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Season 5- Episode 19- Help Us Figure This Out (Premiership Round 15)
30 Plays3 years ago
It's the next batch of babbling fun from those American rugby knuckleheads. On this episode, we talk about the big flashpoint of the weekend from the Premiership at Kingsholm. There's also a matter of the happenings down at Devon as their club resorts back to old tactics in order to "create their atmosphere". We also have some left over grievances from Festivus that just needed to aired so forgive us for not sticking to the usual plan. Kick those feet up, try find something soft to throw in case you get upset, have something cold to drink and enjoy!
Check out the TFRY Patreon at https://www.patreon.com/TheFantasyRugbyYanks
Ask us questions via Twitter: Jarrod- jdyke8man & Ben- admrablsnackbar, and #AskTFRY.
Send us your thoughts for the show and questions for upcoming shows via e-mail fantasyrugbypodcast@gmail.com. Of course we welcome feedback via e-mail, twitter or by rating/reviewing the pod on Apple Podcast.
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Transcript
Introduction and Fantasy Rugby Chat
00:00:02
Speaker
It is the fantasy rugby angst. My name is Jared Dyke. I wanted to say it's stupid and let's move on, but then you kept going. I'm Ben Glauser. I don't like any way anybody gambled that. Collusion. Collusion. Hey, everybody.
Premiership Rugby & Champions Cup Importance
00:00:26
Speaker
Welcome back. It is the fantasy rugby angst. My name is Jared Dyke. I'm Ben Glauser. In we go.
00:00:32
Speaker
Talk about one more week of prem and then big champions cup week coming up here, kind of make a break for a lot of teams. Exactly. Or a fold for some teams, I think. Right. Some people pack it in for the, for the comp. Right. In your honors, go ahead and crack. I'm playing hurt today. So, um, I will be fearless. Yeah. Been there, done that.
00:01:00
Speaker
She don't sound like I did when I was tricking under the weather. Well, you know, I'm a prop I'm used to dealing with. Yeah, I ate something that I shouldn't. Like a puppy. Oh, yeah, I did that. I should have done whatever. I know this place. I'm here. Okay, I can live with it. But this means I'm not going to drink a beer tonight. Yeah, happens. Make sure that you grab
00:01:27
Speaker
Uh, our good friend, George, the fantasy rugby geek, a coffee or beer. Uh, however you wish to see it. I know he's, like we said, we, he's been on a hiatus for a little bit, but he'll be back and it's almost that time too. So yeah, we can't, I'm sure we all can't wait for the return, but make sure that he feels the, it feels the love with a, with a, with a nice little purchase there for him.
Global Insurrections and Historical Context
00:01:50
Speaker
As always on this podcast, there's no discrimination nor should there be in life or in sports.
00:01:57
Speaker
We had, almost to the date, we had another insurrection in the world that thankfully it wasn't here. Yeah, but run by the same people who ran ours. Right. Yeah.
00:02:11
Speaker
And nothing's being done still. I mean, you can go back and listen to our, we recorded the day of January 6th, 2021. So we were watching it happen, watching Washington DC in the background as we potted. So if you want to go back and if you weren't
00:02:29
Speaker
I'm familiar with that. It was a hell of an episode. But it's like two years to the day and nothing's happened. And these same people are going on to do the same things, not just here, but elsewhere. I mean, there's. There's the paradox of intolerance, if you've never heard of that, it's like it's OK to be intolerant of intolerance. So, yeah, we got to stop this shit, you know, and these people are
00:03:00
Speaker
trying, they're fascists, they're trying to create an autocracy that's detrimental to and against the wishes of the people they're governing. So, and they're just being allowed to do it and it's fucked up. Fucked up indeed. Please stop. Somebody with some legal power, they're right there, arrest them, put a stop to it.
00:03:29
Speaker
That'll be okay. That'll support you. You will not lose popularity for this. Everybody's waiting for you to
American Exceptionalism and Government Critique
00:03:34
Speaker
do it. Just fucking do it.
00:03:36
Speaker
Like at this point, people are questioning what side you're on now. So not a good place for law enforcement and a justice system to be. Yeah. Really don't need. Right. Because here's the thing, it's, you know, and I've said it before, it is destabilizing. You already see one insurrection without a government response that shows that the government is weak.
00:04:01
Speaker
And like Lula has handled this so fucking well automatic first days like these people did it. We got to hold him accountable. He fired security people. He's had him arrested. Like nobody walked out of that. Like they walked out of the Capitol. Everybody was in in cuffs or zip ties or whatnot. You know, they right.
00:04:18
Speaker
They dealt with it. We still haven't done anything close to that. No. So it's like, what does it say when we saw it in Germany a few weeks ago? It was Peru to like they're all handling it much better than we are. And, you know, for the greatest country in the world, it's I mean, I have not believed that for a long time. Right. There's there's no way to there's no way to believe that. Well, other than just blind.
00:04:40
Speaker
Well, that's an unpopular opinion or not. I've not believed that for a while. Right. You know, it seems like American exceptionalism is the we're America. We don't have to do that. Yes, you do. Eventually, the people are going to create their own justice. They don't feel like you're getting it done. Read a history book.
00:04:57
Speaker
Yeah, it ends poorly usually.
Rugby Refereeing Issues: Gloucester vs Saracens
00:05:00
Speaker
Right. Like I went to a private prep school. They taught us if we wanted to how to take over the world. And a lot of that was don't make these mistakes. And our government is making fucking every single one of them. So it's annoying. Like I was brought up to not do this. It's like offensive to my education that this is what we're seeing. Yeah, it's. It's beyond ridiculous. Yeah, we're still here talking about this shit.
00:05:28
Speaker
Like talking about, I was trying to loop that into the Owen Farrell shoulder charge. No, but we'll get to that when we get there. We're back talking about that again. We're getting there.
00:05:45
Speaker
Before we get to that, let's talk about our Patreon a little bit. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. We have that still out there. I got boom-bussed up in a timely manner this week, actually. Well done. I prioritized things, you know? Yeah. I don't have to sheet up, but I'll get that done. I have a few weeks for where it's really relevant. Yeah, for everyone to look at the analytics.
00:06:10
Speaker
Also, I will put out rankings again for Champions Cup stuff this week. It's going to be very interesting to see who gets placed where and all the positions and stuff. The really fun times is going to be when we have super rugby.
00:06:23
Speaker
Six Nations and Prem all going for at once. Although I don't think there's as many weeks going with Prem as along with Six Nations, but still. Once will be interesting. 24th. Okay. Yeah. We have time. We have time. Yeah. I looked at that when I was trying to figure out.
00:06:45
Speaker
when we're going to draft for six nations. So I was like, all right, let's make sure we're not like having to do back-to-back day drafts or weekends even. Nope, loads of time. We got time. So we'll sort that out then. But yeah, grab our Patreon and we appreciate all our patrons that are out there and supporting us. If you feel like supporting us, add yourself to the list. We try and put some good stuff out there. Yeah, I will put the super runbie
00:07:13
Speaker
Analytics from the last year up onto the patreon for for everybody to see As your draft prep I'll get that up as we head into that so that'll be a little tidbit it'll show you what we do and You know a little preview of what's to come and the shit you can learn from it. Yeah Of course, there will be some players missing but we knew that's right. It'll just be like oh, yeah because they had they did have players miss it was
00:07:40
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. There was a pretty decent actually some super rugby players this week or this, um, this off season here. Yeah. Yeah. It'll be last year stats, but it'll be, but still you'll get, you'll get the hint. Yep. You get the hint. Let's dive into. Premiership because there's plenty of talking points in many of the matches. So let's get into that before we, um,
00:08:04
Speaker
I think there's one resounding echo from all of these matches, and that's that the refs just fucking bottled it. Yeah, a lot of them did. They really did. We'll start Friday night with glosser and series, which is obviously the big sparking point for all of this right now. I'll address the elephant in the room in a little bit with, like, here's a hint, Carl Dixon.
00:08:33
Speaker
When you've got both captains in your ear constantly to the point where you have to talk to the two of them about it, that should be a hint that you're probably having a bad day. And he was having a very bad day. He was awful. And that was way before the incident that everybody's talking about. It was garbage up until that point and that just was the shit cherry on top of the garbage cake.
00:09:01
Speaker
Like I think, so my personal opinion of this is that in the, in the Farrell decision that came out, one of the things was that it not did not impact the game. Um, like, well, to me, that's the, the league say the premise saying, look, this match was cocked from the start. It's been, it didn't affect the game. And that's the truth. Right. Did like considering the shit that Dick, uh, Dickens, Dixon, Dick skin,
00:09:29
Speaker
pulled in the first half. The what was it the end into the second with the, the Gloucester knock on in the saris end, and then the saris knocked it on like a few meters back. And he's like, Oh, no knock on Gloucester ball it's like, got that wrong. The Lewis Ludlow laying behind the rock.
00:09:51
Speaker
when the Sarries want quick ball and they have a scoring opportunity and he just gives a, that should have been a yellow easily. And yeah, Jamie George, like Jamie George was mad at him because you just let him do it with no real repercussions. And it's like, so, and then the, what was it? The, the, um, Valor Pava Ruskin, like how he had like five bites at the apple. It was, Oh my God, that was so bad. That, and like, that was in,
Player Perceptions: Owen Farrell and Comparisons
00:10:14
Speaker
that was in attacking territory. Like there's,
00:10:19
Speaker
Yeah, and he was when he was when he picked it up, too. Yeah, everything was bad. There was nothing right about that poach. And as I play on. Yeah, I like he took points off the board for Sarri's first half. He maybe allowed them to have points in the second, you know, the late in the second half. But OK, then it's all even like there's these things called make up calls. It's like you fuck one thing, but then you get this other, you know, you call it the other way for the other team. Right. And that's fine.
00:10:46
Speaker
You know, you feel hard done by in this match, I re-round my brain to Dan Kelly, what would have been a red card against Sarri's last year in the closing moments of the game at Wellford Road.
00:11:00
Speaker
would have affected the outcome. But still, like, Saracens didn't do enough. And yes, I was annoyed at the time. And I can, I can, you can probably rewind the tape and hear how annoyed I was. But in the end, to leave yourself in that type of situation is really like up to you. And let's be honest, Saracens were pretty much garbage for most of the night. Farrah was awful. Yeah.
00:11:24
Speaker
Gloucester weren't that good though. But Gloucester was equally as trash too. So you want to put someone to the sword, you want to put the champions to sword, put them away, put them away, you know, or not champions, but the number one team, sorry, not champions, but you won't put the number one team in the league away.
00:11:40
Speaker
You know, you know, put him put him away early. You know, don't don't don't leave it till for some decision of the referee, no matter how garbage he is and he's garbage. There's no question about it. Like we had a chat about that in our group. Like he should be stood down for at least a week or two. And I totally am agreement. You know, it's not his first one. He just had the incident with Marler that he was just like, oh, you're nothing. Like, correct. And he wasn't good that game. Like there's something wrong there.
00:12:09
Speaker
that needs to be set right. There's something going wrong with Karl Dickson. It's not right. He's got to fix it. Now, I do want to address the high tackle because itself, because to me, that's a yellow.
00:12:23
Speaker
It's not a red, everybody, and the ban is fine because they need to take that hit out of the game. And Farrell did one thing wrong in that tackle, and that was he dropped his head. He wasn't, and we'll talk about a similar incident with that later, but he wasn't really looking at what he was hitting. And so he glanced, he got a good shot at the head, but it wasn't like, to me, that's not a high degree of danger. There's head contact, but it's a scrape more than a,
00:12:53
Speaker
Like I wasn't convinced to the high degree of danger of that. Yeah. So to me, it's like it's not foul play because he's low. It's not a high. It's not a high degree of danger because it's not like he's a swinging arm or like a shoulder. He's wrapping up. He's like, you know, he's bent over the players running in with his head down, too. And that's hard to touch at that point. You know, yeah, you got to kind of chop him. So, yes.
00:13:16
Speaker
kind of bad technique on both players but and Farrell needs to be the one controlling it so yeah ban him I'm fine with that I think it's a fine outcome yeah he needs to he it does need to come out of the game right but I think people are making too big a deal of it well I think people we I mean it's been an obvious discussion there's a lot of factors at play here yeah with Farrell himself one I think a lot of people are still holding the Charlie Atkinson hit a few years ago likely
00:13:42
Speaker
Dude, he did a long ass band for that. So trust me. And as soon as he did it, he realized, oh, I totally fucked this up too. So it's, you know, so it's not like he's sitting there protesting his innocence on that one. But also, you know, he's a very polarizing character because one, he's the England captain and two, because he plays for Saris, you know, people love to shit on Saris and hate on Saris. I eat it for breakfast personally, but you know, that's how it is.
00:14:08
Speaker
Yeah, it's like here, he's Tom Brady on the Patriots, if you're American and have never paid attention to rugby before. Tom Brady, Patriots, you know, same kind of attitude towards, you know, same attitude in some ways. But like, you know, people like to see Patriots lose, people like to see Tom Brady, you know, whining and crying on the field after a loss.
00:14:31
Speaker
or after a hit, after he gets touched. Farrell has that same kind of touch point with people and the Sarries too. Like, we get it. They're good. But yeah. But it's like, play better. Like if Gloucester just played their balls off and played really well,
00:14:49
Speaker
They win that game going away. Because as you said, played above average, they didn't even need to play that well. The Saracens were not good that day. No, you know, they just need to play slightly above average. Instead, they played as much trash as the series were playing. So, right. You know, what are you going to do? But on the on the Brady Farrell thing, I will say that there's probably a contrast in the two of them with in terms of what their teammates think of them and what the people that play against them think of them. There's respect for Tom Brady, but not a lot of people like him.
00:15:19
Speaker
And from what I understand, in terms of like the players and stuff, a lot of people would have Owen Farrell as their teammate from what's been said in the media over the years. And, you know, we talked about like, look back at
00:15:35
Speaker
The most recent line store, but I think even before that, like people wanted him on the leadership panel, even if he wasn't the captain. So, and that's a contingent of players from three other countries that have never played with Owen Farrell outside of that, that particular team. So.
00:15:53
Speaker
That speaks volumes to me, and honestly, as it's been pointed out a little bit on social media as well, that's all he cares about, and I am with that. Like, yes, I want, you know, it's nice to be in the limelight and to be, you know, good. We have characters in the game already, so he doesn't need to be that. No. Could he be that? Sure. But that's not his personality. His number one trait, and the number one thing he cares about is, you know, am I respected and, you know,
00:16:23
Speaker
by my teammates and by the opponents and, you know, can I do I get along with them? And nine times out of 10, the answer is yes.
00:16:33
Speaker
Yeah, like he's not trying to win sponsorships and like shoot deals and whatever.
Critique of Rugby Commentators
00:16:40
Speaker
We have plenty of guys that do that. Mario does that for the series all day. And I'm very, very happy to see his face on every advertisement we possibly can get. Because he's fucking gorgeous. Like Farrell doesn't want that. And he doesn't like, I'm guessing it comes from being a second generation professional athlete.
00:16:57
Speaker
Possibly yeah, I probably saw you know and me and that and I think that was kind of how Andy was anyway, so You know, it's just not his personality and that you can't hold that against him and then there's this brings me to the last point though Which is a negative trait We need better comms These fucking comms that we get
00:17:19
Speaker
Austin Healy moans about everything. What does he do to show like, you know, nine times out of 10, he's saying something negative about the match and about rugby. Oh, we have this. Oh, they need to get rid of it. This is a problem. Dude, shut the fuck up. Get somebody in here like I.
00:17:39
Speaker
Like, you know, who actually makes me want to watch rugby. Like, I can't wait for Max LaHief to retire. Oh, it's going to be brilliant when he starts talking. You know, it's been been good. He's kind of he gets on the moon a little bit now and then, but he's mostly good. Mostly good. Yeah, it's usually when he has someone like Austin on the broadcast and it's just that energy feeds into it. And Dalalio has just been a fucking.
00:18:00
Speaker
douche. He's become a bigger asshole as the days have gone on. And I'm wondering if he's, I really think it's gotten worse since Washington under two because he did kind of have a hand in that. So I'm sure he's just like, just he's honestly not handling it well is what it comes down to, you know, and that's
00:18:20
Speaker
Pretty shit. Right. And that's but the thing is that that gauges perception. Like, I think the one time like I agreed with Austin this match was when he did mention he was talking about that. Maybe it was maybe it was lost. The, um, the Val, the repover Ruskin, they were like, well, I guess, you know, I guess that's not off your feet. And I guess that's not a second by. Okay. That's the way you want to call it. Like, but that's the right way they can that it's funny, because like,
00:18:46
Speaker
that was amusing and it kind of brought you into the game and it was like, what did the referee see there? Rather than the, oh, how do you make that call? Talk about it. Yeah, it's a matter of delivery. It's a matter of delivery. Right. And I don't disagree with that. So I think that also added to the whole situation.
Ollie Thorley's Impact on Gloucester
00:19:05
Speaker
They made it worse than it was. A lot of people are making it and continue to make it worse than it was. Right.
00:19:13
Speaker
But on the subject of actual match play, hello, how are you doing, Ollie Thorley? My goodness. I mean, it's no surprise if you listen to me talk, I gush about Ollie Thorley. He's one of the reasons why Gloucester have been my side piece, or one of them.
00:19:37
Speaker
I didn't just the no give to me. Like, dude, fuck you. I'll know I could do this. You don't need another walk in. Let me let me get on the board. Thanks. Got a handle. Don't you worry. I don't think I, you know, I'm not sure it was Ben Earl chasing him down. I'm not sure Johnny May beats Ben Earl, even with a five meter head start with Ben Earl's a frickin. He's a monster. He's a he's a bad, bad boy.
00:20:06
Speaker
And it was, you know, and I wasn't thrilled to see Taylor. I actually would see rather see Hallet and Taylor these days. Yes. So I'm glad that that change happened semi early for the series. Well, that was the thing. Duncan Taylor was getting the ball like every fucking carry in the first 10 minutes. And every time he did it, that something went wrong. It's like when he touches the ball, it was not going well. He's he's in Ian Witten territory.
00:20:36
Speaker
Getting up there. Yeah. I don't disagree. Don't disagree at all. The Gloucester have, they got issues that they do need to sort out though. Like I don't love, I like this back row without Jake Pledry really just makes me go meh. You know, I like, I like the, I do like Jack Clement.
00:21:00
Speaker
a lot. I would like to see him a little bit more because we know what Ben Morgan is going to bring to the table. He looks like an out of shape lock right now. It's not good. That's not what they need. And I'm ashamed because I love Ben Morgan. I've enjoyed watching him play. He was another one of the reasons why I liked Gloucester. And now I look at him like, dude,
00:21:30
Speaker
You play too much. You're getting too many minutes. You're a 10 minute player at the end of the match. That's about it right now. I don't disagree. Oh, and that was a pump, by the way, a dummy throw.
Refereeing Decisions and Accountability
00:21:44
Speaker
No, it was. That's the definition of it. And not only that, but Saris, if he threw it when he pumped, Saris intercept the line out.
00:21:55
Speaker
Right. And that's why you pumped. Right. So it's like, no. And yeah, Sarah says, yeah, they were really good at messing that line out. Pretty, pretty good. Um, Richie only another great, great performance from the guy. He's growing so, so much. And man, it's just great to have him back. You get called into Italy team this week. We'll talk about that stuff more when we get to six nations, but it's great to see that. Um, and in the end,
00:22:26
Speaker
Whether you love it or not, teams that land at the top of the pile find ways to get this done and, you know, put aside the fact that Owen Farrell may or may not have been on the pitch.
00:22:41
Speaker
That, that is what a world-class player does. He has had a bad day and I mean a really bad day overall. Like there's no, yeah, he missed some bad ones. Yeah. Thank you shed for respecting rugby's values. Quote unquote. I don't like the term, but you know what I mean? Anyway, point I digress. I'm for that anyway, but that's the point being, you know,
00:23:06
Speaker
only somebody of his caliber and somebody that is top notch can just say, you know what? I've missed every fucking kick tonight pretty much, but I'm going to nail this drop goal to send us home with a win from 45. It's no, it's a no brainer. I was like, Oh my God. And I was confused cause cause like they went back 10 meters on him. Like
00:23:31
Speaker
They were inside the 22. And then next thing you know, they're 10, you know, two, two or three phases later. It's like, this is not the way you set up a drop goal. Like they did everything wrong. And Faz is like, I'm fuck it. I don't care.
00:23:45
Speaker
I mean, as, as Gene Hackman once said, winners want the ball. Yeah. You know, and that's what you want. That's what you want from your captain, from your club captain, from your country captain. That is what you want. So, uh, loads of credit to Farrell. Yes, he's, he's going to miss three weeks, but you know, in the end he, he shook off what was a really bad day and was able to get the job done for his, his club one.
00:24:08
Speaker
the time came. So nobody else wanted to step up for either team. No, nobody really is like, I'll do it. Why not? Yeah. Not at all.
00:24:19
Speaker
All right, let's go to Saturday. I, uh, I half forgot what time this match started and I missed a few minutes of it. I was like, Oh, and I may have missed the best few minutes possible. So pretty much. Uh, yeah, it was 25 when I turned it on. I was like, Oh, um, I see it missed a lot.
Leicester Tigers' Struggles and Changes
00:24:40
Speaker
And I usually say that sarcastically, but literally a lot, uh, already had.
00:24:47
Speaker
two of the careerist hat tricks on the board. I was like, well, all right, here we go. So this is obviously a bad day for Lester, if you haven't picked up what we're talking about, Newcastle and Lester up at Kingston. Like I said, it's a bad day for Lester.
00:25:09
Speaker
really just puts under the microscope the losses that they've had in terms of player personnel. Borthwick, you know, to whatever extent you want to call that. Most would say at least some, so that's how that is. Yeah, but he's been with that team. They're coast, they keep coast on Bortho's presence, even though, or, you know, even in his absence, they can still do, you know, just work on doing the same things. That is less impactful than fucking Genj. Genj.
00:25:37
Speaker
forward Moroni is probably one that we haven't talked about enough, but I think you had a hell of a game this game Yeah, including a dry like that's gone under the radar a little bit. Yeah Lester centers have not been good this year, right? And Nadolo is is gone now so that options out the window Yeah, and this and obviously there's some injuries on top of it all so I I think there's I
00:26:01
Speaker
plenty to make the excuses if you want to. Of course, Lester won't do that and nor should they. But I think there's just a lot that you can look at and say, Yeah, this is missing. This is George Martin's hurt, who I think is really an underrated part of this team. I really do. I think he's he is a very good six. The dude tackles his face off. So and that does have value. And I know there's ways to fill that gap. But you know, when you have someone that's just that committed, it is hard to replace it.
00:26:32
Speaker
Pollard has not been firing, obviously. That's a huge issue for them. Yeah, there's lots to poke the holes into. Montoya's not playing right now.
00:26:45
Speaker
um that hurts a lot because they're that's because he's stupid good he really is and i saw something about dan cole back in the six nation squad like some i didn't i think somebody was just like hey maybe he has a shot it's like no no no not good there's there's enough tight heads that they don't need to do that
00:27:03
Speaker
Yeah, enough tight heads that can add keys. Yeah, these are good quality scrumager at times. He's had issues, but that's it. And I'm sorry that this, you know, this day and age, you got to do more than go scrum to scrum at an international level. Yep. Agreed. Agreed.
Newcastle Falcons' Inconsistency
00:27:20
Speaker
Agreed. And to Newcastle, like.
00:27:24
Speaker
We're starting to see it more and there's still some pieces missing. There's no doubt about that. I wanna ask you a question. Shoot. Cause again, we don't do hot takes on the show. Try not to at least. Is Brett Connan good? At home, yes, away, no. Yeah.
00:27:47
Speaker
I think that's fair to say. Because I was impressed by his performance. He played well. He's very... He's been much better this year. He's very streaky. I'm on the verge of calling him a good 10. Yeah, he's streaky. That's the thing. He'll hit a cold patch and you're gonna be like, what the fuck is this guy doing? Like, dude, we know you can be better. You're gonna be calling for Gene Schuman to go in.
00:28:14
Speaker
That's not awesome. You get him right. But no, but he's been good. He's been quality when he's on. He's very on. I thought he was very on this game. I still say Newcastle need to go back and sign Will Hadenwood. And I know he's I think he's employed right now by one of the championship teams. But that would they let him walk. And that was a huge mistake. Right. Right. You know, like that is the problem with Brett Conner now, I think, is that he has to play 80 every match. And he basically did all last year, too, it felt like. So
00:28:44
Speaker
You're going to get streaky when, you know, you play 10 to 15 matches in a row, you get tired. Yeah. So hopefully they rest in the sweep with them only being in the challenge cup. Also, I want to see a lot more Tom Penny. Yeah. Keep him back there at fullback. And I know that that's going to now be a crowded back three with the likes of him. Obotanbo.
00:29:05
Speaker
Obviously, Carreras and Radwan are nearly uncitable for their sakes. But yeah, I'd like him to be back there. Yeah, absolutely. Like, yeah, like they did. They had to over to Anbo as the fourth. Boom. You're set. You don't have to worry about your back, you know, your back three. No, I think that's great. Rotate them around every so often. I think that's great.
Rugby Injuries and Player Toughness
00:29:26
Speaker
Also, non-Ruby note, how crooked is Carl Fern's nose? They kept showing it on the night. I had it on with some of the youngsters. I was like, check that out, guys. And they were like, oh my. It's not quite tins crooked, but it's getting there.
00:29:45
Speaker
Yeah, but you're not going to you're not going to get that fixed until especially if you're ferns. No, don't don't fix that until you're done. Absolutely not. No way. No way. Even my little slight, you know, brokenness has been like, yeah, don't bother with that until you're done playing rugby. I was like, OK. I don't get it. I went through an entire over a decade long career, never carded, never broke my nose. I don't know. I playing pro. You also broke your face, though. Pretty good. I did.
00:30:15
Speaker
Yeah, I busted my face. I was like one of those WWE wrestlers who they kept the razors on him and every saw him. That was me. That was bad. That was a pretty bad one. The first time we wore those white jerseys down in was in DC or was that up here? Yeah, no, that was in DC.
00:30:39
Speaker
And I bled all over the store. I wasn't using the shirt. And one of the guys is like, use your jersey. I'm like, it's the first time we warned them. No. Yeah. Don't use the, uh, I mean, those are now just pretty much discarded, but yeah. Oh yeah. Those are bad. No, I think I, I think between you and me, I think I've still got more blood spilled somewhere. Yeah.
00:30:57
Speaker
The gash I put up in practice up in freaking, was it Malden or whatever it was? Or Zagas? I don't remember. Somewhere up on the west of Boston. That was bad. Yep. That was it. That's the one. It's Danvers, but that's not how you pronounce it. That's not how we pronounce it around here. All right. So let's go.
Exeter vs Northampton Match Analysis
00:31:23
Speaker
This is where my bone, the bone depict comes, comes from me.
00:31:28
Speaker
Exeter, Northampton. I'm having a hard time understanding how Saracens are the bad guys in this whole thing. We're Darth Vader and Lord Palpatine because we tried to take care of our players, did some wrong things, paid for it. And the overt racist,
00:31:58
Speaker
team of the Exeter Chiefs continue to just fly that right in everyone's face. And they're the good guys. And that's okay. Yeah. Did they miss something? I don't know. Well, they have lots of homegrown talent. Well, not anymore. A bunch of players at this point. So that's out the window. What does it say? Honestly, about the organization that all their young players, the first chance they get there, they're out of there. Hmm.
00:32:27
Speaker
you have. Yeah, that's, that's like, that's not good. It's, you know, I, yeah, they're all, and they're not really playing all that well. I mean, this match was too many since just still have no defense. No, they don't. It's like fucking cheese out there. They don't, they, the one from the other week disappeared. Yeah. And so yeah, but you're still playing the champ. You say they come back to it because they can't,
00:32:59
Speaker
They're so bad at mustering their atmosphere without it that they've gone back to it without, you know, so, you know, they might as well go back to the old batch because at this point, it's just. It's a farce. Yeah, totally. It's your cosplaying as decent individuals. And but so fucking transparent. Yeah. I mean, when you start blatantly go back to. Yeah. Yeah. We were told they weren't going to do it and they're still doing it because, yeah.
00:33:29
Speaker
That's another problem when you're not top of the table. It's hard to get people out there. So you got to bring them together with a good old fashioned racism. Yeah. Right. What is this America? I'm just, I'm baffled at why it's those two things. Maybe somebody can give me a little bit. Yeah. I would like to know because both were very good at the same. Cause I'm sure I don't have all the facts. Yeah. And they both were good. They were both assholes at the same time for, you know, what's yeah.
00:34:00
Speaker
Cause there's more trophies on one side than the other. That doesn't make sense to me, but okay. Cause here, you know, I know in like, I was comparing the, uh, um, you know, the, the Saracens to the Patriots. Well, it's like, we can all hate more than one team here. Like there's, there's other teams in the league that everybody hates. Back when I was really into the NFL, trust me, there were many teams I hated. Right.
00:34:24
Speaker
Like, should you love Chicago? Just as much as I love Dallas. I love to poo on Chicago. I really did. I really did. And I hated Seattle. I love to poo on Detroit and I love to poo on Minnesota. And I definitely did not like the Patriots because I had to live with it all around me the whole fucking time. And I still don't like the Eagles that much. I think some of the things that they've done, like back when they did the Chantal, I think that was pretty fucked up.
00:34:51
Speaker
the Eagles fan base, I guess, is more what I was. Yeah. Oh, no, they're they're. They're special. Mm hmm. They're not the worst, but they're they're not good. Not not good. Anyway, the two game. So as as bad as the Saints defense was, the offense wasn't that bad. They just didn't get the pass to stick at the critical moment. And that that was huge.
00:35:21
Speaker
That's what led to that very lopsided score line. I think they could have kept pace with Exeter had some of those passes stuck. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. We saw a couple of those passes from Alex Coles who did well to break the line as often as he did.
00:35:40
Speaker
But obviously just didn't find that last pass that he was looking for. And they're looking for it. And that is the good thing, I think, in terms of an attack goes. But yeah, as we pointed out, their defense needs much improving before they can even think about competing for another trophy at any point in time. Right. Because yeah, the defense alone is going to pull them out of games.
00:36:07
Speaker
Which like, like this one, it was like they, you know, their offense wasn't clicking, but you look at, say, I hate to go back to it, but Saracens when their offense isn't clicking their defense, just like how many times did their defense bail them out against Gloucester? Many. Like you need that. You really need that at this level and in this kind of competition. It's not like, yeah, great. You know, you can, you can score pretty well. You have, you have a decent attack, but every so often you turn into Wooster and
00:36:37
Speaker
You look like Worcester. I guess that's not a good thing in that. There's not much else to say. They, they, this, they were very Worcester. Saints. And that's, yeah, that's, and you're not going to go into Sandy park and play like poo and come on. No way. Like anything. No. The one thing I'm really excited for, for the sake of, um, Exeter is the number 15 shirt has stayed the same. It's been Josh Hodge the whole time. I didn't even give him the.
00:37:07
Speaker
Plaudits last week that I should have, but the kids played so well since he's gotten that shirt and just has had a really hard time letting anybody else into it. And you got to be impressed with the kid. And I hope this is... I'm more impressed with Baxter that he's actually doing it. I know. I can't believe he's actually let it ride, but hey. But Hodge has made it impossible to do... Hodge has not...
00:37:33
Speaker
He's been when we talked about this a little bit in the last in automations, but like he's not that good anymore. Yeah, he's more likely than not to knock the ball on instead of scoring. Like it was funny at first, but now it's just like, no, this is who he is. You know, he's not awesome. Hodge is just fucking quality. And you have to fear him. Hodge is not he's kind of reached that no stage. Yeah, that the pace that the pace that Hodge possesses is
00:38:02
Speaker
Deadly right and you know, even back with the series game like the thing that is hard the hardest thing about playing that fullback position is knowing when to Take the ball and scoot which is what he loves to do and being able to just grab the ball and get the hell rid of it So you don't put your team under pressure and I thought he did a pretty damn good job of that In a really bad team last week. So I agree
00:38:25
Speaker
um as well so i gotta give him credit i'm wondering if that's the reason we haven't seen harvey skinner you know it used to be harvey skinner and then joe for joe simmons at 15 yeah i feel like hodge coming on has been like yeah he's he's better at 15 than skinner is at 10 so yeah you can put simmons at 15 and shove hodge to the wing for one of the
00:38:47
Speaker
Guys. And that's you know, that's more about Hodge being really, really good. I'm glad he's held onto the shirt though. Yeah, me too. And I have to say I 100% disagree with the player of the match.
Player of the Match Debate
00:39:01
Speaker
I thought he was not that good. He scored two maltries, I think, and gave away a hat full of penalties and also was not great throwing. No. And he got hurt.
00:39:15
Speaker
Yeah, and then you get hurt after 56 minutes. That doesn't bother me that much about in terms of that. I don't care if you play 50. No, no, no. It's not about that. It's more that like. Dude keeps getting hurt. He does. And at some point, like, you know, I'm not I don't think he's I think he's overrated in the England camp anyway. So it's like I think at some point they got to be like, dude, you know, again, one of the most important ability is availability.
00:39:44
Speaker
And I'd like to see him remain healthier. And maybe start to protect himself instead of the tap and goes. Maybe let someone else do that because you haven't scored on one in two years. So it's done. Move on. And all you're doing is bashing yourself into it. And yeah, you get hurt. Sorry. That combined two things. Two bugaboos of mine. The picking goes and turning over.
00:40:09
Speaker
You know, doing things that get you hurt. I want to see him do less things to get him hurt. Yeah, I think, I think England do need to take the approach of take one of their established hookers and then bring one of the young guys around, like, like Blomire. Yeah. Jinx and Blomire, you're doing all right there. And in fact, at this point, even McWiggin throw him in there too. And Blomire, like, you don't want to throw, run Jinx every day, like, or every match. That's cool too.
00:40:38
Speaker
But Jamie George is a better hooker at this point. Anyway, I think so too. Let's go to Sunday. We'll go over to the stoop first. Quins and sharks.
Sale Sharks' Defensive Success
00:40:50
Speaker
And yeah, not pretty. No, no, it wasn't by a lot of means really. I mean.
00:41:01
Speaker
Sharks dominated the game for the most part. Well, I mean, when it's played in an aquarium, of course the sharks are going to do well. Yeah, it was pretty gross weather there, but. It's like a terrarium in there. And this is a portion of the game for Quinn's last year that was able to be handled well.
00:41:22
Speaker
and they just haven't handled it well with the wet weather this year. And I know Tommy Allen is not Marcus Smith, but we can't put it down to just that. And I'm sure the Quinn's coaching staff won't either.
00:41:35
Speaker
No, because Tommy Allen's an international fly half. He's he's he's still quality. Yeah, he's still and he's had his good games. Like he's been he's been streaky, too. Like he's gone up and down. This was a down and it may have been because of the weather or I don't know. It wasn't clicking. I mean, let's not. Let's not discount the that sales defense is fucking ridiculous and just hard not to crack. Yeah. They're just choking life out of teams right now. Yeah.
00:42:05
Speaker
And that's the thing, like sale, I think they're not as good as, like at this point, it's hard to say it though. I'm like, I don't think they're as good as the record is. They're, they're a solid team. They're, they're going to beat you. If you don't play a good, good match, they're going to do this. They're going to choke you out and just, you know, try, you know, they'll, they'll score their tries. Um, and just keep putting pressure on you, which is kind of how this one went. Um,
00:42:30
Speaker
You know, cause Quinn's didn't, didn't fight back enough. Like they didn't play well enough to beat sale. No, even though they were at home, like sailor or a quality or quality enough side that you can't play like that.
00:42:41
Speaker
Right. And they'll still, terrifying thing is they are going to get better because they're going to have Ford and quirky come back soon. And they still don't, they haven't had DDP available. And right. Fortunately, it looks like Tom Curry is going to be unavailable for a couple of weeks at least. Did Bevin Rod play this game? Sucks. He didn't. Okay. He did. He's been in and out. He came off the bench. Okay.
00:43:03
Speaker
But yeah, I think the biggest position that they need to get back in order to fire a little better is nine, because I don't love this war. And they have nobody else after that now that Joe Simpson's gone. Right. The hell is he good for? Right. But how was Manutu Oglagi not sighted even? How is that just like a that's nowhere near a play on? He does everything wrong.
00:43:32
Speaker
He lowers his head, he ducks, he changes, he throws his shoulder first. Like, that is not the way you come out of attack. You know, you pull out of attack. That's like, he was, he committed and he just want, you know, not that. Yeah, to me, it was about the same as Ben Earl the other week and that, that got red carded. And I know Ben Earl was free to play afterwards, but still it should have been looked at. And that's the fact that it wasn't looked at was pretty poor. Right. And the only reason I think it's, yeah, I,
00:44:03
Speaker
I think this was worse than Earl because he kind of just launched him. So like Earl was kind of going for the tackle, but he was also like bracing. He was soaking it a little bit. He was just trying to give a little bit into it so he doesn't just get completely bowled over to it was just flying. No regard, completely reckless, out of control and had no care for any player welfare. And that's that's to me the difference to it was was advancing on and running into the hit. Earl had his feet planted.
00:44:32
Speaker
So to me, it's worse. But either way, to not look at it and then to not cite it, especially when there's the high profile Owen Farrell thing from the weekend, how is that? There's a double standard here.
00:44:53
Speaker
that I don't like. Yeah, no, and there's, I have a lot of issues with the sightings in general these days, because yeah, rewind a few weeks ago when the champions cup, Scott Baldwin's choking out Paul Wilms on the field and that gets nothing. Yeah, I really, I don't know who's in charge of looking at these things. But to me, that's a huge oversight. Like, that's not even part of rugby. That is you're being a dickhead. Yeah. And that is bullshit. So,
00:45:21
Speaker
It needs to be cleaned that that along with the refereeing obviously is in the kind of goes hand in hand needs to be cleaned up. If we're going to have, you know, any sort of continuity going forward, and we can piss them on about schedules and whatever. But you know, if the officiating and things aren't at least semi on the same page, and we're not, you know, trying to apply same if not similar standards to everything across the board, it doesn't matter. It really doesn't matter.
00:45:54
Speaker
Yeah, and that's got to come out of the game. So there should be a ban for that. My jaw's on the floor that there's nothing for it. I don't get it. It's like textbook, don't do this.
00:46:12
Speaker
Uh, more positive note for sale. I thought, um, you could have mistaken Ben Curry for Tom Curry, cause he played pretty fucking good.
Bristol Bears' Future Concerns
00:46:20
Speaker
Yeah. And Tom's absence, um, picked up all the pieces. So who knows? I mean, he's been quality. He's not never been like terrible, but it's, it's, I don't know how it's like. Yeah. He's, I think he's, he's, his only problem is that his brother's so fucking good. And it's like,
00:46:42
Speaker
Oh yeah, there's Ben too. He's all right. Right. Even though he's a great player in his own, right. It's just, uh, yeah. Yeah. Yep. And I would like to go to London and London Irish and Bristol, but thank you, premiership. Once again, for having a fucked up site and not having the match report available, you ask buckets and there's really nowhere. Oh yeah. Let me try.
00:47:10
Speaker
How much am I, I work around. Maybe that'll work. Sometimes it does. There it is. Go to the Bristol bears page and then we'll give you the match report. All right. I'll try that. That's really annoying though. Yeah. There it is. That's so annoying.
00:47:36
Speaker
Anywho, all right, there we go, we got there. Shouldn't take a work around that. I think I want to more point out how poor Bristol have been these days, because I don't think the Exiles played particularly well, the exception of a couple of guys. It seems no matter what they throw out there for Bristol, it's like,
00:48:03
Speaker
it's 50, 50, maybe even 40, 60, that they're gonna have a really bad performance, 60%, or a decent to quality performance, 40%. And that's just...
00:48:18
Speaker
I'm sure Pat Lamb's ready to fire rockets up bombs and all that shit, but like. Pat Lamb is having like the equivalent, the real life equivalent of the like worst fantasy sports luck ever. Like, you know, they constantly leaving the 30 point guy on your bench kind of thing and starting the guy who gets, you know, two points. It's like, like you said, like every time he puts someone in, it's not, it's,
00:48:48
Speaker
it's not quite working or it works and then it doesn't, it's just inconsistent. But I don't know at this point who else can put in because none of them, I don't, who from Bristol are having, or is there having like a good season? I mean, you could make the argument for Ken, but he's already been established, so it's not really. Right. And I don't know, he hasn't, I feel like he hasn't played as much. So it's like not, not certainly not as much as when he was with, with Lester. Um, we'll get back into it, but.
00:49:16
Speaker
He hasn't been like a wow, got to have him guy this year. I like, you know, rad radros back. He's still, you know, he's, he gets a pass for now, but like, yeah, I don't know. Maybe Toye has played somewhat decently. I've liked him, but again, Justin to the team now. Now he's out for a bit, so. Yeah, Vui, Luitua, Keenan, Bradbury's played well.
00:49:45
Speaker
Yeah, I thought he was, I thought leading up to automations, he was actually one of the best players on Bristol without a doubt. And the fact that he didn't get a shake for the Scotland team was pretty bullshit. Yeah. So it's just, it's tough when your players aren't, aren't producing.
London Irish's Emerging Talent
00:50:02
Speaker
Really is. So I'm hopeful Pat, obviously everybody should know, I would know by now, but I'm hopeful Pat'll get it fixed. So.
00:50:11
Speaker
Just not this year. Probably not this year, but, and I know, um, the brass at Bristol are big into Pat Lam anyway. So he'll get, he'll get some, a stay of execution. There's no reason to worry that. Right. He's still a perfectly fine coach. It's like, I'd say he gets till next year. Like if you fuck, if it's still fucked up next year, then maybe the seat gets hot. Right.
00:50:42
Speaker
three. Yeah, for the exiles. They they found they they seem to have just found keep finding back three players. Like we have, you know, we have Arendelle who's on the shelf right now. But then you have loader and now you have Sinti who's just been playing spectacularly the last few weeks. Best position without does wing belongs nowhere near an outside center spot, but
00:51:12
Speaker
did a really good job with that. Hassell Collins is who he is. Ben Hard's been unbelievable. He's still been great for this team and that's without, this is all without Curtis Rona either. Right. And they did it without really a big cog. Rory Jennings had a hell of a shift of 10 and maybe he should play there over the other guy who has been playing like shit this year. Yeah. No, he won't get an argument out of me for that whatsoever.
00:51:42
Speaker
I still have mixed feelings about this back row. I have mixed feelings about the front row. Yeah. And I also have mixed feelings about the back row, too. I'm not. Rodgerson is a jag to me. Yeah. I love this cunning himself character. I love Gonzalez. I like Basham and I like Pearson.
00:52:06
Speaker
But like, you know how we were talking about, you know, you can rotate people around. I still think their best lineup would be Gonzales, Pearson and Cunningham South at eight. Yeah, I would love to see that. Or if you don't like that Cunningham South at six and, you know, Pearson at eight or something. Yeah.
00:52:27
Speaker
Whatever. Stick Basham on those three. Go back to a five three. Right. Well, Basham can. Yeah, you can. Yeah, he's kind of chunk, huh? I was thinking like he could be and he could be your fourth. I like him better than I like Rogerson. But yeah, yeah, I also like Rogerson a little bit. Right. I like him when I say that as a jag, it's like respectful. Like I like him, but he's not he's not what the other guys are. No, no, I agree. I agree with that.
00:52:58
Speaker
Yeah, so we'll see. Yeah, I don't know why, why Oliver Hoskins hasn't been able to get much playing time. I don't know what's going on with that. Maybe injury.
00:53:13
Speaker
I'm not clear on that. They're, they still don't have creepy. I think he's coming back this week after it's coming back soon. I think his band's up soon. So yeah, I think it might be banned there. It happens. But hopefully those types of bands can teach you a lesson like, yeah, maybe I need to not do that no more. Yeah. Not bad. All right. And that is that. I thought you said we had a lot to talk about.
00:53:43
Speaker
Yeah, I mean, we rattle through it pretty quickly. But, Dan. But yeah, we did pretty well with this. Obviously next week's going to be a big week. We're going to have boatloads to talk about. Yeah, lots of Champions Cup matches. Champions Cup and permutations and all that shit that we'll talk about, you know, that we following as well.
00:54:10
Speaker
Well, yeah, so we're we're nearly there in terms of that Then we'll obviously have beginning next month. We'll be talking about six nations All that jazz Yeah, hopefully we're we're done with controversy for a little bit. I think i'm i'm good Yeah, i'd like to keep that to adult roar. Shall we? Yeah, you know and just talk about rugby And keep the keep the rest to a minimum
00:54:40
Speaker
So, but, um, if you're coming over to fancy corner, we'll see you over there. We got loads and loads to talk about. Many matches, many previews. Yep. Sure. And a little look back at them and all that shit. Yep. You know, but if you're heading over there, we'll see you there. We hope you are.
00:55:07
Speaker
But if not, we'll see you on the other side for next week. And we appreciate you all for listening to us and hanging out with us. Until then, talk to you soon. Later.