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266 Kiya Evans | Literary Agent
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Literary agent Kiya Evans is here to tell us about how she got into publishing, her journey to becoming a literary agent and what she looking for in new authors and new stories.
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Transcript
Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:00:00
Speaker
Oh, a spicy question. I love Because the writing is sort of everything, right? Like you can fix plot holes, but if the writer... So some readers love that and some readers are like, but I wanted more of this. So it's kind of, it's kind of a gamble.
00:00:14
Speaker
Hello and welcome back to the Right and Wrong podcast. on today's episode, I am joined by literary agent, Kaya Evans. Hello. Hi, thank you for having me on.
00:00:27
Speaker
Thanks so much for coming on.
Kaya's Journey into Literary Agency
00:00:28
Speaker
um I like to start off whenever i speak to agents with um the sort of path that led you into becoming a literary agent. So ah let's begin with, did you always have your sights set on working in the publishing industry?
00:00:45
Speaker
ah Not really, to be honest. I think, I mean, I've always loved writing. books growing up. Like it was, you know, my, uh, every waking moment that i I wasn't kind of studying or with my friends or, you know, that sort of thing was spent reading. um I used to kind of fall asleep with a book, wake up, turn over and just like have the book next to me and start reading it again. um but I think that was a very pure love of reading. It wasn't really like a one day I'm going to work in publishing sort of thing. yeah Um, and actually I think,
00:01:20
Speaker
you know, initially I thought I wanted to go into maybe academia. I'm a very kind of like inquisitive person. I really love learning. And so that kind of felt like it made the most sense. Like that's, you know, professional learning is working yeah yeah in in theory. um And then kind of decided, oh maybe I want to go into theatre. So um I did a bit of kind of I mean, these are all kind of like storytelling things, I guess. But yeah, when I was at university, I i was a producer at a kind of student theatre company, and thought maybe I wanted to be a producer and then kind of fell into publishing in a way. i mean, being an agent wasn't a job that I knew existed. So I didn't really know that I wanted to do it. um But once it kind of, you know, started happening and I kind of found it,
00:02:14
Speaker
it I realised it was kind of a mix of, you know, left brain, right brain, creativity and business and strategy that really suited me and my personality. um and then looking back on when I had done the kind of producing stuff,
00:02:32
Speaker
that was a very similar sort of role. um It was very much born out of not wanting to be on stage myself. So being like, I can be the organiser behind the scenes and, you know, deal with contracts and funding and, you know, scheduling and things like that, that is very much part parcel of being an agent and an agent's assistant. But um it wasn't something that I really knew existed. I kind of just thought that working in publishing was like, you work in editorial, right?
00:03:01
Speaker
Yes. I think a lot of people, that's how people see it. They're like oh you want to be publisher? you want to be an editor then? Yeah. Or like you design covers, you know, yeah that's basically it. It's like a, it's my, I think my understanding of publishing came from like rom-coms.
00:03:15
Speaker
It was like, you new york in ah in a bookshop or you're like a high powered editor. It was basically like, all I could think of was like, you know, it's You've Got Mail. Yes. Yeah. Or like One Tree Hill, I think was yes what I thought being an author was like, you just write something and then it a week later, it's an international bestseller. That actually is how it happens. don't know if you know, but
00:03:41
Speaker
No, that would be nice. that's That's so interesting. I think that's a great way of describing being an agent as well, that you're combining left brain and right brain. Cause you, yeah, like you said, you have all of the like logistics and the sort of kind of documentation and strategy of the business side of things, but also the modern day agent is very creative. You're doing a lot of editorial with your authors.
00:04:03
Speaker
Yeah, totally. Um, and it's, it's, you know, I'm very lucky that I enjoy like, you know, both aspects of the job. Like I love, always say to people, but I love contracts. Like it's a real, I just love contracts, which is very lucky in this job. um I find them very kind of like fun to to kind of, you know, look at and strategize and and check and ah negotiate. But, you know, the editorial element of the job
00:04:35
Speaker
is the bit that feels, it doesn't feel like working, which is always amazing. It's, you when you read something or you're editing something and you are just kind of so in it that you're like, I don't feel like, he like, how is this my job? It's such a, it's such a kind of um privilege to be able to do that. um But I do think it is, like you say, like what most people think the job is, is just like you're sitting around reading all the time, which, you know, would be nice, but it's, it's not, it's not that. Yeah. You're just sitting reading submissions, right? That's it. That's the whole job. Yeah, basically.
First Internship and Cold Emailing Success
00:05:12
Speaker
Okay. And then am'm I right in thinking that you you you're kind of you got your foot in the door as an was it as intern at Mushrooms End Statement? I did. i so I graduated from university in 2019 and in that kind of like still, you know, not really knowing what i wanted to do thinking maybe I wanted to go into academia. I was like, might as well do a master's, why not? ah So i I kind of was looking at doing a master's and decided actually I'd had a very kind of
00:05:43
Speaker
you know i hadn't taken a gap year between school and university and I thought actually maybe I should take some time to really think about what I do. would be nice to maybe have some money as well. That would be lovely. yeah um And so I moved back home. I'm from the Midlands, I'm Coventry. um Moved back home and kind of was just applying for jobs and doing that ah doing everything that people do is like a cliche out of uni, thinking am I going to go travelling? Am I going to do a master's, you know, trying to work it out. And then obviously March 2020 kind of scuppered all of those plans because the pandemic hit. I don't know you know. um And so I was, you know, like 21 of uni.
00:06:26
Speaker
There was hiring freezers everywhere. Like i you would I would go on, you know, job websites and things like creative access because i I kind of did think at that point you know maybe I'll i'll look at publishing and there was nothing it was empty um and i I kind of was just trying to make things work like I was doing a bit of tutoring freelance writing like it was it was very kind of mishmash um and you know very lucky that I was just able to live with my parents and be at home but
00:07:01
Speaker
really I really am not someone who thrives on not having anything to do. right So i I kind of, I remembered start stumbling across a, um ah a blog post, I think it was, that Jessie Burton had written. um and I think it's quite a famous blog post in kind of writing circles, but it's basically about how she got her agent, who was Juliet Muschins. And I had remembered reading it and thinking, wow, like an agent, that is a cool job. That's so interesting. It just really sparked something in my brain.
00:07:39
Speaker
um And so i decided that summer when I'd kind of been like trying to you know, reach out to people on Facebook, Twitter, then Twitter and, you know, ah kind of get my foot in the door somewhere. um i just remember looking up the the kind of Mashens website and being like, wow, they're doing really cool stuff. And I've actually read a lot of these books that Juliet represents.
00:08:03
Speaker
um And so I just sent a cold email on a Sunday, I think it was. oh well And, you know, i it's something that I always, my, my younger sister's like five years younger than me and, you know, works in, works in theater. But when she was trying to get her foot in the door, my big advice was always just like, just cold email, cold message, make it really personal, make it clear that you are engaged with who they are and what they do.
00:08:28
Speaker
and But that's kind of what I did. I think I wrote a very earnest email um to Juliet basically saying, if you have any advice or if you're looking for kind of someone to do a bit of work experience, I would be so grateful. And, you know, ever efficient, um, Julia and Liza, they got back to me the next day and they were like, yeah, cool. Let's do a zoom. And, you know, it was kind of a ah and a I guess personality check slash job interview um and kind of immediately they were like great um you know could you start reading and doing an internship for us like next week and basically it sounded like ah it was ah a mix of and this is a big lesson for publishing it was a mix of like
00:09:18
Speaker
hard work, luck and timing. um It just worked out that i I had emailed when they had been talking about setting up an internship and was easier for them to just take me than it was to advertise, I guess. But that's great.
00:09:32
Speaker
Yeah, know. I mean, amazing for me. um But yeah, that was kind of how i how I got my foot in the door. So that was that was summer of 2017. twenty it was supposed to be two weeks um it has not been two weeks as you can probably tell but um yes it was supposed to be two weeks just basically reading submissions and I kind of just interned there the whole summer and they just kept extending it and eventually um Liza was promoted and I got a text from Juliet being like, do you want to, you want be my assistant?
00:10:06
Speaker
Um, so yeah, I mean that aspect, I guess it's quite rom-com, but yeah. And then once, once you're an assistant at a literary agency, you're sort of in the, the sort of the path kind of guides you towards then becoming, um, and you became an associate agent after that. Uh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it was a couple years of being an assistant, maybe three years, I think.
00:10:34
Speaker
At what point do you start building your own list? Like when did you, were you still an assistant when you signed your first author or had you become associate agent
Signing First Author and Client Acquisition
00:10:45
Speaker
at that point? I was an assistant. Yeah. So I,
00:10:49
Speaker
Yeah, I'm trying to think how long it would have been being an assistant. So, I mean, I started kind of being an assistant early 2021. And obviously, we were basically still in lockdown at that point, or, you know, some form of lockdown. So I didn't actually meet the team in person until that summer. And, you know, we moved into an office in the September.
00:11:10
Speaker
um So it was a lot of remote working for the first, like, six months, um which I think is really hard as an assistant. Like, you... You learn so much by osmosis, by just being in the room with, you know, your boss who is much more established than you and practiced than you. And just overhearing conversations, being able to turn your screen and be like,
00:11:36
Speaker
Does this email make sense? You know, those are things that you you really kind of pick up by being in an office. um And so for me, it was really valuable to kind of have that time and experience doing that.
00:11:50
Speaker
um ah And then, but yeah, I think I i so i signed my first client probably about three years ago, around now.
00:12:00
Speaker
So I must have been an assistant for about two and a half years. About two years, just over two years. And it was very much a case of, I wasn't open necessarily to submissions, but I um was doing a lot of kind of reading prize anthologies and you know short story prizes and um you know like Faber Academy anthologies stuff like that basically kind of doing a little bit of hunting rather than people coming to me um and that was that I think that's quite common um and I mean I still do that now like that is still something that I i like
00:12:39
Speaker
doing is kind of trying to find people who you know might be putting work out there but aren't necessarily actively querying um that's always a kind of fun fun conversation to have with someone of like oh I saw your you know your sample in an anthology have you got anything longer for me to read um and I think that is quite a ah common way that kind of junior junior agents or you know assistants get their foot in the door and I wasn't working at a big agency where I was able to kind of, I think a lot at big agencies, a lot of assistants inherit authors because they've acquired their boss or, you know, things like that. There's, there's, there's ways of people building a list that's not necessarily um having less submissions open, but being at a very, very small agency, like there was you know, four or five of us, um it was a bit more of a kind of active, like proactive way of of finding clients, I suppose.
00:13:37
Speaker
Yeah. And I've heard sometimes it can be that you would be reading some submissions, um, and it wouldn't be right for one of the more senior agents list, but you're like, but you say, I actually love this. And they say, yeah, if I had space on my list, I would take this. And then that, and then the younger agent would, would end up getting that. Totally.
00:13:56
Speaker
Totally. And, and that was how, that's how I've signed several clients is they've write queried some, and you know, I mean, it's, it's it's the case everywhere. It's a case even, it's not something that necessarily just kind of junior agents do or or assistants do, but i do think that is how you you get a start is, yeah, like your boss is not, doesn't have the space to take something on or they feel like, you know, they've they've got enough fantasy on their list. They've got enough crime and threat on their list for now. um
00:14:28
Speaker
But there's something in this this submission that comes in because I think, I mean, that's the thing with, I mean, no agent wants to kind of miss out on something. um And so, you know, it only benefits the agency if there's a kind of more junior person there with more, you know, you know, in theory, more, so more time, but definitely more space on their list yeah to take something on and put the time and energy into that and,
00:14:52
Speaker
It could always be the thing that, um you know, kind of catapults your list or starts you off. And it's it's it's very exciting. um It's a very exciting part of the job, but it's often, I think, one of those things that, like you say, it kind of comes about more informally. yeah.
00:15:09
Speaker
so yeah Yeah.
Transition to Paper Literary and Client Relations
00:15:12
Speaker
And so okay. So you, so 2020, you start as an intern. Yes. Then you, you're, you stay the course and, uh, you're an associate agent. They don't get rid of me. You're at Mushlands for five years, I think. And then, and then you've, you, last year you moved over to, to join Catherine Cho and the team at Paper Literary.
00:15:30
Speaker
Yeah. So five, five-ish years from like that first internship. um So yeah, I moved over to paper literary in kind of about a year ago, which is is crazy to think about that it's been a year. um but um But yeah, it just felt like the right kind of, the right time, the right kind of move.
00:15:52
Speaker
and yeah And it's always kind of nerve wracking, I think. I mean, it was, I'd never moved jobs before. So it was very like, I was very uncertain about what what kind of,
00:16:03
Speaker
ah was going to happen and you know publishing is a very very very people-centered industry like you you want to maintain um you know good relationships with people and I do have good relationships with with people but I think that you there's always the worry of like oh what if I what if I move and like something you know it's it's you want to keep it everyone knows everyone it's a very very small industry and you know I would talk to people who ah my friends or you know I have a lot of um have a big Irish family I have a lot of older cousins and I would talk to them about when they moved jobs and you know they all worked in ah jobs where when they left it was like well I'm never going to see them again but I was very aware that like you know this is a small industry and um you want to make sure that the um
00:16:53
Speaker
you're like keeping good relationships. So yeah, it was very daunting moving, but it was, but yeah, I moved about a year ago basically to, to paper. Yeah. And, and absolutely a common thing. Most agents are at some point in their career moving between agencies or whatever it might be. Yeah. Um,
00:17:12
Speaker
When it, I'm always curious, like when it comes to, to your, your list, obviously you started that list at Mushins when you move to a different agency, is it, do you just kind of take that list with you or does like some of them stay, some of them go, how does it work?
00:17:26
Speaker
So I, I took my clients with me, um and, um I mean, it's it's different in different agencies, but I mean, it was very kind of clean and happy and, you know, it was all it was all pretty, it worked out really well.
00:17:42
Speaker
um and And there was one client who, um who stayed with Mushons, but that was a kind of mutual decision. And that was to do with kind of like them being in contract and it just making more sense for them to stay with the agency that had those contracts. um So that was the only, the only one that kind of, um that stayed. But again, that was, I mean, even that decision kind of felt like it came out of like a strategy thing of, of,
00:18:12
Speaker
me and them talking and being like, you know, it does make more sense, like, for you to stay where they're, they're like, invested in you, like, contractually. um Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:18:23
Speaker
Yeah. So it was, um but it was pretty clean, generally. um And, It is very common when people move. um I mean, I think, you know, authors, it's completely understandably anxiety inducing for authors, I think, when they, they um when there's change or when things move, you know, like, yes there's a lot of change, like moving and and publishing, like agents, but also, you know, editors move and it's always a bit of, um I think, disorienting, but um it was it was, yeah, it it went really well.
00:18:57
Speaker
Yeah. I mean, i mean, yeah it's scary just because someone's basically saying like, oh, you know, things are shifting in the background, but you don't really, as from the author's perspective, like logistically, not much, I imagine changes because they're still, their relationship with you is the same. They're still contacting you in the same way. Totally. It's just, you have a different name above your head, basically. Yeah, exactly. I'm at a different desk, basically. I just, I'm, yeah, i've I'm, I'm in a different office. um But I'm still, yeah, still me. And I think that is one of the really lovely things about this job is that you have a very personal or kind of ah specific relationship with clients and with authors like you'll never kind of.
00:19:43
Speaker
ah like you should kind of be that steady thing, that stable kind of person. And, um you know, your clients have a relationship with with you and hopefully they trust you. Like the whole relationship is based on on trust. yeah um And um so, yeah, I mean, when when I told my clients that I was...
00:20:05
Speaker
um going to be moving moving agencies it was it was completely fine and you know they were all just like excited and happy for me and um you know sad to be leaving leaving mushrooms but they were like new things that's exciting yes so yeah their experience with you, like I said, probably hasn't changed much.
00:20:25
Speaker
No, hopefully not. No, I don't think so. And, you know, one of the things that um really drew me to paper as well was that we have a kind of in-house editor, Melissa, who, um you know, does edits alongside all the agents. And as we always call her our secret weapon, like she is so fantastic. She used to work at in the foreign rights department at Curtis Brown for, you know, 15, 20 years. And she's an author herself. So she brings a really, and it's such a rare thing as an agent to have a second pair of eyes on something before you send it out, especially if you're junior and you don't have an assistant to read it alongside you, you know, it's kind of just you out there.
00:21:06
Speaker
um And that felt like something I could offer. it felt like a great thing to be able to offer clients, know, Yeah, no, absolutely. I mean, it's yeah. Yeah. I think, i think I have seen a couple of other agencies have yeah an editor in house, but it's not, it's not a common thing. It's not the industry standard. So that's, that's awesome that you guys have that at your disposal.
00:21:28
Speaker
Yeah. I think it's becoming more common, but yeah. Yes,
Genres and Styles Representation
00:21:32
Speaker
potentially. Speaking of your authors and and the list itself, yes you are currently open to submissions as you continue to to build your list.
00:21:42
Speaker
In a broad sense, then, what are the age groups, the genres and the styles that that you represent? um So I'm a very kind of broad reader. I'm a very, ah I guess, a voracious reader. I think everyone says in publishing, but I do read, um you know, in a lot of different genres and age groups. um And so that is kind of reflected in my list and my taste and what I'm looking for. I think it's, it's, you can't, I don't think, separate um as an agent what you like to read and what you would want to read from what you represent.
00:22:19
Speaker
and Some people do, but just personally, it's not something that I um I find works for me um so I kind of read you know a wide range from like fairly literary upmarket novels some of my favorite novels are kind of in that more uh you know literary space um two really commercial books so I mean I think one of the things that I'm always looking for is um and which I ah do represent is you know um romanticy and that kind of and and fantasy in general and that is a mix of um the slightly more grounded you know accessible fantasy that I think is very popular right now to the slightly more kind of
00:23:09
Speaker
epic fantasy but I think the thing that I'm always looking for across genre is to connect with character to connect with voice voice is very important to me um and also to kind of feel really immersed and swept away which fantasy is obviously amazing for um I'm also always looking for romance I love a good love story um and um you know, across the novels that I love and across the novels that i'm I'm kind of looking for. I think anything that has like a big love story in it or, you know, ah a dynamic between two characters that just, and even if that's like a love story that's between siblings or parents and children or, you know, is romantic, I think I'm always, always really drawn to to those um those kind of narratives.
00:24:03
Speaker
um And then... I also love some, you know, novels that are in that kind of, I guess, like book clubby space, um which is always like a hard thing to explain, think. To identify, yeah.
00:24:16
Speaker
Yeah, but I think um things that feel kind of thematically quite meaty, it's a horrible word, but I think, um you know, that have maybe like a slight kind of mystery element to it or a slight... um are kind of saying something about about the world.
00:24:36
Speaker
um Yeah. That's also, you know, I'm always really drawn to. So I think it's it's a real mix and it's a horrible the thing that we we hate hearing as agents, which is like, I know it when I see it. um But I think generally speaking, it's got to have that mix for me of um ah a kind of like very immersive plot, a very, very kind of singular sense of character or voice and I love to have like I love having fun reading Sumi but I think I think um enjoying reading a book is is the thing that I'm always looking for so I always just want to kind of feel something reading it whether it's um feeling kind of you know laughing or just like feeling very kind of escapist and swept away or if I'm you know you make me cry in a book I'll definitely sign it
00:25:31
Speaker
Um, so, um, there's like a, yeah, there's like a phrase in publishing that's like, if you cry, you buy. yeah right so yeah, that's, it
Fantasy Sub-genres and Sci-Fi Preferences
00:25:40
Speaker
definitely applies to me and my taste, but you know, in terms of age range from kind of young adult to adult, I don't go younger than, than YA. Okay.
00:25:51
Speaker
Okay. Okay. Okay. I have some further questions. Of course. So fantasy is obviously a big, a big part of your, your list and and what you like to read in. You mentioned like romantic, you mentioned epic fantasy. So I imagine you're talking about things like Brandon Sanderson and things in terms of epic fantasy. Yeah.
00:26:12
Speaker
and then grounded fantasy, more like kind of fantasy realism. Do you also, you interested in representing like the more, the sort of emerging niche genres within fantasy, like cozy fantasy or like lit RPG?
00:26:27
Speaker
So yeah, I, I just sold actually a cozy fantasy novel. okay Um, so definitely interested in, in that kind of space. And again, I think it's that,
00:26:38
Speaker
um it's almost like escapism on the other end rather than it being like, you know, big battles and, and you know, fight sequences and things like that. It's almost the kind of um the opposite end of the escapist spectrum.
00:26:54
Speaker
So yeah, definitely cozy fantasy. um I, in terms of epic fantasy or kind of high fantasy, um generally speaking, I am more drawn to,
00:27:07
Speaker
to I guess like grounded contemporary, i guess urban fantasy is maybe what you would call it. Yes. But the epic fantasy that I enjoy or the kind of higher fantasy ah that I enjoy always has ah kind of, I guess so there's always got to be a way in for me. And usually that way in is um ah either it's playing with kind of,
00:27:34
Speaker
story tropes that we're already familiar with it's kind of turning I guess traditional stories on their head um so um I think like someone like you know Samantha Shannon is great at that um and or there's kind of a I guess like a centering of relationship um so um I recently read the island the silver sea by Tasha Suri um and i think that is a fantastic example of a kind of you know a secondary world but it's based on like it's kind of a pastiche almost of of um of England and the UK and it's it's saying something about
00:28:19
Speaker
society now that feels really relevant but it's packaged in a way that is both a love story and this kind of um I guess like a slightly higher fantasy um world um okay so that is kind of my my way into things um but definitely definitely open to to cozy fantasy and, and, and things that, you know, aren't necessarily just like London, but with a bit of magic, although I love that too. Um, yeah.
00:28:49
Speaker
Yeah. Okay. Okay. So it's quite broad and, and yeah I know that we talked about it, but there is a sort of element of, you know, you're, you're willing to give it a go and, and you know, it when you see it. Yeah, exactly. yeah And I think there's a, as a, you know, I,
00:29:05
Speaker
I think there is an appetite for, um you know, as romanticcy has become so, you know, successful and saturated, which is amazing. And I think, you know, much more mainstream. um I think the lines between these things are becoming much more blurred. And so I never want to be like, oh, I don't, I never do this or I never do that. There is, there are definitely some things that I don't, I just don't do. I'm not the right person for, but um I, I,
00:29:33
Speaker
I'm not someone who the minute I see something, you know, like ah if I saw like a very epic fantasy come into my submission box, I wouldn't immediately be like, oh, no, that's not for me. Because, um yeah, at the end of the day, like I want to be kind of immersed and swept away. And sometimes that's difficult to do that in.
00:29:52
Speaker
Yeah, yeah, because so much of it comes down to voice, the characters and the kind of setup, like you said. if there's ah If there's a way in, you know, any genre could could probably work because like that way in will will be universal.
00:30:03
Speaker
Yeah, totally. So fantasy thumbs up, often partnered with sci-fi. do you also Are you also interested in in sci-fi or not quite in the same way? So sci-fi really interests me, but I think it is, i actually tend to go more, um ah slightly more literary, I think, with sci-fi. So um I recently read um a book called Beautyland by Marie-Helaine Bertino. um i hope I'm pronouncing her name right. um Which is kind of... It's like, i think I think the way that I enjoy sci-fi tends to be sci-fi packaged almost as something else. Right, sure, sure, sure. So, you know, something like...
00:30:52
Speaker
um anything that's ah in that kind of genre mash-up space I think I enjoy in sci-fi but i um I think a straightforward sci-fi I'm not the right person for to be honest but if it's a a kind of beautiful beautifully written or packaged or you know um a story that's about Love and childhood, you know, if it's thematic, then absolutely do send it my way. But I think if it's a very straightforward kind of classic sci-fi adventure, it's just not not for me. and okay I'm just not the right, I just don't know enough about the space to to kind do its service.
00:31:36
Speaker
Right. Yeah. Yeah. So probably more like so speculative fiction and things like that would be more in line with what you're interested in. Yeah. I would say speculative is probably a more accurate way of, of describing, describing my, my taste, um, in that kind of space. But it's really interesting. Like I think the romantic tocy boom, if we, we want to call it that, um, it's,
00:31:59
Speaker
It's, I think, kind of broken open a lot of these genre spaces that that for years felt very kind of like clearly demarcated. it felt very much like, well, this is fantasy. This is romance. This is, you know, things like that. And actually, i am such a lover of genre mashups and, you know, things like,
00:32:19
Speaker
authors taking risks on genre and playing with genre and it's it's it's heartening that those are the things that feel like people want to read and also are more open to like you know it's so nice that kind of general readers who never would have picked up a fantasy book before or even thought of themselves as like a fantasy reader are you know reading in in those spaces like I just think it's I think it's great Yeah. And it, and it works both ways, which is really nice. Cause I've seen it online where it's like people who have read, you know, who would who are very much into their epic fantasy are kind of have tried a bit of romance now. And then these people who would used to just read romance are now like moving into the kind of more epic fantasy stuff. They've kind of, it works as like a two way gateway between the genres. Yeah. It's great. Yeah. It it reminds me of, um,
00:33:09
Speaker
growing up and um reading so many kind of like dystopian romances. Cause I, in the, you know, twenty ten s when I was a teenager, it was like, everything was the Hunger Games or was Divergent. And I would just go into Waterstones or into the library and be like, what's next on the shelf? Basically like what is in this section? Like what is the next one? um And I think when you find a love for a genre or a kind of, um,
00:33:39
Speaker
style of telling a story um uh it really cracks open a whole kind of new reading experience for you and I think you become so voracious that you are just open to reading things that you would not have necessarily been open to reading before Yeah.
00:33:59
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Um, okay. Awesome. I think that's a pretty good, um, a pretty good view of of kind of what you're looking for in a, in a broad sense.
Favorite Book for Being Snowed In
00:34:08
Speaker
Uh, we are at the point in the episode where we head over to the cozy woodland cabin. And I asked you if Kaya, you were snowed in, uh, in the middle of nowhere in a cozy woodland cabin, which book would you hope to have with you?
00:34:25
Speaker
Oh, I was thinking about this because, again, I think it's that thing of like, what's your favourite book? um And I think I would probably bring...
00:34:39
Speaker
Fingersmith by Sarah Waters um okay a lot of my favorite books you know when I think back on one of my big favorite books um of that I've read in my life a lot of them fall into this kind of uh slightly messed up gothic space like Wuthering Heights is one of my favorite books ever okay and I think the brilliant thing about Sarah Waters and about Fingersmith is that she's doing again it's like genre mashup right it's a love story. It's a mystery. It's historical. There were just so many,
00:35:12
Speaker
um ah you know, fantastic elements from different genres mashed together in quite an epic novel um and yeah I think that it would provide me with plenty of of reading material for being snowed in waiting for the storm to pass um and again fundamentally it's it's you know it's a love story and it's a queer love story which I I love so um I think it would have to be would have to be Fingersmith um it was a very hard decision okay yes yeah it's always difficult decision what's what's yours
00:35:49
Speaker
um you know what hadn't actually thought about it too much since i changed it not to interview you but what i'm just curious like what is what is yours um my usual go-to's are but i'm one of those people where it's like ask me next week and i would have read something else and be like oh maybe it should be that yeah totally that's me as well every time someone's like what's your favorite book i'm like what's the last one i read yeah exactly yeah well it's the last one yeah yeah um it's a good question i my safe my safe answers are either the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy yeah or small gods by terry pratchett which is like not necessarily most people's like first choice for terry pratchett but that's the one that speaks to me the most yeah um that being said i have dungeon crawler crawl uh dungeon crawler carl i have like bought the book it's
00:36:40
Speaker
it's on my list. I haven't read it yet, but I'm very excited to read it. And if I was going to be, if I was feeling like a gambling man, when I went into the cabin, I'd maybe go for that. Oh, you'd go for something you hadn't read. Yeah, but I know I'm going to love it because it's, okay i'mm I'm a big gamer and it's very gaming orientated. And right my friends or some of my friends said it's amazing.
00:37:04
Speaker
Okay. so so yeah, I guess as well, like in lieu of being able to bring um like ah your games with you. It's like, well, I'll bring this, which is like this in book form. Exactly. The book version. That's exactly what it is. I also feel like since I changed the question, now it's the cozy woodland cabin. It feels like there's there's less pressure with the with the woodland cabin. Everyone feels like that you know you're you're just in there for like a kind of getaway and it's a bit more chill. It's not like you're stranded. Yeah, exactly. Well, I mean, I was thinking it because I was thinking, well, if it was a desert island, it would be a different... answer I think like well exactly that's why I changed it yeah because getting you I was like I want to see the difference and I think I would go for something maybe a bit lighter like you know beach read versus uh something that is yeah cozy and snowed in so
00:37:53
Speaker
Also, people often won't feel like survival guides and things with the desert islands. No one does that how in the cabin. How to build a boat 101. Exactly. Yes. Or like bear grills or whatever, you know.
00:38:05
Speaker
um Awesome. So Fingersmith, ah a cool book, um a great addition to to the Woodland Cabin's library. Yeah. Next up, we are going to get into the weeds of querying cover letters, all that fun stuff that will be available ah at www.patreon.com forward slash right and wrong in the extended episode.
00:38:27
Speaker
There are so many books published and so many films that come out that we can't all just kind of keep up to date with them. Totally. But we should have, hopefully we'll have a sense of what it is. And if it's not, then we're interested. we will always just Google it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If it's in the zeitgeist, you'll have ah an inkling of what it's about and that'll kind of give a sense of Yeah, yeah. Okay, great. I think there was a lot of great advice in there. Lots that people can take away from that to put into their submissions, into their queries and their cover letters. um And that brings us to the the end of the episode. Thank you so much, um Kaya, for coming on and chatting with with me, telling me all about your journey into into publishing and and kind of what you're up to as as
Conclusion and Farewell
00:39:06
Speaker
a literary agent. It's been awesome chatting with you. Yeah, thank you so much for having me. It's been such a nice chat.
00:39:10
Speaker
And for anyone listening, if you want to keep up with what Kaya is doing, you can follow her on Instagram at Kaya Evans agent, um, or head over to the paper literary site, paperliterary.com to find out more about Kaya and the rest of the team and to look into the submission guidelines. Um, they're all laid out there.
00:39:29
Speaker
So it should be simple enough to do that. Um, To support this podcast, like, follow and subscribe, join the Patreon for ad-free extended episodes and check out my other podcasts, The Chosen Ones and Other Tropes. Thanks again, Kaya, and thanks to everyone listening. We will catch you on the next episode.