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The Peasant Party Podcast - wish you all the best guest episode!
51 Plays1 year ago
I had the chance to be a guest on a friend's pod and so I'm dropping it in your feed! Go find the Peasant Party Podcast wherever you find podcasts and on Instagram @welcometothepeasantparty, on YouTube, and yknow all the places. I had fun chatting with Charlotte and I hope to have her back on wyatb again someday soon!
Also you can message me at wishyouallthebestpod@gmail.com so send me emails.
music - "Lofi & Love" by NottyVonDutch -https://soundcloud.com/nottyvondutch - Licensed under Creative Commons: By Attribution 3.0 -http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/
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Transcript
Introduction and Podcast Crossover
00:00:00
Speaker
Yeah.
00:00:13
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to wish you all the best. A personal podcast about modern dating. I'm your host Scott Simmons. It has been a little while. I've missed you. I'm sorry for the radio silence. I've got a crossover episode for you today, sort of, kind of.
00:00:33
Speaker
I was in Austin, and I was able to meet up with Charlotte Warren, who has a podcast called Welcome to the Peasant Party. And she's been on this podcast a couple of times. I always really enjoy the conversations I have with her. And I happen to be in Austin, so we hopped into a studio. And yeah, I recorded an episode for her pod.
Podcast Recommendations
00:00:55
Speaker
And I'm just gonna throw it in your feed here, so you can give it a listen if you want. Go find her stuff if you'd like.
00:01:01
Speaker
It's a little different from what I do. I can't say that she and I agree 100% of the time, but I think it'd be really boring if we did. And I really always, always really, really enjoy our conversations. So yeah, it's called Welcome to the Peasant Party. You can go find her on TikTok or wherever you get podcasts. I think she's on Instagram as well. And yeah, I'm subscribed. I always like her stuff.
00:01:23
Speaker
And yeah, I'm just gonna throw the episode here in your feed. So give it a listen and see what you think. Okay, yeah, enjoy. Here we go.
00:01:45
Speaker
You're so sweet. Everybody, I'm Scott Simmons. I've got a podcast called Wish You All the Best. Yeah, I'm very excited to be here. I'm so excited to meet you in person. You as well. Yeah, I think I've been on your pod twice. We had some great conversations. I think some of the memories I have are talking about things like the loss of the third space and how that affects dating.
00:02:02
Speaker
things like that. So I had a great experience going on your podcast. I think both of them were in the morning. I had my cup of coffee and I think that was a great way to have a conversation. A lot of times it's like end of the day, like, you know, things like that. But it was a great experience. You know, love talking about
Toxic Male Dating Content
00:02:16
Speaker
men's issues, you know, dating from, you know, a man's perspective as well as your discussion on topics of like, you know, I'm a man that goes to therapy and is emotionally intelligent and how do things look without, you know, kind of that men versus women kind of
00:02:29
Speaker
gender debates you seem to see like when people are talking about dating on social media. Like I hate that all of a sudden when people talk about dating podcasts, they think of those like a bunch of people sitting around the table and having a screaming, pissing contest at each other. Like those aren't guys. Yeah, those aren't dating podcasts to me. Those are just angry people screaming at each other. But for some reason they call themselves podcasts. Your podcast is not like that.
00:02:49
Speaker
Yeah, no, thank you. I really it's a passion project podcast. It's it is not as cool. I'll say it's not as cool as welcome to the peasant party. But I'm trying. And really what I'm trying to do is kind of make space for men to have vulnerable conversations around dating. I think a lot of the content out there for aimed at men, like if you're a guy who's getting out there trying to date a lot of the content out there that you're going to find when you look something up and try to figure out how to do it is is garbage is really, really bad. It's it's feeding into a lot of unhealthy
00:03:18
Speaker
stuff, and I think men just need to be more kind of vulnerable and open and kind of talk to each other and support each other around dating, because dating is really important. Finding a relationship, finding that person who is going to be your person, however you want to do that, is a really important thing. I'm trying to make space to have those conversations in a way that's healthy. I'm certainly not an expert, and I know there are other people doing the same thing, but yeah, I wanted to sort of
00:03:42
Speaker
add my voice to that conversation. Absolutely and I guess just a kind of a big maybe too big of a question is why do you think some of the more like toxic you know male dating content has so much appeal like some of those um I know they call themselves like the red pillar like the fresh and fit like what what was attractive about that two men how to come so many men seem to fall into that trap.
00:03:59
Speaker
Yeah, that's a huge question and a great question. Okay, I think two things. I think social media, and I think we're living in a world where men are kind of catching up to feminism. So let me cover social media first, my take on that. You know, social media, as we all know, the hottest takes percolate up to the top, right?
00:04:18
Speaker
with the exception of Welcome to the Peasant Party. There's a lot of TikTok content out there, you know, content out there that the reason that it shows up in your feed is because it really pissed somebody off. Some people really agree with it and it makes them mad and some people really disagree with it and it makes them mad. The algorithm doesn't know the difference. The algorithm just knows that this is going to get a response out of you and it's going to be able to show you more ads, right?
Impact of Feminism on Dating Roles
00:04:38
Speaker
I think social media has been really harmful to a lot of conversations these days and like the internet has just
00:04:44
Speaker
Change the way we do things and that's just real, but I think that's definitely happened for the dating discourse And yeah, I think I think because of that you get a lot of like men versus women Because those hot takes really really drive people to doom scroll, right?
00:05:00
Speaker
But the other piece of that, the bigger piece of that, I think, is that like, there was a, I should have grabbed the screenshot, but there was this tweet that I saw recently that was like someone saying that our parents did a very, very good job raising our daughters, or our parents did a good job raising their daughters to know that they can be whatever they want to be, which is awesome, which is fantastic. Whatever you think about the term feminism or whatever, I think it's incontrovertible to say, or I think it's safe to say that like,
00:05:27
Speaker
feminism has changed the world I think for the better women are not are not consigned to be only like you know someone's companion and that's all they can do right and that's awesome and good but I think men and it's not I don't think it's really our fault it's just we haven't had the time to do it but then we haven't really had the time as a as a culture as a
00:05:47
Speaker
We don't really have the vocabulary, I think, to adapt to that, to be healthy and happy in a world where feminism has done all that work. Does that make sense? Yeah, totally. And I can totally see boys grow up into men. I think one thing...
00:06:03
Speaker
I've noticed I'm blanking on where I saw it but just you go from being this like young cute boy that everybody is you know oh you're so cute like look at you going and playing sports and then one day you're taller than everybody you're scared you're all of a sudden you're scary you go from being cute sweet boy and then you're you know five ten five eleven six foot and
00:06:21
Speaker
You know people are scared of you as you walk down the street because you know It's you know women a lot of times like the thing that could hurt you most is a man and stuff like that And there's not always you know that those lessons and being equipped on how to handle that yeah, and I can only imagine it's hard Yeah, and I think like I think our minds move faster than our hearts
00:06:43
Speaker
And here's what I mean by that. I think intellectually we all understand that yes, a woman can do a job just as well as a man, and we're not living in the 50s anymore, right? But I think our hearts are still collectively the traditions, the culture we have around romance. I think our hearts move a little more slowly. I think we're still a little, as a man, I'm totally guilty of this. I do want to be a provider, kind of. I do sort of,
00:07:11
Speaker
that helps get that chemistry there, that little spark that you have to have if you're gonna have that romantic connection with someone special, right? And a lot of the women that I've talked to, and on my podcast, my podcast is mostly aimed at making space for men to have conversations, but like most of the people who I
Internet's Influence on Dating
00:07:26
Speaker
can get to talk to me on it are women, because women wanna talk about this stuff.
00:07:29
Speaker
But a lot of them, when I talk to, say they need to feel pursued in order to feel that romantic spark. And that's just chemistry. You can't think your way out of that, right? So even though these are women who are fine on their own, honestly, a lot of the women who I've talked to probably do earn more than the men they'll end up being in relationships with.
00:07:51
Speaker
And, you know, are just fine on their own. But they want romantic connection, but they have to feel pursued in order to feel that. And I think, you know, I kind of hope that future generations don't have that, maybe, but I think it's certainly true right now. Does that make sense? Oh, totally. Yeah, because I think there's a lot of women where no matter how successful they are, they still want the, you know, opening the car door and they want the, you know, they like it where it's like the, you know, the guy pays a check and stuff like that. And I think that is something that's hard to go away, like you still want
00:08:20
Speaker
You grew up watching your princess movies and stuff like that. And yeah, maybe you want to be a doctor But yes, you would like a nice gentleman to open your car door and come up to your door and you know Bring you flowers and stuff like that. So it's like thought I think everyone and everyone talks about it too Like everyone always makes it seem like it's so binary as well Like oh, well if you want to be a woman who works hard You want to be this feminist like kiss all of that? Goodbye you either get to you know be this 50-50 you're both outside chopping wood together and
00:08:45
Speaker
They're both contributing the same amount of money to your relationship or you can have this traditional where it's you stay home You know be a Burger King cashier or something so because guys don't even care and then he does all the providing and it also just to me the relationships I see that you know end in marriage don't look like that so it's just it's very interesting that social media has painted it that way and
00:09:06
Speaker
Yeah, it's like, again, it's a dichotomy I think driven by social media between like tradwife and whatever modern progressive opposite is. And I don't think that's...
00:09:17
Speaker
I don't think that dichotomy is real. I think we're all kind of figuring it out as we go, and there isn't a clear answer because this is an interesting time to be alive. We're figuring the stuff out as we go, and it's not totally clear. I will say for the paying for dinner thing, a cheat for guys out there, I will usually say to women, is it okay if I cover the check? Not in an expectations kind of way, just because men are systemically overpaid.
00:09:39
Speaker
And that lets me kind of be the provider and do that thing that I kind of want to do a little bit, but also in a way that's not like slimy or like, I expect something, you know what I mean? Yeah. Oh, totally. Yeah. And I always, like I do know women as well who like on principle, I like to pay my half on the first date. So we just walk away even just in case.
00:10:00
Speaker
So it's very interesting. Also, just dating in general is a relatively new thing. So this idea of how dating used to be, I think up until the early 1900s, there wasn't really dating in a sense. It was here, I'll give your dad four pigs, and now I get a wife. Right, right.
00:10:18
Speaker
I'm a little older, I'm 45, so I've been on and off the dating apps for like 15 years. I met my now ex-wife on OkCupid, she's a wonderful, amazing person. It didn't work out, we both tried our best. But I've seen kind of dating apps evolve from what they were when it was OkCupid to what it is today.
00:10:36
Speaker
But I think I think the internet like even beyond sort of like trading women as chattel, you know property Like modern dating like the internet has I think drastically changed dating and we're not gonna go back like there's no way Yeah, well, it's it's so convenient. I think for people you can meet someone while you're on the toilet, basically And you do and you will like you can and you will yeah, like I'm you know, yeah. Yeah. Yeah
00:10:59
Speaker
So, yeah, I think before we go into things, if someone wants to start listening to Wish You the Best podcast, what episode do you recommend? They start with, do you have a favorite episode? Well, a couple of episodes. I had this awesome guest, Charlotte Warren. Those are amazing episodes. I have an episode. So it's called Wish You All the Best. It's called Wish You All the Best because like, you know, when you're dating somebody after the first second date and they don't want to see you again. The breakup text, yeah. Wish You All the Best. We've always gotten it.
00:11:23
Speaker
There's one that's I think the title is like just Scott and it's my dating app process and especially for men That's just me giving a quick and dirty like run through of like how I use the apps in a way that like preserves my sanity and Kind of I think helps I don't know after doing it for a long time It's kind of what I've figured out how to do
00:11:44
Speaker
And I think it's not obvious, like it's definitely stuff that I wish somebody had told me when I started, I don't know, 10 years ago or four years ago after I was getting back out there. But they're all great, they're all different. I put up an episode anytime I can find someone who wants to come and talk and they all bring different perspectives and I really enjoy that.
00:12:01
Speaker
I love that. No, that's awesome. And yeah, I forgot to tell my origin story of how I kind of got in touch with you on TikTok.
Empathy and Online Dating Scams
00:12:08
Speaker
And I know you're no longer on TikTok. But when I first started my TikTok journey is some call it summer of last year, I think I was making videos like I did something where, you know, I was trying to define what is or isn't a catfish and I put it on a spectrum because
00:12:21
Speaker
Everyone, when you think catfish, there's obviously the MTV version of a catfish where it is the 50 year old man sitting in the basement for whatever reason, trying to trick men into thinking he's an attractive woman. But then there's also kind of the, you know, is this really a catfish in a sense that, you know, maybe someone shows up and they are, you know, they're still themselves, but maybe they're a little bit heavier. They look a little different. You know, what's kind of the line between putting your best foot forward and being a catfish? It kind of exists on a spectrum. And I think there was something where, you know,
00:12:50
Speaker
Some guy responded about, there's so many bots out there, and how do you know when someone's not a bot? And I think I said something back like, how could you not be able to tell the pictures are bad? It's so obvious. They talk like the Nigerian prince emails. It's kind of on you. And I think I said something like that. And it was meant to be funny and kind of snarky. But I genuinely believed that to be true. I was like, how do people fall for that? And you reached out to me and said, hey, I know your intention is to be funny and have fun with this.
00:13:17
Speaker
This kind of issue of scamming that happens on the men's side of dating apps is actually a thing you see a lot. There's a lot of men out there where maybe they're new to dating. They're not as social people. So how are they supposed to know what a real woman sounds like for all they know? And people have been lonely, people have been struggling since COVID. And sometimes that kind of clouds people's judgment. And people do fall for these. And it's something that people are ashamed of. They don't like to talk about.
00:13:43
Speaker
And so, you know, maybe kind of curb that language. I want you to be aware that this is something that happens. And it was something that really opened my eyes. I think something huge has happened for me is on my TikTok journey, podcast journey, is becoming so much more empathetic of men's issues and things that men face. And I really appreciated you sharing that insight. And that's something I keep in mind too. I hate scammers. I hate people who try to go after people. It's hard-earned money and things like that. Yeah. Yeah.
00:14:08
Speaker
That's what I love about your stuff so much is that you are like you like you're literally making the definitions like trying to figure out what the facts are and I respect that so so much and you know yelling through a megaphone at people who use the term high-value man or woman like it needs to it needs to happen the scamming thing yeah you know it's an example of how how dating is I think in a lot of ways very different for men and for women and this is all very heteronormative we're talking about so said dude yeah yeah
00:14:32
Speaker
But like it is very different. And I think I think it's really useful to put in the time and effort for both men and women to understand what it's like for the other side because it's really going to help you frame how you approach someone. It's really going to help you set your expectations properly for the scam stuff. Yeah, I think so my day job is in Internet security. So the scam stuff is like near and dear to my heart because like it's it is a dating apps are a perfect attack vector for people to do scammy stuff.
00:14:58
Speaker
You know, as a dude, we live in a society where men are the romantic initiators, and that's just what it is right now. I hope it's different in 10, 50 years, whatever. Yeah, but right now, that is what it is. And what that means is that you need to be a little vulnerable. You need to put it out there. You need to have a conversation with someone who you don't know if they're even a real human yet.
00:15:22
Speaker
I have had, I used to put, I used to take screenshots of it when I was on the apps of times when I was like 100% certain that I was talking to a large language model on like a dating app, because it happens all the time. And those things are only getting better, so it's only going to get more difficult to figure out when you're talking to a machine or not, which I don't know what to tell you about that, like I don't know how to fix that.
00:15:45
Speaker
But I also want to be fair, there are absolutely scams that target women.
Therapy's Role in Dating
00:15:50
Speaker
I think scams that target women tend to be more of a long con. You tend to have people who, actual humans who are trying to build up a relationship with you, get off the app, communicate offline, and then three months into having this pen power relationship where you have someone who is like,
00:16:05
Speaker
Hearing you connecting with you. They say oh, I have this medical condition. Can you send me $10,000? Grandma having a friend grandma, you know lost her husband found a friend and oh she has this internet friend and yeah, yeah
00:16:19
Speaker
Yeah, and yeah, and it happens and it those target men as well But I think mostly those target women the ones that I think really target men a lot are Just a sort of really quick like hey, I want to hang out with you tonight Can you send me 50 bucks for a cab over? Which is bananas because like who sends who uses a cab anymore? like I would I can just send you an uber if I wanted to do that, right but like I
00:16:40
Speaker
You know, and I'm ashamed to say that I've totally fallen for that. Like early on when I was first dating, it was like, I want to get out there. I just want to meet someone super lonely. Like, let's go grab a drink. Let's go. I want to meet someone because it was, it's hard. For a lot of men, it can be really hard to like,
00:16:56
Speaker
Have you know meet anybody yeah? And yeah that they you know you send 50 bucks over PayPal or whatever you look great Grab a cab. Let's get a drink And they never show and it feels it's heartbreaking. You know it feels you feel dumb you feel vulnerable But yeah it happens
00:17:14
Speaker
That sucks so much. And I have a younger brother and I know like he's very lucky where he's still in school and meeting people that way. But it's one of those things where it's like, you know, I'm definitely like big sister bear with that kind of stuff. Definitely. Yeah. Like don't get scammed and appreciate you sharing that kind of insight. Very lucky. Yeah. So one of the big things you talk about in your podcast, the big thing you say about yourself, like I'm a man who goes to therapy.
00:17:37
Speaker
Do you want to, I guess, give a high level about that? I know sometimes therapy for whatever reason can be a controversial topic when it comes up when we're when people talk about dating. I know there's a big kind of talk track, a man who's in therapy. It's the biggest green flag in the world. What is your overall kind of thought process? How can it help like a male dater? Do men need to be in therapy? Yeah.
00:17:57
Speaker
This is a great question. I go to therapy. I really like therapy. I recommend it to anybody. We live in a world that is nothing like the world that our minds and bodies and hearts evolved to exist in. Since the advent of agriculture, the world has been changing faster than our human selves can adapt. So we're like hunter-gatherers wandering around in a world
00:18:18
Speaker
with the internet and cars and planes and all this stuff, right? I'm not worried about people who say that they need therapy. I'm a little worried about people who think that they don't, right? Asterisk, not everybody, but I see a ton of value in it and it's been very valuable for me.
00:18:35
Speaker
It's also a great privilege, right? It's not cheap. Most insurance, health insurance companies, if you're lucky enough to have health insurance, doesn't cover it, right? So you're paying out of pocket, and it's just a cost, and that is a privilege, right? I think the thing that I would say about therapy is like, for men, we are socialized, like,
00:18:57
Speaker
to stay away from doing that work. We are socialized to not show vulnerability, to not even think that we need help. And I just, maybe somebody's super lucky and they're just mentally healthy and they're, whatever it is about them, about their family, about their friend group, they have what they need and they are like, they don't have anything to unpack at therapy. I think it's possible. I'm not saying it's impossible, I'm just saying that for me it's been incredibly helpful.
00:19:26
Speaker
What I would usually find therapy was after some sort of incident or issue that really just kind of broke me. And it was, I need someone. I don't want to burden my friends with this. And kind of a challenge that I would have when choosing a therapist, aside from the fact that I would be kind of waiting until something terrible happened.
00:19:43
Speaker
is, you know, not all therapists are created equal and it kind of is, you know, in the same way that dating is like a process of finding a good fit. I've met some therapists that, you know, maybe weren't didn't feel like a good fit for me. Like something for me is I always like I like to be given like tangible advice on like what to do or like, you know, here are things that are tangible and there's a lot of therapists who maybe were trying to do like give me breathing exercises or meditation and stuff like that. My version of relaxing is like going and punching a punching bag.
00:20:09
Speaker
like going on a run, something like more aggressive like that. So when I would go and it was like, let's do some breathing exercises, I would get frustrated. And I, you know, I was someone where it wasn't covered under my insurance and it was like 120 bucks to be told to breathe. Like, God damn it. That feels bananas. Yeah. I think, I think, I think you're right. I think finding a therapist is a lot like dating. And like dating, it's really good to be upfront if you can really early to be like, this is what works for me. I'm somebody who like physical fitness using my body is a great way for me to feel better about my mental health.
00:20:39
Speaker
that's a great thing for your therapist to know. Breathing exercises don't do it for me, I don't get it. That's a great thing for your therapist to know. I mean, my approach to finding a therapist is make appointments with three or four, go to them. And oftentimes therapists will comp you like the first session. So sometimes it's not as expensive as it sounds. But yeah, go on a few first quote unquote dates with therapists and just sort of figure out who you click with, figure out who you feel like
00:21:06
Speaker
You can be honest with that's my kind of two cents on that But again, you know, maybe talking I definitely have friends who I love dearly who like talking to a professional about deep secret Personal stuff is just not in the cards and that's especially true for dudes I think totally true for some women, but I think especially true for dudes, right and like
00:21:28
Speaker
If that's not your thing, then I would say find books that speak to you, or find some kind of practice that lets you be intentional and do the work of figuring out what you're bringing to the table in any relationship, let alone a romantic relationship. But for me, therapy or doing that work to figure out who you are and what you're looking for, that's really, really critical for finding romantic connection, however you're looking for romantic connection, because
00:21:58
Speaker
It's not easy. It's not easy to know what you bring to the table. I don't think it's easy to know really what you're looking for. These things are really deep and personal and we're super duper complicated. Human beings are just crazy crazy complicated things and it's a thousand percent okay if you need help in figuring that stuff out.
00:22:19
Speaker
So the male beg question is, do I have to be in therapy? Male 33 writing in with what might be a dumb question. Do I have to be in therapy for women to look in my direction? I've been on apps for the last one and a half years and I swear every other woman's profile I come across, age range 25 to 36, references preferring men who are in or have been to therapy. I also had this mention on a first date once with the woman point blank asking me if I was in therapy. I said I was not and she said, oh, and sort of condescendingly in response.
00:22:46
Speaker
I have nothing against therapy and I definitely see how some can benefit from it. However, I have not personally seen a need for it for myself. I just haven't experienced any significant trauma. I don't struggle with my mental health. It's also not readily available to me in the way it seems to be for some people. It's not free or low cost with my insurance. And while I have the occasional problem or issue like everyone else, I'm really close with my parents and siblings who have always been my go to for lending an ear to listen and support. So am I doing something wrong here? Do I need to be in therapy?
00:23:11
Speaker
I don't think he's doing anything wrong. I hear what he's saying. I think, you know, okay, so a thing for guys to understand about women on the dating apps is that one of the men on the dating apps, you know, big asterisk, not everybody, but I think for the most part, men on the dating apps, their problem is they don't get enough matches. Like our problem is finding somebody who's willing to swipe right and have that conversation and actually get to that first conversation, which is the reasons why for that, we can talk about that, that's a whole different topic.
00:23:41
Speaker
For women, and this is important for guys to understand, for women, a lot of their problem is sifting through the attention that they're getting, figuring out, finding the right guy out of the inbound attention that they're receiving, right? And again, asterisk, depending on who you are, not true for all women, but I think for a lot of women, that's the problem, right? And it's a real problem. And I think for a lot of guys, they go like, oh, I would love to have that problem. Yeah, but different conversation.
00:24:07
Speaker
So the reason I think a lot of women go quickly to sorting by who's in therapy, and there are apps where you can actually filter by people who are in therapy. I think the reason they do that is because they need something to filter by. I think this is also why a lot of women put only six foot and up on their... Because it's a filter. It's some way to filter through what is just too much stuff.
00:24:32
Speaker
And so, you know, for this guy, I would say I think he's doing great. I think I think when somebody asks him, you know, that boilerplate question, have you been to therapy or are you in therapy? His response about like, actually, I'm super lucky to have an amazing family who like listens to me and I can be vulnerable with like, I think my advice to him would be.
00:24:52
Speaker
If you don't need therapy, if you're doing awesome on your own, which God bless you, let her know that. Show her that vulnerability. Because I think that's what she's looking for. She's looking for a man. I think if a woman is asking you, do you go to therapy? She's asking, you know,
00:25:09
Speaker
Are you able to communicate are you able to regulate your emotions? Are you have you have you done some work on yourself? So that you know yourself and you know what you bring to a relationship, right? And it sounds like he can do that It sounds like he's in a good place to do that And so I would say like, you know, you don't have to say you don't have to go to therapy to be dating But like if somebody asks you that
00:25:30
Speaker
find a way to show them that you're able to be vulnerable, that you have those
Vulnerability in Dating
00:25:35
Speaker
skills. Yeah, understanding the reason behind the question, which is, and I think, cause I'll say where I think that that talk track comes from around men who's in therapy, aside from the fact that, you know, it's on all those big podcasts with those influencers with almost like a feral female following, like the, you know, the tinks is in the call her daddy's words, like a man who's in therapy, rah. But I think where it really comes from, and I think a lot of women have had this experience where they go on a first date,
00:26:00
Speaker
And they and sometimes I do think there's got to be some like account accountability part like with your women like as far as choosing the topics that you want to talk about because what I've had female friends described to me is they'll say well, you know, we started having deep conversations and he basically you know trauma dumped
00:26:16
Speaker
on me or of sorts or like, you know, he told me all these deep stories. I was telling deep stories back. And to me, that meant something. If I'm going to share a story about my childhood trauma or something like that, you know, that means only a person who's interested and invested in me would, you know, participate in a conversation like that and share their own stories back. They'll have those conversations and then, you know, they'll get
00:26:37
Speaker
then following that date they'll get you know a hey I'm not ready for a relationship or you know not looking for anything serious or something like that the same way they would elsewhere and maybe that's um you know a few maybe that's one two three dates in maybe you know those deep conversations they thought it was really deep and they you know get physical with this with this person and I think the kind of initial thought process or responses he used me for a free therapy session like you know he just used me for free for free therapy and um
00:27:06
Speaker
You know, if he was in therapy, this conversation would have been had with this therapist and he would have, you know, been more emotionally sound or he wouldn't, he would know that he's not ready to be dating and wouldn't be going on dates. And I think, so I think that's where it kind of gets misapplied in a way because I think, um,
00:27:22
Speaker
That's sort of the thing people jump to. But at the same time, I've known women where it's like, well, I like to ask the deep questions. It's like, if you ask, what's your biggest childhood trauma? And then someone tells you and has that conversation with you, you're going to have these conversations a little more. Maybe there's something kind of on your part where you should rein in them. But I think that's kind of where it comes from, I would say. At least the podcast talks, or when it's on the podcast where it's, hey, you better be in therapy. It's having those experiences where they almost feel lied to by artificial intimacy.
00:27:52
Speaker
Sure. So you're saying like a lot of women want a guy who's in therapy because when they go on the first two, three dates, whatever, and he uses the date as therapy. They feel that way after the fact, I think. You build intimacy and then that gets ripped away because the guy was just using it for therapy.
00:28:09
Speaker
Yeah, I think it's good to go to therapy. But I do think dating should be vulnerable. I think it is good when you're meeting somebody new to
00:28:24
Speaker
kind of be vulnerable early because you want to find out as fast as you can if you're you know if your puzzle piece kind of fits with their puzzle piece you know and you know sometimes people say like you want to find someone who's who's broken in a way that's compatible with your brokenness right and that's a little judgy way to put it but like
00:28:46
Speaker
I think you kind of want to put it on the table, and that's what I try to do. And it's exhausting. That costs you real emotional gas. And I think the dates you go on where you don't do that, at least for me, that's not really, for me that's not really moving towards finding what I'm looking for. I'm not really finding out if I'm compatible with that person, if we're just going out skipping the deep stuff and keeping it light.
00:29:11
Speaker
And so I guess, you know, I think in my experience talking to women about this I actually haven't heard too much about and I and I avoid I guess a lot of this content tinks and that kind of stuff. It just doesn't hit me. I Haven't heard women talk too much about worrying about being a therapist on the first few dates. I have heard women worry about getting into a relationship with somebody who's like
00:29:36
Speaker
Just there are just like mines buried down the road where it's like something that this guy hasn't dealt with It's just like repressed repressed repressed and then someday it pops up And guys we do that a lot We get really really good at bottling stuff up right because we're told that showing emotion is not what we're supposed to do That doesn't mean it's not there like it's still buried in there and eventually it'll it can pop up, you know and
00:30:01
Speaker
I want to tell these women that there's a solution, right? I want to say like just do this thing and you can avoid this this emotional pain because it's emotional pain Mm-hmm, but I don't know you can I think you want to be vulnerable. I think you want to put it out there and When you get that wish you all the best text back That sucks. Yeah, but you know
00:30:21
Speaker
The sooner you get that breakup, the better. Because you're saving time, you dodged a bullet. If it's not somebody who's interested in your vulnerability, if it's not somebody who's interested, if you've shown yourself to someone and they're not into it, move on. That's not the person for you.
00:30:36
Speaker
I also think yeah, I think it's also to like the if you think of like Shrek where it's like ogres have layers and stuff like that I think there's certain things where it's like, you know That's a story that can you know come over time or can be told over time? Like I think there's kind of those early stages vulnerability that gives you a good sense but if there's a story that is you know very hard for you to tell and you only want to tell it to people that you're truly truly close with where even your close friends don't know like You know
00:30:59
Speaker
Yeah, maybe it makes you build some intimacy with a new person. But the idea is the only reason I want to tell it to this person is if there's a guarantee they'll be serious with me or that it'll be my ticket, don't maybe hold back from telling that.
00:31:15
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, that's a tricky one. It depends on what you're looking for. It depends on the kind of person you are. For me, and this is what's so bananas about dating, right? Because like you're auditioning people to be your life partner. You're auditioning people to be the person you're like most trusted confidant. You know what I mean? Which is crazy. And we use the internet to do it. So you can like choose between thousands of people to try and do this. So it's wild. Like this is not,
00:31:42
Speaker
whatever's supposed to means, this is not how it's supposed to work, right? But it's what we got. I think vulnerability is good. I think it's hard. I think it does cost you. I think you can't go on too many first dates. I think it's really easy to burn out on that. I think anybody listening to this has experienced that. But I think it's what you gotta do. I think you gotta bring that vulnerability.
00:32:05
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. I think that is also important is I don't think therapy is just a box you can check. Like I think looking at it like if you are a woman just thinking like is he in therapy that you know anyone can go to a gym and say I went to the gym today and sit there and you know write in their journal instead of work out. So I think it's kind of what what do you like
00:32:22
Speaker
And less so the box checking of like how long have you been going or when do you go, but really also looking at the emotional intelligence on top of do you go to therapy, yes or no kind of thing. Yeah. Yeah. And I don't really know how to, I mean, being vulnerable with someone is a good way to find out about that. Exactly. If you share something and you're like, gosh, I don't know what kind of things I share about.
00:32:48
Speaker
all kinds of stuff but you know if I share something and then they reciprocate then you know that I know that they're able to kind of meet me where I am they're able to like converse on that level and if they're not that's okay maybe we're just on the same wavelength maybe they're just not picking up what I'm putting out but yeah you want to find out you want to find out if you if you click I think you want to find out if you click on that vulnerable emotional wavelength
00:33:12
Speaker
Totally, and what do you think are some good first, second date questions where they can bring out, maybe aren't as scary on the surface, but maybe bring out some of these more vulnerable conversations? That's a great question.
Age and Honesty in Dating Profiles
00:33:30
Speaker
Gosh, I don't know. I think...
00:33:33
Speaker
For me, I think it's less about asking the question and more about figuring out what can I share. Because when I talk about
00:33:43
Speaker
I don't know how I used to be a starving artist and wanted to, I was in New York and I was trying to be an actor, whatever, and when I had to go through the process of deciding that I wasn't gonna do that anymore and I was gonna go back to school and learn something else, I don't know if that's a great example, but something like that, like a vulnerable time in my life where I failed at something, or I feel like I failed at something, which wasn't failure, you know, it was just,
00:34:06
Speaker
Changing life direction, but you know like it's it's not it's not like it's not like Here's cool stuff about me. It's not like my resume Sizzle real, right? I would share stuff about me and kind of talk about what that was like and you know Try not to go on too long about it cuz you know just like babble but like put that on the table and see what they come back with Because if they meet that with like understanding and vulnerability and questions that show that they're actually listening and understanding
00:34:35
Speaker
or you know and or they come back with like here's something vulnerable about me you know and because she's gonna know her yeah obviously she knows her life and experience and vulnerability better than I do so yeah I think I think that the move is to I think the move is to be vulnerable yourself and see what they come back with and if they're able to meet that vulnerability then that's that's a good thing totally I love that answer
00:34:59
Speaker
Yeah, and then my second mailbag question, and this one's a fun one, and I thought it went really well with how we've talked about catfishing, we've talked about scamming, we've talked about how to have challenging conversations, and I thought this one might be a good fit for us to go through because, yeah, it kind of covers on all of those. How do you and should you confront someone who maybe lied to you on a dating app is kind of the idea, with him saying she lied about her age.
00:35:23
Speaker
I, 39, male have been seeing a woman, 40's female, for about three months overall now, even though we spent about a month apart during the summer holiday. We met online, her profile showed she was 40. Upon meeting her, I confirmed her age, her status, and occupation as people often forget to update these.
00:35:39
Speaker
It was her birthday a few weeks ago. I gave a card that had her age written on it and she didn't say anything about it. Today, she asked me to revise a contract that had her information on it and passport to you and it showed she's actually four years older than she told me. She's 44. I feel like she misled me. And at the beginning, I told her that I usually prefer to date women a couple of years older than me anyways, but she never would have shown up on my online dating because my age preferences weren't filtered in to show her real age. So what should I do? I do like her, but this really bothers me. How do I confront her about it?
00:36:09
Speaker
Wow, there's a lot in this one and we're not gonna get to all of it. Again, this is another area where I think it's really good for men to understand what it's like for the other side of the dating apps. Age is such a huge thing for women. It just is. And we live in a society that tells women they're valuable when they're young, that tells men that they're valuable when they're successful.
00:36:38
Speaker
And so, you know, for women, and I don't want to say they're wrong, but like women, I think feel like they're undateable or less desirable when older, which is bananas and broken and wrong in all kinds of ways, but it's real. So like, you know, I want to have a lot of empathy for her because I understand what she was doing. I understand the pressures that she was feeling.
00:37:03
Speaker
I also wanna have empathy for him, because she did deceive him. She literally told him a lie. And I, okay, I'm not gonna get into too much detail here, but this happened to me. And it was with somebody who I really like. And you just gotta talk through it. I think you gotta be vulnerable about it, so like, hey, listen.
00:37:28
Speaker
This I just got to tell you that like this made me feel deceived. This made me feel Trust is an important part of a relationship You know like you can say like this does this make me feel like a little bit It's harder to trust you and trust grows back. You know it happens difficult
00:37:45
Speaker
issues and relationships come up. So it's going to happen. And in a way, it's good to have those because you'll figure out how do you heal through that. But it's real. And I think it's totally legit to say to her like, hey, listen, I need you to know that this like threw me a little bit. This made me feel bad. And I just need to talk to you about it and just put it on the table. And like what she comes back with is going to tell you a lot about about your potential connection. Right.
00:38:10
Speaker
But I would I you know, I would approach it with empathy I would approach it like understanding that that age is It's a real and scary and unfair thing that we have to deal with especially in dating There are a lot of like 39 year old and like quote-unquote 39 year old women on the apps. Yeah You know because like that generation I'm 45 and that's a lot of the women that I ended up I ended up matching with in dating And you know these ladies like
00:38:37
Speaker
they've been told that they should be able to do it all. And so they've frozen their eggs, they've chased their careers, they've had relationships that have gone one way or another, but they get to a certain point and like, it's not like a biological clock thing, but maybe a little bit of that, but there's a ton of pressure. And these women like want to start families to feel fulfilled because that's what they totally legit, right?
00:39:00
Speaker
But like, it takes a lot of time. You have your first kid at 40, you're gonna be 58 when they graduate high school, right?
00:39:09
Speaker
I don't know. I just think there's a lot of pressure on that. It's really, really complicated. It touches on really, really difficult stuff. I don't think that's a deal breaker. I wouldn't like run for the hills if I was this guy, but I would definitely have like a vulnerable conversation about her. Yeah. Just put it on the table. Yeah. Because I think if there's a vulnerable answer to that, like if, you know, it's around, you know, I'm, I'm looking for a serious partner. Like I think,
00:39:30
Speaker
It's also I think because of what we grew up with I think what our mind correlates with certain ages doesn't really reflect like what we're seeing now like when I Thought about 30 for example when I was younger like most people I knew their parents had them by 30. Yeah when I was a kid It was like oh, you know their parents had them in their mid 20s and stuff like that So to me growing up 30 was this big scary age for me, and I think you know now that I am 30 You know I think there's
00:39:55
Speaker
I would say probably about half the friends, half to three quarters are married. You know, maybe a quarter have one young child, if that. And those are the ones that are maybe a little bit older than I am. And, you know, the 30 year olds are still having fun. Like I look back at the parent pictures from, you know, when they were 30 and it just looks different, just like how people compare the new sex in the city version to how they're the same age as the Golden Girls and how just different their lives are. But I think there is sort of
00:40:20
Speaker
Those views are in our head. What a 40-year-old woman is in your mind versus what a 40-year-old woman is and how energetic, lively 40 can be is very different. But I think we grew up in a different time. I think it's exactly right. It's just so different depending on your age, but the world is so different than it was for your parents.
00:40:39
Speaker
Talk about like life stages like buying a house being able to afford like your own space Career stuff just goes slower aging stuff like we I just think we're a lot healthier now than our homes We're like there's not lead in the gasoline, you know, yeah, that's kind of a big deal But yeah, I do think I mean I I'm again I'm 45 and I I don't feel like I you know look back at my dad when he was 45 and I love my dad He's amazing super healthy guy
00:41:06
Speaker
But yeah, it's just a different life stage, it's a different track. So yeah, I don't know, the age thing is really, really tricky and really weird. I don't have a clear answer for it, but I think it's good to kind of just stay open-minded about it, stay honest with yourself.
00:41:24
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, I think that's also the challenge with like the dating apps as well as just those filters. Like, you know, there's I think there's some people that do it because I've on the kind of female side when I was single, I would see, you know, guys on there because it's like there can be, you know, great looking forty five year olds. But there's a difference between a thirty five year old and a forty five year old or a twenty five year old and a thirty five year old. And some of those I definitely had been on some dates where it was like I think this guy's a little older than what he said. And I think sometimes it's more it's less so
00:41:53
Speaker
It's more so I think that they want to maybe be in a younger woman's pool of people.
00:41:58
Speaker
The idea is like, you know, I've dated a younger woman before. If they met me in person or when they meet me in person, I won't feel old to them. Like, you know, they're probably picturing like an older curmudgeon when they think of a 40 year old. But I think when it happened, like I noticed the idea when he was kind of showing paying for the drinks, it was kind of like, Tim, you tried to lie to me and I bugged me a lot. Like I didn't like it. It wasn't by that many years, but it was I think one of those like rounded numbers. I think it was like said he was
00:42:23
Speaker
Mid like 30s and it was like 40 or something and I think it probably had to do with like a lot of people Stop their range at a rounded number. Yeah, and you know, and this is like the guys who round up their height to six foot Like and I'm not gonna lie. I so I am 5 11 and 3 quarters I absolutely put six foot on my dating apps. Yeah, because that's the cutoff for
00:42:42
Speaker
My personal take is that a lot of most people don't know how tall they are. I really, I think guys never go to the doctor. That's a fun, it's like one of my goofy takes is like guys never go to the doctor. I think a lot of times guys will be like, how, wait, you're, you're how tall. And I've thought I was five 11 and you're six foot, we're the same height. Okay. I'm six foot now. So I think it's like a lot of that. I think I'm in Texas. So a lot of guys will wear cowboy boots and that adds to height. So I think that's my personal take on the height thing. As long as you're not going six inches or something. Like I think it's, there's some grace to be given there.
00:43:12
Speaker
Yeah, it's tricky. My personal approach, and I'm not telling anybody
Conclusion and Gratitude
00:43:19
Speaker
they're wrong. This has happened to me, where a woman has put a different age on the dating app, but I think the move is to be honest.
00:43:29
Speaker
You know, again, I added, you know, a quarter of an inch to my height on whatever, Bumble or whatever. But like, I think you want to be as honest as you can. And it's really, really hard to like actually represent yourself on a dating app because the dating apps that have succeeded are like four pictures and some blurbs. Like you're not getting a lot of information, right?
00:43:49
Speaker
But I think with whatever that is, you want to be as honest as you can, at least let me put it this way, at least from guys, you want to be as honest as you can. Because if, you know, assume the best. Make your dating app profile assuming, and go into dating, assuming that it's going to go well, right? Plan for success, and when it doesn't succeed, that's okay. You know, have the resolve, have the friends to support you, get ready to get back on that horse whenever you can, but plan to succeed, right? Because you're there to succeed.
00:44:16
Speaker
do not use the apps, do not date defending yourself against the bad crap that's out there. And the bad crap that's out there is bad. You are gonna meet people who are gonna be disingenuous, who are going to criticize you for whatever, not whatever, all kinds of stuff, right? But I don't think you, I think you wanna plan for success and not plan to defend yourself against the painful stuff. And I get that that's hard.
00:44:44
Speaker
And I think kind of the same for women, you know, plan for success. Like, I think, well, for women, I think it's different. I think for women I would advise.
00:44:52
Speaker
Set up your app, set up your profile, do your swiping and date, trying to filter out the people who are not for you. Assume that you're going to have a whole bunch of guys swiping right on you and try to filter out the guys who you're not going to be interested in. Put your weird out there and really try to attract that guy who
00:45:16
Speaker
Who's gonna get you who's gonna get that part of you that you might feel a little vulnerable about about putting out there because again for women I think the big problem is too much Too much in bad attention. Yeah Anyway, I got a little off track there, but no totally agree and I think having the attitude of just assuming best intention is like cuz I think I've had times where I would be
00:45:38
Speaker
Dating or going on dates where maybe I've just wasn't in the best headspace where it was like you go on the date Where it's like this is another guy who's here to screw me over and like just the attitude like I don't it's oh I feel like you see this plot in movies a lot or something like that But I've definitely been on dates where it's just like you feel like The other person assumes you're evil and you're assuming they're evil where it's like, oh, I bet you're just gonna ghost me anyway And it's like those are not fun conversations to have they never they're not it's not like the movies where those lead to like some sort of like playful banter it's
00:46:05
Speaker
a waste of your time and everyone else's and it just makes everyone more miserable like being kind of you know whether it's going to therapy or just being in a good headspace as you go about dating and you know have it in you the emotional intelligence to assume the best um also when you assume the best like assholes reveal themselves more quickly i in my opinion i think that's true i think it's true and yeah and you know let's be real it's not easy like this advice is not just like flip a switch check a box yes i'm gonna be vulnerable i'm gonna assume the best i'm gonna get out there
00:46:33
Speaker
Yeah, I you know I think if you're on the apps and you find yourself like getting mad at people if you find yourself swiping and being like Getting cranky about someone who you've looked at four of their pictures and see some of their posts and you're kind of like getting butthurt about like oh That's a good sign that it's ready that you're ready to take a break. You know I mean and if you're making your profile and you're updating your profile and you want to say something snarky about like
00:46:55
Speaker
I don't know, please know whatever, like whatever you're mad about because you got some match and somebody was rude, that's a good sign that you're ready to take a break. Because like you, yeah, plan for success. You want to bring that positivity, you want to bring like, there is something awesome and unique and amazing about you.
00:47:11
Speaker
And you want to bring that as much as you can, which is not easy because, again, it's a really crude tool to learn about someone else. Right. But as much as you can in those four pictures and in the blurb, you want to bring that unique, beautiful side of you to the app so that the person out there who is looking for that unique, beautiful thing can find you. Yes. And it's not easy and it's not going to happen fast, but I do think it's I think it's the way to go.
00:47:32
Speaker
Totally. And everyone has a unique and beautiful side of themselves. If you haven't found it, I challenge you to find it. Yeah. Yeah. This has been a great conversation, Scott. Where can everyone find you? Where can we find and wish you all the best? What else do we need to know? What else is going on in the world of Scott before we take off?
00:47:47
Speaker
You're so kind. Wish you all the best is my podcast. It's a passion project. I don't really promote it very well, but if you're into it or if you know a guy who you think is struggling with dating, that's really who I want to have come listen to me is dudes. I think mostly it's ladies because they like listening to this stuff, but it's mostly for dudes. So yeah, it's just wish you all the best wherever you find podcasts. I have an Instagram, wish you all the best pod. Yeah, the podcast is the best place to find me. Awesome. And what days does it come out? Anything, any new episodes coming out? It's whenever.
00:48:16
Speaker
It's whenever I can find somebody who wants to have a convo. I've got some cool ones coming up soon. Some folks that I've just sort of met randomly on the internet. But so in the next couple of weeks, there should be some some new ones up. Awesome. Well, it's been great to finally meet you in person. I love this is like my favorite part of the kind of social media, TikTok personality content experience. And it's been an honor having you here today. It's been so amazing to be here. Thank you so much. And congrats on how awesome this is all going for you. You're so good at it. I'm so glad you're out there doing your thing. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Keep doing it.
00:48:44
Speaker
Absolutely. I'm happy to come on anytime. Awesome. Yay. Thanks so much.