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Inside a Sibling Surrogacy: Their Journey Begins Again
49 Plays14 days ago
When Lisa and Aaron McDonnell began their first surrogacy journey, they never imagined they’d be back here — years later, starting again with the same surrogate who made them parents the first time.
In this heartfelt conversation, host Whitney Hall sits down with Lisa and Aaron to talk about what it’s like to grow your family through surrogacy twice — and with the same person who helped bring your first child into the world.
They share the emotions, faith, and gratitude that led them to say yes again, the lessons they’ve carried from their first journey with Claire, and what it means to build a family grounded in love, trust, and hope.
If you’ve ever wondered what surrogacy really looks like — emotionally and relationally — this story will remind you that family isn’t defined by biology alone, but by the people who choose to create it together.
Follow Lisa, Aaron, and Claire’s ongoing sibling surrogacy journey on our social media, and join the Create a Happy Family community for more real stories from those creating families — and those who help make them possible.
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Transcript
Introduction to Lisa's Journey
00:00:00
Speaker
I had a miscarriage through a natural pregnancy, and then I got pregnant three more times and miscarried all of those. And we were going on running out of embryos. And so I think I just knew we had to try something else because that ah continued loss cycle physically, emotionally was just getting to be too much. And we were down to our last embryo. And that's actually when Claire came into the picture.
00:00:20
Speaker
That's Lisa. After years of heartbreaking loss, she and her husband, Aaron faced a choice, give up on their dream or trust someone else to carry it forward. Lisa, you know, put her body and mind through all these, you know, tests and trials. And, you know, we've always, we're coming up a little little short. So I think we were open to something different and and see if it would work. And we know the history of Claire, you know, she had three beautiful, you know, babies herself. And we're like, hey, this is this is somebody that's proven. and
00:00:52
Speaker
And we we said we're all in. That leap of faith brought their daughter Emerson into the world and changed their lives for forever. We absolutely love being a family. It's, I mean, it's just been such a blessing, such a fun journey. And like, why wouldn't we want to do that again? and so I think too, as Emmy got older, she started asking about, you know, having a little brother or sister. And so that just tugs at your heartstrings a little bit. And now they're doing it again, wiser and still believing in miracles, not just once, but twice.
00:01:24
Speaker
and For us, it's our faith. um And, um, I think just the idea of being perseverant no matter what, like I think even before Emmy got here, it's like if we give up, we know what the outcome is. If we continue to try, there's always hope. And so I just remember we just didn't feel ready to say no, this was the end. And so i think just...
00:01:47
Speaker
persevering when sometimes that's the only option you have is because
Discovering Surrogacy
00:01:50
Speaker
that's where the hope is. In this episode, you'll hear how Lisa and Aaron found the courage to start again, what they've learned from loss and how faith and love continue to shape their growing family.
00:02:02
Speaker
Join us as Lisa and Aaron's journey begins again. Who knew it could take more than two people to have a baby? I'm Whitney Hall, a two-time surrogate, now part of the team at Egg Donor and Surrogate Solutions.
00:02:16
Speaker
And I've seen how life-changing this process can be when you feel informed, supported, and confident about your next step. Each week on Create a Happy Family, you'll hear real stories and expert insights from hopeful parents, surrogates, egg donors, and professionals, all to help you understand what it really takes to create a family in this way.
00:02:41
Speaker
Because at the heart of it all, we're creating happy families, one relationship at a time.
00:02:51
Speaker
So, okay, let's go back like in time. Can you guys just share how you first learned about surrogacy and kind of what those early conversations between the two of you looked like?
Meeting Claire and Building Trust
00:03:06
Speaker
And Lisa, feel free to to start. Sure. Yeah. so we So we started our infertility journey right after we got married. We had our first miscarriage. got pregnant like right away in the first four months of miscarriage. And you know It was kind of a journey of IUIs and IVF, yeah yeah and we honestly never thought of surrogacy. I think we thought about adoption. um We thought about no kids, and and we knew we wanted to have kids. And I think in the midst of me going through several embryo transfers and getting...
00:03:36
Speaker
I had a lot of pregnancies, but a lot of miscarriages. We quite frankly didn't think of it it It came to us because I had shared my story quite a bit on social media. I was putting videos. I think it was more cathartic for me telling a little bit of our story through video and song. And Claire, our surrogate, we had some mutual friends and she saw that online. And so she actually has always had a heart to do this.
00:03:59
Speaker
And came to me. And so she asked me to meet for coffee. One morning we went out and she said, I feel called to do this. And I've heard of your story. I want to do this. And so until that breakfast where we met and and had coffee and she offered to, it wasn't really on the table.
00:04:14
Speaker
And it was very exciting, but also I think a little overwhelming because we hadn't even thought of surrogacy as an option. And so I remember calling Erin in the parking lot after that. And i just said, this lovely woman wants to carry for us. And I think it was just a lot of disbelief. And I think that's when we started thinking about this as an option.
00:04:33
Speaker
Um, because I remember Aaron even being like, well, what, what would motivate someone to want to carry someone else's baby? Like, are we, are you sure that's, that's, you know, it was kind of wild or out there or something maybe you saw like a celebrity
Faith and Community Support
00:04:44
Speaker
do. But, um I think that's when we first started exploring it. So, so Aaron, when you got this call after Lisa, you know, just had coffee and is like, Hey, guess what? ah What, what were your thoughts?
00:05:03
Speaker
Well, to to Lisa's point, I think I was more in shock of just hearing that someone wanted to, you know, carry our baby with us. And I was actually caught up in a meeting, too. So I couldn't really talk to Lisa more about it. And she goes, that's it? That's all you have to say? And I'm like, can we talk about it later? Like, I'm thinking more detail. So it was it was interesting.
00:05:24
Speaker
And still, you know, with everything that we've gone through, was kind of like, you know, what is the next step? And so we ended up talking about it later on and it was still weird to go through the process of of how that would work.
00:05:37
Speaker
um But it was great. I mean, excited. And I mean, obviously we had a a beautiful little girl from it. So definitely a cool journey. Yeah. I think we didn't realize like, because it was so shocking and we processed kind of slowly, i think we definitely felt like for us, it was a faith. We had been praying for an answer and this came. And so I think we knew we would take the steps, but it took us time to realize like, okay, that means I'll never feel a baby kick or like, we won't have that bonding. Like, I don't know that all kicks in for some time until you're, I feel like we were taking a step out in faith to just go through the process and then kind of later realize like what that means. um
00:06:17
Speaker
But. Yeah, no, I think that's really, ah I feel like that aspect of things is so true for a lot of people as they're growing their family, whether it's just you know IUIs, IVFs, surrogacy, egg donation.
00:06:33
Speaker
I feel like once you're on that train, it's just kind of, okay, and next, next, next. And you don't you don't necessarily always have that time to sit back and reflect. its you know You're almost like, okay, decision mode, I've got to do something.
00:06:46
Speaker
When, when do you think it really, i know you said it was a step out in faith, but when did you think it really clicked with that sense of, okay, this is how we are going to grow our family? I think for me, it was pretty quick. I don't know, aaron if it was a little bit longer for you. we had, I had a miscarriage through a natural pregnancy, and then I got pregnant three more times and miscarried all of those. And we were going on running out of embryos. And so I honestly felt, um i don't know, like intuitively, like i I can't continue to risk putting these beautiful embryos in in me, if we're to continue to miscarry, they couldn't figure out what it was. And it was just an undiagnosed infertility and so unexplained infertility. And so i think I just knew we had to try something else because that ah continued loss cycle physically, emotionally was just getting to be too much. And we were down to our last embryo. And that's actually when Claire came into the picture. And so I think the way it lined up, I just knew. and to your point, you're going through the motions and
00:07:46
Speaker
the whole journey is so emotional and it's so many years long. Like you are kind of just like, what's the next right step. And so like in real time, you're not necessarily processing all of it. You're just kind of trusting and taking the next step through it until you kind of go and look back on, on how the journey came about. But I would say I knew quickly, I just knew we had to try something different because what we had done wasn't working.
00:08:07
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. What about you, Erin?
00:08:11
Speaker
So, i mean, I agree with Lisa. I mean, it was the next step. I mean, we've tried everything else. Lisa's, you know, put her body and mind through all these tests and trials. And you know we've always we're coming up a little little short. So I think we were open to something different and and see if it would work. And we know the history of Claire. you know she had three beautiful you know babies herself. And we're like, hey, this is this is somebody that's proven. And and we we said, we're all in. And you know we went through that that process.
Embarking on a Sibling Journey
00:08:43
Speaker
Yes. And it was a beautiful process. I know that had, you know, its own ups and downs as every journey does. And Claire actually shared about it, you know, whenever she came on the podcast, you know, a few months ago. So, um, I know it was beautiful and resulted in your gorgeous baby girl. And now you're back for a sibling journey. What, what made you guys feel like just after everything that, you know, the timing was right to start this over again So it's funny, the first three years we had Emmy, I think it was a mix of she's all we ever wanted. Like we just like we just wanted one baby and family. And so in a way you feel so satisfied.
00:09:22
Speaker
i didn't need any more. But then also after she gets out of diapers and bottles and you start to get your sleep back, you're like, okay, I think I can balance this. that For me, the first three years, I wasn't ready. um And I think she fulfilled such a longing that I didn't feel like we need anything more.
00:09:36
Speaker
On the flip side of that, you have so many people in your circle that talk into you. And I would kind of just take little bits and pieces from from different people I would talk to. And, you know, I had ah a friend at work say, you know, her parents are aging and she's dealing with that by herself. And she wishes she had a sibling. And I had another friend just say like her biggest regret, her daughter's in college now is not having another. and And then you have people that reach out you and they're like, no, one is fine. Like, I don't know how people with more than one do it. And so...
00:10:03
Speaker
you know, you kind of just take bits and pieces, but I think in our heart, like it's the best thing we've ever done. we absolutely love being a family. It's, I mean, it's just been such a blessing, such a fun journey. And like, why wouldn't we want to do that again? And so I think too, as Emmy got older, she started asking about, you know, having a little brother or sister and, So that just tugs at your heartstrings a little bit. So um I think it's all of that. And I think, too, the one thing that, you know, probably delayed this journey a little bit more than doing it in the first few years. um I don't know that you ever feel fully ready. I think I was waiting to feel fully ready. I think everything with fertility.
00:10:42
Speaker
And surrogacy, it's so orchestrated and you have to like say, yes, we're ready. I don't know that most parents say I'm ready for another kid. And so yeah jump a little bit before you're ready and just say, we want, we want to, we want to expand our family. We want a sibling. We want all of this, no matter what comes with that.
00:10:58
Speaker
no matter what the journey looks like. And I think what's hard too, like Aaron and I had talked about this. It's not a guarantee. We could do all of this and still, as Claire shared on the podcast, like our first surrogacy journey with her did result in a loss. It was a miscarriage and there's just no guarantees, but I think we just said, we're going to put ourselves out there again. um you know,
00:11:18
Speaker
just to get a sibling for her. so she has got someone to grow up with and someone as we get older, think we're also older in the process. I'll be 41, Erin will be 48, having a second baby. And so I'm just making sure she's got a family around her. Keep that down, Lisa.
00:11:34
Speaker
You don't need to put my age out there. No, I mean... I mean, to piggyback off of what Lisa said, I think, you know, I joke with Lisa that, you know, we needed to make sure that Emerson was old enough to do chores and help with the baby. So that's why we waited.
00:11:52
Speaker
But no, I mean, we wanted we wanted to make sure, you know, like we grow as a family and, you know, we both have brothers and sisters. And there's no guarantee, like Lisa said, that the, you know, that relationship is going to be, you know, strong between siblings. But we feel like, you know, with our foundation and and with our our faith that, you know, we can grow that family. And Emerson is such a, you know, joy to be around. And she's got such a loving and caring heart, just like her mom, Lisa.
00:12:18
Speaker
that she will be a great big sister. So I think we decided that, you know, age is just a number and it doesn't matter. You know, we can we can move forward and then bring ah another little one into this world and into our family. So we're excited about that. And, you know, it's been going well so far.
00:12:34
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. Oh, she is precious. And I have never seen a little girl more ready to be a big sister. Oh, my goodness. She's waited patiently. Yeah. ah She has She has. Well, I think one thing that I'm hearing consistently is, you know, again, right? Like you're when before, before Emmy, it was okay. Surrogacy is now, you know, coming to me and okay. I have to step out in faith. And now exactly to your point, Lisa, I don't think any parent is ready to is, has that a hundred percent. Like, yes, all of my ducks are in a row and now it's time to take the next step. It is just a,
00:13:13
Speaker
Okay. Let's do it. Yeah. That's exactly what it was. We just looked at each other. think it was like Memorial Day weekend. We were thinking about it and we just knew like every time we're together as a family, like it's the best. like Why wouldn't we want to do more of this? And um in July, I think we signed paperwork. We're like, oh my gosh, what are we doing? And even the weeks after, but it it grows and it's so exciting. And so, yeah.
00:13:39
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. I think the best thing I heard, it was a, it was another intended mom and she was like, you're, you're going for the Christmas card. It can be so hard in some of those moments, but then whenever you think about that Christmas card or, you know, you're, you're going for that, that graduation party or, you know, that Thanksgiving dinner that you have in your mind and you're like, okay, we can do it, you know, that kind of thing. Yeah, for sure.
00:14:00
Speaker
What do you feel like have been some of the differences this, you know, second time around knowing more about the process, obviously
Emotional Transition to Surrogacy
00:14:10
Speaker
having had experience?
00:14:12
Speaker
i I think for me, like the first time around, you're learning to be a parent and just the process of pregnancy and all the things like we've never gone through. And so I think you're you're kind of taking all that in and you're taking the surrogacy journey. I think this time it's just, i don't know, I feel like it's a little more relaxed. I feel like we're, I'm totally trusting of the process. It's you're not hanging on to every little detail. I just trust that it will work out how it means to. you And we're also not learning how to be parents. and I think this time, like we can appreciate being parents and um So I don't know. I think it's a little less overwhelming because you don't have that component. We know what it's like. We've successfully ah raised a little one to five years old. So we've got that figured out.
00:14:51
Speaker
um So, yeah. And I think it's funny. It's been so many years since we first met with Claire that a lot of it is coming back for the first time. And I'm not exactly remembering all the details of the first time, but it's it's a lot less overwhelming, I think, just having now that we're parents. so And I think it is. I mean, the second go around, especially with the same with Claire, you know, it makes it easier. We know what to expect. She knows us. We know we know them. And yeah I think we just have this this bond with each other, obviously, because of Emerson. But we have this bond that, you know, we are
00:15:27
Speaker
Whatever needs to be done will be done. And it's just it's nice and fluid. And, you know, we meet up for dinner. And I think we got something scheduled next week with them as well. And it's not an awkward situation like, hey, can I can I feel like your belly when the baby's in there? Like we we know because those are the things that we do miss. And I think Lisa touched on a little bit in the beginning.
00:15:48
Speaker
You know, I don't get to put my hand on, you know, Lisa's belly or put my, you know, head against her belly and talk to the baby. So we do miss that. That is kind of, you know, hard at times and and difficult. But we also we know what the outcome is when you know, when it's all said and done. We got Emerson through that. So I think we're just.
00:16:08
Speaker
excited We're also enjoying the time that we have with just three of us because we know and in no time at all, we're going to have four of us and it's going to be a newborn. It's going be a lot of work. Sure. We know what that entails. So, but no, we're super excited.
00:16:22
Speaker
yeah If you're loving hearing Lisa and Erin's story, you're going to want to follow along with them in real time. They're sharing every moment of their sibling journey, the milestones, the waiting, even the little everyday joys on our social media at Create a Happy Family.
00:16:38
Speaker
You can find their updates and videos linked right below this episode. It's a beautiful look at what it really takes to grow your family through surrogacy. Okay, back to the show. As you, how do you navigate kind of maybe those those little, i don't, I mean, I guess you can call them maybe little moments of, of grief or, or maybe little moments of, of loss or, or wishing of, you know, like you said, Aaron, like putting your head on Lisa's belly or, you know, Lisa feeling those kicks, how, i mean, I know it makes it a lot easier with Emerson, you know, around, but how, how
Learning from Past Experiences
00:17:17
Speaker
did you navigate that early on and how are you navigating that now as maybe, you know, some of this stuff is starting to come back?
00:17:23
Speaker
For me, I think it was always just the long game. It's it's it's a small price you have to pay for what you're you're trying to have with a child. and right And some children come into families through adoption and other parents don't have the opportunity to do that either. And um so I don't know, it's it's kind of like a short-term pain for a long-term gain. And also I think finding special ways to do stuff differently. So And our first go around with Emmy, um Claire had us, you know, had an app where we could read books to the baby and she could play it. So the baby could hear our voices and kind of get used to it. And it was sweet. You know, it was sweet for us to sit and record ourselves reading to the baby. And so you you just find different ways, I think, to connect. And um yeah, just remember that what the end goal is. So those little those little things are important.
00:18:11
Speaker
They're what make it so special and make it yours because everybody's journey is different. And yeah, those, those little things make it so, so great. How has it been? i know, um I know you've said it's like, it's kind of riding a bike. Some of the stuff is like coming back you're like, oh, I remember that. How has it been going through like the screening, the evaluation, stepping back into the clinic after, you know, it's been a few years. How has that all been?
00:18:33
Speaker
Yeah, it's funny because, yeah, it's like muscle memory. I feel like it has been easier and it's been quicker and more efficient. And, you know we were all kind of joking. We we had to go through a psych eval again. And we were kind of reminiscing like when we did this six or seven years ago with Emmy. And so I think what's interesting at first, we were like, oh, do we have to redo some of that stuff? But I think You definitely you have to, but you should, because like we've all grown and changed through this and Claire's done a second journey since then. And, um you know, things change in the medical world and the legal world. And so I think it was good just to make sure we're all still on the same page um and just to reacquaint us with the process. And. um
00:19:15
Speaker
like I said, that first journey, we were kind of all learning. And I think this time we were able to kind of go through and be like, Hey, did that work? If so, let's repeat that. If it didn't work, do we need to adjust anything? Cause we also have a little kid now and we were probably more accessible before and they have three kids. And so just, I think just coming to an understanding of where everyone's at was still such a great idea um to be able to just kind of level set foundationally on what this looks like. But, but it has been a lot easier because I mean, Claire's just been a dream to work with and, I think it's our families have just kind of gotten along since day one. We had the benefit of having mutual connections. And so I think we're super fortunate to have that, but much easier and pretty efficient. I think this process has gone so fast and we've been a little shocked at sometimes, but it's like, well, we've done this before. And so Claire is on it. We're on it.
00:20:05
Speaker
So it's been pretty expedient. Yeah, i think I think obviously when we had Emerson, it was 2020, so it was during COVID. So lotss are just not i never do yeah you we weren't able to go to all the appointments. and And I mean, even here with busy work life, you know trying to find out work-life balance, we still don't get to go to all the appointments. So it's almost like we we're used to this and and and we know how it works and it's OK.
00:20:34
Speaker
But yeah, times have changed. I think going through the motions again does kind of bring back those memories. Like, oh yeah, you remember when we had to go through the cycle valve? Like I wasn't, you know, crazy and I'm still not crazy. And, you know, everything's still good. And, you know, they don't think I'm too old ah to have another kid. So it's exciting.
00:20:57
Speaker
I mean, the journey, and um it does make it easy that we've been through it with the same surrogate before. So we... you we're I would say we're more than acquaintances. We're really good friends you know when it comes down to it. And and they always have a special part in our hearts and you know in our lives forever. you know It's going to be two times now. Yeah, for sure. Well, and again, I mean, it just highlights, um you know, I think like you said, Lisa, like, hey, we, we, yes, we have done this before and our relationship was so great then, but we've grown and things have shifted. What are we going to do differently or what needs to change or what was great or you know, all of those things. And so that investment that you put into that relationship, um you know, obviously has grown and evolved and, and really makes, you know, the second journey all the more sweeter.
00:21:46
Speaker
With Emerson, you know, obviously as you're preparing her, you know, she so desperately is wanting to be the big sister. How did you guys talk to her about what this journey looks like and maybe how it relates to her story? And, you know, just how how did you prepare her for all of this? that's been like one of the sweetest parts that like is a gift that you you don't think about necessarily. So I think when she turned four, like before we even knew we were gonna do a second journey, I started talking to her about, i' just kind of testing her knowledge on what what she knew about how babies come. And you I started telling her that we had to borrow another belly because mommy's belly wasn't working. And so we started having those conversations around four. And then obviously just in the past like three months, about nine months later,
00:22:31
Speaker
we are actually now going through the process. And so I think she started having a a very brief understanding of how she came to, to the point that she would actually ask us at church, like, hey, can I go see Ms. Claire?
00:22:43
Speaker
ah Can I see a picture when I was in her belly? And so I think she was starting to put those things together. And then we decided to go forward on this sibling journey. And what was cool is bringing her to the clinic with us.
00:22:53
Speaker
And, you know, she just turned five. And it's funny how much they develop so quick. She started asking like, Mom, can I see the tube they're going to put the little baby in? And, you know, she got to actually FaceTime while we were doing the transfer. And, ah you know, I was I was walking her in and I said, this is where we put you in Miss Claire's belly. And so it's just kind of like a full circle. And I mean, she has as good of an understanding as she can for five. But I think.
00:23:16
Speaker
walking through it versus us just telling her how she came to, i think not only further normalizes how she came about, but just like really brings it to life. And it was, it was just, that was a really sweet, special moment that I wasn't expecting on transfer day to bring her with. And she had a lot more questions than I thought for her age and a lot more comprehension than I even thought just asking about the doctor and how it's all done. So yeah.
00:23:40
Speaker
yeah I love that it's, I mean, of course, obviously I know she's so excited to be a big sister, but I love how it's also just a celebration of her and her story. And that's so amazing that, you know, she and, and little sibling are going to have such a fun connection in just that way. Yeah.
00:23:59
Speaker
That's going to have that bond forever, which is going to be awesome. yeah So when she, you know, I know she she got to FaceTime, which is so fun. And then obviously we have like the 10 day wait, which I feel like is just the longest 10 days of anybody's life.
00:24:13
Speaker
How did, what was her reaction whenever you were like, okay, Hey, guess what? Like big sister, it's a label it's happening. Yeah, I think we know it's funny, right? Kids have kind of this blind faith that I think when we told her we were going through the process, like there's like almost no doubt. Like I think she thought when we were going through the process, like I'm becoming a big sister. And I love that because i don't know that when we got the positive test, if it really changed for her, i think she knew when we were going through it. yeah.
00:24:41
Speaker
certainly we then order her like the t-shirt and she got to wear it and we just did like a fall family photo shoot and she knew was all about like announcing big sister so it's definitely come to life a little bit more but um kids are funny like you never make a big life decision based on what your four-year-old says because six months before transfer she was asking every day for a sibling and like the week of transfer she's like you know I just want to be the only one can She goes, can we just give the baby back? I said, it's too late. She's like, can we get the baby back to Miss Claire? said, no, like we were all in. We're all in. And so, mean, thank goodness they change their mind every day. And she's obviously very much wants to be a big sister, but it's kind of.
00:25:21
Speaker
Well, and what a classic. set I know, right. She said, I just want to be the only one mom and dad. So, yeah. Yeah, she's she's already staking her claim in what's hers and what's not hers and, you know, independent. So it's it's it's a big thing for her.
00:25:38
Speaker
i mean, I know we we we pray every night, you know, with her for the baby in Ms. Claire's belly. So she's a part of that as well. So she's excited. I think, you know, as the process goes along and Ms. Claire is showing more and she's going to feel that, that's going to be another thing where I think you know, it's going to set in for more than, you know, when's the baby coming, when's the baby coming, you know, and we'll be soon enough, we'll know, you know, what the agenda is. So whether she's going to be, you know, big sister to a little sister or a little brother. So that'll be exciting to share that with her when that time comes.
00:26:13
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. Oh, it's so fun having these big monumental moments that, they are always a celebration. They sometimes have, you know, other feelings attached to them, whether it's stress or nervousness or, you know, just all of those things. But with, I feel like Emmy is that, that sort of like, Hey, this is like, she's, she's just bringing the joy. She just keeps bringing the joy to every, doing it with another child. Yeah. Is it is what it's making it so much
Anticipation of Second Child
00:26:39
Speaker
more special. Like it was obviously very special the first time around, but sharing it with her, i mean, it's, yeah, it's just been icing on cake.
00:26:47
Speaker
kicks For sure. for y'all, as you were, you know, again, you kind of keep, our you're, you're reliving it, but then it's also a new journey. Was there, was there a moment where it felt real, truly real versus, you know, like, okay, and we have our to-do list and, you know, oh gosh, now it's transfer day. What was that? you, have you had that moment it's like, oh no, this is really happening?
00:27:13
Speaker
I think it's funny after we made for me, after we made the decision and like signed the paperwork, I kind of like I said, I was waiting. I want all my ducks in a row. I wanted to know we were fully ready and I didn't get that. And so I think after we signed it we're like, oh, my gosh. And then we had a transfer day. It went very quick for us. And I know that's not always the experience. But because again, we'd gone through legal years ago, it was a rather quick process and we'd gone through psych evals. So we, we did re talk about things, but we had already aligned on things. Many hadn't changed. So I think when we got transfer day, we thought it was coming maybe in September, or October, it came in August. We were like, what in the world?
00:27:48
Speaker
And so it just, it happened very quick. And I think most recently, like on our first round with Claire, where we had a loss, It happened right before our 12 week appointment. And they said the baby stopped growing around 10 weeks. And so we just had our 11 week appointment last week. And to see that baby moving around and we saw little fingers stuck in their thumb to me, i think getting past that, that kind of hump where you maybe we've experienced a loss before made it really real.
00:28:15
Speaker
um Seeing the little profile we we had, you know, sadly we've had a lot of heartbeat appointments and that's a big one, but i think getting, Getting past that 11-week appointment was pretty special. So it it feels real now. So I think we're just, once we can know gender, I think because you don't get to connect with the baby in you know in your womb, if you're going through surrogacy, another way to connect is through knowing gender and be able to give them a name early. And so that's been pretty important to us. So I think that'll continue as we as we know what what we're expecting. So
00:28:48
Speaker
No, I mean, I think to Lisa's point for me and and where we've had losses before, you know, whether it was eight weeks, nine weeks, and then the first one of Claire was, you know, 10 and a half weeks.
00:28:58
Speaker
um I still remember that moment pretty vividly as as well as Lisa probably does, you know, driving down the wrong side of the road, just in disbelief that that happened. So with Emerson, for me, it was...
00:29:12
Speaker
When she's here, that's when it's real. I think it's a little bit easier this go around. So I would say the the heartbeat that we had knowing and then definitely the last week where we saw an arm and a thumb sucking and a leg kicking and I mean, there's there's nothing stopping what's coming now. So it's definitely definitely pretty real um now. I'm mean just looking forward to seeing, you know, is it a boy, is it a girl?
00:29:39
Speaker
You know, guys we'll be happy either way, but I'm pretty sure I'm going to be like the biggest girl dad again. i just have this feeling. Own it. Loud and proud. Loud and proud. i love it. I love it.
00:29:53
Speaker
One thing that I know, lisa you said when you were going through your own fertility treatment and your losses, you were you found it really cathartic to just share that. And you are now sharing your journey in real time you know with with everything that's going on What...
00:30:16
Speaker
what I mean, that's really vulnerable. And, you know, it it you're you're inviting a lot of people to walk alongside you and it takes a lot of courage. Was there like a specific moment or something that, you know, where where you were just like, no, this is something that I...
00:30:35
Speaker
I want to share. i don't I don't want to just keep it here. i want this to be something that you know others can can be part of. you know I don't know if there was a specific moment because when I first started sharing, I mean it i don't know, it probably i was around 2018 when um we had gone through, I mean think it was like four rounds of IUI. We had done three rounds of IVF.
00:30:55
Speaker
I think we had just announced like our first positive test and then that was a loss. and it It was just so much. and i I think I just made a video and posted it. I didn't really think about it. um And I think that the initial response I got so many people reaching out, it's like, gosh, there's so much more of this that we're just not talking about. And when you talk about it, I mean, I found four women on the street that we lived on that were all going through journeys in a fertility clinic. And it's just obviously, and I think even from when we started this journey seven years to ago to today, it's, I mean, I think it's so much more widely talked about.
00:31:29
Speaker
And I think we're realizing how prevalent it is. And so I think just that initial response and support and I think helped helped me. And I know that I helped other people who reached out to me just to kind of pick my brain on what we were going through and kind of compare notes and just kind of have a sense of community to get through it together. And so I think that's what kind of perpetuated me sharing updates because then people were kind of expecting updates. And so I think, um you know, even when we had the loss with Claire, what was different about that versus my losses and Claire might've said it on the podcast, but just this idea that like grief shared is grief divided and her getting to take the physical piece. And I had more of the emotional piece. And I think too, when you're sharing with other people, friends, family, coworkers, just out in the social media world, it also somehow like removes a little bit of the burden, right?
00:32:20
Speaker
certainly a little bit of the stigma and I think it just helps people navigating their journey. So it's just been a joy to get to share that. So, so I think for me, it's obviously it's different being, being a man and, you know, I don't get to go through all that physical and, and, you know, stuff with pregnancies that, that Lisa went through.
00:32:39
Speaker
um But having some of our neighbors on our street that were going through the same stuff, we were able to kind of relate and be there, but just being able to support Lisa. And I love that she was willing to share her story and our story, you know, with that being said, because I think that's what, when you share your story, that's what leads to other people wanting to step up and do more. And and Claire had this feeling in her heart long before us, but seeing our story and and the losses that we've gone through made her want to call Lisa and have a coffee date, which led to, you know, Emerson and is leading to our second one with them. So I think it's great to put your story out there. I think it's great to be vulnerable if if you can do that. I know it's hard for people. I mean, it's just not easy for a lot of people to do, but
00:33:28
Speaker
We're not the only ones that have gone through this. We won't be the last, unfortunately. But you know there's a lot of different avenues that people take, like Lisa IVF and you know iu with IUI and um all those different things that didn't work. And you know with our neighbors, they they had those ones. Some were able to get pregnant through IVF. Some wasn't able to get pregnant at all, but then you know by the miracle of God, was able to get pregnant on their own. so community and and sharing those stories, you know, helps bring people together, but also give people hope.
Addressing Surrogacy Stigma
00:34:03
Speaker
And I think that's the whole premise behind this is to give people hope that there's, you know, there's people out there that are going through this process and it's a struggle, but it takes a village for sure.
00:34:14
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. We'll get right back to the show, but real quick, if you're dreaming of growing your family through egg donation or surrogacy, we'd love to help. At Egg Donor and Surrogate Solutions, we've spent 18 years guiding hopeful parents with compassion, expertise, and personal experience.
00:34:31
Speaker
Our team includes people who have been intended parents, surrogates, egg donors, and even nurses. So when we say we understand, we truly do. You can schedule a free 15-minute call with our team at createahappyfamily.com to get your questions answered and explore your next steps.
00:34:49
Speaker
You don't have to navigate this journey alone. We're here to walk it with you. All right. Let's get back to the show. I feel like it's it's a club that... um ever you're you're a part of it and you don't always know who the members are because you know sometimes you just, there there are so many, you know in in intended parents in particular who, you know they are so hesitant to share their story. They're so concerned about you know judgment or misunderstanding or, you know wait, surrogacy? I thought only you know a Kardashian does that or you know whatever it may be. um And you know they're they're concerned about fielding those questions or or how to respond to certain things.
00:35:26
Speaker
For someone that's maybe in that in that moment where they do want to share, but they're so worried, what would, what would you say to someone, you know, who's just, who's scared to open up?
00:35:38
Speaker
I think just thinking about the other people that you can help through your journey. um i mean, selfishly, it will, it will help you. i think for me, it was cathartic. Like that's the impetus of why I did it.
00:35:50
Speaker
What I didn't know is how many are going to reach out and how many people I could connect with. And just in that simple connection, just conversations. I mean, old friends from high school I hadn't talked with in 15 years. People at church I just didn't know. I met people who I'd carried and I didn't even realize like how common even being a surrogate was. And I don't know, it's just amazing, I think, to broaden your community and talk to people, just have that support. So, I mean, for me, I kept doing because I realized there's a value in in helping other people, but it kind of just started just needing some help in processing myself.
00:36:23
Speaker
um So I think just being, just gotta be willing to take the risk and put it out there. And I think you'll be shocked at how many people and not just with infertility and surrogacy, but I think with any life struggle really.
Community Support and Agency Role
00:36:33
Speaker
And I think for me, I had learned it earlier my life through other struggles I've gone through is that when we share, it really is that connection and that, you know, helps you get through and helps you work through things.
00:36:44
Speaker
I mean, Just whatever Lisa wanted to do, I was i was supporting with her. You were along for the ride. I don't remember if I even told you I was posting. I don't know. think I just... No, I mean, obviously, I think, you know, being on social media at that time, you know, I'm not on it too much and and don't really have a big social media presence. and Not my not my my thing. But I think, you know, seeing her stories and to go through, like, it was healing for me, too, because...
00:37:15
Speaker
you know as a male, and um I can't speak for all males, but as this male, I tend to shut down and and keep it inside you know from the hurt and the pain. And you know it was good to see those videos that that she was posting or her stories because like it put it put it into...
00:37:32
Speaker
into words or a story, you know, with music, sometimes you would do sound and, you know, it made me smile, you know, know that we weren't, you know, alone. And then just all the people that would come to help and and and be there for us and talk with us.
00:37:47
Speaker
It was great. So I think advice would be, don't be afraid of what other people think. You know, you're always going to have ones that support you and you're going to have ones that are against you. But it doesn't, it doesn't matter in the long run, you know,
00:38:00
Speaker
Everybody longs for a family. And I think that's what the goal is, is to have a family. And, you know, there's groups out there, there's people out there, there's friends out there that will walk you through that journey.
00:38:12
Speaker
And it's not always guaranteed, but at least you have support. Yeah, for sure. And I think sometimes in the midst of that pain and grief and, you know, and Aaron, to your point, when you're shutting down, you have so many people that are or people that maybe are part of your inner circle that are coming to you and they're, you know, they'll say things like, well, just let me know anything that you need. And in that moment, sometimes you're like, I don't know what I need. But it's sharing your story. It has that community. And there is somebody that, you know, has been in that seat and can this helped me or, you know, those words of encouragement that maybe somebody else doesn't know just quite how to say or, you know, things like that. It it does. It opens up your world and gives you that support that maybe you wouldn't have had otherwise, for sure.
00:38:57
Speaker
When, so obviously, you know, shifting a little bit, I know Claire reached out to y'all and that was kind of how everything kind of first got started. But a lot of times people kind of look at agencies as like, this is just how you get matched or, you know, maybe you get started at a clinic first or, you know, things like that. What made you decide, you know, hey we're,
00:39:20
Speaker
Yes, sure. We've done this before, but, um you know, we we still want to have the support that, you know, we had in the past. Did you, like, what made you guys decide to to go with that versus like, oh, let's just do this on our own. We know exactly what we're doing. Yeah, I know. you know, it's tempting. And even the first time around, i had a friend, friend,
00:39:39
Speaker
a family member, a friend, and another of coworker, like, all be like, I'll carry your baby. And it's like, okay, in theory, that's very kind, but there's a lot to it. Like, y'all need protections, and you need someone who knows what, you know, the legalities of it. And it's more complicated, right, and complex than I think anyone can anticipate, and especially when it comes to relationships friends and family. And even if you don't know, and you're getting matched, I think,
00:40:04
Speaker
uh having someone that's just uh kind of a conduit between the two parties that is an expert that also just keeps you on track with everything that you need to do and all the things that you're not thinking of uh right like like i wouldn't have thought of her medical insurance and and what do we do if it does or doesn't cover her and what if she falls out of coverage mid-journey like all the things you don't think of you really do need an expert that's walking alongside you, I would say the benefits for us is definitely there's a lot of moving parts um from just, you know, the psych eval to the match meeting to doctor's appointments, medical, legal. And so I think just making sure everything is moving along, that you're staying kind of on time with everything.
00:40:48
Speaker
um It's the coordination is a key piece. And so I think for us, even though we knew Claire, I think it was just it was kind of a no brainer that we would definitely have an agency again, have surrogate solutions do this again with us just to keep the process smooth and just to protect everyone involved. So.
00:41:08
Speaker
Was there a moment, you know, either during your first journey or maybe even now, you know, now that you're in this one where you're like, oh, my goodness, I am so glad that I am not having to handle this on own. gosh. All of the administration. I mean, I don't know. All of it. I just, you know, it's like we both work full time. We have a little kiddo. And it's just, you know, there's a lot that goes into it. And so I think. ah For me, it's all of it. the The legal, the medical, I mean, just kind of, we get constant reminders for everything we need to be doing. If we're lagging and haven't followed up with something, there's a kind nudge and hard conversations too, right? You you have some tricky conversations about, you know,
00:41:46
Speaker
um what this could look like if the you know embryo or baby doesn't turn out healthy and what does everyone want in that scenario? And have we had that hard conversation? And um what does a relationship look like during and after the baby comes? What are the expectations on both sides? And having a party that's not attached to the IP or the GC and is kind of in the middle of just helping liaise and guide with experience on their side, I think is very helpful.
00:42:14
Speaker
Um, yeah, for me, it's all of it, but I would say those are a few that stand out. Yeah. Has there been anything that, you know, has helped you feel guided and supported, even though you aren't new to the process?
00:42:31
Speaker
that's a great question. Um, Yeah, I mean, this one's definitely, um this one is definitely like, it's coming back to us, I think, as we're going through it. But quite frankly, like we forgot a lot of the details just because it had been so much time. And so um I don't know if any part stands out as specifically helpful, but I think... um I don't know. I just like having a guide along the way. It's kind of that insurance that like, I'm not missing anything. Yeah, no, I'm not as organized as as as as well as you are, Lisa. So I think having surrogate solutions and and and all the people that are involved are great with the reminders and I'm all all for them doing all the all the paperwork because there's a lot that goes into they don't realize. So definitely having that third party. Yeah.
00:43:17
Speaker
to help provide the support. And the you know you guys are always available too for questions. So you know it's it's hard to get through doctor's offices and ask questions, but we can we can reach out to you on just questions that we get with email. So it's always great to know that just a phone call away.
00:43:32
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. And I think, you know, going back to something that you said, Lisa, about, you know, those tough conversations, I think sometimes, you know, and you've kind of already said it, but yes, it's a second journey and and everybody kind of knows all the players, but things are a little different. You do have, you know, a five-year-old versus, you know, not having a kiddo at home yet. and you know, know claire's in a different spot now with you know older kids and you know other you know beads and things and so to have somebody if something does come up that maybe you weren't expecting you know or things like that can't to be there to you know support and talk through and you know have maybe some some of those like you said tough conversations can be really helpful yeah yeah i think it's beneficial for all of us especially because we do we have remained friendly with them in between and you know we have built a friendship and i think just having someone
00:44:23
Speaker
in the middle to help guide us and make sure we're in lockstep has been really helpful.
Messages of Love and Perseverance
00:44:29
Speaker
At this point in your journey, what do you think has helped you stay grounded and just hopeful throughout this process?
00:44:38
Speaker
Oh gosh. um For us, it's our faith. um And, you I think just the idea of being perseverant, no matter what, like I think even before Emmy got here, it's like, if we give up, we know what the outcome is. If we continue to try, there's always hope. And so i just remember we just didn't feel ready to say, no, this was the end. And so i think just persevering when sometimes that's the only option you have is because that's where the hope is. If you stop trying, you're not going to get the family. And so i think now that we've been through this once and we have a kiddo,
00:45:14
Speaker
there is I guess there is some kind of relief. I think on our first journey, if it didn't work, there was this, will we not have a family one day? Now, if it didn't work, that would be devastating, but we have a child that we're so grateful for. so um I think we just have a lot, I have a lot of faith that the process will work out how it needs to, and we'll get through it, you know, with community and support either way.
00:45:37
Speaker
um And truly that never ends as a parent. I think thinking of it that way too, like even when the kiddo comes, then you're worried about them for the rest of their lives and their health. And um oh my gosh, it just, it doesn't end. So it's like, welcome to the beginning of just kind of needing to stay grounded. And yeah, yeah.
00:45:55
Speaker
so Yeah, definitely definitely the faith. I think definitely the the history that, you know, it's been successful in the past, even with a bumpy road the first time.
00:46:07
Speaker
But, I mean, we got a beautiful daughter in Emerson. And I think now where we're at, you know, 11 and a half weeks in, I think, you know it's we're just counting the weeks down now you know just like waiting for christmas to get here in may so um but it's just it's just faith it's just knowing you know our our group of of people and and and claire and and aaron over there um we've all been through this together um and you know we're just enjoying the journey this time um around and i think
00:46:38
Speaker
you didn't know what you were getting into in the, and the the first go around and this being our second, I think we get a leg up in a sense where we know what to expect and what's going on. And I think once you get past that 11th week, 12th week, um, it's smooth sailing.
00:46:52
Speaker
Um, you know, then it's the countdown of the day. So, uh, no, we're excited and, uh, I can't wait. I love that. I love that so much. Okay. I have two more questions for you.
00:47:05
Speaker
If, your kiddo, little boy, little girl could one day listen to this episode. What message would you want them to hear about how they came into this world? Oh gosh, that makes me so immediately emotional. Um, I think just that like you were so thought of and so intentionally, um, prayed for to join our family, to be a sibling to Emerson, to be a kiddo of ours. And, um,
00:47:37
Speaker
don't know. I hope they you know, just a story of, um, of hope and perseverance and not giving up. And, um, I don't know. I think families are made in all types of ways. And so I think just, you know, I want them to know that, uh, how much care and how much effort has gone into this. Um, just like if you were to adopt a child, it's like that child is so loved and it's a little bit of a different journey, but it's, uh,
00:48:03
Speaker
still so much care and love went into that. So we're just so excited. It'll, it's, you know, this will be one of two of the best journeys I think Aaron and I have ever gone on in our life. So.
00:48:14
Speaker
Just endurance would be the word that I would love for, you know, not only Emerson, but whatever the next miracle baby is that's coming is just endurance that, you know, mom and dad never gave up. You know, we we wanted this, you know, so bad to have a family and that, you know, the family that you're going to be born into is going to always love you unconditionally. So that's what I would say.
00:48:43
Speaker
For sure. Beautiful. Absolutely beautiful. Okay. Last question. And we've kind of already touched on it, but um me and coffee, I am, we are codependent. We, I, I'm not at a single meeting without a cup. Yep. There we go. So I always love to ask the question, what filled your cup today, literally, or figuratively, what has been the thing that has filled your cup?
00:49:10
Speaker
in general, just becoming a mom is the best journey of my life. um i it's i don't know. i would i would give up everything else in the world to just you know have a family. um As far as today, i think just the joy of sharing is so powerful. And it you know whether it's good news or bad news, I think it's just sharing with others. It just brings others into the fold. And i don't know. It's just a beautiful blessing to get to share.
00:49:37
Speaker
both the joy and the hardship. I know I said it earlier, but like grief shared is grief divided and joy shared his joy multiplied. And so I think it's just really cool. Even in the good, we're here today celebrating because we've had a great journey. We're on our second. And I think just sharing that is just a great message of hope. So I think for me, that's very fulfilling to get to be part of that. so Your words are always so well said, Lisa. That's why I love you so much.
00:50:03
Speaker
ah My cup was filled with a vanilla sweet cream cold brew this morning. So that was that was great. ah Great way to start the day. Gosh, I took that real figuratively, didn't I? I should have just said coffee. Yeah, yeah.
00:50:19
Speaker
I mean, ah every day, I mean, it's, it's cliche, but every day, i mean, I get to take, you know, Emerson to school every day and pick her up. And, um, you know, so my day is always full doing that. Um, and I enjoy that and and being able to do this again, um, here and in a few months, it's going to be even better. So, um, cause we'll have a family of four, so I can't wait for that. Um, so that's what fills my day up.
00:50:42
Speaker
I love it. I love it. Well, again, thank you guys so much for, you know just, sharing your story before, now, during, in the middle of all of it, just sending all of the good vibes and happy thoughts and can't wait to hear what, if Emerson's going to get to have a little sister little brother. we cannot wait. Yes. We'll know in the next few weeks and we'll keep you posted.