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Megalopolis
18 Plays2 months ago
Today on These Guys Got Juice, THE GUYS ARE GOING TO HAVE A CONVERSATION. A conversation about the new Francis Ford Coppola film, Megalopolis.
Which is more of a conversation: the movie or the podcast made about the movie? Is this movie successfully saying anything? And does it have any juice? Listen and find out!
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Transcript
Introduction & Megalopolis Teaser
00:00:18
Speaker
I'm Doug Davenport. I'm Nick Yours. And we're These Guys Got Juice. And we saw Megalopolis.
00:00:26
Speaker
And when we ask these questions, there's a dialogue about them. That basically is a utopia. I wasn't even trying to do an atom drive. I don't even know what accent or voice I was doing there. Just serious line delivery, man. No, atom driver, you got to put more. You're still holding on. You know, something like that. That feels good.
00:00:50
Speaker
Something like that so we got Adam driver here today Were you just read right there sucks, I'm sorry I Have some notes about the scripts
00:01:05
Speaker
Yeah.
Megalopolis as a Greek Odyssey
00:01:06
Speaker
But overall, I want to just start by talking, because this was like a journey we went on. This is like a Greek Odyssey, basically. We were Odysseus or something. Yeah. We had a fun time. I had a great time. And going out, our little venture getting there and all of it, it was cool. It was a nice, cool, rainy day or a rainy evening.
00:01:33
Speaker
It's a it's a nice theater. They had everything there. I mean, it seems like everything was was going on time. I didn't. I only think I didn't know just because from like a research. I didn't. I wasn't sure. Like, oh, is the Q&A before or after?
Q&A with Celebrities
00:01:49
Speaker
And in my mind.
00:01:51
Speaker
I haven't been to like a ton of like festivals or anything, but I just think of Q&A as being a thing that happens after the screening. I saw Pi in theaters on like whatever anniversary it was, the Darren Aronofsky movie. And they had a Q&A, it was after Strange Darling, the Q&A that didn't work was after that one. I think those might have been the only two Q&As in theaters I've seen.
00:02:17
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, I just I've yeah, I definitely just associate it with with being post the movie, but let's let's let's talk that screenings like we saw your monster in person in the Q&A was after that's when they brought sense, but I don't know the Q&A was this this way was good just because it ended up having a weird energy. Yeah, I feel like prime do kind of for oh this movie is going to be like all over the place and weird. Yeah, the movie did kind of have the vibe of
00:02:46
Speaker
Like it made it did it did sufficiently like kind of like prepped me for like, OK, there's going to be like a lot of meandering, especially De Niro, who I thought was in the movie because he was a part of the UNA. I didn't know that he was in the I didn't think he was in the movie. I was like, oh, is he just like a producer on it because, you know, they go he goes back with Coppola. I looked at he's not involved in this in any way. What about Spike Lee?
00:03:11
Speaker
I don't think Spike Lee's involved, they're just pals. So already the organization of why these guys is very loose, it's just Coppola and two filmmakers and collaborators that he is buddies with and that he had on, and then a moderator who seemed to
00:03:33
Speaker
not have a ton of control over, he would ask the question to Coppola, but he wasn't able to like, the funniest thing is at the very end when he was like, and we're out of time. I'm kind of surprised that Victor Salva wasn't there in the Spike Lee chair.
00:03:56
Speaker
We can get into this at any point, but I guess we'll save it for the movie. Yeah, we'll save it for the movie. Let's talk about the Q&A. That was good, though. That caught me off guard. You're like, what's Nick doing on his phone over there? You're spreading something. You're looking up a nameless director?
00:04:19
Speaker
And then Brian Singer came on stage for some reason. Jeepers Creepers guy, known for four things in life. Three of them are Jeepers Creepers movies. All of them are crimes. Fuck that guy. Fuck those movies. Anyway, this Q&A, we already have the energy of this Q&A because we're all over the place. We're Robert De Niro now.
00:04:48
Speaker
It was funny that he almost felt like he was falling asleep when just recounting a meeting, Coppola leading up to him being godfather too, but then lit up as soon as the opportunity to talk Trump. I guess it was Spike Lee, because he made the dogs and cats Haitian reference or something.
00:05:10
Speaker
Yeah. And then I think that led to all the Trump talk. Yeah. And I didn't quite know what Spike Lee was getting at exactly when he said that. And then Francis Ford Coppola started talking about how he loves Haitians. There's going to be a Haitian subplot in this movie. I mean, we'll go into the subplots in this movie. That makes as much sense as like a lot of other stuff. It's like, sure.
Plot Confusion in Megalopolis
00:05:36
Speaker
I can see there being 20 cut minutes where there's just a Haitian family we cut to in New York, or New Rome rather. Rome, it's New Rome. Oh, well, spoilers. Yeah, I don't know what's in the trailers, because the only trailer I saw besides the one that had the fake, like, crit, it was like, they had their knives out for Coppola. Basically just like, Apocalypse Now was the biggest disaster. I think he said that in the Q&A, too. He was like, they said,
00:06:06
Speaker
up.
00:06:23
Speaker
too. I had to think about that because I was like, I guess all the other franchises had different titles for their sequels. They just had a different escape from, or war for, or not war for, but battle for, or something, playing the apes.
00:06:38
Speaker
I guess sequels weren't really as much of a thing. There were like remakes more than sequels, right? I feel like monster movies maybe had the most ones, but even then those weren't- They would just have whole different titles. They would be like Son of Wolfman or like Bride of Frankenstein. Yeah, there wasn't like Wolfman 2. Dracula 2 or something, yeah. Which, you know,
00:07:03
Speaker
Let's get rid of the number convention. Let's give them unique titles. I don't know. Why not? For some things, if it's a thing- Give it a unique title like, Megalopolis or something.
Sequel Naming Conventions & AI Dialogue
00:07:15
Speaker
I'm I'm pro it if it's something that's maybe gonna have like three entries if we were gonna give you like ten deep We maybe should have like I'm glad saw doesn't have subtitle even though their numbering isn't like consistent until they decide to have numbers again But like some franchises should just be the franchise and then a number Like I I don't I want those next saw to be like saw the next chapter
00:07:42
Speaker
Isn't there one called the next chapter? The final... Isn't there... The subtitle of one of them was like, this is it, the final one ever. No more after this. And that was only seven. Then they released Jigsaw. Yeah.
00:07:57
Speaker
And then one with the Lincoln Park guy. That was that was 3D, I think, because it's 3D is seven. And then they also had the it was like the final chapter or something. But speaking of the final trip, this doesn't play well on a podcast. It's my shirt. I'm wearing. Shout out to Cavity Color Friday, the 13th, the final chapter. Yes. Horror franchises do that, too, where they're like.
00:08:20
Speaker
They're definitely dead this time. There's not gonna be any more continuation of this storyline and this character. There's just no way they're coming back. Yeah. Oh man, but... Megalopolis. Megalopolis 2. Yeah. There should have been...
00:08:40
Speaker
ending of like how Horizon ends where you start seeing the like scenes from part two because it not announced beforehand that this was just a part one but that as the movies ending or like I guess it's winding down and then you just start seeing scenes for the next one they're like coming soon Megalopolis part two
00:08:59
Speaker
Um, did you want to talk more about the Q&A or was it it was I mean I Feel like I was getting rowdy when all the Trump stuff started happening. It was it was funny It was like Trump could never make a movie Saying what this movie says honestly, I think Trump probably could write about this level I was just about to say like I now that you put that in my head. I want to see Trump's megalopolis
00:09:29
Speaker
Does this feel like it was written by AI kind of with a how just like Weird I'm not accusing it of being but it it has the tone of like a human didn't write this or it was plagiarized from like Some kind of text that existed beforehand
00:09:49
Speaker
That's an interesting read up because I to me the dialogue a lot of it is I would say bad but it's like bad in a way that feels very human of like this is how
00:10:02
Speaker
I don't know.
00:10:19
Speaker
This is just him being straight with us with this and I and I don't I I guess I can admire that because I do you know I've said before a lot of other directors I'll respond to even if sometimes stuff is corny like I'll be like well It's earnest and sincere you like whether it's Shyamalan the Wachowskis. I'd say even like Ramey sense of humor I'm like, well, that's very very sincere. So that's why I respond positively to that I can admire that this is sincere while at the same time
00:10:49
Speaker
You know like we'll go into specifics with spoilers which will be soon because that's I feel like pretty much every I didn't I didn't I I didn't know anything about this plot so I feel like the whole thing is a spoiler kind of but like I Just feel like they could have gone further with pretty much everything There's like a lot of ideas and things that are invoked and then the Q&A he had this energy of like
00:11:11
Speaker
you know, he was bringing up that like humanity were capable of, you know, it was kind of optimistic message like we can do so much if we come together, but we need to come together and have a dialogue and like start a conversation. So like him ending up on that note was like, I was like, Oh, okay, so this is some of the stuff we're going to like the movies going to like interrogate and like get into and we'll
00:11:34
Speaker
Be more specific and spoil but the movie itself is basically just doing that again of like we need I mean the quote I read at the beginning is just Adam drivers just like and and having and just us having Conversation is utopia and that's the whole movies like has a circular Thing where it's like no one's really saying anything. Yeah By extent I'm like is the
00:11:58
Speaker
I can talk maybe a fraction of that up to maybe intentional, but specifically with a lot of the Caesar and Adam Driver stuff, I'm like, how self-aware intentional is this stuff?
Criticism & Constructive Feedback on Megalopolis
00:12:10
Speaker
Because if the fact that Caesar or the Adam Driver's character never really says anything is intentional, that could be an interesting thing, but I don't know that it is.
00:12:21
Speaker
The movie ends up being kind of like okay. This is it's you're going for it I like big swings and stuff, but to what end what are you what are you saying? Yeah, it doesn't it's not a movie that feels like it amounts to much. It's like so grand in scale and it feels like just like
00:12:43
Speaker
nothing when you're walking out of it. Like there's nothing to walk away with, really. But they're giving the air and sense of it and even saying that this is important, this conversation we're having. And you walk away just feeling kind of like empty and you're like, well, I saw a movie. It was a lot of a movie. There were actors in there. It was one of the most movies. Yeah. There were actors from movies that I've seen, you know, but they were acting, you know, like some of them were capital A acting. It didn't feel like
00:13:13
Speaker
too important as a film. It didn't yet. And I don't even need the message to be that deep. Like I've talked about other things of like satirical films or films with messages. I'm fine with them being very blunt or like kind of surface level. But but they are saying a thing, you know, like there is a thesis statement to a lot of things. And
00:13:35
Speaker
a lot of I've seen a lot of people compare they're like this is like someone with dementia made Southland tales Richard Kelly Southland tales which at I didn't see the movie at the time but my understanding is people were deriding is like kind of meandering and like it was all over the place but that movie has
00:13:52
Speaker
a thing it's saying about America, specifically America Post 9 11. And there is like an understandable like, OK, I get what this movie is doing with Megalopolis. There's things that it's like gesturing to like there's kind of a Trump stand in, we'll say what character that is, I guess, and spoilers like there. There is someone who's doing Trump stuff in that. But that's just a side plot. So I'm and then it's just like overall, if there is a message to glean
00:14:22
Speaker
from many of it. I don't know that I like it when I was to say that for like what they're saying with Adam Driver's character and how it just reckon the movie as a whole just deals with him. Who I think and I'll go into like my full argument. I mean, I don't even think it's I'm making a outrageous claim. Like I think he's like copeless self insert in the movie of like this ambitious architect. He really has these grand. He has this epic vision for the future and like
00:14:51
Speaker
Some people just are doubting him and like, you know, trying to stop him from achieving his vision and stuff. And so that like, that's the conflict of the movie. I'm like, huh, wonder, wonder where he's drawing from for this. Yeah, it felt very much like a couple of stand in. I do want to say something, though. So I think it's pretty clear that I'm not that big of a fan of this movie. I still am not completely sure how I
00:15:21
Speaker
feel about it. I guess what I said before, just this movie makes me feel kind of empty inside. I guess that's the best way to describe it since sitting on it for a day. But I will say though, getting out of the theater, there's just a level of criticism that people are having for this movie, that people have for this movie.
00:15:42
Speaker
Just seems so unnecessary and ridiculous like there was one guy that was like yeah this movie is like if you took a wet sloppy shit and then found like a piece of corn and It was just like what are you talking? I don't think that's
00:15:59
Speaker
constructive to talk about any film in that way. And I've seen, I've seen some really horrible, I've definitely seen worse movies than this. And like, I will still try to find constructive ways to talk about that, those kinds of things. Cause that's what do you gain from just being
00:16:14
Speaker
that dismissive of a thing and not engaging with it. I don't like that energy from fucking anybody after a movie or on a podcast. I don't know what that guy's podcast name is, but not a podcast I'll be listening to.
00:16:32
Speaker
Yeah. And I'm someone who listens to, you know, bad movie podcasts, but a lot of times they have the energy of like, on how this get made, they're often being like, uh, greatest movie ever made. They like love the thing, like they, like, you know, uh, their beekeeper episode, they're like best movie of the year. Like they love Jason Statham movies. So they're just like, yeah, this rules, you know, like they're not like being like, ah, this, this horror, like they're finding the fun and value in a, in a quote unquote bad movie.
00:17:01
Speaker
Yeah, they're taking a bad movie to you and making an entertaining experience out of it for like a listener or a live audience, too. They're like bringing value to the movie. They're not just like being nasty about it. And they're trying to meet the level, I think, meet the movie on its level a lot of the times of being like, well, yeah, this is just like a dumb fun action thing. So that's like we're going in with that mindset. They have a good spirit about it.
00:17:30
Speaker
I never I haven't really heard any answer with them just where I'm like that was nasty like they went too far Yeah, yeah, there was a lot of that walking out of This movie, but I am glad that yeah, it seems like there is a very like people are loving the earnestness That this movie has and they're giving it like four stars or people are just giving it one star and are like this is an incoherent mess I'm kind of in the middle
00:17:59
Speaker
I wouldn't I think I'm more in the middle. I wouldn't give it more towards the incoherent mess, but I'm like in the middle I feel the earnestness It doesn't work with me because of how just on the nose and like bad the dialogue is in like even those things I would be willing to like maybe not sign off on but be less derisive of if
00:18:25
Speaker
it was actually saying something. It's like beating you over the head, but it's like beating me over the head with nothing. It's very interesting.
00:18:41
Speaker
It feels crazy the whole Q&A he talked about like how long this idea had kind of been percolating and he'd been wanting to write something like this and then he even said it in another context of like you know he's never been a guy who can just like the thing idea comes ready made to him he and he can see it in his head he has to like rewrite and rewrite to get to this this doesn't this feels like a first draft
00:19:06
Speaker
Like, this whole script feels like a first draft and doesn't feel like something that he's been rewriting for decades. So I'm... Well, didn't someone at the Q&A say he had this idea a long time ago? Like the 80s or something? Or maybe it was around the time he was doing Apocalypse Now. Yeah, I don't... So he's had it for a while, but it doesn't feel that way. There's some movies where he could be like, oh yes, this is definitely like...
00:19:35
Speaker
They they put this passion project, they pushed up this hill and like they've really been thinking about this for really long and hard. Like when I found out the history of like Horizon and that he's had ideas for like certain elements of like a character or something for like a while, so much so that like his son, I think is named after like one of the characters or something.
00:19:56
Speaker
And I'm like, that makes sense because this seems like something you've been thinking. There's like kind of too much going on here, but that from a result of like you, I think you thought about this for a long time with with this.
00:20:10
Speaker
You commented on, like, on the right back, like, oh, it almost feels like some things were like a missing lack of resources or something. And like, yeah, it kind of feels like scenes are missing. And it felt like I said, I know he filmed this on like a more restrained like budget since it was so fun. Yeah. But yeah, it you could it felt like a movie that was so restricted. Yeah.
00:20:38
Speaker
Which was interesting because it's like, yes, I understand like self-funding. You will have limits on what you could do. But the restrictions felt like in a way of like, oh, there's just like stuff was taken out. And my friend, I think, you know, we'll get around to doing some some follow up bonus record with him. But my friend, dude, was telling me that like there was an earlier draft of the script. I need to check it out. I think it's on Internet Archive, but like
00:21:06
Speaker
that had sounds like a lot more stuff. So I am I'm interested in and also like actual themes like from how he was describing to me was like, yeah, there's actual kind of like a political message in the movie. And I'm like, damn, so why did you take that out? Like, where is that? Like, I would have been nice if it felt like this movie had a point of view, you know.
00:21:27
Speaker
Yeah, but it just kind of, it doesn't. It's just a movie that yells at you. It has a point of view about having point of views. It's like, we should be having points of views and talking about them, and that's the point of view. I don't know.
00:21:44
Speaker
creative geniuses should be left to their own, you know, devices and be allowed to just be able to do whatever, because he keeps saying everyone should be brought in on this conversation. But ultimately, the movie and him are just like, well, I should also just be able to do whatever the fuck I want.
00:22:02
Speaker
Like, and that's not challenged. I mean, we'll go into specifics and spoilers, but like, yeah, the movie's not like saying that that mentality is wrong or anything. And I'm I maybe have a little bit of issue with that because it feels wrong. It's the closest to anything the movie has to say. And, you know, I'm
00:22:25
Speaker
I can totally enjoy movies with different political standpoints. I've watched, you know, there's movies made by conservative filmmakers that are good. And so, but like this message feels a little libertarian and Randian or however you say that author's name. I actually have never read her stuff. I'm just familiar, like kind of some of the loose ideas and it's like,
00:22:49
Speaker
Hmm, so is that what you were going for with this?
Spoiler Alert & Overture Appreciation
00:22:52
Speaker
Like cuz that's the closest thing that I can pick out to like a theme or message and I guess I'll say more what I mean about that in spoilers. Yeah, and there's Something I kind of want to say in spoilers. So you want to hop in there now? Yeah, let's just do it
00:23:21
Speaker
and we're back. Wow, that overture was like sweeping and like really got me like amped. Oh yeah, so before we get to the movie proper and we were talking about the Q&A, I just want to shout out, bring back having the overture play before a movie because like that really really
00:23:40
Speaker
If anything, it made me, it almost raised my expectations for the movie too high because the score, I was like vibing to the score so much that I was like, man, I really hope this movie lives up to the score. So I was trying to like pay attention. Did you notice any of the music that was actually playing before the movie in the movie itself? Only in one part when like it like cuts to
00:24:05
Speaker
There's like some buildup of someone saying something about saying something. And then it cuts to like shy of the buff with his goons walking into like a bank or something. And the music is all dramatic. I was like, I think I heard this with like the medley that was playing beforehand. This sounds familiar, but I wasn't hearing it regularly. Yeah, I was trying to pay attention for in like an hour or so and I was like, I don't think any of the score from what we heard before the movie has played at all. And by the end of it,
00:24:35
Speaker
Yeah, I didn't really catch anything. Maybe I was like so locked in at a certain point. I like wasn't paying attention. A lot of the music I was clocking was not. It wasn't like sweeping or epic, but also didn't. It seemed like it would. The things I recognized in the actual movie seemed like older operatic music that had been, you know, that's been used from probably like operas and older stuff, but then also in other movies. So it there was
00:25:03
Speaker
I was I wasn't picking out a ton of like things. I'm like, oh, this is the original like compositions for this movie. Um, was the song that was sent so that girl. OK, I know I'm jumping all around, but there's kind of like a a music number or, you know, a music video kind of for the singer, maybe one of the best or better sequences in the movies, but in the movie. But like, I think she is a singer that that.
00:25:30
Speaker
I'm not too sure. I'm out of touch. I don't listen to artists until they're dead. I've just thought up on that kind of scene, but I think she is
00:25:49
Speaker
not a pop singer, but she is like someone. Like she maybe won on like The Voice or something or... Do you know her name? Grenda Grace Van Der Waal. Oh, that does sound familiar, actually. She won America's Got Talent at the age of 12 years old.
00:26:09
Speaker
She's a child prodigy, which makes her use in this interesting because the whole, again, jumping all over the place. But the thing that makes this scene so striking to me is that what I think she has a good voice and it's the way you're visually seeing this like performance play out is interesting because you're seeing like all this like duplicating of of of images and stuff. And but the whole context is this is like an auction for a virgin.
00:26:38
Speaker
Like they're presenting her as like 16 and they're like bidding on her virginity like that They get to take it I guess and it's to raise money for the city No, you're that's all correct. That's at least what I took away from everything that was happening and then Shia LaBeouf's big plan to like undermine Adam Driver and like
00:27:01
Speaker
Make him look like an asshole. I don't even know it was like a revenge plot that he had against his cousin, but so he Plays a video of him of Adam Driver having sex with this lady that Turns out to be fake at the end of it all I think they quickly are like after it cuts to later. They're like it was a deep face She was like yeah, he faked he faked all of it, and it makes me wonder
00:27:29
Speaker
They didn't like show how he faked it or go into that at all. It was like, I was like, did he actually fake it? It was a really weird moment. And it moves on so quickly. Then everyone is like, we're not donating our money because she's not a virgin. You find out she wasn't weird. She wasn't really 16. She was like 23 or something. She had forged documents or something.
Coppola's Script & Allegations Discussion
00:27:53
Speaker
A lot of that stuff of like the, oh, he wasn't actually guilty. I feel kind of rewriting because I still, like I said, I still got to read the soldier script, but my friend dude's dude was telling me that, like, no, he actually did sleep with her. And I don't know that they had that whole no, she was actually older stuff in this original draft of the script. And like she's actually more of a character and part of like what's going on in the movie. So I'm just.
00:28:21
Speaker
Oh yeah, because they get a birth certificate and everything. Yeah, so they can exonerate him. And Carlo Esposito or someone like rips it apart and it's like, what the fuck? You ripped someone else's birth certificate, dude? Like, that's so weird. That got a laugh in the audience. But I don't think that was intended to be a funny moment.
00:28:39
Speaker
I don't think it was. And that whole, just how that whole thing is resolved, leaves me with a weird taste just in the context of, I mean, we got to talk just the allegations against Francis Ford Coppola. And after that, I want to ask you a question about Adam Driver's character. Yeah. So there's been going back a couple of months. It seems like Variety's been the main one picking up
00:29:08
Speaker
the story of like what he was alleged doing on on set. So there was like a nightclub scene, one of the scenes with Natalie Emanuel, Ramses herself. She was at like some nightclub. I don't even remember a specific nightclub scene with her. A lot of the movies already blurring together with me. But so apparently it's just a party scene. And he was just like,
00:29:32
Speaker
directing everyone to be like, okay, this is high energy. You know, he's trying to get everyone to be high energy, but he's just getting like kind of really riled up. And then apparently he even said this is according to a variety after multiple takes he on the microphone announced. Sorry if I come up to you and kiss you. Just know it's solely for my pleasure.
00:29:56
Speaker
and then there is a video I've been having trouble finding like a good quality like actual close version of but like it's he is grabbing this this dancer in there and like uh he's like from the angle I saw he's like trying to kiss her and just getting like her neck and her cheek but that's still not consensual and not like that's that's like assault and I I don't know what context for that would make me cool with
00:30:25
Speaker
him just doing that to someone on set, you know, like because because he's suing now a variety and, you know, charging them with libel, like the the some of the journalists are like charged in the suit, too. And it's like, well, you know, there are there. Yeah. Are there cases of people spread accusations and it ends up not being true. But this video doesn't look good. And so I don't know.
00:30:52
Speaker
Yeah, I haven't seen the video but yeah, I believe you it's it's weird and I Definitely don't I mean I already he's already a sus figure For you know, you brought up Victor Silva earlier. Yeah
00:31:13
Speaker
Not just offended, like I think he paid for the legal defense of this pedophile sex offender. And produced his movies. And I don't... Why are you doing that? You know, like if you're... There's no reason for any good person to do something like that. It'd be like, well, he's just defending his friend, but then why are you friends with someone like that? You know, like... Yeah, or do you actually believe what he did is into crime?
00:31:41
Speaker
right it's very odd and that you would even want to still be associated with him I mean people have made the argument like Victor Silva went to jail and like did his time but it's still is weird I feel like most like
00:32:00
Speaker
rational people you meet would distance themselves and not further associate themselves. Especially if the crime is that severe. It wasn't like a unpaid parking ticket. He was in jail for it. He was a predator to underage people. That's one of the grossest things a person could do. He actually committed the crime too. It wasn't those
00:32:28
Speaker
This isn't just alleged, like this is- And it wasn't like a beedlejuice guy where it's like he got caught before he did the thing. It's like this guy did the evil act, you know? He's guilty, and then went to jail for it. So...
00:32:48
Speaker
Yeah, I can't say, you know, I have to say allegedly about the stuff on Megalopolis because I guess we'll see in the coming months what actually happened on that set. I for now am on the side of I believe this woman because it doesn't and there's there's actually multiple.
00:33:04
Speaker
women who have were saying that he was, you know, like touching people and the fact that he just now why would you announce on Mike? I'm going to come up and kiss you and then say is just for my pleasure. That's yeah, I don't want to I don't want to dwell too much on this. I just had to address it specifically in the context of someone who's like.
00:33:24
Speaker
got too much power feels a little entitled either that or someone who's got a serious drug and alcohol problem and has zero fucking control over there just awful thoughts and you know feelings well
00:33:39
Speaker
I don't know how self-biographical the Caesar character is, because he also has substance issues and stuff, so I'm like... Well that's why I wanted to ask you, do you think Adam Driver's character is a likable character and a good person? I didn't really find myself liking him throughout the movie.
00:34:00
Speaker
I was compelled by when he was on screen because he's a good actor and it's Adam Driver, but I don't think the movie does a good job of convincing me that
00:34:11
Speaker
I should be on board for what he's, I'm fine if he's like flawed or like not likable, but then you could have the conflict of like, well, damn, what he's doing is so important, you know, or that you're like, well, he really has to, but I'm not like sold on either of those fronts. Like, so I'm like, he's shady and seems kind of high and mighty and full of himself. But then I also,
00:34:39
Speaker
when he's pitching Megalopolis to Utopia. It looks stupid. I don't know what he's pitching because he's not saying anything. It's a bunch of mumbo jumbo. He's got like fucking pool tubes connected to like science like solar system balls. You know, it's like I thought this movie was leading to and like Giancarlo Esposios even saying in one of the scenes, he's like, well, Utopia is
00:35:02
Speaker
usually become dystopias. So I thought that what we were going to see the fallout of like, yeah, maybe we shouldn't have just given this guy like unchecked power to just rebuild this society. Like his idea comes to pass and then
00:35:18
Speaker
It seems like Megalopolis is a success. Everyone's like, they're like, you did it. High fives, utopia, we did it. And zoom in on a baby who could control time now, I don't know. It feels like it would be more compelling if everything comes to pass, Megalopolis happens, and then everything falls apart. It's not a success.
00:35:43
Speaker
Everybody like except for Juan Carlo Esposito when they're introduced to like there's like a sample of megalopolis or something where people step on like this little sidewalk or something and It's so dumb and everybody's like on board with it right away. They're like, yeah, we love megalopolis
00:36:01
Speaker
and Juan Carlos, I know. That's why it's like if the movie revealed that Caesar was full of shit, I'd be like, okay, that's actually cool that it's like, because there's all these other figures in these movies, like all these competing subplots that kind of dead end and don't really go, because like, to me,
00:36:20
Speaker
I was like, okay, so Shia LaBeouf, besides wanting his revenge on Caesar, is also a Trumpian fake populist.
Actors' Performances & Typecasting
00:36:29
Speaker
He's being like he's a man of the people, but just wants power. Shia LaBeouf, who's also, I think, awful in this movie. This is one of the worst Shia LaBeouf performances I've seen. It was so bad that it made me start thinking,
00:36:42
Speaker
Damn, uh, what did I like about his other performances? Like I was really, I was like, man, I really need to quickly watch something that I liked him in because like, I can't, this is making me question of like, did he ever have the juice? No, it's just bad. He, his performance is bad. He doesn't even like, his character is dressed stupid. It looks like they're trying to maybe do like a Alex from fucking Clockwork Orange type thing. He's got like,
00:37:10
Speaker
That's what he's going for he failed like that's not it was hard to tell what he was going for it didn't even His look was bad and his performance was bad, and I didn't like Anytime he was on screen, and I'm I'm saying that Allegations are everything he's like done in his personal life aside
00:37:30
Speaker
I'm not saying as a person or even the, you know, whatever Coppola saying about he wants the cast cancel actors. I'm not even commenting on that. I'm just saying in the movie itself on a technical level, his performance is very bad. Yeah.
00:37:45
Speaker
I think Juan Carlo Esposito is pretty bad too. I think a lot of people, so I said this in the car, I said I feel like everybody is miscast somehow. And then you had a retort that I feel like was pretty good. Do you remember what it was? You said something about like,
00:38:01
Speaker
certain actors you can tell their caliber because how they're able to like some a little bit make the dialogue work but you're saying it's like it all is boiling down to like the dialogue just being so bad that these actors can't do anything with it.
00:38:19
Speaker
I think that's a true for so many of the performers, so I can't really start pointing fingers at too many of the actors besides Shia LaBeouf, who I think is just, even with a better script, if he's doing that same stuff is bad. But Adam Driver is just innately compelling and will be doing, he's making choices or doing just a weird thing where you're like, okay,
00:38:42
Speaker
I don't know where this is coming from, but I'm interested to watch it. I'm tired of Juan Carlo Esposito being the villain. He had funny parts in this, but I...
00:38:55
Speaker
like his reactions to some things, but I really want to go back to like, man, I just watched Spike Lee's do the right thing. He's so funny in that. And like, can we go back to that? Like he was funny in kinds of kindness. Was that the one he was in?
00:39:14
Speaker
no you mean Maxine Maxine yeah that's what he was at a movie a movie I didn't love but he was so fun in that he was I mean a lot of the extras are having having fun in that movie and I think I think he was doing something different to God yeah what that meant God I am tired of seeing him in the villain role it's like so
00:39:33
Speaker
done when people are like, make him Dr. Doom, make him this. It's like, guys, how about not? How about we don't? It's just frustrating because he can do other stuff. We've seen it. We have. Yeah. He can also do like really like sincere roles. Did you see that like kaleidoscope show on Netflix? No, I heard. I really wanted to watch. I should watch it.
00:39:56
Speaker
Yeah, I really enjoyed him in that, and you know, he's not going above and beyond, but it's like, he's not doing the fucking bad guy thing either. And we're saying bad guy, he's doing specifically Gus freeing in all these performances. That's every villain role he's, whether he's in The Boys or Star Wars, they're like, can you do Gus, but in Mandalorian, you know, like, space Gus? It's just so tired, and I feel like I'm not the only one who feels that way, like,
00:40:24
Speaker
I wonder how easy I am. I don't know. No, I think I've seen that sentiment for and it's like
00:40:30
Speaker
You know, on one hand, the guy is probably getting a volume of work that he didn't get at an earlier stage of his career because that Breaking Bad role was so iconic. But it's almost like a monkey's paw situation where you're like, well, damn, he's big now in like an established name. But does he really have to just keep doing this for in perpetuity? Like, because if I was him, yes, it'd be nice to be getting that money and work, but I'd be like,
00:40:56
Speaker
I can do other stuff, man. Was anyone else gonna ask me to do something else? Like, that'd be nice. Yeah, I'm hoping it happens. Spike, cast him in your next thing. Have him be silly again. Yeah, let him do more of like, yeah, the Maxine thing. Put him in a Yorgos thing since I already thought he was in kinds of kindness. You're manifesting it. He will be...
00:41:18
Speaker
that would actually be pretty fun. Let's do it. Let's do it. We're fans of Yorgos. I think he might be the director we talk about the most nowadays. Yeah. Tim Burton, you want to have some black people in your next movies? Get Gio and Carlos Presidos. Sure, why not? Have him in one of those. That'd be fun. Have him play the villain in a Burton movie. No, be a silly, weird Burton guy. No, a villain. I want just bland villain.
00:41:48
Speaker
Give me Gus I take back everything Yeah, so there are performance moments that there just be like little like ham driver just does a little skip for no reason and some of the lines it felt like he was like I
00:42:11
Speaker
I love you, Adam Driver. Like, you're doing your best. It's like, I don't feel like that was a Coppola thing. I feel like that was Adam Driver. Yes, trying to find something. Yeah. Like, okay, I need to do something here. Like, there are a lot of things like, yeah, that. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, no, it felt like the choice was coming from him because it doesn't seem like a lot of choices were being made for him as a character. But then there's a lot, because this is where I struggled and I'm like,
00:42:41
Speaker
I think on the right back here like I think 30% of the humor is intentional and that feels right because there are lines where I'm like okay this feels how on the nose and kind of dumb this this writing is does feel kind of the point but then other times where I'm like I think he thought he was cooking here with this line like there are lines like when she comes in to meet with Caesar
00:43:04
Speaker
Gus's daughter, Natalie Manuel, says there's a receptionist like, I'm here to talk about the future of humanity. And then the receptionist's like, oh, that? I'm like, well, that's a joke, right? Yeah, that felt like a joke. But then there were other times where it's like someone would say something with all of their heart. Then a guy in the back of the theater would laugh, and then everybody would start laughing.
00:43:30
Speaker
You're feeling good because you're laughing, but that's not what the movie's expecting out of the audience. I don't think, yeah, a lot of those parts are supposed to just be him sincerely speaking his thesis. But I don't know what he's trying to say. Is it like if he was being blatant about this? He's trying to say we need to have a discussion. Haven't you seen Arrival? He's telling people to talk more.
00:43:54
Speaker
It's about communication. He's telling people to watch Arrival. I mean, that would be a good message. I would support that message. What if it was fully just a movie from another filmmaker, the whole movie's about... You guys really just need to watch this. Yeah, this Villanova guy. He's cooking. You really gotta just see what he's doing. Yeah, speaking of Villanova, someone compared this movie to Dune and Cloud Atlas.
00:44:16
Speaker
I don't understand that in the sight list. Yeah. Cloud Atlas is a significantly better movie, like by far and away. The only Wachowski comparison I could think of for this is like during some of the montage scenes, I was like, this feels a little speedracery in terms of like how it's using blending, like the split screen or like showing these different overlapping images. I feel like Ramey does montages like
00:44:40
Speaker
that sometimes too. I would compare it to Jupiter Ascending on terms of my enjoyability level. That's like, I'd say that's, Jupiter Ascending is much better than this. I mean, that's my least favorite Wachowski movie, but I would even, that's like a cohesive story. You know, it's like, it's got problems, but it's like, it's pretty simple. It's just like a princess and space story.
00:45:04
Speaker
I will give you that. I think I've thought about Jupiter sending more than I will think about Megalopolis in the long run. I'll think about the experience of Megalopolis, but the content of the movie I don't think is really good. I'm not going to remember what the fuck happened in this next week.
00:45:23
Speaker
Well, but did but did anything happen is what I'm trying to piece through because it is like it's so difficult.
Narrative Structure & Dystopian Elements
00:45:30
Speaker
That's why I can't like do a numerical rating for this because it's like no one's doing a numerical rating on letterbox. Unless it's one stars or like four stars. That's all I'm seeing is like the.
00:45:42
Speaker
absolute bottom or close to the bottom or close to the top it's either that or just nothing people being like just not knowing what to say what to make of this and i still kind of don't make i like i said i admire the ambition in the earnest earnestness i just wish it was
00:46:01
Speaker
It was for something because there are imagery in it that's really interesting and cool. So what imagery would you call cool? I'm not saying that to challenge you, but I am genuinely curious because I don't know if I share that feeling.
00:46:20
Speaker
I think a lot of the more surreal stuff when we're, I guess that's just supposed to be in Adam Driver's head or something. When he's dancing or freaking out a little bit. When we're seeing the duplications of him and that seems like that's supposed to be a visual representation of his mind.
00:46:40
Speaker
It's kind of it reminds me of some of the stuff in Vertigo has these like crazy sequences where it's just like color and these images are being superimposed and stuff. And it's like it feels very experimental, especially at the time for like, oh, wow, Hitchcock's really going for it. It almost felt like he was trying to kind of do something in that vein. I don't think this is that, you know, I'm just invoking things. Reminds you this is not as good as Vertigo or Hitchcock, but sounds like you think it says.
00:47:09
Speaker
As good as, uh, a Hitchcock. Oh, a Hitchcock's more so. More like Hackcock. Ooh. No, I- Hitchcock, more like Flacidcock. I- I find, I find that- I'll hop that out. I find, yeah. I just, that was funny.
00:47:30
Speaker
I think some of that imagery is compelling, but then it just brings like every interesting thing brings me to a frustration because I was like, I wish he was doing something with this or like it, you know, I've liked like there's plenty weird abstract things that I like that don't need to be clear cut or sometimes they're just showing you images to show you them. And I especially if they're cool, like I'm fine with that. But like I really would in this
00:47:58
Speaker
Instance it all doesn't come together or add up to Really anything and I would have liked it Visually, I didn't really think this movie was like that good to look at actually was like very annoyed by a lot of the fucking
00:48:16
Speaker
Just I don't even know if you would call them sets or whatever By the end there's fully like you know CG or whatever when we're seeing megalopolis But like anytime they're on that fucking clock It's like I mean there are sometimes I don't know if it's meant to be this way But there's sometimes the clock is see-through and you can see the mechanisms inside and there's sometimes it's not I was just like is the fucking
00:48:40
Speaker
like CGI supposed to be this inconsistent throughout the movie I like didn't get what it was going for but it just like I don't know if it was like purposely bad like Adam Driver gets shot in the face and has like the megalopolis goop machinery like Megalon yeah Megalon Megatron is like a part of him he'd like attaches Megatron to his face where he got shot and yeah
00:49:09
Speaker
It just looks ridiculous. Okay, I kind of like some of that stuff. Because I like it leaning into this, if it's intentionally showing the artifice and trying to be surreal, not real imagery, that was what I was enjoying about that or the clock. Do you think it's intentional? It felt like a restraint to me.
00:49:36
Speaker
Well, that those parts if on in a vacuum, if you just show me those scenes like in some of that imagery was in the trailer, when I saw that, I was like, oh, he's like doing something here because that that could feel intentional. But then you see the rest of the movie and a lot of this new Rome just feels really lazy and like a set design standpoint of like it's just New York. But then occasionally there's like a more
00:50:04
Speaker
Romany thing, you know, like it's it's like such a Thin sprinkling of like a static that like I'm like go one way or the other with this you need to like Commit to because like the the clock tower roof stuff if that's all dream fantasy world Like almost like someone of a Terry Gilliam movie then have the movie look like that That would be interesting have a Terry Gilliam. I was hoping
00:50:30
Speaker
hoping the whole movie was gonna look like that. Like, that's what I thought it would be, and it wasn't. That's kind of what my impression of that's what it was going to be, but then, yeah, then you see, like, it's just, it's just New York and the O, instead of NYPD, it's NRPD, New Rome. I hated the New Rome thing. Okay, but Nick, what if Rome was today? I hated that.
00:50:55
Speaker
Okay, also, speaking of when this movie takes place... Any time anybody said New Rome, I was like, just call it whatever it's supposed to be. It's like, holy shit, like, I don't know. Also, this normally isn't a sticking point for, like, dystopias, utopias, or sci-fi world things, but, like, I'm confused. In one of the titles,
00:51:18
Speaker
inner titles in the things it says like in the third century of the, or in the third century of the 21st century or something. And I was like, so does that mean it's like the 23 hundreds? Because it doesn't really look that far in the future. It looks like it's just New York with like a slight, like someone kind of wanted to do a Rome theme day and then half-assed it.
00:51:46
Speaker
And they went to a costume party city and got some Rome costumes, but like, otherwise it doesn't, didn't feel like, normally that's not like, you know, you, I can watch Blade Runner. You tell me that movie's 2018 and they have flying cars. It looks nothing. We didn't have any of that shit in 2018. I'm fine with sci-fi movies doing that or like doesn't line up with like what you
00:52:26
Speaker
or whatever. Yeah. Like they're all standing on the above like this city display. And I was like, what the fuck is this supposed to be? I thought they were on their way to the actual town hall meeting and they were going to, there was going to be a locate. I'm not saying that's what this, the scene made me think that this was just like some interim place they were passing through. But then I realized as we stayed here.
00:52:38
Speaker
where we're actually at. But in this, I was like, okay, I want there to be a choice here.
00:52:49
Speaker
Adam where Adam Driver was like sitting and like doing shit. And then he just starts doing Shakespeare. But like I. Yeah, that was weird and things like that made me feel like like this feels placeholder of like of like you didn't have an idea for location or the budget for a real place. So it's just in this kind of like.
00:53:11
Speaker
weird it's like a liminal space it doesn't feel like somewhere something should be like actually people hanging out in like this is where we meet Aubrey Plaza and she's like this television reporter and honestly she I like her energy I like her I like how she looks great love Aubrey Plaza I do like her energy her line deliveries
00:53:33
Speaker
tend to be kind of funny again on a script writing level there were some things I don't think were supposed to be funny but coming out of Aubrey Plaza's mouth and just like the look on her face like in dead serious moments it comes off way more funnier than I think it's supposed to
00:53:52
Speaker
Right, yeah, but I am... Like, when she's like, um, I want you to... She was like, you could put your big foot... No, I want you to put it any... She says something... It sounds like she's gonna say, like, your big dick, or, like, your big cupboard. She says your big foot. She says your big foot, and I was like, oh, I don't... And people kind of chuckled, and I was like, oh, I don't think that was supposed to be played for a joke. And I think people chuckled because other people thought she was also gonna say dick or something.
00:54:21
Speaker
I don't. In my mind, he maybe thought he was being clever there or something. It didn't feel intentional. It like. To me, that whole sequence just felt like Coppola's fetish or something like that of when she's because that's the scene where she's seducing Shia LaBeouf, right? Or no, when that's when she's with Adam Driver. OK, never. Well, a lot of the scenes with her, though, do feel like
00:54:46
Speaker
Because I mean, not that there's like, you know, there's plenty of great cinematic, highly sexualized characters. But but like this specifically feels like how she's being utilized and sexualized is like, oh, this is just like shit that he's into that he wanted to see her say and do or something.
00:55:06
Speaker
when she says like anywhere you can put your big foot on me I think that's what she says and it sounds like she's gonna say put your big you know in me but she says put your big foot on me and it almost sounds like she's just like commenting on like how powerful he is or something you know what I mean it it doesn't it seems like she's gonna go sexual but she goes talking about like how powerful he is that's at least like the takeaway I had that was probably the intent and he probably
00:55:37
Speaker
You know, as he penned a paper because, you know, he broke this with pen. He thought he was writing Shakespeare. He was like, this is fucking brilliant. Yeah, this is art. It felt like I had five. It felt like a bad play, honestly, at moments like that the city hall meeting. A lot of the sets looked like a bad play. There's like there's like some kind of.
00:55:56
Speaker
bath house. I guess it's supposed to be where it's like Shia LaBeouf in in John. John Voight is in this movie, by the way. Well, it is a strong word.
00:56:08
Speaker
Seems like he was hanging around on the set. He graces this movie. He was he was there. He was definitely there. There's photographic evidence of it. But there's like they're like having it when like the whole Aubrey Plaza plan of like, oh, we're tricking him into signing over the bank or whatever their plan is. It looks like the idea, I think, is they're trying to make it look like some Roman bath house, but it looks like a bad version. It looks like a bad school play version of that.
00:56:38
Speaker
And if there had been a more consistent like there would if I thought any of that shit was intentional of like that you are making it look fake on purpose, I'd be like, OK, this is something. But like it doesn't happen consistently enough for me to fully give him the bet. Like I'm like, I don't I don't think that's what you were going for there. I thought I think you I think you thought you're like.
00:57:03
Speaker
This is ancient Rome. I fucking nailed this. Like, I'm so fucking smart, man. And the movie does kind of have that energy of, like, I nailed this. And that's how the Q&A had, like, the energy the Q&A had.
Intentional Dumb Elements & Creative Power
00:57:18
Speaker
Like, people are gonna fucking watch this and they're gonna get it. And then you and I, like, asked ourselves, like, was this movie intentionally dumb? You know, I don't think it was though.
00:57:29
Speaker
Right. And that's that's why I, you know, other people may this compare like this doesn't this is not Southland tales because Southland tales is being intentionally dumb to make a point. I don't know. I like I said, like you said, I may be 30 percent of the dumbness I can.
00:57:47
Speaker
attribute intentionally and even then we might be being generous. I don't know. I legit don't know. Is this just a dude who's not all there at the end of his career just like firing off doing something?
00:58:03
Speaker
And that could be interesting. You know, I just wish he was he was doing something with it because like because and then bite. So the end of the movie, we've talked about like how this movie views Caesar and his goal. Well, before we get into that, you want to take a break real quick. Yeah, let's let's take a break. OK.
00:58:20
Speaker
I'm Andrew Ryan, and I'm here to ask you a question. Is a man not entitled to the sweat of his brow? No, says the man in Washington. Belongs to the poor. No, says the man in the Vatican. It belongs to God. No, says the man in Moscow. It belongs to everyone. I rejected those answers. Instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose...
00:58:45
Speaker
Rapture, a city where the artists not fear the censor, where the scientists would not be bound by petty morality, where the great would not be constrained by the small, and with the sweat of your brow, rapture can become your city as well. Anyway, enough about BioShock.
00:59:05
Speaker
At first, I thought that was from Megalopolis until you said Rapture, because I was setting it up, I was going to be like, what rich text is this from? To Kill a Mockingbird? What part of literature did you pull this from? But then when you said Rapture, I'm like, oh, it's actually from something that people enjoy.
00:59:23
Speaker
I should have plugged Megalopolis into it because the movie. OK, like we said before, doesn't feel like this movie is saying anything except that great, brilliant men should just be left to do what they want, because in the game I was quoting for that's like the pitch of in Bioshock, you go to all these like ruined sci-fi dystopias. And like when you're going to this underwater city, you're seeing like this intro video that as it was pitched.
01:00:11
Speaker
I thought Bioshock takes place in
01:00:13
Speaker
a non interference, let everyone you know, all these great men, they need to need to just be let to do what they want to do. The government, no one should be censoring them or are stopping or restricting them. And the whole thing of Bioshock is just like, well, that would
01:00:30
Speaker
immediately go bad like there's no regulations or no one's stopping anything and just like genetic experiments and manipulation have gone out of control everyone's like addicted to like harvesting like genetic material from people so they can like splice their genes and shit it like it society got real fucked up real fast and but megalopolis almost feels like it's saying like no no no
01:00:53
Speaker
What we will do it right. We'll do that version of that. That's good. Like if he got to do whatever he wants and when he makes the society in his image, that's actually good. This is it. Doesn't the movie doesn't feel critical at all of him, right?
01:01:09
Speaker
it doesn't and that doesn't lead or you know lend to like an interesting story it does you know what i mean right because even if i don't agree with that thematically or politically like what does that give us
01:01:24
Speaker
Yeah, if the movie, you're pitching the flawless thing from the beginning and it just turns out to be just that flawless. He's saying for two hours, it's going to be great. I'm the man. No one else can do this. And then he's correct. No one else can do it. He does it. Yeah. And it's not even like he's doubted every step of the way. Like one guy who's like, hey,
01:01:46
Speaker
And everyone else is like, he's such a genius. And the movie has to make a point of proving him like, see Giancarlo Esposito, see Gus, you shouldn't have doubted him. Look at this. Look what he did. So it's saying we should give power to the creatives, basically. Is that what this movie is saying? I mean, if in a vacuum, if you're just saying it's the James Gunn DC situation, like, are we going to give the creatives all the control?
01:02:16
Speaker
I think some people should have restrictions. Are the studios going to be the ones in control? I'm not saying I'm pro. The studio should just be able to veto anything and like demand, you know, creative output out of out of artists. But sometimes studio notes can lead to like, you know, like it is a collaborative process. And I don't know this idea of that.
01:02:43
Speaker
like that's you know the criticism of auteur theory is that like you're kind of like minimizing the other achievements of like this is like a collaborative like it's not just writers there's editors there's all the below line people who are like lighting and the movie doing the sound like all that is a part of it yeah there's like one guy will hopefully have like a unifying vision to bring that all together but it's kind of limiting for that to be the soul way you view
01:03:13
Speaker
this process and for that, not that a tour theory says that has to be the sole lens to do, I think some people to get too caught up in like, that's the
Importance of Editors & Collaborative Filmmaking
01:03:21
Speaker
starting point. Then they never leave that lens of like looking at movies of like, they're just seeing it as the product of this director. And a lot of our tours don't even view themselves like like a lot of them credit their editors like so much. Yeah.
01:03:40
Speaker
Yeah, but yeah, especially in like Tarantino was who I was going to go to long time editor up until before Django, I think.
01:03:50
Speaker
Mm-hmm. She died around that time. But then, Scorsese also credits a lot of the success of his stuff to, I think it's Thelma Schoonmaker, has been his editor for like most of his career. George Miller. George Miller, which is his wife. George Lucas. There's a very funny pad and Oswald bit where he's like,
01:04:11
Speaker
women most of the best movies ever made were edited by women because like It's male directors with the like their cameras their dick, and there's like oh I just shot so much film look how much film I show mine And then the woman has to come in and be like okay. You're sweet. I'll find the story in the patent patent Take it easy Mr.. Oswald
01:04:41
Speaker
Cobble pots. Remi, the rat himself, like, you know, when his rat Hui fans heard him speak like that, what would they think? Yeah, exactly. The kids. Think of the kids, Patton. Think of the kids, yeah. You were a Marvel character, Patton.
01:04:57
Speaker
Which Marvel character was it? He was in the Eternals post-credit scene or something. He was like a super dog or something. That movie that happened that for sure happened. Oh, wasn't he? Harry Styles shows up, right? And then he's like with Harry Styles or something? Yeah, yeah. Harry Styles is Thanos' brother. Thanos' brother, Star Fox, but not that Star Fox. Don't worry about it. They're never gonna follow up on any of that. Yeah.
01:05:21
Speaker
But I have to say about our tours in relation to the DC universe, give it back to Snyder, release the Snyder Cut again. I think that's what Coppola is really saying. Re-release the Snyder Cut.
01:05:39
Speaker
Coppola wants the sire cut re-released. He wants him to restore. What's the fucking hashtag? They still do restore. Hashtag restore the sire cut and restore the twisted universe. Well, also the David released the David Ayer cut. Oh, yeah.
01:05:55
Speaker
There's actual people who want to see that like that that it's like you think like yeah, I know it sucks They took studios shouldn't take control away from directors and give it to like a trailer editing company to make a movie That's absurd. But then also this is David Ayer. We're talking about you think you think his version was Yeah, spectacular. I don't I don't really know I I would like to see it
01:06:19
Speaker
as like an experiment almost. But also like I can fucking shit in my hand as an experiment. That doesn't mean the world needs it. You know? Right. I've already seen David Ayers sabotage, which is like the better version of the suicide. Like he I already have that from him. I don't need to see his whatever his vision was.
01:06:42
Speaker
Like, what if we just release all the old cuts of all the movies and see if they'd line up in some way? You know? Kind of like how you can man your sink up dark side of the movie with Metropolis. Yeah. People do that, actually. They're already doing it. No, they do do that. I actually would- Sink it up with- Oh, I thought you said Megalopolis.
01:07:07
Speaker
Oh, well they should do Megalopolis, that's the new one. I also, yeah, when I heard that this movie was called Megalopolis, like 15 years ago, I was like, there's already Metropolis, you know? Right. It's like too similar. One of you has to change the name, and it's probably not the one that's been around for 100 years, so. Change Metropolis, there's already a bunch of like different cuts they keep releasing of that movie, you could just change the name at this point. There's like an anime Metropolis to... Yeah.
01:07:34
Speaker
I think I did see the anime and liked it. I don't know. Give Megalopolis back to the fans. Yeah. Give Megalopolis back to the fans. So anyway, what I was saying about our tour, like, hey, I definitely I still organize and think of films, you know, through the careers of directors often. But, you know, that's not like my complete endpoint of interacting with
01:07:58
Speaker
the film and like as over time as I get more into other stuff, like, you know, I'm a bit of a consider myself an editor and like, you know, I really can appreciate like of how the edit can bring stories together of like there's like that really is where the story is being told is in like whoever has like that final cut. And so I really can appreciate all these other components that come together. But to me, it almost seems like Coppola has added to like, it's all me. It's all my brain.
01:08:28
Speaker
I'm a fucking genius which I mean that wouldn't be something to like Brag about you know that this is your soul creation
01:08:40
Speaker
Yeah, it's almost better if you could blame other people about this right now. The studio interfered too much. They took it away from me. Francis, wasn't this self-financed? Release the Ford Coppola cut. Also, by the way, there's a character that, I don't know if they don't successfully get named Francis in this movie, right? Oh, the baby. The baby.
01:09:04
Speaker
Wait, is it a boy or a girl at the end? I thought it was a girl. Okay, because if it was a girl, they were gonna name it after Adam Driver's dead wife. Okay, well, let's talk about his dead wife for a second, because there's like a thousand plot lines in this movie that I'm just now remembering. Oh, yeah, that was fucking weird when What's Her Face was following him. And he goes to the apartment
01:09:25
Speaker
And he just sees him caressing the empty air where he's seeing his wife. And my takeaway was like, oh, are we about to introduce the idea of like these overlapping realities or something? Or that this dude just fucking crazy. But she looks at him like.
01:09:40
Speaker
He misses. He still loves her. Her takeaway is not one that I would have come to. This guy's a fucking loony tune. She's like... Right. That would make sense for someone to be scared. They're like, oh my God, what is this? And then we should have shifted tones very quickly. And then she said, she's like, he still loves her. And then when you later cut till you find out how... So I'm already losing the thread. Like, she like...
01:10:09
Speaker
They had a fight or something or she got driven crazy and or she had something to tell him and it was that she was pregnant and then she drowns when she drives off a bridge or some shit. Right. I didn't. That sounds all new to me. I there's it. I feel like I don't know if I remember drowning. I think he came up with that. So he just so he could recreate Juan Carlos Pazito was like.
01:10:34
Speaker
had some involvement
01:10:49
Speaker
It mostly exists so he could recreate, do a worse version of a shot from a 50s movie. In Night of the Hunter, there's just one of the most striking images in any movie where you see a woman under, like her car is underwater and she's dead and her hair is like floating up in the water. And it's like, oh my God, this image is crazy. Especially for somebody in the film, you're like, how did they even like capture this image? I don't know. You haven't seen Jurassic World's Fallen Kingdom.
01:11:16
Speaker
They're in a ball going underwater in that one They have balls in this river. They have like a Jurassic World ball in megalopolis It's like their transit system. Yeah or something
01:11:31
Speaker
But yeah, so Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom may be better than Night of the Hunter. You might want to rethink. No, I'm kidding. I have that movie. I got to watch it. I love it. It's one of the best looking movies ever made, I think. And so, you know, I don't know if you want to pay homage to an influential classic or, you know, like a classic shot. That's cool. But like, I don't think he has anything
01:11:55
Speaker
a new iteration on it just like oh wow this is striking this dead woman underwater and then he had to then justify why we were seeing that so it was just like oh it was his wife i don't know uh that's kind of what it felt like to me it felt like a lot of ideas that he just had a lot of
01:12:14
Speaker
of stuff. He threw it in there and then would work backwards to be like, yeah, well, this is a story kind of kind of kind of for that could be put on the poster. This is a story kind of.
01:12:32
Speaker
like that and forth. Yeah, you quote me on that. No. And, you know, I've already said earlier, like I've watched plenty of weirdo movies that are like super abstract or maybe harder to follow. I could kind of parse of like loose of like what I think that the movie was trying to narratively convey to me for. I feel like when I really lose, the threat is post him getting shot. Yeah, it starts to fall apart for me.
01:12:59
Speaker
Let's talk about that I kind of knew so we talked about this off mic Both of us felt that he was gonna get shot The way he's framed in the like the car door rolls down like oh that kids gonna shoot him Yeah, they're gonna pull a combo from breaking bad a hundred percent Yeah, which makes it a little more on the nose that your cast casting gusts fring you're just all around just ripping from breaking bad and
01:13:27
Speaker
Yeah, and then it was weird when Giancarlo Esposito stands up right before he's blown up and then he walks out with like half a face, which is similar. There is a half a face fucking person in this. Oh, it's him! Yeah. And driver. He got that from breaking bad! He got it all from breaking bad. But yeah, this kid...
01:13:50
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. Even though we both saw it coming, did you jump when Adam Driver got shot? Because even though I saw it coming... It's very scary, or like jarring. It is, because... It's really loud. Also, there's not... The movie has a lot of stuff in it, but there's not a lot happening in it. Oh, we also... We gotta talk about the dude who talked to Adam Driver in the movie also, but we'll get to that later.
Shooting Scene & Live Interaction
01:14:13
Speaker
The guy who talked to him. Okay. A lot of people are talking to him. No, the real life person who did. We'll get to that later, though. So we were talking and the driver got shot. Yeah. So he gets shot. And even though this kids it's it is tell. I mean, I guess this will.
01:14:30
Speaker
is a credit to Coppola as a visual storytelling because it is using the visual language of a scene where someone's about to fucking get shot of how it's like cutting between him in the car, you see the kid, and then you see Shia LaBeouf's guy who's like watching. He's like, okay, so this is the plan. This kid's gonna shoot him. And then the movie kind of just doesn't do anything with that.
01:14:54
Speaker
is like a lot of stuff in this movie. Yeah, they're like, you made him a martyr. It's like, okay, Jesus Christ. That's been just done before so many times, I feel like.
01:15:08
Speaker
I'm trying to decide if, would it be more narratively interesting if that's how he died? No, he's dead. If we shoot him, he's assassinated. And then you maybe have that be the point of like, OK, he is a martyr and the dream of Megalopolis died before he actually had to even try to fulfill it. And then that could be saying something of like, you know, all these people die and
01:15:33
Speaker
Like Megalopolis doesn't happen. It doesn't happen. Yeah, that's way more interesting. But people have the romanticized idea of what it could have been. They're like, oh. Maybe you see shots of that. Yeah. If someone's imagining it, and they're like, oh, imagine what we almost had. Or you see shots of multiple people imagining it. And maybe you have different versions of that, what their version of Utopia. This already sounds more interesting. And the movie like that. Yeah, that sounds way better than, oh, man.
01:16:03
Speaker
Instead he puts some mega cum in his eye or something. Yeah, it grows him a new And again there's things in other might be like I don't need the sci-fi MacGuffin explained of like what this material is There's like some love on the nose direct news bright view like it came from space Don't look up People used to say that everyone was saying don't look up. Yeah
01:16:36
Speaker
I don't even- it's really just in context of this movie not really feeling like it's making a decision either way that it's frustrating that there's not really anything about the- the Megalon's just a thing that's like a means to an end. Other- in other movies I'd be like, that's fine. You don't have to explain the thing where it came from because it can be a means to end because you're using that to explore some interesting idea or story. Did you say Megalodon? Yeah. Did I say Meg- do I say Megalodon? I think so.
01:17:06
Speaker
It's Megalon, or I don't know what the fuck it is, the Megagoop. I can't remember. I thought I had it wrong. That's why I asked you. I was like, wait, is that what it's actually called? It's called... Magloop? No, it's got like multiple syllables. It's like Mega...
01:17:25
Speaker
Well, it is maybe it is Megalodon. I don't know. But what were you saying? I was saying that, like, I don't. A lot of things like in a better movie, if you don't explain what the sci fi gizmo jup is, that I don't I won't care because you're using it to like explore an interesting idea or like tell a story. And I'm like, yeah, it kind of doesn't matter where it came from or what are the actual like, how does this work? But in the context of this movie, where you're not giving me anything, it's
01:17:53
Speaker
So broad and it's so vague. It seems like it does everything. He's building the city out of it. It can restore his eye. You see that dog. It looks like it's water sometimes. You see that dog with a brace and they're like, it's the first mega blah blah blah cast or something. Oh, that one fake virgin girl has a dress. It's like the first mega boo boo shirt. Yeah, you know, dress and it's like it.
01:18:19
Speaker
You know, comes out of a bidet and shoots into your butt now, you know, it just- You can drink it at the store, it's got fuckin- Yeah. It's a Jake Paul energy drink, you buy it, or Logan Paul, whichever one of those guys has prime, or whatever that shit is. Yeah.
01:18:42
Speaker
This has both hit a wall at the same time. This movie. Should we talk about the completely unique experience we had? By unique, I mean us and all the other people in the theater and the 65 other theaters in the country and all the festivals. I did see someone online say that at one festival screening,
01:19:06
Speaker
there was a guy who live in the room was, you know, as the reporter talking to him, he like missed his cue and was saying the thing too early. But it wasn't just audio from the movie that he like went up to, which
01:19:23
Speaker
Either way is kind of underwhelming. It's kind of like the whole movie of like to what end because like as is it just like is it's barely a gimmick to have this is like we saw the microphone there it got me excited because I heard there was like a live interaction segment like oh Adam Driver talks to a guy who like goes up to the screen. And it says at the bottom of the screen
01:19:51
Speaker
On the IMAX screen while like the Overturn everything is playing like there will be a it was a disclaimer I have it was like a live participant blah blah blah will happen and this presentation features a live participant participant element in theater.
01:20:11
Speaker
Yeah, so I was excited for that. And apparently the original plan like the this makes me wonder of like, OK, was the original so many other things in this movie? Was it more ambitious? And then then we got the kind of pared down, maybe a little like this, what we got felt a little half-assed.
01:20:31
Speaker
Because the original plan apparently was to have he wanted to have a voice recognition system in every theater so that anyone from the public could ask questions. And then A.I. would select a prerecorded Adam Driver clip that could respond to one of those things.
01:20:49
Speaker
And so it would have been like almost choose your own adventure of like everyone would have said something and it would have shown us like a somewhat unique to us like response. I could imagine that going terribly. Yeah. And just a regular theater. It's just being dead silent because people don't know what to do or everybody is just.
01:21:12
Speaker
Oh whatever dumb shit, you know, how does how does it sort through the? Answer for that and like in yeah, that sounds like an idea that I can't imagine being Successful that sounds like you're reaching for too much for general audiences. That's like this will not work or it's not possible
01:21:33
Speaker
Is that what it says in the article? Yeah, so so then it was like, okay, so then what if it was just a guy who came up in a guy a couple of times, right? Only for certain screenings and then because I think last night was the only time people are getting like other screenings will just it'll just be the scene and you'll hear the question without all the because it doesn't add anything. It doesn't. Oh, it's like the worst because I
01:21:59
Speaker
originally was like okay if I have to go to the bathroom at any point I'm just gonna make sure I wait for this guy's appearance to see what it is and I could have fully missed it and I wouldn't have even been upset about it if I knew what it was like this guy just walks up and I'm pretty sure he didn't need like the microphone wasn't even on plugged into anything he just
01:22:22
Speaker
kind of moved his mouth and not really in sync to the the off the like ADR question that's being it's like him in a press conference and the idea is that like this guy is asking him the question but really it's just a pre-recorded thing and the guy just
01:22:37
Speaker
Yeah, and he it was just weird too because he was the whole time the guy was looking down at his cards reading along with what I think Adam Driver was saying it looked like he was reading something then he would occasionally look back up at the screen I was wondering like is he gonna say something again? Is he gonna miss his line like what's going on? And then he just didn't say anything else and he walked off and it Do you think he was supposed to say something else?
01:23:04
Speaker
Maybe. I don't know. It's weird, man. But although the way the scene is structured, again, like so much in this movie, it's not. I think that's literally the scene where that that cringe quote that I opened with of whether he's like in us having conversation, that is, I think that's like his answer to the question or something that the guy, you know, I mean, he didn't really ask it, but that this guy is supposed to be asking him through the screen and he just gives the most blank, nothing answer. Honestly,
01:23:34
Speaker
You could have pretended that it was live answering all our questions if you could just have stock multiple versions of him just giving a nothing answer because he's never saying anything anyway. It doesn't matter. It's not like it actually mattered to the plot or anything. Whatever response Adam Driver's character just pooped out in that moment. God.
01:24:00
Speaker
Ah, half baked. We just need to have a conversation. This movie feels like, it feels half baked.
Stoner Comedies & Other Film Comparisons
01:24:06
Speaker
Half baked is better than this. I don't know if I would say that. I don't really like half baked. I don't love it, but...
01:24:14
Speaker
I'm not a stoner comedy person. Aside from Pineapple Express, actually, I quite enjoy that one. I'm trying to think of other stoner comedies now. I've seen some Cheech and Chong. I've never been a big fan of that. I've never seen the full movies. I've seen like parts and then I'll get too stoned and usually like fall asleep or something.
01:24:35
Speaker
I like them as characters, I guess, I don't know. But yeah, I- I like them outside of the roles of Cheech and Sean.
01:24:45
Speaker
or when they're Cheech and Chong in other stuff. When it's not in the context of a Cheech and Chong property. Like when they show up in the Scorsese movie after hours. It's crazy, Cheech and Chong are in a Scorsese movie. But anyway, back to this movie. Megalopolis. How do you spell what you just did there?
01:25:16
Speaker
I'll plug, I'll transcribe it. I'll figure out a way to transcribe the audio. Oh, Apple Podcast does transcribe all of it. That's what I mean. I'll get that and then we'll put that on a shirt. That'll be complete with the, you'll have that sound. Yeah, it blows raspberries or spittle.
01:25:34
Speaker
So, okay, it's gonna lie, the shirt will lie, take everyone's feedback in the audience's response, and it'll blow a raspberry that's like, specifically tailored. It's Adam Driver blowing a raspberry. The shirt will also be see-through. Yes, like the Megalo-glop-glop. Mm-hmm, the gloop. The gloop-bloop-boop. Yeah, one of the Paltrow had some involvement in this. I mean, I, you know,
01:26:01
Speaker
I wish I could just be like, hey, it's great that he did this and it, you know, it's a silly, goofy movie and there was some fun stuff, even if it was a mess. And I feel kind of that way about certain parts about it that it was like, you know, I'm not, you know, most of it, I'm not like offended, you know, it's not like that bad, but it's, it's bad in the way where it's just like, well, you went through all this trouble.
01:26:26
Speaker
And it's like, and to do what? What were you? This is your big shot. You know, like it was very compelling of like, you know, this this great filmmaker is like, maybe this is probably his swan song, you know, like he sold liquid dated his wine company and he's like, banking it all on this big passion project, this big swing that he's been wanting to make. And it's like,
01:26:50
Speaker
He'll make his money back when he sells it to HBO.
01:27:09
Speaker
semi-long walks. Just come with me on it. We'll take a walk. So in the 90s, Tom Green, remember hit Tom Green? Great, funny Tom Green. The 90s, the era of corn and limp biscuit.
01:27:22
Speaker
I have appreciation for Tom Green because I think he's like the progenitor of a sense of a sigh of humor that I like. I don't we don't get Eric Andre, Tim Heidecker or like Nathan Fielder in the same form without like he's a link in that Andy Kaufman chain of like like doing like.
01:27:43
Speaker
interacting with real people and like, like basically trolling his audience, like kind of humor. And so after the whole Monica Lewinsky scandal, she was actually from one of his like hometown, like his hometown of Canada. He had her on the show. It was called the Monica Lewinsky special. And they kept going around to these news outlets, going on talk shows. It was Tom Green and Monica Lewinsky, like we have an announcement to make.
01:28:11
Speaker
This is very important what we're going to say. We have this important announcement. They were going on these talk shows. They were getting buzz and like everyone was like, what is their announcement? Are they like dating? What's going on? And then this was all just like it was kind of like one of those Nathan for you episodes where he's like trolling the news to just get them to make a story be trending because they're the only story what like when they finally have to like talk about what this is that they've gathered on foreign like. And so Monica has come here to Ottawa or whatever.
01:28:41
Speaker
the part of Canada that they went back home to because they have the best fabrics and she's opening a fabric store. It was just like a nothing announcement that he intentionally got everyone's attention, got everyone hyped up for just to
01:28:57
Speaker
tell them nothing. And but that was like an intentional joke that he was Tom Green and Monica were playing, which I thought was it was cool that he actually let her be at a time where she was kind of the butt end of the media in all these jokes. And she actually got to be the one in on the joke being played on the media. That's pretty cool, Tom, that you had that set that up. But this
01:29:23
Speaker
is almost like it. I'm like, is this a joke on me? Because like, what was you got me here and all excited? Have we been in practically joked right now? Yeah. Is there a camera right there? Right there. Yeah. South volcano Q and James Murray here.
01:29:39
Speaker
I mean, it because I want I always want to assume intentionality and things that I'm seeing. It's always it's just more interesting to interact with a piece of art that way of like, OK, I think I want to come from the point of view of like, what were they trying? What was their intent and what were they trying to do here? But it's so hard for me to parse with this, but that
01:30:00
Speaker
It just circles. I have this circle of frustration than being compelled by the thing I don't understand and then getting frustrated again. It's like an ouroboros. Yeah, it's just like this movie is an ouroboros. Eating its own. For the listeners, Doug was just drawing a circle in the air, so that's how I came to ouroboros. Oh my god, it's just like a rifle. A circle? Mm-hmm.
01:30:24
Speaker
This is- Watch Arrival, guys. That's a good movie. This movie's a masterpiece, actually. It's the new Arrival. It's better than the fuck Dennyville.
01:30:35
Speaker
Yeah, give Francis Ford Coppola. He's doing the new Dune. Yeah, give him Dune. Give him all of every- anytime Villanova wants a project, just give it to Coppola. And when Coppola's dead, just give it to his estate. Whoever wants it. McCage. One of his kids. Sofia Coppola.
01:30:56
Speaker
Swartzman's related to him, right? Because Swartzman and Swartzman's mom, who is his mom, Coppola's sister? What's the relation there? They are related. I might be related to Coppola at this point. Everyone is a Coppola. There's secret Coppola's everywhere. It's just, they're kind of like the, uh, the scroll. Shout out to Secret Invasion.
01:31:21
Speaker
Geez, I think we'd go there. Francis Ford Coppola's secret invasion. I mean, compared to secret invasion, this thing's a masterpiece. It's Citizen Kane, but, uh... That's about the level of Marvel property that I would give him. Right, like what... Chief Coppola, you'd give a... I'd give him secret invasion. You'd give him secret invasion. Which one, what one do you think he'd be better suited to? Oh, shit. Oh, you know what? I'd give him, like, Moon Knight.
01:31:49
Speaker
Actually, I'm changing my vote, Moon Knight. I think, I think, yeah. Give Moon Knight back to the fans. They really just gotta give Moon. Yeah, Moon Knight sucks. I saw someone post on Facebook the other day, they're like, Marvel keeps folk, because they were talking about Agatha all along. I deleted Facebook, by the way, fucking finally, but. Yeah, about time. They were saying like,
01:32:12
Speaker
Agathol along like fuck this and all that Marvel focuses on all these characters that no one gives a shit about like Miss Marvel and Making shitty shows about her when they should be making more shows like Moon Knight something that was a masterpiece I was like, dude, I was like everything about this is wrong-headed Miss Marvel is one of the most successful Marvel shows I'd argue and it's like one of their I'm Oscar Isaac doing a British accent
01:32:41
Speaker
Miss Marvel is ten times more of a successful character than fucking Moon Knight. It's like people actually like Miss Marvel, too. Yeah. And like I didn't watch it, but I heard stylistically that show is like doing interesting things in this Marvel. Yeah. In terms of filmmaking and visuals and stuff, which I would have character the Marvel's.
01:33:08
Speaker
Like, would not be- and this isn't like a criticism of Nia da Costa or like the Marvels at all. I actually did enjoy the Marvels, but the Marvels would not be worth a shit without Ms. Marvel in there.
01:33:21
Speaker
I think of what I know about Kamala Akana, she's like a cool character, so I'm glad that it sounds like- She's a blast. Every time she's on screen, you just, you love her. That's one of the more, they're talking about, I won't go too deep into Marvel, but there's a rumor that they're gonna end the MCU and completely start fresh after Secret Invasion. Or Secret War. Secret War, yeah, start from the ground up again, and I was just like,
01:33:50
Speaker
Man, losing Ms. Marvel will probably be like one of the hardest hits, I think. Because I don't know who else I'm attached to. I'm like, no, don't stop, you know, in terms like, you know, fresh reboot, like, I mean.
01:34:05
Speaker
I definitely... You'd be losing Ms. Marvel and the whole Fantastic Four cast. Oh, well that'd be especially weird because you're just starting Fantastic Four and then you're gonna like start from scratch. I don't know what the logic there is. Unless Fantastic Four would be the only surviving members of this iteration of MCU. Like there is spaceship that comes through into a different time.
01:34:26
Speaker
I mean, comics do that shit, but like that's because they write themselves into a corner decades in of like doing stuff. And I feel like, OK, now I don't want to make this whole MCU talk. Yeah, that's my bad.
01:34:39
Speaker
Megalopolis, the other MCU, Megalopolis Cinematic Universe. Somewhere else they got ridden into a corner. I mean, I don't know, was it? Because it doesn't.
Cohesion & Execution in Megalopolis
01:34:52
Speaker
It just feels you said half baked and it just feels like like, yeah, you run out of time. You didn't have time to like, like cook this a little more, put it back in the oven because like there could be something here if you like.
01:35:07
Speaker
found what was in here and then decided on a thing and polished some of this shit. And maybe if it was more pointed. Yeah, pointed had something to say, a strong aesthetic choices, which is kind of lacking in in. Like I said, we said all the new Rome stuff, a lot of those sets look kind of half-assed or it's just like there's a pillar. So it's like, oh, Roman, look, they're wearing togas.
01:35:36
Speaker
And then also, you know, as much as I said, I kind of like the fake looking CG backgrounds when he's on the clock tower, when we actually see the megalopolis city, especially I would when it's like them envisioning the city, I'm like, OK, that it looks so unreal and dreamlike fine. But then when that's just is the city, I'm like, this is kind of a in just like design wise, like
01:36:03
Speaker
Like the rest of the movie doesn't feel like you're making a choice. It just feels like a stock. Like what a stock utopia looks like. And if that was to make a point about like, oh, this is this this great man had this. He said he had this great vision and his his his utopia is just so generic and empty and there's like not anything to it. Like that could be interesting. We've come up with several different themes and messages that could have been more interesting. It just feels like a
01:36:31
Speaker
kind of bad movie that came out in like the wrong era. The earnestness kind of felt like it was like from out of like the 50s or 60s maybe, you know what I mean? I get what you're saying that yes, and maybe
01:36:48
Speaker
there would have been actors better suited in that time to do some of this. They would still deserve better dialogue. Yeah. Like Aubrey Plaza is one where it's like, I get why you would like the look.
01:37:02
Speaker
I was like watching this movie like I could see this movie being in black and white with the look of some of these actors and like you know the line delivery that feels like it was like the lines feel like they were written in that time almost. She could have been in like a 40s 50s screwball comedy.
01:37:20
Speaker
but her delivery but even like her look she has like a look where she could be doing like dramas and like that era of filmmaking but then when she talks it's Aubrey Plaza the Aubrey Plaza we know and it doesn't fit you know
01:37:35
Speaker
Assuming all her parts aren't supposed to be funny and I don't think they I think certain lines were but like I think she's supposed to be it's supposed to be a serious dramatic use of her and she can give great dramatic performances like shout out
01:37:52
Speaker
What's that fucking movie with Scarlet Witch? Oh, Ingrid Goes West. Ingrid Goes West. I love Ingrid Goes West. Great movie. Excellent performance. In my top 10 of 2017, I like love Ingrid Goes West, probably more than most people. I've rewatched it a lot. I really, really like that movie.
01:38:10
Speaker
the maybe the only performance of hers that I would rank above Ingrid goes west is is Legion also shout out Legion she gives an incredible to I mean that's just like an encapsulation of everything that she's good at doing but she gets to do multiple that shows like
01:38:27
Speaker
That's like an audacious boundary pushing show in terms of like how it combines tones and like all these different genres and stuff. Check out Legion, because that's actually in service. All the weird stylistic things that shows doing it actually has a point to make in a story to tell that I think is pretty compelling. So I like big swings when they like add up to some or you at least where you can at least tell what they're trying to do. I don't even fully get
01:38:57
Speaker
what the intent here is, and that's the biggest problem for me, with megababapapus. I agree. I agree. Um, I don't have a whole lot to add onto that. Um,
01:39:14
Speaker
It's hard to tell if I think this movie is bad or not. I wouldn't say, I don't know, maybe it is bad. Banana, banana. Like, there's some scenes in it. If you were to ask me about scene to scene basis, if you were to turn to me and be like, what's your letterbox rating? There's some scenes where I would maybe go as high as three. But a lot of stuff. I mean, like the two to two point five range. Two stars just.
01:39:43
Speaker
That's where I feel like I'm at. It feels kind of like mean a little bit like I don't normally rank stuff that low like two and a half is like I think the lowest I've ever logged something and I don't normally go lower than that because I think it's just because it feels like there should be so much more here and there's not um
Dialogue Critique & Time-Stop Plot
01:40:05
Speaker
Like right now, I have it ranked at number 45 out of 55 of the year. I have it right below Horizon and right above Roadhouse. You have it over Roadhouse. Over Roadhouse, yeah, and right below Horizon. And I rated Horizon three stars. I would have to see what I put this over. I mean, I guess...
01:40:29
Speaker
That new Lee Daniels movie, The Deliverance, which is awful. Like this, this is better than that. So it's not the worst movie I've seen all year. If you put it over Madame Web. Madame Web. Oh, you're thinking about this one. The web connects them all, though. So here's.
01:40:47
Speaker
Yeah, this movie did lack Pepsi product. I was gonna say did they end resolve the conflicts with a Pepsi sign? Why wasn't there a Pepsi logo on the clock? Why didn't they drive to a fireworks factory? Why wasn't Adam Driver stealing ambulances and running people over with them? That would have been cool. Like, I don't know. Maybe this should have been Madam Web.
01:41:12
Speaker
she can see the future he can pause time pause ok I don't want to bring up another thing we're winding down but he pauses time time stop yeah I don't know it didn't really seem like it mattered it almost felt like it was a
01:41:28
Speaker
And like, I'm not opposed to, like I said, I'm all for like cool stylistic flourishes just cause and then sometimes you work backwards to justify a thing like you'll see as you get more into like Lynch and Twin Peaks, especially the return. There's like editing stuff he's doing where it's like I can almost see him just like
01:41:48
Speaker
fucking around on the time of like when you like drag a clip back and forth and make it go backwards and forth like were you just doing this in the editing and you're like hey wait a minute this is this is kind of sick but the way he uses it is cool so it's like then he does actually find a cool use for it like that's a good version of that this almost felt like where he was like oh wait everything frozen but he's still moving
01:42:13
Speaker
That's something, but then he didn't actually build on that or use it to do anything. Because it doesn't lead anywhere. I didn't understand why it was even really in the movie. He has the power. He loses it for a little bit. He does it when the building is collapsing and he stops it for a second.
01:42:36
Speaker
the character like his main love interest like witnesses it and it's like oh my god and I was like oh is she the only one that can see him stop time but it seems like it's a known thing that he can stop time do other people know about it I don't know it
01:42:53
Speaker
It seems unnecessary and inconsequential. Because I always want to find some way to give credit to a thing. I know this is a real reach, but I was like, is it a commentary? I'm like, he has this great power. It's almost like a godlike power to control physics and time and stuff, but he's not using it really for anything. He doesn't really care about this great thing that's been given to him, and then he loses it.
01:43:20
Speaker
And I was like, Oh, it doesn't seem like the movies trying to say anything about that. I don't think I don't think that's I don't I don't know. I don't know what this movie is saying. One thing that I did want to point out that I found annoying is the love interest again. Nailia Manuel. Yeah. Her name Julia Cicero. Wow.
01:43:45
Speaker
Yeah, there's a point where she says like to her dad multiple times like in regards to in regard to Adam Driver's character she Yeah, he's not evil. He's not evil, and I was just like oh my fucking god. What is this oh?
01:44:00
Speaker
I love that when she says that, it cuts to him in a black cloak, like hunched over. It's like, he couldn't be evil if I love him, dad. It's so weird. Has anyone ever had a conversation on that? Like I've never dated anyone and had to like tell my parents like they're not evil. Don't worry. You know, it's like,
01:44:20
Speaker
that it's just so weird who why is that like I have more of appreciation for what Lucas was doing with the prequels over time but some of the dialogue in this is very Star Wars prequels yeah at least like I don't know and that's why I said this on mic before I understand why people hate Star Wars but this fucking dribble belongs in Star Wars you know
01:44:45
Speaker
If this was, I would 100% like this better if there was aliens, we were in some kind of 50s diners with Dexter Jetster, and it was just some weird George Lucas brain dump, because at least he actually does have a point of view. He's coming around to it in a really unorthodox and
01:45:07
Speaker
weird way that has almost had odds with itself in a lot of, especially the prequel stuff, but like he does have a thing that he is trying to express in those movies. I don't know. Yeah, but Star Wars also has an abundance of Bibble Babble, too. Oh, absolutely. A lot of nonsense. Yeah. And but it it Star Wars is the place for Bibble Babble, I feel like.
01:45:35
Speaker
That's what I said, like in other sci-fi, I'm not getting on the case of like, yeah, what does that thing do? Or how did that happen? Or like, is this really a believable future? A lot of times I don't give a shit because you're telling me like a cool story or like giving me enough other stuff to chew on. And this movie is not giving me any. I'm fucking fucking hungry, man. This movie wasn't giving me fucking little
01:46:00
Speaker
Peanut, peanut kernel, like the kernels at the end of the bucket of popcorn. That's what it gave me. It gave me like a little, they weren't even like fully pop things. And I was just like, is this, I, you don't have popcorn? Yeah. In this movie. Learn how to make some popcorn, Francis.
01:46:18
Speaker
The movie was kind of like the popcorn we had during the movie where the guy just layered the butter lightly at the top and then there's no butter the rest of the way all the way down. If you start going below the surface, not a lot down there. Yeah, there's very little on the top too to begin with.
01:46:38
Speaker
We're talking about the Pop Corps and Megalopolis. We're talking about both. We're talking about that Megalopolis. Megabababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababababab
01:47:08
Speaker
We're pitching a lot of things that are better movies. Yeah, Coppola, if you're listening and we know that you are, take notes. Take some of these notes. When you recut this two more times. Yeah, I edit, you know, I said earlier I edit, so I can help with the next cut, you know, we can come up with something, I think. Yeah, you do your director's cut, then we'll do the redux. You add everything and then we'll take away.
01:47:33
Speaker
We'll find the story here. It's just worse. Just so much worse. Did we end it there? You got any final thoughts on the Meg?
01:47:56
Speaker
I've never seen them. They're they're ridiculous. They're based off books. Actually, it's a book series and they're seeing Megan
01:48:06
Speaker
they should cross over. Megan versus, honestly, it's surprising that the Megan sequel is still, it's like next year or something. Like that movie was so big and buzzy that, and since it's Blumhouse, you would have imagined that they would have been like, sequel later this year. Like the next Megan, it's out now. The sequel tomorrow.
01:48:27
Speaker
Yeah, but they actually are taking their time with it, so I'm like, oh, okay. Are they actually cooking something? We'll see. No, they just moved it out of the way so they can release a whole bunch of horseshit before that comes out, like Five Nights at Freddy's and- The AI House.
Humorous Movie Pitches & Praise for Jackie Brown
01:48:43
Speaker
Afraid, imaginary. They're like, hold on, let's dump a bunch of crap before we actually make something that has a story.
01:48:53
Speaker
Night Swim. What if the pool was spooky? Uh, anyway... I was with ya, I was taking that walk. I was like, huh? I was listening. No, cause normally pools... I've seen Night Swim, but you were selling me on it, you know? No, cause here, hear hear me out, normally pools, they're just regular things that you enjoy, not spooky. What if there was a spooky one?
01:49:20
Speaker
Here's my pitch for a movie, Shark Pool. It's just a fucking regular pool and there's a shark in it and you just gotta deal with it one day. What if it was called Megalopolis because there were megalodons? It's just a big open ocean, there's just sharks there and they're just killing everything. What if this is like a third Meg movie? It's just Meg-3-opolis.
01:49:46
Speaker
They are supposed to get more ridiculous. Megan could be the Meg three. They I'm just what I'm saying. They need to cross over. Mm hmm. I you know, I'm not a diehard fan of the Meg books. I'm sorry. I know. But I do know they eventually incorporate time travel. So what I'm saying is the Meg. Yeah, they go back to prehistoric time through like a wormhole in the Mariana Trench.
01:50:13
Speaker
It's science. And people are saying movies are dead. I know, see? They're doing stuff.
01:50:21
Speaker
Jason Statham and the Meg 2 they're at the bottom lowest point lower than we can actually go in the ocean like you know how the pressure is so great that you would just die and he has to go out there without a suit and they're like okay so you just have to clear all the air from your lungs before you do it so the pressure doesn't kill you and you just see him and he just goes like
01:50:44
Speaker
He like takes a deep breath and like bubbles come out of his nose and you're like, oh, he pushed all the air out of his body. He did it. Who says that Hollywood is creatively bankrupt?
01:50:58
Speaker
I don't. Not when I'm watching The Meg. I mean, if this movie had been The Meg, I'd be coming out hooting and hollering. I'd be like, Coppola's back. He did it. But I don't even know if I trust him with The Next Meg. Honestly, after this, I think we need someone to understand structure and story like Trump.
01:51:26
Speaker
Man Trump could not conceive of a sort It's like it's about a guy who wants to build a thing. I mean he's from real estate. I don't know I think he could conceive of It's also about like a self-conceited guy who's always right like I actually think Trump would probably relate to Megalopolis a lot You'd probably be like that's me. I'm Adam Driver man
01:51:51
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. He should have made a movie about Trump if he wanted to actually take a real shot. I mean, Shadow Nuff says culture for the culture, so... I would watch a Francis Ford Coppola directed Meg 3. Not to circle back around to that, but I was sitting on it for a little bit. I think I would watch it. Would it be good? No, but I think it would be better than this.
01:52:17
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. There's already a foundation set for him. Yeah, I mean, Statham's really the auteur of those movies anyway, so like... Yeah, Statham and the shark. As long as he has a good working relationship with the shark, then I think, um... If him and the Meg fell out, is Statham and the Meg... As long as he doesn't sexually harass that shark.
01:52:38
Speaker
Or Jason Statham. Well, don't hire Coppola then. What do you want? Pick which one you want. Yeah. Good point. I don't know, man. Figure out your life, Francis. Yeah, Frank. Frankie. Get it together. What are you doing? Yeah. Frankie. You used to be beautiful. Your ass used to be beautiful. Sam Jackson from Jackie Brown.
01:53:07
Speaker
Show Jackie Brown. That's like a perfect movie to me. Better movie, Jackie Brown. 10 out of 10 masterpiece, Tarantino's best movie, IMO in my opinion, as the kids say. Subjectively. If anyone argues otherwise they're wrong. That would be objective then. What did I say? Subjective. Fuck.
01:53:35
Speaker
We'll replace it with the right word now. Whichever version of this makes it so that I'm always right and my vision is the true one, like Caesar, that's the version of this podcast you're gonna hear. And my vision for this podcast will come and we will have a conversation about podcast and just talking about podcast. That's utopia.
Listener Engagement & Podcast Promotion
01:54:04
Speaker
Remember to rate us five stars, give us a five-star review, subscribe to the podcast, you got any plugs? Yeah, check out this city I'm building called Megalopolis. Who knows how that'll turn out? We could start playing SimCity, who knows?
01:54:24
Speaker
I can't know that that's you have to pay money now to place it not to put there's in-game Buy in no I can't oh for like the phone one. Yeah, I can't do that I could play it on computer. I actually that'd be fun to go back to Sim City I Miss those kinds of games. I love Sim City
01:54:41
Speaker
Um, but so Doug's building a city, go check it out. Have a conversation about it. We're going to have a dialogue. We gotta have a dialogue about the future. That's what we need to talk about. Are you talking about it? Let's talk about it.
01:54:56
Speaker
Uh, but also you can talk about stuff at the show's Twitter at guys got juice. Uh, and then also my Twitter at Doug or not underscore to, uh, yeah, let's, let's have a conversation. I'm going to have a dialogue. Um, follow us on Instagram at these guys got juice pod. Follow me at letterboxed, uh, at Nicholas Ewers. I almost forgot my fucking name for a second. Um, and we definitely, we had a conversation.
01:55:26
Speaker
we did we did we we did what you told us to do it was like to have a conversation challenge accepted now we're balls in your court frank i'm nick yours i'm gonna talk down for it and where these guys got juice good night good night