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Welcome to Pretty Invested: Money is and isn’t everything
354 Plays2 years ago
Welcome to Pretty Invested, the podcast where two recovering finance bros demystify and talk candidly about finance & wealth for the girls.
On this first episode, Eleanor and LD talk about why they started Pretty Invested, their personal financial journeys, and those fun but traditionally taboo money subjects.
You can find us on YouTube, TikTok, and Instagram at:
https://www.youtube.com/@PrettyInvestedMedia
https://www.tiktok.com/@prettyinvestedmedia
https://www.instagram.com/prettyinvestedmedia
Pretty Invested Media and this related information does not constitute professional or financial advice of any kind (including business, employment, investment advisory, accounting, tax, and/or legal advice). Advice from a suitably qualified professional should always be sought in relation to any particular matter or circumstance.
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Transcript
Introduction to Pretty Invested Podcast
00:00:00
Speaker
Welcome to Pretty Invested. I'm Eleanor and this is LD. Presented by your favorite ex-finance bros. We talk about the money things you actually care about. Hey guys, welcome to our first episode of Pretty Invested where we talk about everything money from your favorite recovering finance bros. It's Eleanor and LD.
00:00:24
Speaker
Elsie, how are you? I'm good. It's our first episode. I can't believe it's happening. We're filming in Miami. Yeah. It's a beautiful day. Yeah, first in-person recording. Some of these are going to be remotely because I live in Miami. I live in New York. So why are we having this podcast? Should we just get into
Eleanor's Background and Gender Gap in Finance
00:00:41
Speaker
it? Yeah, let's get into it.
00:00:42
Speaker
I think we were both coming to this idea separately and then arrived at the conclusion together and it fit like a puzzle. But the whole reason this really came to me is that I used to work in investment banking and finance on Wall Street in New York, like the highest level of finance. And even amongst my female friends who were working in that industry, we never talked about money.
00:01:06
Speaker
And the funny thing is, all of my male colleagues were constantly talking about stock credits, their portfolio, what were good investments to make, their apartments, prices that they would pay for stuff. And I think that type of transparency and openness was really helpful to them.
00:01:23
Speaker
We all know that there's gender wall-scout, unfortunately. And there's many ways to tackle it, but I think a big one is just starting to have women openly speak to each other about it and have those conversations. And it doesn't have to be boring, or I think for a lot of people it can be stigmatized. You feel like you can't really talk about money, it's taboo. But it shouldn't be, and we should have had these open conversations with each other.
00:01:50
Speaker
Yeah, men have more of an open, sharing culture. Even guys that don't work in finance, they talk about their finances with each other. Draftkings, what's a Draftkings? What was it? The gambling? GameStop. GameStop, yes. GameStop, the whole Reddit. Yeah, obviously that was predominantly testosterone driven activity.
00:02:10
Speaker
And I think that's when I first started getting involved in my own, you know, kind of like gambling with money, kind of not gambling with money, but it's when I entered my Robin Hood era. And I remember talking to my girlfriends about it and they would just look at me like I had four heads. Really? And I think because I'm typically more willing to put money at risk, I was like,
00:02:33
Speaker
okay i'm gonna talk to my girlfriends about this and i think i always kind of found myself being one of the first people to like openly talk about finances and like what i was doing with my investing because i similar to like i didn't want to have all those conversations with like dudes i i just wanted to have more of like a transparent collaborative thing with girls and the more i tried doing that the more i was like oh my god like everyone is so free to do anything beyond like
00:02:59
Speaker
touch their 401k.
Changing the Financial Conversation for Women
00:03:01
Speaker
There's inherent risk to investing, let's be honest. And this podcast is not financial advice, but there's an upside. And it doesn't have to be so scary. The market, on average, historically has returned 7%. And with compounding interest, if you start investing when you're 23 versus when you're 25, your difference, that's a huge difference in the wealth that you're able to generate as a woman. And I think we just don't have those conversations with one another.
00:03:29
Speaker
Yeah, well it's also like there were never any podcasts that covered this topic. Like I remember graduating school and there was Joe Rogan and there was Call Her Daddy and those were basically like the two things that you listen to if you weren't like absolutely obsessed with podcasts and like you're like well versed on what's available out there.
00:03:45
Speaker
And I remember Refinery29 started doing this thing called money diaries and I listened to it religiously and then they stopped doing it like after a few months. I don't know if women just weren't interested in the topic but like that was my Sunday reset activity. Like I would do my weekly cleaning on Sundays and listen to money diaries and it was so helpful to me.
00:04:07
Speaker
And then that went away and I was like, okay, what are my resources now? Just reading resources. There was nothing that was entertaining for our demographic. Or people who looked like us, who we could see ourselves in. Yeah.
00:04:23
Speaker
I think I assumed finance was, you know, frumpy suits, like, business woman. And like, it wasn't something that was interesting or approachable to me. And we worked in finance and we felt that way versus, you know,
00:04:38
Speaker
I think all of my friends who are women can serve to benefit from talking about their money, feeling like they're in control of their finances, everything from purchasing, budgeting, buying an apartment, how you view money and how you spend it. It touches every part of our lives, but we feel like it's taboo, so we just kind of circumvent it. I think we really just want Pretty Invested to be an opportunity to
00:05:06
Speaker
how these conversations with one another and also tell guests. I think there's so much to be discussed that isn't just like about REITs and 401ks and indices and all this like financial jargon. And I think
00:05:21
Speaker
having those people come on here that are like regular women, who are also really successful, tell you a little bit about their two drugs. Yeah, yeah. And hence the name, pretty invested. It's not like you have to give up being, you know, a girl. A girl. And this is just like some masculine thing that we aren't able to wrap our heads around. You can be feminine and be invested actively. And also just,
00:05:49
Speaker
passionate about things we just like love the the double meaning of pretty invested we're pretty invested people but yeah i think it might make sense to talk about our backgrounds a little bit and you know why we specifically resonated yeah so like you i think had a clear track
00:06:08
Speaker
And you knew earlier on in life that you wanted to work in and around the finance world, whereas my path was more windy.
LD's Immigrant Background and Money Perception
00:06:16
Speaker
But I guess our money behaviors and just our general demeanor towards money starts in childhood. So yeah, do you want to get into it from the beginning? From the beginning? Sure. So I was born and raised in Miami, the beautiful city that we're in right now.
00:06:32
Speaker
And my parents immigrated here, and when they came to the US, they didn't really have a lot of money. It's typical. The number changes, but it's $500 in my pocket, $800 in my pocket. I don't know how much it actually was, but that's really funny. We had a similar age. Yeah. I don't know. The number changes, so I don't know how much they actually came to the US with. Point being, they were not set up. They started in a whole new country, barely knew the language.
00:07:00
Speaker
a few years before they had me. But I was the youngest daughter in an immigrant family. We kind of grew up not with too much. And then in the span of my childhood, my mom started her own business, we became pretty comfortable. And it was a very interesting experience going from like the
00:07:23
Speaker
one of the poorest kids in school. Oh, we're actually one of the wealthier people in our friend group. So I have a very interesting relationship with money where for me, since I didn't grow up with it, there are points where I'm like, you know what, I'm not gonna lend money.
00:07:41
Speaker
you know, define me or motivate me. Like I was able to live a life and be very happy without it. So if anything, I know I can go back and I can survive and thrive. So I don't let money control me in that way. But I also acknowledge the power and the freedom that having financial freedom gives you. So that was my background and it's made me
00:08:06
Speaker
new money as a tool, not something that controls me. And then after that, I went to college and then started my career in investment banking in New York. And I work as a venture capitalist and I've had a lot of privilege in being able to access
00:08:26
Speaker
very accomplished, smart minds being very elite circles and have access and insight to how people who I never would have interacted with my parents' background and know how they've built their wealth and
00:08:42
Speaker
It is a little bit hush hush how people do everything. So I wanted to have more open conversations and yeah. It's not dissimilar from mine. Yeah. Like we were also an immigrant family. I immigrated here with my parents when I was. I mean I've like told you the whole story.
00:09:04
Speaker
I think like our range is like, it varies from like six to $800. We like borrowed from a family friend. And then another family friend like paid for our rent for like three months and then that added to like- Wait, how old were you when you immigrated here? I was two. You're two, it's like a baby. I don't really remember any money stress from like my very early childhood. And I think my parents did a really good job of making sure that
00:09:32
Speaker
We had a lot of fun. Like, we would always go back. So we immigrated from Albania.
00:09:40
Speaker
We'd always go back to Albania, like two months out of the year. My mom was a stay-at-home mom. I always felt relatively fine, because I grew up in Queens. So I always felt relatively fine relative to everyone else in Queens, because we had pretty similar journeys. If other kids weren't immigrants themselves at school, then they were the children of immigrants. So I had two younger brothers. One was born right after me. And then when my youngest brother was born, we have a 10-year age gap. My mom started going back to work.
00:10:09
Speaker
And I really felt a shift in my parents' dynamic when my mom started going back to work. I could just tell that she's spending more money on herself and really living life in a way that I hadn't seen her live her life before.
Career Choices and Societal Expectations
00:10:23
Speaker
And I felt like it impacted my confidence. Even at school, I was more empowered because I saw that my mom was bringing this new energy home. Yeah. It's your money.
00:10:36
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. So I think like that made me start to have more thoughts on what I wanted my lifestyle to look like. My parents were, again, like very typical Albanian, did not want me to go to college far away. Really? No. So the only way that I was able to dorm was if I got a full ride. Wow. So I ended up getting a full ride. It was like a whole process. I worked my ass off in high school.
00:11:04
Speaker
but I think that's where I really developed my work ethic. I was always a pretty hard worker as a kid, but I worked my ass off in high school to get a full ride to Colgate. I went there, I studied biochemistry, because I just... When you're like an immigrant, you're like, STEM. Or law school.
00:11:22
Speaker
STEM or law school, you become a doctor or a lawyer, or an engineer. I was a math leader when I went in. Okay, there you go. So I started biochem and I was like, what the hell am I going to do with my life? Like I hate clinical research because I started doing my junior year. I had that epiphany later on. And like when you dedicated three years of school to a degree, I was like, all right, well, what are the other options?
00:11:47
Speaker
for background. Everyone at Colgate was a wasp. Like, it was always a joke where, like, the frat boys didn't have to work hard at school because they could just go work at their dad's hedge fund. It's a generalization, but everyone had- There's a reason why there is this- Yeah, it's like very, like, Connecticut vibes, um, or Westchester. And I was like, oh my god, I'm not gonna be like them. Like, them? I have to go work on Wall Street and keep interacting with boys like that? Like, I hated it. So I went to tech.
00:12:16
Speaker
Okay, it was awesome. It was the best first job I could have ever had. I was working at this startup in Brooklyn in the crypto space. I got to learn so much. And after two years, I was able to work on their acquisition. And that was kind of like my entry into the VC space.
00:12:36
Speaker
Which VC is still like more more of like a techie version of finance It's not like the depths and throws of finance which like you know from having worked on Wall Street I've never done like Wall Street Wall Street vibes like
00:12:49
Speaker
You could speak to that. Yeah. Yeah. And something that I think we were saying is we want to do like confessions of a former investment banker to bring some people on, you know, but I'd be fine. Get some honest takes on what it's like working the hundred hour weeks or oh my God, or being a trader or working a hedge fund. Yeah. Those are also super different experiences. Yeah. When I told my parents I was doing investment banking, they thought I was going to be a trader. I was like,
00:13:18
Speaker
No. And they still don't know. They still think it's similar. My parents still don't really get what I did. Same. Yeah. Same. That's okay. They're like, you're you're doing well. You don't need our financial support. Yeah. Bye. I think
00:13:33
Speaker
We talked about our career paths. He said you originally in biochem thought you were going to do this, but then decided to work in tech. And I think something to be honest about is the salary and the money component. Oh, my God. How did that inform your thinking? That was like 90 percent of my thinking. Hey, being a scientist, you have to be a martyr.
00:13:52
Speaker
You don't make anything unless you go to the PhD room. And I was like, I'm not gonna be broke until I'm like 28 and like ugly and real. I was like, I want to make money tomorrow. Yeah, and that's okay. Like, yeah, I think we as women are like so shamed for wanting money, but we're greedy. And it's like,
00:14:13
Speaker
think it's okay for us not to be martyrs and yeah okay sorry dog we need to pay people who are in these like other other industries better you know especially we need to pay academics more yeah yeah but yeah money was like
00:14:28
Speaker
so much of the equation. Yeah. And I mean, did you go into finance because you were interested in like the like the nature of the work? Like, did you did you like kind of like crunching numbers? Yeah. Did you like the deal process? Did you like like the business? Like what about it made you excited? Yeah. So I'll get to your your part of your question first. But I think for context, I went into college thinking
00:14:57
Speaker
that I would go become a lawyer, go the NGO route, maybe work in policy. I want to change the world. He has a lot of young people do. And then there's this idea that I told you about called Ikigai, which is the Japanese term. Sorry for butchering the definition, but it's the combination of what you're good at
00:15:26
Speaker
what the world needs and kind of what gives you meaning. We'll put the Venn diagrams in. Yeah. And for me, I was, you know, I said I went to college as a math major. I didn't end up as a math major, but I'm very logically and quantitatively minded. So I was actually good at things like finance and accounting. It was interesting to me.
00:15:49
Speaker
I mean, I'm a pretty decent writer, so I could have gone the other route as well. And then with the world needs the meaning part. I'll touch on those. So for me, I realized that similar to you in biochem, it's not what I wanted to do. I talked to a lot of people who worked in the nonprofit sector, and it just wasn't a day-to-day lifestyle, like the nine-to-five bureaucracy, and then going to law school.
00:16:18
Speaker
To me, it didn't really give me impact. I didn't mind working those hundred hours. I was a hustler. I still am a hustler. You didn't mind? Maybe that I was, you know, what's the word, brainwashed? Into thinking like, oh, I need to. It's part of the grind. It's part of the lifestyle. But I was willing to put it in. And I was like, I'm good at this. There aren't that many women in this industry.
00:16:45
Speaker
The meaning part was like money is actually super powerful. Having money allows me sometimes to bulldoze through to get what you want, right? I saw donations or acquisitions and someone can just take control rather than spending years working on policy that not within my control could be ripped away from me. It's something I'm most passionate about and I can't have that much control over it. I just didn't like it and I like the idea of, you know what?
00:17:15
Speaker
I want to be in the space that's predominantly men, add a female voice there, try and pave the way for other women, and also at the same time,
00:17:24
Speaker
garner enough money and power so that I can make those decisions rather than appeasing to certain government bodies and appeasing to the people in power. You would rather be one of the people. Exactly. So that's where I found meaning. Like not directly in the day to day like doing M&A or helping with an IPO that that's why I was super interested. It's a very interesting process. I don't know if you guys like watch succession. It's fun and it's fascinating. These are
00:17:49
Speaker
billion dollar deals that are happening, like hundreds of millions of dollars of capital you're helping to maneuver. Succession is so good. It is. But I think it was more so like I was going to get super great skills. I was going to be in a position that opened a lot of doors for me. And something about my personality kind of likes being in a space that is male dominated in the sense that like
00:18:16
Speaker
That's why I wanted to do STEM. I was like, no, I want to do it because I want to prove that I can. Same, same. Yeah. Yeah. And like, I want to pave the way for more women. Like, why not? Same. Yeah. So you're like so fired up as a feminist when you're in high school. Like, you also don't really understand how gender work at work yet. Yeah. It's a little naive. There's a reason why. There are a lot of women who you'll see at the top of the funnel, like a lot of analysts. Yeah. Who are women? It's like almost equal sometimes at the banks.
00:18:45
Speaker
But there's a reason why women churn, and there's very few at the top, like the managing directors. And I think there's a lot that we can go into there. There's a reason why I'm no longer at my investment bank. I think I'm in a better position and with more influence. Because the whole thing with investment banking is you kind of are a little bit of a cog in the machine up until a certain point. Yeah.
00:19:07
Speaker
And I thought early stage investing gave me more of an opportunity to develop my own PCs, work with founders. And it's also a good way if you make the right bets, make a lot of money. Yeah. And network with the right people. So I think there's a lot of factors that go into it.
00:19:26
Speaker
Yeah. That was a really long-winded answer. I did like all those things about finance, but the work itself was not the reason why I decided to make that move.
Choosing Careers Based on Personal Values
00:19:37
Speaker
And it was a lot of thinking to get comfortable doing that because I did feel like a sellout for a little bit to my younger high school feminist self that took a shift.
00:19:48
Speaker
Well, it's like a very smart way to go about making one of the most important decisions in your life, like picking your career. It's not just the content of your work. It's more so the lifestyle that you're signing up for. And if anything, that is the lifestyle that you will have.
00:20:03
Speaker
especially working in New York or like in major cities or honestly, I think Americans have like their careers are a much larger part of their lives than they would be for people in the rest of the world. And I definitely feel that seeing that most of my cousins are spread out throughout Europe.
00:20:24
Speaker
I definitely had the worst quality of life amongst all of my family members. And I was not working 100 hour weeks, right? Like, I would maybe do like 80, 90 consistently, but like, yeah, but it's very different from doing that all the time and having that almost be the norm. Like if I did 80 hour weeks, I would get like a pat on the back, you know, and be like, Oh my gosh, thank you.
00:20:46
Speaker
But what was I going to say? Yeah, it's really smart to take into account the lifestyle that you're signing up for. And I think sometimes the only good thing about working in finance is all the learning opportunities that are there and the connection ability. And sure, the money is good.
00:21:07
Speaker
back it out to calculate it per hour, sometimes you're making less than minimum wage. So the money's not that great, but it's a better version of school sometimes, I think. Yeah. And sometimes I think about it, and I think about the rooms that I'm in, the people that I have access to. And it's two daughter of immigrants.
00:21:31
Speaker
was not guaranteed this lifestyle. My parents, like we said, they don't even know what we do. Yeah. They're not able to help us network. No. So it's one of those things where I think back and like, wow, this is actually pretty wild to think the spaces that I've been able to get into and definitely have a lot of privilege.
00:21:56
Speaker
I think finance does give you a lot of access that you otherwise wouldn't have, you know? Like an immigrant girl from Miami, well, daughter of an immigrant, because I was born here, but yeah. And I think there is a lot of benefits to going into finance. I will say, this is not to say that I think finance, like every girl should go into finance. Absolutely not. There's a lot of money to be made elsewhere. There's a lot of money to be made elsewhere.
00:22:25
Speaker
Just to clarify, I do not mean to say like, oh, going the nonprofit or the lawyer route, is it the right one? That was not the right one for me. It's a lot easier for me to look at a balance sheet, right?
00:22:41
Speaker
where my skill sets were, where I found passion, the type of peace I wanted. Yeah. And I think a lot of people are graduating soon. So it's like a very helpful process to look at the Venn diagrams that Elle's laying out in Ikigai and kind of figure out where all of your strengths are. Yeah. And it kind of helps you make a market map, if you will, of all the different career paths.
00:23:05
Speaker
Yeah, and another thing is like something doesn't have to be your job. That's what gives you meaning. Like you can have a job that allows you to work remotely and travel or gives you time to work on your other hobbies or have a side hustle. It's not like your job has to be the thing that gives you passion and like gives you life, right? So
00:23:27
Speaker
There are a lot of factors that go into making these types of decisions. Each person weighs these things differently. So it's a very personal decision and this decision is probably one of the biggest ones you'll make. One of my biggest qualms with
00:23:42
Speaker
Just the path that 18 year olds are set on these days is you have to pick your major when you're 18 19 20 Luckily your major actually doesn't really matter for anything that you want to do in life Like I'm a science major and I worked in tech and then finance It's it's flexible, but you would think that it's not flexible
00:24:00
Speaker
And then you have to make all these big life decisions when you're 22 and like your brain isn't fully formed. So I would say I'm happy that our society has shifted so much now to where the natural path isn't just working up the corporate ladder and going to one company out of school and staying there for 10, 15, 20 years.
00:24:21
Speaker
Like, it's fine now to job hop every two years or every one year. I think with Gen Z, we're probably going to see even shorter 10 years. And that's a really good thing, because I mean, number one, it's great for like, getting pay bumps.
00:24:38
Speaker
But it's a really big part of self-discovery. If you're working a job that really feels like a bad fit for you, that tells you so much about yourself. If you're working at a job that feels like a really good fit for you, that tells you so much about yourself.
00:24:56
Speaker
I think careers are so much more fun than school because you learn more and you get paid to do it. Yeah. Each person has a different path. And I think we do want to be honest and open about what it is to have a finance career.
00:25:13
Speaker
You don't need to be in finance or work in one of those industries in order to take control of your finances.
Spending Habits and Financial Hygiene
00:25:21
Speaker
Have you seen that Netflix show, How to Get Rich? I heard about it. Have you seen it? Do you like it? I'm like halfway through it. I think it's really good. I forget what the host's name is, but he works with people of all different kinds of backgrounds. But I would say he gives very sensical advice about
00:25:39
Speaker
passive investing and maxing out your 401k. There are so many ways to like do your finances. It's just about
00:25:51
Speaker
having the balls to like go through it and like do your budgeting on a weekly basis and understand what your credit score is and be really good at managing your credit cards and staying on top of your bills and all these financial hygiene things that are like not scary but seem so scary especially if you don't come from family backgrounds of like that's exactly yeah
00:26:18
Speaker
Yeah, it's funny because I'm assuming that you probably have better financial hygiene than I do, actually. What makes you think that? So, I'm not a budgeter. Like, I think I have... I'm not a huge budgeter either. Yeah, I know. I definitely... When you said, like, go every week and look at your budget, I'm like... I used to be when I was making less. Really? Yeah. I think there's flexibility that comes with having a higher salary and having savings, so... Wait, it's a slippery slope. I'll get into it. I've made so many mistakes. Oh my god.
00:26:45
Speaker
Because another thing that I think is super fascinating that I want to talk about is spending and knowing what gives you utility and what gives you happiness and value. It doesn't have to make sense for everyone. Maybe you living in a really nice apartment in Tribeca is worth it for you. And I think it's different for people, but acknowledging it and then also
00:27:11
Speaker
moving things around to make space for that. So you're not going to die. Yeah. Right? Like I was buying designer shoes when I was in college. I lived in a shoe box and I'm like, it's okay cause I'm living in a shoe box. So give me my Gucci heels. But I think it can be fun too. Like you can eventually, okay, good. So unless I see something pop out on me on my credit card, I'm not like going through every single one of them. Yeah. And you don't, I don't want to have people to have like a, like a,
00:27:40
Speaker
a scarcity relationship with money where they're holding on too tight for it. Which I totally did right out of school. Really? Oh my god. I would say if like half of what I made, it was extreme. Yeah. And the thing is sometimes people come from privilege, right? Like they don't have to because they know there's this like trust that they can always dip into. Yeah. Like if you can't make rent one month, daddy will cover it. Yeah. So we all come from different backgrounds, but money doesn't have to be like a stressful thing. It can be fun and you can
00:28:10
Speaker
And it doesn't have to be like 50% has to go away, 20% has to go away into your savings. I know for me, I did a different approach. While working in investment banking, and for those of you who don't know, it's probably one of the highest paying right out of undergrad jobs you can get. And I was living in New York, still spent, I think back then,
00:28:33
Speaker
I was spending like $1,700 in a row, which is... That's not bad. That's not bad. No, it wasn't a lot. I wasn't grammar-sy, but we did a flex. Okay. Yeah, that's really good. Basically, a flex is like, it's supposed to be... It was supposed to be a two-bedroom apartment, but we made the living room into a third apartment and just had another person live there. Oh my gosh. It's actually kind of common in New York. That's how we were able to live in a really nice neighborhood and not pay much.
00:29:00
Speaker
So for me, I was like, okay, I'm not spending too much on rent. I can spend more on these other things. And the way that I was able to, I think I put a little bit aside, but the way that investment banking packages are done, compensation, is that you get almost 50% of your net income is in your bonus. So I just,
00:29:28
Speaker
hold out for the bonus. Didn't really save and then put all my bonus into my savings was probably not the best idea but I was really stressed doing banking. I feel like most people in banking do that though. That's probably an exaggeration but most people I know do that. Yeah. Because you're living their entire salary. It's because also you're we'll talk about like lifestyle creep.
00:29:49
Speaker
where yeah, you're hanging out with your investment banking friends, you're in New York, you're going to these Michelin star restaurants, you're buying Gucci heels and Prada boots and everyone else is doing it and so you're doing it and you don't want to miss out and someone else just got the new Prada bag. So you want to get the new Prada bag, it's a slippery slope. So that's why I think a lot of people end up spending more than they plan to when they first start. It becomes like a mental thing, like it's borderline an addiction.
00:30:18
Speaker
Okay, what is your, like, the purchase? You might love it, but what was your most outrageous purchase? Save space, we won't judge you. Like that I regret?
00:30:28
Speaker
You don't have to regret it, but I think it's like, wow, I spent a lot of money on this and maybe like I only wore it once or... Oh my god. Every Zimmerman dress ever. Oh really? Because they're like $1,500 and it's like... Oh my god. It's like a dress. Yeah. Like, okay, yeah, I live in Miami, but it's really only suitable for like a really nice brunch.
00:30:55
Speaker
Or maybe South of France? Like you just can't wear it that much. Right? And I think it's because it's so, like, distinguishable. It's not like you can keep on wearing it because someone's like, oh, and you want to take a picture of that. And it's like, oh, that's last season. People have seen it. People have seen you wear it and you're like, I can't do it. You can wear it multiple times, right? Yeah. So your wear per use is not that high, but... No, it's not.
00:31:18
Speaker
Whereas if I spend $500 on a black miniskirt that's really well made, and I wear that skirt 30 times a year, then I don't regret spending that money, which I have done that. But I love that skirt so much. But I think it's sometimes, I forget, I saw it on TikTok.
00:31:40
Speaker
But I think when you have the mentality, like you're only willing to spend a lot for special occasions. It comes from one of those mentalities where like, you save your money, like you feel wrong about staying on like a skirt that you would wear.
00:31:55
Speaker
like every other day, potentially. Yeah, and it like improves your quality of life. Yeah, your wear per uses a lot, but you're like, oh, I'll spend like $500 on a wedding guest dress. Yeah. Because you're like, oh, it's a special key. And that's how you think about it. And I'm going to get one Instagram post out of it. Yeah. And we're not here to shame people. We're very guilty. No, we've been there. And I think it's just like having a balance, right? You can definitely do those splurge purchases, but then like kind of understand why you're doing it, like take a step back. I know I was pretty like,
00:32:25
Speaker
drain from working in banking that to make myself feel better, I started buying shoes. I had like a designer shoe addiction. And then I work in tech and I never wear any of my heels. It was one of those things where I was like, I'm working so hard, making all this money. What was the point? Let me fill this hole.
00:32:45
Speaker
because I'm not doing anything that I'm super passionate about. We fill this hole by buying more shoes, and then I'm like, oh, I need to make more money and continue this lifestyle because now I have this lifestyle of having a bunch of nice shoes and I want to continue buying shoes. It's a feedback
Balancing Spending and Financial Realities
00:32:59
Speaker
loop. I can't even tell you. That is exactly where I was going to go. Really? The most? What was it for you? Clothes or? Just idiotic decisions. Yeah.
00:33:12
Speaker
like don't even want to assign like dollar amounts but like I would like walk into Saks and be like oh this is a really nice cashmere sweater and it's cold and you know what I had like a pretty hard week at work and you know what like what is the point of me working so hard and being so miserable and having so much less free time than all my other friends
00:33:33
Speaker
who don't work such shitty hours and hate their lunch lives. You have to get something from it. Yeah, I'm like, what am I getting out of this? I'm going to get a cashmere sweater out of it. Again, it becomes like a mindset and it becomes an addiction where you're constantly burning yourself out and you almost resent the money. Wow. It's like shitty energy that's coming in. So you're just like, get it away from me. Like, I'm going to spend it on this material thing. Yeah. At least I'll get this quick dopamine bump out of it. The dopamine.
00:34:01
Speaker
Yeah, and then, I mean, other people do like other hits like party too much and do that and like, I definitely had a phase where I was like going out too much as well. You do weird things when you hate your life at work. Yeah, because like, I think it's
00:34:19
Speaker
You have this cognitive dissonance, right? Where you're like, ugh, why am I working so hard? What's the point of all this? Let me find a reason to justify why I'm working so hard for all this. There has to be a reason. And the one thing that you get is money. And you want the dopamine. You want to see the value from your money. Yeah. And then before, I didn't have any desire heals. I didn't care about it. But then I started caring. The thing with designer as well is you can put yourself in that headspace where you're like,
00:34:48
Speaker
there's always something oh like i've memorized this entire season's shoes or like i know all this season's like trendy pieces and i'm gonna buy like a slightly modified version of these trendy pieces that i'm seeing on social media so that i'm different and then you just incorporate yourself into the meta even more but then nobody cares about what the hell you're wearing and they don't know that your stuff is designer because you care so much to like
00:35:12
Speaker
I've never seen it. Main Street designer. And loving. It's about. So sometimes you swing a little bit too far on one end of the pendulum and then you have to come back to center. And there are plenty of purchases that I'm like, I really love. Fame. And that have appreciated. Yeah. Because they can be investments. But take that step back and be like, do I really need this shoe in three different colors?
00:35:37
Speaker
If the reason why you're doing it is to fill this gap of like needing something, then that's maybe not a good reason. Yeah. Versus like.
00:35:47
Speaker
Oh, this is something I've wanted for so long. I think it really makes me feel confident. And yeah, I have this theory and I made a TikTok about it. Okay. But I feel like because so many Americans are in ill-fitting jobs, it gives them the side effect of feeling like there's a hole that they need to fill because they're so out of alignment with their ikigai that they
00:36:09
Speaker
fuel consumerism by buying things to fill that hole and I feel like if everyone was more in their ikigai or like more aligned with their work then first of all you wouldn't need to make as much money because you wouldn't be blowing your money on stupid things and like random Amazon purchases.
00:36:25
Speaker
And two, we would just all be living way more sustainable lives. Yeah. I've worked through the economics of it, but like... No, it needs to be in the south. High level thought. Yeah. There's a reason why it's called retail therapy. It helps people feel better. You get a dopamine hit. But you're literally just burning money on fire.
00:36:43
Speaker
Unless it's a really good bag. I still don't regret some of my purchases. The heels I do because I thought it was an investment. For the rest of my life, I'm gonna work in a professional industry where I wear heels. I probably wear heels besides my going out heels, my work heels twice a year. And then I regret it. Especially in tech, yeah. I regret it cuz I'm like, no, I have to wear heels the rest of the day. And yet I have so many. Do you have a favorite pair?
00:37:10
Speaker
I love these Gucci, they're almost like heeled clogs and then they have this little tassel zipper. It's so fun. And I'll wear that if I feel like I really want to be special. But then I have so many black pumps. Reasonably sized kid in heel black pumps.
00:37:34
Speaker
multiple multiple multiple I don't know why soul I shouldn't sell them I should sell them but then I'm like that's such a good point I have sold some yeah I should sell I felt like two bags yeah I'm told heels I mean
00:37:49
Speaker
I just don't, I don't blow money on heels like that unless they're like really unique and like beautiful. Like I love, I have like this pair of butterfly heels that are super cool. If they're like intricate and pretty. Yeah. And like art. Yeah. Yeah. But again, you can't go out on them. Cause like, God forbid you like ruin thousand dollar heels. I would never forgive myself. Yeah. And shoes are so delicate.
00:38:15
Speaker
they are they get destroyed oh my gosh yeah no for me it was like i kept spending on it because i thought it would be an investment say it was like all my work dresses like why do i need so many past the knee shifts dresses from theory oh my god i i would never wear them again me and theory have beef yeah don't don't waste your money spending on like a million theory dresses they're also really good if you buy them secondhand
00:38:42
Speaker
Really? Yeah, they're real real. They're like... Guys, I'm gonna sell my my fear offenses. Well at the posh markling. I'm gonna create a posh mark. This episode is really good for me. I'm gonna sell some of my shoes and my work dresses because people are just taking a closet space. Yeah. So yeah, me as well. I'll add it to my to-do list. And then what are you gonna do with that money once you sell them?
00:39:06
Speaker
That's a good question. I've probably just added to my savings
Conclusion and Future Episodes
00:39:10
Speaker
account. Well, I think we've covered a lot. I think the main point is it's so refreshing to talk about money openly, and it's fun. It is fun. Especially that last second. I love talking about spending habits. Oh my god. Yeah. We're still working through it. We're not perfect. We haven't perfected all our habits. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't talk about it. Right?
00:39:32
Speaker
Like just because you don't love all of your spending habits or all of your investing habits doesn't mean you need to wait until it's perfect to come to the table. So as a reminder, we're going to be doing these every Friday. We'll see you next Friday. I think we're going to be talking about manifesting. And yeah, I love you guys. Stay pretty invested. Stay pretty invested.