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S2 E17 - Things Paranormal Netherlands - Paranormal Investigators
27 Plays14 days ago
Today i am delighted to have with me, Mary from Things Netherland and Shane from Ravens Paranormal.
We started off talking about Mary hearing German Jackboots as a child, and Shane's visit from a deceased Great Grandfather.
From investigating with separate teams, to creating their own, and finally collaborating together, we spoke about the problems and issues than can happen with Paranormal Investigation teams.
Mary and Shane shared with me personal stories of visiting cemeteries, as well as how the Dutch Paranormal investigations differ from The UK and North America
They spoke about how they have experienced Ghosts and Spirits from different nationalities, including American, German and Polish.
We finally spoke about the UFO and Cryptid culture, and their Things Paranormal Netherlands Podcast.
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Transcript
Intro
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:12
Lee Hatfield
Hello everybody and welcome to the latest episode of SIPA Paranormal Chronicles. Today i have got people from a different country that I have never spoke to before. I've got Mary from Things Netherland and I've got Shane from Ravens Paranormal.
00:00:30
Lee Hatfield
Mary, Shane, welcome and thank you for spending some time with me.
00:00:35
Shane&Mary things.NL
Thank you very much. Yeah.
Engagement on TikTok and Guest Appearance
00:00:38
Lee Hatfield
and so As we've been speaking about offline, you guys have been stalking me on TikTok, so I thought it'd be a really great idea for for you to to come on and let's talk about a different country than England and North America, which um'm not which I normally do.
00:00:52
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
Mary's Paranormal Journey
00:00:55
Shane&Mary things.NL
what
00:00:55
Lee Hatfield
So if we can start at the beginning and if you can both in turn tell me how you first got interested into the paranormal and then we'll go from there.
00:01:06
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah yeah Well, as a child, I had my childhood experiences. I live in Arnhem and the area is known from a bridge too far.
00:01:18
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I lived in the center and it was invaded by Germans. And as a kid, I saw this guy standing next to my bedroom only at night and it creeped me out and no one believed me. And growing up, I heard them, I saw them, the footsteps, knockings on my door and well,
00:01:50
Shane&Mary things.NL
I tried not to notice it and not to react. And when I was 18, I met my biological father and he's a psychic medium.
00:02:02
Shane&Mary things.NL
And he told me all about spirits and and what that was all about. And that was the starting point of jumping into the paranormal by being a psychic, using hypnosis to go to past lives, all that.
00:02:28
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I joined my first team. in 2000 and it was a team of Reiki masters who went to abandoned locations, so urbexing, to see if they could capture anything but also residential investigations and cleansing the areas. And in 2016, I joined an official investigation team
00:03:04
Shane&Mary things.NL
But that guy who ran the team was a bit narcissistic and I skipped it and created my own team as Cold Spot Eye and got connected with Things Universal and got the opportunity become a European liaison for the Things Network.
00:03:33
Shane&Mary things.NL
and Yeah, Jeremy asked me if I wanted to be head of the chapter from the Netherlands and reaching out to different teams in the Netherlands.
00:03:45
Shane&Mary things.NL
Well, I took the chance and here we are since 2018. Yeah.
00:03:52
Lee Hatfield
That's really cool. So when you mentioned that you could hear footsteps, and I don't want to be derogatory, but what was it like like military footsteps?
00:03:58
Shane&Mary things.NL
yes
00:04:06
Lee Hatfield
like we yeah We know that the Germans used to wear jackboots. So what was that the kind of thing that you heard?
00:04:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, yeah.
00:04:12
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, and it started with knocking on doors after you heard that boots coming up the stairs and walking through a living room. And the knocking turned into banging.
00:04:27
Shane&Mary things.NL
And most of the time and I jumped under the covers hung that and fell asleep. And i have to be honest, since I was 12, I slept with my lights on because I was scared what was coming into my room.
00:04:43
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:04:44
Lee Hatfield
yeah i i i love it how people think that just by doing that it's going to protect them
00:04:51
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
Shane's Paranormal Encounter Story
00:04:54
Lee Hatfield
oh okay shane your turn
00:04:56
Shane&Mary things.NL
when i was i think 10 or 11 i had my first experience with a full-bodied apparition and i was asleep and i woke up from somebody sitting on my bed and i was like okay my mom or my dad is in the room what the hell is going on so i opened my eyes and i saw all a very strange man looking at me which scared the complete shit out of me. Did the same thing as Mary used to do, took my covers over my head.
00:05:25
Shane&Mary things.NL
And i had had been there for half an hour before I was like, okay, now it's gone.
00:05:25
Lee Hatfield
Let's do it.
00:05:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
now I can come back out. I back then had no idea what it was. And I met my now wife as as a friend.
00:05:43
Shane&Mary things.NL
started talking about it and she didn't act strange or anything because I talked about spirits and we immediately i had a connection and she taught me a lot about what the paranormal was figured she was two years younger than me and she knew more than me so that was like
00:06:03
Shane&Mary things.NL
how do you know these things well I'm a witch and I was like you're what I'm a witch so
00:06:07
Lee Hatfield
Bye.
00:06:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
Okay, good, great. and She taught me about paranormal and I said, but who was sitting on my bed? And she's like, I don't know. I was like, I don't know either.
00:06:19
Shane&Mary things.NL
And my mom grabbed her photo book of people that were deceased. My great grandfather was there and I was like, that man right there was sitting on my bed.
00:06:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
She was like, well, that's not possible. And I'm like, why not? Because he passed when you were one. And I was like, what But I saw that man and she was like, well, that's your great grandpa.
00:06:43
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I was like, okay, what's he doing here? Well, that scared me. But after that, I got very interested in the paranormal and read about it. I wanted to go after them to see if I can get answers.
00:06:59
Lee Hatfield
call them on one of their own.
00:06:59
Shane&Mary things.NL
And that's when I started joining teams, which I should not have done in the end, but yeah, lessons learned. And I started my own team and then I met Mary in the to collaborate. So yeah, it's a very good collaboration right now.
00:07:16
Lee Hatfield
And they they always say that things happen for a reason.
00:07:20
Shane&Mary things.NL
Oh yeah.
00:07:21
Lee Hatfield
So, yeah, obviously the the previous teams and I've been in a previous team as well compared to the one that I'm in now. And obviously that didn't work out, so we actually collaborated with the guys are I'm with now.
00:07:36
Lee Hatfield
But it's amazing how you can be with a few people and and you kind of think, this is not the way that I want to go about it. I want to go down this road, not this road.
00:07:46
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:07:49
Shane&Mary things.NL
yep
00:07:49
Lee Hatfield
And then yeah you create your own teams and then you can do things exactly how you
Challenges in Paranormal Investigations
00:07:54
Lee Hatfield
want. Because I used to be a skeptic for the longest time. But then I thought myself, well, if I'm going to investigate, I want to be able to to rule out everything natural first before I look at the paranormal side of it.
00:08:14
Lee Hatfield
And that can take a good few hours just to rule out all the normal stuff. So yeah we're kind of trying to do things methodically yeah and straight down the line. Because the first time you do something and you get caught out for faking or whatever, then your reputation just plummets.
00:08:35
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, completely agree.
00:08:36
Lee Hatfield
The more people that have that kind of mentality, the better, I think.
00:08:42
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, agree.
00:08:44
Lee Hatfield
So let's go to a little bit further in time. You both joined your respective first investigations. Can you remember your very first investigation with team?
00:08:58
Lee Hatfield
Not necessarily the team you're with now, but a team.
00:09:03
Shane&Mary things.NL
Do you want to go first? Because I have to think about this
00:09:06
Lee Hatfield
yeah i' I'll put you on the spot, don't worry.
00:09:11
Shane&Mary things.NL
one. No problem at all. We went to a fortress and there was an English investigator as well and they a were in contact back then.
00:09:28
Shane&Mary things.NL
And our narcissistic founder had made his mind up, everything he thought he saw was paranormal. And it sounds like Zach Bagans, but he thought it was demonic.
00:09:50
Lee Hatfield
That's what was thinking it about when you were saying that.
00:09:53
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, it was infested by 12 demons and he was playing mind tricks and I couldn't deal with it.
00:10:06
Shane&Mary things.NL
So I did my own thing in the fortress and I came in contact with a guy and he was brushing my face.
00:10:19
Shane&Mary things.NL
And it startled me a bit, a bit. But I kept sitting there for an hour thinking it could be the wind, it could be a
00:10:32
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:10:33
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, but he keeps kept stroking my face, so I had to discard everything. And later on, there was a claim. they There were children heard footsteps, children voices, and I did capture it on my voice recorder.
00:10:53
Shane&Mary things.NL
And there was this big hole. And you could talk there and have a conversation. and everything started echoing in my head. So it didn't make sense at the end, but I did take some pictures and I got some pictures of some light anomalies, which we can't explain what was happened.
00:11:21
Shane&Mary things.NL
I took 10 pictures and these anomalies were just on three. and but The previous were perfectly fine. The last one perfectly fine. and they were every time surrounding the rampart and I couldn't explain it and This guy, he said, well, it might be the flashlight, but I didn't use flashlight, night vision cameras, so you don't don't use flash.
00:11:54
Shane&Mary things.NL
And he tried to debunk everything and it ended up me going home for three hours ride about four hours earlier.
00:12:08
Lee Hatfield
Wow. And it's interesting that you mentioned the REM pod because we were at an investigation about a year or so ago and the building had no air conditioning, but this was in and in the summer.
00:12:23
Lee Hatfield
So when we weren't investigating, we had that we had the fans on and we actually realized it was a big fan, but whenever you unplugged it or plugged it in, it would set the REM pod off.
00:12:35
Shane&Mary things.NL
Oh, that's that's an interesting.
00:12:35
Lee Hatfield
have and It was kind of, yeah, like the surge of power. And so the fan was on the floor.
00:12:39
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:12:42
Lee Hatfield
There was a fireplace and the Rempod was on the shelf above the fireplace. And the first time we did it, we thought it was just, oh, okay. But then hang on a minute, put it back in again.
00:12:52
Lee Hatfield
Put it back in. Rempod went off, pulled it out. Rempod went off.
00:12:56
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:12:56
Lee Hatfield
And it's it's really interesting that people think, that every time a REM pod goes off, it has to be paranormal. But unfortunately, they can be manipulated by electrical equipment.
00:13:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, even by walkie-talkies. So, yeah.
00:13:12
Lee Hatfield
Exactly. Yeah.
00:13:15
Shane&Mary things.NL
So if a rampart goes off, I do need more confirmation. So if we have our ghost box with us, it has to have voices.
00:13:22
Lee Hatfield
Exactly.
00:13:29
Shane&Mary things.NL
has to... go off, my your math meter has to react. And still then I don't consider it as paranormal, but interesting.
00:13:42
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, and we kind of do a similar sort of thing. So, yes, we do use cat balls, but we will put them on on a vibration device so that if both of them go off, you know that somebody's walked past them and the vibrations cause both of them. But if one goes off and not the other, then we have to look into it even more because what's causing one and not the other?
00:14:08
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Yeah.
00:14:08
Lee Hatfield
So it's good that you put those kind of things to the test because you have to rule out the natural before you look at the supernatural.
00:14:19
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
00:14:21
Lee Hatfield
So, Shane, have you thought of something yet?
00:14:23
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, I have.
00:14:25
Lee Hatfield
No.
00:14:26
Shane&Mary things.NL
It was actually with my own team and I had a guest investigator with me, a close friend of mine. We went to our local cemetery.
00:14:37
Shane&Mary things.NL
There are war graves over there as well, so and and monumental sightings.
00:14:45
Shane&Mary things.NL
One moment she was giggling, the guest investigator. And were like, why are you giggling? You never giggle. What the hell is this? So that was weird. And then I realized next to us was the children part of the the cemetery.
00:15:00
Shane&Mary things.NL
So I was like, I think I know where it comes from. Because when children's spirits turn tend to come around, you you start giggling. You start getting gigglish and you want to play jokes and everything.
00:15:12
Shane&Mary things.NL
so I was like, you know what? We're going that way. We'll see what happens. A friend of mine lost his child, six months old, so we were going to pay our respects as well. I was there and I was like, let's play hide and seek.
00:15:26
Shane&Mary things.NL
See what happens. Just play with the kids because I knew they were there. and As soon as I said, you want to play hide and seek in Dutch, a voice in my recorder said, who are you?
00:15:40
Shane&Mary things.NL
children's voice and that was for me the most beautiful confirmation that there's children still there and it was a playful voice so it wanted to play but it was like probably taught that not to play with strangers which is a normal thing so the little child asked me who are you in dutch and that was one of my class a evps i still have them on my computer but
00:16:08
Lee Hatfield
Oh, come on, Shane.
00:16:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. I have too much shit on my computer.
00:16:11
Lee Hatfield
Mary, could you could you just like whack him for me? Because it's got yeah he's got to get his his computer all sorted out.
00:16:19
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, I can clean it up one day.
00:16:20
Lee Hatfield
so So because you guys are in Holland... how is the culture in holland for paranormal investigating compared wait you're probably not going to know what but yeah is it the same like it throughout europe because over here we we have a few locations where i live but it's very difficult to get into because the city owned If you go over over the border into the US, it's very easy to get many locations because you can pay for it. So what's the kind of what's the culture like in Holland with regard to paranormal investigating?
00:17:05
Shane&Mary things.NL
It sucks. It really sucks.
Notable Investigations and Evidence Challenges
00:17:10
Shane&Mary things.NL
It's very difficult to get into locations. it's Most of the locations are owned by non-profits, organizations, and friends of the locations who either don't don't believe in the paranormal or are scared you're gonna cause hauntings and scare off visitors.
00:17:37
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:17:38
Shane&Mary things.NL
So you don't come in and they don't look at it for extra money or extra income, know but just for the bad name. And for example, I had one location and I had the privilege to investigate there. It was in the middle of the center and it's connected to the historical basements, but there is a restaurant now running in that place and those historical basements and it's haunted.
00:18:17
Shane&Mary things.NL
personnel are afraid to close off at evenings because of the voices and the things moving and glasses falling off the shelves.
00:18:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I got permission to investigate, but I wasn't allowed to name the place. I wasn't allowed to film so it would be recognizable
00:18:47
Lee Hatfield
Right.
00:18:47
Shane&Mary things.NL
and everything I captured, I had to share with him if there was anything I could push out public. And we had this one moment, we heard loud banging and it was so loud and a German voice speaking and no one is doing anything.
00:19:14
Shane&Mary things.NL
evenings or during that time, shouting in German in our city center. But I wasn't allowed to put it out because the sign of the restaurant was in the picture.
00:19:24
Lee Hatfield
yeah
00:19:28
Lee Hatfield
yeah oh and we have places like that where they don't want the publicity of their location being haunted and then we have another location that's just been bought by a different company the owner doesn't believe in the paranormal so he doesn't want investigators going there anymore but that was a really popular location And it it it's just unfortunate that these kind of places, yeah, these things happen.
00:19:59
Lee Hatfield
But, yeah, you have to do the best in what you can.
00:20:00
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:20:02
Lee Hatfield
So when you guys are investigating, bearing in mind what happened in the past, when you get verbal responses,
00:20:02
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:20:17
Lee Hatfield
do they tend to be in Dutch, English, or German? Or a mixture, all of the above.
00:20:24
Shane&Mary things.NL
All of the awards. Yeah, every language. we We've had Spanish, we've had French, we've had German, vo Polish, English, Dutch, you name it, we had it.
00:20:37
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:20:39
Lee Hatfield
And I'm hoping that you guys can speak all of those languages so that you know.
00:20:44
Shane&Mary things.NL
No. The only one I really do not speak is French. I do a little bit of Spanish and German, Polish, no. English, yeah, yeah easily.
00:20:57
Shane&Mary things.NL
In Dutch, I don't know. i always lose my words. Yeah.
00:21:02
Lee Hatfield
Hang on. When you speak in Dutch, you get confused. Hang on a minute.
00:21:05
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:21:06
Lee Hatfield
minute. Yeah. yeah I've got no words to say about that. so So obviously when you kind of Google the top launched the top haunted locations, it comes up with quite a few names.
00:21:25
Lee Hatfield
You can do the same in Canada, but just because it's coming up with names that... are recognized of having paranormal activity doesn't mean you can go there like we have a big hotel in ottawa that's recognized as being haunted but the only way you can go and investigate is if you go and pay for the room for the night yeah they won't let you go in and because of all your customers so
00:21:37
Shane&Mary things.NL
no
00:21:55
Lee Hatfield
Do you guys have either favorite locations or popular locations that you can go to and you can pretty much guarantee that you're going to get some sort of evidence?
00:22:11
Shane&Mary things.NL
I have.
Favored Haunted Locations
00:22:12
Shane&Mary things.NL
me tell about Well, as I live in Arnhem, have the privilege to live on the war grounds.
00:22:23
Shane&Mary things.NL
So if I want to, I could do it in my own home.
00:22:31
Lee Hatfield
Au revoir.
00:22:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
And otherwise I go to the center and we have some outdoors locations and you can investigate there and you get responses and also intelligent responses.
00:22:50
Shane&Mary things.NL
that Like we have a park and Germans were stationed there and everyone who entered the park was shot.
00:23:01
Shane&Mary things.NL
And we sat there during an investigation, but we had some time off and we were joking. do you want a cigarette? No, I have i i don't have cigarettes. I said, i have Palmal or Marlboro.
00:23:18
Shane&Mary things.NL
And i was forgetting forgetting that the spirit box was on. And there was this voice coming on, passport bitte.
00:23:29
Shane&Mary things.NL
So give me your passport. And it was such a clear German reaction. And the first time, pretty nice.
00:23:37
Lee Hatfield
Wow.
00:23:39
Shane&Mary things.NL
And the second time, it wasn't that nice.
00:23:46
Lee Hatfield
So how much interaction do you get with German spirits compared to other nationalities?
00:23:59
Shane&Mary things.NL
Depending on the place you're at. This afternoon we went to a museum and the focus is there are on the German victims.
00:24:12
Shane&Mary things.NL
and they found lots of German soldiers in the woods over there. So probably you get more German responses in the area of the airport, which was used by the Germans.
00:24:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
You get a lot of German responses there and pretty much in the close area of the bridge. And for the rest, even American and English and Polish.
00:24:48
Lee Hatfield
because it it's quite interesting because obviously I'm from England originally, so we have a lot of history. We have a lot of war history. You guys are from Holland, Netherlands, and you have even more history because that's where the main yeah the main battles were fought in Europe.
00:25:06
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:25:08
Lee Hatfield
But over here, they don't kind of get the same military interaction with spirits. But if they do, it's from a a more distant period than World War I, World War II, because all the military here flew over the pond to fight into Europe.
00:25:29
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
00:25:32
Lee Hatfield
So yeah you can go to Gettysburg and you can see some of the old American soldiers and that kind of thing, but they don't get any like World War I, World War II-based stuff because of the the lack of activity this side this side of the world.
00:25:50
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:25:53
Shane&Mary things.NL
if
00:25:53
Lee Hatfield
So because Mary's done some talking, Shane, it's your turn. Because i thought i feel like you I feel like you're being a little bit too quiet.
00:25:58
Shane&Mary things.NL
look
00:26:02
Shane&Mary things.NL
No, no, no. I'll just leave here and then I'll go back. That's fine.
00:26:06
Lee Hatfield
So Mary's mentioned about her kind of interaction. Do you have similar experiences?
00:26:13
Shane&Mary things.NL
Well, yeah. i have two favorite places or on my side of the country. I have my local forest, which has a, for us, what we think is a supposed a victim of a murder.
00:26:30
Shane&Mary things.NL
It's a man and he really does not like people in army clothing.
00:26:36
Lee Hatfield
and
00:26:36
Shane&Mary things.NL
I always got my boots on, my army pants and back then a bomber jacket. But he really did didn' not like me.
00:26:47
Shane&Mary things.NL
And he also had a daughter and his daughter did like me so much that she is now living in my house. I supposedly took her with me. But I always have responses over there. And the local forest is a place where teenagers come, at least the emo teenagers, and they complain about everything probably and make the atmosphere very negative during night times.
00:27:16
Shane&Mary things.NL
So, yeah, we always have responses there. one day One time I got attacked in the back, or at least it felt like that. I wasn't even ready setting up my stuff and I was actually busy getting my gear out with my back against the pond.
00:27:35
Shane&Mary things.NL
and I heard something running up to me like children hide and stopped in front of me as and as I turned around and it ran back in and dove into the pond.
00:27:48
Shane&Mary things.NL
And we actually sprinted up there to see what was in there, what got in the pond. It was not even a wrinkle of water i'm moving. But we heard the splash and we had no idea what it was.
00:28:04
Shane&Mary things.NL
That stands with me to this day because, one, I couldn't do my investigation properly no more because I was just flabbergasted by what happened.
00:28:12
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:28:12
Shane&Mary things.NL
Second, my ass was in pain because I landed on my suitcase, which is very good to do. I jumped pretty high that left the mark for at least a week.
00:28:23
Shane&Mary things.NL
And i still have undone business there. So I have to go back and I still want to see or hear who did that. Because there's still a building to come that makes me run out because i I'm never scared, actually.
00:28:39
Shane&Mary things.NL
And that's something I really want to do. I am paranormal investigator. I want to do everything logically. i want to see when something is paranormal. When it's not, i want to debunk things. But I also like to get scared.
00:28:50
Lee Hatfield
Oh, yeah.
00:28:51
Shane&Mary things.NL
But I never got scared.
00:28:51
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:28:52
Shane&Mary things.NL
So I still waiting for the one building that's going let me run out. And the other one is the bunkers in Aymoud.
00:28:57
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:29:01
Shane&Mary things.NL
Those bunkers, there's a couple underground bunkers. I love those places. They make me, I almost feel like and I'm at home. And always get responses there.
00:29:14
Lee Hatfield
Interesting. And I think when you said that you'd got unfinished business and you wanted to go back, I'm sure Mary put her hand up then and said, Yeah, I'll come with you.
00:29:22
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:29:23
Lee Hatfield
I'm sure that's what you did. You were like, Oh, yeah, I'll come. Definitely.
00:29:27
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Yep.
00:29:29
Lee Hatfield
So are you guys fans of of all the gadgets, all the bells and whistles, or do you kind of stick to your basics when you're using your equipment?
00:29:40
Shane&Mary things.NL
Well, we always stick to the basics. Yeah. But we tend to to try to test things out. If it's new, see what happens. If it works, if it doesn't work, it goes. Yeah. If it works, we tend to try it but and use it when we can.
00:29:54
Shane&Mary things.NL
But we always stick with the basics. So camera, recorder, EMF detector, that's it. yeah And ourselves, of course.
00:30:04
Lee Hatfield
So I know you mentioned about hypnosis and Reiki masters earlier. So do either of you or both of you have mediumistic skills that you use in investigations?
00:30:18
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yes.
00:30:21
Lee Hatfield
point the finger
00:30:21
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, she does. My wife does. Surprise. We didn't expect that.
00:30:31
Lee Hatfield
So do you actually do you actually hear or or or see things, Mary?
00:30:37
Shane&Mary things.NL
see, smell, taste.
00:30:42
Shane&Mary things.NL
Every sense is works and is on. Sometimes even paints. And it's not always fun, but it's a part of the job.
00:30:58
Lee Hatfield
Exactly. Exactly.
00:30:59
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. ye
00:31:00
Lee Hatfield
So Shane, does your wife go on investigations with you with with her being a witch?
00:31:05
Shane&Mary things.NL
Whenever she can, yeah. i have two kids and I really do not have a babysitter. I always have to wait and see if we can find a babysitter to watch the kids.
00:31:15
Shane&Mary things.NL
And if they can, then yes, she will come along. if If we don't, then she will stay in a distance and we will keep in close contact with her. and because she is a witch she can protect us from distance knows when something's wrong we always have my our phones on airplane mode or off well because my wife and i know each other for so long we have a connection like that I know or I sense when something's going on and she needs to contact me and then I put my phone on I'm like Mary I have to call my wife because something's up and then I call her and she's like okay you have to watch out watch your back
00:31:34
Lee Hatfield
Of course, yeah.
00:31:54
Shane&Mary things.NL
whatever it' the problem at that moment. So that's a weird connection, but it works. Yeah.
00:32:00
Lee Hatfield
yeah
00:32:01
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:32:01
Lee Hatfield
i I kind of find that that information is really good if the person sat stood next door to you. But if they call you and go, oh yeah, just let you know, watch your back. good okay Oh, I've got to go.
00:32:12
Lee Hatfield
Bye. What do you mean?
00:32:16
Shane&Mary things.NL
She tells me what's going on. Trust me.
00:32:18
Lee Hatfield
So.
00:32:18
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:32:21
Lee Hatfield
so
00:32:23
Lee Hatfield
One of the normal questions that I guess to get asked is, you have you ever been scared or what was your worst experience or what was your best experience?
00:32:36
Lee Hatfield
So apart from the ones that you've just mentioned, can you guys give me like, you something that happened so bad that you would never go back or something was so exciting and so like unbelievable that you can't wait to go back if that makes sense
00:32:57
Shane&Mary things.NL
It does make sense. You have to think about it. Yeah.
00:33:01
Shane&Mary things.NL
I got scared, but I want to go back because I'm a bit of a masochist.
00:33:13
Shane&Mary things.NL
I was doing some field investigation and and We got some responses
Intense Investigations and Truth-Seeking
00:33:20
Shane&Mary things.NL
from this woman who was telling us she lived in Amsterdam and she helped building up Arnhem and I thought it was bollocks.
00:33:34
Shane&Mary things.NL
So we did some research and it turned out, Arnhem was destroyed completely. We didn't have anything, no doors, no windows, no beds, no clothes, nothing. And Amsterdam had set up a fund to help us here to restore everything.
00:34:01
Shane&Mary things.NL
So the windows in the old buildings you see are originally from Amsterdam and the doors are from Amsterdam and there is a lot.
00:34:10
Lee Hatfield
Oh, wow.
00:34:15
Shane&Mary things.NL
So the vibes were the same as before. So I was curious to go back and We aren't allowed after dusk in the woods, but hey, it happens.
00:34:33
Lee Hatfield
It happens.
00:34:35
Shane&Mary things.NL
I forget the time.
00:34:37
Lee Hatfield
but
00:34:37
Shane&Mary things.NL
So we we heard some things and I told her because I was with another investigator and and I said, oh, those are rabbits or maybe wild borg or deer.
00:34:52
Shane&Mary things.NL
And we kept hearing those footsteps. But we saw also car lights and at one point I said to her, the fines are so, so expensive.
00:35:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
Let's pick the things up and go to a safe place. where we can stay all night. So we did that and we walked back to the car and I lost her.
00:35:21
Shane&Mary things.NL
I said, what you're doing? What you doing? She said, I saw something. I saw a light. I said, you're nuts. I saw a light. I said, well, now we have a problem.
00:35:34
Shane&Mary things.NL
The police are coming. So I said, come on, we're going to the car. So I turned around and I made two steps and i heard very loud bifiddle footsteps rushing towards me.
00:35:53
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I didn't have the nerves to to watch.
00:35:59
Shane&Mary things.NL
But I walked like a bad ass girl towards my car.
00:36:06
Lee Hatfield
Bye.
00:36:07
Shane&Mary things.NL
When I came to my car, I picked up some cigarettes and brushed my face because it was wet from the sweat. And I said to her, what a fuck was that?
00:36:22
Shane&Mary things.NL
And we went back a few weeks later with some guys. And one was wearing Crocs and one boots. one sneak us and they made turns by rushing between the trees just to try and replicate the things we heard. If it was biphidal, if it was maybe a wolf or fox or a mad wild borg.
00:36:54
Shane&Mary things.NL
So we concluded it was biphidal. but we couldn't replicate it without those guys walking into trees.
00:37:05
Lee Hatfield
Bye.
00:37:06
Shane&Mary things.NL
So it was very interesting. I always wet myself. And last time we went back together. And as soon as you walk in the area, the vibes are so negative and it feels very, very dark.
00:37:27
Shane&Mary things.NL
I still can't explain what we encountered and it wasn't an animal, that's for sure. And it scared the hell out of me, but I want to go back and try and find out what it was.
00:37:45
Shane&Mary things.NL
It
00:37:46
Lee Hatfield
That sounds like but like a road trip to me. think
00:37:51
Shane&Mary things.NL
is.
00:37:53
Lee Hatfield
OK, Shane, your turn.
00:37:55
Shane&Mary things.NL
Uh, yeah, well, like I told you with the thing that rushed towards me as well, it's the same thing.
00:38:01
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:38:02
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. i went Yeah.
00:38:04
Lee Hatfield
There you go. There you go. Problem solved. There you go.
00:38:06
Shane&Mary things.NL
know It's, it's, it's, it's a different location, but it's, it's the same, the thing that occurred, but that's something I want to go back to you see if I can without the teenagers, because they still hang around there and they're very annoying.
00:38:15
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:38:23
Shane&Mary things.NL
Sometimes want to smack them, which is not allowed, probably.
00:38:26
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, people frown upon that, don't they?
00:38:27
Shane&Mary things.NL
But I want to go back there.
00:38:30
Lee Hatfield
saw like Whacking people.
00:38:32
Shane&Mary things.NL
I can tell these teenagers, they're ghosts here, and they're going to probably laugh and still they and stay there. And I'm like, doesn't work.
00:38:38
Lee Hatfield
Well, yeah, because they're gullible. so as well
00:38:41
Shane&Mary things.NL
Exactly.
00:38:41
Lee Hatfield
and
00:38:41
Shane&Mary things.NL
Exactly.
00:38:42
Lee Hatfield
So how did Things Netherland and Ravens Paranormal get together?
First Joint Investigation and Partnership
00:38:50
Shane&Mary things.NL
We investigated in the past. A mutual friend introduced us and we were going to location in the area near the German border. eye And I thought it was really interesting because it's called the Devil's Mountain.
00:39:15
Shane&Mary things.NL
And there's a lot of history. There was a murder over there, but also there were claimed to be witches. I've gathered there, there's a witch's chapel, but there's also a history from World War II, German soldiers with their dogs.
00:39:37
Shane&Mary things.NL
So I'm in... always in and that was the first time we investigated together and it was success it was and very interesting and later on we did an investigation here in the area and it was fun as well Yeah, except for the fine in the end. Yeah, the fine at the end, because we went in the area after that, and it's not allowed. It is not.
00:40:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I couldn't talk myself out of it.
00:40:10
Lee Hatfield
Steve.
00:40:14
Lee Hatfield
Steve Brown- So I've made a note you both like breaking the law.
00:40:14
Shane&Mary things.NL
No.
00:40:17
Lee Hatfield
Kate got it. Yeah. Steve
00:40:19
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. and If it comes to that, then yeah. Yeah.
00:40:22
Lee Hatfield
Brown- So have you guys actually managed to do any best investigations in any of the surrounding countries?
00:40:32
Shane&Mary things.NL
A small investigation in England. Yeah. yeah What was it called?
00:40:36
Lee Hatfield
Where did you go?
00:40:39
Shane&Mary things.NL
went together, we went to Norwich, Norfolk.
00:40:46
Lee Hatfield
OK.
00:40:46
Shane&Mary things.NL
And I've been to Bradford before that, the year before that, and I had an investigation in Old Bus Museum with another team from England itself.
00:40:57
Shane&Mary things.NL
and That was very interesting. yeah That was very interesting.
00:41:04
Lee Hatfield
It's funny you mentioned Norfolk because my home county is the one above Norfolk. It's Lincolnshire.
00:41:09
Shane&Mary things.NL
luke That was very close by, yeah.
00:41:10
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. Yeah, which it always confuses people because my hometown was Boston, which there's a Boston over here. No, no, no, no, no. Mine's the original one, not the fake one that's down the road.
00:41:22
Shane&Mary things.NL
a
00:41:22
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. It's actually quite funny because I went home in November. and we went to this World War I slash World War II museum, my wife was talking to the owner, and he's actually invited us over to do an investigation at his museum.
00:41:42
Lee Hatfield
Like, it's like you do realise, like, all this equipment from Canada to the UK.
00:41:42
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:41:48
Lee Hatfield
But, yeah, at least I wouldn't have to pay for accommodation. That would be sorted because but it's in my hometown, so that would be good. So what... Do you guys think with regard to buildings that are haunted are the most popular ones in the Netherlands?
00:42:08
Lee Hatfield
Because over here, for example, we have jails and we have we have mills and that they tend to be the most popular. So what are the most popular in your neck of the woods?
00:42:21
Shane&Mary things.NL
I think fortresses yeah and we have a few castles and I know there are at least four jails, yeah but they made a hotel out of it. Yeah.
00:42:42
Lee Hatfield
OK. They did that here. We've got a jail in town and they've made it into a like an Airbnb and it was haunted. It's like, oh come on, guys.
00:42:49
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah Yeah, it's over here as well. and I tend to go and book a room there, but it's quite expensive. But yeah, and we have enough outside locations.
00:43:06
Shane&Mary things.NL
We have an area, it's called Munnspede, and there was this circular home from kind of a madman.
00:43:20
Shane&Mary things.NL
And it's so haunted. And legends say there were kids who trafficked there and killed there and kidnapped in the area. So that's interesting. And yeah, some casemates,
00:43:44
Shane&Mary things.NL
cemeteries. Yeah, so there are some locations.
00:43:51
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. So do you guys find that you investigate many, many more outside locations and what you do inside locations?
00:44:02
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Sad enough, but yeah. the The most inside locations we do is with people as people's homes, there's a range residentials.
00:44:08
Lee Hatfield
Because
00:44:14
Shane&Mary things.NL
But that's when we get called in, which is pretty often nowadays. But now then the the normal locations is more outside than it is inside.
00:44:26
Shane&Mary things.NL
Because yeah, we have to be lucky.
00:44:26
Lee Hatfield
Okay.
00:44:30
Shane&Mary things.NL
to get in and now today we went sightseeing and we connected it again so hopefully we get permission by one of those locations yeah to get in again.
00:44:49
Shane&Mary things.NL
so
00:44:50
Lee Hatfield
it's It's funny because yeah we we have quite a few like pay to play locations that we do frequent. But it's really weird that I'm working. I'm currently working on one domestic location, but it's the first one that we've really had. We did have one 18 months ago, but the girl was using Snapchat on her cell phone. Oh, that's a spirit. No, you no it's not. no that's
00:45:23
Lee Hatfield
yeah so that was Yeah, exactly.
00:45:24
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:45:26
Lee Hatfield
so that So that was a complete bust. But like I say, I'm working with one right now, which is somebody who has who is a medium, but she's having paranormal activity and she doesn't know why.
00:45:38
Lee Hatfield
So that' that's really interesting because it it's hit kind of... you would expect a medium to understand, but they have no idea.
00:45:49
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:45:50
Lee Hatfield
So it I've got to reach out to other mediums for help two to move this along.
00:45:55
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:45:57
Lee Hatfield
So that's really interesting.
00:45:58
Shane&Mary things.NL
It is.
00:46:00
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. So you guys mentioned that yeah that you collaborate together and you do investigations when you can.
00:46:11
Lee Hatfield
But how often do you guys then work with other groups as well? Does that happen quite frequently or not as often?
00:46:22
Shane&Mary things.NL
Actually, not as often. And that's because we do not have that many teams left. No, we have a few invites, but we have to have the schedule matching.
00:46:40
Shane&Mary things.NL
I think three or four teams now. We still have to meet meet up with a team from Enschede that's to two hours drive from me.
00:46:51
Shane&Mary things.NL
oh
00:46:51
Lee Hatfield
Bye.
00:46:52
Shane&Mary things.NL
three hours for him. And there's a team in the area here. And I investigated a few times with them. and we still have to match up our schedules to pick a date.
00:47:08
Shane&Mary things.NL
And we have the travelers experience and those make documentaries and go all over the place, to abandoned places.
00:47:25
Shane&Mary things.NL
One is skeptic, one is scared as hell. And one is just for the camera and laughing his ass off. And we promised to go with them on the road. So yeah we need to pick a date with them as well.
00:47:44
Shane&Mary things.NL
And we have an invite from a German team, but we have to fix our schedule with there's theirs. Yeah.
00:47:57
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, yeah.
00:47:58
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:47:59
Lee Hatfield
So we're actually quite lucky because I've got contact within the Comic-Con world. So one of the girls that works at the Comic-Con, she's really big into the paranormal.
00:48:11
Lee Hatfield
So we have a we have a booth at at the convention. So it's really it's really good because you you then get complete strangers coming up to you and going, oh, yeah, I don't believe in the paranormal.
00:48:26
Shane&Mary things.NL
But
00:48:26
Lee Hatfield
But let me tell you the time when.
00:48:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah. Yeah, I know. that That's a very familiar story, yeah.
00:48:35
Lee Hatfield
Yeah, yeah. And and it's weird. and I tell people this a lot. 20 years ago, nobody told anybody. But since a lot of these shows are on TV and it's more coming out in the open,
00:48:52
Lee Hatfield
There's more people admitting that they've had experiences. They've had something that they can't explain and so and such like. And it's it's it's it's great that people can now share stories where, yeah, when I was a kid, if you mentioned that you were seeing spirits, it'd be like, okay, come with me.
00:49:14
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, you're going to...
00:49:14
Lee Hatfield
go go into go and sit and yeah Go and sit in that padded cell.
00:49:15
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Yeah. so where i am
00:49:18
Lee Hatfield
You'll be fine.
00:49:19
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:49:20
Lee Hatfield
So let's just flip the coin a little bit for a second. Over here, the cryptid world is very big. Sasquatch, Bigfoot, Mothman, yeah Dogman, and all of those.
00:49:34
Lee Hatfield
And the UFO world is very big as well, especially with our neighbors just over the border. What kind of culture for cryptids and UFOs is there in the Netherlands?
UFO Sightings and International Collaboration
00:49:49
Shane&Mary things.NL
What I've heard, UFOs is not that small anymore. It's pretty getting pretty Yeah, it's pretty big. Brom and Wilfrid. Yeah, so we have a point where you can put in your sightings and they work together with Belgium.
00:50:10
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. So it's getting bigger and we have that UFO, what's it called? An incident here at the border of Belgium. no yeah and it's even been on TV now.
00:50:27
Shane&Mary things.NL
So it's getting bigger, the UFO.
00:50:28
Lee Hatfield
Oh, wow. Yeah.
00:50:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
People are still laughing about it, but it's getting bigger. 20 years ago they laughed at us for being in the paranormal with spirits.
00:50:35
Lee Hatfield
How? Oh.
00:50:40
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah, exactly.
00:50:40
Lee Hatfield
Yeah.
00:50:42
Shane&Mary things.NL
But cryptids are?
00:50:42
Lee Hatfield
Because it's really weird. Because, yeah.
00:50:44
Shane&Mary things.NL
now No, no, credits no
00:50:46
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. Okay, that's interesting. because over here, you literally every street corner is cryptid. It's like, geez, stop, go yeah go back in the woods, hide.
00:50:57
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:50:58
Lee Hatfield
But it's really weird how like in the US you have and the UFO hotspots.
00:51:09
Lee Hatfield
We have Shag Cove in Canada. In England, Rendlesham Forest is one of the big ones.
00:51:14
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:51:17
Lee Hatfield
And you'd think, rightly or wrongly, that every country would have their one one location where they say this happened. So I think the Belgian border with Holland, that's your thing, even though it was 20 years ago, because Rendlesham was a good...
00:51:36
Lee Hatfield
30 or 40 years ago. Yeah. So it's interesting how just because one thing has happened. Nope. We're keeping that. That's going to be our favorite, even though it's like half a decade ago.
00:51:48
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:51:50
Lee Hatfield
So, guys, unfortunately, we are coming towards the end.
Social Media Presence and Collaboration Efforts
00:51:54
Lee Hatfield
i know you guys have got a YouTube channel and so and a Facebook page. So if you'd like to share all your locations where people can find you if they want to look into something different, please.
00:52:08
Shane&Mary things.NL
a Well, we have everything things Netherlands, but then you put it down at Netherlands.
00:52:22
Shane&Mary things.NL
So the Dutch way, a dot in between or an underscore on YouTube, TikTok, Instagram. I have a LinkedIn account.
00:52:34
Shane&Mary things.NL
made for things. Netherlands, we have podcast platforms, like pages, and it goes the same for the Ravens because put everything everywhere where possible in cooperation with the Ravens Paranormal. yep Yeah.
00:52:58
Shane&Mary things.NL
Same the other way around. so Yeah.
00:53:00
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. blue
00:53:00
Lee Hatfield
i'm glad you I'm glad you said that, Shane.
00:53:03
Lee Hatfield
I'm glad you said that. It's not just one-sided. Yeah,
00:53:05
Shane&Mary things.NL
Well, I'll just leave it to her and then I'll... No. Why are
00:53:09
Lee Hatfield
yeah. yeah i I share all your stuff, but no, you don't share all mine. Yeah, okay, great.
00:53:14
Shane&Mary things.NL
why you sharing? Oh, I didn't? Sorry. Yeah.
00:53:18
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. I can see it's a love-hate relationship.
00:53:22
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeah
00:53:24
Lee Hatfield
So do you guys have anything in the pipeline, anything you're looking forward to to doing together?
00:53:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
Oh yeah. A lot of things. A lot more investigating that upcoming year and the podcast, of course, because we have some upcoming guests.
00:53:40
Lee Hatfield
Oh, yeah, i forgot i forgot to mention the podcast.
00:53:42
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:53:44
Lee Hatfield
Let's mention the podcast right now.
00:53:44
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. Yeah. Things Paranormal Talks. And it started as Ghost Talk. But in America, there was this investigator who also started the podcast with using in the same name.
00:54:02
Shane&Mary things.NL
So I was the cross one and just choose a different name.
00:54:02
Lee Hatfield
you.
00:54:11
Shane&Mary things.NL
And, I had a pause for three years, I think. And because I was fed up with doing it alone and getting all the negativity alone, i asked him to join.
00:54:29
Shane&Mary things.NL
yeahp And he agreed. And he can back me up if I stutter, get nervous.
00:54:34
Lee Hatfield
Yeah. Mary, did did you ask him or did you tell him? Come on, let's be honest.
00:54:41
Shane&Mary things.NL
She kind of told me. Yeah. Yeah.
00:54:46
Lee Hatfield
So like, come here, come here.
00:54:48
Shane&Mary things.NL
it's yes think Yeah.
00:54:49
Lee Hatfield
I've got, I've I've got a job for it. Yes. Yes. Headphones on, sit and speak.
00:54:54
Shane&Mary things.NL
That's one bad side of me.
00:54:54
Lee Hatfield
got
00:54:57
Shane&Mary things.NL
Just this afternoon, I said, if they accept my invite to be friends on Facebook, they are coming on the podcast. They don't know, but they are coming on.
00:55:11
Lee Hatfield
Oh, does it?
00:55:11
Shane&Mary things.NL
That's how it works.
00:55:12
Lee Hatfield
Hang on, hang on. I've got this. No, I'm still waiting.
00:55:15
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah.
00:55:16
Lee Hatfield
It's not.
00:55:19
Lee Hatfield
Guys, it's it's been an absolute pleasure.
00:55:20
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yep.
00:55:23
Lee Hatfield
Thank you for taking some time to to speak to me. I've got a feeling that we're going to stay in touch. The fact that you're stalking me on TikTok.
00:55:31
Shane&Mary things.NL
yep
00:55:32
Lee Hatfield
And i'm good
00:55:33
Shane&Mary things.NL
a
00:55:34
Lee Hatfield
i
00:55:34
Shane&Mary things.NL
My middle name, Paranormal Stalkart.
00:55:39
Lee Hatfield
I can't argue with that.
00:55:40
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yeah. yeah
00:55:41
Lee Hatfield
But for now, I know it's late there. What's it getting towards 10 o'clock?
00:55:46
Shane&Mary things.NL
Yep.
00:55:46
Lee Hatfield
Is it? Yep. So what's left of your evening? Have a great rest of the evening. Have a great rest of the weekend. I thank you for your time. And no doubt we'll speak again soon.
00:55:57
Shane&Mary things.NL
and Absolutely.
00:55:57
Lee Hatfield
Take care. Thank you.
00:55:59
Shane&Mary things.NL
Bye everybody.
00:56:00
Lee Hatfield
Bye-bye.
00:56:01
Shane&Mary things.NL
Bye.