Transcript
Speaker: Delighted to have you in the podcast, where all stories are welcome and the masks come off. Hello, Rajiv. Hi. Hi, Jeeva. How good to see you here and welcome to Soul Brews with Jeeva. Such a delight to host you on Coffee and Soul. Oh, thank you. Thank you.
Speaker: I think it's worth 30 -35 minutes after which you're connecting. I know. I know. What a long time. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Lovely to see you. It's very, very good. Thank you. Yeah. So I'm going to resort back to calling you RSA because I cannot for the life of me call you Rajiv. So it's going to be RSA OR and I hope that's okay with you. That's absolutely fine. Okay, fine. All right. So lovely to see you and so delighted to host you on this forum. Do you have a cup of coffee ready with you? Yes. Coffee is approved.
Speaker: All right, here you go. So I'm going to wait for you to pour yourself here. There you go. Lovely, lovely, lovely. Cheers, RSA. So friendships. Yes. Long, long friendships and wonderful conversation. Longer than most of my kids have lived. Yeah. Isn't that right? My God. Cheers, RSA. Cheers.
Speaker: So can I ask you to hold this cup of coffee if it's not too hot? Just nestle it between your eyes. Just sit back and relax. Allow yourself to feel the warmth of the coffee cup and also the fragrance if it comes to you yet. See, what does it elicit for you? Is there any image or sound or feeling? And whenever you're ready, open your eyes and share.
Speaker: Yeah, so I think for me, I think I get images of a park and I think it's Hyde Park that I get images. And it's, so I don't know if you've been to Hyde Park recently, but there are many manicured and stuff and there are parts which are reasonably left unkempt. And the image I have is one when it's kind of left
Speaker: as is untouched. So long grass, tall trees, that's the image I get. And what does that do for you, Arisa?
Speaker: To me, that's a reminder of letting things be as they are and that it just allows for life to flourish. So what happens when height park or parts of height parker, which are sort of left like this, is there's tall grass, there's dandelions, there's lots of insects that sort of emerged because of that.
Speaker: It's a reminder that life is, you know, prolific and it comes out of everything. So, you know, even when I walk through the park, there are sort of tree trunks that are being felled and probably dry or appeared dry to us. And then suddenly there are still shoots, you know, little stems sort of growing out and early, early sort of leaves there.
Speaker: breathing. It's a stark reminder. So to me, I think that's what the image is. The image is all about
Speaker: Let it be. Don't try to always control and touch and make things. Let it be. Light has a way. Light has a way. Yeah, and the way that you say it and the way it sounds, it's almost therapeutic, isn't it? To be able to go and dip into a space where you can access these feelings. Yeah, it is. We're very fortunate in that sense. And the funny thing is, to an extent, COVID has actually helped us access.
Speaker: Because what happened is through COVID, in order to keep ourselves sort of a little bit active, it's become a daily routine to walk. And when you walk the day, you know, when you walk every day, you see it every day, you see it. So we, you know, we've seen it from last year when we started probably around, yeah, it was around May last year. I would go regularly for walks.
Speaker: And it was basically a late spring, early summer. And so it was prolific. And then we saw the entire thing become completely desolate with just branches, no leaves, everything had shed very stark. Yet there was no figures you could sort of see green moss, you could see squirrels, you could see, you know, you could see life in different forms. And now I don't know, recently we've even got parrots. So I think somebody's released some parrots and they're thriving in Haifa.
Speaker: And so it's just, you know, and then you then come kind of see the flowers on the trees, which I've never noticed to me. So, so it, it has been quite, quite a journey. It's been quite a journey and it's, it's this realization. Yeah. And that sounds, that sounds, as I said, it sounds like quite a journey, which brings me to the next thing that I focus on, which is your journey.
Speaker: You know, and I've known you a long time now, but you know, you always discover new things about people. And that's the beauty of conversations such as these as you memorize. So tell me more, tell me more about your journey, your highs and lows, some defining moments for you that can change perspective.
Speaker: When I look at my life journey, one thing is bloody clear that I have been blessed. When I say blessed, I don't mean that I'm the richest, I'm the best, I have champagne. It's not that. When I say best, I have managed to do everything I want to do. I have managed to succeed and fail. And I've still managed to have a great lifestyle, I think, throughout.
Speaker: And it's not of my own volition. It's not of, you know, it would be great for me to be able to say, oh, but I did X, Y, Z in order for me to deserve ABC or something like that. You know, it's absolutely bullshit if I was to ever say that. It's almost like
Speaker: things have just taken and happened and and what's happened in my life journey is my biggest moments have come from most unexpected sources and you know at the time you just don't realize it yeah but
Speaker: But they are just, you know, it's almost like there was a cradle. There was a hand that came, picked me up and said, oh, actually, you know what? I'd rather you were here. And then you just find, oh, yeah, that's not bad. Like, let's move on. So I've been very fortunate. I've had, you know, if I just follow my career, I've had, I think I've done everything as I wanted to do. Some have succeeded, some haven't succeeded, but overall,
Speaker: You know, it's fine. It's been a great journey and I've never felt like, God, okay, you know what? This would have been better. It's almost like, yeah, things can always be much better. You know, you can have more of this. But you know, it's great, but it is, it's great. So, so I've been, I think I have been blessed.
Speaker: Sure and I get that and I think that's very beautiful and also I think what is great is that the recognition of that. A lot of times we go through life without recognizing how blessed we are and from the vantage point that you're speaking from seems to say that
Speaker: Upon reflection, you see that everything has had a purpose and you've kind of been picked up from one place to the other as well as was needed by you. Am I correct in that understanding? It's almost like, you know, Shiva, it's slightly weird in some ways because it's not like you didn't feel blessed, but upon reflection,
Speaker: you understand the shower of blessings. You know what I mean? Like, it's almost like you've been created as a faulty piece, you know, which tries to go in the wrong direction. And then somebody sort of says, oh, no, no, no, no, actually, you know, what, I'll fix you. It's kind of weird, you know, and, and it's a journey. It's a journey. I mean, I think I've been in the search, but I don't think I've reached the end.
Speaker: place, if that makes sense. Some people realize this and I realize that. I don't think so. I've got to that stage. But I think I'm in a better space than I was, say, five years ago, certainly from 15, 20 years ago. So it's that. That's the sense.
Speaker: Sure. And do you remember any moments that kind of defined you or made some choices? Is there anything stark? If I say just pull yourself out of your every day and just look at yourself. Were there some moments that you felt, oops, this was a place where I really made a
Speaker: I think there are all sorts of really stark points, right? But let's take one or two, right? Yeah, sure. So let's look at my getting into IIT. Now, for the life of me, I wanted to be a mechanical engineer, right? And when I got my IIT sort of rank, I couldn't get mechanical in IIT Delhi, but I could get mechanical
Speaker: same BHU or some of the other IITs. So I was very well prepared to go to IIT BHU and do something or go to Delhi College of Engineering. And then at that point I spoke to somebody and they said actually you know what it doesn't matter what you do from an IIT but
Speaker: that education would be valuable. And I met some professors and stuff. And then I made the decision to join textile engineering, because the professor in IAD explained that there is a mechanical stream to textile engineering. So that's it. And you know, I want to design machines. And you have this worldview of design machines in there. Believe me, I finished my engineering, and I have not done one day of machine design. And I haven't missed it.
Speaker: Will I say that that was a defining moment? It was a brilliantly defining moment because some of my strongest bonds and friends are from my school and my university. Some of the greatest minds I met were during my university days and brilliant minds. Minds that would sort of think I am understanding and they would talk to me like I was a peer. But I knew I had not even a minuscule
Speaker: I didn't even have the first scratch of understanding what they were talking about, let alone contribute to it. So the only thing I could do was lend my ear and, you know, just echo to let them sort of finish that concept. But meeting great minds like that. And I don't know if I would have met them somewhere else. And they're strong bonds now.
Speaker: So that's one sort of simple thing. You know, I also got into FMS and I didn't take that despite the fact that I had that and because I said I've done engineering and I have no clue what I'm going to do because I didn't get a job in machine design.
Speaker: I applied. I applied to everybody. It was not like I didn't apply after my engineering. But then I realized that if I now do an MBA, I would go do something like operations research or something stupid or something like that and build on my engineering. And is that right? So I didn't do it. I went down a different path. And that journey sort of led me to opening up a business with a couple of partners. And we set up a startup in London.
Speaker: many many many years ago when the word startup wasn't even there. Yeah so this is 93 then we started and so initially I managed a team in India then I moved to the UK and you know we've built the business we built it to a good revenue so from zero we built it to a revenue we then got VC funding in. The point is all that journey and then suddenly the whole because we were in the energy sector so we were in energy trading risk management
Speaker: The energy sector came under a lot of pressure around 2001, 2002. And by 2003, we had to wind up our business.
Speaker: But back then I was fed up because I've been sort of doing this for three years, this 10 years. We built up this business and it was all about equity and all about divesting it or selling it to another buyer and making our money. And the valuations are looking good. The VC funding had come in at 20 plus million. We were sort of sailing on money in the bank type conversation. I remember I came and visited you then and we had a great time traveling everywhere in your beautiful Saab.
Speaker: But you know what I mean? And then suddenly you had to shut the business and I came out with liability. But the funny thing was the day I handed over the keys to the liquidators, I remember feeling relief. Although I had no clue what's going to happen next. But it was a great lie. OK, this phase is done.
Speaker: then having spent 10 years in energy, nobody would hire me in energy. I had all the contacts in energy, nobody would hire me. So from energy, I went back to consulting on Outsource.
Speaker: And then I spent two years and then I came back to banking and risk and stuff. But the point I'm trying to get at is that was a real defining moment that everything went from what looked like at a very young age, very successful, da -di -da, big money in the bank and everything would happen or was happening to zero or in fact negative. And then feeling relief when it was negative, what's happening here? And then sort of rebuilding your life.
Speaker: Stop here. Why what thing was the relief? Why the relief? Because you're running a business.
Speaker: You are, your every day is about cashflow. In a startup structure, it's all about cashflow. It's not about P &L. People talk about P &L and balance reasons. It's all about cashflow. And we used to be sitting with three months cashflow and that was it. Our horizon was, why are we going to survive the next three months? And we had a team in India, which was about 100 strong.
Speaker: And we had a team in the UK, which was about 45 strong. So we had fair amount of payroll to meet everyone. That is a fair amount. And we were making revenues. We had maintenance revenues. We had licensing revenues. We had support. So we had revenues.
Speaker: But that pressure of actually managing all these people and their payroll, and doing that in addition to the work that you had to do anyways, which was talk to your clients and make sure business is coming, renew business, and grow the business in general. It was, when you stopped, it was a bit like, oh, you were kind of a hamster on a wheel going nowhere, just from one step to the next.
Speaker: So in that sense, there was a relief. Now, some people would say, you know, you wasted 10 years. You could have been in the corporate world. You could have done this. Not for one minute. I have had that sort of experience of taking something, hiring people. We have to fire people. Don't get me wrong. We have to go through the whole cycle. Sure. And some of it is comfortable. Some of it is not comfortable.
Speaker: The fact that you've done it and come on the other side, now that is a defining moment for me. Absolutely. At that point, I sort of made a difference. I say, the experience of that. And it's not even, so you would, you know, if you asked me, would I change something? Nothing. Because if I hadn't done that, I wouldn't be who I am today.
Speaker: And at the crossroads, I made decisions. It's not like I was doing the business and never thought of exiting, you know, 97, 98. I had somebody actually say, join me, you know, come and join a bank. In fact, my
Speaker: My manager, I was doing a piece of work for Namira. And he said, why didn't you come and join me? And I said, I was pretty frustrated at that point. This was one day I was really frustrated. And actually, it was not even 97. If I remember correctly, it was probably 96. I said, OK, let me think about it. And I'll come back to you tomorrow morning. And then the next morning, I said, no, don't do that.
Speaker: But what I'm trying to get at is everything that happens to you is because of all the decisions and choices you've made. Correct. Right. And then then everything that happens makes you make certain other choices. But it's that journey that I think is is all that you have.
Speaker: And now there's a little bit more to it, but we'll get to that. No, we should get to it now because we only have this time right now. So let's get to it.
Speaker: So my thing is, at that time, there's a lot of suffering attached to things when they happen. And even now, it's not like suffering doesn't happen. If big events happen, it takes me a week, two weeks to sort of absorb the entire impact. I have to sort of mull it over, think it through and stuff. But the point I'm going to get to is actually my thinking today is none of it matters.
Speaker: What matters is, are you making the most of what you're doing? The fact that you win, you lose is absolute and utter nonsense. And the point at which I realized this was there's a story where there is this trader and Guru Nanak Dev Ji gives him a needle and says, look, just keep it with yourself.
Speaker: And this trade -off sort of follows, you know, Guru Nanak and sort of says, you know, I've got this needle, can I give it back to you? And he says, no, no, no, no, keep it. So it happens to every two or three months as Guru Nanak passes his hours or something. And then the guys, finally, the penny drops that you can't even take a needle away from this world.
Speaker: And so we kind of go through this whole accumulation, that whole business I was doing was an accumulation cycle. It's important that you do that accumulation to enjoy the life. We are never going to take anything away. Not even your experience, not even the feeling is going to go with you.
Speaker: And that penny has only dropped now. This is not like a penny dropped 20 years ago, I wish it had, but it didn't. It only drops when the time is right. So that is quite an important sort of
Speaker: thing to recognize. You know, I've been doing these courses where somebody told you, you know, life is empty and meaningless, and there was another place you kind of realize, oh, but they are hollow. In that moment, it wasn't for me, they were hollow, because I understood life is empty and meaningless, great, you define what you want to do.
Speaker: But it wasn't experiential. And to me, the journey is all about that experiential realization of what matters to you.
Speaker: And there is a certain vibrancy that you can create in this, right? And only you can create in this, otherwise it's, yes, and I hear what you're saying. I think I recently heard something from Alan Watts, which sort of resonates. There is nothing to do, but that doesn't mean you do nothing. Exactly. There is no importance of what you do, but doing is important because you are a karmic being.
Speaker: Yeah, you have to fulfill the obligation to life. And I don't call it obligation in the sense of being obliged, but just you have to walk. You have to walk. Yeah, exactly. I agree. But I think the obligation is to the self. Exactly. Exactly. That obligation is to yourself is what makes you happy and complete.
Speaker: Absolutely. Yeah. So, and you're right, you are life.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly. I mean, yes. So, but, you know, yeah, exactly. You're clarifying it from my standpoint, but you're absolutely right. It is an obligation to life, but that life is you. Life is not anything else. It's not, you know, a lot of us, at least when we are born in India and, you know, this whole family and you've got to be part of the family, you've got to respect elders. And we take it like a big burden on our shoulders.
Speaker: You've got to do what is right and what you feel is right. What is dharma for you, not dharma in scriptures or law or books. Wonderful. That's beautiful.
Speaker: And I know I'm with you on this totally RSA, and I'm really happy to hear you talking about this and saying this because a lot of people are at crossroads right now. And for us to reflect together on, while living life, I think these are, as I said, statements that people, we don't know who needs to, wants to hear this right now, wants to get into this conversation at this point in time. So I feel it's really, really important because it's the human experience.
Speaker: is there a metaphor for life that you have or many metaphors maybe but something when the chips are downward this is the way you live life you fall back on something is there something i i think i'm going to say something but i just want to clarify before i say so there's no i mean there are probably lots of metaphors i kind of work with but but to me one thing is that people have walked this earth before
Speaker: and you know some of them are gurus and some of them are lives that people have lived so I don't want to datify anybody I don't want to put them on a pedestal so if I say for example if I say Guru Nanak Dev Ji or if I say Guru Gobind Singh Ji or if I say Sainath or if I say Warren Buffett it is not with a view of saying they are
Speaker: superpowers or superhumans or anything else, but it is taking a life example and sort of applying to yourself. Okay. And one thing, one thing that sort of I get to is how grateful I should be on and I am once I reflect how grateful I get for what, you know, what I would say riches we've been given, you know, we've been given with so many blessings
Speaker: You know, we've been given a mind to think. We've been given our hands to work. We've been given our tongue to taste, hear, smell. Now, we take that as a given, but actually not everybody has the same smell, doesn't have the same thinking ability. So there are lots of life on this planet, but not all have been given these faculties. So there's blessing just
Speaker: the fact that all our activities work. This blessing in the family you were born in, right? So because I was born, I was blessed because I got an education. I may not have been given a blank check with 300 million in my bank, but I was given an education. I had my body, I had been given a mind and I've been blessed with a mind.
Speaker: The worst thing is I call them riches only because I have done nothing to deserve them. It's just serendipity or it's just happened.
Speaker: Yeah. So these are blessings. These are riches. These are riches for us. And so to me, recognizing that. So there are so many stories that you hear of where people have seen somebody on the street who's less endowed than them and realize what a blessing they are, that they're able to at least walk, even if they don't have slippers, because somebody else is there without any legs and he's still going to make up.
Speaker: You know, so for me, these are life examples. So the metaphor for me is just recognize what you have and what you've been blessed with and make the most of it. It doesn't matter. But don't forget
Speaker: enjoy what you have. Just as an example, when I shut my business, we had no money because we had debt on our head. So we used to go to McDonald's and have a coffee and donut. And I'd give you an honor that was as enjoyable as any crosstown donut I have today or any box of Krispy Kreens I have today. Or if I walk into any patisserie or guru,
Speaker: And, you know, today you can walk into Selfridges or Harrods or any place and get beautiful. I mean, that when you come or to Langies, one which I really love. But the point I'm going to get at is the joy is there, right there. A coffee and donut in McDonald's is as joyful as a coffee donut in Starbucks.
Speaker: So then this then brings us nicely to the space of sort of joy is actually within and how it expresses is outside is the mediums right I mean it could be a it could be a croissant and it could be at McDonald's or it could be at the most sophisticated place but the joy is within and I think tapping that and
Speaker: And being with that, opening that up, I think that's a huge win in life. I hope you understand the way I say win. I think it's just about... It is a huge win. It is. It is the only thing that's important is to recognize that every moment there is something for you to be absolutely thankful for.
Speaker: It's just finding that. It's just looking for that and not for the flaws because you know what? Actually, even the flaws don't exist. The flaws are our conditioning that makes us look for stuff because we have this conditioning of perfection or of a certain state. Like my kids, when I take them to, you know, if a bee comes up to them, they are completely traumatized because there are not that many bees around here.
Speaker: But actually, it's a blessing that you have these. It's one of the biggest blessings. Life would not exist. But they are not at the stage, because at the stage, it's an irritant in their life. Of course. But one other thing is, so there's nothing wrong with what's so. It's how we are perceiving it. And actually, and it's back to that. It's recognizing and being thankful
Speaker: for that moment, what it's giving you. If you can do that more continuously, that's my journey. So is that your journey? Yeah. So is that something that you consciously try to? That is my journey. That's very beautiful, very powerful. Some of the gifts that you have received that have shaped you, some of the key influences in your life, what are they?
Speaker: I think education is one. To an extent it's a gift and to an extent I think it's also a lodestone around your neck because what it does is it conditions you. But I think what you have to appreciate is what our standard education gives us is tools.
Speaker: It's not an education. But what we read and what we discuss and the friends that we make, the sangat, that is your true learning. So people who appreciate you for who you are, people who contribute to your thought process and make you look beyond your immediate. So if you're an engineer and somebody sort of makes you read philosophy and sort of discusses philosophy, takes you into uncharted territory.
Speaker: Brilliant. So that's a blessing. That's an education. Where somebody's sort of reading for vocation, great. Or where some, you know, like, by vocation, I mean, is if you're reading, if I'm an engineer, I'm reading for engineering. If I'm a financial analyst, I'm reading for financial analysis. It's fine. You know, you're getting your tools.
Speaker: But you're not expanding your mind. But if you're sort of going to say, OK, fine, I'm going to now bring string theory and see how that would apply to financial worth. OK, a little bit of an expansion. It's an adjacency to think about life, to think about people, to think about sociology, to think about psychology and bring that into your reading and into your experience.
Speaker: That's expanding because you haven't been exposed to that, but you're now exposing yourself to that. You know, living a 360 degree life in a very simple sort of manner. And I guess what I'm hearing you say is also what I'm picking up from beyond that I'll play to you is that it's the simple, simpleness and simplicity. And I don't mean simplistic of life where you get your things that really matter.
Speaker: you know, and how they kind of combine and being able to see that, you know, having the eyes to see. I think those are things that are huge blessings. Would you agree? Yeah, 110%. That is the only blessing one should be trying to achieve is the ability to see how blessed you are, how thankful you need to be.
Speaker: That's the only thing, I think, as a journey, that's the only thing. I think work is important. Do the right thing, do the stuff that makes you happy, that makes you feel fulfilled. Now, if you want to build buildings, go build buildings. If you want to sing songs, go sing songs.
Speaker: And don't worry if you're not great at it, but if you keep at it, you will become great at it. That's my firm belief. It's the 10 ,000 hours theory. I believe in that. You do something.
Speaker: With your heart, soul and mind completely dedicated, you will excel. But do it completely. Don't come and fitter with it. Don't flirt with it. And don't flirt with yourself. Don't do this change for the sake of change. I love singing, but I'll just go for one or two classes and then I'll drop it.
Speaker: because that will not give you that joy. Find what will sort of give you that joy and then do it. Everything else will follow. Everything else will just, you know, it's almost like the universe will sort of pick you up and sort of keep pushing you around and sort of take you to the right place. Trust it. Just trust it. But put your heart and soul into it.
Speaker: Absolutely and is that something that you would like to, so let me put it another way, what is the kind of thing that you'd like to say to a younger, 30 years before? I think I was quite opinionated, I was quite approved, I didn't enjoy, you know, I had this whole sense of responsibility in my head because I lost my dad and stuff
Speaker: quite early in my life. In fact, he was quite ill since I was, I think, 13 or something like that. So I had this whole sense of responsibility and bullshit of that stuff. It's that. Stop carrying the world on your shoulders. Just do what you think is right, but be honest with yourself.
Speaker: lot of the things we do we're not doing it honestly and that's why there's a conflict even within ourselves you know we've been doing it but we don't believe it like you know people will go drink a bottle of wine or bottle of whiskey and they'll say oh i really enjoyed myself and next day they're having a hangover and then saying oh shit i shouldn't have had so much so there's a there's a very small conflict in you don't create conflicts
Speaker: So that's something that you tell yourself. Don't create conflict. Don't create conflicts. No, do vedam. And that's the thing. If you're dwelling on something that you could have done it differently or you should have done it differently, then there's a conflict. In my point, that's the point in which you created that conflict. Absolutely. And then you resolved the conflict. But make sure when you resolved it, you now understand what caused it and you wouldn't do it again.
Speaker: That's it. Just keep yourself conscious to that. Brilliant. Okay, so I do believe that every human being has something very special to offer as a gift.
Speaker: to everybody, to humanity, etc. What's the gift you have? What do you bring, Arisa? I think if I look at my life and what do I bring, I think I bring trust. To me, that's something that I have operated with because I find it a shortcut to a lot of things.
Speaker: If I can create trust and work with trust, it bypasses a lot of energy in terms of explanations and stuff. So that's one piece. And I think the second piece is letting go. So don't assume that your trust will always be reciprocated in the form that you have sort of placed. So sometimes
Speaker: say 60 % of the time it will be reciprocated, 40 % of the time it won't be, you'll state 20%, you know you're actually 20 % better off. So long as that equation is stacking up, keep improving that equation but don't give it up otherwise you'll spend a lot of energy in distrust.
Speaker: So trust is one. And I think that also means trusting your own instinct, your gut instinct. You know, if your gut is telling you don't trust, don't trust, walk away. And it's that. So to me, that's quite an important piece. And then the other thing is mentoring and coaching. I think to me, that comes naturally. That's my sense of it. And I think that's quite important is if somebody needs your help,
Speaker: And it doesn't have to be monetary help. It could be just, it could just be you sitting with them and having a cup of coffee or it could be listening to them or it could be, you know, giving them advice if they've asked you for something or if they've, be truthful in that, you know, just be truthful. If, you know, if I benefited, for example, if, you know, if I was Warren Buffett and I knew how to invest and somebody came to me and said, how should I invest? Give them everything that you can give them.
Speaker: and do it as honestly as possible. But people will take away different things from it. Some people make millions out of it and somebody may not. But that's not your cross to bear. That's not your burden in life. Your entire thing is being absolutely truthful to reaching out and giving what you can give.
Speaker: And comfortably, not, not uncomfortably, not, oh, you know, I gave him 10 ,000 and then for the next 20 years you're regretting why you gave them 10 ,000. If you've given them 10 ,000, it's done, dusted, it was what was needed at the time. Move on. Don't dwell on it. But do it truthfully and honestly.
Speaker: Great. Is there anything else you'd like to say before we close out this conversation? And it's been wonderful, wonderful. There's some very powerful things you've said, RSA, and a great conversation. Anything else? One thing I will say, and I'll say this very honestly to you, is I was a bit surprised when you wanted to sort of have this soul brew with me.
Speaker: And then I kind of watched a few of your videos. I want to sort of just acknowledge, take this moment to acknowledge you for what I would call celebrating an ordinary life. You know, your, your interviews are taking what I would say the unsung heroes and
Speaker: They're unsung heroes in the sense that they may be in their own microcosm, they may be well known. They're not the celebrities. A lot of people interview celebrities and sort of put them on and then you'll get the... I think what you have...
Speaker: done with this is is what to me is is very meaningful is recognizing that an ordinary life well lived is as celebrity worthy as a celebrity life the way they've lived it.
Speaker: And you know this because I have always harped about the ordinary life. And I personally think this, you know, and it's an effort. I'm not even trying to sort of
Speaker: You know, it takes effort. It takes energy. It takes focus. You go set it up, but you are celebrating people and you're celebrating life and you're saying, look, there's a story here. I'm going to find it. People may not know you. People may not know that you have a story, but I'm going to find that story. So to me, that's the one piece I do want to do is acknowledge what you're doing here.
Speaker: Thank you so much, Arisa, and it's true. That was the motivation of starting Soul Rules, is to talk ordinary, all of us ordinary, right? And I have ordinary people chats with them because lives are extraordinary. And those are to be celebrated.
Speaker: Exactly, exactly. And there's something that I find that is, you know, really inspires me. And I feel that ordinary people do this, which is this.
Speaker: There are so many people who are, as you said, unsung, but they are riding out there and they are living their lives and what brilliant, beautiful lives. And we have to stop and celebrate. So I think that's what I want to acknowledge. There are so many shares that are coming into my head right now. You can take a couple, take a couple. How can it be that our conversation doesn't have a share?
Speaker: And that's it. Those that have been lost over time, you're bringing that out. That's one. Thank you so much. Thank you so much. I want to turn the focus back on to you.
Speaker: Is there anything else you'd like to say about yourself and your journey before we close out?
Speaker: I think the biggest thing for me now is recognizing I have a finite number of years on this planet. And the piece that I want to attach to that is that there is no continuity. I don't believe that there is this soul that will be reborn as me. My soul might go and become an ant tomorrow. Who knows? Or this energy will take the shape of an ant, or it may take the shape of an elephant or something. Who knows?
Speaker: And to me, that is becoming very precious. So I just think, and this is another one which one realizes late, but if you listen to Steve Jobs, he said the best invention, the biggest invention or the best inventions is death because it allows the next generation to come through. And I think understanding that your time is finite, right? And then living with it that,
Speaker: in the present, you know, when you make your choices, is this crucial for me? Is this right for me? Is this what I want to spend my last few whatever hours or days or years? I think to me, that's what I want to sort of get to a point that I'm completely cognizant and aligned to that.
Speaker: and more power to you as you keep working towards finding that RSA and I'm sure with the intent and the sincerity with which you move towards that, it will keep flowering and it will keep opening your path ahead for you. And I wish with all my heart that that continues to happen for you. It was a pleasure to have you here on Soul Blues with Siva. Thank you so much for spending this time with me.
Speaker: Thank you. Thanks very much. Thank you for your time and attention and for being a part of Soul Brews with Siva. Until next week, keep the coffee swirling.
