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The Assets and Liabilities of Being a Human (with special guest Megan Phillips)
99 Plays5 months ago
In this very special episode of *Friendless*, host James Avramenko welcomes comedian and performer Megan Phillips.
The conversation begins with Megan's journey toward self-discovery and fostering unconditional love and trust in oneself, which she believes can extend to building healthier communities. The reflect on growing up in boundary-less homes, and highlight the lifelong importance of understanding and setting healthy boundaries, both for personal growth and in relationships.
Megan and James delve into the dynamics of friendships versus romantic relationships, the need for emotional health, and the invaluable lesson of purpose within relational contexts. They explore the nuances of fear-based thinking and the importance of avoiding manipulation in connections. Megan shares her recent triumph over her fear of roller coasters, attributing this newfound courage to inner work and self-trust.
Throughout the episode, the pair discusses the transformative power of storytelling in comedy, Megan’s artistic inspirations, and her reflections on aging, appearance, and social media. Megan’s career journey, from a love of music and dance to finding her voice in comedy, reveals her dedication to authenticity and the joy found in the arts.
Tune in for an episode packed with wisdom, humour, and genuine human connection.
Check out Megan's website at meganphillips.com
and follow her on Instagram @MegNatPhil
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction of Megan Phillips and discussion topics
00:00:08
Speaker
Well, hey there, sweet peas. Welcome back to Friendless. I'm your host, James Avramenko, back with a brand new episode. And this week, I am joined by my very special guest, Megan Phillips. Megan is an incredible comedian performer amongst a myriad of other talents. And um she is one of my newest best friends. We discuss using art to express past experiences, recognizing when our old models aren't working anymore, and what it means to set boundaries with love. All that and so much more. Megan is incredible. I love this conversation. You're gonna love it. So lean back, get comfy, set your volume at a reasonable level, and enjoy my interview with Megan Phillips here on Friendless.
00:00:48
Speaker
uh...
Megan's story about her cat, Spot
00:00:49
Speaker
megan phillips uh... let's start off with a little bit of a wild card what is bringing you joy this week allow we just like get it or we're just in it uh... yeah okay i was like i was expecting a but i guess we're not on the radio show of god really just told me we're not live on the air uh... okay something that brings me joy
00:01:11
Speaker
Okay. I just told you the story, but now we're doing it publicly is, um, I bought a little cat bed for spot my cat. Oh, I bought her two cat beds and I've been trying to bribe her to both go up on top of my bookcase and, um, on my desk so that she can be with me and per and stare at me judgmentally while I am working. yeah And, uh, the most important ah roles that a cat fills. Right, right, right, is just sheer judgment. I'm like, well, now that I don't talk to my family of origin, where else am I gonna get this, you know? So, um ah yeah, so that's that's why we get a feline to recreate the trauma patterns of our past. yeah um So she, ah yeah, and she, I've been trying various methods to get her to go up there. i've tried to
00:02:06
Speaker
treats I've tried to little bits of scent soakers of sweaters. um I've tried little blankets, none of it. I tried her old cat bed, which, you know, one day she was just like, nah, don't want that anymore. She grew out of it. Yeah, she grew out of it. It was a phase, mom. I think that was quite expensive. uh anyway but uh none of that um but then i got these dollar store beds and i stuck some treats in them and a sweater that she's like to sleep on and uh a little catnip toy and she went yeah and now it's her favorite fucking place and that i can't even tell you how much joy that brings me is she is she one of those cats that like gets fucked up on catnip
00:02:50
Speaker
yeah and it's amazing does she go like crossside um pretty much she's like a Pretty lazy feline yeah, but my dad when catnip gets involved you always know because suddenly you're like up oh she She does like flips I'll take a video next time and send it to you like it's honestly she does like midair 180s like she just Like, suddenly she just becomes like, I don't know, fucking lassie. the Like, suddenly she's one of those like frisbee dogs. You're like a super dog. You're so funny. God, I love the super dogs. Oh my god, they're the only reason I go to the P&E. Yeah, we used to go we used to go every year at the Stampede. I used to love the super dogs. Yeah, I remember. I went to
Experience at drive-by P&E during the pandemic
00:03:35
Speaker
the super dog. Do you remember um during the pen? Oh, you were in Saskatoon, where you currently live, um according to Facebook.
00:03:42
Speaker
yeah um But during when they they brought the peony back for one ah That one year, I think it was in 2020, but it was like a drive-by peony. It was oh weird very weird okay it was like a drive-in peony Just go look at the rides yeah yeah well it well it wasn't yeah Yeah, exactly. I mean you just do that anyway, but this is like the peony with like the exhibits um Yeah, cuz that roller coaster is fuck. Yeah, fuck that so scary. I don't do rides. I never will really know Yeah, we'll get into it. but Yeah, I have a story about that um Anyway, but I went to the peony I bought ah it was like a $35 ticket or something outrageous course Specifically because they had super dogs. Mm-hmm. They were bringing back super dogs like and drive by super dogs and Oh my god James. It was so fucking bad. Like I was so far back and they like had this weird thing where
00:04:38
Speaker
like they they put your car in to a special order and then for some reason because i was like the weird solo lady in the car and didn't have kids they like put me in the back so then you couldn't see and like you had screens but like the dogs go so fast that the screens couldn't keep up so then you just kind of had to like Watch a blurry screen or just watch a dot like I'm so far back And then like you could only stay so long in one area before they like moved you along like a parade It was so bad and it's during the pandemic when like every dollar counts that I was like $35 Jesus fuck I could have bought like a gallon of milk for that you know
00:05:18
Speaker
it's It's amazing, like looking back, you know it it makes sense in so many ways why we've all just like collectively like decided to pretend it didn't happen. Because that those two years were so fucking weird and so stressful, and we all were so weird. like everyone Everyone just became the weirdest version of themselves. I didn't shave or cut my hair for two years. I literally had a beard down to my nipples. like it was awful well you became pull-up guy that was after the divorce oh no no I became pull-up no I became you I was told when you get divorced you can become one of five different types of guys um I became pull-up bar guy um I don't know what the other four are because I didn't actually explore all the options but I settled on pull-up bar guy Yeah.
The commonality of Megan's name and funny anecdotes
00:06:10
Speaker
Yeah. ah No, that was after. No. During pandemic, I was a caveman. um I was I was the Unabomber's little brother.
00:06:20
Speaker
but yeah right a I never grew out of it. Oh, and I never will. um Before we spin away too far, let's let's let's double back a little bit. I started us on just like a little wild card question here. But let's double back. For listeners who may not be familiar with you or may not know your work, who the hell are you? I'm Megan Phillips. I'm Megan fucking Phillips. Okay. You're the one who asked me here. Why are you in my home? Did I stutter? ah
00:06:56
Speaker
Wait. ah Well, this is awkward. um Could you please leave? Am I in danger right now?
00:07:09
Speaker
um Yeah, I don't know I'm Megan Phillips there's um at some point when I very first joined Facebook There's a Facebook group that had at least 500 people in it and the Facebook group was called girls named Megan Phillips so There's at least 500 other Megan Phillips's that spell it the same way as me is Phillips that common a name means son of Philip, which means lover of horses. Aw. In Greek, yeah. Cute. Yeah. love it But like Greek love or or just Lycra. I don't know. I didn't go that far. I didn't go that far. Is it Lycra of horses or? I will choose to accept that. But yes, I am the son of a Lycra of horses.
00:07:55
Speaker
cute okay okay sort of a son of a son of the plumber kind of thing um that's a wrestling reference um um so yeah we met really like randomly yeah just kind of out of nowhere ah ah teenagerens yeah um from ah former guest, Sarah Byno, who hosts that. i know um and And you know, I've told the story in bits and pieces here and there in a couple of episodes, but I'd love to hear your side of like what brought you to T-NEXT? How did you end up at the Fox Theater?
Performing at Teen Angst shows with Sarah Byno
00:08:34
Speaker
That one night? That one night.
00:08:36
Speaker
Well, what's wild about it is I have been booked on or booked adjacent um on and off of Teen Angst for probably at least 10 years. Like, yeah, like I've done a couple of Sarah's other shows. I've known Sarah for a long time. I think I want to say like 2007, 2008, like that 15. I'm at the time when I'm like, oh, how long would a 50? Like when I'm like, we're not a decade ago? What are the kids reading nowadays? It's it's it's gotten to the point where I've just stopped doing the math. yeah i just I'm at that age now where when I'm telling you a story, it could have happened yesterday or it could have happened 10 years ago. And I'm not going to give you that context. Right. Yeah. It was ah before the pandemic and after Y2K. That's some point in there we met.
00:09:32
Speaker
and um Yeah, and we met at a thing called dance dance party party actually, I don't know if she talked about that a little bit I think so. Yeah. Yeah ah Which was just something like so cool and so I met her and I was immediately a fan and then in meeting her and becoming friends with her I heard about her book teen angst and Knew that she did the show and then we tried to get me We tried to get me on the show a bunch of times there was a period where I was physically available to do it but I like couldn't find my journals from being a kid and then there was a period where I had found my journals and I just wasn't in town for the shows and then stopped doing the shows and then I was supposed to do the show in January um but I realized the day before that that was a very dumb idea on my part to book that because I had just had surgery like weeks before and I was like I can't leave my home
00:10:30
Speaker
This is a terrible idea. I am high on opioids. I hate all of this. I mean, it would have made for a memorable reading. Could have made, could have done, could have done. But I'm too old for this shit to try and do something that my body doesn't want to do. So yeah, so then I postponed to May, which led me to doing her show. I love it. and And so you do all kinds of stuff like you you are a comedian, you're an actor, you just wrapped a fringe show that is getting redone. Am I right? Yeah. but Yeah. um Tell me a little bit about kind of the origin. I know I know, you know, the the the the question of like
00:11:15
Speaker
how did you get into acting is like, well, I was traumatized. yeah Usually is the answer, you know? Well, I think it's more, I had a story to tell. m Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that's kind of what it is. So what drew you into like, like, I guess, you know, if, if the end points is like your, you, you do comedy and you know, a lot of your own, like one act, you know, one actor shows, um, what led you to that and go as far back as you like. Yeah.
Early artistic expressions in singing and dancing
00:11:46
Speaker
Well, I think, okay, what are some of the key points? So there's, as a child, um, One of my favorite memories as a child, honestly, is like singing into one of them Fisher Price recorders. um Both ah you know such classic hits as Twinkle Twinkle Little Star on repeat with my own slight variations of it where sometimes I just repeat a line.
00:12:21
Speaker
How I, how I, how I wonder what you... So, um you know, really just a hit a minute, a hit a minute, yeah. um And not only did I love singing into a Make It Up, but I also loved listening back to the sound of my own voice. I just remember being like, God, I love how I sound. um That's one of my earliest memories.
00:12:54
Speaker
yeah ah
00:13:00
Speaker
yeah That's one of my earliest memories. so Music and song have always been integral to who I am as an artist and as a person. um And with that too, I would self-soothe a lot as a child. I would sing to myself. I would make up songs on the playground. So, you know, very isolated, lots of abandonment stuff, bullied, all of that um bullshit. And so a major self-soothing mechanism that I had was singing and humming to myself.
00:13:37
Speaker
on the playground so song and music and like making up songs were a big big big part of my story and I would say those go back as early as I can remember and then down has ah dance dance and movement has also like I've always just been a mover and a dancer I've always felt very connected with my body I process through my body I I've just I'm very somatic and kinesthetic in general um and then I grew up with like dance being the most
00:14:15
Speaker
Not not celebrated but like ah supported I guess by my parents in terms of like what they enrolled me in um and ah Let me be clear when I say dance Let me clarify and specialize that it was not just nanny dance, although there was like a base of like ballet tap jazz, whatever that did come later after begging, but my very first introduction to dance was Highland fucking dancing. Amazing.
00:14:46
Speaker
So I don't know if you know much about Highland dancing. I mean, I know the Riverdance or Lord of the Lord of the Dance. Yeah. um That is a ah general misconception, which is ah fucking wrong. OK, here we go. You're not wrong. Just ah everyone else is wrong. um li Riverdance and Lord of the Dance, that's like the cool of the Celtic dancing, okay that's Irish dance. okay So Irish dance is the one, they always got to have like the, they had cool things like feshes is where they would go. That was like the name, that was like the name of that. We Highland dancers had fucking competitions, that was a sexy, because here's so here's the thing, so for everything that was,
00:15:32
Speaker
Irish and cool its opposite was Scottish and militant so like hey basically when you say dance what it is is a highly regimented set of steps like okay so at competitions you You don't even get to like make up choreography or anything, competitions. You literally have set dances like the Highland Fling, the Sword Dance, the Chantreuse, the real. I mean, the sword dance sounds cool.
00:16:04
Speaker
Yeah, you dance on swords. Because what's better than giving fucking sharp objects to minors on the floor yeah to dance around in like small leather shoes? Because like you think of Irish dance and it's like they've got their cool heels. No, no. We have one shoe. We have one. um We have ah one dance called the Irish Jig. where you get to wear those cool shoes um but you have to wear green and you have to be a mad washer woman. Was this like the Scots like kind of taking a shadow of the Irish? I think so yeah I think so the jig I would always place in the jig. I always get first or second in the jig because you've got to be man angry and shake your fist it's very theatrical but the rest of it it's just so militant you have these
00:16:53
Speaker
Shitty lack of support shoes on like basically ballets. They basically stole all of the ballet moves and the shoes and then they made them black and then they the shoes and then um Not the faces that would be gross um And then the, but I wouldn't put it past the Scots, but anyway.
Highland dancing vs. Irish dance
00:17:12
Speaker
um but um And then you have to do, like you have to pick a step. Like you get a set of steps. Every year a bunch of white women um in Scotland get together and they decide what the steps are gonna be that champions are able to do that year in championships. And then they release a book that you have to pay for. And then,
00:17:35
Speaker
You buy that book and then you see what the steps are that you get to do based on there's like, I don't know, six or seven steps. They don't even make up the steps. They just pick from a inventory. So there's like a there's a repository. Yeah. Yeah. yeah okay There's like a ah list of steps that exist in the world and they can never change and they can never evolve. And um then you have to dance in these tiny little shoes on the ball of your feet and um and then you go into the ah podiatrist and the chiropractor um and the physio for shin splints and then they ask you why you have shin splints and then they you tell them it's because you Highland dance and then they say get the fuck out of my office because it's like the worst thing yeah for any child growing up. Also you somehow managed to find the one Irish doctor.
00:18:25
Speaker
ah Meanwhile, and so we go to these like competitions where it's just like militant like your hair is strapped back in a bun. Like it has to be slicked back and it can't like you get points docked if your hair wobbles. Yeah, you have to have very minimal makeup. You wear a kilt, um which is so fucking heavy and expensive. And then you have like one national dress that you get to wear um And then you do these set of steps and I just remember and then and then you go to the Highland games where like the highlight of your time is watching like the sheepdogs fucking Heard sheep or like ah Grown drunk men in kilts throwing telephone poles, which is like the caber toss. That's kind of cool.
00:19:08
Speaker
Yeah, that is kind of cool, but also, um why the fuck are you letting minors hanging around yeah like half naked yeah drunk men? Anyway, it's fine. and um But then the fucking Irish dancers get to like have like beautiful feshes and they get to like all their choreography is like they get to just like make it up and that like all of their dresses, um they get to wear tights and like point their... We didn't get to wear tights, we have knee socks with garters. Anyway, I'm sorry, that's my that's my tight 25 about Highland dancing. But that's how. Anyway, I Highland danced and I sang and I wrote a lot of stories growing up.
00:19:49
Speaker
but I didn't get into doing any of this professionally.
Aspiring to be a professional artist
00:19:54
Speaker
I always knew in my core I was a professional artist, but I had a lot of fear and a lot of trauma and it was not supported um by my parents, certainly not by my father. ah And so I didn't have a lot of people who believed in me or any role models really. um is So I went to university and got a general arts degree, but it was just like, there's always been a part of my body and soul that will not let me do anything else.
00:20:32
Speaker
and Lord help me, I've tried. Lord help the people that have been in my way while I've been trying. like Those are the true victims here. time Is like the the the places that ah have employed me when I have been like maybe I'll just be a box office attendant forever and not be an artist. like And then you have to like actually be nice to customer service people. And it's just like yeah like people like customer service.
00:21:05
Speaker
It worked for the Vancouver Symphony. And ah customer service people would call in. Customers would call in with like genuine issues. And I'd be like, no, I can't help you.
00:21:20
Speaker
I'd be like well, that's kind of your fault for doing and then No, we're here to serve like customers always right I'm like, well that's stupid. Yeah, I mean a Whoever coined the adage the customers always right is a sociopath um yeah But yeah, no, I I know those those jobs so well and It sounds like so so I I when I kind of gave up on theater in my early 20s I Still stayed in like this theater world, you know, and I and I I did all the like peripheral stuff I was box office as manager. Yeah, I was from a house manager and all those things, you know, and I was told myself that that was like me maintaining a connection to the arts even though I wasn't doing the arts and I I thought that was like me serving some part of myself but really it was actually like choking that part of me out you know because it was like there was so much resentment and there was so much like internalized you know shame around being like watching people doing the thing I wanted to do but just being like I did my part because I got those angry old people to their seat.
00:22:33
Speaker
yeah Yeah, totally relatable. Yep. So what broke you out? like Because because you know when what when we met, you were you know you are currently just like an absolute whirlwind of creativity. And and so I'm wondering what um what broke you?
00:22:58
Speaker
So how far back can we go in this? And ah which which breaking point are we guessing? Yeah, where do you want where do you want to start? It's probably good to be specific. Yeah, yeah, yeah. ah Yeah, which which one's most ah which one's most radio friendly? ah Still need you to be specific. Actually, I should probably go. Thanks for coming. This is a really nice interview. Really appreciate it.
00:23:26
Speaker
um Yeah, I'd say there were few integral points. Like if I were to look back, there's a couple points on the timeline that were major moments. um The first I would say was, so I went to university And I did my first year in general arts, even though like I had done a little bit of research about doing theater or music or something out there. And ah it it all seems really scary. And again, I didn't really have any support in terms of like, if I do, if I like, I really would have loved to go to a U.S. college, but like to write fucking essays and S.A.T. is like a nightmare. I don't know. I went to theater school because I wasn't good at school.
00:24:22
Speaker
And then will they need to like tape auditions and I was like, can't you just take me at my word that I'm good? Yeah, that's kind of my just believe me like yeah i still think but ah Everything always works out for me. Why are you hindering this? Don't you know who I am? I'm making fucking Phillips Oh yeah, get in line, there's both 20 others. There's at least 500 others, and that's Facebook alone.
00:24:52
Speaker
Anyway, and that's just the proper spelling of it. Yeah, so I would say the first major moment was I went to general arts and just felt like that was kind kind of all I could do I went to I picked a university that my father had gone to like it just kind of took the easiest path there even though like I had secret desires to do it professionally but I was like oh it's too it's too much too scary
00:25:23
Speaker
um But I would say the first moment was near the end of first year, I had gotten like I had really come to know a lot of the folks in the music department. So the school that I went to, Western, didn't have a theater department. If they had a theater department, I quite likely would have just ah moved there. But they only had a classical music program. So I liked my school and i ah i really there were a lot of things that I liked about the school. So I um just basically with the assistance of the people that I knew and the teachers and the networking that I had done, I auditioned and got into the musical program for voice, for classical music. Damn.
00:26:18
Speaker
um i know which sound which a sounds so much fancier um and it is it's a very fancy school ah to this date i still have no idea how i passed mostly because by the end i kind of frankenstein did degree together uh and b because i fucking i don't remember anything like not that that's not true but there are So few things that I remember. would This is why like when I meet actual musicians, i I really don't like to say that I have a bachelor's in music because usually you have to back that up with knowledge. yeah
00:26:59
Speaker
yep It's like the opposite of somebody who like knows enough that they can just like make a fake degree and pretend and like they can pass because they know all the things that they would have known with the degree. It's like the opposite of that. Like I have the real degree but none of the knowledge to back it up. that's I feel like that's how I've gotten through life in a lot of ways is that I i have enough, you know, if I if i find something interesting, I find enough information about it to kind of get the gist and then my ADHD takes over and I'm just able to kind of like see patterns and like make inferences and be like, well, this makes logical sense. So it's probably true, you know? um And then inevitably get proven very wrong when I meet somebody who actually knows what they're talking about, you know? so
00:27:54
Speaker
so yeah okay so the so you said that there was a there was kind of a couple points in your career that have kind of led you back so the first is like is this like kind of like classic training yeah that when I decided I would say it was the moment when I made the choice to um to go into the arts full time, that that was worth my ah time and money and attention to do a degree in um not just general arts, but like theater adjacent or performing arts, yeah performing arts.
00:28:34
Speaker
um And then when I graduated from there, I decided that I would try doing a master's program in musical theater, um which I, again, kind of like flowed with the momentum of of my classical music degree. So that's all kind of like in there. was it was So I would say, okay, so the first major point was when I I had a moment that I decided that educating, getting an education in the performing arts was a worthwhile use of time and money
Career shift after accident in England
00:29:07
Speaker
and energy. and It was always something that I had wanted to do and I just made the choice to do it. And thankfully I got in. um I would say the second major point
00:29:20
Speaker
Uh, was when I, um, was in England, this was ah about, this was about 10 months into my 12 month, one year post-graduate program in London, England, in musical theater performance, you know, the um the most useful of degrees. Of course. Fuck yeah. ah The most employable of skills. and Hey, ah Neil Patrick Harris has done fine for himself. That's true. You know what? That's true. If one person can do it, that means it's a viable career. He did start out as a child star. and
00:30:00
Speaker
and had to hide his sexuality and affinity for musical theater from the world for, give or take, 30 years. Okay, bad example. um ok But hey. yeah he made He got there eventually. He got there eventually. yeah He's also a short gay man. Yeah. ah So he fits a lot of costumes, is what you're saying. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. yeah Although he is also white, so we have ah that.
00:30:26
Speaker
You know, to deal with. Um... So... It was 10 months into musical theater school that I got hit by that car. I got hit by the car. And so I would say that was the second major moment, because prior to that point, I was on a trajectory, which was the only trajectory I knew as to how to be a performer, um which was you know the classic, you audition for things, you're constantly auditioning as a working ah actor.
00:31:00
Speaker
ah You get booked in things, you get jobs. Wash, rinse, repeat. That's it. That's all you got. ah Hard life people really like to say that it's a hard life. It's a favorite of 99% of the world population so but when I got hit by the car it It really Forced me to examine a lot of things at the age of 22 that most 22 year olds don't have to examine sure
00:31:32
Speaker
um the least of which is how to deal with being a performer when you have a physical body that suddenly can't do the things that you've trained to do um let alone the questions of like identity who am i as a person what is my worth what is my artistry what the fuck am i gonna do with the next 60 plus years of my life when I finally allowed myself to train in the thing that I wanted to do with the whole time and so I would say that was like the second major turning point um because that's what forced me
00:32:13
Speaker
ah both quickly and slowly in many ways, to start writing my own theater material, to start writing, to find fringe, really, and write solo shows. So that's what threw me into writing solo shows. go okay And then I would say the third most, the third next important thing that I did in my life was I went to the 2012 Toronto Fringe and I saw a solo show that I had heard really, really good things about by some guy named TJ Daw and all I knew is that it was a solo show that was really well attended, everybody loved and might give me some inspiration for my own shows.
00:33:01
Speaker
And it was a show he did called Medicine, which was about how he grew spiritually and what he learned and healed from after doing an ayahuasca ret retreat. And I saw that show in 2012 in Toronto, fringe. And I saw maybe the second last show of his entirely sold out run, Packed House, Standing Ovation. And all he did was sit on stage and tell the story of how he grew spiritually. And I was like, I can do that. like sure Not only I can do that and I want to do that, but for me, that was a huge thing of, oh my God, people will watch that. People will not only one or two people, it was a packed house. like he he was He was laughing his way to the bed.
00:33:55
Speaker
Fringe. Fringe style. Let's be clear. But so that was transformative. And then I would say.
Influence of Maria Bamford on Megan
00:34:05
Speaker
the final probably piece of the puzzle that um that has brought me to where I am was when I discovered that I'm supposed to be in comedy. And I i wrote a whole solo show about that, um which I toured in 2016 called Periscope. And it was um about the night that I, no big deal, I took MDMA to fix my feelings.
00:34:33
Speaker
spoiler alert doesn't work. new No. No. But I feel like the root of so many of my current problems started when I began experimenting with MDMA. Oh really? MDMA was a big healer for me. Really? Yeah. Yeah. Oh, we should talk about that offline. Like that, that MDMA was a a beautiful bridge for me um to joy. And it really taught me, it really oh it really taught my brain how to access joy on a level that I would not have been able to without the chemical assistance.
00:35:11
Speaker
yeah yeah yeah And there became a point where I could feel my brain starting to rely on that as the only way to access joy and my higher power. yeah And so this one night periscope was about the night um that God told me that that needed to stop now. But it was in the writing of that show that I was turned on to Maria Bamford for the first time and um a bunch of comedians that I had previously never heard of, ah which is so weird to me to these days because they are like everything to me now, um but time's weird.
00:35:54
Speaker
So I was turned on to Maria Bamford and she just blew my mind of like, oh my God, comedy is just truth. Comedy is just telling truth with perspective. People say comedy is tragedy plus time, but I disagree. Comedy is tragedy plus perspective. Time is just a vehicle to give you perspective, but ah the actual equation is that it's perspective. so All I have to do is find fucking perspective. Yeah. OK, that's a thing that I can do. And so prior to that point, I've since realized that as a child, I actually really wanted to do stand up comedy like I really did. And I would come up with stand up routines, but I never shared them out loud because there was a part of me that knew that because I wasn't a white guy in the 90s complaining about his wife,
00:36:51
Speaker
that there was no place for me in stand-up. And the women figures that I had um were, at least that I was exposed to, were all punched down insult comics. And I was like, I don't want to be an insult comic, and I don't want to complain about my wife, so obviously I don't belong there. yeah um and And when I realized that all of that was a gobbly flapperjack gook, that was all one big fat patriarchal lie,
00:37:25
Speaker
ah that was a pivotal moment for me of like, oh, not just maybe there is a place for me at this table, but like, there is a place with a name tag. Like I am supposed to be doing comedy. um Which is crazy because it's, I hate it. I mean, i like I love it. I love it and I hate it. I hate so much that it's my calling. Like it's my vocation. yeah And I hate it so much because it's so hard. yeah And yet it is like, there is nothing my soul, ah there is nothing else my soul would have me do.
00:38:07
Speaker
Well, you know, what's interesting, like, so you are directly responsible for getting me doing comedy. um You know, I, you know, I've been doing this show, obviously, obviously for six years, something like that, six, seven years. I don't even know how long anymore you've always been doing comedy now. You're just in room. That's just it. Right. It's like, you know, I've always been, you know, me, um but I had never done standup comedy. I'd done theater. I'd done other stuff, but I'd never done. I'd never sat down, written my own jokes and then told jokes to a group of people, you know, and and you sign me up for that anxiety show. And oh I guess really it started with that that other show, the the the variety show where I got up and in the middle of a
00:38:50
Speaker
oh yeah dance show Yeah, in the middle of a magician and a flamenco dancer and I just got up and told a story, but when I thought about killing myself a couple years ago yeah um Didn't go over great. It was ah that was a quiet room ah but But the next room was much, much, I wouldn't say the first room was unkind, it was just not, you know, they were they were concerned in a way, you know? um But, yeah no, I had that exact same feeling that you just described where it was like, this feels impossible and yet, you know, the first time I said some, I said a joke and people immediately responded to it, you know, it was like, uh-oh, because that felt real good, you know?
00:39:34
Speaker
um i remain you know i'm so i still feel on the fence about comedy in general, and stand-up especially. you know And I think that there is an interesting bridge between what I think I equate to stand-up comedy versus the satisfaction of something like what you do with your one-act shows or you know youre yourre your youre
James Avramenko's journey into comedy
00:39:55
Speaker
solo performances. you know um And I think that's where I actually instinctually steer towards. It's just that stand-up comedy mics are more readily available. I'm still...
00:40:06
Speaker
um yeah But there I do continue to still unpack a lot of thoughts around like it. It it it feels sort of like masking when when I'm doing stand up, you know, it it it doesn't feel fully authentic, you know. um And I know that there's a lot of people like what's what's her name? um Is the show Nanette? Is that what it's called? You know, gatsby yeah, you know, and and and so that kind of thing really intrigues me because, you know, the way the way she describes it at the front half of, you know, telling these jokes about trauma and it's like that that's what I've been reluctant around, you know, and that's like I don't I, you know.
00:40:44
Speaker
There's a way to give it levity and give it palatability and give it you know processing space without undermining it for for a laugh. And often there's there's questions I have, especially around things like you know you know talking about queerness. and using certain words around that. And it's like, um you know, when you're in front of a specific type of audience and you're using, you know, ah slurs, for instance, you know what I mean? Like, and it's like within the gay community, you know, within the queer community, like using certain words is like, you know, casual and conversational, but you use those exact same words in front of a different audience. And suddenly you're giving those people permission
00:41:25
Speaker
to use those words, you know, and I don't know how much I want to engage with that. um being very but I'm being very cagey around certain words because after a conversation I had recently, I realized that like I'm not somebody who really happily readily uses uses them, you know, ah in a way that I see a lot of people in the queer community do, and I'm just not one of them you know um but uh but yeah i guess i'm continuing to impact feelings of like finding authenticity within the framework of stand-up comedy and and still not being entirely convinced that it is actually possible you know um because the authenticity i see is you know like you said it's like you know it's like
00:42:11
Speaker
You know, I think someone like Dave Chappelle is incredibly authentic. It's just that his authenticity is he's a dickhead, you know, and I think that that's where authenticity thrives in comedy is essentially like playing the heel, you know, like playing the bad guy in wrestling, you know, is like saying all the shitty fucked up things that we all think, but being the one to say them. And then suddenly now you you're the savior of the masses, right? You know? um I don't know. i don't No, well, it's it's so funny that you brought up Nanette because just before you said it, ah she was coming to mind um because ah ah so I'm building this new show um as we speak.
00:42:56
Speaker
um tree so great to know what it is, because I open it in less than a month. Living the dream. Thanks, Muse. ah But I'm watching, I'm rewatching a lot of my early influences as I'm building this new show, and Nanette is one of them. And so it's funny as I was driving here, I was literally re-listening to Nanette in the car.
00:43:28
Speaker
and You know, the the nice thing about rewatching something, as I know you know, is you pick up on the nuances that you missed the first time or the second or the third. And what I've been garnering this time round is, uh,
00:43:47
Speaker
Hannah said something says something in the show. um The first is that so she talks about this thesis of quitting comedy, right? She wants to quit comedy because she's sick of making herself the butt of the joke. She no longer is willing to speak with a self-punched-down thing just just to apologize for the fact that she's ah you know a plus-size, queer,
00:44:18
Speaker
um ah you know lesbian, um not falling into you know gender fluid, whatever. um
00:44:30
Speaker
But she says that, and it's funny, I was just listening to this part and this was like sticking with me, um which has to do with what you were saying, that when you tell a joke, She says that, like, often what happens is in order to create tension and release the tension, which is what a joke is, set up punchline, that you're you're in the middle, that it means that you you're stuck in the middle of the story. You don't actually get to the resolution of the story because you're in the middle because that's where the joke is. And stand-up is about jokes per minute. um Sets are about jokes per minute.
00:45:14
Speaker
And so what she found was, like when you tell a story, it has the resolution. It has a beginning, a middle, and an end. And the reception to Nanette was people people lost their minds. like There were words like, um Hannah Gatsby has said this herself, like she's been told she killed comedy. It's not stand up. And one of her ah retorts to that is that what she does is a very, very well-known thing on the fringe scene, especially the Australian circuit, especially, because they are dope at this.
00:45:53
Speaker
is many many many comedians stand-up comedians do festival shows but the festival shows always have a turn and they're storytelling shows they are storytelling shows but they're festival stand-up shows like it's its own genre so what she did is already its own genre in Australia so um what i found about stand-up is to me stand-up is a leg on the stool it's a means to the end so stand-up rooms and it's taken me a while to get to this place but where i'm sitting right now is uh... aside from your gorgeous couch is that
00:46:38
Speaker
ah Stand up is a means to an end. It gives me um an audience, a stage time, a deadline, a reason to write. So if I'm workshopping bits, which I am now for this next show, I can workshop those bits five minutes at a time to really mind the comedy in real time. Because comedy, live comedy, does need an audience, especially if you're writing and doing stand up. It gives me an opportunity to sharpen but my writer's brain in real time with an audience and really hone my point of view because I agree with everything that you're saying about like, well, how you say stuff and how it's received, but I also am really playing with like, but I tell people what to think.
00:47:28
Speaker
That's my job as a performer, and I can't change their minds, but I can, much like a teacher, you know, like, like, uh, Michelle Pfeiffer, and like, yeah you know, dangerous minds, you know? Like, I can be cool, teacher with a great, you know, like I can't make, um, you know, uh, Ash Leakwa or whatever at the back, I can't make her, um, pay attention at school, but I can get Willow and Jade in the front, you know, to learn that education is more important than the streets. Jesus Christ. Basically how I assume every 90... I'm gonna blow your mind about Bob Dylan in the 90s, babe. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Note to self, never put Megan into the inner city ever,
Anxiety around roller coasters
00:48:22
Speaker
ever. Never, never, ever. I think that's what we've learned from those. Yeah.
00:48:32
Speaker
why do you hate roller coastaers
00:48:36
Speaker
What a great left field question there. um And also thank you for for remembering that we had mentioned it earlier. um i they they They stress me out. They stress me out in a way that I don't like. you know like My body feels good under certain types of stress. you know um I was raised anxiously. And so ah my nervous system finds comfort in discomfort, ah which is, you know, why I've dated the people I have. um ah But that is like a sustained low level stress. You're just always a little anxious when you're with the wrong partner, right? ah Whereas something like a roller coaster, just the big up and down, throw around, pushing your stomach with the pressure and the... I just i just do not like that feeling at all. um I... i
00:49:32
Speaker
I eventually came around to like a log ride, you know, like just like one drop, you know, like kind of a splash mountain type thing. Right. The Jurassic Park ride. yeah I guess it's now the Jurassic World. But like but but when I went, I was a kid and it was still the Jurassic Park ride. It had just opened. And so like all the dinosaurs still worked. And, you know, it was it was really cool. um And that ride. blew my mind, you know? um But but i even then, i I didn't do a single of the roller coasters, because just fuck all that noise. And to this day, to this day i will I won't do it. it's just Yeah, it's just not a it's not a fun type of stress for me, you know? um And I don't know if that's related to some kind of anxiety thing, or if it's just a me thing, or or what. But but but how about you? Do you do rides? or
00:50:26
Speaker
yeah It's funny, i I never used to, but I recently just came back from Florida. yeah We went to um went to Universal and Disney World, and I wasn't gonna do a lot of the rides, and we went with somebody who loves roller coasters oh yeah so much, yeah and so him and um So the two guys I was with, they were going to go on the rides and I was like, well, I'm not going to sit and watch the fucking bags. So like, I'll give it a try. And I realized that, um,
00:51:09
Speaker
everything that I've hated about roller coasters to date has been um because it's about being fearful of ah lack of control sure yeah being able to control what's happening and control the sensations in I don't like being not being able to get off I don't like being yeah yeah yeah you're that's you're speaking my language there yeah yeah but what's happened is I think Due to a fucking butt ton of inner work, I i now am at a place where um my brain is just healthier than it used to be. And I'm just more chill with ah chaos now in a way, like chaos that I can't control.
00:51:53
Speaker
um
00:51:56
Speaker
and just, yeah, things being out of my control. And so therefore what I found was I was able to release this need of needing to control what sensations were gonna happen. yeah And I found that like I was able to enjoy them in a way that I can only imagine non-traumatized healthy people can enjoy it without just being like, oh, this obviously means that um someone's gonna come home drunk and hurt me. You know, like, just like, oh, maybe I'll be totally safe and I can be jostled around a bit and my body can experience new sensations.
00:52:32
Speaker
It's like roller coasters represent a ah secure attachment that we're not used to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But at the same time, I also did the Velocicoaster and that ride can go fuck itself. Yeah. Awful. Is that one of those like really fast? Yeah. It's a minute and a half of fucking torture. Oh, that sounds like hell time. Like every I think there's like three or four changes per second. Oh, it's like. for me me me me me it Yeah, it was. I just like who's who thinks of this shit like like what monster is like you know what I'm gonna be when I grow up I'm gonna be somebody who just shakes people like this is somebody who like shouldn't have children they will shake their babies you know like that's not that's not you know maybe we should just give them dolls maybe that's how we prevent
00:53:25
Speaker
Future roller coaster engineers from growing up is just like give them a doll to shake and be like here get it out of your system You know go do something productive for society now yeah that ryan ah I'm trying to think if there was any like I Yeah, I was big on just like the log ride styles, but I was like man. Oh god damn I was just such a fucking anxious kid I I learned all the all the queer slurs ah by by when I was a kid because my brother would call them would call me all of them so that's how I learned all those um ah especially at Disneyland because I wouldn't I didn't I was too scared to go on on the ride so of course I was a you know um but every time they went on like one of the big scary ones the Space Mountain or whatever the fuck I would just go to it's a small world with my grandma and
00:54:16
Speaker
That, to me, is the most terrifying ride. Paradise. I loved it. It was smooth. It was nice. Also, like it was the middle of the summer. So you go on Is a Small World, and it's cool. And you're like, you know? And there's like a little breeze. There's a little mist. It's nice. I agree to disagree. And then you get to see all the cultures of the world. It's kind of like learning. you know Right, because all the cultures of the world, indigenous populations included, they all sing this. oh It's a a five yeah yeah yeah five word refrain and burn it into your brain in English. Yep. Yep. It's a small, small world, baby.
00:54:56
Speaker
yeah ah But yeah, no, I could. Yeah, that probably did some psychological damage.
00:55:08
Speaker
ah
00:55:12
Speaker
So we, you know, we are very new friends and yet at the same time, too, I have felt like such a deep kinship with you has has really grown and. um
00:55:25
Speaker
I'm really curious about your sort of um your perspectives on friendship and like kind of like like what what exactly does it mean? you know As you're aware, this show, you know the baseline is this exploration of connection. is is you know and and and Sometimes I wonder, like am I not diving into it enough? am i not you know am i meandering away from the topic too much because of just, you know, my fascination with hearing people's stories, you know, which in a lot of ways I think is sort of part of being a friend is just sort of like giving someone else space to like tell about themselves and and reflect on themselves, you know, but but
00:56:05
Speaker
We had a really interesting ah experience recently you know that like we don't have to go into like gruesome details about, but like we had this little rupture that I think um healed really, really beautifully and like in a way that was like really encouraging for me to to be like to not only feel like, oh, I can trust myself, but oh, I can trust this person too. you know and and And I'm curious about, I guess we can start with that the the universal question I ask of like what it means to be a friend. But I think I'd like past that, I'd like to talk a little bit more about like how you find yourself showing up for friends and how you' are you're trying to show up for them in a way. yeah
00:56:54
Speaker
Okay, I feel like there's three, three parts, three answers that come to mind with that. The first is a.
00:57:10
Speaker
So when I first started therapy, my therapist taught me about circles of intimacy.
Circles of intimacy and healthy boundaries
00:57:19
Speaker
And that was like totally new for me growing up in a very boundary-less home on many levels. You know, boundaries were challenges at the end. um And they were for other people. amen yeah So to learn what healthy boundaries were, not just for myself, but for other people and how important they are. And as a side note, I also, I still have my handouts actually on these. So there were circles of intimacy and then there's boundaries. There's rigid boundaries. There's non-existent boundaries. And then there's healthy boundaries, which are like flexible, um flexible, but strong.
00:58:05
Speaker
ah and
00:58:11
Speaker
this both circles of intimacy and the boundaries that need to be put up with any people any kind of relationship in general uh... but especially when it comes to friends is totally based on uh... their actions not just words but actions which i think kind of ties into what what what we're referencing uh... which is i was also mo when i started to have in my circle of, in my closest circle of intimacy, when I started to have healthy people in that circle of intimacy, I started to see healthy behavior modeled to me. And then and I realized how that made me feel in being in relationship to others.
00:58:58
Speaker
and what that would look like in terms of being in relationships to others. Because when I first started you know out in the world as an adult with the training that I had, um or should I say a tiny bleeding child in an adult body, yeah i You know, it was like relationships where things where I could either um ah try and get men to sleep with me or try and get women to be my mother. Those were my two options with friendships.
00:59:32
Speaker
um or ah Or sometimes, how can I use people? like What can I use them for? yeah And I'm not proud of that, but i'm um I do own my part in my awareness in how that was a you know a Megan 1.0. But in terms of what it means to be a friend, ah I would say,
01:00:00
Speaker
you know like friend is just like hey i view the I view the world and like all relationships and spectrums like we're all somewhere on a spectrum sure um and more ways than one um but is we're we're all in relationship in accordance to everybody else and so life is just a series of relationships based on levels of circles of intimacy and just because your blood related to somebody doesn't mean that they have to have a place of a so in in a certain circle of intimacy, certainly not your closest circle of intimacy. um If their actions don't show that they're safe. And on the flip side,
01:00:50
Speaker
um And then the last part of this equation, I would say, is when, um and this is something I've learned from ah the recovery ah way of life, the recovery tradition, is ah what is the primary purpose of my relationship with this person? um which Can be construed. I suppose is like what what's what can I get out of this relationship? but Purpose is different from use You know purposes not you know cuz purpose is reciprocal You know oh, I like that yeah
01:01:31
Speaker
yeah what is the purpose of that and said that that's really helped me as well create healthy relationships with folks because we as humans we're all just walking assets and liabilities we just are and even the fucking dolly llama farts you know like and licks children apparently does he or something i don't know i can't remember what that story was i didn't pay attention that um Yeah. So we're all walking assets and liabilities. And so like when I first started to have to heal, there were a number of people that I had to shut out of my life completely. Not just because being with them wasn't healthy for me.
01:02:19
Speaker
But for a lot of people it was because I was not healthy for them. yeah And that was a choice that I made because I could see myself engaging in patterns that would start a chain of reactions that were going nowhere for either of us. yeah And that was really sad for me because there are people that have really, really wonderful assets, but they also have liabilities that happen to jar with my unhealed liabilities. But since getting um much, much healthier, thank God, thank God healing happens. Thank God a good job, previous Megan, for doing the fucking work.
01:03:01
Speaker
And so now i'm um'm I've i've like kind of re-picked up casual relationships with people and even somewhat intimate relationships with people, but I keep in my head what I can and can't discuss with those people that keeps our relationship healthy. um and so In terms of what it means to be a friend, I think for me what's most important is that I maintain my own level of spiritual fitness and emotional health and sobriety, even, shall we say, um to the best of my ability. um You know, I'm basically talking to fucking Gandhi here. um
01:03:45
Speaker
um i She says, she like overstays her welcome. but, shut the fuck up, Megan. yeah you um But yeah, it's it's like, as as long as I do my best to maintain those things in myself, then I am giving all that I possibly know how to give to the people around me. And I find that people either respond well to that and I'm doing them a service by either listening or speaking or sharing or whatever,
01:04:19
Speaker
or sometimes being a friend is not engaging yeah with them. It's either not enabling or it's also just letting them have their space to process what they need to process without going into my own fear-based thinking, especially if I think that something is about me when it's really not. Yeah. Well, you know, oh my God, you know, going back to something you you you you talked about like the idea of like, we kind of we don't we We can't know what we don't know. yeah And so when we're raised a specific way, we believe that that's what's normal. you know And so if you're raised not being shown what a boundary is, if your boundaries are constantly broken by the people raising you, then you think that that's what boundaries are. And then you go out in the world and that's how you treat other people's boundaries because that's
01:05:09
Speaker
you know, my god showed me that that's what a boundary is. So that's how I'm going to treat others, you know, and so it becomes this really bizarre like who, you know, I've kind of what I've been trying to do, especially recently is think, think less about like, who's at fault, and more about just like, well, why did you choose this? And why did they choose this? And what you know, and it's like, it's not nobody's at fault when things happen. It's just that like, it's these moments that intersect between like, well what I was shown led me to choose this and what you were shown led you to choose this and this is where we are now you know and and I've i've realized
01:05:47
Speaker
In the process of getting sober and reflecting on um you know social circles that I was in and behavior that was being allowed and be behavior that was normal and behavior that was encouraged, you know um it's it's it's ah it's a recursive loop because nobody's breaking out of that cycle and nobody's looking out at it and saying, wait a minute, what if we didn't do XYZ? And and um that has actually really done wonders for me to, to like first of all, like kind of stop vilifying anyone and instead to just be like, oh yeah, like you know either you'll eventually see, or you won't, and either way, I shouldn't be in this circle anymore.
01:06:34
Speaker
you know um um And then when you learn how to actually hold your own, you know when you when you learn what your boundaries are, right? and i And I think that that's where everything has to start. It's not about it's not about like um It helps to see
Learning about oneself and better boundaries
01:06:51
Speaker
new examples, right? It helps to be modeled new examples. um And this is where that kind of like paradox of life comes into play, where it's like you kind of learn about other people by learning about yourself, and you kind of learn about yourself by learning from other people. You know, it's this weird push-pull thing. um So you have to find the balance between the two, you know? But but you you you don't really learn how to show up around other people until you learn about what you want.
01:07:17
Speaker
kind of from yourself and from other people, you know? um And I lost my train of thought.
01:07:32
Speaker
yeah well ah well like yeah Yeah, I agree. And I think it's just being in fucking relationships are complicated. They're hard and they're complicated and there's no cookie cutter thing. And and there's no hierarchy between, like to me right now, there's no hierarchy between my friendship relationships and my romantic relationships. And I think that socially, at least these days, it seems that we're told to value you know a a sexual connection over ah like a friendship intimacy. you know and And for me, I'm like, no, no, no. Everybody who I'm connected to is is on a level playing field of importance to me. Mostly because i I have a tendency to get fucking engulfed by my by my partner. you know And so I don't want to fall into that pattern anymore. So I'm holding importance for everyone.
01:08:22
Speaker
right and and and that then then you have to navigate every relationship as if it's really fucking important because it is right sorry I stepped over your thing I just yeah nuh uh i just i agree i agree and i think that it also what we need from relationships changes as we change based on the seasons in our lives there were points in my life early healing when i was really doing like the hardcore healing about five or six years ago where
01:08:58
Speaker
I really had to cut down who was in my life really simply. Like I probably only had like five or six people that I would call or see on any given day. I rarely left my home. I was not social. i would People would invite me to things and I would have to so respectfully, gratefully decline, which was the hardest thing because I wanted to go and have fun. And I even wanted to show up for those people, but I just didn't have the energy. So like the relationships that I had were very slim. And so the ones that I did have were huge. They were everything because I needed them, but they also were with people who had
01:09:41
Speaker
the capacity um to give me what I needed. Like they had experience and hope and strength in the areas that I was healing in, which is I hope nobody ever, ever has to heal in that area. um But thank God there are those who have gone before. ah So they could help me um with that, which is a lot of what I was dealing with is something that the average Joe like just not only wouldn't have the space for, but if I were to talk about it, um it would traumatize them. like It would actually add to the harm.
01:10:19
Speaker
So in that way, like ironically, not being in relationship with other people was the best gift that I could give them but yeah at that point in my life. yeah So it I think it ebbs and flows the importance of relationships. And then it's finding too. it's finding you know I think the other side of it is like finding what you can give to others. and And what I've realized in myself is this idea of like, you can't give what you don't have so it's actually like you're not being a good friend by or giving you know you're not being a good friend by being like oh this person's in need I have nothing to give but I'm still gonna I'm still gonna show up and I'm still gonna try and give and it's like
01:10:55
Speaker
that is just a recipe for disaster because you cannot give something you don't have. It's also not real giving. That's just manipulation. It's selfish manipulation. And I speak from my own experience with that. Same. That's not me. Exactly. Being judgment of anybody else besides myself. And even with myself, there's compassion. It's generally in that sense, it's manipulation of others and it's also avoidance of looking at my own shit and feeling my own shit and it's fear of asking for what I need and acknowledging that that's important and instead deflecting to try and control somebody else's experience. Yeah. God damn.
01:11:42
Speaker
um
01:11:45
Speaker
um we've hit that stage of the interview did you ever when you were a kid did you ever just like to make sounds oh yeah i used to do a really pleasurable feeling too i used to uh i used to pretend to make wind i'd always make like howling wind noises that's so calming i know you know what i used to do Um, I used to make a really good, sorry. I used to make a really good, uh, horse, like fluffer. flu you know Okay. yeah yeah Yeah. But people always think that it's but like a lip trail and it's not, there's a, okay. I don't know if my jaw has to be really relaxed.
01:12:41
Speaker
so good
01:12:44
Speaker
oh just sex it think over the pandemic so oh yeah there it is there it is there too when we ah I used to have a friend who's a veterinarian and ah the vegetarian not and not vegetarian veterinarian weird if they were harry and vegetarian. Right. Well, I feel like that will be more common than you think. But the ah we in in lockdown, we did these like weekly group calls and and as the weeks and months progressed and everyone got crazier and crazier, um we started developing this recurring joke where we were just ripping on her about like chubbing her arm up horse asses. You know, that was basically how she spent her day. um But we started developing like That's how she became a vegetarian. Yeah. Yeah. ah We started developing like, you know, like basically like hoarding horse noises became kind of a calling call. We all start doing the like, but you know, like, because the son of the horse lover over here needs to fill up a bassinet over here. Yeah. yeah
01:13:53
Speaker
but but We need to stop this right now. Wait, I have one more question for you. Oh sure, we can throw that. Yeah, fuck yeah, come on. Lay it on me. ah What do you think about Botox? Oh fuck it. Fuck it forever. um Not a fan. No, not at all. i think it's I think it's gross. I think people who get it are gross. ah You don't have it, dude. Did I just suddenly like no accidentally shame you? No, but I think I'm gonna try it. Why? Okay, because Botox for women in their 40s is like what I'm learning about Botox for women in the 40s is like what cocaine was for all the kids and myself in high school where like
01:14:36
Speaker
so many people if not everybody's doing it but nobody talks about it okay and I don't find out about it until six months later right and I'm like oh that's what you guys were doing in the bathroom right okay ok yeah it's crazy so I just thought it is really prevalent like it's really common and it's really you know I shouldn't say I shouldn't be so fucking judgmental I just like I know a lot of like Quite young people doing it so yeah and that baffles me, you know because it's like you're paralyzing your face When your face still works, you know, like I don't I just don't get it. Yeah, you know um but like
01:15:14
Speaker
Yeah, mine is not to say what you should do with or without your body yeah well funny because i never thought of it and then as i age like i start to see like the little aging things i'm like oh like get what people are freaked out about this i You know I remember I don't remember what the exact what is but I remember being told once that like you you earn your face You know that as you age as you age, you know how you use your face you'll you grow into your face right so if you're like a really grouchy curmudgeonly shithead right you're gonna have a grouchy curmudgeonly face if you're a really happy person like yeah you're gonna have a lot of wrinkles but that's because you laugh a lot that's like a good sign you know laugh lines are beautiful you know and so like I
01:15:55
Speaker
How about constant stun and constipation? Because that's what's going on in between. That iss just just fold on my brow, I know I've got laugh line crow's feet yeah and laugh line dimples and then just constipation for brow. yeah The thinker, the real, the thinking man. I like to call it my judgmental third eye. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. No, I'm down with it. I mean, I just you know, like like I say, you know what anyone wants to do with their body have at the I just for me personally, I'm really excited to be wrinkly and weird looking, you know, um it's already started as much as I'm trying to fight it. i I have my my grandpa's gizzard, you know, like I just I it's just it's going to just happen. It already has happened. It's coming.
01:16:42
Speaker
um so like no matter what I do there's you know cuz I sometimes sometimes I'm like I wonder if I could just like lipo my chin like just a couple quick little you know and just just get that gland out of there but it's just not gonna happen you know and and I don't walk around well that's that's what I end up doing if you ever watch me literally if you ever watch me on tick-tock I'm constantly just like pushing I saw this thing years ago and Listen, I don't have TikTok, okay? We've been through this. Fair. Fair. I only see you on Instagram, okay? Fair. So you see the choice cut. I'll get it. I need to go to your TikTok channel. God, James. You see the choice cut. I heard you the first fucking time. Hey, I got two million views because of video I didn't put a joke from you, so, you know.
01:17:27
Speaker
Maybe don't go so that I can keep on just ripping on you on TikTok. Well, as long as I keep flushing your toilet seat without putting the thing down, I feel like it's a draw, you know?
01:17:42
Speaker
but no I I I learned I saw this thing years ago where you you start at your chin and you and you push back along your jawline in one direction and then you do the other side and apparently the reason now again this was on fucking tiktok so it's probably all bullshit but apparently it's like it's like mucus or glions or something and that like clears your throat basically that way. So on TikTok I'm constantly, cause i'll I'll be at the angle and I'll be like, oh God, my fucking double chin's back again, you know? And it's like, I've lost weight everywhere but my chin. it's like It's like all the weight I've lost everywhere else in my body found its way to my chin, you know? um Which like on one hand who gives a shit and on the other hand it is my self-conscious thing. That's your TikTok money maker. Yeah, yeah.
01:18:30
Speaker
um so Yeah, all that Canadian creator fun money ah um megan We could talk for ever ever ever and um As much as I would like to I don't know if ah my listeners are going to stay with us So, you know we can keep talking taking bathroom break right exactly exactly but like but um first of all just like thank you thanks for coming on at last minute just like popping over and recording with me I really appreciate it I but like I you know I really do want to take a moment to to really take this opportunity to just say like how blessed I feel to have met you and ah how how
01:19:17
Speaker
random it it was and then how incredible it's been and and just how grateful I am to be your friend I you you are an inspiration and you are motivation for me and um you have like in the three months I've known you you have fundamentally changed my life so I'm i'm really grateful for you you know
01:19:44
Speaker
but Yeah, same I love you. I just think you're I just think you're the ah you You're bees elbows You're even better than the knees you the the six joints of the fruit fly Right before I crush its little body because those fuckers could die oh we take that Vegetarian veterinarian so that That that literally just like just like ADHD like you know, you know the like step a jumps to step G instead of BCD I immediately associated with this meme I saw the other day that was like it was like a girl like praying and it was like ah elders, please show me the way or ancestors show the way and then The other side is ah a photo of like a trilobite
01:20:36
Speaker
and It's like a trial of like a like a prehistoric invertebrate thing and it's like skittering noises Like which ancestors are we talking about yeah yeah but it's like an amoeba yeah you the like the the glob that falls out of the ocean yeah mitosis figured out like go fuck yourself you're fine ah fuck no I don't have a spine! I can't teach you about courage, you know? We're just trying to breathe without gills. Give us a sec. Oh, fuck. um you You're magic. You're absolutely magic. um is there Is there somewhere you would like listeners to find you? Anything you want to plug? Anything coming up? Yeah, um apparently I have a deadline of a new show in Winnipeg.
01:21:31
Speaker
ah which I will be doing July 10th to 14th. Start till the end of July in Winnipeg. It's called Meghan's Making It, it's ah which is really the advent of the show that I want to take to Edinburgh probably next year in 2025 to the Edinburgh Fringe, all ah loosely ruminating on the theme of what is success? What does it mean to make it? What is the creative process? ah Did I make it just by literally making my bed this morning? Was that enough? Who the fuck knows? And that is a like a cabaret musical comedy style. So kind of like Tim Minchin, Bo Burnham,
01:22:14
Speaker
um ah even Hannah Gadsby, what is comedy? I don't know, performance art is what the Netflix fans would call it probably. Everybody else would call it comedy. um And I'm also doing three days of Grease 2 on my other show in Wells, British Columbia, fuck yeah July 10th, 11th, and 12th. So if you're in and about northern British Columbia, get on up to the Sunset Theater. good old caribou my my oldtoic guns love it yeah um did you drop your link what are the where where ill put of in mehanphilllips dot com yeah put stuff on meganphilips dot com and then my socials are meg bill blackville not megan tea phil because probably should have done some crowd research before I picked that name, but Meg Nat, like my middle name's Natalie, Meg Natville. But everyone thinks it's Megan T. Phil, which is a fair assumption, um and it's also not.
01:23:14
Speaker
oh Yeah, oh, I just saw it I wrote it out and I see I see it now it dy sexia so I always capitalize the end and that seems to have helped but then it just looks like I don't know how to make words and just there's a lot going on with my choices there i love it i love it um I always like to close out the show on a little actionable thing for listeners, so I'm curious Do you have one recommendation for something listeners could try? to scott thing did scott get you doing is that from no probably you know what it's probably inadvertent um um he's funny enough he he he tends to be quite reluctant he he he's reluctant around homework um um he doesn't like fixes he doesn't want me thinking that i like you know i'm only good if i do the steps right like he's like just just he's like just try to remember there just trust yourself to remember you know like i'm like but what if i don't and he's like well then you didn't try next time
01:24:07
Speaker
Fucker. Angel. Angel. oh All the angels can go fuck themselves, seriously. um But from you, ah what is one thing listeners could try doing to be a better friend to themselves or to their community this week? I would say, how can you be more gentle with yourself?
Advice on gentleness and self-care
01:24:35
Speaker
because I think that unconditional love can stem from gentleness. And I think we've invested a lot societally into how we can push ourselves, push to the max, go, go, go. You know, when I was thinking about trust, it's funny that you brought up with Scott, because I was thinking like, when you asked me that question, I was like, oh, maybe it's how can you trust yourself? But I think that all of that stems from when we genuinely love ourselves and get in tune with ourselves. And I know for me the only way that I've ever made sustainable change was when I stopped, dropped, and loved.
01:25:17
Speaker
you know yeah just like stop what I'm doing and like hey sweetheart yeah you're being a dummy yeah it's okay yeah it's okay it's okay like cut it out but also it's okay yeah yeah yeah yeah ah Yeah, I don't recommend doing it anymore. Yeah, I know. But like that's this that's the stopping part. like I feel like that's where the pause comes. So I think i think the world could use a lot more self-gentleness, and then that will pervade it. It just has to. As we learned how gentleness to ourselves works, it just naturally progresses outside of our sphere of influence to those around us.
01:25:56
Speaker
I love that. Maeve Phillips. God damn it. evermino You're your're one in 500. At least. At least. at a minimum
01:26:18
Speaker
a da And that's it. Thank you so much one more time to Megan for coming on the show. It was such a blast chat with her. It always is. Check out her stuff. If you can go see her shows. She is incredible and you will not regret it. All the info on where you can find her is going to be in the show notes. So check it out. And hey, while you're there, why not follow some of the links to support friendless? Be sure to leave the show a five star review wherever you listen. Sign up for the sub stack.
01:26:48
Speaker
and follow along with hey sorry i missed you um i am taking at least july off it may turn into august i don't know we're gonna see i am just out of out of juice um i have one more episode in the can for next week it's gonna be a little wrap-up episode of the seasons and reflections If you have any questions you would like answered in the Q and&A segment of the episode, please be sure to send them my way. You can message me on Instagram or on TikTok at friendlesspod. You can always email me friendlesspod at gmail dot.com. And um I will try to get to it next week. But otherwise, that is it for me. So um I don't really have anything else to announce other than that. I am tired and I hope you are doing good out there.
01:27:39
Speaker
I don't know. um Okay, let's just wrap this up. ah Thank you so much for listening, and I hope you will join me next week for the season six finale. But I'm not gonna worry about that right now, and neither should you, because that is then and this is now. So for now, I'll just say I love you, and I wish you well. Fun and safety, sweeties.
01:28:04
Speaker
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