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The Horrors Persist: Network Review
12 Plays12 days ago
Another crossover episode and another gentle reminder that we will be publishing some episodes like this with other friends as well on thehorrors.co in the coming months. Keep an eye on that space and we will send more details as we have them! Thehorrorsdotco on all social media pages as well!
If you want to hear us babble, start from the beginning. For The Network overview, start at 30 min in.
Some things we mention on the pod:
- Sammi's sweater is from Oxknit (sponsor me, Oxknit!)
- Buy Now: The Shopping Conspiracy on Netflix
- Exit Interview: The Life and Death of My Ambitious Career by Kristi Coulter - a must-read for people who want to hear about early days at Amazon (I've added an affiliate code so if you order from there, I may get a little bit of money)
- Movies with loose ties to Network in theme, tone, and message include: Nightcrawler, Late Night With the Devil, Spotlight, Zodiac
- If you haven't already, check out "The Danish Deception" on TikTok
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Delays
00:00:16
Sammi
hello
00:00:17
Steve
Oh, hello.
00:00:19
Sammi
I'm Sammy.
00:00:20
Steve
And I'm Steve.
00:00:21
Sammi
And you're listening or watching. ah Well, I guess it's the horrors persist. Rose plate special. Crossover. Strange.
00:00:31
Steve
What do we do when we're not doing what we normally do?
00:00:34
Sammi
Strange limbo time where we figure out what we're doing next. But we've got some movie reviews as promised for you. And so sorry that it took so
Steve's Phone Saga Begins
00:00:42
Sammi
long. You probably thought we disappeared forever. We would never come back.
00:00:46
Steve
No, we actually tried to record this at an earlier time, but ah earlier times, yeah, like, I don't know, like one time I think I had to work and i didn't know how to work or something like that.
00:00:50
Sammi
Like three earlier times, I feel like. it
00:00:58
Steve
And then recent time, and I feel like I can share this story on on the pod if you would like.
00:01:03
Sammi
Sure.
00:01:04
Steve
I lost my phone, which is not a like unusual thing. It there is an unfortunate thing. But I think the way that it played out for me was very interesting.
00:01:18
Steve
So I went to a Milwaukee Bucks game. And what do you do after a Milwaukee Bucks overtime victory?
00:01:23
Sammi
Go bucks.
00:01:26
Steve
You go out for a couple more drinks. This is how it's done. So I do that. I have a few more drinks. Now, I am not in a place where I lose my phone drunk.
00:01:38
Steve
okay which And I wouldn't anyways. like I'm not a phone loser.
00:01:41
Sammi
I didn't think that you were just for the record.
00:01:42
Steve
thank Thank you. Thank you. I'm a wonderful person to drink with for the record. ah
00:01:48
Sammi
Agree.
00:01:48
Steve
So what ends up happening is I...
00:01:55
Sammi
I muted you on accident.
00:01:59
Sammi
I tried to mute myself. I can't unmute you. You have to unmute yourself.
00:02:05
Steve
Wow, I've been muted. Anyways, yeah. you but The world is trying to silence me. This is...
00:02:10
Sammi
You're like, what happened is I tried to mute myself because I'm hearing weird feedback in my headphones. since I was like, i was like i'll I'll mute myself. And then I muted you. Sorry. So what happened was...
00:02:22
Steve
Okay, so what happened was I had a few extra drinks and I decided to get an Uber to go home or a Lyft or whatever, just to be responsible and all that stuff. So I call the the Lyft or Uber. I don't remember which one it was, but there's this new safety features for drivers. And it's actually kind of nice because there's there's a problem, I think, in big cities where, you know, you order an Uber and everyone drives the same dumb Nissan or Toyota. And like there's a high probability of someone getting into the wrong car. And if you know someone's been drinking or something, they could get angry or like there's all kinds of stuff that can happen. Right. And you got to make sure the right person is getting into your vehicle.
00:03:00
Steve
So one out of every 20 times I have a driver who utilizes this safety feature basically, and they give you a like four digit code. you get in the car and they go, what's the code? and you go, it's, you know, one, two, three, four. And they go, okay, cool. So they know that like I'm me and they're them and everything's cool.
00:03:18
Steve
So I get in the car and then the person's like, Hey, what's your four digit code? And I'm like, Oh, and I go to get my phone and there's no phone. The phone is gone.
00:03:30
Steve
So I'm like, oh,
The Ride with Strangers
00:03:33
Sammi
Yeah.
00:03:34
Steve
right.
00:03:35
Steve
So then I'm like, I'm very confused. So I mean, I have to get out of the car. Like I can't be in the car anymore. My friends have already left.
00:03:45
Steve
So I am basically like trapped. And so my plan was at that point was i was like all right I'm to look for my phone for a while. And then I'm going to get on the bus and not pay. Like that was my best thing that I could figure out to do, which I normally wouldn't do that.
00:03:58
Sammi
yeah
00:04:00
Steve
But I feel like under the circumstances, you know, so I'm looking around. I'm just like, you know, in the street, I'm on the sidewalk. I'm like asking people. i'm like, Hey, did you anything?
00:04:12
Steve
no, no. no And all of a sudden they hear this voice, it's like, hey! And I look up and there's this like six foot five black trans woman, just like this like dominant figure looking down at me. And she goes, what are you doing?
00:04:28
Steve
And I go, I'm looking for my phone. She looks like, she's like, you're just walking around in circles staring at your feet. You look like someone who wants to get robbed. And I'm like, well, I may have already been robbed in this instance actually. I don't know what else they could take from me.
00:04:41
Sammi
You're like, if I look like that, it's because it may have happened.
00:04:44
Steve
Yeah. yeah So she's like, where are you going? I'm like, i live on the south side. She's like, that's where I'm going with my friends. Do you want me to take you home? And I'm like, yes.
00:04:54
Sammi
Wow, that's so nice.
00:04:54
Steve
So I know I just get a car with a stranger, but I was like, this feels safe and in this car with the two most jacked dudes I have ever seen in my entire life.
00:04:59
Sammi
Yeah.
00:05:04
Steve
Like it was like comical, like their arms didn't go all the way down. It was fucking awesome.
00:05:08
Sammi
Were you in the middle?
00:05:08
Steve
Yeah. Yeah, I'm just like, what a bunch shit piled up on her front seat. so it was like her driving. And we're in like a tiny, tiny little like Toyota Corolla, like an early 2000s Toyota Corolla.
00:05:20
Sammi
Yeah.
00:05:20
Steve
just And then these guys and um I'm in the middle. i'm like, hey, guys, I'm so excited.
00:05:24
Sammi
You're like, hi. Wow, that's nice.
00:05:27
Steve
And they're like, do you want to buy Coke? And I'm like, no, I don't have any money. I couldn't even Venmo you. I don't have a phone. Like, is that funny? And they're like, it's okay. And then they drop me off right at my house.
00:05:38
Steve
How great is that?
00:05:39
Sammi
wow that's nice
00:05:40
Steve
It was so nice. So, you know, a lot of people are like, don't get into cars with strangers. But I'm like, maybe sometimes. And so.
00:05:49
Sammi
Maybe sometimes it's okay to get in cars with strangers.
00:05:49
Steve
advice Yeah, yeah, it seemed like.
00:05:53
Sammi
that If you learn anything from this podcast, it's that you can get into cars with strangers sometimes. They may offer you drugs, um but you can say no.
00:05:58
Steve
Yeah. It's fine. Yeah. You don't have to buy them. That's the cool thing.
00:06:02
Sammi
Yeah, you can say no.
00:06:03
Steve
It's like people can be really nice and you know, they're not like, I'm not worth robbing, obviously. Like I don't even have money for whatever amount of cocaine they wanted
Tracking the Lost Phone
00:06:13
Steve
to sell me.
00:06:13
Steve
So, uh, so then I wake up the next morning and I'm like, well, I still have this problem wherein I do not have a phone. So I hop on my computer. and I do the the find my phone thing on my computer. And where does it show up?
00:06:30
Steve
Wonderful question, Sammy. It shows up at the, it's like the Milwaukee ah Jewish Family Services Center or something. And I'm like, what is that?
00:06:41
Sammi
You're like, I wasn't there. i don't think.
00:06:43
Steve
wasn't
00:06:44
Sammi
Yeah.
00:06:44
Steve
and So i like I call them and I'm like, hi, this is weird. ah like And I just leave a message because they're not open on weekends. like if They say straight up, like these are ours.
00:06:56
Steve
you know Please leave a message. We'll get back to you in the morning.
00:06:57
Sammi
Yeah.
00:06:59
Steve
So I leave a message. I'm hi, this is weird. My phone tracking thing says that like my phone is in your building. And I looked at the building. like I went on Google Maps. I did the Street View thing. And it's just like, it's its own building.
00:07:10
Steve
like they're It's not like attached to clean up.
00:07:12
Sammi
It's not like, oh yeah, yeah.
00:07:12
Steve
<unk> Yeah.
00:07:13
Sammi
Weird.
00:07:14
Steve
Or a restaurant or a bar or like there's no apartments. It's just a building. And I'm like, how, to why?
00:07:20
Sammi
weirded
00:07:21
Steve
And it's way on the east side, which is not where I was. And so then like I check an hour later just out of curiosity because maybe it moved. Like, I don't know what's going on here. And it did move.
00:07:36
Steve
And it was at a grocery store downtown.
00:07:38
Sammi
Oh.
00:07:38
Steve
the local metro market. So I'm thinking, okay, fine. I'm going to go down to the metro market and I guess I'm going to have to tackle someone in the dairy aisle. Like this is the only thing that makes sense. Like I'm just, um' I'm ready. I'm ready to go. I'm going to get that phone.
00:07:55
Steve
So I go to the grocery store and there's a security guard. I go, Hey, listen, I'm not a violent man. In fact, I've never been in a physical altercation in my life. but here's my situation. And someone in this grocery store has my phone.
00:08:09
Steve
And the security guard's like, nobody in this grocery store has your phone. I know where your phone is. I'm like, oh my God, that's amazing. Where is it? Points to a machine. And the machine is like this crime enabling vending machine, but it's like a reverse vending machine. So basically it's a machine and the machine's like, got an old cell phone, stick it in here. We'll give you a hundred dollars.
00:08:29
Steve
These things just exist. You just steal phones, shove it this machine. They give you a hundred bucks. So like, great. Can you open the the phone vending machines? Like now you got file police report and call the cops. So I do that.
00:08:40
Steve
I wait an hour. The cop comes, the cop spends another like 45 minutes on the phone with the reverse vending machine company, trying to get them to open it for her.
00:08:51
Sammi
wow
00:08:52
Steve
It's amazing. um Also, the smallest police officer I have ever seen in my entire life. Like, shorter than you, Sammy, I would say. Yeah, yeah like she was like, little, little.
00:09:01
Sammi
Shorter than 4'11". Wow.
00:09:06
Steve
And looked like she was like maybe 19 years old. I'm like, is this your first time doing policing? Like, what is going on?
00:09:14
Sammi
Rude.
00:09:15
Steve
I mean, I'm guessing they don't send their like SWAT teams for guy with a handle on phone.
00:09:19
Sammi
For, yeah, non-emergency incidents.
00:09:21
Steve
so murder
00:09:22
Sammi
Yeah.
00:09:24
Steve
So anyways, she she was very nice though. And then finally she opens up the machine and she goes, okay, get your phone out. Well, all the cases have have to be taken off the phones before you put them in the phone vending machine.
00:09:35
Steve
So I'm looking down at about 30 black iPhones, all of which are dead. Any of which can be mine.
00:09:40
Sammi
Ah. Hmm.
00:09:41
Steve
so I go, I don't, I don't know. And she's like, well, I don't know. Look, look a little harder. um i don't think there's make a difference. So I narrow it down based on what the camera looks like. I'm like, okay, like this, has this is the right model, but there's at least six of these.
00:09:56
Steve
So I'm like, I've narrowed it down to these. And she goes, and just take one, just take one.
Mistaken Identity and Medieval Times
00:10:02
Steve
We're not going to like figure this out. Okay. So I take a phone, ah go ah um and I'm like, okay, I got a phone.
00:10:10
Steve
Uh, don't have a way to charge it yet. And I'm about to leave. And, uh, you know, Sammy, sometimes when you don't have a phone, you find yourself, you know, you're not staring down at a screen, you're interacting with real life.
00:10:22
Steve
Right. Right. And so due to real life interactions, uh, I'm in the grocery store ah holding like six cell phones, trying to figure out which one is mine.
00:10:23
Sammi
Right?
00:10:33
Steve
And, uh, I get invited to go to medieval times by a, like a friend of a friend. Like, We got a work party tonight and somebody dropped out.
00:10:43
Sammi
You want to go to medieval times?
00:10:44
Steve
You want to go to the Times? And I'm like, yeah, this is what happened to me. I don't even have a phone. Like maybe it's one of these or whatever. And she's like, don't worry about it. We got a party bus. We'll pick you up.
00:10:56
Steve
So I go home with this cell phone.
00:10:57
Sammi
What the fuck?
00:10:59
Steve
I plug it in. It boots up. It is not mine. Like, it's just like, it's like on the lock screen.
00:11:02
Sammi
Oh.
00:11:04
Steve
My, my like number doesn't work. So it's, it's not mine. I'm like, all right, I don't have a phone. I get picked up in the party bus. I go to medieval times, the end.
00:11:13
Sammi
So what did you end up doing? Did you just like get a new phone?
00:11:17
Steve
just bought a new phone the next day. Like I came home from medieval times. I had my little paper crown ah proof that I did it too because they didn't just buy like regular tickets. It was like the VIP
00:11:28
Sammi
VIP royalty. Wow.
00:11:30
Steve
job row like like from the front.
00:11:32
Sammi
That's amazing.
00:11:35
Steve
One of the girls that are rogue got like the rose from the night guy.
00:11:39
Sammi
Whoa. I would tell everybody about that.
00:11:40
Steve
it was. Yeah, it was is like the most exciting time of my life basically. awesome
00:11:46
Sammi
my God.
00:11:47
Steve
10 out of 10. a real slice of American culture, too, if if you don't if you haven't been. i highly recommend it. Yeah.
00:11:53
Sammi
This is so interesting.
00:11:54
Steve
colorra yeah lived my life like This is This Yeah. So that I didn't have a phone, but now i do.
00:12:00
Sammi
Wow.
Sammy's Phone Reset Adventure
00:12:02
Sammi
You know, the only time that anything remotely close to that happened to me, which wasn't that close, was I was doing my 50 mile walk in 2021.
00:12:02
Steve
You know, the only that
00:12:13
Sammi
And I always kept my phone in my backpack. And at the time, I only see it's funny because I'm like, I cannot relate to seeing a sea of iPhones because like my Android saves me yet again.
00:12:25
Sammi
Um, but I'm like, I always keep it with me.
00:12:25
Steve
and
00:12:29
Sammi
And this was when there was a headphone jack. So I would, I would be listening to things with, you know, with the headphone jack and whatever. And for some reason, the way it was positioned in the backpack, it was being pressed in such a way that it factory reset my phone while I was hiking.
00:12:44
Steve
Oh my god. That's crazy.
00:12:47
Sammi
And so I lost everything. And I hadn't synced anything because um not smart. I don't know. I think this was right before we got Google Fi too. I don't remember. But I didn't have like any numbers synced. I lost all of my text message history. I lost every single person's number. Everybody's everything. Except for like a couple things that happened to sync with Google.
00:13:11
Sammi
forever ago, but I hadn't like intentionally synced anything because I'm so used to like you swap out your SIM card and it's all there.
00:13:20
Steve
Yeah.
00:13:20
Sammi
You don't have to worry about it. So yeah, everything was completely gone. And um it was like the worst thing 50 mile walk I had ever done anyway, because like a bunch of weird things had happened. Like um Tuck was supposed to come and then he came, but he was sick. And this was like the first year they were having it in person again and everybody was masked. And I'm like, you have to get out of here. You're sick. What the hell are you even doing here? You have to go. And so I'm like panicking and I'm like, get out of this ah a hotel. You're going to get other people's like, luckily he didn't have COVID, but he had like, I don't know what, it was just some virus, something else, but um he had like driven all this way and sick. So I was like angry walking And then my phone reset. So I had nothing to listen to. And I was walking with nobody. And so I was just like walking really fast. And my Fitbit wasn't working. It was like so dim. I couldn't see it. And so that year I bought a new phone and my Garmin. And these are I both I have them both still. This one's the screen's kind of cracked a shit on my phone, but so work. So I'm keeping it. But I would be able to notice it in a lineup.
00:14:27
Sammi
But that's the only thing that even remotely close happened to me. But I just there was nothing I could do. i just had I bought a brand new phone. I was like, fuck it. There's like there's nothing that can be done.
00:14:35
Steve
but um mean that that's really that that's what i got Now, the question I have, morally, ethically, what do I do with a phone that's not mine?
00:14:43
Sammi
With the other phone. Put it back in the machine, 100 bucks. no I'm just I'm kidding. i'm kiddingdding
00:14:49
Steve
Literally everyone I have talked to has been like, $100.
00:14:51
Sammi
but
00:14:52
Steve
Okay. and hundred dollars
00:14:55
Sammi
Yeah, just get $100. No, i don't know. i mean, yeah, I might. i I think if I was you, I would bring it back to the metro market and I would tell the security guard and just put it in the machine and not take any money from it.
00:15:09
Sammi
You know, like I would just be like, I'm going to return it.
00:15:10
Steve
ah player
00:15:12
Sammi
Is there a way that we can put it in there without me getting any money for it? And that's what I would do. Um, but yeah, interesting.
Shopping and No-Buy Period
00:15:21
Sammi
Uh, nothing that exciting has happened to me except for we're maybe looking at vacation land or properties, but as that advances, I will share more with all of you because who knows what's going to happen.
00:15:31
Steve
very exciting yeah comment below what should steve do with a random cell phone that's not his yeah okay so uh
00:15:32
Sammi
It's very exciting. Um,
00:15:38
Sammi
Yeah. Should Sammy buy land or an actually built house? um And then I got my hair done. And you said and I want you to say your compliment because I need it right now.
00:15:50
Sammi
We you said it offline. I'm like, you need to say, well, off the pod.
00:15:55
Steve
have to understand like if you if you're just listening, you're not watching like when Sammy is not like, you know, someone gets their hair done and it doesn't like it's just like whatever, right?
00:15:58
Sammi
Yeah, you should be watching.
00:16:05
Steve
When Sammy gets her hair done. There's also like a full ensemble like outfit thing that goes with her. So I told Sammy I'm like, like, I love your hair and and the outfit and everything.
00:16:15
Steve
And I was like, you are like a whole entity. Like you're not like, just like, oh, nice new hair. It's like a whole thing. n warm lonely for You one of one.
00:16:23
Sammi
A fully formed entity, I think you said. Yeah. Fully formed.
00:16:27
Steve
Yeah.
00:16:27
Sammi
Yeah.
00:16:28
Steve
you are an ay there is one of one
00:16:31
Sammi
Thank you. Thank you. I just discovered, well, didn't discover. I'm what such a colonizer. um Right after Thanksgiving, too. Yikes. um No.
00:16:43
Sammi
No. So i I've been getting ads for this company called Oxnit, and they have like all these like vintage-y you know sweaters and stuff. And I was like, I don't know if the quality is good or whatever. And I am like a new works addict. I have like so many new, like, it's so funny. Now it's gotten to the point. I have so many of them that if I wear something different, sometimes people will get mad at me.
00:17:08
Sammi
I've literally had this happen where people are like, why aren't you wearing a jumpsuit today? And I'm like, I do own other clothes.
00:17:14
Steve
She does own other clothes, yeah.
00:17:15
Sammi
And they're like, I mean, but like, but like that, that's your thing. And I'm like, I have other things. Okay. I have other clothing. Um,
00:17:22
Steve
fully formed it's not just the jumpsuits okay
00:17:25
Sammi
Yeah, they were like so mad. But i was it was like one of my most uncharacteristic outfits, but i was still very colorful. It was like a very colorful flannel, you know? And I was like, I think that this still looks like me. And they're like, you're not allowed to wear flannel. I'm like, but I like flannel. So anyway, that was weird. But um but yeah, the New Works people in my little cult that I'm in ah said that they like Oxnit. And there was like one couple that they like dress alike a lot of the times like they'll go to events and sometimes they'll even wear matching patterns or like things that really coordinate and she was like yeah my husband's like starting to like these shirts even more than like new works and he's buying them more and I was like oh okay cool that's good to know so I bought this one to try it out I sent the link to talk because there was a bunch of like men's clothing and then he like responded with a screenshot of his cart and he was like I like these
00:18:19
Sammi
And I was like, okay, don't buy anything. um And then I bought a bunch for, don't know if he's up here or not, but I bought a bunch for black, on a Black Friday sale and they were all like 20% off.
00:18:24
Steve
You're going have to send me a link to this. thing I'm going
00:18:30
Sammi
And they even have like a mystery thing where you spend $50 and you get three mystery ones.
00:18:32
Steve
Hmm.
00:18:36
Sammi
You just put in like you know do you want women's men's and what size and they'll just send it to you so i bought three mystery ones for me and then i think i bought four like things for him like two he liked and then two that i think he'll like that he probably didn't see or he's colorblind and so he didn't know it's called knit i will put it in the podcast notes too i wish i had a referral code um but it's really a cool place um
00:18:52
Steve
what's the What's the name of the company again? What's it? ne
00:19:00
Steve
Okay.
00:19:04
Steve
Maybe 2026 is going to be my year of Sammy core for like my...
00:19:08
Sammi
I mean, these these clothes are good.
00:19:08
Steve
Trademark simple.
00:19:11
Sammi
I mean, I just have to say. And if someone wants to coin. Yeah. If you want to coin Sammy core and make that a thing, that's awesome.
00:19:18
Steve
remarkable ah
00:19:20
Sammi
But yeah, they have really good. They have really good stuff. Did I put it? Did you find it?
00:19:25
Steve
I did.
00:19:26
Sammi
Okay. Yeah.
00:19:27
Steve
Got it.
00:19:28
Sammi
Okay, good. ah Yeah, you should buy things there and i will try to get a referral code. um But they have really nice like knit things.
00:19:33
Steve
There you go.
00:19:36
Sammi
Like I wasn't sure because it's quite affordable. And I was like, are these going to be any good?
Holiday Mishaps and Corporate Life
00:19:41
Sammi
And people have said, I mean, you know, it's like you care for your knit things differently. I don't tend to dry basically anything that I own at this point.
00:19:48
Sammi
Um, so it's like, if you are good at caring for your things, I think they'll last a long time. It sounds like the people who have bought it said, oh yeah, several washes, no issues, whatever. Um, and this is like thicker than I thought it would be like in the pictures that kind of looked like thinner and flimsier.
00:20:01
Steve
Thank you.
00:20:04
Sammi
Like this is like, okay, millennial women might get this. Um, but you know, once you hit a certain age and then you start going to loft, um There's a bunch of like loft sweaters that I own that are a lot thinner than this.
00:20:17
Sammi
that And they just after a year or two, it's like the collar starts to get a little wavy and you're just like, I just feel like this is kind of falling apart. This one, I got it. I like I was like, oh, this is like more substantial than I thought it was.
00:20:29
Sammi
So that made me happy. So i was like, all right, well, I'll get some mystery ones and see what happens. But I also feel like I need to address what you may be seeing, and that is like tape in the corner of my glasses.
00:20:40
Sammi
Maybe you didn't notice. Maybe I'm just calling attention to it now.
00:20:42
Steve
Now we're all staring.
00:20:43
Sammi
Yeah, come look at it.
00:20:43
Steve
Yep. Hmm.
00:20:44
Sammi
um The day before Thanksgiving, I was just cleaning off my glasses and then my hand went like this and my frame just snapped.
00:20:54
Steve
okay
00:20:54
Sammi
And the lens popped out. And I went, this is the worst possible day for this to happen. Because it was Wednesday night. And it's not like my vision care place is going to be open until Monday. So I was like, what do I do? And then Tuck super glued it and put tape on it. And um so if you see that, just know that I'm doing my best. None of my old... um Whatchamacolums, my old glasses really work for me.
00:21:26
Sammi
I'm getting yelled at by my computer. Okay, anyway. What the hell?
00:21:32
Steve
You're just getting yelled at.
00:21:32
Sammi
it's Yeah, it's telling me my battery is low, but I'm literally charging the battery on my mouse. I don't know. Anyway, it's like 0% remaining, and I'm like, it is plugged in, and the light is green. so don't know.
00:21:46
Sammi
I just got four notifications about my mouse.
00:21:47
Steve
What
00:21:51
Steve
what are you going to
00:21:51
Sammi
I feel like they were delayed. um Anyway, so that's the kind of life that I'm having right now. Nothing too calamitous except for the fact that, yeah, it was literally, and I was prepping a bunch of food and I'm like, I can't see anything.
00:22:06
Sammi
And I was just like helpless as he was fixing it. And I was wearing my old glasses and I was like sitting this close to the screen, you know, was just like, oh, I was like, this sucks.
00:22:14
Steve
I don't care anymore.
00:22:17
Sammi
This sucks so bad. i am Velma in real life. So it was not is not a good situation.
00:22:20
Steve
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. I
00:22:23
Sammi
I have dressed up as Velma too for Halloween for anyone wondering. Of course I have. um Oh, real quick before we get into network. oh Gosh, we're going to to put a timestamp for like, if you want to actually hear about network, you'll have to go to this minute.
00:22:35
Steve
want to hear about the movie. Yeah. Yeah.
00:22:36
Sammi
Um, What did you do anything for Halloween? Did you dress up? We've like even talked for i don't even know how long outside of you losing your phone and talking about you losing your phone.
00:22:43
Steve
I don't know.
00:22:46
Steve
I really didn't. Like i had to i had to travel a bunch for work and stuff. So I haven't done anything for Halloween really.
00:22:50
Sammi
Yeah.
00:22:52
Steve
um And yeah, Thanksgiving was pretty low key uneventful. So um yeah, other than like chaotic things happening to me, um my day to day is fairly mundane.
00:23:03
Steve
Just a lot of work, a lot of work.
00:23:04
Sammi
Just a lot of corporate BS.
00:23:05
Steve
A lot of corporate BS.
00:23:06
Sammi
um
00:23:08
Steve
Yeah, I'm a corporate man over here. So I got drunk and lost my phone and then I went to medieval.
00:23:12
Sammi
Yeah, bro.
00:23:14
Steve
Then I worked my corporate job, yeah.
00:23:15
Sammi
And I'm just doing like the most Wisconsin things ever.
00:23:15
Steve
enough like
00:23:18
Sammi
That's all I'm ever doing. I'm just like, well, you know, I went out to the middle of the state and looked at the, I went, well, it was a leaf peeping.
00:23:24
Steve
i know it's like i i texted you the other day you're like oh i'm in where were you that's stephen's point where you're ah oh i saw oh yeah wasa they got like a tv channel at the station though like they're real that's ah that's the city that's the big time oh yeah
00:23:30
Sammi
Wausau. Yeah. Yeah.
00:23:37
Sammi
They have, they there is a Northwoods baseball league. Did you know that? They have a team. Yeah. Town of 40,000 people. And there's a festival there and a cousin subs and toppers and yeah.
00:23:50
Steve
That's all you need
00:23:51
Sammi
And Rocky Rococo. What more do you need? See, we're we're like being up in the corner of the state. We're so deprived because we're an hour away from the closest cousins or Rocky Rococos.
00:23:58
Steve
you need.
00:24:02
Sammi
It's really it's tough. It is really tough. At least we have a festival. Thank God we have a festival. But that's a new development as of like a year. So and then and then, oh, my God. OK, I'm going to rant for a second.
00:24:13
Sammi
This is so Wisconsin core. OK, so Sammy Court also includes Wisconsin core.
00:24:16
Steve
but
00:24:20
Sammi
Everyone should know that.
00:24:20
Steve
Oh, absolutely.
00:24:21
Sammi
But I feel like I'm one of the most Wisconsin people and maybe people don't know that, but I am one of the most Wisconsin people you'll ever meet. Um, so, so,
Festival Foods Loyalty
00:24:30
Sammi
okay. So ah where I live is essentially Minnesota, but it's not, it's Wisconsin, but people will say that they'll be like, well, it's basically like we live in Minnesota.
00:24:38
Sammi
And I'm like, but we don't, we live in Wisconsin, but people up here, forget that. They just say, yeah.
00:24:42
Steve
Don't tread on me.
00:24:43
Sammi
Yeah, like they don't get it. Like I had to teach. I feel like I mentioned that on a podcast like ah like a few months ago, like a teacher was like, oh, so you're basically in Minnesota. And i was like, no, like I answered so fast. so I think I surprised everybody in the room. was like, no. Um, but anyway, so they don't really know fest, like there are festivals in Minnesota, but they are owned by a different company. Like the parent company is different. And so like the model is a little different. I mean, it's still, I like it, but it's still, it's different.
00:25:16
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:25:16
Sammi
And so they don't know what like the Wisconsin festivals are like. And so when there was news in our city about like a new grocery store opening and festival had put in like an application for a liquor license or whatever, you know, to to operate.
00:25:33
Sammi
ah There were a lot of comments on like Facebook and stuff from people being like, I've never even heard of this place. Someone even called it a no name grocery store.
00:25:43
Steve
Wow.
00:25:44
Sammi
A no-name grocery store. That offended me.
00:25:48
Steve
I mean, I definitely fuck with festival foods, man. That's, that's,
00:25:50
Sammi
Festival is my favorite grocery store. Everyone should know that about me. It is my all time favorite grocery store. I think they have the best deli section. They have a great bulk food section.
00:26:02
Sammi
And when you walk in, it's like there's the produce and then like all the food for the special diets is like right there. So it's like literally I just have to go to one part of the store and I get all of my grocery shopping done.
00:26:14
Sammi
I don't even have to go to the rest of the grocery store. It's awesome. So I love it.
00:26:17
Steve
Yeah.
00:26:18
Sammi
Their pickup is wonderful. I do curbside pickup like once a week. Actually, i have to do my order today and they're just phenomenal. But they were like, oh, we should get like Lunds and Byerly's, which I don't think a lot of people outside of Minnesota know what Lunds and Byerly's is.
00:26:34
Steve
No? Yeah.
00:26:34
Sammi
It's kind of like, OK, wait, you probably weren't around for the V. Richards days. um Do you you know um Fresh Market in Brookfield or like um I'm trying to think.
00:26:45
Sammi
It's like a bougie grocery store. It's very bougie, but it's like overpriced.
00:26:48
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:26:49
Sammi
It's not like bougie, but it's good. It's just like you pay a lot extra for stuff that you could get other places for cheaper, um in my opinion. And we have another like fancy grocery store out here called Kowalski's, which is kind of like Sendix, but a little bit fancier.
00:27:06
Sammi
And that I feel like you pay more, but you do get more. Like there's more interesting things to buy They have like a really nice cheese section, which is a priority for Wisconsinite always and me especially.
00:27:22
Sammi
So you can get like any kind of cheese you can dream of there. But yeah, Lund's is just like, it's not a place where you would do everyday grocery shopping unless you're like an elitist a-hole, in my opinion.
00:27:34
Steve
Yeah.
00:27:35
Sammi
And so when people, people are like, oh, well, we should have a Lund's here, not this no-name festival grocery store.
00:27:35
Steve
Agreed.
00:27:41
Sammi
And I'm like, the most the biggest problem we have in our city in terms of shopping is that we have one grocery store with like a big one with no competition And so I think it's overpriced.
00:27:51
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:27:52
Sammi
So I'm like, we need to have something that comes in that's actually affordable and has like ah like a wide variety of products that you can't get there. And ah now ever since they moved in a year ago, now everyone's like, oh my God, this is the best place ever.
00:28:07
Sammi
I love festival. Oh, like they're amazing. This is the best thing that we've ever gotten. And I'm like, I remember when you were all complaining about it and I'm not going to forget about it. Okay.
00:28:16
Sammi
Yeah. i i' say I've got screenshots. ah
00:28:21
Steve
One thing I'll say about Festival is it is the only time I've gone and like actually bought crab legs from a grocery store because they were so cheap.
00:28:33
Steve
I felt like it wasn't an opulent purchase.
00:28:33
Sammi
Nice.
00:28:35
Steve
i thought it was it was It genuinely felt like something that I could buy as a normal human being. And that that was a amazing.
00:28:41
Sammi
Wow.
00:28:42
Steve
so Yeah, but then I'm like, what?
00:28:43
Sammi
I mean, i think their prices are very good and their deli is really great. And yeah, all their like fresh stuff is really nice. um And they're employee owned in Wisconsin.
00:28:54
Steve
Hey, we love that. That's
00:28:55
Sammi
Yeah, that's I mean, Festival and Woodman's have my heart forever because they're employee owned grocery stores.
00:28:59
Steve
right, baby.
00:29:00
Sammi
And I think that's why everybody's nice there because they're getting paid well.
00:29:03
Steve
Mm-hmm. I think so,
00:29:05
Sammi
So you should support them. They also supported our local pride because they do like hot dog sales or whatever, like they have a hot dog cart.
00:29:10
Steve
too. Ooh.
00:29:14
Sammi
And so they actually reached out to us and said, we want to fundraise for your pride event and we want to do a hot dog day for you, which was really nice.
00:29:14
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:29:23
Sammi
So. They really like being part of the community. And so we love them. Okay. Anyway, let's talk about ah bad corporate things.
00:29:32
Steve
but This is great. We're just like, Sammy and I have have dedicated ourselves now since we're sort of in this, like, I don't know, this weird in-betweeny
Analyzing 'Network' and Modern Media
00:29:43
Sammi
Liminal space. Yeah.
00:29:43
Steve
space.
00:29:44
Steve
We're in a liminal podcasting space.
00:29:44
Sammi
Yeah.
00:29:46
Steve
It was like, everyonewhile let's just let's let's do a movie about how everything right now is bad. like like what What are the movies that accurately capture the feeling of of the time that we are in?
00:29:58
Sammi
Yeah. Yeah.
00:29:58
Steve
And I think it's interesting that we started with um a movie that was made in the 1950s.
00:30:05
Sammi
yeah
00:30:05
Steve
And we've we've gone ahead now to the 1970s, covering Network, previously Facing the Crowd. And network was made in the mid 1970s. But again, it's like, we've been handed something on a silver platter that feels like it is very of the moment, which is a testament to the brilliance of network because it is probably like one of the most timeless films that you can watch about like the state of, of like media and, and corporate control and government propaganda and how people are swayed by things.
00:30:23
Sammi
yeah
00:30:40
Steve
And, and, basically what it boils down to and I think you can boil down like a lot of um you know populist folks specifically those on the right that have been ah so successful over the past few years it is wild to me like I will never give it over the fact that Donald Trump is a man who despises the poor and yeah he has no idea how normal human beings live and he shits in a golden toilet and yet people look at him and say well
00:31:00
Sammi
Yeah.
00:31:11
Steve
He's one of us. And I'm like, how do you identify with someone like this? And Network is a movie, their core thesis sort of sums up why someone like Donald Trump can be so popular.
00:31:22
Steve
And the answer is, is because he articulates the pain and the concerns and the frustrations of the masses. Now, where does he put that pain? Well, he puts it on things that that don't deserve it.
00:31:36
Steve
So I got to tell you, the reason your life sucks, it's not trans people that are making your life suck. Okay.
00:31:42
Sammi
Right.
00:31:43
Steve
It's not immigrants that are making your life suck. Remember the phone story I told at the beginning?
00:31:47
Sammi
I was just going to say, they might give you a ride home.
00:31:48
Steve
of I literally have my life saved by a trans woman. Are you kidding me? Her name was Portia. Shout out Portia. If you're listening, I fucking love you, man.
00:31:57
Sammi
Thanks, Portia.
00:31:58
Steve
Thanks, Portia. You saved my life. Like genuinely. ah So but the point is, is like they they they point at these, you know, marginalized groups because it's easy to basically stomp on them and to point at something and say,
00:32:13
Steve
Your life is shitty because there's this other group of people over here who have it pretty bad. And, and you know what, you should just stomp on them. And it's, it's sort of distracts you from the reality, like your material reality, what's going on. But that's it. You know, as soon as someone says like, yeah, it's fucked up. And, and you know, it's, it's this thing that is causing you pain.
00:32:33
Steve
Well, then you get riled up about it. But the thing is, is like, even if you hate trans people deep in your heart, cause you're an idiot,
00:32:35
Sammi
Right.
00:32:41
Steve
I got to tell you, your material conditions are not changing. that's not It's not going to fix anything. And that's important to remember. And when you watch a movie like Network, it's incredible because they articulate the same thing. And you're getting fed this sort of like corporate media version of you know radical politics.
00:33:00
Steve
And the the one difference in Network is... they sort of posit that, oh, like, wouldn't it be weird if like, you know, hardcore left-wing politics were the like deciding factor for for, you know, populist movements or whatever.
00:33:16
Steve
And you would think, cause at the time that actually made sense. And now somehow that's wrong completely.
00:33:19
Sammi
Right.
00:33:21
Steve
And I don't think anybody saw that coming. ah But then instead of like MAGA, you've got, you know, the Mao Zedong hour.
00:33:33
Steve
giving Giving like an hour of time to to these like Maoist radical ah like sleeper cells and all this time. And the the thing that really sticks out to me about this is you get to watch these people who are radical and they basically throw their belief systems away.
00:33:53
Steve
to draw an audience, to collect money.
00:33:56
Sammi
Right.
00:33:56
Steve
And they justify it to themselves because they say, well, if I have you know more wealth and power and influence, then I'm able to you know do politics better or whatever.
00:34:06
Steve
But what they end up doing is just compromising their ideology and their belief system. So yeah, and gee whiz, ah how many people do you think work for a major news network and actually believe the insane things that they're spouting?
00:34:21
Steve
Like I have to believe there's a good portion of the people that are on Fox news. Like, are you telling me like Tucker Carlson doesn't wake up every morning and go, I'm kind of full of shit. Like he, know these people know it.
00:34:31
Sammi
He has to know. Yeah.
00:34:34
Steve
They just do it because they're that evil and that Craven and they don't have any connection to their own ideology. And network basically puts that all on display. So one of the best movies ever.
00:34:44
Steve
That's, that's it.
00:34:45
Sammi
Yeah.
00:34:45
Steve
That's me stepping off my soapbox. Now, please say me.
00:34:47
Sammi
No, that was so good.
00:34:48
Steve
Yeah.
00:34:48
Sammi
No, thank you for that. Um, Yeah, I mean, I was excited to rewatch this because I hadn't watched it in several years. And it was, yeah, it's like there's always something I think you can pull out of this movie based on whatever is going on at the time.
00:35:01
Sammi
And again, i will direct you all to the culture of narcissism. I think it's a great book. I don't love all of the book, but I think there's a lot of really good gems in there that align with a lot of what gets covered in this movie. Yeah.
00:35:15
Sammi
Oh, my gosh. I had ah another parallel that I was going to. Oh, um there's a new this is so bonkers that this is on Netflix, but there's a new Netflix documentary that just came out. Oh, what is it called? Buy Now or something like that.
00:35:30
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:35:31
Sammi
I have to find it really quick. I'll put that in there. Yeah. Buy now the shopping conspiracy. um I will put that in the notes as well. um But i'm I'm like midway through it right now. And then Tuck was like, well, i want to watch this with you. And I was like, i just kind of want to preview it. Yeah, I couldn't wait. um But it's really good. It's all about you know the things that make us shop. and And I've been talking to talk about doing like a no-buy month or a no-buy year, like going into the new year. like I have a lot of clothes. I have more clothes than I need. i have you know like i've got a lot I've got plenty. I mean, I don't tend to buy excessively one way or another. I'd rather spend my money on good quality things than like ah like a large volume of things. I've only bought one thing from Shein, and it was like...
00:36:19
Sammi
2017 or 2018 before I knew what she and really was, you know, and then I was like, oh, that's disgusting.
00:36:23
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:36:25
Sammi
I'm never going to buy anything from there again, you know. um But this documentary talks about all of the things, you know, like on Amazon and with like they use a lot of fashion because of fast fashion and everything. um to cover why why you buy so much. and and what ah And it's interesting because they interview a UX designer who worked at Amazon for 15 years.
Consumerism and Ethical Media
00:36:51
Sammi
They also interview like an executive who worked at Adidas like in the early 2000s, early mid 2000s, when they kind of like went from crashing to blossoming. And he straight up says, like, I feel like I did things that were really bad and I don't agree with it and they don't sit right with me anymore. So I want to talk about it.
00:37:13
Sammi
um And he's like, looking back, I wish I had done things differently. And the UX designer also talks about that. Like, I totally... I read a book, too, about someone who was at Amazon in the early years, and I totally get wanting to be there then.
00:37:26
Sammi
That would be so exciting, you know, because it's like, you know, she talks about the challenge then was, can we get anyone to buy a pair of jeans online? Like nobody was shopping online.
00:37:37
Sammi
It was such a weird concept. You know, and it's like to be there starting then when it's like, oh, my gosh, anything is possible.
00:37:39
Steve
Yeah.
00:37:45
Sammi
And it doesn't feel like the slimiest thing. It's just like most people still like shopping in stores. So we're just doing something novel and interesting to like we are. you know, we're testing 15 versions of colors on buttons and text to directly dial into what's going to convince you to buy now, you know, that there was like a patent on or like a trademark on the term, like one click shopping and, ah you know, and you're like, oh, that's so slimy.
00:38:15
Sammi
um
00:38:15
Steve
Anywhere? Anywhere?
00:38:16
Sammi
There's a great book. It's called Exit Interview, The Life and Death of My Ambitious Career, written by Christy Coulter, who is actually part of um an accountability like focus group I'm in.
00:38:28
Sammi
And she said she used the space to like ah write this book. She puts it in her acknowledgments, which was really cool. I was like, ah, I was like, I read your book. Um, so that's a really great book too, for anyone who wants to like learn about kind of like those early years and then going from like, I'm doing something really interesting to like, oh my gosh, am I the bad guy?
00:38:47
Sammi
Like that, you know? And I, I think that there's, you know, in, in retail, in news, in any industry, you know, it's like, I feel like I've spent so much of my career gut checking myself, you know, like working in advertising, working in marketing.
00:38:49
Steve
Yeah.
00:39:04
Sammi
I'm always like, I There's certain lines that I have never crossed and will never cross. And and I know that I have said no to a lot of money and opportunities because of that and have gotten probably blacklisted in places I don't even know I've been blacklisted in because of the things I say and the things that I do. um So it's always fascinating and interesting to me to hear these people who are in positions that like 20-year-old Sammy would have probably really looked up to.
00:39:32
Steve
Yeah.
00:39:32
Sammi
And then like, wow, like this is like a big wig in a news company in in a fashion brand and whatever. And wow, they're so influential. And then to hear them say, like, I feel dirty, you know, it's like it's I don't know, it's it's kind of edifying. But yeah, it's so interesting because I feel the same way in network. It's like.
00:39:53
Sammi
There's there's certain things that are happening in the movie that I'm like, wow, like he's going out there and he's saying what everybody's thinking. But then when you like peel back the curtain further and you see him start to kind of like get into this phase more and more and then you're like, wait.
00:40:08
Sammi
Oh, we're getting, you know, it's like that, um you know, like identity framing and all that stuff, you know, where you're like, oh, you're getting a glimpse of him. and then when you start seeing the full picture, it becomes uglier and uglier. And you're like, oh, I don't look up to this person. And oh, you're not trying to.
00:40:29
Sammi
like promote this yeah like radical ideology in a way that actually transforms anything, you're commoditizing it. you know like It's becoming a product.
00:40:39
Steve
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:40:41
Sammi
It's becoming entertainment. And when I watch this back, like I don't think I have watched this since I watched Nightcrawler. And I really was reminded of Nightcrawler watching this, you know, where it's like in in that movie, crime, everyday true crime, especially in white suburban affluent neighborhoods is, you know, is a product, is something that gets ratings and that gets you money.
00:41:07
Sammi
And so, you know, the whole like Jake Gyllenhaal talks about how like he starved himself to look like a hungry ravenous coyote or whatever, you know, in the Yeah.
00:41:16
Steve
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:41:17
Sammi
And he just constantly like he had that like, you know, scary look the whole movie.
00:41:17
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:41:22
Sammi
And, you know, to hear like the talk of the the programming side of things, you know, Faye Dunaway's character talking about like how she is designing the programming in a way that sells like, oh, yeah.
00:41:37
Sammi
you know, heiress becomes a radical and, you know, takes over a bank. And wow, that's so interesting, you know, like that class play and everything. So that was that was something that really struck me about like watching the movie again yeah, it's like, how far are you going to go? Like you said, but you know,
00:41:56
Sammi
before you compromise your morals. and And to see, like, you see these two sides, like this establishment news guy who's still trying to hold on to integrity, monitor his friend, but he still, like, wants something more, too.
00:42:12
Sammi
You know, it's like he's connecting with this young woman. It's a power play. But then she's also using him to get ahead in her career. It's not like she's some helpless victim by any means.
00:42:24
Sammi
um
00:42:24
Steve
Oh, no. Yeah. Yeah.
00:42:25
Sammi
But yeah,
00:42:25
Steve
And that's the thing. It's just like everyone is fully motivated by their individual desires. Like there's, there's no like collectivism.
00:42:33
Sammi
There's no hero.
00:42:34
Steve
and oh here There's no good guys.
00:42:34
Sammi
Yeah.
00:42:36
Steve
It's like, and even when you are presented with something that you think is like, okay, like here is a collectivist group. Like you have the, um, like the, the radical terrorist cell or whatever, and they are yeah ah allegedly they're like, oh, well, we have to like, you know, funnel this money into the communist party or something like that.
00:42:56
Steve
But all they're doing is arguing for individual enrichment and not actually trying to fund or advance their own politics.
00:43:00
Sammi
Right.
00:43:05
Steve
And Faye Dunaway's character is amazing too, because she's aptly pointed out as a like the first generation of of people who were raised on television.
00:43:18
Steve
Like that, that's what they know.
00:43:19
Sammi
Right.
00:43:21
Steve
So we always talk about like, Oh, like screen babies with their iPads and all this stuff.
00:43:24
Sammi
Yeah. iPad babies. Yeah.
00:43:26
Steve
This has been a serious like concern, like pearl clutching hand wringing issue for decades and decades and decades. Like the format changes, but the concerns remain the same.
00:43:38
Steve
Like screen time is nothing new. And It's so interesting because the way that they position her then is like, this is all she has ever known is she's only known things that have been filtered through the television.
00:43:49
Steve
And so that's where her mind goes all the time. And it sort of drives her character too, because she's constantly climbing, climbing, climbing the corporate ladder, but to what end?
00:44:01
Steve
It's almost like power for power's sake to the point where one point she's like having sex, talking about what she could do for the daytime TV schedule.
00:44:10
Sammi
Yes.
00:44:13
Sammi
Right, because that's because that is what i mean that's what gets her off.
00:44:14
Steve
That's
00:44:17
Sammi
like she's that's all She's got this one-track mind.
00:44:18
Steve
what literally gets her off. unfortunate Yeah.
00:44:21
Sammi
you know and then yeah And then she's opposite you know this guy who's trying to...
00:44:22
Steve
Yeah.
00:44:27
Sammi
oh my gosh, I'm trying to remember his character's name. um ah Max Schumacher?
00:44:34
Steve
Are talking about Mac? Yeah.
00:44:35
Sammi
Yeah.
00:44:35
Steve
Yep.
00:44:35
Sammi
Yeah, so he's like he's trying to like hold it all together.
00:44:36
Steve
Goodbye.
00:44:39
Sammi
like I feel like he is... the most stable person in the movie, although that's kind of a tough, you know, but it's, but it's like, he's also like, you know, having to answer to this board and, you know, and like figure out like, but he's like literally trying to like hold this like breaking thing together.
00:44:48
Steve
Yeah, right.
00:45:01
Sammi
But he also is like unfulfilled.
00:45:04
Steve
Mm-hmm. Yep.
00:45:05
Sammi
In his life or feels like he's supposed to have something more.
00:45:05
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:45:08
Sammi
I think, you know, it's like he was kind of more of a behind the scenes guy. He never really had his like spotlight moment to the same degree. And so I think it's like he's trying to hold on to being like young and relevant.
00:45:21
Sammi
That's what it feels like to me. But he also is like pulled in this direction by, you know, all these other characters who are like, well, the stakeholders aren't going to like this and our advertisers are going to pull support.
00:45:33
Sammi
The president's going to call you about this, you know, whatever. So I think that makes for some really interesting tension. But he is kind of the voice of reason.
00:45:43
Sammi
Yeah.
00:45:44
Steve
now ye Yeah, because well the the whole idea is Howard Beale, as he starts out, he's he's just a regular news guy on the lowest rated evening news show on TV, basically.
00:45:45
Sammi
You know, but he's not the voice of the people the way like Beale is like, you know, people, you know, it's I forgot how it started. Like, I haven't watched it in so long. I forgot that he like announced on television, like, I'm going to kill myself on air in two weeks.
00:46:10
Steve
like of Of all the four major networks, there's lot
00:46:12
Sammi
Or at one week, sorry. Not two weeks.
00:46:15
Steve
And so they're they're they pretty much are like, we're forcing you out, you know, whatever. It's time to retire. we got to change things up, et cetera, et cetera. So this is all very like like mundane, normal stuff.
00:46:26
Steve
And then he sort of has a bit of a breakdown. And yeah, to what what you said, he he just announces on air. He's like, yeah, this is all bullshit. And I'm just going to kill myself.
00:46:37
Sammi
I'm going to blow my brains out in one week.
00:46:39
Steve
Yeah. Which again, like 1976, this is a shocking thing to say. If that happens, yeah, that makes sense that someone would say that.
00:46:43
Sammi
Yeah, they're like,
00:46:46
Steve
And what ends up happening is he says that and people, I mean, the the ratings spike and they decide it's like, well, we should probably keep him out the air because if he says he's going to kill himself, people are definitely going to tune in for something like that.
00:47:01
Steve
And What they end up doing is you know he he just keeps ranting and and raving about you know the corporate power structure and this and that and the other thing.
00:47:10
Sammi
Yeah, life is bullshit.
00:47:12
Steve
Life is bullshit, basically.
00:47:12
Sammi
Yeah.
00:47:13
Steve
And people are like, yeah, life is bullshit. And he doesn't even point to anything particularly concrete. And meanwhile, he's doing this ranting and raving, and his mental state is declining rapidly.
00:47:25
Steve
And what they find out is that if you have someone like a Howard Beale or an Alex Jones or a Candace Owens or any of these very like polarizing, just sensationalist figures in the media, people will tune in because that shit is crazy. And also people like to feel like they are being heard, that you are you know expressing their needs. And As the the Howard Beale show goes from a very typical just, you know, just the facts news show into something more sensationalized with like, oh, here's a fortune teller and a computer.
00:48:05
Steve
And like, there's all this other stuff that they bring in.
00:48:07
Sammi
Yeah, like and rotate around these special talking heads. Yeah.
00:48:12
Steve
It becomes almost like like a weird late-night panel show set
Media Sensationalism and Corporate Control
00:48:16
Steve
up. It's this whole production, and at the center of it is Howard Beale and his ranting and and raving and deteriorating mind.
00:48:25
Steve
And people connect with this, even even as a catchphrase, which is, we're mad as hell. We're not going to take it anymore, which is great because that expresses everything.
00:48:34
Sammi
Right.
00:48:37
Steve
It's like, you're mad at what? And you're not going to take any, what are you going to do? And there's no answers there. the The answer is just like, yeah, fuck this shit. It's just anger for anger's sake. And a call and and there's no call to action. There's no there's nothing to do.
00:48:52
Steve
And the one time, you know once we get into oh the rise of Howard Beale, the one time that there's a true call to action. Howard Beale finds out that the, you know, big corporate entity that owns UBS, which is the, like the news channel, he finds out that, you know, they've got all this money tied up in Saudi Arabia and, you know It's this corporate conglomerate and yada, yada, yada. So he starts ranting about this, and he says, you know if you allow this deal to go through with the Saudis, then $2 billion dollars are going to go to Saudi Arabia and this, that, and the other thing. So I want you right now to write your your the the president, and we're going send all these telegrams to the president. We're to stop this deal.
00:49:39
Steve
And even though Howard Beale is set up as this you know messiah figure who's raging against the machine, he is still a part of this major network. He is a part of the corporation. And so he ends up meeting with the head of this corporation who closes the shades and tells him point blank, there are no individuals, there are no nations, there are no people, there are no money. Everything is just corporate but bullshit and nothing matters and you are insignificant.
00:50:07
Steve
And fuck it, man. Basically. And then Howard becomes his puppet for that line. You know, he's, he's been completely broken and it's just great because it's just another person who is compromised to this end.
00:50:22
Steve
He's radical as he is. Like, if you think that like Alex Jones is some super radical who would never be, you know, ah pushed around by the corporate media. Are you fucking kidding me? oh i love This guy, come on.
00:50:31
Sammi
Right. I mean, all he does is sell stuff.
00:50:35
Steve
Yeah. He just sells like boner pills and like brain gum.
00:50:38
Sammi
colloidal silver and you know like doomsday food buckets
00:50:42
Steve
murf gun Have you seen the colloidal silver like Papa Smurf guy?
00:50:45
Sammi
yeah of course that was like was was he on montel or what show was he on yeah and he was like people look at me funny because i'm blue yeah yeah
00:50:46
Steve
love that man. Yeah, that was like 30 years ago or more. oh
00:50:57
Steve
Yeah, brother. um Yeah, it's great stuff. And you know that that that time when he like insults the Saudi deal and and calls people to action, that is the only time anyone ever gets mad at him. Meanwhile, in another episode, Howard Beale's like...
00:51:11
Steve
there's this is bullshit, the television's bullshit, nobody reads, everyone should just turn off their TV. Can you imagine? Like, you you have a TV show, and the host of the TV show is telling you to turn off your TV?
00:51:18
Sammi
Yeah.
00:51:20
Steve
No one gets rid of that.
00:51:20
Sammi
Yeah, that was that was very radical, I thought, yeah, to say, turn off your TV and, you know, go out to your window and go yell right now, you know, and everybody did it, which was, you know, which it was very much a face in the crowd.
00:51:22
Steve
Yeah.
00:51:27
Steve
Yeah. Totally.
00:51:31
Sammi
Everyone bring your dog, you know, type of moment.
00:51:33
Steve
Totally.
00:51:35
Sammi
It was very similar to that. But yeah, like, you know, um so yeah, Faye Dunaway's character, Diana Christensen, was like, oh, this guy. Yeah, like, you know, so she looks at it and goes, we can turn news into programming.
00:51:49
Sammi
What would be wrong with that? And, you know, this is also like they were having these budgetary challenges. So they're like news was its own division, right? As it should be. News should be its own division.
00:52:01
Sammi
And instead, or yeah, like, or sorry, not it became its own division. It was a leading segment. It was a big part of the network was news.
00:52:10
Steve
Oh, is
00:52:11
Sammi
It stood on its own. And then they're like, you're going to be a division of like programming or whatever. And they're like, but what? So yeah. Again, like this reclassification of this person who was kind of like a Walter Cronkite character in the beginning to, well, now news doesn't even get its own funding.
00:52:28
Sammi
It doesn't get its own thing. It's going to act as a subsidiary under entertainment very much feels like the way that, you know, like Fox News became, you know, over the last 20 years. Like,
00:52:39
Sammi
you know, and that, yeah, like news has to entertain you and like at all times. So you're, we're going to find the most shocking egregious things. We're going to, you know, bring the Jerry Springer to the news.
00:52:53
Sammi
Like is such a, you know, it, it seems like such a weird thing to think would happen in the seventies. And that was probably a very shocking thing to see like the seventies.
00:53:01
Steve
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Mm-hmm.
00:53:04
Steve
which
00:53:05
Sammi
And now i feel like that's, I just wanted to,
00:53:05
Steve
yeah
00:53:08
Sammi
point that out because I feel like it's something that you would gloss over in 2025. Like, well, you know, yeah, news is a lot of entertainment. And like one of the reasons that people do distrust, you know, the news and institutions is because like there have been so many budgetary constraints and the way that we receive the news is so different. And, you know, like so much reporting, investigative reporting is so different these days, too, because people don't have the money like, you know, in news companies to like, oh, you have a month to work on this one story or something.
00:53:41
Sammi
Like, that sounds so luxurious.
00:53:42
Steve
Yeah. something
00:53:44
Sammi
You know, I think about like, yeah.
00:53:44
Steve
Yeah. Entertainment aspect too. Like it's, I mean, that's just, even then it's like, okay, from the 1970s, you get into the cable news era and then you got, okay, well now see we're CNN, we're the cable news network, but we're on the clock.
00:53:57
Sammi
We're going to be around the clock. Yeah.
00:53:59
Steve
so So then you start generating news, like you're finding news to report on regardless of if it's important or worth, you know, noteworthy or not. And so some of that editorial ah just discerning what is and isn't important goes away. And then from there, you start shifting away from just like, I'm a newsman and I'm telling you the news to like editorializing and and panel discussions and shows. And now it's like, Jesus Christ, man, if you, if you turn on Fox news or you, you know, you, you go home for Christmas and you, your parents are one of those households where they just leave it running 24 seven. You ever been in a house like that?
00:54:37
Sammi
I have.
00:54:37
Steve
Horrible.
00:54:37
Sammi
I didn't live in a house like that, but I've been in a house like that.
00:54:37
Steve
Yeah.
00:54:40
Steve
and And it's not rare. Like most people have been in a in Fox news house where it's just on all the time.
00:54:43
Sammi
Yeah.
00:54:46
Steve
And then you watch, there's a show called a Gutfeld, Greg Gutfeld or whatever.
00:54:50
Sammi
Oh, my God.
00:54:51
Steve
And he's a, he's a blowhard panel guy. And he's just like, I'm going to say it the way things are. What if we just ate all the poor people that would solve world hunger? Like this, this is a,
00:55:01
Sammi
that was a pretty good impression.
00:55:03
Steve
Thank you. But well not only is he saying things that are intentionally like, ooh, like risque, but then there's who are his panelists?
00:55:03
Sammi
ah
00:55:11
Steve
And he's got like a formal former pro wrestler who's there with like his championship belt just sitting there and like, yeah, I think trans people should go live on an island and then maybe we we just bring them supplies every once in a while.
00:55:25
Steve
Like that's what he said. What no the fuck, man? then he's in a new world.
00:55:29
Sammi
I mean, they also said like to reclaim, you know, the, the um, the The group that was I don't even want to say it, but the group that was like, you know, led by the mustache man in the 1940s, they're like, we should reclaim that word.
00:55:43
Sammi
And I'm like, what are you? You're reclaiming that word.
00:55:45
Steve
What you reclining? Yeah.
00:55:49
Sammi
So you admit
The Role of Investigative Journalism
00:55:50
Sammi
it. So you admit it. OK, that's interesting. That's interesting.
00:55:52
Steve
So then you see this final evolution because we've been waist deep in the Fox News muck, but at least you could divide yourself and say, okay, when I see a loony like Jeannie Pirro or Pete Hegseth ranting on Fox news about bullshit or Jesse waters ranting about bullshit.
00:56:13
Steve
I can at least say that I have the media literacy to go. That's stupid. And, you know, all these people can scream as much as they want, but there are limitations to what actionable things they can do. No longer the case, because all of these loonies, whether you're, you know, Laura Loomer or Pete Hegseth or G.D. Pirro or whoever, they now have legitimate government positions where they make actual policy decisions.
00:56:40
Steve
And they were Howard Beals.
00:56:42
Sammi
I mean, look at Dr.
00:56:43
Steve
Yeah.
00:56:44
Sammi
Oz. That's a scary one, too.
00:56:46
Steve
I know. He's not even a doctor.
00:56:47
Sammi
That's a really scary one.
00:56:49
Steve
He's not a doctor of anything. don't
00:56:51
Sammi
He's a scary man. um You know, yeah, I...
00:56:53
Steve
know.
00:56:55
Sammi
Like, I just think, okay, some some things came to mind when you were talking. um I would recommend if you if you all like spooky stuff, you should watch Late Night with the Devil when you're talking about ah ah late night TV show vibes. ah That's what it's becoming.
00:57:11
Sammi
Late Night with the Devil, okay? But yeah, i you know I think about like Spotlight and Zodiac, these stories of you know these these big it news investigations that couldn't have happened without the culture of the time being dedicated to, I mean, obviously that there were other stories that they were publishing at the time.
00:57:34
Sammi
These are both newspaper stories, but you know, these big investigative efforts. I mean, Robert Graysmith is such an interesting guy. If you, if you haven't read his books, I highly recommend, I think Zodiac is such a lot of like serial killer movies, like sensationalize the serial killer.
00:57:50
Sammi
And what I really love about Zodiac is it's a three hour movie that actually talks about everything that literally happened.
00:57:51
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:57:58
Sammi
And people thought the movie was boring because it covered everything that actually happened. There were no, there was no lies, like no bullshit.
00:58:03
Steve
yeah
00:58:07
Sammi
I've read both of his books. They, there are things that they left out that were actually even a little bit more exciting than what was covered in the movie, but they cut them for time. um But they talk about how, you know, this This guy who worked at a newspaper went, huh, this is really odd that these police departments are so siloed and that newspapers are getting so possessive over their information.
00:58:33
Sammi
And we would be able to get so much further with our investigating if everybody cooperated. And so he was, I don't know how familiar you are with all of this story, but this was like one of my, I was very obsessed with this when I was like 18, 19.
00:58:41
Steve
Mm-hmm.
00:58:48
Sammi
But he was like, I'm going to put all of these things together in one place and also call on the public to try to solve some of these things. Like people have got to be good code breakers out there.
00:59:00
Sammi
And there was like this couple who like did like, you know, what is it called? Cryptography or something like that. They like did it for fun. and so they like started working on like, you know, cracking the code on these letters and everything. And, you know, i feel like.
00:59:16
Sammi
He's such a good example of like what the news can be and and where we can go if we join forces and, you know, use our resources and and, you know, like do things in a reputable up and up kind of a way that isn't just like looking for claim or money or whatever. i mean, like this cost him quite a bit because he was like, even though he had some time to work on this stuff, he was being distracted from like his other jobs and like, you know, it was affecting his relationship and his job and everything to do this. um
00:59:51
Sammi
But I think it's a good example of like doing important work that can make a difference. And this is like the polar opposite of that. It's like, you know, it's like that's what the news can be.
01:00:00
Steve
Yeah.
01:00:01
Sammi
I think Spotlight is another really good example of like what the news can be and what it can uncover, despite the fact that there are like powerful people who like don't want you to talk about, you know, abuse, abuse in the church like that, you know, ah in Boston of all places, you know, like that's um what a hot button issue.
01:00:19
Sammi
But yeah, network is like the exact opposite of that. It's like, yeah, how far can we fall?
01:00:26
Steve
The last thing I want to say
01:00:26
Sammi
And this is it. And we're seeing it in real time and it becomes more relevant every year, sadly.
01:00:32
Steve
Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. The last thing I want to say about Network is there. So if you haven't seen it, spoilers or whatever, it's from 1976. It's one a gazillion.
01:00:42
Sammi
Yeah, you should have watched it by now. Come on.
01:00:43
Steve
It's literally one of the greatest movies of all time. Like it's and I'm not saying that to say that.
01:00:46
Sammi
Yes.
01:00:47
Steve
I mean, like genuinely you watch and you're like, oh, wow, they can make them like this. It's that good. Watch it. If you haven't, though, I don't know Put your fingers in your ears right now. ah The ending.
01:00:58
Steve
is it's supposed to be kind of this this big shock ending, but it's not really that big of a shock. So Howard Beale has his come to Jesus moment with the head of the evil conglomerate, right? And previously his success and the in his the the way that he was being exploited was the network was radicalizing, or they were they were monetizing radical thought essentially. So they're saying, oh, look at this shocking you know radical stuff. We're gonna take it. We're gonna put it on TV. And that's where the money is. And the moment that Howard Beal starts spouting this corporate line, then their viewership drops. And he's basically saying, like, you know, everything is meaningless. It's it's just a big downer. And everyone's freaking They're like, we got to get rid of Howard Beal. What are we going to do? Who are we going hire to replace him?
01:01:46
Steve
And the corporate overlords are like, nope, he's got to stay. He's staying. So the only solution they can come up with is... we're just going to have to kill him. We're just going to have to assassinate him.
01:01:57
Steve
And it's supposed to be this kind of like jarring moment, but then you take a step back and you're like, no, this is like, obviously this is what they're going to do.
01:01:57
Sammi
Right.
01:02:06
Steve
Like, this is the way that these characters take the steps that they do. It's the only thing that makes sense. And I think like stepping into it now with, with either a contemporary mindset back then, or even now and saying like, wow, like they would actually just like kill this guy to, to shut him up.
01:02:23
Steve
ah And it seems so insane at the time, but then really, no, it it's just it's like, no, this this it makes perfect sense what they end up doing. like There's no other logical way to end this movie other than destroying the thing that you have created and then worrying about how to monetize the next thing. That's that's what they do, because Howard Beale isn't a mentally ill person. He is a product and he is a means to an end. And that end is more money, more influence, more power. So if he no longer is useful, what do you do?
01:02:57
Steve
Get rid of him. That's how you do it. And it's it's really powerful.
01:03:00
Sammi
Yep.
01:03:01
Steve
But it's also like the way that it ends. It's just such like ah there's like a bleak comedic tone to the whole thing. And it really is. it's it's It's like an absolute circus. So, um yeah, I don't know. In in the end of Network, they they murder a TV show host. And here in America, we elect them to the highest political positions in the land.
Future Episode Plans
01:03:26
Sammi
Yep.
01:03:27
Steve
It's different world.
01:03:27
Sammi
yep Yeah, that's, I mean, well, yeah. ah Yeah, that that is, it's like, it does come full circle. it It starts with his intention and probably his premonition that he shouldn't be on TV anymore, and it ends with him not being on TV anymore.
01:03:45
Sammi
So he kind of gets what he wants in the end, sort of.
01:03:46
Steve
exactly exactly it's a little more drawn out yeah yeah
01:03:48
Sammi
So it's okay. It makes it ethical. No, So yeah, I don't know what we're going to be doing next. um Maybe another, i don't know.
01:04:00
Sammi
we We'll discuss it offline, but we'll come back soon. I promise. um There are some, I do want to read um some more Bachelor Nation books. So that's definitely like next on my list.
01:04:12
Sammi
And um oh my gosh, there's so much going on with the Mormon wives. Holy shit. And
01:04:19
Steve
Everything is happening with them...............................
01:04:21
Sammi
Yeah. Oh, my gosh. And then, OK, I'm going to briefly mention this. I know we're going to try to get off early ish, but I need to talk about the Danish deception, because if I don't talk about it now, I might explode.
01:04:34
Sammi
um But I just want you all to know, like, it's so weird When you see like bachelor nation people in like a different context and like other people outside of the bachelor are talking about them.
01:04:45
Sammi
It's always like strange. It's like, yeah. Senior teacher in a public place. I would assume, but my mom was a teacher.
01:04:50
Steve
Yeah, yeah.
01:04:51
Sammi
So I have a weird perception about that, but yeah,
01:04:52
Steve
Mm-hmm.
01:04:56
Sammi
Yeah. So Anyeka, who was in Colton's season, did like this 26 or something part series called The Danish Deception about, and I won't spoil it for anybody, but I will just kind of give you a brief overview, about her ex-husband, who was like Danish and apparently like not stole money, but he asked for money and a bunch of people gave it to him.
01:05:20
Steve
Would you say he was deceptive?
01:05:22
Sammi
i yeah I would say he was deceptive, yes, because he was lying about why he needed the money. I don't know if you've watched any of this story yet, but it's pretty wild. To the tune of like almost half a million dollars, I want to say. like Some people did the accounting of like all the people that at least she is aware of that he asked for money, including her. And it sounds like it was close to half a million dollars. Yeah.
01:05:45
Sammi
Yeah. And so so she um so she covers like this whole series about like, here's all the stuff. And she was kind of she even mentioned that she was channeling Risa Tisa in like, who the fuck did I marry?
01:05:58
Sammi
Like that whole series, which I think everybody who watched it loved it and and loved Risa Tisa because she was honest about her role in it.
01:05:59
Steve
Yeah.
01:06:07
Sammi
And also you could tell that she did not like this guy anymore. So, but there's some things about anyaka series where it's like her eyes are lighting up when she's talking about this stuff.
01:06:17
Sammi
And you're like, wow. And he broke it off with her and people are like, I don't know. I feel like you still would have been with him and still would have been defending him. So I'm not sure.
01:06:25
Steve
ah yeah
01:06:26
Sammi
So, so there's a lot of people coming for her right now and saying, um, how did you miss all these red flags? Like, she's like, well, anyone could fall victim to that. And they're all like, really anyone? Um,
01:06:37
Sammi
And she's like, yeah, but anyway, it's an interesting story. it's it's ah It's a fun litmus test. I would recommend checking it out and seeing how you feel about that. But maybe we'll cover that more.
01:06:49
Sammi
um Yeah, but I don't know. We'll see what's next. I'm not sure right now. But there are things coming next.
01:06:53
Steve
We'll find out.
01:06:55
Sammi
And I will be on break, so I will have more time to watch and read things.
01:06:57
Steve
Yeah, things are to happen. We're going watch stuff and talk about it and read things.
01:06:59
Sammi
Yeah. Yeah. So yeah,
Platform Transition and Thanksgiving Tales
01:07:03
Sammi
um but I will say probably next time or maybe at the time after that, I'll start to move these kinds of things over to the Horrors Persist.
01:07:12
Sammi
That will become its own entity. So watch for that. But you'll get another warning or two before we move these things over there. But if you want to catch those, make sure that you are there.
01:07:23
Sammi
We'll start posting some clips over there as well. But until then, friends, I hope you are almost done with your leftovers by the time you watch this or listen to this and that you're you're not a turkey trot family.
01:07:37
Steve
Yeah, and don't do needle drugs.
01:07:38
Sammi
Because, yeah. well
01:07:40
Steve
I don't ever make me run. Ever.
01:07:42
Sammi
There was there was a ah really not so tick tock of this girl who was pranked.
01:07:42
Steve
Nope.
01:07:49
Sammi
The family acted like they were a turkey trot family. And they pranked her.
01:07:54
Steve
Nope.
01:07:58
Sammi
And she's about to marry into that family.
01:08:01
Steve
Nope. Nope or me
01:08:04
Sammi
That's when I'm done.