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153- The Three Little Pigs: Starving, then stolen, now safe...all in the name of art?
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This week, Dominic, Paul, Julie & Ant start off by discussing the perculiar & sinister-sounding art installation involving three piglets being starved...to draw people's attention to animal abuse in animal ag. But the plot thickened almost as much as the artist himself, as the piglets were subsequently stolen by animal rights protestors. As well as this story, we also look at nine other news articles from the vegan & animal rights space from the last week or so.
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Enough of the Falafel is a community of people who love keeping on top of the latest news in the world of veganism & animal rights. With the Vegan Week podcast, we aim to keep listeners (& ourselves) informed & up-to-date with the latest developments that affect vegans & non-human animals; giving insight, whilst staying balanced; remaining true to our vegan ethics, whilst constantly seeking to grow & develop.
Each week we look through news stories from the past 7 days in the world of veganism & animal rights.
If you spot any news stories that might catch our fancy, or have an idea for a discussion topic, get in touch via enoughofthefalafel@gmail.com.
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This week's stories:
https://www.irishnews.com/news/world/piglets-left-to-starve-as-part-of-controversial-art-exhibition-stolen-KYBYI3LHYZN27HTFXMNBYO2R5U/
https://www.theanimalreader.com/2025/03/01/wimbledon-donates-tennis-balls-to-shelter-harvest-mice/
https://abcnews.go.com/amp/US/alaska-sled-dog-race-raises-allegations-animal-abuse/story?id=119223075
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/mar/03/spain-iberian-lynx-rewilding-lobbying-hunters-farmers
https://vegconomist.com/company-news/proveg-nigeria-partners-v-label-promote-vegan-products/
https://www.fooddive.com/news/coca-colas-fairlife-cuts-ties-with-2-arizona-farms-tied-to-animal-cruelty/741227/
https://www.rspca.org.uk/getinvolved/campaign/farming/pigstunning#:~:text=We%20demand%20an%20alternative&text=Gases%20like%20argon%20offer%20potential,crucial%20to%20improving%20animal%20welfare.
https://sammamishindependent.com/2025/02/council-mandates-vegan-catering-for-city-provided-food/amp/
https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2025/mar/02/lamb-watch-holidays-lambing-weekends-tourists-uk-farms
https://www.farmprogress.com/farm-business/one-company-s-waste-milk-is-a-farm-s-white-gold
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Thanks everyone for listening; give us a rating and drop us a message to say "hi"; it'll make our day!
Dominic, Paul, Julie & Ant
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Transcript
Introduction and Focus on Vegan Week
00:00:00
Speaker
Hello everybody, welcome to your one-stop shop for this week's vegan and animal rights news. I'm Anthony, joining me for this episode, we've got three people, Julie, Dominic and Paul, but that is enough of the falafel, it is time for Vegan Week.
00:00:17
Speaker
So I think vegans go looking for trouble even when they're not looking for trouble. That's not what butter's used for. Brrr! Protein! Take your lab-grown meat elsewhere. We're not doing that in the state of Florida. about your protein and what about your iron levels? Should I call the media and say, hi, sorry? they They're arguing like, oh, poor woe is me, oh no.
00:00:37
Speaker
Hang on a minute, you always pick the phone.
Controversial Art and Ethics of Using Animals
00:00:44
Speaker
Hello everybody, Julie here. Welcome to show. Thank you very much for joining us. long as you't get the wee bruant with the horns you'll be all alright does veganism give him
00:01:02
Speaker
i don't have laser vision and hello everybody julie here welcome to the show thank you very much for joining us Hello everyone, I'm Paul and just to say if you're new to the show, this is our news show and it's where we look through last week's news that has vegan and animal rights impacts.
00:01:23
Speaker
Hello, hello, hello, my name is Dominic and I'm really happy to be here as always. But that is enough of the falafel. Let us hear what's been going on in the news this week.
00:01:38
Speaker
For more details on the upcoming news stories, including links to our original source material, check out our show notes for this episode, available on your podcast player.
00:01:52
Speaker
Okay, we'll start our roundup with half a dozen stories that I will fire at Dominic, Paul and Julian get their take on this. First one comes to us from Copenhagen in Denmark, potentially very upsetting and and quite bizarre as well.
00:02:07
Speaker
So the story here, as reported from the Irish news we've taken this from, were three piglets who were being allowed to starve as part of a controversial art exhibition in Denmark, they have been stolen, according to the artist. so lots lots of contrary things going on there. So the artist, born in Chile, Marco Evaristi, he said he'd been aiming to raise awareness of the suffering caused by mass meat production with his art installation that opened last week in Copenhagen.
00:02:37
Speaker
But by doing so, he was denying these piglets food and water. And apparently they would have been allowed to starve to death. But it's been revealed that these piglets were taken by animal rights activists who were assisted by his friend, Caspar Stephenson.
00:02:56
Speaker
Dominic, when I read that, I kind of think that that was part of the plan all along. Is that your take or am I being... You took the words out of my mouth. Yeah, yeah, took the words out of my mouth. do kind of wonder whether, you know, I don't know. So I'm experiencing this story for the first time. I've not read or heard about this story before. You've just said about it, Ant. And hearing it, I was thinking some people are less egoic than I am as a performance artist. So I go around saying vegan poetry and make no mistake, love it when people tell me I'm good. buzz off Maybe this fella... Maybe he was really, mean, I'm being generous here because maybe this wasn't the case, but maybe he was up for the negative comments on himself when all along the plan was to have his friend be involved in freeing the animals.
00:03:53
Speaker
And yeah, I don't know. i don't know. It's a really complicated. story isn't it yeah yeah yeah and I mean i can't really understand any other interpretation of that in that you know if you follow the link in the show notes that we we do for all our stories you can read read it in full details. Like he's saying like, oh, I get a lot of hate messages, but my work is about animal rights. i'm I'm trying to raise awareness of these things. But I don't see how you can do that whilst basically starving animals. that's That's not animal rights, is it? Like no matter, the that surely the means don't justify the ends.
00:04:29
Speaker
Yeah, to be devil's advocate and say an opinion that is definitely not my opinion, I guess that if the story is as read that that was his intent to starve three piglets.
00:04:43
Speaker
I guess he could try to justify it by saying it's for the greater good that like to raise awareness and make more people vegan or not. I mean, you know, when people talk about the impact of say individual animals I've had critics say to me, well, what's the point? What's the point? You know, and it's like, you know, the the industry still exists, so the the terrible barbarism still exists. It's like, well, it means everything to that one individual pig or that one individual cow, doesn't It means everything to them. So kind like the opposite is true in this. case isn't it that i would definitely say
00:05:21
Speaker
that if the story is as read, that the ends don't justify the means. what But i'm I'm choosing to be a conspiracy theorist and hope that it was all a big planned thing and that actually the three piglets were never in any
Animal Welfare Concerns in the Iditarod Race
00:05:35
Speaker
danger. That's what I'm choosing to do. got no evidence for that no evidence at all other than like his friend being one of the activists that seems a little uh yeah let's hope well well i mean sure surely you could raise that awareness by starving yourself and putting yourself in a cage you know if you want to do that like those pigs haven't consented have they but yeah who knows who knows what's going on in the in the mind of this chalet and artist but it's made the news and it seems like those three piglets are safe
00:06:05
Speaker
Now, let's move on to Julie's first story. Some of you might not know, Julie's a bit of an endurance athlete. She's a very accomplished runner. And this story has some similarities, only Julie consents to take part in her long distance races. But this Idatorod trail sled dog race contains participants who, I think it's clear, are not participating It's known as the last great race.
00:06:31
Speaker
It's a 1000 mile race held annually in Alaska since it started in 1973. occurs during the peak of Alaska's winter, i.e. the 1st of March. That is when it has taken place in the last week as we record now. and it requires dogs and mushers, which is the name of the drivers of the sled, to travel through frozen rivers, mountains and blizzards.
00:06:55
Speaker
Due to a lack of snow, this year's race has got a different starting point, um which extends the competition even further. It's added an extra 150 miles. But it's getting some backlash, I would say thankfully, in that some argue that the race is a form of animal abuse, with dogs working under high levels of stress in extreme weather conditions. ABC News, who you might have heard of, they requested comment from editor Rod, um but basically they didn't get anything back.
00:07:27
Speaker
Julie, you've had a look at this one a bit more closely. What do you make of it? Oh, horrible. Absolutely horrible. These dogs are running, as you see, a total of a thousand miles. They're running a hundred miles a day, all roped to each other and pulling someone on a sledge. So they're not just running that distance, they're pulling that distance.
00:07:51
Speaker
The dogs are dragged along the ground if they need to stop running. They are just dragged and they have to do the toilet as they're running often.
00:08:02
Speaker
So the leading cause of death among the dogs participating, and some of them do die, is aspiration pneumonia, which is inhaling your own vomit and then you know the the lung infection. that It's not even a fast death. I've seen people die from that.
00:08:22
Speaker
And, you know, it's ah the most revolting death you can imagine. So that's what the dogs die of. There's even, it's written into the rules what you have to do if your dog dies in the race, that you have to take it to the nearest checkpoint, as if people should have to be told that.
00:08:41
Speaker
Can you imagine how heartless those people must have been? They must have been leaving their dogs at the side of the race. Yeah. so we've had to make That goes against this quote that there is in this article from a veterinarian who's saying, oh, no, no, the race is safe.
00:08:54
Speaker
Who's saying, oh, in the last 14 years, only seven of the 14,000 dogs have died. Well, you know, that that rule being built in suggests that, you know, it's not an unthinkable thing to happen.
00:09:05
Speaker
But they're not counting the dogs that die in training and they're not counting the dogs that die after the race is over because I say aspiration pneumonia takes a while to kill you. But also 80% of the dogs who've completed that race have persistent lung damage and they have a 61% higher rate of stomach ulcers and erosions.
00:09:27
Speaker
So obviously the dogs are put under a huge amount of stress and it has a horrible effect on their health. It's one thing to go for a run as a consenting human, but as an animal, to be tied to a whole load of other animals.
00:09:42
Speaker
If you're the parent the animal who is not feeling well or who has hurt themselves, but everyone else is continuing to run and you're tied to them, you do not have a choice about stopping. So it is hugely cruel.
00:09:56
Speaker
I must admit, I don't even like the look of Canicross, to be perfectly honest with you. Good for PETA. They are on the site. It must be freaking cold out there.
00:10:06
Speaker
They are holding demos at this race. a And good for them for doing. So I would say to the people who would participate in something like that or enjoy the spectacle of it or whatever it is, not that they'd be listening to this, but do know what?
00:10:23
Speaker
If they really want to show the world how good they are at getting pulled along on a freaking sledge, then they should get 12 to 16 of their mates to agree to pull them along for a thousand miles in the snow, in the worst weather, at the worst time of year and all that.
00:10:46
Speaker
And if they can do that well and good, carry on, And you know what? See if they can't persuade 12 or 16 of their mates to do that. Maybe they shouldn't be forcing their dogs to
Growing Vegan Movement in Nigeria
00:10:57
Speaker
either. Yeah, just comes down to consent, doesn't it? It really is as simple as that. But like you say, well done, Peter, for raising awareness. And if you go onto their website, we'll put a link in the show notes.
00:11:07
Speaker
um You can add your support to their their wishes there. We're going to move on to a story from Nigeria. We reported a couple of weeks ago from some brilliant progress in Ghana with regards to veganism and animal rights. So great to have another story out of Africa. The food awareness organisation ProVeg Nigeria, they have partnered with Global Vegan Certification V-Label. That is the sort of yellow flag.
00:11:32
Speaker
label with the green writing on it to promote plant-based and vegan products throughout Nigeria and the whole of sub-Saharan Africa. um According to this article that comes to us from Veg Economist, Nigeria is said to have seen significant changes in dietary patterns in recent years, growing number of people avoiding or simply reducing their intake of animal products. Consequently, the country is a rapidly expanding market for sustainable and ethical products.
00:11:59
Speaker
One report suggests that the Nigerian food market will grow with a compound annual growth rate of 10.3% in the next seven years. The V-label,
00:12:12
Speaker
ah the vlabel It is already active on the African continent, has been for a few years. V-Label South Africa operates under ProveG as well. So great to see that growing, Paul. I mean, it's I don't know, we we might have a stereotypical view that perhaps there isn't you know being...
00:12:28
Speaker
Being vegan in and somewhere like Nigeria might be next to impossible. But if if there's a call for labelling and a need for it, that that suggests it is growing. Yeah, it's good news story from a part of the world that I guess probably not a lot of us know about. But I was looking at this article and it does talk about in 2023 that 4% of Nigerians describe themselves as vegan.
00:12:49
Speaker
Further 17% identified as vegetarian, while 32% said they're flexitarian. So they're flearian so they they're that you know they're not not bad figures compared to a lot of other things. countries that we might think are perhaps of quite engaged with veganism.
00:13:05
Speaker
um yeah good Great to hear it's growing in popularity and established by sorry supported by established organisations like ProVeg and as you said, it's sub-Saharan region as well as Nigeria.
00:13:16
Speaker
So, yeah, it's a a good a good news story. I'm actually off to a Nigerian tapas restaurant in London soon, as we've just opened up. So um I'm hoping to sample some of that food ah fairly soon. I think it's in Tottenham. So, yeah.
00:13:28
Speaker
Fantastic. Listeners won't be able to tell this because we are audio only. But just as Paul said that, both Dominic and Julie just perked up. Hang on. What? What? What? what where Where is this? Tell me. Tell me more. Tell me more.
00:13:41
Speaker
um right let's move on now again just to give some background as to the people we have on the pod did you know listeners that dominic last year was glastonbury festivals Poet in Residence and obviously Glastonbury Festival is like a big cultural event in the UK where we are recording from but another mainstay of British culture is the Wimbledon Tennis Championships that takes part takes place in early July and they have made the news in the Animal Reader brilliant website if you haven't visited it before check out the animalreader.com
00:14:18
Speaker
ah they've been featured in the animal reader this week because apparently Wimbledon's iconic tennis balls over 55,000 of them that are used in the tournament each year they are apparently finding a second life providing safe
Wimbledon and Animal Welfare Initiatives
00:14:33
Speaker
shelters for a harvest mice in England so instead of discarding these balls once they've been used Wimbledon have partnered with the wildlife trusts across the country to repurpose them as weatherproof nests harvest mice are really quite small, so at five to seven centimetres, weighing as little as four grams.
00:14:52
Speaker
Goodness me, that just makes your heart melt, doesn't it? And naturally, they would build a round nest from woven grass, usually hidden in tall vegetation, but due to agriculture and urban expansion reducing their habitats it is harder so uh Wimbledon have made this iconic uh I say iconic what what do you reckon Dominic like is that are we being cynical are we saying oh they're just going for a any bit of PR or is is this a nice little move that they're making here what do you think i think it sounds a really good thing i suspect that most people presume that companies
00:15:31
Speaker
do ethical stuff when so many people live in areas where recycling is enforced it's not enforced where I am I live in Manchester city centre and the recycling is terrible here it's a real challenge do you compare that to people who live more suburban where there's like all the jokes about oh been out on this day blue bin brown bin what bin is it that's not the case like recently you'd think that it's like a liberal hotbed the city center not at all not all so it's lovely to hear that someone as massive as this is is doing something so so great of course we need to remind ourselves that the whole reason why um you know habitats are under threat is because of people it's not because of the natural predators i think again another narrative that often comes in is people being like oh isn't it great that we help out these little animals they don't get eaten by foxes you know aren't we and it's like
00:16:26
Speaker
Well, they're not the biggest threat to them. We are! We're the biggest threat. So it's the least we can do to try and do something to counterbalance that. So, yeah, on the face of things, good on Wimbledon. What a lovely thing to hear. i have i have a worry, though, this.
00:16:42
Speaker
Dogs quite like to pick up tennis balls, don't they? And I was thinking about, ah don't know where these are going to be, but... I just worried about these little mice being inside these balls and their dogs seeing it again oh tennis ball grabbing it and not having a great result that that kind of crossed my mind pessimistic maybe but no absolutely well I I was thinking of that that that smell that tennis balls have that doesn't strike me as a particularly natural smell I'm wondering like you know what the the impact I'm you would have you would imagine someone would tested this out and checked it was, ah checked it worked.
00:17:13
Speaker
But I don't know, there could be long-term downsides. But anyway, I don't want don to put too much of a negative spin on it. Oh, that was a good little pun there, spin. Anyway. and Thank you, thank you, thank you.
00:17:24
Speaker
I imagine, as you say, Dominic, we are the biggest impact. And again, not to, you know, piss on Wimbledon's parade too much, but I wondered if they swapped all the cream in the strawberries and cream that they serve up to plant-based cream, you know, whether we could argue there's actually a bigger impact on on the world. Or go to play devil's advocate, to go back to the comparison of the artist and like, you know, one animal suffering, one animal being saved.
00:17:55
Speaker
Like, of course, vegan cream, vegan cream, plant-based impact. But for those little mice, if they're having a better time, that's of a greater impact to them as individual lives.
Rewilding and the Ethics Involved
00:18:06
Speaker
so They can do both, can't they? think do both i can do both definitely yeah okay flavor of the month coming up we have been talking a lot about rewilding and introduction of species and things like that in the last few months with good reason it's been in the news and we've got another story here coming to us from the Guardian from Spain where we are hearing of a story where last year's apparent conservation success story it seems to be at risk or possibly already backfiring. This is the story that the Iberian lynx
00:18:46
Speaker
which apparently had been close to extinction, um had sprung back to life, quote unquote, thanks to a two decade long effort to expand the population. However, that progress is already at risk.
00:18:59
Speaker
Several regional governments in Spain have listened to pressure from farmers and hunters, interestingly, to block the introduction of the species in into the wild. Their claims are that the wildcat preys on livestock as well as rabbits and partridges.
00:19:17
Speaker
Opponents of the lynx have made breakthroughs threatening to undo efforts that helped its population grow to about 2,000 across Spain and Portugal. Julie, I mean,
00:19:29
Speaker
We don't like to say I told you so, but I kind of feel like those words might be on your lip. Not necessarily, but I mean, I think there is a little bit of a difference between preventing extinction, you know, where there is a small population and you're just kind of helping it along and reintroducing A species totally from scratch When it hasn't lived in an area forever You know And I think there might be other ways Hopefully that you can prevent Extinction in a species Other than just uprooting Some poor animals that are wild And transporting them And transplanting them And doing all that very artificial stuff Preserving their natural habitats And the the species That they would
00:20:16
Speaker
predate upon you know things like that making sure that they've got a habitat and food and things I think would be important anyway unusually Hunters and farmers and I are in agreement about not picking up these beautiful, oh my goodness, is there anything more beautiful than a lynx?
00:20:37
Speaker
These beautiful creatures and, you know, using them a bit like pawns, just kind of placing them here, placing them there, hoping that they'll kill the rabbits here and not kill the other stuff there. And there'll be tourist attractions, but not hurt any people. And, you know, all of that.
00:20:56
Speaker
You just can't do that with animals, I'm afraid. Animals are a bit random and they breed and they kill things if they're carnivores and they do stuff that you don't plan on them doing.
00:21:10
Speaker
And yeah, it's just... This kind of selfish anthropocentrism is very evident here. It's nothing about the well-being of the lynx. It's all about what it can do for humans.
00:21:23
Speaker
The whole argument is based on that. And if the farmers are getting upset about their sheep getting killed, they're not getting upset about their sheep getting killed. They're upset about their profits being hit.
00:21:34
Speaker
Because their sheep are going to get killed by them. but it's funny how when animals in fields get killed by wild animals or even dogs over here or whatever, yes, it's horrible. It's absolutely horrible.
00:21:48
Speaker
But the farmers make out that they're crying over their sheep getting killed when they are and the business of killing sheep themselves. It's I think what is really telling about this article and what really galvanised me into kind of maintaining my view on this about transplanting animals here, there and everywhere is the photograph of the lynx running along.
00:22:13
Speaker
with a great big collar on with a sort of transponder thing and a big antennae on it you know and that is you know I mean you just think if that's the life it's leading if that's what you are giving it as an existence in its new place where it maybe isn't comfortable or hasn't the things it needs it probably wishes you hadn't bothered just leave them alone please leave them where they are now and just yeah just deal with what we've got i think and that's damage limitation humans have done some awful things but that's no excuse to try and do other stuff that might turn out to be more awful things yeah yeah it's a real real bittersweet image that one i've got up in front of me now um ah like you julie i was surprised at how much i was uh
00:23:03
Speaker
agreeing with various people that normally I wouldn't normally
Animal Cruelty Allegations and Industry Response
00:23:06
Speaker
agree with. i love this quote from the head of Aragon government's hunting and fishing department, Jorge Valero. um He said, it's wrong to bring them back just because they were here 20 or 100 years ago. It makes us look like Jurassic Park.
00:23:20
Speaker
I thought that that's really good to to remember for rewilding and things like that, isn't it? Just this kind of like, ah, chuck some of them in. That'll be great. What could go wrong? And then like a harsh cut to being savaged by a lynx inside an industrial kitchen or what whatever the scene was with the raptors in Jurassic Park.
00:23:37
Speaker
We've got to learn. Got to learn from Spielberg, really, haven't we? Anyway, let's let's move on to our last quick one here. this is is goingnna be This is going to pull at some interesting strings here.
00:23:50
Speaker
The Coca-Cola Fairlife supplier has cut ties with two Arizona farms over animal cruelty ah allegations. Like, what are we to do? Are we to film feel like we agree with Coca-Cola? What's going on?
00:24:02
Speaker
um So this is the story that following an investigation by animal... recovery mission last year. Coca-Cola's Fairlife milk brand, they've said to two farms, no, we're not we're not taking your milk anymore. The group called it egregious and frequent the animal cruelty. So quite hard hitting there. These findings were made public just over a week ago on February the 26th.
00:24:29
Speaker
It was part of a lawsuit filed in California District court They also, interestingly, alleged that Fairlife polluted nearby waterways, linking to our main story last week about Nando's chickens doing the the very same, or rather the farmers, not not the chickens themselves.
00:24:49
Speaker
um This was a six-month investigation. It revealed abuse from employees, including top managers, animals being hit, dragged, whipped, shot, shoved, force-fed and chained at the two dairy farms in Buckeye.
00:25:03
Speaker
Arizona um and in a statement Fairlife said the dairy offering has zero tolerance for animal abuse. Whilst we might not agree with that last bit Paul um in in terms of how we would decide animal abuse is i guess it's good that that this has been highlighted and and ah stance has been taken. pretty Pretty shocking stuff, really, wasn't it?
00:25:26
Speaker
Yeah, and I must admit, you know, just um rolling back a little bit, you know, just looking at the title of, like, Fair Life, it just made me think again of this sort of cringeworthy Titles we have like, you know, happy eggs and stuff like that. I mean, it's just just opposite really to what what goes on.
00:25:42
Speaker
um As you say, big time player, Coca-Cola ditching these supplies from two farms as a result of these undercover investigations and the cherry on the top being the pollution. For me, what sprung to my mind, and it's probably because it's kind of part of my work, you have to ask about the due diligence that these companies do about um when they're looking at their suppliers. And I mean, especially they're going to promote and a product as being, you know, humanely, but being based on humanely treated animals, um it wouldn't It wouldn't cost a lot for them to be having regular inspections and certainly a lot cheaper than suddenly finding that there's massive problems with the operations.
00:26:22
Speaker
i mean, it is a real sort of amateur and penny pinching approach, I think. um They do say they do third party audits, but it just feels like it's obviously not been effective. Fairlife has got a one billion pound, a one billion, one billion dollar turnover. think it must be.
00:26:38
Speaker
you know it it does start to sort of have some similarities to the RSPCA Assured scheme that we've talked about I guess you kind of get the impression they probably do a check at the start on some somewhere and go yeah it all looks good we'll trust you carry on and if you're doing due diligence on any kind of supply you regularly go back and check that where you have checks in place which obviously aren't working so yeah it seems like that in these sort of operations it still takes the undercover work to reveal the issues that are going on so fair play to the people that are doing that as you say that quotation from them about saying oh there's no place in our cooperative for this sort of mistreatment of animals but um you know you wouldn't be doing what you're doing in the first place if that was really the case that would be out of you obviously yeah absolutely and and just in terms of the money oh obviously the the priority needs to be that you know the well-being of ah sentient non-human
RSPCA's Humane Practices and Ethical Debates
00:27:31
Speaker
animals. But um if you are just looking at this through a money lens, like you say, Paul, if you do your due diligence properly, actually, they they paid out, Coca-Cola and other parties agreed to pay $21 million dollars to settle lawsuits three years ago because of false advertisement claims that their milk
00:27:51
Speaker
came from humanely treated cows so like if you're even if you're just looking at this from a money point of view like do the checks like actually prioritize these things because it will it will bite you in the bum financially if if no other way of of of course there are bigger things than money involved here but Yeah, seems really short-sighted, doesn't it?
00:28:10
Speaker
Right, that's our first six stories of the week. We're going to be back shortly with our picks of the week, where Julie is going to be looking at an RSPCA campaign.
00:28:22
Speaker
Dominic is going to be looking at some American councils in the US of A. And Paul is looking just down the road from him at some very suspect holidays.
00:28:38
Speaker
Okay, Julie, do you want to get us kicked off? We were we were surprised to see this, I i feel, this this week, this this story from the ah RSPCA. it It feels like a long time coming, but um so a strong statement against carbon dioxide being used in the killing of pigs.
00:28:55
Speaker
Yes, it was interesting to see this popping up. The RSPCA has been under fire for a very long time for its RSPCA Assured scheme, which, and for those of you who don't know, is a thing that animal agriculture animal abusers can sign up to. doesn't have to be just farmers, abattoirs, people who transport animals to be killed and all that.
00:29:25
Speaker
They can sign up to this and it means that when the product of all that abuse is in the supermarket, it gets a little logo on it saying RSPC Assured and it costs a bit more money and people can feel that what they are paying for is a approach is some has been processed, for want of a better word, in a way that is less abusive or whatever. You know, it's it's meant to be more humane and that people pay a little bit more or maybe a lot more, I don't know, but they pay more for it. so And they're meant to inspect these farms and the farms pay for that to be part of the scheme.
00:30:11
Speaker
um So it's a voluntary scheme. Anyway, the RSPCA have come under fire for, A, in the first place, having farm-assured scheme because all farms are abusing and exploiting and breeding animals to be slaughtered. So that's, if that isn't cruel, I don't know what is.
00:30:31
Speaker
But also they have more recently, well, not really recently, that's been going on for a while, but they've also come under specific criticism for the fact that their products, that the pigs that are used in their RSPCA-assured pig meat products have been stunned and killed using and carbon dioxide gas in the abattoir.
00:30:58
Speaker
So they've been specifically criticised for that. And if you've seen Joey Carbstrong's film Pignorant, then he gives a very clear x inlin explanation and an exposition. He shows you, he' he puts a camera in one of these gas chambers.
00:31:16
Speaker
So he shows how hideous these deaths are for these animals. And he also shows... how disinclined to comment or challenge the status quo the RSPCA were at the time of filming that, which wasn't that many years ago.
00:31:34
Speaker
So what they are now coming out with is a little bit of a surprise and they're saying that they've been campaigning against this practice for ages and contributing in all kinds of ways with consultations and objections and campaigns and all the rest of it. And they're inviting people ask the public to join in with them now with that. But it's it's a bit odd because we've heard nothing about this and they've even kind of alluded to that in the the article on their web and and this particular article and on their website, you know you may not be aware that we've been doing all this work.
00:32:12
Speaker
Well, yes, you're right. We were not aware because you were extremely silent when you were asked about it previously, RSPCA. Anyway, what the RSPCA are saying is that yes, the animals are that are on their assured farms will go to an abattoir and they will be killed with this hideous gas because there is no, and I quote, oh God, I hate this word, humane or economically viable alternative at the moment.
00:32:43
Speaker
And until one is found, they will continue to endorse these farms and these abattoirs and all the rest of it. So, It just makes an absolute nonsense of the reassured scheme.
00:32:57
Speaker
If they're going to approve something that they fundamentally disapprove of, where's our trust in their process? Where are the outcomes for animals? And where is the incentive for the people who are carrying out this hideous practice to do anything different if they are getting approval with the thing that they're doing?
00:33:18
Speaker
The only thing the RSPC are doing at the moment is they are supposedly insisting that the concentration of carbon dioxide is 90% as opposed to the industry standard of 80. And that apparently kills, well, stuns and then kills the pigs a little quicker.
00:33:37
Speaker
But just horrific. And of course, the elephant in the room is that what... police has an organization that claims to oppose all cruelty to all animals why is it doing why is it even involved if there is no and there isn't we know that if there is no humane wei to to kill pigs then they shouldn't be approving any of it they should be persuading people not to consume pigs if they're sticking up for animals
00:34:09
Speaker
You know, when when you're talking to a carnist and they tell you that thing about, ah, but look at my canine teeth, you know, I'm designed to eat meat. None of us humans are designed to catch and kill a pig.
00:34:23
Speaker
None of us have got the fingernails or the teeth or the running about or anything. We cannot do it. We can't do it. So I don't believe that we were designed to hunt and eat pigs at all, ever. Not even, i mean...
00:34:38
Speaker
the The ones that we have, the domestic ones, poor souls, they're very different from wild boars. But I don't think humans were capable of doing that.
00:34:48
Speaker
So, yeah, they should just leave it alone and eat something else, eat some nice plants. I would say that I i agree with the with the statement that you've said, Julie, there in terms of you know giving your approval to things, saying this method is is is is good or is better or is the least worst method.
00:35:08
Speaker
I don't think that's it that's a good move. But a couple of things you've said um in this episode so far, Dominic, in terms of like actually thinking of these pigs right now. Like, I can understand why there there could be people who want to advocate on behalf of these pigs, not not the future pigs, that kind of as vegans, by abstaining and by trying to sabotage these industries and and bring them down. we're We're doing that for the future animals, really, aren't we?
00:35:34
Speaker
i don't know. i I don't think that's something I would ever feel strongly enough to put my energy into and that I kind of feel that the strong stance of abolishing it and standing...
00:35:47
Speaker
and in that lane, I suppose, is is where my energies are best put. But I don't know. I could imagine a better put argument. I don't like this one that the RSPCA is putting out there because they are still approving certain things. But I could imagine somebody arguing for, do you know what?
00:36:04
Speaker
Someone needs to advocate on behalf of these pigs and their children and their children right now to try and incrementally reduce that suffering a little bit.
00:36:14
Speaker
i I don't know how cross I would feel at that. Like I said, I don't think it'd be for me, but I could imagine a better put argument than this that I wouldn't hate. I don't know if anyone else feels the same. I think i'd think it would have been more helpful if there was a move that said if we they're going to carry on allowing it to happen while saying it's a bad thing to say, we're going to use our influence to say,
00:36:40
Speaker
after a year or something like for example we will no longer do that so you're then using your position to try and move the industry in a different direction. Might not be perfect for vegans, totally get that.
00:36:52
Speaker
But um you could I think they could have been ah bit more could have been a bit more forceful and and done a bit more with the statement, I think. I think everything they write, whenever they write anything about, well, we're trying to make it better for the animals right now, they should always include a and as well,
00:37:12
Speaker
you know, for you to play your part and, you know, then go plant-based or go vegan or whatever. They've done it slightly. i was looking at their Facebook yesterday and because there's just been Shrove Tuesday, they were talking about eggs.
00:37:29
Speaker
They were persuading people or trying to persuade people to have free range eggs. But they did put a wee bit at the bottom of one of their posts saying, and by the way, you know, you could just avoid them altogether and be plant-based. And I think they just need to put that on every damn thing. If they are going to still try and make things better...
00:37:51
Speaker
That's really Compassion and World old Farming's job, as I see it, not the RSPCA. If they are trying to prevent cruelty, they should be trying to prevent cruelty, in my view. But yeah, they they could be doing both, but I think they should always add that at the end.
00:38:06
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. And and like like you said, Paul, that that kind of like, right, you've you've got to do something within this amount of
Plant-Based Policies in Local Councils
00:38:12
Speaker
time. Otherwise, this action is going to happen. I noticed at the top of that timeline that you were talking about, Julie, they've said um in August 2018, we were part of this joint letter asking for a ban on the use of high concentrations of CO2 for killing pigs.
00:38:27
Speaker
and to develop humane alternatives no later than the 1st of January 2024. But it's like, or what? What are you going to do if that's not done? Otherwise it's like, you'd you better stop. You'd better stop hurting those animals by next week or or or I'll be really cross, you know. It needs a bit more weight behind it.
00:38:47
Speaker
Anyway, baby, baby, baby, baby steps, perhaps. Let's move on to Dominic's pick of the week. Thank you for that one, Julie. Dominic, you are covering something we've heard about in the UK. We've heard about it in Europe, but I don't know we've reported on American, US of A American councils having plant-based catering policies for their public meetings. But that is that is your pick of the week this week, isn't it?
00:39:13
Speaker
Yeah, that's what's happening in the state of Washington. Now, my pronunciation isn't the best. City of Samamish?
00:39:25
Speaker
Is that how we're to say it? It's a great name, isn't it? Samamish. It's a good name. I might not be doing it justice with my pronunciation. But yeah, the City Council have created plant-based catering policy for public meetings where the city provides food.
00:39:42
Speaker
So there's been loads of debate within the council and it only narrowly passed by vote. But pass it has done. it was the council member Sid Gupta who introduced the idea within a resolution draft, ah comparing the low carbon footprint of plant-based foods to the high greenhouse gas emissions of meat production.
00:40:07
Speaker
ah So there has been some people arguing, well, this is like one small area. A lot of people are like, is it a lot of work for very minimal impact?
00:40:19
Speaker
um And, you know, really, really good on the people who've made it happen for arguing it. So Gupta said it is a small step, admittedly, but I think it is important because as we do move to implement our climate action plan,
00:40:34
Speaker
I would like for us to take that step before we tell our community, you know, hey, this is something you can do. So I think this ties into what Julie was saying about but how she wished that, that you know, a great number of groups would just pull. And you can go vegan at the end. And I think they're really like leading by example. They are still going to have meat stuff. like that that there There is that possibility. but The idea is that vegan stuff must, with the new policy, be at the top of of all things.
00:41:06
Speaker
And there has to be a minimum of twice as many plant-based options to meat options. So like that kind of flipping of what we usually get is i think it's a really big step i think it's really really good to lead by example what do you reckon and do you reckon it's too little to really matter or do you think it is worthy of celebration well mean we have our filters that we take in information about the world and and unfortunately for our american listeners at the moment like the picture of what the usa is like is a very conservative of you know of a very aggressive one so i i
00:41:47
Speaker
and that is a generalization and it's a country of over 300 million people isn't it many several of whom hundreds of whom in fact listen to our podcast hello out there so i mean it's i'd just take this i'd just be like yeah that's great that's great and and well done for the people pushing it forward and you know the you've just got to look at the pure numbers of these things haven't you that though it doesn't feel like a very vegan thing to say, if there's somebody out there who eats seven steaks a week, if you reduce down to two, well, that's saving five steaks a week, isn't it? and And arguably makes more impact than someone who's
00:42:25
Speaker
vegetarian almost vegan you know if that person becoming completely vegan that's a great thing and there's a big power in there yeah the what i believe yeah huge problem is carnists not being aware of what vegan food has the potential to taste like the number of people i couldn't eat all that nonsense and they've not even tried so when i've been to buffet events which in general I dislike buffet events because there's so much potential for waste just food craing in the bitter
00:43:00
Speaker
especially the meat going in the bi often the vegan options ah minimal like maybe they know i'm going and Good for them that they provided something vegan for me. And people might be going, oh, that looks tasty. Can I have a go?
00:43:13
Speaker
And I'm like, get off. There's only a tiny bit. It's all for me. Oh, it's all for me. So I've got to be a poor job of promoting veganism because I'm hungry. I've been at work all day and I want me grub.
00:43:25
Speaker
I'm appreciative to have been given some. ah But yeah, on previous podcasts, I've mentioned there have been one or two things where like there's been a small meat section at these group buffet environments. And that's really, really good where it's predominantly vegan because that's how people get introduced to fantastic new tastes. And when such a strong carnist argument is m bacon, you know, you've got counter that with like falafel.
00:43:59
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. i didn't Yeah, all all for this. And it it doesn't seem to be part of a a joined up effort. we We've talked, um weve what we've done a special episode on the plant-based council campaign that Julie is closely involved in.
00:44:14
Speaker
Didn't seem to me that it was part of that. But as with everything, you know, what one person doing something in the grassroots stage of things can inspire other
Lambing Tourism and Ethical Implications
00:44:23
Speaker
people to do that. So any of our American listeners, indeed anyone anywhere in in the world listening, like this is happening, it can happen in in any country, any part of the world.
00:44:33
Speaker
um And those little nudges can have a big impact and in fact i've been looking whilst we've been discussing this we've had about 60 downloads in seattle which is basically the same sort of area as samamish so uh do get in touch and tell us if we've pronounced your city name correctly and have you've seen an impact of this thank you for that one dominic let's move on to paul's pick of the week which by contrast is just down the road from where paul and i live and uh Yeah, it's news of some very bizarre holiday activities that are going on. to Paul, tell us what's been happening in in sheds in in the Malvern Hills lately. Yeah. So, yeah, this, as you say, this is in Malvern, which is a beautiful place if people don't know about it, the hills.
00:45:19
Speaker
ah But it's not a beautiful article, that's for sure. And this is really one of those ones. I've had a few articles like this where... you kind of look at it and they think, ah where am i going to start with this? It's like, there's so much here to unpick.
00:45:31
Speaker
It's unbelievable. So yeah, um essentially, ah summary wise, this article is highlighting the growth of holidays where people, people including families can get involved in the in the process of blaming and it's basically talking about um different um ah different farms that are offering this and the sort of money to be made and how that works and what people do etc and I will say at the start I think the worst offender in all of this is the journalist who wrote the article Sally Howard and k not the farmers because I think they express some quite honest views actually in what they say
00:46:09
Speaker
so um Yeah, basically, it's apparent here that, oh, by the way, and I should say the journalist is also the Guardian Health writer, which also surprised me and massively as well. On the surface, it would you might think it's a kind of situation where it's the farming industry's attempt to try and, of ah I'll say, carewash the production of meat as something beautiful and lovely where people can come and, you know,
00:46:31
Speaker
pet lambs and like kind of help birth them and stuff like that um and you know i i was expecting to read it as a ah propaganda article um that was a bit like the sort farm to fork one where people are saying here's all the stuff that how um how meat's produced to kids and then you say what about the death thing and the abattoir thing that we don't cover that that's ah we can might might be bad um Yeah. And and it it seems to me that a lot of this um with people going, I do wonder, um mean I've got a bit of a background in psychology. I wonder whether this is actually people um unconsciously wanting to go and validate their choice by sort of seeing it as a nice and fluffy, a fluffy thing.
00:47:11
Speaker
um and And again, not having to see the abattoirs and taking the kids along and almost helping them with this sort of a brainwashing of like, oh, isn't it a lovely situation with leaping lambs and all stuff like that?
00:47:22
Speaker
So I do wonder whether there is a bit ah bit of that. The interesting stuff was that a lot of the quotes from farmers in ah in the article sort of say things like, um it's a bit strange for me to see sheep treated like pets because we're in business, which is an honest sort of position.
00:47:40
Speaker
And then another farmer saying, you know, this is a business it's not all about cuddles so actually i got up i kind of the quotes that were given i thought were quite quite honest really from the farmers it's kind of they're sort saying you know and they didn't talk specifically about the killing but they're quite quite um honest about it well there was one bit if i can interject paul where that there's one person saying actually i won't install a lamb camera because they're talking about like live live streams of lambing online um as well as the in-person holiday bit um and and
00:48:12
Speaker
One of them was saying, no, I won't do that because often there will be a a birth, a delivery that's tricky. So say the vet needs to come or the lamb comes out dead. And and in in a way, that kind of, yeah, like you say, kind of got to admire the honesty there. But also it's like that highlights the kind of, I don't know, massaging of one's conscience that this is perhaps tailored to it's is people saying, oh oh, I want to watch this. I want to be part of this because it will make me feel better about it. But actually, we're not going to show you the times where it goes wrong. We're definitely gonna not going to show you the bit where we deliberately kill them. but Actually, we're not even going to show you the bits where
00:48:51
Speaker
actually it it it goes wrong in the in the birthing or or or stuff like that. yeah That was very compelling. Yeah, and I just wonder how much cognitive dissonance must be present at these sort of sites when this is going on, because I'm presuming, like, you know, these are self-catering places. Are these people going and, ah like, caring for lambs and then going off and having lamb chops that have been produced locally as well?
00:49:11
Speaker
I mean, i yeah ah presuming these people are going to eat meat and dairy. ah Yeah, just it's boggling, isn't it, as to why these... how these how people can kind of hold these two views at the same time and they're paying money to the abusers of the animals as well ultimately they're playing into that operation um they can say oh it's like an airbnb thing but um you know if you're going to stay at an airbnb and farm you're ultimately supporting that that farming operation and its profits so yeah it's it absolutely gobsmacked me um it kind of just truly truly frustrated even just looking at the article know if you noticed um
00:49:46
Speaker
you know, but they've shown lambs with the numbers sprayed on them, which just in itself is, I always find the most upsettingly objectification of animals when they're sprayed with numbers on, because it's like, why can't you just see this is, this is just an object. It's just a thing of profit.
00:50:01
Speaker
It's not a life. um You might see it as a life, but it's, it's destined to be on your, on your plate because of a choice you are making. So yeah, I absolutely was,
00:50:12
Speaker
gobsmacked by it so I think I've got lots of other stuff but I think my notes went a bit off kilter because i was like and another thing and this is this is my madness um but yeah I do think it's really sinister that whole thing of parents taking their kids there as I say because it it struck me as a bit bit similar to them taking them to sort of fun days at horse racing you know let's sit and go on a bouncy castle while horses are being whipped and kind of dying around you it's just like so look at what's going on around you know it's uh it's crazy crazy stuff very sinister i have a question for dominic who you know your your imagination is part of your living right what do you think goes on at an adult's only night time lamb watch that was something that was mentioned in the article i was thinking what on earth is that oh my word why does it need to be adults only what's going on yeah dodgy dodgy that's it dodgy that's the word dodgy dodgy dodgy yeah yeah i i mean that the the fact that in this article it says 90 of the 400 members of farms day uk now offer lamb watch holidays obviously not every
00:51:27
Speaker
ah sheep farm is part of Farmstay UK. That's like a ah ah kind of an organisation that is particularly tailored to lambing operations where you, well, no, sorry, farming operations, animal ag operations, where there is an element of hospitality involved.
00:51:44
Speaker
in the farming operations that they've kind of diversified but the fact that a quarter of those farms are offering this this experience if you like yeah it's it's very prevalent isn't it and um yeah it's kind of similar to uh getting storybooks in in children's schools saying uh oh the jolly farmer look at look at them aren't they doing a good job yeah it's it's just i was just waiting to waiting to read something in the article that said and you know the next thing we'll be starting off family fun days to abattoirs um but they didn't seem to didn't seem to go down that route for some reason i did also think i did expect also to get a and message from julie to try and grab this one must admit i thought she'd try and take this one off me two so i saw it and i got so upset by it that i thought i'm glad i'm not reporting on that two things i would like to see
00:52:34
Speaker
Knowing sheep quite personally as I do and the fact that they are prey animals, they are frightened of people naturally and these sheep will be extremely frightened of people because of the things that happen to them when they're in contact with people.
00:52:51
Speaker
The sheep in my life are... not frightened of me, but they're frightened of strangers, you know, and they only have good experiences with humans. I make sure of that. And they're still frightened of strangers.
00:53:03
Speaker
But these sheep will be used to being handled horribly and they'll be frightened of people. So they'll be even more scared by the presence of strangers at a time when they're at their most vulnerable, when they're about to give birth.
00:53:17
Speaker
That's the first thing that's horrific. It's a horrible thing to do to an animal who's already under a lot of stress. It's also an infection risk as well, a time when an animal's health is at the most vulnerable as well. when it's Because female sheep are really, they're kind of fed in a way that they are fed really well so that they're fertile and then they want them as skinny as possible when they're pregnant. and It's just the way that they do it so sheep who are at that stage of, you know, about to give birth, they're really undernourished and exhausted and skinny and weak and all the rest of it.
00:53:55
Speaker
And their lambs are huge and they often have birth complications these days as a result of that. And a lot of births go wrong. And the other thing I would say is that in a way there is no, I don't see i i don't see hypocrisy in that when I see children being encouraged to cuddle lambs and then children being encouraged to eat things made out of lambs' bodies and sheep's bodies at the same, you know, in the same day,
00:54:27
Speaker
i i see that as being logical in a sense, because both are just commodification, really. It's like, oh, lambs are ours to grab and cuddle and appropriate in whatever way we want to, you know, they want to grab them and experience them and all that it's not a mutually respectful enjoying their presence kind of thing isn't it's a grabbing kind of they're an attraction they're a thing to take your kids to as an activity and we want to bottle feed them a load of crap that um you know formula milk stuff that isn't even good for them and all the rest of it
00:55:06
Speaker
They are commodities in that setting in the exact same way that they are commodities in the abattoir and then on the supermarket shelf or whatever.
00:55:17
Speaker
That's just how people are. But yeah, they do love lambs. They do get obsessed with lambs because they are... visually entertaining and they fulfill some kind of need in human beings but i don't experience that as a mutually respectful equal relationship with animals it's very much a kind of anthropocentric they are there for our enjoyment one yeah why else would they have wool you know it's so we can enjoy it
00:55:50
Speaker
Oh dear.
Dairy Waste Conversion and Greenwashing Concerns
00:55:51
Speaker
Oh dear. Lots of learning to be done. um Thank you for that one, Paul. Now we, enough of the falafel, like we're we're just a group of random old vegans, really bringing bringing our passions and and taking our interpretations of the news with us. and And very often we will contribute the news articles to one another. And if you out there listening, you found an article you think would be interesting for us to discuss, or if you disagree or have another angle to take on a story we have presented on, we'd love to hear from you. So here is how to get in touch with us.
00:56:23
Speaker
To get in touch with us, just send us an email at enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com. We see ourselves as a collective. Our listenership stretches all around the world and everyone's opinions, questions, feedback and ideas are what helps shape the show.
00:56:42
Speaker
Go on, send us a message today. Enoughofthefalafel at gmail.com. Okay, we have got just enough time for one more story. Now, I would say I've been vegan a little while now. And and when when you have been vegan a little while, i think it's quite forgivable to fall into that trap of thinking, oh, you you know what goes on in animal agriculture, you know, the practices and things like that.
00:57:06
Speaker
But this story here that's coming to us from farmprogress.com features some practices that I had not come across before. And I imagine a lot of our listeners won't have come across them either. I'm just going to read verbatim the first couple of short paragraphs and then we will discuss it. in a bit more detail before the end of the show.
00:57:25
Speaker
Here we go then. Another load of green crates filled to the brim with gallons of milk has arrived. Driving a skip loader, she lifts one of the crates and dumps all of the gallons into a large pile. Another employee pushes the gallons into a depackager, a machine that mechanically separates each plastic gallon from the milk.
00:57:45
Speaker
Where does the milk go? Into the one of the farm's two manure digesters that generate power for hundreds of homes. The milk is like white gold for farmer Brett Rineford.
00:58:00
Speaker
It's a good fertilizer once it goes through the digesting process, he says. Last year, we didn't buy any commercial fertilizer. We just used the food waste and manure, he says with a laugh. So that's the opening to this article. You can read the full article if you follow the link in our show notes. So this is a farm that has partnered up with a store in the USA called Dollar General.
00:58:26
Speaker
Now, Dollar General threw out 13,000 thirteen thousand tons of dairy products in 2024, mostly fluid milk that had been compromised, expired or gone bad for any number of reasons.
00:58:39
Speaker
But with this scheme where this farm takes this this waste dairy back, they apparently saved 1,700 tons of waste milk last year, doing lots of things with it, including making electricity.
00:58:56
Speaker
ah The farm plans to install a 1.3 megawatt motor this June which would max out their digester's capacity to produce power and it could therefore generate electricity for more than thousand homes.
00:59:10
Speaker
Waste heat from the system provides power and water to the farm itself. um And the first system they had took in manure as well from 400 cows, but the herd size has since increased to more than 700 head.
00:59:25
Speaker
So we've got animal agriculture taking its waste products and propelling more animal agriculture, but also powering homes lots of conflicting feelings and confusion going on in my head does anyone want to jump in and give their opinions or shed some more light on this because i would say this was a bit of a confusing article for me anyway yeah i must admit um i'm torn on this one if i'm being honest ah maybe similar to you and um mean the the main thing this says to me is that too much milk's being produced now that might be a
00:59:58
Speaker
A good thing it might be reflecting a drop in demand or it might be a case of subsidies holding up production of milk in a dine industry, you know, creating these kind of food mounting kind of situations. But the flip side of it is I really hate I hate food waste. I mean, I'm um um a bit sort of completely anal about it in my own sort of house.
01:00:15
Speaker
I don't like it. and So there is a part of me that thinks that if there is what they call waste is being used and having another purpose, then I'm um' reasonably supportive of that.
01:00:27
Speaker
um Otherwise, you know, for me, if you see things like, I think Don mentioned it earlier, if you see like meat being thrown away, i feel... to some degree more upset because it's like this animal has gone through whole process and has been murdered and then wasn't even eaten you know um it just the sort the mad waste of it just sort of intensifies if if you ask me from that so yeah i mean obviously the what we all want is just not producing in the first place but kind of trying to put a bit of a non-vegan spin on it if you like really
01:01:01
Speaker
Their big digester thing is absolutely cutting no ice with me. It in itself will be a massive user of energy and it's a horrific scar on the landscape if you see the size of this thing.
01:01:17
Speaker
and the smell and the noise as well. So it cuts no ice. When a calf drinks milk from its mother cow, there is no waste and it doesn't go off because that's how things are meant to be.
01:01:33
Speaker
But when we remove that poor little calf and steal that milk, that's when the problem starts and that's what we need to stop. So I am not happy to think about this so-called waste milk being repurposed in this way because I do not believe that that is efficient or has a kind of net offsetting of all of the ills of the dairy industry even if you were to leave the animal abuse out of it but all of the energy that has gone into
01:02:08
Speaker
that cow being fed for all that time, all the methane it has produced, all the water it has consumed, all the rest of it. I don't think it matters a toss.
01:02:19
Speaker
What they recycle that so-called waste milk into, I don't think they are offsetting a anything. So I think this is greenwashing and it's pretty horrible and it just shows you how inefficient and how crappy and polluting the dairy industry is even when people make efforts to recycle the actual waste that it produces as well as all the other crimes that it is guilty of so yeah this cuts no ice I think it's an absolute yeah greenwashing and a waste of resources
01:02:58
Speaker
I just wanted to add um a couple of things. I ah firstly wanted to echo what what Paul had said in terms of like the, it it seems so, so upsetting when animal products are not used to nourish animals.
01:03:15
Speaker
people you know ah we we know about their health issues to to issues to human health of of animal products i'm not saying they're perfectly nutritious but if they have been produced like that the thought that even just a tiny fraction of them when you think of all of the horrible suffering that has been involved is not being used to nourish anybody and is just being wasted.
01:03:38
Speaker
That's disgusting. and And for me, that in a sense is almost an argument not not to do it because actually it it takes me back to the the story about the wolf race.
01:03:49
Speaker
oh Oh, only seven of them have died. Yeah, but none of them consented. So that's that's seven people, seven beings who've died. not consenting to do that. and And you could say, well, you know, this is this is cutting down some of the waste.
01:04:03
Speaker
Yeah, but but if even if just a fraction of the stuff is wasted, like those those animals didn't consent to that. and So the fact that it's wasted is is awful. I think that it is a really worrying bit of greenwashing.
01:04:17
Speaker
I think people need to see this for what it is. and And this is papering over cracks or trying to. um There is a farm near to me called Morley Milk, which look them up, they think they are the dog's bollocks, they think they've got it all right and is systematic animal abuse going on.
01:04:34
Speaker
It doesn't matter if the cows decide when they walk in to be milked, it doesn't matter if you've got solar panels on the barn, doesn't none of that stuff matters. You're still violating an animal's reproductive systems, you you're you're still killing animals much earlier than they would naturally die.
01:04:52
Speaker
It's a load of old rubbish. One last little thing I wanted to say was um they kind of let slip in this article that the farmer in question um said that the initial focus of the project was to deal with neighbour complaints over manure being spread on fields.
Episode Wrap-Up and Listener Engagement
01:05:06
Speaker
I think they perhaps shouldn't have let that cat out of the bag to use a non-vegan phrase. It's like, I think we can see through you here. That needs to be the headline, I think.
01:05:18
Speaker
Anyway, thank you for your comment on that one. We hope you've enjoyed the show today. If you have, there's a little something you could do for us if you can spare wee moment. If you've enjoyed today's show, we'd love it if you could take just a few seconds to share it with someone else who you think might enjoy it too.
01:05:37
Speaker
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01:05:53
Speaker
That will also help the show pop up when people search for vegan or animal rights content online. Thanks for your help.
01:06:05
Speaker
Julie, feel like I culturally misappropriated you there. I said the the phrase, if you have a wee moment, I don't think I would have said that. yeah oh That's okay. that's okay
01:06:21
Speaker
Thank you everyone for listening. Yeah, thank you very much. I know all of us really enjoy making this podcast. So cheers for being with us.
01:06:32
Speaker
ah Heads up for when the next Enough of the Falafel episode will be coming out. Vegan Talk will be available from Thursday the 13th of March with Anthony and Julie.
01:06:44
Speaker
And the topic will be animal testing involved in food production. Anyway, that's enough of the falafel for this episode. Thanks to Dominic, Anthony and Julie for your contributions. And thanks again, everyone, for listening.
01:06:57
Speaker
I've been Paul and you've been listening to Vegan Week from the Enough of the Falafel Collective.
01:07:05
Speaker
This has been an Enough of the Falafel production. We're just a normal bunch of everyday vegans putting our voices out there. The show is hosted by Zencaster.
01:07:16
Speaker
We use music and special effects by zapsplap.com. And sometimes, if you're lucky, at the end of an episode, you'll hear a poem by Mr Dominic Berry. Thanks all for listening, and see you next time.
01:07:46
Speaker
This episode may have come to an end, but did you know we've got a whole archive containing all our shows dating back to September 2023? That is right, Dominic. There's over 100 episodes on there featuring our brilliant range of different guests, people's stories of going vegan, philosophical debates, moral quandaries, and of course...
01:08:07
Speaker
around a dozen news items from around the world each week. So check back on your podcast player to hear previous episodes. And remember to get an alert for each new episode, simply click like or follow and also subscribe to the show.
01:08:22
Speaker
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