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Fathers (feat. Roger)
91 Plays2 years ago
In this series, we are digging deeper into current and potential fatherhood. We are peaking through the eyes of several different men, all in different life stages. In this episode, we are interviewing Roger!
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Transcript
Introduction to Fatherhood Focus
00:00:41
Speaker
Welcome, welcome, welcome, beautiful people. Welcome, pioneers. We are in season three through the eyes of men's fatherhood. And it has been such a blessing to hear all of these dads talk about fatherhood. I don't know about you guys, but society and culture, we hear about bad dads all the time, but we don't hear good fathers being able to tell their side of the story and getting to hear their wisdom. And this season has just been blessing me because we've had the chance to do that. And on here today we have Roger.
00:01:13
Speaker
So, Roger, tell us a little bit about yourself. Yeah, well, thanks, y'all. It's so great to be on here with you and to have this opportunity. So, yeah, just for your listeners, my name is Roger Gerstenberger, and I have the privilege of being married to my beautiful wife, Patty, for 31 years. And together, we have raised three sons. And I don't know if you ever actually finished raising them, but anyways, we are in that process.
00:01:42
Speaker
Yeah, just love, have a beautiful family. So grateful to the Lord to be a dad and to be a father. And I get to do that both at home and then I'm also involved in education. So I have the privilege of serving students and coming alongside families just in their process as well. Yeah, so good.
Defining Fatherhood: Roles and Responsibilities
00:02:04
Speaker
All right, first question, what is fatherhood?
00:02:08
Speaker
Oh wow, that's a really broad question there, right? You know, I think that personally, when I think of fatherhood, I really think of three specific things. And I'm gonna lay them out this way, parenting, protecting and providing. And, you know, parenting, like, you know,
00:02:32
Speaker
Just because you have a kid, you're a parent, right? You can be a mom, you can be a dad. But fathering or mothering goes a little bit deeper. And as it relates to parenting, parenting is
00:02:44
Speaker
is really raising a child. It's bringing them up. It's creating the framework and the boundaries of what being part of a family really means. It is helping a child to develop, to identify even their own unique skills and abilities and the design that God has intended for them. And it's nurturing them.
00:03:08
Speaker
And yes, providing boundaries and, you know, rules, if you will, in a framework for what life and good behavior look like. But it's also supporting and creating expectations for our children.
Media Portrayal and Balance in Fatherhood
00:03:25
Speaker
And that's kind of the broad sense of parenting. And then providing and protecting really, you know, really fatherhood is providing for your children.
00:03:35
Speaker
It is providing a safe place. It's providing a healthy environment and it's providing the resources necessary for that child to learn and to grow and to take responsibility for that provision and to be the man and lead in that. And then also to protect, to protect the family, to protect the wife, to protect the children and to be a safe place.
00:04:02
Speaker
Um, and it's really also, you know, I think as we relate as, as fathers, we have sons and daughters. And again, I never had the privilege of having a daughter. I have the privilege now of having a daughter in law, but, but as a father to, to have a daughter and to communicate that she is beautiful and that she is worth pursuing and to have a son to affirm that, that he has what it takes to be a man and to fulfill the call that is, you know, is on his life.
00:04:32
Speaker
So that's kind of, I don't know, just some things that come to mind on what fatherhood really is. And it is, it's much more involved than just being a dad. That's so good. What are some generalizations about fatherhood that need to be shut down? Oh, wow. You know, I think men in general and fathers in general, I think even if you look at media and television, you know, fathers,
00:05:01
Speaker
aren't aren't portrayed as being strong leaders are sometimes portrayed as, you know, sort of being bumbling idiots or, you know, not being strong or being weak or those kind of things and and
00:05:16
Speaker
you know, as a man, I can be, you know, I can make my mistakes for sure. And we're not immune from doing stupid things, but I think that fatherhood is so important, but it's not just, you know, this macho tough guy image, nor is it this, you know, absent, apathetic, you know, personhood that it's, you know, it's really in between those things that there's a,
00:05:45
Speaker
a strength and a peace and a combination of some seemingly contradictory things that fathers do care, but fathers also fight and stand up for righteousness and the right things in their family. So I think sometimes those generalizations fall on either side of those two categories, but what fatherhood really is, is a combination of those things. Does that make sense?
00:06:14
Speaker
Yeah, I like that. Is it challenging?
Modern Challenges and Generational Shifts
00:06:18
Speaker
And why? Oh, yes, absolutely. So yeah, my wife and I always always joke, right, that we decided we weren't going to save for college for our three kids that it'd probably better if we save for counseling, because, because our kids would probably need more counseling after we raised them than, than a college education. But
00:06:40
Speaker
It really is it's it's challenging right in today's day and age and society to to raise up young men and women to be a dad to lead fourth in the family with with really so much coming against the family unit as a whole you know so much coming against our kids that is that is challenging them that is
00:07:05
Speaker
that coming against truth and even a stand for truth, you know, certainly in their lives and all that. So learning how to lead well is really difficult. And there's so much more coming against our kids. I look at my own three sons and the challenges that they have and the things that are coming against them that
00:07:26
Speaker
You know, my generation, while we certainly had our own share of challenges, I think it has just really increased the things that my young men, my boys have to fight against. So good. Is your father in your life, and how has that affected your fatherhood? Yeah. So my father passed away back in 2016.
00:07:53
Speaker
But, you know, my dad and I had a good relationship and he did the best that he could. I think that there were things in my own father's life that, you know, I grew up, Patty and I, my wife and I will laugh a little bit.
00:08:11
Speaker
I grew up in a very kind of German stoic independent self-reliant home where emotions were not really recognized or talked about. But my dad did the best that he could and he was a good provider and he was a good protector. And he definitely helped lead me in truth and things of righteousness and supporting of that. And so I am grateful to him.
00:08:41
Speaker
for that and definitely he did have an impact on me and you know my goal as a father is that I can improve on that just like I'm sure he improved on on what he grew up in is as I know some of our generational history and my hope is that my sons can be better dads and fathers than what I am and what I was to them and so that they can be better fathers to their own children and my grandchildren
00:09:08
Speaker
And then that, you know, in our generational line, we continue to improve our fatherhood skills and what it means to be a father in our families. So good.
The Intersection of Faith and Fatherhood
00:09:21
Speaker
Was being a dad your plan or was it God's? You know, I think that growing up, like many of us, you know, we have a dream of, yeah, maybe someday, you know, I'm going to be a dad.
00:09:35
Speaker
For young ladies, I want to be a mom. And so I think I had that plan. And I was fortunate enough that Tati and I were able to have children. And we waited a few years after we got married. So I think a combination of both. But the reality of it is I think I had
00:09:58
Speaker
I hadn't really thought through all of the implications of what being a father really was. I remember the day that my first son was born and holding him in my arms and I mean literally just weeping and being overcome with emotion of this new life that was in my arms and that the Lord had allowed us to foster and steward and just thinking
00:10:24
Speaker
I have no idea what I am doing and how am I going to ever be able to take care of this child and what does it mean? And just feeling so overwhelmed in that. But yet, you know, God's grace was sufficient and, you know, we figured it out together and we took all kinds of parenting classes and did a lot of research and really just, you know, again, did our best, failed in many ways. Hopefully we did a few things right. But yeah.
00:10:54
Speaker
It was I guess it's a little bit of both my plan and certainly the Lord's plan for us.
Impact of Miscarriage (Q&A)
00:10:59
Speaker
Have you and your spouse ever had to deal with a miscarriage or still bird, and how did you get through that. Yes, we did. So, Patty. I think it was after a second child had a miscarriage and
00:11:17
Speaker
That was a really, really challenging process for both of us. And we both had to grow through that and in that. It affected us. I mean, obviously it impacted both of our hearts and our lives, but our response was very different. Obviously Patti, it probably impacted more and her response was different than mine.
00:11:44
Speaker
I felt the grief and loss, but I didn't know what to do with it. I went internal and my wife was more of an outward processor, processed more externally. But we had to grow even in that loss of our communication and sharing with each other the grief that we both felt and how we were processing that as we walked through that together. It was really a learning and growth experience for us.
00:12:14
Speaker
you know, that challenged us and realized as well that when we're around other people that walk through a similar situation, we're able to have a lot more empathy and hopefully able to provide more support and love and encouragement to couples who walk through this situation. But it definitely is challenging and, you know,
Family Bonds and Sibling Relationships
00:12:42
Speaker
Our hope in this is that we, again, we believe that life begins at conception and that that child exists. And that someday on the other side and in heaven that we will be able to meet that child that we never had the privilege of seeing and holding here on earth. Yeah. Do you have a good slash close relationship with your kids?
00:13:10
Speaker
Yeah, I really do. Like I said, three sons and my youngest son is in college. In fact, he'll be coming home here in just a week for the summer and being with us. We have our middle son who lives with us here in Spokane, not in our house. He has an apartment on the other side of town and we'll be moving out to Chicago shortly. And then my oldest son who's married and lives in Seattle. But we are a really close family and have really
00:13:39
Speaker
You know, it's one of those things you kind of have to fight for and contend for to have that relationship with our kids. And each of them are very, very different with different hobbies and interests and activities. And so as a parent, trying to connect with them on those level of interests and activities and meet them there and share together. But God has been so gracious in that.
00:14:05
Speaker
The other thing that we've really been intentional on with our boys is encouraging them to be what we call best friend brothers. Because here's the reality is that our relationship with siblings is the longest relationship that we will have in life.
00:14:22
Speaker
Yeah, it's going to be longer than our relationship with our parents. It's going to be longer than our relationship with, you know, with a spouse or significant other. Our siblings, it's going to be the longest relationship. And we wanted to and had sometimes had to fight for that relationship between our sons and that they would get to know each other and appreciate each other even as different.
00:14:45
Speaker
Yeah, you know, Shala, one of the things that I really appreciate most about my boys is that, you know, like I said, they are best friends, that they take trips together, they spend time together, they will call each other and FaceTime each other just on their own and that they have the relationship with each other that exists even outside of just the greater family relationship, which really
00:15:10
Speaker
you know, is just a blessing to both my wife and I that they, they care about each other and they want to know each other. And again, as different as they are, they value each other and the relationship that they have as brothers. Yeah. Hopefully me and my sisters would get there one day. We're trying. We're working on it. All right.
Discipline and Consequences
00:15:28
Speaker
What do your kids do that soften your heart? Oh, wow. Um, you know, um,
00:15:37
Speaker
that softened my heart. There's so much, you know, as a father, I'm certainly proud of the accomplishments and the things that they do. But I think the things that soften my heart is just even, well, they'll write me a note or a card, whether it's birthday or other special things. And they just, they express the gratitude and the things that they appreciate about me and our relationship.
00:16:04
Speaker
That really brings a lot of value to me. The other thing that really softens my heart is to watch how they treat their mother when they respect her and they take care of her and they honor her just for, you know, what she has done for them, that she has helped raise them, but also just who she is and their impact, her impact, excuse me, on their lives. I love seeing that, that they honor
00:16:30
Speaker
you know, their mother, because I know, and again, even with my oldest son, that he honors his wife as well. So good. And that's really brings great value to me. How did you deal with disobedience physically and emotionally? Yeah, so we were a family that we would physically discipline our boys when they were younger.
00:16:58
Speaker
And we had kind of the spanking, you know, stick, so to speak, that if they were disobedient, we addressed it and they knew that it would be addressed. And, you know, I know that there's been, you know, arguments for and against that. We believe it was effective and here's why. We don't see it as physical abuse. We view it as appropriate
00:17:27
Speaker
punishment that, yes, brings pain for just a moment, not lasting marks and not lasting abuse. But here's the beauty of it with our kids is that it was dealt with. So even in their disobedience, they knew that they were wrong, but yet they knew that it could be dealt with swiftly and quickly, that there could be forgiveness and restoration. And truly, I mean, both my wife and I would attest of those times with our sons that
00:17:57
Speaker
you know if they got a spanking and you know they would they would wipe the tears away but then they would skip off and go and play with a joyful heart knowing that even though they had been disobedient and they felt bad there was punishment but it was done and there was there was forgiveness and there was restoration and it had been dealt with
00:18:18
Speaker
rather than just kind of nagging out there, lagging out there, or feeling like we were just always mad at them or something like that, that it can be just kind of swift and appropriate punishment for their disobedience. The thing that I feel like is really important that we did deal with, and maybe you can say this was more on the emotion side of things, is
Teaching Values and Personal Growth
00:18:46
Speaker
Um, really trying to go for the heart, uh, when there was disobedience of not just here's a set of rules and regulations and do's and don'ts and all that, but to really communicate the why behind, you know, that rule was in existence. And, you know, I think even as, as, you know, uh, in, in, in our family with Christian beliefs and wanting to follow biblical standards and expectations that
00:19:13
Speaker
that even defining those things scripturally as to, you know what, God loves us very much. And like scripture says that God disciplines those he loves and here's why, because those boundaries that he has set up for us are there for a purpose and they're there to protect us from things and that it really is love. And so when we have that understanding of why we shouldn't do things, because it's actually harmful to us in the long run,
00:19:42
Speaker
It's easier to accept and understand and also then change our behavior, hopefully, to do things in a more appropriate manner. I wish life gave you spankings that way could just be one and done versus you have to sit there and wade through the consequences. It's been two years, but it's cool.
00:20:03
Speaker
Right? Yeah. And just that message, right, that I think is really lacking so much in today's society as we see that, you know, the decisions we make do have consequences. And whether or not we believe it, we will have to be responsible for those consequences in some way, shape or form. And so it's valuable to instill that knowledge and understanding in children before they get too old. Also,
00:20:32
Speaker
reminding them that the consequences sometimes aren't always yours. Sometimes your action will have effect on other people and it may skip you over, but have catastrophic effect for people around you. Absolutely. We don't think like that. No, it's so true. And you know, even, even on that Charlotte, like as, as a dad, right? As me, as a father in my family, the decisions I make
00:20:57
Speaker
don't just affect me, they do affect my family. And so if I make poor decisions in regard to my health or my marriage or my finances, guess what? Those decisions affect my wife, they affect my children, they could affect my children's children. And that's a very sobering thought, but that's the reality of
00:21:26
Speaker
of where we're at. And so, yeah, our decisions definitely have consequences. Yeah, so good. What are you trying to or what were you trying to instill in your science? Oh, gosh. So much. And I think that, you know, that changes as your children grow older. Yeah. And that's, again, I think, just generally speaking, in a broad brush,
00:21:55
Speaker
approach of what we tried to instill in our sons was a sense of right and wrong and understanding that there is an absolute truth related to scripture related to what God has established as truth in this world that we
00:22:14
Speaker
want to operate as good citizens, that we want to steward our own lives, but also be cognizant of the world around us, to live a life of service towards others, to be kind and generous to those around us, and to always seek to better and improve ourselves. Yeah, that's good.
00:22:42
Speaker
What are some unspoken promises, principles, characteristics, et cetera, that you want them to grasp just by watching you?
Modeling Behavior for Children
00:22:51
Speaker
Yeah. You know, there's that old adage, right, that things are more caught than taught.
00:23:00
Speaker
And I think even, you know, Cheryl, you probably see this, right? I mean, I look at my own lives and habits and tendencies sometimes, and I'll even catch myself thinking, oh my gosh, I was totally my dad right there, right? Or I was totally, you know, we just pick up some of those, you know, quirks or traits or behaviors even, right, that were modeled from our parents.
00:23:28
Speaker
Again, that's kind of a humbling and sobering thought in reality as well, is that our kids are watching on it.
00:23:39
Speaker
never want to be that hypocrite or be viewed as that, that if I have those kind of expectations on my son, that I need to model that, right? I need to model what right living looks like, that if I believe that there's absolute truth and I need to live my life in accordance with that, and as a demonstration of that, that if I expect them to be generous, they need to see me being generous to others and those around us.
00:24:10
Speaker
You know, just, just even an example of that, what, what I like to do from time to time is if we're out as a family, um, you know, maybe eating or we see someone who, you know, maybe looks like they're in a hard time or something like that, where we'll pick up their, their lunch bill just anonymously. And they've, they've seen us do that over the years. And then.
00:24:32
Speaker
I love when I get a phone call or a text like, hey, I was out for lunch today and I saw this guy who looked like he was down on his luck. I paid for his lunch and he never knew and it was such a good feeling. Those kinds of things that, again, that we as mothers and fathers, as parents, that, again, we need to demonstrate the actions and the attitudes that we hope that our children will
00:25:00
Speaker
follow and instill in their lives. But if they don't see us doing it, I'm going to say that the success rate of those things being lived out in the lives of our children is really going to be very small because they have to see that demonstrated. We have to model that for our children. How do you incorporate your walk with Christ into your parenting? Yeah. Really, it is everything.
00:25:29
Speaker
fully integrated in that, again, even in modeling that, right, for my wife and I, that they see us having quiet times on our own, that they see us in worship, that they see us in Bible study, that they see us actively pursuing God in prayer, and that even in our conversations that
00:25:53
Speaker
You know, our spiritual relationship with our Heavenly Father is integrated into every part of our life. You know, it's not just, you know, kind of sprinkled on the top, you know, if you think of like a cupcake, if life is a cupcake, that our spiritual relationship is just not something that we sprinkle on the top and say, you know, this is, but it's mixed into the batter of life.
00:26:21
Speaker
that we, our relationship with God and that he cares about every aspect of our life. And that even when our sons would go through a hard time or a breakup with a girlfriend or a disappointing athletic experience or whatever it is, just inviting them to even ask Jesus into the middle of that situation. What does he say about you? And what do you feel like he thinks about this situation? So just really trying to both model and
00:26:50
Speaker
intentionally integrate our relationship with Christ in our relationship with our boys and throughout every aspect of life.
Balancing Work, Family, and Life (Q&A)
00:27:01
Speaker
How do you balance work, spouse, ministry, kids, and your own personal walk with God? Yeah, that's the million dollar question right there. Life balance is, it can be challenging and I'll be the first to admit that
00:27:18
Speaker
I have failed miserably at that, especially in years past, Patty and I, and we had our first kid and I was, you know, trying to build my career and spending the extra time at work and all that, but really, it was really at the expense of my time with my wife and my time with my son and all that. And so I think that what I have learned, in fact, I even have,
00:27:45
Speaker
this as an expectation for my employees and at our school of that we have to maintain balance in our life. And balance requires priorities. And so if I look at scripture and I kind of extract what I feel like priorities in life are, it kind of boils down to this.
00:28:15
Speaker
And first and foremost is that I'm a son of God. Yeah. And that I need to honor that relationship, my own personal relationship with God. Secondly is that I am the husband to my wife and that I need to prioritize that relationship.
00:28:36
Speaker
And that I need to make sure that that relationship is intact and not just intact and not just in existence, but thriving. That my relationship with my wife is growing deeper and stronger. And quite honestly, my boys need to see that. They need to see that I love and care for my wife and spend time with her and prioritize her. And then third, I'm the father to my children. And that I need to make sure that they feel valued.
00:29:04
Speaker
and preferred and cared for and heard and seen. And then after that, then, you know, I feel like there's work relationships that I have that obligation to provide for my family and so do my best at work. And then there's hobbies and health and those kinds of things that fall, you know, behind there too.
00:29:28
Speaker
you know, that I do need to stay healthy, right? And so taking care of myself physically and eating well and exercising, I mean, that's a big part of it too, of stewarding that because if I'm sick or unenergetic, I can't do those other things well. But, you know, I start out every morning of every day with a quiet time before the Lord and time in prayer and committing the day to Him.
00:29:55
Speaker
spending time with him and asking him what he has for me. And I just, I have found that that's, I need that to lead into that. So that's kind of, that's helped that balance because I feel, I kind of put it this way that really there's,
00:30:18
Speaker
There's kind of three main questions that, you know, one day I'll have the privilege of standing before the Lord. Right. And this is this is the theology of Roger. You're not going to find this in scripture. So hopefully it's not heresy. But but I feel like he's going to ask me three main questions. And if I can't answer these questions really well.
00:30:39
Speaker
the other questions don't really matter. And that is this, that the first question that he's gonna ask me was, you know, was I a good son? You know, and did I love him and honor him and obey him as a son to the father? The second question, you know, I imagine him asking me is, did I love my wife like he loves the church? Did I care and provide for her?
00:31:07
Speaker
sacrifice for her and do what I could to see her succeed. And then thirdly is, was I the father to my sons if he was to me? And I feel like if I can't answer those three questions well, there's not much after that that matters. And there are other things that matter, don't get me wrong, but I want to be able to answer those three questions really well.
00:31:36
Speaker
You are such a teacher. That spirit is heavy on you. Well, you're very kind. What challenges do you have as the head of house and how do you overcome?
Leadership and Decision-Making in Families
00:31:50
Speaker
Yeah, right. That kind of, that's a good follow up question, right? Of priorities of being the head of the house, right? Because, um,
00:32:02
Speaker
To me, leadership, which I believe being the head of the house is a leadership position, right? And I believe that when you take leadership and you boil it down, if you will, to kind of the crud at the bottom of the pan, leadership is all about serving. And so as the head of the house, how am I serving my wife and my family?
00:32:28
Speaker
Um, and that's, to me, that's a, that's a collaborative process, um, that I, I need to make sure I understand their needs and hear those things. And, uh, again, that they're, they feel heard and honored, but also sometimes that means making the hard decisions and that the buck does stop with me. And while I certainly want my wife's input and I want her to be heard and their decisions that we make together, um, there's been decisions that, you know, uh, in, in our life, the Lord has, has.
00:32:58
Speaker
taken us through a number of transitions, job wise, moved across the country, those kinds of things. And those are decisions that I've had to make. And obviously with collaboration and input from my family, but at the end of the day, they've trusted me to make the decision and to hear from the Lord. And that's a scary responsibility. But I have to lead. I have to lead.
00:33:26
Speaker
And so I think that's what being the head of the household is, is it's this mixture of just serving, collaborating, but also making hard and the best decisions of A, what the Lord has for us as a family and B, how we can provide best for our family. Yeah. So good.
00:33:50
Speaker
What falls through the cracks because of whatever is happening on a daily basis? What area are you slacking? Oh, that varies from time to time. But, you know, I think like, I mean, right now in schoolwork and all that, it's really a busy, busy kind of time. So sometimes those things that
00:34:14
Speaker
I end up kind of slacking in or that don't make the daily to do list are, are probably those more of those personal things, those, those hobby things, whether that's reading time, personal time, or maybe time to work out that I don't get to the gym as often as I'd like to right now or, you know, on those weekly basis. Um, but again, it's, it's some of those things that are priority that, you know, I do want to make sure that time with my wife and that, you know, I'm, I'm,
00:34:42
Speaker
Connected with my boys when I can, that I'm doing a good job at work. And again, when work has high demands that I'm not going to sacrifice my time with my wife or those things that matter with my boys. But what I will sacrifice is maybe just more of those personal interests for the time being. And just, again, having to be intentional about trying to restore those things too, when the seasons slow down a little bit and when we have more margin. Yeah.
00:35:10
Speaker
Do you find yourself overcompensating in any way for any reason?
Personal Growth: Handling Insecurities
00:35:16
Speaker
Overcompensating. That's a good question. I think at times I can be hard on myself. Yeah.
00:35:38
Speaker
Um, just, and just honestly being transparent. And I think if anybody's listening to this too, um, there may be some, some men that resonate with this. So I, again, kind of growing up, I grew up in a very, like I said, sort of results oriented, independent, self-reliant, semi perfectionistic, um, and, um,
00:36:00
Speaker
So sometimes I can struggle with feeling like, am I doing enough? And in that, I think sometimes maybe I'll overcompensate with feeling bad or apologizing maybe to my wife or kids or those type of things that, and they're beautiful and they assure me that things are good and doing okay.
00:36:26
Speaker
You know, I think, and I don't know if that really falls in that overcompensating category, but I think it, in some ways it does have just, I will overcompensate out of my fears and my insecurities of, of am I doing enough? And, you know, and so kind of seek, you know, to apologize or those kinds of things and feel bad or disappointed in myself.
00:36:57
Speaker
What do you do on the days you want to quit?
Coping with Difficult Days
00:37:03
Speaker
Yeah, we all have those days, right? Yeah, definitely. I've had those times, those really kind of dark nights of the soul, if you will, those really challenging seasons where
00:37:26
Speaker
I mean, honestly and sometimes ashamedly, I've had those moments where I just had this outburst with God and I've cursed him and been so angry and felt abandoned by him or whatever in those situations or when it just felt like my world was falling apart. But I do meet with him and I do try and hear his voice in that. And for me,
00:37:55
Speaker
Where I do that, our whole family, we're big outdoors people. We love the outdoors. We love, you know, all sorts of outdoor activities. And for me, like I have to, I have to get away and just be alone and go get outside in nature and just have those heart to heart conversations with my father, God, and just say, okay, what, you know,
00:38:23
Speaker
I'm honestly mad, I'm angry, I'm disappointed, I feel like quitting, it's not working like I think it should and I need help. And I need you to meet me here. Shala, it's just time and time again, he has and he has met me there and he has been that loving dad and spoken to my heart and brought affirmation and sometimes correction, right?
00:38:51
Speaker
in my own heart and maybe my own views or perspectives or realizing that, you know, the expectations I've, I had about a situation or how things should work is like, where did you, you know, where did you get those expectations? Well, because it wasn't for me and realizing that, you know, I could, I could be kind of self-sabotaging in that just with unrealistic expectations. So that's, that's kind of, I just, that's, that's where I run to.
00:39:20
Speaker
Um, and again, he's been faithful. You made me think of the song, um, run to the father by Cody. Yeah, right. Yeah. Yeah. And honestly, again, I know it may sound trite or, you know, but I really do. And in those really hard and challenging times, and he's, he's just been faithful. Yeah. Every time, every time who has helped support you through your journey as a father.
Importance of Male Support Networks
00:39:47
Speaker
Yeah. I think, um,
00:39:49
Speaker
So I have had the privilege of just having other good relationships, both with friends and men who are kind of in the same season of life that I was. So whether that's when we had young kids or even now when our kids are older and that presents different sets of challenges and different opportunities of how to lead and be a father for
00:40:17
Speaker
the current needs of our boys. And like scripture said, it's not good for man to be alone, that we need that fellowship with each other. I need other men in my life that I can bounce questions off of, that I can seek counsel from. Yeah, speak wisdom into you. Absolutely. And the other thing that I've always been intentional of, and both Patty and I have,
00:40:41
Speaker
Uh, both individually, in other words, me seeking out like a mentor man, like someone who is a season or two ahead of me, who can speak into my life and like wise we'll do that. You know, maybe with an individual woman who's a season or two ahead of her, but then also as couple, like finding a mentor couple for us that, that we can even bounce things off.
00:41:05
Speaker
off of them together as a couple in our marriage relationship or in parenting or those type of things. And you have to be intentional about that. And as a man, I will admit that guys are horrible at this. That we have, you know, I don't know whether it's just that, you know, macho, you know, we can do this, we had it all figured out kind of pride, which it really boils down to.
00:41:31
Speaker
in our lives, but we need other men in our lives and we need to be able to bounce off things and get, you know, hopefully good counsel. And that's why it's important to have good friends. But yeah, so I've really sought that out and been intentional about trying to develop those relationships. And I'm an introvert. I'm that guy that, you know, I'm not going to have like 50 friends, but I'm going to have five or six men that are really close with and I want to go deep with.
00:42:03
Speaker
Yeah. What do you wish you were told about fatherhood beforehand?
Continuous Learning in Fatherhood
00:42:11
Speaker
Oh, man. Everything, right? It's like, you know, I go back to that, my story of that day when I was holding my, you know, first son on the day he was born, right? I don't know.
00:42:25
Speaker
a darn thing. Yeah, I don't know. You know, I don't know, Jack, about being a father. And so and I in there are, you know, there's great books and resources and those kind of things out there. And certainly in that process as parents, both my wife and I sought those resources and read those books and all that. But you know, I think that honestly, there's
00:42:54
Speaker
that that journey of learning is part of the value as well. That my staff, I say this to my staff all the time and they roll their eyes because I say it all the time, but it is this, it's the day that we think we have it figured out is a day that we're in trouble.
00:43:19
Speaker
And Shala, here's the reality. So, you know, I've been married for 31 years. My old son is, you know, let's see, 27, about to be 28 here this year. And so, been a father for 28 years, but there are a thousand ways I can be a better father. There's a thousand ways I can be a better husband. There's a thousand ways I can be a better father.
00:43:43
Speaker
And here's the reality is that while counsel and there's definitely good wisdom and we want to seek that out, that there's this, I think it's really God designed that He designed us to continue to learn, to seek Him out, to grow. Like we're called to continue to grow and develop.
00:44:03
Speaker
So while on one hand I wish that there was sort of this user manual, being a father and having a kid and here's steps one through 12 and now you know it. I wish someone had told me that it is as much about the journey as it is about any set of knowledge or instructions or procedures. What is one thing you wish you were told by your father?
Receiving Affirmation and Confidence
00:44:38
Speaker
You know, I'm going to get kind of personal here again. And I don't think my father knew how to do this. And the thing that kind of hurts my heart is that I don't think he knew how to do it because it was never demonstrated for him.
00:45:01
Speaker
But I mentioned that being a father and talking about sons and telling them that they have what it takes to be a man. And again, my father did the best that he could. And he grew up, honestly, his father was quite absent in his life. So even I'm amazed and impressed and grateful for the father that he was.
00:45:33
Speaker
Again, a lot of my growing up was sort of performance-based and perfectionistic. And so again, I always wondered if I was living up to his expectations or meeting those expectations. And so I wish I had heard those words from him. That would have meant a lot to my soul. And I know he loved me. I know he was proud of me.
00:45:54
Speaker
without much of a role model at all there, but
00:46:03
Speaker
but there's something in the male soul that longs to hear those words from your dad. What is one thing you were told by your father that you use often?
Lessons on Decision-Making and Emotions
00:46:17
Speaker
Yeah, so my dad had a lot of sometimes interesting quips and quotes and things like that that
00:46:27
Speaker
he would say, and I think from time to time, two of the ones that I most often repeat is, which is really funny being an educator, right? One of the things that he always used to say is he's like, you know what, Roger? The world is run by C students. In other words, by students who, you know, like had a C average, right? And which,
00:46:52
Speaker
You know, probably gave me too much of an excuse to slack off when I was in school and think, well, if dad thinks to see is good enough, you know, and I can rule the world that it's good enough, good enough for him is good enough for me. But, you know, what he meant by that.
00:47:07
Speaker
was that oftentimes we will see, you know, high achieving people, right? That aren't well-rounded and that, you know, there's a book knowledge and there's a street knowledge.
00:47:23
Speaker
and that the people that have both an IQ and an EQ, that have both knowledge and emotional intelligence that know how to develop relationships and lead people and all that. And a lot of those things, quite honestly, and again, as an educator, you're not gonna have a class on that. You have to learn that through life.
00:47:47
Speaker
And so when we take the time to invest in those aspects of our life and develop ourselves in those aspects of our lives, those are the people that are going to find themselves promoting positions of leadership and authority and those type of things. So that's just kind of one of those funny statements that goes a little deeper than it sounds on face value. But I often repeat, especially as an educator, it kind of takes people back there.
00:48:14
Speaker
The other thing that my dad used to say is one of the things that he always used to say, do something even if it's wrong. And I like that, even going back to like just being a father, the importance of making a decision, of not being apathetic, of not being just complacent, that, you know what, as fathers, we do have to lead.
00:48:42
Speaker
And not that we're gonna make a decision that we know is wrong, but we have to make a decision and life requires us to make decisions and we wanna make the best decisions we can, but any decision is better than no decision. Because no decision is a decision, really. And so I think that as man and as leaders and as father, certainly we need to be proactive and we need to...
00:49:09
Speaker
do things and make things happen and make decisions rather than just, you know. Sitting on your hands. Exactly, yep. So there's a couple of his famous sort of clips and things that have stuck with me. What is one thing you want to tell other fathers?
Encouragement for Fathers
00:49:30
Speaker
I think if I was
00:49:35
Speaker
to sit down and however many fathers are out there listening to this today, I don't know where you're at, but maybe you're frustrated, maybe you're disappointed, maybe you're wondering if you have what it takes. And I want to speak those words, Shala, over your listeners and over fathers who might be listening to this today to say, don't give up, that you do have what it takes deep down inside and that
00:50:02
Speaker
there is only one perfect father and that is our father God. And that with your kids, they need you and that there are strengths and there are abilities and there's insight and there's love and there's care and there's concern and there are those things that are inside each of the fathers that are listening that our kids need. And so I would just encourage them to
00:50:32
Speaker
to just step up, to not give up, to be available, and to believe in yourself that your kids don't need a perfect father, they need you. And God has created you uniquely and specifically for the children that he has given you, whether by choice or otherwise. And so you have that opportunity to help raise them,
00:50:59
Speaker
protect them, to parent them, to provide for them, and you do have what it takes. In the mighty name of Jesus, I cosign on that prayer. What do you tell your kids often?
Expressing Love and Pride
00:51:12
Speaker
What do I tell my kids often? Oh my gosh. I am really intentional, again, probably because of my upbringing of telling them that I love them.
00:51:27
Speaker
that I'm really proud of who they are. And not just what they did, and not just, again, based on a set of accomplishments or successes or all that, but again, I love them as much in their failure as I do in any success. And I want them to really know that and understand that and hear me, that my love is for them,
00:51:57
Speaker
It's not conditional. It's for who they are, not what they have done. And so I really am intentional on that because I know, as I've stated previous, I didn't get a lot of that growing up. And so I want to grow in that area. And I want my sons to have more of an opportunity to hear that from their father. That's so good. What do you think needs to be talked about more as it pertains to fatherhood?
00:52:26
Speaker
I think that just I think the importance of fathers in culture and in society of just of leading and you know I mean there's so much distortion and all that but I think that if you were to take a group
00:52:50
Speaker
of women, and Charlie, you can attest to this, and maybe you had these conversations right then, that what a woman wants is a strong male. Yes. Right? And again, not a ruler, not an overseer, not someone who dominates that.
00:53:09
Speaker
Someone who knows how to lead. Exactly. That we need fathers to lead. And I look at our nation right now, and there's just this leadership vacuum of people who have convictions and are willing to stand by those convictions and lead with truth and integrity. And that has to start in the home. If I'm not, I can't expect to be a great father and leader
00:53:38
Speaker
in my work or in my social circles or whatever. If I'm not doing that at home, it has to be born out of who we are. And so that has to be demonstrated in our homes and because that develops us and our character and who we are and that's our true identity. And so that fatherhood thing really is a leadership thing. And it's so needed in this culture. It's needed in our families. It's needed in our politics and our government.
00:54:08
Speaker
our nation. More on that also, not just women needing and or wanting men who lead, but not seeing a dad from a woman's perspective, not seeing a dad in the house leading makes it really hard for her to respect a man who is a leader because she's watched mom be mom and dad. She's watched mom be the leader. So not that she can't respect him, but
00:54:36
Speaker
it's harder for her to respect him because she hasn't seen a man in that position. And I'm speaking from experience. Yeah, right. No, so true. So true. Yeah.
00:54:46
Speaker
Yeah and again my heart breaks and with absolute respect like if and Patty and I say this so often like I mean single moms are heroes. They are absolute heroes and I don't know I mean my wife and I will look at each other and like I can't imagine being a single parent as a single dad and she can imagine being a single parent as a mom because we so need each other
00:55:10
Speaker
And there's things that she can bring to the relationship and for our kids that I don't do well. And there's things that I can bring to that relationship that maybe she doesn't do as well. But to put all of that burden and all of that responsibility of protecting and providing and parenting, it was not meant for one person to carry alone. And so again, my heart, again, just breaks and not out of a, you know,
00:55:39
Speaker
just, gosh, I feel sorry for you, but like I have such respect for the single parents who do take that on.
Societal Role of Fathers and Leadership
00:55:48
Speaker
And many who do just an absolutely amazing job. So true. Do you think that there's a lack of fathers and why? Yeah, I do. I think kind of just on the same line of conversation that we were just having, Shala, that I think men aren't stepping up.
00:56:09
Speaker
They don't have the confidence they and just like you stated, you know, even in your own background right of women who haven't seen that in their own life. So they don't, they don't know how to trust men or, you know, that
00:56:22
Speaker
that that goes for little boys and young men who haven't seen that father figure in their own life. And they don't know how to lead and how to step up and do that well. And I think that has led to this huge deficiency of two fathers in our culture and in this nation today. Yeah. What is your hope for your future as a father? And what is your hope for your kids?
00:56:49
Speaker
Yeah. Um, so again, my, my hope for, you know, future as a father is that I can continue, obviously, you know, as our kids get older, that relationship changes that, um, you know, the relationship, it goes deeper. We can, we can be a little more of a friend than just a parent. Uh, but.
00:57:09
Speaker
but that my sons always feel like I'm approachable, that they can talk to me about anything that they know I love and care about them and that, you know, as a father and then ultimately as a grandfather, right? That they can continue, you know, multi-generationally to fulfill that. And then, you know, my hope is that, again, as I alluded to, that my children become even a better father.
00:57:39
Speaker
in their families and a better husband to their wives. And that generationally, that the Gerstenberger family is one that advances and that increases. And that generation after generation, we get better, we get stronger, we get more, you know, we just do as it relates to the family and fathering and mothering and loving and serving. That's so good.
00:58:07
Speaker
Do you think this generation of fathers have things harder or easier than you have them? I do think they have it harder. Again, just because there's so much pressure against kind of the traditional family, that there is a
00:58:25
Speaker
fewer and fewer role models and men in their life that demonstrate good leadership and fatherhood. And so I think there's less of a support structure for this generation than my generation had. And again, it breaks my heart that we're there. I know it's my heart and Patty's heart that we see that restored.
00:58:53
Speaker
So, but it's not getting easier. Yeah. All right, last two questions.
Commitment and Loyalty in Tough Times
00:58:59
Speaker
What is something you have to say to this generation of men and fathers? Yeah, I think it kind of goes back to what I said before about just that be a man, stand up, lead. You have what it takes. Do the hard thing.
00:59:21
Speaker
Um, be loyal, be committed, um, you know, uh, as a husband, I mean, let's start there that, you know, those wedding vows of, of for better or for worse, that in those times when it's the for worse kind of times that you don't, you don't skip town and run that you, you demonstrate stability and care and love and support and you, and you tough it out together because on the other side of that is such a beautiful place and such a deeper relationship.
00:59:50
Speaker
And that even with kids, and yeah, raising kids is tough, but that you don't skip out, that they need you, and that you do have what it takes to raise your children, to lead them, to parent them, to provide and protect them, that you have it within you. It's not natural. Again, it is a journey of figuring out how to do that well, but don't give up. Yes, yes, yes.
01:00:20
Speaker
And last question, what is something you have to say to this generation of women and mothers?
Acknowledging Women's Burden (Q&A)
01:00:30
Speaker
I think the thing that comes to mind, Shala, is honestly, will you forgive us? Sorry, I can get a little emotional on this.
01:00:54
Speaker
I think as men, we have been derelict of our duties, speaking in general. And again, there's men who are listening who are amazing husbands and fathers. And so again, there's absolute men out there who are doing great things, but generationally and culturally like we were just talking about. Men have given up and men haven't,
01:01:23
Speaker
stood up and taken a stand and been the men and fathers that I think were called to be. And that has left a huge burden and a huge responsibility on mothers. And when you look at the divorces, and this is Christian and non-Christian, and there's unfortunately not a big difference there, but when men aren't on the scene,
01:01:50
Speaker
90 plus percent of the time, who is it that's raising the kids? Moms. It's the moms, right? And like I said, I mean, that is such a huge responsibility that was not to be carried alone.
01:02:02
Speaker
And as a man, I, again, I believe a lot of that responsibility, there's always two sides, don't get me wrong. But a lot of that responsibility is men who have not been willing to step up and to fight for their kids, to fight for their relationship too.
01:02:22
Speaker
And fighting for is not fighting against. I think sometimes we're really good at fighting against our wives or fighting against things, but actually fighting for something. Fighting for and contending for a relationship that yeah, you know what may be really rough right now. But I believe in the value of those vows and that pledge that I made to you. I believe in the value of the fact that
01:02:46
Speaker
together we have these children or this child that together we're going to raise and we're going to create great opportunities for this little boy or this little girl and we're going to work together to raise them up as a young man and a young woman of integrity who values life, who understands that they're a unique creation and that they have skills and abilities and value in this world.
01:03:13
Speaker
Oh, that was that was me right there. Oh, well, pioneers and beautiful people. Thank you so much for this episode, Roger. Thank you so much for being on. This was so good. Guys, I really, really hope that you take something from this. Take this and run with it. Change your life, the community in the world. Go to the Patreon, go to the website, like, follow, share, and we'll catch you in the next one. Bye. See you later. Thanks.
01:03:45
Speaker
So.