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S3E28 Who?! Two Journeys, One Purpose: Abby and Kara on the Power of Surrogacy
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Summary:
In this heartfelt episode, Whitney Hall sits down with Abby and Kara to explore their emotional journeys through surrogacy. They reflect on the challenges they’ve faced, the deep and unexpected connections formed, and the transformative nature of the experience. With honesty and warmth, they share how trust, community support, and shared vulnerability shaped their paths and helped them grow. This episode is a celebration of the powerful bonds built through surrogacy and a reminder of the magic that unfolds when people come together with love and purpose.
Takeaways:
- Surrogacy can be a miraculous experience.
- Building trust is essential in surrogacy.
- Community support plays a vital role.
- It's important to have open communication.
- Memorable moments can arise unexpectedly.
- Finding joy in the chaos is crucial.
- Prayer and community can provide strength.
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Recommended
Transcript
Introduction to Abbey and Kara's Surrogacy Journey
00:00:01
Speaker
Hi everyone. Surrogacy is so much more than a medical process. It's a deeply human experience rooted in trust, shared vulnerability and connection. And today's episode is a powerful reflection of just that.
00:00:13
Speaker
I'm joined by Abbey and Kara, two incredible women whose surrogacy journey brought them together in the most unexpected and meaningful way. Through open hearts and mutual respect, what began as a path to building a family turned into something even more lasting, a friendship amongst their families built on trust, empathy, and shared purpose.
00:00:33
Speaker
In this conversation, they open up about the highs and lows, some of them being absolutely hilarious, the strength found in community and the joy of forming a bond that extends far beyond the surrogacy experience.
00:00:45
Speaker
Their story is a beautiful reminder of what's possible when people show up for each other with honesty and intention. Enjoy. Me, you, and who?
00:00:57
Speaker
Who knew it would take more than two people to have a baby? In a world where infertility is no longer a taboo topic, this podcast will take you through all of the different aspects of surrogacy and egg donation through the lens of many who walk this journey in different ways.
Whitney Hall's Surrogacy Background
00:01:15
Speaker
My name is Whitney Hall, and I am a two-time surrogate now turned surrogacy coordinator for egg donor and surrogate solutions. the very agency I used when I chose to carry for two amazing families.
00:01:29
Speaker
With this podcast, it is our goal to help guide and support you as you learn about what it takes to grow a family in an alternative way, as well as hear inspiring and beautiful stories of how this path has changed lives forever. We can't wait for you to hear about just one more way happy families are created every day.
Abbey and Kara's Connection and Surrogacy Experience
00:01:51
Speaker
Guys, seriously, thank you so much for just coming on and sharing your story. Abby, I feel like your name has just been around floating here for forever.
00:02:04
Speaker
I know I always hear, oh yeah, Abby told me and you know, just all things. So I'm so excited that I get to finally talk to you, which is so fun. I know. I haven't got to connect with you at all. I was talking to a surrogate friend yesterday about this.
00:02:19
Speaker
She's the one that got got me roped into this years ago. She you would be perfect. in and So i was talking to her yesterday and telling her that we were doing this today.
00:02:34
Speaker
And I said, honestly, curious what we're going to talk about because my first journey was so insane that, yeah, I'm like, this one was just so – wonderful. Asher was the best baby.
00:02:50
Speaker
and Okay, well, before we go in there, just for any of our for our listeners that are not watching, don't you guys go ahead and just introduce yourselves so that they know who your your voices are?
00:03:06
Speaker
Okay. You ahead. You want to first? Yeah, you go ahead. Okay. I'm Abby Jurgens. Yay. And, yes, I um was a surrogate twice, and I carried three babies in two journeys and um had successful transfers, just...
00:03:27
Speaker
Had a really, just really miraculous things in both um both journeys. But today we'll mostly be be talking about our second journey here. and Yeah, ah we're lucky enough to have Kara here, your intended mom, now mom.
00:03:44
Speaker
Yes. She's graduated from intended mom. Full mom. Yes, I'm Kara. I am our was intended parent, I P, and now am full mom to my sweet little son that Miss Abby carried so faithfully, so gently. i could not, I mean, this was my first, me and my husband's first time doing surrogacy.
00:04:09
Speaker
And from the beginning, i was so stressed. I'm like, what's this going to be like? Like, how's it going to work? But honestly, everyone made it so nice. And Abby was just like, I couldn't have asked for a better, better surrogate mommy but for Asher. Like, oh my gosh, I,
00:04:26
Speaker
I brag about Abby all the time to my friends. I'm like, she was the best. Like, I'm going to cry a lot. Salty coffee. I always say it. I'm like, yeah, salty coffee all the time.
00:04:39
Speaker
love that. No, that's so sweet. Well, okay, Kara, before you start bragging on Abby, let's go back a little bit. How did surrogacy even become part of your story?
Kara's Journey with Adoption and Surrogacy
00:04:52
Speaker
So, okay, yeah. So my husband and i got married in 2016, and we had had a lot of discussions about, you know, children ahead of time.
00:05:04
Speaker
but then when we got married, we were like, okay, now, like, let's get serious. Like, what's that going to look like? And I kind of already knew my body was, like, um not meant for baby caring. I kind of had suspicions. I kind of like, I don't think this is going work.
00:05:19
Speaker
And even before surrogacy was part of the conversation, I was adopted. And so I knew adoption was a big thing for me. and So we actually started an adoption process before we started surrogacy.
00:05:31
Speaker
And we thought, oh, the adoption process, like, you know no you don't know exactly how long any of these processes are going to take. Sure. Absolutely. So we thought, oh, we'll start the adoption process. And then, like, after adoption, we'll then do the surrogacy.
00:05:45
Speaker
um Well, we started our adoption process in 2020, which is a great year to do anything. Oh, great year. Yes. Nothing major going on.
00:05:56
Speaker
Really easy. No, it was a very boring year. Yeah, totally boring year. And so that made things a little different for our adoption. And we knew it would probably elongate the process, but our Our agent was so kind. It was like, this probably take yeah two to three years. I've never had a family wait any longer than that.
00:06:16
Speaker
And so my mom like, okay, like in my head, I'm like, oh, it could happen like tomorrow. so I'm thinking like, oh, this will happen like a year. And then we'll have like, then we can do surrogacy the following year. Well, we're coming up year three of waiting for our ah adoption to come through. Yeah.
00:06:33
Speaker
And we we're like, and I'm just looking at my husband. I'm like, I just, I want a baby. Like, and he was like, well, let's go ahead and start the surrogacy process. I know we haven't adopted. We haven't placed or anything.
00:06:45
Speaker
Let's and start the surrogacy. And let's see. Let's just, cause we had no idea. We had zero clue how it was going to work. Sure. Um, but through, um we did an egg retrieval.
00:06:58
Speaker
and And so that process started like in the spring of 2023. twenty three and at the same time, as we're having these discussions with my doctor, we get a call from our adoption agent saying like, we've placed you, you're going to have a baby in September. And I'm like, what?
00:07:18
Speaker
um and And then, yeah. And then, so over there was a lot of overlapping things So many insurance calls, so many doctor visits, so many everything in 2023 was wild between getting our adoption process up and going and finished within less than a year. And then also getting the IVF treatments I needed and matching with Abby. and And so by the end of 2023, my first daughter.
00:07:43
Speaker
i had my first daughter through adoption and then Abby is pregnant with Asher by the end 2023. So that's kind of like the very abbreviated story of like how surrogacy came into our lives. It came in like a flash of lightning.
00:08:00
Speaker
It struck hard, fast, but it was wonderful. the result. Oh, my gosh. That is so wild. It's like crickets, and then it just comes full force. Yes. Oh, my gosh.
00:08:11
Speaker
Okay, so, Abby, you kind of already alluded to it because you said, you know, first journey was little, you know, just... What were your words? A little wild, little something. Unexpected. Unexpected.
00:08:24
Speaker
Unexpected. So even after having that experience, what made you, what inspires you to come back and say yes to doing this again? um That's a great question. i I try. There's a couple answers to that, but I was to keep it as condensed as possible.
00:08:46
Speaker
um Just with a lot of prayer and discussion with my husband, um the fact that our first journey went as smoothly as it did with such things throughout, like curveball after curveball, that that I was like, if we made it through that and um just such a miraculous um journey in itself that we we deserve it to ourselves to do this again.
00:09:19
Speaker
um Another reason being um Surrogate Solutions being such an amazing company and working with the same, I knew I would get to work with the same coordinator whom I loved.
00:09:32
Speaker
And felt very comfortable with. so and So she had called. And I remember being just, you know, it's always your, like, weeks out. You're like, I'll never do this again.
00:09:47
Speaker
Postpartum. I really wanted to have... ah You know, I think I'm sure you've heard this over and over through the agency, but ah it's just the neatest experience to have a baby for anyone.
00:10:00
Speaker
But to do it for someone who's never had their own. I'm going to get emotional. But to have their own baby, um just biologically and and for the first time to have that experience. I was like, man, that really that was always like.
00:10:15
Speaker
in there and my previous family had three kiddos before wonderful family. They just wanted one more, you know? And so this was I just knew it could be such a different process. So, you know, in talking through with the agency, um, that was kind of the, um,
00:10:34
Speaker
The thing I was like, if I can find a family who you really connect with, um just desiring their first baby and we have the same, you know, beliefs and those kinds of things, it would be amazing. So then Karen Caleb came along and it was it was the perfect. I mean, it was pretty instant for I feel like both of us.
00:10:55
Speaker
Oh, I love that. So going from, know, you, you're, you're, kind you have kind of this dream of, okay, first baby and all of that.
Bonding Moments During Surrogacy
00:11:07
Speaker
And then Kara, all of a sudden you're like, Hey, we're doing surrogacy. And Oh, by the way, we're also adopting too. yeah. Like how was that between, between y'all whenever you're kind of, you're, you're having this experience of like, right.
00:11:22
Speaker
Here we go. Like, I don't want to call it a curveball because it's kind of beautiful and fabulous. No, it's no. It's like, okay, this is another fun part of this amazing story.
00:11:32
Speaker
Yeah. ah For me, I mean, I remember exactly where I was and and that discussion with the coordinator. And I remember her saying, well, kind of being, feel like she was going back and forth between talking to you, talking to us, and, you know,
00:11:48
Speaker
I think you were very upfront with like, we want, we know there are multiple ways that we're planning to do this. Absolutely. I think that's, that's key with any family that's trying to match is just being very honest with that. Like it wasn't like a, well, we're done. You know, I felt overwhelmed for them.
00:12:06
Speaker
but personally oh my gosh. No, for sure. But I think that's beautiful, Abby, to know. I mean, truly, just the transparency of yeah of just being forward and upfront about anything is right so important in yeah this process because it really does help with that connection and that trust factor.
00:12:31
Speaker
And, you know, no, no one should ever feel surprised in this process. No. Right. Yeah. For sure. So Kara, you, I know Abby, you kind of said you felt pretty like instant connection.
00:12:43
Speaker
Kara, how did you feel when, again, you're, you're kind of, you have a lot going on and you meet Abby. How did you, what were your thoughts when you first met Abby? How did you kind of know, like, this is my person?
00:12:57
Speaker
uh it was so funny because right before we got a match with Abby and we'd also had received another match and wass so funny because we had been up on the website I think like uh almost month um before we actually got matches and I was after about a month I was like oh man I really hope someone likes this and then within a week we got, or within a day, I think both Abby and another person, like, came into our view, and we're like, whoa, okay, now we have, like, people to choose from.
00:13:27
Speaker
and But I don't, you know, I just remember looking at Abby's profile, and the other woman, she looked phenomenal, too. Like, she she's sounded fun. She, I think she was a big Disney fan. I'm like, oh, I can, we can vibe.
00:13:44
Speaker
be like I I think you put out there, like, where you didn't say we live in like the woods, but you had alluded to like we do hiking and like we love adventures. i don't remember. Something like that. Yeah, outdoorsy probably. Outdoorsy. And in the past couple of years, Caleb and I have gotten really into hiking and like nature walks. And that was something that was important to us and we want to do with the kids. And so I don't know. It just made me feel like, ooh, maybe I'll learn something outdoorsy or from Abby. And I just thought, oh, she seems like a fun person too.
00:14:18
Speaker
And so don't know. It was just kind of one of those I don't feel like I would have necessarily gone wrong with and the other lady. Right. But um yeah, it was just like a drawing of interest at that point to to Abby. And then when we met on...
00:14:33
Speaker
I guess a a Zoom call. don't know. It just felt like instant connection. Kind of like. Yes. Not like like love at the first sight. Kind of vibes. like Just like, oh my gosh. yeah I see you. You see me. yeah And we're just vibing. And then our husbands like are so cute. yeah like they just are They sport talk all the time. I love it. It was just sweet. And I don't know. I think what also drew me into Abby and Cody. Because this is something I don't know.
00:15:04
Speaker
I don't know how, what other, I haven't actually talked to a lot of other moms that went through surrogacy, but to me, I didn't realize how important it was for us anyway to not just feel comfortable with Abby, but comfortable with her whole family.
00:15:18
Speaker
yeah And so early on when we met Abby and Cody, i was like, Cody's great. And i could tell, that Abby was going have like the best support team. yeah he was going have the best helper, the best cheerleader, of the best, just everything that she would need.
00:15:37
Speaker
And she already has two kids and at the time I think were still living in y'all's tiny home. Yeah. And I was just like, oh, my gosh. And she wants to be pregnant.
00:15:47
Speaker
Okay, I guess. And then y'all moved and all this. And it just crazy. I'm like, okay. But I don't know. Just seeing how well Cody was just there for her. And then I got to see her kids. Oh, I think I remember they were kind of sick. But I was just like, I don't know. I just i felt the connection with her and just seeing how much love she was surrounded by. So I was like, I i just feel really comfortable with this person. She seems really strong and well-loved.
00:16:12
Speaker
So I just, i don't know. It was just like a, a good vibe kind of feeling and, and seeing the love that was surrounding her. I'm like, okay, she's, I think we can do this. So I feel like that's such an important point because it, yes, absolutely.
00:16:30
Speaker
You know, like Abby, you're the star of the show, right? Like where, you know, when it comes to like, Hey, we're trying to find our, our surrogate. We want to make sure that, you know, everything's all good. You want to make that connection.
00:16:41
Speaker
But you're exactly right, Kara, that support person aspect is just as important. And it does feel good to know like, hey, when there's a sick kid, when there's, you know, things happening, like she does have a good support. That absolutely feels just that's vital.
00:16:59
Speaker
Yes. Yeah. What about you, Abby? How did you kind of know? You were like, Kara's my person. my goodness. Well, I mean, you're already getting to see her, but she is just the funnest person.
00:17:15
Speaker
Caleb supporting you, loving you. Like, he was almost just as concerned and had all, like, he had all the questions he had. And it wasn't, like, in a doubtful way. It was just very, like, every appointment, everything. He just likes to know...
00:17:29
Speaker
Like he's very informed and he likes to know, um you know, that he can be like, what can I do? How can I help? Like he's such a good helpmate. And so like we definitely saw that too. I remember Cody and I getting off the call and we were just like, we love him. They're like, well, it's funny because it's like if we are not opposites, but we're very different. So then to to mesh that well beyond I think it was just the same thing, like a very, like a deep interest in like, I want to get to know them better. Like, I want to be your friend.
00:18:01
Speaker
I'll carry your baby, but I also want to be your friend. Yeah, that very true. I think I remember saying something similar It was like, they're just cool people. Like, I could just hang out with them.
00:18:11
Speaker
know. Yeah. So it just grew from there for sure. Yeah. That is so fun. Okay. So going along those lines, Abby, it grew from there. How did y'all grow?
00:18:23
Speaker
that relationship with each other, you know, were there maybe specific moments that kind of deepened like the bond or kind of, how was that? Yeah. I think getting to,
00:18:35
Speaker
be in person like you guys are so intentional in person it's like so deep like they go I remember sitting at what restaurant was that breakfast place oh yeah snooze oh my gosh so good so we yes we had the best time and ah Caleb had brought this deck of cards oh my gosh this was like a let's get to know you better um And these questions, I mean, they were some hard-hitting questions. This was like, was that our first medical, think it was like a med screening or whatever. Yeah, med screening. Yes.
00:19:13
Speaker
Yeah. And so we were we were in Texas and we were um meeting them for breakfast. He brought this these, you know, getting to know you better cards and would you rather type questions. I love that. And then getting to go deeper.
00:19:27
Speaker
It was fun. And so... We had fun, but it was also, like, left it was very intriguing. It left us very, like, wow, that was that was more than just let's go have some biscuits and gravy before our appointment, you know.
00:19:40
Speaker
What a great idea, too. Because I feel like in those situations, it's very easy to kind of stay surface level and, you know, and, yeah.
00:19:51
Speaker
I like to call it like cocktail conversation, you know, just very like, you know, oh, how's your day? What's the weather? Yeah, exactly. love, and I feel like that is such a great tool for like, okay, hey, we're kind of doing this big thing together.
00:20:07
Speaker
Let's dig deep. Yeah, and we did right off the bat. I think none of us, like, surface from what I've learned. So, like, we're, like, not in a bad way. i Just, like, they're so genuine and, like, what you see is what you get people that um just getting to to connect with them was, it was fun and it there were lighthearted moments, like, silly questions, too.
00:20:29
Speaker
But it was fun to, like, chime off of your spouse and, like, kind of throw them out. Like, no, you like this for me. ha, ha, ha, ha.
00:20:40
Speaker
No, that's so great. good memory Yeah. Oh my gosh. I love that. That's such a great, that's such a great idea. so obviously you guys had this beautiful journey together. you you know, we had beautiful baby Asher and, you know, just to had all of those wonderful things and have since continued to just have this amazing relationship.
00:21:00
Speaker
Looking back, what would you guys say were maybe some of just like your highlight favorite moment, big or small? Oh, my gosh. Go ahead. ah Well, I was just trying – I was actually, as you were talking about snooze, I was actually thinking about – because by the time we got to meet you guys in person, had just been born. Because I remember that first appointment, or at least – I guess, yeah, that first appointment.
00:21:32
Speaker
And I remember all four of us and Kiki were there. yeah and I remember – I'm not trying to call your husband up. I remember him being like I hope I don't have to get my blood drawn.
00:21:43
Speaker
well ro oh I'm so glad you're saying Not to judge Cody, he's a wonderful, very strong, hardworking man. Shout out Cody, you got this. Shout out Cody.
00:21:54
Speaker
But I think that's what made it kind of more funny to me. It's like, he is such a man's man. And I'm looking at Caleb, i'm like, come on, Caleb. Like, get in there. Like, get manly like Cody. and But then Cody's are here like, I really hope I don't have to draw blood straight. I really, I'm just, I really don't want to. And Abby are like, you might have to.
00:22:13
Speaker
And then sure enough, like, they're like, Cody, you got to come back here. Oh, that was the best. I forgot about that. i did. I forgot about that. Yeah, he gets weak over needles, and i was I was dying. I'm like, really?
00:22:28
Speaker
know. Can we put this in perspective, please, Yeah. Do this one thing. Right, your one thing. saying your one thing um like The simplest thing, the least painful thing any of us have had to do. Literally. um it's It's, you know, because Abby's going to be pregnant. I had to stick my stomach full of needles for over a month and go to all these appointments myself beforehand. And then...
00:22:57
Speaker
And Cody's like, I don't want to get my blood drawn. He was stressing out. Yeah, the the coordinator tells you the next thing. And that was just something I totally forgot that he even had to do. And it was like hitting him.
00:23:08
Speaker
Like, wait a second. remember this. I forgot about this that was part. You're going to be okay. You got this, bud. I do it every week. I know. Abby and I have been getting our blood drawn like at least once a week.
00:23:25
Speaker
and I'm not a fan of I used to be a big baby about needles too but like you kind of like you kind of like this is this is in perspective it's like this little thing no one's ever died from this like we're gonna be okay gosh so anyway it was that was that was just a funny story but then another funny it was the same same day I think um because after he had done his blood draw, he went back out to sit with Caleb, and I can't remember but, oh, I know what it was. Kiki had a plow out.
00:24:00
Speaker
Of course. In her carrier. And so Caleb and Cody had to, like, handle that while me and Abby are in the back talking to our doctor, and I come out, and I come past Cody, who's, like, throwing away, like,
00:24:15
Speaker
diaper junk and i like what happened he's like oh Kiki kiki had a a diaper incident and I'm like oh no Caleb's like yeah she had a blowout and Cody's having to help me I'm like oh my gosh but it's also very cute way to get close fast way to get close fast yes yes so I keep thinking about funny things like because they're all funny The last day we, well, with the day we, not to fast forward too much, but the day we left after having Asher, we'd gone to breakfast and Kiki had had some food earlier in the morning when we i first got
Challenges and Bonds in Surrogacy
00:24:50
Speaker
up because she was hungry. So we gave her some food in the morning.
00:24:52
Speaker
And then we went to breakfast and we gave her some French toast. And I guess she's just overeaten because we're outside in the parking lot about to leave. Cody's holding Kiki because Kiki secretly loves Cody more than any of us.
00:25:06
Speaker
Cody's holding Kiki and she just vomits everywhere. And basically, Cody, I guess, saw it coming because you there's a distinct memory in my mind of him like yeah holding her over like a pitcher and like letting her just vomit into this plant.
00:25:21
Speaker
This is amazing. Caleb got flattered on, though. Flattered, yeah. It was a whole whirlwind, though. Like, in Kiki's defense, that poor child had gone through.
00:25:34
Speaker
weren't planning to have Asher. i forgot. yeah That was the whole issue. So, not the whole issue, but I mean Yes. It was a surprise. Well, yeah. So, that I think that, sorry to fast forward all the way to that. No.
00:25:48
Speaker
That was part of, like, Kiki's under a lot of stress. Yeah. They had planned out. I don't mean to tell your whole story, but, like, they had planned out to, like, so Kara's mom, right, Kara's parents were coming.
00:26:04
Speaker
We were going to have Asher stay on Tuesday. So the whole plan, our plan was. Yeah. You guys just fly in on Saturday, so you're not there, like, all this time. Because you know how that can go.
00:26:17
Speaker
Get settled Bring Kiki, but then she can stay with your mom. And then you guys just peacefully, blissfully bring Asher back to your hotel, and you chill for a week, and we all besties.
00:26:28
Speaker
Yeah. That didn't happen at all. So it was like, no. It was like, um. it It always comes where, like, for us down here, our doctors only work on certain shifts.
00:26:41
Speaker
And so we knew, like, our doctor was going to be here on this day. So we kind of were hoping for the Tuesday plan. And then that just never happened. So basically my my water also doesn't break. But I knew there were, like, some good contractions. So we move on into all that. And I'm like, hey, you guys might. They were already going to be flying in on Saturdays.
00:27:04
Speaker
Just maybe it'll be fine. So they start flying in, and then the timing was just, like, I'm going to have to hold this child in for them to for him to meet his family. within – they was it like within 20 minutes of me delivering Asher. They got off the plane, drove two hours, made it to the hospital. You know, it was blissful. So po yeah Kiki was had been through a lot of trauma in those last few hours.
00:27:36
Speaker
It had been lot for Kiki. Yeah, she was going to, we were going to be there Saturday. We were playing. I wanted to, part of the reason we came in Saturday is also because Abby had talked so much about her church and her church family. And i was like, I will leave them.
00:27:51
Speaker
And yes I i had met her mom who because we did a maternity shoot in June. And yeah I got to meet her, her mom and see the town. And I fell in love. yeah Love Marion. and So i was like, I want to see your church family because you talk so much about them. Yep.
00:28:09
Speaker
So that was the plan is like go to church Sunday. Parents come up Sunday night. Kiki yeah stays with them Monday through Wednesday and we all fly home Thursday. But yeah, we, but I just remember Abby texted me Friday night being like, girl, I'm having contractions. I'm like, okay, my, I literally was like, Caleb, we might have to drive tonight.
00:28:31
Speaker
and yeah And both Caleb and Abby had to kind of talk me down like, no, no, no, no. Like, no, we're not driving 12 hours with your toddler. Um, no, I was, I was in a panic. I did not sleep well Friday night.
00:28:44
Speaker
We get up Saturday and we, we get to the airport and I'm just like the whole time. I'm just watching my phone, waiting for texts to come in from either Abby or Cody. And she's like, I'm at the hospital. i'm like, Oh my gosh, I'm, I'm going to have heart attack.
00:28:58
Speaker
And we get it. And of course it's raining. And so I'm like, Caleb, you can't like speed and we're going hydroplane on these tiny roads and, Kiki's just like, Kiki's champing it out, honestly. She honestly yeah did well on the flight.
00:29:11
Speaker
She did, it it was a two-hour flight and then a two-hour car ride. and So Kiki's just dealing. We get to the hospital. And I mean, she was in the delivery room. She saw everything go down. She did.
00:29:22
Speaker
Flect her part. So she saw everything. I have a beautiful picture of us from it. But even but even after Asher was born... I felt bad because Kiki has had to just be held this whole time. I can't put her down anywhere.
00:29:39
Speaker
But thankfully there was like the children's ward was down the hall and they showed me and there's like a little playroom. So after the super big high of emotion right after Asher was born, I'm like, I'll take Kiki and let her play in the playroom. I'll make all my phone calls anyway.
00:29:57
Speaker
so she was able to play, get some energy out. And then it became a question of like, in my seat at the hospital with Asher is Caleb yeah and whoever and so it just kind of that kind of stuck because it's oh man I really want to stay here with my with my newborn son but uh uh and not to like go way back in time again but um when we did the adoption and and i this was a bunch of a bunch of other emotions a bunch of other things went into this But i I spent the first night with Kiki in the hospital with birth mom. So we actually were in the same room together with Kiki. We actually actually worked out because we took turns taking care of her.
00:30:42
Speaker
um But the second night we hospital with Kiki, Texas, I think it's required to be in the hospital for 48 hours. And so we had to stay a second night. And so the second night birth mom had requested one night alone with her.
00:30:55
Speaker
And there was a thing, ah not a bad thing. It was just like a very emotionally driven situation. There's a whole nother story with that. But I was like, let you like, yes, you have that. That is, yes, you take that time.
00:31:09
Speaker
So Caleb and I then snuggled in our, our single hospital bed and the other room. And so I had decided, going to let Caleb have a first night with Asher because he didn't get a first night with Kiki in the hospital.
00:31:22
Speaker
So that kind of what made that decision for us. And so he stayed at the hospital the first night with Asher and I took Kiki to the hotel, which was a whole nother adventure because I had all this stuff with,
00:31:33
Speaker
with her and our suitcases and all just bags and then I left food in the car and anyway and But we figured There's just whole thing. But it's so fun.
00:31:45
Speaker
I feel like, I mean, I think this is such just a great descriptor of how you can plan to the best of your ability. And it's just not always going to the way that we want it But I feel like what was so great about this is, Kara, you had such amazing trust in Abby, yes, of course you're stressed. Of course you're looking at your phone. Of course you, but the, what but you're not worried about not being contacted. You have an amazing communication. yeah You know, think like, you know, at the end of the day, worst case scenario, if I don't get there in time, Asher is going to be okay. And you guys had built such an amazing relationship and trust with one another that, you
00:32:26
Speaker
Even if, you know, the rain and you do hydroplane and, you know, whatever, you're going to, you're going to, it's going to okay. And then you guys do get to have these crazy chaos moments and kids throwing up and, you know, holding over a plant and all of this stuff.
00:32:42
Speaker
And it's just, you guys are just living life with each other. And I mean, that's so beautiful that beyond just that, really, you know, just beyond the surrogacy part,
00:32:54
Speaker
you guys have this connection and relationship where your husbands are talking sports and where, you know, a kid is helping some, you know, husbands are helping with diaper changes and all of the things. I mean, it's beautiful.
00:33:06
Speaker
It's just beautiful. Yeah. It was and another sweet memory i have is when we were able to, after the hospital stay, because thankfully ah in Illinois, the hospital stay was only like 24 hours or one night.
00:33:20
Speaker
So it was quick. But I appreciate the fact we were able to actually go spend our last full day, or at least part of but our last full day, hanging out with Cody and Abby at their house with their kids.
00:33:36
Speaker
And I got it. It was the first time I'd really seen Kiki interact with other children. And now her kids are a bit older. Sure. Remind me how old Abby? how They're six and eight now. They would have been, yeah five and seven at the time. Yeah.
00:33:51
Speaker
So they're yeah bit older. Kiki is almost one. um But I have some really sweet pictures at their house of ah her kids just being so sweet with Kiki and her young youngest daughter sweet with Asher. just he's yeah He's like a day old, and he's just like you know in his little car seat.
00:34:13
Speaker
And there's just sweet little moments of like kids interacting at various ages. But just all kind of just like knowing to like, be gentle and be kind, be helpful, like, especially Porter. He was such a good big brother to his little sister and his little surrogate sister. He was just so sweet.
00:34:34
Speaker
So I just remember being like, oh, man, I, I, If anything, I hope that in that moment, if anything, I hope we stay connected with them because I want I want Kiki and Asher to know Porter and Keatley as they grow up and be like, hey, they were there for you guys and you are super little.
00:34:52
Speaker
So it was it was such a sweet little moment. And like we said earlier, Kiki decided coy Cody was the favorite adult. and so Every child.
00:35:03
Speaker
Yes, just loves Cody. It's so cute. And he's so great. And I just have some really great pictures with him just holding her. and they're just laughing about whatever. And it's sweet little quiet slice of life moments, which I live for a live for a slice of life moment. And so that was that was another sweet memory. And I was just like, ah, this is this is.
00:35:26
Speaker
Ah, this is the good stuff. This is it. Yeah, this is the good stuff. I love that picture of like just that slice of life memory. I think that's such a beautiful descriptor. Abby, when you're thinking about that, when you're thinking about just the impact that you have had on, you know, your family and you have had on you know, families and then thinking about your family and how they've been impacted by this experience. What is what, what do you think of whenever you think of just that?
00:35:56
Speaker
Myself and a lot of other surrogates start when their kids are pretty small. I mean, that that's part of it. So I feel like surrogacy has just been a part of their life as much as it has been mine.
00:36:07
Speaker
um But they get to know... you know, Kara and Caleb so deeply as well and love them. Like we're constantly, this is their baby, you know, like those kinds of things that, um, it's almost funnier now, especially during, you'll see a friend's mom is pregnant or something.
00:36:28
Speaker
And the questions, they're just like, Oh, is that yours? Like yeah the things that they're like, Where it's like so inappropriate on a normal day, but like we have to just explain and fill in the voice of like, so sorry, that was horribly rude. Let me give you some context.
00:36:46
Speaker
But, um... Yeah. So it's just fun. Especially my son. He just comes across like he's just very matter of fact, like, oh, is that yours? Or is that your baby? And um are you keeping it? That's always the question.
00:36:59
Speaker
Are you keeping it? Sure. Oh, my gosh. I love it. I love it. That's like my eldest. She would she would never ask, is it a boy or a girl? She would ask, is there one or two?
00:37:09
Speaker
Because I have twins. Because we have twins. I keep her twins. And then my first surrogate pregnancy was twins. So she was just like, you just have twins. That's just what you do. So, yeah. Is one or two? Yes. Yes. Yeah.
00:37:20
Speaker
Yeah. So funny. Yes. So there's just, there's always funny things like that. But, I mean, there are times, I'll be honest, there are times that it was really hard. course. And even recently, Porter was like,
00:37:32
Speaker
ah He's eight now, and he's seen he's been old enough to comprehend as best as he can. So he's seen two journeys, and he's like, hey, can we go back to the trampoline park like We have like Slick City in St. Louis, which is like slides.
00:37:48
Speaker
We're very adventurous, and we love to do crazy, you know, this one.
00:37:53
Speaker
You know, I've had to, like, take one for the team, you know, with my big old belly, and they understand. But at the same time, it's like those little comments you hear and you're like, man, yeah, i have I have had to take, you know, be on the sideline more than um then i think of. that that That's embedded in their mind as much as – um how exciting and awesome it all is too. They just, um you know, just the sacrifice that it takes, but it's obviously so worth it. And yeah, well, I get to have these different fun memories. They get to have, you know, you know, it's Porter and he's corralling all of, you know, these crazies in the living room and you know, all of that stuff.
00:38:34
Speaker
And you have kind of this new added family, you know, as part of yours. Yeah. Yeah. I will say, I will never forget, and still to this day, sort the Porter and Caleb connection.
00:38:47
Speaker
Just as much as Kinky and Cody, Porter and Caleb. Oh, my gosh. So the last day, guys were heading home. We go eat I mean, there's a theme here. We like food, right? We eat a lot. I love it. I'm here we go We go have some good Mexican food. We're talking.
00:39:04
Speaker
It's a little emotional just wrapping things up. At this point, Porter learns a little bit of, like, Caleb and his work, and he's he's just interested, you know, with Caleb's job.
00:39:18
Speaker
And Porter being an 8-year-old boy is just, what? This is awesome. Yes! um And so they just built such a strong bond. And my son is emotional, but not he doesn't let people know it or see it or whatever. you know um But you could tell he was like, wait, they're leaving and they live far away. And this is not okay. They've been with us.
00:39:41
Speaker
I remember like you guys just driving back to the airport and Porter's quietly crying in our back seat. And we didn't know... And so I turn around and I see him bawling and I'm like, what's wrong, buddy?
00:39:53
Speaker
And he's like, I miss Caleb. And was like, oh, me too, buddy. And so but then it was neat because Caleb has YouTube videos conveniently.
00:40:04
Speaker
So I'm like, let's pull up some music. So we like pulled up some of Caleb's music and his videos. And there he is. And the kids are just singing in the backseat to him. Covering Disney songs.
00:40:16
Speaker
Yeah. Well, again, I mean, that's just that highlights that beautiful connection of it's not it goes beyond just I shouldn't say just,
Advice for Future Surrogates and Parents
00:40:26
Speaker
but it does. This journey goes beyond. Yeah, baby and transfer days and, you know, just yeah and and all of those things. And I think one of my one of the things that love the most about y'all's story is this this want and desire to have a baby and this want and desire to, you know, be a part of that story and be able to give this gift is so big and so huge and it can feel so.
00:40:50
Speaker
i emotional and and serious. And there's, you know, all these checkboxes and the things that you guys are bringing up that are the highlights are the hilarious and the funny and the joy and the, yeah all of that. I mean, it's so, again, it's just so beautiful.
00:41:09
Speaker
When, when you guys are, if you had any advice for any, you know, potential intended parent, Or a woman who's thinking, maybe I could do this.
00:41:21
Speaker
What would you want to say to them? Either of you. I think if I could give any, any intended parent advice,
00:41:31
Speaker
I would always say definitely pray, find a community of people who will pray with you for you. Because that was a big part behind the scenes, even prior to meeting Abby and Cody, is we had a really strong church family. and we had a really strong community of people who loved us and knew
00:41:52
Speaker
And I would regularly have little ladies at our church come up to me and ask me, how's how's it going? And they knew it was a hard question. They knew it was an emotional question because I didn't want to be a mom for a long time.
00:42:04
Speaker
And I just had been, this was also during when I was still waiting for Kiki. And I would just get really sad and they could see. And so they come over and they just be like, can I pray for you right now? And just in the hallways, in the parking lot, just pray a hand on mi me and be like, you know, God bless less Caleb and Kara with a family that you have for them.
00:42:23
Speaker
and I think I would remember those prayers in this the harder days, the sad days, the difficult days, the challenging days. um And even after we made the connection with Abby and Cody, even after we secured our adoption situation with Kiki, there were still plenty of hard days throughout the process. It was still long, it was still hard, but I just would never forget the prayers of the people who loved Donna so much.
00:42:50
Speaker
um So find yourself a community, even if you're it maybe you don't pray or go to church or whatever, but find yourself a community that you're willing to be vulnerable with and to tell them like, this is hard. I'm sad. I need I need a hug.
00:43:05
Speaker
Yeah, I need someone to just come sit with me. i need someone to just go to coffee with me and and just talk about it. Just tell them because I have a friend who also did she did a full IVF and adoption. So she our stories are actually very similar.
00:43:20
Speaker
And she took me out to coffee many times. And I would tell her the same stories. I'd tell her the same sad things. And she would just sit there and listen. And that was a huge thing for me um to support me. and Caleb. I know Caleb is... He has emotions. But, you know, kind of like a lot men. They just kind of shoulder them. And they just...
00:43:40
Speaker
do their thing but I could tell wasn't necessarily having coffee conversations where he's he wasn't having salty coffee time but he was having his time in his own way whether it was through his hobbies or just he plays a lot of video games so I knew he was playing with his friends or his dad and he'd be just just the extra love and community he had to support him emotionally he could then let me cry to him because I cried a lot um so I think That would be maybe one of my biggest things is find yourself a good community, hopefully yeah ah praying community that'll just surround you and love on you. And as far as when you find your match after you kind of are on the journey, um have conversations with your surrogate family.
00:44:23
Speaker
Remember that they're They're people too. They have families too. They have so much love clearly to sacrifice their bodies this way. And I couldn't have asked for a a better person, better person than Abby, who is just so immediately, i felt so secure because I could tell the type of love she has, not just for her family, but for a stranger it was very sacrificial. And I think that's really beautiful and very hard to find and in genuine without expecting anything.
00:44:55
Speaker
And, um and she truly was just so easy to work with. Like she was so like, just no drama, no issues. We had some nice little FaceTimes and we were just like cheering each other on through all the things that we're going through. um But I think it's because both of us put an effort to be like, send texts to each other. So like, Hey, you want to FaceTime? Do you want to chat? Do you want to send a little message? Like,
00:45:21
Speaker
You both were engaged with each other. So that's something else I tell intended parents, parent that to have a good relationship and also to not make things awkward as you move forward, because you're going to be in the hospital room probably more than likely. Don't wait till then to decide like, oh, I guess I should find out their favorite color or something. Like don't wait till then. the fluffy questions and the deep questions. Get to know them. yeah Remember their people. Remember they have love to give.
00:45:51
Speaker
And they're worth knowing just beyond being like, oh, that's that's the care of my baby. No, that's that's Abby. That's a beautiful person that has so many good qualities.
00:46:01
Speaker
And she's chosen to be a part of my life in this very intimate vulnerable way. And I think if you can view it that way, what makes you grateful. It makes you humble. It makes you compassionate. And then you need all those things as you're doing the show to remember, like, oh, boy, like,
00:46:17
Speaker
This is a lot, but it's a lot for your your surrogate mom as well and her family. oh yeah. Anyway, that was long-winded, but they all those thoughts just kind of things. No, no, it's beautiful. And you're making me have salty coffee.
00:46:29
Speaker
I mean, oh, my gosh, you guys, you guys. No, mean, I think that's so i think it's so beautiful, Carol. What about you, Abby? Well, thanks for making me follow that.
00:46:39
Speaker
I know. No, I'm not going to slurp on it. no So good. Oh, man. I think that just going throughout this, even this conversation, you can see overarching themes of having community, having a loving, supporting person or people in your life and and being vulnerable, being honest, being um just, I think surrendering control in life is something that
00:47:17
Speaker
you know, both Kara and i love the Lord and we pray and we have our faith and we also have our support. So I think I just want to reiterate that as much as Kara has that having having a community, having our faith community has also been on our end. and I'll give a little shout out to our Southern Illinois surrogates too. We I think there's like over 12 of us within an hour of my home who have all carried under surrogate solutions,
00:47:49
Speaker
which says a lot to the company. um And then I just, so having those women to bounce off, like, Hey, I forgot how this works or what does this even mean? Or, know, how did you handle this situation and betas and all the things you forget about in the beginning? are So having, having people to keep you grounded and um to bounce off like the tough questions was so important for me. um And then, yeah, just,
00:48:21
Speaker
just be who you are, be who God created you to be, and and just give up control, because, you know, we can make our plans, but he he is the ultimate planner, so i just, just...
00:48:35
Speaker
yeah just I love it. I love it all. No, for sure. But I think that's so beautiful, Abby, that idea of give up control, whether you're faith-based or not, if you have taken the time and you are part and you have built this trusted team, agency, doctors, yeah just all of the professionals that are part of this process, if you have that trusted team,
00:49:01
Speaker
the Being able to give up control in an uncontrollable situation and feeling okay with that because you know the people around you are, you trust them.
00:49:14
Speaker
They have your best interests at heart. It makes this process so beautiful. And then you can be vulnerable and you can, yeah you know, just trust in the process.
00:49:25
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, no, that's beautiful. Well, you guys, this has been amazing. And um I am just, I'm so grateful that you guys were willing to share your story.
00:49:37
Speaker
And just, I love the relationship that you guys have. I have one last question for you and it's a fun one. For anyone who knows me and you guys have seen me this whole time, I'm sipping on my coffee because coffee and were best friends, albeit it's saltier now than it was at the beginning.
00:49:53
Speaker
But I always love to ask the question, what filled your cup
Personal Reflections on Peace and Connection
00:49:59
Speaker
today? Literally or figuratively, what's been the thing that has filled your cup?
00:50:03
Speaker
I think this morning, andm I'm in a hotel. Right now, we're actually, my husband does a lot of touring with conventions. He sings, and so we are at hotels a lot.
00:50:14
Speaker
um And this morning, he was kind enough to go to breakfast with me and the, but and like, you know, downstairs buffet thing. yeah And, um, you know, yesterday it was a crazy travel day. We had, there's another crazy story, but it was just a really nice, like morning, just him sitting at the table, just enjoying a meal together.
00:50:39
Speaker
um And just, I don't know. And we do, we actually do this quite often. We share a lot of meals together. Like, and we like the kind of quiet nature of like a coffee shop or a restaurant, you know, quiet restaurant. But ah this morning, don't know, it's just something sweet about just sitting in and just, you know, a old hotel buffet area and just kind of sitting and enjoying the quiet for a moment before the weekend kicks off with all the busyness he's going to be in. And so just any, anytime I get a chance to sit and have a chill moment with my husband over food, as this has been a theme for this whole conversation, always fills my cup. Yes. Coffee and some bacon and my husband's
00:51:20
Speaker
That's all I need in the morning. Bam. Dream. I love I love it. What about you, Abby? Oh, very similarly. We took our kiddos to school this morning, and we just came out of one of the most chaotic Cool. Seasons of our lives. Yeah. So, um like, literally last week. So, it's been this transition back into just, like, peace and being intentional, having hard conversations, and just praying. So, yeah, this morning we dropped the kids off, and we got...
00:52:01
Speaker
an hour to connect before before hopping on here and so we sat on the couch with our coffee as well and and we got to read and pray and just have a beautiful time of just I guess surrendering and just okay and when I don't do those you know it's not every day that we get to have a blissful morning together but on those mornings I'm like can we do that every day Right?
00:52:30
Speaker
Oh, I love that. I love that so much. Well, I'm glad you each got to have your peaceful start in the morning. And I love that this got to also be part of your day because y'all's story really is, it's just so wonderful. And y'all's relationship is, is just, I mean, it's amazing. It's goals. It's magic.
00:52:50
Speaker
Yeah. um wow Thank you guys so, so, so much. And yeah, truly. Thank you. It's beautiful. Thank you so much for joining us on this episode of Me, You, and Who.
00:53:05
Speaker
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00:53:18
Speaker
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Speaker
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00:53:45
Speaker
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Speaker
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00:54:11
Speaker
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