Become a Creator today!Start creating today - Share your story with the world!
Start for free
00:00:00
00:00:01
A Bond Born Through Surrogacy
45 Plays9 days ago
Two women — 2,700 miles apart — connected through surrogacy and built a lifelong friendship. After loss, Jackie found hope through Kaitlin, a first-time surrogate who carried her daughter and helped her become a mother. Their story is proof that love creates family in the most unexpected and beautiful ways. 🌷
Recommended
Transcript
Jackie's Determination and Loss
00:00:00
Speaker
So basically I had decided that I was going to have a family with or without a partner at at this point. Right. And then unfortunately I lost the baby.
00:00:11
Speaker
pretty late term It was like a tragic traumatic kind of loss. I said at the beginning, I knew my limitations. I just knew I wasn't like, I didn't want to go put myself through that again. i didn't want to put,
00:00:25
Speaker
a child through that. know what I mean? So I was like, let me look into different options. That's Jackie, a single mom from New York who refused to let heartbreak be the end of her story.
00:00:38
Speaker
She's been through every test, every treatment, and was ready to find a new way to bring her daughter into the world. I just kind of fell in love with the whole the whole idea of being able to do something. I compare it to like, you know, we played The Sims as kids and yeah they would have them these aspirations that you would have to achieve. And when you achieve them, their little like diamond on top of them would turn platinum. And as soon as I thought about surrogacy, I was like, that's my platinum.
00:01:04
Speaker
Like that is my life goal. That is what I want to do. That's Caitlin, a mom, wife, and first time surrogate from Washington, whose platinum dream was helping another woman become a mom.
Bonding over Surrogacy
00:01:17
Speaker
Because I put in my profile, like, I love the Foo Fighters and I want to be BFF with Dave Grohl. And I knew in my mind, I'm like, it's going to stand out to someone. Two women, 3,000 miles apart, instantly connected over kindness, honesty, and the Foo Fighters.
00:01:34
Speaker
And together, they begin a journey that would change both of their lives. This conversation is a special one from the early days, back when this podcast was called Me, You, and Who. The name may have changed, but the mission's still the same, helping you create a happy family.
Podcast Introduction
00:01:52
Speaker
In this episode, you'll meet Jackie and Caitlin, two women who turned distance into connection, heartbreak into hope, and surrogacy into something far greater than ever imagined.
00:02:04
Speaker
This is Across the Miles, how Jackie and Caitlin's surrogacy journey created a lifelong bond. Enjoy! Who knew it could take more than two people to have a baby?
00:02:16
Speaker
I'm Whitney Hall, a two-time surrogate, now part of the team at Egg Donor and Surrogate Solutions. And I've seen how life-changing this process can be when you feel informed, supported, and confident about your next step.
Caitlin's Surrogacy Journey
00:02:31
Speaker
Each week on Create a Happy Family, you'll hear real stories and expert insights from hopeful parents, surrogates, egg donors, and professionals, all to help you understand what it really takes to create a family in this way.
00:02:47
Speaker
Because at the heart of it all, we're creating happy families. one relationship at a time.
00:02:57
Speaker
Well, okay. So before we get into just talking about just her glorious, squishy self, i want to like, let's go back to the beginning. Yes. Let's travel back in time. All alright so both of you and like, please feel
Finding the Right Agency
00:03:12
Speaker
free to jump in. Like, well, I guess like Caitlin, what led you to surrogacy in the first place? Like when did this even like pop into your mind?
00:03:21
Speaker
I saw an ad on Facebook and it was for a popular surrogacy agency here in the Pacific Northwest. So I did some research and I think the whole thing is is kind of kismet what led me to it. Cause I saw it and then I, I worked for a mortgage loan officer and I was talking to one of our borrowers and she mentioned that she was looking into surrogacy. So I got a couple of agencies from her, did my own research and And I just kind of fell in love with the whole the whole idea of being able to do something. I compare it to like, you know, we played the Sims as kids and yeah they would have these aspirations that you would have to achieve. And when you achieve them, their little like diamond on top of them would turn platinum. And as soon as I thought about surrogacy, I was like, that's my platinum.
00:04:07
Speaker
Like that is my life goal. That is what I want to do. and there were a lot of things that led me led me to Jackie. There was like a bump with a previous agency I should have known was a red flag. You know how first time surrogates, we just, we turn into yes girls. We get so excited.
00:04:25
Speaker
and really everything that like led me to Jackie is just insane. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. That's amazing. Okay. So much to unpack there. First of all, I like 100% love like that visual of like, I want, like that was my platinum. Oh my gosh. yeah And yes, I was spent way too much time, honestly. You need to edit that so in the background when she talks. Her little platinum. Yeah. hear the sound cool blood of dy Oh my God. i love that. No, that's amazing. Okay. So yeah, I think
00:04:57
Speaker
You hit the nail on the head, especially like, you know, as a formost or as a former surrogate myself, like you do, you become a yes girl because you're just so excited and like, you want to make those dreams happen and, you know, just all of those things. And you said you were doing research and had an unfortunate incident with another agency. Okay. Tell me like, tell me a little bit more, like what did research look like for you and how did you kind of like, what was that red flag? And, you know, just for other women who are thinking about doing this kind of, what are maybe some of those things that we need to look out for.
00:05:28
Speaker
Yeah. Well, I mean, i didn't know what I was doing. um You know, those, those Facebook, those review groups are a cluster. I don't really know how to decipher it. I don't know what people are talking about. I wasn't in that one at the beginning. I just YouTube surrogacy and just wanted to watch somebody's day in the life of, of being surrogate. And the most popular video at the time, you know, I was like, well, I'll try this agency. And I applied and, you know, they, they were really nice. And be they were, I was really honest with them. I told them everything. I mean, I don't have any complications or anything crazy. And then they're like, great. Well, we will send your profile out and like contact you, which I know surrogate solutions does it the opposite way.
Jackie's Family Decision
00:06:15
Speaker
And I prefer the way surrogate solutions does.
00:06:18
Speaker
And i I matched with somebody cause I was like, yeah, sure. I mean, people are nice. People will put on their best front. And they were, their profile seemed okay. Didn't know what I was looking for.
00:06:30
Speaker
And ah had a meeting with them. uh, sorry, lost my train of thought. yeah Yeah. I had yeah had a meeting. i had a meeting with them and I was like, yeah, sure. Like I didn't get anything bad from them. And then a couple days go by and, um, the match coordinator was like, well, their escrow didn't fund all the way. So we found this other couple and we're ready to match you.
00:06:53
Speaker
and yeah we're ready to go. And I was like, well, can I meet them first? Can we talk first? And she's like, oh, yeah, I guess i guess that's fine. was like, okay. so And so I did.
00:07:06
Speaker
and then i I matched again because I didn't know what I was doing. and I was supposed to go down for medical screening.
00:07:20
Speaker
My coordinator, we had some interesting conversations. She had told me a little bit about what she liked to do before transfer and all this stuff she liked to get out before transfer. And like, that's weird, but okay, whatever.
00:07:33
Speaker
and my medical screening, my, my, sorry, my flight and my hotel was not booked and it was 24 hours to medical screening down in California. Stop.
00:07:45
Speaker
No. And so that was my red flag. And that was the day that I was like, I can't, I can't do it anymore. Like, I am, I'm sorry that like, we because we got through psych. And I'm like, I'm so sorry. i was like, this is just not right.
00:07:58
Speaker
Like, I don't feel like I'm being taken care of everything. And I told my husband, I was like, I'm gonna wait. to look at another agency again. i waited a week before applied at Surrogate Solutions and I talked talked to Amber and everything was night and day difference. Everything has been night and day difference.
00:08:14
Speaker
I don't know. I hear other podcasts. I hear other surrogates and I'm like, wow, I like got the cream of the crop. Like this is the best agency. But yeah, I'm really glad everything that led me to Surrogate Solutions. And then the previous agency was,
00:08:32
Speaker
I had gotten off some medications and they weren't going to wait. They didn't care. They're like, yep, send you through whatever. But surrogate solutions was like, no, we'll wait three months. And what I, what's funny about that is I had to wait two extra months after I applied. And I think if I wouldn't have had to wait that two months, I would not have matched with Jackie. Cause Jackie was with surrogate solutions for like three weeks.
00:08:55
Speaker
Yeah. wouldn't We wouldn't have matched. No. Oh my gosh. Oh oh my gosh. other Oh, and we can't imagine that. Absolutely not.
00:09:08
Speaker
It really was. It was so, oh my gosh, it was so meant to be. And I know those bumps are so hard, especially when you're going, like when you're feeling all of those like awful feelings and, you know, as you're going through something, wanting to do something so amazing, but Oh my
Matching with Surrogate Solutions
00:09:21
Speaker
gosh. I'm so, ah I'm so glad that that all worked out. I'm so glad you had such an amazing experience just at the beginning of everything, especially after you had gone through everything that you went through. So, okay, Jackie, I know like you were only hanging out in matching land for like three weeks. It was like, it was amazing, but it was crazy. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Cause I, I know we like kind of gave the
00:09:47
Speaker
it can be six months to a year and you know, we take our time and Caitlin, you're right. Like we, we do things different. It's not, it's not the list. It's not your number 25 and your match with number 25 or, you know, like that kind of thing. It's, we we really do try and find the right, the right person. But, um, okay. So Jackie, what was your, before you even got there, right.
00:10:08
Speaker
What led you to building your family this way? So, uh, most so many steps before this. Yeah. then surrogacy was like another big step. So basically I had decided that I was going to have a family with or without a partner at, at this point. Right. So I had free froze my eggs Yeah. Years ago. Right. um yeah What they don't tell you when you freeze your eggs is like, it's better to freeze embryos than it is to eggs because eggs may not work. Right. know i once I decided that I was going to do this, I was like, okay, we're gonna give like, I'm a very, like, I know what I want.
00:10:53
Speaker
And I know what I can't do. Right. I know what my limitations are, which I think is like really key going through this process as like an intended parent is like just knowing your limitations. Like some women can keep going and going and going. And like, I was like, I'm doing this. If this doesn't work, we're onto the next step. So that's like what has kept me going.
00:11:16
Speaker
I don't get caught up in like, just because it didn't work this way, it's not going to happen. I think that's like a really key point that like, I feel like a lot of my friends that have gone through it or go through fertility issues, like just like it's stuck in like one step and like everyone is different. There's different ways that people deal with things. But I think for me, it was just like, okay, if this doesn't work, then we're moving on to the next step.
00:11:38
Speaker
Right. So I basically, my my frozen eggs didn't work. I only had, I think I only had like four or five. i don't even remember at this point. They didn't work. So I was like, okay, going to give myself one round of IVF. If that doesn't work, I'm moving on to donor eggs because I'm not about to shoot myself up, spend all this money. Cause to me, genetics wasn't like the end all be all. Like I didn't mind. Like it's like, it's not important to me. It is important to other people, but it wasn't, isn't important to me. Sure. Absolutely.
00:12:09
Speaker
Wound up not that the first round of IVF was not working. and I just didn't want to do another round. Like I didn't want to do another round because I didn't want to spend all that money. I didn't want to put my body through it. So i was like, i'm moving on to donor eggs, which is fine with me.
00:12:24
Speaker
And i found donor eggs. It was really fast. The clinic that we worked with, RMA of New York, was, like, amazing. and they, like... I can't recommend them enough. They're incredible. Oh, love that. It makes a difference. It really does. And I think walking into it, like, i when I first started this process, like I i froze my eggs through NYU, but then went to RMA because of like referrals, right? A lot of my clients who had gone through it worked with RMA of New York and like loved them. I also think that's important for like
00:12:59
Speaker
That is, I had, i was able to monitor locally. So like, I think that's another key fact that was like brought up to me. So went to RMA of New York with, um, like they were with me the whole time through, the frozen eggs didn't work. Then we're going to donor eggs. So like, sure. The donor eggs made great embryos, got pregnant the first time, and then unfortunately I lost the baby.
00:13:24
Speaker
pretty late andform It was like a tragic, traumatic kind of loss. Oh, gosh. I recommend anyone go to therapy right after something like that and work through it. because Absolutely. Yeah.
00:13:37
Speaker
I like the day after I was like, let's go therapy because you can't keep that stuff in. Like you shouldn't keep that stuff in. So I worked through it. And I mean, like, I'm a pretty strong person, but that was like,
00:13:50
Speaker
and then stuff yeah yes And then I was going back and forth because i had, so I had made four embryos. The first, you know, I got pregnant on the first try. So i had three embryos left. But like I said at the beginning, I knew my limitations. I just knew I wasn't like, I didn't want to go put myself through that again. i didn't want to put Yeah.
00:14:17
Speaker
let me look into different options and one of my best friends was going through the surrogacy option and i wasn't honestly even thinking about it until then because i'm like i ah don't want to do this again yeah And I was also looking at adoption, right? And I was like, sure again, genetics, not important to me. So let
Shared Values and Goals
00:14:37
Speaker
me look at both options. But then I just figured since I had embryos and like, I think it would be important, like that would be like her sibling. I'm like, this is really important. So I decided to go towards surrogacy and I did research.
00:14:55
Speaker
Yeah, you did. Yes, I did. i have an Excel that I, and like, that's why this podcast and like, telling our story is so important because like, I don't want it to be like just the Kardashians or rich yeah can do this. Like you can do this. Like I am a single woman, like you can do this. yeah And it was like research and research and research. And like, no one host me besides my friends who wasn't even, he had matched, but like, he wasn't on a journey yet.
00:15:28
Speaker
Yeah. um And so I just did research and I think like I found that there's a lot, a lot of surrogate agencies that like want $60,000 up front and like you're still on ah a list. No way. That can take nine months and like you're not going to get that money back for nine months. So like are you going matched or like what is. So I wound up getting linked up with a really good lawyer who was like if you can find agencies and there are agencies that don't take your money until you're matched.
00:15:57
Speaker
Work with someone like that because like, that's, you you know, and then you go back and forth like, okay, I don't give them money. Are they going to work for me to find a match? Like it was all this back and forth. Then there's concierge, donor, like donor concierge. And I'm like, oh my God.
00:16:16
Speaker
but like It's overwhelming. It's so overwhelming. Because it's not regulated, right? So like surrogacy is not regulated. So you're finding all these agencies. It's not like when you're trying to find an IVF clinic where like you have doctors that need to be regulated that like,
00:16:32
Speaker
So it was a whole big thing. And I wound up finding very minimal agencies that didn't take my money up front. Surrogate solutions was one of them. And i talked to Gail at first and she was yeah amazing. and I was like, Oh, and then lost, I talked to Lauren who was another, I'm like, Oh my God, I love Lauren. know Sad after my Lauren call because I am a very liberal person.
00:17:01
Speaker
I'm very liberal. And I feel like a lot of surrogates are not. And there's a lot of like, I wanted two main things for me that was really important was like, I was in charge of like termination. If God forbid something was wrong with the baby or someone's life was in danger. Like I wanted to be able to make that decision and vaccination. Right. And like, not just talking about the hype of COVID I'm talking about like some, like, I want you to take the Tdap shot, right? Like,
00:17:29
Speaker
And some so I was afraid that, like, I was worried because the the examples that I was sent by Gail of the surrogates that Surrogate Solutions had were more on the red line. And I was like, ah I'm never going to find someone. And then like three weeks later.
00:17:46
Speaker
Lauren emails me like, like it was like nine o'clock at night. And it was like, she's like, I found the perfect surrogate for you, but she's across the country. And i was like, what? And then like, you know, you have to go online and like, look at the profile. And I was like, Oh my God, like she could be my sister. and like literally looked at and i was like, okay, is it supposed to happen this fast? Because I was too like six months, nine months. And then fast. We had a zoom call and like literally after our zoom call, I like emailed Lauren, like subject line was like, I love them. Like, Oh, I think later on Lauren had said that like, we both did the same thing that we were just like, hu yeah. yeah
00:18:30
Speaker
Oh my gosh. and now Jackie, there's so much. There's so much. Oh my gosh. No, i love. We'll get right back to the show in just a second. But real quick, have you ever wondered what it would be like to help create a family through surrogacy?
00:18:45
Speaker
At Egg Donor and Surrogate Solutions, we've spent 18 years walking alongside women who said yes to making a difference. And we'd love to support you as you explore if surrogacy might be the right next step.
00:18:57
Speaker
Our team includes women who have been surrogates themselves. So when we say we understand, we truly do. You can download our surrogate journey and compensation guide at createahappyfamily.com.
00:19:10
Speaker
It's a big decision and it's okay to have questions. This is your invitation to find out more. All right, let's get back to the show. I love this because you you are so right because, it i mean, every journey is unique. and There is so much out there and, you know, it's, and it's so hard to get lost in Google and Facebook. And, you know, I always say just beware of Dr. Google and beware of Dr. Facebook. And, you know, it's, it's madness. And yes, you're right. Those examples out there are the celebrities and the sensational clickbait of, you know, the horror stories that happen and, you know, things like that. And it can be really, really hard to, to get in on, you know, just, Just all of that for sure. And yes, you you absolutely hit you know a high point there. like it It's not a regulated industry. There is a group, it's called SEEDS.
00:20:01
Speaker
And if an agency is a member of SEEDS, there is regulations. But government wise, like literally, it's not regulated. Yes, there's every state has their laws and and things like that. But, you know, it's it's just different. And that's definitely something.
00:20:17
Speaker
to be aware of when you're doing research and things like that. And, you know, oh my gosh, yes. And then poof, here comes this magic Caitlin just in your inbox and like, oh my gosh. And then it was just kismet from there. So at any point in time, and this is like to both of you, because, and Caitlin, I'm sure, Jackie, I don't know if your research, if you did go into Facebook land, but Caitlin, I'm sure you saw, okay. So then I'm sure you both saw how a lot of times you start like the agency thing becomes so scary that people are like well let's just take the middleman out and do this independently was that ever a thought in your mind not for me no that's too much that's too much work I work full-time and I'm a full-time mom and full-time wife and I like to live my life and I was like there's no way
00:21:06
Speaker
Yeah. Absolutely no Yeah. And for me, it was, it was, I have, I don't have the time for that. And I would be able to do it. My type A personality don't get me wrong, but i feel like I needed someone who had been through that and like guide me because like, I wasn't playing with this, you know what I mean? like And, and surrogate solutions like is on ah the lesser end, like less expensive than most agencies. Yeah. We're for sure. I'll pay someone to like, get me done the right way. Then like yeah having to guess and like for something that like for, for a human life. No.
00:21:49
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Oh gosh. And how, what was kind of your timeline between, you know, your loss and when you decided that maybe this was the route I know you said the, and yes to therapy. I can't like, I will shout it from a mountaintop. I don't care who, what, where, when, like everybody should just be in therapy. I love it. Yes. yes I love therapy.
00:22:17
Speaker
yeah What was kind of that timeline for you and how did you just kind of get through? i know you said like you you were like, I know my limitations and I had, you had set those boundaries in place. Like what was kind of that as you were working through that?
00:22:34
Speaker
I mean, the timeline was freaking quick too. Like yeah everything was quick here. Like the, I lost the baby in June I matched with Caitlin in September.
00:22:46
Speaker
oh my gosh. And I decided to go through with
Community Support and Fulfillment
00:22:50
Speaker
surrogacy. I want to say in August, like I was like, I'm doing this, but like, I don't do something. And just like whimsically, like I research. Yeah. And like, I really researched adoption too.
00:23:04
Speaker
And like, it was just like, it was, it was hard. And like, I didn't want to go through the heartbreak of like, if I was someone else outside of like in a different state, they have so many timelines of like when they could change their mind about taking the baby back. And I was like, no, I can't, I can't do that myself. Like ah my limitation. Yeah.
00:23:23
Speaker
But yeah, it was quick. It was. Yeah. Oh my gosh. Well, and it sounds like like you you had all of those those things in place. I mean, you said, you you know, single woman, you so you had your therapist, you had your friends, you had like that. just why yeah yeah I don't like, i think I think what you have to really do is like not keep things inside. And like, I don't. And like, I talk about things and like, i think that that is like,
00:23:51
Speaker
you have to do that. You like, I know so many women, like a good friend of mine, like has gone through so many losses and like, if you don't go through, if you don't get help and go through therapy, like it, you're just gonna, it's, you're gonna do it eventually. Cause it's going to come at you eventually. yeah right Like, yeah so it's just important for me. Cause like my whole big thing was like, I knew i was going to be a mother.
00:24:17
Speaker
there So I just was like, that's not going to not happen. Right. Like when I was going through the law, that is not, and that's not an option. Right. And like, my friends were like, of course not. If anyone is going to do it, you're going to do it. I'm like, yeah yeah. But like when you're going through it, I'm like, I don't know guys. And then like, eventually you get to a point where you're like, okay, you got to do it.
00:24:38
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Oh, I love that. Caitlin, how was, you know, your experience as far as okay, you knew you were going to be a surrogate and then just educating the people around you of like what that meant. And, you know, like, were you kind of shouting it from a mountaintop or you were like, oh oh, absolutely. Yes. I am like the proud, I am one of the proudest surrogates. Oh yeah. I am so proud.
00:25:04
Speaker
No, I had, an outpouring of support. My mom has always known that I like to do, wouldn't say outlandish things, but I like to do different things. So like, when i was like, oh, I want a cloth diaper on. She's like, interesting. Good luck with that. Or, oh, I want to go to these school. She's like, interesting. Like I'm here to support you. I'm her only child. So she has always been like rah, rah, rah on my side yeah for for everything. um oh my God. And my husband, my lovely husband, he has been so supportive of the entire thing. My son was
00:25:35
Speaker
I believe he was about to turn three at the time. Yeah. Cause we matched in September and he turned three in December. my my, my whole work, my boss, my boss is my age. He's been so supportive.
00:25:48
Speaker
I have met like very minimal people that have been so unsupportive. And if they are unsupportive, they don't live like near me. So yeah. Yeah. and And it, and it doesn't, it doesn't break my heart because the tribe that I do have trumps everything else.
00:26:04
Speaker
that could, that could be negative. And that support has continued to increase and grow. And I've been very vocal about it on my Facebook page and my Instagram and just making the connections with, with other surrogates too. And I, you know, I opened the platform for people like, ask me questions. I'm an open book. Like, you're not going offend me. And I mean, they slowly trickle in. They're like, I've been wanting to ask this for a long time, but like, What's this like? What's that like? sure And then all the all people need is just a perspective shift.
00:26:36
Speaker
You know, and they're like, well, I would want to keep the baby. Well, perfect. You would fail psych. So don't worry about it. Don't worry about it. but But it is a very valid question. I mean, you know, we're we're taught from such a young age that like, you know, the the child inside of our body, it's ours. We grow that connection with it.
00:26:56
Speaker
But I mean, from with surrogacy from the get-go, your first initial move towards surrogacy is, I want to have somebody else's baby. And then from there, like every single email appointment, everything is a constant reminder that like, this is something I'm doing for somebody else. And, you know, if I wanted to keep a baby, like I would have a baby myself. My life is at a perfect balance and I mean, shout out to people who have multiple kids, but it would, it would be devastating.
00:27:23
Speaker
Like I, I am absolutely overjoyed that I just have, that we just have our son because yes we're like a little gang, but yeah. well sort yeah tremendous You, you hit a huge thing right there. Like you're happy with your family. That's step one right there. Like you're, you're good. And then, like you said, you made that connection with Jackie, you, you, as a surrogate, you make that connection with those intended parents or parent and like, you want to see them, like you want to see that family. I don't want to go through the newborn phase again. Like I don't, like I know it's beautiful. It's all, it's all so, so beautiful. But like, I am minus getting up in the middle of the night to pump at the beginning. It was like, I am sleeping. I am healing. Like It was really cathartic to just be able to heal by myself. Like I hate being by myself, but that first morning in the hospital was, was beautiful. I was by myself. The daylight was streaming in. I took a shower. Like everything was so quiet and peaceful.
00:28:24
Speaker
It was incredible. And then Jackie, you know, was in a couple of rooms down just living her dream, like being like, this is everything that I have, I have lived for everything that I have wanted. And yeah. Yeah.
00:28:35
Speaker
oh my gosh oh my gosh what also what caitlin was just saying is like you have to match with someone who like wants the same things right like i surrogate solutions does such a good job yes and like i wanted a relationship with my surrogate because like it's part of my kid's story right like yes my daughter story that she knows everything how she got here and like If you're not like, I wanted Caitlin to be a part of her life, like moving forward, not just like, you know, and i think that's really important because like, there are definitely like some intended parents that don't want that. I don't know why.
00:29:14
Speaker
And there are some surrogates. I don't want that. Right. So like, I think it's like so important to make sure you're on the same page with like your match. Yeah. Which is why you need an agency like surrogate solutions because like it is so it would have been a horrible experience if we were not on the same page about things. like And like, we got that out. Everything was out like at the beginning, right? Like in our initial call, like we talked about everything.
00:29:40
Speaker
Oh, I love that. Well, Jackie, you're so right. And I know you had said it previously, like it was really important for you to, you know, have somebody that had similar political views and gave you the ability to, you know, like you, you wanted to have agency in, just, you know, the, if anything medical happened and like, you wanted to be a part of that conversation and, and that's huge. And I think, you know, like it is so important. That's why, you know, I say like, you're, it's, it's a bucket, it's not a list. And it is like, you do get the ability to, you know, narrow down those big, important things, you know, like
00:30:21
Speaker
termination vaccination, you know, all of those and then some, and then you get to find out, do we mash, do we gel? What does that look like? And for you guys, I mean, I know, so not only did you guys want to have that close relationship and you did, but you didn't even let geography get in the way of that. So like, yeah, you guys are opposite and the country 2700 ish miles apart i think yeah okay what did that look like how did that like how did we make this happen we didn't mention caitlin like the thing that like really matched us this is yes this is our favorite thing well let's see fighters yeah oh my god i love it like shout out lauren lauren does such a good job i remember my first meeting with her picked some profiles you know did the one through five
00:31:10
Speaker
what What I love about surrogate solutions is we talked about it and we talked about what we really wanted. And she's like, okay, I know you did this. Like, I know you marked these, but I know that's not what they want.
00:31:21
Speaker
I know that X, Y, Z is not what they want. She's like, I got this single mom. She's like, I'm going to put her on a few other profiles, you know. I just, I talked with her earlier. I'm listening to what you're saying. And so I looked at them and yeah, I was like, oh my gosh, Ty, my husband, I was like, Ty, she likes Foo Fighters. I'm like, I love Foo Fighters.
00:31:41
Speaker
And it's like, this is great. This is wonderful. And i had told Jackie in the match meeting, i was like, this really stood out to me. And she's like, i knew it. She's like, I knew the person that I would find that that's what would stick out to them. I swear, because I put in my profile, like, I love the Foo Fighters and I want to be BFF with Dave Grohl. And knew in my mind, I'm like, it's going to stand out to someone. Like, I knew it.
00:32:05
Speaker
My person, that's going to be it. Oh my gosh, that's amazing. That's hilarious. Talk about distance, st like, that's, like, I then like we, i think what was it like at the beginning of the pregnancy, we saw that Foo Fighters were coming to Spokane and I'm like, and I worked it around my like we were supposed to go see the hospital due to COVID. They weren't doing tours.
00:32:34
Speaker
Okay. So, what but I was like, I'm coming still. Like and i it wound up being like the best thing ever. Like yeah which we were the Foo Fighters together. Oh my gosh. It was like a full circle girl thing. It was baby girl's first concert. Like, but no, I'm trying to think about what she went to three doors down. She went to Foo Fighters. She went to something else. like I can't remember, but music's like she was going to like, yeah Oh yeah.
00:33:06
Speaker
Yeah. Jackie, your previous yeah employment history, pretty yeah big in the music industry. Oh my It's definitely going to be a music girl. I love that. That's amazing. I think when you're like thinking, when I was thinking about like matching and that's like one of the questions, right? Like is distance...
00:33:26
Speaker
a factor. And to me, I was like, with like technology these days, like, yeah and I'm a big communicator and h so my we still talk every day. yeah but Like if we don't talk every day, it's because one of us is like crazy busy, but like it is like,
00:33:42
Speaker
like so easy nowadays to like FaceTime, like to talk, like Caitlin would FaceTime me like most appointments. Like it's not like you had to like, like I felt a part of the whole journey, even if I was almost 3000 miles away.
00:33:58
Speaker
Yeah. Well, you know, you're, you're exactly right. I know for so many people it's, it's that they want to feel part of it and, you know, but distance doesn't necessarily have to be that factor. And Caitlin, obviously you felt so loved and cared for. And so like, I mean, you guys were just team baby. Like, yeah, sure. Yeah. Me, Jackie and Meg, Meg played a huge part in just like the gel of everything, but I'm also a big traveler too. I love traveling. You know, I did some time in Germany when my parents were in the Air Force and my parents split and I would fly to Germany as a kid by myself. Like, so me going to New York wasn't a deal breaker. Honestly, if anything, I preferred it was fun. Yeah, it's neat. I've got a best friend that lives in New Jersey too. So, you know, the journey, this journey brought me to see her too, which was so beautiful. I'm so grateful. My husband's a big New Jersey Devils fan. He got to watch the New Jersey Devils play. A dream he's had for 25 years. my gosh. And just, I remember meeting Jackie for the first time and I was just so excited and everything just went so smoothly. Where did you guys, was it medical screening that you guys met for the first time? It on the street of New York on like what, 6th? Where RMA was because she waited outside for
Reflecting on the Journey
00:35:17
Speaker
me.
00:35:17
Speaker
oh my gosh. And we just, we just jumped, jumped right into it. And it felt like we didn't miss a beat. yeah I love that.
00:35:27
Speaker
It's almost like crazy and scary to think about it because like I ah could only wish everyone's journey was as smooth as that. Because it really was. like it was like Meeting, we clicked.
00:35:41
Speaker
First transfer, took. Like, everything, like, and I was prepared. You've got to be prepared, right? You have to. Yes. And, like, especially going through a loss that, like, things can get screwed up, right? Yeah. So, like, I was ready. I know. was like, it's to work.
00:35:55
Speaker
We're going. I did the things. with you first First time GC, you get to kind of, like like, you kind of live in, like, a different, like, land. You're like, oh, no, there's no way this isn't going to work. Yeah. I'm still going to live there because everything went good. stay in that land yeah yeah i think to me having a loss and like going through all this to have caitlin who was like the positive force yeah was just like i'm like thank you because like to me i just like even like i didn't like being pregnant like Even before there were issues, like I didn't like going to ultrasounds. I didn't like, it was like kind of like PTSD. and I knew I would feel the same way if I went back that route. Right. And like, and I have a positive force of Caitlin that's like also so great for my child. Right. Like she has that positive reinforcement being fed through her. So it was just like,
00:36:48
Speaker
And then you have someone so excited while you, you know, versus PTSD. Like, I mean, that is great. Yeah. I didn't go for the anatomy scan. Cause I was like, I have PTSD. I can't do it. Like, and i understood. and like, but it like, for me, that was so like worth everything.
00:37:06
Speaker
Oh, I love that. I love that. Did you, Jackie, did you ever struggle? i know you said pregnancy was just hard on you in general. Was it ever hard to like, okay, here's Caitlin and she's doing amazing things. And of course I knew you were grateful and excited and wonderful, but was that ever hard or were you just like, this is exactly how it needed to be? No, I was like, this was, this is great.
00:37:31
Speaker
ah Yeah. I was like, oh my God. mean, what did you say, Caitlin? Like I found like the, like, like I definitely feel like it was the way it should have been.
00:37:44
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Everything was, was yeah. Spot on. It's not like, perfect and I can see how that could be triggering for, for women who have gone through that. Like I really could, like, I see both ends of it, but like, for me, it wasn't, I was just like, my ultimate goal was to be a mother.
00:38:03
Speaker
Right. However way it came, it was going to happen. So it didn't matter if it was my genetics, didn't matter if I was carrying her. Like it was like, that was the goal.
00:38:13
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And we made it and we were there. Okay. do yeah yeah I want to hear about delivery day. want to be like, oh my gosh, give me all of the things.
00:38:26
Speaker
I mean, ah the reason I was a surrogate in the first place is because was just hyped to give birth to my son. i was just like, yes, we're to do it. It's going to be great. And you know what? but what It was worth like a first time birth with my son. It was great.
00:38:39
Speaker
But we ended, we did end up doing an induction. i should add my OB was very supportive as well through the whole thing. He would, Jackie could call during appointments. He would answer any questions that she had. She would say, you know, i heard this. i'm nervous about it. and He's like, nah, he's like, no, don't worry about it. She is i know my average young, healthy. And she's like, okay Yeah. Scheduled an induction.
00:39:00
Speaker
And I know that's like how many centimeters you're dilated really isn't an indication of labor, but. me and Jackie were a little nervous we're like, well, you should just come up a little bit sooner. i did end up making it to an an induction day, which was only three days before my technical due date.
00:39:16
Speaker
And gosh, it was, it was magical. I should add Jackie's mom, Rhonda is the most in incredible person. love Rhonda. Yeah. right i we we we love rhonda She came out with
The Delivery Experience
00:39:35
Speaker
Jackie too. They stayed at an Airbnb.
00:39:39
Speaker
was not missing the birth. I was not missing the birth. You were not. Yeah. How So far away. York. Caitlin, you're in Washington. So Jackie, when did you, yes, state. Yes. State. When did you get there?
00:39:54
Speaker
So I was supposed like, we figured two weeks early would be fine. Right. And then like she went for, she started going weekly and like, she was three centimeters dilated. it And i was like, Oh my God. And like, that could last for weeks, but like, I was not taking the risk. Right. So I'm like, mom, I'm getting on a plane.
00:40:13
Speaker
So up yeah we, I think we got there the last week of September. So, but it was like, honestly, so amazing. Like as soon as we got there, I felt better. But like you, we had to fly to Seattle and then drive to Spokane, which is a five hour drive.
00:40:32
Speaker
And like during the whole time, I'm like, okay, I'm going to land in Seattle. Caitlin, if you feel like you're going into labor, I'll drive overnight. Like it was, yeah. Yeah. But thankfully you were in Spokane for three weeks, which yest wasn't too bad. So we were hanging out. Yeah. yeah yeah So we got induced in the morning. i mean, everything was pretty, pretty textbook, you know, check in. here you go. The hospital that I go to is a little, it's still within like the metro of the city, but it's a little out of the downtown area. So they're not as busy. so you get a lot more attention, which is kind of nice. Oh, yeah, it's lovely. Especially like coming from New York.
00:41:07
Speaker
I kept on saying, i'm like, I can't believe this place. Like, yeah you don't even change rooms at this hospital. You birth and recover in the same room, which I didn't know that that was a thing that you didn't do that. I didn't know that that was, that that was, that that was the dip, like something that was different and not yeah the changing. But I mean, I, you know, they get the Pitocin in, they get it rolling. i think I was like three and a half when they started everything.
00:41:33
Speaker
Um, they broke my water a couple hours later. think I got the epidural around seven centimeters and things almost started to slow down. My husband went for a quick walk.
00:41:44
Speaker
Jackie was over by the contraction monitor. And my husband told me this afterwards. He's like, as soon, he's like, I walked in as soon as you said, i feel a lot of pressure yeah because then you like you feel that pressure down there. yeah and Yeah. Nine hours too, from the start of Pitocin to, delivery.
00:42:02
Speaker
It was great. My OB even stayed an extra hour late to see this through. Yeah. ah He was my OB for the whole journey. It was great. And I um had asked Caitlin and the doctor if I could catch...
00:42:17
Speaker
The baby. We have it on video. Oh my gosh. Oh my God. It's literally. And like. Great moment of my life. only did the doctor let me catch the baby. But like. Then this is when I started getting nervous. He's like. You're going to pull her out. I'm like. What? Are you talking about? Jackie delivered her baby.
00:42:32
Speaker
i delivered her. oh my gosh I was like what what I'm like I don't know he's like put your hands in here and she's like what I'm like what is happening and then basically like Caitlin was laughing at me and she laughed her out yes I laughed yeah because there was the conjecture had stopped and then my OB b was she had so much hair so my OB was like making can everybody laugh like because he was doing like little Wolverine stuff and little swirls and I start laughing and we have this on video he's like no keep making her laugh like she is laughing her out keep making her laugh
00:43:09
Speaker
Oh my gosh. That is so dreamy. yeah It was like everyone in the room was like crying. It was crazy. It was like, cause I pull her out and then they clean her up on Caitlin. And then like, as like, and then I cut the cord and then i put her on, like, it was literally like, what is happening here?
Embracing Motherhood
00:43:28
Speaker
Oh my gosh. It was, it was absolute magic. Everything was very textbook, very easy. You know, i I did my regular labor methods, just trying to soothe myself like lavender oil. I was getting up and moving around my OB. When, after he broke my water, he was watching the contraction monitor and then watching me talk and then watching it. He's like, okay, all right. He's like, was hoping to get a wince out of you, but, but no.
00:43:57
Speaker
my God. I mean, this hospital out of the world, their anesthesiologist is dedicated only to the maternity ward. So don't have to wait for like them to go around to other people. I was the only baby or person that had a baby that day too.
00:44:10
Speaker
Yeah. oh my go Wow. It's been a better journey, honestly. yeah Honestly, from start to finish. That's just, I mean, the thing that I keep thinking about is just Jackie, how you said Caitlin was just this excited, happy force. And then to have your baby come out with laughter, like, my oh my gosh. Yeah.
00:44:31
Speaker
That's just, oh, that's so magical. I like, I don't even have any other words besides just magic. Like basically whole thing. You guys, that's amazing. Okay. So we have our gorgeous, amazing delivery day.
00:44:44
Speaker
What has it been like since I know Caitlin, you said it was the next day it was just gorgeous. You had your time and Jackie, you're with your sweet angel baby. How have things been post delivery?
00:44:57
Speaker
You go for it, Caitlin. They've been good. No, they've been great. I'm, I'm pumping. I've had a lot. I think. ah Yeah, there's there's a lot. I think I stopped because switched to pumping for the preemie milk bank because Jackie had a certain time that she wanted to get baby two.
00:45:17
Speaker
And yeah, I've got like three layers of that sitting in my new deep freezer. But the things have been things have been really good. it's been really It's been really nice being back to like my family of three with my husband and my son because we are yeah so close, so tight knit. But then it's also so...
00:45:36
Speaker
I cried so much postpartum because I was like, I can't believe that Jackie gets to go home with her baby and like have what we have. We have a family here. i want people to have what I have. That's why I got in a surrogacy. I want somebody to have what I have. And so it's, I mean, it hasn't come without, it's its normal bumps and all this stuff.
00:45:57
Speaker
sure I mean yeah we're recovering there's hormones there's yeah absolutely yes I think I cried for like three weeks straight but in the best ways possible in all the best ways possible and Jackie I'm so i am so lucky that she sends me pictures and videos and I've gotten to like watch her grow up and I show my husband too because my husband and her were like buds he'd like to yeah love her yeah he loves her they are they were best best buddies and he was so good with her too
00:46:27
Speaker
I can't believe that all the videos he got. He did so good getting videos her birth. Oh god. He was amazing. I was like, thank you. And the memories you'll have, crazy. Just crazy. The memories you'll have. I know. Oh my gosh. Caitlin, did your son meet? I know. i Well, yeah. Okay. So your son got to meet baby girl and awesome.
00:46:51
Speaker
Awesome. yeah How was that? That was important to both of us. Like, yeah, it was really important. Um, cause him and I would have talks all the time. Like the baby in the belly is not going to come home with us, which was fine with him. He didn't want to share any of that stuff.
00:47:04
Speaker
No, he's like, cool. And I was like, whose baby is this? And he's like, Jackie's baby. And I was like, and who is she going home with? And he's like, Jackie, like, duh. And so he met her and he was like, he was like, but he's still, he was still a little on the younger side. I mean, he was a couple, a couple months off from turning four. So he's still really, really young when, when all this is happening, but he's, he is understanding like what surrogacy is and and what mom did and that.
00:47:33
Speaker
you know, buddy, you grew in my belly, but because you, you came from me and dad and dad and i decided to have you together, like you're, ah you're our baby, but this is just, mommy just wanted to help somebody grow a family. Is that okay with you? Yeah, course.
00:47:48
Speaker
Of course. Duh. See, it's all taught from home and it's all like kindness is taught from home. wouldn't have said it better myself, Jackie. Yep. Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. Jackie, how's it been? how how's newborn life for you?
Post-Delivery Life and Advice
00:48:03
Speaker
I mean, like, she's just the best thing ever. Like she's the best baby. She really is. Like, she's so funny and she's just such a good, like you could tell she's just good baby. Thank God.
00:48:15
Speaker
Yeah. Like the hard part, I was worried. The only thing I was worried about the whole story is he was getting home. Oh, It's hard. You're like traveling across the country with a two-day-year-old. Like that was the only thing I ever worried about the whole time.
00:48:33
Speaker
And it was actually like easier than I thought. Still hard. flew. You flew, you drove. I mean, I went back and forth to this, Caitlin. I was like, I'm going to take a train. I'm going to Seattle. So Seattle's about a four-hour drive. And it's you had you would have to fly out of Seattle to take... Just a one. Like, if you fly out of Spokane, it's connecting flights all day.
00:48:54
Speaker
If you fly out of Seattle, you can get a direct flight. So she drove like four and a half, five hours with stops to Seattle, then to do the one-way speed. Oh, traveling.
00:49:06
Speaker
Yeah. and I didn't want to go up and down with her because I was nervous enough to go up once. And like, I have a great pediatrician who literally like, I, I, I did my research on a great yeah you did and and I talked to him about this. And like, you know, I also think it's important. Like I want my daughter treated like, like a normal delivery, like a normal, you know, and And yeah so you well coming like, like my pediatrician, that was really important to me. Like, you know, knowing she's from double donors and like a surrogate, like that, everything was just typical. It wasn't like out of the, out of the ordinary. And I found a great pediatrician who was just like, yeah, great. And then i was like, should I worry about her getting on a plane? Like, you know, there's COVID, there's RSV, there's freaking the flu. I'm like, oh my God. It was flu season.
00:49:57
Speaker
Yeah. But he was like, no. He's like, newborns have so much immunity, especially like, Caitlin was like, amazing. And like, had all of her shots and like, you know, like so she had immunity from all of that too. so it was just, it it went better than I thought, thank God, but it was still like a track. And then like, I just wanted to be like home to start my like routine.
00:50:23
Speaker
and it's been great. She's like, and I have like a great family. My mother takes care of the baby while I'm working. And like, she's just been amazing. amazing like i think i knew i had the motherly instinct but you never know right like you don't know until like you're in it like all my friends kids and tell my kids i'm like yeah yeah but like definitely like the switch is like it was there and like nowadays the baby does not go in the nursery the baby comes with you so like
00:50:55
Speaker
She was like, as soon as I delivered that girl, she was with me. Like, and it was like nonstop. And like, i went from zero to a hundred baby. Yeah, absolutely.
00:51:05
Speaker
And it's been, yeah. what Yeah. I'm going hopefully she's up. I want you guys to. Yeah. Oh, that would be amazing. He's so cute.
00:51:16
Speaker
Oh my gosh. Her hair is growing so much. It's like sticking up. It won't go down. i know a lot of hair I love it. I love it. That's amazing. So with, I mean, again, just magical. That's the descriptor. I feel like just magical. And with everything that you guys went through and just all of it between loss and, you know, ah starting off with maybe not the right agency and, you know, just things like that. What would be the big advice that you would give to any potential carrier or intended parent?
00:51:53
Speaker
Um, I have many pieces of advice. The biggest piece of advice is that like, don't give up and trust your gut. who Like,
00:52:05
Speaker
I knew I was going to be a mother and I knew it was going to happen some way, somehow. I think like just the way that you think it's going to be when you're like 12 years old doesn't mean that's how it's going to be when you're 45. Right. So like, I think that like you have to trust your gut and don't give up on things and, and research, research, research, research.
00:52:28
Speaker
yes Yeah, that literally played in my head. i was like, that's what I'm to say. Research, like, listen to people's stories. Don't even just like Google, don't Facebook, listen to people's stories. Because there's even stuff that, because of course, you know, I'm going to go on to do another journey.
00:52:46
Speaker
yeah So, i mean, there's even things, even though this was textbook imperfect, there's still things that I want to look for or include. I just got lucky Jackie.
00:52:58
Speaker
And i just, I think you should really just listen to what other people's stories. Like you have to decide what's right for you.
Dispelling Surrogacy Myths
00:53:07
Speaker
and and don't bend. If there's something that you, that you're like, no, this is what I want. Like stand your ground. a good agency or a good match, they you can find a way to work together. And if somebody's not willing to do that, or somebody's saying, That's not really how we do it No, like run.
00:53:29
Speaker
Red flag. Yeah. we Yeah. What was your thing? What was your thing that you were like, this is this is it. This is a make or break. Stand my ground. um I didn't learn. I mean, it's a really hard question because first time surrogacy, you don't really learn it until...
00:53:46
Speaker
Until after we're after yeah done. Yeah. I'll have to see, I'll have to see how my next match and everything. I like that. Honestly, I want to be like, I want to work with RMA all the time. They were amazing. You know, I i was, I was listening to another podcast the other day where the clinic had not told the gal to continue her progesterone shots oh after transfer.
00:54:13
Speaker
I, RMA would never let that happen. Or i was, i mean, even down to agency. Or your coordinator. Yeah, your coordinator's not going to let that happen. Yeah. yeah Exactly.
00:54:26
Speaker
i had another friend with with surrogacy too. And she's like, I was like, is your you're with an agency. You have a coordinator. Yeah. And she's like, yeah. Because she had a failed transfer. I'm like, well, did she advise, you know, A, B, C, D, E, F? And she's like, no.
00:54:40
Speaker
And guess what? After her second transfer, she got pregnant. And so I just think it's hard when you first enter the surrogacy world, you just don't know what you don't know.
00:54:53
Speaker
yeah yeah And finding fellow surrogates, asking them questions, like listening to other people's stories, you, you have to, or else the world, like people will eat you up.
00:55:03
Speaker
Like you said, it's not regulated. They, they want you, you are surrogates are highly, highly sought after we do something that a lot of women can't do, or a lot of women don't want to do. And while those are completely fine, you know, we're, it's just a highly sought after thing.
00:55:20
Speaker
And unfortunately people can get taken advantage of, um, Well, Jackie, yeah. I mean, that was your experience as an intended parent. It's, I mean, you can so easily taken advantage of.
00:55:32
Speaker
And that's why I also want to like continue to tell my story. Obviously not. Yes. Oh, like obviously because of my daughter, like she will know everything, but because I feel like yeah now being in this world, like I definitely feel like surrogates are definitely have more of like a tribe where they can go and talk to Right. like, eat one was always like in this group, like surrogates were talking about this. I'm like the intended parents hardly talked. Right. It was like, it's kind of like, and I get it because like, in like when you're at the surrogacy stage, like you've gone through loss, you've gone through ah traumatic things. Right. So like, sure. Not really like a more, like I could see why surrogates talk more than intended parents, but like, I do feel like,
00:56:16
Speaker
There needs to be some kind of group for like intended parents and not just on Facebook where like, Not like, like someone like me who is just an average person on the street can do it. It's not just like, like I keep on saying the celebrities cause, or like, it's not a lifetime movie either where like someone's going to run around, take my child. You know what mean? Like the legal, i the legal ease that has to go into this thing also, like it's not going to happen.
00:56:45
Speaker
Like, and I think it's those two things that like keep on getting caught up. And like, I'd love for more people like me to tell my story of like, This is like, this is an option that i wish women who wanted children 20 years, 20, 40 years ago, don't have children because there was no options for them. And now there's options. It's 2024. Like, and like these kinds of stories needs to be told.
00:57:10
Speaker
Yeah. Well, not only are there options, but there's, safe, caring option where you're being seen for Jackie and not intended parent number 0321 or, you know, like you're, you're Jackie and Lauren saw you Jackie and, you know, Lauren saw you Caitlin and she saw Foo Fighters and she said, let's go. Like,
00:57:36
Speaker
so yeah Yeah, no, you're so, you're so right. And, and I mean, you know, yes, in the Surrey Sea groups, it is like a tribe. And I feel like intended parents, you're so right, Jackie. There's, I mean, there's so much, so many things happen for so many people to get to this point yeah and some traumatic and some just is, and you know, it can be so hard for people to be vulnerable in that way. And the more and more that it becomes,
00:58:06
Speaker
less taboo and less scary and less, you know, Oh, something's wrong with me or, Oh, you know, whatever it may be. Like the more people will talk about it, the less, you know, kind of scary it is just right and the more people are able to support each other. Like, and yeah. I'm thinking about like, even like when Gemma grows up, like, do you know how much you were loved to get into this world? Like, you know what I mean? Like, it's so um like, it's so opposite of like, like, yeah,
00:58:36
Speaker
When you're with, when you're in a hetero or like ah a gay relationship and like you have a baby and then like one leaves and one doesn't, or like it was, you know, like there's so many ways children come into this world now. And like the way that my kid came in was like through all this, like wanting and loving and like, that's all a kid needs. Right. Yeah,
00:58:59
Speaker
Absolutely. Absolutely. Yes. Oh my gosh. So loved. So loved before she and like she was yes she is right. Like between the surrogates and the intended parents, like the intended parents to go through this has to really want a kid. And some people go through it for like upwards of a decade. Yes. i And i I'm grateful that I found Jackie cause she was so easy on me. Like I know that people who And, you know, it didn't come without struggles. It's not a quantity thing. It's definitely a quality thing. But, you know, there are people who have struggled and struggled and struggled for years.
00:59:35
Speaker
And sometimes they're just a little more distant from their surrogates. And then i I commend Jackie's just ability to get back up on that horse and go to it and still, like, want that connection with me. And I know that there's there's space in between because people don't want to get close to their surrogates. But...
00:59:52
Speaker
you know, Jackie, Jackie took a risk and I am so grateful. Yeah. Well, I mean, Jackie, you said it earlier, you know, you, you, that was a priority for you was to have that close relationship relationship with Caitlin. And, you know, there's,
01:00:06
Speaker
everybody's journey is different there's room for whatever that looks like for everybody and I think that that's what you know Lauren and Megan and just everybody tries to do is find those people for each other and you know it's and you guys had just you found one another and it was just that it was that magic yeah was that tell through and through like grandma was meant to be here Yes. Oh gosh. Yes.
01:00:31
Speaker
Really nice to be here. Cause like, I was like, like I think about this too. Like if I, if my pregnancy was fine and like I had a kid, like I, I wasn't going to get pregnant again. You know what I mean? Like, and like, yeah. Like, yeah.
01:00:47
Speaker
Yeah. oh that's beautiful. That's beautiful. Okay. Well, I want to honor your time, but I do have one last fun, silly question. So for anybody who knows me, I have a very,
01:00:58
Speaker
codependent relationship on coffee. And here we are in the afternoon and she's on cup number. I don't even want to say, but what filled your cup this morning? It can be figuratively. It can be literally silly. What, just whatever. What filled your cup this morning?
01:01:18
Speaker
I am going to say, Gemma laughing. Of course. She, yeah or I know. um And mind you, I heard a little laugh like a week or so ago. And then home my mother heard laughing and I was like, don't even tell me that. Cause I was at work. And then this morning she laughed for but both of us. So phli al bethha yes. Oh my God. And it's the best sound ever. What made her laugh?
01:01:45
Speaker
She loves being on the changing table. Like she loves it. She kicks her. She loves it. Like, I don't know what it is about the changing table, but she loves it. And like, we talked to her on there and like like, oh, and she's also been like kissing.
01:02:02
Speaker
Like, oh but like, sometimes she gets a little angry and she'll like eat my face, but like she aggressive kisses. I'm like, this is early for this, huh? Yeah. the ah Well, the laughing we knew was going to happen.
01:02:18
Speaker
That's amazing. Caitlin, what filled your cup? Well, mine's always full of water because pumping. Oh, good job, girl. Good job. Yes. Honestly, I was just really looking forward to this podcast, being on this podcast. I definitely am ah a serial listener of all things. I just can't get enough of it because I still try to process like, is this even real life? Like, did this really happen? So yeah I was just really, really happy to be here and really happy to share our story because you know I hope that somebody hears it and it's just a ah glimmer of hope for them because they know that all journeys don't go this this smoothly, this perfectly. but you you know I think that no matter what would have happened, Jackie and I would have would have seen it through and stuck it out.
01:03:01
Speaker
hundred percent I love that. i love that. oh my gosh. why like I would love, honestly, like, I know Caitlin's probably, I'm speaking for Caitlin, but like, if anyone has questions, like I would love to talk to anyone who has any questions or like any kind of advice that they need or anything, because like, and I tell this to all my friends too, like don't go through it alone. And like, there are people out there that could help you. And like, I want my Excel worksheet to go somewhere.
01:03:32
Speaker
Yes. Oh my gosh. Yes. That sounds like treasure. Other than me to be able to look at and be like, Oh my gosh. Yes. No, that sounds like a, just ah treasure trove right there. I'm just all of the things. And oh yeah, no, I love Excel. I can't work it, but I love it.
01:03:52
Speaker
Oh, Love a good Google Doc. Oh my gosh. Well, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And you want me to see if she's up? Let me see she's up. Yeah, let's see her. Let's see her. She's sleeping. Oh, Look how big she is. Look at all that hair.
01:04:09
Speaker
gosh. Look at her cheeks. Her cheeks are what kill me every single time. i was just about to say, she's so delicious. This hair is getting longer and longer and longer. I think she's to have curly hair because the way it sticks up off her head.
01:04:22
Speaker
All of mine, we would do sprouts. That's what we called it. in The little. yeah Oh my goodness. My baby. Hi, Jimmy. She's like, no, nap time. you don know No, it's nap time. Oh, you, you snug up there. You snug up there. oh she is the biggest snuggle of that.
01:04:42
Speaker
Oh, I love it. What are you doing? I want to make this for somebody. Like, look look at this. like Look at that. Look at that. I'm glad it's there. i' glad it's there and I get to watch it.
01:04:56
Speaker
And you get to watch, yes. I'm like, oh, I love that for you. and Yes, I couldn't want anything else. Oh my gosh, that's amazing. Look at her. oh the best baby oh and look at that mama glow. She's she's got it. Oh, she glows.
01:05:13
Speaker
Hi, baby. Look at that hair, baby. Gosh. You don't know me from Adam, but you know, yeah, there's your to sweet Caitlin. Yes. Oh my goodness.
01:05:27
Speaker
Look at these. Are you smiling? Yeah, I saw that smile. what gooddo ja You guys, I i cannot thank you enough. I really can't. I just am so excited just for you and your story and to be able to share this with so many people. And I'm just so excited for you guys in general. I mean, yeah magic, magic. It just, that's what it was. It was magic. that's what it is. It's magic. And I'm happy for you guys.