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Episode 87 - The ADHD Conflict Crisis: How We Handle Ourselves (And Others)
45 Plays1 month ago
In this episode of ADHDville, co-hosts Martin West and Paul Thompson dive into the often tricky world of ADHD and conflict. They explore how navigating conflict can sometimes be easier with others than with ourselves, and how ADHD amplifies certain situations in unexpected ways.
Paul and Martin reflect on the emotional toll of people-pleasing, overthinking, and the challenges that come with managing personal and external drama. They also discuss how their ADHD brains lead them to focus more on other people's problems than their own—and why establishing boundaries is crucial for preserving their energy and emotional well-being.
Join Martin and Paul as they chat through the ups and downs of conflict, all while enjoying a pint (or two) at the King’s Agitated Head Pub in ADHDville. Expect plenty of laughs, insights, and maybe even a few moments of self-reflection along the way.
Hit subscribe so you don’t miss the chaos – and drop a comment. 🔥
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ADHD/Focus music from Martin (AKA Thinking Fish)
Theme music was written by Freddie Philips and played by Martin West. All other music by Martin West.
Please remember: This is an entertainment podcast about ADHD and does not substitute for individualized advice from qualified health professionals.
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Transcript
Introduction to ADHD and Conflict
00:00:00
Speaker
and we go. Here we go. Back in the room. Back the room. Back in the room for what? The 84th time, I think. No, 87th time. 87th time. Yes.
00:00:12
Speaker
Okay. Right. So we're going to talk about ADHD and conflict. And some say that we are much better at dealing with others than we are um our own bleed conflict.
00:00:26
Speaker
um Yes. So let's dive into that then. Yeah. Let's go to a place where the distractions are landmarks and the detours are the main roads. Welcome to ADHD, Phil.
00:00:37
Speaker
Yay!
00:00:41
Speaker
Meet the boys because the boys are here. We're poised. Boys to entertain, boys to entertain, boys to entertain, boys to entertain, boys to entertain you.
00:00:56
Speaker
ADHD. ADHD.
00:01:02
Speaker
ADHD.
Meet the Hosts: Paul and Martin
00:01:03
Speaker
Hello, I'm Paul Thompson, and I was diagnosed with the combined ADH and that extra D calling towards a couple of years ago. I'm Martin West, and I was diagnosed with the combined ADHD poo-poo platter in 2013, and we start off, as we have been, in the King's Agitated Head pub in ADHDville, where we, the ex-co-mayors of ADHDville, sit at the back table...
00:01:31
Speaker
And enjoy a point pint and take care of business. Yes. Maybe a packet of port scratch-ins as well. Lovely. um Exactly. So this is a good point just to remind you to hit that subscribe button, hit that like button, make a comment. Comment for God's sake. Yes.
00:01:50
Speaker
What's wrong with you? Good or bad? What's wrong with you? you five Good or bad. Good or bad. Just not indifferent. Good or bad. Not indifferent. We're not interested in... Right.
00:02:03
Speaker
Right. Structured to our episode, haven't we, this week?
Episode Agenda and Engagement
00:02:07
Speaker
Right. one On today's agenda, yeah, we're going to talk about how to how to how we deal with the crisis and how we deal with other people's Yes, because it can be a bit different.
00:02:24
Speaker
Right. Yeah. And all right. So where are we going today? Mr. Paulio. I'm glad you are smart. I'm so glad you asked because I know your fingers on the is on the button of the um of the music linked to the destination that is this week, the police station. Yeah. Right. Let's get in our tractor.
00:02:48
Speaker
and Yes, let's go to the clique, the pokey. From the pub to the police station. Yeah. Yeah. Here we go. Let's go there.
00:02:59
Speaker
And we're off.
00:03:05
Speaker
um
00:03:15
Speaker
I'll see what we've done there. The music it sounds a little bit like Hill Street Blues.
00:03:22
Speaker
Yeah, exactly. Got that i love TV 70s cop vibe. I don't know why. Always the theme tune to the Hill Street Blues always made me feel emotional.
00:03:35
Speaker
Even to this day, it's like, God, that's so good. It's so good. i mean, to me, it's like when you're growing up in the UK like we did, you look to those like American programs, you're like, oh, my God. I mean, they really, the Americas really set the standard in those days, you know? Yeah.
00:03:58
Speaker
Yeah. It was like Hill Street Blues. I think it was one of those first like fly on the wall kind of approach. It was. and Yeah. And then and then if you if you flicked over to the other side, you had the English version, which was like Zed cars.
00:04:14
Speaker
Yeah. was just like, And are really clunky and... Clunky and horrible. Yeah. And these are the sexier American TV cop shows. And they're the the the like the the meetings that they had every morning.
00:04:31
Speaker
they To me, they seem like I could imagine that was as real somehow, you know? Maybe it was. I don't In my imagination. But anyway.
00:04:41
Speaker
Be careful um out there. Be careful out there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay. is that that that That was a line. Yeah. So I was just... boy Marty, because it's really interesting. After, like, 87 episodes, you'd think that... um But the beginning, like, blimey, how many episodes can you invent about ADHD?
00:05:06
Speaker
Well, actually, the truth has been, like, even when you get to like, 87th episode, there's, like, endless themes happening. You know, we never struggle for a theme like this one, for example, um and which for me is like a massive thing.
00:05:25
Speaker
Dealing with conflict
Impact of Neurodivergence on Self-Esteem
00:05:27
Speaker
for me personally has always been something that has like weaved. it It's kind of um weaved itself through my life, you know, for good or for bad. Mostly bad, I have to say, as we'll find out.
00:05:43
Speaker
and What about for you, Martin? did do you like i think like I think anyone who is neurodivergent is no stranger to conflict yeah in themselves and with other people.
00:05:58
Speaker
It's the air that we breathe, it seems. yeah I was listening someone, up another podcast this morning, um and a ah lady was saying something really interesting.
00:06:10
Speaker
You know, it's quite famous, this um number that I think most of us have heard, that by the time we reach our teen adulthood, we've heard 20,000 negative messages more than neurotypicals.
00:06:27
Speaker
Actually, that number has been found to be complete nonsense. It's complete rubbish, but it's been popularized. It's like, okay, but she made a really good point. It's like, that that's probably sub true. Who cares about the number?
00:06:41
Speaker
Yeah. The real negativity, you know, negative messages is the ones we had in our own minds, you you know, ah putting ourselves down, you know, being uncaring towards ourselves, being like a bit horrible to ourselves, you know.
00:07:04
Speaker
Right. But don't forget that idea of being horrible to yourself has been put there by someone else saying that you're wrong, that you should be doing this or that, and then you feel bad about yourself, right?
00:07:21
Speaker
Right. that so Almost as someone put it into your head that you should feel bad about yourself. Right. Therefore, yeah. Okay. yay Yeah, yep yeah, yeah. The seed was planted our minds. Right. All of those negative voices that you get in your head, they start off outside of you and then you've internalized them.
00:07:43
Speaker
And then you think it's your own voice, but it isn't. It's actually you're just replaying other people's now what Yeah. What they've said. It's on a theme of, oh, why can't I play to their rules, you know, and that kind of struggle with that, you know, endless struggle. Right.
00:08:06
Speaker
and that and And that's because you've done something and then someone says, no, those are not the rules. And you go, oh, crap. And then you struggle to kind of,
00:08:18
Speaker
do the rules and then they keep going why are you why why you so stupid why can't you follow the rules and you think god I can't follow the rules I'm stupid and then you just yeah as I said you just internalize that and that's yeah you you pick up other people's garbage and you carry it around like it's your own You're going, ah, makes me so mad. Freaking baggage, yeah.
00:08:43
Speaker
yeah Anyway, conflict. Yes. Even that right there causes a lot of conflict yeah because it ends up that that very basic...
00:08:56
Speaker
yeah idea yeah causes a lot of problems well I personally I internalize so much conflict like never ending unceasing kind of going round and round conflict to my mind dealing with stuff you know are Endless. My God. Ever-ending conflict. hell.
00:09:22
Speaker
And for like, I'm sure for like the situation, whether it was a professional, personal thing, I think often for the other people ah the you know on the and other end of this situation For them, it was like nothing.
00:09:35
Speaker
For me, it was like I would turn molehills into mountains from nothing, you know? right Yeah, yeah. Oh, my God.
00:09:46
Speaker
ah know. Especially like if you've got like um yeah rejection sensitivity and dysphoria, it makes you...
00:09:57
Speaker
it it It does turn that kind of, you know, someone saying something offhandedly bad, not really putting a lot of store in it, but then you taking that little mountain and turning into a, no, into that little molehill and turning it into a huge great mountain. and Yeah.
00:10:17
Speaker
And I just made things mean. all kinds of stuff you know in my head i made you know what for for one person would be like you know minor comment for me would be like you know turn it over and over in my head you know it'd be it would become slight like ridiculously out of proportion you know i
00:10:49
Speaker
Absolutely.
Helping Others with Crises: Emotional Detachment
00:10:50
Speaker
You know what we were saying at the start where it's easier to deal with other people's crisis than it is our own? Mm-hmm.
00:11:00
Speaker
Like, I find... i you know like There is a lot of enjoyment for me in someone coming up because they're having a crisis and then and I kind of like help them so out their thing because it's it's it's almost like I don't have any...
00:11:22
Speaker
emotional investment in whatever their conflict is. And I can, right I can jump in and and help them. and And in fact, I can do way more for other people and I can do for myself. So I'll totally struggle to open up my own mail.
00:11:38
Speaker
But if, you know, someone else is like sitting there with a pile of mail and they're just feeling overwhelmed by it, I will quite happily open it up. you know Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, on my part, I'd even go as far as to say that actually,
00:11:52
Speaker
ah a reputation that people would come to me, you know, is like, Oh, Paul's good at resolving conflict, you know, h and which is, right which is, yeah.
00:12:04
Speaker
um And I, I wonder if, well, I think, I wonder if it's like a combination of things, it's, you know, that overthinking and rumination and, and et cetera developed a certain kind of,
00:12:17
Speaker
dialogue and you kind of get used to dealing with, you know, juggling a lot of balls. At the same time, we are, something we refer to a lot is um um being hyper um sensitive to our environment. So we're like hyper vigilant.
00:12:36
Speaker
and observing, you know, of things. So you can see patterns, you can see, pick up relationships, you know, and maybe, you know, almost like visualize solutions quite easily for me.
00:12:53
Speaker
Right. Towards other people, just not myself. Does that make sense? Yeah, no, I think because, We do tend to be quite deep people that that yeah you can look at so someone else's con conflict with two people, say, and then you can kind of...
00:13:13
Speaker
i you probably have a much more deeper understanding of their struggles as people um and you can empathize with them more, you know, and you can empathize with this with with their struggles.
00:13:28
Speaker
um And, yeah, and as you as as you said, you've probably got some life experience with crisis. And, know, if you've got ADHD or whatever, you're – you spend half your life trying to smooth things out, you know, make things work smooth all the bumps over. So you're quite good at finding solutions, as you say, like, um you know, you because you've spent so much time like pattern recognition and ah he's looking at your in in environment and all these things come together and you kind of go oh, yeah, yeah no, I can see –
00:14:03
Speaker
a path forward for this conflict. Yeah. know Yeah. To kind of get it resolved. Yeah. Well, I remember a situation where I was quite young. I think I about 18 or 19. And my sister was going through crisis with her boyfriend or whatever. I think it might have even been her husband.
00:14:28
Speaker
and my And my mum and my dad were trying to resolve her situation. And I could tell that it wasn't helping her. And I was kind of like on the sidelines, like watching in from the side, listening, watching, blah, blah, blah.
00:14:45
Speaker
And I, and there was a, a kind of a pause in the discussion. And I, having watched and listened, I like let go of like what I thought they should do with my sister and her boyfriend.
00:15:00
Speaker
Right. And like everyone like turned around and looked at me like, bloody hell. You know, it's like I came out with this like really like precise, like, um like um hit the nail on the head kind of like, you know, rational thing that they should try and do, you know, to help resolve their situation.
00:15:25
Speaker
ah Where did that come from? You know? Which was another dynamic of us growing up. I don't know how how it was with you, Martin, but me growing up in, you with our generation, kids were like, were seen but not heard.
00:15:45
Speaker
ah But definitely in my family, you were seen but not heard. If you were like with my grandmother's house, having dinner, Sunday roast or something, mean you weren't, you didn't speak until you were spoken to.
00:15:57
Speaker
Right. It was the same with, in my family as well, with my, my family, in my ah father, your opinions weren't invited all welcome. Right.
00:16:11
Speaker
So as a consequence, I think I became just like hyper observant, you know, watching everything from the side, you know, and kind of learning as I went along.
00:16:25
Speaker
Did you have that? Were you in that kind of situation, like seen or not heard, or were your opinions invited? or God, no. God, no.
00:16:36
Speaker
I think if if you've got like a narcissistic parent, your yeah your your opinions, on and unless they align with the narcissistic parent exactly, then they don't want to know So yeah keep your mouth shut.
00:16:54
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Well, I think it's maybe a bit different now is like kids, you know, children's opinions and ideas or points of view are more, you know, parents try to be more inclusive, you know, in, in you know, allowing their voice.
Upbringing and Conflict Resolution
00:17:15
Speaker
I know. It is weird, right? I remember, and I think about this from time to time. When I was a kid, I would have to watch whatever TV my parents were going to watch, right?
00:17:29
Speaker
Okay. So whatever it is that they wanted to put on TV, that yeah you didn't get a say. No, God, no. You were left alone for Saturday morning cartoons.
00:17:44
Speaker
That was great. But other than that, no, in in the evenings, it was whatever they wanted to watch. Neither was dinner. you know it It was like, a what's for dinner? Oh, what do you what would you like to have for dinner?
00:17:56
Speaker
No. Burgers, chips, beans, you know, whatever was served. It was whatever arrived on the plate. And it's odd because I find that even with, like, my own kids, it would be a little bit more like, well, what do you want watch? So it was much more, you know, trying to find a sort of a middle ground between what I wanted to watch and what my kids wanted to watch whatever. yeah.
00:18:25
Speaker
But also when, for us, it was like in bed by nine o'clock, which was pretty rough on us because sometimes that coincided with Starsky and Hutch starting at at nine o'clock.
00:18:39
Speaker
Oh, I know. That was tough, for me you know. Yeah. But what I want to say is that anyway I don't want to make it seem like it was better Yeah. Because wasn't. No, no, it wasn't.
00:18:53
Speaker
No, you know not by any stretch of the imagination. No. Right. Because now you have everyone has a screen, right? So it's not just one screen in the room, which was the TV. tv It's now everyone can have a can sit and do stuff on their laptop or their, you know, on their, you know, tablet or whatever.
00:19:14
Speaker
But also having me personally, having grown up, not only in that kind of environment, but I also grew up, I had, um I stopped ah growing when I was about 11, like my hormones, you know, went on strike and I didn't grow.
00:19:32
Speaker
um right for a like i stopped growing for about six years so i was um profoundly aware of being treated like a kid all the time you know even when i was 19 20 i was treated like i was a 12 year old and that my opinions didn't matter right the point is that i'm not doing like doing a victimhood story or anything like that the point being there was a kind of ah a um positive thing that came out of that is one that did have my voice.
00:20:07
Speaker
i really enjoyed it, you know.
00:20:11
Speaker
It was like I became hyper observer because of that environment I grew up in. but ah But as a consequence, I became, I think, quite good at dealing with conflict, you know, being hyper vigilant, you know, sensitive to environmental situations, you know.
00:20:31
Speaker
Yeah, I see. Yeah. i was I was thinking, how are we going to bring this back round to a crisis? and and you've well and you've yeah you've and you've and you've And you've brought it back, Paul.
00:20:45
Speaker
I brought it back. I brought it back in. ah had it on a long piece of elastic, but I brought it back. Yeah. Nice. With a twang. Yeah. um But yeah, other people's, so you that you generally, do you have, would you say, a good reputation with dealing with other people's conflict? Yeah.
00:21:03
Speaker
Yeah, I think, I don't know, like this this is a very broad brush that I'm painting, but I kind of feel like there is part of my life and probably a part of a lot of people's lives where you are...
00:21:21
Speaker
get pulled into other people's conflicts and you and you do help resolve things right and then at some point you kind of go wow this is taking a lot out of me and then it's and then you you you get to a point where you start to kind of go you know what that's that's not my circus that's not my flying flying monkeys i do not need to get involved in this in this drama and just almost like pick off the conflicts that you have to pick rather than all of them.
Setting Boundaries and Emotional Management
00:22:00
Speaker
yeah yeah and so you've actually you actually kind of put a little bit of a boundary around. You can kind of go, you know what, I care about the stuff that is within my little boundary wall.
00:22:10
Speaker
Everything else can can just like just go fuck off. Yeah, totally, yeah. Because, you know, it's, Because it does take a lot out of you to kind of get involved in drama.
00:22:24
Speaker
There's element of, you know, like the spoon thing, you know, is, is um you know, um ah measuring your your energy, you know, and how you spread that out.
00:22:37
Speaker
Right. Definitely. I have a friend it comes to mind, a friend of mine in Palermo, and she said, she has a reputation of like dealing with everyone's problems and conflicts like so much. So she's like, cause like the, everyone's kind of like auntie, you know?
00:22:53
Speaker
hu at one point, this is, this is like, this is the hyper, um, vigilance. At one point I kind of noticing her that she was sad. i ah saw her and she's like, you don't seem that happy. So I said to her, um,
00:23:12
Speaker
I know you you have a reputation for sorting out everyone's problems, but I'm just thinking you don't look very happy. And I just want to say, if you've got a problem, you can talk to me about it And she got really emotional, you know, because she's like, no one says that to me.
00:23:32
Speaker
You know, so you get somebody get a reputation and and it gets slightly abused, you know. Yeah. In her case, well it's two way at some point. it has to be.
00:23:47
Speaker
Yeah, because it's it's not only do you get abused for it, but you almost yourself, ah because you're a people pleaser, you want to please other people and help them, right? You have this kind of like need to. Exactly.
00:24:05
Speaker
without And it almost becomes part of it. If you become the person that people come to, then that almost becomes part of your eye eye i i identity.
00:24:16
Speaker
yeah So um it's quite difficult to then kind of go, no, like i can't yeah I can't do all of that anymore. I can only deal with a certain amount of of crisis in my life.
00:24:28
Speaker
And in fact, I find that as I get older, it's I want less and less crisis. And the and i find that people, certain people in my life cause drama.
00:24:41
Speaker
And sometimes I cause drama in other people's lives. It's not like I'm fucking God. But, you know, like. yeah But some people just do it because they cause the drama because they like the attention. you know, it's like, oh, yes, let's cause a crisis.
00:24:54
Speaker
I'm just, I distance myself from them. And it's like, I, I just, I will just ghost you now. Yeah. I will just ghost you. It can be a form of masking as well, because if you're constantly, obviously, if you're constantly looking after other people's problems, you're not looking after your own.
00:25:14
Speaker
Right. Yes. And at some point you just get burnt out, right? You get burnt out and you have to go, oh crap, you know what? I need some spoons for me.
00:25:24
Speaker
ah need, and I need support. and And that's the thing, right? Is that it's difficult for us to ask for support. So when someone like you comes along and goes, mate,
00:25:36
Speaker
if you want some help i'm here it's like oh oh someone's helping me and i didn't have to ask because asking for support is difficult if someone comes to you and says you look a bit sad can i help yeah yeah yeah that's like then and it's like but we won't go into this too much but also this is the type of advice as well i always try to keep whatever when someone comes to me for advice and I try to keep it simple, you know.
00:26:08
Speaker
ah try to look for the simplicity in it, you know, rather than adding and complicating it, you know, if that makes sense. Yeah.
00:26:19
Speaker
um Okay. um just just so afterve I've just realized that this isn't really about crisis. about It's about conflict. That's the – I think that's the – so tired dealing with conflict yeah is it dealing with conflict yeah yeah oh it is god damn it i i i myself miss miss read that yeah so yeah have we have we done the dealing with other people's stuff or um i think so i think so i think i think i think we can move on yeah i think of and unless you've got something else i think hang on a second
00:27:00
Speaker
Yeah. All right. Yeah. Hang on, caller. Hang on, caller. Yeah, dealing with our own conflicts a bit more complicated and a bit more colourful, I'd imagine.
00:27:14
Speaker
Blimey. yeah mean what I mean, where where do you start? is' like they it's it's it's It's like a field that you could just get your spade and dig anywhere and you would just find self-conflict.
Internal Conflict and People-Pleasing
00:27:28
Speaker
It's like from the moment you're born till the moment you're listening to this on the podcast, it's just one long, ever seemingly never-ending series of conflicts, one after the other.
00:27:44
Speaker
Well, I think um there's something that yeah weaves through a lot of my personal history when dealing with conflict is people-pleasing, which I think you touched on before.
00:27:56
Speaker
That... um I'm trying to think of ah ah of kind of an example. so many So many times I've been in conflict and I've um undervalued my own needs and my own, ah you know, importance in terms of my part of the story of that particular conflict um and just concentrated on people-pleasing, you know,
00:28:27
Speaker
right So often, you know, I've tried to resolve ah situation by pleasing the other person in the story, you know, completely ignoring my own, you know.
00:28:41
Speaker
So often. Yes. To people please, but also to like, oh, let's get off this discussion because I was just uncomfortable with those kind of situations, those kind of discussions always made me really nervous, you know,
00:28:59
Speaker
And so you ended up like, you know, appeasing the other person and and them, you know, coming out at the other end and then feeling they got to feel like they were right.
00:29:11
Speaker
Me coming out at the other end with this like oozing with frustration, like fucking hell. I wasn't authentic, you know. It's like fucking hell again. I've not.
00:29:23
Speaker
um thought enough or valued enough my own needs you know valued enough my own opinion yeah yep that's that's happened a lot but within yourself right with like what you need yes yeah yourself versus you know yeah what the world needs you I don't know is that right I don't know But it's like, you know, the one one part of the situation would be going, oh, this is this is, I'm not happy about this. I'm not happy with that. I'm frustrated about this.
00:29:59
Speaker
that And then it gets into like, you do this, you do that, you do this, you do that. And I'd be like, often end ending up like, um to avoid making it more conflicting than necessary, like pretty much agrees, like, okay, like climbing down.
00:30:20
Speaker
You know? Right. Climbing down just like, okay. And then what happened, it evolved into like situation where I'd be going, okay, this can't always be about me.
00:30:34
Speaker
You know? It's got to be like a two-way thing. It can't be always me that backs down. And it can't always be the problem is about me. Right. Right.
00:30:50
Speaker
But that took a while. That took a while, I must have admit.
00:30:55
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. It's like i have to you end up having to choose which hill to to die on. um Yeah. In that you can't... you can't it You have to stand up for something at some point, right? At some point in your life, you end having to stand up for yourself um and in any conflict. Exactly.
00:31:19
Speaker
conflict ah you can't do it all the time as you say fish if it's if you just back down all the time then that is like a very it's such a tough place to end up the other dynamic in that is that I think I had my own internal conflict and conflict ah people's problems I'm like being really kind of like fact
00:31:51
Speaker
part of the problem in my own case but oh she thinks that isn't and then there's that and then there's this and like confusion you know um and the opposite of resolving conflict for others, you know, being, you know, muddled thinking, Oh, what's the best way to do it? Like she's, that she's happy with me and bla bla blah, blah, blah.
00:32:21
Speaker
And in the end, just like handle it quite badly.
00:32:27
Speaker
But what, what about you, Martin? Did you, what's you like, what's your, I was was there like, did you evolve? Yeah.
00:32:40
Speaker
A bit. A bit. I mean, um but i mean what i mean um what if you if you talk about, I mean, there's all kinds of conflicts. So if you're talking about like relationship conflicts, then I tend to be the one that will initially put my case, but will back down.
00:33:10
Speaker
um
00:33:12
Speaker
But yeah, but we'll back down almost always. But I will state my, what I believe is right, if you like.
00:33:25
Speaker
yeah And then and then i will they listen and then mostly i will find a way out of the conflict. So either it's kind of like listening to the other person and going, oh, you know what, your you're completely right.
00:33:43
Speaker
or you're half right, or whatever it is, i can see your point. I get it. plus i I see you i what I've caused here. yeah And all right, well, in the future, will try and do it better.
00:33:59
Speaker
and Yeah. Because at the end of the day, there's no it's never one person's fault It's always going to be, but usually it's, it's, there's a bit of a mix, mix bag in there.
00:34:12
Speaker
Yeah. You know, I, I, I do try and listen to the other person and try and empathize with them and try and,
00:34:24
Speaker
and see it from their point of view. you know And as I said, it's it mostly ends up like I can see where i screwed up.
00:34:35
Speaker
I go, oh, yeah, I can see where I went wrong. I should have done this. I should have done that. But for me, I'm um'm trying to like not have as much guilt and shame about it as I wouldn't have done when I was younger, I just feel so bad about myself that, that, that, yeah, that my, that my, how I felt about it or how upset I was about that, that whole thing would then be the focus of that conflict. Yeah.
00:35:12
Speaker
going on. so it would be, there's a conflict. ah put my hand up. I feel bad. I go into a, I'm like, oh, I feel so bad. And then that becomes the focus. It it ends up being about me again.
00:35:24
Speaker
Right. Ends up being like me me me, me, me, because I feel bad that I upset someone. And that's not right. Yeah.
00:35:35
Speaker
Because you can't. Internalizing things. Well, if you take the focus of, the but if you take the focus back onto you again, then the other person who had an issue with you yeah doesn't get the airtime, doesn't get the the attention that they want to focus on them because you end up being upset and then it's about you.
00:35:58
Speaker
And then they just feel like, well, it's just about you now and how upset you are and how guilty you feel. Yeah, exactly. i I think a lot of it comes down to, you know, self-esteem, and you know, rejection, senseor sensitivity, you know, and, um you know, you avoid, you want to people please, but you don't, but you also want to avoid feeling rejection.
00:36:24
Speaker
and that's not a good foundation point. You know, that is not a good foundation for an argument.
Evolving Conflict Handling Approaches
00:36:31
Speaker
um um too much in my case, I don't know whether that's because of ADHD or not, but i a lot of um internalized thinking like ah shed loads.
00:36:46
Speaker
I mean, way too much, way too much. But um the this for in my case, it's been a kind of evolution um if nothing, if for no other reason other than I had to find a better way because I was exhausted um um from, you know, overthink.
00:37:13
Speaker
And I gradually, slowly but surely, I kind of found my way, you know,
00:37:22
Speaker
avoiding overthinking, I guess a bit more self-esteem in a way and in trusting myself to find an emotionally intelligent solution in my head, you know, without overthinking it, you know, um being rational or even logic, finding, big get this is the, I got better at finding the, picking out the logic in it, you know, and if it wasn't a logic in my thinking, leave it fuck it leave the fuck alone.
00:37:54
Speaker
Let it go, you know, to avoid going round and round in my head. so Like, okay, rationalizing and finding logic and bit of common sense, like a mixture of those things.
00:38:08
Speaker
oh I'm somewhat a little bit like that, but also not in that I find that because my autistic little brain wants to find ah a logic to it,
00:38:21
Speaker
And then I hang on to that logic. And that's the worst thing. Because I'm hanging on to the logic. ah So say if there's an argument or conflict and there's a logic to it that I can see.
00:38:37
Speaker
ah I can see the logic of this. It's complete. says if I hang on to that, it say it doesn't. It doesn't forward anything. It just mires and you get kind of caught up in the logic and the sense of it.
00:38:59
Speaker
Yeah. Rather than... Isn't there something... Yeah, go on. because that's the Rather than deal with the emotional part, which and the because when you get to conflict, it's like 99.999% emotional and emotions don't run on logic. Sure. So if you find that you're having and ah having a conflict and you're trying to hang on to logic...
00:39:28
Speaker
That's like 0.001% of the con conversation. It's actually just about dealing with the emotional side. than it Sure.
00:39:40
Speaker
But I think what I was getting at is that my my for many, many years, my sense of logic um meant that I would just like internalize everything and just go round round and overthink it all.
00:39:55
Speaker
um And so the logic bit was only like a small percentage of that, you know, but applying some, but it will be more, I guess logic is the wrong rational about it.
00:40:10
Speaker
Like thinking, Paul, you know, um maybe I found myself going down a rabbit hole, another rabbit hole for like 20 minutes and you come out the other end thinking, what?
00:40:22
Speaker
Like, oh, oh how did you take yourself here? You know, you think back, that's madness. That's madness.
00:40:34
Speaker
It's like, okay, how can I stop doing that? Because it's freaking exhausting, you know?
00:40:43
Speaker
is. It's exhausting, but I still do it. even though I've worked really hard on that, right you know, um because you would say, you're talking about logic. The problem is sometimes our logic is not neurotypical world logic. Like I had a conflict with ah a teacher at school recently.
00:41:04
Speaker
um And I, in my mind, he was being a disruptive um element of the classes. And I went by God over and over because my logic been neuro diverse. It's not his, you know, im like fuck, how can i have this conversation with him?
00:41:24
Speaker
You know, And this is interesting, actually, in a lot of my dealing with conflict, conflict is often in the end, knowing that they will not understand my point of view, not having that conversation with them and just like letting it go very often.
00:41:44
Speaker
Right. makes sense. You know? Yeah. No, that's what said. What's the point? You know, kind of thing. Right. There are hills to die on and you just kind of this is not a hill to die on because you've only got so much energy, so much spoons, you can only deal with so much drama.
00:42:01
Speaker
You kind of, that's what find. It's like I just let go ah more and more of it. If someone's being an arsehole over there, Is it affecting me? and Is it a big deal? me No, probably isn't.
00:42:13
Speaker
I'm just going to, you just be an arsehole over there. i mean, that that that's not right for every situation, obviously, but but i know but i just I just like, oh, drama? Yeah, no, I'm just going to go over here. I'm just going to kind of ignore that because I've got time.
00:42:32
Speaker
I don't have the energy. for it totally i mean that's the thing like i got to i we've discussed this in different episodes um in the past but i got to about 40 when i was about 42 i was um i had a massive crash and i was exhausted from um accumulation of all of these things you know like and for me It wasn't like I made a choice.
00:43:03
Speaker
Like, Oh, I think I need to deal with conflict better. It was, it was, said the choice I had to start doing it better and, and using my energy in a much more, in a healthier way.
00:43:21
Speaker
Yeah. And that conflict deal with conflict was a big part of that. Definitely. Yeah, yeah. All right. Have you got any other closing thoughts on your little thing?
00:43:36
Speaker
which I don't know. Built of frustration. Oh, yes, I have. It's quite a thing, actually. All right. There are. It's quite a thing. I mean, we've touched on this in other episodes, but I won't go too much into it but it is an important dynamic.
00:43:56
Speaker
Often other person and that you might be dealing with um on any kind of conflict they might be of a personality type that is the polar opposite of your own Like, ah you know, ah for instance, where we've got like ah narcissism.
Narcissistic Personalities and ADHD
00:44:19
Speaker
um Right. ah but You know, personality types. You know, um yeah all all of these kind of things, the personality types. A narcissist is going to be all over our RSD, like a nasty rash.
00:44:34
Speaker
And they could pick it up so much. And that becomes another thing. You know, you... you way have have conflict with this kind of person, it's a big test for your RSD, um big test for your people pleasing because there are those types that can sniff you out and they prey on you. So that's that's really tricky, really tricky. and Right.
00:45:01
Speaker
And again, but once you realize who they are, it's like I don't need this in my life. I don't need that drama. Totally. Totally. Go away. There comes a point where need to get as good as sniffing them out as they are sniffing you out, you know?
00:45:17
Speaker
Mm-hmm. um yeah yeah yeah and ah they're not always like those kind of like really kind of stand out personality types either it can be like softer personality types as well like some people are just really good at being passive aggressive you know they don't necessarily necessarily fall into being narcissists blah blah blah way overused kind of description of personality types but It can be just like a trait, you know, a personality trait. Like for me, passive aggression, I've had to deal with that in the past.
00:45:51
Speaker
That's a hard one, you know. Yeah, getting better, I think, out of self-respect, through self-respect, getting better at filtering out those people in your lives, you know. Right, because it's also people.
00:46:05
Speaker
Noticing. It's also people that have conflict with other people then come to you about that conflict that they have with someone else. And then they want you to kind of like, you know, empathize with their side and be involved in that drama.
00:46:21
Speaker
Right. when When the conflict isn't about you, it's about someone else. But yet they're coming to you. to kind of emotionally offload, to get support and all that kind of stuff.
00:46:32
Speaker
And then you end up, you kind of think, well, i hang on second, this person is always doing that. Like, yeah, they just, they just seem to like be like the drama because, you know, drama, um, is a really good, uh, gets, gets the, the, the,
00:46:47
Speaker
the the dopamine going so people can get very addicted to creating drama because it creates a dopamine and they're probably on that and then you end up getting in. Yeah, there's people that some people are just not interested in resolving it. They, for them, the thing is the talking about it is they're not, the resolve is like, you know, it's like, well, you know, if it's resolved, that's okay. But if it's not, you know, it's like gossip, what came to mind is gossip. People were like, are really attracted to gossip and they get into that thing, you know, despite themselves.
00:47:29
Speaker
And it becomes like something quite contagious in a way. All right. So I think, you know, have a look around your life. Yeah. See what you have to deal with, what you don't have to, what people what people you have to deal with and what people you don't have to deal with. And yeah, man, we could all better at filtering. Self-esteem, is umma you know, proving self-esteem is a good place to come from on that.
00:47:55
Speaker
You know? Yeah. It's always, it's not, it's a hard one, self-esteem, but yeah. Boundaries. Boundaries. Yes. Set them up, guard them, set them up and guard them.
00:48:09
Speaker
um Right. Awesome. Are we in a good place to jump in the tractor and head over to the post office? That little tractor seat.
00:48:21
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. All right. Let's jump in.
00:48:30
Speaker
um
00:48:36
Speaker
Perhaps I should have music for the the ah the post office. But anyway. Anyway. Anyway.
Listener Feedback and Creativity
00:48:45
Speaker
So we're at the post office.
00:48:48
Speaker
are. Which is at this point, this is where I say that um our listeners' feedback is really, really fun. And it so damn well is. no Feedback, we want it. We want it. Good, bad.
00:48:59
Speaker
We're not interested in different. Not interested in different. Just tell us where shit. a bit indifferent about ADHD. No, we don't want to. Tell us it's crap. but tell us Tell us why you think it's crap.
00:49:12
Speaker
We're medium. Yeah. Or it could be just like ideas for future episodes. Like, guys, you've not covered this. Can you cover this, please?
00:49:23
Speaker
And we'll cover it maybe. Okay. Guys, so um so can you stop doing one hour episodes? and Yeah. Or something. Anything. Yeah. Anyway. Can you waffle a little bit less?
00:49:34
Speaker
Whatever it is.
00:49:37
Speaker
Right. Well, we have ah ah aie ah Alexandra, our official town ah townna crier. um And in case you're interested, a town crier isn't someone who cries.
00:49:52
Speaker
They just tell people stuff. They just come out and they tell people stuff. um It used to be like the before printing um was invented. That's how people got their news.
00:50:08
Speaker
Yeah, someone would come out into the town square and then they they would announce what was going on with their taxes. Yeah. um um ah In our case, it might be so it might be the ex-town mayors, Martin West and Paul Thompson. They've just gone through the town hall again with their tractor, with the plough in it, and they've you know ploughed up the roads again.
00:50:34
Speaker
Something like that. Yeah. Headline news. Yeah. Don't feel bad about that. So, yeah, Alexandra has left a really nice message as ever ah t on our YouTube.
00:50:48
Speaker
um ah Because she was she was talking about reflecting on um the last episode about ADHD and creativity. And she never thought herself as being a creative person. But she I think she knew she was, right?
00:51:01
Speaker
She is. And, you know, she put down, it I'm not good enough. Yeah. And this like brought to mind um about drawing.
00:51:12
Speaker
There's no good or bad way of drawing. Just draw. it All drawing is good. There's no good or bad. That's why it's called art. It's not like accountancy. You know, it's not like the books are balanced. They're not.
00:51:25
Speaker
Any drawing is a good drawing. Just learn to love your drawings or whatever, however they come out, you know. Right. A slight bit of backstory, though. It's ah her mother, um if if I remember right, this is a really good artist.
00:51:44
Speaker
Oh, OK. ah So think she was like ah it. and There was that pressure coming down. Yeah. You're not good.
00:51:56
Speaker
You're not good. You know? Yeah. Whereas, whereas, no, no, whereas I think, I know, I mean, you know, she says that she really likes architecture and she likes creativity. She likes creative stuff and I'm, I know. Mm-hmm.
00:52:14
Speaker
i yeah I see a very creative person. And she said herself in that message, you know, she has a, she's a creative thinker, you know, there you go. That's all you need.
00:52:25
Speaker
And she was saying that God, her grandfather had to give up his creative career for economic reasons, which happened a lot, you know, in those days, it's like being, having a career creativity is a bit of a luxury, you know, even now,
00:52:39
Speaker
And she he had to work in a bank and she said it slowly killed him because he didn't get to be creative. But it was really nice. She was talking about always had really interesting brainstorming kind of conversations with the grandfather. It was cool.
00:52:58
Speaker
Yeah. So there's there's an outlet, you know, creative um creative um conversation is a great creative outlet if you haven't got a pencil to hand or whatever. Yeah.
00:53:10
Speaker
um Cool. And also my brother texted me after listening to the episode. So hello, Andrew.
00:53:21
Speaker
um and he And he said, are you, ah but because we we we mentioned that that we were we we had that we were thinking about writing books.
00:53:34
Speaker
We had that little thought. running around our heads. But keeping under wraps at the moment. So, yeah, so he was like, are you writing writing a book? i was going, well, you know, ah kind of write a bit and then I don't do anything for a year then I write and then do a bit and then don't do anything for a year. And then so, you know, it could go on like that for the rest of my life as far as I can ibi well work out. And then he was like, well, I'm going to give you your a hard time if you don't take it forward.
00:54:04
Speaker
i'll go like body double you on your book mate just know that let's just know that yeah just know that um yeah no uh and then and then then he was like yeah i'm thinking about about a book as as as well i'm like have we just reached the age where we kind of go I should write a book.
00:54:30
Speaker
Is that, is that what happens when you, when you kind of, can you get to our age? You kind of go, I'm going to write a book. ah I think there's an element of it. We get to an age where we realize that um all the blocks that we thought we had in the past don't actually freaking exist, you know?
00:54:53
Speaker
You know, say oh ah I'm not going to write books. I can't write. I only got a CSE in English. It's like, you know, grammar is like Ian, a great writer. you McEwen, great writer.
00:55:07
Speaker
He said, you know, grammar, you don't have to be good at grammar to write a good book. You know, if you want to start a sentence, you know, and right, begin a sentence with the word and absolutely no problem, you know.
00:55:23
Speaker
I almost think it's like, I think you you end up sort of with the feeling that you've sort of accumulated quite a lot. Yes. In your life.
00:55:35
Speaker
And you're kind like, what do I do with all this stuff? ah and yeah and yeah and Yeah. And you also think, well, you know, time's starting to run out a little a little bit here. So maybe now is a good time.
00:55:48
Speaker
Also, I think, you know, like you've kind of got to the point where for bunches of people that the kids have kind of now left home. So you've got a little bit more time on your hands. And you kind of go, well, you know, I've got this stuff and these thoughts have been running around my head for the last 20 years or whatever. long this Yeah.
00:56:06
Speaker
Jot them down. I'm not sure where you are with this, but I've trouble is I've got like too many now and I've got like, ah need to like prioritize because I've i've got about four or five.
00:56:21
Speaker
like live runs, you know? All right. Flipping and flopping around. And I need to like, I tend to think I need to like park a couple, like decide I need to choose. and Right.
00:56:35
Speaker
Two of them, otherwise not do any of them at all. That's the danger. That is the danger. I tend to like, uh, my process is ah don't kill anything.
00:56:50
Speaker
but I will find that I add to something more than the others. Like I'll just keep coming back to a thought or a plot or a thing or a drawing or a something.
00:57:04
Speaker
I keep coming back to that one and building it more. And then it just becomes bigger than the rest. And then just end up kind of going, oh, know what? afterll I'll just park those other ones. Let's just concentrate on this one. Because clearly my brain is more interested in this one.
00:57:20
Speaker
Sure. Just by the fact that it just keeps thinking about it more. Mm-hmm. Well, yeah, also because like sometimes creative process, and mean in this case, so creative process, you know, in this case, you creative projects, that process doesn't always have to be linear or, you know, doesn't have to keep to a certain time or rhythm. It could be like...
00:57:49
Speaker
It can go wherever it goes, you know, it has its time. Sometimes it's some projects need their time, you know, and sometimes that's long, you know. oh yeah.
00:58:01
Speaker
I actually worked worked out that I've been that i've been yeah've been working on the the first genesis of the idea of the book was like eight years ago. i think I said it was five. It was actually more than eight years.
00:58:15
Speaker
But you have an idea and then you and then there's like a year and you don't do anything with it. And then you think about it more. Then another year passes. So it isn't like eight years I've been working on it. No, it's been like a couple of days and then a year and a half and then a week and then a year and then maybe two weeks and a year, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:58:39
Speaker
And that's fine. yeah That's okay. Yeah. Well, for a lot of people, the process is is the art. You know, doesn't always have to be about the end result. not no You know, you get a hell of a lot of...
00:58:53
Speaker
stimulation from the process. Yeah, enjoying... It can be really interesting and not necessarily having a plan, which is great. It's quite liberating. Yeah, and hang having no plan is is is exactly what this podcast is all about.
00:59:10
Speaker
and so that just leaves it for me to say that ADHDville is delivered a fresh every Tuesday to all purveyors of Please subscribe to the pod... And rate us most awesome. um And feel free to correspond at will in the comments. But wait, there's more. If you want to see our beautiful, beautiful faces, then you can sally forth to the YouTubes and the TikToks. Or Sally Fields.
00:59:38
Speaker
And you can pick up a quill and email us at ADHDville at a... Good. good I was going to say well. You can email You can do it. Yes.
00:59:49
Speaker
ADHDville at gmail.com. But in the meantime, fucking kind to yourselves. And I besiege you fellow ADHDers, fare thee well with gladness of heart.
01:00:03
Speaker
Aw. Aw. There, says the mayor. That's that.