Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
A Fathers Tale - Aaron Foust
126 Plays1 year ago
In this episode, Lisa is telling us the story from a different perspective. When looking at death row inmates, we can usually see the pain from the past, using it as the “why” for the crimes they committed. However, looking at the case of Aaron Foust, through the eyes of a grieving father who did his best, it leaves us with the bigger question of why did he do it, and could anything have stopped it the collision course this man was on, leading him to death row.
Episode: Evil Lives Here “I Raised a Sociopath” Season 7, Episode 2
I hope you enjoyed our banter and arguing, and of course or opinions – but please let us know what you think twistedtalestruecrime@gmail.com
Also, come visit our socials for photos and extras, amazing memes and people.
Facebook – TwistedTales True Crime
Instagram – TwistedTales_Pod
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Banter
00:00:05
Speaker
Well, hello. Welcome. Good evening. Good afternoon. Good morning. And thanks for tuning in to Twisted Tales with Faith. She's here too. Lisa's here. She should be obstinate. And Lisa, I was doing like a moment of silence just to make people think that your only friend was now gone.
00:00:20
Speaker
lots of friends that aren't you? I mean, they're my employees, but still. Right. Yeah. You pay somebody to like you. I don't pay them. The owner of the company pays them and I just lost them around. I'm
Lisa's Storytelling Uncertainty
00:00:31
Speaker
playing, I'm playing. But anyways, what do you got for us, Lisa? It's Lisa's turn to tell a story. Right now, I just want to go ahead and warn you. I have no idea what's going on tonight. Kind of grossness, you know?
00:00:42
Speaker
Mostly because my nose is still whistling. So, sorry if you hear it. Not grossness of the story, just your general persona. Just me being disgusting as a human being. People are used to being disgusting as a human being. See, can you hear it? I'm whistling. My nose is whistling. But no, everyone is used to you being a problem. But it's really annoying. As is your usual personage. You personage. I really wish we recorded these so people could see the faces you make of me. Yeah, I make a lot of faces. I wear every emotion on my face. Which is one, anger.
00:01:12
Speaker
I'm going to do my best not
Sources of Inspiration
00:01:14
Speaker
to curse at you tonight. That'd be nice. I don't have a lot of time to edit. All right. So we all know that I get my inspiration from pretty amazing places, right? Random videos. TikTok. Yeah, something on Discovery Plus. I don't know. Hey, I saw this commercial and it made me think about Googling said issue. You're kicking me. I didn't mean to. So I had actually started this whole thing doing I wanted to do a podcast on this German woman.
00:01:41
Speaker
And I ended up dropping it completely because everything that I thought was like this mom was a hero. It turns out like she was like a freaking shit show. Yeah. And I was like. Which one? That tick tock mom, there's this mom that's like she's she's made tons of media on social like tons of money on social media because she had so many followers.
00:02:03
Speaker
and she
Intriguing Stories and Abandoned Ideas
00:02:04
Speaker
has like five kids and was like This great mom great family turns out that she was like malnourishing her kids not not here that one She wasn't physically abusing them, but she was mentally abusing them like she's she's standing trial and her kids are all taken away Wow No, I had no idea but she was like this amazing mom. Oh, no. Well, I got the idea for the my story I was actually just like scrolling through Facebook and I saw that this woman had Shot her daughter's
00:02:33
Speaker
rapist and murderer, murder. Yeah, murder. OK. Yeah. And I was like, I'm going to that's the story. I'm on board. That's the story. Superhero. I need to. Yeah, I need to do what a crapshoot. What a crapshoot. They'll down a rabbit hole. Did you? I did. But the suckiest part of it was is like you could totally get the entire story on this one chick. Yeah. But not the guy that like he was already accused once and did time for being a molester, but whatever.
00:03:01
Speaker
I ended up ditching that story because it pissed me off because I really wanted her to just be like vigilante mommy. But she was a bag of whores basically. Yeah. I mean, she was still great because she like, you know, shot him in the face in the middle of a courtroom mom before that. Yeah, that would have been cool. Yeah.
00:03:17
Speaker
really wasn't
Inspiration from 'Evil Lives Here'
00:03:18
Speaker
quite the story that I was paying it to be. And so I was like, hey, hey, yeah, I'm totally almost ready, but I've started all over again. Yeah. How many times that happens? That happens a lot. A lot. Hey, I was doing a story, but I found a better one. So see it in 24 to 48 hours. Pretty much. Yeah. So this one I got because I get sucked into all kinds of stupid TV shows. But this one I saw on an episode of Evil Lives here. I don't know if you've ever watched that.
00:03:45
Speaker
Nope. No. I've heard of it. Like I've heard it referenced. Yeah. But no. OK, so we both have very, very strong opinions when it comes to murder. Everything. Right. Hang them, hang them high. Right. When it comes to like the crap they do and whatever. This story actually caught me off guard.
00:04:04
Speaker
And I'm going to I'm going to just jump right into it, but it was not not what I had expected. All
Introducing Aaron Faust
00:04:09
Speaker
right. So Aaron Faust is the subject of this podcast. OK, but his father is actually the one who sat down and told the story of his journey that he had with his son, convicted murderer, Aaron Faust. OK, Robert married Aaron's mom at about 20. Her name wasn't given. So he's the stepdad.
Unsettling Childhood Behaviors
00:04:33
Speaker
No, bio dad, bio dad. He got married to her at 20. I thought you meant like the son was. No, no, no, no. They had one child. At first, things were going really well. Mom started having issues like I don't know. And they didn't quite get into like a whole lot of detail. But the only thing I could think of is per that time, because we're talking, he was executed in 97, I think.
00:04:59
Speaker
OK. So postpartum probably wasn't a thing back then. But that's kind of the only thing I could think where she just couldn't do it. And then Robert, the dad wound up with full custody of Aaron. So they got a divorce. Yes, they did. They divorced, got full custody. As Aaron started growing up, he started displaying behaviors that his dad could only describe as odd. Robert had a babysitter that used to help
00:05:27
Speaker
Uh, with raising him and doing all kinds of goodies. Yeah. You got, I mean, you know, how does this single parent, you have to have someone help. Yeah. Right. Especially like, you know, before this kid is, you know, a certain age, there's only so much time you have. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. School hasn't started yet or summer or whatnot, but she went to, he went to pick her, uh, Aaron up at the sitter one morning or one afternoon, and he noticed Aaron was sitting in the corner.
00:05:53
Speaker
And so, you know, as any parent would. What do you do? Yeah. Because back then it was actually the kid's fault, not the teacher's fault. Correct. Right. Right. And he had said, like, you know, this was a really nice woman. It was she was a great Christian woman and she would help him out like a lot when it came to being a single dad and trying to do all this for a kid. Right. Yeah. So she had this look on her face and was like, you know, can I talk to you like in private for a second? And
00:06:22
Speaker
She explained to him that Aaron had picked up her cat and was choking it. Yeah, like on purpose. Yeah. Not like my dad was like, well, I mean, they had to have been like just playing around, whatever, whatever. And she's like, no, like he wasn't hugging the cat. He had he had the cat by the throat, two hands holding it up, choking the cat. Well, and so like any dad, right, got pretty upset with Aaron.
00:06:49
Speaker
And straight up confronts him in front of the babysitter and was like, why why would you do that? And Robert to kind of explained it as he had like a blank stare, almost like he didn't even really acknowledge the fact that his dad was talking to him. So his dad pressed him again and was like, why did you do it? And he's like, I wanted to. OK, now he's this is a younger boy, maybe six, seven years old. Yeah. Right. Right. And not he's not abused. He's not like anything at this point. Right. So at this point.
00:07:18
Speaker
He's too young to be beaten right now. Right. Well, I mean, yeah, I get you. I get that. You know, for me, that would be kind of like a what's happening. Right. Yeah. That's kind of a sinking feeling. And so you fast forward a little bit. Dad gets the kid home, pressed him again. Why did you do it? And Aaron just said, I don't know. I just did. That's not an answer. Never. Yeah. There was never a coherent answer if he even got a response out of Aaron at that age.
00:07:47
Speaker
So their normal routine as as things, you know, progressed was dad woke him up for school, made him breakfast, got him to school. But out
School Violence and Psychiatric Evaluations
00:07:57
Speaker
of nowhere, Aaron started waking up before his dad would. And he would like the first time he found Aaron, he was sitting outside in the freezing cold and nothing but a pair of pajamas just sitting in the doghouse.
00:08:15
Speaker
So he grabs the kid's jacket, runs out to the doghouse. And he's like chastising him like any parent. What are you doing? It's like freaking 30 degrees out here. Yeah. You're wearing thin pajamas. This is not helpful. Like you're going to you could really get sick. Yeah. You could hurt yourself. Like you could die if you got cold enough. And he actually spoke this to the kid. Nothing. No response. No nothing.
00:08:38
Speaker
just he said it was just like a blank, blank stare. Right. Yeah. The same. They didn't have mental health. And so. Oh, yeah. So this happened a few times over the course of a week. At one point, dad was woken up very early in the morning. Aaron had wandered off again and he actually ended up on the porch of an off duty cop who called Robert and was like, do you know where your son is?
00:09:06
Speaker
The guy's in his bedroom. He's like, no, no, he's not. I wouldn't be calling you if he was in your bedroom. Yeah. And so obviously Robert takes off to go get his kid. He's like getting on. What are you doing? The officer in front of Aaron was like, bud, like you need to figure this out. Like we could take your kid away for stuff like this. Yeah. You need to, you know, basically put a leash on the kid, right? Like nobody has no idea what's what's actually going on in their home right now.
00:09:32
Speaker
Yeah, this kid just keeps wandering off. And again, Robert's like, what are you doing? What? Like, why are you doing this? Nothing. I don't know. Why did he not get like testing for the boy? Hold on. OK, so Aaron progressively starts getting worse as he's getting older. Yeah. And sorry.
Escalating Criminal Activities
00:09:53
Speaker
At one point in school, Robert got a phone call from the principal. Hey, we need to talk to you. Yeah. Gets down there and Aaron.
00:10:02
Speaker
I'd beat the crap out of a kid who said that he Aaron said the kid was bullying someone else. But Aaron beat the kid so bad he broke his own hand. She like hitting him in the face, broke his own hand. Yeah. So the school basically was like, your son needs help. And so Robert had him seen by three different psychiatrists. Yeah, three. Every single one of them said he's fine. He's a sociopath. You know, yeah. Well, he's fine.
00:10:30
Speaker
Even though he keeps getting more and more violent, the doctor said he's going to grow out of it eventually. Right. I mean, how many times do you hear that just from not psychiatrists, but like anybody? He'll grow out of it. He'll, you know, yeah. Oh, he's 14 years old and he's pissing the bed. He'll grow out of it like. Yeah. You know what I mean? So that was like, you know, one doctor after the other doctor, after the other doctor, he's got three diagnosis and no help. Yeah. Because they're all saying he's fine, right? Pretty much. Yeah. They're like he's you know, everything's good to go. Yeah.
00:11:01
Speaker
So at one point, the dad was so like, this sucks. Robert got like really, really low. Yeah, because he didn't know what to do anymore. It was a problem, a big problem and getting worse. The thought just kept creeping into his head. What is he going to be capable of as an adult if he has absolutely no empathy now? Yeah, a lot.
00:11:27
Speaker
And he had told a story that one night as he had gotten off, he had gotten off work. Sorry. I think he got the kid to bed. The kid fell asleep, Aaron. And he was like, and listening to him talk about it was like, you can only imagine what was really going through his mind at that time. But he was like, I mean, I could stop all of this right now. I could kill him and I could kill myself.
00:11:55
Speaker
Like he literally contemplated a murder suicide. It's gotten bad. She's. And so he fleeting thought. Right. Yeah. Soon as he had the thought, he was like, nope, nope, I am not. I can't think this way. He did some praying over the kid, prayed and just told God, he's like, you have to have this at this point because I don't know what else to do. Right. Well, yeah, he's tried. He's he's exhausted his avenues. Yep.
00:12:23
Speaker
So at age 14, Aaron was arrested for trying to steal a car. Robert again asked why, got no answer from him whatsoever. Aaron said, I just wanted to have some fun.
00:12:37
Speaker
Robert actually wanted his son to go to juvie, but the judge sentenced him to probation. I was going to say he wanted his kid to go to jail because to keep everybody in him safe. Yeah. Well, not even just that. Like he wanted him to have like a severe consequence, like all of the consequences that dad has ever dished out up until this point. There's been no, nothing. The kid don't care. Jeez. So again, he pretty much got off with a slap on the wrist. Aaron got into a fight at school.
00:13:07
Speaker
officers broke the fight up and found Aaron had a knife on him. Yet
Diagnosed as Antisocial Sociopath
00:13:13
Speaker
again, no real consequences, except what Robert dished out to him was like, well, you can't do this or that. Give me the knife. You're not having it back. You can't. Where did you even get this from? Aaron totally shuts down. Doesn't even talk to him like just doesn't like nothing. OK. So Robert gave up.
00:13:34
Speaker
And he he needed a break. And so I think right around. Gosh, 16, 17 something. I don't even know. Robert sent.
00:13:45
Speaker
Aaron to go live in Iowa with his mother. Now, mom, who has been basically like no one void up to this point, you have to wonder if she knows like everything that's been going on. I know you guessed PTSD at the beginning, but you have to wonder if there's not some kind of hereditary imbalance, if you will.
00:14:04
Speaker
Right. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like narcissism or something like that. Not even narcissism. Like, I mean, you've got if you want to go to the spectrum, you've got Asperger's where they don't feel empathy or sympathy like they just don't understand that.
00:14:22
Speaker
And back then, there would be no diagnosis for something like that. Even in the late 90s, there wasn't like what we have now with seven century deprivation and this that. Yeah. But, you know, like you've got so many such a wide spectrum of mental disorders and some of them can be triggered by stress. So her giving birth, having PTSD, supposedly maybe having PTSD could have triggered her.
00:14:47
Speaker
could have triggered her and then the divorce and him not seeing his mom anymore could have triggered him. Do you know what I mean? Like, yeah, I just have to wonder if both of them are so shut down. And that is actually what like at one point Robert had said it was almost like the boy in the like the boy in the picture I pegged maybe for like maybe three or four. So like young enough to where it would impact not seeing mom anymore, but like maybe not old enough to really recall.
00:15:10
Speaker
Yeah, as he got older, but I don't know because he was young when like the cat incident happened. Yeah. So you had I just I don't know. I'm just pure speculation, but I'm wondering if there isn't some kind of at least something there. Yeah. And like I've seen kids get pissed off about like more of like a retaliative thing. Right. Yeah. But he had scratched me. Yeah. I'm going to hit the cat. Right. Like that's kids instinct. Right. You did it to me. I'm going to do it to you.
00:15:39
Speaker
Like that's that's normal. I want to see what this looks like the inside. So dissecting a live cat. That's not normal. You didn't dissect it. I know. But I'm just saying like, you know, you know that your husband does stuff like that, right? But he waits till they're dead in hunting. Don't make him sound weird. People are going to call. He dissected a rabbit in this very garage. But the rabbit wasn't living when he did it.
00:16:01
Speaker
Don't make it weird. I'm just messing with you, Faith. Come on. We live in the south. Yeah, everything. Everything. Yeah. Everything gets disemboweled anyway. So again, sends them to live with mom. Apparently, Aaron had a two county high speed chase. Oh, he was arrested and at 18, 18.
00:16:28
Speaker
was finally diagnosed as an antisocial sociopath. I said sociopath. Yeah. So he did three months and was released and moved back in with his dad. At this point, Aaron was 18. Dad.
00:16:46
Speaker
just kind of sat there and was always like I never I couldn't understand like why he would do what he would do like I don't get it's not normal right can't I'm not saying just because he was anti social he's crazy quote unquote but we always say you can't make logic out of create like you can't make sense out of crazy no so you can't
00:17:05
Speaker
when there's that you can't make sense out of what other people think and do anyway. But when there's an imbalance
Hope and Normalcy
00:17:09
Speaker
or when something's broken. Yeah, you can't. You don't know. Especially if there's not a call. There's no. Yeah. And there's no way to fix it. I don't know where it is. It's just broken. Yeah. Yeah. And listening to this dad talk about and like tell this whole story, you should really go watch it. He just kind of as much as he knew like he couldn't help his son.
00:17:30
Speaker
He was never not there for his son. And so it's this weird like battle that Robert faces. So when he's telling the story, he's literally heartbroken and he can tell it by the way he talks. But anyway, so Robert could never really understand why Aaron kept doing what he did. But eventually Aaron finally, he got a stable job. He moved out, got a girlfriend, got an apartment.
00:17:57
Speaker
to be turned into a quarter. Everything was like just super normal and I guess it lasted for a while. So in his dad's life, they were right. He outgrew it. The consequence maybe. You know, and I'm sure, but dad, I'm sure that Robert never gave up on what his son is capable of, especially like anger.
00:18:17
Speaker
It's probably always the back of your head. But any time there's like that little little glimmer of hope, I feel like you clang to it. Yeah. Like you're telling yourself he's able to keep a job. He hasn't gotten fired for crazy reasons. Yeah. He's got a girlfriend. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like you're telling yourself all the good things. So he did. He outgrew it. He's an adult now. That was all childish folly, if you will. Sewing wild oats. Right. Like I know that's what I do. Like, thank God something's happened. Right.
00:18:45
Speaker
and just hoping that you everything else was just a bad bad dream. Yeah, maybe I'm maybe I'm remembering maybe I overreacted. Yeah. Definitely. Because I was stressed. I was a single parent. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, justify that stuff. It's like, I've even had moments with my own kid where I'm like, where does that kind of anger come from? Mm hmm. Like, you're
00:19:05
Speaker
You're 10, bro, like chill out. Like Fortnite is not the end of the world. Right. Right. You know what I mean?
Return of Violent Tendencies
00:19:11
Speaker
I'm sure you've had to deal with it with Bella or she's she's not as old as Caleb is at this point, but yeah, she's going to get to that hormonal stage to where it's like. Oh, yeah. What have I brought into this world? Yeah. Yeah. But so.
00:19:28
Speaker
Again, dad thought, you know, things were going really good. He had a great relationship with his son throughout the throughout all of this. Yeah. Crazy childhood. Even when he was with his mom, he never stopped talking to him. He's a good dad. Yeah. Talked all the time. He just was mentally incapable of helping at that point. He had been dealing with it for so long. He just needed a break. Yeah. Everybody needs a break. So one night Robert got a phone call and it was Aaron. Aaron was screaming at the top of his lungs like,
00:19:58
Speaker
going back that crap crazy. OK. And look at you censoring yourself. I know. It took me a second to say. It turns out it was him and his girlfriend that were having this like knockdown drag out fight. So is it like a butt dial? No, he was calling his dad to calm him down, like reaching out to dad for help. Right. Oh, that's sad. Dad hangs up, shoots over there.
00:20:23
Speaker
Yeah. By the time he gets there before cell phones. Yeah. I just want to remind people. Yeah. I'm sorry. Before cell phones. I knew that there was no there were no smartphones back then. No. And if you really wanted like a Zack Morris cell phone, you had to pay out the butt for it. So and it usually had a cord connected. Yes. If you were really cool, you had a clear pager, though. Oh, yeah. Those were shit. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. I was never that cool. I wasn't that cool either. But I might I envied them. I take my mom's old ones.
00:20:51
Speaker
Me and Sheena would paint on them or now polish them. Like, what were they? The super phones before the iPhone. Blackberries. Everybody had to have a blackberry. And then all of a sudden. Right before that. Heck yeah, buddy. Actually found Frankie's old black. Well, I mean, like, I mean, when you talk about like smartphones, yeah, it was a blackberry back then. It's why we get off topic really quick yet. So dad gets there.
00:21:18
Speaker
When he shows up, he can already hear them screaming in the apartment. It's time. And he has a shotgun in his hand. Aaron does not good at all. Not good at all. No, you've escalated. Well, the way that Robert was explaining the situation at hand was this young woman probably has no idea any any of
00:21:42
Speaker
of Aaron's background at all. She's screaming at him at the top of her lungs. Oh, what are you going to do? Shoot me? Yes. Go ahead. Shoot me. Go ahead. Point it at me. Pull the like goading hit because she doesn't know he will. And that was the first thing that entered Robert's mind was I'm about to witness him murder his girlfriend. Oh, like.
Involvement with Dangerous People
00:22:05
Speaker
Hello. Right. Mm hmm. And what do you do at that point? Full body tackle him before he gets shot off? Not even close to what Robert did. So what happened? He literally basically walked up on his son because his son was trying so hard at that point to calm down. And Robert said, I know he didn't want to hurt her. Yeah. And I know he didn't want to hurt me because he cared about us. But he was so enraged. Anything could have happened.
00:22:35
Speaker
Yeah, anything and he was like and I honestly believe to this day had I not shown up when he called me Had I not gotten that phone call? He would have murder. Yeah, but a murderer on the flip side of that He only showed up because the kid Knew his limit. So why are we talking about him? If you dad girlfriend in front of the dad because we're not done yet Crap, so dad gets him calm down gets the shotgun out of his hand basically tells chick
00:23:02
Speaker
You need to go. Yeah. Like my you know, you you have escaped certain death. Yeah. Woman leave. Right. Yeah. So Daddy defuse. This is diffuses the situation. Who does the kid though for now? Everything turned out. Yeah. OK. And like you have to like really watch to to like hear his voice and the overwhelming like fear of his son that he had. Yeah. Like because he didn't know if he was even going to walk out.
00:23:31
Speaker
And that is such like I couldn't imagine that now. You know what I'm saying? Anyway, so eventually. Aaron now in his late 20s. Roman town doing what he wants to do still has a great relationship with his dad. Mm hmm. But he was also hanging out with a lot of crappy people, drug dealers. And at this point, dad speculates that he was like a leg breaker like you. You would call Aaron if you owed him money. Yeah. If you owed somebody money. But
00:24:02
Speaker
he would always go and hang out with his dad and have a drink with his dad. And they just, you know, Robert always knew something that things weren't quite right with Aaron. But he always tried to redirect him and help him. Yeah. Yeah. Like he just he literally just at that point, this kid's an adult. Like, yeah, there's nothing you can do anymore. And so he just he stuck with it. That was it. Like he could approve. Like he knows. Yeah. He knows something's off.
00:24:31
Speaker
But there's not been anything legally to like get the kid committed or locked up. You can't just say I've got a gut feeling. His son would tell you he described it as he would tell me all kinds of stories, but it's almost like he would stop before the ending. Yeah. Where and he said, I don't know if he was telling me that because he wanted me to feel like his son was a tough guy or because he would use phrases like I'm invincible, dad, nobody can hurt me.
00:25:00
Speaker
Yeah. And he always said at the end of each story, it was like there was an ending to that story, but I don't get to know it. And he always thought in his mind that person isn't living it. And so May 20th, 1997, Robert's 48th birthday, he got a phone call from his ex-wife who told him that Aaron had been arrested and gave him no further information about anything. Do they live in the same state?
00:25:27
Speaker
So how does she know? I'm assuming that's probably who they called. I mean, be honest, right? Something happens with somebody's kid. Do they call daddy first? No, they call mom. Always. Well, I guess so. But the kid craps himself at a daycare. They don't call dad first. They call mom. OK. And be honest with you, I don't know if he was in Idaho, Idaho at that time or not. I'm not sure. So he got no more information. But the very next day, Aaron called his dad from prison and Aaron basically was like,
00:25:57
Speaker
Hey, dad, you know, love you, whatever. I was arrested for murder. Robert said he always wondered what would happen next in all of his stories. He never had an ending. Now he does. And now he does. So he had always hoped that, like, yeah, you know, he he did really stupid things. You know what I mean? Like he would steal cars and he was, you know,
00:26:20
Speaker
He would do dumb, adolescent, stupid things, right? But he always just prayed that it would never end up that way, but always had like this dark, sickening feeling that it was good. He was capable of it, basically. So when he was talking to his son, he said that the first thing that popped into his mind after hearing that he had been arrested for murder was that night that he walked into his son's bedroom and
Arrest and Realizations
00:26:48
Speaker
contemplate in killing the kid and himself.
00:26:50
Speaker
And like could you imagine that now as a parent thinking mm-hmm 20 something years ago Had I pulled the trigger on him and myself somebody else would still be alive because I knew Deep in my heart like something now. Here's the thing. Here's the crap part about that It could have gone either way. Yeah, you don't know it could have been perfectly freaking normal but for him to not be a
00:27:13
Speaker
That kind of guilt. There's always there's always somebody. Oh, yeah. Whether you survived, whether it was like it's a crapshoot for everybody. Well, all the stories that we talk about, which is what kind of drew me into this one, is always like, oh, I don't feel bad for the for the killer. Oh, yeah. Sorry. You had a crappy childhood, but you can pick, you know, you have choice, whatever, whatever. But like actually hearing
00:27:39
Speaker
this dad talk about raising his son in a somewhat normal, you know, not the perfect family. Right. But it was definitely a broken. Yeah. But doing the best that he could do. But just because your divorce doesn't mean you can't correct. Yeah, exactly. Had a great life because his dad did everything possible to try to help to try to help him. And that's what sucks, because like if he'd had siblings that were normal, quote unquote, like live productive lives, they're going to be, you know what I mean? Like, right.
00:28:08
Speaker
like a school shooter, the whole family's judged for the actions of one imbalanced individual that you don't know how hard that family tried to prevent it and or if they had any clue what was going on in their mind. And that for me like was kind of like that moment that kind of hit me hardest. Yeah. Was here's this guy who literally did what he could. Yeah. He reached out.
00:28:29
Speaker
Multiple took them to like three different psychiatrists saying, like, I know something's in. Yeah. Help me fix it. Not fix him for me. Yeah. Help me do this. Tell me what to do. Tell me what's wrong. Tell me how to. Yeah. He did everything. Yeah. That sucks. So the night that he had almost killed a son, he prayed that God would just take over and he thought all the chaos he continued to. He thought that through all the chaos, he continued to believe that God would just take over.
00:28:58
Speaker
and that no matter what happened at the end of all of this, at some point, Aaron would just come to Christ and that he could actually see his kid one day, okay? Because at that point, he knew. He knew what was happening, but he had no way of stopping it. None whatsoever. He did everything he could. Yeah, because even though he had a sickening feeling, you don't just say, I think my son's killed however many people. I'm gonna lock him in a dog crate. That's wrong too. Yeah, you'd get arrested.
00:29:27
Speaker
So no matter what happened, no matter how much crap Aaron got into as a stupid kid or a dumb adolescent or a moronic adult. Yeah. Dad was always his pillar. Yeah. And tried to get him help. Did everything he could to no avail. Aaron was convicted of capital murder and sentenced to death. Did it say why he killed this person or who it was? He was actually a rich guy.
00:29:56
Speaker
Mm-hmm, and I believe it was him and another guy that had been arrested for murdering this guy But they stole his stuff and that makes the capital. It was yeah, it was nothing To do with drugs or anything like that. I think they just wanted his shit and so they took and killed him so and I'm pretty sure they killed him with I think they tied him and Strangled him I think hmm, and then they just kind of like dumped him like he didn't mean anything excellent
00:30:24
Speaker
So he had absolutely no remorse for what he did. In fact, he was pretty much perfectly OK with dying. He was asked in one of the interviews that he had posted, they asked him straight up, like, how do you feel about being on death row? And he was basically like the sooner, the better. Jeez. Yeah. And like to me, that's a sick mind. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like he knows something's wrong with him. You would have to think like, do you know what I mean? Like he knows that's why he called his dad that one time. He knows.
00:30:55
Speaker
Yeah, so Robert went to see him just before the execution and asked him because he was only accused of the one. And basically, it was like, is there more than one? You know, that you all the stories, all the lives. Yeah. Aaron replied, yes. And then told his dad that they were all drug dealers.
00:31:15
Speaker
Aaron, I think, probably felt like he needed to justify his actions to his dad. Yeah, it's the one person I got away with beating the hell out of the bully. So maybe dad will understand like these people are just drug addicts or whatever. Right. Trying to make it sound better. Who knows? But he pretty much in a nutshell was like, I don't know if they lived or died. So I really I couldn't give you a number. And the relationship that he had with his dad, he was never. Aaron never lied to him.
00:31:45
Speaker
Yeah, like he was pretty up front about. Yeah. But he could be because his dad. Well, but here's the thing. His dad didn't like blindly stand by him. Correct. He tried to help him, but his dad never judged him. He loved him either way, regardless, which is what a parent should do. Yeah. But like then, like when he made that statement, we were always honest with each other. He was always real. He was always truthful with me. I'm sitting here thinking to myself, if I had accused my kid of choking a cat, knowing
00:32:13
Speaker
He was going to bear a consequence for that. First instinct for any child is to lie about it. Children don't have to be taught how to lie. He did not. Didn't even face him. No. Just told his daddy I did it and don't care. Yeah.
Reflection and Acceptance
00:32:26
Speaker
You know what I mean? Like, I know that's that might sound stupid, but I feel like for like a normal toddler child, my kids don't have to be taught. They know. You come out of the room knowing how to lie. All of us do. Yeah, that's why I drill in my kid's head since she was like two. You will have a consequence, but you will not be in big trouble if you tell the truth. If you lie, it's capital. Yeah. And my house like you're in. So I don't care if you tell me this guy is green instead of blue. If it is a lie, it is going to be so much worse.
00:32:54
Speaker
Oh, yeah. And I had to tell your brother like several times, hey, if she comes and tells us something, if she should be in trouble, we have to tamper it down because we have to teach her young. Like if you don't lie, it's not going to be as bad. It's not that bad. I try to tell my son the same thing where it's like you're still going to have a consequence if you do something wrong. But if you're dishonest about it, your consequence is going to suck.
00:33:14
Speaker
Oh, yeah. But she would come to us when she was like four and be like, please don't be mad, but blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. I'm like, all right. Well, did you just tell me the truth? Yes. And you're not in trouble. Let's just try not to do it again. Right. Like so young try to drill in her head, drill in her head that way. Now we'll talk about it. There might be.
00:33:32
Speaker
you know a consequence but quite frankly when she's in high school if she makes a dumb decision and goes to party and get drunk I don't want her to make a worse decision and get in the car with a drunk friend because she's too afraid to call me yeah like call me you call me because you you got drunk or when you're with a bunch of drunk people where you shouldn't be you will not get in trouble I'll pick you up we will go home we'll never discuss it again
00:33:55
Speaker
Yeah, because I would rather you make a dumb choice and not want to do it again based solely on the repercussions that you're going to have yourself from being hungover. Yeah. And get into the car and I never get to see you again. Yeah. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, I agree with that 110 percent, 110 percent. But but you have to like it is I mean, she's eight now. So it has been six years of a thrilling this into her head at every step of the way. And still to this day,
00:34:23
Speaker
She'll do something and I'll ask her a question that I already know the answer to, quite frankly. Yeah. And before she says, I'll look at her and say, remember, we don't tell lies. Yeah. And she'll just sit there for a second and you can see her trying to decide. Yeah. Should I go for it? Right. And her little arms will deflate and say, well, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, all right, that's that's OK. That's fine.
00:34:44
Speaker
Let's just try not to, you know, we just don't tell lies if you if you don't lie, you're not in trouble. But it's hard to get that drilled in her head. So it's hard to just be like, yeah, I did it. So I wanted to write like that's not a normal. That's not a normal reaction. Yeah. No, because, you know, you're in trouble. You were sitting in the corner, your dad and literally could care less if you had a repercussion. And to me, that again is, you know, because you don't know. I mean, he could have gotten spanked. He could have been. I mean, that's that's the generation of bankers. Right.
00:35:14
Speaker
groundings, what like whatnot. And he just whatever, man, whatever. I don't care. Do what you will. That I'm just going to go freeze myself to death in the doghouse. That's the weather. You know what I mean? I'm so glad that my kid is such a people pleaser right now, because all I have to do is be like, I'm really disappointed. And she puts herself in timeout. She saw she cleans out all her room. She punishes herself. And I'm like, all right, that was easy. I've discovered that the easiest way to get to my kid is if you think if he thinks he broke my heart.
00:35:43
Speaker
Yeah. If you start crying. Yes. If I start crying, start carrying a needle in your pocket, jamming your legs. Oh, anyway. So again, he told them he was honest. They'd always been honest with each other. I lost my spot now because you ramble too much. Shut up. Oh, wait, you are. That's the problem. So Robert pretty much knew something that always been off and not not quite right.
00:36:10
Speaker
but never stopped fighting for Aaron, always being there for his son, always, always praying just for his son to find God. They could see each other again. But no matter how much of anything, I mean, he I really believe he had to throw down his life for his kid to be normal, to have a normal life. Yeah, he was a good dad. Yeah. So just before execution, so just before Aaron's execution,
00:36:38
Speaker
He wrote a poem to his father on Father's Day. And are you fracking kidding me? Dead series. Oh, this sucks. I don't want to. I typed out the exact poem. Watching this dad read the poem rips your soul out. Yeah. Rips my freaking soul out of my nose so hard. Oh, Aaron wrote. It's Father's Day. Your only son is locked away. Won't be home till he's old and gray.
00:37:06
Speaker
Try as you may, try as you might. I could only do wrong and never right. I only knew misfortune and pain. A few sunny days, but mostly rain. Now I'm in prison and life seems down the drain. I'm just the man that never fit in, except in a world of darkness and sin. All my life, I've never been able to keep a friend. But dad, you have been true blue to the bitter end. As a father, you have been a real treasure.
00:37:34
Speaker
You tried to take away the pain and bring nothing but pleasure. My life has been full of sadness and my mind clouded with madness. Hold on. But when all is said and done and I am laid to rest, I hope you know that you did your best.
00:37:48
Speaker
Oh, it punched me in the gut because there's this kid like on the one hand. Yes. But on the other hand, like for the dad who's going to say like it's awful. It wasn't about Aaron. It was about that. Aaron had that to say to his dad. I know he was executed. But that's the thing. Like it's like that is just peeling away a layer of skin and pouring lemon juice in it like painful.
00:38:17
Speaker
But for the dad who struggled his entire life to try to protect this kid and help this kid and fix this kid and ultimately just love this kid to see that the son realized that. Yeah, he knows that. Like it was a lot of bad and the kid knows that. But you were the bright spot. She's crazy, right? Mm hmm.
00:38:45
Speaker
And he had mentioned also that his son came to Christ before he was executed. Yeah, I don't know death row. Oh, and so he holds it in his heart that maybe one day he'll get to see his son. You know what, friend? I wouldn't want to take that from anybody.
00:39:02
Speaker
That is a punch. That is awful. What a horrific story when I would have rather when it got to the mother Helga from Russia. Thank you very much. Give me a bad parent every day that their kid turns out awful. That, you know, mentally and emotionally, I can handle a parent that tries so hard and the kid that is not I don't like that.
00:39:26
Speaker
Mm. Well, and it's hard for me because we always it's that age old question nature versus nurture, right? Oh, it literally had no there was no rhyme or reason really that anybody could unless he completely disassociated when his mom left and how that happens at such a young like his dad had even said at one point he thought it was demon possession and he was becoming so like infuriated because and again, like you
00:39:52
Speaker
Like, how could somebody not? Like, to be honest with you, you've traveled down every other route that you could possibly take. Psychiatrist. He's been in prison. Yeah. He's done this. He's done what? Like, where's the logic? Right. Yeah. So for him to jump to the conclusion.
00:40:09
Speaker
I wouldn't be like, there's gotta be some kind of explanation. You're just trying to justify what can't be justified. Exactly, that's what I'm saying. So I would never look at him and be like, dude, you're cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs by saying something like that. At the end of the day, sometimes it's just product default.
00:40:25
Speaker
Sometimes there's no reason that the wind-up toy doesn't work. It's just broken inside. No one dropped it. No one stepped on it. No one ran it over. It just came from the factory broken. But people don't have warranties and you can't exchange them. It just is. I just couldn't imagine feeling... You know what though? A part of me would feel gratified.
00:40:52
Speaker
and the fact that he knew all along. He could rely on me. He knew all along he could trust me and he knew all along I wasn't going.
00:41:02
Speaker
Yeah, well, I mean, that's why I say like the punch in the gut is awful. Yeah. Like the amount of emotion he must have felt reading that the amount of motion he probably still feel if he's alive, like it's always you love him and hate him situation. Oh, yeah. You know what I mean? Like our our constant. What could I what else could I have done? What should what else? What? You know what I mean? Like what would have made the difference? Yeah. But I mean, that's like that's a normal
00:41:31
Speaker
reaction to any circumstance. You lose a loved one. I should have called them more. Yeah, I should have visited more. Yeah, you know, whatever. I watch that story. And like I said, I've always been like the aggressor when it comes to hanging and hanging high. Yes, you have. And while I don't disagree with his sentencing, I've actually looked at the opposite end of the spectrum. But I'm going to give praise to that dad in saying, I think
00:42:00
Speaker
that if he had gone and been called as like a character witness for his son, I don't I don't believe based on the story he told. And I won't know because I would have to dig back in and try to find some court reference somewhere buried deep. I just don't see him getting up on the stand and saying that my son's a stand up guy now. I really don't think he would. He would have just, you know, I don't. This is what happened. This is what he was like. And honestly, I'm not shocked. You know what I mean?
00:42:29
Speaker
But like you you listen to all these other cases where you have like Shannon Christianson, perfect example, the men and women who murdered the crap out of her and Chris. And they oh, my son would never. This wasn't his idea. He was caught or what, you know, he felt trapped. And I'm just sitting here thinking.
00:42:50
Speaker
I don't know how you as a mother could look at something like that that your son did. Mm hmm. Find a justification. Yeah. Stand up for him. Yeah. I'd be like, yeah, go ahead. Release him to me. Release him to my custody. See what happens. Like that. That's a hard story, man. Like it sucked. It sucked when I was watching it. So I was like, man, faith. I'm going to tell this story.
00:43:15
Speaker
She's going to hate. Yeah, I don't even feel bad. Don't even feel bad. Of course you don't. Oh, well, on that happy note, I'm sorry. The name of it, the episode, if you guys want to go, if you have Discovery Plus, it is called Evil Lives Here and the episode is called I Raised a Psychopath. I know it. I know.
00:43:44
Speaker
And I'm trying to see which season it was on just to get you there a little faster. I'll put it in the show notes. No. Well, don't think nothing. There's nothing Jovial. You've killed my mood. So I'm sorry, man. On that depressing note, guys. Hope you have a great turkey day. Absolutely. Gobble gobble. And lots of your favorite food. Pass out because that's what you do after you eat.
00:44:09
Speaker
Yes, hopefully your kids are at the age where they can amuse themselves. Hope you find some good deals on Black Friday.
00:44:17
Speaker
Oh, well, sorry. All I can say. Sorry. But if you need to laugh, you can always, you know, go a few episodes back and listen to Lorraine Bobbitt. Yes, that was a good one. That was a good one. Much better. If you already posted the other one that I kind of guess at the beginning. But yeah, no. Okay. Okay. I didn't want to say I didn't want to ruin it for anybody. Yeah, I posted a var a less. That was good, too. I hated you. But anyways. All right. Well, enjoy turkey day, guys. Have a great week.