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Launching Forward: Emerging into Adulthood Part 2
88 Plays9 months ago
In this second episode, Julie and Dr. Hirt continue their exploration of emergining into adulthood, delving even deeper into the journey of overcoming obstacles and embracing the uniqeness of each individual's journey.
About today's guest:
Dr. Sean Hirt is a Licensed Psychologist & Practice Founder of Hirt Psychology. Dr. Hirt has an array of clinical experience in a variety of settings including private practice, residential treatment centers, non-public schools, and emergency shelters. He is particularly sought out for his expertise in treating and addressing anxiety, depression, poor self-esteem, behavioral issues, and autism spectrum disorder in children and adolescents. Other areas of focus include substance abuse, life-transition issues & trauma-related disorders.
Get in touch with Dr. Hirt:
https://www.hirtpsychology.com/sean-hirt
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Transcript
Introduction to Season 2
00:00:11
Speaker
Welcome back to season two of Outside of Session. I'm your host, licensed clinical social worker, and therapist BFF, Julie Hilton. This season, I'm interviewing some incredible guests who also happen to be experts in their fields. Mental health, motherhood, spirituality, and so much more, I can't wait for their stories to be told. These are all the conversations I'm having outside of session.
Challenges of Becoming an Adult
00:00:47
Speaker
Hey everyone, and welcome back to Outside of Session and part two of my conversation with Dr. Sean Hurt. We're continuing our talk today about how difficult it is to become an adult. For everyone, honestly, I'm 36 and I don't always feel like I'm there yet, but we're talking about those young adults who are having a particularly difficult time getting started, and honestly, how this involves the entire family.
00:01:14
Speaker
So make sure you go back and listen to last week's episode if you haven't had a chance to already. And I hope you enjoy today's episode.
00:01:25
Speaker
So I want to go into that a little bit more, just recapping what we've
Mental Health and Goal Setting
00:01:29
Speaker
talked about so far. So we've talked about there's a mental health piece to it. So if you have the emerging, the identified client coming in with depression and anxiety, that's a piece to work on. There's also like the goal setting piece of it where you're asking them, well, what do you want for yourself, right? So even identifying like, where do you want this to go?
00:01:49
Speaker
And then I feel like with the parents, there's room for work with not only them setting boundaries, but I feel like there's a lot of relationship building with the parent and working on clear communication, clear expectations, things like that. There's so many different moving pieces to the puzzle that you're working on. Yeah.
Breaking Down Adulthood
00:02:12
Speaker
So Mark McConville in a book that he wrote called Failure to Launch,
00:02:19
Speaker
It's a great book, but I think the way that he breaks it down is kind of easy to digest. So he looks at this as... Admittedly, I've thought about this so much that it's hard to know where his thoughts ended and where mine have begun. But I want to give credit where credit's due.
00:02:40
Speaker
Anyways, he kind of breaks it down into three sections, right? And there's responsibility, and then relationships, and then what's relevant, right? Or relevance, right? And you can look at this for both and I'll go with the identified client first,
Skill Building for Young Adults
00:02:58
Speaker
right? So responsibilities, right? This can be where a lot of like skill building comes in, which we were talking, you know, which I know we're going to talk about a little bit. But
00:03:09
Speaker
whether those are daily living skills, right? Laundry, dishes, things like that. Or employment skills, you know, how to get a job. Or, you know, academic skills, right? Executive functioning skills, right? So that's where a lot of like the social skills. But that is where a lot of, you know, there's a lot of deficit there.
00:03:35
Speaker
And again, we talked about this earlier, but I don't think that it's an ability issue the majority of the time. I think it's just an experience issue. So you have the responsibility piece and then you have the relational piece or relationships as kind of this next task that the emerging adults need to deal with, which is, okay, so you have changing relationships, right? Where parents go from the traditional idea of a parent to more of
00:04:05
Speaker
you know, what does my relationship look like with my parents now, right? As I'm emerging as an, you know, as an adult, right? And that's something that you'll see with both, you know, with both the parents and, you know, the emerging adult is how are we going to navigate this, this new like sort of coming of age, right? Which that's not new, right? Like that, that struggle is not new, but I think because it is extended, right?
00:04:36
Speaker
more now, it's maybe perhaps a little bit trickier to navigate. But the other piece for the emerging adult in relationships, it's in relation to teachers, right? Are they now, like old teachers that maybe you have relationships with, right? Are they now mentors, right? Old coaches, are they friends? Like where does that fall into, right?
Parental Expectations vs. Child's Desires
00:05:03
Speaker
And then finally, and we talked about this a little bit earlier, but relevance and what is relevant to, you know, the emerging adult. Not so much what is relevant, you know, by society's standards, right? Because society, you know, we still kind of push this narrative of, you know, you graduate high school and then you go to college. Well, what if somebody wants to weld, right? Or learn a trade, right? Is that okay, right?
00:05:32
Speaker
And so I think a lot of times, you know, in jumping over to the parental side, you know, helping them to recognize that the idea or vision that they have for their child may not be what their child actually wants to go and pursue.
00:05:49
Speaker
You know what that makes me think of too, is that when you become a parent, it doesn't come with an instruction manual, right? And you're just winging it for so long. I guess parents, that's what we all feel, right? But I think by the time
00:06:06
Speaker
kid turns 18, you kind of feel like, okay, I've got the hang of this in some aspects, right? But then there is there's this relational shift to well, now I'm the parent of an adult child, which is completely different than parenting a minor that you feel a different level of responsibility for. And I wonder if a big piece of this is just that parents like we don't have that conversation a lot about shifting from parenting to
00:06:36
Speaker
having adult children and how the relationship changes and what are my responsibilities? What is my role supposed to look like in their life? I don't want to have to tell them to do their laundry anymore, but I also want to be available to help them because you're not done parenting the day they turn 18.
00:06:55
Speaker
So I wonder if it's like this gray area for parents too, where they feel very lost and like the role is ill-defined for them as well.
Parenting Adult Children
00:07:04
Speaker
And so they don't know where their own boundaries are of what is helping too much to the place that you're enabling some things that you don't want to continue, but where's the line between you also don't want to completely hands off and say, well, I did it when I was 18. So I expect you to do it because like we said before, in 2023, that's, it's just not the case. It's not possible.
00:07:25
Speaker
Right. And that is, you know, I think a lot of times for parents coming in, they almost need permission to shift gears, right? Because we are so used to, you know, as parents that they start as minors and we're responsible for all of their needs, right? And so I like to go back and use kind of this language of, okay, what is natural and logical? So for example, in a roommate situation, if they're living in your home, right? If you have a roommate living in your home,
00:07:55
Speaker
Right? There are, you know, you're not going to so much get on to the roommate about their personal space, but the community area should, you know, should have some rules and some standards and we should all be chipping in. Now, if there are, if there's an odor coming from the room or there's bugs coming from the, like that, you know, then that's something different that, you know, needs to be negotiated. But so thinking really much more pragmatic and again to,
00:08:22
Speaker
you know, Mark McConville's credit, one of the ways that he frames it for parents is, imagine that this was your nephew and not your child, or your niece, and they needed to stay with you. How would things shift, right? Which I think just that little bit of separation kind of emboldens you.
00:08:46
Speaker
As soon as you said that my immediate response that I think of is that I would want to help, but there is a different sense of responsibility. Right. For how things go, right? Like there's a little bit difference of a, um, like I don't, I don't take personal responsibility in the same way. Right. You, you perhaps maybe what came up for you is like, I don't feel like I owe them in the same way.
00:09:15
Speaker
I don't feel like I owe them and I also don't feel like it's my place necessarily to make some of those decisions for them with which, because I've never been a decision maker for them and with your kids you have.
Technology vs. Traditional Skills
00:09:25
Speaker
And so maybe that shift is to say, I have to move out of the role of being the one that makes the decisions for them and instead help them sort through. Cause that's what you're trying to do is help them learn how to make decisions for themselves and figure out what that supportive role is. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. That that's such a simple thing, but like, I can't even like, I can feel that shift.
00:09:45
Speaker
Yeah. I remember the first time I read it, I was like, yes. Okay. Because it.
00:09:57
Speaker
It's almost hard to describe what it does to you, right? But once you kind of start to give a little bit of distance, it's like suddenly you have, because you do have a skill set, right, of setting boundaries, you know, with other people, right? That you don't, that you haven't, you know, grown so accustomed to being responsible for.
00:10:18
Speaker
And so I think it allows you to tap a skill set or to bring a skill set over into a shifting area of development within the relationship with your child.
00:10:29
Speaker
I mean, that's interesting too, because we could get all into, as parents, how our kids turn out, what they're doing, the decisions they're making, how much we let that influence our identity, how much of that we take on for ourselves. And so even when you're talking about child versus niece or nephew, I think that there's a feeling of, parents hold on to, is this a reflection of me?
00:10:58
Speaker
Yes. You don't necessarily do that with your brother or sister's kids. Right. Well, and to take it a step further, you know, if, if I'm a parent and I'm stepping in, um, or if I'm an uncle, right. And I'm stepping into the role, um, to allow, you know, a niece or nephew to live with me, I almost might feel a little bit proud of that. Like, like I'm glad that I can help out. Right. Oh my gosh. That's so different.
00:11:25
Speaker
Yeah. Sorry. I didn't mean to cut you off there. No, no, I, uh, that was pretty much my thought. Yeah. There's a sense of, um, I'm glad I'm able to help them through this phase. Let me give you almost wait for them to come to you. Like you kind of let it be, you know, let me know how I can help, but you kind of wait for them to come to you. Right. Right. Right.
00:11:51
Speaker
It's, so getting back to the bigger picture is when parents come in, they need some help too, right? Because really, we're talking about a family system that is going through a significant change, right? Even under the absolute best circumstances, it's still this shift, right? And under the best circumstances, sure, maybe that shift
00:12:21
Speaker
is a little bit less turbulent, right? But there's still going to be some, you know, growing pains.
Benefits of Gap Years
00:12:28
Speaker
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah.
00:12:34
Speaker
So I want to ask a question about, so we're talking about developing skills, and sometimes I like how you said that it's not a lack of ability, it's like we're all developing new skills as we grow, right? What are some ones that you specifically see that are potentially underdeveloped in this population?
00:12:59
Speaker
The first one that jumps out is just social skills. I think that for all the good that technology has done, it's also kind of robbed of some experiences. So when I was in high school and I would apply for a job,
00:13:20
Speaker
I had to go in. I had to ask for the application. I had to go fill out the application. I had to go back and hand it in. And a lot of times when I'm working with young adults now, they're like, yes, I put in 56 applications today. But it's just, they're all online applications and you really are sort of like this number. And a lot of times they feel disempowered because they're not hearing back, right? Oh yeah, absolutely.
00:13:47
Speaker
And so, you know, I think that that is another, you know, sort of area where you can really help the, you know, the young adult to feel empowered. Well, okay, so you send in the application, have you followed up, right? Now, in their defense.
00:14:03
Speaker
corporations have made it, I think, much more challenging to be able to follow up in any meaningful way. But I still think that there's power in saying, what do you think might happen if you go and just introduce yourself to the manager and say, I want you to know that I submitted an application? Because how many people are doing that? Right, right. But but if you ask, you know, like, I think that we imagine that that is an intuitive thing.
00:14:33
Speaker
But I don't think that it actually is. And before we were recording, we were talking about this a little bit. And I kind of gave the example of my grandfather. My grandfather would be able to go into a store, get an application, fill it out, say, my name's Mike, so on and so forth. But later in his life, we were trying to get him to use an iPhone.
00:15:00
Speaker
And that was incredibly challenging for him. And it wasn't that he was incapable. It was just a completely foreign set of skills. And I think that that's true with a lot of emerging adults. It's not that they're not capable. It's just that they don't have the experience.
00:15:21
Speaker
Well, and when you were telling that story before too, you were talking about how it's a different set of skills that, so again, it's not that these young adults can't, it's that what has started to come natural to them and what they've been practicing for a really long time, doesn't necessarily translate into the working world. And so they can do really incredible things. Like I know teenagers that can teach themselves how to code.
00:15:48
Speaker
Yes. And if they could figure out how to do that professionally, they would make a ton of money because if you ask them any my age to do something like that, I'm like, God, I'm stressed over the technology just trying to record a podcast, you know what I mean? But somehow they like, I have a nephew that like can teach himself how to do stuff like that all day. And it's just for him, he's grown up around it. He's like, Oh, yeah, it's easy. It's no big deal.
00:16:10
Speaker
But you're right, to be able to get him to do certain other things that come really naturally to our generation, because that was the norm and the expectation,
Making Skills Relevant
00:16:22
Speaker
unfortunately, 20 years ago now, right?
00:16:25
Speaker
easy. It's very different for them. And so I think that that definitely can play into the self esteem building too, is to show them you do have a lot of skill, you also have a lot of natural ability that comes really easily for you. We just have to figure out how do you translate it? And how do you use it for your advantage? Yes. Absolutely. And I think that when we frame it in
00:16:51
Speaker
Like I think technology is a good way that we can frame it so that parents and others can understand sort of this difference, right? Because it's something that happens a lot, right? I think a lot of parents could identify with feeling like their kid knows how to operate things better than they do. Absolutely.
00:17:14
Speaker
Well, and they've had the experience. They've had the repetitions, right? They've been able to practice that. And so they're naturally going to be better at it. Yeah, they're interested in it too. It's fun. It doesn't feel like such a chore.
00:17:28
Speaker
Yeah. Well, and you walked us right into the, to the third point, which is relevance, right? It has to feel meaningful to them. And if it doesn't feel meaningful to them, it's just, you know, another task that somebody else told me that I need to do with it. And there's very little connection to anything that actually matters to them. Right. Yeah.
00:17:56
Speaker
Hey everyone, I just wanted to pause for a quick moment to say thank you so much for all the love and support that you're showing outside of session. If you haven't already, do me a huge favor and hit the subscribe button. Give me a five star review and share this podcast with all of your friends. Help me take this show to another level. Now back to today's episode.
00:18:21
Speaker
I also like what you said before, because I feel like this kind of fits into relevance as well, is that college is not the perfect route for everyone. That has changed a lot. And I see a lot of young people feel like they're being forced to do four more years of school, and they just don't want to. That's not an environment that they feel like they excel in. They're not excited about it.
00:18:50
Speaker
That could partially be because there because college requires maybe a different set of skill as far as like managing your own schedule because we talked about that before it's somebody's not waking you up for class every day. So some of it is just like the organizational piece of it and learning how to study because a lot of us did not learn how to study in high school and then you get to college you don't know how to study so it's not that you're not quote unquote good at college it's just that
00:19:15
Speaker
It's just completely different, but I've had a lot of conversations lately with my son with my nephew About there's nothing wrong with not going to college That you can be incredibly successful not going to college and especially what you were talking about more of a trade school or doing something That a lot of people for some reason have gotten away from but I even read something the other day about go into plumbing welding and What was the other one that I heard?
00:19:47
Speaker
HVAC, yes. And you will make a ton of money because nobody wants to do those things anymore. But you can be incredibly successful in it. Absolutely. And the other thing that I think is underutilized is the gap year.
Alternative Paths to College
00:20:05
Speaker
So let's say that there's an individual and they've been in school their entire life up to this point and they're not really sure if they want to go to school and they're not really sure that they want to do welding or HVAC or a trade of some sort. Allow them to work a minimum wage job for a year and allow them to see what that's like and to see what the possibilities are
00:20:35
Speaker
Um, you know, if, if you don't try to further yourself in some way, either they're going to hopefully, you know, find something that they're kind of pulled to, whether that's, you know, um, and it could be anything, right. The opportunities are, you know, endless, or they could be, you know, they could have that year to kind of just sit and think, okay, so rent is X amount and I make this much and.
00:21:01
Speaker
My boss who's been here for 15 years makes this much, and that still isn't gonna really give me the type of lifestyle that I think that I want. Okay, so what are my options? And allowing them to come to that, to have the experience of working a job, trying to make some money and see how far that money goes. And then again,
00:21:30
Speaker
you're pulling on relevance. Suddenly, what didn't seem like a big deal, why do I have to go to school? Well, if they realize like, you know what, it actually will help me to make more money, or if they don't want to go to school, okay, maybe I need to get more serious about going to a trade school or getting certifications and whatever to improve my earning potential. But then it's their decision.
00:21:59
Speaker
And so, and I think insane, you know, if you need a gap year or two, like from a parent perspective, I'm okay with that. It would likely come with, you know, some expectations, right? In responsibilities around the house and those things. But I think that it could also be a really good opportunity to kind of learn some of the skills that they maybe didn't have, right? Because of the way that school is set up now and their schedules are set up now.
00:22:29
Speaker
and to kind of practice those skills before going forward. So that makes me think too that I wonder if kids feel a pressure that it has to be all or nothing.
00:22:43
Speaker
that you either have to go to, you know, as soon as you graduate, you have to go to a major university, you have to have your career path already defined. Like, especially if maybe that was their parents experience that they, you know, they've always wanted you to, Oh, I went to Georgia, so I want you to go to Georgia, I went to, you know, whatever school, I was in this sorority, I was in this fraternity, I want you to carry on this legacy.
00:23:08
Speaker
And I wonder if there's just a very black or white all or nothing thinking of if I don't know for sure that I want to do everything that has been kind of like the plan laid out before me, then I have like decision paralysis and I can't make it make I can't do anything. When there's this, there's a ton of gray area where at that age, you can be learning so many adult skills and things that can help further you, but just not all at once.
00:23:37
Speaker
Right. It's like that gap year can be learning how to manage a budget that gap year can be learning. Just like some of those, like an entry level year to adult thing, right? Right, right. And which is which is surely better than for, you know, their sense of self than going in and having the experience of, you know, feeling as though they failed, right? And needing to come home or
00:24:06
Speaker
you know, whatever the case may be. The other part is having all of that stress going into, you know, going to school, for example, if you're not prepared, is going to wreak havoc on mental health. Yeah, it absolutely is. I know a lot of
00:24:26
Speaker
probably college seniors this year, I guess, were high school seniors when COVID hit. And they had such an incredibly difficult time starting college because everything was online. They didn't kind of get closure with high school, you know, that took a really big hit on their self-esteem too. So if you have
00:24:50
Speaker
If you have a high school graduate that is not sure about wanting to go to college, I hear a lot of parents say, well, just go ahead and go because your first couple of years are your core classes anyways, just go ahead and go knock those out. I'm sure this is case by case, but is that something that maybe you would advise against just because it would put them in that stressful environment that they don't feel like they're buying into, they don't feel like they're making that choice for themselves?
00:25:15
Speaker
Totally case by case. Just last night I was talking to a parent about the possibility of a gap year for someone. Earlier yesterday I was talking with an emerging adult about the idea of maybe taking a class or two and working and kind of like to your point, one of those gray kind of areas to see what felt appropriate for them.
00:25:43
Speaker
So it really is case by case. And I think a lot of what I try to keep at the forefront of my mind is like, what is it that this emerging adult wants? Because that's where you're going to get the most motivation.
00:26:00
Speaker
Yeah, it makes me think I have a client who I started to see and she was really, really struggling in college and after a while we just realized it was because she had never once had the thought, do I want to go to college?
00:26:16
Speaker
And she was I think in her junior year and she hated it every semester. By the end of the semester, her mental health was just tanked. She hated it. And once we got her to a place to say this was never your decision. She had a really difficult conversation with her parents and they were like,
00:26:32
Speaker
actually we're fine if you don't, we thought you wanted to. So it was kind of this expectation on both ends. So she is taking some time off and she's working a minimum wage job and she has never been happier. She is thriving. She is learning things about herself. Her relationship with her parents has improved so much. She, oh my gosh, she has grown emotionally so much since taking that step back.
00:26:56
Speaker
And she'll say, you know, who knows, maybe I'll go back one day. Um, it just wasn't the right time for me right now. And it has completely changed the dynamic because now she's not financially dependent on her parents anymore. So she's been able to move out. She's been able to grow in so many adult ways. It's just not with a college degree. Right. Well, and what an awesome, um, opportunity, right? For her to kind of advocate for herself. And then, I mean, it's wonderful that the parents were receptive.
00:27:26
Speaker
And not only that, but encouraging because the implicit message there is like, okay, we trust you. Like, we trust you. If you don't wanna do it, okay. And I think sometimes that's what a lot of, God, it feels weird seeing young people. Which, yeah. But I think that's what they're looking for, right? Can I succeed?
00:27:55
Speaker
can I be taken seriously? Am I okay to feel this way? Absolutely. And I think that conversation was very scary for her. Yeah, I'm sure.
00:28:12
Speaker
I think I made it sound like it was very easy. And I think I made it sound very easy for the parents to say, Oh, yeah, we, we've paid, we've, you know, paid tuition for three years, we don't care if you decide not to go. So that was not an easy conversation. And it
00:28:27
Speaker
They responded very well, but it did take them a while to come to terms because for a while they did, you know, push for a little bit. Um, but I think you're right. Like to be able to say, I trust you and to be able to say we're still some sort of, some sort of safety net for you. And that will look different for every family too. But, but with that confidence, if I trust you, is it still safe to come to us?
Complex Family Dynamics
00:28:52
Speaker
You know, as you're learning how to be an adult and learning how to manage your budget and you are in an entry-level job, if we can help, we can have a conversation about what that will look like going forward. Right. Right. So trust goes both ways. Yeah, absolutely. And the other thing is, after having a difficult conversation like that, everybody's going to inch forward.
00:29:23
Speaker
at their own pace and speed. Maybe mom is all on board, dad is not. Maybe a lot of times what you'll get is kind of responses that are actually responding to the way that they
00:29:45
Speaker
maybe the young adult and or the parents would have responded previously, but aren't actually, that's not actually what's happening now. And so you have to kind of help them to see that. No, I know it feels like, or you kind of jumped to the conclusion that they weren't gonna be on board, but it sounds like while they do have some concerns, they're willing to support you in that for now. So I think that it's,
00:30:16
Speaker
It's very rarely a linear process. Absolutely. I feel like we could talk about this all day. But to wrap up, I feel like if anyone is listening, I think taking away that this is so complex and there are so many different individual things that come up, right?
00:30:41
Speaker
But I think if everybody initially has in their mind that this is a problem we just need to fix, and there are some of those feelings of I'm the problem or I did something wrong, I hope that this is encouraging to see just like everything else in life. There is no simple answer to this.
00:31:00
Speaker
Nobody is, you know, when you come into therapy, nobody's going to be pointing fingers saying who failed because that's not what this is about at all. But there are so many dimensions to it of relationship building and open communication, which is not easy for families, period, right? So whether it's this scenario or any other like family therapy is a thing because communication among people is so hard.
00:31:22
Speaker
And I hope that that's encouraging, not only that lots of things can change beyond just, if I could get a job, everybody would be happy. Because that's not, that's not, that's not the only thing that needs to happen here. That's like a side effect of the other place's healing. Right, right. And, you know, a job, right, just as an example, and this is true for I think everything, every single thing that we've touched on,
00:31:50
Speaker
But people think job, they think, oftentimes I think means to an end money. Well, there's so many things that job provides as well. Interaction with other people.
00:32:07
Speaker
the acquisition of new skills, structure, responsibility, doing what you say you're going to do, developing the muscle of probably doing some things initially that you don't really want to do. You do them because it's part of your job. And I think that's true almost completely up and down the board when we talk about all the different facets of emerging adulthood and
00:32:38
Speaker
the parents and the emerging adult learning how to navigate that. Yeah, absolutely. Thank you so much for sharing all of this. I do want to ask you the question that I've been asking everybody before we jump off. And that is, at this point, if you could go back and tell your younger self one thing, what do you wish you could tell him?
Embracing Failure
00:33:03
Speaker
It's okay to fail, just get up.
00:33:08
Speaker
That is super on point. Yeah. Well, that's right. Yeah. That it's okay to fail. Like we're using that as, um, not necessarily a word with what's happening with emerging adulthood, but we all fail at some point, right? Like we all don't do our best at something. It's okay. The first time I heard somebody say I've failed my way to success,
00:33:33
Speaker
It like my head spun around because I just, that was, that was not the way that I was wired to think, but it's true.
00:33:45
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. That's true. But I think that that's something that, um, when you're in those positions, you think that the people around you have never failed because we'll talk about it enough, right? Like I can't tell you how many times I've had to rerecord podcasts and how, how much failure there was on the way to having a practice and things like that. But we don't talk about that as much. Well, I'll give you a perfect example of a failure that's probably occurred as we've been recording. I tend to say right a lot at the end of what I have to say.
00:34:16
Speaker
if there could be a little game, I bet the over-under on that is I probably said it 35 times. Just while we've been recording. And so I set out and I wanted to avoid that.
00:34:33
Speaker
I don't know, I guess the listener will know if I achieved it or not. Yeah, I guarantee nobody noticed. Mine is always, you know, that's mine at the end. Sean, thank you so much for taking the time out to do this. I will make sure to put all of your contact information in the show notes so that anybody can get in touch with you if they have any questions or if they want to reach out for your help, but I just appreciate this so much.
00:34:58
Speaker
Anytime. Anytime. Thank you. Yeah, absolutely. That's all we have for you guys today. I hope you enjoyed this episode and we'll talk to you later.
00:35:11
Speaker
Thanks for tuning in to this episode of Outside of Session. Remember, while I am a licensed therapist, this podcast is not a substitute for individual therapy. The contents of this episode are for educational and entertainment purposes only. If you are having a mental health emergency, please dial 911 for immediate assistance or dial 988 for the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline.