Transcript
Speaker: gez and We're back in the room, Paul. We're back in the room. Oh, no, it says error. Oh, Jesus Christ.
Speaker: There's something that says, fail to start recording. the following participants may be experiencing connection problems.
Speaker: Hello? Hello?
Speaker: and Hello? Oh, it's recording. Back in the room. we're back We are back in the room, Martin. We are back in the room. We're back in the room.
Speaker: We're having some technical errors, peeps. You know, so sorry to our public, but let's try it. Let's give it a go. Let's give it a freaking go. Right. So we're off. Okay.
Speaker: So ah what am I saying? Yeah. So today we're going to talk about 10 things. that we're just a little bit jealous of when it comes to neurotypicals. not not because Or envious.
Speaker: No, right. and And it's not because we think that we're that they're better or that we're better. It's just that they are more standard issue.
Speaker: standard issue um the the world bill around then so they So they get to do things easily.
Speaker: And on occasions, like, even if it's just for one freaking day, could we just not be like them? And just, you know, things could be a little bit easier. yeah
Speaker: Right. A little bit. Just little bit. can't help but think. Teeny, weeny bit easier.
Speaker: Yeah. So, let's go to a place where the distractions and landmarks and the detours are the main roads. Welcome to ADHDville! Yeah, let's go there. Let's go there.
Speaker: With the music. Yes. Talking about jealousy. Talking about envy. The music is happening. Envy, jealousy.
Speaker: Jealousy, envy. I can't hear the... I can't hear any music. so where did Where did the intro go? Intro music go? It's gone. Which is weird.
Speaker: I don't know, mate. I don't know, mate. Let's just pretend that I overdubbed it in. Right. We're not slaves to technology. We just, we can improvise.
Speaker: wi Hello, I'm Paul Thompson. I was diagnosed. And I was diagnosed. and i was diagnosed And I was diagnosed. that that That'll do. I was diagnosed. Well done.
Speaker: Yeah. I'm really proud of that. I was diagnosed with the ADHD in 2013. and practically a couple of years ago okay
Speaker: i ah i'm martin we i was diagnosed with a aty yeah in twenty thirteen a lifetime ago. And we start off as always here the town hall, in the mayor's, in the inner pub. No, we don't start off in the town hall. We are starting off in the in the mayor's no not even the mayor's where are we but it's like it's like such a chaos it's chaos thompson it's because we are starting off as we as we do well just let's put this in a little bit of context we started this podcast about half an hour ago
Speaker: And then technology went against us. Technology. technology yeah And we had to abandon the whole freaking episode. And we had to start all over again.
Speaker: What the fuck? Yeah. catue kickca superro
Speaker: It's okay. And this is us restarting and trying to find the energy, get the energy back. um pretending that we haven't already done this already the energy.
Speaker: This is us, like, being agile. I have the energy. It's just it's just my my brain has said, I've already yeah said all this. i can i can I can just forget all of that, right? I can just dump it in the waste paper basket.
Speaker: Yeah. um Yeah, you've already ticked those boxes. yeah Right. Have you ever done this thing, Paul, where you're cooking something from from from a packet and it has instructions on the packet, right, and you and you get the thing out and you shove the box into the trash can, right?
Speaker: And then you go, oh, hang on a second. Right. And then you have to rummage around the trash can to read what the cooking instructions are. right Fish back.
Speaker: that's that's what mo yeah right That's what my brain is currently doing. It's just through right okay all all of all of the first episode, all of the first 15 minutes into the trash, and now I'm having to um to like get into the trash. and Right.
Speaker: Right. And also, by the way, i'll ah just want to say to our wonderful public, our wonderful listeners, the half an hour that we lost was pure fucking podcast gold that the world is never going to hear.
Speaker: It was buffed to a shining How do you feel about that? Right. Comments.
Speaker: Yeah, write in the comments. Please send us some comments about that podcast called that you're never fucking going to hear ever again. Right. get too we um We're up to, we just need to decide where we're going, Martin, to discuss it.
Speaker: Which um I would suggest we go to the coffee shop at this point.
Speaker: All right. thank Thank you, Paul. I'm glad someone is vaguing. So we start tractor. The tractor sounds.
Speaker: The tractor. Let's start the tractor. Let's go to the coffee place. And hopefully, yes just's go there the tractor starts.
Speaker: Oh, there go. You know what? That's good. Let's pretend...
Speaker: Let's pretend. What? Can you hear the... How can Totally. I'm going to have to overdub that afterwards.
Speaker: So ah what what are you going to have, Martin? What kind of coffee are you going to have? Anyway...
Speaker: god You know what, mate? I think last time i i went with an iced matchup. I think I'm going to have to have something a lot stronger. I'm going to have to have what we call a red eye. Okay.
Speaker: All right.
Speaker: I'm going to go for a Bloody Mary, which is totally off menu. It's a coffee shop. But I do happen to know that they do happen to keep some cheeky, you know, quantities of if you if special clients. If they roll in like me and they want a Bloody Mary, they do them.
Speaker: ah got to have that. I know the manager. Yes. Exactly. it's Exactly. Cool. So let's get on, I suppose, at this point to the theme. Let's get on on to our 10 things though that we're slightly jealous about.
Speaker: Yes. Right. Slash envious. So, yeah, what this isn't is a new neurotypicals versus ADHD thing. Right.
Speaker: This isn't a sort of a brain war. this is This is just like 10 things we're a little bit jealous of because the world works for them and not for us.
Speaker: Yes. There's enough, God knows, there's enough polarization in the world. And this we are not. People do not come to ADHD or podcasts for polarization.
Speaker: It's not what we're about. So let's start with you, Martin. What's your what's number one on your list? Number one, number one yeah is consistent energy and focus.
Speaker: Without burnout or getting bored. And I'm jealous because neurotypicals seem to right just like decide to turn their attention to something.
Speaker: See, that's already resonating for the second time. And then they do it. They go, oh, you know what? I'm going to fill out some paperwork. Yes. and then Do it. And then I'm going to go mow the lawn.
Speaker: And then I'm going go cook breakfast. I don't know. Whatever it is, right? but They're like and like, you know what? I can prioritize stuff. I can like yeah just do it. i not can do it Yeah.
Speaker: And yeah that they might have off days, right, where they're tired because they've been drinking in the night before or something. Yeah. No problems with transition. Right. But they can somehow just manage to kind of like write keep going at a steady pace. Right. got a hangover. Yeah.
Speaker: Whereas we are like either all like we're either on fire and we're like, we're like running a hundred miles hour and doing stuff. Yes. Or, Or we're just kind of flatlining and we're like, no, I can't do this thing.
Speaker: um On it. But they are so consistent. consistent like Yes. You know. Yeah. I wish I could just have that sometimes. You know what I mean?
Speaker: If I could just kind of hit the consistent button for like a day. I'm not polarizing. Yeah, totally. No. Yeah, yeah. No, totally.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah. On the upside, the twist, if you like. That sounds good. That's good. Is that. Okay. Is that. ah My. the my the The first one on my list, Martin. Thank you for asking. Hang on. hang on yeah ed Ed is caught in my in my in my headphone lead.
Speaker: He's got his legs wrapped in it. Hang on. Eddie.
Speaker: I need my headphones back. There we go. Chaos episode. Chaos episode. okay Is he garroted? Yeah, yeah. So I was just going to finish up and say... is Was Eddie... No. it is Is Eddie garotting your headphone cable? No, he just got his little back leg caught in it.
Speaker: um ah So I was just going to say that the upside, if you like, a our of of our of our not having consistent energy and focus is that when we are on...
Speaker: when we have that energy and we do have that, or that focus, we are like, you know, yeah we is we can learn stuff really quick. We can be, we can master all kinds of different stuff.
Speaker: Um, you know yeah So it has its advantages. But sometimes would just like a little bit of consistency. Totally. All right.
Speaker: So I'm only guessing, but I'm guessing that neuro normal people are looking at us at certain points i think and thinking, oh, God, I wish i was as spontaneous as that guy, Mr. West over there.
Speaker: There's upsides and downsides. Anyway, on my list, I've got something quite specific. The first one on my list. remember Remembering people's names in Italian.
Speaker: Italian. All right. Okay. So I didn't know this yeah until about 18 months ago. But my brain has my brain has a, yeah how can I put it?
Speaker: It has like a, it maxes out be ah beyond 30 names that I need to remember. So I started after 35 years as being a ah creative director, I started, i changed, um,
Speaker: profession and I became a teacher in high school. And all of a sudden I need to remember somewhere well in the last 18 months, somewhere between 700 and 900 different names in Italian.
Speaker: That's crazy. Turns out I can't do that. Turns out my brain is saying absolutely fucking not Thompson. Are you off your rocker? No.
Speaker: You can't do it. And literally I've realized 18 months on my brain is saying, no, I can't do it. Not only that, it's not like I can't remember any of those names.
Speaker: I can't remember any names beyond this point. It's all become a big mess, a big mush, a big blur of names.
Speaker: And I can't remember anyone's names anymore. So I envy, and I'm slightly jealous slash envy, of people that can remember names. Because it is a problem, actually.
Speaker: Especially it Italian names because they're longer. Stefano, the Vici, the Barley, the Barley. um And they all end with they all end with a vowel.
Speaker: Yes. Well, I've got, I did some bit of research on it. There is a thing because I've, as an English speaker, everything that's like Italian names often contain sounds, syllable structures, or letter combinations that are not familiar to an English brain.
Speaker: Right. So even if they were English names, I would probably be having a bit of a struggle. But in Italian, with these syllable and, you know, sound combinations, my brain goes, no no, you can't do it.
Speaker: Forget about it. which i Which is a... It has become a problem, actually. Forget about it. Especially when it comes to a point where have to give kids at school um a grade for their conversation English.
Speaker: And I can't remember any of them. any of them Right. Forget about it. No. Right. I completely forgot their names. No.
Speaker: yankki pisonari
Speaker: Okay, so that's my thing. Right, yeah. and What i basically said was I can't even dream of remembering their names. I just thought actually sort the Greek names were even longer.
Speaker: So what's second on your list, Mr West? So this will be number three, obviously, as we're going down the top ten, um not in in in any any order. But he's...
Speaker: I think this is one where you and I overlap. So my one is is his memory that shows up on time.
Speaker: Like, I need, like, when I need something, like, where are my keys? um Yeah, even, like, what is that person's name?
Speaker: Or what is that, know, like, I suddenly need to remember something, like an appointment, what time it was, like, That part of my brain just decides to shut down.
Speaker: Just goes, no, no. So, you know, like a it would be good if I could just remember things when I need to remember them.
Speaker: Yeah. um You know, that would. There's walkies. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, it is very yeah difficult um to to yeah find an upside to that.
Speaker: Yeah. No, I get that. Totally. Yeah. like And I mean, that's it's interesting because its like the it seems like it seems like the most basic of things, doesn't it? Oh, I made the chair.
Speaker: Okay. Number four is managing documentation. Yeah. Managing documentation. I literally, this literally happened to me today. Okay.
Speaker: I had to go and find a document and um it was, there it was time precious. It was time precious. I had to find it within a certain slot.
Speaker: Okay. Not a physical slot. I mean, a time slot, Martin, get your mind out of the gutter. Okay. And, and I had to find it and I got, uh,
Speaker: so anxious about it. And I said to my girlfriend, because my girlfriend was all involved in this. And she said, i said, well, I said to her, look, I know you can, you're looking at me and I'm getting anxious about it.
Speaker: I know I'm not pretending there's any logic to my anxiety about this freaking document. There's no logic. I'm not pretending it. I'm not pretending that it needs to, it needs to some kind, it needs to in some way coincide with your logic.
Speaker: I'm saying it just makes me very anxious. I remember I said to my ah accountant years before I had my ADHD diagnosis.
Speaker: Okay. I said, I think I've got some kind of um phobia. with documentation.
Speaker: As it turns out, ah it is a kind of, it feels to me, the best way I've ever found to explain it to my girlfriend is that it feels like a phobia and it does make me very anxious to kind of like, oh, i need to find a certain document in a certain time frame um And it is time precious because if I don't find it in time, is going to
Speaker: have a it's going to have repercussions, financial repercussions. ka And I became, at least it's happened today, i became really nervous and angry and frustrated.
Speaker: And it's it's hard to explain. Yeah. And so my envy is that I wish I didn't have to have that kind of yeah that's that sense of phobia. So is that like of shit finding things within a certain time frame? Does that resonate for you? Did you have that kind of level of anxiety? with Yes, all the time.
Speaker: Oh, ay oh good Lord, he's offline now. Where has he gone? Oh, it's like a disaster episode. It's a shame because I think with there's some podcast gold in in there.
Speaker: There is. No, no, no. i think I think it's good. I think I like the energy. I like i like the the chaos energy of it. Yes. Yeah. So I think we're at five.
Speaker: Right. So I'm going to crack on and say like number five, count of, is emotional stability, like neurotypical people aren't quite as, so that they're therere there a little bit more, you know less up and down, right?
Speaker: Yeah. You know, like if they get an if they get annoyed, they are they are and annoyed for a bit, right? And then they kind of get over it and kind of carry on.
Speaker: whereas Whereas we will be, you know, like if if someone' if something bad happens, that that can like flatten us out. Like we'll just be dead. We'll just be either sort of like, you know, have ah have a complete meltdown you or um you know, like we'll just kind of emotionally just burn out and overthink and...
Speaker: yeah Well, I'm going to challenge you on that one, Martin. I think... say One thing about being neurodiverse is that we're ultra sensitive to the ups and downs of our um sensitivities.
Speaker: okay right And there are many people, I've known many, many neurotypicals that they have no consciousness of their ups and downs.
Speaker: Yeah, and that's what I mean. Yeah. And so, okay, okay. So it's it's like I always said before I got diagnosed with ADHD, my sensitivity was my best friend and my worst enemy at the same time.
Speaker: Right. Okay. Yes. You know what mean? Yes. Yeah. It'd be like somewhere. It doesn't have to be your best friend or your worst enemy. It could be just like um an associate, someone that, you know.
Speaker: A co-worker. A co-worker. I mean, what the how banal can you get? Co-worker. Once in a while, you know ah would like that.
Speaker: A co-worker. yeah That's brilliant. I love that. I love that. Yeah. Okay. Love that. number six is yours. Oh, this is a big one.
Speaker: A sense of place. A sense of place. This is ah b a biggie. All right. Okay. So since this sits place, this is like I've got in brackets restlessness.
Speaker: Okay. four Five S's in one word. Well done. Restlessness. Five S's in one word. Let's bring on.
Speaker: Okay. Anyway, so I worked out... Since I since i've moved to Italy, I've moved house 12 times in 20 years. That's crazy. ah I've moved house 12 times in 20 years.
Speaker: Since I was 21 and I left home, i counted this evening. i've left I've moved house, I think, twenty maybe 21 times.
Speaker: That's crazy. Here's where the envy comes in. i see people that have stayed in the same freaking house, in the same freaking village, in the same freaking country, in the same freaking continent.
Speaker: um for the last 35, 36 years. think, oh, God, that sounds good.
Speaker: You know? Yeah. No. Yeah. And at the same time, there's this, you know, best friend, worst enemy thing we were talking about before. I've got friends that call me, you know,
Speaker: um good friends that call me, you know, we maybe haven't heard of you from each other for like a year or two. And they call me or they send me a message. They say, where are you, Paul?
Speaker: And they, I know that some of them actually say that they envy me. Oh, right. For moving around. for like if this freedom I have, you know, it's like, where the fuck are you, Paul? with this eda You know, 2025.
Speaker: Oh, I'm here. oh okay. And they kind of envy that freedom that I have. But at the same time, I envy them. Like, oh, some people that have lived in the same village all of their lives. That's stability. Yeah.
Speaker: Right. i I kind of, oh, God, that's got to be good, isn't it? Yeah. No, I do tend to like to stay in one place. So so that's where i I get to challenge you, Mr. T, because because I can say, right, well, if you're autistic, say, then the idea of you sort of moving house, right,
Speaker: ah Even for some ADHD people, vi i the idea of kind of giving up your stable place where you know all the root routines and the habits you know where everything is and you know how to get to the the store. and you know So your entire system of how you run your life works in this house. And the idea of moving house to go somewhere else Yeah.
Speaker: Is too much. So you'd like try and cling on to staying in one place.
Speaker: Well, I don't know. I really, I've always really loved the idea of going to and and into a new reality and challenge myself into a new reality. ah ah For instance, I've even, mean, I talked before about moving, how many times I've moved since um I left home when I was 21. Yeah.
Speaker: But even since I've been in Italy, I've moved 12 times in the 20 years I've been in Italy. i mean, that's insane.
Speaker: Yeah. No, there is something fun about about that. Yeah. But I've seen more of Italy than 99% of Italians have seen.
Speaker: Right. I've been to Palermo, I've been to Turin, I've been to Milan, I've been here and there, and I've seen so much of Italy. And there's a sudden richness survive that I've experienced in that.
Speaker: That's all good and that's great, and I wouldn't change it for the world. But I am fucking exhausted. You know? It's exhausting. Yeah.
Speaker: Yeah, no, there is something I really like about, and it comes, and it it really comes to home when, when I'm sort of growing things like I can, I can grow seeds and I can put them in the ground and I know that I will be there.
Speaker: Okay. Next year. Yes. You know, yeah i can I can plant. so i So I've started some strawberry seeds this year the that won't come up till next year. And then they'll kind of like be good for another two years of so or so.
Speaker: And I know um exactly where I'm going to be. hmm. So I can kind of, I can, I like that stability. I can plan ahead because I'm in one place.
Speaker: It's that's very nice. It's nice. i ah of this was i'm going back 10 years now i was at the cinema and i watched um at the cinema there's a documentary about nick cave who is not australian those who don't know him australian um is part of ah in a group called um nick cave in the and the um bad seeds okay ah Australian ah musician lives in Brighton, okay, as do most of his Australian band members, okay.
Speaker: At a certain point during this documentary, I think it's called 20,000 Hours. It's documentary that just basically... shadow his life for 20,000 hours goes to see his mate in Dover in Kent.
Speaker: Okay. And his mate lives in the middle of nowhere in a little ramshackled bungalow. Okay. And so there, there is, and he'd like goes to visit his mate in his ramshackled cottage in Dover.
Speaker: And me at the cinema, I start to cry. Oh, blimey. For no particular reason other than ah but i was shocked. It's like, oh, what am I crying about?
Speaker: and My eyes are broken. My eyes are broken. No, they weren't, actually. They were actually quite what literally fixed. and they I realized that I craved that, you know,
Speaker: That life that he was having in my home country, middle of nowhere, but slightly bit of a hermit life, this kind of very kind of um this way of living, way of being that I crave to have, you know? Mm-hmm.
Speaker: And I'm totally unexpected out of nowhere. I was, I was crying like, holy crap. I had no idea why I was crying. Yeah. But yeah, it comes back to this, this like feeling having at some point in life, I want to feel rooted.
Speaker: Right. Yeah. I haven't had so far. Nice. All right. nice Nice. um So where are we up to now? um I think we're up to five.
Speaker: Oh, no, no. We're on one, two, three, four, five, six, seven. So so number seven. Yes. Number seven. All right.
Speaker: I've got...
Speaker: Being able to dart something when oh yes start something something. You know, just starting something.
Speaker: yeah When you want to start something, it just seems like such a simple, simple idea, you know, that yeah you can pick a task and then without kind of like spiraling out of control and like don't have you and you don't have have enough spoons and whatever it they can just start.
Speaker: and like And I struggle. I struggle to start. Even things that I really want to do. Even things that are kind of like, oh, yeah, really you want to do this. And it just, there seems to be a lot of, my my brain seems to want to process, start to kind of like want to process the thing that i'm going to do i'm going to start doing. And then it just it just gets caught up in the,
Speaker: yeah thinking about it or something and then i get anxious about it and then i yeah you know don't yeah yeah and it's there's and there's often nonsensical as well take why you why you'd like you know why especially post-diagnosis You think, okay, you you think, Jesus Christ, I should know my mind by now.
Speaker: And you're almost like um like, for me, i need to finish. some For me, it's not so much starting something, it's finishing finishing something off.
Speaker: Right. you know yep um like ah So many good ideas I've had in the past. So many good ideas.
Speaker: Like when the dot-com thing started 25 years ago, I had a ah really good idea. ah even had investors. Even the investors, we even your ex-bosses, Martin, I had a conversation with.
Speaker: And they said, oh, we'd really invest in that idea, Paul. And I didn't take it on. And it's like, oh, fuck's sake, you know, um like yeah good ideas.
Speaker: And I want to I'm now a point where i it's really hard to do it, but really trying hard to like, okay, got a good idea. Okay, let's take that idea and run with it.
Speaker: Right. But not just run with it. See it through to its potential. God, that's hard. I can remember you and i working at Redland Marketing Department.
Speaker: So we're going back many years now. And I was working on a project and for and then for some reason I was struggling to finish it.
Speaker: And it was at that point that i realized I was great for the first 80% of a project. And then yeah on that last 20%, I really tailed off badly.
Speaker: Right. Right. and and know And it came to me like, oh, my God, 8% and then this is 20%. And then from that point, I went, no, I'm going to be good that 20%. And it almost became, had to put 80% of my effort into last 20% of project.
Speaker: Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker: into the last twenty percent ever project yeah to make the whole thing work. Like I had to realize that that I had to put way, had to, most of the project was the last 20%.
Speaker: twenty percent and and once I kind of like totally accounted for that, I became a lot better. Yeah. ah totally get that. I totally get that.
Speaker: I worked on, as you well as you know, Martin, I worked on a sculpture ah last last year. Yeah. And it was exactly that. It was exactly that.
Speaker: Finish it, Paul. Finish it. Finish it. Oh, for God's sake, finish it, you know? the But not just finish it. Finish it to its full potential.
Speaker: God, that took so much energy for me. Yeah. All right. So that was number seven. Okay. Number eight is yours, Paul. Composure.
Speaker: Composure. composure
Speaker: never had it you've you've talked about this before yeah neurotypical people seem to be kind of somehow centred and they kind of come off as like self-assured and just yeah or at least have the potential to be composed they don't panic so much yeah yeah and I've never, I mean, the nearest thing I think I get to compare is when I'm painting, sculpting or photographing.
Speaker: Right. you like but in your But other than that, yeah, other than that, composure is so hard. And it's I remember ah um ah I started working working with, I started having sessions.
Speaker: God, God, even that sounds weird. Anyway, I started having sessions with a new psychologist. Yeah. in Turin about, oh, blimey, going back about eight years now. Blimey.
Speaker: No, seven years. Okay. and she so she but From the get-go, she said, so, Paul, what do you want out of this, you know? and basically what she saying, what you want out of the relationship relationship between me and you?
Speaker: And her as a psychologist, me as a patient, I said, ah basically said to her, I wanted composure. I wanted to get to a point in life where I felt happy with my lot.
Speaker: who And I could just be.
Speaker: And that was enough. Right. You know, that's why said to her and it's true then as it is today. Compose is like, yeah.
Speaker: Don't have to try any harder anymore. You know? Right. Is that like kind of sort of like peace, like bit of a sense of calmness?
Speaker: and Yeah. um Where your nervous system is not kind going, your brain's kind going. Just it, just letting it, letting it, let it be, let it be, let it be, let it go.
Speaker: Right. But it is that. It is that. It's like, you know, len just whatever will be will be, you know, it's like, you know. Right. You know what?
Speaker: I definitely feel I'm more in that place than I ever have been. Oh, that's good. Like I'm, I and know what it ends up being. And at the same time, Fuck you.
Speaker: You bastard.
Speaker: I only wish the best for you, mate. Yeah. Thank you, mate.
Speaker: ah That's good, though. That's good. Let me just see how jealous you are. Oh, okay. Fairly. Oh, madam. Fairly. That's good, though. That's good. Yeah. You know what?
Speaker: it It comes from... I think at some point you end up, as as i as you are doing, you you you you start to pull apart your life and go, well, this gives me anxiety and this...
Speaker: gets my nervous system on the edge and this doesn't bring me peace and you kind of go well let's just chop these things out right and you and you start chasing just just those kind of like nice quiet times which is ah think one of the benefits like i used to like living in manhattan right or working in manhattan and i lived in brooklyn it was buzzy buzzy all the time i like the that city none edge but then when moved out and now I've got like space and I've got a garden I can plant things and I've got and I've got and like I was like oh suddenly my my whole body just goes just kind of like that could be challenging right winds them
Speaker: It is for while. That could be really challenging. Yeah. Right. It's like, this is weird. Like, this is silence. I'm not, I'm not, um not and like, where are they where are the cop cars screaming up and down the road?
Speaker: Right.
Speaker: That's really nice. That's really interesting. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally. I guess what came to mind was you were saying that it's like, oh, well, I've been chasing the freaking, you know, dopamine all my life.
Speaker: That didn't work. Right. You know? Yeah. yeah It's like, oh, so paul Paul Martin, when you going to give that up?
Speaker: Well, you know what? I almost feel like it's um I just get dopamine from smaller and less chaotic things. Right. So a like if you have like if it's bustle and trauma and stuff going on, you can get dopamine from that.
Speaker: um yeah But actually, over time, you can get dopamine from just real, really simple little quiet times. Oh, God, yes. and You know, like i just listening to birds and shit.
Speaker: Yeah, exactly. Yeah, the simplest things, like noticing stuff. you know, that other people don't get to notice, you know.
Speaker: oh For me, one of my greatest pleasures in life is good food, good what good wine, and good company. Mm-hmm. And I don't really, you know, ah of an evening, I don't really want more than that.
Speaker: I've done everything else. Right. You know, in evening kind of, an evening kind of entertainment realm, you know, clubbing, concerting, you know,
Speaker: um drug filled, alcohol fueled evenings. You've done everything and more. Okay. Done all of that. I don't need to do that again. Now I'm more than happy with, you know, good company, good wine, good food.
Speaker: That's more than enough. Right. I don't need the good wine. Yeah. out yeah And the good company once in a while. but yeah mostly not.
Speaker: I totally get that. I totally get that. Yeah. Just me. I totally get that. Yeah. Me doggy. Yes. My dog. Watching the ducks in our swimming Yes.
Speaker: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, I could, for instance, it so it's a good point. Well put, Mr. West. last Last Saturday I cooked with me me and my ah partner.
Speaker: cooked a risotto, asparagus risotto. All right. Good bottle of wine, having a chat, playing cards. Nice. And that was it.
Speaker: That was our evening. And it was fabulous, a fabulous evening. Fabulous. I love that. i think she quite liked it too. wow. Cheeky.
Speaker: Cheeky. ah But, yeah, but and and other simple things, you know, noticing, you know, well, you know, you and i we both, we actually, we first met at art college, and the the first thing that I think was Sheila said to us on the first day, or definitely the first week, she said, going to teach you to see with new eyes.
Speaker: New eyes. New eyes. And I still hold on to that. now It is a gift that keeps on giving to see things.
Speaker: The gift that keeps on giving to see things, see beauty and, you know, um in, a you know, everyday things is is a joy. So what we're saying is like neurotypical brains have far less noise.
Speaker: than yes so it would be yeah nice to kind of like have a have a brain that that was less chaos in your head and you could just kind of like be it would just be easier just to kind of find your little zen yeah yeah but but i guess my how I would wrap up that, at least in my mind, that discussion is that in that chaos, when you've experienced that level of continuous chaos for 40, 50 years, you, your brain becomes somehow trained in all of that chaos and,
Speaker: to deal with the chaos and therefore filter the chaos and know what feels good and what doesn't. Mm-hmm. You know, so does that make sense?
Speaker: Yep. Yep. we are We are very good at working in chaos. Yeah. So that be will be I think you develop a very agile mind in the end.
Speaker: You know, it's a painful journey, but you get there. Right. You can find peace in a very difficult situation, right? Yeah, exactly. That's if there's a problem and people are freaking out, someone with ADHD or some neurodivergent person can be quite level-headed and cool and and actually you function a lot better in chaos. Mm-hmm.
Speaker: because i Because we are so used to working in chaos. um Yeah. Nice. um Nice. i My last one, number nine, I so i saved my brain big guns and for the loss for the last
Speaker: um so i am generous ah Neurotypicals being understood by by but but did it cool by default.
Speaker: you know like They can be understood. like like The default position for so society is they are on understood.
Speaker: Yeah. Whereas is we, neurodivergent, we have to work matt
Speaker: explaining ourselves you know we you know like know we we we find that we have to kind of like make up or mask right so you end up having to mask and to put a lot more effort into just working in that normal world and being understood whereas neurotypical people have a lot less work to do to be to just you know be understood yeah yeah you know what i mean yeah know what you mean
Speaker: And at the same time, the complexity of the ADHD mind is also its joy. Well, yes, I was going to come on to the twist part, why it's oh good for us.
Speaker: Yeah. Part. Yeah. Right. um I just I just want to kind of hang on to that kind of for a little bit longer, like. like Sorry. Neurotypicals have this.
Speaker: I didn't leave room enough room for the hanging. no no, we should hang more, Paul. We should hang more. All right, let's talk about something else.
Speaker: That's a really nice point, though. That's a really, really nuanced and really nice thing. Why do they get to be understood? And we have to work. Yeah.
Speaker: We have to work. yeah We, Paul, we have to do a podcast. You know what mean? that That's work. That's extra work that we're putting in. Yes.
Speaker: Just to try and explain to the world. Yeah. you know, just to make the world understand us more.
Speaker: Yeah. But also be vulnerable because it's not new. It's nothing new. It's like ADHD didn't happen now today in this episode. It, it's always been there.
Speaker: Right. It's just that we're, we'd like being putting ourselves on the, you know, um on the block, putting our heads on the block and, And actually being vulnerable, where there's nothing more vulnerable than having your head on a block, um and saying, you know, this what it feels like to be vulnerable, to be authentic, to be sensitive, you know, and more sensitive than neurotypicals are.
Speaker: it's It's hard work. Right. Think about this, The world assumes that we are normal. the world assumed that we are normal So you walk down the street, you go into a store, you do this, you yeah do that. And the world assumes that you're normal unless you have to know that person.
Speaker: and then And then because we are who we are stuff will happen. We'll be fishing out, trying to fish our keys out of a restaurant trash can, right? Right.
Speaker: And they go, oh what? No, this isn't this person's not normal. And then we have to there a city we have to put in effort to explain who we are and and yet and to try and include us under that normal umbrella.
Speaker: um Yeah. I would go further than that. but yeah Okay, go on. No, no. Go go further, Paul. I'll go further than that. think it's it's become flipped now. It's become that, think it's become, they've started to, i think that there's a certain level of aggression against people that are neuro diverse.
Speaker: I think it's based, based on envy because like, oh they have something that can really hang their hat on, you know,
Speaker: They can hang their hat on, okay, there' there's oh, there's a why, there's a reason, you know, why they're struggling and everything.
Speaker: I think there's a level of envy, you know, because there's a level, there's a sense of place, tribalism in being neurodiverse that they...
Speaker: Right, yeah. Yeah, i would yeah i would the I would definitely say that there is a reaction to neurodivergent people having a voice and and putting ourselves into a group.
Speaker: um I think identity. Right. I'm not too sure that it's necessarily jealousy or envy. It's just like... we are now the the other and we've just become visible. Right. and Otherness.
Speaker: They don't like that because it means that... normal is bigger than they thought it was right there's more yeah there's more in normal than they think which which and it requires them to put in effort or work or something into including us and they resent the work it would need to understand right to um to understand us Their perceptions have been challenged about what normal means.
Speaker: Right. And they don't want to put in the work. It's easier to hate something than it is to love something, right? It's it's easier to go. Or indifferent. Right.
Speaker: I mean, that would be a start. That that would be fine. Yeah. I would take that over, they've you know, dis dislike. yeah Yeah. like I mean, that i mean there's it's it's a really difficult thing. I can't think of it in Italian, the Paragon, you'd say in Italian, in italian the similarity is so in the the yeah trans community at the moment.
Speaker: I mean, just, it's just abhorrent. It's just disgusting what's happening at the moment in the, and you know, the negative feeling towards the trans ah community at the moment.
Speaker: And it's just, there's so much just toxicity going on at the moment. yeah And I think the, unfortunately, you know, this, um, uh, what's, what's the word I'm thinking of?
Speaker: Um,
Speaker: Oh, God. um Dynamic. um What is the word? The divide. You know, the people are thinking it's black and white way.
Speaker: is not is you know It's not going in a good direction at the moment. It is not. Polarisation. Polarisation. ah It's this polarization. and just not The answer isn't in polarization. It's not there.
Speaker: No one's going to find it in polarization. It's going to be in nuancing. going to be be in empathizing and thinking, oh, maybe my perceptions and my thinking is missing something. Maybe I'm not informed.
Speaker: All these challenging concepts, you know, that people are feeling, seems it seems like they're less and less willing to take on. Right, because it's not useful for their agenda.
Speaker: Yeah. in Including or being inclusive is is there is more power in in having an enemy um pointing to an enemy um right and saying and it's it's their fault.
Speaker: like There is more power there than there is in the effort to include. but that Yes. um It seems like there's always been this obsession, you know and religion is a big part of it. It's good and bad.
Speaker: you know, good and bad. It's always been there. It's polarization. It's nothing new. So it's, you know, good and evil.
Speaker: And it's not, the world isn't like that. The world isn't good and evil. It's everything in between ah for heaven's sake, you know? Yeah. um All right.
Speaker: Number 10. Let's, let's, let's get to number 10. Mr. Mr. T. mr t um I've got what it just seems after that discussion, this one seems a little bit banal, but I've got number five. I'll say anyway.
Speaker: Yes. Avoidance of all all related ADHD, ADHD tax fallout. i i I envy the neurotypical world for notught not having um have had not having had to pay all of the taxes I've had to pay in my 58 years of the consequences.
Speaker: You mean actual taxes? No. ADHD tax. ADHD related taxes, you know, costs, you know, I'm talking and probably in my case amm getting, oh, God, this is interesting.
Speaker: i mean, think think about it. I'm probably talking about 200,000 euros. euros
Speaker: Right. I'm guessing, you know, putting it out there as a figure that it's cost me. I think that's pretty accurate, I think.
Speaker: Right. So you're... I'd rather have it in my bank. Right. So you're saying that because you have ADHD and the consequences of that and mean that you've ended up having to pay...
Speaker: another 200 grand. um Yeah. Whereas a neurotypical person, probably a little bit more on it, not procrastinating so much, and then yeah they don't end up. So the MP is less.
Speaker: An envy that's less emotionally based is more practically based. I would rather have that money. You know, money his is, you know, i don't want I'm not a capitalist by any,
Speaker: um can in any in by any shape or form, but um it is, money does have a consequence in terms of um peace of mind.
Speaker: It does. Right. Let's say I mean, it's it's the kind of like, oh, God. yeah I mean, because I've i'veve i'm been in this place before where I've procrastinated about something and it's cost me hundreds of thousands.
Speaker: Right. And... and and you And it becomes emotional but because you feel like such a fucktard, right? Because you kind of feel like such an idiot. Right. And yeah like you're like, yes yeah it doesn't hit job on your self-esteem, right? And you go into a guilt-shame spiral. and Yeah. ah Yeah.
Speaker: No, it isn't about the money. it's It ends up being about the sort of, emotional cost that it hits you with because you're like, I'm such a fucking child.
Speaker: Why? Yeah. ah yeah And then you just trust yourself. Yeah. but I should be, as a 58-year-old man, i should be way more comfortable than I am.
Speaker: Way more comfortable than I am.
Speaker: Right. But, you know, this is, hey, this is where I am. So, yeah, it's it's it's not very emotional. It's not very very kind of romantic, not the most romantic or simulating part of this conversation for this podcast. But it's a big, for me, it's a big factor in the end.
Speaker: Yeah. yeah and And it's related to your well-being, you know, state of mind. There we go. All right. So that is our top 10. Top 10 things that we are you were a little bit jealous about neurotypical people.
Speaker: um Yes. my My little kind of closing comment is that we might not be consistent, but we are memorable. Yeah.
Speaker: Yes. Yeah. mean, there's... Yes. In terms of our, um you know, what we leave behind, what's what's the word? It's one of those words that I can never remember.
Speaker: zawa Legacy. Thank you, Martin. Our legacy. On the ends of the hips. Okay. Legacy. Legacy.
Speaker: I've got... See what did there? Legabees. I've got legabees. And... and legacy say you know we push comes to shove who gives a flying doodah about what we leave behind other than a legacy an emotional legacy is the most important right i tend to like to think of that how Right, because it's like, you know, so much of my life has been chaos and crap and shit and damage.
Speaker: Right, in that order. Fires and, right, and disaster. Fires. I mean, just like, like you know, I just mean like, you know, ah know You know those kind of films where a disaster film, but so there was ah so there's a whole bunch of my life which is like a disaster film and then now I'm trying to kind of like at least kind of put things right and in some way and just trying to fix things and trying to at least end in a place that was like... Would you like, in terms of film genres, would you like it to turn into a kind of a rom-com?
Speaker: Oh, God, no. Who wants that? Who wants that? What film would you like your life to turn into if it was a film genre?
Speaker: Oh, God. You know, like, I don't know. It has to be of has to be like at the end of the film where I'm dead and then there's a sort of like a wake, a party, and they go and and they go, you know what?
Speaker: He was a bit of a cunt, but
Speaker: but what he came good in the end. Right. andy And he did these good things. And he was positive and he made a difference. Even though we started out in in like, yeah, arsehole world.
Speaker: yeah It's like a sort of hero's journey, right? So, you so yeah so you know so so ah you know, bad comes comes becomes good. but That's that's the that's the the film. It's just that hero's journey.
Speaker: yeah And it all ends fine. I think what you're saying is you'd like to be a genre busting. kind of guy no i think it's like almost every genre is like you know zero to hero ah story arc i'd like to be i'd like to be genre busting i'd like to be have you seen the film um uh pride prejudice and zombies no i've seen the book but Okay, have you seen it or read it?
Speaker: I've seen it. I've just seen the cover. Oh, okay. that you should see the You should watch the film. All right. Pride, Prejudice and Zombies is great. All right.
Speaker: That will never happen. I'd like to describe my life when I finally pop my clogs. i would a big I want to be that kind of genre. I want to be a genre-busting kind of chap.
Speaker: All right. and That would be okay for me. All right. Cool. That would be a ah legacy that I could deal with. Paul is genre-busting Thompson.
Speaker: um All right. Well, let's let's end there. um ah we are going to, I think I am going to kind of like say, let let's just kind of do the feedback.
Speaker: Yes. And then we'll zip through the final end is in sight. Okay. We've been recording since 1.30, 2.30, 3.30. Almost two and a half hours.
Speaker: God damn it.
Speaker: time
Speaker: Oh, we've had technical problems, guys. We have had technical problems. But I think it's one the best, maybe the best episode we've ever freaking recorded. well, you know. Especially because Martin said the word cunt, you know, five weeks ago.
Speaker: Which personally it was for me a highlight. It's taken 83 episodes for the C word.
Speaker: So that's good. Even Eddie got up for that one. Even Eddie was rooting for you on that one. No, he is. He's like down by my feet. Eddie was saying, finally, you said, it's about time.
Speaker: Actually, he's like, come on, can you just feed me, you bastard? That's what you're thinking. Okay. Is it? What is Eddie's feeding time? It's anywhere between four and five, and we're like ten to four. safe Same for my Rudy.
Speaker: Same for Rudy. He's like, come on, then. Get that food in me. What are you waiting for? Come on. Feed me. Come on.
Speaker: That's him. Okay. So, yeah, feedback. All right. to we we Should we get back in the tractor? or Let's get back in the tractor and we'll go back to the pub.
Speaker: Come on, let's get in there. can't hear it. I'm sure they're there. I'm sure it's getting there. All right.
Speaker: Cool. That's probably the tractor over. um Yeah. This is where you say... This is where I say your feedback is vital to us.
Speaker: ah Full stop. We read all of your comments and we might read yours. How are the future podcasts? Full stop. ah Like these two that Marty is about to mention. like Like this one.
Speaker: um this one? No, there is just the one. So... so a like Alex Zandra, the official ADHD town cry.
Speaker: um um Always, always ah lovely, lovely comments. um And she was commenting on last week's where you and I took an autism test.
Speaker: Yes, and we were kind of wondering about our particularly high scores. We're like, ooh. Yes. Ooh. It's a bit interesting. And she does point out that a the i negative autism test can be false, right?
Speaker: So yes if you score lowly if you score low, that doesn't mean that you don't have autism. But but but she goes on to say that a positive one, i.e. one where we've scored fairly high, is almost every time positive.
Speaker: So if you've scored highly... there is a far greater chance that it's correct rather than... yeah, I'll get that. Yeah.
Speaker: yeah I get that. Okay. it's yeah it's It's almost like if you scored highly, yeah, yeah, you're in the club, mate. That's what it is. I'd like to add, because I'm not sure if we said this, because if people are curious, go back to the the last ah talk last episode, I just want to point out that most autism tests are based on white males as subjects so you know the the autism tests are so um um they seriously need updating and they need to be made much more relevant to much broader audience autistic as we are white white males they are much more suited to us so uh if we've scored highly
Speaker: o Who knows? shout Watch out. um All right. So next week, next week, we're up next week we're going to talk about ADHD and the sense of smell.
Speaker: i we Some say sense of smell is, you know, the most linked to memory, right for instance. Right. Yeah, it is. So let's see how that turns out, Martin. Right. Some ADHD research into ADHD and smells.
Speaker: All right. So that just finally leaves me. Although, well, I'm not going hear this. A lot of hours. Oh, it's crazy. Oh, it's been hard work. Right, is to say that ADHDville is delivered fresh every Tuesday to all providers of fine podcasts. Please subscribe to the pod and wrote rate us most amazing and feel free to correspond with us in the comments. But wait, there is more if you wish to see our beautiful, beautiful faces and Sally forth to the YouTubes and the TikToks. Sally Fields.
Speaker: And you can also pick up a quill and email us at ADHDville at gmail.com. But in the meantime... and kind yourself. And I beseech you fellow ADHDers, know thyselves, sons of the hounds.
Speaker: Come hither and gather flesh. We've got to the end. We've got to the end. We did it. We've got to the end. Jesus Christ.
Speaker: There, says the mayor. That's that.
