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041 - It's Okay Not to Know: Embracing Vulnerability, Growth, and Self-Compassion with Brenda Do
14 Plays17 days ago
In this heartfelt episode of Vulnerability Muscle, host Reggie D. Ford sits down with Brenda Do, a seasoned copywriter turned children's book author, to explore the power of vulnerability, self-compassion, and the journey of embracing our true selves. Growing up as a Chinese girl in 1970s America, Brenda rarely saw characters who looked like her in books, making her feel unseen and unworthy. This experience planted a deep seed of self-doubt—one she later sought to uproot through storytelling.
Now, as the author of It’s Okay Not to Know, Brenda crafts inclusive narratives that help children—and adults—unlearn limiting beliefs and embrace the beauty of curiosity, mistakes, and self-acceptance. She and Reggie dive into conversations about cultural conditioning, overcoming subconscious barriers, and why self-love is the key to unlocking a more fulfilling life.
Throughout the episode, Brenda shares insights on the societal narratives that hold us back, the impact of childhood messages on our self-worth, and how shifting our mindset can transform not just our personal lives but also our professional and creative endeavors. Whether you’re a parent, an educator, or someone on a journey of self-discovery, this episode will inspire you to embrace uncertainty, rewrite your inner dialogue, and recognize that you are enough—just as you are.
Contact Info:
https://www.brendado.com/
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Transcript
Parental Expectations and Pressure
00:00:00
Speaker
No wonder kids are so hard on themselves. It's because we don't, you know, we only put like the A paper paper on the refrigerator. We don't put the C paper up there. We don't ask them i during dinner, ooh, honey, what did you fail at today?
00:00:14
Speaker
And really think that was a good thing. Instead, we ask, well, what did you do well today? How'd you do that sports? How did you do this? Did you get the blue ribbon? It's always achieve, achieve, achieve. So we recognize and we award achievements rather than effort.
Introduction to Vulnerability Muscle Podcast
00:00:30
Speaker
Welcome to Vulnerability Muscle, the inspiring podcast challenging norms and helping you redefine vulnerability as a strength. I'm your host, Reggie D. Ford. Each episode of Vulnerability Muscle dives into a variety of topics such as mental health, social issues, and mindset shifts.
00:00:48
Speaker
We explore the power of vulnerability and fostering meaningful connections. healing, building resilience, and promoting personal growth. Sometimes these conversations are uncomfortable, but good workouts often are.
00:01:03
Speaker
So join us and flex that vulnerability muscle. Welcome to this episode of Vulnerability Muscle.
Brenda Doe's Journey to Inclusive Children's Books
00:01:09
Speaker
I'm your host, Reggie D. Ford. And today i have an amazing guest.
00:01:14
Speaker
This is Brenda Doe. As a Chinese girl growing up in the 1970s, Brenda noticed that none of the books at school and in her library featured characters who looked like her.
00:01:25
Speaker
Even at that young age, the lack of diversity made her feel excluded. Even worse, it planted a seed that she wasn't as good as the kids pictured in the book.
00:01:37
Speaker
So when writing her inaugural children's book, it's okay not to know. Brenda intentionally created and created inclusive characters that all children can relate to.
00:01:48
Speaker
The story features whimsical characters untethered from race, gender, socioeconomic status, and physical ability. As a seasoned copywriter, Brenda expertly distills complex social emotional learning themes into accessible narratives.
00:02:02
Speaker
You know how adults often look back at their younger selves and think, if I only knew then what I know now. I wrote this book to offer some of that knowledge.
00:02:13
Speaker
So our young ones... can get a head start at living their best lives, Brenda says. ah I love this. And with no further ado, Brenda Doe, how are you doing?
00:02:25
Speaker
Yeah, that could be a rhyme. No further ado, Brenda Doe. And thanks for saying my name correctly, too. I'm doing awesome, Lee Banks. Well, I'm glad I got it right. I usually try to check, but I felt confident in that. So I'm glad. But I'm excited to have this conversation with you. Thank you.
00:02:44
Speaker
Thank you for having me on the show. yeah I've listened to so many of your podcasts and I'm just thinking it's so real. The world needs more of that. Thank you. And and we're going to keep providing more of it. And I know that we're going to get some real from you and I appreciate you.
Adopting an Abundant Mindset
00:03:01
Speaker
i want to ask just, just the question I've been asking today is, is how's your heart? Ooh, that's a good one My heart is, my heart is full. It's full and it can take on more. Yes.
00:03:15
Speaker
Yeah, I always, I set my energy in the morning and I talk to my, I call it my upstairs team. And anytime good things happen throughout the day and what I wish for, what to create throughout the day, I always say, okay, ooh, I like this.
00:03:29
Speaker
More please. ah So my heart can always expand for more love, more happiness, more everything. Oh, I love that. And I love that you have some capacity for more. That that is good. Like bring all the abundance to you and and to others and to everyone that we encounter on our day. I ah hope that they feel somewhat of some of that same feeling in their heart because we need it.
00:03:54
Speaker
we We all need it. And I like you're talking about bringing it on to others as well, because the way I look at it is the more I have, the more I have to share. And it's all about uplifting everyone else, you know, as as well as yourself, right?
00:04:08
Speaker
yeah I always believe you come first, because as you know, you can't get what you don't have. And then so i was just like, it's like, um it could be Anything.
Redefining Money and Beliefs
00:04:19
Speaker
It could be happiness. It could be experiences. It could be money, anything.
00:04:24
Speaker
cause And I always tell the universe, I love money and I look good in a lot of money. and So I am not shy about it. I was like, I can take more, more please. Yes.
00:04:36
Speaker
Yeah. I love that. I love that abundant mindset. Right. And, and like in, even in that example of it, it's about like what you you have a lot, but you also can give a lot. And I think when you look at it from that perspective, we, we, this is, we, we take the association that money is evil or money is, is the root of evil. And you, you realize that it is a tool that can be used for a lot of good too. So I love that.
00:05:01
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And you know, the the thing is all of those well-meaning stories that we were told and those beliefs, Good people are poor. Money is a root of all evil.
00:05:12
Speaker
Money doesn't grow on trees. Well, technically it does because it was paper back in the day, you know, and you look at all those, what it's telling us subconsciously is money is bad and people with money are bad. So therefore, if you want to be a good person, you should stay down there. should stay poor.
00:05:30
Speaker
And then people grow up wondering in life why they can't seem to get ahead. And when they do get ahead, they might lose it, you know, or something happens, right? There's something like the shoe always, the other shoe always drops and all that kind of stuff.
00:05:43
Speaker
And that's all from subconscious beliefs. Yes. Right. And you are so good at knowing what subconscious beliefs are running your show. Who is talking to little Reggie inside and saying, oh no, but little Reggie is trying to keep big Reggie safe.
00:05:57
Speaker
But you're like, no, no, no, this isn't what we want a new anymore, right? We need to parent ourselves to get through
Vulnerability as Strength
00:06:03
Speaker
that. yeah And that's but very similar to what my book does too. It's to teach the little kids those little beliefs that well-meaning adults kind of screw them up with.
00:06:14
Speaker
you know Yes, yes. Oh, I want to get into that. But let first first, let's hop into a segment called What Comes to Mind. Okay. All right. So first thing that you can think of, there's no right or wrong answer. It can be as long as you want.
00:06:28
Speaker
But what comes to mind when you hear the word vulnerability?
00:06:33
Speaker
Strength.
00:06:36
Speaker
Yeah, because people think being vulnerable and crying is a weakness because we're taught that. To me, to be able to truly express yourself, to feel heard, to really show where the hurt is, that takes ah heck a lot of strength.
00:06:54
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I think that was the, the, what I realized when coming up with this podcast and the name, it was like, I've, I jumped into this, this matrix of vulnerability and I was having a conversation with a friend and I was like, you know, the more that I exercise my vulnerability muscle, the stronger I feel, the more liberated I feel. And it was just like,
00:07:18
Speaker
vulnerability muscle and and like it is it's liberating when you can drop the shame and the shackles of those narratives that little reggie little brenda got told and start to reclaim that story and so i love that strength oh good thank you especially as ethnic people too sorry yes yeah you know i mean because I grew up thinking, um was told, you don't cry, you don't speak up, you don't say anything, you're supposed to be just a little robot, a good little robot, and that's it.
00:07:50
Speaker
And it was bad enough for that the women couldn't show anything, the men were expected to be even more stoic. Yeah. Wow. Wow. Wow. I, I, I'm working on a talk right now. And one of the lines that I remember hearing growing up was, um, stop crying before I give you something to cry about.
00:08:09
Speaker
Oh yeah. Totally invalidating the emotional experience that I'm feeling that led me to crying and then saying, I'm going to give you something physical punishment to cry about and how that message gets ingrained in many of our young people ah that their emotions don't matter.
00:08:29
Speaker
and that they're not a reason to express what comes out naturally for humans. And so just reprogramming all of that, unlearning all of that is huge. So thank you for that.
00:08:42
Speaker
What do you do to center yourself when you're feeling stressed or maybe depressed?
Finding Solace in Nature
00:08:46
Speaker
Oh, I go out in the woods. So I live in the Seattle, greater Seattle area. So it's very green and mossy and rainy here.
00:08:54
Speaker
So we got a lot of woods and a lot of water. And what the Best thing for me to ground myself is to get outside, be in nature and move my body.
00:09:06
Speaker
It just really helps you just calm and the heck down. And then you start figuring out it's not all that serious. Yeah. Yeah. It simplifies life. Oh, I love it. I love it. Nature is the best.
00:09:21
Speaker
And then lastly, what is a favorite childhood memory of yours?
00:09:26
Speaker
My favorite childhood memory, i think I was maybe four or five years old and I got a big old stuffed Pooh Bear. Winnie the Pooh Bear.
00:09:38
Speaker
And this was back in the day where my family didn't have much money. So Christmas was pretty much, oh, you got a pair of socks. you know It was very practical. And it was the one time I actually got a toy.
00:09:50
Speaker
And that Pooh Bear was my best friend for probably 30 years. And I'm in my 50s now. I still have him. so Wow. He's body bagged and up in a closet.
00:10:02
Speaker
That's special. Yeah. So yeah yeah, he's still my best friend. i can never toss him. That is super special. Oh man. I love that. Well, ah if do you have pictures of him?
00:10:15
Speaker
Yeah, i do. But he's kind of scary because he was a 1970s Pooh Bear. So they made stuffed day animals a little different back then. Yeah. Oh, that's so funny. I would love to see.
00:10:27
Speaker
I would love to see them. I think that'd be really cool just to see the difference and in and what it
Cultural Upbringing and Family Stories
00:10:33
Speaker
represented for you. That's really nice. Do you know the like the history of of Winnie the Pooh and all the characters and how they were created to highlight neurodivergence? Is that true? or like Do you know anything about that?
00:10:46
Speaker
Oh, I didn't know about the neurodivergence part. I think if I'm not mistaken, and somebody please correct me if I am, but I want to say like each of the characters represented, like I think maybe Tigger is like ADHD and then you have ah depression and is it Eeyore?
00:11:04
Speaker
ah You know, like so all of the different characters had some type of neurodivergence that they were highlighting. And it was like one of those times early on that it was celebrated in that way.
00:11:14
Speaker
so Oh, yeah. That one I haven't heard yet. I know that it was A.A. Milne's, the author's creations. They were, well, actually, no, that's not true. Yeah, they were creations for his son.
00:11:28
Speaker
However, I don't know if they were personal aspects of himself. um He definitely, he mentioned that he created some of the characters ah based on the people he saw around him, you know, in the village that he lived in.
00:11:43
Speaker
So, you know, the rabbits. ah who who is always Mr. Nosy telling everybody what to do. You know the owl who thinks he knows everything. Cause everyone knows someone like that. Yeah. definite I'm curious about your, your village when you were growing up, your community, your folks, who, who was around and what, what shaped you, who shaped you early on?
00:12:06
Speaker
You know, we grew up, so I, there were five kids in my family. And so we and my parents were immigrants. So English is my second language.
00:12:17
Speaker
And then so we grew up basically within ourselves because we were the only chocolate chip in the cookie in our neighborhood. And so it was not safe to be out.
00:12:29
Speaker
ah Wow. Yeah, we were not welcomed. Even at school, we weren't welcomed. And this was in the Washington, in the Seattle area. Oh, sorry. This was in California. This was back in the seventies. Um, back then they didn't have English as a second language.
00:12:43
Speaker
So I was all excited to go to school with my little Holly hoppy lunch pail. And I didn't realize that, uh, I wasn't speaking the same language until I went to school and went, what's going on. I don't get it.
00:12:56
Speaker
Right. Wow. Yeah. And then, so when, uh, The teachers were so upset with us back then since they didn't have ESL training. I remember the principal coming to my mom's house and saying to her, your kids can't be in our school until they learn English.
00:13:14
Speaker
So they are no longer welcomed here. So the way we figured it out was watching Sesame Street and Electric Company. And I was all counting with, ah you know, Muppets trying to figure out what's going on.
00:13:30
Speaker
And then we popped ourselves back in school. So because of that environment, we weren't very welcomed anywhere outside of the house. My tribe was our family. It were our immediate cousins who lived nearby and also my parents and my siblings.
00:13:46
Speaker
And that was so it quite insular if you think about it. ah So I didn't have much knowledge of the world outside of that for a long time. Wow. Wow. That that is such a challenge for a young person, probably not truly understanding everything that's going on and and being told you can or can't and being liked or not liked. And that that must be extremely difficult.
00:14:09
Speaker
ah what brought What brought your parents over and and what was that journey like for them if you had conversations with them? I'm curious. and What brought them over was just more opportunity.
00:14:20
Speaker
you know It was during the time when they knew China before it became communist. They escaped it. you know and Then in the 60s, I think my dad came in here in the
00:14:33
Speaker
in the late 40s, no, early 50s, around there, in the mid-50s. And then my mom came here in the 60s. And then so during that time, they were just thinking, okay, we want to start a family. We want to have somebody start it in the U.S. We don't understand totally what's available, but we'll make it work because it's better than what we have now back in the home country.
00:14:52
Speaker
So like most immigrant stories, it's we sacrifice this generation so the next generation can keep moving on up. and then up and up and up. So when I hear the stories of what they went through, especially with the wars and everything else,
00:15:08
Speaker
I mean, we have a really pansy soft life. Yeah. When I get stressed out at work, I got deadlines or something's exploding, whatever it happens to be. I got to sit back and go, am I eating?
00:15:22
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I have a roof over my head. Do I have health? So there's no real emergency here. That definitely puts things in perspective. Mm-hmm. Oh my goodness. Wow. Well, but I'm glad they came and I'm glad that you're here.
00:15:37
Speaker
ah But you know, in in the environment that we're in, there's a lot of misconceptions about immigrations or immigrants. And what would you say to dispel some of those myths? I mean, you've already hinted at a couple of them, but like, what would you say to somebody who has some some feelings about immigrants in a negative way?
00:15:58
Speaker
think like what comes to mind is what we hear in the news now. um you know, the biggest thing is they steal our jobs. Well, depending on the immigrant and depending on what's available and how they came into this country, they're not stealing their jobs. They're doing the jobs that most people don't want.
00:16:16
Speaker
And definitely for the pay um that most people think that is too low for what they do. So they're doing your harder jobs, working longer hours for less pay.
00:16:29
Speaker
So really, if anything else, they're being and taken advantage of. Now you can argue, well, they shouldn't be here anyway. They don't have a choice. I was like, well, there's a lot to go around that with as well.
00:16:40
Speaker
yeah As far as explaining why they should be here, how it does help our economy, because there are lots of studies to talk about that. One thing about immigrants is they come here.
00:16:51
Speaker
i can't speak for all, but like for my family, they came here because they wanted to continue the family line at a higher level. with more opportunities, more education, more money, more bigger families, whatever it happens to be. they're not They weren't asking for us to be president of the US.
00:17:10
Speaker
They just wanted us to have a happy, healthy life and not struggle so much. So they came in here legally. you know They worked their butts off. um They did blue collar their entire lives, working 20 hours a day, six days a week.
00:17:26
Speaker
So if anybody says that they're lazy and they steal and all that kind of stuff, they really don't know their facts. Yeah, definitely, definitely. And I know through throughout different periods of history, different types of immigrants and different ethnic backgrounds were targeted for different reasons. And and you know there was anti-Chinese, there's anti-Irish, there's anti there are all these different periods where ah there is ah a huge push against a certain group of immigrants.
00:17:55
Speaker
ah Was that prevalent in the 70s? Not the anti-Chinese part. However, I was young enough to meet people who were Irish and worked in the camps, the railroad camps, along with the Chinese.
00:18:10
Speaker
I heard some disturbing stories because of the violence, the racism and everything. And here I am, like four years old, not quite getting it, but being freaked out. Wow.
00:18:21
Speaker
Yeah.
Understanding Fear and Promoting Love
00:18:22
Speaker
but ah And I understand how, you know, because usually what creates any type of hatred is fear. Because if you don't understand something, you're going to instantly go, oh, well, it's scary.
00:18:38
Speaker
Maybe it's a threat. So I'm going to push it away no matter what. And, you know, when you start joining the bandwagon and not thinking for yourself, then you start, it can actually start escalating becoming violent.
00:18:50
Speaker
And, oh gosh, have you watched that movie that's recent? It's called um The Wild Robot. I have not, no. Have you heard of it? so i haven't. Tell me about it. oh it's out. I think it's still in the theaters now, but it's streaming.
00:19:05
Speaker
So it's available streaming. Okay. The wild robot talks to what's happening now in this, and you know, with all of the political stuff happening all over the world though.
00:19:15
Speaker
And unfortunately it's an age old story since humanity walked the earth. Right? So what it talks about is You have a situation where you've got a new community. Something is new within it.
00:19:28
Speaker
They don't understand it. They automatically fear it. They deem it a monster. They give it derogatory names. They teach their young to hate it and to be fearful of it.
00:19:38
Speaker
And the entire time that new entity, which was the robot, is just trying to help and trying to show love. And then so the whole message is when everyone comes together through love,
00:19:52
Speaker
through understanding, they're all stronger together. And they're meant to work together, not to work apart. So ah the message is definitely one of those where it Unfortunately, probably needs to be repeated until humans stop walking the earth. but It's one of those where it's so beautiful and it's so simple and it's so true.
00:20:15
Speaker
It all comes down to love. Yeah, fit done you have love. You open your hearts and you're willing to listen when you have love. There are no wars when you have love because you can't love and hate at the same time.
00:20:27
Speaker
So true. yeah So true. Oh, I love it. I love it. I love it. I say, so it's funny. This was probably 10 years ago, but Facebook used to do like your most used word in your posts or comments and all that. And they like went through all the information you put on there.
00:20:45
Speaker
And for me, the, they did the word scramble and my biggest word was love. And I thought that was very telling of just the, the value that that is in my life and how,
00:20:57
Speaker
I think it is the strongest force. us I think it it can to help overcome so many evils that we see. And I think more importantly, we we have to find that love for self.
00:21:11
Speaker
And that's why I talked about it in ted TEDx. I think there's so much noise that make us not love ourselves just as we are. That is a part of society and culture and normalized life.
00:21:23
Speaker
that if we got to a place of really loving ourselves, then we have more space. We have more room for other people so that that love can can shine. so Oh, exactly.
00:21:33
Speaker
you know And that's where the book goes too, because it's all about self-compassion, self-love. And once you learn to use that to overcome obstacles, then you have the compassion to love others and to help them along.
00:21:46
Speaker
So you're so true. It all starts with the self, right? And when it comes to self-love, Unfortunately, most of the messages that again, well-meaning adults don't know because it just keeps getting passed down thinking this is what you're supposed to do.
Instilling Self-Worth in Children
00:22:00
Speaker
That thankfully we're starting to open up and realize, yeah, maybe not so much. yeah So what a lot of kids unfortunately are learning to at very young ages are I'm not enough.
00:22:14
Speaker
I'm not smart enough, fat enough, skinny enough, you know, good enough for me, white enough. You know, that was the message that I got growing up. Yeah. Yeah. And so you talked about the book, like, like go back. So bring us back. Had you written, I mean, you're, you're a copywriter, but what was your writing experience prior to writing the book?
00:22:33
Speaker
And then what was the ultimate inspiration for bringing it to life? Well, my experience writing is completely opposite of the book. I write business to business content, mostly for tech.
00:22:47
Speaker
I write thought leadership articles and things like that for CEOs and forth. basically you, cause as a copywriter, you're in the background. So someone else will, look cause it kind of goes writing for others so sometimes.
00:22:59
Speaker
And in some, basically i um, spend my day acting and sounding like a, uh, 50 year old white man. and Wow.
00:23:11
Speaker
Yeah. So then, you know, yeah I have to go completely opposite to write a children's book, right? And this is my first children's book. So what inspired it is years ago, i was visiting my little nephew and niece at their parents' house.
00:23:28
Speaker
And we were just finishing dinner and my nephew was helping us put away the leftovers. So he was holding a little plastic container with full of food and and the lid wasn't on tightly enough.
00:23:40
Speaker
So then he accidentally dropped it. And it was a hot mess. I mean, there was food all over the counters, the floor, the you know the cabinet walls. I'm like, ah ah I'm seeing it And then the sad thing was,
00:23:53
Speaker
His first reaction was, oh man, I'm so stupid. um Yeah, I know. and it just broke my heart because it's not like his parents yell at him and call him stupid when he makes a mistake.
00:24:06
Speaker
And then I thought, why was he so hard on himself? Instead of sitting back and going, oops, you know, and helping clean it. Instead, he just took it as a personal proof that he wasn't worthy of something.
00:24:18
Speaker
Wow. And then so the copywriter in me, now as a copywriter, We analyze social, you know, our behavior. um We analyze cognitive behavior, basically. yeah So I spend my time staring at people. i'm i'm that quiet person, basically. like that You can put a lampshade over my head in a party.
00:24:39
Speaker
And I'm all listening to everyone's conversation, trying to figure out. Why did he say that? makes them think that? I wonder what but happened in their life to make them act that way. I'm always analyzing because that's how we can help write in a way that's more engaging is by understanding the audience.
00:24:57
Speaker
And then so the copywriter in me kicks in. And I'm thinking, what caused him to be this way? And then I started going down this rabbit hole of research. And I don't know if you're familiar with Carol Dweck's work.
00:25:10
Speaker
She's the one that. Grit? ah and No, she's the one that created the whole growth mindset. And she's a Stanford psychologist. yeah She did all these studies with kids. They were amazing studies.
00:25:22
Speaker
And then so I started looking at her work, started looking at this and that. I started thinking back at the messages I receive and I hear commonly. And I realized, no wonder kids are so hard on themselves. It's because we don't you know we only put like the A paper on the refrigerator.
00:25:38
Speaker
We don't put the C paper up there. We don't ask them i during dinner, oh, honey, what did you fail at today? And really think that was a good thing. Instead, we ask, well, what did you do well today? How did you do that sports? How did you do this? Did you get the blue ribbon?
00:25:54
Speaker
It's always achieve, achieve, achieve. So we recognize and we award achievements rather than effort. And when I say about, you know, what did you fail at today? We don't ask people to ask kids to push themselves and stumble and explore the stumble.
00:26:12
Speaker
Yeah. And reward them for, oh, you went out of your comfort zone. Good on you. Yes. What did you learn from that? How can you, you know, pick yourself up and then keep stumbling later? You know, because you keep expanding when you do that.
00:26:25
Speaker
It's just like your TEDx talk, right? When you really win inside and you let yourself go. you actually became more expansive, more powerful version of yourself. You're able to have the confidence to start a podcast, do another presentation, all that kind of stuff to share your gifts and to also learn what gifts you have.
00:26:43
Speaker
Now, as kids, if we keep judging ourselves thinking, oh, well, if I'm not, if I don't get an a that means I'm not lovable. Or mom your know mom and dad's not going to think I'm good if I don't get good enough as a kid or as a person, right? If I don't get um you know, like, let's say an award, you know, on the spelling bee.
00:27:05
Speaker
So if you look at that, then what happens is they grow up kind of staying in their own lane and their world gets smaller and smaller because they stay in what they can do well and do safely.
00:27:17
Speaker
yeah And my observation is it's even more prevalent amongst girls than it is for boys, because when boys fall off the jungle gym and they do something, they hurt themselves, they Unfortunately, there's a lot of bias usually where they say, oh, hey, that's okay. You tried. Go ahead, pick yourself up and keep going.
00:27:36
Speaker
Or boys will be boys, which I really don't like that phrase. Yeah. For a lot of reasons. so um But girls, usually there's less forgiveness when they make a mistake.
00:27:48
Speaker
So they tend to really shrink their worlds early on. And then when ah they grow up, here they are supposed to go up to work and they're supposed to show their best selves, but they have all of this inner judgment and all these inner limitations going on in their subconscious.
00:28:04
Speaker
And then, so, you know, like right now I'm in, you know, the, the um Pacific Northwest where there's a lot of high tech and the whole concept, I mean, the whole, know,
00:28:17
Speaker
Attitude around here is fail fast and fail forward. Yeah. yeah
Failing Fast and Psychological Safety
00:28:20
Speaker
Right. And you can't fail fast if you don't really truly bring your whole self. Right. Because don't feel safe to fail fast because you feel you can get judged. You're going to get fired. You're going to get whatever for it.
00:28:30
Speaker
And then so when you have kids growing up that way. they're limiting themselves as adults before they have a chance to really show their true gifts in the world and live their best lives.
00:28:44
Speaker
And I see that and I'm going, that's how I was. And it took years for me to get through that. And I'm still a work in progress because we're ever expanding. Right. And I just thought if I had started off way back in the day,
00:28:58
Speaker
without those limitations, how much better could my life be? How much more rewarding can I make those around me, you know, to to know me and how can I help them and all that kind of stuff. I mean, it's a ripple out type of situation, right? Oh, that that is so huge. And and like the the amount of shame that is carried through through decades of our lives that we internalize and then become a part of our personalities and, and who people know us as it's like, people know us as a version of ourselves who doesn't really like ourselves.
00:29:32
Speaker
And that shows up in so many different areas of life. But I thought it was, it was a couple of things that you mentioned were very interesting. But I wanted to tap into some of the the research that I've been doing on vulnerability, especially in the workplace. And And like finding ah Google's Project Aristotle, which is a study done to figure out what made the most effective teams, the most successful teams that enjoyed working together that produced great output.
00:29:59
Speaker
And they they researched over 180 of their teams, 50,000 plus people surveyed in this and over 100 different elements that they looked at.
00:30:12
Speaker
And the number one most critical factor that they found amongst all of that, can you guess? Vulnerability. Vulnerability, yes. yes so Being able to be vulnerable and take risks without the fear of repercussions.
00:30:28
Speaker
um Like that that in itself of having that space to to mess up, to be messy, to fail, fail fast and recover from that without losing your job, without being berated, without being ridiculed.
00:30:43
Speaker
And, and know that that is a part of the innovation process. That is a part of success is failing. And, and I thought that that was just so interesting and something that,
00:30:54
Speaker
other people in other areas of life ought to embrace. And so i just, I thought that was fantastic, but I want to get back to something. Oh, do you have a comment there? Oh, well, you know, I was thinking, okay, so we talk about failing, right? And we're talking about failing fast and feeling safe enough to do so.
00:31:11
Speaker
It's also, I think when it comes to failing, it's also knowing that, oh my gosh, I've just lost my train thought. You'll find it. I was like, what was that? There was some serious point about, oh well, I'll get back to it.
00:31:28
Speaker
When you said train of thought, it made me think of a Inside Out, which is a fantastic movie oh if you haven't seen it. But there are all these different ah metaphors and things. And there's a train running through the little girl's brain. And it's the train of thought.
00:31:43
Speaker
There's like the sarcasm. It's big, it's hilarious. So there's a lot of good things like that in there, but if it comes back to you, please feel free to to ah chime in. Oh, I remember what it is now. Sorry.
00:31:57
Speaker
Yeah. Okay. I think part of being vulnerable. is being able to admit fault. Yes. Right. Because, mean, we've all most likely met people, grown adults, who you try to just offer a suggestion or say something, no matter how gently you do it, and they instantly back up and bristle. like, you can't tell me what to do. I knew that already. I'm going to shut you down.
00:32:24
Speaker
To me, that's the little girl going, or the little boy going, Oh, I can't be wrong because that means I'm not lovable. And that goes all the way back to that message that we learned as a little kids.
00:32:36
Speaker
You cannot fail. You're not enough. You're not enough. You have to be perfect. And we don't come out of the womb perfect. None of us are. yeah And then so so that's where that vulnerability, where i love a proper leader, you know the difference between leaders and managers, leaders inspire.
00:32:53
Speaker
And a proper leader would say, messed up. Or yeah the idea that we thought was going to work. Hmm. No, it's not working. So let's go ahead and change tracks. I'm learning from it. You're learning from it. How can we learn together?
00:33:06
Speaker
That's vulnerability as well. Absolutely. and To have the humility to say that, right. We, we need that. And, and I think that ego and that, that part that's hurt, that, that little boy, a little girl who's hurt inside of them is, is that ego and it's stopping them from being humble and being vulnerable.
00:33:25
Speaker
But that is what helps us grow. And that's what builds trust. That's what helps us connect with other people. But if you know it all, or if you have all the answers are never wrong, never sorry, never, then that's, that's not human.
00:33:40
Speaker
And that's hard to connect with. so And I love that. That's the title, like your book. It's okay not to know that, that like, that's such a great title. Like what, where, Who are you? Who?
00:33:51
Speaker
I know you were talking about your your was it your nephw your cousin, your nephw my nephew, your nephew and in in writing some of that. But who benefits from this book? Who can gain something from this?
Healing the Inner Child Through Literature
00:34:02
Speaker
yeah I love that question because, you know, it's the person reading the book to the child. Right. Because I'm not saying anything that no one's ever heard before.
00:34:13
Speaker
as a copywriter, my job is to just rephrase things to try to get through your head better. But really what it is, it's the adult that's reading this, teaching this lesson to their children.
00:34:24
Speaker
I'm hoping that they go, oh, yeah. So then they can be more forgiving to themselves, yeah more curious instead of judgy. you know And that makes them a better person for to themselves and to those around them as well.
00:34:38
Speaker
Because you know kids are smart. If mom and dad don't do it, I'm not going to it. They can tell when you're just calling it in. Definitely, definitely. That is so good. And i've i've I've had this thought and I'll just put it out there in the world. But like it's like we write children's books, but I think like the the series of books that I'm thinking of and writing and doing all my work around this has not even been told to the world, but you're hearing it, ah are inner children's books, right? And it's exactly how you described it. it is it is a It is a children's book that a parent will read to a child, but it's for that parent's inner child.
00:35:16
Speaker
It is speaking to that parent all day long. And there are lessons that that kid will pick up on and gain from, but there is a lot of healing in reading those words for that adult. Oh, yeah.
00:35:28
Speaker
Ooh, that'd be powerful. I like it. I like it your Your book falls right in line with that. Oh, thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that. Yeah. you You said something an earlier that just ah baffled me, I guess.
00:35:42
Speaker
um you So you went from not knowing the language to then writing in the voice of 50-year-old white men. That...
00:35:55
Speaker
One, like how inspiring, right? to to To go from not even knowing this as your first language to being able to be that good of a writer to do that in a field, tech field, like that's that's impressive.
00:36:06
Speaker
um But what what comes up for you as you're writing or are you aware of anything that comes from up for you when you are in that voice, when you're speaking from that perspective? No, I think you have to be a good actor.
00:36:21
Speaker
in order to be a good copywriter. And it depends on the type of copywriting you do. I used to write direct response when I first started. Direct response is very hard-hitting, very salesy, very intense with psychology ah because it's all about People call it manipulation. I like to politely say, no, I'm just guiding your thought process.
00:36:43
Speaker
But yeah I start off in the supplement industry where I'm convincing like an 80-year-old man on a fixed income to part 45 bucks out of their pocket to you know to buy this bottle of something.
00:36:57
Speaker
It takes a lot of psychology to be able to do that. yeah And to keep them engaged because it's not just by here. Here's my ingredient. Liz, this is what it's going to do for you. No, it's got to get you emotionally riled up. So you do it.
00:37:11
Speaker
And in order to do that, you have to be really good at acting. i like to say that I'm actually channeling. um So I've pictured that person. I do as much research about the the people, the industry, the audience, the everything as possible.
00:37:28
Speaker
It's like I'm always cramming for a final and for every single project that I work on because you there's so much back-end research to do. And once I get into that groove, I just kind of sit back.
00:37:39
Speaker
Sometimes I just got to put the right music on. I do change my music according to the mood I need to be and how much testosterone I need. I can never write to 20-some-odd-year-old males because I just don't get y'all.
00:37:54
Speaker
And I'm okay with that. But, you know, I put that in there and then I just start letting it rip. yeah And that's the mindset you have to get it. You have to be fully immersed to be an effective copywriter.
00:38:09
Speaker
Wow. that That is far more than i that's ah that's a process. and And I can see like just thinking about good actors and what they do to get into a role. i mean, you you have to do that as well.
00:38:20
Speaker
that ah that That's really cool. Do you ever, like there's a term and I'm curious if you've ever identified with it or how it shows up in your life, but code switching.
Code-Switching and Self-Acceptance
00:38:32
Speaker
have you Have you heard of this term and then Do you feel that you've done it in life? Maybe not through your writing, but other parts of life are or whatever. But how does that term land with you?
00:38:44
Speaker
That's funny because I have a lot of black friends um and I understand co-switching. Yeah, it happens very heavily there. So that for Asians. Yeah, I de never thought of that before, but you're totally right.
00:39:00
Speaker
Because when I first got my first corporate job out of college, I used to be in corporate sales. yeah And then so when I got my first job, I was the only female on a very aggressive sales team.
00:39:13
Speaker
And I was the only ethnic person on the entire team. So I remember... The first time, after like a week of shadowing someone and all that kind of stuff, you know, before i I went out on my own, ah the sales guy said to me, you know, Doe, you don't act the way you're supposed to. I'm like, what's that?
00:39:34
Speaker
And he goes, you're supposed to be all meek and demure and you speak up a lot. You're not supposed to do that. Wow. Wow. So... Sometimes co-switching works both ways for me.
00:39:45
Speaker
Sometimes it's to go against the Asian way that I was taught, which was to be, um do whatever that person wants, what you feel doesn't matter.
00:39:56
Speaker
And especially as a female, your job is to serve. Because I grew up old school. i or I'm a totally different generation than you. yeah And then that's and then the other one is sometimes thats indoctrination plays in sometimes.
00:40:11
Speaker
And I catch myself going into a business environment or any environment, even to the market, it doesn't matter. but Less now that I'm more self-aware, but it was, like back off a little bit.
00:40:22
Speaker
I wouldn't speak up when someone accused me of something incorrectly. I just let them go ahead and blame me. You know, that kind of stuff happened as well. And then as I learned to speak up and feel safe speaking up, think I got kind of belligerent.
00:40:38
Speaker
My pendulum went the other way. and people were like, okay, you need to just chill out. So then I had to just back off a little bit. And then now I'm at that place where I'm just going to go, this is what it is.
00:40:51
Speaker
You either accept it or you don't. And I'm okay if you don't, because I understand I am not right for everyone. And it's not personal. Just like, I can see you're a good person, but you drive me crazy. So I'm just going to leave you over here now and not interact as much as you might think I need to. Yeah.
00:41:12
Speaker
Yes. There's freedom in that authenticity and just being able to show up as you are and not worrying about what other people are going to perceive you as because they're going to have an assumption one way or the other. Yeah. And if you can be comfortable with who you are and how you show up, then that's what that's what matters and staying true to yourself.
00:41:30
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Because when people look at me, i used to remember when I lived in um Nevada, people would look at me and go, oh, yeah, I know where you're from. um You're from San Francisco and you're in computers, right?
00:41:43
Speaker
Wow. Or they thought was a doctor or ya CPA. And i was like, um thank you. But i was like, no, I'm a writer from Fresno. And that really just like, happened?
00:41:57
Speaker
Yeah. yeah Oh, that's good. i think I've shown up in in rooms where I challenge the the status quo in that same way. So like, as you just mentioned, CPA, my i start i I have a CPA. I'm i'm certified public accountant.
00:42:11
Speaker
so That's where my career started. And then I got into finance and wealth management. And so I walk in the rooms and and you don't see many people who look like me with those designations. And so ah it's always it's always fun to to challenge the norm. I think there' is there's an uphill battle with that as well of of redefining what people ah perceive as a wealth manager, as a writer, as an Asian person who doesn't do or does do this. and ah But I think that is a really cool thing that you challenge people in that way.
00:42:46
Speaker
Oh, I think you too. I mean, because what's so cool is, I love blowing people's brains that way, where they think they know you, right? Because, okay, um I can look freaking prissy, and I get that.
00:43:00
Speaker
So, and it's just, I've got the face, I get it. And then, you know, um especially when I'm not smiling, it looks angry, and got an angry Asian face, and that's just how it is. And then ah when I dress, generally speaking,
00:43:15
Speaker
my idea of casual are basically slacks and heels. So I do look, yeah, I do look a little more formal than your average Joe. And then, so when people see me, they just go, Oh my gosh, she's so high maintenance or something.
00:43:31
Speaker
i was like, and then they have no idea because when people start getting to know me, they realize, wow, she's just really down to earth. If people are rolling around in the mud, I'll roll around the mud with them. It doesn't matter because I'm just all about the who am I with and how can I just have the best experience possible?
00:43:49
Speaker
Oh, that's so good. That's so good. And is that is that the thing is are are those themes coming out through your book? Like like just community. And i know there's a lot of curiosity in that. But what what else do people gain from reading your book?
00:44:02
Speaker
I think they gain forgiveness, self-forgiveness, especially. compassion, love, ah by sharing, I equate not knowing as a present. That's the metaphor.
00:44:16
Speaker
And then you're there's one scene where, you know, think the protagonist is giving the the present to another monster. And that's the community that you picked
Impact of Children's Literature
00:44:25
Speaker
up on. So there's a lot of it has to deal with self first.
00:44:30
Speaker
um So it's it's the curiosity, it's the self-love, it's the compassion, it's getting to just see a situation for what it is instead of without the craziness of the judgment around it.
00:44:45
Speaker
ah It reminds me of when I um ah had a ah co-worker who her little son was having the hardest time learning how to tie his shoes, shoelaces. And he was so hard on himself. So after school, he would just practice, practice, passing. he was so mad because he kept thinking all the other kids at school already know how to do it.
00:45:05
Speaker
I'm so dumb because I can't. And he instantly started to push himself down and judge himself. And the more he was and putting that pressure on himself, the harder it was for him to learn it. And it just broke his mom's heart.
00:45:20
Speaker
Right. And if we didn't have that, if we didn't have the judgment and and we just went, oh, I don't know how to do it yet. Okay, well, let's just try this. Well, maybe try to do this. Oh, I didn't work. Okay, let's try this and not have the emotion behind it, the heaviness behind it.
00:45:34
Speaker
Then we can just move forward faster. And that's what I'm trying to teach to the book as well. That's where the curiosity comes in. Oh, I love it. I cannot wait to I'm getting multiple copies of this and I'm giving it to many people in my life. so Thank you. Thank you for writing it.
00:45:51
Speaker
I'm as an author myself. I'm always curious what like other people's experiences are with with how people receive their book. Do you have any memorable stories where someone wrote you or or came to you and and and talked about what your book has done for them?
00:46:08
Speaker
and I think my favorite one, it's the simplest one. It's the one that comes from the kids. When a parent took a picture and it was story time at night.
00:46:20
Speaker
And then she goes, I just got to let you know. This book has been in our book basket for months and they've read it many or I've read it to the the kids many, many times. And every week we have book cuddle time or something like that.
00:46:35
Speaker
And then so what she said that what they do is she goes, okay, pick two books out of the basket and then we'll cuddle up and read. And she just goes, every single time they picked your book, I'm still sick of reading it.
00:46:47
Speaker
Wow. But I'm like, oh my gosh, that's so awesome. Because yeah yeah all the accolades I get, i love ah from the therapist, from the educators, from all those other people, and the and the caregivers and the parents.
00:47:01
Speaker
The ones that really mean the most to me, though, are the ones from the kids because they know, right? And they're not going to lie to you. They're going let you if you don't like it. That is the best. oh it's so good to get. Oh, I love that. I love that.
00:47:15
Speaker
I'm going to hop into a segment and it's it's just fill in the blank. Okay. And so ah you you let me know what you what comes to mind. But ah vulnerability makes me feel blank.
00:47:30
Speaker
It makes me feel scared and then strong. Yes. I think that is fair. I think that is is very accurate.
00:47:42
Speaker
Oh, man. My biggest so or my superpower is blank. The ability to feel into someone else's heart.
00:47:55
Speaker
Yeah. It's all about connecting on a heart level to me.
Embracing Uniqueness and Personal Growth
00:47:58
Speaker
And then it's like before I got on this call, was like, i don't know what to talk about. Reggie's going to run the show. That's totally cool. I'm just going to open up my heart, feel it connecting with his and we're going to have a beautiful time.
00:48:09
Speaker
Yeah. So that's my intent. And that's my intent for everything I do. Wow. Even when I'm writing for a 50 year old white man.
00:48:19
Speaker
it That is that is good. And I i bet you have a lot of great days leading with that. Yeah, I try to. Yeah. And then, you know, and I'm very, very intense. So I get that. Um, cause I'm a very gold driven person, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's just, I'm a type a person.
00:48:37
Speaker
So even with that, I know when I sit back and I look at certain situations, I can still have a great day. And when I feel myself getting too intense and pulling myself down from that intensity, I'll have to sit back again and go, okay, wait, Brenda, is this what you want?
00:48:54
Speaker
Do you want to stress or yourself out like this? You know, and how are you helping other people this way? Because you are really a pain to be around right now. You know, so I will actually talk to myself like in the third person.
00:49:07
Speaker
And that usually just snaps me out of it because I'm like, okay, I get i get it. love it. I love it. If you could tell your younger self, and I want to specify your younger self, maybe the version of you before learning English, anything, what would it be?
00:49:27
Speaker
That what makes you different is your superpower. It's what makes you awesome. So never lose that. You're meant to be here. You're meant to be unique.
00:49:40
Speaker
And you're meant to show to the world what you can do. And it's safe to be heard. That's a big one too. That is so good. That's so good.
00:49:51
Speaker
When I need inspiration, I turn to blank. Hmm.
00:50:01
Speaker
You know, that's a weird one for me because I don't have mentors. I don't have heroes. and just I think I'm inspired by whatever I happen to see around me. So if I need inspiration, I'll call it in.
00:50:14
Speaker
I'll talk to my upstairs team and I'll say, OK, you know what? I'm feeling like this. Bring me something knock me out of it. Bring me something to inspire me. Bring me something to give me ideas. Just bring it.
00:50:25
Speaker
And I just stay open and I'll just wait. It could be me reading the back of a cereal box. It could be me walking down the street and hearing a mom and her daughter have a conversation. Yeah. And it could be anything.
00:50:36
Speaker
Or it could be staring at a really pretty bird outside my window. Yeah. For matter. I love it. There's a lot of presence in that. I think that's one thing that I've gathered from you. That's really cool.
00:50:49
Speaker
I try because I didn't used to be this way. I call this Brenda 2.0. i used to be that very stereotypical Asian who just went after one hard goal after another and just plowed over everybody and everything and didn't care just to get things done. Right. And ah I got things done, but boy, did I leave a lot of upset people along the way.
00:51:12
Speaker
And I wasn't happy myself. And that's when I already had a so back I think it was my 30s when I realized, wow, this is not how you want to live your life. so What was the catalyst for that change?
00:51:26
Speaker
That's a good one. I think it was always coming through. There wasn't any one specific. I just remember feeling angry all the time. and I mean, really, I felt like my mother.
00:51:38
Speaker
because I was thinking angry and judgy, never happy with anything around you. Every time I saw something or heard something, I would instantly critique it and say, oh, they're so stupid. Oh, this is so dumb. Oh, that's so ugly. This is so messy. It was just one complaint after another.
00:51:55
Speaker
And then all of a sudden I sat back and go, I remember talking to my dad going, I'm turning out to be like mom. Oh, He goes, well, that's not good. go, no, it's not. I didn't do something about it.
00:52:10
Speaker
How did your mom how'd your mom feel about that? She doesn't know.
00:52:16
Speaker
Dad knows. I can't talk to mom about it because she's still in her judgy ways. She just knows I'm not as argumentative somehow. I grew up. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, wow.
00:52:28
Speaker
It's been a ah true honor to to hear your story and to to get to connect with you. And I hope that people reach out and ain't and can can learn more, get the book, do all those things. But do you have any last final thoughts for the audience and things you want to leave them with?
00:52:47
Speaker
Final thoughts. I would just say, always know you're meant to be here and you are more than enough. Always know that.
00:52:59
Speaker
Because there are no mistakes ever. And there isn't the whole, when people say, well, I didn't ask to be here. go, yeah, you kind of did. yeah On some soul level, whatever your beliefs are, yeah you made it here.
00:53:13
Speaker
yeah So make the best of it. and know that you are so much more capable than you really believe you are. You could be the top of your game right now, and you're still capable of more.
00:53:26
Speaker
And that doesn't mean you have to suddenly explode and, you know, earn more money, help more people or anything like that. Open your heart. It will tell you what you're more of and what you're capable of, because your heart always knows.
00:53:40
Speaker
And actually, that is one thing I do want to tell people. Start thinking with your heart and feel with your brain. Go opposite. Because this will never lead you astray.
00:53:52
Speaker
It's always your head that's meant to protect you by overanalyzing and thinking and limiting. Shut that off. Because if you're ever trying to make a decision... You know what the right decision is when you really feel into it because it feels calm.
00:54:08
Speaker
It doesn't feel it full of anxiety or I should have, could have, would have, none of that junk. It's just, yeah, this feels right. And then that's what you should go with. Follow your heart.
00:54:20
Speaker
That is very insightful. Thank you for that. And I receive those words because because you were speaking to me at some point in that. And so thank you for that. And I'll add to that, any room that you show up in any room that you find yourself in, you belong there.
00:54:37
Speaker
And and and the the imposter syndrome, the thoughts, the negative self-talk that you may have, that comes from some conditioning that isn't your truth.
Overcoming Imposter Syndrome
00:54:47
Speaker
And so know that when you're in a room, you belong there, no matter who else is around you, and walk in your power.
00:54:54
Speaker
Oh, I love that you said that. Because I actually had to go through a process when I wrote this book and I started marketing it. I didn't feel like an author. yeah And I write for a living.
00:55:06
Speaker
Yeah. You know, that was trippy. And I was like, oh, I don't deserve to be called myself an author. I just channeled the book. It's okay. I'll just say I channeled the book, you know, because it came to me too easily, you know, quote unquote, right? Yeah, right. When you're good at something, that's what happens.
00:55:22
Speaker
Thanks. ah so So many times in my life, in different roles, corporate roles, or in different situations, even at a party, I would walk in a room going, oh, I don't know if I bull belong here.
00:55:37
Speaker
So I'm glad that you said that for me to hear it as well. So thank you. Definitely. Definitely. Well, Brenda, how can people reach you if they want if you want them to? How can people reach you? How can they get the book? Where can they find it? All those things.
00:55:48
Speaker
They can go to my website, Brenda Doe dot com. ah There they can buy the book directly through me or they can go through their favorite indie bookstore. ah They can go through Amazon. They can go anywhere they want.
00:56:02
Speaker
If they don't see it in the store, they can just ask for it and they can get it ordered really quickly. and They can reach me through the website, through my social handles. It's all on the website. Best thing to is email. I'm pretty old school.
00:56:14
Speaker
yeah If to do it through social, I might get to you next year.
00:56:22
Speaker
If it's urgent, email me. ah Definitely good to know. Well, Brenda, with all the things you could be doing and all the places you could be, I appreciate you being here with me embracing vulnerability.
00:56:33
Speaker
Thank you so much. And thank you for what you do. When i saw the name of your podcast, I was like, I got to talk to him. I love this title. So thank you.
00:56:46
Speaker
Thank you for joining us in another episode of Vulnerability Muscle. If you've enjoyed these conversations around vulnerability, please consider leaving a review. Your feedback not only motivates us to continue to do the work that we do,
00:56:59
Speaker
but it allows other people to witness the power of vulnerability. Share your thoughts on YouTube, Apple Podcasts, Spotify Podcasts, or wherever you're listening from.
00:57:11
Speaker
And don't forget to spread the word. You can follow us at Vulnerability Muscle on Instagram and me personally at Reggie D. Ford across all platforms. Visit vulnerabilitymuscle.com for additional resources and support.
00:57:24
Speaker
And remember, embracing vulnerability is not a sign of weakness. It is the source of your greatest strength. Sometimes it's uncomfortable, but most workouts are. So keep flexing that vulnerability muscle.