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160. Unveiling the Grief-Gut Connection with Stephanie Papadakis
135 Plays11 months ago
Stephanie Papadakis is a grief recovery specialist, holistic nutrition consultant, and autoimmune protocol coach. After experiencing her own grief, trauma, and health issues, she dedicated herself to helping others heal their broken hearts and address health issues caused by emotional stress - like poor digestive health, hormonal imbalances, and autoimmune diseases.
Through her work, Stephanie helps people deal with grief and trauma in order to heal the gut. She believes that when we honor our grief and give ourselves permission to feel all of our emotions, we can begin to restore balance in our lives and find true happiness.
In her free time, Stephanie loves to travel, eat, explore new places, and meet new people. She is always looking for her next great adventure with her wife and her dog, Bounce.
Web Links
· https://www.gutofintegrity.com/
· IG + TikTok: @gutofintegrity
· https://www.facebook.com/gutofintegrity/
·https://www.facebook.com/groups/thespacebetweengratitudeandgrief
Contact Kendra Rinaldi to be a guest on the show or for Grief Coaching:
https://www.griefgratitudeandthegrayinbetween.com
In this episode we talk about the following topics:
- Stephanie's personal journey through grief and how it impacted her gut health.
- The profound connection between emotional stress, grief, and physical well-being
- Stephanie's transformative experience with nutrition, exercise, and intentional lifestyle changes.
- The importance of addressing emotional and mental health alongside physical health
Recommended
Transcript
Introduction and Personal Realizations
00:00:01
Speaker
So when I went back to nutrition school, that was sort of where all of those aha moments came. That's where I learned about the gut-brain connection, and that's where I kind of pieced together that my body was under this incredibly stressful situation with grief. What I didn't mention was that four other people died within a two-year period after my dad. So there was a lot more, even more going on that was causing me to have all of this anxiety.
00:00:34
Speaker
Hello and welcome to Grief, Gratitude, and the Gray in Between podcast. This podcast is about exploring the grief that occurs at different times in our lives in which we have had major changes and transitions that literally shake us to the core and make us experience grief.
00:00:57
Speaker
I created this podcast for people to feel a little less hopeless and alone in their own grief process as they hear the stories of others who have had similar journeys.
Meet Stephanie Papadakis
00:01:09
Speaker
I'm Kendra Rinaldi, your host. Now, let's dive right in to today's episode.
00:01:17
Speaker
Today, I'm chatting with Stephanie Papadakis. She is a grief recovery specialist, a holistic nutrition consultant, and an autoimmune protocol coach. She believes that when we honor our grief and give ourselves permission to feel all the emotions, we can begin to restore balance in our lives and find true happiness.
00:01:40
Speaker
I cannot wait to dive into this conversation and find out more of how you got to this space. So welcome, Stephanie. Thank you so much for having me, Kendra. I'm so excited to be here. I'm happy you are here. And we were just chatting. We chatted for probably like 10 minutes prior to starting to record. We're like, let's just start. Let's start recording. Let's start recording because we might say more while we're chatting and forget that we even have a recording scheduled.
00:02:09
Speaker
They're like, wait, I only blocked off 45 minutes. We've been chatting. So now we know. So Stephanie, tell us more about yourself. I'd like to start more with your upbringing. Where do you live now and where did you grow up? And then we'll take it from there.
00:02:26
Speaker
Um, I love, I love that question. I, now I live in Santa Rosa, California. It's about an hour north of San Francisco in Sonoma County, which is one country. It's beautiful up here. I feel like I live in vacation land, which is really nice. And I found my way up here through a couple of different cities. I grew up in, um, Orange County, California in Mission Viejo.
00:02:49
Speaker
which I wanted to get out when I was 18. So I went to UC Santa Cruz and was there for four years. And then I moved to Boston for graduate school and I was there for three years. And then I moved to San Francisco, which is where I met my wife. And then we moved north to Marin and now we're in Santa Rosa. So we'll be here for a long time.
00:03:11
Speaker
So you're back back again in California and you have a dog.
Life with Bounce the Dog
00:03:16
Speaker
Tell us your dog's name because that's your baby. So I know because I have two and they're also my babies aside from my human babies too. I have my, what is your dog's name? My dog's name is Bounce and he really lives up to that name.
00:03:35
Speaker
One of our best friends found him running down the side of the road and she said he bounced into her car. So she named him Bounce.
00:03:42
Speaker
And he is the most expensive free dog we've ever had. Oh my goodness. What the feeding or the ill or things that your surgeries, what, what made it, what's made it expensive. He, um, won't eat his food unless there's like a delicious topper. So we have to constantly like either make more food or buy more stuff. He has had 64 insurance claims in the last seven years that we've had him. Um, and not, not for any other reason than he's kind of like.
00:04:12
Speaker
We call him Dennis the Menace because he just gets into things. Recently, he just broke his toenail. It's so random. What mix of breeds is he? I think, well, we are very certain that he's part pickle, but we don't know what he's mixed with. We think it's either Basinji, maybe Shepherd, but we don't know exactly. We haven't done the test yet.
00:04:38
Speaker
Now, since you're in the health space, have you had that conversation with Bounce and told them about all the nutritional things that come from eating his food? I'm joking. No, actually, we have had that conversation. Okay. He gets salmon skin for his coat.
00:05:00
Speaker
Okay. So he is in one of your protocols. So we can add that. You can add animal nutritionists to your list as well. Yes? Awesome. Yes. There we go. All right, Stephanie. After all this, let's now dive into your grief and your trauma story, because that's what led you to now be in this space of really healing
00:05:24
Speaker
people's gut really dealing more with our emotions. So what is your story in that space?
Coping with Grief
00:05:34
Speaker
What was your story? Yeah. So I grew up Greek Orthodox and in my religion, when anyone died, we would go to the wake and the funeral. And so I grew up arresting a lot of dead people, to be honest. And when my dad died in 2009, that was like
00:05:52
Speaker
a total game changer, seeing him, seeing his body was broke by broke. I didn't eat for five months. I lost 22 pounds. I went to work like a zombie, came back, literally watched
00:06:14
Speaker
Dexter because it felt like a really good way to get out my anger and I was So you went even deep you would actually find things to even go darker in that moment of that It's that's interesting because some of us not say because do might do the opposite Oh, let me try to cheer up But you wanted something to match the mood of how you were feeling and that yes the heaviness the heaviness I think you know When someone dies, I've heard this through clients and friends, you know
00:06:44
Speaker
oftentimes things happen with family members after that and that happened with my family and there was a big split and I didn't talk to my dad the side of the family for quite a few years after that and so I think a lot of that anger was you know part of that didn't allow me to really grieve my dad because I was so angry about this other thing that was happening
00:07:06
Speaker
And so when I finally came out of that fog, I think when you have someone so important pass away, those first six months are hellish for everyone. You don't want to believe it. You don't want to acknowledge it. You just want to forget about it. And yet, of course, you can't. And so I was living with someone at the time. I moved out and got in my own place, and that kind of forced me to take care of myself again.
00:07:35
Speaker
So when you started then that journey or that realization, okay, you're here not eating partly because of your grief, had you already studied nutrition at that moment or not?
00:07:45
Speaker
Not formally, no, but I have always been, it's kind of been a hobby for me. Okay. So in that moment, here you are, I'm going to use the word wasting away, but you know what I mean? And that's it, because you were not eating, you're not taking care of yourself. What things started happening to you physically, other ailments
00:08:07
Speaker
that started coming up. If you mind sharing something, that's your own personal journey. So whichever ones you feel comfortable sharing, if there were any things that you started to notice shifting in your health based on how your gut was in that moment.
The Gut-Brain Connection and Health
00:08:25
Speaker
Yeah. So the biggest thing that I noticed was my gut health shifted from being more constipated to having more loose stools.
00:08:37
Speaker
And those were pretty constant and it didn't match up because I wasn't really eating. Um, but I was constantly having to go to the bathroom and I didn't know exactly what that meant. So when I moved out, I thought, okay, well, I got to start taking care of myself. If I got there, like, I brought a cook nutritious food. I have to move my body again. You know, I was feeling really weak. I had.
00:09:04
Speaker
I've always been an athlete. I've always kind of worked out even after playing soccer for 10 years and running track and just kind of keeping in shape through my twenties. But once that happened, I could see like all the muscle was just literally wasting. Um, and so I knew I had to make a lifestyle shift. So I got a gym membership and I didn't go for three months, but I finally did.
00:09:29
Speaker
Um, and then I started cooking for myself. I started like trying to get back onto a sleep schedule where it wasn't staying up till two in the morning and waking up at seven to go to work and really just trying to be intentional about those things. That helped with my mental health. I met my wife shortly after that. I attended a grief, a mindfulness grief group.
00:09:57
Speaker
after that as well, which was incredibly helpful, but that didn't help all of the gut health stuff. That was still happening throughout this whole time, no matter what I ate. And I wasn't quite at the point that I understood the connection between the gut and the brain and how that can affect
00:10:19
Speaker
everything. Literally everything. Isn't it the other brain? Do they call that the other? Is the gut the other brain? Is that what it's sometimes referred to? Yeah, the gut is the second brain. The second brain. So when did it click that, okay, my emotions are tied to everything that's happening right now to me. When did that click and when did your research just start taking
00:10:45
Speaker
place and you shifting. You had let go of the emotions to some extent of your grief, but I know you're saying that there was also the other grief component of having the secondary losses that sometimes come with grief. In this case, you lost a whole side of your family for a period of time because of the tension right after your dad's time. You're still grieving that as well aside from your dad's death.
00:11:13
Speaker
Tell us how that, you know, you can see how much I talk. This is what, if I had a video, if people could see me talk and how much I talk with my, I love it. I love it. I do that too. Their digits are lower right now. Mine are right up here on the camera. Yeah. Okay. You can see how I add humor in this conversation here, but yeah. So tell, tell us how, how, when did it, when did it click for you? It actually didn't click for quite a few years.
00:11:43
Speaker
I had gone, I tried a lot of different diet shifts over the course of the years. I had tried being a vegetarian for a while and it worked until it didn't. I added meat back in. I tried paleo because I thought maybe it was gluten and dairy that was an issue. It turns out that it is, but that still didn't help.
00:12:05
Speaker
So when I decided to go back to school and become a nutritionist, that was in 2016. And that was after I was also at a really awful job that was making me literally sick. I was in the bathroom for probably two hours out of every day and just never knowing like when it was going to happen and.
00:12:26
Speaker
You know, I would get called into the office. Where have you been? I'm like, I have IBS. I'm sorry. Like I knew that I had gone to the doctor. They said you have IBS irritable bowel syndrome. And there's nothing we can do about it. That was, you know, we can give you an anti spasmodic. And I wasn't really interested in taking that because I wanted to find more of the root cause. So when I went back to nutrition school, that was sort of where all of those aha moments came. And that's where I learned about.
00:12:53
Speaker
the gut-brain connection. That's where I kind of pieced together that my body was under this incredibly stressful situation with grief. What I didn't mention was that four other people died within a two-year period after my dad. So there was a lot more, even more going on that was causing me to have all of this anxiety and all of that anxiety, all of that emotional stress.
00:13:20
Speaker
you know, our body, my body was in a chronic state of stress. And most people's bodies are because we live in the society where we have a lot of little chronic stressors and we probably don't even realize it, but our body still sees that as stress. It can't, it can't. Differentiate. Differentiate, yeah. Yeah, between one thing. Even when you work out, it's a stressor. So you need to know that releases cortisol. So you kind of have to know
00:13:48
Speaker
how to even balance even that within your life so that the, yeah, so you're right. The body does not realize that you being in traffic, stuck in traffic, that stress that there is any different than the stress caused by the grief that comes from losing someone. The body still sees all that as stress. Yes. Yes. Okay. Yes. And so you're constantly releasing cortisol at a low level all of the time.
00:14:18
Speaker
And doing that can raise your blood sugar. It can change the composition of your gut bacteria. It can reduce the amount of serotonin that your gut makes, which is not only like the, you know, feel good, happy neurotransmitter. It's also something that helps move.
00:14:39
Speaker
through food through your gut. So if you are not making enough serotonin, oftentimes you could be constipated. For me, I think it just because the way my body works, I was leaning in the opposite direction. So going back to nutrition school helped me see all of these collections.
00:14:59
Speaker
And in that time, that was when I realized, okay, I want to focus this on how grief affects the body and how grief affects the gut-brain connection because it's so important that
00:15:12
Speaker
you work on the, if you want to work on the physical, you have to work on that in mental and emotional side as well. And that's, that was where I was like 2016 to 2022. That was kind of my stance. And so I eventually learned about all the different kinds of gut dysfunction. And I went to a doctor and an integrative doctor where I was finally diagnosed with SIBO, which is small intestine bacterial overgrowth. And I did,
00:15:42
Speaker
two different protocols, one herbal, one medicine protocol changed up my diet, a low FODMAP, which is basically low sugar, low carb to try to get rid of all of that excess bacteria and get my gut back into a good place. And it did work until something else cropped up a couple of years later. Another grief.
00:16:12
Speaker
another trauma or something else? I think that popped up because I was processing a lot of my traumas. I had started a different kind of therapy, the IFS, internal family systems. What is that one? What is that one called? Internal family systems. Okay. And it's awesome. I like
00:16:39
Speaker
highly recommend it because I feel like in the last couple of years, not even the last couple of years, I started last year. So in the last year and a half, I feel like I've been able to work through more of my trauma than I had in the last 25 years that I've been in talk therapy. Does it have to do with generational trauma?
00:17:01
Speaker
So not necessarily the family that is being talked about is your internal family inside of you. So your feelings. So you have your protector, you have anger, you have shame and guilt. Like the movie in and out, just like that. Okay. So as in all that, so just to kind of figure out which one of these
00:17:24
Speaker
characters of your family comes up in the different situations of your life. That's what this type of therapy addresses. Okay. Yeah. And what's great about it is that you can sit with those parts and get to know them. And when they come up, you can be curious about them and ask them, why are you here? Like, what are you trying to tell me? I honor you. Thank you for being there.
00:17:51
Speaker
I'm safe now, like I don't need you at this moment.
00:17:55
Speaker
I love the word honor instead of judging. We tend to judge our emotions when they show up sometimes. And so I love that in this type of way of really, you're really honoring, you're here, okay, why? Because a lot of times we're like, wait, why am I feeling angry? I shouldn't be feeling angry. No, no, no, no, no, no, not right? And we start this whole story around it rather than like, okay, this is emotion. Why? And having that,
00:18:24
Speaker
conversation with it again.
Diet, Leaky Gut, and Autoimmune Diseases
00:18:26
Speaker
Okay, that's it. So I had never heard that way of therapy. So thank you for sharing something. I did not know.
00:18:33
Speaker
Yeah, you're welcome. It's Dr. Frank Anderson. He works a lot with, he'll collaborate with David Kessler often. And he, he's one of like the big people who do IFS, who does IFS therapy. And so it's just a really, it's just, I don't know, it's changed my life entirely. And it's helped me just come to terms with a lot of the traumas that happened in my past that I
00:19:03
Speaker
kind of knew were there and were affecting me, but I didn't want to really go as deep as I could with them because it's scary, right? I mean, it's super scary and you can't grieve multiple
00:19:17
Speaker
things, right? You have to grieve one at a time. So I had to go back and look at all of those things and, you know, not to say that I'm totally healed of everything. I'm still working and I'm going to be working for the rest of my life on all of this. I'm still going to be grieving the loss of everyone that I've lost in my life, but it's not as heavy.
00:19:43
Speaker
Thank you. Thank you for sharing that part of your story. Now, in terms of how you then coach people, you mentioned in your bio a lot about autoimmune. I don't know if it was your bio or your website, a lot about autoimmune issues and knowing that most of these, if not all, because I'm not a health practitioner.
00:20:10
Speaker
start really because of gut health. Can you talk about that? We're seeing now this connection of grief, trauma affecting the gut, then the gut having all these other facts, including skin conditions. I have a friend that's a dermatologist and she totally goes more into, let's see your gut. Let's just go into your gut. That's where she goes, not like, let me put this topical thing. Tell us that connection between the gut and
00:20:40
Speaker
different types of diseases that may show up. Sure. So the easiest way to explain it is our gut has, our small intestine has a barrier and it kind of has these interlocking structures and it's supposed to be locked entirely. Nothing is, no food particles are supposed to be able to get through it.
00:21:01
Speaker
But with a lot of stress and a lot of the kind of high sugar, high refined carbohydrate foods that, you know, the standard American diet eat has in them can cause those like junctions to become what's called leaky. So if you've ever heard of leaky guts, that's when those junctions open up a little bit and food particles can get out.
00:21:26
Speaker
So some of those food particles, our body identifies as bad guys, we'll say. So we have this 75% of our immune system lives in our gut. So we have this like army of
00:21:41
Speaker
soldiers that are, you know, trying to get rid of all of those bad things, but sometimes those food particles can build up and cause infections. So when those particles get into the bloodstream, your body can have a physical reaction to them. So for instance, like Hashimoto's,
00:22:02
Speaker
the thyroid molecule actually looks, it's like 95% identical to gluten. So when gluten enters the bloodstream, you have leaky gut and gluten enters the bloodstream and someone with Hashimoto's, their body is trying to attack the gluten, but because it looks similar to thyroid, it also attacks thyroid. So when your body ends up attacking these things in the bloodstream, you can end up having different symptoms.
00:22:31
Speaker
You can have weight gain, you can have skin issues, breakouts, rashes that also, you know, the stool situation can change. You can have some people have like severe allergic reactions, throat closing up, not being able to breathe. And all of these things can be symptoms of something else. Some of them can just be food intolerances.
00:22:55
Speaker
Right? Like mine, I don't think I'm allergic to gluten or dairy. I think I have severe intolerances to them because when I eat them, like when I used to eat them, I would notice right away. So, you know, it doesn't always turn into an autoimmune disease is what I'm trying to say. But sometimes when it's left unchecked and you have these continual stressors,
00:23:20
Speaker
that never stop, your body is constantly in that inflamed mode. That's when it could potentially turn into something autoimmune. Stephanie, I want to ask you, when someone then comes to you, what would be the process, like the first consult? What would you want to know from that client? And how would you then dive deeper into the aspects of grief and then
00:23:47
Speaker
Yeah, like basically what would be the standard process of having you as their health slash grief coach, right? All of it. All of it. Health, grief, life, nutrition. So I've changed things up a little bit. And I think I mentioned this like right before we start recording, you know, before I was kind of doing like this whole nutritional intake and finding
00:24:16
Speaker
you know, going over the whole health history. And I still do that with my grief clients, because it's important for me to have the whole picture. And now it's like functional medicine, integrative medicine, like we want to know what has been like for you from the moment you can remember.
00:24:32
Speaker
So now, what did you eat growing up? What was your sleep like? If you're menstruating, what are your periods like? What are your stress levels like? What kind of toxins are you around? What are you putting on your skin? Could that be leading to different toxic buildup in your system? What's going on now? Why are you coming to me? What's this acute thing that made you say, I need help?
00:24:59
Speaker
And then I ask also about like, you know, grief, grief, you know, I, I don't, I don't get too much into asking someone about their traumas right away. Cause that's sort of, I noticed will come out, but, but in terms of grief, you know, I ask, have you had any grief, like losses in the last two years? So that I know like that, that might be an underlying thing.
00:25:23
Speaker
Now, because I sort of shifted my practice to having nutrition be more of a secondary thing, as more of a support, I still go through all of that stuff, but it's sort of more like, let's talk, what is the acute loss that brought you in? And let's talk about everything around that. Let's talk about what has come up for you within that. What else are you thinking about? And how can we support you?
00:25:50
Speaker
in your lifestyle as well. What would be some nutrient dense foods that would help you? If you need a supplement, what would be helpful for you? If you cannot cook at all, here are some really easy 30 second meals.
00:26:06
Speaker
You know to get food into your body or why don't you make smoothies because at least if you can't eat or chew you can drink something So really just setting my clients up For wherever they're at meeting them where they're at is the most important thing
00:26:22
Speaker
In that process, as you're going through, somebody could start, do they think that it's going to be a quick fix or do they know that, you know, now in society, a lot of these things are like, no, I want to get results now, or I need to get results in a month. With this approach, because it's deeper, it is a longer process, correct?
00:26:46
Speaker
Right. But then the benefits are that it's a lasting process because you've already dealt it from the root cause. You won't keep on doing the yo-yoing. What are some of the reasons that that happens? I think what I've seen with the yo-yo diets and the clients that I've had who have done them in the past, it's about weight loss.
00:27:13
Speaker
you know, and hopping a lot on the fads that we hear about in the media. You know, one minute it's the Mediterranean diet, one minute it's plant-based slash vegan, one minute it's paleo, you know, and I totally hopped on that paleo train for a little bit. I'm not going to lie, you know, I was curious. I've been curious about food my whole life and I wanted to see what that would do for me. And, you know, like I said, it helped me realize dairy and gluten don't work for me.
00:27:40
Speaker
But what I notice is that because someone wants such a quick fix, even in our keto, like let's take keto for instance, you're supposed to have 80 to 85% of your macronutrients as fat. So people see fat, they think bacon, cheese, foods that just are super high in fat, but maybe not like the highest in nutrient density.
00:28:08
Speaker
So for me, when I work with a client and ask them about that, we talk a lot about how nutrient density is the most important thing.
00:28:17
Speaker
And once you start eating and building your plate in a nutrient-dense way, that's when you'll start to feel shifts in your body. Maybe you'll lose a few pounds, but I don't focus on weight loss because I don't think that's the most important thing for people. I think it's more important to look at what's causing that want or desire. Is there emotional eating happening? Well, what's underneath that?
00:28:45
Speaker
what are the cravings coming from? Are you low in certain nutrients? And that's why you're craving like salt or sugar. So really like trying to look at those root causes, not shaming, not
00:28:59
Speaker
and not saying, I think this would be good for you. There are specific therapeutic diets that I will recommend though, because it could be helpful for someone. Ketogenic would be, if you suffer from seizures, that diet was actually created for people who have seizures. So it's a therapeutic diet for that.
00:29:18
Speaker
But, you know, in terms of like autoimmune, the autoimmune protocol, that is a therapeutic diet for someone who has severe autoimmune symptoms and is looking for a way to reduce them naturally. It's not a forever diet. It's only supposed to be 30 to 90 days. And then you start adding foods back in because we want that the gut wants variety.
00:29:42
Speaker
It is a process. There's a lot of questions that go into that process in order to really make these lifelong changes. And what you said regarding the yo-yo component of health being more for
00:29:59
Speaker
weight loss makes sense because that is when we're like, oh, we tried this. Oh, that doesn't work. Oh, no, we tried this. Now, I've yo-yoed in different styles myself in order to find solutions for things that have to do with my emotions and my health too. Like, okay, like you said, oh, you tried maybe the paleo and found out, oh, I am...
00:30:19
Speaker
not allergic. I know I'm sensitive to gluten and dairy because I did this elimination for over a certain amount of days, and I know that this was how I lived my optimal best. But it is sometimes so hard to maintain, personally, I'm going to say, even the things that I know don't suit me as well.
00:30:43
Speaker
because of social situations, right? When you have kids or you go out and things, and you don't want this kind of feeling, that restriction, and it causing more stress because you can't eat these things, which what we're trying to do is remove the stress.
00:31:03
Speaker
I know that this is not a consult right now. This is an interview. But is there any tip you can give to the listeners as to how do we manage the stress around food?
Managing Food-Related Stress
00:31:16
Speaker
Because again, we don't want to add more to our plate in terms of the stress.
00:31:24
Speaker
Yeah, so when I'm talking to clients about like, and they're on therapeutic diets, it is so overwhelming and stressful to be in those social situations. And I think, you know, allowing it to not be perfect, you know, like,
00:31:42
Speaker
If you're at a holiday party and you want to have a glass of champagne, have the glass of champagne. Because you know, like all of this work that you've done up to this point, let's say you've been doing AIP for six weeks. If you have a glass, one glass of champagne, it's not going to ruin everything.
00:32:01
Speaker
Because you've already made all of this progress in the past six weeks. So what do you do the next day? You wake up, you make a nutritious breakfast, and you start the next day as if you had started two days ago. The one thing that I would say is if you know a food is going to bother you, maybe that's your hell no.
00:32:27
Speaker
Hell no, I'm not going to eat gluten. I had dairy in New Zealand. It closed up my throat, but I tried it because I was in New Zealand and I wanted to try it. Right? You're like, it's grass-fed cows for sure because it's New Zealand. And you still had that type of reaction? Oi.
00:32:45
Speaker
Yeah. And I ate it again. I ate it a couple of times. Oh, okay. You sound like you. I knew that I was going to do it. You sound like me. One time I loved jackfruit and I was like, and I've eaten jackfruit before. And one time I was like, oh, I bought it and it was already peeled in the little container. And I'm eating and I'm driving, eating jackfruit. And I started feeling my throat close up and never had felt any time, any time in any allergy I've had my throat closing up.
00:33:15
Speaker
I drink water, dada, whatever. I come home, I put it in the fridge, and I tell my husband, I think you're going to have to eat the jackfruit because I noticed I had somewhat of another reaction to it. Then the next morning, I'm like, oh, maybe if I rinse it off, maybe it has to do with all the sap or the sap of it or something that maybe is the one that's caused.
00:33:41
Speaker
I rinse it maybe like I wanted to eat it so bad so I'm like you with the milk that I'm like I had that reaction and yet I'm like but I want to have my jackfruit. Yeah it's so hard and and the other thing that I say to my clients is like you know you don't have to be perfect if you know something you have agency in the situation if you know something is going to affect you and you still want to eat it anyway prepare for it.
00:34:09
Speaker
Know that you might be feeling off for the next couple of days after it. What do you need to do to set yourself up for feeling better? Not having shame around.
00:34:21
Speaker
or guilt or saying, you know, I really, what I really don't like is when people say I'm having a cheat day. I was just, you stole the, I was, just say like indulgence, even the indulging meal, like don't, even if it's dad, delicious meal, I don't know. Yeah, decadence. Decadence meal, something, but not cheat. It automatically shifts something in our brain. Cause then like you said, it makes you feel like you're doing something bad.
00:34:51
Speaker
And then all the set of emotions start all over again. Yeah. Yeah. And you're now, you're going to just be in that cycle, closing cycle of guilt and shame around food. If you put it, and even when you can put it into good and bad categories, because food is neither good nor bad. It just is right. Sugar's not bad. White flour is not bad. It just is for some people it causes mayhem in their bodies.
00:35:20
Speaker
Right? For others, it doesn't. You know, I think a balance of like, just when I start with my clients, you know, if they're not on a therapeutic diet, it's just about like adding foods in. You know, we're not going to eliminate anything just yet, but let's just add some things in. Add in, you know, maybe have like salmon twice a week. Cool. Maybe have some broccoli, you know, try to have one vegetable every day.
00:35:48
Speaker
whatever it is that is easy and just adding in more of those nutrients can be really helpful rather than taking them away. And then at that point, some people might say like, oh yeah, I do want to stop eating less of this stuff. It doesn't make me feel as good. Well, let's go back to the part of emotions, right? So the part of what comes first, the chicken or the egg, which may be in your
00:36:14
Speaker
therapy when you were doing nutrition first then gut you switched it now around to gut now nutrition but the reality is that a lot of the foods we eat do end up having a reaction as well in our mood as well when we eat things that are high
00:36:32
Speaker
in sugar, we probably will have more crashes and then this whole set of emotions can also start to unravel as well. So what are some of these patterns that you've noticed with, that was a word I wanted to use when I read it before. It was patterns. It was that word that was not coming to my brain. It just came a few minutes later.
00:36:57
Speaker
What are some of these patterns of foods that you notice in most of your clients that end up, and again, it could be different for everybody, but that end up making them feel worse than they did before they ate it? And to just preface that, like a lot of times they're being eaten because they're comforting.
00:37:18
Speaker
Yes, yes. Right. Or too much of something again. Again, we're back again to not the bad, this is not again for bad or bad, the bad or good. This is not regarding that, but it's the part of what it, okay, here's my, okay, no answer that. And then I'm like, my brain is just going everywhere because I love this topic of food. So yeah, what would be some of the answers you give to this question first?
00:37:49
Speaker
Well, I'll, I'll actually use myself as an example for this one, because I, even though I like, I do work with clients on this, I think people listening might want to hear it from a nutritionist and a grief coach. So, um, I have, I definitely have emotional eating stuff. And when I, like a lot of people, you know, the first kind of death that was in the family, my parents were like,
00:38:16
Speaker
Here's some cookies or here's some cake. Like I know a bad thing happened, but here like use this to, to make you feel better. And that became a thing for me. So when my dad died, like if I was going to eat anything and it actually, no, it wasn't then it was probably around 2013, 2014. My go to, uh, like emotional eating meal was mac and cheese from a box, Annie's.
00:38:45
Speaker
And then it was Haagen-Dazs chocolate peanut butter ice cream. And those two things I would get like maybe every couple of weeks and just gorge. And it would make me feel better for about an hour and then the pain would set in. And I think for me at that point, it was, I didn't want to feel the emotional pain. So I was eating to feel that physical pain. I was like having to go to the bathroom, having the,
00:39:15
Speaker
You know, not, not feel just like feeling my gut hurting. And I, I have gotten a lot, I have done it a lot less in recent years, but there are times when I am really, really sad that I'll still do it. I'll buy a box of cookies. Maybe now they're simple meals, almond flour cookies, but I also know that I don't like almonds affect me very much. So if I have six or seven of them, I'm going to be in a lot. So for me, it's about.
00:39:45
Speaker
not binging them, but really allowing myself to have it if I want it, but be more mindful about it. So, you know, having one pokey, taking a bite of it, savoring it, you know, thinking about like, is this making me feel good? And then at the end asking, do I want another one? Is this going to make me feel better? Is it because I'm sad? Because I'm angry? Because I'm anxious? Like, why am I eating this? I get more of it.
00:40:13
Speaker
you know what's gonna happen if you do. So I give my, I'm trying to get, I'm trying, keyword try to give myself more grace around that and to just kind of notice the feelings around her.
00:40:28
Speaker
When you're saying that, it reminds me of something I heard once about somebody that was also an emotional eater. And what she was saying is that every time that she was about to go ahead into the pantry, something that helped her was to stop and journal in that moment and write everything that was happening around her. Were the kids screaming? What was happening in her brain or in her surroundings?
00:40:58
Speaker
to then be able to think if the reason she was heading to the pantry was really because she wanted something in the pantry or because she was trying to hide or mask anything that was happening in that moment and then
00:41:14
Speaker
she would still make that conscious decision there. Do I still want that cookie or do I still want that after having read all this of why it is I'm going to it? And if she still wanted, she'd still just go get it, right? But it was at least she'd already put the emotions on paper so that then she wouldn't completely eat them in the pantry. So they had already been released in some way. So let's talk about that release of emotions.
00:41:41
Speaker
How is it processing all our emotions to talk? Like we said, there's the talk therapy. There's the one you did, the interim now. What is it? Internal family systems. What other ways can people start processing more of this grief? Seeing you, what ways do you bring it up? Yeah, so there's a few different ways that I like to go about it.
00:42:10
Speaker
Um, journaling is a big one, right? Because oftentimes we feel all of this alone and the easiest thing and the least costly thing is to get it out by writing it down or drawing it out or, you know, voice recording or whatever works for you. Some people aren't writers.
00:42:29
Speaker
So, but they're talkers, so I would say, you know, voice record. Some people are artists, so they draw or paint. But just getting out those emotions so that you're not holding on to them is really important, and you're not doing it alone.
Changing Perceptions of Grief
00:42:46
Speaker
Talking to someone, right? Like, we know that talking can be really helpful. But we also know that our emotions live deep inside of us, and our traumas live inside of us, and our body remembers that.
00:42:58
Speaker
So another way that I like to like help my clients with that is talking about like the different states of stress. So like fight, flight, freezer, phone and how, you know,
00:43:13
Speaker
oftentimes we're mostly frozen in that state of overwhelm and so how can we calm our bodies down so that we can move forward so that we can take action because when when we're in that freeze overwhelm state we can't take action we're stuck so we have to have our bodies feel safe again so really like painting that picture and knowing for you individually what makes you feel safe who are the people that make you feel safe what
00:43:43
Speaker
What about your day makes you feel safe? What are some moments of joy in your life that make you feel safe? What are vacations that you've gone or places that you've been to that make you feel safe? And so that way we can feel that safety, that groundedness, and then we can move forward and take action.
00:44:06
Speaker
Safety, I think it's what every human being seeks, right? These are all great tips and tools that you've shared and it's just so helpful to hear them. And I'm sure it's even more helpful to work with you because you can even go further with the person as to what it is that really is addressing their situation. So what is a way that people can work with you and what
00:44:34
Speaker
What offerings do you have? I know you have some offerings on your web page, things people can download as well. So tell us the different resources you provide and how people can get ahold of you.
00:44:47
Speaker
Yeah. So my website is gut of integrity.com and there's a whole freebies section so you can go and download a bunch of stuff. I work with people usually at different ways. I have packages, um, usually three month or six month packages. Those will be three months of working on strictly like brief emotional mental work and then going into the nutrition piece. Also we'll do kind of one-on-one
00:45:17
Speaker
week to week sessions I guess is the way to say it or every two weeks and really like diving deep into the brief work and that's that's the meat of it is really just understanding all of your losses and how they have shaped you to who you are now right.
00:45:36
Speaker
And so I'm also starting a grief group membership online. It's going to be awesome. It'll be a weekly grief group with, you know, videos and handouts and things for you to have support and be witnessed and be seen in your grief, because that's really all we want is a place to talk about
00:45:58
Speaker
Our grief in our society, you know, we don't have that place often. And so for me, you know, what I tell people is I want to be part of that change in the world where we are able to talk about grief. It's normal. And it's something that's not.
00:46:16
Speaker
people aren't scared to talk about, people don't try to laugh it off or make jokes when someone is sad, people actually know how to be in grief with someone, and they know what to say, and they know how to act, and they just know. They don't say, oh, let me know if you need anything, but they say, I'm going to bring you dinner on this day, and you're gonna be cared for on this day, or I'm gonna check in on you on this day.
00:46:45
Speaker
They don't forget to keep checking in after like one month and think that you're fine. And they don't say things like, oh, you know, you must be moving on now after seven days. Things that have all happened to me.
00:47:02
Speaker
So I really want to be part of that change and I want to be there for people because I've been there in all of you. I deeply know what it's like and I hope to be able to support people on even just a small part of their brief journey would be an honor for me.
00:47:21
Speaker
That is exactly why I even have this podcast was to start more of these conversations, make it less taboo to talk about grief and all the different things that come from it. And you mentioned we have something in common regarding the grief gratitude. Tell the story of what it says on your website when you saw the name of this podcast.
00:47:46
Speaker
Yeah, it was amazing. So I was looking on, I can't remember if it was Apple or Spotify, and I found Kendra's podcast because the name is Grief Gratitude and the gray in between.
00:47:59
Speaker
was like, oh my God, my whole thing is the space between gratitude and grief. I have to know her. And little did I know, you're amazing and I want to be friends with you. Well, there we go. If we think alike, of course, I am at it.
00:48:21
Speaker
Thank you so much, Stephanie. It has been an honor chatting with you at this moment and getting to learn more about this. And thanks for indulging me in all my questions. Like, wait, maybe I have to pay for me to record her right now because I'm asking too many personal questions.
00:48:40
Speaker
I didn't sign up for the membership yet. Thank you so much. Again, people can find you. I'll link the website below, but gutofintegrity.com is your website and your different social media links. Are they all linked on the website as well? Can they find you on there? They can find me on the website. My handles are at gutofintegrity for Instagram, TikTok,
00:49:09
Speaker
And you can just search God of Integrity on Facebook and you will find my business page. I have a Facebook group that has almost 700 members, all the space between gratitude and grief. So you can also join that. And this has been such a pleasure talking to you Kendra. Thank you so much for having me.
00:49:27
Speaker
I know these conversations are going to continue because we really want to make that change in the world. Yes. Thank you. And if you guys by chance got hungry as you were listening to this podcast, go check out her website because she has, Stephanie has a few recipes on there. I was getting hungry before I was like breakfast tacos, healing that got one salad at a time. These different articles eat the rainbow. So again, a lot of freebies on there and ideas and recipes that you can take as well.
00:49:57
Speaker
to start healing your own gut, but remember that it all starts with addressing the emotions as well that you are dealing with. And Stephanie Papadakis, did I say it right? You did. Is the person to go to if you want to really address the issues from the core. So thank you again, Stephanie, for being on. Thank you.
00:50:30
Speaker
Thank you again so much for choosing to listen today. I hope that you can take away a few nuggets from today's episode that can bring you comfort in your times of grief. If so, it would mean so much to me if you would rate and comment on this episode. And if you feel inspired in some way to share it with someone who may need to hear this, please do so.
00:50:59
Speaker
Also, if you or someone you know has a story of grief and gratitude that should be shared so that others can be inspired as well, please reach out to me. And thanks once again for tuning into Grief Gratitude and the Gray in Between podcast. Have a beautiful day.