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00:00:01
HIGHEST 2 LOWEST
64 Plays6 days ago
Spike Lee's third attempt at remaking a classic..is this finally the good one?? Is Spike a madman or a genius? Are the two mutually exclusive?? Find out right now!
Tony joins us again so you can bet your ass we get political. You can also bet your ass we talk about Ice Spice's ass.
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Transcript
00:00:18
Speaker
that's a great
Filmmakers in the Modern Era
00:00:19
Speaker
point. And I think it will pertain to our overall discussion because I've just been noticing of not just the film we're about to discuss, but then just other just looking at other filmmakers who've been around for a while, like who other who might be in, you know, what but people would call like their late era and like who is like adapting with the times and also experiencing ah willing to acknowledge these things that are are baked into society at this point, like the internet. Because like when I was watching the latest Cronenberg, was like, wow, he really is on the money with like so much that like of and just from when you hear the basic premise, you're like, okay, yeah, it's about a guy who does a weird invention and and then like goes as a rabbit hole of like what what that entails. But it's like, no, it's also dealing with like
00:01:07
Speaker
the you know conspiracies is part of it like you know like he has like an AI girlfriend assistant thing in it and it's like well Cronenberg's like how old is he he's like in his 7 he must be 81 I think 81 okay
00:01:25
Speaker
ah So the fact that a guy like that is willing to engage with so much of the modern world in a way that some other filmmakers who are much younger would would not want to touch that, you know, like like we were talking on Eddington of like, yeah, Ari Aster should be applauded, like that he is willing to even like tackle this stuff.
00:01:44
Speaker
Yeah. it regardless of like how you feel that he handled it, like at least he's like going for it. And i think Spike Lee similarly is like, yes, he is a product of the time that he came up in, but I think he is still paying attention to like what's going on and in ah in a way that other filmmaking contemporaries, i mean, when you were telling me, hyping me about the film, you threw out the comparison of megalopolis of like ah and I I started was definitely picking up on those vibes as the movie went on but because it was interesting that Spike Lee was at the ah when I saw the IMAX screening of megalopolis it was like a cute live Q&A from New York and Spike was there de Niro was there and
00:02:32
Speaker
I think Coppola thinks he is kind of with it, like that he is pushing things in and then like and heat that he's current in a way, but it does it doesn't read in the product that we're receiving and the final, of you know, the final film of like, I think this old guy's two up his own ass, you know, to actually like...
Spike Lee's Relevance and Style
00:02:52
Speaker
get a whiff of like what even is our our current reality. Spike on the other hand, like yes, there's lots of things this movie that are purely there because probably because they amuse him, you know, like like having ah Nicholas Totoro say straight to camera, fuck Boston. Yeah.
00:03:12
Speaker
Like um basically any of the New York sports stuff is pretty much like just it's for him. Oh, and people who are the fans of those teams. But he is still talking shit about Larry Bird.
00:03:24
Speaker
It's like exactly. Like that stuff is it's it is for him. Like you could say it's masturbatory. But he yeah also does have things to reflect and say on the current moment. And I think I think that's.
00:03:38
Speaker
uh, worth discussing, especially in comparison. Like, I think we could talk about the movie on its own merits, but I had just rewatched the original, uh, high and low. And I think there are some interesting diet divergences that like, that are very intentional choices that he's like, not, not, and I'm not just talking about stylistically what Spike does, like, but just in terms of like, uh,
00:04:01
Speaker
who the narrative is centering through throughout the whole thing. Cause it's like the cops kind of take over the whole movie for like, and after the exchange happens in, in high and low.
00:04:13
Speaker
And like it, that there, it's really just like the cat and mouse between them and the kidnapper at that point. And we stay with, with ah Denzel with, with, with, with King, you know, like pretty much all of, of highest to lowest. And I think a lot will, the,
00:04:29
Speaker
the the first conclusion is like, well, yeah, I think that's reflective of how Spike feels about the and NYPD of like, that it's like, there's three detectives assigned to this thing and none of them are, I mean, in their minds, they're taking it seriously, but like, they're not, they're very dismissive of any leads that he brings to them. And, uh, it's not like, and you get the sense that, uh,
00:04:55
Speaker
this is like every cop in Japan is like on this in high and low that they're like like it's like their number one priority is like not just like even once the kids secure like no we're gonna get his money back because that's so the honorable thing to do like we have to do right by him and this guy can't get away with and then he and here it's like yeah look you know, maybe we'll get them.
00:05:19
Speaker
Which feels very real to American policing and the NYPD. mean, it's like Even, and also is there's probably like the class element of like, this is just the chauffeur's kid that's been taken.
00:05:35
Speaker
You know, it's not ah ah a wealthy person's kid. I mean, even, I would imagine with the movie, in terms of like the police response be that different, if it was actually his son, maybe slightly more resources, but like, also he's a black man. Like, does that supersede the class thing too? Like, even if he is an influential person,
00:05:57
Speaker
person that you know like well because uh he brings up the and i hadn't even heard of like the ebony alert thing that he uh that the the mother brings up but like the fact that the police are so dismissive of that of like well it's not a law like that's not really like a thing that we deal with in the state yeah and it's So I think all those those changes are are very intentional. Sorry, i'm I'm jumping all over the place with like combining both movies. But ah i ah overall, what what what were your thoughts on it?
00:06:33
Speaker
Well, yeah, just I want to build off of what you were saying there because you said a lot of great stuff there. And there was... Comparing it to high and low specifically, let's start there, right? ah The thing that's missing from the original movie is race, the component of race, right?
00:06:48
Speaker
and And as you also brought up, ah class, you know? And when it comes to how these things apply in this film, it's just, it's Like, class is what comes first because that's what's on King's mind, right? The Denzel Washington character.
00:07:03
Speaker
But then as he continues throughout the story, he understands his roots. And in certain cases, he understands, like, he's still a black man at heart, right? And a lot of this film is about, like,
00:07:15
Speaker
black art, its proliferation, um ownership of that, right? What you do with it, right? How you wield it, right? And it's a very interesting film to have come out the same summer as Sinners because saw that film. I was just about to say that, yeah, yeah, because that's also about black art and who owns it, what are...
00:07:35
Speaker
the means of owning it and do you sacrifice anything by like doing it at a large scale? I mean, cause in, in, in Spike Lee is, you know, ah at this point, a veteran of the, you know, he's done things for, you know, there's, there's clearly ones that are for him. And then also that he'll, he'll play ball and do something for the studio.
00:07:54
Speaker
i mean, it's still an interesting, it's not like it's an anonymous director for hire when he does that. It's still like a Spike Lee joint. So, but but he he's intimately familiar with this this stuff. The thing, we like, the reason that race is, like, an important thing, obviously, for Spike Lee, beyond the fact that he's just a black man living in America, right?
00:08:12
Speaker
But the thing is, is also, as a filmmaker, he hasn't been afforded, like, the same kind of, like... um like Like, he's a great filmmaker and he's always been considered that, right? But he hasn't been given the same kind of things that a Scorsese or like a, like any of, like a Tarantino. Like, I don't think how much I hated Tarantino when I was watching this movie.
00:08:33
Speaker
Because like, I feel like Tarantino, he got like, you know, hundreds of millions of dollars like into the 2000s and 10s, right? To make whatever he wanted, right? And just like,
00:08:44
Speaker
Spike Lee does not really get that same kind of thing. He has to kind of go off and do his own things here and there. He's got to do NYU film school. He's got to do the advertisements as well. The last time he did a movie over $100 million dollars was Inside Man, right?
00:08:57
Speaker
And the fact that he's not getting like, you know, financiers to make movies on the scale of a megalopolis just from private investors, It tells me everything I need to know, right?
00:09:07
Speaker
this is an author This is an artist who's had to like cut his teeth the entire way through, right? And even when he makes something that's a big whiff, like the sweet flood of Jesus, right? Which is like a really confounding failed remake, right?
00:09:22
Speaker
But you can see what he's doing. He has his integrity the whole way and bringing it back to Sinner's. and When we're talking about like black art and black businesses, right? It's always at, you know, odds and at war with white yeah businesses, right? It's a like there is a system that's built for white wealthy people, right?
00:09:41
Speaker
And when you're a black person who's entering that with wealth or modicum of wealth as well, there's always going to be a level of pushback. Right. And what's interesting is that Lee at the end of his life, I think, ah is showing that he has as well.
00:09:55
Speaker
You know, he's he's maintained some kind of status, but he still hasn't forgotten what the people are saying. He's still tapped in. Right. He's not like ignoring the pleas of the people.
00:10:06
Speaker
And I think that there's some interesting things, especially about like modern day politics that are talked about in this film that show that he's light years beyond as you brought up Coppola,
Critique of Coppola's 'Megalopolis'
00:10:16
Speaker
right? Coppola, the whole thing about Megalopolis, the reason that people say they like that movie is because it's an old man stuck in their ways, right?
00:10:23
Speaker
I don't want to watch that. I don't want to watch like somebody who doesn't listen to other people. That's an uninteresting perspective to I mean, what and it' yeah, it's like i can see in theory, I'm a guy who's all for big swings. and And I do like when an artist or director sticks to their guns creatively But i also it to to what to what end like like there are moments in Megalopolis where you could say like, yeah, he's really going for it stylistically.
00:10:55
Speaker
But that movie at the end of the day is just him like patting himself on the back of like, I'm I'm so guys, I'm really fucking good. like and Like in like the world needs brilliant men like me or will never reach.
00:11:09
Speaker
utopia, but my ah vision of utopia is just a society where they have those ah automatic walkways they have in air. This is a very and boring vision of of a perfect society.
00:11:22
Speaker
I heard someone and argue like, well, you can't even, utopia is so abstract. It's like, you can't even visualize what it's like. Yeah, you can. Like, what are talking about? There's like all genres of sci-fi dedicated to like envisioning what a perfect society could be. So he's just lazy.
00:11:37
Speaker
don't know. Totally. And, you know, it actually speaks to their limitation of their worldview, right? Because it's like, you know, how much money do does America's military, like, how much does America spend on their military every right?
00:11:50
Speaker
I'm sure, like, if they took that budget and they just applied it to healthcare, housing, right? And, you know, um don't know what else you could do that would be, brought like, getting guns off the state. Like, a lot of the problems with that money. Totally. Yeah.
00:12:06
Speaker
Yeah. I'll show you what a utopia looks like. It looks like that, you know? So like whatever Francis Ford Coppola's idea of you know, like everywhere is airport, everything is 60% more trees, you know, everything looks like a bone. There's more modes of transit. that That's the vision of the future.
00:12:23
Speaker
In the future, walkable cities have taken over and they've destroyed cars. It's illegal to own cars now because the walkable cities are. Well, I'm actually pro the elite. Let's get rid of cars thing. Yeah, same here. To restructure society to be carless. That that is that is pretty utopian.
00:12:39
Speaker
But other than that, he's not on to anything. Bro's on to nothing. No, no and and and that's that's where Megalopolis truly fails, because like when it's time for him to like expound upon what his vision is.
00:12:51
Speaker
He has nothing to say. It's just empty platitudes, right? And when you're a filmmaker who's selling the product of your, you know, massive, you know, big swing as like, this is me pouring my heart and soul out. And it's a big question mark, right?
00:13:07
Speaker
I'm like, oh, there' is there anything in your soul then? That's what makes to me yeah like, okay, I'm not seeing anything here. And then you bring on to the real element, the fact that like there was sexual assault on that set, right?
00:13:19
Speaker
Like, what are we doing here by applauding this film in particular, Megalopolis, when the the mission isn't so quite clear and it just turns out that all this really was was just this filmmaker wanting to do another big movie again.
00:13:31
Speaker
And when they had that chance, they just took every that took advantage of everyone that they had at on their disposal. Like, that's not That's not an artist. And he doesn't, that's so interesting. He's like, no, please, I am the Adam Driver character and we're also kind of good. Like, I know there's historical allusions he's doing with the ah storyline where Caesar is, ah you know, ah accused of of violating the Vestal Virgin or whatever, but like, also it is creating it's also coming at the same time of the hidden being his accusation. So I did very, to me, very plainly him trying to litigate that in real time of like, no, these were just haters.
00:14:12
Speaker
Because like i I never read the original script, but friends have told me that like there actually was a version where Caesar was actually guilty of that, of what they were accusing him in it. And that the the film as a whole is a was actually like more critical of that character.
00:14:26
Speaker
Because that would, to me, would be more compelling if the film was like, No, yeah, Caesar's like full of shit. Like he doesn't, he keeps saying all this shit that sounds nice, but he doesn't really have anything of of substance to offer.
00:14:38
Speaker
and That would be a compelling movie to me. But like he doesn't, that he clearly doesn't want to like actually challenge himself in that way. It's why Hyacinth Lois is an interesting movie because like the king character is not presented as the guy who has all the answers. He's very flawed. He's our protagonist.
00:14:54
Speaker
Exactly. And he's he's clearly like a Spike Lee stand in. Right. Where, you know, like he has acquired all of this wealth. He has he has gained this position. And also you can make the argument that he's just Jay-Z and that would be fine because that would be funny just to imagine Jay-Z in this role.
00:15:10
Speaker
um but He's also the Spike Lee stand-in. I think there's also like, i mean, some very clear religious, ah I mean, he's he's King David, but then also they refer to him as God, you know, of like, you know, like you're you're not God anymore or something. So it's like,
00:15:25
Speaker
i there's there's there's a lot he's playing and I don't think that's all just to be as Spike Lee thinks he's God I don't think that's it what he's getting to at there he doesn't think he's God but he's been anointed God that's what the film is ah is like is a talking about society places that mantle upon you ah Exactly. like It's like, well, yes, you can enjoy, reap the benefits of that station, but then what are is the cost of it? And then what do you what what do you respond to that with?
00:15:57
Speaker
So Highest to Lowest is about Jay-Z, right? Megalopolis is about Kanye West. You know, like because Megalopolis is Megalopolis is all about how like somebody just comes in and says, I am the greatest. Right. I got the vision. I've got these things.
00:16:11
Speaker
They have these like half sprung together ideas. Right. And in the end, they're still in the service of the right wing. Right. So ultimately, ah that's what but people are supporting with Megalopolis. Kanye West.
00:16:22
Speaker
A hundred percent. That's wow. i didn't even put that together. Brilliant. Do we even need to talk about Aya Stoloz? I think we saw it. I think we cracked it.
00:16:34
Speaker
We cracked it wild. Get Spike on the phone. We got some last minute rewrites before the movie gets to streaming. Yeah, they do that now. There's DLC for movies, so they can just like patch it.
00:16:45
Speaker
Like, they won't patch for when it reaches streaming. Yeah, by the time people are hearing this, it'll probably... Like, for me, the theaters around me, it's really just at the end of this week, it goes down to like...
00:16:59
Speaker
just like a very fraction of like the kind of more niche theaters will be will be showing it still if you can find you know wherever you are if there is somewhere that's maybe a lot of the way this is really worth seeing on a big screen so like I was I would heartily recommend it I may I'm still gonna rewatch the shit out of it I mean there's images that are still etched in my mind that I wanted to you know, we've we've talked about how we both like to kind of like rewatch the, even if it's just the shitty camera version. I was like, I kind of, I was like looking for it before that. i was like, I want to see some of those shots again.
00:17:35
Speaker
ah theyre like But seeing it on a big screen and with, and ideally with some kind of yeah audience is, is but seeing it with, you know, based on where I live. And when I saw it, got a pretty black audience when I saw it. So that was great. You know, like when the one detective says that she's from Spelman, which is like, I, people in my family who'd gone to, like my grandmother had gone there.
00:17:59
Speaker
So like when they saw, she says, Spelman, black excellent. Someone in the car was like, mm-hmm. Or like, I know that's right. And also, yeah but it's just an entertaining movie. That's the thing about Spike Lee is that even when he has something to say, he knows how to filter it through.
00:18:15
Speaker
i don't i don't think he's like a populist filmmaker in the same way that, let's say, a Steven Spielberg is, but he still wants everybody to be able to sit down and then
Theatrical Releases and Audience Engagement
00:18:24
Speaker
get something. i think Because I think he understands the message is also more, it goes down easier if you if anyone can enjoy the broader package.
00:18:34
Speaker
And totally it also does feel like he does sneak it like it feels like a more conventional crime drama kidnapping movie at the very beginning for like the first act.
00:18:46
Speaker
and And almost like he wants to lull people in of like, OK, it's OK. Denzel's here. And, you know, it's going to be just. you know, there's a kidnapping, you've got to get the bike. And then like, as you go ah go, he's like putting more of his bike-isms in there of like, ah, no, no, see is this this is still me.
00:19:03
Speaker
So I think and that that is very calculated of like, that like he doesn't want of like he's fully himself as a filmmaker but he doesn't also he also doesn't want people to immediately be like be like driven away of like what is you know so and if anything the narrative it's like the actual film like even if he's doing things that are formally boundary pushing the narrative itself is kind of like streamlined compared to like high high and low like we said like the whole investigation aspect is
00:19:35
Speaker
is taken out. Like, there's, like, the whole thing where the cops get into finding, like, the kidnapper's confidants and, like, with the heroin exchange and all that. Although I would have liked to Spike's version of, like, that club scene, like, when when the kidnapper exchange ah at at at the club. And was like, oh, I mean, I just love a good club scene. So, but I feel like Spike's version of that code could have really been so. But but and the movie as it is, like, I get why he makes the changes that he does. it's an actual reinterpretation, right? Like ah we were talking before about, it's, it's like a, it, I don't, yeah I don't know what the original book was, you know, I never read the book. I'm a lawyer, you know, I don't, i don't know the book.
00:20:18
Speaker
Why, why read when movie just as good, right? Come on. Uh, But when it comes to seeing the movie, I wanted to start there because you brought up ah seeing it with your crowd. And I saw it in Toronto and it was like a, you know, mostly white crowd. Right.
00:20:33
Speaker
But I remember because like the two like old white ladies sat right behind me. Right. And they're just like. this is so good turnout. This is so nice to see so many people turned out, you know, and and they were just like happy because it was not like animated. It was not like a like a big budget blockbuster, right?
00:20:50
Speaker
And, ah you know, i saw that at the TIFF Lightbox is the only theater in Toronto that's playing it right now, right? And, you know, Going further than that, right, there are no theaters in the surrounding regions that are playing ah highest to lowest, right? At least from what I've gathered.
00:21:05
Speaker
Nothing at least from a 50-kilometer radius from where I live. This is a Dead Note Washington movie. Why does... why does cause this is an Apple movie. Do they not like money? You're like, don't understand. The thing is, is like a lot of their profits have to be written off is the thing, right? Like a lot of it, they're spending way more money than they have to be getting from the actual subscription, right?
00:21:28
Speaker
I don't know who over there has found in their books that it's cheaper to just, and they'll make more money by just not releasing films in theaters like Spike Lee's newest film.
00:21:39
Speaker
Because what you're doing is you're you're robbing it. That's what this what we're watching happen right now with the release of this film. We're being robbed of a great theatrical experience for everyone. If this thing played on like, I don't know, 1,500 screens in North America, it would have made like $10 million. dollars It would have probably stuck the stung around it stuck around for a bit, right?
00:21:59
Speaker
People like Black Landsman. He's a commercial filmmaker, ultimately. the The thing is, it's like... commercial filmmaker with a... One of the biggest stars, like, like of we we're talking like ah like actual movie stars where it's a dying breed because most of it's IP driven now. like there's There's Tom Cruise and then i think Denzel's not quite in terms like the global reach of a Tom Cruise, but like people like love him. like He's beloved. he He crosses any kind of like a racial barrier, like people will go see him in a movie.
00:22:32
Speaker
oh he's He's like one of the highest box office earners, I'm sure, right? He's just somebody who like everyone loves to see him on screen, right? He brings, he like he's somebody who has no ego.
00:22:42
Speaker
he He delivers exactly what the project needs, right? And he understands that and he treats his art like with high regard, right? And, you know, you're ah we were talking about like commercial, right? And you brought up Steven Spielberg earlier, right?
00:22:55
Speaker
I think that ah Spike Lee is the black Billy Wilder, right? And that's what his films... Good person, yeah, yeah. He makes those like 50s and 60s, even 40s, like, you know, zippy comedies, you know, ah morality tales, romances, right?
00:23:11
Speaker
And they're kind of all mixed into one because they're just that good, right? And Spike's always been obsessed with Billy Wilder and his favorite movies are like The Sweet Smell of Success. And what's that Eddie Griffith one? The Face in the Crowd, right?
00:23:25
Speaker
Like the but those are like his North Stars as a filmmaker. And you can see that across all of his work. And, you know, you compare that to, ah you know, things that are released today, right? If you were to throw on face in the crowd with just any Joe Schmell on the street, you know, you show them that movie, they're going to treat it like it's 12 Angry Men, you know, where they're going to lose their minds when scenes happen, right?
00:23:46
Speaker
Same deal with Beats Metal Success, you know, good movies, they for they they they are not just good because of their historical, and but they're also good because of their impact and their structure and how they handle their stories with integrity.
00:24:00
Speaker
Also Ace in the Hole is another one. Ace in the Hole and of was it Face in the Crowd? I think when went on TCM were like his double. Yeah, that he picks.
00:24:12
Speaker
He loves those kinds of dark, dark noirs like that. And you know what? It's like I've said already, like it's in his films. And what's interesting with Highest to Lowest is like, It's his version of that kind of movie, but it's a lot more optimistic.
00:24:26
Speaker
And you can almost say that about a lot of his films where they are dealing in heavy subject matters, but there's ultimately like a chipper streak to them that kind of carries you through to get to the real like final message, right?
00:24:40
Speaker
That may not be happy. The final message may not be happy, but there's a sense to believe that he enjoys life. And it's just nice to see that enjoyment for life. It's coming from from anyone.
00:24:51
Speaker
A hopeful, earnest place. And you can see it infused into like, there's there's actual joy even when characters in his films are in dire service. Like even in this movie, like ah like Jeffrey Wright and Denzel are kind of playful with each other in moments. Like when they'll do like a little shadow box or something. So something that where they're they're kind of playing with each other in in a moment where it's like another movie would not have, it would just be like plot, plot, plot, plot. We need to even if it's just like for a few sites we don't have time for that those little like character moments and like no he takes the time because he wants them to feel like like like people because people are multifaceted like even in the the darkest of of days like there is still going to be some some levity or light you know so some something in in there and i think he wants to infuse that in his storytelling Totally. And then bringing that back to like the concept of the cops and how they handled those kids, right?
00:25:50
Speaker
Because you brought up Jeffrey Wright's character, right? And Jeffrey Wright, like, The decision to make him a Muslim man, right, is just perfect. You know, the ex-con turned Muslim, you know, it's awesome. Right.
00:26:04
Speaker
And when it comes to like his position in the story, right, how he relates to Denzel Washington, where there's that connection there that goes beyond ah class. Right. ah He's still an employee to King for sure. Right.
00:26:17
Speaker
But yeah there there there is the understanding that they have each other's backs because of their their history together. Right. But what challenges their history together is when the ri real, sorry, the reality of class gets in the way.
00:26:29
Speaker
Right. When his kid is being treated differently than his, but than King's, when they find out that his was actually stolen. And the fact that he has to beg and plead for them to have any kind of like, you know,
00:26:41
Speaker
remorse comparing it to high and low the original again right like the chauffeur guy had the business but was like apologizing to uh to king oh it was like a thing of like i'm sure he's a clever boy he'll find some way to get it like he was like apologizing for even asking him to pay the ransom and stuff and he becomes more active trying to find the canada after he gets the son back but he's like he's he's really deferring to like, he's like, no, I know my
Capitalism and Personal Accountability
00:27:09
Speaker
station. I should, I ah should even ask that of you.
00:27:13
Speaker
And it's a different dynamic because ah yeah I also don't get the sense that they like went way back or anything that this guy was just an employee. And unlike Denzel and Jeffrey Wright, where it's like, no, there's a history there. There's, there's like some, he almost, he like, he's the chauffeur's son is his godson in in highest to lowest.
00:27:33
Speaker
Like, so it's like, that's family. And the fact that it takes him longer to be willing to give the money for that kid's son, for his son, right? The fact that King has that connection and there's more of a fight within him to give that money is crazier, right?
00:27:48
Speaker
Like, the that that speaks so much more to King's character, you know, the fact that he cares so much about the status that he's accrued, that it is getting in the way with how he sees other people. That's why it's more enriching to have King be the lead than the cops, obviously, right? Yeah. Because Well, ah you know, the thing that's interesting about this film is while we've talked about, you know, like ah black business, right? And the idea that he's this hyper capitalist who has this position built over decades of, you know, doing whatever to get to the top, right?
00:28:17
Speaker
I don't think that the film is trying to tell us to have sympathy for the rich ever. I don't think that they're trying to make us see like feel as though rich people have it worse or anything. In fact, it really throws them in the mud ah whenever possible, right?
00:28:29
Speaker
And the fact that there is like a half of the movie, right, is him pretty much just like coming to terms with whether or not he's going to do the right thing. that's That's a more interesting take, at least from that prism, you know, I still think the high and low is a masterpiece, you know? Yeah, it's Curacao.
00:28:47
Speaker
Exactly, you know, I'm not going to sit here and say the highest lowest better, they're two different things, you know? theres They do two different things better than each other, right? But together, they're amazing to kind of consider because they enrich each other, and that's what the best remakes are supposed to do.
00:29:02
Speaker
ah but But with the film itself, with Highest to Lowest, I felt that it really was trying to hearken back to that, like, 50s era of filmmaking, especially in all those wide establishing shots, as well as just, like, most of the shots in this film just playing out in wides and then only cutting into medium shots.
00:29:22
Speaker
That was kind of fucking daring for the modern end film landscape. Also, the score felt like it was evoking those kind of movies. Like, there's there's a There's kind of a like it does get sweeping and energetic when, you know, we get to the exchange or the action secrets. But but it is it's kind of like letting you sit in the melodrama of this, of like that this is this is a morality tale. And like like a lot of those movies that we reference are also morality tales.
00:29:49
Speaker
would OK, so would would you if you're if you're king, are you are you paying say for that kid? Yeah, same same scenario. Oh, totally. You're overextended and, like you ba you like, you barely have any money to your name because of this deal that you're trying to, know, take control of your your business and the art and you're paying it.
00:30:09
Speaker
Here's the deal, right? Think about all of, like, the, you know, rappers who are able to make, like, Get Rich Chris Games, like, Soldier Boy or Ja Rule, right? Like, King's got name recognition, right?
00:30:21
Speaker
So, like, and then the film even talks on that, too, right? Where it's, like, he's going to be fine regardless, right? Like he can do that, you know, that's going to spin into positive PR that allows you to do whatever. So just from that standpoint, you know, of course, no brainer.
00:30:34
Speaker
But then also just like my best friend's kid's missing and I have the chance to stop that, you know, of course I'm going to help them out, you know, that's that's how I feel about it. But but but I think that the The fact that the film raises that question, right? It speaks to our era in an interesting way because we we talked about this on the cloud episode, right? We're in the fuck you get mine era right now, right?
00:30:55
Speaker
And it's been that way for 20 years, right? And this film is a reputation of that. It's like somebody who's like waking up from a coma realizing, oh my God, I've contributed to that for decades and now I need to change my ways before I die. I'm not the only person that matters. Like there's other people in in this world Although as a counterpoint, I do like how Toshiro Mifune in the high and low does seem genuinely fucked by the end. Like, like that, like his possessions are getting auctioned off. Like that. It's like, no, this, he'd made the right decision, but is, well, he will be ruined by this.
00:31:29
Speaker
the The thing is just like, ah you know, the way the high and low presents it, you know, like we're also talking about a film that came out in 1950, right? And the idea of capitalism itself was different back then, right? The idea of like a businessman being more honorable in that time period.
00:31:44
Speaker
would be there, right? So we would have more sympathy for the business guy who has done this, right? An ultra capitalist in 2025 needs something very different, right? So it's like, we that that's that's where the, you know, that's where I'm coming at this, I guess, you know?
00:31:58
Speaker
But I think that both are interesting. I definitely get that. And I think both both films dwell on like ah the public's perception because even though the the context is different, their business is different, you know, the music industry versus choose, you're still selling a product that the public needs to buy.
00:32:15
Speaker
and ah And you yourself are also a product when you become that point. like You're the brand, you are the product. And it's like, what happened how valuable is that social currency? Like, like ah that that kind of idea that he keeps repeating in high school is like, not all money is good money, but also there's something along the lines of like, that his social currency is also like super valuable. Like, they're calling him like the Black Panther. the hood i love all the like, Photoshop headlines. Because it's like,
00:32:47
Speaker
cause it's like Yeah, there are people would have a reaction to this because this would be a big news story. And then that also is going to reflect how people feel about this this business. Like in um high and low, when they force him out of the company after he pays, there's like a boycott of national shoe of there's like, no, like we were not going to buy these shoes now because like that you did them dirty. And and then they're even the company's like offering him the olive branch at the end of like, hey, you um but I mean, you won't have your same position, but we kind of like need you to so we don't take as big a ah PR hit. And he turns them down because of, you know, like it's because of honor.
00:33:27
Speaker
And I think that context is is also ah besides the updating of like the class dynamics and race, like that but pride is also a big ah big part of King's decision process. King and then also the ah jeffrey Jeffrey Wright character because he doesn't want to have to ask, beg his friend to like pay this ransom. like that that's like But also, yeah it's like, sure, he's thinking, should I even?
00:33:57
Speaker
you like Come on, man. like We're basically family. like You should just have have me on this. I was always expecting revealed that like the chauffeur's son was also his son or something or some kind of playfulness with with that.
00:34:13
Speaker
i i like that even I'm jumping around. But then when he when he's confronting i young young felon in in prison at the end, he's like, you could be my dad. and He's like, shit, I might be. was like the character now like, yeah, I was fucked around. Like, i don't know.
00:34:27
Speaker
Like, maybe. but It's probably not a non-zero chance. I don't know how much we want to get into spoilers. ah Should I say what I think? If it's spoiler filled or no?
00:34:40
Speaker
Let's just say starting now we can go full spoilers. Like, yeah. Okay. Alright, let's do it. so So that moment, right? When he's saying like, ah I could have been your dad, right? It's also an allusion to like, this is the world that King created, right?
00:34:54
Speaker
King facilitated the rap game into what happened with young felon right he created such an exclusive power structure that somebody felt that desperate to get his attention that they had to do that right so regardless of these is biological father or not he is his father in that way and that's right created him he created the circumstances in which that he could come about so he like he is still he's he's responsible for this and in a in a way yeah
00:35:25
Speaker
And he likes his music, too. That's the best part, is that he likes his music and he can't admit it. and the And the film doesn't ever make that like a, you know, in your face kind of thing. But he he likes Young Felon. He would have signed Young Felon.
00:35:38
Speaker
He just didn't hear him before. Before he has the best years in the game. Right. And he he already had passed him over. Right. He plays that moment and so well when he's like walking and listening to it before he makes the connection, because he's like Bobbin is he's like he's into it.
00:35:53
Speaker
and And then I think that the when and Spike just beautifully just drops like a young felon music video, it like like basically using like musical rules of like, yeah, this is reality breaking. it But we're in his, we're kind of seeing it in his mind's eye of like what what he's like kind of envisioning like, okay, this artist, like if I sign him, this is what the video would look like and all that. So like his his mind's already going to those places because he recognizes that talent.
00:36:21
Speaker
But it's like, no, this can't, this could never work now. but But it's interesting that in that moment, he is still weighing that. Like, there is ah there is a version of that conversation where you would have signed him, right? But it's in having that conversation. I wasn't sure. He says no, that I'm like, is he going to?
00:36:41
Speaker
Also, what do you think make of the moment of like during that confrontation before i young felons apprehended when he says, just let me die, like when he's holding them off the train and any he like wants to, is it?
00:36:55
Speaker
does he have like a martyr complex in the way of like where he's like, well, the, the street story, like I have this, this, this acclaim. And then if I die from this, like I'll kind of be a legend or is, is there actual, i mean, there are illusions to suicide in the, you know, sometimes, sometimes you just put that in ah in a rap song because it sounds lyrically, it works, but, but in it, suicide is mentioned in trunks like his song. So it's like, it's,
00:37:22
Speaker
is Is that something that's just like he is already in that, in that play? i mean, you have to already be willing to go to dark place to do something as extreme as what he did. So the the fact that it doesn't seem too far removed from like a depressive suicidal state.
00:37:38
Speaker
like i I don't claim to be like a rap expert, right? I'm not going to do that on mic right now, but I will say I know a few things. And what I will say is that I think that Spike Lee is tapped in, in terms of like young thug, uh, XXX Sensacion, specifically within like the SoundCloud, like kind of like lit ladder trap, you know, like suicide boys, all that kind of stuff. Even like, uh,
00:38:00
Speaker
Young Lean, all those people, right? Like he's looking at like how rappers today have to stand out, right? And you have people literally doing like jail time on crazy levels, either like in, you know, ways that are unfair in certain circumstances, you know,
00:38:15
Speaker
understandable in others. But like i brought up the tentation before, right? um I don't think that it's a one-to-one, nor do I think that comparison's being drawn. But there is that similar level of like outsider coming from nothing, darkness, right?
00:38:31
Speaker
ah Doing real criminal activity, right? ultimately getting but too caught up in that, right? and And that moment that you're referring to, right, this idea of like him just being okay with dying, right?
00:38:42
Speaker
A lot of those rappers are in really dire situations, right? And making money to to get out of ah whatever situation they were in, right? That's a savior, and look right? And ah the fact that that's their quick ticket out of there, right,
00:38:55
Speaker
It can warp the mind, right? And that's what Spike Lee is trying to get at there, right? Where it's like, because you can make your quick bag and you don't have to ah come to terms with the reality of the world, right? You have a warped perspective.
00:39:09
Speaker
And in that moment, you know, we have sympathy for young felon because this is all he's ever known. He hasn't made it to that next point to where he could feel vindicated, right? But if he were to make it, he would feel vindicated, right? Right.
00:39:20
Speaker
ah And at the at the end of the day, you know, um he was in art for the wrong reasons in that sense, right? ah But he is a victim of the system.
00:39:30
Speaker
And so while he still did something wrong, it was a system that King helped create as we've established. Yeah, i don't I don't think he's supposed to be totally and unsympathetic. I mean, yeah, what he did was was bad. And he's also not being, like, he he's not ah sorry at all at the at the end. But I think in terms of, like, the circumstances that created him and that this is a systemic thing, ah it reminds me of the, are you familiar with the rapper Mick Jenkins?
00:40:01
Speaker
Mick Jenkins. I've heard them, but I have not listened to them in a while. He's from Chicago, I believe the Hyde Park area, but he has a song called Martyrs and I'm paraphrasing the lyrics, but it's, there's like the hook kind of goes where he's talking about like, I'm, I'll make this money. I'm to fuck this bitch or stuff like that. But then, then he's saying, I'm, I'm, I'm just with my niggas hanging. And then you see imagery of like,
00:40:25
Speaker
you know people being lynched of like that this lifestyle and that pursuit is like suffocating and and killing us like the the it's like it's a trap you know it's like ah the noose is there and we're just you're just tightening it by by pursuing this And in King being in the position that he's in, he now holds the news, right?
00:40:45
Speaker
The best scene in the film, my favorite scene in the film is, uh, well, I guess it's like a couple of scenes, but I'm counting them as one because of what they mean. Right. Um, but, uh, there's the scene where he's in the car driving to work and he asks, uh,
00:40:59
Speaker
Jeffrey Wright to play a theme song, right? And he puts on like some, you know, classic funk music, I think, maybe. ah um And then he gets into the ah lobby, right? And then there's that woman there who wants to perform for him, right?
00:41:12
Speaker
And then that's the song that we hear as he goes into work, right? And the song is all about like, being chosen, right? If you if you could only hear who I am, right? And what's interesting is is King only hears that.
00:41:26
Speaker
He has the best years in the game and later in the so in the movie, we'll see what happens when he watches someone he connects with where he's able to fill out the whole space, right? But at the beginning of the film, he only just sees who's in front of him. He only hears what he hears, right?
00:41:40
Speaker
And that itself is not so impressive to him, right? And that being his theme song is desperately from somebody who is like, on the outskirts who just needs to be accepted, right?
00:41:52
Speaker
That's this theme song. And then the implication is that they don't sign that person who sang him. mean, we don't, we don't see her again. So I assume she wasn't signed, but it's like, yeah, exactly. By reaching this level, he's made his world and his view of it smaller.
00:42:07
Speaker
Like that, that, that he kind of, he kind of needs to have, even though, like you said, he will be fine ultimately, but he at least having the threat of losing everything or losing his place and what he's accomplished to kind of give him that perspective.
00:42:22
Speaker
it's it's It's being close to the edge because the so but that's what his life is missing, right? He has he has not been challenged in decades, right? And this is like a true challenge, a real challenge, not not like, you know, child's game, right?
00:42:37
Speaker
And he needs to step up to it. And the thing that's interesting is that in camp, right, it's the reason why he is the best, right? But he still has to fight a battle within himself to get to that point. And that's what the best movies are about. That's what they do. They show you people change.
00:42:53
Speaker
Right. Like the the hardest things he has to do is come to terms with with the decisions he has to make. The actual like nitty gritty of like, oh, when we need to find young Phelan, it's just Jeffrey Wright putting out word to the streets of like, hey, you know, this guy, like once once he's heard, made the connection of the song, they they put it together like that.
00:43:12
Speaker
I love the confrontation at the studio when they kind of have like the the rap out. So like that's the stuff I'm talking about where he's like stylistically like all the are all bets are off but all'll also narratively makes sense in this moment like these are both you know people from that world so uh even if it's like a little playful for them to be doing this like i buy within the reality of this film that that's that you know they would they would do this um and there's there's so many good shots visually that like convey the the mirroring of that like
00:43:47
Speaker
They are the same, you know, like, like, yes, the circumstances that have birthed young felons, you know, circumstances are, are, are different, but like that in a different world, it could have been different, you know, like that, that he could have, could have been a successful artist that King signed. could have maybe even reached the heights that King did in ah in another, you know, version of, of, of reality.
00:44:11
Speaker
It's like, there's not, it's lot of, it's just love. And not to diminish like his skill to what do he accomplished to get there. But like, that's just like a lot of life is just like, it's just a dice roll. And the people who are on top aren't really there. Like lot of people view reality as like some kind of meritocracy of like, well, those billionaires deserve that because they're, they work so hard. it's like, no, though they did.
00:44:38
Speaker
Yeah. and oh yeah
00:44:45
Speaker
that's what they want you to think that they're like brilliant and like all this work. And again, like not the King does seem generally talented and smart and has like a good ear, but it's like, there's not a lot of people can do that.
00:44:57
Speaker
You know, like a, it's like, it's not, it's not like an exclusive to him that it deservingly, but like only he, he and no one else can rise up with him. And there's also that sense of, i like that you made the JC comparison. Cause like there's the, now this kind of,
00:45:13
Speaker
um I've heard it referred to like black aristocracy of like the ultra wealthy black celebrities of like Jay-Z, Beyonce. And I would say even Obama's in that tier now because totally he's like um a producing mogul and stuff now. And so like not just the president.
00:45:30
Speaker
ah So. Makes movies. Yeah, he makes he makes movies. But then also, what do you lose with that? Because then we kind of saw in this most ah recent election when they tried to deploy him to kind of gin up support for Kamala, that was falling on deaf ears. Like no one wants to, he can you can roll up his sleeves all he wants in front of a crowd now, but people are not going to buy him as like having any kind of like voice or understanding of like what real people are going through.
Political and Social Critiques in Film
00:46:00
Speaker
that's like, no, man, you're up there. Like, you're not, you're not, you're not down here in in the nitty gritty. Like, actually, you like, what the, what the fly of fuck are you here, like, preaching down to me? I'm so glad we're on this topic because it's something that, you know, like, it's very, like, plainly obvious. Yeah.
00:46:15
Speaker
you know, cringe, you know, Canadian looking on the outside end. But at the same time, like Barack Obama is a massive figure, right? And he changed a lot of American politics for the better in 2008 and then for the worst in 2012 onward, right?
00:46:30
Speaker
And the reason was, was because he just upheld the status quo, right? And so what this film is dealing with and reckoning with is like, What happens when you spend decades upholding the status quo for yourself to be enriched, right?
00:46:42
Speaker
But you recognize that the status quo is only built to help you, the rich person, and not to everyone else around you, right? And this film makes that text, right? I think it's so interesting that, um you know,
00:46:55
Speaker
ah Young Felon and King, they relate to each other better than King and his own son. You know, they're able to see each other more as equals. Right. And the reason for that is because of like the arguments between reality and the cyberspace between his son, especially in that scene where you literally get the Kamala Harris poster on the wall.
00:47:16
Speaker
on the side of the screen with Denzel Washington as the sun is fighting back, right? To me, what that is telling me is, while I still believe that ah Spike Lee is a neoliberal, you know? Yeah, sure. i believe I believe that he is licking his wounds right now.
00:47:31
Speaker
I believe that he feels like he bet on the wrong horses. I feel like he's like, I can't believe, you know, we gave this so much support to the Barack Obamas, the Bidens, ah clinton the Clintons, the Harris's, right?
00:47:44
Speaker
When it could have been the Mondani's, right? And now you see Lee out there right It's like, what did we gain by spelling out? Like, we still lost and in the end. So it's... it it does it never It never really pans out to even like maybe sometimes there can be some kind of short but term victory, but overall like there never, once you cross that threshold of selling out your values, then it's kind of like you've no one's going to take you seriously on, on either level because it's like, that's the whole, the whole playbook of like when Democrats and Kamala were like trying to do red baiting, like, Oh, like, Oh, can we get the non Trump Republicans or these moderates of like, well,
00:48:25
Speaker
then it just makes it look like you don't believe any in anything really that you're like willing to like, like engage. And you're just giving more credence to these like right ah wing positions, especially like when you start using their parlance and like saying like legal aliens and stuff like that, instead of just saying like non-documented and stuff. But, but it,
00:48:45
Speaker
Like, one, you're losing credence with your base, then you're also not going to get those Republican votes because they don't. They're like, no, I don't buy what you're saying. Why would I get the diet version when the full Coke version exists, right? That's what Trump is, right? If he's saying he's going to get all the illegals out, you know, you're not going to take Kamala Harris who's saying that she'll get the illegals out, but you're thinking like she'll only get 50% of them out.
00:49:08
Speaker
And she's going to do it locally. He's going to get them all out. Yeah, exactly, right? You don't want the fucking woke person in charge taking care of deportations, you know? and and on that note, right, like,
00:49:21
Speaker
that's that's where the fault is of the Democratic Party. And that's what this the film is reckoning with, is that decades of, you know, telling people this is good enough, you know, this is the way it needs to be, right?
00:49:32
Speaker
has It hasn't worked. And with Kamala's case, you know, where she was attacking the left kind of, you know, saying like, ah we got to be more embracive of the right wing voices, right? The reality is, is the majority of people feel Like the majority people, if you were to just like do, ah you know, ah census, right, you would probably find that most people are like left wing progressives, right?
00:49:54
Speaker
Just from an ideological standpoint. Universal health care is more popular than Apple Pie. I saw that stat in terms of like people that are actually for that. But it it's also comes down to messaging and how you package things. And like Democrats are really poor, like presenting things that are popular and good ideas as good things.
00:50:12
Speaker
So then then conservatives get to control the narrative of like, well, no, this ad if everyone had health care. But there's no way to make that aid.
00:50:24
Speaker
You just have to do it through like you know branding and lying. You have to say like somehow like a Mexican family getting health care is taking away money from your dinner table. and Yeah, they're not paying taxes in the... You want them to to go you able to get health care? Huh?
00:50:39
Speaker
yeah Everyone health care? Even Osama bin Laden? You love Mexicans more than your own family? And then, like, all of a sudden, it becomes a racialized thing, right? All of a sudden, like, the state is actively doing, like, white supremacy.
00:50:52
Speaker
I feel as though, like... the whole like Kamala Harris thing, it's representative of this ideology that people can defeat the system from the inside, right? And the reality is is you can't, is it doesn't happen like that. The only way that that happens like that is if there's a revolution, you know?
00:51:10
Speaker
And how often are you seeing revolutions happening at corporations and ah in in countries, you know? And And Spike's even grappled with that idea in other movies, too. Like Black Klansman, a lot of people, but I saw lot of people walk away from that saying, like, I do agree with you that he ultimately probably is a neoliberal.
00:51:26
Speaker
But I think there's a misread of that movie where they're saying of like, oh, you just get these bad apples out and then it's fine. Because the ending of that movie is like he's continually having this debate with his more radical a girlfriend about like if that kind of like change from within is possible and then the actual end you know like yes do you get the like the audience pleasing ending where they like they take care of the white supremacist the bad cop is is is hauled off but then when he's when he's at the very end when they're still having this debate of whether this change is possible you get the the knock on the door and then it's like the future coming to them like you see like i was like
00:52:05
Speaker
the then current things of like what rise of white supremacy and it's like yeah is if that was us if this kind of thing was able to be accomplished from within the inside we probably would have seen some things or some so something result of that by now but like it's not like people have not been trying like there have been people who try it but it's like if it's a systemic thing they're only they're gonna hit a wall like because that's it's the system People, like, especially in America, think that, like, you know, ah we only need, like, X amount of X minority in the room, and then this problem will be changed, right?
00:52:38
Speaker
But the problem is they're people first. They're not just their identity, and they're still corruptible in the same ways. You know, financial incentive, the idea of breaking out of a class, that does a lot to a person, right?
00:52:49
Speaker
And whiteness is not just something that is racial. It's also something that's financial, right? And what ultimately comes down to is being true to where you came from. Right. And I'm not even talking about that from a racial standpoint. I'm just talking about like, you know, if you are a poor person and you you get to a position of of power and then you just keep on making concessions for the rich and powerful, you have forgotten where you've come from. You are now an an extension of that same system of power.
00:53:14
Speaker
mean, AOC was a bartender and she ran um so much of her brand was that I'm, you know, I'm going to be that hard fighting socialist who puts down my foot. ah you know, like, and they're like, the squad, ah, finally some progressives who are gonna, but it, literally everything she's all pretty much ever done is, like, give concessions to, you know, the the the Democratic leadership. And it's like, well, how much of that is like some people are like, well, it's strategic. You have to play ball in order to get the stuff through. But it's like, if you're only making concessions, then what what is the actual progress that like what what what do you gain from it?
00:53:51
Speaker
AOC just went on tour with Bernie Sanders for this like stop, you know, what is it? The oligarchy tour, right? And then stop there right like just Yeah, actually, you know you know, actually, it's due tomorrow, actually. Sorry, I got the day wrong. Tomorrow, it's totally gone, guys.
00:54:08
Speaker
It's over. When you wake up, look outside, no more allegarchy. It's not going to be there. There's something different out here. the sun's just a little brighter, that you know
00:54:21
Speaker
No, but you're you're on the money, right? Where it's like ah there was recently, sorry, just to finish off my point, you did that all quirky tour with Bernie Sanders. do You know, she has all this progressive motion, but just like within the past couple of weeks, Gavin Newsom has more popular popularity than her.
00:54:38
Speaker
ah Why is that? is because like she doesn't have like she's not doing anything materially. Right. Like she is saying that she cares about these things. And then she votes for funding Israeli arms.
00:54:50
Speaker
Right. Which is like to the right of Marjorie Taylor Greene now, which is insane. You know, the fact that she is now to the right of Marjorie Taylor. And then she'll go on blue sky and argue with leftists who like call her out.
00:55:04
Speaker
Like, well, why? Why? Why are you mad at them? like they're not They're just for noticing a thing you did. like you should I think you should be maybe looking inward and maybe trying to figure out, is there some what can you do from your current position instead of just doing this all out?
00:55:23
Speaker
know. It reminds me a lot of ContraPoints. Did you see everything that happened with her? I know she's deactivated. I tried not pay too much attention to like those those kind of political influence.
00:55:37
Speaker
So we might summarize for for you what what happened. She like put out this statement on Reddit where she said like leftists were like not helping the Gaza conflict because they were sharing like the atrocities.
00:55:53
Speaker
Right. She was literally saying like if you share atrocities, you're actually like doing something wrong for the movement. Right. So essentially she was. You're helping the. I don't know. Exactly. Yeah.
00:56:06
Speaker
What does that mean? Yeah, you're an idiot. You're just mad that other people are talking about something bad that's happening, right? You're too cowardly to speak up yourself. Exactly. and and And the reason that we're bringing this up in the high slows conversation, people, is because this is what happens if King did not pay for the ransom.
00:56:24
Speaker
This is what people do all the time, right? This is not like some unimaginable cruelty that would have happened if King didn't pay for the son. He would have, you know, for Jeffrey Wright's son, he would have gotten away with that no problem, right?
00:56:37
Speaker
Like, people would have forgotten about that, right? And that's what happens with a lot of these figures. He said, like, oh, the news moves so quickly in terms of like, the discourse cycle. Like, there'll be some other thing.
00:56:48
Speaker
And it's, yes, like, well, overall, there might be a ding to the brand, but that could be temporary. i mean... Remember when we were all supposed to be boycotting McDonald's? I don't think that took, you know, like I think ah McDonald's is doing fine.
00:57:05
Speaker
Well, well, I'm a Wendy's guy. I go to Wendy's. I go to Burger King, you know, not gonna get the shamrock shake there, though. um ah You know what it is? I'll break BDS for McRib. That's what I'll do. yeah you know You're not getting that anywhere else.
00:57:20
Speaker
The barbecue sandwich. It's probably not for a real animal. Nowhere else you get mad. The only place you can find that sandwich is going to like a high school during a lunch, you know, and I'm not going to walk into a high school lunch and order from them.
00:57:34
Speaker
I've tried it. They get mad. It's your all pass. so Here's my driver's license. I used to go here. What? I can't still come here for lunch? God forbid a guy get nostalgic.
00:57:46
Speaker
Where'd you get that pipe again? You told me before. Oh, I just got it from like a dispensary. Okay. It's called like the Nova plus or something. Nova. Nova Pro.
00:57:56
Speaker
Hell yeah. Sorry, folks.
Cinematic Techniques and Emotional Engagement
00:57:58
Speaker
Smoking is bad. um When it comes to... ah Spike Lee's oeuvre, right? i I feel like ah there's been talk often about, like, stacking them up and stuff.
00:58:08
Speaker
And I think what's interesting about his films is that, like, they're just always varying degrees of successful, it's except for, like, the real stinkers, right? I feel like even when his films don't fully come together, there's still a complete ideology.
00:58:21
Speaker
And that's what I admire about him as a filmmaker, right? um And I think that highest to lowest, when you look at it in the context of the rest of his films, I think it's, like, saying something the loudest not allowed us actually I should take that back there's more than say the loudest but yeah fucking Nelson Mandela like at the end of the film talking directly to camera it's pretty obvious you know but at the same time you know it really feels like what he's saying on this outing is really important you know it feels like yeah like Chirac was important for him but like that was you know
00:58:55
Speaker
not as on the same level, you know, it it feels like he's really trying to reach out. and And I feel like he's specifically talking to like young black artists, like to like have control over what they do to have integrity and what they make.
00:59:08
Speaker
Right. And that extends to the business acumen of it all. Right. That's when you get into the king element of it. Right. But i the, the, the The world and how it treats these two young kids, you know, that's more so just to put onto being black and moving through the world, even in the current circumstance where even though there's so much progress that's been made, the same villains of yesteryear exist and persist over time.
00:59:34
Speaker
Yeah, it's true. And but then also him trying to reckon with of like, he's acknowledging that it's all kind of a trap, right? Because, uh, the, you know, you have yeah your young felons who are trying to hustle through music on their way out.
00:59:51
Speaker
I mean, King's kid and the chauffeur's kid, they're, they're, uh, you know, born into relative privilege and, you know, they're being trained by a professional coach for, you know, the like basketball prodigies. But that's also been historically seen, you know, as a way out. It's like those those are the paths of of available.
01:00:11
Speaker
And it's like, ah can we break out of that cycle? Is it is there something within those systems that we can do to I don't know, alleviate any of that. I think i think he's grappling with all that.
01:00:24
Speaker
And then also the fact that the exchange happens during, when when was the film like actually made? Because I know, you know, sometimes it's like a year beforehand and then you have all the post-production. I was just thinking because of the Puerto Rican parade, is there any chance that that happened? They filmed that at the real parade.
01:00:44
Speaker
They filmed that at the real parade, yeah. at the real parade, but I was just like, when, uh, so would that have been after there was that whole, but ah who was the fucking comedian who was like opening for Trump and called Puerto Rico, like a garbage, uh, 20 inch clip. Oh, and yeah. yeah So, so it almost, it almost felt like he was responding to that of like, he wanted to celebrate Puerto Rican culture specifically of like, no, look, this is electric and beautiful and,
01:01:14
Speaker
ah i was I mean, like that could have just been a coincidence that lines up to feeling like a response to that, even if it's not in like mapped out that way.
01:01:25
Speaker
And then also an excuse to you know get Rosie Perez back in there. Ramos is playing himself, but he has he been in like a Spike Lee movie? ah Who? Sorry?
01:01:35
Speaker
Anthony Ramos from... Yeah, I think so, but I wouldn't be surprised if he shows up in another one. It's not himself. He's a great actor.
01:01:45
Speaker
I was happy to see him pop up and it felt like he was just a part of that scenario. Right. um But like the the because that sequence is just talking about like the multicultural nature of New York itself. Right. The melting pot, as they say.
01:01:59
Speaker
Right. And ah when Spike is able to just like let his films convey that, you know, not just in the New York context, you know, just in any sense. Right. that The showing America is a collection of these racial identities that come together. They clash, even right?
01:02:15
Speaker
ah That's where you get a lot more honest filmmaking than it most of his contemporaries, right? Like, has Scarsese ever done a scene where it was about the complexities of, like, you know, a white guy, an Asian guy, and a black person?
01:02:28
Speaker
I don't think so, right? Most of them don't touch that. You know, and they shouldn't, you know, because they they lack the vocabulary for that. Right. But because Spike is so adept to the these things from the nature of his upbringing to his experience in making films, you get a lot more rich commentary that you just don't get from a lot of filmmakers.
01:02:48
Speaker
Yeah, I agree. And I think it's also, it almost feels like something's implicitly being said, because like we said, a high and low delves so much more on the logistics of how the kidnapper is able to ah pull all this off.
01:03:01
Speaker
We don't actually know anything about yeah ah young felon's confidant, because he doesn't make this, the the drop, of you know, there's like several motorcycles and other people, someone on the train pulls the emergency stuff.
01:03:12
Speaker
So it's like, it's almost like some kind of implicit street solidarity that's kind of implied of like, uh, uh, cause he talks about that, like how passionate people are for him already. And then we see that when, when he's, when he's apprehended, when he's arrested all the people at the, at the courthouse, but like almost it like, but it almost feels like so some, some, like,
01:03:34
Speaker
During this huge ce cultural celebration, we're also seeing some kind of like class solidarity of people in it who like we don't even know explicitly if they've been promised a cut of this ransom. But it's almost like that they're just in it for like, oh, yeah, fuck this. Hey, you know, it's like, why?
01:03:51
Speaker
Why shouldn't we team up to take him down? then Well, I think that it's interesting in the context of like young felons ah notoriety. Right. I think I don't think his size matters for the weight of his audience. Right.
01:04:05
Speaker
As you alluded to already, he has people in like his neighborhood who listen his music all the time. Right. You have people who are big fans in just a personal level. Right. But then born from that, like going further from that, he already has like a Apple Music account.
01:04:19
Speaker
You know, he already has put his stuff out there. And the nature of people who are fans. now means something different to what a fan meant previously, right? And also ah the context in which people have fans, right?
01:04:32
Speaker
So somebody who has like, in but in Young Felon's case, like let's imagine, right, he's he's probably got anywhere between like a thousand like 50,000, you know, hardcore fans.
01:04:42
Speaker
And 50,000 is like really overshooting it, right? But I'm just saying like in general, right, he's got a pocket of 1,000 to 50,000, right? Having and an audience that's that large that is so dedicated, right, can be mobilized more readily than somebody who has a million so followers, right?
01:05:00
Speaker
But they don't like engage with them as much, right? So I think that the what that's commenting on by having Young Felon have like this essentially like syndicate that is able to work with them is that You know, his success, his perceived success is the success of the other people who listen to his music.
01:05:16
Speaker
Right. And it's it's them buying into him as if they're going to get out of the hood by doing this as well. Right. But they won't. Right. It's just, again, uplifting him. And much similarly to King's perspective. Right. I'm sure there's a bunch of people that he could have brought up in his life as he got to that position.
01:05:31
Speaker
Right. But we only see him with like five people. Right. And then it also speaks to that. You said how the nature of fandom is so different now. There's almost like a i mean, sometimes it feels like the way people define themselves so much aggressive, so aggressively by things that they consume and are are fans of that it's It's like more, even more extreme than like sports fandom, but it's almost like there's like a religious component to it, you know, like of like how people feel like that, that, that is their God. And like King, like they're using that language and describing King, like that's kind of how young felon viewed King.
01:06:07
Speaker
But then now young felon is at a point where there's people who look at up at him at in that level of like right you know like if young felon gets up high enough and wouldn't there just be another person who would want to take something from him out resentment of like oh you didn't you ignored me you know Well, it's, it's surf them, right? It literally is like, King is the King, right? And these are his peasants, right?
01:06:31
Speaker
And what's a peasant to do to get rid of the King, right? They gotta fucking overthrow them. They gotta like, you know, rally up the people. And sometimes in doing so, they've got to like create a fucking cult. They gotta like, you know, create like a group of people who are equally as ill-informed or, you know, lesser, you know, the try to do something, it's in pursuit of one person's selfish interests, ultimately, right?
01:06:55
Speaker
Like, people, we're at this point, you know, where people, they're they're having struggles with living, getting by and all that, right? And they can only put their faith into somebody who has more emotion than them, who represents their values, right?
01:07:09
Speaker
And I don't know what Young Felon's rapping about on all the rest of his songs, right? But i imagine that it's speaking to somebody, you know, this idea of, you know, who's moving through the world, selling money, ah selling drugs, doing murders.
01:07:25
Speaker
Does Young Felon do those things? He's gone to jail. We don't really know for what, but who knows if he's actually doing those things. Right. I think it it because it does. ah as far as we know, the kidnapper in high and low, like he's he's killed people, you know, like that that that that he has like a body count, like he killed the the heroin addicts that he was he was using. And ah we don't see like no one dies in this. Right.
01:07:51
Speaker
No, I don't think so. I mean, Jeffrey Wright gets shot in the eye or he gets the glass in his eye. But like, yeah, no one, no one actually dies. So, yeah, for all we know, young felon could serve time for just like possession or some kind of dumb trumped up charge. Like and then, yeah, that experience does harden someone that they're then willing to do like more extreme things. But like we don't we don't know like what he's actually, you know.
01:08:16
Speaker
has done and in a criminal capacity outside of this. You know what I want to say? um want to say big up to A$AP Rocky because I feel like he is just like totally slept on in every regard, you know, just from like an acting perspective, from ah from a musician standpoint. Like he's he's put out great music for a long time.
01:08:34
Speaker
He starred in things and he's acted really well in other films and he's coming out with more films soon. Like he's going to be in that Rose Byrne, Conan O'Brien film. Yeah, they had the trailer for that before he...
01:08:47
Speaker
Yeah, he was great in I actually only am surface level familiar with with his movie. I'm almost like more familiar with him as an actor at at this point. But like i um when the time when he was kind of blowing up, I was getting into Aesop Rock, the Dwarf rapper.
01:09:08
Speaker
And then would I almost like kind of resented the Aesop Rock because people would like assume that's what I was saying. You mean like Aesop Rock? I'm like, no. This is different. Like the fables, Aesop's fables. Oh, you mean Aesop's fables?
01:09:21
Speaker
Not who I mean either. no but I really and enjoyed him in this. Like, their scenes together, like, I mean, those really are the, for me, those the standouts. ah be Besides the, you know, like I said, like the money exchange or like all the stylistic flexes that Spike's making. Like, they when Denzel and him are in a scene together, I'm glued to the screen. It's electrics.
01:09:46
Speaker
One thing I wanted to talk about as well with this movie was how they mix formats. you You catch, like, especially in that subway sequence, how they just do a full transition to 16 millimeter film at one point.
01:09:58
Speaker
And yeah, it's got like digital, it's got 16 millimeter, it's got eight millimeter. And it's just like cutting between all of them so seamlessly. and And that's why I've always loved what Spike Lee is, that he's just had an appreciation for all formats of film. Like, he's done films on digital video.
01:10:13
Speaker
He's done films, like, on 35, 16, 8, as we've already said. And now we're seeing them all kind of come together in this, like, hodgepodge in an interesting way that means something different for this film.
01:10:24
Speaker
Like, high and low, it's just black and white, and you've got the pink cloud, right? For this, it's like, you've got those 8mm and those 16mm flares, right? And every time that it happens, it feels just as drastic.
01:10:35
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. There's just something very satisfying. Well, it was satisfying, but then I was also like, wait, am I seeing like grain? I didn't know this was shot because I didn't like do any research beforehand of like what how he he shot it. So like to see it go back and forth. I was like, shit, I wasn't expecting him to be be playing with it like that. But yeah, that that's always fun to see.
01:10:56
Speaker
And just... playing with form in ways that I've served the, the, what he's trying to do creatively, but then also just look cool not to keep dump, dump it on megalopolis, but I feel like all the form boundary pushing stuff. Coppola was doing that.
01:11:14
Speaker
mean, what's even the coolest looking thing in that movie. This is a hook to me. It looks pretty average. Yeah. It looks like crap. The whole movie looks like shit. The movie is shit. Fuck you, Francis Ford Coppola.
01:11:26
Speaker
but The only scene in that film that looks good is when he's talking to the love interest and it's those beams that are being held up in the clouds, you know? I like them that space. Yeah, like ah that looks cool. And now remembering also when...
01:11:43
Speaker
headlights were falling like you see like some shadows like they're kind of projected on the sides of buildings and ah that's true that was good it looked it looked all right but also but bad movie those but those saw those shots like are hearkening to some kind of metaphor right and the rest of the movie is devoid of that right it's so just text it's not subtext right and and i i feel like in highest to lowest while it's a you know I wouldn't say that you're getting a lot of like metaphor in the frame often, you know, like you're not getting like a lot of like text in it to like, it's not like Eikli's particularly subtle when you, he'll be aggressively on subtle when he wants to be because he does want you to be able to follow him on it. and He doesn't want it to be like too obtuse or he's like, no, you know, this is this is what we're talking about.
01:12:33
Speaker
it's it's It shows like a ah like ah a confidence in the material almost, right? Because like in the comp and like and the capturing of it, right? He's not doing like, you know, crazy zoom-ins. He's not like, you know, storyboarding these scenes out like crazy.
01:12:48
Speaker
He's filming this like it's something from the 50s, you know? a couple of wide shots, a couple of medium shots. That's it. He's relying on the blocking of the characters. He's relying on the performance from the actors and the script itself. Just to carry these scenes.
01:13:04
Speaker
That's what movies are all about. You don't need to do any of the extra shit, really. When all of the ah core materials are really strong, right, that's when a master filmmaker can really flourish.
01:13:15
Speaker
All of the stylistic tidbits are the garnish, right? And that's why people, you know, sometimes they get lost in that when they're watching film. They think that the garnish is the text. Sometimes they can make the garnish the text, you know. but Yeah, it can be really delicious garnish, but it I feel like you do need some kind of foundation there. Exactly. you know what? You brought him up earlier. Cronenberg does the exact same thing.
01:13:36
Speaker
The, you know, the shroud isn't made like it's a fucking Tarantino movie, right? It's very like shot reverse shot, right? I know. But it's, it's the ideas that come with it that let those images just s sink in your mind so well.
01:13:48
Speaker
That's what makes a well shot movie. That's what makes a resonant film. you was just yeah There's a confidence in the material. You're letting it play out. And you feel that throughout everything in highest to lowest. It never feels like it's somebody second guessing themselves.
01:14:00
Speaker
It feels like everything was planned out ahead of time in such a concise way without it feeling inhuman, which is what makes that's where that distinction with Megalopolis comes. Yeah, the emotion is readily apparent. Like you said, like this is clearly something that he's passionate about and he wants you to be able to share in the in that passion. So I feel like that kind of earnest, invitational energy of like, no, let's celebrate in this. Well, maybe we not celebrate because he's also dealing with heavy, but he's saying like, no, like we can explore this together.
01:14:30
Speaker
like of like this yeah Like, come along for the ride. And
01:14:34
Speaker
and and like ah ah I just find that like, ah but especially when it gets past that subway point, there's the propulsive narrative element that's brought to it because it becomes a chase movie, right? Before then, it was a lot of stewing, right? I really like the stewing. I've heard a lot of people compare, you know, I've had some issues with the term late period style, because I feel like some people, they kind of throw it willy-nilly, right?
01:15:03
Speaker
I don't really think that Spike Lee is exhibiting late period style in this film.
Denzel Washington's Transformative Roles
01:15:08
Speaker
I feel like his finger is still on the pulse. It feels in line with what he's been doing. So because yeah it's it's also hard to define for some filmmakers who I feel like have been in.
01:15:20
Speaker
It's like, well, has Clint Eastwood been in his late period style since like the 90s then? Like, like what this is when do we when do we start counting that? I feel like people just kind of use late period style as a way to describe awkward scenes.
01:15:34
Speaker
Right. They're just like, oh, the scene was awkward. It's because they're an old man. Right. and Yeah. That's a little reductive. Right. I think that especially in highest to lowest, there are some awkward scenes, but they're often done so for the purpose of comedy or for the purpose of just like letting something play out.
01:15:50
Speaker
Right. I'm okay with that. There's an integrity that comes with that. It's just an approach to storytelling that's different from other people's, right? And it's something that would have been done in previous generations, right? But I don't think that that is necessary late period style.
01:16:05
Speaker
To me, that just indicates a filmmaker who's getting back to the roots, which Spike Lee is clearly doing here. And also, like, ah Denzel, we shouldn't be discrediting Denzel's, you know, take on this, right? Because I feel like ah so much of his performance in this movie is him, like, showing how much of an old man he is, like, you know, not caring how he's presented in that way.
01:16:28
Speaker
And then he transforms into the younger version of himself. And when you see that transformation, like, happen in real time, like, like it it actually takes, like, 45 minutes for him to do the classic Denzel walk in this movie, which is like crazy to me.
01:16:44
Speaker
Right. So like, it's it's clearly a conscious choice where they're they're trying to play off, you know, this guy's out of step a bit. But Denzel himself, you relating to these arguments of, you know, politics, right?
01:16:56
Speaker
I saw some people online calling him a conservative and a Trump supporter, and I decided to look into it myself, right? I think that account was like a Trump um Trump or account that was just like and claiming others.
01:17:08
Speaker
Yeah. feel Like, yeah, these guys are so are conservative, too. I looked into it. Right. And and i actually, i the one I saw may have been different from you. I saw somebody who was like a film Twitter poster post this as like a this is my favorite Republican. And it's Denzel Washington.
01:17:23
Speaker
and I wasn't sure if they were making fun of of that post that I was referencing because like I feel like and i it got debunked pretty quickly of like people being like, no, like we could see who he's giving money to. Like he's not Republican.
01:17:36
Speaker
But I wanted to point this out specifically. Right. He voted for Hillary Clinton, obviously, you know, best of the two options, I guess, you know. didn't it He didn't vote for Kamala.
01:17:48
Speaker
yeah He just didn't vote in the last election. You know, I think that's really interesting. Right. Especially with what we've already talked about, you know, with these, ah you know, Spike Lee specifically, who's coming to terms with that.
01:18:00
Speaker
Right. If Denzel was there before Spike. Right. And then there's that like battle within them both as people, right? Where they're they're kind of coming terms of that. and it seems like Denzel got to that point a bit earlier than Spike did, right?
01:18:14
Speaker
Yeah, like how far, how much am I willing to concede on this? And that just doesn't, a lot of people made made that calculation. calculation Like, well, yeah, is it worth it? Especially if,
01:18:28
Speaker
ends up losing any, because it's like, okay, you still have your values and go for the lesser of two evils or whatever, but then it's like, well, what if you won? It's like, what's the difference between the two, right? it's that That's what the reality is, right? It's the whole problem that's at the core of this film, right? It's like you can't truly change a system from the inside,
Moral Choices and Societal Issues
01:18:50
Speaker
right?
01:18:50
Speaker
You have to build a new system. And that's what was happening there, right, is you know, the lesser of two evils is still an evil, right? The war in Gaza, not the war in Gaza, what am I saying? was just fucking saying like CNN, genocide in Gaza.
01:19:06
Speaker
Yeah. It's, is ah what, like, that is the thing that's the marker and the delineation and change for a lot of people. That's going to be the thing that, like, shows how ah willing you are to listen to the values of people, not just the people, but all people, right?
01:19:23
Speaker
And consider them as actual people, not just as an abstract or like political, like, you know, object of like, yes, this this is the politically feasible thing to do. It's like, ah you can't keep using that excuse when you're this far into like a genocide of like, it's like, okay, so like,
01:19:43
Speaker
what what what what's the play there? You know, like, what what are but but what's your endgame there? Like, ah we we're just gonna some weapons little longer and then then then we'll do what's right.
01:19:56
Speaker
Don't worry, they're only defensive weapons. No offensive weapons. There's a distinct difference between the two. um yeah I wanted to bring this. Sorry. ru but No, I was just of laughing at how absurd that that is. But people actually talk in that way. So it's not even actually fun.
01:20:14
Speaker
No, it's depressing. ah Jeffrey Wright's character. He's a Muslim, right? He's Muslim. He's he's a guy of faith, right? That's not a mistake, right? Because we're watching this film 20 years removed from 9-11 pretty much, right? In New York, right?
01:20:29
Speaker
That's an added layer to... like how he's treated with those cops, right? America is massively against Islam, you know, massively against the Muslim community, right?
01:20:40
Speaker
It's like normal to make fun of people who are ah Muslim there, you know? And so i think that that's baked into the core of the film, especially with Jeffrey Wright's character going through that with his son begging for... ah Denzel's character to care about him, to see him as an equal in that way.
01:21:00
Speaker
And the whole film is the struggle it's for him to get to that point. I'm not making like the Israel-Palestine connection there. What I'm making the connection is is that he yeah like there is a call out there that there is a mistreatment of people who are seen as different, right?
01:21:14
Speaker
There's a mistreatment of people that, ah especially in America, aren't afforded the same values and rights as other people. And That's what is' showing there, which if you're right from his class, from his religion and from his race, of course.
01:21:27
Speaker
Yeah. And like you said, there's like tears to that other end because it's like not just like like, oh, he's Muslim, but then also you're a black Muslim and also you're not, you know, you're the half of a lower class status than then. So it's like you you're a con.
01:21:43
Speaker
You're on probation. Right. you're We're not giving you the same kind of leeway that we're we're going to give Denzel. But ultimately, they're the ones who have to ah solve this for themselves because the system is not going to to help you. I mean, that was the biggest laugh in my audience when when he's like, what is that there? It's insurance. This is Jake from State Fox.
01:22:07
Speaker
and Like when he when he has the and when they're going to, ah we we haven't talked about ah i young young Felon's ah girlfriend. um Because I do like. Oh, the baby mama.
01:22:19
Speaker
The baby mama. I do like that scene when when he when he sits down. is I feel like it's him for the whole movie that, it's been, okay, we've got to get this kid back, but then now he wants to get his money back and he wants kind of pay back. He's literally playing James Brown's payback on on the way there.
01:22:38
Speaker
But I feel like some steam has been taken out of the, the because one, the kid is named after David. ah And the when she talks about ah like how she saw him in such a steam, like ah ah he worshipped him, you know, the fight that this was you know, he was like everything to to him. So I think this is the first time that David has to, is actually thinking about young film, like as a person and in that scene of like, oh, right.
01:23:09
Speaker
Yeah. He has the, he has a guy, girl, he's got a kid. He seemed like he wanted to be me, you know? ah And yeah, that this, this is not because, because in, in both cases in high slows and high and low, it's, it's, it's,
01:23:27
Speaker
initially just seeing like, oh, this is just a hater who's attacking my status. Like who just, it almost like it's not even a personal thing of like, they just picked me as ah some random rich person. Why me?
01:23:38
Speaker
But it's like, no, that this is, this is about you. It always was. Right. And it's a matter of like having to come to terms with that and understanding their infelicity in how that scenario unfolded. Right.
01:23:52
Speaker
And then to draw it further to how he sees parallels within himself. Right. Right. like that conversation with the baby mama, I saw that as like him talking to a younger version of his own wife, right?
01:24:02
Speaker
Down to the fact that she's wearing the bracelet, right? Because like most of their conversation ah ah between Denzel and his wife is talking about the good old days together, right? And how they don't have enough time for those things together, right?
01:24:17
Speaker
Oh, he was all like, he was working a lot before, but there was a passion there and she and she was let into that, right? And now she's not let into that anymore, right? And the baby mom is in a similar position where she's let out of that. She doesn't see what's going on with young felon. She doesn't really know what's going on in that's that sense.
01:24:33
Speaker
Right. But the same kind of love and admiration is there because they're in a different circumstance, obviously in that sort ah read. But then also like it's the same admiration of passion.
01:24:45
Speaker
It's believing in somebody. Right. And ah King respects that from her. I get that impression. I think that King really likes her as a person when he's talking to her that way.
01:24:56
Speaker
Beyond just, you know, having a child in her arm. Yeah, there's a light in his face. And i think I think that informs how he goes to when he goes to confront young felon at the studio, there's even the moment of like when he throws up thing of like, God, my bitch runs her mouth too quick. He keeps repeating, why you gotta call her a bitch? Because he's met her now. So he's like, that she's not just some abstract bit bitch or ho. It's like, no, she's not. She seemed like a lovely woman.
01:25:24
Speaker
Like, I don't know. Why is she a bitch? It's like, why, why do you turn on these other, like, not just, it's like a microcosm of like, you're turning on the wrong person here. Like, we shouldn't be fighting each other. You shouldn't be mad at your, your significant other. Like, she is not the problem. She's not the reason that you are in this scenario.
Pop Culture and Artistic Expression
01:25:45
Speaker
who And it speaks to like ah the desperation that comes with like the modern crop of people who want to be famous, right? Or they don't even perceive those around them as people, right? He's not affording his baby mama or his kid is their own humanity, right? yeah Like he's, you know, just Like you said, calling them a bitch, right?
01:26:03
Speaker
Dehumanizing them ah for the sake of just, you know, this conversation. Just how he doesn't really care about kidnapping children. You know, obviously it's a big leap, right?
01:26:15
Speaker
Right. It's like he doesn't have respect in people. the The view in which he sees all people as people is gone, right? Because to him, all that matters is making money, right? Right.
01:26:27
Speaker
I don't blame them because it's commodities, because it's a society that teaches us to commodify everyone and everything. Like you're a product, I'm a product, he's a product, and everyone needs to sell themselves. And like that, that's a function of like what, how you get ahead is by selling yourself. You have to out, not just sell yourself, but then outsell someone because you're success. Like we talked about with cloud, like it, your success is dependent on someone else's failure.
01:26:55
Speaker
Ultimately. The song that ah we hear young felon rapping throughout this whole movie, you know, like the front to the back. Yeah. Yeah. Trunks. Pretty good song, I have to say. I've been really thinking about that stuff since the other day. Yeah, I love it.
01:27:09
Speaker
ah I got to say, though, that is the same as the theme music as we hear in the front courtyard, essentially, before King goes up in the record studio. Right.
01:27:21
Speaker
That's what trunk like Trunks is. It's still like a desperate call for someone to hear you, right? That's what all of these kinds of songs are, right? And and that's bringing it back to that scene of that's his theme music, right?
01:27:34
Speaker
That's all King hears at this point is people pleading, right? And he's heard it for so long that he doesn't care, right? It only takes this...
01:27:45
Speaker
He's numb to it. It's only when he's confronted with the reality face to face with young villain that he's able to like actually like come to terms with the reality that has been wrought through all of it.
01:28:02
Speaker
What were your thoughts on Ice Spice? In the ah one scene she was in? Or in general, you know, if you just want to make this a nice spice symposium. and I am not super familiar with her music. I mean, I've seen lots of images of her. think she's very attractive.
01:28:22
Speaker
I was... This show's my priority. I was popping more at the the guy she was who was trying to introduce her to King. I was like, oh, who's this guy? and Andy McQueen. He's like a I've seen him in the various TV shows. He was like on station 11 in the other Lindelof, the show that Lindelof co-created after Watchmen that he did. He played that guy, dude plays Jesus. That's, it's a really weird show. It's about a nun trying to take down a, uh, omniscient AI. That's,
01:28:55
Speaker
And she can also, and like literalizes the idea of nuns being married to Jesus, kind of similar to Benedetta. But it's like, no, she has like, she can go to like a non-physical space and like be with the literal Jesus who's like, like that's her significant other.
01:29:10
Speaker
And it's in play by him. ah But no, yeah, I mean, I guess I'm in the one. She seems cool. yeah That's pretty much how they treat her in the movie.
01:29:21
Speaker
I wish I had more to say about this Lindelof show. I haven't seen it personally, but like most of those things, I'm sure it's worth checking out. Have you seen Leftover? Not yet. I haven't started it yet, but I know it's amazing.
01:29:34
Speaker
I haven't seen it. Now it's going to become a Leftovers podcast. Come on. I don't want to watch all of the Ethan Klein and Hassan Taiker episodes of the Leftovers podcast. That just sounds like a waste of my time.
01:29:47
Speaker
do they Did they do a Leftovers podcast? Not a Leftovers podcast, but they did a podcast called Leftovers. Oh, okay. See, that's how I, like, I know those who those guys are, but then when you say, when you make, like, the joke was too clever for me.
01:30:05
Speaker
No, no, it was too online. That's the problem. i I was too online. I had too much context. But with the Ice Spice in Highest to Lowest, right, um her character is, like,
01:30:20
Speaker
Hey, ah Mr. King. Hey, I Spice. I'm the greatest. you You sure seem like it. I'll talk to you later. i mean, you know, Spike Lee's got a lot of other things to address in this movie. I think he just wants to be like, I know who she is.
01:30:36
Speaker
i am with it. You know, you guys are listening to the ice and the spices. I know she's got that wagon, right? yeah but hurt But it's it's just such an out of place, you know, you just drop her in, right? And it feels like a billboard almost for her music.
01:30:56
Speaker
I'm not complaining. I think that's funny. i know i mean, like I said, there's a lot of things that are in here, I think, because they just amuse us a Spike Lee. I know, because, like, there's only my music tastes are not, I wouldn't say narrow, but, like, they're just focused on where they're focused. So, like, I'm not going to be aware of, therapy like, because I know ah singer at the end that his son's been hyping up, she's someone, right?
01:31:21
Speaker
um I wasn't familiar. I didn't know. Well, if she is not someone, she probably will be. So, I mean, because I think, yeah, she's like an actual ah singer, but like she has a beautiful voice.
01:31:35
Speaker
um But also, i the thing that I did clock is that she's also the one singing the song in the credits, which is sampling. It's a fair amount of to just pronounce how it's even freezing cold and theys the it I feel like there was a point where every couple of weeks the video for it would go viral and people be like and did you know there's no actual lyrics this Italian songwriter what came up with like what sounded like American pop music and it's all just gibberish but there is something i feel like it almost feels besides just
01:32:14
Speaker
just that being a good, uh, beat to use for someone to to sing over, like the idea, you know, there's other religious illusions in, in this movie. It makes me think of the tower of Babel of everyone was speaking in tongues, uh, as you know, that, that was, that was their, their punishment for, for, you know, uh, daring to, to do that. And that,
01:32:40
Speaker
Spike is almost saying of like, okay, well, let's decode that. Let's like break down that barrier of like that. We can't understand each other. Now there are clear lyrics that this is, you can hear what is being said that, so we can understand each other now of like that. That's kind of like the whole movie trying to break through that barrier of like, we're not hearing each other.
01:33:03
Speaker
Totally. I think you're you're hitting the nail on the head there specifically in how King approached his music business. Right. He wasn't truly listening to the artists. Right. He was on autopilot for it seems like at least 15 years. Right.
01:33:17
Speaker
And when when when you're on autopilot, when you're no longer passionate about ah specifically in a position of being a tastemaker. Right. you're going to push forward some pretty shitty voices, right? And you're going to, you know, drop the ball in many ways, right?
01:33:32
Speaker
But what's interesting is the film ends with James striking out his on his own record label, right? Having own his own control over it, right? And there There is one thing to say about, you know, how corny it is to be like, oh, we're just going to, you know, take the industry by storm and it's just going to be us, right?
01:33:49
Speaker
Separate from that, right? I don't think that's corny. I think that that's actually a beautiful message at the end of this film because it's also saying, you know, it's time for us to carve our own identity separate from...
01:34:00
Speaker
like the white people in control, right? It's about like creating the culture separate from how other people can have their hands in that process, right? And like, as you were saying with that sample of that nonsense gibberish Italian song,
01:34:16
Speaker
ah That's a reflection of that, right? Where it's like, ah to some degree, a lot of Black art has to be commodified or filtered through the prism of how white audiences interact with it or how ah white record executives that put their input on that, right?
01:34:31
Speaker
So this is a comment saying, like, this is ah free from white eyes, free from any other eyes, but Black eyes, right? and And that's the way that, you know, so like...
01:34:42
Speaker
There's a freedom there, right? There's a freedom of being able to to just express that without the, ah you know, control or perspective of, you know, the higher class fearing down.
01:34:54
Speaker
Yeah, because that's always the prevailing logic of like, if you want anything to succeed on like a larger scale, especially in music, it's like white people need to buy your music and be listening to it. Like they're, even though they're increasingly smaller portion of the population, for some reason that they're the most important ones that we have to <unk>s the cater to instead of just making the thing for yourself and doing it for you or just, you know, like this is, this is for, this is black art for black people.
01:35:22
Speaker
I mean, and I think that's, he's he's underlining that throughout the film from everything to just just by pure ah virtue of him this being him being fully himself as a filmmaker from some people might think those little wipes he does with like the company logo are corny I fucking love that I love any kind of cool transition in a thing whether it's like a sick dissolve you could do a silly wipe or there's there was a good transition ah could fade to black when you close the circle on someone before it transitions Friendship had a good one of those earlier in the year ah fucking love that shit yeah it's hearkening back to the old school right the 50s like we were talking about before right ah but also it's a level of character right it like it it keeps everything within like the grammar of the world itself right in in a way that's like
01:36:21
Speaker
it's It's a little corny i in my mind, you know, when you get that screen wipe. The way it's done. But it's like earnest corniness, so which is why it works. Yeah. and It's like, yeah, I'm 100% on board with filmmakers being corny when it feels like that this is that's just coming from a place of pure passion. Some of so some of my favorites are the Wachowskis can be very corny. Sam Raimi, pretty corny sense of humor.
01:36:46
Speaker
feel like people forget Nolan, how corny Nolan can be. Because like he's often talked about like he's like some cold clinician and it's like, hey, he's a softie. His heart's on his sleeve. His sense of humor is fairly corny. But, but i you know, i I respond well to that kind of cornyness when, like I said, like when it's earnest.
01:37:10
Speaker
I think that everyone has these like mythic approaches to directors, right? They think that they are like these serious authors and auteurs who they can't be like seen as goofy. They can't be seen as having fun. Right.
01:37:24
Speaker
Right. ah that That's personality. Right. That's character. Right. right? Like when, when someone allows for those elements of themselves to shine, it's actually a positive, not a negative. And Christopher Nolan definitely fits within that realm.
01:37:38
Speaker
I think that's Spike Lee specifically in that context, right? When we look back on his previous films, like, the ending of Jungle Fever, right? With, like, Wesley Snipes, like, grabbing that kid and going, no! You know?
01:37:49
Speaker
Like, that's awesome. I love that ending. I wouldn't change it for a second, right? It's totally over the top, right? But it's like, only Spike Lee could have done that. eight And we need more authors who are going to go in that direction and not be so adherent to like the traditional ways of presenting themselves.
01:38:07
Speaker
And that's why I brought up Tarantino earlier in this podcast, because I feel like a lot of like the lauding that Tarantino has received over the years, it's slowly going away, I've noticed.
01:38:18
Speaker
people don't hold them in the same regard anymore. And it's because his stuff doesn't have the same F to it. And when you compare them to a Lee, right, while Lee can be more, you know, goofy in certain circumstances, his stuff actually packs a stronger punch and it's persisted over time because it's been able to accurately comment on the times in a way it's not just nostalgia mining.
01:38:40
Speaker
And Lee is self-confident enough to know that Like, okay, if I experiment or maybe even fail, that's fine. That's like part of the creative process and being an artist. And there's like a freedom and exhilaration to that. Like, yes, can it be disheartening of something that doesn't turn out the way you want or it's not well received? Sure. But like, then you learn from that and move on. Like it's this notion that he's, Tarantino's trapped himself in of like, I need to do only 10 and then retire.
01:39:15
Speaker
because one, he'll be little one or two releases, two separate movies. I don't fucking care what the intention was. So he's, he's already, he's already done 10. So fuck off.
01:39:28
Speaker
but it's like, why, who who are you? afraid What are the examples of who you're afraid of becoming? Cause I feel like the, that, There's so many directors in their, you know, 80s or, you know, ah advanced age who are still ah pushing themselves and like still doing creative stuff. So it's like you're you don't want to do that because you're afraid what your legacy. It's like, who gives a shit? Like, why is that the I mean, kind of parallel to what King has to like reckon with of like.
Tarantino vs. Spike Lee
01:40:00
Speaker
how much of am I overvaluing of what other people will remember me for be thinking of me in this moment versus what I personally qualify as success. And it's like, that's, that should be the, the, as an art, I, that's what actual art is to me is like that you're willing to be vulnerable like that.
01:40:22
Speaker
getting to the heart of it, Doug, right? This whole movie is about how King's fault is that he doesn't let others in. He doesn't let other people be a part of like the story that he creates for himself, right?
01:40:35
Speaker
And only in doing so is he able to succeed in his role, right? And at the end of the film, it's like, that's when he's bringing his wife back into the business. That's when he's bringing his son into the business, right? It's now a family business. And like,
01:40:48
Speaker
It seems like he's going his separate ways with, ah right? You know, but I think there's still going to be friends. You know, I still think they're going hang out all the time. Yeah, he just won't like work for him or like, you know, lose an eye for him. You know, so he's totally understandable. Pretty ah based on the ah the, I don't know how much time is supposed to pass the days that he's had. Like, yeah, I would probably call it then.
01:41:10
Speaker
Exactly. that That's when you say, that's when you pull the ripcord, right? like Like everything that's been, that could have been said with that friendship, it's been done, you know, just kidding. um but a But what I was getting at there is like, it's the control of the self, ah not for the sake of image, but for the sake of principle, right?
01:41:29
Speaker
Like but relating it to Tarantino, right? Like what's that legacy for, but to be remembered in history books, the exact way that you remembered yourself, right? And that's probably not anything going to happen, but right?
01:41:41
Speaker
Right, because you have no control over, you won't actually be there for all time for every book that will be written about you, so you can't really control that narrative. You and kind of need to just let that go and focus on what you can control, which is what you're doing as an artist. Like what can you, cause he is one of the privileged few who actually has the opportunity to put out exactly what he wants to put out.
01:42:06
Speaker
And so there's kind of something extra aggravating about him being like, no, I'm just gonna, you know, hands off. I have for one, one more. And it's like, Dude, do you know how hard it is to get a movie made now and how hard it is to get a movie made that's, like, idiosyncratic and, like, specific to that filmmaker? Like, you have a ah thing that resonates with people. Why don't you want to do, like, and and he also, whenever something's not fully received in the way that he wants, he kind of disowns, like, he kind of disowns Death Proof because people were...
01:42:39
Speaker
so So on that, I mean, i that's at the bottom of my Tarantino ring, but I still think that's a good movie. like i don't I'm not saying like throw that out. And also his best movie, Jackie Brown, I feel like is one that's like, oh, well, that didn't go over how he wished that was received, but he just never made a movie like that.
01:43:01
Speaker
and zero Like, no, that's not the lesson you should be making. You should be taking from it. Like, look, we all we know he lives in Israel, right? He's not exactly the best judge of character taste in any regard. Right.
01:43:14
Speaker
But when it comes to like his acumen as an author, as a filmmaker, right? Like he doesn't have the same integrity as Spike. And that's just seeping through everything that he's made, right?
01:43:26
Speaker
And the reason I brought up Tarantino in the first place is because Tarantino and Spike Lee have had a long-running feud for decades at this point. yeah I'm sure you're familiar, right? Yeah. mean, it's like a lot of basis of because i it's been going on kind of just forever that I forget like what was even the impetus of it. Is it just Tarantino co-opting black culture? You know, like is ah is that the the spark for it?
01:43:53
Speaker
it's that and it's also like, um, like, A, like his use of the N-word, right? Uh, and, and B, he, he found, uh, Django Unchained just be a disrespectful film.
01:44:04
Speaker
And, and I'm gonna lay my cards on the table. I agree with Spike Lee. I think that's, Django Unchained is a disrespectful film. And I think that, like, how Tarantino has, like, co-opted black culture, as you said, how he's employed the N-word, all that stuff, you know?
01:44:18
Speaker
Like, but that's just, it's it's speaking to somebody who cares only about the aesthetic and without understanding the ah scenario in which it came from within. And I'm almost like sharing Nazi propaganda films without, like, showing the appropriate context, right? Right. That's what Tarantino's films are, right? It's playing with your toys in a sandbox and leaving them there.
01:44:38
Speaker
And Spike Lee understands what the toys in the toy box mean. He understands their historical and but impact as well as the cool things they can do. and And that's what just makes him an overall more important filmmaker.
01:44:49
Speaker
Spike will also show his influences and his things that he's into on his sleeve. Like we talked about all the the New York sports stuff he put he put in this in this film, but he's also he's also willing to interrogate himself. Tarantino's interaction with culture.
01:45:08
Speaker
Like, I personally enjoyed Django, but I also, that is a movie made by someone whose only reference point for blackness and black culture is through other pop culture. Like, it's not like...
01:45:22
Speaker
like it it that that's his only prism through which he can like understand any of that which as an artistic voice that could have value if he was willing to interrogate that like if the if there was you know a film that was kind of like him reckoning with that but I don't think he sees it so proud of that think he's like nah I fucking killed it I'm i'm killing it also i'm gonna just keep saying that word. don't know. Like, I don't, I don't, I don't, I don't think he's, ah like, because it's okay for filmmakers to have limits. It's like, everyone's not able to be able to comment on anything. Like, you, you referenced Scorsese earlier, like, that, you know he's limited his experience in a way that Spike
01:46:12
Speaker
isn't But Scorsese will even still be self-reflective on like the whole ending of Killers of the Flower Moon is him putting support of like, these this is my limits as a storyteller. Like I'm at the end of the day, I'm not really any better than this radio show that's like, you know, kind of telling this tragedy in a glib way because like, it's not my story to tell. And it's like, I don't even have the tools to fully...
01:46:38
Speaker
explore what what what this this means. so And like him him kind of and I think that's just like the Catholic in him has to be like, I'm guilty. I'm sorry. but Sorry. He makes all of his best movies, but he's still like...
01:47:01
Speaker
ah I'm so sorry. Lily Gladstone's so good. Oh, no. you're you're You're hitting the nail on the head there, right? You are, because it's like, it's it's not a, matter that at that point, it's not a limit for Scorsese, right?
01:47:16
Speaker
He's still talking about that thing. He's still reckoning with himself, right? But he's still able to convey the the core theme, which is, empathy in that sense, right? And understanding and listening, right?
01:47:29
Speaker
Which, you know, in a Tarantino sense, it's like, how cool can I say the N word in this scene? You know, how can I fit this into the dialogue in the funniest way possible, right? There's no understanding of what it means in culture, in society,
Spike Lee's Storytelling and Experimental Films
01:47:43
Speaker
right? And when you do that, right, you're not devaluing the word itself.
01:47:47
Speaker
You're actually just devaluing that word's meaning to other people and giving them the permission to play around with it more. And the Spike Lee's thing, right? With it how he's approached ah race and how he's approached all these things.
01:48:01
Speaker
You know, it's not to say that, right? as Spike Lee has never had problematic elements in his films. You know, he's had stereotypes in his films before. I'd never make that claim, yeah. But i I think he is willing to, you know...
01:48:13
Speaker
look back and go my bad on some of that stuff. I don't, i don't think he's someone who like will dig his heels and be like, I've never done anything wrong in my entire life. You know, like I, he's, mean, he's you and he knows that like, he knows he has limits and is not perfect. And that's what makes art interesting is that it's made by imperfect flawed people.
01:48:36
Speaker
and and And when it comes to like imperfections, that's where Spike Lee's films work the best when they feel a little shaggy, right? When you've got that cop running down the stairs in highest to lowest after the guy in the and the backpack, you know, I feel like the takes are going on for so long. It's not even exciting at that point, right?
01:48:53
Speaker
but ah But I'm just stewing in the moment. I'm just like enjoying the performances from that character actor, you know, I'm i'm enjoying, you know, the way that Spike Lee's capturing it all. That's why I go to the movies, you know, just like kind of revel in it. Right.
01:49:06
Speaker
and And when you're, when you were talking about directors who are really good and are just reveling in it all, it's why Spike Lee is one of the best. Yeah. I mean, i I do have a lot of, uh, gaps in there. Like I've seen, you know, bigger ones like Malcolm X do the right thing.
01:49:22
Speaker
Also inside man's also up there. But like, I, I, I do have a lot of, especially the more experimental ones that I, I, uh, ah need need need to fill in and I feel like those those will be worth my time maybe even something like I don't know ah the the old boy remake is probably should probably should exist but the fact that it's a Spike Lee old boy remake intrigues me and I'm gonna watch it I'm fine there's probably even if I'm like that was a bad movie it's gonna at least be interestingly bad
01:49:55
Speaker
You know, I will say, you know, because it's important to talk about with this film, right? Because this is this now third remake, right? And this is only good one, right? um The Sweet Blood of Jesus, right?
01:50:08
Speaker
um Have you seen that one or no? No, that that's another of one I haven't seen. So, like, that one felt like he tried to make, like, a Twilight movie mixed with, like, a Tyler Perry movie, right?
01:50:21
Speaker
Like, he tried to make something, like, on a really, really low, almost television studio budget level, right? Yeah. And then, like, add that vampire element to it, and it's because it's a remake of Ganja and Hess, right?
01:50:33
Speaker
um There's that, you know, history with it, but it lacks the weight, right? Because it feels so modern and commercial, right? There is one hilarious sequence, though, where Rami Malek just, like, loses his mind.
01:50:46
Speaker
So if you do ever watch it, That's kind of what the movie is worth it for, in my opinion. ah But then with Old Boy... um I've seen a funny Raymond Mnullet scene in that one, too, where he's... ah It's a hammer and he starts screaming.
01:51:01
Speaker
And also, Samuel Jackson's hilarious in that movie. He brings out, like, the X-Acto knife and he brings it up right up to his face and he's like, but you're not going to do what I think you're going to do with that boy or whatever. Like, it's it's one of those...
01:51:12
Speaker
like classic Samuel Jackson things. ah But Oldboy is the opposite of Ganja and Hess, where it's like, ah sorry, in The Sweet Blood of Jesus, which is the remake of Ganja and Hess.
01:51:23
Speaker
um the The Sweet Blood Jesus was trying to, like, take the grimy original and like polish it a little and present it in a new fashion, right? And old boy is just taking what has already happened and just directly translating it.
01:51:38
Speaker
And there's no, like like the American impressions that you get onto it are very slight. Like ah that is the only film. Old boy is the only film that I could directly call a paycheck film.
01:51:51
Speaker
The sweet blood of Jesus felt like an attempt at a paycheck film where it's like that was a low cost, high rewards. But old boy felt like the only one that was like, I'm trying to make something that can cross over. It's this really well established classic film.
01:52:05
Speaker
and And he was asleep at the wheel. He was like, I don't know why he could have brought more to it. Right. Cause it sounds like, even though i don't think you have lot of, uh, films like that don't need to be remade but like a he could have at least had because like the context for the original old boy is like so Korean so it's like ah like finding an American way through that especially given America's history with with prisons private prisons or something there could have been there could have been something there with that it feels like it goes for this like
01:52:41
Speaker
like out of time feeling, like existing within the ninety s and then appearing in the 2010s kind of thing, right? I kind of like when, yeah, the stylistically anachronistic stuff like that, like, but ah so um I mean, it could just be aesthetic, but I also so would like it to be for some end sometime you're going to do that.
01:53:04
Speaker
The problem is it is it does it for no reason, you know? Like there's no like 25th hour moment where like they reckon with America's current point, you know? like and And that's what I would have wanted with an old boy is like some kind of like reckoning, right?
01:53:18
Speaker
And and maybe maybe Spike just wanted like to just make a fun action film, right? and And wanted the permission to do that, right? His choice to make an old boy film, like to me, it's that was the ego of Spike Lee in that moment, you know?
01:53:34
Speaker
Where he felt like he could just do that and it would be fine, right? And no one would care that he just took old boy and did it again. like no one We were talking about like Speak No Evil like ah last week, right? like That means something different in the original country. And it's the same with all of these other films, right?
01:53:51
Speaker
If you do nothing in terms of like trying to ah bring that country-specific ah commentary along with it, all you're doing is removing the context of the original film.
01:54:03
Speaker
And that's where it fails. And that's where it feels the least like a Spike Lee film. And that's where highest to lowest really succeeds, where it's not only building on the original so source material, but and also just like bringing something different than what high and low
Spike Lee's Legacy
01:54:16
Speaker
did.
01:54:16
Speaker
not like It's like a 100% Spike Lee movie, though. like it's it's like It's not like he's lost in there. And and yeah, they are both going for for for different things. like yeah there's I never went in expecting that he was going to one-up Kurosawa, and I don't think he did either. Because why pointedly the final acts of these movies are very different. like the Even if a starting point's familiar, like they diverge more and more. the deeper in you go.
01:54:49
Speaker
the And I like that. you know I like that they they they have such distance to across one another. And it feels like Spike Lee learned his lessons from his previous films. like like He is a filmmaker who listens, as we've said, right?
01:55:02
Speaker
And like that's why when you look at his ah library, his filmography, right? um there There are some misses there. There are a few, you know? But by and large, most of them are great, you know, and I'd much rather have them take those whiffs, you know, take it on the chin, make a better one on the next outing and even have some that become diamonds in the rough because you never hear people talking about Red Hook Summer.
01:55:26
Speaker
I think that's like one of those best movies, you know, i need to know that one, too. I mean, also sometimes there these these things are just a victim of how they're released now, because like we've talked about.
01:55:38
Speaker
Apple's non-release strategy for this, but then also like ah how many people have even seen, uh, um, uh, was it the five bloods or?
01:55:51
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. That was a streaming problem too. Right. That came out during COVID. Right. Yeah. That probably would have been a ah pretty decent, especially cause he had Chadwick Boseman and then one of his last performances. Right.
01:56:02
Speaker
Um, but like, his His movies have kind of been left in weird limbo, right? Like Chirac was one of the weirdly first Amazon original films, if I'm not mistaken.
01:56:15
Speaker
i but That's the first one I can remember of them being, that they were kind of like, hey, we got Spike Lee. So it was like, they were kind of like, ah at the time it felt like they were showing off of like, no, look, we're making movies.
01:56:28
Speaker
We got this that's divert from I don't want to divert from Chirac, but I wanted to tell you this because I think this might get you to watch Red Hook Summer, right? ah Did you know that it is essentially his clerks? Didn't know that.
01:56:43
Speaker
That's very compelling to me. As and someone who defends all three clerks movies, And I'll make it even better. I'll make it even better. Specifically, it's a an extension of the Do the Right Thing universe.
01:56:58
Speaker
And Spike Lee plays Mookie in it. Connected universe. Whoa. He did a connected universe movie. And it's the one that no one talks about. Damn.
01:57:08
Speaker
Okay. I mean, I was going to see it anyway because I i'm ah walked away from this pre-motivated to fill in all my spike blind spots and besides wanting to revisit ah the ones I'd already seen. But yeah, I i got it. I got to see that.
01:57:22
Speaker
Yeah, they they but he's always making interesting things and it's always his own voice, right? um You know, and and and that's just all I look for in an artist. You know, if they've got their own perspective, they got their own way of looking at things and they present that in a coherent way that's engaging, you know?
01:57:40
Speaker
That's all you really want from a good movie, right? And Spike Lee has consistently given audiences that for decades at this point. And it's really like, as we've talked about before, you know, there is that bittersweet element, you know, where he's had to fight really hard to get to that point, you know, where Malcolm X had like a tiny budget in comparison to if like Norman Jewison were to do it.
01:58:01
Speaker
Or it's like, come on, man. Like the thing is, is, ah you know, He did it. He did the damn thing. You know, if this is his last movie, right, he climbed the fucking mountain and he conquered it, which is what's going to be great about like seeing Spike Lee's filmography as it exists throughout time.
01:58:17
Speaker
He never really sacrificed. He always made the films the ways that he wanted to make them, even if they weren't that great. You know, as we talked about with Old Boy and The Sweet Blood of Jesus. um He still was his own artist. He still had his own voice and he stood for other artists as
Closing and Promotions
01:58:35
Speaker
well.
01:58:35
Speaker
And and like it's really ah hard for me not to have nothing but like ultimate respect for him. like that this is When you make a movie like Highest to Lowest, putting your heart out there, you're putting it all on the line.
01:58:48
Speaker
And the fact that he's doing this in the on, man. You got to give it up. I mean, like you said, what more can you want from an artist? That's why that's why we go to the movies. Well, I feel like we we thoroughly covered it all. Is there anything you wanted to, ah final thought, you wanted to include or anything on it?
01:59:07
Speaker
um No pressure you don't. I was just is giving you the opportunity. No, no. Yeah. you over come up with something. yeah know like once Once it's on streaming, like I'm like, I can watch, throw this to my parents. Like it's not even, even with the stylistic garnishes that we talked about. It's like those are not going to, this could have, there could have been a war. I'm not saying this movie is as good as Inside Man, but this could have played to that same level of audience of how like Inside Man is just like an unqualified, like,
01:59:40
Speaker
crossover success with, and and this is those are pretty a solid crowd-pleasing hour. I don't see much in here that a regular audience would take issue with. yeah Honest filmmaking that is able to take stock of ah the reality that we are in, but then also looking yeah like you say, it's ah it's not it's not nostalgia, but being able to look back into the past, learn from those mistakes, and also reflect on them in a meaningful way of what that means going forward. I think Spike is delivering on all those fronts, and that's
02:00:18
Speaker
why i think we're just we're just lucky to be living in ah in a world where he he makes them. I wish it was easier for him to make the of those films and I really hope that he makes more, but yeah you know I'll take it while we got it because it's great.
02:00:32
Speaker
Ooh, yeah. Yeah, I yeah and gotta get that. Yeah, agreed. i Did you have anything you want to plug? Yeah, I mean... Yeah, and and just watch this space.
02:00:44
Speaker
Plan to have you on for plenty more things on on this. I mean, whether it's these guys got juice or I've started you know posting things on ah on another feed, does somebody cooked you. Just that's for...
02:00:56
Speaker
experimenting, playing around. I mean, that's kind of me just doing a Spike Lee, just seeing what works and doesn't work and throwing it out there. ah but, uh, yeah, they've called me a Spike Lee podcasting.
02:01:09
Speaker
Uh,
02:01:11
Speaker
You follow me at Twitter at the Doug files. ah my YouTube is also Doug files. I got, I got to catch up with a lot of stuff in the editing to, I'm going to upload on there, whether it's a video forms of, of some of these discussions we've had, maybe some discussions with clips from said movies involved.
02:01:32
Speaker
Uh, and yeah, check all that out. That's what I got guys.
02:01:44
Speaker
Juice, Juice, Juice, this is your life.
02:01:51
Speaker
juice your truth choose this is your life