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SPC S2 E27 - The Darkwoods Paranormal Podcast
11 Plays1 day ago
Tonight, I have The Darkwood Paranormal podcast with me, Raven Knight and Gabriel Von Graves.
Raven Started by telling me about playing with a Ouija board as a kid, without her mum knowing (She does now), and being haunted by the Dean of a school.
Gabriel then revealed that he dreaded nightfall, and never really felt alone at night, as he kind of saw images and shadow people, until he realised it was visits from his great grandma.
Gabriel goes on to tell me about how a ghost or spirit, saved his life in a boat leaking gas, and how he rudely ghosted a ghost after it said hi.
Raven then tells me how she was able to debunk lights at her first investigation
We discussed people not knowing what Pareidolia is, how Darkwood Paranormal Podcast was born, and the fact Gabriel would throw Raven to Bigfoot to save himself.
And finally we spoke about the different kind of investigators, good and bad, and does Gabriel ever admit that he's got mediumistic skills?
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Transcript
Intro
Introduction and Guest Announcements
00:00:12
Lee Hatfield
Good evening, everybody, and welcome to the latest episode of SEPA Paranormal Chronicles. My name's Lee. How could you forget I'm the good-looking one tonight?
00:00:25
Raven Knight
It's true.
00:00:25
Lee Hatfield
Subtle pause. It's true.
00:00:26
Gabriel Von Graves
Very true.
00:00:27
Lee Hatfield
Tonight, I have got Darkwood's Paranormal podcast together. That is Raven Knight. That's the one with the beard. No, no, it's the other way around. Gabriel Von Graves is the one with the beard. Raven Knight's the one without the beard.
00:00:39
Lee Hatfield
Raven, Gabriel. Welcome. Thank you for joining me.
00:00:43
Gabriel Von Graves
Thank you.
00:00:44
Raven Knight
Yeah. we're super excited to be here actually.
00:00:46
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely.
00:00:47
Raven Knight
yeah
00:00:48
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. So, yeah, somebody's been texting me all day going, I'm really excited about tonight.
00:00:54
Raven Knight
Don't tell all my secrets.
00:00:55
Gabriel Von Graves
What time are we on again? That was the text.
00:00:56
Raven Knight
That's exactly what it was.
00:00:57
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:00:57
Raven Knight
That was, how did you know that?
00:00:58
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, yeah.
00:00:59
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:00:59
Lee Hatfield
It's like, how could you not know what the time is?
00:01:00
Raven Knight
but
00:01:03
Lee Hatfield
Come on.
00:01:04
Raven Knight
I just wanted to make sure it was right. Listen, after some of the days I've been having lately, I was like, listen, let's verify. i want to make sure we are on the right page at the right time.
Time Zone Humor and First Paranormal Experience
00:01:13
Lee Hatfield
But the girl that I released tonight, that I interviewed on Tuesday, she's like the same.
00:01:13
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:01:19
Lee Hatfield
It's like, what is it with you Americans? It's like, what what time like am I coming on your show?
00:01:22
Raven Knight
I can't tell the time.
00:01:26
Raven Knight
You can't tell time.
00:01:26
Lee Hatfield
Anyway.
00:01:26
Gabriel Von Graves
They can't follow directions.
00:01:26
Raven Knight
You can't tell time or do math.
00:01:27
Gabriel Von Graves
That's what that is.
00:01:29
Raven Knight
Math.
00:01:30
Gabriel Von Graves
That's right.
00:01:31
Raven Knight
It's true.
00:01:31
Lee Hatfield
Is that math math with two Fs or with a thing?
00:01:33
Raven Knight
he I can spell.
00:01:34
Gabriel Von Graves
With three.
00:01:35
Raven Knight
I can spell.
00:01:35
Lee Hatfield
Maths.
00:01:36
Raven Knight
Sort of. Most the time.
00:01:38
Lee Hatfield
Okay, kids, so Darkwoods Paranormal Podcast, we're all in the same job, kind of, but before we talk about that, I want to talk about your very first paranormal experiences.
00:01:52
Lee Hatfield
so So, Gabriel, shall we go ladies first?
00:01:56
Gabriel Von Graves
Ladies first.
00:01:58
Lee Hatfield
Okay, you start then.
00:01:58
Raven Knight
Oh, oh boy. Okay. So i love that. I get to go first. i was actually really into the paranormal as as a kid. i I did, and Gabriel always gives me a lot of grief for this, but I was the kid that liked the Ouija boards, that I did that kind of stuff. We, we and I always say, sorry, mom here. We did seances in my parents' house, which may or may not be haunted now. Sorry, mom. All that to be said, that's, that was the stuff I was, I was really interesting, right? And I was really into it.
00:02:31
Raven Knight
But I didn't really have my first experience experience that I would say was an actual paranormal experience. you know, we've had some things that kind of happened that could have or could not have been paranormal. But It was when I was in college. I worked at the college radio station and I worked it that was up on the third floor.
00:02:52
Raven Knight
And to to give you the layout, I was in the newsroom and then there was a kid that was DJing on in the other room. And right between us was a great big window so I could see him. He could see me. I'm doing some work. He's doing some work.
00:03:06
Raven Knight
And it's later in the later in the day, so not not a lot of people are around. you know I pretty much lived at that radio station.
Attributing Paranormal Events to a Deceased Dean
00:03:14
Raven Knight
But he was doing his thing, and all of a sudden, like out of the corner of my eye, i saw somebody that looked like they walked by.
00:03:25
Raven Knight
so you you know you had the door. It looked like they walked by the door. The lights flickered at the same time, and both him and i kind of just like... stopped and looked at each other like we knew something it was weird it was just a really weird thing that happened and we couldn't really figure it out because you go down the hallway and at the end of the hallway is a locked door there's nowhere to go you can't just you know like there was literally nowhere to go so we both kind of looked at each other really strange I got up I went into the other room and we both at the same time said did you see that
00:03:56
Raven Knight
And we couldn't figure out what it was. You know, we were just kind like, that's really weird. But after that, like I said, I lived at that radio station. I would be up there. i think I had five shows or something during the week. Friday nights, instead of going out to the bar, like everybody else, I lived at that station. Like I would leave at like midnight or whatever. So I'd be up doing the late show.
00:04:17
Raven Knight
I'm the only one in the building. And you'd hear footsteps and keys jingling. And when you go to turn, like the mic's off at the end of the night, ready to leave. I turn around, the mic would be back on.
00:04:29
Raven Knight
Just stuff like that started happening. And you definitely just had that feeling that something was in there with you or somebody was in there with you. Same thing, like sometimes if you'd leave, i would, sometimes I'd have other people stop up, of course, like friends would stop up at the station.
00:04:46
Raven Knight
And sometimes if they'd go out to go to the bathroom and they come back, that door would be locked. And I would say, oh, looks like somebody doesn't like you because the door doesn't just lock by itself.
00:04:56
Raven Knight
You know, it it it was just a very interesting experience.
00:04:57
Lee Hatfield
Joe Piazza,
00:05:00
Raven Knight
And so i have to backtrack a little bit, a little bit before any of these activities started happening. at the station, and I never put this together until like way after, you know, years later, we had the dean of students. She was on her way to work one day and she got into a car accident and she died.
00:05:20
Raven Knight
And she actually, her office was on the first floor. And shortly after she died was when we started having experiences up in that, in that radio station.
00:05:29
Lee Hatfield
Wow, that's cool.
00:05:30
Raven Knight
So I was pretty sure, like, I kind of put it together. I'm like, I think it could have been her. That was that was still still there. And the funniest part of it it, it wasn't just me. You know, I had experiences. A lot of other people that were up in that radio station had experiences too. So that was my very first experience.
00:05:51
Lee Hatfield
A couple of points to to to bring to that. yet The fact is that two people saw something.
00:05:57
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
00:05:58
Lee Hatfield
which is always better than just one person seeing it.
00:06:01
Raven Knight
Right.
00:06:02
Lee Hatfield
Because, yeah, oh i saw I saw a cloaked guy walking down the corridor, but if only I saw it, you guys are going to go, right, were you smoking? Were you drinking? yeah Whatever.
00:06:12
Lee Hatfield
that And it's sort like there's less truth in it. But for more than one person to see something, that makes it more factual.
00:06:23
Lee Hatfield
It makes it more more real that multiple people saw something.
00:06:26
Raven Knight
Yeah. Yeah, for sure.
00:06:29
Lee Hatfield
But yet the yeah, it's definitely the Dean. Definitely the Dean.
00:06:33
Raven Knight
It was, and that's, yeah.
00:06:33
Lee Hatfield
100%. hundred percent
00:06:35
Raven Knight
and And it wasn't like a, you know, it wasn't an ominous presence. It was just, you knew something was there and it would mess with the stuff. And sometimes you go, okay, I'm not in the mood tonight. Please just not tonight.
00:06:47
Raven Knight
And it wouldn't do anything. And then, you know, the next time it might, some footsteps, keys, jingling, whatever, you know, and you're, okay, I know you're here. And you just, it was a, it was a presence you knew was there and you just didn't, it wasn't scary or threatening.
00:07:00
Raven Knight
So but it was very interesting.
00:07:01
Lee Hatfield
That's cool.
00:07:02
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:07:03
Lee Hatfield
That's cool.
00:07:03
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:07:04
Lee Hatfield
That's cool. Okay, sir.
00:07:06
Raven Knight
All right.
00:07:07
Lee Hatfield
Over
Childhood Paranormal Experiences and Revelations
00:07:07
Lee Hatfield
to you.
00:07:08
Gabriel Von Graves
Well, mine is a little bit different than Raven's.
00:07:11
Lee Hatfield
Bigfoot.
00:07:11
Gabriel Von Graves
as yeah Well, yeah. No hands. So as a as a young child, i was always i always dreaded nightfall and going to sleep because I never felt truly alone.
00:07:15
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:07:23
Gabriel Von Graves
i always kind of saw images and shadow people. So I used to, I think I was three when this happened, I used to throw the covers over my head because you know if if I couldn't see them, they couldn't see me.
00:07:35
Gabriel Von Graves
But then they started, you know, moving my bed and and things started moving around my room. And I talked to my parents. And of course, you know, they made me go talk to the minister because I was just seeking attention.
00:07:46
Gabriel Von Graves
So i learned to just, you know, hide in my bed, you know, in over time, I didn't sleep much as of of a child because was always scared. a little bit by little bit, my in my bedroom, the closet would start opening up a little bit, a little bit in All a sudden, hands would kind of come around. And then couple months after that, after I started getting a little bit more, you know, I was used to it, this lady would start peeking out of my closet. She had very, very long gray hair, and she was very pleasant to look like. She didn't look that old to me. course, I was a young, and everybody looks old, but she didn't look like a grandma. She just looked like like a mother figure, you know, kind of young.
00:08:26
Gabriel Von Graves
and as time went by, she would sit on my, the foot of my bed and rub my thigh, not in a sexual way, but as like a motherly comforting way. and that used to comfort me. I used to go to sleep and I'd wake up refreshed and, fast forward about, 10 years ago, I was sitting with my mom and we were going through a picture book. of her memories. And this picture, all sudden, she turned a page and I saw this woman. I'm like, that's the woman.
00:08:53
Gabriel Von Graves
And she goes, what? I said, that's the woman i told you as a child would come from my closet. And you guys never believe me. That's her. And I've never met her. And she goes, that's my grandma.
00:09:06
Gabriel Von Graves
So I She lived in that house before my my mom's parents did. And then, you know, of course, we lived in it after my grandparents. So she was there just to comfort me. And ever since then, you know, I still I think everybody still has the fears that they had when they were a child. Right.
00:09:23
Gabriel Von Graves
I don't like nightfall, even though as an investigator, as we all know, everything happens during the day that's going to happen at night. We're just more acceptable for it at night because we're more relaxed in the outside influences are not there.
00:09:34
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:09:37
Gabriel Von Graves
So we're relying on you know things that may or may not be there. Noises sound a little bit louder, that kind of thing. But I've always been able to walk into a room and know if someone passed there.
00:09:50
Raven Knight
Thank you.
00:09:53
Gabriel Von Graves
And, you know, I can feel the presence of death in a room. And that's kind of what got me interested in the paranormal, not to figure out what it is, but I like mystery.
00:10:05
Gabriel Von Graves
I grew up with Nancy Drew and the Hardy Boys and and Scooby-Doo. So to me, life with the paranormal, life is kind of a mystery to me. And I enjoy that aspect because I don't think we will ever solve what paranormal is.
00:10:19
Gabriel Von Graves
But I think... Accepting that there are things, there is mystery in life, I think, for me, keeps life more interesting.
00:10:28
Lee Hatfield
I cannot believe that this is the second podcast on the trot that Scooby-Doo has been mentioned.
00:10:34
Gabriel Von Graves
Right?
00:10:36
Lee Hatfield
It's like, what is it? But yeah, it's like, it's always funny about, you you mentioned Scooby-Doo, when you see the ghost and then the pull off the hood and yeah it would have got away with it if it had been for you pesky kids.
00:10:39
Raven Knight
We do.
00:10:45
Gabriel Von Graves
Right?
00:10:50
Lee Hatfield
But you raised a good point there, Gabriel, the fact that you always used to hide under your bedsheets. And I was talking to somebody on a podcast a few weeks ago.
00:10:58
Gabriel Von Graves
Ha
00:11:00
Lee Hatfield
It's like, how is a little piece of cloth this thick going to protect you from your worst nightmare? I do that now. And I'm like 60 old.
00:11:11
Gabriel Von Graves
ha ha ha ha. Well, I think it's more than that. I think it's a symbolism of of control. So as a child, you know, our life is is very small.
00:11:22
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:11:22
Gabriel Von Graves
And having something that I can control when everything is out of my control, I think that was why I used to cover, you know, my my head in sheets.
00:11:29
Gabriel Von Graves
And I think that's why kids do it now, because they can control that aspect.
00:11:33
Lee Hatfield
Exactly. And it's interesting what you said about going through the family photographs. The amount of times, and you've probably had it as podcasters as well, that people have a that exact same scenario.
00:11:46
Lee Hatfield
Somebody comes into the bedroom when they're young, they don't know who it is, their parents may or may not believe them, and then you're flicking through photographs or you see a picture on the wall and you go, it's that person there. And that person maybe died yeah well before you were born.
00:12:03
Gabriel Von Graves
Right?
00:12:04
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:12:04
Lee Hatfield
And how can people say that the paranormal does not exist when things like that happen?
00:12:13
Gabriel Von Graves
Right?
00:12:14
Raven Knight
Exactly. Exactly. That's
00:12:17
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and it's it's so weird. is yeah There are all these people that go, there's no such thing as ghosts. OK, prove that to me.
00:12:25
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:12:26
Raven Knight
Well, it seems like a really big coincidence, and that's the other thing. you know and Like Gabriel was saying earlier, I was in true crime. I love true crime. That's another thing I love. And a lot of detectives in true crime cases say there's no such thing as coincidences. So it seems like a really big coincidence for that to be a reoccurring story, you know that people would point some somebody out and say, oh, that was the person, and it just happens to be a family member.
00:12:51
Gabriel Von Graves
Well, look at alien abductions.
00:12:52
Raven Knight
don't know. Yeah.
00:12:53
Gabriel Von Graves
it's the same thing. A lot of people who never met have the same kind of experiences.
00:12:54
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:12:57
Gabriel Von Graves
So it is it mass hysteria? Are are people actually experiencing something and other people are experiencing similar things, which does kind of give gravity to a truth, I think.
00:13:10
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and yeah you mentioned mass hysteria, but it can't be mass hysteria if yeah there's a bunch of people in the UK, there's a bunch of people in the US, s there's a bunch of people in Spain or...
00:13:11
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm. us
00:13:19
Gabriel Von Graves
Right?
00:13:22
Lee Hatfield
port yeah That's not mass hysteria. Mass hysteria is a collection of people together that are all kind of experiencing the same thing. So I think we can cross that off the list straight away.
00:13:34
Lee Hatfield
So at what point...
00:13:34
Raven Knight
That's Gabriel's explanation for Big Point, too.
00:13:38
Lee Hatfield
No, we're going to get onto Bigfoot in a minute because I've got it
00:13:39
Raven Knight
hu
Listener Skepticism and Paranormal Validation
00:13:41
Lee Hatfield
underlined on my notepad.
00:13:42
Raven Knight
love it.
00:13:43
Lee Hatfield
cause new Because it it says here, Gabriel's an expert in Bigfoot.
00:13:43
Gabriel Von Graves
Don't feed into her nonsensely. Don't do it.
00:13:46
Raven Knight
Hate it.
00:13:50
Lee Hatfield
So, yeah.
00:13:50
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes. yeah Make a star right next to that, please. Thank you.
00:13:54
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and what I mean is i got I've got size 44 shoes.
00:13:54
Raven Knight
Highlight, circle.
00:13:57
Lee Hatfield
That's a big
00:14:00
Lee Hatfield
So at what point in both of your lives did you kind of realise that I don't know what I saw, if it was real or not, but now I've come to a point in my life where if it is real, i want to investigate it more.
00:14:23
Gabriel Von Graves
Do you mind if I go, Riff?
00:14:24
Raven Knight
Go ahead, yeah.
00:14:25
Gabriel Von Graves
So not too long ago, I used to live on a houseboat, me, my wife, and our child in the state of Minnesota during winter year round. I lived on a houseboat.
00:14:35
Gabriel Von Graves
And this houseboat, we found out after purchased it, had a body count. And several things would happen on that boat. Like I would be in the engine room and all the lights would go off. working something. And I'd be working on something. and I wouldn't quite understand it and I was trying to figure it out. and All of sudden, the the the owner's man would just drop and there it is. Right. But the most significant thing that happened to me in that boat that I talked to my wife about all the time. And and I think this this goes into how do we know what really happened is that we discuss this.
00:15:07
Gabriel Von Graves
And I'm like, this really happened. And my wife goes, yeah. So after we moved off of the boat, we moved on land. I felt kind of guilty because we our son was about five years old and he he was never really allowed to have kids over because we're in a houseboat. There's a liability, right? and His friends couldn't come and play.
00:15:24
Gabriel Von Graves
So we lived on a hobby farm and in the process of selling the houseboat, I'd go back. And it was during winter time, which is hard to sell a houseboat, but it was such a big boat, we left on the water.
00:15:35
Gabriel Von Graves
So I went down to check it one night said, I had a cold, you know, and I was kind of cranky. I didn't want to go there. You know, it was like minus 25 degrees in the middle winter and in in Minnesota.
00:15:46
Gabriel Von Graves
So I go and I chop the ice around the boat and make sure the the bubblers, the bubblers are the ones kind of fans in the water that keep the water open around your boat so it doesn't freeze in. But when gets really cold, you still got to go still kind of crack the ice.
00:16:00
Gabriel Von Graves
So I stepped on the boat, you know, and I was checking it and there was no power there, which means the boat was cold, means everything was frozen. And I was annoyed and I jumped down into the engine compartment. I heard a splash and I'm like, darn it.
00:16:13
Gabriel Von Graves
You know, now we have water coming in and I'm getting annoyed. So I'm trying to fiddle with the batteries. I'm i'm clicking to... cables together to get sparks and i and it's not working because there's no power. So there was a matchbook. So I went to go light a match and soon as I was able to strike it, something, because it was dark, it was black, something blacker than the black that I was in rushed me and
Life-Saving Paranormal Event on a Houseboat
00:16:38
Gabriel Von Graves
blew it it blew it out. And I'm like, what is going on? So I did it again and the same thing.
00:16:43
Gabriel Von Graves
But after the second time it happened, you you have that sense that something's wrong. So, you know, I was scared. You know, I'm in the middle of a boat. It's it's late at night. So I climb out of the engine compartment and and and i I go home for that day and I come back about a week later annoyed. didn't want to deal with it until I felt better. And as I got close to my boat, I smelt gas.
00:17:07
Gabriel Von Graves
So I opened up my boat up and it just got this wolf of gas. So here I am trying to air it out and I go to the engine compartment in that puddle I jumped in was actually gas. I had a service tech winterizing my engines and he stepped on one of the fuel lines and broke it.
00:17:24
Gabriel Von Graves
So whatever was there literally saved my life. There are people that lived around us. And then i had another event where we lived in a little town called Elmwood. They actually have Elmwood days.
00:17:34
Gabriel Von Graves
They're known in the state of Wisconsin as a UFO capital of Wisconsin. The story of it is, 1972, a sheriff crash.
00:17:39
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
00:17:43
Gabriel Von Graves
witnessed in alien craft kind of come down on this, on this buddy's, uh, the field. And that was what they're known for. You know, it's, it's documented. And we lived in a house, which I didn't know that story. We lived in a house, not that far from that field.
00:17:58
Gabriel Von Graves
And, When we moved there, it always felt weird. I walked in and I'm like, you know, there's something with this farm. You know, I don't know if we really want to live here. And my wife goes, it's beautiful area. Let's just deal with it. We live in a boat. We want to give our son land. And that's how we ended up on a, on a farm. And throughout living on that,
00:18:30
Gabriel Von Graves
I would wake up late at night to hear my son screaming because somebody was playing with his toys. we It got so bad, we actually put a camera
00:18:35
Raven Knight
Thank you.
00:18:38
Gabriel Von Graves
in his room and I'd sit there i awake at night and I'd watch things move. So we ended up moving our son into our our room. But, you know, it it doesn't feel real after a couple of years pass.
00:18:50
Gabriel Von Graves
So I talked to my wife and do you remember that this really happened? She's like, yeah, it did. So for me, the validation is when you get to experience it with somebody. When you look back on my memories like the boat, I i could have blew myself up and the people living in the boats next to me. Something intervened, something paranormal.
00:19:10
Gabriel Von Graves
The gentleman that passed on, passed in that boat, he was working on his generator and and he wasn't a very good mechanic. It had a leak in the exhaust.
00:19:19
Gabriel Von Graves
And him, his wife, two dogs, and two of their friends fell asleep and never woke back up.
00:19:24
Raven Knight
Hello.
00:19:25
Gabriel Von Graves
and And I remember one of my first experiences on that boat, I was working on it. And when we had to sign a waiver, which I thought was weird, we bought the boat not to work on the generator until we had it checked out. I didn't think anything of it. And I was working on the generator and I got it working. And then all of a sudden, all the carbon monoxide detectors went off.
00:19:44
Gabriel Von Graves
before, i mean, just as the generator started. So little things like that, i don't think the paranormal for me, at least in my experience, it's always negative. Some of it is actually comforting and protective.
00:19:57
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. So one of the first questions that I have with regard to that is, did you really say darn?
00:20:05
Gabriel Von Graves
Did I what?
00:20:06
Lee Hatfield
Really say darn it?
00:20:06
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:20:08
Gabriel Von Graves
I did.
00:20:09
Raven Knight
He edited himself good.
00:20:10
Gabriel Von Graves
I think I said gosh darn it, actually. I put a gosh in front of it, maybe.
00:20:12
Raven Knight
He's been dead. Gosh darn it.
00:20:14
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:20:14
Lee Hatfield
Hey, potty mouth.
00:20:15
Raven Knight
I'm from Minnesota.
00:20:16
Lee Hatfield
well We'll have less of that. Okay.
00:20:18
Gabriel Von Graves
i You know what? I will try to behave. I will.
00:20:20
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. But it's interesting like yeah when you mentioned about the fumes, like yeah as so as i said on ipod on your podcast, I used to be a firefighter.
00:20:30
Raven Knight
Hmm.
00:20:30
Lee Hatfield
And I know how comput combustible fumes can be.
00:20:30
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:20:33
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
00:20:35
Lee Hatfield
But if you've just got the liquid, you can put a lit torch into the gasoline.
00:20:36
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:20:41
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
00:20:41
Lee Hatfield
It won't ignite because it's it's it's the the vapors that ignite, not the liquid itself.
00:20:46
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm. Great.
00:20:48
Raven Knight
That's interesting.
00:20:48
Lee Hatfield
So the fact that that that room was full of vapor, like something was definitely protecting you.
00:20:53
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:20:55
Lee Hatfield
But like you say, what was it?
00:20:56
Raven Knight
here
00:20:56
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes.
00:20:59
Lee Hatfield
But interesting. I love that story. That is extremely cool. Raven, you'd better better that otherwise i'm
00:21:05
Raven Knight
I can't. I don't think I can.
00:21:06
Gabriel Von Graves
Top that one, Raven.
00:21:07
Lee Hatfield
Otherwise, I'm going to cut your camera.
00:21:08
Raven Knight
Oh, jeez.
00:21:11
Raven Knight
Oh, no.
00:21:11
Lee Hatfield
well please Please don't.
00:21:13
Raven Knight
Please don't.
00:21:14
Lee Hatfield
OK.
00:21:14
Raven Knight
i don't
00:21:14
Gabriel Von Graves
Hands up.
00:21:15
Raven Knight
utton
00:21:15
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, hands up.
00:21:17
Gabriel Von Graves
Let's do it. All right.
00:21:18
Lee Hatfield
well people People will know why at the end of the episode, why we keep doing this.
00:21:21
Raven Knight
Why we do the hands up. I don't, I don't have a better story than that.
00:21:23
Lee Hatfield
Yes.
00:21:28
Lee Hatfield
He wanted it to outshine you. That's what it is.
00:21:31
Raven Knight
To be fair, like, again, when we talked about like, we just, oh, that was real.
00:21:31
Gabriel Von Graves
Doesn't take much.
00:21:36
Gabriel Von Graves
but That took you a while. I like it.
00:21:38
Raven Knight
Oh, it did.
00:21:38
Gabriel Von Graves
Okay.
00:21:39
Raven Knight
Cause I was, cause I was thinking of how I was answering the question. And you said that.
00:21:42
Gabriel Von Graves
I'm sorry. That takes a lot of energy. Go ahead.
00:21:43
Raven Knight
Oh, I'm not blonde anymore. Listen. Yeah.
00:21:46
Gabriel Von Graves
Lee, you got to help me out on this.
00:21:47
Lee Hatfield
Oh, no, i I want to see fisticuffs.
00:21:48
Gabriel Von Graves
You got to come out. We got to.
00:21:51
Raven Knight
Oh yeah.
00:21:52
Lee Hatfield
I'm ready for this.
00:21:52
Gabriel Von Graves
hu
00:21:52
Lee Hatfield
yeah
00:21:53
Raven Knight
I'm violent. I, I don't have, I don't have a story like that.
00:21:54
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. Your hand comes through to the camera.
00:21:56
Gabriel Von Graves
Right. Right.
00:21:59
Raven Knight
I only have like, so I come from a small town where, the town next to it, which has grown a lot, the town that's next to the town I came from, but, uh, there was nothing to do in my town.
00:22:11
Raven Knight
There was nothing. And, we would go out and and, you know, some people go and party in a field. And instead of doing that, most of the time, we would go to an even smaller town called Kerryville, which is very well known around here for being haunted.
00:22:26
Gabriel Von Graves
Kerryville, Wisconsin.
00:22:29
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:22:30
Raven Knight
to be to be also pointing out that chad lewis we had him on our show at one point but chad lewis is an amazing paranormal investigator slash author he has books about you know like places you can go in wisconsin and carrieville's in there and i know that we have you know looked at this book several times and tried to say oh where we where can we go and and in do investigate that's what we did we would always just go out to carrieville And or Mary Dean, because Mary Dean had the hellhounds.
00:23:00
Raven Knight
So if you went out there late at night, went to the boat landing, you might see the hellhounds or there's a little island across the way that if you went out there, you know, it's there's all the stories. But that's what we did. We had nothing else to do with our time. And we went and did investigating or, you know.
00:23:18
Raven Knight
16 year old investigating, you know, but yeah, that's, that's what we did. We went, tried to find the church and the graveyard and,
00:23:24
Lee Hatfield
Well, yes, matt i I used to call it dating. But if you want to call it investigating, you go right ahead.
00:23:31
Gabriel Von Graves
Ha ha ha ha.
00:23:32
Raven Knight
No, actually, the funniest part is we went out there one night with, there was a whole group of other kids. So it was like two car fulls of kids and I had a car full and there was another car full and we were following the other car full and they tried to ditch us.
00:23:45
Raven Knight
They took us out to the middle of nowhere, down some dirt road. We found some weird cemetery that we were all at and then they tried to ditch us like, oh, look at, joe you're all going to be scared now.
00:23:55
Raven Knight
And i mean, we made our way back and now this is what I choose to do for fun. But
00:24:00
Gabriel Von Graves
I don't know she topped me yet. Lee, you may have to cut that camera.
00:24:02
Raven Knight
I didn't. I don't have a topic.
00:24:05
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, okay. I'm just gonna... yeah
00:24:07
Gabriel Von Graves
Bye, Raven. just
00:24:10
Raven Knight
I fall through the, whatever, the trap door in the bottom and I'm like, can't even do it.
00:24:12
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes, yes. oh
00:24:17
Lee Hatfield
If you fell off your chair, then i would laugh so hard.
00:24:21
Raven Knight
Luckily it's it's a bench chair.
00:24:21
Gabriel Von Graves
The whole table would go, everything would fly on the ground.
00:24:22
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:24:24
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, yeah.
00:24:24
Gabriel Von Graves
That'd be funny.
00:24:26
Lee Hatfield
Oh, we'll have to see if we can do that on some video. That'd be so cool.
00:24:28
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:24:29
Gabriel Von Graves
We need to do that.
00:24:30
Lee Hatfield
So Would I be right in thinking that you both have been on, let's use the word, official investigations?
Personal Experiences and Investigations
00:24:39
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely. i Yeah.
00:24:40
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:24:41
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:24:41
Raven Knight
Yeah. So that actually, you know, we, I did my own stuff.
00:24:42
Lee Hatfield
OK.
00:24:44
Raven Knight
I don't know how much Gabriel did before we met, but I've, I've done my own stuff. And then once we met and he said, oh, I really want to do a paranormal podcast and start doing this. I was a hundred percent in, you know, this is definitely something I've been interested in my whole life.
00:24:59
Raven Knight
My mom is, again, I bring her up a lot, but she's jealous now. Cause she, she, she,
00:25:05
Gabriel Von Graves
She's also a huge Gabriel fan, not a Raven fan, believe it or not, but a Gabriel fan.
00:25:07
Raven Knight
knockive
00:25:10
Raven Knight
what does the show
00:25:10
Gabriel Von Graves
Hi, mom.
00:25:13
Lee Hatfield
And how much money cut his hands for her to say that?
00:25:16
Gabriel Von Graves
About $20 every time I mention it.
00:25:17
Raven Knight
lot
00:25:20
Raven Knight
I'm glad that you have that arrangement.
00:25:22
Lee Hatfield
So
00:25:23
Raven Knight
I'm going to message her later.
00:25:25
Lee Hatfield
and I just knew that I just knew this podcast was not going to go very well tonight.
00:25:29
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:25:30
Lee Hatfield
I could feel it in the water.
00:25:31
Gabriel Von Graves
yeah I can split the 20 with you, Lee. I mean, $10 a piece.
00:25:34
Lee Hatfield
Oh, okay.
00:25:34
Gabriel Von Graves
That's pretty good, brother.
00:25:34
Raven Knight
but
00:25:35
Lee Hatfield
Okay.
00:25:35
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:25:35
Lee Hatfield
Okay. Now we're talking. Now we're talking.
00:25:37
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. Mom, that's 20 a piece, my friend.
00:25:38
Lee Hatfield
So, yeah, so. can you Can you remember your very first investigation? And before either of you answer, how did it compare and being there to how you anticipated that it would be?
00:26:00
Gabriel Von Graves
That's a very good question, Lee. Go ahead, Raven.
00:26:01
Lee Hatfield
I know, that's why I'm a podcaster and I ask this.
00:26:03
Raven Knight
Oh, gosh.
00:26:03
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah, right.
00:26:04
Raven Knight
It's a very, no, you go first.
00:26:04
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes.
00:26:05
Raven Knight
You like to go first and blow me out water.
00:26:06
Lee Hatfield
You could learn so much.
00:26:07
Gabriel Von Graves
I could. i could.
00:26:10
Raven Knight
What are you doing
00:26:10
Gabriel Von Graves
Teach me sensei. You know what i mean?
00:26:13
Lee Hatfield
wipe on wipe off $20. right
00:26:15
Gabriel Von Graves
Hi, Mom.
00:26:16
Lee Hatfield
twenty dollars
00:26:18
Gabriel Von Graves
Just making us money, Lee.
00:26:18
Raven Knight
I'm going to text her, Mom, you owe Gabriel like $100 at this point.
00:26:19
Gabriel Von Graves
That's all.
00:26:22
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. So for me, if I remember your question, sorry about that, Lee. The first official investigation I went on was I remember as a child going to my great grandparents' house and I saw a little boy hiding in the fireplace. And this was about 30 years ago. That house came up for sale. So I actually knew the realtor that that had that house. It was in a small little town called Farmington, Minnesota.
00:26:49
Gabriel Von Graves
And so i said, hey, buddy, i this sounds weird, but can i spend the night in this house? I'm thinking about buying it. I actually, this is my grandparents' house. remember as a child. And he said, that's that's weird. But yeah, yeah, you can just sign a waiver. Don't break anything. I said, sure. So my first investigation was trying to see it through an adult's eyes and not a child's eyes of what I saw.
00:27:12
Gabriel Von Graves
And i can tell you that as a child and as an adult, I saw the same thing. And what I thought was very interesting, looking through it as an investigation, that I believe that entity remembered me as a child.
00:27:27
Gabriel Von Graves
Because the day that I saw him, it was on Easter, and remember this clearly. Yeah. My my parents used to hide little Easter eggs and stuff like that. And I was going i because, you know, I never slept very good, especially in somebody else's house.
00:27:39
Gabriel Von Graves
You know, went to go visit my grandparents because, you know, my my friend that was comfort me was was at my house. She didn't come to the other houses. So, you know, in that house always felt weird. as my great grandparents.
00:27:49
Gabriel Von Graves
It had a smell, so weird smell, weird sounds and stuff like that.
00:27:51
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
00:27:54
Gabriel Von Graves
And so I got up and I was looking for the candy. And I remember going downstairs and there was a living room and it felt colder than all the other rooms. So that that intrigued me. I was scared. But, you know, there was something comforting within that cold. There's like a warmth in that cold. I remember feeling very, very cold. But when but it was pulling me in that pole.
00:28:17
Gabriel Von Graves
was warm. So I remember you know looking for for eggs and something said, look on the banister. So I remember looking at the banister and then it registered to me that something talked to me.
00:28:29
Gabriel Von Graves
And I turned my head and there was this little boy that was hiding in the fireplace. And I know I got scared. I dropped all my my my candy and I went to go run and I fell and then I woke up in my bed.
00:28:42
Gabriel Von Graves
And, you know, as a child, I wonder if that really happened. But I remember I still had chocolate on my fingers for eating the candy, you know. So something I fell and something brought me to my bed.
00:28:53
Gabriel Von Graves
It wasn't my grandparents I did ask about. So as an adult, when I was, you know, spending the night in this house, I sat in that little tiny entryway that the kind of foyer that that had the fireplace.
00:29:04
Raven Knight
Hmm.
00:29:04
Gabriel Von Graves
And I remember having the cold hit me again. And i was I saw that I remember feeling the hairs in the back of my back, my neck, and then you'd feel it on your arms and everything would kind of stand up.
00:29:15
Gabriel Von Graves
And I didn't have any equipment. Right. Because there wasn't any like ghost hunters, movies, anything. It was just me, which I think the human body is the best detector there is, because I think we're we're we're hardwired for for flight or fight. Right. So I i was, as as a man, I stood up and I was trying to understand this.
00:29:33
Gabriel Von Graves
And I heard that little boy's voice again. And he says, good to see you again. And that scared me so much that I ran out of that house as a grown man. I wasn't expecting the voice, nor was I expecting for him to remember me.
00:29:48
Gabriel Von Graves
So that was my first investigation in what I feel that I thought I wouldn't get anything.
00:29:48
Raven Knight
Wow.
00:29:55
Gabriel Von Graves
I thought I would just sit there and it was the imagination of a young child on on a sugar high. But the event happened again. And I do wonder if maybe there was a relative connection in that house, because I knew that that was kind of in my grandparents' bloodline a little bit.
00:30:12
Lee Hatfield
So the only thing that I can say is you're running out of that house. Your ghost friend has come to say hi and you up and skedaddle.
00:30:20
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:30:23
Raven Knight
You ghosted him.
00:30:24
Gabriel Von Graves
I peaced out.
00:30:24
Lee Hatfield
And it's like, it's like, oh, that.
00:30:24
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes.
00:30:25
Raven Knight
You ghosted the ghost.
00:30:27
Gabriel Von Graves
I did.
00:30:28
Raven Knight
You jerk.
00:30:28
Gabriel Von Graves
i did. But it startled me because it it wasn't that I heard something. I was expecting that to be a haunted house.
00:30:35
Raven Knight
Sure.
00:30:35
Gabriel Von Graves
It's that it remembered me And so I started thinking, you know, when I think the paranormal, how they see us, I think they see us as energy not as the person.
00:30:37
Raven Knight
Hmm.
Speculations on Spirit Recognition
00:30:45
Gabriel Von Graves
Because as a child and as an adult, we we look different. But I think it recognized my energy.
00:30:49
Raven Knight
Hmm.
00:30:53
Raven Knight
Interesting.
00:30:53
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. Yeah.
00:30:54
Raven Knight
OK.
00:30:55
Lee Hatfield
Very interesting. And yeah and yet I think you're absolutely right about mentioning about the energy. And, know, people say that, yeah animals recognize you recognise you. just have to be that yeah your pet dog or your pet cat.
00:31:09
Lee Hatfield
yeah You've seen stories of gorillas where someone's gone back after 20 years or elephants and they remember they remember those people.
00:31:15
Raven Knight
Oh, yeah.
00:31:18
Lee Hatfield
So why shouldn't spirits do the same?
00:31:22
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely.
00:31:23
Raven Knight
That's a fair point.
00:31:23
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
00:31:25
Raven Knight
Well, and they know that elephants, for example, have like a really good memory.
00:31:29
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:31:29
Raven Knight
Elephants are way smarter than we give them credit for.
00:31:30
Lee Hatfield
It's like, yeah.
00:31:31
Raven Knight
They're very, they, they have a really good memory.
00:31:35
Lee Hatfield
And that's why Bigfoot doesn't like Gabriel or something like that.
00:31:38
Gabriel Von Graves
Bigfoot!
00:31:39
Lee Hatfield
OK.
00:31:39
Raven Knight
What?
00:31:39
Lee Hatfield
Wait,
00:31:40
Raven Knight
I don't know if it was what we were raising our hands for, but here we are.
00:31:44
Lee Hatfield
you started it.
00:31:45
Gabriel Von Graves
yeah
00:31:46
Raven Knight
it
00:31:47
Lee Hatfield
Raven, go for it.
00:31:50
Gabriel Von Graves
Dazzle us, Raven.
00:31:54
Lee Hatfield
You guys like a husband and wife, jeez.
00:32:06
Raven Knight
but then, you know, one of my first investigations probably as an adult or somebody who was a little bit older and, wanting to take it a little bit more seriously was the Green Eye Bridge, which is another place in Wisconsin.
00:32:19
Raven Knight
And the the story is that, you know, it late at night, you can see these green eyes over over the bridge. And it's, i that's that's the story, you know.
00:32:29
Raven Knight
And so I went out there trying to figure out if i could if I could find this, if I could figure it out. Me being me, I went by myself. Not always the best idea, but, you know, that's that's what I did.
00:32:41
Raven Knight
I don't have a crazy story like Gabriel. I actually have the reverse. So I am, of course, the person that goes and tries to seek these things out. where With Gabriel, as we've noticed, they just keep going to him.
00:32:54
Raven Knight
He is like a beacon for spirits.
00:32:57
Lee Hatfield
And he's also a bit of a wuss, let's put it out there.
00:32:59
Raven Knight
And he's a wuss. He runs away and I go into the basement.
00:33:01
Gabriel Von Graves
i didn't I didn't pee my pants. I ran. Completely different.
00:33:03
Raven Knight
and shoot you You run away.
00:33:05
Gabriel Von Graves
Peeing my pants was later.
00:33:05
Raven Knight
with
00:33:06
Raven Knight
I go into basements with no questions asked. I'm just like, yes, a basement, let's go
00:33:06
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:33:11
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:33:12
Raven Knight
Yes, a random bridge in the middle of the night by myself. Why not? But, you know, I had the EMF detector and, you know, I started to realize something very important when it comes to the Green Eye Bridge real fast. is you know on that bridge there's not a lot you're not getting a lot of hits except for like at the very end of the bridge over here and maybe the end of bridge over here and what is it that's happening at the end of the bridge so i'm sitting and trying to figure out what could be happening i'm not getting anything else i'm just getting hits but what's happening is there's legit a power line that's hanging
00:33:51
Raven Knight
Right, right there. And I said, oh, there it is. All of the hits, it's it's all coming from this power line, which also, you know, if if we know anything about that, like if you already hear a story and you think that, oh, it could be haunted and you're already going to go out there and think, oh, look, this is, no, there's a power line. it It really was a disappointing, it was a disappointing first, we'll we'll air quote it, first investigation because I want to see things and and experience things.
00:34:23
Raven Knight
And it's like, well, at least we know, you know, that this could potentially just be that.
00:34:28
Lee Hatfield
But the good thing is is that you were able to debunk it.
00:34:32
Raven Knight
Right. 100%.
00:34:33
Lee Hatfield
And if there's so many things that people say are paranormal that you can debunk, yeah you go on Facebook, like all these pictures that people, what can you see in the picture?
00:34:39
Raven Knight
hundred percent
00:34:39
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:34:46
Lee Hatfield
I can see like, you know, flare from the from the sun or I can see smoke or I can see something that has got a natural explanation but it's the unnatural that we can't explain yeah like I think I told you on your podcast where I got kind of my hand held I cannot explain that it felt like a child grabbed my hand but it only happened to me it didn't happen to my colleague
00:34:58
Raven Knight
Sure, sure. Mm-hmm.
00:35:20
Lee Hatfield
But it was only me. Can I explain that? No. But, you we kind of like to challenge ourselves by testing everything that is natural before we look at the paranormal or the supernatural.
Natural Explanations vs. Paranormal Experiences
00:35:36
Lee Hatfield
Like black mold, if you've got a bad enough in your house or your apartment, whatever, can cause hallucinations.
00:35:38
Raven Knight
Oh, yeah.
00:35:40
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:35:44
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
00:35:44
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
00:35:44
Lee Hatfield
Carbon monoxide can cause hallucinations. yeah High EMF can cause hallucinations.
00:35:50
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
00:35:51
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely. Absolutely.
00:35:51
Raven Knight
100%.
00:35:52
Lee Hatfield
So it does not have to be something of a supernatural nature that's causing you issues.
00:35:59
Raven Knight
hundred percent
00:36:00
Lee Hatfield
I've got noises in my in my loft. Oh, I've got a squirrel or a raccoon. But people will automatically go to the paranormal solution, even though yeah even though someone walks up and goes, nope.
00:36:13
Raven Knight
Yes. You got it.
00:36:18
Lee Hatfield
it's
00:36:20
Gabriel Von Graves
if If I may add to that, Lee, we recently just got back from West Virginia and Kentucky.
00:36:20
Lee Hatfield
and it
00:36:25
Gabriel Von Graves
We were in the Bigfoot Festival on the big the big foot festival in Red River Gorge in Stanton, Kentucky. Right?
00:36:34
Raven Knight
you got it
00:36:50
Gabriel Von Graves
While we were getting back from the day of the Bigfoot Festival, we were just i was just rolling some B film and just talking to the camera to let them do it.
00:37:00
Gabriel Von Graves
was actually thanking people. for coming to our booth. We had people driving four hours, which I thought was amazing to, to meet us. I wouldn't even stay five minutes to meet us, but this guy drove for four hours. and like, what is wrong with you?
00:37:11
Gabriel Von Graves
You know?
00:37:12
Raven Knight
Oh, we love you. thank yes and thank you.
00:37:13
Gabriel Von Graves
Oh, I mean, we love you. Yeah.
00:37:15
Lee Hatfield
It wasn't Raven's dad's mother playing the twenty i mean
00:37:18
Gabriel Von Graves
It was her mom to come see me. I was like, yes.
00:37:22
Raven Knight
thanks lovelyli
00:37:23
Gabriel Von Graves
That's $40 a piece so far there, Lee. Anyway, so I was, and there's actually a video of this. I was about to record it, and we were outside because this cabin had like a little kitchenette built on the side of it.
00:37:36
Gabriel Von Graves
And I was starting to record, and as I was recording, something caught my eye. It was a reflection. I was actually looking inside our cabin, and there was a face. And I stopped real quick and there's actually video of that.
00:37:45
Raven Knight
Yeah. Yeah.
00:37:47
Gabriel Von Graves
And i actually ran into the cabin and something jumped into the, the bathroom of that cabin. it's just a small little, you know, a homemade cabin. And in the Appalachian mountains, we could feel things.
00:38:00
Raven Knight
yeah
00:38:00
Gabriel Von Graves
And that wasn't the first event.
00:38:01
Gabriel Von Graves
We were the first and second night we were there. There wasn't anything, but the third night, there definitely was a different feeling in that whole area. i do I do think folklore and superstition had a lot to do with it, but there's stuff we didn't do that you're supposed to at the Appalachian Mountains, like close your shades at night.
00:38:19
Gabriel Von Graves
We didn't know that.
00:38:19
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:38:20
Gabriel Von Graves
There was actually this big, huge Indian head statue that was sitting on on a buffet, kind of in the living room areas, Jason, too.
00:38:21
Raven Knight
Close your curtin
00:38:27
Gabriel Von Graves
each have seven bath but our bedrooms, of course. But so adjacent to that, there was his head. The head was there the whole time. But for some reason, this night, there was something about that head.
00:38:36
Raven Knight
curtain. Hmm.
00:38:37
Gabriel Von Graves
It just didn't feel right. In fact, I walked over and kind of moved it closer to so so Raven could see it from her bedroom because I wanted nothing to do with it. Yeah, exactly. you know And I didn't run away this timely.
00:38:47
Lee Hatfield
Move it towards Aver.
00:38:49
Gabriel Von Graves
I did pee my pants, but I didn't run away.
00:38:50
Raven Knight
He wanted to run away, but there was nothing out there, you know, or what was out there was worse than what was in there.
00:38:51
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:38:55
Raven Knight
i don't know.
00:38:56
Gabriel Von Graves
Right. And the weird thing is you know, in in the Smoky Mountains, like that at least the the the foothills of it, everything's really loud at night.
00:38:56
Raven Knight
Maybe that's.
00:39:03
Gabriel Von Graves
You have all the creatures. And then automatically when things would happen, you would there would be like an energy, but yet everything would become silent. And it was so weird that we both looked at each other that happened.
00:39:14
Gabriel Von Graves
And I'm like, what happened to everything?
00:39:15
Raven Knight
yeah
00:39:16
Gabriel Von Graves
You know, cause we were, I was trying to watch TV cause i had a TV outside and all of sudden the volume was turned up and the volume wasn't turned up. The background noise died and that was the creatures.
00:39:27
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:39:29
Gabriel Von Graves
And we both kind of looked at each other and that's when I thought, well, I'm going to start wrapping up. It's getting weird out here, you know? So I was going to say thank you for having us at the Red River Gorge and it was a beautiful festival.
00:39:39
Gabriel Von Graves
But that's when I caught the entity. So a lot of stuff online, like you mentioned, definitely, you know, people sensationalize things. Very rarely do I come across evidence I'm like, wow.
00:39:49
Gabriel Von Graves
But then again, unless you're actually there, it's hard to understand the frame of mind and what was happening in the moment, at least in my perspective.
00:39:53
Raven Knight
yeah
00:39:57
Raven Knight
That's the other thing about that.
00:39:57
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:39:58
Raven Knight
No, that was the other, that was actually a really fair point because we do have that video up. There's a lot of people that are like, what are you talking about? When the reaction that Gabriel has in this moment is a real reaction.
00:40:05
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:40:09
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:40:09
Raven Knight
And I really, unfortunately, like in his real reaction moment, he like turns the camera off and then he runs to go check and he sees something else in the bathroom.
00:40:18
Raven Knight
But i was like, oh, I wish we could have had that on film.
00:40:20
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:40:21
Raven Knight
Because, I mean, this was legit. Like, he legit had this reaction. He's very interesting, and we've done a lot of investigations and stuff together. And honestly, whenever Gabriel has something that he sees or whatever, he definitely has...
00:40:37
Raven Knight
Something happens his over his face. Like, it takes over, and I know immediately that something's going on. Like, I can just...
00:40:46
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:40:53
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. keep Keep going and smart, you know.
00:40:55
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, yeah.
00:40:56
Raven Knight
Keep going.
00:40:56
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:40:57
Raven Knight
Mom's new favorite.
00:40:58
Gabriel Von Graves
you know and I think when things happen, we we run to it, and it's not to see it, but to discredit it.
00:40:59
Raven Knight
$20, Mom. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:41:06
Gabriel Von Graves
Because I think if you're going to be an investigator, my main job is taking away all known information. things that can make that happen. Noises, is the ventilation going on, right? is there Is there animals, like like you said, of of your loft? So I think people that are real credible, the first thing they go to is, what is it other than what it seems like? And once you take away what it is, what it seems is what it is.
00:41:34
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and it...
00:41:34
Gabriel Von Graves
And go ahead.
00:41:36
Lee Hatfield
No, I'm nervous now in case you interrupt me again.
00:41:40
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:41:41
Lee Hatfield
So, well, yeah, hands up. Oh, my God, it's going to start a new trend now. One thing that I wanted to raise about that particular, though, is that the wife and i when we watch these TV shows, it's always a case of, quick, turn your cell phone to blurry before you take the picture.
00:41:46
Raven Knight
How am I?
00:41:57
Gabriel Von Graves
but
00:41:58
Lee Hatfield
But,
00:42:00
Gabriel Von Graves
There's a special Bunley. Right?
00:42:01
Lee Hatfield
yeah.
00:42:01
Gabriel Von Graves
But you see that you hit the blur. Yes.
00:42:03
Raven Knight
Oh, is there?
00:42:03
Lee Hatfield
But...
00:42:04
Raven Knight
that's what they do when they capture Bigfoot.
00:42:05
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:42:06
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, but then I i shared a meme on Facebook and last a couple of days that and actually said, what if Bigfoot is naturally blurry and everybody's camera is absolutely fine?
00:42:06
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. Yeah.
00:42:16
Raven Knight
Yeah. Yeah. So do you want to know something really funny, Lee? That is actually a joke by comedian Mitch Hedberg, who's out of Minnesota. That was one of my favorite jokes of his.
00:42:28
Raven Knight
And I see it in Minnesota and he's making the rounds or that's making the rounds again. And I'm like, oh, I love that joke.
00:42:28
Gabriel Von Graves
Minnesota.
00:42:34
Raven Knight
It's one of my favorites.
00:42:34
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, that that is.
00:42:35
Lee Hatfield
But but it's it's right what you say, though, about yeah cameras and such like. The amount of people that take pictures.
00:42:45
Lee Hatfield
Oh, I saw a face in flames. No, you didn't. I saw a face in a dark house. No, you didn't.
00:42:58
Lee Hatfield
yeah Yeah, there's a word called pareidolia.
00:43:00
Raven Knight
yes yeah
00:43:01
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:43:01
Lee Hatfield
that a lot of people do not understand what it is and what it means. But I don't want to criticize all these people because they're genuinely thinking that it is something real. And you would break their heart if, oh, yeah, they'd call you a troll or whatever if you said, well, actually, that's yeah like lens flare or it's this.
00:43:27
Lee Hatfield
But there's so many people out there that think that what isn't paranormal is, and it's very difficult to break it to them gently that what you're seeing is not of a paranormal nature.
00:43:35
Raven Knight
Yeah. Yeah.
00:43:43
Lee Hatfield
It's actually natural if waveforms and yeah lights in the
00:43:44
Raven Knight
yeah
00:43:44
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
Creation of Darkwood's Paranormal Podcast
00:43:47
Lee Hatfield
sky.
00:43:47
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. Northern lights, for example, if people see colored things. it yeah It could be Northern lights. It could be something completely natural. So Darkwoods Paranormal Podcast, obviously you two are, I use the term loosely, friends.
00:44:08
Gabriel Von Graves
Loose, very loosely. Yes.
00:44:09
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:44:10
Raven Knight
We kind of get along.
00:44:10
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes. Hi, mom.
00:44:11
Raven Knight
know Hi, Mom.
00:44:12
Lee Hatfield
so hi So how did you two first meet? And then how did Darkwood's Paranormal Podcast come about? I think you kind of mentioned it earlier about how it come about.
00:44:23
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:44:24
Lee Hatfield
But yeah, I'm getting old. It's near bedtime. So let's crack on and remind me.
00:44:28
Gabriel Von Graves
Go ahead, Raven.
00:44:29
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:44:30
Raven Knight
Do you want the real story? sorry Fake story.
00:44:32
Lee Hatfield
Oh, oh, oh, oh.
00:44:32
Raven Knight
No. No.
00:44:34
Lee Hatfield
Both. so Now you've mentioned it. I want both.
00:44:36
Gabriel Von Graves
yeah
00:44:39
Raven Knight
No, the story he's going to tell you is that, you know, he was like, I want to start a podcast. No, that's a true story, actually. we We actually worked at the same place. And I was a part of a true crime podcast.
00:44:51
Raven Knight
Actually, I was, I did a true...
00:44:52
Lee Hatfield
I can say it wasn't a prison any chance, was it?
00:44:56
Raven Knight
No, no.
00:44:56
Lee Hatfield
OK, just checking.
00:44:56
Raven Knight
I wasn't interested.
00:44:58
Lee Hatfield
It was library.
00:44:58
Gabriel Von Graves
Well, it was like a prison.
00:45:02
Raven Knight
Yeah. The place we worked at?
00:45:04
Lee Hatfield
OK. OK. OK.
00:45:05
Raven Knight
bit old
00:45:05
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:45:05
Lee Hatfield
it was a library is
00:45:05
Gabriel Von Graves
at At the time? Yeah.
00:45:07
Raven Knight
Oh, it wasn't a prison.
00:45:08
Lee Hatfield
okay
00:45:09
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:45:09
Lee Hatfield
yeah
00:45:09
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:45:10
Lee Hatfield
okay o o o
00:45:11
Raven Knight
well But we so i I was part of a a true crime podcast.
00:45:12
Lee Hatfield
okay
00:45:17
Raven Knight
i love i loved i loved to doing true crime. Like I said before, I love true crime. And then At the time, at the around the same time, Gabriel was going to start his own podcast, was was talking about starting a podcast, found out that I had a podcast and then asked for some advice. I actually tried to invite him on our show, but he never did get that email, which is really funny.
00:45:40
Raven Knight
Till this day, I don't think you ever got the email. Because what I found out...
00:45:42
Gabriel Von Graves
No, I wouldn't go on your crappy show.
00:45:45
Lee Hatfield
It's got it he's got it pinned on the wall behind him.
00:45:47
Gabriel Von Graves
I do, I do, I do.
00:45:48
Lee Hatfield
one
00:45:50
Raven Knight
Like that one time. It's funny because we we worked together, but we didn't really talk to each other very much.
00:45:54
Gabriel Von Graves
We didn't know each other, no.
00:45:55
Raven Knight
Like we saw we saw each other like in passing, but it wasn't like we knew each other.
00:45:58
Gabriel Von Graves
I had higher standards back in that daily.
00:46:02
Raven Knight
Such bull.
00:46:02
Lee Hatfield
Wow.
00:46:02
Raven Knight
Such bull.
00:46:03
Lee Hatfield
Wow.
00:46:05
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:46:06
Lee Hatfield
Next time you see him below the belt, okay.
00:46:08
Gabriel Von Graves
No, she does.
00:46:09
Lee Hatfield
Okay.
00:46:10
Raven Knight
yeah Hands up.
00:46:13
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:46:13
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:46:13
Lee Hatfield
handsome
00:46:14
Gabriel Von Graves
yeah yeah
00:46:15
Raven Knight
So anyway, Another person that worked at the same place with us basically said, oh, hey, Gabriel has a podcast. He had a business card, gave me the business card. And I said, oh, I would love to have him on the show. I love paranormal stuff. Like, I've always been really interested in that. So I sent him this email trying to, like, invite him on the show, which never happened. But then we actually did did see each other, like, a week later or something. And he asked me about, the you know, podcasting. And said, oh, I can kind of give you some – some tips and tricks and whatever. And we started talking a little bit about podcasting.
00:46:51
Raven Knight
The most ironic part of this is that at the same time, so the true crime group I was in, there was about six of us and I took like a two week break. There's a lot of stuff. I took a little bit of a break from that podcast. And by the time the two weeks were up, they had all gotten into a huge fight and the podcast broke up.
00:47:10
Raven Knight
so I'm, to be fair, one of the girls that I'm friends with from that podcast is still doing the podcast. She has another friend that does the podcast with her now, but there was such a huge blowout from this whole thing that, you know, obviously that was, that was pretty much done. And so Gabriel and I decided to, to do this one together.
00:47:31
Raven Knight
And that's, that's a love hate relationship.
00:47:31
Lee Hatfield
And it's it's a love-hate relationship.
00:47:34
Gabriel Von Graves
Hate hate, I think.
00:47:35
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:47:35
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. So how long has it...
00:47:37
Raven Knight
He loves me when I get guests like you, Wanli. That's true story.
00:47:40
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely. Yep.
00:47:42
Lee Hatfield
Well, yeah, for the people that don't know, it was a last-minute gig.
00:47:42
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:47:46
Lee Hatfield
but It was like, oh dear, the person that was supposed to come on, was it the same day or the day after or something? It's like, oh, my God, to cut our guest has let us down. Can anybody help? So it's like that's on Facebook. And I went, oh, go on, then.
00:48:00
Lee Hatfield
but yeah Yeah, we've reached.
00:48:01
Raven Knight
And still, one of our, I mean, we don't have favorites.
00:48:06
Lee Hatfield
Excuse me.
00:48:07
Gabriel Von Graves
We have favorites, Lee.
00:48:09
Lee Hatfield
Thank you. $20.
00:48:10
Raven Knight
yeah
00:48:11
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. Love you, mom. Okay. Yeah.
00:48:13
Lee Hatfield
raven Raven's now got an eye infection. so
00:48:16
Raven Knight
He used to make fun of me and wink into him.
00:48:17
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, it's got a bit of a twitch. So how long was how long has Darkwood's been going?
00:48:19
Raven Knight
I'm a terrible pirate.
00:48:23
Gabriel Von Graves
We've been going for about two years. I actually started it under Unboxed Media LLC because what got me interested in podcasting was I think there's a genuine distrust in the news, right? I mean, there's a lot of conspiracy theories, stuff like that. And I started listening to talk radio after 9-11. And I thought it was very interesting media source. And then I started getting curious into podcasts that that arrived, I think, about maybe four years after nine nine eleven around there. And then I thought it was interesting because these were real people talking about real things.
00:49:04
Gabriel Von Graves
And so that's what got me into... podcasting So I thought, well, you know to do it legally, i did it under Unbox Media LLC. And then I thought, well, what things interest me? Because you you enjoy something if you actually are interested in the subject matter. So I like tech. I like business. And I like the paranormal because it's been...
00:49:26
Gabriel Von Graves
a part of me. It's nothing that I've actually wanted. It just always has been there. And it's something that has scared me and yet intrigued me at the same time.
00:49:31
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
00:49:35
Gabriel Von Graves
So that's what kind of got me into i'm talking to Raven there for Paranormal. Because the tech stuff I can do myself, business stuff, absolutely. Because I'm a big Tesla guy.
00:49:45
Gabriel Von Graves
i like robots. Only because I find in the business world, it's getting harder and harder to recruit and to And to subsidize that, people are are creating systems and robotics that'll do the jobs that it's very hard to feel.
00:50:03
Gabriel Von Graves
And I always found that very interesting. Where there's a need, someone will come up with the answer. And I love that. so
00:50:08
Raven Knight
I
00:50:09
Gabriel Von Graves
I do that, but I thought, you know, paranormal, I kind of like a buddy. And as you know, Lee, you have to trust the person that you're with. And Raven, to her credit, is very trustworthy. She's just like me where she doesn't sensationalize things. things are She's the first one that'll run to the basement. And then I have to remind her, would you like some way of communicating in case something's wrong in a flashlight? Yeah.
00:50:31
Gabriel Von Graves
You know, because here, here's the thing. She, she brings up Bigfoot all the time. And i explained it very easily to her. If we ever went Bigfoot hunting, the good thing is see Raven's like three foot two or something.
00:50:43
Gabriel Von Graves
So I would pick her up, throw her at Bigfoot, Bigfoot would eat her as I ran away. So if you look at our relationship, it's more of a need, a case anything ever happens.
00:50:48
Raven Knight
Yeah, he sacrificed me to make
00:50:53
Raven Knight
fun.
00:50:55
Gabriel Von Graves
Raven will, will, will, will be left for dead as I get away.
00:51:00
Raven Knight
I'm taking one for the team, Lee, is essentially what it is.
00:51:01
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes. Yes.
00:51:02
Raven Knight
I'm taking one for the team.
00:51:02
Gabriel Von Graves
yeah And you can borrow her for that because she she'll fit right in your pocket Lee.
00:51:03
Lee Hatfield
Wow.
00:51:06
Gabriel Von Graves
And you only, she, you just give her little bit of crumbs because she's so tiny. It's that's, that's what she eats. It'll be fine.
00:51:12
Raven Knight
I'm five, too.
00:51:13
Gabriel Von Graves
You are three, seven.
00:51:13
Lee Hatfield
You do realise that there's actually a sport about throwing little people.
00:51:13
Raven Knight
I'm not.
00:51:14
Gabriel Von Graves
Oh,
00:51:15
Raven Knight
I'm not.
00:51:23
Raven Knight
I'd like to see you try, Gabriel. yeah but
00:51:25
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, it's it's funny it's funny that you mentioned robots because the department that I work in, part of our job is to renew ID cards for people.
00:51:35
Lee Hatfield
And we get quite a few requests a day and it gets really boring. So I've started, when I get brand new people coming coming in for their first day on the job, I always go to them, well, you know in some of these websites that you have to prove that you're not a robot?
00:51:52
Lee Hatfield
And they they're accompanied by their manager and they go, yeah. so what Can you tell me how many chairs there are in the room?
00:51:58
Gabriel Von Graves
yeah
00:51:59
Lee Hatfield
And they go like, oh, three. No, there's five. No, it's not like, I'm sorry. I can't can't prove or deny that you're not a robot.
00:52:07
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:52:07
Raven Knight
I love that.
00:52:07
Lee Hatfield
I can't give you ID card. Sorry.
00:52:10
Raven Knight
I love that. That's amazing. Amazing.
00:52:12
Gabriel Von Graves
That's pretty good.
00:52:13
Raven Knight
That's very good.
00:52:13
Gabriel Von Graves
That's pretty good.
00:52:13
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. of it So the fact that you've been doing it for two years, Do you both have one particular episode
Exorcism Story and Authenticity in Paranormal Investigations
00:52:25
Raven Knight
Oh.
00:52:26
Lee Hatfield
that's left you either startled and afterwards you're going, oh, my God, did well did we really have that conversation?
00:52:37
Lee Hatfield
Or it's been spine chilling. Or if you get asked this question, you always go back to the same episode and before you answer so i'll give you a little bit more time to think i interviewed a guy that is american but he's lived in thailand for a long time so he's got the the thailand kind of like priest training and all that and he's an exorcist and all that kind of stuff and he was telling me a story of his of a girl that he was seeing at the time
00:53:08
Lee Hatfield
she found a pendant i can't remember where it was it might have been in a vacant house she brought it home to his apartment she put it on and then within a matter of minutes she flipped back into the crab position and then walked up the wall backwards and it's like holy crap
00:53:24
Gabriel Von Graves
Oh wow.
00:53:27
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
00:53:29
Raven Knight
Wow.
00:53:32
Lee Hatfield
yeah For somebody to experience that, yeah i i I believe the guy. There's no reason for me not to believe him. But that was kind of like a jaw-dropping moment. I'm like, I'm sorry, what?
00:53:46
Lee Hatfield
And it was so kind of like a wow moment that if people ask me that question, that's the one that I always go to.
00:53:51
Raven Knight
Hmm.
00:53:57
Lee Hatfield
So now that you've had time to think, and obviously Raven's now thinking about food.
00:53:59
Raven Knight
Oh gosh.
00:54:03
Raven Knight
I love food. How'd you know?
00:54:05
Lee Hatfield
There we go. yes Yeah.
00:54:06
Gabriel Von Graves
Because I mentioned crumbs in pockets.
00:54:07
Raven Knight
You had crumbs. Yeah. Pocket crumbs.
00:54:09
Lee Hatfield
So who's got one?
00:54:10
Raven Knight
My favorite.
00:54:13
Lee Hatfield
Let's go see.
00:54:15
Gabriel Von Graves
you want to go Raven or should I?
00:54:15
Raven Knight
Oh, gosh, that's a really tough question. And it's a very good question.
00:54:19
Gabriel Von Graves
It's a pretty good question, Lee.
00:54:21
Raven Knight
And I feel like Gabriel's going to one-up me again. But i kind of want to start with, i did I don't know if it really answers the question of like something insanely crazy that happened during COVID.
00:54:34
Raven Knight
the interview because we do so we do you know we have some that are not interview episodes as well but then we also have interview episodes and I i do love the interview episodes because I love talking to people and I love hearing their stories and but one of i would say the craziest or best things I think that has happened in one of our episodes is that we again I'm going to bring up Chad Lewis we had Chad Lewis on And he's got over 30 books, at least, of, you know, paranormal places to go, all these all of these paranormal things. And I cannot remember, for the life of me, the name of... the It wast i was another bridge. It wasn't the Green Eye Bridge, but it was another bridge. And this bridge, there is the ghost of a woman named Mary that says to haunt the bridge. She was actually the
00:55:28
Raven Knight
She was actually murdered. This is a true story. Like back in the 70s, this woman was murdered. They found her body underneath the bridge. And so now, of course, they say that she haunts the bridge. That wasn't the crazy part of the story. The crazy part of the story is that they actually ended up I mean, this was in the 70s. So this many years later, finally catching the killer.
00:55:51
Raven Knight
He actually confessed to the murder.
00:55:52
Gabriel Von Graves
That's right. Mm-hmm.
00:55:53
Raven Knight
He's actually now sitting in prison for the murder of this woman.
00:55:55
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:55:57
Raven Knight
And I think the craziest part for me
00:55:57
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
00:56:01
Raven Knight
was the fact that when when Chad was telling us the story, this wasn't a huge case in this area. This wasn't something that people, you know, really talked about. The person that talks about this case all the time is Chad Lewis because of this haunting. So because of his work in the paranormal field, this case actually did still have some sort of...
00:56:20
Raven Knight
not attention, I guess attention would be the word, attention to it, so that now, this many years later, they were actually able to solve it, but it was because of the work that he kept doing and bringing attention to that case, not even on purpose, but kind of on purpose, if you know what I'm saying. So for me, as a true crime person, as a paranormal person, i was like,
00:56:45
Raven Knight
That is an amazing, an amazing thing to do. And you just would have to be so proud of yourself to actually be able to say, hey, it's because I've been bringing attention in this case that now it's solved.
00:56:59
Raven Knight
So for me, that was that was a huge, wow, that's amazing kind of moment.
00:57:03
Lee Hatfield
That's pretty cool. is it
00:57:04
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:57:05
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and it's sort like, yeah, being in emergency services, yeah, I've been to crime scenes, and it's sort of like, once a crime scene happens and it gets cleared up,
00:57:12
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:57:17
Lee Hatfield
yet they may or may not find the perpetrator, but if they can't, it could go dead, and yeah and that's it.
00:57:23
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:57:26
Gabriel Von Graves
All right.
00:57:27
Lee Hatfield
And then yeah it gets cleaned up, people move on, people sell the house or whatever, next family move in, and it's forgotten.
00:57:27
Raven Knight
Really fast.
00:57:34
Lee Hatfield
But at least with that, it's like because Chad kept mentioning it, the fact yeah and it's sort of like, that that's pretty cool.
00:57:39
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:57:41
Raven Knight
And to me, like, that's, it's the same thing with, like, paranormal, like, stories.
00:57:42
Lee Hatfield
That thing.
00:57:45
Raven Knight
If you're telling, you know, you're bringing attention to the the cases. I mean, we, there's a lot with the Villisca Axe Murder House, of course, where people just... There's a lot of drama sometimes in that, but at the end of the day, like they're still giving somewhat, hopefully we know that it's very, a lot of the time, very overdone in this, in this field, but they're still bringing attention to something that happened that was tragic. And there was, there was people still have their name out there. Yeah.
00:58:16
Lee Hatfield
That's it. And the fact that you Gabriel mentioned about energy earlier, the fact that these stories are repeated time and time again, is it that energy that's yeah it's keeping the story alive, but is it also keeping the spirit alive as well?
00:58:30
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:58:30
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:58:33
Raven Knight
Yeah.
00:58:33
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
00:58:34
Raven Knight
And it could be. I 100% believe that that could be something, you know.
00:58:37
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely. Absolutely.
00:58:38
Raven Knight
Yeah. Yeah.
00:58:40
Lee Hatfield
Okay, big man. Over to you.
00:58:42
Gabriel Von Graves
Well, I have a different...
00:58:46
Gabriel Von Graves
story than the Raven does. For me, it's meeting the people like like Yuli and like others that we have met along the way that I find that sticks out to me the most. Also, on the other side, the disappointment I have gotten getting into the paranormal field that it seems to be a money grab in a lot of instances. You go to these houses, you rent these houses. Sometimes they're $800, $900, $1,200 to rent. And you go in, they have these damn teddy bears. Dang teddy bears. I know you hate that.
00:59:18
Gabriel Von Graves
Dang teddy bears everywhere. And they try to reenact something scary. And for me, if you have a haunted house, and I love history. So going into these facilities, I don't mind paying the price for because they they reinvested and they helped restore these beautiful old locations. And I love that because I'm a big history guy.
00:59:38
Gabriel Von Graves
But at the same time, my disappointment when in this field when I go to these places is they try to create something that it's not. If it's a haunted, beautiful lakeate lo location, let it be a haunted, beautiful location. Don't put dolls on swings or have a doll room because that's the most haunted thing. Because I do think that that is that distracts people from the history and the momentum that there might actually be a paranormal entity in that location. And I think what it does as an after effect, I think it creates dysfunction in the paranormal worlds because you have these investigators coming in and they're trying to create something that's not there. And sometimes they bring things and they man the manifest things that aren't there. And i think that could be very distracting for people that are curious, like yourself, Lee and me and Raven, that
01:00:35
Gabriel Von Graves
in the truth that is paranormal and not something that's been creative because they can, so they can rent a building for $800 for six hours.
01:00:44
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, because we do like, I call it pay to play kind of thing.
01:00:49
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep. Absolutely.
01:00:50
Lee Hatfield
But a couple of the locations close by here are old jails.
01:00:55
Gabriel Von Graves
Oh, yeah.
01:00:56
Lee Hatfield
And they're pretty much how they were when they were closed.
01:01:00
Raven Knight
Yeah.
01:01:00
Lee Hatfield
yeah They haven't decorated.
01:01:02
Gabriel Von Graves
That's cool.
01:01:03
Lee Hatfield
So it's all the fixtures and fittings are the original ones.
01:01:06
Gabriel Von Graves
Right?
01:01:07
Lee Hatfield
So you've got that ambience, or ambience, whatever you want to call it, of how it used to be when it was a running prison.
01:01:10
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
01:01:14
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:01:16
Lee Hatfield
And yeah the same with the houses. So yeah don't put, like you said, don't put fake items just just to give that ambience of this is haunted and this kind of because yeah you're going to give people false hope.
01:01:23
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:01:27
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:01:32
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely.
01:01:32
Raven Knight
Oh yeah. Yeah.
01:01:33
Lee Hatfield
And it's just as just as good that to go to a yeah a cemetery and pick up a single EVP and you've had a really great night that you go to a house that looks the most spookiest in the world and you get absolutely nothing.
01:01:45
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:01:51
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely. Yeah.
01:01:52
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, we went to a they call it a manor, but it's a guy's house.
01:01:52
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
01:01:58
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
01:01:58
Lee Hatfield
And in the bottom floor of of his house, he's a like a Victorian circus entertainer, if you like. and he's got like a replica of the Elephant Man.
01:02:14
Lee Hatfield
He's got a replica of a body in a glass crypt and stuff like this.
01:02:14
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
01:02:18
Lee Hatfield
And it's like a Victorian parlour kind of evening. And he was talking about this little girl that murdered her parents after finding her father having an affair. She like stabbed her dad when and she got she got incarcerated.
01:02:34
Lee Hatfield
And they were is he basically simulated seance to kind of get her to communicate as part of the parlour tricks.
01:02:45
Lee Hatfield
And there was a li there was a box on on a on a stand.
01:02:45
Gabriel Von Graves
Greg?
01:02:49
Lee Hatfield
And he said, oh, this is some of her personal belongings in this box. And it got two wooden doors wrapped together, clothed by twine. And then on the top of the box, there was a crucifix.
01:03:02
Lee Hatfield
He made the excuse to go out the room for something. The crucifix flies off the box.
01:03:09
Gabriel Von Graves
Oh.
01:03:11
Lee Hatfield
And then you literally see the twine unwind itself.
01:03:14
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:03:16
Lee Hatfield
The doors fly open and then things start coming out of the box. I'm sat next door to this stand with a boxer and I'm pulling the twine. I'm thinking it's it's real twine. yeah The doors are like, how the hell did he do it? But it was such a fun evening.
01:03:32
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. And it was like, you know, one of those par Victorian politics kind of thing.
01:03:35
Raven Knight
Yeah.
01:03:36
Lee Hatfield
And the way that he did it was absolutely fantastic. And it was so cool.
01:03:41
Raven Knight
That's amazing.
01:03:42
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, it's it was absolutely like, it was a great evening. It really was. It was absolutely fantastic. But the house itself is as spooky as shit. ye Let's get it out of there.
01:03:54
Lee Hatfield
So and I know we've been talking for an hour and five minutes. Where does it go?
01:04:00
Gabriel Von Graves
Feels like five minutes absolutely does for me at least.
01:04:03
Lee Hatfield
And we haven't put our hands up for at least five more. So there we go. So if people are wondering why we do that, Raven went onto the table before we started. So we're see yeah she she wanted to see where my fan was.
01:04:13
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
01:04:16
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes.
01:04:16
Lee Hatfield
And that's all I'm going to say.
01:04:18
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
01:04:19
Raven Knight
And so now that's a that's a check, you know?
01:04:20
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
01:04:21
Raven Knight
we got
01:04:22
Gabriel Von Graves
Well, I'm letting Lee know it's not me when Raven has her hands underneath the desk.
01:04:22
Lee Hatfield
So.
01:04:26
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. Her excuse was, oh, sorry, I fell off my chair.
01:04:31
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes.
01:04:31
Lee Hatfield
OK.
01:04:31
Raven Knight
I did.
Authentic vs. Sensationalized Haunted Locations
01:04:31
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
01:04:31
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
01:04:31
Raven Knight
I did pull off my chair.
01:04:32
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep. it was It was a poor excuse.
01:04:33
Raven Knight
It's been known to happen.
01:04:34
Lee Hatfield
It was.
01:04:34
Gabriel Von Graves
Poor excuse.
01:04:35
Raven Knight
It's a terrible excuse. And he called me out on it.
01:04:37
Lee Hatfield
So did. and we it We did. We did. We did. So, yeah, the US is renowned for having a lot of haunted locations.
01:04:47
Raven Knight
Hmm.
01:04:49
Lee Hatfield
You've got a few big ones near you. but Have you actually been to one of the any of the big names locations? And if you add up tap tap tap the hold that breath.
01:05:03
Lee Hatfield
And before you answer, Did you actually experience anything or was it a washout?
01:05:10
Raven Knight
I know we're thinking the same thing.
01:05:13
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. So i prefer to go to places that have that that are not well-known.
01:05:13
Raven Knight
And three, two.
01:05:20
Raven Knight
Super big.
01:05:21
Gabriel Von Graves
The reason being is because I find it to be more real. All the places that are well-known, big names, we've we've been to Kansas City is littered with a bunch of them.
01:05:31
Gabriel Von Graves
And there's a lot of disappointment in those areas and there's a lot of sensationalization that that is associated that's associated with those. So for myself, I actually prefer the small unknown things that they're not well documented because it's very hard to go into a place that's well documented and document something differently.
01:05:53
Gabriel Von Graves
Right. Because, you know, I heard a voice in there's 600 people that said we heard the voice, too. Right. I got it this way. Got it that way. It said, you know, my lucky number, whatever. Right. Because they're always trying to one up you. But when when you go to a place that's not as commercialized,
01:06:11
Gabriel Von Graves
I find that there's a realism in that because you're the first one to catch things. Things are more relaxed. Things are more static because you get all these people going in. And if there is a he thought precedent thought process behind the paranormal, I would think that they get tired of people trying to catch stuff. so I think maybe also with kinds, everybody investigates differently and some are very rude about it. So I think that's a turnoff as well. So by going into a fresh place that doesn't have all that negativity of people trying to stir things up that aren't there, bringing, you know, their own baggage in there. I, I just find it more satisfaction going into a place that hasn't been well documented. Then we can start the documentation process for me.
01:06:57
Lee Hatfield
yeah And what I always tell people is yeah if they do exist, because we we haven't got concrete evidence that they do, but if ghosts and spirits do exist, they are not performing monkeys.
01:07:11
Raven Knight
No, they're not.
01:07:12
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:07:13
Lee Hatfield
And these locations, every Friday night every Saturday night, and you get every man and his dog and his teddy bears turning up.
01:07:13
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely.
01:07:13
Raven Knight
it does not.
01:07:16
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. Yeah.
01:07:20
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
01:07:21
Gabriel Von Graves
then
01:07:22
Lee Hatfield
See what i did there? Every man his dog and his teddy bear.
01:07:25
Gabriel Von Graves
I like it.
01:07:25
Raven Knight
I heard it.
01:07:25
Gabriel Von Graves
I like it.
01:07:25
Raven Knight
I heard it.
01:07:26
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
01:07:26
Gabriel Von Graves
I like it.
01:07:26
Lee Hatfield
yeah
01:07:27
Raven Knight
That's good.
01:07:27
Lee Hatfield
And yeah like you say, you've got arrogant investigators.
01:07:32
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
01:07:32
Lee Hatfield
You've got the ghost hunters that want to just go out and get scared, and they don't care about the evidence.
01:07:34
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
01:07:38
Gabriel Von Graves
Mm-hmm.
01:07:38
Raven Knight
yeah.
01:07:38
Lee Hatfield
If they get real evidence, they could just like blow it off. But then you get the true paranormal investigators that want to document the evidence. They want to experience whatever it is people are experiencing, and they will come away with a smile on their face if they've got a positive hit.
01:07:58
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:07:58
Raven Knight
Yep. and And to be said, I mean, Gabriel says, you know, and I agree, like i love going into like more of a residential or something that's not very well known.
Interest in Investigating Winchester House
01:08:10
Raven Knight
However, get me in the Winchester house. I would love that.
01:08:14
Gabriel Von Graves
I would love to go the Winchester Hills. Have you been, Lee?
01:08:16
Raven Knight
let' Listen. this
01:08:17
Lee Hatfield
I have not, but we know that Raven would fall because of all these unlevel floors and i it's like, oh, there's stairs there that are not finished.
01:08:18
Gabriel Von Graves
Okay.
01:08:21
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes.
01:08:22
Raven Knight
is dearest.
01:08:28
Lee Hatfield
Where's Raven?
01:08:29
Gabriel Von Graves
Oops, sorry, Lee.
01:08:29
Lee Hatfield
Uh-huh.
01:08:30
Gabriel Von Graves
That was on your desk. Sorry about that. Right, Raven?
01:08:32
Raven Knight
I thought that was a basement I was just trying to go into.
01:08:37
Gabriel Von Graves
Right.
01:08:37
Raven Knight
No, like but I love, but again, you know, i love things like that.
01:08:39
Lee Hatfield
Uh-huh.
01:08:43
Raven Knight
Like that, that place, such a mysterious place. Like I love if the history of it, even though like it makes no sense.
01:08:47
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
01:08:50
Raven Knight
I would go into a lot of those places as well. So I love doing stuff that's not super well-known, but I also love doing stuff that like has that little bit of history or a story to it too.
01:09:01
Gabriel Von Graves
Yes, hu
01:09:02
Raven Knight
So.
01:09:02
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. And one thing that I would like to do, and obviously it's going to cost a lot of money, is when you see these locations on TV that these, you know, like, let's call them famous, even though they're kind of not, but let's call them famous, investigators go to, and they get so much activity.
Skepticism of Paranormal TV Shows
01:09:22
Raven Knight
Yeah.
01:09:22
Gabriel Von Graves
yes yeah, yeah.
01:09:23
Lee Hatfield
I would like to go the week after. Because if you guys have got this much genuine activity, the chances are that if I go there the week after, I'm going to get some genuine results.
01:09:27
Raven Knight
Yeah.
01:09:31
Gabriel Von Graves
Right? Mm-hmm.
01:09:37
Raven Knight
Oh, yeah. It's going to ramped up.
01:09:38
Lee Hatfield
And yeah and it's yeah, exactly. And it's like, what are the chances of you having the same amount of evidence? Or would you be able to disprove some of the evidence that they've put out there?
01:09:52
Gabriel Von Graves
I would say that there's a lot of things that are made for TV.
01:09:52
Raven Knight
I bet you would. ye
01:09:56
Gabriel Von Graves
You could disprove a lot of things.
01:09:56
Raven Knight
much
01:09:59
Gabriel Von Graves
We like to say the jack the Zach Bagans of it all, because i think a lot of stuff that is on watchable TV is sensationalized.
01:09:59
Lee Hatfield
Yes.
01:10:08
Raven Knight
That's very, yeah.
01:10:08
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and could imagine sort of like, I've got this genuine EVP, have a listen to it. And the producer goes, yeah, can you just do that again? We want to want a different camera.
01:10:18
Gabriel Von Graves
Right. Yeah, right, right, right.
01:10:19
Raven Knight
two. We didn't get it good enough the first time.
01:10:19
Lee Hatfield
No, that's that's not how it works.
01:10:22
Raven Knight
No.
01:10:22
Gabriel Von Graves
And the camera's always right where it needs to be before something happens.
01:10:23
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
01:10:26
Gabriel Von Graves
And a lot of times, a lot of the stuff happens, as you know, Lee, when you're setting things up or taking things down. In fact, we have a good friend named Johnny Vortex that builds a lot of these machines that'll catch things.
01:10:40
Gabriel Von Graves
And he has a theory that there there's a noise that resonates from it. And it kind of scares away paranormal activity because they can hear it. it it's It's at a frequency that that disturbs them.
01:10:55
Gabriel Von Graves
So that's why I think for me, at least, i get a lot of activity before the stuff is on and after it's turned off because I think there is maybe irradiation or a noise that does kind of bleed through that that is distracting.
01:11:11
Lee Hatfield
Agreed. And yeah, I was talking to a guy that goes hunting for Bigfoot and Sasquatch and he literally said exactly exactly the same, that yeah they can see us and hear us way before and they sort of like, we're we're seeing them go, up more humans.
01:11:24
Gabriel Von Graves
Yep.
01:11:30
Lee Hatfield
Nope.
Life-Changing Motorcycle Accident and Spiritual Experience
01:11:31
Gabriel Von Graves
Right. Right.
01:11:31
Lee Hatfield
They're too noisy. Okay, guys. So we are coming towards the end, but I've got one question for Ray.
01:11:39
Raven Knight
Oh, boy.
01:11:41
Lee Hatfield
Does Gabriel ever admit that he's got mediumistic skills?
01:11:41
Raven Knight
I'm ready.
01:11:46
Raven Knight
Oh. I think he doesn't quite admit that, but he does admit that he is a beacon for for things. He does admit that.
01:11:58
Raven Knight
And I don't know if he realized that until after we met or not, but he can pick up on stuff for sure.
01:12:04
Lee Hatfield
Because excuse me, we're talking about you, shush now.
01:12:04
Gabriel Von Graves
Well,
01:12:07
Raven Knight
We're talking about you. Yeah.
01:12:09
Lee Hatfield
Yes.
01:12:09
Raven Knight
yeah
01:12:10
Lee Hatfield
But if someone sees, if someone hears, if someone senses, they've got mediumistic skills.
01:12:18
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm. I don't think he's ever even put those things together. I think, to be honest, I think Gabriel was just trying to live through life and all of these things just kept coming at him like, hey, hey, hey, you know, and I think now he's my, he may have finally accepted it besides the fact that he like is, runs away.
01:12:38
Raven Knight
Yeah.
01:12:39
Lee Hatfield
So the fact that I've now asked you, shall we ask him or shall I just move on?
01:12:44
Raven Knight
You can ask him. I say ask him.
01:12:46
Lee Hatfield
OK. Gabriel.
01:12:48
Gabriel Von Graves
So if I may, about, about three years ago, I was in a really bad motorcycle accident.
01:12:51
Lee Hatfield
No, you may and not.
01:12:52
Raven Knight
didn't ask you the question.
01:12:53
Lee Hatfield
fact
01:12:57
Gabriel Von Graves
I was rear ended by a truck. the truck was going 65, 70, I was going 35 and I was on a, on brand new Harley Davidson and he rear end me.
01:13:06
Gabriel Von Graves
And I remember flipping the bike a couple times and I remember seeing these beautiful pieces of my motorcycle go flying everywhere. And then I remember something cradling me and setting me down on the ground unharmed. I had maybe two, two scratches and it bothered me being an investigator. And I think this actually what kicked off the whole paranormal thing is because, I realized how precious life is and how quickly it can be taken from you. It's the only time that I was on my bike that I was not wearing a helmet.
01:13:39
Gabriel Von Graves
And I remember it bothered me because like the only time I was not wearing a helmet, I was in a motorcycle accident. And months went by and it kept on festing in my head. And then one day, i truly do believe I've heard i i heard the I heard God talk to me because I was asking why. Why did... I mean, no scratches. My motorcycle was messed up. Why? I mean, you what's special about me?
01:14:05
Gabriel Von Graves
And I remember hearing this voice in my head, and I wish I could remember exactly what it said. i don't think we're... At least for me, I don't think I was supposed to remember word from word, but I was supposed to remember the meaning of it. I remember when I heard this voice, I felt incredibly loved and warmed in a way that I really do not have the words to to to explain it. But I remember after this event, it seemed so clear.
01:14:29
Gabriel Von Graves
And it was in in this voice, I believe it was the the voice of God, was very humorous. And from that moment on, I realized, I've never truly walked alone in this world.
01:14:42
Gabriel Von Graves
So all those times I was scared, there was always something there that was comforting me. And then i started looking at life a little differently. i I'm a man of faith, so I have no question in my head what happens when my soul leaves this meat suit.
01:14:59
Gabriel Von Graves
But what fascinates me,
01:14:59
Raven Knight
Mm-hmm.
01:15:02
Gabriel Von Graves
is the difference of what I learned in church and what I experienced as an investigator. And even though I don't doubt my faith, I do find it interesting of things that do happen. And whether it's piquatory, Catholic religion believes that are if things are really bleeding through, whether it be a parallel dimension, That's what keeps me investigating is because I'm not looking for the answers.
01:15:25
Raven Knight
Thank you.
01:15:29
Gabriel Von Graves
I'm just enjoying the ride that it takes me on, meeting beautiful people like Yuli, becoming great friends with Raven Knight. we we We met wonderful people like Chumming with the Spirits.
01:15:40
Gabriel Von Graves
And then we met a lot of people that we decided that that's just not who we want to be with only because of different ways they investigate and the different ways they approach things.
01:15:51
Gabriel Von Graves
So I'm never really looking for at the answer, and I don't think there's anything special about me. I think that we all have a wonderful ride through this life that we have, and we just experience it differently.
01:15:58
Raven Knight
Hold
01:16:07
Lee Hatfield
Why didn't you say all that, Raven?
01:16:10
Gabriel Von Graves
so sorry.
01:16:11
Raven Knight
on, can we go back? Can we rewind that?
01:16:12
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. I don't.
01:16:13
Raven Knight
I will go back and say all of those things.
01:16:14
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, i think that I think that's a perfect answer. I'm not saying yes.
01:16:17
Gabriel Von Graves
i'm so sorry
01:16:18
Lee Hatfield
I'm not saying yes. I'm not saying no But there's something. But I don't know what it is, but she's which is absolutely fine.
01:16:25
Gabriel Von Graves
Wow.
01:16:26
Lee Hatfield
But just before we finish, talking about motorbikes, Google motorbike hanging off traffic light.
Closing Remarks and Future Collaborations
01:16:36
Lee Hatfield
bar because in, and I think it was BC a few weeks ago, motorbike got taken out by a car with such force and the the rider survived.
01:16:47
Lee Hatfield
The motorbike took off and you know the bars of traffic lights, it latched itself and it was hanging.
01:16:52
Gabriel Von Graves
wow
01:16:54
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, it's actually on.
01:16:54
Raven Knight
Oh my gosh.
01:16:55
Lee Hatfield
yeah it's And it's true.
01:16:55
Gabriel Von Graves
Wow.
01:16:56
Lee Hatfield
People thought it was AI, but it's actually and it it was in BC somewhere.
01:17:00
Gabriel Von Graves
Wow.
01:17:00
Raven Knight
That is crazy.
01:17:01
Gabriel Von Graves
That's fascinating.
01:17:01
Lee Hatfield
But that is so cool. Raven, Gabriel, it's been an absolute blast.
01:17:03
Raven Knight
That's crazy.
01:17:07
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely.
01:17:07
Lee Hatfield
life My fan has continued to work, and I'm nice and cool. hands Hands above the table. I'm so happy that I was able to appear on your podcast, and in turn, you've now been on mine.
01:17:22
Lee Hatfield
I think we're going to stay friends for a very long time. At least me and you will, Raven.
01:17:25
Gabriel Von Graves
I hope so.
01:17:29
Lee Hatfield
as i As I said on on your podcast, yeah and Raven agreed that, Gabriel, you've got the perfect face for radio. So that's...
01:17:39
Gabriel Von Graves
I've heard that more than once, Lee. Thank you for you know bringing it up again.
01:17:41
Raven Knight
Now just tell people that actually, that's the funniest part.
01:17:43
Gabriel Von Graves
That's great. and That's great.
01:17:44
Raven Knight
That's what tells people now too.
01:17:44
Lee Hatfield
Well, Gabriel sent me a message, mentioned the radio thing again.
01:17:45
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah.
01:17:48
Lee Hatfield
just
01:17:48
Gabriel Von Graves
Yeah. Yeah. yeah yeah
01:17:49
Lee Hatfield
But guys, it's been an absolute pleasure.
01:17:51
Gabriel Von Graves
Thank you for the experience.
01:17:53
Lee Hatfield
Hopefully in the future, we'll we'll have you back on and we'll talk some more, winging it for the entire evening.
01:17:59
Gabriel Von Graves
Absolutely.
01:17:59
Raven Knight
I love it.
01:17:59
Lee Hatfield
but for now But for now, guys, well go on.
01:17:59
Gabriel Von Graves
You are.
01:18:02
Lee Hatfield
go on you're You're a woman.
01:18:03
Raven Knight
was going to say thank you for having us.
01:18:04
Lee Hatfield
You have to have a last word, don't you?
01:18:05
Raven Knight
Yes. Yes. I finally recognized. Thank you, Lee. I was just going to say thank you for having us on. No, we, we love, we loved having you on. I think you're an amazing person in, are not just an amazing person. You're amazing host. So we've had I've had a blast. I can't speak for my cohost here, but I've had a blast.
01:18:26
Lee Hatfield
It's true. I am amazing.
01:18:27
Raven Knight
You are amazing.
01:18:28
Lee Hatfield
but But guys, thanks very much. You have a great rest of the evening. Take care now.
01:18:32
Raven Knight
Thank you.
01:18:33
Gabriel Von Graves
Thank you, sir.
01:18:33
Raven Knight
You too, Lee.
01:18:35
Lee Hatfield
Bye-bye.