
Right. But I mean, but we grew up with that, right? I mean, that was that was so like, I don't know. you never You never know what's going to happen. and it's ahcom andration I will say, like i don' I don't want to be an old man in the Elliot cloud type person.
01:13:29
Speaker
you know like I think the kids are going to be fucking cool. ah The young kids now. I think... I don't know. like With the... as For better or worse, the influx of being able to... like find your people or find your thing and just so how much shit you're exposed to, I think has gone up exponentially from like when any of us were coming up.
01:13:58
Speaker
And I can't see that other than a net positive. Yeah. I think the kids are all right, man. No, and I don't, I'm not saying they suck. Oh no, no, no, no.
Support for the Younger Generation
01:14:09
Speaker
I'm not, I'm not being combative at all, but like, I, yeah, I just, always want to like, I'm with them.
01:14:17
Speaker
Whatever they're doing, even though I don't understand it, I'm with them. Yeah, we are for the kids, but we are not preaching to the kids. Fuck no. As some of these other people are doing. i Dude, i'm I imagine our listener demographic is like maybe 32, 33. At the absolute lowest.
01:14:39
Speaker
Yeah, like like I'm talking median. I'm not talking the absolute lowest. I would say we're we're probably in the like early 30s, like 33 or so to 56 or something like that, you know, like demographic.
01:14:58
Speaker
I feel like we're we're we're definitely not reaching the kids and that's okay. Yes. yeah I will say, though, this entire conversation, the only thing in my mind is skibbity-toilet.
01:15:08
Speaker
Yeah, and fuck that. and i don't I don't even know what this is. I don't either. i mean but it's weird i like I don't want to know what this is. i see jokes about it online.
01:15:21
Speaker
Don't have a clue to ever look into what it is. it's like um It's just like a viral video. ially I just told you that I didn't want to know what this is. i know but thought But that's all that it is. I'm not explaining what it is. okay Thank you. yeah i yeah i mean we We grew up in the wild west of the internet though. right yeah was like Dude! were talking about this on Sunday. like You remember the G.I. Joe videos? oh like Early YouTube. ah Also the hamster dance, obviously.
01:15:50
Speaker
um Right. All that stuff. There's so fucking many funny... I mean, Homestar Runner... yeah Oh my God. Yeah. question yeah tra door i really like, as far as internet culture goes, i don't know if that's ever going to be defeated.
01:16:07
Speaker
I don't think it's possible. Hmm. I haven't seen Homestar Runner around recently, but it doesn't mean it wasn't the peak. Yeah, well, I mean, I would say... Look, maybe we're just thinking about the nostalgic old people here. No, no, no. The Onion is the peak of the internet.
01:16:25
Speaker
The Onion, the Vine... The Onion is the internet distilled. Like, they're doing clever satire all the time. That's great.
01:16:36
Speaker
Yeah, oh, it's still fantastic. And I'm not saying that that none of this is like... shifted the way that things have been but for a small moment in time that was peak internet and that will always be peak internet you heard it here first so i know we're we're hitting we're getting near a longer episode um but i want to put you guys both on the spot here oh great oh shit okay Connor, what's a question that you have for Matt? and man
01:17:11
Speaker
Oh, dear. dear. ah I feel like it feels like we're like cowboys ready to draw. was going ask first. How people?
01:17:22
Speaker
um ah ah
01:17:29
Speaker
Yours is going to be just as random as mine, buddy.
01:17:35
Speaker
And I don't know if I have an answer to mine, if that tells you anything.
01:17:41
Speaker
um
01:17:44
Speaker
How's the acid trip? I mean, are you interested in chewing more acid and after this experience? Yes. Sorry, that's kind of a throwaway question. that is a little – I'm honestly a little bummed, but sure.
01:17:59
Speaker
No, I'm saying like I don't want to ask you an intimate personal question on the fucking air. You know what i mean? and it's like we talk – people who know this about the show, it's like Matt and I talk basically every day anyway.
01:18:13
Speaker
So we've gotten through a lot of it, but okay I don't know. My question is... that your Your question can just be, hey, what's up? How you doing? My question is not that deep, but, ah dude, acid fucking rules.
01:18:28
Speaker
Yeah. This is my third time taking like a half tab, and it's like I smoke a lot of weed and love weed, and they interact with great together.
01:18:42
Speaker
But i was always terrified of acid because I knew people that did it way too often. And I had flashbacks and shit, and that never sounded good to me. But ah i like it more than Shrooms at this point.
01:18:57
Speaker
so Yeah. No, it's definitely more... I don't know. Total. it's an It's an... Yeah, like... music never sounds better. Like it's an interesting thing as someone that thinks a lot, like it's a nice way to not to be cliche, but I feel like to unlock parts of your brain that you can, you know, that you can use differently.
01:19:23
Speaker
And i don't I recorded some guitar, you know, demo Drax and shit the last time I tripped and it was garbage, but you know, like I can, I don't know.
01:19:35
Speaker
It's, it's fun.
01:19:38
Speaker
And yeah, if if you think a psychedelic trip could be for you, I would suggest trying it.
01:19:46
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's, i would back that up. Connor. yeah Do you remember the first song you ever slow danced to?
01:20:01
Speaker
No, I never slow danced with anyone. Wait, what? I would always ask them like to play songs that we can mosh to. i mean, I do the same thing. In middle school, we could take ah we could take CDs for like the DJ to maybe play, and then they never played any mosh yet after one time.
01:20:21
Speaker
Yeah, they were not very receptive to playing like System of a Down or whatever Nirvana, whatever shit I was trying to get them to play. they were not No Race Against the Machine?
01:20:32
Speaker
Yeah, no, they did not they did not want to have that one happening. Well, goddammit. Yeah, no. I wasn't, I mean, yeah. I fiercely avoid dancing.
01:20:44
Speaker
um even with even with like i'm I'm surprised to hear that, though. i mean like So is hip-hop more for you than about the wordplay? Yeah, I would say so. I mean, it's like, I like the music, but it's like, I'm not dancing all the time.
01:20:58
Speaker
You know, I don't think that that that that is a requirement of listening to music is dancing to it. But I feel like, i don't know, disconnected from it in a way, because like, I did play guitar and stuff like in bands.
01:21:11
Speaker
um But I don't know, it's like, I haven't done a lot of audio like production. I mean, of that
Music as Meditation
01:21:20
Speaker
sort. like I haven't made any beats.
01:21:25
Speaker
I constantly try to get Connor to listen to guitar rock again. And sometimes he's receptive, sometimes that. Yeah, I do. I do sometimes. It's just as like... I don't know. It is weirdly...
01:21:40
Speaker
I like... like i like music with words of that tempo, I guess, because it sort of turns my brain off. Like I can't think about other shit.
01:21:53
Speaker
I'm just like thinking about the words, you know, and that's like a sort of meditation, I guess.
01:22:02
Speaker
Which is like mostly about selling drugs. All right. One last question for you guys.
What to Save in a Fire?
01:22:12
Speaker
All right. whenon land um as i say that this is not the most uplifting question hypothetically your house is on fire what's the one thing you're saving oh jesus christ and it's so scary i've been thinking about this like a but like a few blocks away like eight houses just burned down oh shit yeah just because like i don't even know what the fuck like someone left something on you know what i mean uh i gotta get my grandmother's uh
01:22:42
Speaker
vagina, vaginal Georgia O'Keeffe art. I got to grab that thing. no question. I mean, it's like, it's like in my living room. It's like a big, like, she calls it the sea critter.
01:22:56
Speaker
But it's like a commentary on like upskirt photography. Like when Britney Spears had that upskirt, like she made this almost this piece almost immediately after I guess it's like three by five.
01:23:10
Speaker
So it's very big, but that's what i would that's definitely what I would take out of my hands. That sounds amazing. I'd love to see a picture of it sometime. Yeah, dude, we'll post it. It's so good. She's awesome. and she's like you know As we said the top of the episode, she's like trying to get out.
01:23:29
Speaker
Yeah. out yeah We're not talking pets or any anything deep. um So... probably the first thing I'm grabbing is my guitar.
01:23:42
Speaker
It's not special. Hell yeah. Yeah. No. Hell yeah. It's a 2023, uh, Squire Jazzmaster that I fucking adore.
01:23:52
Speaker
Her name is Loretta. Uh, and yeah, it's, it's my favorite guitar I've ever owned. Um, I've put probably 10 years of wear on it and little under three years, sorry, 2022, 2023.
01:24:08
Speaker
but yeah al outside of my cats that's the first thing I'm driving
01:24:15
Speaker
awesome ah well guys I want to say thanks again for having me on a third time and to to interview you guys real pleasure it's always fun hanging out with you guys and shooting the shit yeah which we do have never done in real life but like this is so good i think this is like a nice way to spend the night so Yeah, agreed.
Interview Reflections
01:24:38
Speaker
Agreed. John, thank you so much, man. We really appreciate it.
01:24:42
Speaker
And yeah, acid trip aside, this has been super fucking enjoyable. Well, when you come up with really good questions, I think like... Totally. to To follow us, I mean, God.
01:25:00
Speaker
But I think truly, like, it's been like... What what i' what I was almost... What I almost thought that I wouldn't get out was when we first pitched this to you and you said you could do it like a deposition.
01:25:13
Speaker
i I thought that that was just like, I was a little scared. Like I didn't, I didn't know we were getting into. And given the additions of me, that would have been terrifying. Oh, God.
01:25:27
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. right Right. Right. Right. Because John is a successful professional. is. And so, you know, who knows? He's much more professional than either of us derelicts.
01:25:39
Speaker
so Yeah. John has actually worn a tie to a business. I've also worn a tie to business. I don't know if you government a serious endeavor these days. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You may be right. And that's a topic for another day.
01:25:56
Speaker
But yeah, dude, thank you so much. It's been super fun. And for sure, guys, hopefully everyone enjoys this little glimpse into mine and Connor's fucking inner working life.
01:26:11
Speaker
Yeah. Matt has basically said it for me every single time. So i so i I mean, I rest my case with that. I mean, I'm like really happy with the way that the this is gone. Yeah. Only half of that is the acid trip.
01:26:27
Speaker
Right.
Conclusion and Contact Information
01:26:29
Speaker
Anyway, everyone, thank you for listening. ah If you've got questions, comments, concerns, shoot us an email. ApocalypseDuds at gmail.com.
01:26:40
Speaker
We are at ApocalypseDuds on Instagram. And I am Matt Smith at RebelsRogues. And I'm conor flower Connor at Connor Flower.
01:26:52
Speaker
And we have been lovingly interviewed today by John Loafers at Leisurely Loafing and of at WeJohnsJawNZ fame.
01:27:09
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, yeah. And this has been... loving that's exceed exactly right lovingly interviewed so thank you matt for fucking coining every phrase and having every answer anyway we will see you next week yes sleep tight