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Ottis Toole is a Tool
106 Plays11 months ago
…..all I can say is Lisa named the episode people! Ottis Toole had a traumatic childhood, as so many before him, however instead of taking authority over his life and future – he decided to fall in to a drifters life, leaving a path of destruction through the United States. After being caught, he admitted to multiple murders, his involvement could be proven in some & others were left for speculation. The thing we do know is that his life left those around him worse for ware.
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Transcript
Introduction to 'Twisted Tales' Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Well, hello and welcome to another episode of Twisted Tales with Faith and Lisa. And we're here kind of and sleepy Sunday, man.
00:00:11
Speaker
It is a day of rest. It is a day of rest. And here we are talking about this. So entertain me, Lisa. Entertain you. Did you know?
Scott Peterson Case Update
00:00:19
Speaker
OK, I don't know if this is relevant and I didn't have time to really research. So feel free to tell me if I'm wrong, peeps, because we've got some new Facebook followers. Yeah, we do. But I saw a thing when I was checking out this week when I went to go get flowers for my kid, for my husband to give to my kid on Valentine's Day. You want to ask me how many how much I got for Valentine's Day?
00:00:42
Speaker
I'll quit boo-hooing about it. But anyway, Scott Peterson is getting released from prison and they're reopening the case saying he was innocent and he didn't kill AC Peterson. Really? Yeah. I meant to research it. I had no idea. Yeah, we'll definitely have to die. We'll have to. We'll have to dig because I completely like I was sitting there and I was like, what the F you I'm still trying to figure out right now why every time I get on TikTok, it's they're like missing kids everywhere.
00:01:12
Speaker
Yeah, that it'll like just it's because our phones listen to us, please. I'm telling you my.
TikTok Algorithms and Privacy Concerns
00:01:19
Speaker
OK, I'm not kidding. This guy at work was talking about how he loved Mr. Pimple Popper, which grosses me. Oh, yes. Frank and disgusting. And I he was telling me all about this episode and I was Billy Billy. Sheesh. I don't want to hear. I don't want to hear. Yeah. He was talking about it.
00:01:34
Speaker
The next day, guess what's all over my TikTok feed, all over my Facebook advertisements, all this pimple popping crap that I want to see. So I yelled at him and I was like, Billie, for the next week, every time he'd come in my office.
00:01:50
Speaker
You left. You've literally took the heater. I was called and you left. You took the heater completely away from just actually, I was at least trying to share. I was at least trying to share. You left and I forgot. I got toast. Anyway, so next week, every time you walk in my office, he just screamed by my phone, Pippa Poppy. And so the ads continued. So yes, it does listen to you. And as much as we talk about this crap, you know what our our algorithms probably look like?
00:02:20
Speaker
the first suspect in any crime near us. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Anyways. But yeah, no, I just saw it when I was standing at Sioux City and it said Scott Peterson released trial reopening and I was like, what? Yeah. I mean, we have to look it up. Yeah, I meant to. And I completely forgot about tile. So thanks, man. I actually still every once in a great while go back to Lake Mead just to see if anything was new from when we did our 50 state tour. Just because, you know,
00:02:49
Speaker
It's the inquiring minds and all that. Yeah, pretty much. Well, if Lisa is starting to talk, it is my turn.
Introduction to Otis Toole: Early Life and Abuse
00:02:58
Speaker
I actually I kind of rambled on for a lot of pages on this one. And we both know how much I really like to put things into my own words, you know. So I actually gave you a title tonight and it's called Otis tool is a tool.
00:03:15
Speaker
She's real creative with the word super and you should just paste that in neon.
00:03:21
Speaker
OK, you know, it's the best title ever. You know, shut up like a kindergartner right in the book. I don't even feel bad. The elephant, the gray elephant is gray. Dog goes by. It's a play on words. Faith, it was creative for me. It's interesting. It was spelled two different ways, two different meanings. But it's same word. You know, it was great. Yeah. Shut up.
00:03:46
Speaker
right there with you. Yeah, yeah. Oh, God, I hate you. And here we go with another lovely night between me and my wonderful sister-in-law, whom I love very much. She does not. Right. So I will, in fact, be talking about Otis Toole tonight. I'm sure that name possibly might ring some bells. And he's a tool. Maybe not at all. He is a tool.
00:04:11
Speaker
Oh, God. Yeah. So Otis Toole, born in Jacksonville, Florida, of course, in 1947. His parents were less than adequate. Of course. Of course. Shocker, Shocker. I know. His dad was a raging alcoholic and abusive with that. His mother was not much better when Otis was five. One of his father's friends came over and paid Otis's dad so that he could molest Otis.
00:04:39
Speaker
Oh, the man took him into the back room, molested and raped the boy at five at five. Yeah. Now, before before I continue, OK, with with the rest of Otis's story, I would just like Otis, not Otis, just to.
00:04:53
Speaker
Otis, same difference. I always, I kept reading it, reading it as, oh my God, I quit. She talks for a living. I do. See, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I get out of here. All right. So Otis, I still like Otis either way. Because that's his name. It's Otis. Why do I keep saying all? Oh my God. Oh, this is going to be a long story. Yeah.
00:05:21
Speaker
I can still read a map. OK, just throw that out there. Anybody who has never listened to the podcast before, you just go do some some some digging. And you will see how great faith is at the map of mythology. Yeah, there you go. Yeah, I keep going. All right. So before I continue with the rest of Otis's story, I would like to save the record.
00:05:44
Speaker
that a lot of the information came from Otis himself. OK, so I'm just going to say take what I say with an open mind. Yeah, because I couldn't tell you how much of it is actually true. Fantastic. All right. Yeah. Anyways, I am. I'm pretty sure some of it was true. Well, yeah, there's going to be a grain of truth that there's no. Yeah. But he's also going to either elaborate. Yeah, elaborate. So Otis's father eventually abandoned them.
00:06:12
Speaker
Him and his family and left Otis and his siblings with their mother. She was an abusive woman like that, but more mentally abusive, you know, she didn't straight up punch him in the face. As a matter of fact, she would dress him up as a girl and call him Susan. Oh, yeah. She apparently did this as a form of punishment to pretty much humiliate him when he did something she found inappropriate.
00:06:38
Speaker
Oh, apparently. I'll probably throw that word out there a few times. I don't know. Because, you know, there's three sides to every story.
Comparison: Otis Toole and Jordan Turpin
00:06:45
Speaker
Faith, yours, mine and the truth. All right. It's not as inappropriate, though, after your son's virginity, we'll call it is sold his innocence at five at five. Then you're going to dress him like a girl and call him Susan when you're mad at him. Yeah, actually, the more I went through this story, like at least the first half of the story, the more I went through it, I'm just sitting there thinking to myself, you know,
00:07:08
Speaker
Really? Now you're going to mess with the heater, turn it back to yourself and shut it off completely. I didn't. I had it tilted to myself. You're the worst. You're the worst. Shut up. Anyway, we talk about these stories all the time. Yeah. When we do our podcast about people with their serial killers, whatever with horrible. Yeah. It's not a real far leap of how they end up the way they do. Oh, absolutely. But I was just sitting there thinking to myself, like, can we not just like kill these parents? And then maybe the kids would stand a chance. But then I'm sitting there like
00:07:38
Speaker
You know, Jordan Turpin, that name ring a bell? Turpin does. Yeah. So not our friend. No. Not that guy. Yeah. That's totally different. No. She was they called it. I think they called it like the House of Horrors. Yeah. She ended up escaping. Yes. Didn't even barely speak like coherent words because she was completely uneducated, like the whole nine. Her parents literally tortured the kid. Yeah. Right. And she ended up escaping doing that whole nine. I'm just like,
00:08:07
Speaker
She had the advantage of being able to live like a normal life. Yeah, I thought. But all the kids that were in that house, three of the youngest ones put got put in foster who were really abused sexually in the system. So I'm sitting here thinking to myself, all right, even if the government took the kids. Yeah. Really, what what chance do they not. Right. It's a 50 50 crapshoot. We get back into my my my words here.
00:08:38
Speaker
Like I said, dress him up as a girl, form of humiliation. Apparently his sister would dress him up, too. But from what I can understand is because she wanted a sister. Oh, she would also call him Susan and force him to play games with him that always turned sexual. So at their age, this is literally me just making an outlandish claim. Yeah, I'm assuming that she was probably molested herself. Right. Like if
00:09:07
Speaker
Yeah, when you know people are, oh, let's play a game. It's a fun game. Whatever. Correct. And being as young as they were, again, it's not a big leap to say that you do what you know. Well, frankly, if he was if his dad sold him at five, probably doing the same thing to little girl, I guarantee the little girl was either molested by the father and or his friends for a price. Well, there were things that also claimed.
00:09:33
Speaker
There was a lot of abuse that was just going on.
Otis Toole: Dark Influences and Destructive Path
00:09:35
Speaker
Wow. So sister was doing the same thing to him. So it was claimed to other family members, which I just said and neighbors were also sexually abusing Otis at that time. She's so Pete Otis came out as gay at age 10. So according to him, this only made his abuse worse. There was. Yeah, because it's like the what 50s when he's 10. Yeah.
00:10:01
Speaker
It wasn't looked upon highly, then it was illegal in some states. Oh, geez. He didn't really stand a chance. Not even a little bit. No. There was one person in his life who did care for him and he cared for her. And that was his I think it was his mom's mom. It was his grandma, but they are paternal grandmother. Maternal would be his mom's mom. So then it was his father's. Yeah. OK, so paternal. Thank you. You're welcome.
00:10:31
Speaker
This woman was a Satan worshipper. She called Otis the devil's child. OK. And according to him, taught him all about rituals, self mutilation and even took him grave grave robbing where they would steal body parts from corpses. So when you said that there was someone that actually cares about him, I thought it was going to be so. Yeah, you would think, right? Not someone that was like, hey, you're mentally and emotionally disturbed. Let me make it work.
00:11:01
Speaker
Right. Yeah, totally. And because I was just kind of like kind of really hammering in that this kid probably never stood a chance. OK, no, he did not like not even a little bit. No, no, no, no, no. Nobody around to help. Nobody. Nobody to fix things. So anyway, in the 1950s, yeah, he did his sweet man that took him to Rob. Great is sweet. And I'm about self mutilation. That's who he had to take care of him.
00:11:31
Speaker
Oh, I don't even want it. Like, you know, people are like, could you imagine how that conversation went? No, no, I don't want to imagine how that don't want to. Oh, my God. So in the 1950s, Otis started run away from home. Wonder why? On and off. But he always went back to lie. Legitimate question. He didn't have anywhere. Well, I'm assuming if he was born in what you said, forty forty seven, forty seven. So the fifties, he's still like he was still pretty young, a kid. He doesn't have a choice but to go back.
00:12:01
Speaker
She's so again, like I said, he would run away on and off when we went back to the house. But while he was out roaming the streets at this young age, he started to light fires to vacant homes pretty much just to watch him burn. According to him, he would get sexual gratification from doing so. OK. Now, I'm just going to reiterate.
00:12:24
Speaker
Take everything I say that Otis says with a grain of salt, because we really don't know. But I'm sure he did. Yeah, I would not be surprised again. It's not like he had a wholesome childhood. Right. His good memories, again, are grave robbing rituals and self-mutilization. I'm sorry, guys, I don't mean to laugh, but it's it's it's not comedic in that sense. It's it's.
00:12:51
Speaker
You laugh because it's uncomfortable. And that's how I lay it. So my wires are crossed. But it is so outlandish, like usually when we talk about horrific childhoods and stuff, there's like the one person that takes care of them and the one person that took care of him. Sweet, sweet man taught him how to hurt himself and go rub grapes.
00:13:13
Speaker
and worship the devil. Her sweet nickname for him was Satan's child. Which you know... Devil's child. Okay, fine. The devil's child. And in the 1950s in America, the devil was not a good figure. He's not still. And Satanism wasn't as accepted as it is today.
00:13:39
Speaker
So you're talking it was frowned upon. Yeah, you're talking about 1950s Bible Nation. Yeah. And the only person that loves you calls you the devil's child, which that's when they had prayer in school and everything else. So we won't even go with the love aspect. The only person that didn't like hurt you abuse you. Yes. That you do sexually. Yeah. Because she did abuse it. Oh, yeah. She taught him how to mutilate himself.
00:14:07
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. So neither here nor there. I wouldn't really call her the best figure in his life. Probably not. Yeah. OK. That's why I laugh. Yeah. So. Yeah. Outlandish. Yeah. And then we're like, well, how do you end up that way? Oh, I don't know. You want a map. You want A to B alphabetically. Most important, the least important. Well, I think that's a lot of stuff that goes on.
00:14:30
Speaker
Like when we start talking about like child trafficking and stuff like that, I think it's when you hear stuff like this and your brain won't go there because you're a normal human being. I had a great childhood. Do you know what I'm saying? Yeah. Like people that hear about they wouldn't actually be doing that. They would. Yeah, they would. They would. They would. There's sick people in this world, but that's why I laugh because it's just so it's sad. But it's like, really?
00:14:59
Speaker
Yeah, like it's almost like you didn't have one family member that wasn't like come live with me. I'll take care of you. But a lot of people don't make you PB and J's and cookies and milk. Not even close. Not this. Not this guy. My kid thinks I'm abusing her if I don't pack her sushi for lunch. I mean, well, I guess that's the difference between a normal human being and this. So anyway, he wound up dropping out of school about 14 years old. Shocker.
00:15:29
Speaker
And he dove into a porn obsession. Oh, because, you know, that makes it better. Right now, because you already have absolutely no idea of sex whatsoever. There's no passion. There's no love involved. There's nothing.
00:15:48
Speaker
Then you dive into porn where it's just as bad. Yeah, it's all. Yeah, none of that's real. And it wasn't just the porn obsession. He had an obsession with like bondage stuff. Well, yeah, the darker porn. Yeah. So because he's trying to make sense of what was done to him. Yeah. In a nutshell, I guess. She's aware that at that point, like his mind was so trained to that that it's.
00:16:13
Speaker
It's the only thing that what he's used to made him happy. You know what I mean? What he's used to. So anyway, he also started frequenting gay bars at this time. Again, 14. But needing money, he started to prostitute himself. Wasn't a big leap to that. His first John would be his first kill. Oh, he claimed after they had sex, he freaked out and ran the drone over with the car. OK.
00:16:42
Speaker
This would be the first life of many lives he would admit to taking. He said after he killed that John, he felt powerful at 17 years old. He was arrested for the first time for loitering and was in and out of jail for petty crimes. And after a while, he became a drifter. It started traveling from place to place, prostituting himself and begging for money to survive.
00:17:06
Speaker
In 1974, at 24 years old, he was living in Lincoln, Nebraska. A woman who was working in an adult bookstore had found her body had been found dead nearby the store with multiple gunshot wounds to her head and her chest. Well, you didn't have sex and her. The store had been robbed. A bunch of bondage porn magazines had been stolen. OK. And Otis was the prime suspect.
00:17:33
Speaker
But due to eyewitness accounts and lack of evidence, Otis was never charged. Now, I'm just going to throw this out here. There were eyewitness testimonies that the guy was like five to all this others. Otis was a tall guy. I think it was like six to something like that. It didn't fit the description. Yeah, literally. But because Otis looked like Otis and was creepy as hell. Yeah. And had a had a his. Well, nobody knew that at the time. Gotcha. OK, so
00:18:03
Speaker
It could have been possible. It could not have been. Nobody knows. All right. So he ended up like an. Uh huh. Why you of course you would look up a photo. I said because Otis looks like Otis. So I want to see what he looked like. I'm breeder. I don't blame you for checking. So he ended up leaving Nebraska and moving to Colorado. He committed another murder in the same year, 74 in a massage parlor.
00:18:34
Speaker
He entered the parlor right at close and at gunpoint told two women to give him all the money they had, which was basically 60 bucks. So he took out a rope, tied him up and stabbed one of the women repeatedly and then slash broke while the other woman watched. He then turned his attention to her. He drug her to another room, raped her, stabbed her and shot her. He set both of them on fire and watched as they burned.
00:19:02
Speaker
As it turned out, despite being stabbed and having to throw a cut, and being set on fire, the first woman that he didn't, yeah, she survived. That sucks for her. Oh no, no, no. She was actually able to give a statement and a description of the man who did it to her. He was 6'2", clean shaved, and drove a white pickup, but Sir Otis was already gone.
00:19:31
Speaker
Driving to his new town, because like I said, guy's a drifter. He just keeps on moving, right? They arrested another man in the case who had an alibi, didn't match the description. And you can't see because I'm like rolling my eyes as soon as I was sitting here listening to this and then reading it. It's real life. Like they arrested this guy and I didn't give names. If you guys want to go out, do your own research, go ahead. But the podcast is going to be long enough.
00:19:58
Speaker
So if you want to hear more about it, like you got to seek it out yourself. All right. Do some homework. All right. Who did they arrest? Is it another killer? Anyways, so they arrested this guy because information and limited time. I'll tell you, research it to yourself because the guy sat in prison for a very long time. Oh, no. And he didn't alibi. Uh huh.
00:20:27
Speaker
They were desperate to close the case. Apparently. This again, I'm not going to I'm not going to go like everything's the cops fault. Back the blue. Don't back the blue. They're all retarded. I'm not saying stuff like that. OK. Deal is when the pressure is coming down on you like that, you want to solve a case. You solve the case. You solve the case. You should just do it correctly. That would be nice. That would be very nice because you're not solving it if you put an innocent man in jail. That's just another crime. Yeah. Yeah, you're not helping anybody.
00:20:56
Speaker
Anyways, so still in Colorado, he claimed to have taken another woman's life by shooting her in the head as more pressure in Colorado was coming down on him. He decided to leave and drift on to somewhere new. Oh, we do. According to him, throughout the late 60s and early 70s, he drove across the United States, never staying in the same place very long. And after his eight year journey, he made it back to his hometown in Jackson, Florida.
00:21:23
Speaker
And back then, they didn't have like all the CCTV and everything else. So nobody like there's no I mean, if he's just driving from town to town, I mean, I was going to say at this point, there's there's no DNA. There's no there's there's nothing. Yeah. So during this eight year journey that, you know, he had talked about those those murders had occurred within this, you know, eight year road trip that Otis it took.
00:21:51
Speaker
Jesus. So gets back to Jacksonville, ends up moving back in with his mother, his stepfather, his niece, his niece and his nephew, which are the children of the sister that abused him, that abused him. Good. So she wasn't exactly saying I actually think she died of a drug overdose like later on. Wonder why. But again, we're not going to get into all that.
00:22:16
Speaker
So I just started visiting local soup kitchens where he could get food. And he also chose to pick up men that way, because again, at 10 years old, he said he was gay. So if he's gay, why is he targeting rape and women? I don't know. There's like I'm serious. The times all the times you've mentioned that he's raped and killed women, it's been because of a robbery. So it's just there.
00:22:43
Speaker
Maybe, maybe, like I said, I do doing this whole thing that when I was doing this research, I'm not kidding. I was just like, I know you guys can't see my facial expressions. That's what I was just doing to faith. Like, it just doesn't make sense. And now I'm starting to talk too fast. But it just it's it's weird.
Criminal Partnership: Otis Toole and Henry Lee Lucas
00:23:00
Speaker
All right. OK. So in 1976, he would meet a man and begin a relationship that literally was an act made. OK.
00:23:09
Speaker
Otis's lover's name was Henry Lee Lucas, which also might ring a bell to some of you, but we won't go there. Henry was already convicted of murder. He had killed his mother after an argument and was sentenced to 20 to 40 years for second degree murder. So how's he out already? But was released 10 years later in 1970 because of this behavior.
00:23:35
Speaker
Prison overcrowding. Oh, even better. Even better. Keep those potheads in and let these horrible murders go. Oh, no, it gets it gets so much better. So in one year later, Henry was arrested again for the attempted kidnapping of three young schoolgirls and then released again in 75. Why overcrowding again? Honestly, at that time, I'm serious, like I'm going to be real life at that time.
00:24:05
Speaker
Like the the crimes against kids were just it's like not even relevant, man. Like people that would molest kids still to this day, they serve a sentence of like what? Three to 10 years max for hurting a kid. Yeah. Come on. And you know, back then in the 70s, it wasn't any better. OK. So again, he was released in 75. They met in 76. They both thought they had found their soulmates. If you take in the facts, they pretty much did. Yeah.
00:24:35
Speaker
Yeah personality like like how does that happen? How did you weird twisted and if you want to I'm just gonna go ahead and allow you the opportunity to please look up a photo of Henry Lee Lucas Because he's just as good-looking as good old Otis. Okay Henry Lee Lucas. Oh, oh, oh, yeah
00:25:01
Speaker
I think, I think like Max, Max inside, inside his mouth, he maxed three teeth. We sure they're not from the Appalachian region. Oh, they're both gargoyles. Oh yeah.
00:25:19
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Look at this picture of Otis. He doesn't even look alive. Right. He looks like the crypt keeper. Like I know. OK, guys, I'm sorry. Faith and I have to make light of some of this stuff. And it's not because we're twisted in morbid whatever. It's it's it's because they deserve life to us talking about such depravity.
00:25:41
Speaker
Okay, that's not a good endorsement either. Brings life to us to talk about the deepest, darkest reaches of the human mind. No, to make fun of. Oh, yes, yes. Oh, oh, oh, I was listening to a podcast yesterday while I was cleaning my house. Was it mine? Because I'm still trying to read. It's not. Continue. And they talked about somebody and they were like, yeah, she's going to bob at him. And I was like,
00:26:07
Speaker
What? And I got so mad. They're like, well, I mean, he did abuse her. And I was like, OK, thank you. There you go. Anyway. And it wasn't it. That was a good. That was a good. That was a good cast. That was a good cast. Anyway, didn't. All right. So they found their soulmates. They did. They would commit petty crimes together. They work together. And according to both of them, they would kill together. I'm sure they did. Oh, yeah. For years, these two drove around.
00:26:38
Speaker
the U.S. Right. And pretty much raped, pillaged and murdered together. Excellent. At some point, they took Otis's niece and nephew again, his sister's kids. Not a big shock. And saw that coming. Yeah. With them and use the kids as cover. They claimed that. Oh, I thought they were going to be abusing the kids. Not there yet. You're still talking anyway. You ready? So they claimed they leave the kids in the car while they would go rob and kill their victims.
00:27:07
Speaker
And they would, you know, everything was just great. There was there. The kids were the cover story because who would, who would, what a good life for those two kids. Who would suspect you guys with kids. Right. Right. So it wasn't long before Henry began molesting Otis's niece. And then they apparently started a relationship. So I think.
00:27:29
Speaker
I think she was like 12 or 13 when they started. That's not a relationship. So I can only assess. Right. Based on Otis's life, Henry's life, the life that Otis's sister lived through. Yeah. Those kids were probably abused to. They were now if they weren't before. Probably had no like.
00:27:50
Speaker
The girl probably was so brainwashed at that time. It's just normal to her. It was just normal in a nutshell. But why is there again? Why why are they choosing your speculation? If they're gay, why are they choosing the girl? I couldn't tell you. Could not tell you. There's not that I want the boy to be abused, but about like any of this that ever really made sense because again, we'll get this off Otis that his niece, quote unquote, stole his man. Oh, honey. So.
00:28:19
Speaker
They all eventually decided together. Well, you know, Otis and Henry that they were going to travel up to Maryland where a bunch of Henry's relatives were living and they were going to go stay with them. OK. On the way there that he had a good childhood. Oh, yeah, I'm sure he did. But he's a completely different podcast, like totally different podcast. Gotcha. So on the way, Otis ended up falling really ill, getting real sick.
00:28:47
Speaker
And Henry took him to the hospital. Otis was not in good shape. So Henry made the ultimate decision to just go ahead and take the kids and left to go to his relatives house. OK, mostly Otis. Do we know he was sick? That was pretty much what I got. So he basically left because he didn't want to pay Otis's hospital bills, which is pretty much what he said in a statement after all this was all over. But again,
00:29:17
Speaker
He's a different story. So Henry was soon caught by the police, taken to custody for stealing a truck. I think it was Otis's cousin's truck that he was accused of stealing. So the kids were taken because you keep pulling out snacks today. Well, that's good for you. It's four o'clock. I'm hungry. You go right ahead. We get back into it. Those cousins stole a car. All right. So Henry got busted.
00:29:44
Speaker
They took the kids and put them back into the custody of their mother. And it wasn't much better, I'm sure. Oh, I'm sure not. But again, new podcast. So I don't know. All right. So eventually Otis recovered from a sickness but was completely alone.
00:30:03
Speaker
Um, so his his lover, man stole his children and vehicle. So his niece and nephew anyway. So he went back to Florida. So on his way back, he claimed to have murdered many others. All right. In 1983, Otis was finally arrested and charged with arson, where apparently he killed, I think it was like a 64 year old guy that was in the house when he set it on fire. And that was when the floodgates opened.
00:30:29
Speaker
He began claiming responsibilities for murders across the U.S., telling police that he and Henry raped and tortured hundreds of people. And if you're wondering why I didn't like get into all the murders that he committed or that he supposedly claimed to commit was because they can only tie him to like five. OK. All right. So between Otis and Henry, who was also arrested but in Texas for killing Otis's niece,
00:30:57
Speaker
He killed her? He killed her. When did that happen? I thought the kids went back again. Different podcast. You gotta you gotta let Henry go at this point. We're not talking about Henry. It is dude, but this would be like a 10 episode podcast if I got into Henry. But I thought they took the kids and sent them back to their mom. So how did he get her again? Again, that would be the Henry podcast.
00:31:21
Speaker
Are you doing that one next? Oh, I don't know yet. I haven't decided. I haven't decided. I haven't decided. She will be. Don't worry. Yeah. All right. So between the two of them, they confessed to killing 100 people. No way. No, no, 200 people. No way. Like 300 people. Their their number of body counts. Yeah. Was like ever changing. Gotcha. In a nutshell. All right. That's why we don't believe them. No, we don't. So.
00:31:51
Speaker
Cops from all over the corners of the United States. This is annoying. Pause the damn cast. We've been pausing. Don't assault Brian. It's on video camera recording. I just want to get through it. You're pissing me off. Why? It's not my fault. Your family's crazy. You encourage. So the whole case,
00:32:20
Speaker
became like celebrity status. Of course. The popularity of it became absolutely insane. They were both on the news. They were every newspaper, every outlet at that time. And everyone was saying that these guys claim to have killed like over 200 and whatever people. Right. In the 70s and 80s were like serial killers are us. No joke. Right. Yeah. There was. Yeah. There was a lot going on. Right.
00:32:51
Speaker
So cops from all corners of the US came to interview Otis trying to get their cold case assault. They showed him pictures of their victims and in some statements that were made in the research that I did, there there were actually police feeding him information about their cases just to get it solved in a nutshell. That's kind of what I think. I mean, because it's a cold case, right? Like you don't have any other leads. You have no idea. And then here comes this guy who's like, oh, I traveled around the world killing people. Yeah.
00:33:20
Speaker
And so he was literally confessing to murder after murder after murder. And you can find the interviews of Otis and Henry all over YouTube.
Otis Toole's Murder Confessions: Truth or Fabrication?
00:33:30
Speaker
Otis Otis Otis. Yeah, I know. I did it again. I saw Otis. All over YouTube. And I watched a lot. And to be honest.
00:33:41
Speaker
At one point, I found out that Otis had a IQ of 75. So he was like wicked smart. Right. And as I watch these interviews, he seemed so evil, but at the same time, like he is the devil's child. Touche. I also think that he was almost entertained by the idea. Yeah. Like it was attention seeking. Right.
00:34:07
Speaker
And it was all right. So like you said, there you talk to somebody, somebody gets invested into your story and the more horrific he got and the more reaction he was getting, the more detailed he would become. Right. OK. Well, whether whether the details were accurate or relevant, he liked the attention.
00:34:28
Speaker
Well, let's let's look at I mean, just look at him at five years old. He was sold probably for like a six pack of beer and his whole life is being neglected, abused, being called Susan and dressed up mentally, emotionally and physically abused. He wants someone to want him.
00:34:48
Speaker
Like that's the just every human being that that's the desire. It's an intrinsic part of our nature is to want to be wanted. You want to belong. You want someone to care about you. You want you just want that. So he's finally getting that in his mind. Someone's paying attention to him just for him. Right. So you say about kids all the time as long as they're getting attention. They don't care if it's negative or positive. Yes.
00:35:13
Speaker
Well, he's getting people that aren't hurting him to just sit and talk to him. And for him, that's the first time that's ever happened. So while vile and clearly deranged. And I know he absolutely. OK, like that was beyond the shadow of a doubt. I feel like he was led into a lot of the confessions that he made to solve cases that had burned police for years. Well, yeah. You know what I'm saying? And they they could
00:35:42
Speaker
You again, you would have to like, I'm going to cite out a lot of this stuff at one point. My mouth. Obviously. You're like a friggin savage over here, like my neck was hungry. Apparently. All right. So again, I think a lot of the confessions that he gave were for police.
00:36:04
Speaker
to just close the case, whether it was real, whether it was not, nobody knows. You stabbed her first, right? Yeah, because. And then what did you use a strangler with? No, not that. Did you use a rope you found, maybe? Yeah.
00:36:18
Speaker
In a nutshell, I can't blame the culture that like I get it. Like you have cases. I know. But you have cases like that that are. And and put behind bars, the wrong person. The original person is still out there. But just like last week when the love triangle Bill did it. But and it's already been in jail, so we'll just blame her. Right.
00:36:40
Speaker
Even though I get that, I totally do. But at the same time, this scenario is a bit different, considering the fact that this guy did, has actually been convicted of like five murders somewhere. Go free. I agree. And what people will do in haste is pretty incredible, especially when, you know, the general public is.
00:37:02
Speaker
Yeah. Up in arms. Like, why haven't you figured this out yet? Like, I can't. I mean, I get it. You want to talk about something like that's difficult is trying to figure out a murder when you have like no clues. Oh, yeah. And especially back then. Yeah. And the pressure that gets put on these police departments to like solve this. I was like, yeah. Yeah. They're not prophetic. They don't know. Yeah. So anyway. When you meet somebody as truly evil as Otis Toole is,
00:37:31
Speaker
So it's not a leap for these cops to think you probably murdered this person. Yeah. OK, so likely he did probably murder a portion of them. Right. But there's not enough evidence to back his story. So I think he was only convicted of five. And then one of the research shows and stuff that I watched said that it was probably six, but circumstantial. Yeah. Right. But that's a far cry from 100.
00:38:01
Speaker
So, yeah, but reliable. Otis was all right. I have no doubt that the hundreds of murders he confessed to some were like actually true. But the dude was confessing to everything, all of them. Yeah. Open murder. And it was things that he could not have like while he was in some of the areas at the time, there was no way to actually say he
00:38:30
Speaker
murdered here and then drove like a thousand miles away in a day and killed again. Yeah, like it wasn't feasible. OK, so. Yeah, anyways, so like I don't even know. They started the second half.
00:38:49
Speaker
of the Otis tool story, because I told you this one was going to have to be a two parter. So is this the end of part one? Not there yet. I started the second half. I'm trying to think of where we're resolved here. How is there that this is what I've been thinking like the past 10 minutes is you said this is a two parter. He's in jail. So where's part two? Like I said, I started the second half of Otis tool. And again, when I. All right, I could have done both parts on everything.
00:39:19
Speaker
that Otis told it, OK, talk about the murders in depth, talk about him and Henry's relationship in depth, all this other stuff. But I ended up running across a confession that Otis had made that took me down a rabbit hole. Oh, I do love. I will never forget this whole this whole deal. Well, he probably did kill over 100 people. Yeah.
00:39:48
Speaker
or didn't kill over 100 people, he was absolutely a savior. But Otis Toole confessed to a murder that would have made him responsible for one murder that turned two parents into warriors. OK.
00:40:03
Speaker
And I'll tell you all about it next time. Oh, you suck. Seriously. Seriously, I'm sorry, but I'm telling you, Faith, like I was just I was dead set on just doing the whole thing because I started listening to the guy's story and I'm like, Oh, what do you expect? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like we talked about the entire time is that he was literally raised to do dumb things to be a psychopath. Yeah. But then the more I started listening into it, I'm just like, OK, fine. Like I get like.
00:40:31
Speaker
And you and I have had this conversation about 1,000 times, like nature versus nurture. And everybody always says the same thing.
00:40:39
Speaker
Nature, it's nurture, it's this, it's that. If kids just had the experience, but then some people go outside of it. Yeah, absolutely. And there's so many people that have a horrible childhoods who came out on the other end better than they ever started. Right. So nobody really knows like what that what that part is. Right. I think it's where the things just building up.
00:41:03
Speaker
Which I think is why a lot of the times I think I like doing the shows, especially when I read some of the crap and talk about some of the crap that we've talked about it. Like I'm a hundred percent in tune when I'm out. A hundred percent. Like where's Caleb? Where's Brian? Yeah. How far behind me are they? How far ahead of me they are. And I do the same thing myself. Like if I'm walking just from the grocery store to my car, I look behind me.
00:41:30
Speaker
Oh, yeah. I don't want to be caught off guard. Right. No, that is no way to live. That's no way. Slowly. Yeah. Make sure to look all the way. And that's so not a way to live in the majority of people who probably don't do what we do and listen to some of the whacked out crap that we talk about. Don't do that. Well, they're fat done. I'm unhappy. Yeah.
00:41:50
Speaker
Maybe not really fat, but you know what I mean? That's not like us. As I've just eaten a bag of cheese fries. I don't even feel bad. I don't either. Don't even feel bad. It was an individual bag. I used to be super skinny and athletic. I could probably run faster than that. I will say that. But other than that, I'm good. We're too heavy to kidnap. That's for sure. Try picking me up.
00:42:15
Speaker
I'm not moving. And if you can make me move, I will go with what you deserve. So 100% not that big. I'm just going to go ahead and tell you guys there's there is no like forklift. They don't have a house to get us out.
00:42:31
Speaker
Oh, the couch shaped woman. Those are girls. Well, like I said, you can see what forms a human being in their childhood for sure, especially because children themselves are easily influenced. You know what I mean? Being exposed to things of sexual nature or evil in nature at a young age is it's going to mess with them. And so I don't I honestly I don't think that Otis with a 75 IQ ever stood a chance.
00:43:01
Speaker
No, does it does it wipe out the things he did? No, not even a little bit. But you understand how he got there. But then again, on the other hand, I don't because you have people that have had horrific childhoods. Yeah, my dad did. Both of his brothers did. Do you know what I mean? Like my cousin was brought into crack houses on Christmas Eve.
00:43:25
Speaker
and left there while his dad went to do crack. Like they had horrible childhoods and a married man with kids and.
00:43:33
Speaker
And both my uncles are doing great now. So do you know what I mean? Like they never perpetuated the abuse cycle. My dad was the best dad ever. Yeah. Like they broke the chains. So I don't, so on the one hand, I can read through Otis' story and say, well, yeah, this is why he's the way he is. But the other half of my brain is like, but dad's not. So it doesn't have to be. I always like refer back to.
00:44:00
Speaker
the previous generation, like these are the people that raised this. How did nobody know? Right. Well, how did nobody ever say anything? And if something was said and they had been arrested, you look at the criminal justice system. Right. And it's a slap on the wrist. Yeah. How many how many parents get their kids back who shouldn't?
00:44:19
Speaker
A lot. OK, like. That's just I mean, it's no different today. How many kids are being abused day in and day out and they go to public schools and no one notices. But how do you notice? You've got a room full of 35 kids. Yeah. How do you notice the one? And it's not even just the school system. I'm talking about neighbors and stuff. Yeah. And they're lower. I could promise you.
00:44:47
Speaker
There are so many people in this world who have seen something that wasn't quite right and said nothing. Oh, yeah. I know. I'm just saying. See something to say something. I agree with that statement 100 percent. Well, it's just like I was I was watching TikTok this morning slash afternoon before I had to come to your house. And I was watching an interview on I remember was called, but it was Sophia Bush. OK. Was who played on One Tree Hill, which we loved, right?
00:45:18
Speaker
And we used to go to Jenna's or me, you and Jenna would meet up every week to watch One Tree Hill. And Sophia Bush was doing an interview on like some podcast and she was talking about, it was either the producer or the director of One Tree Hill and how manipulating and emotionally and physically abusive he was. And she said that like, he like,
00:45:43
Speaker
mentally like would mess with them by telling her that the other two girl co-stars like the main characters Hillary and Joy were bad mouthed in her and coming to him saying all this stuff but he did the same one to each girl so all the girls hated each other but they Sophia said that like it really that's what hurts her the most because they were such good friends they clicked so instantly and they lost years hating each other but more than that
Media Influence on Youth Perception and Desensitization
00:46:09
Speaker
like
00:46:09
Speaker
She said, you could tell a man wrote a lot of the stuff because he would have like, it's a school about high schoolers, right? And he'd have the girls like an underwear lingerie. And so they'd have to do photo shoots. She was 20, 21 at the time. And they'd do photo shoots. And it came to find out this guy had a pin board in his office of all these young girls in their underwear. And she was like, it's incredibly violating. And she said, 18 women on my show.
00:46:39
Speaker
wrote a letter to like a petition to the new show he was doing at the time, which I don't remember, it was a CW show. And 25 of the people on that show said he's doing the same thing to us. And she said, you know, when we finally got out of the show, we realized it was not, everybody knew that he does these things. Like she said, it wasn't that uncommon for him to pull one of the young girls into his office for a quote unquote one on one.
00:47:06
Speaker
And it was all this stuff. And she said, until me too, no one gave a crap. Now he's not working. But before that, he did whatever he wanted to these young kids that are on this show. And she said, what? And I tell you something else that bothers the shit out of me is a 20, 21 year old girl talking to my 35 year old married boss. It never occurred to me to say no or to not believe what he was saying was true. But you know what makes me more and more mad? So you were talking about this 21, 22 year old girl.
00:47:36
Speaker
Yeah, and her skimpy whatever's right. She's being betrayed, portrayed as a high schooler. Yeah. On TV. Yeah. I mean, does anybody else not see anything wrong with that? Like kids younger and younger. What's not even just I'm just thinking about the men and the women who are over the age of consent, looking at stuff like this.
00:48:01
Speaker
And it's not a bad thing. Like, how is that not a bad? It's that is that not. I don't care that it's not real because they are in fact 21, 22, 18, whatever. OK, but they do it on. But that's still teenage. That's what I'm saying. Teenagers. Yeah. On all these little MTV shows. Little scandaly. Yeah. Dress. I'm sorry. And then that's how the girls go. I do have a problem with that because it's.
00:48:28
Speaker
Crap. I'm not even just talking about like the lingerie scenes, but like the sex scenes that they will post on on a Netflix special or whatever of these kids in high school going at it. And that's porn. That's child porn. Yeah, you're conditioning kids younger and younger. I know like the exception to the rule is there should be an exception to the rule. They're acting. They're not actually in high school, but you're showing you're showing high school kids that this is how you should act. Agreed.
00:48:58
Speaker
And then we wonder why all these kids are messed up. Yeah, I was looking at the bigger picture and we are so desensitizing. Oh, that's what I'm saying. Yeah. We're not not adults. Not a big deal. Kids, because you're telling me mom and dad aren't watching these shows with junior in the room. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So you start seeing it at a young age now. I know it. Boobies and butt are just in your face nonstop. And so it's not a big deal. And when you get abused, it's you know, this is what I see on TV.
00:49:28
Speaker
We'll wrap back around. Otis was was abused. All these sexual things didn't mean a thing to him because that's what he knew since a young age. Well, that was an unsatisfyingly abrupt ending. I love you. Mm hmm. This will be a part two.
00:49:46
Speaker
It will be. I'm sorry. Sorry, guys. Although I will say in your defense. Well, in my defense, Lisa, the whore that she is wanted to record this episode, then have me do an episode and then her episode would be three weeks. And I was like, you can't do that. I wanted her. People are people are going to go look into this episode. I promise you, I will.
00:50:09
Speaker
fine. So next week will be it'll be back to back fine. Otis tool part two. No cliffhangers today. All right. Well, until next week. All right. Bye.