Transcript
Speaker: so just before we get into this week's podcast uh our guest ah Vanessa um at some point she says oh can you can you cut this bit out and then after the podcast we talked about it and she said yeah no no it's okay add it in so um just when you get to that bit and you go oh didn't the guys cut it out no it's fine it's fine all right on with the podcast here we go in the room back in the room in the room in the room mr thompson i'm excited i'm excited to be in the room mr t we're all excited we are well let's just crack on because this is a guest episode we should you know uh we should hasten our way um so uh let's go to a place leave our audience hanging a little bit on who the guest is
Speaker: Well, it will be in the in the title of the podcast, so you'll give it away. all right, so let's go to a place where where the distractions, the landmarks, and detours are the main roads. Welcome to ADHDville.
Speaker: Oh, yes. You have a guest. I am very excited.
Speaker: Yes, I am. very excited. I'm very excited. ADHD. ah Hello, I'm Paul Thompson, apparently, and I was diagnosed absolutely with the combined ADHD and the D about a year and a half-ish ago.
Speaker: Blimey, that was choppy. um And I'm Martin West, and I was diagnosed with combined ADHD in 2013.
Speaker: So we're just two mates, Martin, just a reminder, who, by coin coincidence or not, in brackets, after 39 years of friendship, discover that we're co-hosting.
Speaker: ADHD is. Who would have known it? Shocker. Absolute shocker. Flash news. Now, it's really important to say that this is an entertainment podcast about adult ADHD and does not substitute for individualized advice from qualified health professionals.
Speaker: So don't take any advice from him or me or him. Or him. No, all I say the or him, but you say. Yeah, I was improvising.
Speaker: I was leading into my random, you know, ADHD-ness. so ah We're just here as a kind of all-inclusive ADHD part bench with room for everyone, including your doppelgangers, your alter egos, your buddy your shepherds, and even your best buddies.
Speaker: Still here. Congratulations. You've already earned yourself. a loyalty badge, ah grab your jetpacks, your pedalos, your space hoppers and any other transportation methods.
Speaker: And let us take you to ADHDville, an imaginary town we've created our minds, in our tiny little minds, ah where we like to explore different parts of the A, the D, the H and the D again.
Speaker: And we start off as we are now in the ah King's Attentive Head pub. But, Paul, let's jump into the tractor because I want to get myself to the coffee shop.
Speaker: So let me just bundle in. Let's bundle in. man.
Speaker: um
Speaker: All right. Let me just get a round of drinks in, I feel like. Oh, I can see Vanessa. Well, round of drinks, because here it's the evening, so I've got a little cheeky glass of rosé wine.
Speaker: All right. All right. Well, I've i've just seen a Vanessa. And so let's welcome our guest, Vanessa. Vanessa. Hi, guys.
Speaker: How you doing? I'm very well, you? We are splendid. We are splendid. Yeah. ah Paul was telling me earlier that he's leaning into being angry.
Speaker: so well So he's kind of, yeah. yeah You're kind of being like a little mini Hulk at the moment.
Speaker: I am bit. I am. I am. i mean like I got to the point where like, oh, Well, I was saying to Martin just before we came online, you know, people like if you've been with a psychologist for a while, maybe spend two, three years with them. And finally, a classic thing is like you admit that you're angry. Oh.
Speaker: But then what happens? What happens after that? Why not lean into the anger? I'm thinking. Just be angry. I'm so like playing with that idea. See where it takes me.
Speaker: Yeah. All right. and Okay. Very nice. All right. So, Vanessa, let's crack on with you. Let's on. Yeah. So, tell me. This about you, Vanessa. We're kind of always interesting. Well, always interesting. Fascinating, actually. Yeah.
Speaker: How much, okay, we're all part of the ADHD community, late diagnosed, but actually how different we are. So over to you, Vanessa.
Speaker: What's your story? and I'm going to try and be concise, which I'm sure we've all said the words long story short, but it never is. But the intention is there for me to be succinct. It won't happen, but I will try.
Speaker: So my problem my discovery of this diagnosis is quite different to a lot of my peers, or a lot of us lot, because and before I went to school, my my late mother and taught me to read and write. So when I started school at three and a half, four,
Speaker: I could already literally read a daily a daily newspaper properly. had a teenage, the reading age of a teenager. and And so when I first started schooling everybody else is learning the difference between curly cut and kicking cut, I reading like The Hobbit. I was five years old reading The Hobbit. Everybody thought I was a genius and all this kind of stuff.
Speaker: So anyway, again, I'm going to try and be concise. But so I got thrown into the class with aged 10 year olds when I was six because I just could not be in any way occupied with four and five and six year olds because for obvious reasons.
Speaker: So ah school or a genius, I was like gifted child. Everyone thought I was like top of the class and everything. But when I got home, I was a little shit. I was destructive, tantruming, poor emotional regulation, messy.
Speaker: and I was just a proper arsehole at home. But at school, I was like this golden child. So it never got picked up by the school system and everything. it would There were never any issue with behaviour at school because obviously I were occupied. that I was getting my dopamine from being top of the class everybody else thought was amazing. I got the dopamine through academics. Yeah.
Speaker: Anyway, first of all... Were you aware of when you went home? Were you aware of, oh, I don't know, just throwing it out there, like, you're aware of being like an arsehole and not being in control of not being an arsehole?
Speaker: and No, I just found... Or is that more about reflection? but When I look back, I've admitted were an arsehole. When I were a kid, I just didn't, I used to feel like, but I hadn't done anything wrong. I didn't see that anything of my behaviours were actually, I'm sure you can relate, intentionally bad behaviour. They just suddenly, my behaviour wasn't accepted by my parents, but I wasn't in control of behaviour. I was just like a loose cannon all the time.
Speaker: But when I were about eight or nine, I said to my mum, mum, something's wrong with me. And she said, what do you mean? And I said, well, my brain doesn't work the same as my friends. My mum were a nurse, but she would have been 75 this year. But but she was an old school nurse. That's really perceptive at that age.
Speaker: And she said to me, what do you mean something's wrong? And I said, think something's wrong with me. i don't i don't I'm not normal. And my mum said, don't talk bloody stupid. You're born idling. You make excuses.
Speaker: Go tidy your bedroom and this sort of a thing, right? And then i I used to say it like, a but because she was an old school nurse, she had no time for mental health or depression. She just thought, don't be so wet. Get on with it. Head up, chest out, best foot forward. Yorkshire woman way, right? Even though she were a nurse...
Speaker: but That's so British, isn't it? Like, you know, yeah nothing going on here. Carry on. yeah And I continued to say this sporadically through my early childhood. And then I remember, this is quite funny actually, but you probably won't believe it is true, obviously. I remember once, I was always, my handwriting was terrible, it still is now. We had a conversation about this in the family home today.
Speaker: And she used to sit and make me do my homework like 13, 16, 18 times because it was illegible. But as you can imagine, it just got worse and worse and worse. and Anyway, ah so she thought it were act of rebellion, but I can't bloody write because my brain's going too quick to form a neat letter. I'm sure you can really relate.
Speaker: Anyway, I am getting on to this. So I did homage to this. I kept on saying to my mum, like, something's wrong, something's wrong. And she said to me, I've heard enough now this. She said, you're a gifted child. The hours I spent teaching you to read when you were two years old. I could properly read fully at three and a half. She's like, what a slap in the face. Stop this now. if you keep on saying stuff like this, you're going to end up in a lunatic asylum now.
Speaker: Fast forward for a second, I did end up in a lunatic asylum a few times, but it wasn't because I thought that something was wrong, it's because something was bloody wrong. Right? Anyway, so back to being like a kid. And then and ah then she used to say, I used to, procrastination's my main thing, and i'm sure it is for a lot of us, but even at the age of this, eight, nine, ten, when I knew something was wrong,
Speaker: And I remember, this is totally honest, may God strike me, this is true story. I rang Childline, if you're, obviously know you're both English, you'll know what that is, but you don't even know if it's a I rang Childline and said, hey I've got to put a bit of a problem.
Speaker: And they're like, what's the problem? And I said, well, Every time I look at my school book, like to do my own work, I just can't open the the front cover. But once I do, I can do the work. It's easy. But I just can't open the page. And the person on the phone said, this is for children in danger. Speak to your mum and speak to your parents and put the phone down on me. Right. wow So i I wanted to change and help my myself and be better. But I just could. I cannot.
Speaker: My executive dysfunction is like on steroids. My executive dysfunction. But and you so then I kept on saying it and saying it. may Amazing the ah maturity of your of the insights you were having at that age. Incredible.
Speaker: Yeah. that so It's not common. You're the complete opposite of me. ah kind of, and listening to you, I envy you, right? I just thought I was as dumb as hell and gave in, you know?
Speaker: Because I learnt to read early as well. My mum, I wrote my first book when I an eight-year-old. Obviously, it's not published or anything. I'm on my ninth adult books that writing now. But, of course, none of them are – six them are finished. The other ones are all – but, anyway, I'm digressing. What surprise.
Speaker: So, back to the – But is it – sorry to interrupt you, but was there someone, if it wasn't your mum, was there someone – that was offering you an alternative, like an aunt or a neighbor would say, ah you you have something, Vanessa. It's enough no, all by yourself. I would just say an asshole. this is very, Right.
Speaker: anyway and my dad loves gadgets right and all this so my dad always have twelve like the best stereo so when people got the internet and laptops and desktops rather at home we had a laptop a desktop computer when i were sixteen so when i was sixteen i don't think google were a thing it were a search engine but um it won't the thing but anywhere right I very quickly ascertained what the fuck was wrong with me because um this I was searching it the internet.
Speaker: So for me, at the age of 16, I'm now 46. So I've known for 30 years that I'm effing ADHD, wall to wall ADHD, right? And no one would listen. So I went to mum at 16, like almost bawling, going, Mum, I know what's wrong me. she's like, I've told you before, I won't hear me this, now stop.
Speaker: So I said, I want to to the doctor and tell him this. Now, my mum was a practice nurse our doctor's surgery. So I couldn't even go to the doctor privately and say, please help me because she worked there. ah Anyway, I'm going to be quick about the next 30 years. And I am aware I'm taking over. You don't have to be quick. Take as long as you like, whatever it takes.
Speaker: So, then a but really long story, really trying to be concise but fairly, I read it. There were many things, many times from being 16 till 22 and 23 and 24 that I'm like, this is ADHD. Stop talking, bloody stupid. It's all a myth. It doesn't even exist. You're making excuses. You're bone idling. You're not organised.
Speaker: Find a place for everything and you can you'll be able to find it. I went, the floor's a place for everything because I can see it all. She's like, no, Vanessa, you're scruffy. What kind of husband are you going to get? Look at you, you're a scruff bag. And I were a tomboy as a kid.
Speaker: so But the thing is, this was really sad. I started crying last night when I was telling my boyfriend about it, who, by the way, is also ADHD. But like every single thing I ever did as a child, even though with this gifted, very, very clever girl, had to start, I ah ah quickly realised that if I said to my mum or my dad,
Speaker: an idea or a story or whatever, the fact that I'd said it it negated any value of it at all. So I used to say, like, tell little lies to mum and dad for validation. I could say, mum, my friend Louise made this story up to today at school and it were X, and Z, and they'd go, that's a brilliant idea. Why don't you ever think of those ideas? And it was my idea.
Speaker: So if it was, if these ideas were not mine, they were well received. But if anything, that it with the fact that they were my ideas, everyone just wrote it off. And it really pissed me off, you imagine.
Speaker: It sounds like you're provoking your own stimulation, like almost like provoking... you know, the the the provoking people as a kind of stimulation to get your dopamine, almost. wanted to know that my, I knew my idea or story, whatever it was, were good.
Speaker: But I knew if I said it were my idea, they would say it was shit. So I just would say it from somewhere else and they'd say, that's really interesting, that. And I'd be like, wow. i go That's amazing. So then going through my adult life, I was massively overweight. When I was 10 years old, I women's size 16, so I'm a size 12 now. So I was fat as fuck all my life.
Speaker: And, of course, I just got... You're just greedy. You don't know when to stop. Now I know. I craved good dopamine through carbs and chocolate and fizzy drinks, but i didn't know that then. I was just a fatty. Self-medicating. Yeah.
Speaker: And I used to... Anyway, so I'm trying to, like, jog along with this, but... ah literally When I got... When I were getting married and stuff, and mar I was saying to my mum, mum, I'm definitely going to go to doctors.
Speaker: They'll laugh you out of there. You're a high achiever. You're very successful in business. Because I'm actually a professional photographer by trade. And my degree is in photography and journalism. So she'd be like, they'll just laugh you out of there. And I'm like, mum, people with ADHD... This is before we had a community. here are It were really out in the open. This would have been like... fifty twenty This would have been 25 years ago now.
Speaker: ah my mom will like And She just wouldn't, it was just completely poo-pooed. Anyway, and she kind of said to me, stop. But your mum's a nurse, right?
Speaker: She was nurse. She's passed away now. She boughts shes she was a nursing sister, very high up. But she were old school and she were a general adult nurse. didn't have time for any of this mental health stuff. You know, but anyway.
Speaker: and that generation, isn't it? So I was 16 when I knew, and I'm 46 now, and I got diagnosed last July. For the last 11 years, I've been waiting for the bloody diagnosis for all that time, and I've known since I'm bloody 16. I feel a bit emotional saying this because you'll both probably relate to this, but...
Speaker: So all them years, and in them three decades of my main main years of my life, I have had fucking hell to live with. Like, my kids had to go live with their dad. Suicidal ideation, drink, drugs, massive weight problem, abusive relationships.
Speaker: ah Just absolute chaos. Like, Courtney Love from Yorkshire. and And my husband cheated on. I've loved about everything that could go wrong did go wrong. And unfortunately, when my mum passed away, like, which is the other 12 years ago now, I went to my GP and I said to the doctor, like, listen, I know you've been my doctor since I was three.
Speaker: And my mum wouldn't let me come ever to you. And I've wanted to come for, like, for all these years. But I've got, like... something like ah i've said i think i've got every single symptom of adhd that i've seen except two when i just won't admit them and he said well what are the two that you don't have and i said wet in the bed in low self-esteem but i would still fight and i said oh but if i'm pissed i do wet the bed anyway so basically if you open the dsm on the adhd page it should have a picture of me going hi me again on some roller skates going around in a circle
Speaker: So yeah anyway, so then, ah so all this time, all this time ago, 12, 11 years ago, ah got sent for a referral and I only got assessed and diagnosed last July.
Speaker: Wow. However, another reason, another reason that my story different to everybody else's is because I research everything and I absorb information. i knew I needed medication, and And basically, I have been sourcing methylphenidate and done the titration myself three and a half years ago. And when I did that, my entire life changed. No more drugs. I'm cleaning drugs. I've been cleaning drugs for four years.
Speaker: I'm a year sober of alcohol next next Tuesday. But only in me actually being medicated, sourcing it myself, titrating myself... and That's when life's changing. I've had to do the diagnosis myself and the fucking medication myself and even sourcing the medication, touches all of it myself. Wow. And then after I've done all this, I'm on a i'm on a a Zoom's call with psychiatrist, doctor whoever, who halfway through the thing says, I've just quickly sent you a form to fill in.
Speaker: And I went, no, I'm sorry. I've waited 11 years for this assessment. I need to be diagnosed. And I'm like, I diagnosed you within two minutes of speaking to you. You're raging ADHD. So out crying and he said, like, what's... And I said, three decades of my life ruined, fucked. My kids have probably disordered because of my ah things how I've dealt with things, my coping strategies.
Speaker: And it's taken you less than two minutes to diagnose me. And it's like, but I don't know if it I'm really lucky because for me, I'm like, fight till the last gasp, where there's a will, there's a way.
Speaker: But not everyone's got that, like, drive. And like how many people are sort of dead by this age because they just can't cope life? have Not many people source methylphenidate themselves and titrate properly and effectively without abusing it and actually end up with six-figure business. The kids adore them and everything in my life's perfect.
Speaker: But I'm lucky, but I keep on thinking, like, how many kids have lost their parents of Tibbisaro, how many mothers and fathers have lost their kids, and it's just because they never got the right medical attention or whatever.
Speaker: yeah And it's like, people, it's not just, look, here's a squirrel or a medsorbitant spending. It's such a serious condition, but everyone just thinks it's a bit of a lark, don't they? It's not. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, there's like... I kind of... yeah that's um it's it yeah it's It's that thing of, like, what is ADHD? Oh, it's like...
Speaker: losing your car keys and oh look squirrel right that that's that's kind of like sums up the whereas actually yeah it's to your point it is you know it goes way deeper than that it's way bigger than that and and it's a lot darker than than that and it's and it's not only your life that that ends up being quite screwed up but you know but it's the the people around you you know if you're undying snozed Also, our ah um parents, I'm just thinking out loud here, you know, our parents are like only one generation away from, you know, the post-World War II generation, you know.
Speaker: And yeah I don't know, my father, he is still still around. By the way, I'm going to tell him I've got ah appointment with him tomorrow to tell him I've got ADHD.
Speaker: An appointment with your dad. Set your watch. I have. That's how we are. yeah That's just how we are. And you're to tell your dad that yes that you have ADHD after all these years? Yes.
Speaker: I'll probably leave out the detail that is 70% chance that I got it from him. I'm going to leave out that detail. But I mean, that's the point. that That generation have a profound fear of anything they don't understand.
Speaker: Well, it's all sort like, ah you've you've you've you've you've just got to kind of stiff up a lip and ration books and you know and yeah that's and that was their attitude.
Speaker: I was bombed in the Blitz, et cetera. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Um, and, um, and and it's like, I kind of envy the people now that are diagnosed as 20 year olds and 30 year olds.
Speaker: Um, and having, uh, even ah with all the problems that are surrounding getting diagnosed and stuff, but at least there's a conversation out there about it at the very least, you know?
Speaker: yeah it's a so It's a starting point, you know, whereas for us, it's like nothingness, you know, yeah actually but a huge level of shame to actually even contemplate it.
Speaker: I think my father's going react badly to it tomorrow, but we'll see. Yeah, he'll he'll he'll be like, what are you talking about, boy? Yes. yeah i be the but but but shut up And then, so after all that bloody tempestuous three decades of absolute utter chaos and upset and devastation, the fucking diagnosis I craved all my life, it means as much as my marriage, and absolutely nothing, because it's just literally someone going, yeah, you were right all along.
Speaker: So it doesn't mean anything. I've titrated myself. We're still waiting for titration from and NHS. I've i' still sourced medication in my own sweet way. And it's not, I don't take amphetamine. I take actual medical prescribed methylphenidate.
Speaker: It's just not prescribed for me. But let's not a to advocate illegal, illegal gain of I never saw nothing, officer. I never saw nothing, yeah. In fact, I'm meeting my apothecary on friday on Saturday night for a meal, at me and the boyfriend and her boyfriend, and she's, you know, she's my apothecary, I like to call her.
Speaker: Nice. such a Such a nice word. I do like that word. and What word? Sorry. Apothecary. Drug dealer. Apothecary. Ah, okay.
Speaker: Okay. Pusher. Well, I don't know whether that is. Is that the Italian? in china yeah um It's Spacciatore.
Speaker: All right. So but I don't know if if you know, but Paul lives in Italy and I live in in New York and For some reason, I thought you were in Canada. don't know where I've got this from. I've been to New York. I might be soon. Whereabouts in New York are you? You can't give your location, obviously, but... I'm about an hour's drive from Manhattan north.
Speaker: i was there when i ah when ah I was there the year before at Twin Towers for about three months in total, and and but anyway. Nice. Nice. so like So you're saying that ah you have all this kind of drive to kind of get you know to kind of like find answers and and and to actually get yourself in a better place. Because I know that you go down the gym once in a while.
Speaker: It's very occasionally these I don't know if you saw it on TikTok But I've recently had a load of plastic surgery Caught sepsis and nearly lost my leg So I've lost a lot of weight from that Here's my scars from my bingo wingectomies There we go for everyone on ah on YouTube Yes, so um so Wow yeah I love you i love ah love that Sorry to interrupt you, Martin I love that you did that I'm going to do something It's like, you know, it's like I've got scars.
Speaker: you know yeah Can I just add a little caveat into this conversation? ma I'll be really quick. I won't, but I'll just say I will to ease you in. But when was 28 years old, I was 28 and a half stone. And i had a gastric bypass and I lost 15 stone.
Speaker: And then my husband ran off with a fat girl. but She would love to. Anyway, then I got fat again to try and get my husband back. ah Then I got fat again to try and get my husband back. It didn't work. Anyway, then I got thin again, fat again, thin again, fat again. And then recently, I've lost loads of weight. I've had my bingo wings cut off and my thigh bollocks cut off, which is the fatty bit at the top of your thighs.
Speaker: So I'm... Side bollocks? So had all this done, came home from Turkey, went to the hospital. i nearly lost my leg in November for all this messing about. i I remember the whole hospital drama.
Speaker: I'm not showing you my thigh scars, lads. Sorry. We did an episode once on ADHD tax and you take the ADHD tax a whole different level.
Speaker: I'm always messing around like tattoos, dye my hair, damn it's surgery, all fillers. I'm always fucking about with my appearance, but it's not low self-esteem or poor image. It's just a novelty factor of something new. Mm-hmm.
Speaker: Right, right, right. I did warn you that had a million miles an hour, didn't No, I love it. So, so like When you – I'm just im umm just i' just kind of like processing the statement of my husband went out with a fat girl and she was lovely.
Speaker: um It's funny. um Like so the link between like eating and – you know, and ADHD, you know, that kind of debt that kind of that that that the dopamine thing. So know I mean, I know someone close to me who is also on that kind of similar journey ADHD and she's on GLP ones.
Speaker: So am I am on them now. Oh, right. How are you finding the GLP ones? I mean, um ah i mean that so for this person, I mean, that the whole kind of food noise thing kind of shuts down. yeah And for her, it's it like um she she doesn't get the the the dopamine kind of hit from from food. It's just not something that she wants anymore.
Speaker: Wow. i just forget to read now it's not as i'm not ever ah do it's just a thing like but for me i stopped drinking a year ago next week so twelve months sober i don't take drugs but buy feeling these hundred miless away and now don't get du me from food so i'm like dopamine list ah the wall wow
Speaker: Actually, I get my dopamine from work because I feel like I'm be achieving things every single day in business. So thankfully, that's my reward system is another client, another client. They've given me a compliment, praise, praise, praise.
Speaker: Never had it in my life because I've always been useless. So my clients love what I do. ah make them a lot of money and i take a lot of time off their hands. So found like my place and my purpose. It's to help other people. who and also, and the irony is my mum wanted me to be a nurse.
Speaker: But in 1996, when I were 18, wanted to take exercise to listen to Oasis going to nursing, doing nursing at uni was not rock and roll enough for me, which would then led me to the photography and journalism, obviously. like So in the end of it, I'm working for nurses.
Speaker: and But yeah, so finally, like everything I do, would is just it turns to gold in this industry. So all the years of having a load of shit about me and this is not this is all right, but you could have done better. Don't apply yourself enough. It's all negated now because I'm like...
Speaker: I don't want to say I'm living my best life because young ones say that, but you know what i mean? Yeah, and no, no. And it isn't for nothing that, I mean, like, you know, I've worked in the, and Paul has as well. You know, we've we've worked in the creative advertising, marketing world for our entire lives and it's full of people with ADHD.
Speaker: Like full of them, full of them, you know, um yeah because that just seems to be like a kind of a career that just so suits so ah our brains. Well, I was listening to ah another ADHD podcast last night, actually, and someone said something really interesting.
Speaker: He said he developed a career that in hindsight was clearly himself medicating. So what I'm saying Martin and I, and probably you as well, Vanessa, we somehow instinctively came upon or found that a job that helped us self-medicate our ADHD. Right.
Speaker: Yeah. You know. yeah Yeah. It plugged some holes and, you know, made the cogs go around. and it's And it's funny because social media is quite good for those for those ah for those do dopamine hits because because it's a lot of small content that you make quite quickly and put out there, and you can see the likes and the shares and the stuff coming back. So it it is a very – um it's very adhd friendly kind of uh area to be in you know like so you um do you like uh vanessa do you um uh doom scroll i am doom scroll on but on legs yeah yeah let's go now
Speaker: And you know, some I've had problems sleeping my entire life. I'm sure you can all relate. But and if I don't... These glasses that um ah sometimes I sometimes have on TikTok, they're only like blue light glasses, so I'm not overstimulated. But yeah if I...
Speaker: come off my phone at like nine and I put my phone on the landing to charge and I get into bed sleep all night. if Only if I'm medicated. sleep all night long. If my phone's around, I'm too nosy. I want to know what's going on in the world. I don't have the time for sleeping. My brain doesn't want to sleep.
Speaker: And I think I don't, I don't think I've had a proper night's sleep since 1984, to be really honest with you. I think chipped yeah the luck the last time I had a good kip, think Duran Duran were doing that in the hair day.
Speaker: right Oh, no. Just hungry like like like the wolf on the on your on your on your phone. last Last night went to bed at the start. That's the first Duran Duran reference we've had in 74 episodes of our ADHD podcast.
Speaker: And and um or I'm struggling with that. Duran Duran. Oh. I don't even like Duran Duran. don't know where that came from. It must be the ADHD point. How do you kick her off this podcast? Where's the... No, it's Martin that mentioned Duran Duran. I love Duran Duran.
Speaker: No. No, come on. ah Vanessa ah brought up Duran Duran. I love Duran Duran. i do i love pe but ah look i love cow dialing I love how how three ADHDers get together and a conversation goes.
Speaker: It doesn't go off in tangents. It goes off like fireworks and and ah totally unpredictable. It's one of my favourite dopamine hits. Being amongst ADHD is conversation ah just wildly, you know.
Speaker: Well, I'm going to kind of go going to say, okay, so when I got into music, I liked, was like the late 70s, early 80s. I liked all the music. do all the Depeche Mode and Duran Duran and all of that kind of music.
Speaker: and then But my mates were into the 70s rock, the kind of the Led Zeppelin, the Metallicas. Right. So and then so then i absorbed that through them. So, so through them, I kind of got much more into, into the kind of older, I can't say classic rock, but I mean, I guess it is called classic rock. Um, but you know, but I've got, I love all that now.
Speaker: I've got a Duran story. I was working for an agency in London and they were commissioned to organize and communicate, do the marketing for party for the new Sky Digital channel, right?
Speaker: And a party was a, um, uh, uh, battery power station, right. When it was still, you know, i you know, bricks and rubble and stuff like that.
Speaker: And sky, they commissioned the agency to create a party in the middle of that. Right. And so we're eating this, the, the, the, the staff, there was a buffet and there's,
Speaker: booze and drugs and blah, blah, blah. And at certain point, they turned off all the lights and they said, now you need to walk to the other and ah corner of the battery power station. Okay.
Speaker: And they built a wooden like structure so you could get through the over the mud and the puddles and stuff. And they we walked over there. The lights came on.
Speaker: Duran Duran for a private party. Only like the wolf. Yeah, and they were shit. Oh, come on. Yes, they were clearly paid too much. hate your story.
Speaker: They were paid loads of money. They didn't give a damn. They just, like, went through the motions. Anyway, Duran Duran story. Duh. Have you got a Duran Duran story with, you know, Vanessa? No.
Speaker: have a Do you have a Led Zeppelin story? Come on. I do. I do have a Led Zeppelin story. That's what I'm talking about. That's what I'm talking about. Well, I've got story about everything, as you've probably gathered. No, I thought you might.
Speaker: When I was little, my dad, I like how was born in 78, right? So when I was like, my dad would listen to like rock music, Bowie, Ultravox, all this sort stuff. But then there's always been an undertone of 70s rock and stuff. And then, so if I actually liked Led Zeppelin when I was three and four years old.
Speaker: Do you know, have it's been lifelong. And Bruce Springsteen's my absolute thing, but I'll tell you that another time. Anyway, Led Zeppelin, when I was bigger, because I've obviously just recently lost a shit, I've lost six stone in a year this time, right? Isn't that right?
Speaker: So I wanted to have tattoos, but I know that I don't want to look like a big butch lesbian with tattoos and big fat arms. So I thought, well, I'll wait till I get bingo wings cut off and then I'll have tattoos. So anyway, I had Bonzo, John Bonham, for the ones watching this who are uneducated in the musical genius.
Speaker: So I had the John Bonham, the picture, he's drumming, but the tattoo is that good that he's even got the motion of the stick right now. got it on my back and I thought... Well, even see I've got the best tattoo I've ever seen in my life and I can't see the damn thing.
Speaker: So then I thought, well, I need to get some other lot some other lot involved now. So then I got this bloody erotic plant one. Then I had Mothership tattooed over the top of it, because obviously, which is just a compilation album of theirs, but...
Speaker: um The reason I got the word mothership is I am the mothership of this family and I didn't want my kids' names on me because, you know, adult I don't like that kind of a thing, especially if they're called like Chardonnay and Mercedes. I didn't want to go down that road. So my kids are called that Isaac and Isabel. They're not called Chardonnay and Mercedes, but you know what i mean?
Speaker: Mm-hmm. So I got mothership to a assert my authority on the children as well. Right, but anyway. and Then I got bloody Percy here. And then I thought, well, what about the rest of them? this is just like, it's all... I've only had these tattoos done in September and October. They're new. Okay. But... And then the boyfriend that I'm going out with now, I met him on TikTok and he's ADHD to the high heavens as well.
Speaker: But... I don't really want this to go. This bit can't go on air, so cut this bit out, right? All right. I actually fell in love with him over Led Zeppelin 1. ah but I'll show you but now. we can we Can this bit just be between us?
Speaker: Yes. If I fall out with him, then it's there for everybody. I'll be like, oh, wish I'd ever said that now. Right, so... Because I had this done on my arm, which is absolutely... That's the Hindenburg disaster off the ledger playing front cover, right? Yeah, yeah.
Speaker: So went to his house and he gave me the album in 12-inch vinyl, right? And instead I found on the front room wall. Right. Anyway, then we went to Ikea about six weeks. I went out with him last summer, and then ah we fell out because was doing this stoic thing of, like, I come first, everyone can fuck off. It's my rules or no rules, and I wouldn't be nice, and I wasn't very... I'm a bit of a bitch.
Speaker: Anyway, we got back together this time, and then basically he was erecting that picture, wrong word. He was placing that album cover on my wall, and as he was doing it, thought...
Speaker: I think love this bloke. And so anyway, a couple of weeks later, because I never say soppy shit because I've done all that crap and being like vulnerable, needy, separation anxiety. I'm over all that period of life, right?
Speaker: So I don't say I love you, baby, or any of this crap. It's not for me, right? yeah So anyway, he we're on about lovey-dovey shit, which I don't like to admit. And he said, when did you realise you were in love with I said, well, don't want to say because it sounds like rehearsed. He goes, go on. And went, it's when you put all the death plea album up on me front room. all i I saw you put it on and it was like,
Speaker: Hallelujah moment. yeah You actually fell in love with me over a Led Zeppelin moment. Yeah. Wow. chris Play cash beer and turn it up. Okay. So that's my Led Zeppelin story.
Speaker: Nice. Okay. Nice. nice Don't talk about romantic shit though. don't like it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. know what you mean. no, no. Yeah. Oh, boy. Wow. Something like alcohol back in the day, back in the day. I mean, you were talking about drink before.
Speaker: Booze. Did we talk about drinks in the last episode, Paul? I seem to think with that we that we did. think we did. Yeah, which we but where you're kind of like you kind of go through this period of your life where you're kind of like, oh, I can now drink alcohol, and then you kind of go, oh, hang on a second.
Speaker: um ah i'm a I used to feel awkward at parties and going out, but now um but now I'm just like in the flow and I can talk to people and and and and have a good time.
Speaker: Yeah. And then you end and then you kind of then you end up having to rely on it to kind of like you know have a social life i think i think probably then you find other stimulants don't you and uh like if you find your stimulant right the thing that works for you all kinds of you know yeah yeah ah well i so i stopped drinking last march and this is no word of a lie when i got to about 16 weeks in
Speaker: um were I was thinking, when were last sober for this long? And I worked it out and I've basically been pissed since 1995. Right? hey Wow. So now, at the age of 46, I've actually had to get to know Sober Vanessa because she's never been here before. It's like she's just been born. Sober Vanessa this isn't a thing. I've had to get to know Sober Vanessa. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah. But the good thing is that when I did get diagnosed and I said to him, I used to take amphetamine because I know what is in it is and it makes me normal. But I said, but I know it comes at a cost to mental health, so don't touch that.
Speaker: And I said, I've done every drug and other stuff. And I said, I stopped drinking in March because I'm willing to try anything to just be normal and functional. as I said, and I've included alcohol in the contraband things to try and be the best that I can.
Speaker: And I thought to myself, and the apartment was 7.45 in the morning on Zoom. But I was raging pissing before this. I used to drink three, four bottles of red wine a night on my own in the house. And that's why I've lost so much weight before the GLP. if I was drinking bloody 3,000 calories of bloody Malbec every night before I even had any food.
Speaker: Wow. Anyway... So if I'd not have stopped drinking, I probably would just sacked off the diagnosis or been presented in a very different way. But because I were able to say, like, I've overcome a drug issue and the don't drink it, obviously it doesn't need me to say that to get the diagnosis. But drinking, stopping drinking is the best thing I've ever done it's it in my life, stopping drinking.
Speaker: I did that in lighter in a but much lighter way. In fact, hear myself go into this ah story and I kind of regret it. But I'm going to say it anyway because it is so pathetic compared to your story.
Speaker: I stopped drinking coffee when I started taking the ADHD meds. Just so I would know, like, when I – when the effects of the ADHD meds um ah came on, I wanted to be sure that it wasn't affected by anything else.
Speaker: Yeah. Right? and wasn It wasn't that I was, um you know, I was... you know, that ah caffeine was, you know, having a bad effect. on Okay.
Speaker: What I feel, I want to know more or less a hundred, as much as I could, that that's what the ADHD meds were doing or weren't doing. Is that what you, you, what you're kind of getting at giving up alcohol and stuff?
Speaker: No, so yeah I've got like a catalogue ah but a back catalogue of errors and mistakes and catastrophe and calamity. ah Trailer destruction since 1978 has followed me and it's my most of it's my own poor choices and poor emotional regulation.
Speaker: But also when I look back and pinpoint all the severe chaos, drink's always been involved, right? Right. So... and this On this week last year, which obviously I said I'm sober a year on next Tuesday, I went to Spain in in January. I just got up one day, I went to Spain, and I got steaming for a week.
Speaker: Right? And then I came home, and then I had a massive argument with my daughter. She's 18, and she said, I'm going to my dad's for a week. And I woke up at midnight. This is ADHD and not in its finest, but a typical example of a chaotic brain in ADHD.
Speaker: ah I had the RSD from my daughter because she says she's going to live at her dad's for a week. So I woke... I was drunk because it were a Monday, so it would have been a week yesterday, a year ago yesterday.
Speaker: I got drunk because I went to my ah business partner's house Monday where I had a drunken business meeting day, but we got a load of work done on Mondays, right? Anyway... Long story short, my daughter had to go up me and said, i'm off to my dad's.
Speaker: So I got RSD to the max and just went and went to sleep. When I woke up, I drank a bottle of wine and went to Manchester airport at midnight, booked a flight to Spain on the way there. And then four hours later, I were in Spain.
Speaker: And when I were there, I were on TikTok making a whole show of myself live, threatening people, swearing, just being a horrible, uncouth creature, right? And then ah when I came home, and obviously my daughter had made friends I came home, I thought to myself, like, you are a mother of two teenagers and your daughter's looking at you to see, like, what women should be like and your son's looking at you to see what kind of women you should go for and you're behaving like somehow the young ones. You know, you're not exactly the right good, you know, I would behaving like Courtney Love.
Speaker: So I just thought, like, I've got to stop this stupid knobhead behaviour. So I said to Bella, my daughter, I'm sorry being a knobhead and I'm stopping drinking. she went, yeah, right. And I haven't touched a drop since.
Speaker: and right But in that year of me not drinking... Right. and Everything in my life is as normal as it could be. it's i Obviously, we know I'm ADHD, but I feel alcohol has exacerbated the symptoms all these years when I thought I need a drink to calm down on a night to shut all the noise.
Speaker: When I've stopped drinking, all the symptoms of ADHD have reduced, not fully, obviously. so they So alcohol and my ADHD don't go well at all. So my caffeine anecdote at this point is outs sounding more and more fucking pointless. Yeah.
Speaker: Pointless. ah Yeah. ah so vaguely Amazing. Yeah. But in the end, what I'm hearing is in the end, you're really determined that when you when when you want to be.
Speaker: I will be, but I will say one thing, and I want every other ADHD to think about this, because we all don't think about this, right? So when you're growing up, if you whether you know you're ADHD or you're not, whenever you give a reason, an excuse, but whenever you give a reason for why you've either not met a deadline or why you've not done something that's been expected of you, and then you say...
Speaker: If you ever mention ADHD in an excuse and capacity, you're shot down in flames. it's your own fault. you don't You just make excuses. But then when we do something good and we think outside the box and everything's... Then then we're expected to say, because I've got ADHD. No, if you've got to take accountability for the shit stuff, it's not ADHD. Yeah. credit that we do amazing things it's because our our brains and we're in control of it that we achieve excellence but we expect to then say it's because i'm adhd no fuck you adhd i'm taking the credit for this like i've had to take the blame for all my shitty behavior i'm taking the credit for my business being like one of a kind and it really well known in the industry did it it's there's maybe a tinge of adhd in it but i'm taking the credit for that because i've had to be able to count the bill for my bad behavior
Speaker: And we all should remember that, that if you're going to take blame for what you've done wrong, then you have to also take on all ownership of the good stuff we do. Absolutely. Yeah. Well said. Yeah, yeah. Well said.
Speaker: That's good, yeah. And also, when people say you're making excuses, no, you're not. You're giving a reason. You're giving a reason you've got a tantrum. It's not because it's because you've got ADHD and you've got poor emotional regulation. It's not an excuse. It's a fucking scientific reason as to why you can't control your behaviour. It's not an excuse.
Speaker: Yeah. Absolutely. Totally. All right. Well, I'm just doing a time check and I'm thinking... Yeah. um we We are. That is a that's a powerful ending.
Speaker: um Yes, this is good. so um So um now I'm kind of thinking we we ask ah every guest that that comes on um ah one one one question. so in of which we were the mayors and now we're the ex-mayors.
Speaker: It's a long story. um But we invite everyone who comes on to kind of like, you know, to kind of plant a flag, to kind of open up a business or a place in ADHDville. An activity even.
Speaker: Yeah, so we've had ah guests have have opened up um ah secondhand bookstores. We've had... Vinyl Shop. Yep. ADHD-themed theme park.
Speaker: Yep. Yeah. ah ah Tequila and tequila... Tapas Bar. Tapas Bar. From your mate. Yeah, so we're ah where... What do you want to open up, this Vanessa? What's your...
Speaker: i I want an ADHDville musical instrument shop. Oh, nice. Guitars. nice Think of all the dopamine in that shop that can be created. Yeah. love going into it and just a guitar shop. And just a quick fun fact, when i because I was like a gifted child and I did all this bloody reading, I got thrown to peripatetic music class lessons for everybody to try for them to try and occupy me.
Speaker: And i've got I can play every single instrument in the brass and woodwind section of an orchestra and I've got exams on a lot of them. But I can't quite grasp strings. I'm a bit of an arsehole on strings, but... Throw a clarinet. I'm a grade 6 saxophonist. and I did all this when i went even before I was 13. What about the oboe? The oboe. I play the oboe and the bassoon and the euphonium and the tuba, if you want me to tell you the truth. Nice.
Speaker: I'd pay to see you with a kazoo. but that And then the so my son's recently got into bit playing bass and I've been playing his bass. I've been telling him put that down. I'm sick of hearing it. And then when he goes out of the room, I start...
Speaker: ah saw In your music shop, can we have is music instrument shot can we have quite a large department just for percussion? Yes. Percussion? You want drums? You want a whole drum room? want bongos. Bongos? Yeah.
Speaker: you bongos yeah to All right. I do like. I used to go to the hundred club in, in London of a Friday night.
Speaker: And I saw this guy who was doing like a led as group did a kind of a Latin jazz vibe thing. And this guy, a bald kind of South American guy was playing the bongos. I've always wanted to be him.
Speaker: Oh, right. i was i was mean that I was in the 100 Club um maybe 20, 25 years ago, and it i was there with my work people, and we were being loud and obnoxious.
Speaker: And then a guy came over and said – Was it me? No. It was a guy from the establishment who said, Arnold Schwarzenegger. um no all no Schwarzenegger, who was on the next table over to us, is not happy and wants us to shut up.
Speaker: Oh, really? Oh, okay. If he's asking for us to shut up, then we'll just shut up. Okay. i telling a story I've got a similar story.
Speaker: Just down the road from there is Ronnie Scott's jazz club. i That's what I meant. Sorry. Oh, was it? I meant i meant Ronnie Scott's. Okay. I went in there and and Elvis Costello's Mrs. Diana Krell was playing.
Speaker: I arrived and I was very, very drunk. Very, very drunk. And ive got asked to be quiet three times. Yeah. and i was ah I was a total nightmare. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, the ah the yeah um I've only been in Brody Scott's twice, and the and the second time, the band on the stage stopped and asked that table over there to shut up. No. And that was us again. Were you on that table? Oh, God. Yes, I was on the table.
Speaker: The shame. I'm sorry. by like I'm surprised um yeah I won't ever be allowed in there again. The irony for me is like about 10, 12 years later, i was mistaken twice in same week for being Elvis Costello.
Speaker: People came up to me twice in the same week and asked if I was Elvis Costello. oh I kid you not. Yeah. have you have ah why yeah have you have you Have you ever been mistaken for someone?
Speaker: I mean, I know that my mom my dad was mistaken for being Richard Attenborough, the um the the the actor, you know, the kind of um the ah old school actor.
Speaker: I haven't ever been mistaken for anybody, but when I was younger, people used to say that looked like Cameron Diaz on steroids and when I was younger. I can see that. I'll take that. but to i say so I used to say, where's my shirt? as My hair's gone curly. I look like Pat Butcher.
Speaker: But everyone used to say look like a chubby Cameron Diaz when I was younger, yeah. 20 years ago. What are you doing to me, Pat? At Glastonbury once, ah two girls came up to me and asked me for my autograph.
Speaker: Convinced that I was junior Julian Lennon. Julian Lennon? Elvis Costello? said, no, I'm not Julian Lennon. Oh, come on, come on. We know you're Julian Lennon. No, really, I'm not Julian. Oh, come on, come on. In the end, I had to sign sign something.
Speaker: ah breast. I had to sign one of their breasts or something like that. You're coughing. Yeah, I know.
Speaker: if you If you had, I would have heard about it a lot a lot earlier than now, Paul. Really? Good. If you had. um All right.
Speaker: All right. and All right. All right. Well, I think that just – should we just kind of slide into an out outro? is it and so But before we go, is there anything else, Vanessa? don I just want to check that there's nothing else that you wanted to kind of like – say or a point that we didn't kind of get to that you would like There is one thing I'd like to say. is like So every time that I presented to a GP or a psychiatric person, a psychiatrist, through these 30 years of chaos, every time presented to a doctor, this is the one thing that i want me makes me want to be violent to the whole world.
Speaker: They would always write... Patient believes she is ADHD. They gave me a misdiagnosis of bipolar, BP, all sorts. And every time I saw, patient believes it. Anyway, so now that now obviously after 30 years of knowing, i did the job for her and even got me on medication. That in that though that sentence, patient believes she's ADHD, haunts me to this day.
Speaker: That's all I want to say. the me that But that suggests you've asked to see your records. I have. Oh, okay. Because you can write legally, see your records. I've seen them.
Speaker: Right, okay. Wow. They gave me misdiagnosis of cyclothymia or cyclomythia, whichever it's called. It's like decaffeinated bipolar. I was diagnosed with BPD, CPTSD, and I was like, listen, the the symptoms are very similar behaviours. I'm bloody... And then they said, we think you're rapid cycling bipolar.
Speaker: I did the job for them for 30 years, and in the end of it, obviously, I've succeeded, but that's not the point, is it? What about people who are not so self-aware? Right. Yeah. Totally. I but hope actually met someone, well, worked with someone this morning.
Speaker: She's 40, I think about 40. She has no idea. but she But not only does she know about ADHD or autism, and it was so clear that she she she has a lot of problems with it.
Speaker: She doesn't know that she doesn't know. Like, so, I mean, it makes me want to cry. you know, it's it's really sad. Anyhow. Thank you for having me. um And I know that you've probably both got bleeding ear holes right now, but welcome to everybody's world that's in my life. I don't stop talking. I even talk in my sleep.
Speaker: And like I have a hyperverbal and I just don't ever stop talking. I love it. Yeah, I love it. no It's a pleasure to have you on our podcast, Vanessa. Thank you very much. Yeah. And, you know, ah ah so, um yeah, you can ah go and find Vanessa on TikTok.
Speaker: that's That's where yeah you mostly hang out. Right. Do you want me to kind of give your your TikTok handle? or ah you i So my name on TikTok is wet spaghetti, because I always say that an ADHD person's brain or thought process is like a bowl of wet spaghetti. The thoughts are all there, but you have to go around the others to get to them.
Speaker: And a neurotypical is like a packet of dry spaghetti. So that's my name on TikTok is wet spaghetti. where it's beginning Yeah, so how do how how do you feel about that, Paul, being being somewhat Italian?
Speaker: Yeah. Spaghetti, a bowl of spaghetti. Yeah, spaghetti should be al dente. So it's like, should be overcooked, al dente.
Speaker: So it shouldn't be too wet, in other words. All right. And ah yeah what do Italians feel about when you when when you break spaghetti in half? You know, like when you get dry spaghetti and then you kind of break it in half to fit it in the pan.
Speaker: Yeah, you just don't do it. They just don't do it. Yeah. The weird thing about Italy is everyone has their favourite pasta, they have really strong opinion opinions about the best pasta, as if it matters, like it really matters to them.
Speaker: Fafalle. i mean but Yeah. To me, it's just different shapes of the same thing. Yes. ah when I feel like ah feel like I'm being really uneducated when I so when i say that.
Speaker: You know what I mean? i feel like what it is It is true and it's not true. It's like if you – I once spent some time with ah with a – ah what What the hell do you call them?
Speaker: A wine specialist. ah What do you call them? like A curie de sueur, a curie de sueur. Yeah, but they yeah they don't. they do Anyway, so she might realize if you could eat, you could drink a good red wine out of two different shaped glasses and the taste is completely different.
Speaker: So I guess it's the same with pasta shapes. All right. Putting it out there. yeah All right. right All right, well, that case, I am going to hit that outro button.
Speaker: I'm just going to go and slide right right out. I'm going to go and say that ADHDville is delivered fresh every Tuesday to all providers of fine podcasts. Please subscribe to the pod and rate most magnificent. And feel free to correspond at will in the comments. But wait, there's more if you want to see our beautiful, beautiful faces. And that's all of our...
Speaker: all of our faces today which are yes beautiful um you can go and sally forth to the chi to to the youtubes and you'll also find all of us on tiktok and you can pick up a quill and email us at adhdreal at gmail.com but in the meantime be fucking kind to yourself And I precede you, fellow ADHDers, come here.
Speaker: Come here. I'll scoot that up. Anyway, I precede you, fellow ADHDers, know thyself, sons of the hounds. Come hither and get the flesh. Thanks, Vanessa.
Speaker: Slick as ever. Bye, Vanessa. Thank you. I hit the wrong button. I was supposed to hit. There, says the mayor. That's that.
