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Ep 34 - Sheba and Sanjay Gutpa share a coffee
94 Plays3 years ago
Presenting a conversation over coffee with Sanjay Gupta.
Sanjay is the Global CEO of EnglishHelper. In his previous avatar, he was the Head of the India Leadership Team at American Express India.
More about him is on his LinkedIn.
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Transcript
Introduction and Toast
00:00:02
Speaker
I'm delighted to have you in the podcast where all stories are welcome and the masks come off. Hi, Sanjay. Hi, Shiba. Welcome to Soul Blues with Shiba and thank you so much for making the time for this. I'm delighted to have you with me. My pleasure, Shiba. Always glad to be with you. Thank you so much, Sanjay, for making the time. Really appreciate it.
00:00:30
Speaker
So you have your cup of coffee ready with you? I do. All right. So here's mine. And here's to life, Sanjay, to friendship, health, happiness, and safety for everyone. Drink to that. All of those things and more, Shiba. Thank you. Thank you. Cheers. Cheers. Is your coffee laced with something fun? I wish it was.
Coffee Ritual and Journey
00:00:55
Speaker
Oh, but it isn't. Not right now. Can I ask you to hold your cup in your palms, please? Can you just nestle it between your palms? Is there some voodoo thing going on? Voodoo thing going on? No voodoo. Just relax. I didn't tell you that my cup of coffee is quite hot, so whatever. Alright. Don't try and burn me. Alright, so then just keep it.
00:01:22
Speaker
Just keep it in your hands. You can just sit back and relax a bit. And keep inhaling the smell of the coffee. And see what it brings up for you. Does it throw up anything? Don't you speak? Yes, whenever you're ready. You can open your eyes whenever you're ready. Thank you. It was hard to stay focused and not grab this next sip. I'm a greedy hog. I love my morning coffee.
00:01:50
Speaker
I learned, well, I think I got to coffee drinking a lot when I lived in the US and New York. So, you know, I grew up in Calcutta. And so very tea kind of place. And you and I share a common background of the tea industry. That's right. So one of my first jobs was J Thomas, which is, I think the world's largest tea broking company and probably one of the oldest.
00:02:19
Speaker
And so there was a lot of tea drinking. I drank a lot of Darjeeling tea incessantly from morning till noon, through noon till night. Well, no, I didn't do the night. That's been an exaggeration. I suppose the night can bring other things.
00:02:34
Speaker
Yeah, that is true. And then that stayed with me and us because Panchal is also from, my wife is from Calcutta. And when we moved to New York, I think that was the time when I really began truly appreciating my breakfast. Because the Americans do everything in great excess.
00:02:56
Speaker
And I would reject most of those things, but I couldn't reject the excess of a massive breakfast. And because it is massive and it's copious with, laced with a lot of protein, somehow the mugs of coffee went down really nicely. So I'm not saying always quality, but lots of coffee. And that's why I started drinking lots of coffee in the morning, which I do now from breakfast through till almost early afternoon before I switch back to tea.
00:03:25
Speaker
So you have an ideal candidate for me now for this conversation. Coffee and soul and what else? So tell me, how many cups of coffee do you do in a day till lunch? How many do you?
Coffee's Health Benefits
00:03:38
Speaker
I will typically drink three to four cups between breakfast and lunch and maybe one cup thereafter. So about four to five cups. That's a lot of caffeine. That's a lot of caffeine. Yeah. And I was
00:03:52
Speaker
I was under some stress with people saying, you're really pushing it now. Till I ran into the famous Dr. Deepak Chopra's brothers, Dr. Sanjeev Chopra, who was still not long ago the Dean of Continuing Medical Education at Harvard Medical School. And he's written a book, which is I think 101 reasons why you should drink coffee.
00:04:17
Speaker
And he's one of the world's renowned, I think it's a liver specialist is a heptologist, I think maybe or is that the right word? I don't know. But he sold me the notion that coffee is not just good for the soul, but it's great for the body as well. So listen, I drink five cups and is medically validated.
00:04:38
Speaker
Absolutely. And you don't have anything on the other side to show for it. So it's all good, Sanjay. Yeah. Well, I think I told Sanjay a couple of years ago when I met him in Boston, when he mentioned to me that he's now on the board of this coffee company. I said, Sanjay, is there any connection between your coffee? He says, no, I wrote the book before they invited me. So he's a man of principle, I believe.
00:05:04
Speaker
All right, good. No, and I'm sure, you know, and probably seeing the way that he'd end the way that he stood behind the coffee, they invited him after that. Salya, tell me, you know, you've had a very interesting journey and a very interesting life and would love to hear a little bit about your journey, your learnings more than anything else, ups and downs.
00:05:29
Speaker
where you are today, I know with English Helper, but what led you there? It would be great to hear about your adventure in life.
Childhood Memories
00:05:40
Speaker
I quite often begin talks, especially in my current role and in the context of what I do currently, which is I work in the area of education by recalling the story of my childhood. And I say that I was five and my elder brother was eight.
00:05:58
Speaker
and we would go to school by first crossing a river, the Hooghly, take a rickshaw to the railway station and unescorted through this journey, get on to one of the local trains and do a 14 station journey, get to the other side and walk a couple of kilometers crossing the GT road to get to school. So five and eight, no chaperone.
00:06:21
Speaker
And it took us two hours each way to school and back, only because my mother, mainly, and my parents who were educated, my mother was a teacher, believed that we needed good education. And so with their heart in their mouths, they'd send us every day. And I remember once during the time when I was still very young in school, there was a lot of unrest in West Bengal and northeastern part of the country with naxalite movements and so on and so forth.
00:06:50
Speaker
And often the train services would get suspended because somebody blew up the tracks. And I remember one afternoon coming at three o'clock and I might, might've been about eight years of age. And we came to the station near Haurah and the trains had been suspended. We went to the station master and he said, forget it. There's no way the trains are going to resume today. So we went back to the main road to see if you could hop on a bus, which would have been a three and a half hour journey to home.
00:07:18
Speaker
People were all over buses, those buses. Everyone who had a train journey to take had gone onto a bus and they were on top of the bus, behind the bus, inside the bus, below the bus. So for two kids, that was almost impossible. So we came back to the railway track and walked 30 kilometers, 8 and 11. And when we reached home, it was midnight, no cell phones. Even if my parents had got through to the school phone, they would have said, we don't know.
00:07:45
Speaker
And so they were just sitting there dry eyed, tears had gone, run out. And when my mother saw us, she obviously embraced us and hugged us and you know, she did all the things that parents would do. And then what she said was very telling. She said, okay, go to bed, you have to go to school tomorrow. Right? Oh, that's awesome. Yeah. So, you know, much as I, when I was young, hated the thought that every time I came home, my mother would check my homework and it was really torture in school and torture back at home.
00:08:15
Speaker
But the fortune of being, you know, sort of in an educated learning environment and the fortune of being educated, whatever that might mean, led to the many fortunes that my life opened up for me. You know, whether it was friendships and relationships, whether it was jobs and careers, whether it was places and travel, all of that because I could hold my own and learn how to learn.
00:08:42
Speaker
And so when I was well into my career and we were living in Singapore, this was in 2000, I'm thinking around seven, I got this tremendous urge.
Career Shift and Purpose
00:08:54
Speaker
I was getting this tremendous urge. My company was asking me to
00:08:58
Speaker
relocate to either London or New York and most likely on an upward trajectory. But something came to me, a voice, a whisper, a feeling, a niggle, I don't know, which sort of said, it's time you did something just that that sort of in some ways gave back, did more than for yourself. And it wasn't a noble feeling. It wasn't the feeling that, you know, suddenly I wanted to change the world. It just felt the right thing.
00:09:24
Speaker
So I found someone like you. I found a life coach. And he was a friend and I heard his story. He had been a very successful investment banker at the age of 39, gave up his job, became a life coach. And I said, you did it. You do three days of commercial, two days of pro bono.
00:09:43
Speaker
And what made you and how did you? Because I'm thinking I want to do something else, something new. So we began a journey together of six months in life coaching me. I went to my company and I said, I don't want to go to London or New York. I want to go to India. They were a little bit surprised at that stage, but they were good enough to relocate me here. I became the chairman of American Express in India, but I had a very clear purpose that I needed to find a new path. And one day that came to me,
00:10:13
Speaker
And I sort of went back to the company and I said, okay, I'm out, not because I don't like you, but because I'm liking a direction that I want to take for myself.
00:10:23
Speaker
So what was the defining moment there? Was it something that kind of built up over time or is it something, obviously you were on a path, but this final thing that you said, was it an event that happened? Was it a process? Was it something that, what caused it? It is all of those things. And I think it's mostly the process. So the three things that I realized was that
00:10:52
Speaker
One, I want my time back. So when you work for a large corporation and get reasonably well compensated, you sold your time. And rightfully so. I wanted my time back. Two, I wanted to invest in myself. And what that meant was my personal well-being, my relationships.
00:11:11
Speaker
My interests, my hobbies, my friendships, whatever they may be, which often suffered because the time had been sore. It was hard to find that balance because when you're on the treadmill, the driver is really that main factor. And the third is that I realized I wanted to give back, but use what I had learned
00:11:32
Speaker
and I know and have experience of for giving back, not just by writing checks. And so these things came to me very sharply. And it's interesting, the way I characterize them is, you know, when you're a kid and you're sort of putting money in a piggy bank, sometimes the coin gets stuck. And then you get this incredible satisfaction when you tap it, tap it, tap it at one time in one day or whenever it is.
00:11:57
Speaker
one, it goes and settles at the bottom. So the realizations that I sort of achieved were not new ahas, they were simply. Yeah, thoughts that were there within me, which suddenly came and settled in my stomach. And one fine day I came out of these sessions with my coach and I said, I now know that this is the right thing.
00:12:22
Speaker
And that belief is what has fueled me over now 10 years, right? Doing a different set of things and leading a different sort of a different life with absolutely no looking back. And I think it's a bundle of events and definitely a process. What's very interesting is when you said sort of a different life.
00:12:47
Speaker
And I'd love to unpackage. Can you unpackage that for me when you say it's a different life, but it's just sort of, so what's the whole back on that one? No, it's a sort of a different life in the sense that I still work a corporation. I still take all the things I've learned about how to work in an organized way, how to do things at scale, how to build a business, how to focus on customers, how to look after
00:13:12
Speaker
myself and people around me who depend on me, how to comply with the law, how to be ethical in what we do, how to take, solve problems and all of these things I've learned over time. And those are the things that I'm applying because those are the things I know best, right? It is sort of the same life, but it is different because in a large corporation, as you get more and more senior, you realize that most of the time is spent on managing the inside of the company.
00:13:41
Speaker
and less and less time is really spent on managing the outside of the company as though it may seem the reverse, right? Executives come first in large corporations, then comes the shareholder. And here it is a very clear path of just simply focusing on doing things that make sense for the purpose with which you have created the organization. And therefore to that extent is different. It's sort of the same thing, it's different.
00:14:08
Speaker
And I've said to my team that as long as I'm involved, I don't want to be this organization to be more than 99 people. You know, drawing from Harari who says bands of apes stick together when they are small enough. And when they get too large, they disband because there's loose touch with each other physically. Humans can create large corporations. They can all be under one brand, the notion, imagination. Animals don't have the imagination. They need touch, feel and reality.
00:14:34
Speaker
And I want us to be that kind of an organization, as long as I'm around. And then things will happen differently, maybe. So those are the kinds of things which are similar and dissimilar. And of course, the work we do is incredibly dissimilar. The work we do and the places we do that work and the purpose with which we do the work. Therefore, the decisions we take are quite sometimes unique.
00:14:58
Speaker
Yeah, I'm sure. As I'm talking to you, there's a visual that comes to me, which is of a stone skimming on water, the skims, the various skims. What's the maximum you've done?
00:15:13
Speaker
Oh, I don't even remember. It would be about five, seven maybe. Yeah. Well, that there was always big competitive effort, but nevertheless, carry on. So if I was to ask you to, and if you can look at your life like that and each skin, each time the stone kind of comes up before it hits the, it's like phases in our lives. Is there, as you're talking, I'm really looking at
00:15:39
Speaker
If you were to, you know, we dip in and then dip out. So if we are on the up, that's when we are watching our own life and looking at it before we go down for the next.
00:15:49
Speaker
insertion into the water are there some ways that you can say that this is how these are the things I learned and I've moved from this space to the next space to the next space and these were my key learnings is there something that that and and I think why I'm asking that is because it would help people who are probably either just starting out or have a similar journey to yours
Life Phases and Learnings
00:16:10
Speaker
Sanjay
00:16:10
Speaker
I have no clue whether I can be of help to anyone, but I can share with you what comes to me most readily. So I'd say phase one is extreme youth. And I lived in an idyllic environment right next to the river, which I crossed every day to go to school. In fact, it's the 65 war for those of you.
00:16:31
Speaker
those of your audience who may have been born, will probably have been born in 2000 or something, the millennials and the various generations that we talk about. But in 65, we were crossing the river, in the middle of the river. And I was six, I think, yeah. And then four Pakistani jets came to bomb the rifle factory, which was right next to my house. When the middle of the river got in school, me and my brother,
00:17:00
Speaker
And we're looking up at these four, I think they were Sabre Jets or Starfighters, I forget, came in from those days East Pakistan. And the AKAC gun started going and we could see the black puffs of smoke. And suddenly one of the planes got hit and went down. And I remember turning to the boatman and saying,
00:17:20
Speaker
So, you know, you sort of life is life is life is defined by the context of things, right? Absolutely. So that that life was very idyllic. It was a beautiful place where we grew up with freedom, with
00:17:35
Speaker
you know, nature with sport. And it was also very determining because we went to the school two hours away and we did it ourselves as young kids. So maybe we learned a few things. And I think the second phase would be when I got married because I got married under somewhat challenging, trying circumstances into a very different sort of culture. And it was fantastic to get
00:18:04
Speaker
you know, move into a culture where for the first time I found that, you know, I really experienced and started understanding the need to recognize the equality of all genders, the equality of genders, right? Because I grew up in a time where
00:18:27
Speaker
If your boss was a woman, and my father's boss was a woman, and I know that, I mean, in no ill intent on his side, it was just the time and just his circumstance.
00:18:37
Speaker
but I know he was a bit sheepish about that, right? And everybody had this thing about women and their role. And so when you grow up a man in a world which is a man's world, it takes a while before cognition comes to you about certain things. So my marriage was a fantastic driver of that first level of cognition. And I started thinking about those things because I was helped to think about those things as well.
00:19:05
Speaker
I think the second, so that's the second phase. The third phase of my life was I had this very comfortable life working for this tea company. We had an apartment and car and gas never, you know, club memberships. And I felt two things. One is I felt that I wasn't learning. And second, I felt that I was working in a system which was perpetuating the class system, the caste system.
00:19:28
Speaker
the Brits had left behind the tradition of the Brits and Indians being subhumans in some sense and unfortunately many of us had picked up that tradition and were because of our background of caste possibly just perpetuating it to the to the notion of class and I found that to be somewhat disturbing and I found that to be disturbing because events
00:19:53
Speaker
and transactions that I experienced suddenly came to me and I said, you know, I don't think this is right. So I quit that job and Panchali, my wife was very supportive and though she had her own career, she recognized what was needed and she said, let's do it because I can transport my career. We moved to Delhi to work for Ayesha in the Faridabad Tractor factory.
00:20:17
Speaker
Right. So from very pakka meals in a dining room in gin and tonic, we were in a very different environment. The first of in a block of 500 flats in Vasan Koon, taking a bus to go to Faridabad. And it was a hard transition. Yes. Right. I almost gave up because it felt that I maybe because just the circumstances were so different. The context was so different. The environment was so different. And it was harsh.
00:20:47
Speaker
And from Calcutta to Delhi. And it was harsh, you know, it was harsh and it was very difficult. But we stuck it out. It was the best thing we did because that was a very defining thing. So what made you stick it out? I think just the habit of sticking it out, you know, you know, you felt like giving up, but it was impossible to give up. And then as you stuck it out, things got
00:21:10
Speaker
always a little better, always a little better. You got some new home and then you worked your way through it and one fine day you emerged in the sunlight and there was no looking back. And it was a fantastic period of learning, of understanding equality if you will at the workplace. You can be who you are, you can be the boss, you can be the vice president or the GM but you're a human being irrespective of what your role is and I love that.
00:21:35
Speaker
And that organization was ethical. It was outstanding in many ways. And it gave me the opportunity to move to the next phase of my life, which was working for the large global corporations. And that training I got from, I might have got a few ways of styles from my time in Calcutta, but the fundamentals and the training on
00:22:01
Speaker
of work and business and of ethic, of quality of customer that I got at Aisha, paid me rich dividend as I worked for PepsiCo and Motorola and then eventually at American Express. And I think the third phase or the fourth phase is that period. And suddenly at American Express, I found myself for reasons I didn't understand, boom, I suddenly got
00:22:24
Speaker
into a large job, into a big role with all the trappings of Mercedes, you know, I'm like, okay. My friend said, you're the only person I know who has a Mercedes. I said, yeah, I'm the only person too that I know. So, you know, it was coming from our background. This was massive.
Global Work and Identity
00:22:41
Speaker
And it was intoxicating in a way. At the same time, it was also humbling.
00:22:48
Speaker
And from there, I think the move to go around the world was great educator about understanding difference, about living with diversity, and also about coming to grips with being an Indian. Because being an Indian, especially coming from the background we came from, there was a certain amount of colonization that was imposed upon us. In a sense, the colonization, which I don't want to be,
00:23:16
Speaker
you know, too dramatic about this, but the fact is that, you know, white people were... It's a fact, Sanjay, yes. Were people who we sort of felt new stuff or worse stuff or did stuff, right?
00:23:31
Speaker
And I think that going out in the world helped equalize many things. And I think- Sorry, I'm coming in. I think what is amazing is the way that this, by your very life and the roles you played and the places you worked in, you challenged it probably at every level, Sanjay, about just the white person knowing versus, and I'm not saying this again, I'm not making, like you, I'm not trying to make it bigger than it is, but I do believe that there is tremendous value in this.
00:24:02
Speaker
in standing up for where you come from, the origins and what you bring.
00:24:08
Speaker
And so those lessons that going out there, living the life, living a life of some comfort, living a life of some style, when you're a senior in a large corporation like American Express, you live life at work and away from work reasonably, stylishly and splendidly, all of that was great. But just the travels, the cultures and the lessons were quite amazing. And that eventually culminated reaching a place in Singapore with a large global responsibility, looking at
00:24:37
Speaker
potential to go somewhere and back to where we started, my life coach. Amazing, amazing. What a journey. So if you had your life to live over, would you do anything differently, Sanjay? Many things would be the same but I would learn more, I would educate myself more.
00:25:01
Speaker
I would find myself more balanced in terms of sharper capability around certain skills. So I've always strummed at the guitar, but I've always strummed at the guitar and that's all. I've always strummed at the guitar poorly.
00:25:18
Speaker
We have to still do that Kishore Kumar evening. I taught my daughter very early on before she was taught by anyone else a few chords. So she proudly went to her first music class and her teacher said, oh, you play a little bit. Who taught you my father? And he said, well, I'll learn everything that you've learned.
00:25:37
Speaker
So, you know, I'd rather that he would say or he, she would say that, hey, listen, that's it. Your father's the man. So I would love to learn a few of those things. I think educating the mind, continuing to invest in relationships and building, you know, sharper capability in areas of interest. I'd focus on all of those things. The rest is just life. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. I wouldn't change.
00:26:03
Speaker
I mean, how do you say change things? What would you change for? Would you want to travel more? Would you want to see more? Would you want to own more? I don't know. I mean, would you want to achieve more? I don't know. But I definitely think I would love to be learning more.
00:26:21
Speaker
greater curiosity from a great earlier age, understanding the things I understand maybe earlier than I did, maybe, and, you know, investing and working with the relationships that are important for people, caring about people. I learned about the larger responsibility as a human being that I felt it came to me over time. I may have had it within me. Maybe I could do with that earlier in my life.
00:26:49
Speaker
And as I said, playing the guitar would be better. So Sanjay, before I ask you that, what have been some of the key influences in your own flu? It could be people, but things you've read. But key influences in your life? Who have inspired you?
Influences and Values
00:27:14
Speaker
Well, your parents are always a very important influence.
00:27:18
Speaker
The books I read, I read a lot of books. I don't know where I grew up because these were places that were inhabited by lots of Brits. We had massive libraries of books in our clubs and I read everything from A to Z whether you understood it or not. And then I realized one day that, you know, it all added up somehow some network of information and learning had developed. So I read a lot.
00:27:46
Speaker
And I think those were important influences. The friends I had in my growing up in my neighborhood were very important influences. I think my panchali has been a massive influence in my life. I think that
00:28:05
Speaker
There have been influences in every stage, every phase as you work, as you with people, with leaders, those have been of course very important. But I think becoming a parent is a big influence because a parent is an incredible process of adaptation, right? From cradling a child to supporting and nursing and to empowering. The child grows faster than you do.
00:28:34
Speaker
And to be able to understand the phases of a human being as they move through your life, and using that as an education to evolve yourself, I think. So I think my daughter has been a massive influence, as any parent might say, of their own own children.
00:28:52
Speaker
Yeah, but you know what it is for you is it is for you, you know, each parent, of course. And is there an adage you live by, Sanjay, when the chips are down, what keeps you going?
Traits for Overcoming Challenges
00:29:07
Speaker
And if you tell me the chips are never down, that's fine too. No, chips are down often enough. I mean, you know, when you, one of the things I realized, especially as I do what I do,
00:29:18
Speaker
that when you come out of large corporations, I don't know where the buck stops because you, buck stops with you sometimes, but there are oodles of money and there's lots of brand and there's lots of resource. And every time something happens that sort of affects the business, you feel very, you feel like you're in a difficult situation, but it's nothing like when you're doing something and you have 80 people and you're responsible for them,
00:29:46
Speaker
their well-being, their emotional well-being, their financial well-being. And you have just that limited amount of money in the bank. And you're fighting hard, and you feel everything that you're doing makes sense, and the world doesn't feel that way. And you're kind of wondering where the next stepping stone is going to be.
00:30:07
Speaker
So as much as you do these things because you are passionate and your principles and you have absorbed that this is what you want to do, living the light is like climbing the mountain, right? You want to climb the mountain. When you're climbing the mountain, it's step by step and it scrapes and bruises and you fall down. I think perseverance is what is most important and hope and a belief that if you try hard enough, then either you will just stop
00:30:36
Speaker
And that's it and or you will find something will happen and you'll find your way till it's impossible or you actually read somewhere. So I think perseverance and hope and optimism and I'm sort of blessed with those kinds of
00:30:51
Speaker
those kinds of attributes maybe that's because of how I grew up and what I did and what I got exposed to but I see them in me and to do what I've been doing for 10 years yeah I mean I feel as energized in some sense as I was almost 10 years ago and that is a bit of a strange thing I feel like should I go to a counselor
00:31:21
Speaker
Passion of the enthusiasm, the hope is so evident. It's not just evident in the work that you do, but it's an evident in the way that you engage with people or anywhere. And the genuineness of that comes out. So that's a beautiful, beautiful quality, Sanjay. And you can't fake it. It is there because it's there and it's very beautiful.
00:31:45
Speaker
your unique lens and I believe each individual, each human being brings something which is totally unique to them. And it's their gift to humankind in that whole tapestry, the thread that you, what do you think is your unique gift? I love people and not in a very, I don't mean that in a very expansive way. I give my love to people. So when I am with people who I know
00:32:15
Speaker
and they know me, they can count on me and they can count on my love. Whatever that might mean, right? It means different things for different relationships. But I think that's, and I have no doubt that that is what has got me love back. Absolutely. And more power to that, more power to the love you give and therefore the love that you get back.
00:32:42
Speaker
And may it continue to be unconditional to the- I love dogs too. I know the dogs love it right back. Yeah, that's true. Okay, so what do these kinds of conversations mean for you, Sanjay? What's the purpose of conversations like this? What do you think?
Storytelling and Positivity
00:33:04
Speaker
I think there are, you know, the art, firstly, I believe
00:33:10
Speaker
that everybody has a story, right? There are 7 billion plus stories on this planet. It is impossible for us to say, I have a story that is so unique that everybody sit up and notice. It's about knowing how to tell stories, telling the story of your life. And in telling the story of your life, you're reflecting constantly upon your life. And like some wisdom said, it's the good things that stay and the bad that is somewhere, but it
00:33:38
Speaker
And from the reflections of your life, if you can constantly reflect on the good thing, that's power to you, that's energy, that's battery, that's fuel. After this conversation, I have to jump into my car, scream into my car, smiling because I have reflected upon my life and found the positive nodes that recharge. So for me, that's what makes sense. Absolutely, absolutely. Sanjay, it's been an absolute
00:34:03
Speaker
pleasure and a joy to have you on Soul Rules with Siva in Coffee and Soul and thank you so much for making the time. Is there anything else you'd like to say?
Conclusion and Gratitude
00:34:13
Speaker
I love you Siva. You're really a star. You're really a star. You're an inspiration and
00:34:21
Speaker
and you are humbled beyond words. Thank you very much for spending your time talking with me. I'm sure there's another 7 billion stories you will find, but it's lovely that you're unearthing stories and just getting us to talk and in doing so far, fueling us with our own oxygen. Thank you.
00:34:40
Speaker
Thank you so much, Sanjay. Thank you very much, Indee. And have a great day. And all the best from coffee and soul. We must continue to have our coffees. Now it's cool enough for me to hold. Bye. Thank you so much. Cheers. Bye. Thank you for your time and attention and for being a part of Soul Brews with Siva. Until next week,
00:35:10
Speaker
and keep the coffee swirling.