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149- Camp Beagle in legal victory!
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Always great to see a court case resolving to allow animal rights protests to continue; in this episode, Paul, Julie & Anthony discuss the case of John Curtin, who- along with Camp Beagle at MBR Acres in the East of England- have been allowed to resume their campaign against animal breeding and testing industries. We also look at eight other stories from the vegan & animal rights space from the last week or so.
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Enough of the Falafel is a community of people who love keeping on top of the latest news in the world of veganism & animal rights. With the Vegan Week podcast, we aim to keep listeners (& ourselves) informed & up-to-date with the latest developments that affect vegans & non-human animals; giving insight, whilst staying balanced; remaining true to our vegan ethics, whilst constantly seeking to grow & develop.
Each week we look through news stories from the past 7 days in the world of veganism & animal rights.
If you spot any news stories that might catch our fancy, or have an idea for a discussion topic, get in touch via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com.
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This week's stories:
https://www.modernghana.com/news/1380826/animal-rights-group-launches-global-campaign-to.html
https://thetab.com/2025/02/18/these-are-the-russell-group-unis-where-students-have-already-voted-to-go-vegan
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/transgender-leader-of-bizarre-radical-vegan-cult-tied-to-multiple-murders-across-america-jailed-until-trial/ar-AA1zjKOl (really just wanted to comment on this, in that all the headlines use the phrase vegan, yet it's nothing to do with the story)
https://www.theanimalreader.com/2025/02/18/debate-in-argentina-over-capybara-contraception/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/feb/14/rats-strangled-in-part-government-funded-australian-domestic-violence-study-ntwnfb
https://www.huntsabs.org.uk/aniseed-and-antis-countryfile-covers-the-hunting-act/
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14405063/Waitrose-king-prawns-humanely-animal-rights.html
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c241p7pnmdzo
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/cb1212166.html
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Thanks everyone for listening; give us a rating and drop us a message to say "hi"; it'll make our day!
Julie, Paul & Ant
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Transcript
Introduction to Vegan Week
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everybody, welcome to your one-stop shop for this week's vegan and animal rights news. I'm Anthony, joining me for this episode are Julie and Paul, where that is enough of the falafel, it's time for Vegan Week.
00:00:15
Speaker
So I think vegans go looking for trouble even when they're not looking for trouble. That's not what butt is used for. Brr! Take your flat-grown meat elsewhere. We're not doing that in state of Florida.
00:00:27
Speaker
What your protein and what about your iron levels? Should I call the media and say, hi, sorry. They're arguing like, oh, poor woe is me. Hang on a minute. You always
00:00:42
Speaker
social injustice has connection another. That's just what people think vegans eat anyway. As long as you donna get they wee brunions with the horns you'll be alright. Does veganism give him superpowers?
00:00:58
Speaker
I cannot fly around the city. I don't have laser vision.
Campaign Against Dog and Cat Meat Trade
00:01:02
Speaker
Hello everyone, Julie here. Welcome to this episode of Vegan Week.
00:01:08
Speaker
Thank you for joining us. Hello everyone, whether you're first-time listener or a regular listener, I'm Paul. But that's enough of the falafel. Let's hear what's been going on in the news this week.
00:01:23
Speaker
For more details on the upcoming news stories, including links to our original source material, check out our show notes for this episode, available on your podcast player.
00:01:34
Speaker
Okay, we are starting off this week's show by heading to Africa, specifically Ghana. Although a lot of us recording the show are based in the UK, we try to cover news from across the world.
00:01:46
Speaker
um And so this one was a welcome one to come across our news box. This is from modernghana.com. And it tells us that the Coalition for Cruelty-Free Africa, in collaboration with the Liberia Animal Welfare and Conservation Society, they've initiated a global awareness campaign demanding legislative action against the dog and cat meat trade. So they're specifically focusing on discouraging people from eating companion animals. that Obviously, a campaign we can get behind. Lots of different organisations weighing in as well. You've got Global Justice for Greyhounds and All Dogs, the Coalition of animals African Animal Welfare.
00:02:29
Speaker
Lots of organisations coming together. There's a widespread awareness drive. They're putting billboards across Africa. If you follow the link in the show notes, you can see a very striking picture that was taken on the 19th of Feb and is up somewhere in Ghana. It doesn't tell us where. They called it the barbaric dog and cat meat trade. Interestingly, they're also citing zoonotic disease as a reason to do this, as well as the sort of sentimental argument of dogs and cats are family, not food.
00:03:00
Speaker
Julie, obviously it's great that you know people are are nudging the needle wherever it is. you know If it's a meat-centric culture, then perhaps companion animals are the
Zoonotic Disease and Advocacy
00:03:10
Speaker
place to start. But i thought the zoonotic disease focus was an interesting angle, wasn't it?
00:03:14
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Sometimes when you're doing vegan outreach and speaking up for animals, you have to use the argument that will be best received by your audience and not necessarily always come in first with the one that's closest to your heart and your values as someone who's already vegan. You've got to try and meet people where they are.
Coalition's Campaign Overview
00:03:37
Speaker
What I would say is if you go on to the Coalition for Cruelty-Free Africa and the Liberia Animal Welfare and Conservation Society websites.
00:03:53
Speaker
You will see all of the campaigns that these amazing organisations are undertaking. This is just one of many. And the things they are doing are absolutely humbling and so holistic.
00:04:08
Speaker
They're really amazing in that they are tackling the welfare of animals who are working animals, but not stopping there and saying, oh, well, you know these these animals are working And that's an undisputable fact, but actually promoting veganism in schools and taking plant-based eating into schools. And this campaign is part of you know a lot of other measures, helping people on low incomes to look after their companion animals, helping wild animals.
00:04:45
Speaker
They're doing the law, they really are What brilliant organisations and what brilliant work they're doing out there. It's so holistic. I wish that our SSPCA and RSPCA were working like that, you know. accepting to a certain degree the status quo that there are farmed animals already and there are things we can do you know in the immediate term to ease some of their suffering but never giving up the overall aim which is to be looking at a much more sustainable way of life and one that is not revolving around animal abuse and slaughter.
00:05:25
Speaker
They are doing animal welfare the way that actually it should be We shouldn't give up on the fact that animal welfare has become some horrible anthropocentric term now. You know, the animals should still hang on to that as an
Animal Welfare Efforts in Africa
00:05:41
Speaker
idea.
00:05:42
Speaker
So yeah, their websites are humbling and the obstacles that they are facing in their push for animal rights and veganism Compared to our culture in the UK here, I'm talking just from that point of view, you know, our struggles are nothing compared to what they are dealing with.
00:06:01
Speaker
They have really adverse weather events. They have droughts. They have all kinds of... very ingrained culture that is much more sort of anti-animal rights than we've even got to deal with here. You know, it really gives you a different perspective when you see.
00:06:21
Speaker
But they're persistent and they're so hopeful and so wonderful. a you know, one of my high points of... today well it was also my cry of the week was going on in particular my favorite website is the and Liberia Animal Welfare and Conservation Society that their stuff is tiny little area you know for a wee country four million people what they're doing is amazing there was obviously some kind of competition they'd run for school children and they had as the theme be kind to animals and then it looks like they had to complete that sentence and then draw a picture of what that might look like and there's a picture of a boy holding up his picture be kind to animals and he's drawn a beautiful big elephant and aim let me just check that I'll get the words of this exactly right it says underneath
00:07:20
Speaker
I can only be happy when I am wild. And that made me cry. I thought, amazing you know, really to show such at that age, to show such understanding and, you know, I bet his upbringing did not lead him to those thoughts about elephants. You know, that's not been his lived experience of meeting these animals and seeing them.
00:07:46
Speaker
And yeah, I just, I love that so much. Anybody who is listening to this podcast from any of the, you know, African places, that my geography is terrible.
00:07:58
Speaker
Hello there. And it's so lovely that you're joining in and we are admiring your campaigns very much. Absolutely. Yeah, just just shows what's possible, doesn't it? And like you say, can make you slightly irritated if you hear someone going, oh, yeah, that vegan cheese doesn't taste quite as nice as normal cheese, does it? Oh, come on.
00:08:18
Speaker
Well, you know, one of the things we have to contend with where they're launching this campaign about, you know, in friends, not food and about the non-consumption of cats and dogs.
00:08:30
Speaker
is that cats are seen as witches and to even nowadays in parts of Africa. I did not know that. Yeah, they're they're taking it, like you say, from the angle of, and you know, the health risks associated, but that isn't where their heart is. You can tell by looking at the rest of their campaigns, you know, that that is...
00:08:53
Speaker
just their strategic way of giving, you know, meeting people where they're So I really admire them for that. Absolutely, yeah. And long long may their work continue.
Capybara Population Control Debate
00:09:05
Speaker
Well, we're going to keep things international, but a slightly different background. We're going to go to Nordelta, which is apparently a wealthy district near Buenos Aires in Argentina, where a heated debate has erupted over a plan to control the growing capybara population. Now, if you're not sure what capybara is, it's just basically think of a giant guinea pig They are closely related, but they are much, much, much bigger. Think like a sort of medium to large size dog. The number of animals native to the area has been increasing. um And residents cite that sometimes they fight amongst themselves or with local dogs. And both of these are causing concern amongst residents.
00:09:45
Speaker
They say that since 2020, they've noticed a sharp increase in the population. There's no natural predators in the neighborhood. So the numbers are rapidly increasing. growing. Each female can give birth twice a year, sometimes having up to eight offspring in their litter.
00:10:00
Speaker
So the local authorities have planned to inject 250 of them with two doses of contraceptive medication. Well, that's the bad news. The good news is that Carpinchos no Delta somos su voz, or nor Delta Capybaras, we are your voice.
00:10:18
Speaker
They are a local group who are opposing the plan, arguing that there was little constant consultation with residents and they're suggesting some alternatives such as wildlife corridors or protected areas.
00:10:33
Speaker
We'll see how this thing develops. Paul, you've had a look at this one. it's um It's a story that is very similar to others we we've covered recently in terms of people just getting a little bit cross that animals are just being animals and, oh gosh, we can't have this. We we need to interfere. what's What's your take on this?
00:10:52
Speaker
I guess this is one of those one. I know the sort of stories we've covered before. Like I think it is in places like India and Africa where animals have started coming into what's what's termed, you know, like human areas. and But of course, they're coming in for food and we've impinged on their land anyway in the first place.
00:11:08
Speaker
And I guess iss I think from reading the story just now, the ah Obviously, they were there before the the human settlement was there. So I guess there's that aspect to it. um like Maybe slightly, probably slightly controversially, what I actually thought reading this story might might not be aligned with you you guys, but I actually thought...
00:11:29
Speaker
This could be slightly worse in that, um you know, we have seen stories here where the reaction is just like, well, we'll just shoot some, we'll just kill some. So, you know, you guys might not agree with this, but I must have, I thought this could be a worse outcome. I think if you're going to um look at the way you are, you know, if you accept...
00:11:49
Speaker
and you might not, that there there's a ah control that's been been needed, then this is ah not not the worst way it could be done. But I do accept that, you know, that's, some you could say, well, um why should we be interfering? um This is an animal that was there before. So I don't know if you got what you guys think of that. um I might be on my own on that one, I guess, but...
00:12:08
Speaker
Well, I would agree with you, Paul, in that like we've we've clearly seen and and know of examples where just routinely sort of populations of animals are, quote, controlled, like you say, by by ending their lives. So relative to that, that is better.
00:12:24
Speaker
I think we can... I'll speak for myself. i would I would say, well, you're still interfering with animals. like that Those animals have done nothing wrong. Why do their reproductive systems need to be violated?
00:12:36
Speaker
Yeah. And at the same time, realise that pragmatically speaking, if you've got, a I mean, one of the concerns that's cited here is like, oh, when they fight with one another, it can lead to traffic accidents and other issues. Well, I'd still say that that's not, that's not really the Capybara's fault that that there's a road nearby. Like they've not built that road. They've not decided to go drive around a car.
00:12:56
Speaker
in cars But realistically, what are you going to get people to do in 2025 and in a non-vegan world? So and in a sense, I can ah can see why we might need to sort of swallow pills like this and say, well, it's better than the alternative. I'm much more of a just leave them alone person. Maybe that's a bit pie in the sky. But I just think once you give people license to interfere in one small way, you give them an open door to then continue this idea that it's up to humans to decide how many of a certain species are welcome and what they can do with those that are not.
00:13:36
Speaker
I mean, I think like having vegans putting out the argument like like this group are saying, do you know what? There are alternatives to interfering with their reproductive systems. you can You can have a wildlife corridor. You can have a protected area. Like saying those things and maybe if if what people settle on is, you know, neutering them or or whatever, we we can say, well, at you know, at least they're still alive.
00:14:01
Speaker
um But I think probably yeah the vegan voice still needs to be and the animal rights voice still needs to be out there, even if we might accept that sometimes it might not be listened to. it's It certainly won't be listened to if if we didn't put it out there.
00:14:14
Speaker
that That would be my opinion anyway. Any road, let's report on something closer to our home in the UK at least, and that is the plant-based universities campaign.
Universities Shift to Plant-Based Initiatives
00:14:25
Speaker
There have been a couple more universities this month that have voted to go plant-based in their on-campus university-owned catering, um if that if you like. The Russell Group of universities, um generally speaking, seem as quite prestigious. there There's 25 of them across the UK.
00:14:46
Speaker
um And we've taken an article from thetab.com that has given a quite handy little update on what's going on with regards to those universities and their stance with regards to plant-based eating. So it was the University of Bristol and Imperial College London this month who have voted to start serving plant-based food.
00:15:08
Speaker
And like I say, there are others in this Russell group of universities. So the University of Warwick, voted to do the same in 2024 although they have since gone back on it. Cardiff University, the University of Edinburgh, York have all tried to do that but their student unions have gone against it but there are more positives where we've seen things that have been voted for but it's not yet in place. So Cambridge University in March 2023 they voted for the university to go completely plant-based although they're not quite there yet. They've not
00:15:41
Speaker
said an official date. Queen Mary University of London, they are starting to transition. So this academic year, they are 60% plant-based in their on-campus outlets. Newcastle University last year voted for 50% at the moment, and they're working towards 100%, but still no exact date.
00:16:02
Speaker
And UCL University College London, um they voted in 2023 to join the Plant-Blaze University's plan nine cafes and shops on campus. They have to be 60% plant-based now and 100% plant-based by 2029. Julie, you've got a bit of an insight into this in that you've you're part of the Plant-Based Council's campaign.
00:16:25
Speaker
yeah Good to see the momentum going in in the universities, but frustrating to see those ones where they sort of say they'll do it and then drag their heels a bit. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. They're getting allowed to um faff about and sit on the fence.
00:16:42
Speaker
And I must admit, it's disappointing, but the Russell Group, and it's 24 universities that they run. They have an awful lot of policies on their website that are applicable to all of their universities. You know, they've got standards about certain things that they do.
00:17:04
Speaker
and even if animal rights weren't on there there should be something about the environment and sustainability and about carbon footprint and all the rest of it.
00:17:15
Speaker
And ah having had a quick look, i nothing is obviously there. And that's the argument that you can win with this one, I think. And it's disappointing because actually they could just say, well, do you know what? This bottom line is, this is our university and we're telling you,
00:17:35
Speaker
And that could be 24, plant-based, done. No argument. And if people don't like it, then they can go to a different university or the time that they are, like at university, isn't their entire life. It's not even their entire day in a lot of cases.
00:17:54
Speaker
They can go and eat elsewhere. But actually, if they are ah serious educational institution and if they are looking to a you know, be progressive and all the rest of it.
00:18:09
Speaker
I think they should just a wholesale just make that a policy. Platt-based, done. I completely agree with you. And I had a similar conversation at work last week, which did did get a bit heated. I i normally keep my cool, but I didn't.
00:18:23
Speaker
And yeah, along the same lines of, and and and there were others agreeing, saying you don't have to eat here. You know, you you don't have to eat at this canteen or whatever. But actually, if we do stand by these things, if going to do something, do it properly.
00:18:38
Speaker
You know, these these people making these policies at universities, are they going to get to the end of their lives going, well, do you know what? We played it safe. I'm really i'm really glad that we were moderate in what we did. Like, no, no one's going to think that. they're They're going to say, you know, those who do stick their neck out and say we we stood for what we thought was the the right thing to do.
00:18:57
Speaker
If anywhere should be plant-based right now, it's a university for so many reasons that are kind of obvious, but just if anywhere should be the example and you know on the leading edge of these matters and not dishing up retro, unhealthy, nasty food to people, it should be universities.
00:19:24
Speaker
You know, definitely. And that's what they should be teaching the students who are learning anything about food science or anything as well. You know, progress, please. Not staying still or going backwards.
00:19:37
Speaker
Yeah. And I mentioned this with the Warwick University U-turn that we saw, I think, November last year. Actually, there's a ah kind of maybe it's overregging it a bit, but like a bit of a social justice thing here in that if you do vote to do these things, you do need to follow it through. ah It's not OK to be like, oh, well, like we've got a mandate here. People have voted on it, but we've had a look and we think it might be a bit hard.
00:20:01
Speaker
So we're not going to do it. You know, if your students say that it's it's what needs to happen, it it needs to happen. You know, serve your community quite literally. But um as you say, Julie, universities don't always do what they should. And unfortunately, this this next story, ah I will give a kind of sensitivity warning because there are some unpleasant details.
00:20:20
Speaker
about animal experimentation in this one. Of course, we're gonna report on it, it's important too, um but some bits are are really quite unpleasant.
Ethical Concerns in Animal Studies
00:20:28
Speaker
So there was a study led by Monash University in consultation with Alfred Health and other institutions, this is in Australia, and the aim was to improve the detection of brain injury resulting from intimate partner violence. So not a pleasant subject in the first place.
00:20:46
Speaker
What's the way that it was done basically by strangling rats now um that it they said that it was ah non-fatally strangling rats as if that makes it okay oh it's fine don't worry they they didn't die horrible horrible things done they were non-fatally strangled for 90 seconds using a silicon band weighed down by 680 grams applying a force about three times the rat's body weight other rats in the study were given a traumatic brain injury inflicted by a 50 milligram weight propelled using pneumatic force into the rat's head.
00:21:21
Speaker
Absolutely disgusting. And not surprisingly, it has made the headlines because a lot of people have said, you know what? This shouldn't have been approved. Despite the the lofty aims of trying to understand more about intimate partner partner violence,
00:21:39
Speaker
that it did pass an ethics committee, but lots of people, um academic people, have had a look at this and said, do you know what, this is absolutely not okay. So we've had a veterinary expert, Dr. Katherine Herman, who's based at John Hopkins University in the US, Dr. Andrew Knight, who listeners might recognise the name of, who has done a lot of work in the UK advocating for animals, but in an academic field.
00:22:04
Speaker
environment, as well as Bella Lear, who's chief exec at Understanding Animal Research Oceania. However, the latter person was saying, no, no, no, I'm sure they did it okay.
00:22:15
Speaker
I'm sure it was fine. She was quoted as saying, trauma studies always sound horrible, but when you put them into the clinical context of what this is trying to treat, then they do make sense.
00:22:26
Speaker
Paul, does this make sense? Do you do do agree with Bella Lear? You know, in the clinical context, it does make sense. No, not at all. And and that last comment you yeah definitely got my back up as well.
00:22:38
Speaker
I mean, you know, personally, ah never cease to be amazed at the the studies, the research studies that are dreamt up here for what look to be really obvious results and really of little value.
00:22:55
Speaker
to science using bad science itself the the results here were what you'd expect basically oh if you give a ah high impact damage injury to something it's worse than if you don't i mean well no shit it's yeah yeah well the and the main outcome of the study here was that um they they they realized that if you strangle and hit the animal at the same time the outcomes are worse than if you just did one of them it's Really? Really? Was that worth it?
00:23:26
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, it's it's it was yeah i mean it's it's mind-boggling, isn't it? I mean, I think for me, maybe it's because it's kind of like what I do for my living. The thing that I noticed was really missing here um was a really kind of ah ah an exploration of how did this get through first time and how are we going to stop or how are they going to stop that being repeated because clearly the process to pass the ethics committee you know went through positively um first time around and now it's saying oh no it isn't so so what are they doing about that moving forward that's what that's what worries me is it's like well this could happen again surely then
00:24:07
Speaker
So that was one that was one element that I didn't think the story really brought out. but Maybe it maybe is has happened, but it's not part of that story. Yeah, I mean, it was it's it's it really does deflate you and and makes you angry reading this sort of stuff, I have to say.
00:24:21
Speaker
The other bits that I picked out here, you know, there was because i know it's Australian money and I can never remember how this works exactly, but there's $1.9 million dollars of funding given for this, which is going to be a lot of money, whatever.
00:24:33
Speaker
um You know, you think what that sort um money you could do with better science based research. Yeah, it's really, really a depressing read. It has to be said. Absolutely. I've just looked it up and there an Australian dollar is the equivalent of 50p.
00:24:47
Speaker
So sort of half that number of of of dollars to make ah pounds and not money. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. I guess a positive that I would take is that this has been reported in the Guardian. It's been reported in quite a few places, actually popped up quite a lot.
00:25:03
Speaker
And I, that whole thing about how did it get through the ethics committee in a sense, that's the big question mark. That's, that's the headline really, isn't it? It's allowed to happen and it, and it shouldn't have been. So if that has made it into a lot of newspapers and is, is getting coverage, then, you know, we know that millions and millions of animals are,
00:25:23
Speaker
and needlessly experimented on and it's kind of giving a bit of voice to that isn't it that's the hope yeah and the other the other thing i think forgot to mention there looking at my notes is of course you know they're saying about it's non-fetal strangulation etc but of course all these animals as with the most of these as far as i know they're all ultimately euthanized as part of the research they all die It's not like there's or you just just a bit of strangulation and we'll send you off into a field. They're still killed. They're still abused and still, you know, for for for no real scientific purpose as far as I can see. so
00:25:56
Speaker
Absolutely. Sad stuff. Sad stuff. um Now, depending on your algorithm for your social media and your news and everything like that, you might have come across our next story already, particularly inflammatory or unfair headline.
00:26:10
Speaker
I think. So there's been ah ah lot of furore in the US about a members of a, quote, cult-like group tied to a Border Patrol agent's murder, and things are ongoing there. They're that they're looking at to what what's happened and is so-and-so connected to it or not.
00:26:28
Speaker
But there's been a lot of, if you go searching for vegan news or indeed...
Misleading Headlines and Veganism
00:26:33
Speaker
people might have shared it with you already, you will see headlines like, we've got this one from MSN, transgender leader of bizarre radical vegan cult tied to multiple murders across America, jailed until trial.
00:26:46
Speaker
You read through the article and there's basically nothing to do with the fact that this the one of the members of the group is transgender and that them and possibly other the people in this group are vegan. It doesn't seem to really feature anywhere other than maybe in one sentence it's mentioned, but it has nothing, there's no suggestion that a murder has been carried out in the name of veganism or anything to do with someone's gender identity either. Julie, that the two of us have had the misfortune of wading through this this story, which is not a pleasant one, obviously, you know um involving a murder. Could you see any reason why the word vegan has
00:27:26
Speaker
been used in the multiple headlines that have been popping up this week around this story? Oh, just because it catches people's attention and for people who are looking to hate on vegans, here's another reason to appeal to those, and sector of the news-consuming market. It really is a puzzling article, this one. It's worrying the lack of awareness that it shows.
00:27:56
Speaker
Transgender leader, first of all, there isn't a such a thing. do know what mean? Because leader isn't a gender, You can't be a transgender... Because you have to be a transgender woman or a trans... You know I mean? transgender man. yeah A transgender leader doesn't make any sense. Of Bizarre, I think if there was a cult that was going around killing people, which they we don't know because people, just because they're ah suspected, doesn't mean that it's actually been them.
00:28:27
Speaker
But Bizarre is probably not a very accurate description. Bizarre radical, don't know where they get that from, vegan cult.
00:28:38
Speaker
Well, this person might be leading a cult and this person might be someone who eats a vegan diet.
00:28:52
Speaker
He doesn't follow a vegan lifestyle, I don't think, judging by if the other things that he's done are true. but Or they have done, I should say. But I don't know the pronouns that this person wants to use, you see.
00:29:06
Speaker
But ah just because, I mean, I'm a vegan. But I might start a cult that isn't a vegan cult just because I'm a vegan. Do know what I mean? But um yeah, a perplexing article full of prejudice and and inaccuracy and non-understanding of things. I mean, I know we're a vegan show. We don't need to be talking too much about transgenderism.
00:29:35
Speaker
But listen to this. La Sota is a man who identifies as a transgender woman.
00:29:45
Speaker
What's wrong with that sentence, children? you know what mean? If someone identifies as a transgender woman, that's what they you know? How dare you question the journalistic integrity of msn.com, Julie? I'm appalled. Oh, goodness.
00:30:02
Speaker
My goodness. So the sentence where a veganism comes in is he also called himself vegan, and described people who eat meat as carnists yes yeah um yeah that kind of that makes sense that's what lots of people do that doesn't mean anything in particular so yeah really kind From me, shoddy journalism, I also watched a little piece on YouTube. It was a news presenter presenting a so-called story. There wasn't much story to it about these three individuals.
00:30:48
Speaker
And she was making a big thing about this person in question, who's who's referred to as Jack, aim about this person's face and how menacing and and awful... ah Just looked like a very ordinary face to me, to be honest with you.
00:31:09
Speaker
But really super duper unprofessional and just absolutely baiting the crowd. Just to absolutely stirring up as much hatred and antagonism and intolerance and and everything as possible.
00:31:27
Speaker
You do wonder whether these reporters or editors kind of almost have a checklist of, here's some key things. If you get this in any story, i don't know, vegan, maybe not white, single parent family, came over on a boat, Afghan, like anything like that, get that in the headline.
00:31:42
Speaker
Gram as much as you can in. Yeah, it Yeah. And it's it it needs calling out because really it is very thinly veiled or not veiled at all bigotry because it is just othering. It is saying if you want anything, if there is anything about you that is different to the norm. So what if they're transgender?
00:32:00
Speaker
What does that have to do with anything? So what if they're vegan? Like that doesn't have anything to do with anything. And it is just basically a way of trying to frighten people in into being different and of course it's awful that someone's been murdered of course it is no one's going to say otherwise but like this this whole other ring and this whole kind of like oh did you hear they they do this with their free time or whatever well if it's not hurting anyone what what does it matter what's that got to do with anything so yeah think it needs calling out so if you're feeling courageous call out that kind of bigotry i say let's move on to perhaps some journalism with a bit more integrity this comes to us from the hunt sabs website and they are talking about a special report that was done on bbc's country file program can't say that's a a program that i watch particularly regularly however last week they did
00:32:51
Speaker
ah mark the 20th anniversary of the enactment of the Hunting Act with a special report.
Illegal Fox Hunting Issues
00:32:57
Speaker
And from the Huntsab's perspective, I can't say I've actually watched the programme myself, but they said it came across very, very well. So there was a Huntsab, an MP, Assistant Chief Constable, all agreeing that illegal fox hunting was still widespread under the current act.
00:33:15
Speaker
they were that There was one person representing the hunters, on the documentary and basically they don't seem to have come across very well at all. date they dave They chose to have a spokesperson, Richard Gurney, who apparently is a member of the country's most convicted hunt, so particularly poor choice on on that hunt's PR team, but they as as good as admitted that trail hunting was basically their plan B in case Sabs turned up.
00:33:45
Speaker
ah they As good as said, yeah, we still hunt, but we have to have this pretend thing just in case anyone's watching. And also somebody from the the hunt did get up in the BBC camera's face and was very aggressive towards them ah before apologising. So basically, Paul, a great bit of PR for for those of us who are anti-hunting and bad news for those who are still trying to do it, I think.
00:34:10
Speaker
Yeah, going to the bit that... jumped out at me was uh you find yourself bamboozled as to why they would pick out what seems like the worst person it's like some kind of it's a bit like some kind of bumbling fool would get out and you'd hope that their their fellow idiot hunters would be sitting there going oh god not him again he's said there don't say that it's kind of and like you say you just decide brilliant you crack on mate with your ridiculous uh statements like uh yeah yeah i mean it's it's uh like you said going back to the original point um you know the the kind of should we say these supportive or perhaps neutral parties are mps etc might say neutral ah all like ah accepting the i think what we all know is about what really goes on with with drug hunting and which is still you know consistently denied by by hunters but so yeah that was that was a that was a positive
00:35:06
Speaker
may we uh may we see that used to make the act even more stringent moving moving forwards um i know there was been there's been some press as well this week with mike foster you know obviously who introduced the bill um originally who was a my local mp talking about all the stuff he's gone through as well with this um over the time so it was yeah interesting reflection not where we want to be i guess ultimately but we're it's certainly further forward than um maybe what some of us might have thought going back many years ago yeah i think there's a good chance that that this bumbling idiot who did appear on the program actually is the best that the hunters can can put for and there's a very good chance that a lot of people they'd say absolutely do not let that person on it it it might be that actually this is the best they've got and uh yeah long may that continue and uh you know continue painting themselves into corners right we're going to be back in a moment with pick of the week where we will be talking greyhounds and prawns
00:36:09
Speaker
Okay, pick of the week time. Julie, we're going to start off with you. I've just read the opening sentence of yours. Can I can i read it out? Because it it sounds like someone's being really ironic. It's from the Daily Mail.
00:36:21
Speaker
Waitrose have promised to kill prawns humanely. after animal rights campaigners said the creatures feel pain. I mean, really, that's a really nice, simple statement for those people who are reading the Daily Mail. You know, it's putting it really, really basically, isn't it?
00:36:40
Speaker
But so tell us a bit more about this story and and your response to it. Okay, story first. Yes, just as you said, waitrose sell king prawns and they are going to make sure that they're killed in a different way than they are currently killed.
00:36:58
Speaker
Currently, Prawns are killed by putting them in ice slurry and they die of asphyxiation. It takes them sometimes up to three or four hours to die and sometimes they are not killed by that process and yet they are cut and you know because people can't eat all of the little bodies of these wee individuals so there lots of bits of them that have to be cut out and taken out.
00:37:24
Speaker
and they can still be alive when that happens. They are going to make sure that they're phasing in, it's not going to be an overnight thing, that these little beings are killed by some kind of means of electrocution.
00:37:41
Speaker
They are bragging about the fact that they have already banned the practice of what they, well, what and the industry call eye stock ablation,
00:37:54
Speaker
And really what that means is female prawns get their eyes cut out because female prawns' breeding cycle depends on sight and their perception of light.
00:38:06
Speaker
If you remove their wee eyes, then they will breed more often and then they become more profitable. How disgusting is that? I couldn't believe that when I read that, that they're like you say, they're bragging, saying, hey, don't worry, guys, we've already banned that people. fit like What kind of a but ah brag is that? yeah Don't worry, we don't cut their eyes out.
00:38:29
Speaker
You're kind of going, hang on, I wasn't even thinking you were. What are you talking about? I know, So now they're saying all of Waitrose's farmed prawns will now be electrically stunned.
00:38:41
Speaker
And there's pressure on other retailers to do the same. In the UK here in 2022, the yeah UK government provided legal recognition that these little beings, little animals from the sea, crabs, shrimps and prawns, that they can feel pain and that they can suffer and that they can experience distress. I think there's three different things that they found out.
00:39:08
Speaker
They're still saying they they need more research, which I think is just horrible to hear. So that's kind of the long and short of ah I would like, you need a degree to be a journalist, so you need to be pretty clever, I would have thought.
00:39:24
Speaker
I would like a ban on the term humane slaughter in the same way that a journalist wouldn't unless they were talking in ironic terms or quoting somebody, they wouldn't get away with writing an article about the tooth fairy or something. I mean, it's just, it's a contradiction in terms. It really is.
00:39:46
Speaker
And it's not harmless because it gets into people's psyche and they start to think that it exists and that it's a thing. And that I think is really holding the animal rights movement back.
00:39:59
Speaker
And I would like to see that term utterly banned unless we're talking about it in the past tense and saying this is what people used to use as a term and it's ridiculous. you know It needs to become ah an expression from history that everybody goes, oh my goodness, weren't we naive? Weren't we daft? Imagine thinking that and writing that, you know, flat earth, humane slaughter.
00:40:25
Speaker
We need to make that redundant. I think, in a way, I'm pleased that the story has come to light. These wee beings that live in the sea, there are people out there who are animal lovers who probably wouldn't eat meat.
00:40:43
Speaker
and you know want to be kind to all animals but who don't count these wee shrimp people and the wee prawns and the wee shellfish folk they don't count them as sentient beings and they think it doesn't matter and I had the experience of going at a Chinese restaurant and they thought it was fine to give me you know a dish with prawns in it you know and i was like no no And they didn't seem to think they were really sort of living things.
00:41:13
Speaker
So I'm pleased that this is coming to light because I don't know that ah that everybody thinks about the way that these little beings live and the way that they are slaughtered.
00:41:25
Speaker
And if anybody out there, I'm sure that most of the people listening to this podcast, hello there, everybody. are vegan but if you have friends who are that friend who avoid meat because they love animals but they eat fish for example or they know they eat these little things but they are people who are interested in the environment Please tell them that they are bankrolling, they are funding and supporting the most destructive type of fishing that is you can possibly get.
00:42:01
Speaker
Absolutely. It's a huge market. These little beings are theyre raised in two different ways. They're either raised out in the sea where they need to be caught by nets that are very small gauge nets that catch lots of other things as well. it's called bycatch, which then dies and gets chucked back in the sea.
00:42:25
Speaker
And this fishing practice is incredibly damaging to the sort of ecosystem of our seas. Or the ones that in the UK here, certainly the ones that are in our supermarkets and restaurants and all the rest of it are from Southeast Asia, I think, off the top of my head.
00:42:46
Speaker
And they are farmed. So mangroves have been... completely destroyed you know inland areas that are really important carbon sinks have been destroyed to make these great big concrete pools to raise these little beings in all crushed in together and they're only allowed to live for I think about 100 days before they're killed and then the water that they've been living in, which has got tons of diseased ones and dead ones, that gets tipped out into the sea, polluting the sea. They produce lots of methane and also they're fed fish.
00:43:25
Speaker
So they are trawling about fishing fish to feed to the little prawns to feed to humans. It's just, you couldn't make it up. but It's ridiculously wasteful and destructive and awful.
00:43:39
Speaker
And if people could just take a moment and reconsider and just choose something different instead of little prawns, that would make an enormous difference to not just the seas and the health of the seas.
00:43:57
Speaker
And obviously, you know, the wee animals wouldn't suffer, but the the health of these inland areas as well. It's massive, massive. market I didn't know till I looked into what a size of a market is.
00:44:12
Speaker
Hello listeners in America, I'm afraid you're the country with the biggest consumption of these little creatures. If you can persuade your friends that there are wonderful alternatives out there and they don't need to be consuming.
00:44:25
Speaker
These wee things tiny things. There's very little to eat in them. They've got no defence at all. They are utterly defenceless, tiny little creatures.
00:44:38
Speaker
But just because they're tiny doesn't mean they don't feel pain and suffer and want to live and all the rest of it. They are just, you know, they're at our mercy. And, you know, what do you do when something's at your mercy?
00:44:49
Speaker
You know, you should show it mercy, surely to goodness. I have to say this this did make me think of pescatarians, not to pick on people, but there's there's clearly a group of people there that ah are thinking to themselves, you know what? I'm going to choose not to end those particular animals' lives. But actually, as this article um states, that according to the Shrimp Welfare Project, five times more than all the land farm and and land animals that are killed in a year, five times as many as all those animals put together equals the number of shrimp.
00:45:22
Speaker
that are killed each year. That's just shrimp. that's That's not other that's no other ah fish um as as well. So, you know, the the number of animals' lives that are being ended just by eating, quote, seafood is is huge, isn't it? And there isn't anybody speaking up for them. There's not really anybody speaking up for them. And you might think, oh, but Julie, aren't you forgetting? What about the Shrimp Welfare Project?
00:45:46
Speaker
Well, look, do your due diligence on them. They are not in any way that I can see helping to persuade people to eat something else or to boycott that industry or to not support it or anything at all.
00:46:00
Speaker
What the Shrimp Welfare Project, they've got a massive reach. They've got very impressive board members and all the rest of it. They are leasing things. Equipment for these companies To carry out the m electric shock treatment To kill these little beings So yes they're sort of Making their hideous ah You know unnecessary deaths faster But they're not doing anything at all To
00:46:32
Speaker
educate people about any of the ethical concerns about consuming them and killing in the first place and none of the environmental impact nothing like that it's just all about you know getting their machinery out there to do the job Can I ask Paul, I know we're both fans of ah scouring the Waitrose reduced tickets to get some ah cheeky vegan bacon um at a reasonable price.
00:46:57
Speaker
Do you think stories like this, is this is this positive PR for Waitrose? We could say, oh, this is good because it's is drawing attention to the horrible practices that are happening to to animals in in our oceans.
00:47:11
Speaker
Is it kind of letting Waitrose off the hook? Is it giving them some positive PR or can people see through that? i don' I think probably, and i'm going to is this is going to be a generalisation here, so apologise for it, but i I think, I can say this as a waitress shopper, um that those people like to in general hold themselves up as kind of being shopping perhaps,
00:47:31
Speaker
with some higher consideration than other supermarkets. don't know if that makes sense, but so there might be more connection with those shoppers potentially.
00:47:43
Speaker
But yeah, i mean, it doesn't really do a lot for the for them if they're still being killed. i mean, the thing that the thing that got me thinking about this one was I still know a lot of people who are pescatarians and say that they are pescatarian because of animal welfare or, and you know, not wanting to kill animals.
00:47:59
Speaker
And we've known for quite a long time now about the um pain and suffering to aquatic animals. And yeah it's almost like it hasn't quite caught up with people's logic. It's like, well, yeah, you know, you you kind of took that step ah with your chicken and beef and stuff like that. And great. But, you know, need to say we do it for milk as well. But it's is's almost like.
00:48:20
Speaker
It's very easy. You should be able to say it's it's an animal that feels pain. If that's what you're primarily against and you still want to eat have milk because you can't quite make that connection, surely that's a really easy one. You should just be able to take that off and go, well, I'll have to apply consistent logic to you know actual animals I'm directly able to see ah killed, even if I'm struggling with the stuff that's associated to milk that we know about.
00:48:44
Speaker
Yeah, it just seems to be like that people haven't quite caught up with that. No, no. And I i do think stories like this, if you're somebody who ah consumes animal products, but you like to think you're doing so in a higher welfare way, you you're not going to actually read the article. You're just going to say, oh, Waitrose are doing even better. Good. OK, I'll carry on getting my animal flesh from there. You're not going to actually read the article because you know that there's probably going to be details of how the animals are killed in there and then you're going have to face up to that. So you just go, no, it's good in here. Is it okay? Good. Yeah. I'm carry on shopping here. Okay, good. Cognitive dissonance, please.
00:49:17
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Give me my cognitive dissonance earplugs. um Okay. We've been skeptical about that story. Understandably so. Thank you for sharing that one, Julie. Here's one surely though, we can be happy about. We've taken it from the BBC news here, but there have been lots of places sharing this, including animal stories.
00:49:35
Speaker
advocacy charities and that is the news that greyhound racing is to be banned in Wales and it's Paul's pick of the week Paul why is this your pick
Animal Rights Progress in Wales
00:49:44
Speaker
of the week? Yeah I mean it's it's it's a great story i mean you have to delve in a little bit more to get some of the aspects in focus but yeah it's ah for me it's one of these ones where the symbolic decision and move probably outweighs the actual impact so yeah obviously Wales gonna stop ground racing one of the things that isn't so good is they haven't actually given a date ah so it's a little bit open-ended which worries me a little bit because you know
00:50:10
Speaker
there isn't that commitment to say by a certain date the thing here is there is only one greyhound racing track in wales so from an impact perspective you could say it's you relatively low but it's also should be relatively easy then to kind of enact that when you've only got that one track and the associated business around that.
00:50:29
Speaker
So, yeah, that was good. um um For me, it's more of a kind of where does this now lead for other debates, you know, with Scotland or England. i mean, I think if I remember rightly, and Julia probably correct me on this, if I go wrong, Scotland have only got two Greyhound tracks, I believe.
00:50:44
Speaker
And I think there's something like 17, 18 in England England so you know you would think well Scotland might be a good um target next I think they might have debated this a few years ago actually possibly in Scotland but I did catch an article we didn't quite read it all the way through so it's kind of where does this go next is is kind of my exciting bit about it it's grand race has been an interesting thing isn't over the last few years because we have seen some tracks close we have seen some tracks close and then reopen and then I think I think is it Wolverhampton that's a new track that's going to be opening or a newer version of it so it's not you know there's been some kind of
00:51:18
Speaker
negative stories when you see new operations opening but you know we've got yeah there's only one track within the m twenty five now um romford you know i think i don't know what the figures are like now for people attending it but i thought they were pretty much reducing um from when i looked at it ah some years ago i think so yeah generally a good generally a good story i think for me but it's more it's more about that first step and it's kind of opening up and sort of almost like looking in the box now going okay what happens what happens now really You're right, Paul.
00:51:50
Speaker
too Well, there are two greyhound tracks in Scotland remaining. They did... try to build one in the county that I live in And in fact, they started building it. They started building the grandstand. There was tons of local opposition, including from myself.
00:52:07
Speaker
And yeah, they got planning permission all the rest of it, but it's lapsed. Nothing has happened. It didn't get through. But I don't know that it was a victory for animal rights. I think it was more just that the agreement that was reached between the person who was putting up the money to build the stadium with the house builders that were in the area at the time I think that deal fell through so but there was a huge amount of opposition that sounds like they absolute the absolute best way of it happening it's it's almost like building an abattoir but none of the animals actually get to it's just like wasting carnists money just like build all the infrastructure and then at the last minute go
00:52:47
Speaker
Now you're not allowed. You're not allowed. Take it down. And then make it a vegan restaurant. Yeah. Yeah. yeah Well, interestingly, one of the ah kind of beat the BBC sort of do their balance thing, don't they? Which, of course, is very important.
00:52:58
Speaker
um But they towards the end of this article, um the Labour MP for Kerfilly. Oh, sorry, it's it's not the MP, the Labour MS. I'm not sure what that means. But anyway, someone from the Labour Party in Kerfilly said, i'm I'm worried because the track is on a floodplain.
00:53:14
Speaker
And actually, if there's a ban, and this this stadium gets taken down, there's going to be derelict land on a floodplain adjacent to my constituency. So it's almost saying like, the only good thing that the Greyhound track was doing was helping to sort of soak up floodwater.
00:53:30
Speaker
or something like that which i think is quite a nice nice little quote but it doesn't seem like there's that much backlash for it no no i mean there's there's the inevitable backlash like you say with the balanced view from the um greyhound is it the gbgb great i can't remember what it stands for but i like their quote well i like it because it's ridiculous obviously this has nothing to do with the welfare of animals and more to do with extreme animal rights movement i'm just like Yeah, it's just kind of like ridiculous, really, isn't it?
00:54:02
Speaker
But yeah, it's its it seems it seems just a ridiculous statement, doesn't it? Well, i I think actually, you know, as a minority as we are. I think there's probably more vegans in Wales than there are people that go to greyhound racing. So actually to call animal rights people extreme is probably not statistically true when compared to greyhound racing. I think you'd call them greyhound racing extremists in Wales if there's only one track. Just one thing I wanted to pick up think it's actually. It's a cult, yeah, yeah.
00:54:34
Speaker
They're probably transgender as well and, you know, have disabilities and other things. Yes, I really liked how the Deputy First Minister, when announcing this, cited the fact that New Zealand have banned greyhound racing.
00:54:53
Speaker
um a couple of months ago to just that domino effect of people wanting to be seen to be doing the right thing. I mean, really, the animals don't care how change happens. They just need it to happen, don't they?
00:55:06
Speaker
And actually, if it happens in a sort of peer pressure way going like, oh, my God, are you seeing all these other countries or these other constituencies or these other people near me who are starting to not do these things anymore?
00:55:18
Speaker
If that's what makes you change, it doesn't bloody matter. Like, just stop doing it. So I think hopefully we can see the domino effect continue yeah and i think they cited new zealand as well they cited new zealand as well because um they uh managed to get the uh policy and the actual implementation very quickly didn't they because ah they have said they'd like to get it in as soon as possible um i'd i'd much rather say rather than that kind of hopeful view it's kind of like actually we're going to do it in a year or two years because you know you sit set your stool out make make it make it something you're going to track yeah absolutely well we've got time for just one more story but before we cover that one we love hearing from you we love hearing your opinions you might disagree with us you might think we're rubbish you might think we've missed something or there might be something else you want to tell us if so here is how to get in touch
00:56:07
Speaker
To get in touch with us, just send us an email at enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com.
Camp Beagle Protest Victory
00:56:14
Speaker
We see ourselves as a collective. Our listenership stretches all around the world and everyone's opinions, questions, feedback and ideas are what helps shape the show.
00:56:26
Speaker
Go on, send us a message today. enough of the falafel at gmail dot com Okay, so our last story of the week comes from Camp Beagle. If you do not know what Camp Beagle is, I'll do my best to very quickly summarise it for you.
00:56:43
Speaker
um and MBR Acres is somewhere in the east of England um where they have a licence to breed animals for animal testing and research. And for several years now, June 2021,
00:56:56
Speaker
it started there have been activists outside basically continuously for the whole time i don't know that anyone technically lives there although people might have been there for a very very long time and not really returned home very frequently um but lots of support um there for for the people who are saying no this is not a good thing to do they're protesting um the work that is done there and the animal rights implications for it john curtain has been ah part of that group. He's been described as ah living there semi-permanently, so i I imagine he has a legal address somewhere else, but does spend a lot of time there. um An injunction was launched against him. It was in the High Court.
00:57:40
Speaker
Lots of to-ing and fro-ing saying, should he be allowed to to be here? There was accusations of of trespass and contempt of court um and interfering with vehicles.
00:57:51
Speaker
And basically, the long and the short of it is it the the judge has come down in a positive way. And certainly that is John Curtin's take on this this matter. in that the judge has allowed Camp Beagle to peacefully protest.
00:58:06
Speaker
um And John Curtin himself said, it's the first time it's ever happened to me. I'm looking forward to going back to camp. Obviously, a lot of people involved in protest and direct action might have had brushes with the law in the past. And that's certainly the case for Mr Curtin. But it seems like it was a a happy trip to court in that basically other than a small fine of 90 pounds for being in contempt of court basically there were no other real exclusions that that practically impact the protest work that is going on there unless i've read that wrong i mean julie paul do jump in at this point if you disagree if you think there is a
00:58:46
Speaker
a massive obstacle that that's come from this. But i I couldn't read anything. It looked really positive to me. No, he's back. He's back in his tent and he's back shouting at employees in their cars as they're leaving work and all the rest of it.
00:59:01
Speaker
I saw a live feed from his his tent ah from the gates of MBR just before the show started and everything. He's back in action. i have a lot of time for John Curtin. I hugely admire him.
00:59:17
Speaker
I don't know if he listens to the podcast. Hello, John, if you are listening. Because he doesn't just do this gig. You know, he's been an animal rights activist for 40 odd years and He's everywhere speaking up for animals. He does lots of speaking engagements and he was a member of the ALF back in the day.
00:59:38
Speaker
He's done so much stuff. I mean, Paul, there's got to be instances where due to high feelings and and and passion and and, you know, maybe cathartic releases, there will be times when those advocating on behalf of animals will cross a line and and will end up being prosecuted. But generally speaking, people are going to want to stay on the right side of the law so they can continue doing it.
01:00:01
Speaker
So I think this has got to be seen as like a wider victory, hasn't it? Because the the alternative would be if there's a, a negative outcome for things like this is it would put people off doing stuff, wouldn't it?
01:00:11
Speaker
Yeah, I think I suspect there's probably two schools. I thought isn't there with them people wanting to say on the right side of things because, um you know, i know I can only speak from personal to experience. I'd want to kind of be doing as much as I can while staying within the law and kind of using any loopholes within that. But then you do see,
01:00:29
Speaker
Maybe some people with animal rebellion, extinction rebellion who might see arrests and maybe even prison sentences as a way of raising awareness, which isn't necessarily. i think both together are useful, but um there's the whole argument about if you end up in prison, what you're doing for the animals. um longer term i think so yeah so yeah i think it's a good thing think you do see a lot of these cases don't you where it has to go through the whole laborious legal system to then get a change and it's probably i don't know how long this took but it's you know weeks months loads of money involved to get to a position where you probably thought this is this is how it should have been in the first place but i guess you know
01:01:09
Speaker
things don't always work out right the first time, as we know, in the in the justice system. So, yeah, good to have a hopeful final result that is positive for the animals and those supporting them. Yeah, and I think particularly in the context of what we've seen in the last few years, particularly the tail end of the the latest Tory government in the UK, in terms of restrictions on protest and things like that, I think I know a lot of people, myself included, who were worried about that and thinking, well, like, what...
01:01:37
Speaker
what can we still protest and actually the the the claims and the things that were were thrown at mr curtain in this trial were that he was causing a public nuisance that he'd harassed people he trespassed by flying a drone they were all thrown out so ah it obviously doesn't mean that you can do whatever you want and and therefore it's fine but actually it I read that as actually peaceful protest and actually a lot of the tactics that are effective in terms of bringing to light things that that the horrific things that are done to animals, like they're they're still fair game, which is that's that's a good thing, right?
01:02:14
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. As opposed to, like as we all know you know, people that have stood on a path somewhere with a with a placard and then have been taken to court for causing offence to people. There's some crazy stuff that goes on, isn't there, within the law now of protest, but... yeah When I went to, um that they they call them ah save vigils, or they certainly did when I when i went to one in in Bristol near me, and the the understanding that there was there was that um the trucks bringing animals into the slaughterhouse would stop for three minutes.
01:02:47
Speaker
And after three minutes, then that the the group of us protesting would withdraw and and and let the lorry in. I understand why, like I said at the at the top here, like I understand why emotions can boil over and people can end up crossing a line and and and doing those things. I'm not not saying it's a good or a bad thing, but i do understand how that happens. But ah actually to be able to document things and and and shout about it is surely an important part of being in a civilised culture. So I reckon this is good news.
01:03:18
Speaker
Go John and everybody at Camp Beagle. and If anybody from there, as I say, is listening, hello to you and thank you for everything you're doing. Absolutely. And I think I've said it before on the pod, but lots of different ways you can support them and in in terms of just sharing their work online. um Of course, you know, donations and things always work. Or um again, I sound like an old record, but I've i've given them raffle prizes before, um you know, that they they'll do regular raffles and and and things like that. So Lots of ways to support their good work. If you want to support our good work, we won't take your money, but here's something you could do for us.
01:03:56
Speaker
If you've enjoyed today's show, we'd love it if you could take just a few seconds to share it with someone else you think might enjoy it too. We don't have a marketing team or a budget to spend on advertising, so your referrals are the best way of spreading the free Enough of the Falafel Joy further still. And if you haven't already, we'd be really grateful if you could leave us a rating on your podcast player.
01:04:22
Speaker
That will also help the show pop up when people search for vegan or animal rights content online. Thanks for your help.
01:04:33
Speaker
Thank you everyone for listening. The next episode of Enough of the Falafel is a vegan talk episode and it's out from Thursday the 27th of February and it features Anthony, Kate and Paul and they are going to be answering the question why is honey not vegan? I'm looking forward to that one.
01:05:01
Speaker
It's a really short episode. It's just 30 seconds long. There's the intro and then we say, because it comes from an animal, and then that's it. That's it. it's real short listen, that one. um No, not true.
01:05:12
Speaker
No, not not true. It was a good chat. was a good chat. Look forward to listening to that one. Anyway, that is enough of the falafel for this episode. Thank you, Paul. Thank you, Julie. Thank you, everyone, for listening. I checked you all out online a moment ago, seeing all the different countries and towns you're coming from. First listener from Pakistan this week.
01:05:29
Speaker
Welcome, if you're listening again. I've been Anthony. You've been listening to Vegan Week from the Enough of the Falafel Collective. We'll see you next time.
01:05:41
Speaker
This has been an Enough of the Falafel production. We are just a normal bunch of everyday vegans putting our voices out there. The show is hosted by Zencaster. We use music and special effects by zapsflat.com.
01:05:56
Speaker
And sometimes, if you're lucky, at the end of an episode, you'll hear a poem by Mr Dominic Berry. Thanks all for listening, and see you next time.
01:06:22
Speaker
This episode may have come to an end, but did you know we've got a whole archive containing all our shows dating back to September 2023? twenty twenty three That is right, Dominic. There's over 100 episodes on there featuring our brilliant range of different guests, people's stories of going vegan, philosophical debates, moral quandaries, and of course...
01:06:43
Speaker
around a dozen news items from around the world each week. So check back on your podcast player to hear previous episodes. And remember to get an alert for each new episode, simply click like or follow and also subscribe to the show.
01:06:58
Speaker
Thanks for your ongoing support wherever you listen to us from.