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Flashbacks & Emotions, Is Ron's Leg Even Broken, and James Hosts a Rave
90 Plays1 year ago
Today, we are analyzing Chapter 19: The Servant of Lord Voldemort | 1:33:00 - 1:36:55
Remember, ickle firsties, there will be spoilers!
Our episodes are edited by our very own James Beltran. The music is licensed from Pond5 and were created by contributors: P_Ball, MLevanios, and JamesBlundson.
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Transcript
Episode Introduction and Spoiler Warning
00:00:22
Speaker
Welcome to Peeves Gampfest, where we sometimes host a chapter by chapter page to screen analysis of the Harry Potter series, and sometimes we just have a common room chat. I'm Meeks. I'm James.
00:00:34
Speaker
And I'm Sarah Day. And today we are analyzing chapter 19, the servant of Lord Voldemort, which is minute ah minutes, hour. How do I say that? It's hour. This is hour 133. One hour, 33 minutes.
00:00:54
Speaker
Okay, it's one hour and 33 minutes to one hour and 36 minutes and 55 seconds of the film. Before we start gabbing, we wanted to give a spoiler warning. We will be using our vast knowledge of the wizarding world to compare the page to the screen, and we may gab about moments that happen later in the books or films. You've been warned, Dickle-Firsties, before we begin a message from the Daily Prophet.
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00:01:44
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00:03:09
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Chapter 19 Analysis: Sirius Black and The Shrieking Shack
00:06:08
Speaker
All right, welcome back listeners. So today we are discussing the adaptation of chapter 19, the servant of Lord Voldemort, which is the third chapter that includes um Harry, Ron, and Hermione being in the shrieking shack discussing all of the stuff about Peter Pettigrew, Sirius Black, finding out all of that history. And so we covered the first, well, it's kind of like a chapter and a half of that in our previous chapter by chapter episode. And so now we are, and we're discussing chapter 19, which finishes up
00:06:50
Speaker
on that discussion that they have, and then they start to get themselves out of the shrieking shack before chaos ensues in the next chapter. So how do we feel about this adaptation? I think this chapter, well, the last chapter and this chapter are a great opportunity to have some flashbacks to
00:07:19
Speaker
the marauders being in school and then everything that happens with the voldemort attack and being the secret keeper and everything that they're explaining right now could be a really great flashback to see this on the screen instead of them just talking about it or cut cutting back and forth between the flashbacks and this scene at the shrieking shack
00:07:47
Speaker
All I really want to see is all three students using Expelliarmus on Snape and just blasting it. That's really all I want to see. I mean, we can always use more Snape getting hurt. Getting what he's due. Well, I mean, it was cool how they did it in the movie, but I want to see all three of them react at literally almost the exact same time, just so that they can get more time with Lupin and Sirius.
00:08:16
Speaker
Like I think it's just, um, see, I can't remember if it's Harry or Hermione who does it in the movie. Someone has their wand, they're approaching, they're pointing in at black and then they pointed at Sirius and like blast him through the bed. I think it's Harry, but I can't remember off the top of my head, but, um, it was just the one student, but like, whereas the book, it's kind of less like all three of them had their wands.
00:08:44
Speaker
Because Lupin gave them their ones, and so all of them used it at the same time. They basically used Expelliarmus x3, and I guess the force of that was just enough to knock him into the wall. So I don't know. Just like those kind of details would be very interesting.
00:09:06
Speaker
to like change it up and not have it be similar to the movies but like have it be different. It's just like those little details I think are important to kind of just be like all three of them had had their ones and they all used it at the same time. And change it up and make it like cool,
00:09:24
Speaker
ah cooler I guess. I don't know what I'm saying.
00:09:31
Speaker
Yes, I agree saying the three of them attack him. And then this is the moment right where they're like, Oh my God, we attacked a teacher. um yeah Yeah. I think having that attack the teacher. yeah Yeah, having that kind of like almost like an intense moment and then the realization of what just like what they just did. um But it's having all three of them do that means that they all know how important this information is to have that serious and looping
Flashback Concepts to Enhance Adaptation
00:10:01
Speaker
content. Yes. um And that they need to know this full story and Snape as always just meddles and ruins everything.
00:10:12
Speaker
And so they just get him out of the picture. um But like combining our two thoughts here, Snape and flashbacks, um because they tell the story. I can't remember if it's in this chapter or the last chapter when they're giving all of the history.
00:10:30
Speaker
um But the last chapter. Seeing Snape following Lupin into the shrinking shack when they were kids or the prank that they were playing on and James stops.
00:10:47
Speaker
him from going but he sees Lupin. um I think just um having that all fleshed out you know what it would be really cool actually and maybe I should save this for our episode breakdown but I'm gonna say it now. um You know how I sometimes shows. Well, one episode will end with kind of a clip cliffhanger. And then the next episode is either another character storyline or a flashback. And then the whole episode is kind of filling in some missing spots. And then the next episode we go back to the main storyline. I think something like that when we enter the Shrinking Shack, and Ron is like,
00:11:28
Speaker
It's not a dog, it's Sirius Black. And that's the end of the episode. like we see We know that Sirius Black is in the Shrieking Shack with them. And then the next episode is all of the history of who the Marauders are, all of the history with Voldemort's attack, although it doesn't explain Sirius' side of the story. It's more it's more ambiguous and doesn't It doesn't give you any facts Really like I'm trying it. Are you following me? Like we it could yeah Like i mean you see serious you see serious at the house destroyed, but you don't see him Like ha ha I I win or you and you don't see him
00:12:18
Speaker
devastated that his best friends are murdered either. You just see him looking at the house, right? But no real emotion on his face. And then you see the confrontation between him and Peter, but there's no dialogue that really gives away who's really the bad guy here.
00:12:37
Speaker
So we just get this history, very ambiguous. And then we get to the next episode, back in the Shrieking Shack, Loop income, Snape comes, we get all of the dialogue. Not as much as we have in the book, because of course the book is telling the story, but we've already seen that in the previous episode. So kind of cutting some of this dialogue out, but explaining the perspectives now and getting the truth. I love that idea.
00:13:07
Speaker
I think I can run with that idea a little bit. I'd like to expand on that more. Expand the way. I want to expand that. Do you need to think on it? Yeah, I need to think on it. But I love the concept, and I feel like it could work if it was done correctly. But the idea feels intriguing, because it's revealing the mystery of the story hu um without get like without blatantly telling us like the the the thing is still giving us time to figure it all out and for Harry to figure it all out and stuff like that. So I like that. I think the Acolyte was like the most recent show I've watched that did that a little bit. I don't necessarily think it did it too
00:14:04
Speaker
too well. um I feel like they drew it out a little bit more than it needed to be. um But the concept and the idea is there and I like that concept and idea so I appreciate what they were doing but I don't think that they did it. It wasn't in consecutive episodes like I think you're wanting it to be, which I think would be way better.
00:14:28
Speaker
I think they had like two big flashback episodes, right? Yeah, they did the first flashback episode based off of the girl's perspective. but Right. And then they did it like four episodes later, the Jedi Master's perspective. Right. And it just, it came out of nowhere and I was like, that would have been cooler if we had come back to it like right after kind of scenario. So like maybe if the two episodes were combined I don't know. I could go on and on about the outline. The point is, is like I think it would work as long as it's, like you're saying, before and after kind of scenario. like It's a consecutive thing that's, a it detours, but then it comes straight back to the main story and it doesn't take away too much kind of scenario.
00:15:19
Speaker
And it could not even be a whole episode of flashbacks. It could be like half an hour of flashbacks and then half an hour back in the Shrieking Shack, depending on how much content they really have um or how much you want to right how much they want to show us in flashbacks and how much they want to tell us in the dialogue at the Shrieking Shack. But I think it could be a really cool, like we're on the edge of our seats because we were like we, Sirius Black is now here with Harry and then we have all of this.
00:15:51
Speaker
um, context being explained on screen. Um, and then we can like fast forward and even, um, sorry, I'm just getting really excited about my idea here. Um, we even see Sirius seeing the newspaper in Azkaban and like it zeros in on Harry instead of scabbers. But then when we're back in the shrinking shack, we can flash back to it real quick and zero in on scabbers instead of Harry. I do love Harry isn't in the newspaper. You're right. um How does he do it? um Because we're we're led to believe the he's that Hogwarts was about Harry. Did we not know that it was the newspaper? but he he he's He was sleep talking.
00:16:37
Speaker
Right. The people were saying that he slept talk, and he was like, he's at Hogwarts, he's at Hogwarts. Well, I guess then the the the connection, because i i see I think I see where you're going with that. And I do really like when a show or a movie does a flashback and gives you a different perspective when you understand the other side of the story. And so maybe it can be you know they show Sirius muttering, he's at Hogwarts in his sleep. And we see that early on.
00:17:05
Speaker
And we see the conversation, whoever has with Harry saying he's at Hogwarts or Harry overhears that, right? He overhears Dumbledore. Was it when he overhears Dumbledore? Yeah, Fudge and everybody at the at the um Oh, at the the bar. the first backgroundroom mistake yes we We're Harry Potter fans. um And so it can be a flashback maybe to him overhearing that and then
00:17:37
Speaker
like, it can go to the Daily Prophet picture, zooming in on scabbers, and then the text of the Daily Prophet that says he's returning back to um to Hogwarts or some other families returning back to Hogwarts, whatever, whatever that connection would, or however he sees that, like that could be that connection between the he's at Hogwarts and how they like have it at the beginning and at the end. Yeah.
00:18:05
Speaker
I love the idea of this being a flashback heavy episode. I think that, I just think that it like lends so much more to the story and the character arcs when um movies and TV shows do that. Or books too. yeah well and it does is to throwback They always say, show us, don't tell us. And this chapter is very much a tell us chapter, which is fine for a book. um But it's not going to it's not going to translate well to the screen. So um as I was listening to this chapter today, I was thinking about like going back and forth between the flashbacks and the Shrieking Shack. But I just couldn't see that in my head working well. So that's how I got to the
00:18:47
Speaker
um and on a cliffhanger with Sirius Black appearing and then having this whole flashback, either half episode or full episode, whatever it is, and then coming back to the Shrieking Shack and telling telling the story in us in in less words than in the chapter, but I really like think that- Less of a dialogue where, because it yeah it's really it has to be really crafted in a book because there are those limitations on what you can what you can do. And so i I agree. Sorry, my dog is barking in the background. I apologize if that's coming through my microphone. um And so I agree that having that um having them be able to show us like they're going to be able to do that so much better, which is rare, they're going to be able to do that better than what the book is capable of doing, as long as they actually
00:19:35
Speaker
come up with a creative way to do that yeah because if they just have like Sirius and Lupin telling the story that's really boring like that's just the easy way and the boring way to go about it so if they actually and it's just like if yeah they if if they do that if it's just these two having a conversation and telling the trio the story you're right it's so boring you can't just have You can't just have this is going to be a full episode's worth of content between ah the whole between these three chapters, right? um Everything, all of this information that we're getting in the Shrieking Shack, you can't just have the characters telling us like you can in the book. um So there's gonna have to be, I think, some sort of flashback or some sort of more visual storytelling tactic.
00:20:27
Speaker
All right, here's my two cents. I've had time to think about it. and I think we can end our tangent out after this, but this is how I feel like it needs to happen if it's gonna happen. And I mean, i if somebody thinks of a better idea, they can they can claim it and go with it, whatever. The writers- The listeners write in. The writers need to come to me and go, I wanna use your idea for this episode because now I'm claiming it as mine.
00:20:55
Speaker
Anyways, so we we we have the whole episode happen beforehand and Ron gets taken by by the gram into the tree. Crookshanks comes in, saves the day, the tree stops, they go in, they're trying to follow him, yada, yada, yada. They run into the shrieking shack, they're just like, what is this? And then they find Ron, and Ron's like, it's not a dog, it's not a dog, it's Sirius Black. And the Harry and Hermione turnaround, the door shuts, kind of like the movie, and then Sirius Black just appears from behind all the raggedy clothes. Episode ends.
00:21:29
Speaker
ah huh And then the net everyone's like, oh no, Cliffhanger, what's going to happen? like he's like He's a murderer. he's gonna They're going to have to confront him. How dare they cut the episode off right here?
00:21:41
Speaker
um But then the ah the next episode starts off dark black night going into Hogwarts. like that We are seeing the Hogwarts grounds. We see the castle in this full view. It's nighttime.
00:21:58
Speaker
we we're making the viewers think it's still present day but it's not present day and we go in and we zoom into the Whomping Willow and instead of the trio we find a a group of four people instead of, no, sorry. We're gonna do the trio, but it's gonna be a different trio than we then then were originally thinking. It's gonna be James Potter, Sirius Black, and Peter Pettigrew. And they're walking up to the Whomping Willow and it's ah doing its little thing, and it's younger. You can tell that it's different. Viewers are like, what the heck is happening? And then Peter Pettigrew transforms into... The rat.
00:22:48
Speaker
I think I blew myself up. I don't think we can show them being animatoguses yet. I don't know. Yes because we already do it in the last chapter. But like if this is the flashback episode it'd be I think it's fine. Keep going. Keep going. I think it's fine to have Peter turn into a rat. Okay. Peter turns into the rat. He runs over. He hits the knob. The things stop. Sirius and James and Peter go into the tunnel. They transform into their animagus forms. And then they meet Lupin, who's in his werewolf garb.
00:23:25
Speaker
Basically he's just like he's a war wolf now like you could just take it off. the Form his werewolf form. form where I can't function. rate um But they ba they're basically doing their own little thing and they.
00:23:42
Speaker
time passes on and they we see just animals playing with a werewolf and they're like exploring the Forbidden Forest. pass it we We obviously now have cemented that they're not Harry, Ron, and Hermione, so now day comes by, they're in past Hogwarts, they're talking and discussing Maybe we show Snape being pranked, right? And then Sirius pranks Snape because Snape's trying to be like all suspicious or whatever and trying to figure out what they're what they're doing. um Time passes.
00:24:20
Speaker
uh after that and then we get you know them all all four of them with Lily and and Harry eating at like a little dinner that they've all put together and they're all having fun and um serious talks to James about necessarily maybe being like the secret keeper um kind of scenario and talking about like how Voldemort's after their family And Sirius is like, yeah, sure. And then we see the house blow up. um And we we know that story because that flashback happened like two seasons ago. Wait, time out. yeah I also, um this would be a really good time to show some sort of tension between Sirius and Lupin because they both think each other. Yes, definitely.
00:25:09
Speaker
Yeah, they both think each other is a traitor now. Nobody's thinking it's Peter at this point. So some sort of tension between those two. Somehow. We don't know what that could be. Yeah, the media series and James are talking about it and then Sirius and James end their conversation and Sirius runs into Lupin, who's about to leave. And Lupin's like, what were you two talking about? And Sirius was like, nothing.
00:25:30
Speaker
nothing of your concern at the moment so like kind of scenario you know something like that ah yeah yeah the same scene but then we transform over to the house blowing up and serious arrives and he's he's frantically looking for something Let's have him frantically looking for something. We don't necessarily know what he's looking for. Cuz it could be he's frantically looking for Voldemort or he's frantically looking for Harry. Exactly. Love it. He's looking for something. Hagrid shows up and- Yes, that's right. Hagrid's talking to Sirius and Sirius is like, blah, blah, blah, blah, here, take my motorbike. He wants to get out of here. Well, and the whole conversation about him trying to take Harry.
00:26:17
Speaker
We can see that because we still don't know, because we still think that's him trying to get him to throw him out in the middle of motion. He put him up, Hagrid shows up, and Hagrid's like, here, give me the baby. And he's like, no, maybe I want to take him. like we We still kind of get that maybe feeling that maybe he's a good guy, maybe he's not a good guy. The more I'm thinking of it, or like listening to you explain this, the more I think it could still be a full episode.
00:26:41
Speaker
Yeah, and then he he's like he he reluctantly gives up and he's like, hey, take my motorbike. Don't worry about it. And then he flies off. he's He's distraught. He's sad. He's grungy. He's been looking for someone for days. Is it the same day or is it days? I think it's the same day, but we could we could change it to be days. I don't know. This is just me spitballing here. The point is is he's been he's tired. he's He's emotional. Something's been bothering him. We haven't been told what. Peter Pettigrew shows up.
00:27:20
Speaker
and is cornered in the... at like Peter Pettigrew sees Black, runs, Black chases him in the alleyway, they maybe do a couple spells of Vadul, and Pettigrew just like begs for his life. Doesn't say why Sirius says, how dare you?
00:27:42
Speaker
Um, and I'm going to kill you. Well, it has it can't be that it can't be, it can't be serious chasing Peter. It has to just be like a confrontation because we still think Peter Pettigrew confronted serious at this point in time.
00:28:01
Speaker
So it just needs to be, it can't be a chase scene. It just needs to be, it can later once that all has been revealed. But in this flashback, before we get Sirius' side, it still needs to be ambiguous. And so it just needs to be the two of them facing off, one's pointed at each other, um some sort of dialogue, but still very much like,
00:28:22
Speaker
um okay so chase scene comes later but the point is is like there's a confrontation they're doing a like it it just shifts into them dueling right and so they're dueling and Sirius says very ambiguous things like I hate you and you're going to die for what you did and or something to that nature where it doesn't reveal too much but it's also revealing a little bit where maybe you can maybe connect the dots beforehand but not necessarily too much where it's like on the nose kind of scenario I don't necessarily know somebody can come up with the words not me
00:29:01
Speaker
Um, but then there's a big explosion. People are dying. It's all like, like the the ringing noise and ah serious just looks at the spot and it's like, maybe they both send a spell at the same time. Right? Big explosion. There's nothing left but a finger. And he starts laughing because he feels like he won. And then that's the end of the episode.
00:29:31
Speaker
Uh-huh. Or if if we want, we can go into Ask Man. But I don't think we need to, because I think that's an epic enough ending right there that it can bring us back into a day where we're kind of like serious as a madman. Like,
Emotional Depth in Harry Potter: Adult Perspectives
00:29:47
Speaker
holy crap. yeah like He just blew somebody up. And now he's got three kids in front of him. And then that's when we start figuring out what's actually going on. I like it ending where you said the bigot like him laughing maniacally and Auror's coming in on him and arresting him um and then it like zooms in on his face and then zooms back out back at the Shrinking Shack. I like that a lot. I still think it could be it.
00:30:15
Speaker
i um full episode, but that's a really great segue if it is only half an episode. It's a really great way like zooming in on his face and then zooming back out.
00:30:26
Speaker
12, 13 years later with him at the Shrinking Shack and then go into his side of the story. Or like that whole, but not even his side of the story, but that discussion that they're like, you killed my parents, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. He's like, no, listen to me. There's still a little bit more stuff that they can probably pepper in. Maybe there's a few things when they were kids. I don't know.
00:30:48
Speaker
um But generally I think you're right, like this could be an entire episode in of itself and it gives us the perspective of the marauders and we get to see James and Lily and just a whole different perspective of things that were talked about, but now we're seeing it for the first time unfold and like it's still ambiguous enough that we're not getting the entire picture, but we're maybe getting an unlike.
00:31:15
Speaker
were getting an uncut uncouth version of like oh crap like this guy could be very bad news if people still believe that Sirius Black is a bad guy. Well and it would be great also because you know we know the real story so us seeing it from that lens but then
00:31:37
Speaker
the new audience that's coming in to watch this show for the first time, never seen Harry Potter and and like like seeing all of the discussion online about it is gonna be a lot of fun. But Meeks, you were pretty quiet um and i was I was too excited to just let James talk and I kept cut again. So what are your thoughts on this? No, I mean, I honestly, I just, I was like happy to listen to both of you share your ideas. Cause I think that that's all great. Like love the ideas of,
00:32:04
Speaker
like I can't wait for people who just like what you just said who have not been exposed to Harry Potter before and to live this um reveal yeah the way that we did but be able to have a TV show hopefully that will be able to make it even um more intense and stronger because you're seeing it, not just reading it. So I'm really excited to see what they come up with because I think a TV show is just the way to go with putting this onto a screen, you know, as we've said one million times. And it's not just like the the new people who are getting to watch it. Like this is brand new points of view for the people who know the story. And it's just like,
00:32:52
Speaker
that would be way more interesting to see serious black perspective in a kind of here say here that kind of viewpoint because we don't really get that in the movie like we get that in the books i mean we but seeing it versus reading it is a completely different experience and having that happen is i think for us in of itself would just be an epic little point of storytelling and it's new and it's not being ah redone and it's one of those things where it's just like you're telling the same story but from a different lens and it makes it that much more enjoyable for people who
00:33:33
Speaker
are already experienced in what's going on kind of scenario. Cause then we can go like Hagrid and Sirius and little baby Harry. Like, oh, that's so cute. But like we're yeah seeing it like like in a whole different view that we've never got to see it in the movies. Like we only got to see it in our imaginations and now it's being played out.
00:33:52
Speaker
Right, and I think we've talked in in the past about wanting to see the flashback of Hagrid coming to the house and talking to Sirius and all of that, and like wanting to see that. And so you know whether we get that in the first season or not when Hagrid is telling that story, um if if we do, bringing it back and seeing it again and seeing that conversation, now knowing Sirius is supposed to be a murderer,
00:34:19
Speaker
Um, and then having it revealed that he isn't and just like seeing like just all the different perspectives. Cause that's now three different perspectives we've got, you know, cause we have the original when Hager doesn't know yet that he's a murderer and it was just serious black. And then years later, we do have the perspective that he's a murderer. And then again, we have it. No, I'm not a murderer. I really wanted to protect you, blah, blah, blah. Yeah.
00:34:48
Speaker
And that's the good thing about having the same, sorry, showrunners and like what I've said before about it being a show is that we can recycle content like that, unlike we can when we have multiple directors and and and um producers behind the films. Yep.
00:35:07
Speaker
Okay, I'm done talking for a while. No, this is all great stuff. I'm just really excited to see what they do with it and for for so many reasons it's, I think, gonna be a lot better. um So, okay yeah.
00:35:23
Speaker
i ah yeah I am interested in how you two, after going through this book and going through this adaptation slowly, I feel like all of us have already had some perspective changes ah that we were not expecting when we started this. I feel like we all are thinking a little bit differently than we've always thought about the adaptation or about Harry Potter in general.
00:35:50
Speaker
And one thing that I realized recently is that I don't like the adaptation of Sirius as much as I thought that I did. And that makes me sad because I do overall think that, um what's his name? Not Gary Oldman. It is Gary Oldman, okay. who's You are so funny with your actor's names. I don't know why i I always am like so dumb about it. Who plays Lupin?
00:36:19
Speaker
Oh, I'd never remember that. Okay. Well, i' pull up sometimes we all don't remember things. Anyways, Gary Oldman, obviously, much like Alan Rickman, David through this. Yes, that's right. Thank you. um Gary Oldman, of course, did a fantastic job with what he was given. I think that he didn't he doesn't look the way that I had imagined Sirius to look and I think that a lot of people would agree with that but I think that the writing for Sirius just like the writing well and also Alan Rickman like he's lovely and wonderful and charming and a fantastic actor and he has gravitas but
00:37:05
Speaker
He was not the right adaptation for Snape if they were going to be super book accurate. like That's just not Alan Rickman. But the writing for these characters is not um as accurate as it could be in order to like really portray these characters in ah in an accurate adaptation.
00:37:27
Speaker
I think a main portion of that is is the ages. um everybody was age well all the like All these adults, the main you know the Marauder generation was all aged up because of Alan Rickman's casting. I think first and foremost having the age-accurate cast is going to help a lot because You grow so much from being in your 20s, 30s, 40s, you know, like you're you're a different person all those years later. So.
00:37:59
Speaker
um You're and like even like you're like your manorums and like the actors are just going to be different when you have a 40, 50 year old playing a character than the books that's supposed to be in their 30s. Yeah.
00:38:17
Speaker
But yes, I agree with you. that's I think that might be the one thing, like the the biggest thing I'm looking forward to is more accurate casting and portrayals of the characters.
Discussing Plot Holes and World-Building
00:38:32
Speaker
Agreed.
00:38:35
Speaker
i I'm very interested to see how they handle the transformation of Pettigrew from rat to person again. Uh, cause I th- when it comes to character reveals, uh, Peter Pettigrew's reveal like into the series was just pretty epic. Just all of a sudden just this rat running around and then jumps and then gets hit by the spell and just immediately transforms into a person and then like just gets thrown into this hole in the wall and is just like, ah, I'm stuck. Uh,
00:39:15
Speaker
you know and there's so many gripes so about the movies that i have i think that that's the one gripe i don't have is like peter pedigrew deformation you can tell he's been a rat for multiple years he's kind of just like got those mannerisms because he's been a rat for so many years timothy spalding i think his name is i can't remember i i believe it's timothy but um he He just does a really good job of incorporating the character after being a rat for 12 years and just having all of that, you know, the makeup was done well and his like his acting was doing well and i was just like out of the entire thing I think that was probably the most impressive part.
00:40:07
Speaker
and just Uh, you know, if they do something similar to that in the TV show, I wouldn't mind, um, because just having the rat there and then just transforming it in the middle of the room doesn't seem quite as cool of a reveal. Um, but if anything, I think that's, that was done well. Yes. And the actor's name is Timothy small. Um, and I agree with you. I think, ah well, it's actually my piece pleasure is the Peter Pettigrew transformation.
00:40:40
Speaker
Spoiler alert. Yeah, his that adaptation was really, really good. um I also, we talked earlier about flashbacks and stuff. I really like how in the book there was a callback to the newspaper article. So I know that we obviously had a much bigger discussion about that, but that's something I wrote down in my notes is that um there's a lot of callbacks in general in these books like throughout the whole series and so i I like when little details like that are brought back like when you first read it and you just see the daily profit picture about the Weasley family you don't think that that would be a key feature for like the big reveal later on in the book so I like that there was that little callback.
00:41:34
Speaker
Does anybody have any other notes?
00:41:40
Speaker
This chapter now.
00:41:44
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, overall, I think there wasn't too much. I mean, I guess there is thinking back on it, but there wasn't too much for me to say. like the The adaptation was fine. It's just hard for me to separate these three chapters from each other. And I think that's why a majority of our conversation was more of like the flashback portion of the you know the the hill history and the explanation of everything that's happened. So it'll be really interesting to see how these three chapters are turned into episodes. I do and have a question. Have they answered this at any point? And I just missed it. How do Dementors communicate with humans? Because there's a couple times where it's like, the Dementors say this, and it's like, what does that mean? How did they do it? Dementors can understand human language and language and follow commands. They will do as
00:42:40
Speaker
They will do so as long as they feel the course of action will allow them to eat more souls. That was somebody from Reddit, apparently. So yeah, on the Reddit, they're just basically saying um they assumed there were also guards like human guards or wardens or something like that that were also at the prison that that's who told fudge blacks been talking in his sleep.
00:43:10
Speaker
Yeah that would make sense because um I mean I know that non-human creatures obviously there's ways that they communicate and stuff but I just have never seen anything about how Dementors are able to potentially communicate with humans but I thought that there was something in one of the books that somebody said that they, I don't know, the Dementors talked with them. Like I thought Dementor or ah Dumbledore did at one point. Somebody just said magic. that's how So I'm the Harry Potter wiki, which I mean, may not necessarily be to take it with a grain of salt. Yeah. But I mean, there's references here that we can kind of maybe delve into later.
00:43:56
Speaker
But it says here that their sapience was heavily debated. They were sentient enough to taste and sense fear, being drawn to it in the promise of positive memories that it could feed off of. They were also intelligent enough to bargain. They obeyed the British Ministry of Magic for years because in guarding Azkaban, they were provided with the sustenance of any remaining hope or happiness in the prisoners.
00:44:20
Speaker
They could understand and follow at least simple instructions which allowed Dementors to act as a bodyguard to the Minister for Magic Cornelius Fudge in 1995 to bury dead prisoners in the prison grounds and to escort prisoners in and out of muggle-born registration commission courtrooms in 1997.
00:44:40
Speaker
They could also communicate what they had heard Sirius Black saying in his sleep to the Ministry in 1993 and comment on his less human, less complex state of mind in his animagus form, implying that they could speak or otherwise communicate with Wizards.
00:45:00
Speaker
On the other hand, Abba's Dumbledore described Dementors as savage creatures unable to differentiate between who they pursued and who stood in their way. He also informed the students to give Dementors no reason to harm them, saying that forgiveness and mercy were not in the nature of Dementor, and despite their having many bargains with humans, first with the Ministry of Magic, then with Voldemort. They seem to have had difficult keeping these bargains in mind, as shown when upon the stunning of Umbridge by Harry, the dementors in the room immediately abandoned restraint and attempted to kiss Mary Cattermole. Apparently, had heedless of possible retaliations were repercussions from the wizards. Moreover, they have no soul of their own." So, I mean... a
00:45:47
Speaker
I mean, I guess it's kind of just what you want to make of it. I guess theres they're, they're, they're sentient enough that they can communicate how they, how they do that exactly is unknown. I wish JKR had more thought out notes before fleshing out the books. Um, like token did, I mean, I feel like, um,
00:46:16
Speaker
Tolkien had everything thought out. There's no sort of plot holes. Not that this is necessarily a plot hole, but it's definitely a question. Like, how do they communicate? There's no answer for that. And Tolkien had an answer for almost everything. And, you know, I mean, that's what I mean.
00:46:32
Speaker
She's so successful. Harry Potter is so successful, but there's definitely lots of discussions like this, like these little tiny little plot holes. So it doesn't take away too much from the story. Like we still have an excellent story, but there are still a lot of these questions and hopefully the show can kind of fill in some of these gaps that she left. Or maybe, I mean, she's an executive producer, so maybe she can fill in her own gaps. True. I mean, yeah.
00:46:59
Speaker
Or it's just magic. Or it's just magic, I mean. But again, that's like, there's there's rules, you know? and And I think even like her, I think she contradicts herself along the series. And again, like Tolkien had his rules laid out, like he knew the rules. So even like, yes, you can say it's magic, but define you the magic of your world. Yeah, he he has notes upon notes upon notes about It's amazing. It's worked in his world. But I mean, I guess that just differentiates the two of them be from being, you know, a spectacular offer versus a legendary offer author, like just the amount of work that they put into it kind of scenario. But I mean, they put a lot of work into it equally, I think, but like he did way more to flesh out the world.
00:47:58
Speaker
in areas that she didn't consider, I would imagine. I don't think they did equal work. I mean, because it's clear he has way more notes, but they have they probably have an equal passion, let's say. and that's what i Yeah. Yeah. Good save. Like I said, words aren't coming to me today. But that's definitely, I think, more of what I was trying to say than network. Right.
00:48:26
Speaker
um Anybody else have anything to say? I didn't have very many notes because there wasn't much that was like that.
Character Transformations and Adaptation Details
00:48:38
Speaker
One of my other notes that I did have, which we've already pretty much covered is the conversation in this chapter in the book, there's just so much more of a of an explanation of how Peter Pettigrew and his actions like really has so much more to do with the whole plot line of the entire series. And in the films, we just don't really get very much of that whether they were like, oh, well, we don't really know what's gonna happen at the end. Although, we did they when they were filming this? No.
00:49:14
Speaker
um
00:49:17
Speaker
So, Maybe they just thought that, you know, once again that stuff wasn't very important or what but I mean you just get much more of a sense of how, how important every little thing that Wormtail did how much that, you know, has to do with Voldemort and the the larger plot.
00:49:38
Speaker
Sorry, Sarah Day, I watched you yawn and then it made me yawn. I'm so sorry for listeners. yeah I mean, you should know by now, I'm on the, I'm um about three hours ahead of these two. So it's always usually later for me. Plus I'm feeling sick again. So I'm like practically halfway to bed already. So my apologies. All right. um James, what was your peeve's pleasure?
00:50:07
Speaker
um My peeve's pleasure for this adaptation is most likely going to be Peter Pettigrew transforming from rat to person and then just how really well he integrated and made the character in his own and just the voice he used and just like the the begging and the the the fear and just all of it put together was just made it made it kind of kind of like oh like ah get this guy off of me and like wow that's kind of pathetic like there's no sympathy for the guy uh which means they did their job really well kind of scenario um so yeah
00:51:01
Speaker
Yeah, I put the Peter Guru transformation as well. I thought it was just a really great CGI for the times and just really, really well done. Same. since All right. James, what was your peeves peeve? My peeves peeve.
00:51:28
Speaker
Um. Ron not being in enough pain? I don't know. I i don't have a peeve either. Like I think we just this again, for me, it's just there's not. I feel like these three chapters are so intertwined. This portion of the film is so intertwined. It's hard to like separate and really have a complaint about this particular chapter.
00:51:56
Speaker
Well, and just not not only that, but like I feel like the adaptation for what it did at the time did a really good job. And I know what I want more from the TV show, how they can go in and change what the movie did and like expound upon it and grow upon it. um I have no complaints against the acting from any of the actors. I think the kids did really well.
00:52:23
Speaker
uh regarding how young they are and like in the situation of of being in the presence of Alan Rickman and Gary Oldman uh David Thewlis and Timothy Spall and just like all these cat actors that are like getting to like that they've probably heard of and they're just like, oh cool, this is like, I get to work with them kind of scenario. Anyways, like they did all good and then like this, the Shrieking Shack was good and what we got out of this book was good. And so it's kind of just hard to be like nitpicky in my opinion about what I didn't like when it's probably one of the better parts of the movie.
00:53:08
Speaker
In all honesty, compared to the rest of the movie, it's probably the best part.
00:53:18
Speaker
which Which... The bar's kinda low. Don't say that, me! Come on! But, like, i yeah, I don't know. It's just... like I guess Ron... Compared to the book, Ron wasn't acting as hurt about his leg like you could have so short. That could be like my piece. But like that's, you gotta understand how we're reaching that. Yeah, no, no, no, I do.
00:53:53
Speaker
Saturday, what's your peeps? Yeah, I don't have, I don't, yeah, I didn't write anything down. I don't really have many complaints about this chapter. Because we loved it.
00:54:07
Speaker
really mean it was finem just kidding um I agree, James, Ron's leg, I have written that down a lot of times in my notes. Like, why is Ron not in pain?
00:54:22
Speaker
and in the book or in the movie they have him like clutch his leg once and then he and then that's somebody hurt hit hits it right it's like more of a comedic effect yeah and it's like his leg is broken i'm sorry but maybe maybe he's one of those people that doesn't really feel pain because i know that people like that exist but something tells me that's not true and if he had a broken leg it would be
00:54:51
Speaker
It's just like strange to me that they would turn the whole Whomping Willow scene into a Roadrunner cartoon and then you have somebody with a broken leg that has to sit there for hours and they wouldn't turn that into like a cartoon thing. So um I think it's It's really weird to me too. So you know what? I'm changing my peeve to that. My peeve was that the writing felt flat, that, you know, just was like the actors, I agree with what has been said before. Like the actors, they did such a good job with the tools that they were given. However, the whole adaptation is a great tool. It's like WTF is happening. So yeah, my peeve is Ron's leg.
00:55:37
Speaker
Yeah. All right. We're all two for two. Yeah. yeah yeah It's insane. I'm glad I can set the trend. And I think the part that you were thinking of as Dumbledore coming up to the hospital bed. Oh, yeah. like yeah right Which is like kind of funny, but also like,
00:56:01
Speaker
I don't know. It just feels like no, who would actually do that? I don't i feel like din I don't know. I don't think I think he's too smart for that. It was just a comedic effect. Yeah, it just didn't land.
00:56:16
Speaker
michael they didn't um baldor would do that Did he play Dumbledore? Yeah, Michael. I'm doing a callback. I know you are. Everybody. Get another joke in this film that did not land. really me
00:56:35
Speaker
Okay. Oh, you know what this also made me think about the whole Ron's leg situation. I am shocked at how much people in the Wizarding World don't know basic medical stuff. like and Not that they have to be perfect at repairing bones, but wouldn't you think that if they have magic that they would be able to learn some like basic basic magic medical care healer stuff? i mean yeah Well, i mean like we know if you're bleeding, you know get it like if you have a paper cut, put a band-aid on it.
00:57:08
Speaker
Yeah. And then like, Ron's like, you know that if there's like a splint or something, like you need to put a splint or something on like a broken like, not that I ever want to do that. However,
00:57:19
Speaker
what I do or what I have done in the very numerous times that I've been in gymnastics and seen people break bones, I corral all the kids so away while the adults deal with the situation. But you call for help or something. And I just feel like I know that this is I know that this is like a different type of situation and they're in the shrieking shack and whatever. But I'm like, I just feel like if If a child and you're a teacher, like Lupin, one of your students who is 13 years old has a broken leg and you're not going to react at all. Doesn't that just seem weird, but I guess that's Hogwarts for you. Are you talking about the adaptation or are you talking about the book? Both!
00:58:05
Speaker
Well because in the book he he's outed as a werewolf before he can react to Ron's pain. Oh that's right and then Ron is like don't touch me werewolf. Ron is like don't come close to me werewolf because Hermione was like he's a werewolf he's working with Sirius. That's right I forgot about that okay and then you know what Ron deserves to be in pain if he's going to be bigoted like that so I've changed my tune.
00:58:26
Speaker
totally but in the movie like yeah i they kind of like jump short that but that's because he's not really they're not really focusing on his broken leg they kind of just his broken legs in the background and it's just not it it's not being addressed and it's not That's awful. It's not being acted out by Rupert Grint enough to be like, it's not being focused. And so therefore it's just not necessarily something to be considered about. But like I do note that, yeah, in the book, he he does try, but Ron said no, because he was scared, and didn't necessarily know what
Storytelling Potential in Harry Potter Adaptations
00:59:09
Speaker
to do. But then after everything's calmed down, Lupin then goes in, tends to it, and he's like, I can't
00:59:15
Speaker
fixed bones like Madame Pomfrey does, but I can at least put it in a splint and he puts it into a splint kind of scenario. So he think does remind himself a little bit. Yes. Thank you for that reminder. I had forgotten that.
00:59:28
Speaker
Which means like he does know a little bit of healing magic, which I do want to recall that Madame Pomfrey praised Lupin for knowing healing magic because he gave chocolates to Harry after the Dementor attack. And Madame Pomfrey was like, Oh, a teacher that actually knows what he's talking about. like I think she specifically said defense teacher too, right? Yeah, so Madame Pomfrey praised Lupin's healing abilities is just a little bit.
01:00:02
Speaker
All right. um Where are we? Oh, Salutes! James, what's your salute? ah Dang. I mean, now that we went through the entire process, I think my salute has to be the episode we just came up with that the writers are gonna go in a couple of years ago. Oh yeah, these guys totally read out like this flashback episode and we got to give them credit. So let's email them and let them know that we want to use their idea. So I have to salute that because that was just epic storytelling right there. I mean, you should give all of the houses the points for that. Totally. All the houses get points for that. I didn't really contribute anything. So I'm going to be honest and not give myself any points. How many points are we talking?
01:00:51
Speaker
three? just Okay, three each. Yeah, three each. But seriously, I think I'm moderating just so just saluting the now I feel left out.
01:01:06
Speaker
so james continue ah Just saluting the entire idea of like that that whole storyline. I know I went into this like the last ah chapter analysis episode that we did, but just
01:01:21
Speaker
There's so much potential for this to be groundbreakingly um intense and awesome and so much more. and it i mean Even though I want them to use my idea, they're probably going to come up with something equally good and equally as yeah like awesome and I'm not really going to be disappointed because it's they included it. like fact like If they just don't include it at all and they skip this entire thing and we don't get like any semblance of a reveal of who Sirius Black was in the past and Lupin and all that other stuff, like I'm gonna be boycotting the entire thing because like you had one job.
01:02:01
Speaker
yeah You can't look at the source material and go, we don't need this, and move on. yeah it's just It's too epic of a ah reveal. And if it's done right, you are going to have cinema. That's what you have. And so if you don't do it right, you're gonna just like you're shooting yourselves in the foot. So I have to salute that. We have a pretty good team behind the camera. So I feel confident that they're going to even whether they take our idea or not, they're going to come up with a really great way to portray these chapters in the whole series really. Totally.
01:02:41
Speaker
But my salute um is the reunion between Sirius and Lupin when they when everything is out in the open and they realize that they were loyal to James and they, you know, embrace. And again, this book, the emotions are just hitting me different than they did back in the day. And I'm really actually paying attention to what's happening instead of when I'm listening to go to sleep.
01:03:05
Speaker
And I really can't wait to see all of these emotions come out on the screen. I think that, well, I hope they're gonna, the cast will really nail, especially Lupin. I think all the times I'm talking about a emotion in this book so far has i' always been Lupin. So um another really great moment for Lupin to show a lot of emotion in this scene with Sirius and the relief that Sirius will feel when he finally, like loop in, somebody is on his side and somebody believes him. And then again, you know, it' um
01:03:42
Speaker
um you know ah more relief when the trio finally believes the story they've, you know, brought Pettigrew out to the open. And um I'm just really excited. I'm just this whole, these three chapters, everything that comes out in the Shrieking Shack,
01:03:59
Speaker
portion of the story. I'm just really excited. And I know we're about to get into some really exciting stuff with the time travel and everything too. So um I'm just really, I'm pumped. Let's go. But that's my, the reunion was my Weasley salute tonight.
01:04:15
Speaker
Um, it'll, it's, I can imagine it's really interesting to, for you to, to be parents and now be like slowly going through these books with the lens of having children. Um, I don't have that.
Harry's Emotional Journey and Character Growth
01:04:28
Speaker
So, but I'm an adult, you know, and so I think that it would be really interesting if we, um.
01:04:35
Speaker
I don't know, as the emotions keep getting heavier and heavier as the books keep getting more serious, like keep, keep getting more serious. If we ah keep that lens of, you know, what it's like to be an adult, particularly as a parent, um rereading these, you know, through, through a different lens. Well, and how we relate more now with the adult characters instead of the students.
01:05:01
Speaker
yeah i like we would yeah I remember relating to Harry, Ron, and Hermione a lot more than I am now. I remember going through these books and I was like, they know what are these kids thinking? Exactly! I was like, what in the world are you idiots?
01:05:18
Speaker
did it's It's amazing how well JK Rowling is able to write from a kid's perspective and but also include the very adult feelings that adults are going to have in these books and so I can't wait.
01:05:32
Speaker
um to get to the later books when the kids mature a little bit but also there's just more content that happens. That's not just them at the school, you know, more stuff with them. So, I'm excited, excited to see how we feel.
01:05:48
Speaker
um my salute was I do I almost want to copy your Sarah day with the, you know, like the reigniting of the relationship between Lupin and Sirius but I wrote down Harry's emotional roller coaster because I think that that's so ah It's just so heavy what he always has to deal with as a child. um But like going from, it's not just like you know the reveal for Ron and Hermione where they think that this person is a mass murderer and then they find out this story, but they don't have any actual connection with him. like He goes from thinking that this mass murderer is trying to kill him for a whole school year and then finds out that
01:06:35
Speaker
you know that or and then you know early on he finds out that he supposedly killed his parents or was responsible for that and then finds out that everything's different and so like all of the things that he has to feel at that young of an age is so intense and so like to see his transformation that he goes through just in this chapter is so like heartbreaking but also amazing to see him grow.
01:07:03
Speaker
yeah um and it's not No, I know. Not even close. We're in book three. I mean, wait until the next book. No, and but I'm just like, I'm talking about this one, too. Like, his emotional roller coaster is about to go into a very yeah happy white swing where he's going to be very hopeful and very happy towards the future and all this other stuff that we're going to get into in the next couple of chapters. And then it's going to all get to you. I know. That's really sad. Oh. I told you, it's not over yet. This is the beginning for James shutting your mouth.
01:07:39
Speaker
casting a spell. Biggie, you be quiet. I'm sorry. I'm just saying you introduced it. I'm taking the idea more further. Does anybody have anything else about this chapter's adaptation?
Episode Conclusion and Listener Engagement
01:07:53
Speaker
All right. Thank you for crossing havoc with us today. On the next page to screen analysis, we will be discussing chapter 20, The Dementor's Kiss, which is, I'm going to get this right, one hour, 36 minutes and 55 seconds to one hour, 45 minutes and 38 seconds of the film. Oh, we get almost 10 minutes of the film.
01:08:15
Speaker
Wow. Exciting. Sometimes it's 45 seconds.
01:08:21
Speaker
All right, James, where do people find you? You can go on to Instagram or TikTok at James M Beltran and find me there.
01:08:35
Speaker
You can find me Sarah Day on Instagram at Captain dot.McDee. That's M-C-D-E-E. And please pay attention because so I also host fantasy heroes and we would be opening up our registration sometime this fall.
01:08:51
Speaker
moonon a um James will be announcing his nightclub Instagram page on the next episode. You can find me, Meegs, on Instagram, at Megan, M-E-G-A-N, underscore, Lachowski, L-A-C-H-O-W-S-K-I, and from there you can find all of my other projects. And you can follow the podcast on Instagram, at PeevesGabFest, and on YouTube.
01:09:15
Speaker
Iqul Firstis, don't forget to subscribe to the podcast wherever you listen and leave a five-star review. If you have any feedback, leave us a voicemail at 409-422-3378, that's 409GAPFEST, or email us at heavesgapfest at gmail.com. Also, join the discussion in our Facebook group at facebook dot.com slash group slash heavesgapfest. Until next time, Iqul Firstis, bye!
01:09:50
Speaker
yeah idea more for like it is meeting
01:09:58
Speaker
one ven she's got
01:10:04
Speaker
There's lights going everywhere.
01:10:09
Speaker
Wait, write this down so we can have a blooper. James, please leave this in.
01:10:17
Speaker
Uh, I will do something of the sort to my best. Where's the remote to turn off the lights? like Listeners, James house is like a, like a rave nightclub right now. Little mermaid Ariel rave nightclub. There we go. So.
01:10:41
Speaker
so my daughter decided to see her video like her youtube video to the tv which is right above my desk so that's what happened and in the process of doing that my roku remote is also somehow attached to my lights that are on my desk yeah interesting how that all came together hmm So i I went to go turn off the TV, but it when I go and press the power button, it turns on the blinking raving lights every time. but but thing I don't know why ridiculous this thing know why everything like that has to be connected, but there you go. What a coincidence, James, that you have all of those lights and exciting rave things going on.
01:11:37
Speaker
Um, my coincidence is that you obviously crafted this whole thing. Okay. anybody have