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Pastied Tits and Hockey Sticks with Miss Colleen
1.4k Plays4 years ago
Miss Colleen on:
Instagram -- www.instagram.com/jerseygurl21/
Twitter -- https://twitter.com/jerseygurl2121/
OnlyFans -- https://onlyfans.com/jerseygurl21
AVN Stars -- https://stars.avn.com/jerseygurl2121/videos
ManyVids -- https://www.manyvids.com/Profile/1003359815/JerseyGurl21/
Two Bi Guys is created and hosted by Alex Boyd and Rob Cohen
Logo art by Kaitlin Weinman
Music by Ross Mintzer
Season 2 is executive produced by Rob Cohen and produced by Alex Boyd and Moxie Peng, with support from IFP
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Transcript
Introduction of Hosts and Guest
00:00:12
Speaker
Welcome to Two Bye Guys. I'm Alex. And I'm Rob. And we have been looking to have a conversation along these lines for quite a while and never a better time than right now where we have Miss Colleen
Miss Colleen's Journey with Gender Fluidity and Bisexuality
00:00:25
Speaker
here. We wanted to talk about
00:00:27
Speaker
gender, gender fluidity, and bisexuality. And Ms. Colleen, who is a fetish content creator, is somebody that Rob and I have crossed paths with over the last couple of years here and there, and feels like the perfect person to have this conversation with. So very excited to have you here, Ms. Colleen. Welcome.
00:00:45
Speaker
I am excited to be here. I've been wanting to be on this podcast for a while so it's actually surreal that it's happening and it's exciting. Nice, well we're very glad to have you. I'm very curious to hear about your experience with gender fluidity and the content you create and how it all relates to bisexuality. Oh yeah, I'm very happy to share all that good stuff.
00:01:09
Speaker
Sweet. Glad to hear it. So maybe we can start Ms. Colleen with just like a brief intro just from you of your pronouns and just anything else that you want to share with us about kind of your background. Sure. So my name is Ms. Colleen. I am 24 years young. I am a bisexual, genderfluid, fetish content creator hailing from the Jersey Shore. And
00:01:32
Speaker
Yeah, I just been on this journey of just really diving into my gender and sexuality ever since I was 20.
Understanding Pronouns and Gender Expression Differences
00:01:41
Speaker
So I really came to accept and embrace being gender fluid probably three years ago once I had the terminology and the vocabulary to speak how I feel.
00:01:55
Speaker
And what are your pronouns? And given the gender fluidity, did they change? Are the pronouns fluid also? The pronouns are pretty fluid. I primarily like to go by she, her, but with work and people that have only known me as presenting male, it's like I don't feel bad if someone use he, him when I'm at a drag because, you know, it just comes naturally to people when you have a beard and you look very masked.
00:02:23
Speaker
I was gonna say the listeners can't quite see that you have a little mustache and beard there. Oh yeah, it's very interesting because when I'm at a drag the pronouns don't matter as much but when I'm in drag and I'm presenting female it's more it means a lot more to me and I didn't realize how much it did mean to me until I had a front, an acquaintance rather, in the scene
00:02:48
Speaker
And this person just kept using masculine terms like, Oh, what's up, dude? Or, Oh, you look good as a guy. And like, those aren't like compliments to me. So I remember I, you know, feeling that way and I had to sit them down and saying, Hey, I don't like those masculine terms. It's not my fantasy. It's like, I don't take that as a compliment.
00:03:08
Speaker
And this person corrected themselves, and I'm glad that they took it upon themselves. Like, oh, sorry, they didn't realize it, and gave it as a moment of education. Yeah, I love that. What are your experiences using she-her pronouns in drag? What does that mean to you? What is that experience when
Drag as an Amplification of Self
00:03:24
Speaker
you're presenting that way?
00:03:25
Speaker
versus, you know, out of drag. In a sense, when I'm in drag, it's like putting on my suit of armor and going into, I don't want to say battle, but just like stepping into the arena and it's like part the seas, bitches. Miss Colleen is here and I have this presence and it's just, you know, like people are just drawn to me because I, you know, you could see in the background of my room, I wear outrageous wigs. I'm wearing six inch stiletto platform heels. Like I have a presence.
00:03:52
Speaker
But every now and then when I just go out presenting mail, I don't have that same presence and it's kind of more just like, ooh, you're faded into the crowd a little bit. And that's just, at times it's a little like, like I take a back step and I'm like, wait, I'm not getting this reaction from people. I'm not getting people just like coming up and talking to me or someone say, Hey, could I buy you a drink? It's very different. What led you to, to kind of form that, whether you want to call a persona or, or just identity and presentation for yourself?
00:04:21
Speaker
So I remember my first exposure to femininity with someone that wasn't male assigned at birth. It was with Gigi Gorgeous. I remember following her on Instagram all throughout high school.
00:04:39
Speaker
I just admired her beauty and I didn't know she was transgender. I had no idea. I just thought that she was this beautiful woman and just didn't think twice about it until she posted about being transgender. And I'm like, what does this mean? Like I don't have, I don't know what this means. And I did some research and I was just like kind of just blown away. And then I just started following her journey through like her makeup tutorials and stuff like that.
00:05:03
Speaker
And it just spoke to me and then I just tried it and haven't looked back since. Yeah. You know, we've talked a lot on the podcast about kind of gender fluidity within our own identities sort of thing and how we like scoff at the idea of masculine norms.
Why Miss Colleen Doesn't Identify as Transgender
00:05:18
Speaker
Right. But I think it's an entirely different, well, not entirely different, but a very linked but different conversation of like actually owning other gender presentations as like your
00:05:28
Speaker
outline it like perfectly as like power right like you literally said that that's like a that's a powerful image for yourself and that that definitely intrigues me because I think a lot of people view that as like drag as this kind of persona you put up on a stage and then it's not power as much as kind of like an alter ego almost right like that it's presented to us almost as this alter ego sometimes it reminds me of like a superhero putting putting on their other persona or something is that
00:05:58
Speaker
Yeah it's interesting because I go back and forth with the thought of it being like an alter ego because the way I like to think of it just when I'm in drag and I'm exuding that personality with people it's kind of how like RuPaul says how
00:06:13
Speaker
drag is not like putting on like this persona. It reveals who you are. So like just being Miss Colleen and being out in full drag, it's just kind of like, if my personality is on one level, it's like amped up a thousand percent when I'm going out in drag and presenting female. Yeah. I mean, it sounds like basically just a bigger version of who you are rather than some different version of who you are. Yeah, exactly.
00:06:36
Speaker
This may be a semantic question or maybe it's like besides the point which you can tell me but like do you identify as trans and within the trans community or is like the fluidity and being able to be non-conforming sort of a separate thing?
00:06:52
Speaker
Yeah, I never thought through my entire time exploring gender and drag and all that, I never once thought that I was transgender. It was just, if anything, it was just more, it was like an extension of me and I just never thought about being transgender because there's, I like presenting masculine. Like I like, I do like having a beard every now and then and, you know, going out in a suit and
00:07:15
Speaker
just as far as like personality and attitude wise like there's things that I enjoy that are masculine and you know and But they're at the same time there's this mesh with what I enjoy with feminine things and traits and stuff like that So that's why the fluidity aspect of it fits right fits the best
00:07:31
Speaker
You know, it's funny and it's similar, feels similar to like my bisexual journey in that like, I never quite, I knew what gay was, but I never quite identified with that because I had attractions to women. But I also, like I had both. And I think when I first learned about what being transgender means, that never felt like me at all.
Influence of Drag on Bisexuality Recognition
00:07:53
Speaker
But the more I've got into this community and
00:07:56
Speaker
to alex about this and at bin at by request the more i've learned about like gender non-conformity and fluidity and that kind of thing and like i've questioned okay well i don't feel like a woman a trans woman but i don't
00:08:13
Speaker
totally care to be masculine or a man, at least not all the time either. And I've realized that it's like somewhat of a similar spectrum and that even though I haven't moved that far away from the masculine side of the spectrum, I am open to it and I would like to and I don't really feel attached to this side of it. Is that how it feels for you? And also, how does your bisexual journey relate to this? Was it intertwined?
00:08:41
Speaker
Yeah, I feel gender fluidity and androgyny kind of go-co in hand. I wouldn't say they're the same thing, but they coexist in kind of like that same discussion. So that's something I've been playing a lot with ever since the pandemic started in March, because when I would go out, I would be self-conscious about, you know, being tucked, wearing hip pads, wearing breast forms.
00:09:03
Speaker
And now I'm just like, okay, I'll be in full face. I'll wear this beautiful wig, but my man chest is going to stick out. I noticeably have a bulge. Like I don't really care anymore. And I just want to play more with that androgyny aspect of it. So, and I know a lot of other people that.
00:09:20
Speaker
aren't necessarily gender nonconforming, but as far as like a fashion sense, they go for more the androgynous kind of thing. And it's just, you know, and it's interesting how like fabric and clothing can empower someone to feel type of way. But as far as bisexuality playing into my gender,
00:09:40
Speaker
I remember early on when I was like 19, 20 years old around that time I was very aroused at the idea of being in drag and having sex with men. I don't, just at that time that's what like spoke to me and I never thought about having sex with men out of drag because I just didn't
00:10:00
Speaker
sit right to me and it just didn't have that same level of attraction as it did if I was presenting female and in drag. So that's when like the bi curiosity for me started like trickling in and you know, I had some experiences and I'm just like, okay, this is, I, you know, I'm attracted to men, but
Dating Experiences and Queer Connections
00:10:18
Speaker
my attraction of women is still there. So that's what I'm just like, yeah, no, I'm pretty certain that I'm bisexual.
00:10:25
Speaker
Huh. That makes so much sense as you say it, but it's not what I would have guessed. I don't know why I would have guessed the bisexual awareness came first. So you're saying you actually explored gender first and then that sort of led to fantasies that played out and then you realized you could call that bisexual.
00:10:46
Speaker
yeah and i was it was interesting because i had this discussion with someone the other day with how i got into watching porn and like finding my sexual attraction and things i remember the first porn i would watch was with transgender women and that's all i mean i i can't remember vividly watching boy girl porn like when i was watching it i just i remember vividly
00:11:07
Speaker
Trans you know a transgender woman and a guy you know because when you watch porn you either like visual herself as one person or like seeing an act happen turning you on and I'm just like I don't really
00:11:18
Speaker
Resignate with the dude or the trans woman like just this whole thing is attractive to me and then once I started Exploring gender and getting into drag and you know I kind of segued into you know kind of being attracted to what a transgender woman would be doing bottoming in a scene so that that was a very interesting like awakening that I had
00:11:40
Speaker
For the longest time, I was very stuck in like if I was going to have sex with men, I have to be in drag. But I've kind of like kind of let go of that in a sense. And just because my attraction just kind of changed towards men. And it's just like, I don't necessarily have to have that now where I have to be in drag. And it's just like, like, OK, I want to maybe give this a try. And certain fantasies come into mind. And like I said, the attraction kind of like changes for me.
00:12:07
Speaker
Yes, the definition of bisexuality. Yeah. Fluid attractions that can change over time. Yeah, because for me, I mean, if my bisexuality in a nutshell, and it's funny, I joke with my one friend about this is I'm bisexual. Yes, but men are on thin fucking ice. But like my belief is is I'm bi, but I have
00:12:35
Speaker
emotional romantic monogamous desires with women but when it comes to sex and kink and BDSM that's where the more like the doors open as far as sexual relationships, DS relationships and stuff like that. So in your romantic like other kinds of relationships like more dating scenarios do you mostly date women and do you present as a man most of the time or how does that work?
00:13:05
Speaker
When I met my ex-girlfriend, we met on FetLife,
Impact of Athletic Background on Queer Identity
00:13:10
Speaker
and she was a woman that was into drag queens, crutch stressors, transvestites. And I'm like, hey, I fit into that broad category. And the first time I met her, I presented male and we kind of just hit it off. And then, yeah, like when we would go out, I would go out in full drag and, you know, we would just make it this whole ordeal.
00:13:28
Speaker
And she was the only like serious relationship I had. Every other relationship that I've had with a woman, you know, was either like two to three months or less, but all those relationships have just been me presenting male. And I remember I was going to speed dating a lot, just regular speed dating at a local bar. And I was good at getting matches, like, you know, not to toot my own horn, but, you know, I can vibe with someone and connect with someone. And I've done it like six times and I matched every single time.
00:13:57
Speaker
But like once it comes down to like, hey, I'm bisexual, I'm gender fluid, I'm kinky, I'm a content creator, like one of those four things that just like kind of rubs someone the wrong way. And it's just, okay. So that's why I wanted to like pump the brakes a little bit on just dating straight cisgender women and just kind of want to connect with more queer people.
00:14:21
Speaker
Yeah, I definitely relate to that quite a bit because I think I definitely struggle with the idea of dating a straight cis woman. Just because there is an experience of queerness, I think that all three of us can like share and kind of align on like just like a view of gender, right? That if I were straight and cis, I just don't think I'd view gender in the same way that I do right now. It would be a much further journey.
00:14:46
Speaker
to do that. And I always say to allude to some of the stuff that you were talking about, your own gender, I fully know and realize that the only reason I am not walking around with heels, that I don't have heels in my closet and such,
00:14:59
Speaker
is because I've just been raised to have more power in my masculine presentation, right? Different than your experience, obviously. It's interesting, because I had that light bulb go off in my head as you were talking, because my background growing up, especially through high school, I was a jock. I played football, I played ice hockey, and I was in that stereotypical group, like the cool kids that were
00:15:26
Speaker
going to party every Friday Saturday night and hung out with that click of cool kids. So like perception is an amazing thing to me because you know the way I can be perceived is could be totally wrong absolutely incorrect about who I actually am and it's interesting because like I hear a lot from other queer people like in my experience that they knew they were queer such early on in their lives or you know as a teenager and I'm just like
00:15:53
Speaker
Gosh, I didn't realize I was queer until two or three years ago. I didn't come from a background that fostered that in me. For most of my early life as a teenager, I was working blue collar jobs. I only exposed myself as much to queer people and queer culture as I allowed it. It didn't really happen until three or four years ago.
00:16:18
Speaker
Right. It's like if you have that ability to be comfortable in different worlds, then you end up not necessarily realizing that so early. If it's somewhere in the middle, it's like a longer process to figure out. Yeah. And it's like when I have that discussion about, you know, being this jock, this, I use air quotes a lot around cool kids because, you know, just kind of that ideology kind of just doesn't sit right with me anymore. But, um,
00:16:46
Speaker
just having that idea and then when I talk to people about it and just like, oh, you must have dealt with like toxic masculinity and like all these things growing up that you must be like sick to your stomach about now. And I'm just like,
00:16:58
Speaker
Um, you know, I acknowledged that those things exist and people have had, had bad experiences like with toxic masculinity or locker room culture with football and you know, like bad stuff with cool kids being bullies and all that, but that wasn't my experience. Like I learned valuable life lessons from being an athlete and, you know, I never gotten fights in high school. I don't remember disliking anyone. Like, you know, I was just kind and nice to everyone. So.
Integrating Identities into Daily Life
00:17:24
Speaker
Like, it doesn't sit right with me when people just automatically assume, like, oh, you were all these things and now you're this, so you must have had that experience or something. And I'm just like, no, I just evolved as a person and expanded who I am. Well, and it sounds like you're, like, drag what some people frame as alter egos. Like, that concept doesn't work for you for the reason that, like, it sounds to me like you've just integrated all of those identities into, like,
00:17:48
Speaker
who you are like on the daily right like when you're presenting one way doesn't mean that you maybe still don't have some of that like jock teenager kind of like you don't respect that part of yourself too that's what i'm hearing yeah would you say that's right oh that's definitely fair and like you know being a content creator and having an online presence it's interesting how
00:18:08
Speaker
people connect with me because, you know, people connect with me, obviously, you know, with physical attraction, seeing how I look and what I'm presenting and what I'm doing, you know, in my content. But the people that really stick with me and the people that are super loyal and that will, you know, our big customers are the ones that are in love with my personality.
Unique Content Creation Journey
00:18:28
Speaker
Like, I posted a pic the other day of me, you know, posing in a thong and knee-high socks with my hockey stick, and this person was just, like, totally enthused about, like, the hockey stick I had, because it's, you know, an older one, and we're having a full-on conversation about my hockey stick, and next thing you know, they're a subscriber. I'm like, that's so interesting, you know? And that's how I connect with people, is just exuding those kind of weird personality traits that you wouldn't expect from this presenting person. Yeah. Very interesting. And it maybe, like, defeats the assumption even there that's happening, that, like,
00:18:57
Speaker
People are just into you because of like something you're actively doing sexually or something Yeah, it's just like oh if you think my only fans DMS are just literally sex thing and being flirty No, I had a full-on conversation with someone with all the truck upgrades I did to my truck and probably now every time that they see a lifted pickup truck, they're probably thinking of Miss Colleen now
00:19:25
Speaker
I have many more questions about this, so before we get further, can you just step back and give us a little overview of, like, what is the kind of content you create? How long have you been doing it? How did you get started? And, like, why? What motivated you to do it?
00:19:40
Speaker
So first and foremost, I wasn't one of those basic bitches that hopped on and only fans when a pandemic hit. No, I started, I actually started, it would be my one year sex worker anniversary this Halloween. Happy anniversary. Yeah, thank you very much. I went to Exotica in New Jersey and I just had this realization that I was posting sexy stuff and I was on FetLife and just
00:20:04
Speaker
you know, showing my expression and my self-expression. I'm like, it would be cool that if I could make money doing this. So, you know, I made some connections at Exotica and I started The Only Fans and the rest is
Content Focus and Audience Desires
00:20:18
Speaker
history. But the kind of content that I enjoy most shooting and doing is just really captivating, interesting stuff. Like the basic stuff I do is, you know, pantyhose warship.
00:20:29
Speaker
school girl, for whatever reason, really resonates with people. I couldn't tell you how many school girl clips I shot, but, you know, since I'm a switch and, you know, I'm kind of versed, like, I...
00:20:41
Speaker
I'm trying to get better on, you know, I don't want to say limiting, but having a more tiny focus area doing stuff. But, you know, I, I, one of the things I love doing is shooting custom clips. So people that have these fantasies and they say, you know, I visualize this, they give me a script and then I make it come to life with a clip. And it's just like, there's something so surreal about doing that, making a fantasy into reality. And that's probably my favorite thing to do as a content creator. Cool. Well, I've checked out your content and it's awesome.
00:21:10
Speaker
Thanks. I, and it's funny, I saw you subscribe and I was like, this name is, is, I know this person. And then I'm just, once I clicked on your bio, I'm like, Oh, it's him. Well, I had to do some research. That's what I figured. I was like, I said that to a friend. I'm like, yeah. I was telling her that I was doing this podcast and I was just like, Oh, these he's there for research purposes. This is strictly business.
00:21:31
Speaker
Right. That's the hidden perk of hosting this podcast. And like we interviewed the Buy Mail porn stars last season. I remember, yeah. I had to subscribe then. I just had to to see what they were doing. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah. Rob has a very specific focus with this podcast. Yeah. The dedication is real. Yeah. Well, how are you received overall? Like how do you see your image as a content creator?
00:21:58
Speaker
And like what are your goals with that?
Creative Boundaries and Audience Psychology
00:22:01
Speaker
So like and that's the one of the things I was mentioning earlier how I want to just kind of tighten up on a specific area of focus because you know I'm very broad like you know I'm a switch like you know what I actually physically enjoy doing is with kink and sex is I'm a switch and I'm verse so that's so many
00:22:21
Speaker
doors, so many little hidden passageways you can go down. But I definitely want to focus more on like a specific niche and just kind of tightening that up. And I want to expand and do more collaborations. Like one of the other things I really love doing is photo shoots. So one person that I always love shooting with, Agent Topshik,
00:22:42
Speaker
who's actually gender fluid as well, but she's a cisgender woman or female assigned at birth, I should say. And it's funny because we're both the same build and body type, but she's female assigned at birth, I'm male assigned at birth. So it's so cool using concepts and stuff with her. And that's the one of the things I really love doing with the photo shoots is just having these amazing concepts that I've had. One of them recently being the, I did a road warrior shoot.
00:23:08
Speaker
and we incorporated my truck and we found like this distressed area and the fact that I had this vision for probably like a year now and it came to life, it was amazing. And the fact that I can monetize that and make money with it, it's just really cool. I like those pictures. I just saw those. They're very cool.
00:23:28
Speaker
I was like in tears when I got those pictures because like I said, I envisioned that for like a year and I was just so happy. They're badass. It's the one with all the black leather, right? Yeah. Those were cool. Yeah. Do you have a sense of like the makeup of your audience mostly like along the gender spectrum and also do you have a sense along the sexuality spectrum where people fall?
00:23:53
Speaker
Yes, definitely on the sexuality spectrum. And I would say probably, if not all, my audience is male or at least male assigned at birth. And, you know, I do have certain people that prefer to see me being like super submissive, you know, in chastity doing submissive things. But then there's those other people that just want super dominant stuff. They want to see what I like to call my she-cock or my she-ness and just do that kind of stuff.
00:24:21
Speaker
And, uh, it's very interesting. Yeah. I'm laughing at genius. Yep. I like that. Also, like, I mean, 90 something percent of your content, you're in drag, female presenting, but then there's an occasional hit of like male body, male presenting, you know, no drag. Do you get responses to that too? Do people like to see, like, are people interested in the fluidity of it or?
00:24:48
Speaker
I have just a couple people that are super interested in seeing me present male and you know shooting content but it's not something I'm interested in doing.
Being an Enigma: Gender and Attraction Complexities
00:25:00
Speaker
You know that's kind of one of my hard limits as a content creators like I won't shoot presenting male like I'll shoot androgynous stuff kind of like the road warrior.
00:25:07
Speaker
look where I had my natural hair and you know just wearing nipple pasties and but right that's kind of one of my hard limits as a content creator that and bottoming for men for content that's not something I would I have interest in shooting do you want to talk about like what like why
00:25:26
Speaker
Yeah, so my creative juices don't flow for doing male expression for shooting content, but I know for why I won't shoot scenes bottoming for men is just because I don't want that image, because that's going to draw that crowd that wants that, where they're going to just see me.
00:25:47
Speaker
There's a whole psychology of it if I'm bottoming for men in a scene because that's what people are going to get in that mindset and that's what they're going to want. And I just don't have the energy to work with those kind of people. And I'd rather be with the more submissive kind of crowd and the crowd that just feeds off my fun and energetic personality rather than just being alpha dominant towards me.
00:26:14
Speaker
Interesting.
Romantic Connections in Queer Communities
00:26:15
Speaker
Yeah. Cool. You mentioned at some point to us that people will say like they're kind of confused by you, that you're just kind of like an enigma in some ways. Do you find that you're confusing to folks? And how does that feel? Like, how do you feel about being perceived that way?
00:26:29
Speaker
It's very interesting because at first I had a big issue with the fact that someone sees me and I'm turning them as far as sexuality. I had a big issue with that at first because of what I don't know if you two recall that with James Charles where he went off on this thing
00:26:47
Speaker
where he said it was his, it was his attraction to hook up with straight men and turn them gay. And it was just, it was more of like a malicious thing that he was doing. And so that's why I didn't really didn't like that at first. But once I started talking to those people and what their thought process is behind what I'm doing, that's sexually confusing them. You know, I became more receptive to the idea and it's different for every
00:27:13
Speaker
person it's just and it's funny because I joke with some other creators I work with that you know it's not gay if it's a she-cock and there's something about that ideology that
00:27:25
Speaker
you know, for a straight identifying male to be attracted to a trans woman or just any kind of woman that possesses a sheeness or a sheacock, that it's not gay because it's a woman. And I remember reading the book, Not Gay, that you guys talked about in your podcast before, because I was like so intrigued with that psychology of straight identifying men
00:27:51
Speaker
engaging in homosexual activity. So like what does someone identify as if they're hooking up with me? Like I'm gender fluid, so I'm gender nonconforming. So like if I'm hooking up with a woman, we could say we're lesbians, it's homosexual. But like, or when it's strict, you know, straight up with a guy, it could, again, it could be viewed as gay or homosexual. So it's like, I'm always playing with the idea of terminology and vocabulary as far as for like attraction and gender.
00:28:21
Speaker
Yeah. So I am curious with that being said, you know, you mentioned that you kind of steer more towards queer folks, like romantically and otherwise. Do you feel like that's part of the reason that it just like takes that stress of like, what is this? And like, it's not a question that in that way, if the other person is like viewing you as a man or as a woman, because like you were just two queer people.
00:28:46
Speaker
Yeah, you know, queer people have that vibe where you just don't have to explain everything or just like give them a dictionary and say, here you go, here's what I
Reevaluating Queer Identity and Societal Impact
00:28:55
Speaker
am. Like when I meet most queer people, you ask what their name is and then when they say, oh, what are your preferred pronouns? It's just like, you get me. I don't know you, but you know me and we just know each other as a people and I vibe with you because of that.
00:29:19
Speaker
It's so interesting what all of you are saying, because it's something I've been thinking about and struggling with too recently. Like, I have friends who are straight, cis men who in the past few years have opened themselves up to their attractions to trans women. And if you're opening yourself up to being with a queer person, does that make you also queer?
00:29:44
Speaker
It's a woman. You're a man. You're hooking up with a woman. Trans women are women. So not really. But at the same time, like what you're saying is like there's this understanding when queer people are together. And I don't know. I mean, it's all sort of semantic and it's besides the point. If you can connect and have that understanding, then that's the most important thing.
00:30:05
Speaker
See the whole like thing with just the word queer because like the definition of queer if you like look it up it's strange or unusual and I believe you guys talked about this before where it's just like am I queer enough or oh am I too queer and you know I've had that question to myself I'm like oh am I queer enough when I go out to you know when I would go out to a gay bar with my girlfriend at the time my ex-girlfriend
00:30:30
Speaker
And it's just like, all right, we're presenting as a straight cis couple and people aren't going to validate the fact that I'm queer because I'm here with a straight identifying woman.
00:30:41
Speaker
Well, and if queer is defined as unusual, like right now, most queer people are not the norm. We're not a large percentage of the world, but if our queer mission is successful and we spread this gospel of fluidity and non-binariness,
00:31:01
Speaker
as I think the world is and everything is sort of fluid and non-binary, then if we're all queer, is anyone queer? What's the, what's the unusualness of being queer at that point? Yeah. Yeah. For me, it's like when I talk about like just some, when it's someone I'm trying to woo or potentially dating, like if I could just,
00:31:20
Speaker
If you could get past the monotony of, what do you like to do for fun? What do you do for work? Where'd you go to school? If you can engage with someone and just not have either those three or four questions, and it's just natural and flowing, and it's just like, like I remember I was talking to a girl, I don't know how we got, and she was queer identifying, don't know how we got into the conversation, but I just stopped myself for a second. I'm like,
00:31:44
Speaker
Did I just drop on a girl that I'm potentially trying to impress my ideal way to die in a horror movie? Like, in the first five minutes of talking to this person? Like, did that just happen? But, you know, that to me is just like, you know, kind of that strange and unusual thing about queer dating.
00:32:04
Speaker
Yeah, like the way I look at it is like queer is like a Extremely multifaceted word as we're highlighting here that it's like one everybody has their own definition of it and also there's kind of no definition of it at the same time and I feel like what you're highlighting Miss Colleen is like the idea of like kind of social queerness where like there is like a social kind of mindset and
00:32:26
Speaker
that is just like outside of the norm. And then there's like the separate queerness that is directly linked to like gender and sexuality that I feel like at least I like will often like refer to queer as like where it's like directly tying in like a dismissal of heteronormativity, right?
00:32:45
Speaker
where we're just regarding the idea of all of these binaries, and just embracing all of the gray in between, and realizing that even if I'm presenting super masculine right now, and maybe only with a man in the last year, that still I see all of that gray, and all of that gray makes me queer.
00:33:08
Speaker
Yeah and it's interesting because you provoked the thought that I was having the other day in a conversation how there's levels of being gay like there's gold star gay and there's like someone told me about being platinum star gay and I'm just like what does that even mean and they explained it to me I'm just like
00:33:26
Speaker
Wow, but you know, it's platinum stargate. So platinum stargate is that like you were born by c-section. So you didn't even come out of a vagina and you haven't even seen one or been in one since. So that's platinum stargate. And I'm just like, I, wow, I am against that.
Embracing Masculine Traits in Queer Identity
00:33:47
Speaker
Yeah, let's define people by things they couldn't control. They were literally babies. Apparently they exist. That hurts a little bit. No, I've heard that too. It's a thing. Yeah, it's real. Okay.
00:34:03
Speaker
Wild. But go on, you were saying something too. Well, just like it'd be interesting because it's interesting for me because like when I think about my queerness is you know I present and drag and you know I have a super feminine look but like if you look at some of my hobbies like I like lifted pickup trucks. I drive one. I play sports. I talk about sports but I'm in a community that's not straight white men talking about sports. It's like you know community with other queer people.
00:34:32
Speaker
Well it goes back to this thing we've talked about of like there's this whole list of things that usually end up aligning with male and female or masculine and feminine these norms that like everything is supposed to fall in line and so it makes sense that as a gender-fluid person you get
00:34:51
Speaker
pulled in those different directions by these societal norms. But also, as you've described, you just are who you are. And if you're honest and open about who you are, then you'll find people that like that and are attracted to that. And that's how you make this stuff work.
00:35:09
Speaker
Yeah, something else that is really striking me with what you're talking about, you've kind of framed like queerness as something that you experienced through your more masculine traits in some ways, like talking about sports in queer settings. And like, I just think it's really interesting that something that some people, if they were to see you as this masculine presenting person talking about sports,
00:35:32
Speaker
could view as like this heteronormative thing, right? Like this thing that just like is the box that you were put in when you were 10 and now you're just trying to fit into that. But I love the fact that you're like owning that and rightfully so as a part of your queer identity, right? Like that hinges on the existence of like very masculine traits too.
00:35:52
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I remember vividly going to a local gay bar and I'm stepping out of my lifted pickup truck in full drag and six inch platform heels, and all I hear is, damn, from like really far. I'm like, what just happened? And it's just someone's like, I did not expect to see you to come out of that truck. And I'm like, oh, well, thanks. I guess I'll take that as a compliment. And he's like, yeah, you look beautiful and all that.
00:36:18
Speaker
Yeah, that's just kind of like how you're going to talk about how you present one way and, you know, or someone sees one thing, they perceive it to be one thing and just 180, you know, it's not what they perceived. Yeah. Well, and in that moment, you're literally, there's like a hyper femininity, there's a hyper masculinity almost that you could like read into that. And then there's like the androgyny that you're also talking about exploring on the daily too.
Insights into the Kink Community
00:36:42
Speaker
So I think sometimes folks kind of lose sight of what gender fluidity is and it's like switching from one to another and like for like this is kind of like a more masculine phase of life and then this is a more feminine phase of life and I think hearing how you've integrated all of that into like very much the same person and very much like the same identity for yourself that's super interesting to me and super cool to hear about. Thank you.
00:37:14
Speaker
I want to ask about kink because I have a kink which we haven't talked about here and we will not yet, maybe someday. But I have one and it is very specific and like it makes so much sense to me and it turns me on like instantly and every time and yet other kinks make no sense to me or like I get because of my experience that they exist but the actual thing does nothing for me like
00:37:44
Speaker
I won't list stuff but you know it's very interesting how it's like almost an all or nothing if you have it you have it and also my kink is kind of what opened my mind up to being bisexual because it was through that that I realized oh I like to see people of any gender involved in this
00:38:06
Speaker
fetish, like gender isn't exclusionary for me. Have you found stuff like that and like what's it like to create kink and fetish content when you either share the kink or I'm assuming you do some content where you don't share the kink, what's that like?
00:38:22
Speaker
So to kind of touch on what you were saying, not so much on a content base, but as far as a community standpoint, so I found community in Kink and BDSM. We're in my local area and from ranging from Philadelphia to New York City.
00:38:37
Speaker
and one of the most amazing things that i've come to love about the community is that you can do things with your friends like how like friends play like hey let's play basketball this weekend or hey let's play volleyball no i'll go to my friends say hey you want to do that impact scene this weekend then just like oh yeah let's do it and let's have a negotiation so the fact that
00:38:59
Speaker
I can do that with people that I just call friends and not have an emotional attachment that's like intimate or romantic about it is like the coolest thing in the world. And it doesn't have to have a gender tied to it too. Like if you're good with rope and you know how to tie someone up, like I don't care if you're male or female, like you're going to get me into subspace. You're going to get me into that mindset. Like gender's not playing into it. Yeah. But as far as creating content, since I feel like a lot of my,
00:39:28
Speaker
fan base and subscribers are either men or people were male assigned at birth. The psychology that I think that people when they watch my content they either want to be the one that's doing it to me or two they want to be me in a sense.
00:39:45
Speaker
So and I have both types of fan bases where like I'll fully talk about the people that want to like be in my position and like how they can get there and you know exploring gender and like doing all these things and you know doing things like makeup and as far as like putting together looks and then you know as far as shooting content like the people that want to do
Role of Play in Self-Discovery
00:40:04
Speaker
stuff to me it's just kind of like schmoozing them and you know using the right words and flirting and just you know kind of keeping them on the hook. Cool.
00:40:14
Speaker
Alex, what are your kinks? I think I'm still lost on the fact that listeners are going to be like trying to like go through a list of fetishes and like rewind back before you started talking, Rob, and try to figure it out. Try to figure it out. Different ones. See, that's what fetlife is. Like with my fetlife, like when someone asks me what are my kinks, I go to my fetlife and I say like, and so this, this, this, hard limits are this. Curious about this. So that's a useful tool.
00:40:44
Speaker
I know there's a whole list. I mean I have this one specific fetish but then as I then entered the queer community I realized oh like I could get into some of these other things too and like BDSM and rope play and like impact play like
00:41:00
Speaker
I've always kind of wondered the connection between queerness and kink stuff, because it seems like even if you're 100% heterosexual, getting into this kink BDSM world is a little bit queer. Again, it's semantic, but I don't know, there's some relationship there. See, there's this one party I go to, and I just started going to it earlier this year, back in October,
00:41:27
Speaker
You know, it hasn't happened since COVID, but I found compared to all the other parties I went to that this specific one had the most queer people. And I just like how I said earlier, you just kind of like felt that vibe with people, especially when you talk to them and you just kind of know.
00:41:44
Speaker
and it's interesting when I go to like another party somewhere else and it's just you know you get kind of that patriarchal heteronormative vibe from that party and it's just oh this is different like it's fun in a sense but it's not as fun as that other queer specific kind of like party and it's just
00:42:02
Speaker
you form a community and you make friends and you know you can do BDSM and like rope and impact and like all these things that it doesn't it's not necessarily a intimate romantic emotional connection like kind of thing like it's just stuff you're doing on a friend level
00:42:20
Speaker
It's play. I mean, play is like the perfect word for it. I mean, it's not a childish thing to do. It's very adult. But in that way, it's like play dates, where it's like you don't need to define it as like friendship or relationship. It is what it is, and it's just play. Yeah, it's a connection. You negotiate it and talk about it. Yeah, absolutely.
00:42:42
Speaker
Cool. That seems like a nice place to leave off. Everyone go out there and play with each other. Play however you want.
Conclusion and Social Media Links
00:42:49
Speaker
Yes. Thank you so much for joining us, Miss Colleen. I'm glad we finally got to have this conversation. It's been a long time coming. Yes, it was an absolute pleasure. Thank you for having me. And you can subscribe to Miss Colleen on OnlyFans and anywhere else. AVN stars, many vids. Any of those sites just look for Jersey Girl 2-1.
00:43:09
Speaker
Cool. And if you're a little embarrassed to do it, you can just call it research. Yeah. Yeah, if you're researching your sexual identity or gender, you're doing research in self-reachers. Self-discovery, self-exploration. Exactly. No shame in that. Every time you watch porn is research. Really. Cool. Well, thank you again. This was nice to have you and nice to chat.
00:43:37
Speaker
Two Bye Guys is created and hosted by Alex Boyan and me, Rob Cohn. Our logo art was designed by Caitlin Weinman, and our music was composed and created by Ross Mincer. Season 2 is executive produced and edited by me, Rob Cohn, and produced by Alex Boyan and Moxie Pun, with support from IFP. Thanks for listening to Two Bye Guys.