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Celebrating The Inner Teenager (with special guest Sara Bynoe)
94 Plays7 months ago
In this very special episode of "Friendless," host James Avramenko is joined by Sara Bynoe (actor, producer, host of Teen Angst) to dive deep into the complexities of friendship and the emotional impact of friend break-ups. Sara opens up about a painful experience with a friend who crossed a line and failed to show remorse, prompting her to reflect on the importance of setting boundaries and acknowledging the lasting effects such betrayals can have.
The conversation steers into a candid discussion about the different dimensions of emotional trauma, with James emphasising the necessity of allowing oneself to feel the repercussions fully. Both contemplate the difficult choices surrounding the potential for reconciliation after trust has been shattered.
Sara shares insights from her journey with cognitive behavioural therapy and the mental health strategies she's adopted to help navigate her responses to challenging situations. Likewise, James reveals his own path to self-understanding following a recent psych evaluation.
They further explore the essence of friendship – what it means to be a good friend, the value of kindred spirits, and the intricate dance between connection and self-preservation. Sara and James also touch upon the topics of neurodiversity, the stigma associated with psychological diagnoses, and the relationship between trauma and personality development.
Community building is highlighted as Sara discusses her role in creating inclusive spaces through her events, such as "Teen Angst". They also reflect on their own evolving criteria for cultivating meaningful friendships and the lessons they've learned from holding onto or releasing certain relationships.
Follow Sara's work through Yellow Notebook Productions HERE
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Transcript
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:08
Speaker
Well hey there sweet peas, welcome back to Friendless. I'm your host James Avramenko and this week I am joined by the one and only Sarah Vino. Sarah is an actor, a producer, the host of my favorite show in town, Teen Angst, as well as say whaaat.
00:00:23
Speaker
And on top of everything else, she's an absolute gem of a human. We discussed the universality of teen angst, the traumas of friend breakups, and the power of playing games with strangers. All this and so much more. It's time to lean back, get comfy, set your volume at a reasonable level, and enjoy my interview with the incredible Sarah Bino here on Friendless.
Rekindling Passion for Acting
00:00:48
Speaker
This week on Friendless, I have a very new friend who, uh, she is an actor. She's the host of one of my favorite shows in town that I've gotten to be a part of. And it was, uh, honestly, it has like reinvigorated my, uh, my little like long repressed actor bug inside of me of like being on stage and.
00:01:10
Speaker
and being validated by people. The show is the the Teenage Show at the Fox. It's fabulous. The one, the only, Sarah Bino. How are you? I'm good. Thank you so much. That means so much to me that you like that show so much. It's fascinating to me because it's like not only was it like really fun, obviously, to be in it, you know, like who doesn't, you know, I mean, as a performer, it's like I love
00:01:34
Speaker
being looked at, right? But it's like, it's like being in the audience is so beautiful, you know?
The Healing Power of Teen Angst
00:01:40
Speaker
And I find it, I was, you know, I made a joke about it last time I was it, I was on, but also like, I genuinely see it as like, really powerful inner child work, you know, in that like, we're, we're collectively groaning and we're all like, oh, it's so cringy, but it is also like, really validating and like,
00:01:59
Speaker
I know after the first one I did in January, like I talked to my therapist about how like it was really healing. It was like, you know, like to, to sort of like almost like give teenage James some flowers of like, you made it kid and you're okay. And right, you know, and, and it's a really beautiful room you've created there.
00:02:17
Speaker
Oh, thank you. Yeah. Do I need to explain it or something? Everyone knows everyone is. I was good. That was going to be kind of my follow up. I'd really like to hear the story of like, because you've been doing this for like 20 years now.
Origin of Teen Angst Show
00:02:32
Speaker
Yeah. I started it in 2000. So I had the idea when I was 19. Um, okay.
00:02:40
Speaker
Well, we've got some time. I'll give you the whole. I'll give you the whole thing. It's literally the point of a podcast. You talk as much as you want. Right. So.
00:02:50
Speaker
I was on, so I was in like my second year of college. I was in theater school in Calgary before I came to theater school in Vancouver. So much theater school. And I was on the phone with a friend and we were, I don't know, just having like those, you know, late nineties, epic marathon conversations. And I came across this binder of poetry that my high school boyfriend had written for me. And, um,
00:03:17
Speaker
I don't know if he had like shown up at one of our plays or something, but anyway, so something prompted me and I pulled it out and I read it to her and we laughed like mean evil bitches. And then I was like, I have stuff too. And then I shared that and like she had some stuff and was like, okay, this is very funny. And my brother was getting into website design. And somehow this idea of like creating teenanxpoetry.com came into my head.
00:03:45
Speaker
And I started to create all these different categories like I'm alone. No one understands my pain poem Like suicidal ideation, but I call them life sucks and I want to die poetry Poetry about them, you know people that like caused your teen angst or that, you know, never had there were cool people never had teen angst Those people are called liars
00:04:09
Speaker
Yeah, or I don't know, emotionally secure people. I don't know. I've never met one of those. Yeah. So yeah, so I started like formulating this and then in order to launch the website I created with my brother and his like computer friend, teenagepoetry.com. And this is before like blogger was a thing.
00:04:30
Speaker
before, like, I mean, certainly WordPress, GeoCities, like, they had to create the code for it. And it was my dream to like be able to search for every, like, every poem that had the word fuck in it, or, you know, everyone by an author, like tagging, like, this was what I was like, Oh, wouldn't that be great if we could do this. And so I had the first, like, Teen Anx Night as sort of a launch of the website, which was no, I believe it was November of 2000.
00:04:57
Speaker
And I had friends that read, it wasn't just poetry, but the website was always poetry and the night people could read whatever because not everyone had poetry. And I had one friend literally laugh so hard she peed her pants. And yeah, and I was like, Oh, this is fun. And it sort of slowly kept doing it. And then
00:05:16
Speaker
I don't know why or how if I had an amazing friend like give me a suggestion about like send out a press release and tell the media and then like CBC Calgary was covering it. And it just really blew up from there. And then the website got a lot of attention.
Teen Angst's Impact and Challenges
00:05:28
Speaker
And I was approached by American publishers were like, your website's really funny. We thought about a book. And then I was in Vancouver doing Studio 58 at the time. I'm like,
00:05:37
Speaker
doing like the main stage shows, my upper terms at theater school there, and then like working on this anthology, and the show was kind of all there at the same time. And it's never stopped. Yeah. Did that book end up coming out? Yeah, 2005. Holy shit. This is incredible. I love it. I'm like, it's just back there in the cherry blossoms on my laptop.
00:06:00
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, it did okay. It was like 10,000 copies were printed. To start was Poetry Month that it came out April 2005. And then I know they printed a bit more but like, I never made money from it because that's how publishing works. I also like I do when I pay people that do Teenage Night. I also paid people that contributed. And apparently that's not like a normal thing people do.
00:06:22
Speaker
Yeah, that's always baffled me. You know, that's that's always baffled my like when I when I see these calls for like anthologies and stuff like that and it's like you might get an honorarium and it's like I'm writing your book.
00:06:34
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, from my perspective that at the end of it, it was like, oh, I did a lot of work and maybe got like two thousand dollars. Yeah. Yeah. From it all. It feels like the nature of not only publishing, but also especially publishing poetry. Like you got to. That's another rung. Yeah.
00:06:52
Speaker
Well, yeah, I mean, technically it was a humor book, but I mean, I have had high school students, like somehow it ends up in a high school library and people are like, I did a report on your poem. And I'm like, this is the cutest freaking thing ever. Oh, I love that. Yeah. It's such a legacy. It really is like, you know, and, and, and now, you know, here in 2024, like
00:07:14
Speaker
there's such a like power to being able to say, you know, this has been going on for 20 years and it's, you know, and you're seeing people now coming on stage who are writing stuff that was, you know, they were teenagers after you started it, right? And it's just, it's become, you know, this whole other ethos almost, right? Yeah, but I mean, that's the thing that I've certainly learned from it is,
00:07:39
Speaker
the universality of it right like I've had shows with people you know in their 60s and then people in their early 20s and you're like it's the same shit it's just different references yes yeah and that really just like bonds us all together and everyone finds something to laugh at
00:07:56
Speaker
So that actually that leads me to something I'm curious about is you know you you talk about the universality and and what are some of the things that you've picked up on through the years that you've noticed are like reoccurring kind of teen tropes. Oh I mean
00:08:13
Speaker
Well, I mean, these are probably more reflective of my experience and what I see in other people's stuff. So there's that caveat. But certainly, like one of the categories I had when I started the website was I'm alone, no one understands my pain. And I always feel like this night is just validating that experience, like that's my inner child where it was like, no, everyone feels like they were alone, no one understood their pain, everyone feels alone in their struggle.
Universal Themes of Teen Angst
00:08:36
Speaker
And this event is to prove to my inner child that no,
00:08:42
Speaker
You know, you may not have all gone to the same school, but there were other people that felt shitty or you didn't realize that like this quasi popular person was feeling ostracized or, you know, in a bad relationship with her boyfriend or, you know. Well, and that is such an interesting, you know, to to have that's been kind of an offshoot of this show as well has been like when I when I interviewed people from years and years ago and and realizing
00:09:09
Speaker
Not that I didn't know they were people already, but it's like hearing their perspective on what was going on at different times and how I was so locked into my own perspective of things and then hearing what their take on that was. It's always very illuminating. And I often have to sort of fight an almost loop of regret of not knowing that at the time. But then I have to remember that it's like, well, we were children, so.
00:09:38
Speaker
Yeah, we were children, we had, our brains were not fully formed. We had lots going on. Yeah, so to finish maybe your question, other tropes. I mean, the classic, I don't know if it's like, just the focus shift that kids will have in their diaries, like, I love Brian, Brian, Brian, Brian. Chris, Chris, Chris,
Humor and Intensity in Teen Diaries
00:10:01
Speaker
Chris. Oh my God, the president of the United States put a bomb on something. Anyways, it's dinner, bye.
00:10:07
Speaker
just like what, what is going on? Are you like, that's all I have to say about that. Anyways, my brother's a dumb dumb.
00:10:15
Speaker
I like the this happened a couple times in the last show of like that that switch and it's like they haven't actually said anything but that's like to them it's so detailed right you know it's almost like they're lacking the vocabulary to get that interior world out so they can just say this really basic like I like him anyway yeah yeah I have so many feelings and I don't know what to do about it just feelings feelings feelings distraction
00:10:42
Speaker
Yeah. This was really important today. We went to McDonald's and we stole straws. We're so bad. Like, okay. Um, so, so I want to, you know, I, I actually want to loop, uh, loop around because, you know, talking about, you know, this is just sort of one aspect of your whole kind of create, you know, your whole career and what you do. And, um, I sort of got ahead of myself in the questions that I often like to start with a bit of a, an intro with a very blunt question.
Sarah's Personal Journey
00:11:12
Speaker
of who the hell are you? Yeah, I'm not just the teenage girl. Exactly. Jeez. I have been places and people are like, are you the teenage girl? I'm technically midlife now, but sure. I don't know. I mean, I'm still, I know, I'm still a struggling actor in Vancouver.
00:11:39
Speaker
A person who loves to go out dancing. I'm obsessed with cherry blossoms and all flowers. Yeah, it's all like, how far do I go back?
00:11:51
Speaker
Well, that's just it. That's what's so fun about this question. And I often kind of, uh, seizes people, right? Because they're like, it's so simple, but at the same time, it's like, go as far as you want. And what's your impulse? You know, that's what I have a highly sensitive person with, um, trust issues and
00:12:11
Speaker
like a mental illness called like being an actor, wanting to be on stage. I did not get enough attention. My name means princess. My parents, well, no, it wasn't my parents that told me that. Some like guy at daycare told me that. Wait, Sarah or Bino? Oh, Sarah. Sarah. Yeah. I don't know what Bino means. Yeah. Interesting. I know. And I'm Hebrew.
00:12:36
Speaker
Oh, fascinating. Okay. Amazing. Yeah. That's what I was told. Yeah. You're like Princess Sarah. I'm like, you're redundant, but I'll take it. Just seeing you in kindergarten being like, that's like saying jacket coat.
00:12:57
Speaker
I was more like, I knew it. Like I was just in my, I was really into Sleeping Beauty. I mean, the most terrible old Disney movies with savior princes, but yeah.
00:13:11
Speaker
Um, and so you come from Calgary. Um, and, and what kind of, uh, you know, yeah, we, I talk about this often on the show. So you were in very, very good company of like, what hurt you to make you become an actor?
00:13:30
Speaker
I mean, I think I don't know if it's what hurt me. I think it was positive reinforcement. I have a memory of learning to tie my shoes. Well, and that my mom still does this. We were going to tie my shoes and she go like, what do you do? And you go tada. And then they would applaud.
00:13:49
Speaker
Yeah, even a couple Christmases ago, I was with my mom, we were making a puzzle and you put the piece in and she's like, you have to say ta da. And then they would apply and I was like, Brian, right? Ta da. So yeah, it wasn't hurt, positive reinforcement. And being a, you know, empathic, emotional person being like, I need to do something with all these feelings. I think I was just always drawn to it.
00:14:17
Speaker
that and a little bit of writing and art. Like it was, it was good. I had expressions that needed to come out. Um, you know, I read, I read somewhere last year that I was talking about, uh, now this is not me diagnosing you in any way, but it's, it's for me personally, you know, cause I'm, I'm on the spectrum.
Neurodivergence and Theater
00:14:35
Speaker
I'm, I'm ADHD autistic. And, uh, and it was talking about how very often neurodivergent people will gravitate, especially to theater because they, you know, there's rules.
00:14:46
Speaker
and there's lines so you know exactly what to say and who to say it to you and you get to practice there's repetition involved you know so there's like lots of these kind of like underlying qualities that you don't realize it's like were you a theater kid or you were just undiagnosed autistic you know yeah you know I've actually thought about this a lot lately and
00:15:07
Speaker
No. So I'm my brother has self diagnosed and it's like pretty sure he is. But we're very like I'm like, I is autistic miss and like is the spectrum.
00:15:20
Speaker
I'm more on the highly sensitive thing but is it also like that because my dad was sometimes volatile when I was younger and it was like oh dad's upset don't you know be careful to read emotions so there's maybe a little bit of that but then like hyper vigilance yeah but then I've also had like therapists be like no like during urban early COVID lockdowns like your life was fine but you were like the world is fucked up and I am really anxious about it do you like I think like you are
00:15:44
Speaker
She's like, not to be like woo woo, but like you're kind of one of those empathic people. So I'm still not sure. I don't, I think I'm more, uh, yeah, I don't in the spectrum of neurotypicalness, I feel I'm more, more typical, but more on the like cry baby, um, sensitive to, um, energies. If I want to get like, my mom was a little woo woo, so.
00:16:10
Speaker
I love it. Lean into it. If the woo-woo-ness gets into part of it, perhaps. I'm neuro-woo-woo, you know? There you go, right? That's it. Maybe that's what I am. I love it. I love it. Yeah. I mean, certainly, like, the TikTok algorithm is like ADHD. And like, you're just judging me because I've been on here for too long. Maybe that's what it is.
00:16:28
Speaker
Well, there's also, you know, I think that there is a misconception of like, because there's so many overlaps, you know, when it comes to psychology and all these things, like they don't really, they don't really know like best. Yeah, exactly. And like, obviously there's lots rooted in science, but there's also lots rooted in observation.
00:16:47
Speaker
And like the whole, I always get the name wrong, but like the DSM or DSM or whatever it is, um, you know, it was basically written in the back room of like a hotel conference by like just like six guys in the fifties, you know? So it's like, well, yeah, it's all based on like old white men. Like, do you, do you act like an old white man? No, I really don't. Well, you must be, you know, hysterical or something. Right. And the overlaps of like how symptoms show up to like, between like, you know,
00:17:16
Speaker
empath, autism, neurodivisions in general, ADHD, trauma, all these different things, right? It really becomes quite a muck of unpacking what's real, what's perceived. Where does the trauma end and the personality begin? Yeah. I don't know. People are different. I think the thing that when I think about autism and the way my family is is that, well, how do I word this?
00:17:50
Speaker
There was a really horrible thing that happened with my my grandmother basically just told me when I was 18. And it was like the difference between me and my brother was that I like I took it so personally. And my brother was like, that's weird. She's fucked up, which is maybe more healthy. But like, things like never like someone's anger never
00:18:08
Speaker
I mean that I know and I think probably like if when I like have deep conversation like brother like there probably was a lot of anxiety that like he just like kept it in and was like walled whereas I was like must express immediately like why what
00:18:22
Speaker
You know fucked up families. Yeah, no I and I you know I was just talking about this with somebody the other day about exactly that kind of like Because I'm with you. I'm somebody who's like Something feels I have to say that feel you know like I've got to express it right away whether it's like even really real or not it's like I have to verbally process it out and and I watch other people have the capacity to like take something in and like not
00:18:49
Speaker
react to it and then be able to sort of like put it away and continue with their day. And I'm just like, that's a superpower to me, you know? Yeah, I think, you know, it took like cognitive behavioral therapy, a little bit of medication to be like, Oh, right, I don't, I don't have to go down this neural pathway. I could, I could choose to respond another way.
Exploring Friendship
00:19:21
Speaker
The whole central exploration behind this show is this question of friendship. In recent weeks, I've had a new... This is something I'm dancing around. I'm not really sure how to talk about it in public just yet, so I'm still finding the proper words. I had a psych evaluation. I got the results of the psych evaluation. I got diagnosed with some things.
00:19:48
Speaker
And it's really reframed the core of what I've been exploring in this show of like connection and understanding people and not being able to understand people at times. And, you know, the real basic question is,
00:20:04
Speaker
you know, what is a friend? And it's such a fascinating question to me because again, it's so simple and yet it can mean something brand new to every single person. And so I really love putting that question to my guests of at your core, what does it mean to be a friend?
00:20:24
Speaker
Oh gosh. I think, yeah, such a hard, I mean, like, I want to go to like dictionary definition and be like, that's it. I don't want to get emotionally involved in it. Because there are so many levels of friendship. Yes. You know, and for someone like you have your Facebook friends, you know, used to have Twitter friends was like, Oh, just this person. I don't really know. And maybe you'll meet them in real life. And you're like, Oh, yeah, you're cool. Yeah, we could hang out.
00:20:49
Speaker
you know, or people you went to theater school with and trauma bonded. And you're like, well, we're friends for life because we trauma bonded, but like, I never talked to them. But I mean, like, first,
00:21:00
Speaker
I think more about what makes a close friend is maybe what I want to talk about more. I mean, want someone that I hopefully see or talk to on a regular basis that understands my past or at least tolerates it.
00:21:22
Speaker
Yeah you know like I have like just like activity buddies and maybe I would just call them like oh yeah they're my activity buddy you know and maybe you have enough conversations and like they become a friend.
00:21:33
Speaker
Um, yeah, I feel like I could ramble on forever, but please go for it. The thing that I was like, you need to, I'm just going to say, stop stopping yourself. Like just go for it. Uh, the thing that I wrote down about this question was like, is the thing that I feel like I am always looking for, not just friendship, kindred spirits, maybe because I watched too much, uh, Anne of green gables when I was young, but like I have been,
00:22:01
Speaker
very much like obsessed with like that kind of friendship and relationship. Like someone that you're just like, we get each other and it's
00:22:13
Speaker
magic. Yeah. And especially how they can like, I'm forgetting the names of the characters, but I remember especially the girls, they had their own, like, they were themselves and yet they got each other too,
Seeking Kindred Spirits
00:22:27
Speaker
right? They were still their own personality, but they, right. So they weren't enmeshed, right? It wasn't like, I do this, you must. They fought a lot, but they also understood where each other was coming from. Yeah.
00:22:38
Speaker
um and that's a quality i think is i mean maybe it's because it was written and not real life you know but but um yeah but how do you find someone like that like how do you find how do you find kindred spirits i don't know i feel like uh if i knew i'd have more of them i mean sometimes it's really i remember when i lived in england and i had a i've had a really hard time like connecting with people and then like showing up at some weird
00:23:05
Speaker
Poetry dinner thing and like sitting next to some guy who is like parents were Portuguese He was like in South London and we just were could take the piss out of each other right away and I was like Are you my new best friend? Like those moments are just like electric and like we this guy and I like we still Randomly check in on each other and just like what are you up to? I mean, we also have theater background So sometimes there's like that like you just see a spark in someone else and you're like We get it We're on the same wavelength
00:23:36
Speaker
Yeah. Where do I find them? Oh, I mean, I had a really interesting, I had a, well, we haven't hung out since, but I did a travel gig in December with another actor here who was much younger than me. And I've done like a lot of travel gigs for acting and commercials. And you don't always get along with the people you're cast with, and you know, spend like four days in a foreign city. And this guy and I like got along so well. I was like,
00:24:06
Speaker
kindred spirits, like thank God, you know, also like you have the same sort of habits and interests and we're like, oh, good travel buddies. Be like, I'm always just looking for like fun. I just want to get along with people. I have fun and do what I want to do with them and laugh.
00:24:20
Speaker
Yeah, no, I love that. I think I think keeping it like, you know, for lack of a better word, keeping it simple like that. Right. Like it's, you know, I think that's something that I've learned is that it's like friendship doesn't have to be complicated and not every friend has to be someone who can like almost like therapies you. Right. You know, I think something that I've really become actually almost
00:24:45
Speaker
like too reliant on that I'm trying to really pull back from is like relying on people who are just as like trauma informed or lived trauma or like, you know, like who frame everything around mental health. Um, that's something that I'm kind of trying to step away from a little bit in a way where it's like, I have my own journey and I have my own healing that I'm doing.
00:25:06
Speaker
And I'd love to talk about it sometimes, but not everything needs framing from that, you know? And, and sometimes it's nice to just go like, Oh, that sucks. Anyway, do you want to go watch baseball? Yeah. Yeah. I, yeah. I w I want, I want, for me, I want both. I want to be like, can I tell you this shitty thing that happened? And can you make me feel better? And can you tell me like, give me the things that I want to hear?
00:25:31
Speaker
And be like, great, now let's go do karaoke and be ridiculous and get free drinks from those guys down the hall. The dream, the actual dream. Sometimes it's happened and it's felt so good. So I want to know what you are looking for in friendship these days.
00:25:58
Speaker
Yeah, you know, I mean that's so you know, like I said before a part of it is that it's like I think So I think for me I I Have spent almost my entire life looking for a friend that will stick around I've always really struggled with kind of keeping friends. I'm someone who can make friends, but then one reason or another
00:26:26
Speaker
It's usually me. We split, you know, for any number of reasons. And so I think I'm in so many ways, and we'll kind of come to this later in some of the other questions, is like in so many ways, it's what I'm learning to look for in myself rather than outside from other people.
00:26:50
Speaker
Because I think my instincts has been to find qualities in other people that I think I'm lacking in myself. And so instead of relying on that outside validation, I've been really working on
00:27:08
Speaker
practicing that for myself, you know, self validation, self love, self, you know, like getting really good with being alone and getting really good, like going and doing things that I'd want to be with someone for and just doing that alone instead. Right. So, um, yeah, it's this funny thing, like, especially with sort of the way my last year kind of half year has played out, like in so many ways,
00:27:33
Speaker
I'm sort of embodying the opposite of this show in a certain light. I'm actually trying to really pare down who I'm vulnerable with and I'm trying to pare down who I trust. I'm kind of not looking for more friends. I'm looking for deeper connections to fewer people.
00:27:55
Speaker
In terms of those qualities though to sort of give like, you know, it's like it's understanding its patience, you know Consistency I think is a big one and and that doesn't necessarily mean you know, I I'm not somebody who like I Don't need to see someone every day But I but I whatever they can offer I'd like it consistent even if that's just like once a month, you know, like But just being able to trust the regularity is something, you know
00:28:25
Speaker
Which comes from a lot of self knowledge, right? Because it's like if somebody says they can talk every day, but then it's burning them out and then they're building resentment, like that's a recipe for problems, right? So I'd rather just people be really honest with their own capacities and their own, right? So yeah, I think those are the cores I'm looking for. Yeah. It's funny when you mentioned
00:28:50
Speaker
You have trouble keeping friends for a long time.
Evolving Friendships
00:28:55
Speaker
I feel like some of my friendship issues have been because I have held on longer than probably the friendship. We've outgrown each other. Yeah.
00:29:05
Speaker
Or that they I let people get away with shitty behavior for too long. I was like, but I've known this person for so long and no one else shares these memories with me. It's almost like a it's like a sunk cost fallacy. Yeah. Right. Of like, well, I've known them for this long, so I have to hold on to them. Right. Yeah. That really. Yeah. You know, so that.
00:29:27
Speaker
whole world of friend breakups is one that I dance around quite a bit and I you know we were saying before we started recording you know it's like I
00:29:37
Speaker
Like I lost a whole like network of people last year. Um, and, and I know, you know, I, it's very doubtful any of them are listening and if, and if they are high, sorry, you know, um, because I know they have their own perspective on it and, and both are valid. Um, we've never really had the chance to actually talk through what happened, you know, so I don't, I don't actually know what their perspective is on these things, but I know from my side, it's like,
00:30:06
Speaker
you were saying about friendships that kind of overstate their welcome and things like that, right? And I am somebody who can really rubberband between holding on too tight and then letting go too soon, you know? And I'm never really sure which is the right one, you know? And yeah, it's definitely been on my mind of like,
00:30:29
Speaker
when is it time and when is it time to let go and when is it time to fight for, you know? And I'm really curious if you're willing to sort of share, you know, you were sort of alluding to a story before we recorded that you might be willing to share. I'd love to hear that. Yeah. Oh, gosh. Okay. So, I mean, this is 100% my perspective. I've tried to do a lot of work to try to figure out what the other perspective was.
00:30:59
Speaker
I have my theories, I don't know. But ultimately, so I went, I blocked a person out of my life after we went on what was supposed to be a 25th friend anniversary, at least from my perspective. I can feel like my face getting hot even anyway. So we went to a Caribbean, well, we went down to the Caribbean.
00:31:25
Speaker
because this person lives out east and it was a she she lives out east and There were little hints that maybe I was you know turning a blind eye to things like let's meet in a neutral location Was was a bit of a like yeah, why did she want it to be in a neutral location so we went down stayed in an all-inclusive resort and
00:31:53
Speaker
The vibes were just a little weird and I was so in this like, I am trying to have a 25th friend-diversity with someone. Let's have a great time together. And it turned out that she had wanted this opportunity to have like a conversation to, well, it was two things. One, like reevaluate our friendship. And she had like lists of what kind of like,
00:32:20
Speaker
terms of what the friendship should be. And I mean, like this person like lives in another, you know, city well far away from me, like, you know, we'd sort of talked into like texting and talking every now and then and maybe seeing each other once a year. So some, yeah, so
00:32:40
Speaker
The other thing was that she shared with me that she had been angry at me from something that had happened at a big event three years prior and had never expressed this anger with me. And it's funny, I'm talking about now, the whole thing blindsided me completely. And a lot of it was that she was like, my friends out there think you're a garbage person. Yeah.
00:33:11
Speaker
I think I have blocked out a bit of this. I just have the physical feeling of what it felt like in my body, because the whole weekend that we were away, I was in a state of shock. But I do very clearly remember one moment, because I was going through a depression at this point, and she had said, if you're ever thinking about killing yourself, you should do it. Whoa. That's what I heard.
00:33:39
Speaker
When I brought that up with her in an email after the fact, she said something to the effect of, I would never say that because I would never say that.
00:33:57
Speaker
The way that it was handled was not like, oh my God, if that's what you heard, you completely misunderstood me, which maybe from there we could have evolved something. And so based on that reaction to what I had experienced,
00:34:15
Speaker
there was like defense and there was no accountability. Yeah. And it just felt like, like, like I'm vibrating now. The whole, the whole experience was really fucked up. And I think because I was in so this, this mental, this mental state of like trying to have a good time and salvage this weekend that I spent thousands of dollars on and was not in a great financial state at that point to be in this neutral location instead of like going to her place or my place or, you know,
00:34:44
Speaker
meeting at a friend's cabin or something. The whole thing blindsided me completely. I was in shock. I remember processing it with my therapist and she was like, I'm sorry, this is the most horrible thing I've ever heard of. I'm like, right? This is really fucked up. So
00:35:15
Speaker
It's definitely like I just went on a trip with one of my other really good friends. And I had to have a conversation with her in advance. I'm like, I know that you are not gonna do what this person did to me. But I need to acknowledge that this is the now trauma I have when it comes to traveling.
00:35:31
Speaker
with a friend that I'm going to be like ambushed about something in a way like you couldn't, if you were angry at me for the last however many years, could you tell me in advance before we do, before I drop a lot of money? Yeah. Good job. Like really good job to, to like vocalize that. Right? Like, cause that's scary. That's scary to like, it's scary to say, it's scary to say, Hey, I'm scared. Right? Like, and so like, I just want to say like, good job. That's great.
00:36:01
Speaker
Thank you. Yeah. I mean, it's funny. I remember when this friend anniversary friend, uh, did like drop like this, like I've been angry at you for three years. Like the way that I responded is so unfair. That's already so like, that's like, no, no, no, no, no. You do these horrible things. And I was like, okay, I have no recollection of this. I mean, drinking had been involved drinking that I didn't want to do was involved. Um,
00:36:29
Speaker
life and complications. So the way that I responded, I remember I remember her saying like, Oh, I didn't expect you to handle this so well. And thank you for making me feel heard. And I was like,
00:36:40
Speaker
I don't know what ever would make you think that I wouldn't hear you. Cause as I said earlier, so much I take personally. I'm like, this is my personal responsibility for like how other people feel. So like, hence my hyper sensitivity. So the whole thing was really fucked up. So, and I did like, they kept, this person kept trying to reach out to me and be like, we need to talk. And I just was like, maybe when I'm emotionally, when I'm emotionally ready, but
00:37:09
Speaker
I just had to block. And I've never looked back. And it's that thing now with time going, there were things that she said on that trip that I'm like, oh yeah, that was fucked up.
Emotional Impact of Friend Breakups
00:37:21
Speaker
I have this other really good friend, Melissa, who this person had said, Melissa's not a good friend to you. She talks about you behind your back.
00:37:30
Speaker
And in like the most recent years, you know, Melissa has been nothing but amazing to me. So it was this whole, like, I don't know what the whole thing was about. I just know that it still to this day makes me feel hot and I want to cry. Yeah. And I mean, it's okay if you need to cry, you know, you're safe too. Yeah. Um,
00:37:50
Speaker
Yeah, it was just the most fucked up thing I'd ever experienced. Yeah. Yeah. That sounds awful. I'm so sorry. Like that just sounds like just heinous. And it's like it's it's.
00:38:05
Speaker
I have been in similar places, you know, and I've and I've heard like, you know, not one to one. And by no means am I trying to like, compete or compare, but it's just like, Oh, let's do it. Let's compare. I have other stories. You know, it's a thing of like, it's a thing of like, yeah.
00:38:23
Speaker
Emotional trauma and emotional abuse is is really hard to explain to people who haven't been through a version themselves, you know, because it's like sometimes I think people like
00:38:37
Speaker
it feels almost too nebulous where it's like how do I describe how it changed like how it feels my heart beats or how my brain throbs or like you know like like it's such a strange way to
00:38:57
Speaker
What's the word like it's it's so strange how these events change our brains and we can't actually Clock them until we look back later, you know Really good job blocking I learned I heard a thing recently that I loved that I've really held on to which is the saying that's like I
00:39:16
Speaker
Um, it's, it's a, it's a very singular act of love to yourself and to a person who you love to allow them to experience the full extent of the consequences of their actions. So when someone causes such deep hurt, um, you know, the consequences a separation, right? And, and, and, and to not.
00:39:44
Speaker
uh, you know, cut short your own process and your own experience and your own healing to placate their, you know, forgiveness or whatever it might be. Right. So, so, you know, um, and, and, and this isn't me, this isn't me fishing towards this relationship, but I think more just like stepping back esoterically, like, do you believe that
00:40:11
Speaker
like stuff is done and done, or do you think that there's like, if there's ever chances to like circle back after time? And if so, like what would need to happen for a circle back to work? Yeah, I'm of two minds of it. Mostly I feel like the trust has been broken. Yeah. And the lack of empathy for what I heard.
00:40:41
Speaker
and how I felt. And that there was sort of no like immediate apology of like, Oh, I fucked this up. Like I meant to try to get closer to you. And all I did was say something that pushed you further away. You know, that like in the moment that needed to have happened. And well, we live in different cities. So it's sort of like,
00:41:08
Speaker
How to say that out of mind? The long distance, you know, friendship. Do I need another one of those? So many of my good friends live in other cities already, so it's like, I don't know. Yeah, what would need to have, I mean, that's what, what something needed to have been said was in the moment. Yeah. You know, or somewhat after. You know, I don't, I wish her no harm.
00:41:37
Speaker
just that all I wish for is that there was some understanding of how it affected me. I'm sure it wasn't her intention. I know there was some things that she'd set up during the trip that was like, oh, I was fully expecting to get another room. And I was like, what the fuck is happening? You thought I was going to blow up on this thing? And instead, it was like, I didn't mean to do any of that. And this is completely, I had no idea that this is where our friendship was.
00:42:08
Speaker
So maybe there's a lot of stuff that like I'm not understanding about what happened Yeah, but ultimately nope
00:42:16
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Well, and, and, you know, uh, for me personally, you know, I hit a point where it's like words stop mattering, you know, like it's like, you know, once, once something's been done and then it's been left to sit, like what you say afterwards. Doesn't, you know, doesn't register, you know, if anything, it's like, what are you going to do? You know, I've been talking about that a lot on recent episodes of like.
00:42:38
Speaker
you know, to me, actions speak so much louder. And like, and what someone does, like, you could apologize a thousand times who gives a shit if you're going to just go back to the same cycle, you know, unless you've shown you're actually changing or have changed, right? Like, and you're and you're actually doing that work because, you know, yeah, people will say whatever they want to say to get what they want in the moment, you know, and and then they'll just go back to whatever it is. Right. Yeah. So I'm much more interested in actions than anything else. Yeah.
00:43:08
Speaker
Yeah. Um, well, I'm so, I'm just so sorry
Intention vs Impact in Friendships
00:43:12
Speaker
that happened. People can be, you know, you said, you said something really, really, really profound there about like, you know, most people are acting on instinct and it is important to remember that, you know, like, yeah. Cause you said, you know, you're sure her intention wasn't this is just, you know, her own mode of expression, right? And it's really important to clock that that is true. And also.
00:43:37
Speaker
you know, it's the whole question of intent versus impact, right? Of like, and how much do you weigh those things? And I think that I don't think it's one or the other. I think that there's a, you know, a scale to it. But like, whatever your intention is, the impact still matters, right? And and both have to be reconciled to truly heal past it, right? Yeah, I think the thing with a lot of these
00:44:01
Speaker
uh for me and my friendship trauma um since this i'm just gonna go for it all now uh is i i have my
00:44:12
Speaker
by many different friends. Once again, with teenage, I'm sure this is universal, felt very judged by some friends. And like, that's sort of what's caused the rift. Like with my weird lifestyle, like I had another friend at one point, we were like, 27, 27. Tell me, isn't it time I got a real career? Yeah. And I was like, going to do the fringe festival. And I'm like,
00:44:36
Speaker
I still don't have a real career. I mean, I'm- What's a real career? Yeah. Uh, you know, it's like I have, I have savings. I don't have debt. Like already that that's probably better than many people in North America. Um, not that it's a competition, but it's like, like I have some shit together. I've just chosen to choose a career in the arts. And yes, granted my success is common. Like the last, like,
00:45:03
Speaker
five, six, seven years for doing commercials for fucking corporate America, uh, which, right. And then you're like, Oh, please more than a theater contract and theater never wants to audition me. So, you know, you're like, all artists were taking what we can. I have my shows and my little projects that, you know, fuel me. Um, but the judgment from friends or like, or, and I think probably, you know, when I do the like,
00:45:31
Speaker
inner work or work with a therapist. A lot of it is coming from, it's not about me. This is my thing. It's not always about me. It's about them and them maybe feeling uncomfortable with them not pursuing their dreams or them feeling uncomfortable with their life situation. You're kind of getting projected on by them. And then I take it so personally and I'm like, I'm fucked up. But I'm like, I'm pretty good with where I'm at and loving my day-to-day life.
00:45:58
Speaker
That's just it. And I think that there's, you're preaching to the choir on that one about just like, I'll take every, even slight criticism, like just so deep in the gut, you know? And I'll just be like, oh my God, you're absolutely right. Like what a piece of shit am I, right? You know? And it's so easy to forget that like,
00:46:23
Speaker
the vast majority of negativity that's spoken aloud is just externalized self-loathing, you know, like it's so much of it is just projection of, I can't remember the exact quote, but I remember years ago reading something, I think it was from like Siddhartha or something, it was like, basically was saying,
00:46:42
Speaker
The thing you hate most in your enemy is the thing you hate most of yourself, right? You know like it's it's the reason you hate that in them is because you see it in yourself and you hate yourself You know so like and and that's what that whole work of like Unconditional self-love comes from is like if you can unconditionally love yourself you can unconditionally love anyone, you know because you know yourself better than anyone and so
00:47:07
Speaker
So much of life is assumption. It's assuming what people are thinking, assuming what people are doing, but you know what you're thinking and you know what your rationale is. So you know what a piece of shit you are. So if you can unconditionally love them, then you can love anyone. Yeah, fair.
00:47:29
Speaker
It's funny, you've put me on such a tightrope walk of a topic that I desperately want to go deeper into, but I'm also terrified of it.
00:47:44
Speaker
You know, when it involves other people, especially people I don't speak to, it's like, it's such a tough, like, I don't want to, I don't want to be misconstrued. I don't want to be misinterpreted. I don't want to have it used, you know? Yeah. Yeah. I just, what's coming up for me is like, yeah, but also like by me, like, I think for me, like me not talking about this horrible thing that happened, um, it's kind of giving them still power.
Owning Experiences and Overcoming Trauma
00:48:09
Speaker
Yes. Um, it's like,
00:48:12
Speaker
So part of me is like, our experience is our experience and it's valid and it's also eating away at us and helps other people that do know us and love us understand us.
00:48:35
Speaker
So that really does lead me into the next sort of portion of this exploration of connection is, you know, a friendship as I've started to kind of internally process it is like the friendship is the one on one. And then you out of that you build community, right? You know, community and community isn't always friends, but community to me is like kind of like safe, right? And I'm curious for you,
00:48:59
Speaker
Again, it's one of those nebulous terms that can mean anything and everything and nothing. And I'm really curious what what community means to you and what what a word like that feels like for you. Yeah, it's fine.
00:49:16
Speaker
I feel like my junior high, high school essay training has been so ingrained. I'm like, well, the definition of community is people of a place or having a characteristic. So what does community mean to me? I think about the communities that I am a part of or not a part of. I live in Mount Pleasant, Vancouver. I think of my political associated community, I think of
00:49:46
Speaker
the people that I do a lot of auditions with. That's certainly a community, if not a partial group chat. People with the trauma bonds from theater school. The communities that I feel like I've got a foot in, like slightly the comedy community, slightly the theater community, like the yoga community when I go to class.
00:50:10
Speaker
So a lot of it's about sharing space and sharing interests, but normally sharing, like I don't really have a lot of like online communities. I like in-person communities, like I think like teen angst, you know, I hope becomes a little community for the night. We're certainly all there. Like I always sort of think of it as like a slumber party where I'll just like share in secrets. That's the vibe that I want it to have. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what community is really.
00:50:38
Speaker
during interest, time, and space. Yeah. Okay. So that was going to be my follow up about like, like, what is it that binds us?
Community and Belonging
00:50:45
Speaker
You right? Like, but if I guess, yeah, you said interest, time, space, those, those are your three community tenants. Yeah, I guess so. I like that a lot. I think that's a really powerful framing and I really, I really dig it. Um, um, do you find like,
00:51:02
Speaker
Again, this comes back to such an interior exploration of myself, but I'm really curious, how do you find yourself building community? Is it in individuals that then conglomerate or is it in big swathes of groups? Yeah. So I feel like this is one of my burdens and one of my dreams.
00:51:27
Speaker
is that I'm always wanting community and wanting to create the community that I want and then being pissed off that no one shows up.
00:51:38
Speaker
Right, like I started this, I started a chapter of an event that was happening across North America called Dance Dance Party Party. I started the Vancouver chapter. And the rules of that from the original New York chapter were no booze, no boys, no judgment. And it was just like, we're going to rent a dance studio for an hour and have a dance party.
00:52:01
Speaker
You know, and it's great. Like I handed the torch over to another den mama of that group and like, they really have a great little community. And I'm like, I wasn't a great one. I was den mama. Like they were, they were all there. Um, but also I was juggling like seven jobs and like, who am I to, you know, join this community that now has time to go up for dinners and all these things. Um,
00:52:22
Speaker
Uh, yeah. Cause a lot of like my artwork, like, like teen X or say what this other comedy show I have where people, funny people read from terrible books are kind of in this idea that like, I have, I have an idea or this game that I want to play and I try to get people to play the game with me. It's a lot of what I'm like, Oh, is that starting to figure out? I'm like, maybe that's just my art is like, let's.
00:52:43
Speaker
try to bring people together to do things you wanna do so that you have community. And then it's like like-minded, right? To people, interest, time, space, sharing it with each other. Don't know where it's going with that. It's beautiful though. No, it's beautiful. And I think you tapping into recognizing that that's a strength of yours, I think is wonderful, you know, because it's like you are, you're a really powerful facilitator and a really powerful like games master, you know, like to frame it like that. I think that's an incredible skill.
00:53:12
Speaker
Yeah, they don't all work. Teenage is certainly the one that I'm like, it will, it has, is not, doesn't show any signs of dying any, any soon. And it's certainly had longevity. It's great. I mean, it's just amazing how people contribute to be like, oh, I have something. I'm like, great. Cause I've certainly exhausted my resources of it. I've been doing this way longer than I was a teenager. Yeah.
00:53:38
Speaker
Now I just think about all the other events that I want to like have wanted to do for years and be like, why am I not doing these other events? Well, you know, energy capacity, COVID, you know, certainly COVID. But, you know, that's actually that was one of the most magical moments of Teen X was like both. I've been to a couple now and every time we come out of the show,
00:54:01
Speaker
The whole group I'm with is like, oh, I've got to dig up my diary. Or, oh, I used to have it, but I don't know where it is anymore. I wonder if my mom still has it. And it's like, there's always this excitement that spills out of the room that doesn't always happen at live events in general. There's something really connective about the way you framed these things and the way you framed the sort of, there's an audience participation without
00:54:29
Speaker
that like the terror of like you know being at a stand-up comedian show and then being like you sir i'm gonna roast you you know it's like please don't yeah yeah i guess it is it's come and play this game with me yeah yeah i think we'll go play the game i'll be go home i gotta see if i can stop for the game exactly right exactly and it's gentle and it's nice you know it's like no i think it's wonderful and i think
00:54:52
Speaker
It's really important to recognize that that is a skill, that that isn't something that comes naturally to everyone, to give that kind of thing a shot and then keep doing it. I have always been the party planner of many of my groups. Even if it's like, I got this event I want to go to, who wants to join me? That may even be the secret to many friendships these days.
00:55:19
Speaker
You just continue to be like, knowing things. I mean, that's even been like how people I've dated. I'm like, finally, someone wants to go do fun things with me. And then I'm like, but I don't want to do all the fun things with him. Yeah. Isn't that the trade off, right? Like I like you a lot, but I'm going to need some not you time to, you know? Yeah. Well, I don't want to do that fun thing. Oh, no.
00:55:51
Speaker
Well, I thought, you know, since I knew that I was gonna have some dark trauma probably come up, and I'm talking about, like, best things you've ever done for a friend, a friend has ever done for you.
Support During Difficult Times
00:56:06
Speaker
Happy moments. Yeah, yeah. So I...
00:56:14
Speaker
It's so funny, I've probably told the story before on the show somewhere, but like, in a lot of ways, where my brain instantly goes to is a time that like,
00:56:25
Speaker
is tied to one of the lowest points of my life, but also was like so incredibly beautiful and helpful that I'll just like, to the day I die, I will love my best friend for this. Like when I was getting divorced a couple of years ago, my best friend Mark, who was also my best man at my wedding, he just bought me a plane ticket and flew me out to Vancouver and was like, just get out of town, you're coming to stay with us, you know? I stayed with some other friends for a couple days here,
00:56:55
Speaker
and then I went out to the island and I stayed with him for a week and we just like drank and shot the shit and cried and he taught me how to use Tinder because I had started dating my ex-wife before Tinder was popular so he like got me set up on an account and you know and like just kind of showed me the ropes of what dating was like in 2022 you know and uh
00:57:18
Speaker
and uh you know just yeah just gave me a week away from everything you know and it was just such a beautiful gift and and um and him along with my other best friend matt who lives on the island as well you know matt was like driving me everywhere he was he picked me up from the plane and he dropped me off the ferry and you know and just like
00:57:37
Speaker
it's just it's those like acts of service right you know like just like showing up and not needing to be asked you know like just being like we're doing this right yeah those are the things that really stick right yeah um i'm trying to think if there's another one that comes to mind that isn't tied to such
00:58:02
Speaker
fuck i don't know oh well so this is it yet again i i'll basically always use matt and mark as examples because they're just like two two of my best friends and uh and they uh a year or two ago i i don't uh really spoke weed all that much i i um i used to back in the day i used to smoke it all the time and then i stopped and anytime
00:58:26
Speaker
Since I've tried it, I've had pretty intense, not only anxiety, I've been terrorized by it. This is probably almost two years ago now, a year and a half, something like that. I decided I was going to try again. I smoked a joint to myself, by myself, and then I was drawing. I was drawing really hard to stay on the drawing and not panic and freak out.
00:58:53
Speaker
And it wasn't working. And we have a little group chat, the three of us, and I texted them. And I was like, I need help, basically. And they were like, show us your drawings. And so I did. So I took photos of what I had drawn. And I showed them. And they were so kind. And they were like, oh, those are so good. You're an incredible artist. I love these. And they just like,
00:59:17
Speaker
unquestionably we're just like giving me flowers just gassing me up right and the next day i sobered up and i looked at them and it just awful just like like just the worst doodles like just like at best it looked like a child you know and um yeah and it was just i just felt so loved of like yeah them just being like we're not gonna tell him the truth we're gonna give him you know like we're just gonna love him today right
00:59:45
Speaker
Well, that's so sweet. Yeah. Yeah. So it's stuff like that. Those are the moments that I really treasure is, you know, anticipating your needs. Yes. Oh, what a good way of putting it because that is exactly it. It's it's you know, I'm someone who I waffle on the idea of like.
01:00:06
Speaker
I guess you could almost say like lying for safety or lying for support, you know, because it's like they were totally lying to me that those were good drawings. But it's like it wouldn't have been helpful in the moment. Right. So why would you tell? You know, they were very good drawings for a very stoned person. Exactly. Exactly. Right. Context. Right. You know, but but it's like sometimes lying can be used for good, you know. Yeah. The fib. The fib. Thank you.
01:00:38
Speaker
That's stealing from you or... Exactly, exactly. You know, and that's the thing. Yeah, gentle fib. Fib is a nice way of putting it. I like that.
01:00:46
Speaker
You know, so I'm cognizant of the time and I know you've got other things you've got to get on with with your day, but I only have one kind of like wrap up question. I feel like I feel like we've only scratched the surface. I feel like there's so many different directions we could have gone with this conversation and
01:01:08
Speaker
I just, I find you endlessly fascinating. And I really like, I want to say thank you very much before I get to this like wrap up question. I just, I really want to say like, thank you so much for coming on the show. Thank you for having me on teen angst. Like I, I love the show. I have more, I'm trying to stagger my signups because I don't want to just be like, I don't want to just be like coming back next week, next month. Right. You know, like, but, uh,
01:01:31
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I try to stagger everyone just to be like, okay, we've got other people that want to come through. But I'm always happy to have people back. I love continually hearing people or there's some people who I'm like, I would I want to listen to this every time. Right? Very fun.
01:01:46
Speaker
There's a few I want to repeat, but I have new stuff too. So I'll sign up in the fall. But yeah, no, I just really want to say thank you. And I think you're absolutely incredible. And I'm so grateful that we've met and connected. And I just really hope you keep doing everything you're doing, because I think your work is immensely valuable. And I find you to be
01:02:14
Speaker
How do I put it? You're a member of a community that I would like to be in. You know, like I don't see you hold yourself in the world and the way I see you put yourself in the world. I don't even know if you recognize necessarily how much power there is within it and how much I like really admire it. So thank you very much for that. Thank you for that. No, I have no idea.
01:02:36
Speaker
Absolutely no, no idea. West Coast, Mark Maron. No, I shouldn't say West Coast. He's in the West Coast. Canadian Mark Maron, younger. No, you're great. I mean, you've gotten tea next night. I'm so excited. I feel like I should have
01:02:53
Speaker
caught up on your past history before I was on this podcast. I'd be like, I want to know more about this. This is great. We'll have you back on again. We'll just have you back on again down the road and we'll do a catch up and we'll see where we go from there. Last question of the show, I always like to leave listeners on a bit of an actionable step that they can kind of take with them and try out.
01:03:14
Speaker
What do you think is one thing listeners could try doing this week for basically to be a better friend either to themselves or to their community?
Acknowledging the Efforts of Event Organizers
01:03:26
Speaker
My mind goes to like five things at once. Maybe I am like ADHD on the spectrum. You know what? No, no, no. Give him a top five. I mean, selfishly as, you know, the party planner, I'm like, reach out to your party planning friends. Sometimes we get a little burnt out and bitter. We being I, we're always the one that know things or just be like, is there anything cool you want to do? I want to hang out with you.
01:03:52
Speaker
Right? Like flip the script sometimes and your friendship would be like, acknowledge that they're the one who does that and doesn't. Plan the party for the party planner. Oh my God. I did have friends throw me a party years ago and I was like, oh my gosh. It was very, it was beautiful.
01:04:13
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, I think what you said early on about, you know, like that we do need to like friend ourselves first is always great advice and certainly, you know, stuff that I'm always working on. And lastly, you know, make a plan, make a trip with a friend.
01:04:32
Speaker
have the conversations you need to have in advance. Like I did on my most recent trip with one of my best friends. Yes. Yes. Set your expectations early and be honest about what they are. And then you'll have a great trip. Yeah. Oh, thank you so much, Sarah. I just, just one more time. Thank you for being on the show. Um, do you have anything, uh, anything you want to plug anywhere you'd like listeners to find you anything, anything like that?
01:04:59
Speaker
um well i finally started an instagram account for my shows because it's just too much it's too much i'm like do you really want to see all my dogs and stupid hats uh people that want to come to my shows you probably don't um so that's yellow notebook productions um it's all spelled out because all the other uh abbreviations of it were taken um yeah that's probably the best thing
01:05:25
Speaker
You know, I'm everywhere on the internet. It's too much of me and my dogs and silly hats. I don't know when this is coming out.
01:05:32
Speaker
Actually, really quick, it's coming out this week. Great. Okay. Teenaches night is the last one of the season is May the third. Then in September, I don't remember the date 20 or 22nd. Uh, I'm going to do one at the Shadbolt. They have asked me to bring the show there. Uh, and then I need to talk to the Fox about when the next season's going to happen at the Fox. And then I'm doing my other show at the new little mountain gallery in Gastown. Uh, it's the show say what readings of deliciously rotten writing. This is the other.
01:06:02
Speaker
I have an idea, come play a game with me where I find funny people and they have to find a book that makes them say, say whaaat? Cuz then this is ridiculous, the plot doesn't make sense, check out this crazy dialogue, like get a load of this insanity. Yeah, so it's a show that I ran for years pre-pandemic and many people were like, I found a book, like I found a book, I want to play the game. So I'm like, okay, we'll do it again.
01:06:27
Speaker
It's very nice. And when is that? Oh, yes, May 29. It's a Wednesday and it's an early show 7pm to 815. Little mountain because I respect people with jobs. None of these 930pm shows. That's not my audience. My audience likes to go to bed early.
01:06:46
Speaker
I was just, I was just reading an Instagram post that was talking about how their concerts need to have matinees because it's like, I don't want to see a band. It starts at nine with two openers. You know, it's happening more and more. I just went to ballet BC to had a dancing. I went to last night where it was eight to midnight. I was like, yes, I will go dancing eight to midnight. Yeah. I will be on the dance floor at eight Oh five.
01:07:10
Speaker
Yep, and then I will be at home long before midnight, but nice that it's an option. I want to leave at 10.30. Yeah, exactly. That's when the birdhouse starts. They open at 10 p.m. I'm like, get a life. Stop doing cocaine. Yeah. Lord. Yeah. I mean, I think it's happening. The culture shifting. Yeah. So that's excellent. Excellent. Well, thank you very much. All that is going to be in the show notes. Sarah Bino, you are magic. Thank you again. Thank you.
01:07:52
Speaker
And that's it for this week. Thank you one more time to Sarah for coming on the show. I just adore the work she's doing. Please check out her profile. I have added that link in the show notes. Go see Teen Angst, go see Say Wah, go see everything else she puts on because she's an incredible host.
01:08:09
Speaker
artist and I just think the absolute world of her so please support her speaking of support if you want to help out friendless why not sign up for the friendless newsletter you're getting a weekly update including five distractions for the week which will range anything from books movies music TV shows articles this week you're getting a link on a study of whether or not you should flush with your toilet lid up or down
01:08:35
Speaker
You're also getting a curated poem that I have enjoyed this week and a monthly playlist of music that I am using to distract myself from the intrusive thoughts. The friendless subscription is coming along nicely. We're hoping to launch this in June. I'm still taking feedback for anyone who has any ideas, but it's looking like it's going to be there's going to be some courses. There's going to be a private discord.
01:09:02
Speaker
There's going to be weekly live streams, probably a book club, lots of fun stuff coming down the pipeline. I'm really excited to share it. More information is going to be coming out in May and then we're going to be launching that in June. So get hyped. But that's really it for me this week. I have no other updates that I can think of. I'm sure I will publish the episode and then remember all the stuff I wish I had said, but that doesn't really matter. So we're going to leave it here. Thank you so much for listening and I hope you're going to come back next week for a brand new episode.
01:09:31
Speaker
but I'm not going to worry about that right now and neither should you because that is then and this is now so for now I'll just say I love you and I wish you well fun and safety sweeties
01:10:00
Speaker
you