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Ep. 59 - The Private Prayer Language of Introspective Con Artists w/ Bonnie and Karen of Deconversion Therapy
90 Plays3 years ago
This week we’re joined by our friends Bonnie & Karen, hosts of the hilarious podcast, Deconversion Therapy! We tackled some fun topics, and explored some theories about Joel Osteen’s toilet fund. If you’re not following them on social media, you’re missing out! Find them on Instagram and TikTok @deconversiontherapy, and enjoy their fantastic show wherever you listen to podcasts!
Check out our first merch! You can pre-order the "Born Again Virgin" t-shirt at www.growing-up-christian.storenvy.com
If you're a coffee lover, you owe it to yourself to check out our beloved sponsor, Captain Cecil's Coffee! They have an all new selection of single source artisan roasts for 2022, and they are offering our listeners 20% off when you enter the promo code "growingupchristian" at checkout. Plus, orders over $50 get free shipping! Find your favorite blend at www.captaincecilscoffee.com.
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Transcript
Merch Announcement & Humor
00:00:00
Speaker
Hey friends, quick reminder that we've got t-shirts available for pre-order. They got our new logo on them. They're nice. Uh, you go over to store envy.com and search growing up Christian, or you can go to growing-up-christian.store envy.com, which is a terrible URL, but it is what it is. Uh, there's a limited release. We're, we're only going to do the pre-order for a couple of weeks here and we have limited quantities that we can do, but I think you're going to like these and
00:00:29
Speaker
Every t-shirt you buy will chop five years off of your time at purgatory, which I feel like some of you need. So growing-up-Christian.storeenvy.com or go to Store Envy and search Growing Up Christian and get yours today. Now, on with the episode. You're not thinking of the weight of this. Why wouldn't you marry Joel Austin? The hair product's alone.
00:00:57
Speaker
the money behind the toilet, the mansion, the traveling. That choice makes a lot of sense. That's the only sensible answer I feel like. That one works. I'm going to bang Greg Locke because I don't want to be loved. I want to be taken. It is a fine second ordeal, I guarantee you.
Introducing Jeremiah & Apartment Talk
00:01:33
Speaker
Hey, everybody. Welcome to another episode of Growing Up Christian. I'm Sam. I'm Casey. And we have Jeremiah here hanging out with us tonight. What's up, guys? So how's it going? Oh, fantastic. Casey, how are you? You're in a weird white void and I'm not comfortable. I am. I'm in my I'm in my Kansas City apartment and there's no decorations. And when I got here, the heat was turned all the way down, so it was freezing.
00:02:03
Speaker
But it's good now. What's freezing? I mean, it was down like the thermostat was pegged at like the lowest setting. Are the thermostats into pegging? That's interesting. Yeah. Yeah, it must have been weird to walk in on that. It was like being pegged with an icicle. So you have experience with that. So I know that you're explaining something that you
00:02:32
Speaker
It's exactly what that is. What's great about that is like, if you do get it stuck, like if you overdo it and get stuck. It's going to come out eventually. I mean, and it's like an enema really. Was it like licking the flagpole, like the cold and the really soft skin just kind of bonds immediately. Yeah. And you just got away for spring. Look, if you've never had to use a hairdryer for like an emergency de-icing.
00:03:04
Speaker
I have never actually seen someone do the frozen pole trick, have you? Like a frozen flagpole? Yeah. Yeah, I've seen one or two people do it. I mean, it's just like it looks like there's something about the metal your tongue and your tongue is so soft, it just sticks to it immediately. I have never seen it in real life. Every time I see it in anything and you watch the pole away and like the
00:03:31
Speaker
Oh, it's really hard for me to watch because I think if somebody just like taking maybe what we were talking about revenge movies last week, I think this would be a great way to kill somebody is you get their tongue stuck to that flagpole and then you just rip their head away and it pulls it. That's what I think of every time I see it. So I think that this is connected to everything important. Yeah. Well, I just pull your spine out. If you rip somebody's tongue out, they're holding a chicken and they choke on their own blood and they die. This episode is weird. I think we started off in a weird space.
00:04:02
Speaker
Yeah, I don't think you're describing like a final destination movie, not revenge. Yeah. Well, I appreciate Saddam Hussein was accused of this. Yeah. That was before or after he got into chemical weapons testing on people. Right. That's according to Dick Cheney. So yeah. Well, I mean, take all the subsequent heart condition problems that people have. But, you know, that's just a coincidence.
00:04:32
Speaker
Oh, are we going to go? So can I, can I go off on something for a
Ghislaine Maxwell Verdict Discussion
00:04:37
Speaker
minute? Go off queen. Is that what they say? Okay. So, uh, Glenn Maxwell got convicted this weekend. Yep.
00:04:47
Speaker
Um, which that's good. I feel like it's the only possible conclusion to everything that happened. There wasn't going to be some big reveal or anything like that. But, uh, what was crazy about it, I was watching a video where they were talking about it and both the BBC and Fox news on their like after report where they, you know, they always have a pundit on to talk about the verdict and stuff. Both channels had Lex Wesner.
00:05:17
Speaker
on to discuss the verdict. And so he's like the billionaire lawyer for Jeffrey Epstein. It's the one that got him the sweetheart deal when Acosta let him off in Florida on those molestation charges and stuff. He's also one of the people accused of molestation
00:05:40
Speaker
in the case that Virginia Dupree accused him of any, and he used his time on the BBC apparently to like kinda smear her like through some shade at her. It just made, like as, I don't know why of all the people you could talk to, you would have that guy on to give his take on it. Apparently he owns Victoria's Secret Abercrombie & Fitch Express Incorporated in Bath & Body Works.
00:06:09
Speaker
and Wikipedia says his other name is quote, the Merlin of the mall. All right, well, that's a good nickname. I mean, I'm not, you know, everybody's got their their their pros. Yeah, there's a whole section in Wikipedia career, Jeffrey Epstein Association, like that's that's the two sections they have. Oh, then philanthropy. That's great.
00:06:33
Speaker
Yeah, just not a great guy to have on for any reason, especially not to like slander the person accusing him of of molesting them while they were underage. You muted Demi. My biggest hang up was God. I probably talked for like a good minute. I don't know. I was muted. Cool.
00:07:04
Speaker
Yeah,
Humorous Mall Store Ownership
00:07:05
Speaker
my biggest hang-up is the way that you would say molestation the first couple times. You got it right the third time, so that's fine. But I almost cut you off and didn't let you finish your sentence, but I figured I'd do it myself. What did I say? Molestation. Molestation. He did a molest. It's like mollusc.
00:07:28
Speaker
mall estate. That's a weird way to say it. Are you supposed to say mall? Not mall, mall, like you're going to the mall. I think so. Yeah. Maybe that's how they say it in Boston, where everybody looks like a human rat hybrid. Yeah. I mean, that's an interesting take, but I don't know that that has a lot to do with. That was mean.
00:07:52
Speaker
Yeah, it's fine. I mean, I think we've probably broken a record for the number of times someone said molestation on a podcast. Well, let's get it over the hump. Make sure it's a hard goal to beat at least. We can set a Guinness world record or whatever. No, it's the one that's like really easy to Ripley. Is it Ripley's? Can you just get Ripley's now?
00:08:15
Speaker
Yeah, that's a, that's probably not in the book just yet. So we might have a chance at like planting our flag in that one. Yeah. Most of the time. Okay. So if you guys are going to be like, let's say, uh, you set off to be the Merlin of the mall in like the year 2002. Okay. When all the good stuff, when mall still had stores in them and they weren't just kind of like a carpet bagger market of
00:08:45
Speaker
you know, had embroidery and stuff like that. What what stores would you want to own? And would it be different today than it would have been when you were, you know, 16?
00:08:58
Speaker
Go ahead. Yeah. You start Jeremiah. I think what I mean, I think the smart business choice is obviously like three FYEs in the same mall, just at like different ends for all of your DVD rental needs. But 16 year old me would have wanted to own all of the game stops that like all the game stops and maybe like a pretzel cart. And I think I still stand by that. Yeah. Like an, like an anti ends. Yeah. Those are the best cause you can smell them coming.
00:09:27
Speaker
If you're in the same block, you don't even have to be on the right floor. You can smell that pretzel house. You want a pretzel that weighs at least two and a half pounds. It's got enough sodium to kill you if you don't split it with somebody, like that type of pretzel cart. Who are the lunatics that are ordering the pretzels with the dirty hot dog in the middle?
00:09:48
Speaker
I've never heard of this. What's that? What? No, that's like a corn dog. It's a pretzel. Is that what you're saying? Yes, it's a pretzel dog. But do they actually crisp the outside like a pretzel? Like, is it like boiled dough? Yeah. And I mean, I. I'm coming at it pretty hot, but I would probably eat one. Actually, I think I have
Fast Food Burger Preferences
00:10:11
Speaker
eaten one. I think I dropped one on the floor in the Dallas airport and still ate it.
00:10:17
Speaker
I got a few bites in before it, well, one end hit the floor. Yeah. So you just carve that piece off and you still got like a lot of dogs left. You just ate it like a beer of corn. I was going to say, yeah. One side, got a pretzel and a little bit of hot dog in each bite. Yeah. You just nibble the side with no hair. Yeah. Exactly.
00:10:40
Speaker
Okay, so FYE and then what was the store? It was like a movie store, but it wasn't FYE. It was like older and they had weird action figures and stuff in it. You remember those? I thought that was FYE. I don't remember what these were called, but it was like almost more of like a movie buff.
00:11:02
Speaker
like a movie fan store and they would have like weird. You remember like those strange morbid action figures that some of those stores would have that were like adult collector items? Yeah. I mean, what's a hot topic would have stuff like that, too. We had around here. It wasn't in malls, but there's we had I think it was just around this area. Newberry Comics.
00:11:26
Speaker
So yeah, it's not wearing a belt, but it's kind of like that was a mix of everything. It was like FYE meets hot topic meets. I'm probably explaining it wrong. And anyone from the series can be like, fuck you, dude. You don't know what you're talking about. People like it, but there's a lot of collector's stuff there too. Like you can get.
00:11:42
Speaker
a wide array of music and movies, but you could get shirts and you could get action figures and any sort of collectibles. It was a big deal. I guess it still is. I haven't been in one in ages, but it sounds like whatever your version of that was, is what you're explaining. It was like, was it cinema? I don't remember. Anyway, somebody knows what somebody, somebody will message us with the name of it. But what's your choice, Sam?
00:12:12
Speaker
Okay. My go-to in high school, that's tough. Probably would have been some shitty clothing store, like an American Eagle or a Paxon. Paxon was pretty dope back in the day. Yeah. I used to find a good bit of my clothes with Paxon.
00:12:33
Speaker
And that, you know why? I think that was the first store that allowed me to accessibly and easily buy skinny jeans. I think that's why I have a soft spot in my heart for a back son. That's where it started. That's where it all started, man. I'm in college. I'm shopping around and looking.
00:12:47
Speaker
American Eagle still too baggy, right? Cause it's for the more those like preppy kids. It's not who pop collars. Remember the, the, uh, the, is it still a phase that kids go through where you would wear two polo shirts so that way like, and you would pop the collar so that way the kids still aren't doing that. Yeah. They're not doing that anymore.
00:13:06
Speaker
I mean, there's a lot of like these kids. Yeah, there's a lot of like terrible old fashioned that's coming back. Like you see kids with like mullets and super baggy clothes and stuff. And it's like they're doing, I guess, a slightly hipper version of the 90s. Still doesn't look very good. Oh, mullets are coming back full force. I've seen
Mall Shopping Experiences
00:13:22
Speaker
a few lately. I love the it's like the you'd put a pink polo on and then a brown polo and you pop the colors inside. It's like fresh. Those kids are looking good.
00:13:35
Speaker
That was the kid that like stood outside the party store and tried to get somebody to buy them like Jager bomb components. Yeah. He definitely tried buying pills and didn't realize he was buying aspirin and then fly it to his friends after like taking money out of his mom's jewelry box. April said that like 2000s era fashion is coming back right now.
00:14:04
Speaker
Like girls are wearing those, uh, like super low cut jeans with the flared legs and. Really? I haven't seen anyone dress that way yet. Very Brittany. Yeah. She, she's ahead of that stuff then for me. I don't know.
00:14:20
Speaker
Crop tops are, I don't know if they were ever out, but I feel like they're literally everywhere now. There was this picture that's going around of like Ted Cruz with his daughter, like his wife and daughter. And they, I guess his daughter, she's like only 13, but she went to TikTok because that's where the 13 year olds live. That's their metaverse right there. She went to TikTok and basically said, I don't, I don't agree with my dad on everything. And people are loving it. And honestly, people need to stop giving kids like this attention because
00:14:51
Speaker
Like it's not special as a kid to not believe, if she believed everything her dad believed, I'd be like, yeah, that's fine because what else would you expect? She's 13, doesn't know anything. And if she doesn't believe anything her dad believes, it's because her dad believes it. I'm not saying she doesn't have agency, but 13 year olds aren't smart and we should stop putting them on pedestals.
00:15:09
Speaker
Yeah, like a 13 year old whose dad is a famous politician, and she publicly disagrees with them, like, obviously. But my connection, why I even brought the story up is in the picture that got shared around. I guess she was wearing a crop top.
00:15:24
Speaker
and but the photo that got posted her Ted Cruz had altered so it covered the shirt like covered her tummy and after I heard that I can you can kind of see the photoshop job I don't know I mean I'm gonna believe it because it sounds very Ted Cruz she's always been a problem for him remember when uh
00:15:43
Speaker
It was back during one of his presidential runs and he like tried to kiss her on stage, like try to kiss her on the cheek and she's like, no, no, no. I mean, if you're like preteens on stage with you and you tried to kiss them in public, they should, that should be their reaction. It's like.
00:16:03
Speaker
Yeah, that's such like a a pandering move of look how close my family and I are he tried to kiss around the lips I heard because just to show how close they were His lips are slimy guaranteed he looks slimy to the touch like he looks like you remember in the first x-men movie that guy that turned to jelly Yeah That's his mutant power
00:16:31
Speaker
He does look a little bit like a linebacker who just started melting like 10 years ago. And he's just gotten sadder and grayer ever since. Like someone like robbed a wax museum and put Frosty's hat on it. Dude comes to life. Oh, man. OK, my.
00:16:56
Speaker
Merlin of the Mall Choice is the same then as it is now. I want to own the store that sells hookahs and beaded doorway covers and swords. You want the Wooloo Mall Ninja store. Yeah, it's like a brick and mortar wish. Yeah, dude, that's what it is.
00:17:22
Speaker
I don't know what mine would be now. I haven't been into a mall in so long. I don't even, those still exist. They're not doing well. It's not. Wichita has two. We have the east side and the west side mall. The west side mall is, it looks like RoboCop in there. It's like escape from New York level decay. The east side mall is holding on.
00:17:52
Speaker
I feel like malls were like the only businesses that were excited about the pandemic because they were like had an excuse to take money and not have to completely wall like hole up because like you would go into them. They're already like kind of empty. And now that's like the pandemic like that's why we were okay. And now the pandemic ruined us. So we'll just take that government money and just not hemorrhage money for the next year and a half. Perfect.
00:18:21
Speaker
Yeah, Yankee Candle and their billion dollars PPP loan. Yeah. I think I'm like the odd man out, but I actually like malls.
00:18:32
Speaker
because I don't like to shop for things online, like some things, like clothes especially, like I wanna like see it and feel it and try it on. I don't wanna have to bother sending it home. I'm weird shapes, I need to be able to try stuff on, it's hard, like I'll try it on and then I can buy the other 10 versions of it online, but I really wanna go in person if I can.
00:18:53
Speaker
Yeah, I'm five, six, and an 80% torso. I need to see what these jeans look like. I'm about 80% torso too, and it does make shopping for stuff very difficult, like the lines, they just don't flow. Remember those little figures that you could buy in the quarter turn machines that were like homies? No. Remember those? Ah, you'll have to look them up. But I feel like they had like real baggy pants and their legs were about like an inch long.
00:19:23
Speaker
Yeah, I do know what you're talking about. Yeah, actually, it sounds a little familiar. Very cartoony. We're homies. You and me, we're orangutans, one or the other. I'm not going to Google that. I'm not sure what to type in. How do you Google that? Homies and figures. 25 cent. You put the thing and you turn the knob. What are these things even called? Is there an official name for those if you wanted to buy them for your
00:19:52
Speaker
Oh, I got a store bubble machine. I don't know the homies. They they are a set of plastic. No, no, they're too old for that. They're plastic collectible figurines representing various Chicano Mexican American characters. They have different series you can buy. Oh, there's a lot of them.
00:20:12
Speaker
Something tells me it feels a little bit weird for white people to own the entire collection. Yeah, I don't feel like I'm going to. I'm going to totally collect sticky hands instead. Yeah. Or super balls.
00:20:26
Speaker
Are the sticky hands worth more if you don't take them out of the packaging, like to keep the stick fresh after like 20 years? Oh, they definitely are. You take them out of the packaging, they're like a corn dog hitting the ground in the airport. Like a collector, like they're valuing it, they're going to have to like taking it open and just dab it against the wrist, like to just see, does it get that good pop still? Dude, I can't wait like 30 years from now to watch Antique Roadshow and there's somebody like popping a Superball out of the original plastic bubble that it came in in the quarter machine.
00:20:57
Speaker
You ever go on eBay and just look at like the weird giant collections of stuff that people are trying to sell? It'll be like 18 years of McDonald's toys every single one still in the package.
00:21:11
Speaker
And people will pay a lot of money too. Like there's always somebody that's like I've been as a child. My only joy I got was on Sundays when I go to McDonald's with my grandparents and get the toys. Anyway, I made a bunch of dot com money and I will spend $4,000 on this complete original set. Thank you. That's exactly the my collection.
00:21:32
Speaker
Like collecting is like an action. It's not like a, it's an action and it's a thing, right? But to like just go and like acquire someone else's collection and be like, this is my thing now.
00:21:45
Speaker
That's what being an adult like with money is like, like when you're a kid and you're collecting, you know, I didn't do Pokemon cards, but I wasn't allowed to, but like friends who collected Pokemon cards and stuff, you get like one set a month or something. And now they're adults and they're like, yeah, I can just buy like, I'll just pay for 35 packs till I get what I want. But it's not as much fun anymore because like, you know, they're not, if you're willing to spend a lot of money on an adult hobby, they're not that expensive. And it takes a lot of the thrill out of it.
00:22:12
Speaker
Or beanie babies. A lot of people went under on those bad boys. That didn't pan out the way people were expecting. But NFTs, they're going to stick. Yeah, but NFTs, it's happening. We need to get into the NFTs for sure. Do you guys remember the old Burger King toys or the McNuggets you could dress up that would come out around Halloween?
00:22:34
Speaker
No, those are badass. I like never ate a burger. I think you guys were a lot less vegan than I was. A lot of this is not ringing bells. Were you did you have where you was your family, not a meat eating family? Oh, yeah, not at all. My mom would make fish every once in a while. She grew up like she raises to a little more like pescatarian vegetarian and then got more into being pure vegan when I was like an early teenager. And yeah, my parents are 100 percent vegan.
00:23:04
Speaker
Wow. Dude, that is actually really interesting because I feel like I didn't even, I wouldn't argue that I thought
00:23:14
Speaker
being vegan wasn't even a biblical perspective. I never knew anybody who avoided meat until I was in high school. And I felt like it was just- Half the opinion over this burger, boy. Yeah. I felt like the only people who didn't eat meat were teenagers who just wanted to be rebellious and have that part of their identity. That's how
00:23:36
Speaker
little I got of that. So hearing that, like what, cause I mean, you obviously grew up in a super conservative evangelical family as well. So where, what was, what was that? How'd that even work? That sounds so wild to me. Well, it's just funny. It's like people ask questions like that. And to me, it's just like, what do you mean? How does it work? You just like, don't eat meat. Like you just eat a lot of vegetables. Did they talk about why? Um,
00:24:00
Speaker
A little bit. I mean, the primary reason was health was just because it is generally healthier to not eat a lot of processed food and red meat and everything. For most people, I'm not trying to make any big sweeping health advice things, but it wasn't just eating vegan. My mom was a fantastic vegan cook and made really, really healthy food. So that was the primary reason. And then for her, it was a little bit about just being a good steward of the earth, but you got to be careful who you say that around because some people get a little bit like,
00:24:29
Speaker
Why are we trying to preserve the earth? What the raptures come like five, six years from now, like the left behind books, they keep dropping. Do you not know how this is going to go? Like what are we trying to preserve it for? So like there's some people I think take it to, of course, the other extreme in like evangelical circles, like burn it all down.
00:24:47
Speaker
frack the cows, carve everything just into a meat shake. But my parents, I think they're starting to... They don't gloat. They wouldn't do that. But they're getting to the age where everyone else their age is on a bunch of medications and health is starting to break down and stuff. And my parents are like, hey, we're about to be retired. We're going to go backpack every national park. That's their plan. My mom outrock climbed me, which isn't a huge feat, let's be honest.
00:25:13
Speaker
But she outrock climbed me like a couple of Christmases ago and she's 60. Like they're doing fantastic. So it's hard to argue with the results. Yeah. I mean, dude, that's sick. I think it's so funny. I would have been so blown away. That meeting a vegetarian or vegan family when I was.
00:25:29
Speaker
like a elementary school kid, even middle school would have been like meeting liberal Christians. Well, these exist. They weren't super strict about it. Like if we went to a restaurant and we wanted like one of us wanted to get a burger or something, that was fine. It was just they weren't going to cook it in the house, which is even cooler. I like that perspective. But they
00:25:50
Speaker
It's a lot easier to be a vegan these days than it used to be. Like kids these days, like there's actual vegan ice cream that's fantastic. There's, I think cheese, they still can't make a good cheese, but there's butters and stuff. You would never know the difference. I mean, there's a lot of like legitimately awesome vegan food. They're even getting like beyond meat is getting to the point where like, it's not the same, but I could have a good beyond meat burger. And if it's like properly dressed and stuff, like it's, it's as just as good of an experience as having a real meat burger.
00:26:18
Speaker
But back in the day, like the ice cream was just like hard as a rock. It just tasted like icy coconut water or something. And like the yogurts were terrible. Like soy has come a long way. Like I used to eat soy in the dark, the really dark bland days. Yeah, everything's kind of moved that direction. Like you can have some wild dietary ideas and probably find some pretty normal foods to eat as substitutes. Yeah.
00:26:48
Speaker
When thinking about, like some people will still, I don't know, I guess you'll hear people have differing opinions on the Beyond Burger. Some people are like, you can barely tell the difference. Other people are like, this doesn't taste anything like a burger. I've never tried one myself. I've been interested in giving it a shot. But it's funny because, you know, McDonald's
00:27:07
Speaker
Is McDonald's in that game or just Burger King? I forget if they're all, you know, they're pretty much everybody has an option now, like a Beyond Burger Impossible Burger. I think Burger King might have been the first with like the Impossible Walker or something. That's right. But I think it's funny because if I if I want sometimes I want a McDonald's burger, I just think they taste good. But if I want like a burger, like a real burger, you don't go. Let's go to McDonald's like you. They're not the same. They're so different. So I feel like
00:27:36
Speaker
When people are like trying to compare the Beyond Burger to like a McDonald's or Burger King burger, when you're like, you're already getting something that doesn't taste like a burger. You're just upset that it doesn't taste like what you think of when you think of McDonald's or Burger King, but it probably doesn't taste nearly as much like a real burger.
00:27:54
Speaker
I don't know. Like it's already gray and flavorless and like this thick like make it out of a plant. Who cares? What's the difference? Exactly. Half the flavor with McDonald's is the bun and the cheese. Anyway, the bun is like, what, 30 grams of sugar or some shit like that?
00:28:12
Speaker
That sounds about right. What is like your fast food burger choice? McDouble, dude. I don't even have to question that. I fuck up McDoubles whenever I can. McDouble, isn't that, is that like the dollar menu one? It used to be. Now it's like two bucks or something, $2.29 sometimes.
00:28:30
Speaker
Come on, Joe Biden. I know. Exactly. Make doubles, gas prices. What do we want? Rapid tests and real burgers for a dollar. I'm voting all right next election. I can't handle this anymore. I think my favorite fast food burger is actually a cookout burger. Do you guys have cookouts?
00:28:50
Speaker
It's not good food, but it probably tastes the closest to like if you're on like a scouts camping trip or like Royal Rangers, in my case, and they get out like the big old Costco pack of like 35 burgers that they're throwing on the grill. And, you know, the scout leaders over there just slapping them all together. And like it's a, you know, flame cooked burger. It honestly tastes pretty good after a long day of hiking. They taste kind of like that. Like it's it's definitely better than a McDonald's cheapo burger, I think. But it's not like good food. But out is where we.
00:29:20
Speaker
Now I'm blanking. Cookout, then I know. You have talked about cookout. I remember you talking about cookout when we were in college.
00:29:27
Speaker
So I've never been to one. Jesse, okay, it is cookout. He's going to be so mad at me for mixing in and out. In and out is the one from the West Coast, isn't it, that everyone raves about. That's the one that's super famous. Cookout, I think it's a lot younger and is like the $4.50 gets you a milkshake. A meal, yeah. Yeah, and an onion rings, a burger. It's so much food. It's terrible for you. It hurts, but it's so cheap. Yeah. When I went to North Carolina with Jesse for that beloved show, he made sure we went to cookout and
00:29:58
Speaker
I mean, I was impressed. I liked it. I mean, I feel like it was hyped a lot, maybe overhyped. I don't know what I thought I was expecting, but when I got there and you pull up to the drive-thru and you look at the prices on the menu, you're like, I'm reading this wrong because that's a burger price. He's like, no, no, that's everything. That's like a burger in two sides and a drink price. It did blow my mind a little bit.
00:30:28
Speaker
And I thoroughly enjoyed it. So you guys have Freddy's Freddy's steak burgers. That's like a thing here. And they are delicious and like fairly reasonably priced. And they've got, they have like a very small menu. It's like burgers. Uh, I think they have a chicken sandwich that they shake out of a bag or something like that. And then like onion rings and fries and ice cream, but it's great.
00:30:59
Speaker
Cool. That was my choice. You guys ever had sloppy steaks? No. This sounds like it's always funny. Evermind. It's, forget it. For the few people out there, they'll enjoy it if they get it. We can move on. It's about time to wrap this thing up.
00:31:29
Speaker
I have one news item I wanted to bring up. Yes, you have a topic. I do. I do. So are you familiar with the origins of Let's Go Brandon?
NASCAR & Cryptocurrency Controversy
00:31:37
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Yes. Like Brandon Brown, the NASCAR driver for anyone who doesn't know, a newscaster made the biggest mistake of her career in good faith.
00:31:47
Speaker
The crowd was chanting, fuck Joe Biden. And she trying to like not get an FCC fine was like, Hey, oh, I think they're saying let's go Brandon and the NASCAR driver Brandon Brown was like, Yeah, okay. Well, since then, to his credit, he's been like, Look, I don't want to be involved in politics. They're just using my name. Like, please leave me out of this. This has nothing to do with me. And honestly, I felt kind of bad for him. Like,
00:32:08
Speaker
You can't really pick when you get dragged into being like on the Internet. I think I like a saying I heard once that's like every day someone's the most famous person on the Internet and your goal should be to never be that person. No matter what. They'll be like, you know, falling out of a bucket of grapes or, you know, getting punched in a bagel shop. Exactly. It's like you're never going to be the most famous person on the Internet for good reasons, like ninety nine point nine percent of the time. So I honestly felt a little bad for him.
00:32:36
Speaker
But he now has a new sponsor for his car. They have unveiled, he's, I'm sorry, I'm trying to read this whole headline. He's going to be sponsored by cryptocurrency meme coin. Let's go Brandon coin, which has been unveiled for the 2020 NASCAR Xfinity series season, but it gets better. Guess what the short version of that name is. LGB coin.
00:33:03
Speaker
Okay, lgbcoin.io. Let's go branding coin. So on their website, they're the official partner of and they do partner up in those space between the two words because this is run by amateurs of NASCAR Xfinity series driver Brandon Brown, blah, blah, blah. It's a decentralized meme token inspiring positivity and patriotism grounded in a strong belief in the American dream and the principles of freedom. This is America's coin. Brought to you by Austin University.
00:33:34
Speaker
The coin is currently selling for $0.00009445.
00:33:51
Speaker
This is not crypto advice, all crypto is a scam, don't do it. However, if you wanted to spend like a dollar on, let's go Brandon coin, you could get, I think 10 million coins. I don't know if I'm doing the math right. You get a lot of coins and just wait. Maybe it'll go up by like 18,000% like some of these stupid things do. If the rednecks figure out how to download MetaMask.
00:34:14
Speaker
So he's got an LGB coin painted on the side of his car. Although NASCAR in the past couple of days, they had approved it. And now they've seen the car. They are having, quote, higher level discussions about that sponsorship. Why is he what blows my mind is that he wants
00:34:34
Speaker
that sponsorship. I mean, he's a real NASCAR driver. Is he being paid well for this? It seems so crazy. Money to sponsor one of those cars. Yeah. So the sponsor with a coin that represents something political that he didn't even want to be affiliated with is really- Well, he said he didn't, but I'm wondering if maybe he thinks this is his opportunity to ride the wave. Yeah.
00:34:56
Speaker
Well, it's all money based. Like if you got the money to compete, you'll compete. If you don't, you're just only ever going to do so good. That's the way I understand it anyways. So when somebody waves a check, do you want to race or do you want to stay home? Yeah. How much, how much cash could LGB coin possibly have? Well, as someone who owns 14 million Shiba Inu coins,
00:35:23
Speaker
I would guess that it could be a lot. Is that a true story? Oh, yeah, yeah. I shouldn't be in charge of my own finances.
00:35:39
Speaker
I love is the people talking about like Shiba like they think it's gonna pop like Doge like what if it gets to a penny I think or a penny or a dollar one of those like exceed the GDP of the world like there isn't enough money in existence for it to go that high but people still think like yeah I don't know the memes they just they just do this I could just pop off I mean all has to do is go up to like if it even went up like
00:36:01
Speaker
to like 50 cents or 10, 10 cents, you would, I mean, you'd walk away with what, millions, right? If you're looking at what meme coin, I don't remember how many zeros were in front of that nine four, that point nine four. Oh yeah, it's an insane amount. I mean, it's down to all those zeros in seven, nine, 18, it's gone down about 20% in the last two minutes, so.
00:36:23
Speaker
It's a wild ride when you're in meme coins. It's all about like the, you got like the, the five ones at the top, which have legitimate futures. And then there's everything else, which is all just like, what are people Googling today? Right. It's like 100% hype. And you got to jump off that train before the hype dies.
00:36:48
Speaker
Yeah, there's definitely some like my brother-in-law invested in one that I think he bought it when he bought a bunch when it was like $29 a coin and then it shot up to $3.50 and he didn't cash out. Now it's down to like $2.50 or maybe even $1.50. He thinks it's going to go back up. I'm not sure that it's trending in that direction, but what doesn't the
00:37:20
Speaker
the god I'm gonna I'm an idiot I don't know anything about crypto at least keep it that way like that's the best thing for everybody involved no it's my get rich quick scheme for someone who doesn't know anything about it it's like gambling for people like us right Casey it's like yeah but I mean why not I'll throw a hundred bucks down here see what happens I think the difference between this and gambling is gambling kind of has rules
00:37:41
Speaker
like there are odds that do exist, even if they're like super stacked against you, they technically exist. I don't think this has that this is more like, I'm going to shoot a rocket into space. And if it lands on a planet that can support life, I'm rich. I think that's how it works. Like that's, that's the logic. It will land on a planet. Space isn't all empty. Okay.
00:38:04
Speaker
Yeah, we're actually starting our own pretzel dog coin and you can just make those checks out to Casey and Sam. Yeah. I mean, why don't we start our own? How do you make a coin? Can we make growing up Christian coins? I think you just yell it loud enough and it happens. They just show up. Make sure meme coin build a community in the metaverse and we're going to
00:38:31
Speaker
We're riding this thing into the 22nd century, baby. When you build your template website that looks just like all the others, make sure yours also has a strong team behind it and a robust roadmap and a super cool community. Hit all those fine points like they all do and you can't go wrong with Gutcoin.
00:38:50
Speaker
Exactly. Guck coin. I don't like the sound of that. It sounds great. Well, it can be guck.io, so you call it Gucci-o. Gucci, man. Oh, that sounds European. Gucci-o coin. We'll sleep on it. We'll come up with something good. And then you can all invest and make Casey and I rich. And then we'll just cash out and say, see you later. It'll be great for us. So we would appreciate your support. This is like the long con. There's no hell.
00:39:21
Speaker
You got 60 years on this rock, scam somebody if you get the chance. That's what I say. Yeah.
00:39:29
Speaker
This whole thing has just been a long, slow buildup to just launching your coin and checking out. No, we're building trust. You establish that trust and then you take advantage of it as soon as you can. So we're on our way. All right. Our guests, guests, plural today, are the lovely ladies from Deconversion Therapy Podcast.
00:39:59
Speaker
Bonnie and Karen. Bonnie and Karen. And this was just, we've had the bomb before for anyone who's been following us and listening from kind of the start. I forget what number episode they were. We had a great time talking to them. They're very funny. Their podcast was very funny. So we thought it'd be great to hang out with them again. So we invited them on and just talked shit. I mean, there was no agenda. There was no, you know their stories. If you don't go ahead and listen to that first episode that we had the bomb.
00:40:25
Speaker
You could find it in the back catalog. I'm not going to help you or give you a number or stop to look it up, but it's get the story and then come back to this one and listen to us. What? I mean, where did we go? It was all over the place. Oh, we talked about, uh, the, uh, Bonnie's Hollywood career and. Oh, it's some goofy games. It's fun. It's a good episode.
00:40:55
Speaker
So yeah, enjoy our conversation with Bonnie and Karen, the conversion therapy, but first a word from our sponsor.
00:41:05
Speaker
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00:41:35
Speaker
going into the holiday season, he offered us a very generous promo code of 20%. But because Captain Cecil's loves us and the growing up Christian community so much, he's decided to extend that 20% to our listeners going into the new year. So go to Captain Cecil's coffee.com and remember to enter the promo code growing up Christian at checkout for 20% off your order. And of course all orders over $50 get free shipping.
00:42:00
Speaker
That's CaptainCecil'sCoffee.com. Enter promo code GrowingUpChristian. Hey everybody, we're back with our guests, the incredibly funny hosts of the Deconversion Therapy podcast, Bonnie and Karen. Hi, Bonnie and Karen.
00:42:21
Speaker
How are you doing? Oh, I'm supposed to ask you that. So let's just start over. We're going to take over. Sorry. This is Bonnie and Karen today. We have Casey and Sam with us. This is what happens when you have people who host podcasts on your podcast. It's like an interview inception that happens. It's like an arm wrestle to see who clicks cruise control first. Exactly.
00:42:45
Speaker
I'll just, I'm just going to kick it and let you guys take us to the end here. Is that fine? You guys want to? No. Yeah. Aren't you going to open us up with a word of prayer? Yeah. Heavenly Father? No. That's as far as I'm going before. Tongues only or I'm out of here. I was going to get real charismatic. I didn't write tongues.
00:43:08
Speaker
I was totally adjacent. I hoped at some points that my prayer in the charismatic group would somehow evolve into that. But unfortunately, it never did. I never had my moment of tongues. I don't think we covered this before. Did you guys ever have your moment of tongues? Did we talk about that? I did. Bonnie had already
00:43:33
Speaker
jumped ship by the time I was working my way into the charismatic world. And if you think you weren't doing it right, you were. They were just like, you know, just start doing it, walk out on faith. And of course, you just imitate everybody else. That's kind of what they say about meditation.
00:43:55
Speaker
Well, you're not really doing it wrong if you're trying. There you go. That's what they'd say. And then, you know, just like anything, you would just start doing it whenever and you doubt yourself, but people around you would be like, Oh, yes, that's from God.
00:44:13
Speaker
They affirm it. I see the spirit on you. So I can still do it, but Bonnie gets scared. She says, don't do it. Is it too much to ask for you to speak in tongues for us? You know, I have not done it in a long time. And as you know, there's public tongues and then there's prayer language.
00:44:31
Speaker
Okay, you don't get those confused. I need you to take us to school on that because that's right. So the way I can do it, I thought it was the same thing. I thought public, I thought tongues in your private prayer. So when I was at Liberty and I was adjacent to this group that did believe in tongues and it wasn't for me, I remember thinking, uh, based on, you know, my interpretation of the apostle Paul that
00:44:56
Speaker
They're that they only that the private prayer language was tongues and that maybe some people had that gift. But I certainly I was able to be like, well, I just don't have that gift. I have other gifts. That word is cool that people didn't respect as much. But that's right.
00:45:12
Speaker
i definitely never got to tell me no matter how much i tried and after we talk about times i want to hang on the meditation concept for a second too because why is it that tongues always like. Everybody's tongue sound the same like nobody launches into tongues and has a sound like german you know exactly it and everyone would say you know.
00:45:34
Speaker
None of these languages are the same. They're all ancient languages. We're all ready You have a yeah, you have 200 people in a church. Well, you've hit the language limit on earth We're done. No one else can speak tungsten, but everyone sounded the same the shit about a Honda type of you know, it's White southern person thinks Jewish sounds like or Hebrew
00:46:03
Speaker
That's right. I picture a lot of K sounds in there, like, ha maka laka sha maka ba. Yes. I don't know. Hebrew. That's right. I'm feeling, I'm picking up on some Hebrew notes right there. It's a C-H, Bonnie. It's more of a, but you're close now. When Kenneth Copeland does tongues, it sounds exactly like that. Oh, gosh. Oh, we're going to talk about him a little bit tonight.
00:46:26
Speaker
Maybe in a way that you wouldn't expect. Sexy time. Hey, you're on the right track. We found a Kenneth Copeland porn and we're going to show it to you. What's the difference between private prayer language and tongues? It could be the same stuff, but private is you keep that stuff to yourself.
00:46:54
Speaker
You don't do it in your mind, you still sort of whisper it so there's an understanding that you've got the gift. Because you don't want to hide that. It's like ASMR at that point. Yeah, yeah. And then public is when God sort of forces you in some way to stand up in a church service and you do the blind out. And then you know it's of God if someone else stands up and interprets it.
00:47:20
Speaker
And let me tell you, I've been in a few where there's very long awkward silences and you're just like, oh shit, that guy's not of God, you know, because no one's interpreting and everyone's really nervous and then someone will stand up. Just like I, like if no one is saying hi to someone, I'm like, I'll do it.
00:47:43
Speaker
So someone stood up and interpreted, and God usually says the same thing. He says, my children, the time is getting closer. It's time for you to know that I love you. You're my children. You're special. I mean, it's just, there's a doom and you're special.
00:48:05
Speaker
which is the deadly mixture. I love the idea of someone being able to stand up and interpret for someone else what they had said, because that could go so wrong. The way it needs to happen is that after someone speaks in tongues, they have to wait for two people to say that they can translate, and they take those two people into separate rooms. Separate rooms. And then have this conversation about what they actually are saying. It's more about the spirit of what's being said.
00:48:36
Speaker
That was actually a game we did in an improv class at some point. You know, you do gibberish and then somebody interprets it. And like the one who has the hard job is the interpreter, of course.
00:48:49
Speaker
I was actually going to ask you about that because when I was listening to your podcast today, you mentioned something about being in improv classes in New York. They were fun. Did you have some connection to the comedy world?
00:49:06
Speaker
Kind of, when I was in, when I worked in- You're missing your podcast. The podcast is a connection to comedy work. Oh, I worked in comedy development at a studio. And so my job was literally to go to comedy shows all the time. Yeah. So that's a big wig, but she doesn't talk a small wig. But every time you talk, someone mentioned someone, she's like, yeah, I met him or this. Tell, you talked about your roommate who was in the car with Joe Rogan.
00:49:36
Speaker
when he um okay so my roommate was dating a guy from news radio and they all went to the emmys or i don't know golden gloves maybe and um she comes back and she's like joe rogan turned himself upside down and showed us how he could touch his penis with his tongue and i'm like what why so
00:50:00
Speaker
For years, I had been holding on to that. And then it comes out, you know, it's some kind of Google alert, I don't know, on the news. Yeah, because it's like a couple weeks ago, I guess he said it on his podcast. He watched it with somebody who's like, well, I can suck my own dong. I know.
00:50:20
Speaker
So I always held that as like, oh, that's my special knowledge. He spoiled the surprise. But I'm impressed that 20 years later, he can still do it. That's true. Yeah, that's probably the most impressive thing about him at this point. Sorry, Casey. Yeah.
00:50:42
Speaker
News radio was what, Andy Dick? Was he, he was a part of that, wasn't he? That show was amazing. Amazing. The Andy Dick show? No. News radio. I've watched like two episodes of it, but I don't really know much about it. Those were like the great rockers of comedy writing. Anyway, I could go on, but Phil Hartman was in it.
00:51:06
Speaker
Oh, yeah, I hear nothing but good about him. Oh, and Mara Tierney. And anyway, OK. You left that world. You left it completely. You could. Yeah. But can you I mean, take what you love and then make it a job.
00:51:22
Speaker
That's what we're trying to do here. Are you serious? I mean, except for you guys, it'll work out for you guys. Yeah, right. That is funny, though, when you think about like, I feel like people have these like very romantic. I mean, we all do. It's really romantic version or ideas about like doing something for a living, you know, and I don't care how much you love to fish. If you have to wake up to this morning and you have to fish,
00:51:51
Speaker
Like fishing sounds a lot less impressive. And, you know, you're not going to take and go fishing on your day off now. Like you kind of you've tainted that. It's it's a different thing now. It's just not all it's cracked up to be. That's what I said as a supermodel. I was like, I don't want to do it. Don't want to do it. And then I did it. There is a lot more walking involved. That was the big turn off. You're like, I can't. I'm done.
00:52:20
Speaker
I am more of a supermodel hobbyist myself. Okay. But let me, but seriously, every time I think about that, um, there was a guy.
00:52:28
Speaker
Cause I went to acting school too. Cause that's what you think you have to do. Oh, I like entertainment. I will be an actor. And so, um, one of the first things that he's James Franco's acting school. No. Um, although I don't know, maybe it was, uh, but the, but one of our teachers said, don't mistake a love of enjoying something for wanting to create it. Cause those are two very different things that stuck with me forever. And I'm like, yup, I'm out.
00:52:58
Speaker
yeah that's gold you have met some like very interesting characters during that time to eat i mean some people who are absolutely nuts i can i would imagine yes he was
00:53:11
Speaker
Well, everyone who was the cutie at your school, who was the cutie at my school? Yes, I'm I'm he was in the afternoon classes and I was in the morning classes. Adam Scott. No way. I was I would like go peek in and watch them doing their dance rehearsals and stuff like he's so good because he's just, you know, talented and talent wins and he he deserves to win.
00:53:38
Speaker
He deserved anyway. And then there was this meathead guy, I know this isn't what a podcast is about at all. There was this meathead guy who was such an ass and he would go up to girls and go, you know why I look like this? And they go, what? No, so I don't have to date girls like you. I'm like, no way. Who says that?
00:54:02
Speaker
Is this somebody is this like a name now? No, but he was all buffed up and meted out and. Gross. What a douche. Yeah, I would never like. I would never try to look at which like you're in shape. This gets gross. You know, yes. And I can tell right where that is. If any one ever means there is there's that line.
00:54:31
Speaker
and I can see it get crossed and a body at height, breath ratio. Once it's off, that's it. It's true. Your whole personality is trash. Yeah. It's a hound difference. I was like, so much of your mental energy is devoted to that. You can't be funny or charming anymore.
00:54:55
Speaker
I don't think so. I like the people who skip leg day where it's like they're really big up top and their legs. I feel so bad for them because no matter how many leg days they do, it's still going to be want want.
00:55:14
Speaker
I think it was Casey asked us before we started if we've gotten any like blowback from anyone and there was this he wasn't a pastor but he was like a want to be something and he kept messaging me anyway he wanted to write a book on people who were
00:55:34
Speaker
Deconverting out of evangelism out of the church anything and you know, I told him just Not going to do it not going to talk about our listeners to someone and then use it and
00:55:49
Speaker
He just got all, you know, he was creepy, very crossing the line all the time. And then we saw he did have a podcast and he did have a book and his podcast is him taking a picture of himself in a weight room mirror, sitting on a weight bench with his, not it being a leg day for a long time, but the upper half very built.
00:56:17
Speaker
And we're like, that's your podcast cover? I mean, you guys, if you did it again, if you want to take a selfie in a gym mirror, feel free, but yeah. I'm not about it. I don't go to the gym for sure. All right.
00:56:34
Speaker
I like those people though that are very curious and want to learn more about people who deconstruct. And it's like, so they can make a short list of reasons why everyone is deconstructing. Yeah. Like the gospel coalition did this article a few weeks ago. Did you guys see that? No. There's four main reasons. We actually talked to that guy.
00:56:59
Speaker
We had him on and it was just such an unfruitful discussion that I don't think we're going to even air it. Like it was just pastoral deflection. You know what I mean? And then, you know, because there was very like cut and paste answers for why people deconvert and the very simple one line solution for how to not fall for that trick. Yeah. But then when you get into the, you know, you get him and you corner him on it, it's like,
00:57:27
Speaker
Well, actually, what I mean by this is if you look at the source and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, it's like that's not what you said in the article. Right. And you haven't talked to any people who have really deconverted. And Bonnie, we did talk about it briefly on one of our episodes because remember one of them.
00:57:45
Speaker
some of our listeners want us to make a t-shirt. I left the church for street cred because that was one of his points. And I'm like, what street do you live on? What street do you need cred on? That's not the Huffington Post piece, is it?
00:58:02
Speaker
No. Okay. No. This was, yeah, the gospel coalition. And I think, you know, what was it? One was Trump, two was street cred. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. All right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. First one was church hurt. Church hurt. Church hurt. Bad teaching. And the prescription was lament. Oh. You know, lament. Yeah, yeah. I guess he's sad about that war. That's sad. You should come to Bible study.
00:58:33
Speaker
The Street Cred one was the funniest one though, because it's like, because they make it seem like such a trivial decision to like, throw your worldview into, right into a tumult. I want to have awful conversations with all my friends and family over this subject, because it's cool on Twitter, you know, I want to have Street Cred with people I never talked to, because
00:59:00
Speaker
they were sinners in the first place. But I can't wait to get to this new street where I'm going to have credit. Yeah, it makes no sense. But I can see that for some jobs, you know, maybe, or everyone's, you know, using swear words and
00:59:19
Speaker
and smoking things and going out and drinking and you're like, oh, well, I guess I better fit in with my work crowd. Yeah, I just made a lot of work for me in Christianity, so it wasn't a big deal. That's what's so funny about it. All these things that he acts like people want to do, like, oh, I just want to go sin. I don't know if you've
00:59:42
Speaker
been to church, but like, the only like, the only difference is like, I mean, if you're a Christian, you just get to apologize and repent for it afterwards and still be good. Like, yeah, we're not finding any real difference between like, what's going on in and out of the church. I mean, we all know the stats divorce rates the same, like,
01:00:00
Speaker
all the shit that they act like is out in the world is just like kept under the rug in Christianity and they're all acting the same and then just pretending like they've like that they're just a work in progress and they're just in the process of sanctification is the language that they like to use. They're not perfect, Sam. They're just forgiven.
01:00:21
Speaker
Yeah, they had 2000 years of close ties with an all powerful deity. But that doesn't mean you can tell the difference between them and an atheist. You just you can't do it. I did like a catch TikTok about like, there are, you know, another news story has come out about a terrible situation that happened to a young
01:00:49
Speaker
kid and we really need to lock up these people and blah, blah, blah. I don't agree with their lifestyle. And of course the whole goating was that it would be homosexuals, but then it was youth group leaders because the statistics are insane on youth group ministers doing shit. Like I think it's
01:01:12
Speaker
We need more studies because it's bad. It's got to be. It's like a position, if you feel like you need to be in ministry or you want to be in ministry, but you're a man child.
01:01:24
Speaker
Like I'm not saying all youth leaders are men, children or anything. But we all knew, I mean, you know, at Liberty, there was the people who were Bible majors. And then there was the people who were like youth ministry majors. And there was a distinctive difference if you looked at the collective. And one of them drank a lot more than the other group, you know?
01:01:47
Speaker
Well, Bonnie and I were saying that, like Sam, as he drinks. Like the youth ministers, yeah, they were young at heart. But when you're young at heart, which Bonnie and I are too, like your mind doesn't get to the maturity level that other people are at your age. So that's why they're like, you know what, I think that 16 year old does like me. You know, that's the situation.
01:02:14
Speaker
It is an unbelievably common. Yeah. Okay, so if you take the church as a business and you look at the head of the church, that's the CEO and all the different parts, there's no secular version of a youth minister. You like the CEO only with less responsibility and impact and accountability.
01:02:37
Speaker
Maybe the equivalent of that would be like the CEO or company owner's son. That's exactly what I was going to say. He's a COO. That's his title. We have two of them. There's one COO that makes a lot of hard decisions and he gets to just masturbate in his office and think nobody's thinking. I do much more than that as a CEO. That's why he's throwing shade at me.
01:03:06
Speaker
There you go. You need a black light that round. Yeah. I think the whole, all of that, I would think like maybe the youth minister is like the person in charge of diversity and inclusivity. That's what I think. Oh, social media manager, maybe. The social, I don't know.
01:03:30
Speaker
It's a quandary. We'll have to go to the jails and ask them. It's got to be a very ambiguous position though. Without a lot of tangible things that you could connect to it. It's not the CFO because he has all the financial stuff to do. You can look at a report at the end of the year and say what all things he did. The youth pastor's got to be a floater.
01:03:55
Speaker
Yeah. Right. Like an intern who just never goes. Right. We had so many youth interns. Wow. Yeah. Did you have youth interns that came alongside the youth pastor, or did you just have a revolving door of people who were in charge of the youth group? People who are one or two years older than we were. Right. They were just superior. Look at my authority.
01:04:24
Speaker
I have to let a dog in. Was that? That's my dog impression. It's not like a stampede. At the time it didn't dawn on me, but then years later I'm like, what the hell? They were barely older than we were.
01:04:46
Speaker
Some of them were dating some of the people, RA. But honestly, some of them were outside of the dynamic. Not that it's always, it wouldn't be weird anyway, but someone who graduates from college with a youth degree at 22 in charge of the youth group of, oh, you're hanging out with kids who are 16, 17, 18. Some of it's weird. I mean, depending on how young you go, it's weird. But if it's the high school senior, look, if they weren't,
01:05:16
Speaker
the youth pastor, they were just at church. I know, I'm defending. It's just not like the most unreasonable thing for that person to find someone in the youth group attractive, but instead of being like, that's exactly why you probably shouldn't put them over a body of students. You're like, that makes it, that makes them perfect for this because they're only a few years removed so they can still understand them. And they'll, the kids will respect it and look up to them and it creates this
01:05:43
Speaker
has to potentially create a very problematic environment. I remember when he was lame as a member of the youth group. That's right. The youth leader that you and I had, Karen, was opposed to either of you guys. We got ripped off. He didn't seem cool at all. He was very farty. That's how you know he's safe.
01:06:08
Speaker
He was farty. That's the first adjective. Yeah. He was definitely, I would assume, early 40s, but looked 50 and married and, yeah, definitely didn't fit into the cool thing that you- No, like he was not the stereotype from the HBO show, the Regis Gemstones. Oh, my God. He was not that. Incredible show. Exactly. Yeah.
01:06:38
Speaker
There was always like it seems to say that again. Now, I said, what are the weirdest youth group games? I feel like every youth group, it sounds like your guy was pretty maybe not that weird, but, you know, a lot of youth groups devolve into, you know, eating chips out of people's toes and shit like that. Like, have have you ever played more sexual games in your life? That's what I like.
01:07:03
Speaker
Popping the balloon with your butt sort of thing. Even just the handing the orange. I remember we did that. Yeah. Orange from neck to neck. And I was just like, this is the closest I've ever been to a boy in my life. Look how you saw your first kiss. You guys did it co-ed, huh?
01:07:22
Speaker
Yeah, I can smell the guy I handed off my orange, too. You smelled like oranges. That's it? Well, all the girls are staring daggers. Like, I can't believe you made me get near the sun. Oh, in a bad way. He was the guy who said about another friend of his, like, he keeps aspirin in his car to give to girls. Like, let me tell you, that's not going to do anything. And we're sure it was aspirin.
01:07:52
Speaker
He's got like a Batman tool belt of commonly asked for things just in case someone needs a pencil sharpener. Absolutely. Yeah. Aspirin. Oh, my God. Does anybody have gum? He's like, I got gum. I got gum. I gotta lift him up. Change. That's right. I just felt fun. He's always like, I got change.
01:08:21
Speaker
It's like the little individual pens dispensers of quarters. Exactly. Always near the youth group guy when he's like, oh, we should get more pizza on it, you know, a little cloud of smoke behind, you know, Santa's little elf.
01:08:38
Speaker
Yeah, like the like the single dudes like the middle-aged single guys that were just kind of odd. Yeah. And they were just around the youth group all the time. Yes. Yep. And they had one that wore a duster. Yeah, they would guide them. Yep. Sort of. They always had a vehicle if you needed ride sound. But those, the equivalent to those are the same middle-aged men at skating rinks.
01:09:08
Speaker
Oh, OK. If you see that I'm dragging with you. It's the same. You know, one's Christian, one's not. Or maybe it just went on Wednesday night and they're like skating rink night. Is this ice skating? Roller skating. Roller skating. OK. Now I'm like a skate park. Yeah. No, that's very flat. It's like a skate park, but it's completely flat and there's nothing to do.
01:09:38
Speaker
It's inside. It's a roller rink. Yeah. OK. And then there's middle age men. It's.
01:09:46
Speaker
Let me tell you what one of these leader guys did. One of my friends said that he was curious about drinking. He wasn't middle-aged. He was probably 28 or something, but at that age, it felt middle-aged. He was like, well, then you should drink and you can drink and be safe and I'll be on the phone with you.
01:10:11
Speaker
Oh my god. That's just weird. It's just weird. We'll just hang out on the phone. Yeah. Almost like we'll fall asleep on the phone together, kind of hang out on the phone. There you go. You take a sip and then let me know. You took a sip. But drink and I'll kind of be here so that you don't do anything crazy and you don't get in trouble.
01:10:31
Speaker
But you're going to get it out of your system. And the person drinking is doing it alone. Right. Like an alcoholic. Okay, just making sure. And then, I guess, the middle-aged guy is after a few hours. It's Sherpa. He's drinking Sherpa. What are you thinking about? Do you like him? What are you wearing?
01:10:52
Speaker
How do you feel? Do you feel funny yet? I'm actually have never really drank yet, so I'm curious to know what this is like too. Are your pants tight yet? Are you in your PJs? What's on your PJs? Is there button up in the front? Do you have one of those hatches in the back so you can take the dump without having to pull your pants down? Who has those? The hatch. The hatch. The back hatch. Casey has those. Oh yeah. You know, we're not here to judge.
01:11:30
Speaker
Speaking of youth group and youth group games, I'm going to segue us into a couple. Did you guys, so when I was in youth group, we had the youth group version of, and it wasn't really done in youth group, but it was done amongst the youth.
01:11:44
Speaker
Yeah, the PC version of it for a youth group was Kiss Mary Kill, their PG version of Fuck Mary Kill. Did you guys play that? We played... What was the game, Bonnie, where we all sat in a circle and then the girls had to sit on the boys' laps to make them smile?
01:12:07
Speaker
What kind of shit was going on in the leader section? It was something like, can I make you smile? You know, it was definitely some, you know, perv who invented all these things. I'll think of it and people know. It is so accurate. I'm going to look at it.
01:12:32
Speaker
But no, we did not have anything about violence and sex, Sam. But they had it on 30 Rock. Close enough. It's the same. So I can tell you who Frank would marry Bob Gill.
01:12:48
Speaker
Well, yeah, I remember being in middle school was when I was introduced to kiss Mary killed, but it's fuck Mary kill, which is where you have to fuck Mary, kill Joseph and raise Jesus as your own baby.
01:13:06
Speaker
Uh, okay. So, but we're going to play this, uh, real quick. And of course I believe both of you are happily married. So this is, of course, no, okay. Not happily just married. Okay. Okay. So maybe we're going to, we're going to break these down. There's no quick answers here. We need to really weigh the pros and cons of all the people involved in this consumption.
01:13:31
Speaker
And I know you all have spilled a lot of words on all the people that'll be brought up at this point. So for round one of Fuck Mary Kill, we have Joel Osteen, Greg Locke, and that fat piece of shit who talked about women not wearing sweatpants in Walmart, Stuart Alan Clark. You guys remember him?
01:13:54
Speaker
I remember him, Bonnie, do you remember him? We did a little bit about him, but you've got to picture the full thing. He's the one that's like, not every woman looks like Melania Trump. And then you put a picture of her on the screen.
01:14:09
Speaker
Yeah, his whole he's a very ambiguous looking person like there's not a lot you can't no real defined face It's just like yeah, it's like it's like if you put like some googly eyes on a ball of play-doh Stuck that on he looks like a butternut squash. Yeah. Yeah so in relaxed fits I
01:14:30
Speaker
You know, I thought that these examples would be, like, hard to choose, not disgusting to have to choose. Yeah, oh no, of course it's going to be disgusting. That's how this game works. Hold on, let's do it for Bonnie, please. Okay, we have Raffa Nidal.
01:14:57
Speaker
OK, very funny. We have, um, Kendall Duhan.
01:15:03
Speaker
And we have Donald Trump. Who do you want? Okay. But see, okay, but this is pretty much what you've done because Joel Osteen, I would do with the, the Mary and the F1. Well, you can't tell. I know. The funny part of this game is that's what's funny about the game. It implies that you're not having sex with the person you marry, like a real marriage. Come on.
01:15:29
Speaker
A long-lasting marriage. A good Christian marriage. Okay. Together for 20 years, you've had your kids. Then Karen can answer this round.
01:15:39
Speaker
I mean, Joel Osteen seems like a passionate lover, don't you think? No, listen, that is... I want some of that toilet money, so I'm marrying him. Okay, good move. Copeland has a lot of money. It's wall money. You didn't say Copeland, you said Locke and... Oh, I didn't say Copeland, you're right. I said Joel Osteen, Greg Locke, and Stuart Allen Clark. So I've got the Mary down, the F, oh no, Steve. Greg Locke probably fucked.
01:16:08
Speaker
That guy is going to be aggressive. He'll yell at you. He might choke you a bit, but he is. Yeah, I read probably will shock you and not touch you.
01:16:21
Speaker
He's like one of those through the shoot dudes. Or you mean he has a cattle fraud and that's all that happens. Is he just electrocuted in jerk soft at the same time? Masked or unmasked. Okay. I think. Or condom. I know.
Humor on Relationships & Scams
01:16:38
Speaker
There you go. I think if I have one opportunity to say kill and Greg Locke and the same sentence I'm going for it.
01:16:46
Speaker
So that, I am going to make sweet, sweet love to Stewart Allen Greer. That was his name. Oh, Mark. Stewart Allen Greer. Sweet love. I didn't expect it to go that route, but perhaps for biting the bullet and killing it.
01:17:07
Speaker
You know, a hero comes along with the strength to carry on. I've got, that's a got to with that. Okay, Bonnie, I sent you a picture of my sex partner, Stuart Allen Clark, if you need to look at him again.
01:17:24
Speaker
The person you cheat on Joel Osteen with. Oh, yeah. You're cheating on Joel Osteen with Stuart Allen. I mean, I respect your moves. I look, I think if I feel like Greg Lockwood, I feel like that guy can fuck. But I also think it would be funny to put a bullet in his forehead. So I understand why you went that way. I just feel that he's very he's a pocket pal. He's very just like, you know, frenetic.
01:17:54
Speaker
And well, that's true. It'd be five seconds. You could close your eyes and pretend he's Zach Galifian. You should marry him and then you could stay in separate rooms and be, you know, estranged. You're not thinking of the weight of this. Why wouldn't you marry Joel Austin? The hair products alone. The money behind the toilet. The mansion. The traveling.
01:18:22
Speaker
That choice makes a lot of sense. That's the only sensible answer I feel like. That one works. I'm going to bang Greg Locke because I don't want to be loved. I want to be taken. It is a fine second ordeal, I guarantee you. I want to have to go to the hair salon afterwards.
01:18:47
Speaker
I don't want to derail the game, but we got to talk about this, the toilet money. I would love to hear your theories on what what happened there.
01:18:56
Speaker
I have the answer because that's how I am. I think I know things, but I'm going to let Bonnie give her could be correct. Why would he want offering envelopes? He's got plenty of money. It's clearly somebody who was working on the house and had access to two separate places. One where the pile of offerings were and one where there was a hole in the wall and just shoved it in there and then sealed it up.
01:19:23
Speaker
Right? Like a handyman. It had to be somebody who had access to the safe, right? Because they said it was in a safe is what they claimed when it was taken. So it's somebody within the inner circle there. Definitely. But I had to be quick because why would he take checks?
01:19:40
Speaker
He just took whatever he could get, right? Exactly. Just like he took his shirt, stuffed it in there and like did this. Yeah. Of course, at that church, it's not suspicious to walk out to see a man walk out of a room with no shirt on clutching a bag. It is. I mean, it's just, yeah, very normal. Your shirt is sticking Venbo like a hobo. And that's how we found out it was the youth group leader.
01:20:06
Speaker
Who else would walk shirtless and everyone be like, he's going to get Mountain Dew? I agree with Bonnie, although there are a lot of women secretaries that have embezzled from churches. So who knows if but I don't think it was him. I think Joel, because we did an episode on him and we're shocked that he doesn't take he doesn't take money from the church. Like he makes tons of money.
01:20:34
Speaker
If he took that money himself, he would have put it on his jet. Like, why would you put it behind the toilet? He could have easily gotten it out there. And he just shows up to preach. He's not like sitting in there. And it's small potatoes for him. Yeah, that's like nothing. That is like less than 1% for him. Like, he's not going out of his way for that. And then to hide it in a wall. We know that guy doesn't know how to seal up a wall, too. I mean, that guy doesn't know how to use it.
01:21:03
Speaker
Do you think they've referred tools to like diamond mine rules where it's like if you get caught with an extra quarter to cut off your hand or. Yeah, I think it's calling out like now. I think they're just.
01:21:16
Speaker
Cermets and NFT and your crypto currency. I don't know. I think he's just jumping right to that. But I do also wonder like it obviously it might be someone who isn't there anymore. But we had a listener who said he knew someone who did something similar, stole some money so that it would only look like it's the other person because they were disgruntled, a disgruntled employee and they wanted to frame it on the boss.
01:21:46
Speaker
So interesting point. Okay. Well, I worked for a woman.
01:21:53
Speaker
whose name will not be mentioned. And she was so oblivious to how her system didn't work. I actually thought at one point, I'm going to start taking $75 a day and put it somewhere and show her that this is easy to happen. And then after a year, I'll go, here is the money I've been taking from you for a year. And then I thought,
01:22:18
Speaker
Probably gonna play out the way I expect. This probably won't be the way I was thinking. The problem with people who... Oh, I'm sorry. No, say it. The problem with people who will take that money is they're never as good at lying as they think they are. That is like a universal thing with liars.
01:22:41
Speaker
I feel like a lot of people think they can lie really well. It's like acting, right? I feel like it's a lot like acting, which is why you can't trust actors. I mean, let's start there. And you know. There you go. Fine. You lived in that world. I don't know any, but I hear. We had like $500 go missing at the store where I worked once. And we knew it was this guy, but we didn't have any proof. So we sat him down and said, listen, we have video tape.
01:23:10
Speaker
of you taking this money. And you can tell us right now if you want to, or we can bring the authorities in. He's like, no, man, it's okay. I'll tell you what you want to hear. I don't want to go back to jail. And we were like, back.
01:23:31
Speaker
I don't think I've mentioned the company that I specifically that I work for. So let's just hope not, but I sit next to a woman who does sales audit. So, you know, I mean, if, basically like if one of the retail stores, I work for a retail company,
01:23:49
Speaker
in the corporate office. So if one of the stores comes up short at the end of the day, they're going to get a call from her the next day. So it's like, and she is brutal. The amount of times I've heard phone conversations from her, I'm like, I would have quit. I would have been gone. I've almost talked to her and been like, that was a lot. Like that person is definitely crying after they hung up the phone.
01:24:12
Speaker
And it's like, it might be over something as small as $20. It's like, well, there's supposed to be $20 and that $20 is gone and you were the one who was working. Maybe you should check your pockets. And the people are like, I don't have it. I feel like you can hear them. I didn't take it.
01:24:27
Speaker
It's really like people are terrified and she will just straight-up accuse anyone who was working that shift of stealing that $20 I mean, I've worked in a retail job before like at a store College and some you when you count it the end of the day, it doesn't line up. You're just like fuck. I'm just getting fired I quit saying here like I know how this is gonna play out I already
01:24:51
Speaker
Yeah. Oh my gosh. Okay. So this has nothing to do with God or anything, but I was working at Macy's when I was like 21 and somebody came up to me and they're like, somebody gave me this gift for Christmas and it's chocolate and I'm diabetic. And I'm like, Oh, I'm sorry. So I go about like, do you have your receipt? No, you don't. Of course you said I was a gift. Here you go. And then I realized she had just taken it from the display. Left.
01:25:20
Speaker
Now that's a scam. That's so sad. That's when you swore you'd never open it again. Oh my god. In the creative ways that people think.
01:25:36
Speaker
What did you do about it? Did you run to your manager and come clean right away?
Ethical Discussions & Jokes
01:25:40
Speaker
Not a bit. And you were like, well, we'll see how this plays out. I'll just go put it back on the display. So Bonnie went and made a Xerox of candy and then cut it out and then placed it there. So wrong. Decoy chocolate. Do you have any other people you want us to... Yeah.
01:26:05
Speaker
D flower. You guys are so clean doing this one, Bonnie. No, I don't think I should because I've taken an oath as a realtor. And, um, we're like a code of ethics. And so if anybody ever tracks it down to me and I say that I want to kill somebody, I might get, you know, you just get terminated. Wait.
01:26:28
Speaker
What if I say, what if we change kill to punch in the throat? Can we do that? I feel like there was a time not that long ago that you had to be connected to a murder to be a successful realtor in South Florida. How about I rank them?
01:26:52
Speaker
There we go. Hot mix. That'll work. We'll let you do whatever it is you need to do to keep your job, whatever, okay. I don't know, I'm just a nerd like that. Let's play it safe. All right, Catherine Crick, you know her? No. You do. You're gonna go, yes you do. Okay, is she the one that gets people outside and they're always like crying and
01:27:20
Speaker
you know, we're getting this delivered from this girl. Okay. Yeah. She's casting out demons in LA. Apparently she went to acting school and didn't make it in the acting world. So she's now casting out demons in LA. We did find her IMDB page. There are tons of people who either did that, did acting or music. Copeland.
01:27:44
Speaker
Yeah. Oh, well, he's also on this list. Kenneth Copeland. I mean, you can't have these lists without throwing Kenneth Copeland on one. And the last is Sean Feut. Oh, damn it. No, I feel like you have to say his name twice every time. But don't say it a third time because he will show up. All right. What we got again, we have we're going to marry wine.
01:28:11
Speaker
OK, so wait, let's do whose teeth would you lick? OK. Go ahead, Bonnie. Whose teeth would you lick? Kenneth Copeland doesn't have real teeth. So does this count? I mean, his teeth are clearly fake. It's the way it falls. I would lick Sean's first, and then that lady, and then Kenneth Copeland. That's a black hole. Your tongue will never come out of. That's my order.
01:28:43
Speaker
Just lick Kenneth's and they're like a gummy jelly mold of teeth. You feel them slip back and you actually get the roof of his mouth a little bit. I told him. Kenneth, because I think it would be so entertaining, yet, I mean, obviously. I just want your husband's face to pop in. I know. He sounds gross.
01:29:13
Speaker
I think that would be hilarious. Plus, you know, he would blow away my COVID.
Sean Feut Controversy
01:29:20
Speaker
There would be so much happening in that room. During the act, you would definitely grin creepily at you and point in your face. Oh, man. You have to remember that. It's so demonic. I can see him doing the like- You have to do it then you would slut shame you. I know. I can see him doing the American Psycho, like looking at himself flexing in the mirror during it.
01:29:42
Speaker
Or just like a skeletal arm that's under that jacket. His skin's hanging very low off the bottom of his arm. And then he's going to squeeze his hand where he has that pocket of blood that goes in that glass. Did you see that video? He pretends that he gets cut and he squeezes it into a glass mixed with grape juice and drinks it. Oh my God.
01:30:08
Speaker
on his plane. That's a good trick. Not even on the plane. So, but the woman I don't know very well, so I would think marriage because we could get to know each other over. Okay, I respect that. And you can see where I'm going with Kill. I mean, one that here needs to be put out of its misery. That is a side part that need not be like that. It doesn't make sense.
01:30:36
Speaker
You don't wear a Lakers tank top to lead people to Jesus. That guy's not fair. I feel like there's a lot of trickery going on with him because he has just that hipster vibe, but it just doesn't work with trying to lead people to Jesus through praise and worship. I think it worked enough to keep him financially
01:31:00
Speaker
float a float. Okay, so it's working. It's working better than whatever I'm doing. He's got enough to keep him afloat, but he's never going to be a superstar. Well, he came in third when he ran for Congress. I didn't even know he ran.
01:31:23
Speaker
Yeah, he ran for Congress, came in third in his district, and then was like, oh yeah, God called me instead to nearly immediately George Floyd was killed. And he decided God wants him there. And then he went to the George Floyd
01:31:40
Speaker
impromptu memorials that were going on and he stood in the middle of the street with his blonde hair flowing and played Christian music so loud in a black neighborhood that all the black artists on the sides of the road had to stop playing because he drowned them out. Like he's... Come on. I and the killing shall go to Sean.
01:32:04
Speaker
Yeah, that makes a difference. I think I'm marrying Catherine because I feel like this particular scam is a phase that she'll eventually come out of and find a new scam. Just be it's fun to reinvent yourself. I feel like I could be a good cohort. And she's outdoorsy.
01:32:25
Speaker
You're a good sales person too, Casey. So yeah, outdoorsy, good sales. She's basically in sales, you're in sales. I can see that working out really well. I would love to pitch a scam.
Televangelist Scams & Integrity?
01:32:35
Speaker
That's all I want to do. That's not what you're doing now? We can so do it. It's always baffles me. I unfortunately can't do it because I'm such a good person.
01:32:54
Speaker
Seriously. It would be so easy. People just do it all the fucking time. It's crazy. They do fall for the same tricks over and over again. Yeah. Oh yeah. Like the same trick person. Like the guy's just a little too over the top in the tank.
01:33:13
Speaker
for whatever particular viewpoint they're, you know, like they just like love grabbing these characters and putting them at the forefront of their identity group, you know? Over and over and over. And they just can't see it. So I'm like, well, you know, I would like people not to see me. Maybe I'll try one of these things. Maybe I'll grow my hair long and curly. Do a hard part. Get an air streamer. Get a Lakers tank top and hit the moon.
01:33:42
Speaker
You have to be unusual looking in some way, though. Like that's like a sales training tactic, too. Like there's got to be something about you that's memorable beyond the point of like, because people aren't going to remember what you say. They're just going to remember. Yeah, it's a quick little twirly hat. Make three stages noises. It's a good one. Well, when I I post a picture of when I was a missionary doing pantomime,
01:34:10
Speaker
with the bright cheek makeup, I can pull out that makeup again. You didn't miss your pantomime. You're supposed to be like lady of the evening. I don't even remember. Wait, pantomime? Is that my me? Yes, it is.
01:34:26
Speaker
I'm doing a bit of cheerleading slash voguing slash miming. Have you guys seen those videos from Asian countries where they do like a pantomime thing of, oh my gosh, I can't believe you knocked over this kid in a wheelchair. Go away. And then they go up to the kid in the wheelchair and they give him love.
01:34:47
Speaker
TikTok videos. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yes, some of those are so outrageous. I used to do those for God. I sent more information on this because I still don't think I understand what you do. Don't put God
01:35:03
Speaker
in a box. I just pantomimed a box. No, this was just with you when I was a missionary and you'd go overseas and you all were too lazy to learn the language so you would pantomime how Jesus is going to die and that all of you are different sins like gluttony and vanity and all this and then Jesus is going to die and we loved our makeup so even Jesus had rosy cheeks
01:35:32
Speaker
And it was played by Sean Feud. It was. And they're like, that hair, we knew there was something special. But there were people there with each other interpreting it for their friends. Right. Right. They're speaking in tongues. They should have bought a Honda, is what they're saying. Should have bought a Honda.
01:35:56
Speaker
Oh, then we kill Jesus, which is fantastic for the people who have no understanding of the Bible, do not know why we're here, don't understand we're Christians. They just see people enacting killing the other person in the group who is nice.
01:36:12
Speaker
and then lifting him up into, he's not on a cross, could not carry props around with us. We were traveling show. You didn't make a human cross together and then- That's it. Just the hands to the side. Really? We would bang his wrists. In the music, there would be the banging noise. Then later he resurrects and then he hugs us all. Everyone clapped. They loved it.
01:36:42
Speaker
They did not know what it meant.
Church Performance Pressures
01:36:45
Speaker
They were like, Americans can put on a show. Did you guys interpret clapping as people responding to an altar call? Did you include them in your numbers of all those who got paid? We should have. Your soul winning stats.
01:37:02
Speaker
We were planning scenes. How many souls do you think you saved? Do you have zero? Come on. Yeah, I really I hope so. I really think and I've had a few back up on me, which I'm proud of. But no, I really think zero. My husband and I were talking about that with our kids. And luckily, missionaries are unless it's
01:37:33
Speaker
forcible missionary work where they like colonized and took away everything from them and made them attempt Christians. The actual numbers are very low. Really? Yeah. I feel like I have one maybe under my belt. I don't think Wow, not anymore. No, that person is not anymore. So I don't have any but I believe once saved always saved for that. So I'm just going to go ahead and say I still have one because it's hard for me to
01:38:00
Speaker
You just for the numbers. But yeah, I'm a numbers guy. I'm a numbers guy. Oh, I got none. Yeah. I spent a lot of time worrying about, you know, whether or not I was ministering effectively a very little time actually doing it. Did you rededicate your life? I think I did a couple of times. Yeah. That was like a summer camp ritual. Yeah. Yeah. You can have a half a point for each of those. So.
01:38:29
Speaker
The real one is one every after. Because one of your friends saw you go up Casey and thought, Oh my God, I should go up too. And that was you don't know that you saved some people. Yeah, that is how they explained it. That's what they always love to say because we are special.
01:38:46
Speaker
And that's why these mega churches have people who are just primed and ready. They're like crisis actors for church. Every Sunday they get saved. They're like casinos that have fake winners that just generate excitement.
01:39:03
Speaker
There's a great, back to my lover Kenneth Copeland, there's a great video where he does the guy in the wheelchair. And it's so obvious that that guy is an actor because he can't even work his own wheelchair until he doesn't fit. And then Kenneth knocks over the whole wheelchair, him in the wheelchair. And he's still, you know, praising from the ground. And I'm like, either you get up out of the wheelchair or you
01:39:31
Speaker
It was a very half-assed show. Sell it, bro. If you think it's too much, it's just enough, you know? Is that a sale thing? That's what I always tell people when we're doing a photo shoot is like, all right, pose. If your pose feels awkward and over-exaggerated, you're just right. Nailed it.
01:39:59
Speaker
Like I don't understand about the, uh, the, what did you call it? Like private tongues or prayer, personal prayer tongues. Yeah. It's called private tongues. Yeah. It seems like a very outward display. Like it's a very performative thing. It seems like nobody's really excited about selling, like doing it for themselves or else they have to tell someone. It's like a murmur in a crowd. It's like,
01:40:25
Speaker
someone who goes to a club and doesn't wash off the stamp the next day at work. Like you want people to see it. You keep the wristbands on for a few days. Yes. You keep the wristband. Your lift pass. There you go. You need the acknowledgement, but yeah, but it's between you and God.
01:40:46
Speaker
Oh, you saw it? Oh, it's just me and gone. It is so funny to look back on how performative a lot of that was, like in youth group, in college, like, I mean, throughout most of my life, it's just like,
01:41:03
Speaker
Some of it's looking for validation that what you think is true like of course is just hopeful like just keep backing this up so I don't have to go into a spiral and then but other other times and for a lot of people it's just like it's a weird way of showboating because like most kids just brag about I don't know like normal kid things like
01:41:24
Speaker
Oh I had this crazy party when my parents were gone and they might have not even really done anything like but they would just find normal things to brag about but Christian kids have to find the dumbest shit to brag about it's just I know but it doesn't translate to school like it's okay in your youth group
01:41:41
Speaker
When you get to school like you bring it in there a little bit and I remember a friend of ours coming up to me in the parking lot out of nowhere going. I just want you to know I believe in premarital sex. That's forward. Somewhere along the line I was telling people you know what my beliefs were you guys have any other you have any other great brags or.
01:42:09
Speaker
Oh, yeah. Christian brags. I mean, I would have the swagger and be like, just got through Colossians today.
01:42:20
Speaker
Like that would make me proud. Another thing I was talking about. You should have gone with Leviticus. People would have respected you. I know. And they'd be like, yeah, that was a hard slog. I was talking about like on TikTok or whatever, like people should cut us some slack because in church we were told we were, even though we always felt not worthy of God,
01:42:50
Speaker
because obviously they told us all the time, we are not worthy. It's a key component. We were always also special. Like you can't, you're not a singer, doesn't matter. You're in the choir.
01:43:04
Speaker
Oh, you can't, you know, you have no education, doesn't matter, teach Sunday school. Like, we're always plugged in to different places of service.
Church Skills vs. Real World
01:43:14
Speaker
So, you know, typhoid Mary could be working in the, you know, buffet line on Wednesday nights. Like, none of us were really prepared. Except handbell choir, Bonnie was not allowed in because she couldn't read music.
01:43:30
Speaker
Oh yes, I remember the hand no choir. We talked about that. That's right. That made it into the title. Yeah, that made it into our title. That's it. But yeah, so I think there's always those things that we felt maybe we're good at and then later you come out of the church community and you're like, hmm, it's not that good. That isn't going to take me anywhere. That isn't, you know,
01:44:01
Speaker
that doesn't translate in any way. It's not a marketable skill. No. The music stuff was the worst because everybody had like a handful of people who were not good enough to get up on any stage and perform, you know, and they would just keep letting them get back up. Take your egg. We had this lady. She was scared.
01:44:25
Speaker
She was just like off like she just wasn't I don't know what was going on with her but She was a little strange and she had a violin and it's like all the instruments to play bad publicly like screech screech and she would play I feel like she played the same like three songs every time like she She had a Christmas song
01:44:54
Speaker
She had like Amazing Grace and then one other one and she would just like grind it. Can I throw in another awful instrument to not play great? Is that trumpet? Oh, oh, yeah. There was a guy when I was growing up at my church who was taking up trumpet lessons. And I remember the first time he played. I don't know what song he played in front of the church, but I'm like,
01:45:19
Speaker
I'm looking around wondering if everyone's hearing what I'm hearing. Cause I'm like, I don't think this is right. Like this sounds like he should have practiced more before he brought this before 450 people. So did you tell him to sit down? No, I just clapped. He tries out for some Phil harmonics somewhere. He doesn't get in cause he's terrible.
01:45:45
Speaker
and then the devil did it. Like there's no, like that's it. We didn't understand, you know, especially people who are oblivious and really were bad at things, but didn't know. Okay, but how about when people tell Simon Cowell in whatever show it is that he hosts? Well, I just wanted to come out here and I had fun and that's all that matters. I'm like, no, that is not all that matters. We have so much fun.
01:46:14
Speaker
There is this girl that that I went to school with and she loved to sing but she was terrible and you don't like Everybody wants to be able to do like the vibrato thing when they're singing right and and this girl couldn't do it But she would do this kind of like jittery shivering thing Yeah
01:46:37
Speaker
Yeah, it just sounded like. You could tell she thought she had unlocked the key to to music and and then went on to be a music major in college. And it's like nobody at the heart to tell her like, this isn't for you, like. And in college, they're taking your money so they don't even care anymore. Oh, yeah. You're going to get all the reinforcement you need. Yeah, we'll take it.
01:47:00
Speaker
Here you go. Yeah, I think that was it all the time. And like the fake brags, you know, we're always about quiet time or of course God blessed you in this certain area. What I love not having and it's still I'm amazed by it is we used to always talk about our trials and our tribulations or what God's pulling us through.
01:47:30
Speaker
And like how much focus that was on all these negative things that were part of our life or part of our character was so obsessive. And now that I don't do that, it's amazing how quickly I get past incidents that when I think I was in the church or in small groups probably would have lasted for five or six weeks because we were praying, we were seeking fervently.
01:47:57
Speaker
You know, and now I'm like, oh, it didn't work out? All right. You know, there's no, nothing else attached to it that has to be supernatural.
01:48:06
Speaker
Yeah, that makes so much sense to me because when you would bring those things up to people and then they would be part of the conversation, then there was the constant follow-up on it. Certain things that you probably wouldn't have actually gotten past had you not given it so much life by speaking about it and giving it that power over your life, you would have just been able to blow past it in a week. It's like making mountains out of molehills, I guess.
01:48:35
Speaker
And sadly, once you say something that is a little off, that's it. They will never ever look at you, Sam, and not think,
01:48:45
Speaker
That's the masturbation boy. You can never get away from it. You know, I heard plenty of, like, people pour their heart out with things and later they might have been fine, but I cannot forget what they have said in that meeting. Yeah. You can't hear things either. What? Bonnie, write that on his shirt.
Oversharing in Church Settings
01:49:11
Speaker
Yeah.
01:49:11
Speaker
There's like certain things that are acceptable to struggle with publicly and other things like keep that to yourself. Yeah. And it's not the worst advice.
01:49:23
Speaker
We've all met in over share and we don't like them either What about like the the youth group prior like the person that was that would like corner you When you really just wanted to like hang out and goof around with your friends and they would like corner you and be like So you tell me what God's doing in your life right now and you're like, oh, I don't know how to answer this I wish you would never talk to me again
01:49:47
Speaker
I don't remember that ever happening to me. I think I must have always been on the fringe of... Were you asking people that? That didn't happen. I mean, Liberty's Baptists, but in our old school Baptists, that didn't happen too much to us. When I started getting more into the charismatic stuff, that would get asked a lot.
01:50:13
Speaker
And even then I thought, okay, let's avoid this person because they can't read the room. Like it's New Year's Eve or having a party. Here comes Phil. You know, everyone avoid him. Cause next thing you know, he's either, there's either the person who's like, how's, how's your thought life going? Thought life? Like, are you thinking about things you shouldn't?
01:50:39
Speaker
Oh yeah, yeah. How's the thought life? Or they're doing the opposite of, I just need to unburden myself and then you have to listen to their shit forever. Oh man. Those people are still around. I'm so glad.
01:50:55
Speaker
I don't have to like anyone anymore. No. I don't know. There are those people outside the Christian world too, which is funny when you realize that some of it might just be general personality disorder that follows people anywhere they go. And you're like, there are those people you avoid because you're like, oh, I see this person. And if you go, hey, how you doing? You're like, shit, I shouldn't have said that. And then they're like, well, last week was really hard.
01:51:23
Speaker
How long is this gonna be i gotta i mean i have to go pick up my kids i don't i can't i don't think i can do this when i was running the territory would you run into that with like. Be like a guy in the parts party be like a man how's it going and like you made the mistake once of like talking to him about his divorce. And now like every year there every two weeks and every time he's like well you'll never guess what she did today.
01:51:46
Speaker
And you're like, oh, God, I don't know you. I don't want to hear it. There's no way out. Yeah. I wonder if that's where Name It and Claim It came from.
'Name It and Claim It' & Affirmations
01:51:57
Speaker
Because that's a good idea. If you go to a Name It and Claim It church, and then Sam comes up, and he's trying to tell me some, you know, boohoo story that he's going through. And I can just say, don't put it out into the universe.
01:52:13
Speaker
name it, claim it in God's name, and you have to move on. They had it right. They just didn't want to listen to people's show, I think. I like that, actually. Because they would name it and claim it meant. Yeah. It means you name what you want or what you feel God wants for you, and you claim it, and you go forward with the belief, say that they're fear, and you act.
01:52:40
Speaker
as if you have the belief that it's going to happen, but you don't keep repeating it because that shows a lack of faith. It's like, will it into being? Yeah. Yeah. People like Tony Robbins use the same type of motifs that are just wrapped in a different package as like your Joel Osteen, right? Because Joel Osteen's whole thing is that he's all about naming and claiming. Look, if you're struggling with poverty right now, just
01:53:06
Speaker
You just speak it into existence that you're going to be rich and you're going to and God's going to bless you. But like Tony Robbins uses very similar tactics where it's just like you try to get I think it's probably less sinister because you're not putting a divine being behind it and then like a divine or I don't know an immortal evil enemy that can creep in and snatch your blessings if you're not careful. Like fucking Swiper from Dora the Explorer. It's like
01:53:32
Speaker
It doesn't know what the secret is. That's exactly OK. The secret is like that. The there was some affirmations, you know, it's the same. And of course, it's great to think positive. But I think right in the church, we never had that. Like we're going to cut you off from talking more about it. So when that.
01:54:01
Speaker
comes around, I'm all for that. I like the naming. It's a good tactic. I don't know if I can sell it enough to use it. But I'm certainly going to try. I've got a few people in mind. I think what you need to do is you need to workshop it. And then you need to bring it around to your committee and then bounce it off. And then you need to, yeah.
01:54:27
Speaker
So I guess what you're saying is don't ruminate over things out loud to the other people in your group. Don't bleed all over them every time you talk to them.
01:54:40
Speaker
Yeah, sometimes I feel like our generation's like version of the the affirmations the secret all that type of stuff is the uh like You are beautiful. You are powerful. I'm so proud of you like Spoken into the void at a nameless faceless audience
01:55:00
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I like the spirit of what you do. But you don't know me. So if you say you're proud of me, like it doesn't mean anything to me. Does it mean something to other people? Like, I guess if you derive something good from that, great. But I don't want to hear people I don't know tell me they're proud of me. I'm just like, No, that hurts my feelings somehow. Like you're not that's not helping.
01:55:22
Speaker
I heard something really smart the other day. They were talking about like in the workplace, whenever you can speak positively about someone else. You shouldn't. Who you're talking to will put those attributes on you. So when someone is doing a video and they're like, hey, you're beautiful. You're awesome. People like it because they're putting on that person. You know, that's a beautiful, awesome person that's saying that to us.
01:55:51
Speaker
I don't know if they're totally absorbing it themselves because I hate that stuff too. I'm like, how do you know everyone you're talking to is awesome? Someone could be doing something gross right now. We're cynical. That's why. Yeah.
01:56:09
Speaker
We're all here because we're jaded. I think we had a major breakthrough here today, honestly. I think we have made it somewhere new together today. We've gone on this trip, and I like where we've ended up. So thanks for this. Here's the question. We got here together.
01:56:26
Speaker
Okay, we've come to this realization, right? None of us wants to be a lunatic televangelist, but we want to make that money. Can we go through the motions of the scam and sell it well enough while not losing your mind enough to cash them checks? That's what I want to know. It's a hard one. I feel part of our souls will be lost.
01:56:57
Speaker
Did I lose it while making Sweet Love to Kenneth Copeland already? Probably, though. I don't think so. That could have been the time. I think I'm always looking on Zillow Homes, the Zillow Gone Wild. Have you ever seen that Instagram? No. That sounds amazing. Which I find the craziest things on Zillow, and they pull them together on Instagram. I find our cult houses in there all the time, like,
01:57:24
Speaker
Bonnie and I when we start our cult, like, this can be it. Because some, it's like a nice house, but then I'll have a baptismal in it. Or they'll have a dungeon over to the right. Or it'll have, I mean, like, crazy... People are doing weird stuff. Just Kanye West's house? Oh, Kanye. It's just a white box. Oh, my God.
01:57:49
Speaker
I wonder though, if we figured out the perfect scam, would we go home and convene and go, these people are so stupid. I can't believe it. Let's go do it again tomorrow. Like most of these people do. That has to happen, right? Like any shock jock talk radio host?
Nexium Cult & Superficial Intelligence
01:58:11
Speaker
What was the one that was recently in the news and the trial happened with the V, Nexium? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Did that guy ever confide to anybody? These people are so idiots. Or people really believe it. I feel most of them have bought into part of it.
01:58:37
Speaker
At least. Yeah. Like I think Copeland, I think Copeland has to believe a little bit. He does. Yeah. Sure. He's out of his mind. What's this Nexium thing though? I miss that completely. Oh. Nexium's like a weird, it's like Colt meets a multi-level marketing scam and it was a big deal. A bunch of celebrities got sucked into it and turned into a sexual abuse thing. It was like a pyramid scheme.
01:59:04
Speaker
Sort of, but it was improvement to write like self and business tips. And that's a very mild word for it. But they had levels of classes you would go through. Sounds like Scientology. But yeah, it's very nice. Scientology is still a church. And this guy's getting in trouble. Where's the documentary? It was at Netflix or HBO now.
01:59:31
Speaker
HBO had the one that I watched. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or HBO. Yeah. There's a few of them. But then it got weird because then they're like, hey, we have an elite group. And it's going to be just the women. And oh, by the way, you need to get a tattoo burned onto with a cod herring iron. And you have to do it collateral.
01:59:58
Speaker
You have to get out of the lateral in this group and tell something really horribly shitty about yourself that everybody else will know and you don't want revealed. Wow. That's still saying knowledge. This is still saying knowledge. Mine is the branding. I know. The physical trauma of branding is huge. Where is Shelly Miscavige? Keith Ranieri. Yes. That's the guy's name. Yeah. He looks like a guy who was at our church for sure.
02:00:25
Speaker
Keith in an area, I feel like he is a true believer. But his garbage is a lot easier to believe because it's just a bunch of regurgitated self help stuff. It like Scientology is that until you get to the aliens and right now when they when you get all the secrets, it's that what's going clear. Is that what they call it? Yeah, yeah, you get all the secrets.
02:00:50
Speaker
And I think with Keith Ranieri, it's more, you know, the guy that would always sit in the back in high school and he was good looking, but no one really could see that because he was always reading Nietzsche. And like, he just had that thing about him where- Like he wouldn't get a proper haircut. Wouldn't get a, yeah. I think that guy might be really smart.
02:01:19
Speaker
But that's because he told you he was a gifted pianist. That's right. That's it. He said he was smart. That's right. The whole cult is based around this guy being a super genius. Right, right. And he's good at selling that idea.
02:01:36
Speaker
Yeah, it's like when you hear people who like, like you said, they might study these philosophers, they'll repeat quotes from philosophers to explain the world around you to you. And you're like, wow, this guy knows a lot. But then you realize that person's got like 15 to 20 quotes. And then when you dig in any deeper, you're like, this person
02:01:58
Speaker
doesn't know anything. That's just memorized information. There's no applied learning. They don't apply any of it to their lives. They don't even know what the application would even look like. They just repeat it. There's so many smart people in history that you can just repeat them and people will think,
02:02:17
Speaker
Isn't that weird? Isn't it weird that you can just quote smart people before you and people are like, that guy knows what he's talking about. Yeah, my mentor for years and years and writing who brilliant has won awards that I could
02:02:32
Speaker
you know, international words. I got to, I guess, the end of the loop. And when he started over with some of his stories that were told so much in this way that you thought was the first time that he just thought of it. Once I heard that again, I was like, shit.
02:02:54
Speaker
Oh man. You flip the tape over for the second time. Right. For any new people who were coming in and I'm like, very good at like taking something you said that fits it. And it's like, oh, you know, so-and-so says, how'd you do that?
02:03:13
Speaker
So yeah. So you make it. Yeah. It's like over and over again in life. I watch. There's really good people in leadership. There's really smart people that should be in leadership, but a huge percentage of the time that person is passed over and the leadership position is given to someone who doesn't know much, but they will say it with 100% confidence.
02:03:38
Speaker
Yeah, we were working on confidence. They'll let you figure out the rest on the spot. And if the business burns down in the meantime, like it's a resume builder. Nobody calls references. Yeah, apparently not. I don't want to go back to jail.
02:04:03
Speaker
That's right. Exactly. Well, I'm a little disappointed that we made it through all of this without really getting to know who Bonnie would marry. Lick Teeth. Lick Teeth. I gave you my rankings. I know. It's not what I was hoping for. But thanks to Karen for being a real player here. You showed up when it started. I know.
02:04:31
Speaker
That's right. And you know, I don't know if you guys know that Kenneth Copeland accidentally liked one of my tweets once. We've framed that. That's like our banner for our Facebook group. But maybe that's why I have a little song.
02:04:53
Speaker
You do. And he's got a little softy, so it's great. It works perfect. And your husband, I bet your husband on the other side of that door is just like, I get it. Busted through the door. I get it. No, I heard what you had to say and it makes sense. And, you know, this isn't an open marriage, but Kenneth is okay. I am yet half the man he is. Go to town on that spray tan bag of guts. You would like lift up and have like just spray tan on half your face.
02:05:23
Speaker
I know that comes off on anyone that he touches. Don't touch me. When he smiles too much, the wrinkles start like pulling it. Like he starts seeing the white lines at the bottom of the wrinkles there. Crypt keeper, man. Where can everyone? He'd probably evaporate during it and then like his soul would envelop mine. Then we can all start. Yeah, that's a bold assertion.
02:05:53
Speaker
Exactly. But then we'd all have the spirit of deception and we could all start our scam. I like this plan of action. Yeah, I think we all need to go into business together.
02:06:05
Speaker
And then I'll realize how gullible you all are. And I'll steal $75 a day. Give it back to you in a year. I was going to come out on top. She's like, my plan is working. Just as I suspected it was. Karen is always at that toilet wall. I'm just adjusting things. Thank you, guys. This is always fun. Yeah. I'm glad we got to do this again. Where can everyone find you? You're on Twitter, Instagram.
02:06:34
Speaker
Your Tennessee. Blowing up TikTok. You're doing great. That's right. Your TikTok game's strong. I respect it immensely. Oh, I'm unfortunately addicted. So we're on TikTok. We're barely on Twitter, Instagram. Instagram. Our Facebook group, like, is self-cleansing. What do you call it? They do their own thing, and we pop in once in a while. But yeah, De-conversion therapy, podcasts.
02:07:04
Speaker
And that's it. Excellent. Well, it's been a blast talking to you. Everybody go and check out their social media, listen to their podcast, and we will catch you next time.