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Episode 19: Finding Courage
19 Plays6 days ago
We are back this week to discuss the many aspects of courage, what does it mean, and why it is sometimes a true testament to who someone is.
Good Morning, Gents! This is a podcast hosted by four Marine Corps veterans with the goal of uplifting men to be the best version of ourselves. In an age of high rates of suicide and depression, especially in the male population, we are taking a stand. This is a place that will cover all of the challenges and realities that we face in the current world, and how we can break down barriers to betterment for ourselves, our families, and the world.
A tragic suicide of our friend sparked an idea and experiment for us as we rekindled our friendship: A group text where we say "Good Morning" to each other every single day, and continue the conversation about what is going on in our lives, be there for one another, and spread positivity and reassurance. Men bear so much weight of responsibility in society that it is hard for men to have an outlet to express themselves. This has attributed to the vast number of suicides in the male population. We aim to cut those numbers down with this podcast. Between the discussions our hosts will talk about, and the guests we bring onto the show, we invite you to join us on this journey towards self-betterment for all.
Email: Goodmorninggentspd@gmail.com
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Transcript
Episode Return: Scheduling Conflicts and Travel Plans
00:00:07
Speaker
Good morning, Gents
00:00:13
Speaker
Good morning, gents. We are finally back with another episode. Sorry about missing last week. We have the four of us collectively been all over the place.
00:00:24
Speaker
um It's been very hard for us to line up a day in which we were all good. But right now we currently have three of us. We have me, myself, Tyler, we have Brandon, and we have Mac.
00:00:37
Speaker
It's going to be a good one today, guys. It's to be a good one. What's going on, gents? So I am going to London this upcoming week. And since I'm kind of the the editor of the show, we're just going to crunch out two episodes here.
00:00:53
Speaker
And we're going to make sure that they're both out within a timely manner for you guys, since we're not going to be able to record while I'm gone.
Defining Courage: Meaning and Significance
00:01:01
Speaker
So, today, we're going to be talking about courage.
00:01:05
Speaker
What does it mean to have courage? What does it take to have courage? And why is courage important? So, Brandon, if you'd like to start, what um what the hell is courage? Alright, the best encyclopedia in the world, Google, is telling me.
00:01:21
Speaker
That courage at its core is the ability to face fear, danger, or difficulty with strength and resilience. It's about doing what you believe is right, even when it is difficult or unpopular.
00:01:33
Speaker
It's not the absence of fear, but rather the triumph over it. I do think that's important to the whole fear aspect. ah You know, there's plenty of people who think that having courage is just this crazy bravado of I'm going I'm going to man up and I'm going to do this without having any kind of fear whatsoever and storm the beach, you know. hmm.
00:01:58
Speaker
But I think having courage really is doing something that you know is important despite your fear. Like you you have this fear to you for what you're going through and you know that it's dangerous, but you do it anyway because it's the right thing to do and you push through it while being afraid.
00:02:21
Speaker
And that is showing courage or If maybe it's a moral sort of thing where it's not literal danger, you are being courageous, although knowing that there could be some sort of social or economic blowback to you or your family.
Everyday Courage: Acts and Examples
00:02:41
Speaker
Yeah, I think it gets really difficult sometimes. I mean, doing, and I don't know if, I think I speak for all of us here when I say that, doing like the courageous thing, like saving the cat in a tree was something all us would probably do. I don't know all be climbing trees to save cats, but you know, that that that fear aspect of heights or or gravity, however you want to look at it, is one of my greatest fears. But I remember being, as a firefighter, I could go on the roof all the time and not even worry about it. But I go up there and clean snow off of a satellite dish to watch TV in the wintertime. It's like, I don't want to do that.
00:03:12
Speaker
So I think courage also comes into play in like your circumstance or the predicament you're also in too. And I've, I think I found it harder where you touched on moral courage. Like when you, when something's going against your, your, your own moral, your own ethic.
00:03:27
Speaker
I think sometimes that's harder for some people. um I don't know if I'd say that in today's day and age, because you see a lot of people that are very boisterous about their morals, but a lot of people that may oppose some or their own personal beliefs, they, they kind of just leave it alone.
00:03:42
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. it It is truly a rare quality to be able to not just be true to yourself, but be real enough to where you can stick up for either truth or the right thing.
00:03:58
Speaker
And it's not only difficult, but it's also a It's just a rare quality in humans when everything is pushing in one direction, even though it's the wrong thing.
00:04:15
Speaker
And you can find these rare gems in the world who are willing to face the adversity head on because it's the right thing to do. And that that takes guts, man.
00:04:28
Speaker
Just sticking up for what you believe or the right thing. like That's true courage. Let's unpack this a little bit. good We're kind of just trying to figure out where
Types of Courage: From Physical to Spiritual
00:04:39
Speaker
we're going with this. So let's let's look at the different types of courage out there. You have physical, emotional, moral, social, intellectual, and spiritual courage. That's that's what it's broken down into, right? that's Those are the categories they give us. sort So let's let's ah let's just, ah if you guys are cool with let's unpack one at a time.
00:04:57
Speaker
right let's go with that that sounds like a good plan uh sounds like a great plan yeah let's let's start with physical courage now i'm not going to look up what the definition of physical courage is unless you guys want me to you guys want to start there sure yeah all right physical courage facing physical danger or adversity often involving bravery in the face of harm now like reading that i look at that like You guys are firefighters. You've done that. you I mean, who the fuck wants to run into a burning-ass building? That's dumb.
00:05:27
Speaker
That's my opinion. Hey. Dumbest fucking thing you guys can do. But that's that's physical courage, right? like There is a risk versus reward there that you know that, hey, if this goes bad, I'm either dead or I am disabled to the point that the rest of my life is going to be a shit show and it's going to be hard to fucking live.
00:05:47
Speaker
But I'm willing to risk that and I've been in those incidences, physical courage, there's something that happens physical to your body too, when you're about to face that. you know like you almost get a You feel a little bit more manlier when you finally suck it up and you're like, I'm doing this, fuck it, we're going.
00:06:05
Speaker
And you just accept the consequences as are, and you go head on to the end of that. like Physically, whether it be adrenaline, whether it be ego-driven, whether it be stupidity.
00:06:16
Speaker
Let's not get it wrong. yes Stupidity and courage run very, very closely. and Courage, I think, just stupidity is taking out the danger in the fact that you're not thinking about it.
00:06:28
Speaker
Courage is you've thought about it, you know the risk, and you do it anyways. Yeah. so Like to me, like that's what physical courage is. You know how bad it's going to go, but you throw your body in there anyways, or you you run mile fucking two hundred fifty thousand miles marathon or you swim the english channel or you do something where if you succeed you come out endorphin high if you fail the the possibilities of what can physically happen to you are so substantial that it can completely alter your way of life and you do it anyways because you believe in it
00:07:09
Speaker
Like those guys that climb skyscrapers or base job that that French dude who balance beamed across the fucking World Trade Center. Yeah, that's physical courage. Oh, that's courage.
00:07:22
Speaker
Like, what was the point of it? To get a little start on? That's fine.
Courage in Relationships and Emotional Honesty
00:07:26
Speaker
I'm okay. but It takes courage, right? like or the People got weird passions, man. Yeah, I'm not here to knock anybody's passion. Not knocking it.
00:07:35
Speaker
Or the, let's do this way, the overweight, out of shape person going into the gym of meatheads. Yes. I take some courage. that That's courage.
00:07:45
Speaker
That is physical courage. Because if you fail, or if you think you failed, you're physically sick to yourself and you're physically, that that covers all the different types of courage. There's emotional courage in there too, but we're on physical right now.
00:07:58
Speaker
So you have to put your body out there and put to and do hard shit to get a reward out of it. And that takes courage. And that's that is the the person with a learning disability going to college.
00:08:12
Speaker
That is the poor kid trying to pay for college. That is the out of shape 45-year-old who's trying – to just lose weight and be better.
00:08:23
Speaker
and all All that takes an effort of physical, actual courage. You got to show up and do it every day. Being the steroided out big dude who fucking tries to intimidate some other person, that's not courage.
00:08:38
Speaker
No. That's just being a false positive. You've been so big that nobody's ever wanted to bother fuck with you. So when you try to fuck with people, they just leave you just you think you're this big, bad, tough guy.
00:08:49
Speaker
you're not That's not courage. That's fucking being an asshole. bullies suck dude we sited down building like yeah bullies aren't courageous you're just an asshole fuck you bullies what else you guys got physical Dude, I think you hit nails on the head there, man. I mean, shoot, I know friends of mine are firefighters, friends of mine are cops.
00:09:08
Speaker
know That's not just public safety, but like you said, dude, I think the best one that you hit on the head there is that person making taking that step to like physically put themselves out there in a place where you think you're going to get hurt because you see all these people, like all these influencers and all these YouTube videos and stuff, people acting stupid in the gym.
00:09:27
Speaker
toward other people you know and it's it's demotivating don't get me wrong but to physically nurse yeah nurses the signs up for a double shift i mean you know you're physically going to be dead after those two shifts should do anybody anybody that wants to work a 16 hour day or 24 hour day today you you got my you got i yeah you got my you got my respect yeah the blue collars like you gotta to get you You decide to go into the trades. You know your ass is waking up at 4 a.m.
00:09:57
Speaker
You know your ass is getting on the job site by 6. And you're going to work all damn day. And what's the repercussions? You're exhausted. check A good paycheck. Some good pennies. You get a good paycheck to feed your family.
00:10:13
Speaker
But physically, you are drained at the end of every day. Oh, yeah. that's there there That is a form of Courage to get your ass up and go do that every day.
00:10:24
Speaker
Even just being a man and stepping up for your family, knowing knowing that it's going to come at your deficit. Yep. That's courage because you're you're stepping up for others.
00:10:37
Speaker
Oh yeah. to be a good dad, to be a good husband, like yeah you're going to have to sacrifice. You don't get to be selfish in this game. Well, I think that's physical.
00:10:47
Speaker
I think sacrifice really seems to be the key word here. Whether it is physical or moral or anything else, there is a sacrifice to having courage. Yeah.
00:10:58
Speaker
For me, with the whole physical courage, yeah, I will run into a burning building. If especially if I know there are people in that building who are trying to get out or who just couldn't make it because that's just who I am as a person in wanting to serve. Just, you know, same thing i as.
00:11:21
Speaker
me with the military like service is my entire life and being there for other people makes me whole and know that my life is worth it by being there for others in the most selfless way But at the same time, I'm also terrified.
00:11:42
Speaker
One, I'm still three... I'm three years on the job. I'm not the most experienced firefighter there is. There's a lot I still have to learn, and I am by far not an expert.
00:11:54
Speaker
And there's some guys on the job who I really look to for more of that wisdom, and I'm glad that they're around me when I get into these kind of situations. But two... There are some really shitty ways that I don't want to fucking die on this damn job. I do not want to run out of air in a building and fucking suffocate. Like, that is my spit yeah that is my biggest fear.
00:12:18
Speaker
Suffocation, for whatever reason, same thing as, like, drowning, are my two, like, I don't want to run out of air. that Either way, you suffocate because you leave your mask on or you drown because you take it off and your lungs blister up.
00:12:30
Speaker
but So it's like, I'm not even thinking about the flames, which also burning to fucking death would really suck. But I'm thinking like, I have this 30 minute bottle of air, which really you only get like 20 minutes and I fucking suck down air.
00:12:48
Speaker
And if I get disoriented in a building, like, yeah, I could call a mayday, but who's to say that they're going to get to me in time, depending on the situation or if a fucking wall comes down on me or whatever, like,
00:13:00
Speaker
it It's a terrifying prospect, and I am terrified of it. I'm not going to lie. It is very scary to me to be facing these situations, possibly.
00:13:10
Speaker
you know it's Every day is an unknown. When I go into work, I have no idea what's going to happen that day. But it is a risk I am willing to take for the greater good and because I love to s serve.
00:13:24
Speaker
I think that's well put, man. Well put. Very well put. All right, let's move in the next one. Emotional courage, facing our fears and vulnerabilities like confronting difficult emotions or expressing feelings honestly.
00:13:38
Speaker
And I am going to assume that this is the courage that most of us lack the most in. how they agree. Yes, I would say, especially a type A personality, we you can put us in shootings. You can let us fight the big guy. You can put us in burning buildings, whatever.
00:13:59
Speaker
Yeah, we we might tinkle our pants a little bit, but we're probably going to do it. maybe It's probably ego-driven there. But you want us to be emotionally vulnerable, available, and confront and express is the key word there.
00:14:15
Speaker
Are feelings honestly there? I will be the first to admit I am trash. I have been working on it. and I've paid the professionals, but every time I do it, if I say what I'm really feeling, like I get that immediate fear of negative feedback.
00:14:34
Speaker
Yeah. Like it is a meat. It's almost sickening. Like it is. If I'm like, Hey, I'm feeling this way. And this is why knowing I'm telling that to a very nice person to somebody that actually cares about me and is not going to like belittle me.
00:14:49
Speaker
You still get that like immediate, like I just have like a sickening feeling like I am fully expecting a negative feedback. like when you It's like when you open up to somebody and then like you leave the area and then you just feel like that, oh, did I just say the right thing? Or like did I let too much of me out? did i And you know what? Normally, i think we we feel that afterwards. like it's that And I always fight a lot of my emotions with anger.
00:15:15
Speaker
So it's like I just get angry instead of like being sad or hurt or you know scared. it's just But I'm getting better at it. So I am working on it. I am conscious and aware of it. Yeah.
00:15:26
Speaker
Well, I think as veterans and first responders, we tend to be the people who bottle stuff in, who don't know how to express ourselves.
00:15:37
Speaker
And I think a lot of it has to do with trauma and the stuff we experienced and not knowing how to express it and feeling a fear of judgment.
00:15:48
Speaker
It's really hard to open yourself up. and be able to communicate effectively. Like for me, especially with my wife, I tend to bottle stuff in and not, I don't know the right words to say, or I tiptoe around things because I'm fearful of her judgment.
00:16:10
Speaker
And and it it takes a lot. And she sometimes has to pull it out of me for me to be courageous enough to say the words I need to say.
00:16:21
Speaker
it's a very important thing. I'm glad you brought that up because I think a lot of guys struggle with that. And honestly, I think it it leads to the end of a lot of relationships. It really does. I think, I mean, a lot of the a lot of factors go into a relationship, right? And both parties have to be, when a relationship ends, not once, okay, I'll take that back.
00:16:40
Speaker
When a relationship ends, sometimes it one person's complete utter fault. There's no way around it. And we all know those situations. But good, healthy relationship where there's nothing crazy like that going on when they come to an end, both parties are usually involved. But I think a huge thing always on a man's side is, and I'll speak this from being divorced. I mean, I was married over a decade and with three kids and i did the military, the first responder. Like I put myself into the traumatic jobs that are top leaders and and divorce in divorce and a ah big thing
00:17:15
Speaker
even when we would go try to get professional help is that emotional fear that if i said what I was really feeling, the hate and that might actually lead to the divorce. You know, like there was a fear if I actually expressed how I truly was in my ex-wife truly loved me, I could, could have said it looking back now, hindsight 2020, I should have said what I said. And yeah, it may have pissed her off for a while. She may have been mad, but there was a time that we truly both cared for each other. And I don't, I think it would,
00:17:45
Speaker
I don't know if it would if our relationship would have went down like it did, but i think I think a big factor on my side of it is I feared that like, hey, if I say this or and really express this, she's going to get pissed and she's going to hold it against me and that's just going to ruin our relationship.
00:18:03
Speaker
Well, what ruined our relationship is I just didn't fucking say it. yep And i think that's i think that's ah I think that's something a lot of guys deal with. I do, i think. And there's two ways to deal with it.
00:18:16
Speaker
I know that about myself. I have the the doctor, the psychiatrist. I mean, I try to find... That's courage you have to work on. That's not That's not bullets coming down range at your courage. That's that's like that's scary courage. That's what that is. That's terrifying courage.
00:18:33
Speaker
And so I know that about myself now and I'm trying to work on it, but dude, every time I still get that, like I'm with Tyler, like that hard fear of like this person I care about, if I say it is going to fucking, in it you be here and that's the crazy, cause you're not getting rejected.
00:18:50
Speaker
It ain't like they're packing their bags that night and leaving. no they're just processing what you said because they want to respond to you correctly but especially if you're an over thinker dude what are you doing you're like man fuck i fucked up i fucked up terribly how did i say that like what does that mean what is she thinking and you're just like every but and then you make it worse because what do you do when you start overthinking about what you just said you try to explain it you don't need to explain your feelings when it came from the heart and you said exactly which you said it how it needed to be said oh yeah and then you start explaining it and then it makes you so much worse and those are lessons like those are lessons i learned the hard way that i hope people can learn from my mistakes
00:19:30
Speaker
I'm glad you brought all that up because I've been facing a lot of those similar situations with my wife. And I really do struggle to say the hard thing that I might feel inside that, like, I'm worried how she's going to take it.
00:19:46
Speaker
And really, as I've discovered, especially recently, just with certain situations like When she rips that truth out of me, it actually ends up being beneficial to the relationship.
00:20:00
Speaker
And it goes a lot better than I thought it would by just fucking saying the damn thing instead of tiptoeing around it. Like... it Communication itself goes a long way in a relationship, but they might not like the answer, but by you saying that and speaking truthfully and honestly is is only going to serve the relationship better because it's either a hard truth and you work on it together and it's something that she can get over and realize like maybe where she can work on something.
00:20:36
Speaker
Or you can tiptoe around it or hide it and then you guys don't communicate well at all and then the relationship doesn't work out because you guys have shit. And my thing is looking at it now, like if you can't have those conversations with the person you're with, you should start thinking about the person you're with.
00:20:52
Speaker
And that sucks because you love them and you care deeply about them. But if they can't handle your emotions, that's not good for you. like That's brutal, right? Tyler, I've never met your wife, but she sounds great because it sounds like she took in what you said.
00:21:06
Speaker
She processed it. She knows you better than anybody. And she came to a solution that you that made you feel comfortable and got you guys over that. And now guess what?
00:21:16
Speaker
You have more courage to say the next thing. and build on that because she she's emotionally intelligent enough that she accepted what she said and maybe it hurt her feelings i don't know that i'm not going ask you to go into detail so maybe it hurt her feelings and maybe it took a night or two and maybe it took a couple days to come back from that but she had a process it her way and that's how she did it she did it but she processed it and then she found a way that both of you could move forward on it that made you feel safe and i think where a lot of us guys get into is we we've tried it maybe a couple times and the way whoever we tried it with did not let us feel safe afterwards and if you don't feel safe like even in a gun fight if you got a gun in my hand there's a level of safety there right because i can level the playing field just as well as bad guy can if not more because i know i'm trained
00:22:09
Speaker
emotionally, I don't feel safe, I'm not doing it again. Especially guys like me. i mean I'll be the first to admit guys like me, like, I'm not I don't feel safe with you. I'm not going to give you all that. And like, i' I've got a ah same kind of style. Like, I had a couple very embarrassing moment. The girl I dated after I got divorced, the there were some embarrassing moments in bed that at mid 30s, you don't want to deal with.
00:22:33
Speaker
But it it changed my mood. And she was she knew something was up. And She knew something was up. She knew I was acting weird and like not that I did anything wrong on those nights, but like some things like she was upset about and she tried to get it out of me. And I just kind of like did what I could to dance around the situation.
00:22:52
Speaker
And so finally I was like there like, I finally like I got up one morning. I was like, I got it. I got to do something about this because I don't want to see her hurt anymore. So I went to the VA and I got the doctor's appointment and finally she called me because she had texted me and I just didn't respond. back I can ask and like that locked up, right? I was locked up because I wasn't trusting it.
00:23:11
Speaker
And finally I was like, you got to tell her, you got to tell her why, what you're doing. So I call her back. I'm like, Hey, I'm at the VA. She's like, well, why did you have an appointment? And it was just like, this is what's going on.
00:23:23
Speaker
This is where my mood's been. And like, Fear of embarrassment and fear of like, I don't know. I don't know what I was scared of because she reacted the exact way I thought she would.
00:23:34
Speaker
But there was such a fear there that like, I let it get to me where when it happened, if I would have brought it up to her right then and there, why we were both still in bed, guess what? We would have avoided all of that.
00:23:46
Speaker
But ah didn't. And she reacted exactly how I thought she would, caring, loving, supportive and but again like guys like us that's something we struggle with and i think anybody listening to this that struggles with that i'm sorry that sucks and i don't know how to help you like that is one where you maybe us just sharing that the struggles we've had with it helps you go okay i'm gonna say it i'm gonna say it and if if i don't get the and if it goes bad then maybe maybe that's something else i need to look into i think sorry brian go ahead
00:24:24
Speaker
I can I know we put this a lot towards like veterans first responders and stuff like that because that's a lot of our background but I know from working blue collar work after I got out of the service i know a lot of those guys and gals in factories and places they're locked up tight man they don't yeah dude they eat their young they're like um so I know emotional courage it affects everybody you know and I know there was a time where in my own relationship and I think all of us are still here kind of in that topic there with with wives and stuff and I shared with mine um like a very unhealthy relationship with pornography
00:25:05
Speaker
And I can tell you right now that that was, honestly, I didn't know how she was going to accept it. I didn't know how she was goingnna take it and how we were going to talk afterwards. But honestly, it was the best thing because now it's been six months yeah since I've even, shoot, dude, I don't even have like in i don't even want to look at other women like at all.
00:25:23
Speaker
Yeah. So and it was it was very hard, you know, I mean, because there were things on both ends of our spectrums. But just having that that courage and that uncomfortable situation of just talking with her really opened up the floor to strengthen areas of our marriage. 100% man. So and i could honestly say man, like, after a decade of being married,
00:25:45
Speaker
We didn't have a lot of those conversations. We just didn't. ae I wasn't good at receiving them, nor was I good at and participating in them. When you're getting yelled and screamed at, like i wasn't hearing what was being said. She had the courage to tell me what was going on. she She was encouraging. She was telling me were exactly what was going on and how to fix it.
00:26:09
Speaker
And I... didn't have the courage at the time to hear it, listen to it, input it, like and really dig into what she was telling me and vice versa. like I mean, I can't speak for her, right?
00:26:23
Speaker
There were times where I tried to express myself, but the way it was received from my viewpoint also made me shut down really quickly because I lost all aspects of safety.
00:26:34
Speaker
Now that, that was, that's how it ended. it the first You guys saw us in the first half of our marriage. Like we were, we got through a lot of stuff when we, when we all live by each other.
00:26:44
Speaker
And it just, and I think a lot of it, the transition, I struggled huge with the transition and we never talked about it. Dude, we never She knew how much the Marine Corps meant to me.
00:26:55
Speaker
And then we transitioned and I took a job. I didn't, I wanted to do the job. I didn't like the part that I was doing the job for. There was my, I hadn't reached the goal I wanted to yet.
00:27:08
Speaker
And we never talked about that. I never opened up to her about it. I never told her how much I missed the Marine Corps, how much it bothered me to work for a department like that. And so when I got the job I did now, like I remember how happy she was about it. And I think looking back, I mean, she was more excited than I was.
00:27:26
Speaker
And I think that was her feeling like maybe like I had finally reached the the level i had always wanted to and she knew that she knew like that wasn't where i wanted to work and so when i got the job i have now i think she was so happy not necessarily like yeah you get the big pay raise and shit like that but i think she finally felt proud that i was possibly getting the job i wanted then and looking back i'm like i know i never received that so like if there's if you're things and if you're listening in your marriage that you're like and it's not good like
00:28:00
Speaker
yeah It took me a divorce, man. It took me. And that takes a lot of us. if take fifty do you guys listen to that humor man lab I sent? 56% of the time, this thing we call marriage fails.
00:28:12
Speaker
56. Dude, if anything else in the world broke 56% of the time, you wouldn't fucking buy it. Yeah. or participate in it. If there was a fifty fifty shot you were going to die every day at work or 56% chance that you were going to die every day at work, would you get a different job?
00:28:34
Speaker
Maybe. I would. I would. Think about it. Fucking – and then how many – and let's just say – let's compare it. Like I'm not going to take the guys who were name like the Huberman line. I won't take But like – okay, you got a 56% chance of dying at work every day.
00:28:50
Speaker
Okay, let's say there's a 25% chance on top of that that you're just going to get severely injured. Now with all that risk, are you still going to do it? Like no. no so if you wanted 81 chance of dying yeah then it fucking sucks right 81 chance that this thing goes fucking south and it goes south hard like and it's just like man don't do like it it takes a lot of us a ah divorce like we don't get what we don't get the good thing right the first time right like unfortunately i'm
00:29:21
Speaker
The fact that Brandon, you and your wife have been together for so long amazes me. And it's awesome. And I love it. Dude, 14 years on Wednesday married. My brother and his wife, I think just hits 18 years. Wait, what am I?
00:29:34
Speaker
Yeah. 18 years this year, they hit 18 years. And it's just like, man, to see that, like that, when people are like, I've been married for 12 plus years and it's we're great. We're still having sex and we're doing this. And I'm like, dude, you guys, like you found a way to both have the courage.
00:29:51
Speaker
To have those conversations. So, do you have anything else to add to emotional courage, Tyler? ah I think we're getting we're getting getting stuck in it. I think the theme is say the damn thing.
00:30:07
Speaker
Do it. Because as hard as it is, it is worth it. And if there's a weird thing you can't handle the truth, well, then, you know what?
00:30:18
Speaker
You should be living in a fantasy because real life is not pretty and the truth matters. So speak your mind and a relationship especially.
00:30:29
Speaker
Brandon, I'm sure you can be a testament to this is all about forgiveness and being able to forgive each other and understand each other and work through the ugly things.
00:30:41
Speaker
Oh, for sure. and But just just know that I think my last thing to add to emotional courage would be is don't expect an immediate response out of the other person, including. think that's where I failed.
00:30:54
Speaker
Yeah. Allow it time, because if you don't allow it time, you will never. Yeah. Amen. So next type of courage, Mac, where we at? Are you ready? Next one.
00:31:07
Speaker
moral courage standing up for what is right even when it's uncomfortable unpopular and often involving ethical principles that kind of falls back in there the ah the emotional side too standing up for yourself so i got i got i got a pretty good story for this one and i don't know if i go for this but probably not but you know i want hear it i used to i used to drink a lot but you did not yeah It was just a little bit, but hey.
00:31:38
Speaker
So one night, I remember, and this this kind of stands up for my morals. like I don't like bullies.
Moral Courage: Standing Up for Beliefs
00:31:43
Speaker
like If I see people being a bully to somebody else, yelling at somebody else when it doesn't need to be done. can't fucking stand it.
00:31:49
Speaker
And if I'm doing it, I wish someone would stand up to me and say the same thing to me because you know what? Every now and then I need to be put in my place. Hold on, question. And I don't want to sidetrack too far. Are you a bully to the people you care about? Like, do you tease them in like a bully aspect and then like people you don't fucking like, you don't tease them at all. Like it's just straight and narrow with them.
00:32:07
Speaker
Yeah. But see my friends out of I tease my friends out of the love that I have for them. Yeah. Like it's like a bullying aspect to my friends, but it's all out of love. If I don't like you, like I'm pretty straight and narrow with you.
00:32:18
Speaker
Yeah, for sure. All right, go for it. So sorry we're sitting there at this at this Taco Bell here in lower Michigan, and it's a college town. And there are these two guys. I mean, they were like a little, I'd say they look like me. They got glasses, a little nerdy looking, you know, and they're kind of sitting by themselves.
00:32:37
Speaker
And there was a bunch of like, I don't know, frat guys, because they kept chanting something over in the corner. And they started hucking burritos at these kids in the corner, and I didn't like it I did not like i don't know if this goes under physical courage or moral courage or what.
00:32:51
Speaker
So I just grabbed the top shell taco I was eating and started throwing them back in defense of these other guys. And I had just made friends with another with another Marine there. And I was like, you got my back, dude, if something goes sideways, he's like, yeah, I'll be with you.
00:33:05
Speaker
So i just started hucking burritos back and they got like seven of these dudes stood up. It was just me and this other guy. I'm like, yeah, here we go. in the middle of that. They all stood down, though. I was like, wow. like But then, out of the corner, the two guys were like, hey, man, like you guys good? And they're like, what, did your mom tell you to say that? And i was like, I just stood up like... Fucking assholes.
00:33:28
Speaker
I think moral courage is the one thing that we all try to pass on to our children more than anything. For sure. I don't need my son to be a superhero. i don't need him to be an asshole. I don't want my girls to be superheroes. I don't want be. want them to be who they are.
00:33:42
Speaker
If they're loving, kind, happy people, i hope that for them. But morally, i want them to have the courage at school to stand up to the bullies. the Hey, i'm not gonna that's not nice. We're not going to make fun of that kid.
00:33:55
Speaker
Or to have the courage to sit with the kid that is not the most popular kid. To make friends with them. too i dont like Just have the courage to be different than the crowd. and you know Sometimes you find out you have more in common with that person than you thought.
00:34:08
Speaker
I mean, I was kind of the dorky, nerdy, fat kid in school. So, like, for me, it's really important that my kid's like, hey, you don't need to be picking on everybody else. Like, you don't know you don't know anything about that kid.
00:34:20
Speaker
Like, so he he wears the same shirt three days in a row. Yep. There's probably more to that story, and you should count your blessings that you don't have to. Even sometimes the bully.
00:34:31
Speaker
um Yeah, you're saying it's not it's not his fault. Yeah. Yeah. And I think I think for me, moral courage is I mean, I work in a world where I get to I get to stand behind my moral, my moral courage every day. like I'm that blessed that I get paid to use my moral courage.
00:34:50
Speaker
But for my kids, it's that is one thing that is extremely important for me to pass on to them is, hey, we need to we need to have the courage to be nice. you yeah because i wrote And we had we need to have the courage to be an individual.
00:35:02
Speaker
We don't need everyone's approval. You don't need people to like everything you do. You don't need popularity. You to have the courage to stand on your own two feet and be you and be nice to everybody because everybody deserves a shot until they don't.
00:35:17
Speaker
Yeah, know you hit the nail. You hit the nail on the head. You got something, Tyler? I think moral courage is the hardest one, ah at at least for me. Like, i I always try to be a good person.
00:35:29
Speaker
i always try to do the right thing. I think when you're focused on certain things, they can get in the way of realizing that your decisions might be wrong or you might be – Doing something that you don't realize might be like like you don't want to be a bully or like you're in environment where you're joking around with people so often that it's hard to differentiate like something serious and something more lighthearted because that environment has cultivated this
00:36:06
Speaker
kind of constant ball busting sort of mentality, especially, you know, you look at the kind of jobs we do firefighters, cops, um you know, the kind of manly macho sort of jobs where everyone is. It's just a big dick measuring competition and everyone's got to be hard asses on each other just because, and then you're just so used to the ball busting that like you you don't necessarily stick up for people or yourself the way you should at times.
00:36:41
Speaker
At least that's what I found. Yeah, you know, there's something else with moral courage here, too, but I agree with you as well, because that that getting your chops busted all the time by somebody, you know, especially when you start feeling like it's going too far in your own morality.
00:36:55
Speaker
I mean, you got to stand up for it. Or if you're seeing it go too far, but also here, and I'm just kind of following some things here on moral courage as well. but one of them says to accept your mistakes and apologize when you are in the wrong. Yeah.
00:37:09
Speaker
Yeah. That's a huge one. Yeah. Being able to be self-aware and to be, and being able to say it out loud, like, Hey, I know i messed up or know i'm not here. I know I haven't been present or putting in the effort you have.
00:37:30
Speaker
I'm sorry. I recognize that. That takes a lot of courage from somebody to admit that you are openly wrong. Oh, yeah. And I'm very bad at it because I'm a type A person, man. it's like i just thought I started to believe that I'm just probably going to say something wrong or fuck it up at some point.
00:37:47
Speaker
So like I've gotten so comfortable with like my own personality that like if someone's like, no, you're wrong, I'm like, oh, okay. Or if like I'm talking to somebody and like I got to get that vibe that like they're mad at me,
00:38:00
Speaker
Like I'm so used to it now that I'm like, Hey, I'll stop. I'm like, did I piss you off? And like, well, yeah, kind of like, this is what you said. i'm like, um, I'm sorry. Like, you know, like, and I think it's just because i live in such a world of people ragging on each other all the time that I sometimes don't differentiate between like the fucking ragging with the boys and then changing who I'm talking to. And i'm just like,
00:38:25
Speaker
keep that personality going. And then they're like, they're upset. And you're like, I'm, I'm sorry. I didn't mean to it. I got, I don't have an excuse. I should have known better. and ten percent dude Yeah.
00:38:36
Speaker
I should have known better. I'm sorry. And so it, I think it takes a lot of courage to be, to self see what's happening. So we've got three more left in the types of courage out of the six.
00:38:48
Speaker
Are you ready for the next one? Oh yeah. Caleb, Swamp Oak, Swamp Oak, Caleb, where you at bud? Nobody. We miss you. We love you. know Social courage. Being true to oneself in social situations, even when it involves risk, embarrassment or rejection.
00:39:07
Speaker
I'm pretty good with this. i have a lot of. Yeah. I feel like I'm pretty. Same here. Yeah. Yeah, I don't mind being the black sheep. I like being a different person than the crowd.
00:39:22
Speaker
i I'm comfortable with it. like do Can I be a social guy? Yeah. Do I want to be social? and like Do I wish I had the pleasure of not knowing?
00:39:35
Speaker
Yeah. yeah You ever, like, look at the people when you're at, like, a concert like or a venue or, like, you're just somewhere where there's, like, people are just like, oh, nothing's going happen. Nothing's going to happen.
00:39:45
Speaker
I got my fucking gun in my waistband, an extra magazine because of the shit I'm aware of outside of this world where I'm like, fuck, it'd be so nice to just not know. Dude, I can...
00:39:59
Speaker
I can honestly say, like aside from like the the being prepared in like a social situation like that, um I could tell people right now, even even kids going to college, man, stand up for what you believe in.
00:40:13
Speaker
Because you're going to face a of social situations, especially on campuses, where if you think one way, where the general population of a college campus thinks another, don't give up on who you are.
00:40:27
Speaker
Don't change yourself. You don't need approval from fucking anyone. also, those environments, as I've come to learn, are very much mob mentality.
00:40:39
Speaker
And people don't really do the research and no find out who they are or what they believe. They just kind of fall in line with everyone else.
00:40:50
Speaker
Like, do the do the fucking research. Actually... investigate all sides to everything and try to understand things as they might be.
00:41:01
Speaker
Don't just fall for the fucking quick headlines or what everyone else is saying. Like find out who the fuck you really are. And if you have a good handle on it, stay with, stay with who you are. Yeah. Yeah.
00:41:13
Speaker
Grow it. don seek improvement Don't seek improvement, but don't seek like approval from other people. And also, you don't have to go out and rub your views on everybody.
00:41:26
Speaker
Don't try to force the way you think on everybody. If you are confident and knowledgeable and educated and true to what you believe, people are going to follow.
00:41:37
Speaker
People are going to know. If you're the quiet guy, like if you're not the center of attention and you're not like just this, if everybody is at, if you're at a bar and everybody's loud and obnoxious and blah, blah, blah, and you're that guy that's just kind of sitting off to the side, like you're polite, you're social, you'll talk to people, but you're not that dude that is in the middle of everybody just being loud and obnoxious. Like people are eventually going to come to you.
00:42:01
Speaker
They're gonna see and they're gonna be like, Hey, why are you over here by yourself? I'm just enjoying the night. How are you enjoying the night? Like you're over here. You're off. I'm here talking to my friends. like ah Why don't you come out and dance with us? like I just don't really like to dance and you know don't really like to be in the middle of a crowd. That causes problems sometimes and I'm not here for a problem. and i just be that like If that's who you are, be that guy. If you want to be the loud, obnoxious middle of the dance floor guy, go be that guy.
00:42:28
Speaker
Go be that guy. I'm not that guy and I don't understand those guys but I'm happy that they exist because they entertain the shit out of me. You're welcome. Yeah, because you're that guy. Caleb's that guy Yeah.
00:42:40
Speaker
I'm not. And I'm not going to change. Don't always. you're our friend. Don't always be in an echo chamber where you're only around people who agree with you. It's yeah really nice.
00:42:51
Speaker
And it's a great way to build character and be able to understand that not everybody thinks the same fucking way as you or is the same kind of person. and Like,
00:43:02
Speaker
Be okay with being around people who are completely different than you or see things differently than you. They're going to challenge your views too. Yeah. Let them challenge your views and you challenge their views and that's okay because everyone's different.
00:43:15
Speaker
and And if you disagree, so be it Yeah. And that's okay. And you can still be friends after that. Yep.
Self-Discovery and Authenticity in Social Contexts
00:43:23
Speaker
You can. Yeah. That's what I hated the most about college, which I thought was like supposed to be all about free thought and debate.
00:43:30
Speaker
But like, it's just become these massive echo chambers. Okay. It's about free sex and cheap beer. You got it wrong. I didn't go to a party school. I think Dr. Slamon tried to explain to the you that one day. He did. listen Free sex and cheap beer is what college was about.
00:43:47
Speaker
I believe the lesson was about spring break. Yeah, exactly. And I've never been to college. Next one. You would have done well.
00:43:58
Speaker
ah That was social courage. Intellectual courage. Challenging our beliefs, exploring new ideas, and engaging in critical thinking.
00:44:09
Speaker
I feel like we just kind of talked about this, though. Yeah. I think that's what we're doing here. Intellectual courage. Yeah. We are engaging in critical thinking. we're We're challenging our ah our emotional courage.
00:44:23
Speaker
i think people I think for me, when I've just read that, the first thing that came to mind was don't be afraid to continue educating yourself. Thrive to learn something else.
00:44:34
Speaker
and Don't let it go against you any of your other courages. but Yeah, and I think you should strive to always learn and learn something, skill, knowledge,
00:44:46
Speaker
how to overcome a lack of a courage. I don't know. learn Always explore new ideas, explore new people. And I think that's intellectual courage. I think it's something that you keeps you from being complacent with your life.
00:45:02
Speaker
Dude, if you're the smartest guy in the room, you need to find another room. yep You're in the wrong room. You're in the wrong. If your life is going to look like Groundhog's Day for the next 30 years, you need change something.
00:45:13
Speaker
Fuck. I was looking today about going back to school. We're not today. The other day I was looking at going back to school. I'm already 200 plus credits and i only have a fucking I'm associates in a whatever. Bachelor. Regular four year degree.
00:45:27
Speaker
Yeah. i have and I have enough college credits to have a master's plus some and I'm looking at going back to school this time to get a degree. and i'll Do it up bro. Useful.
00:45:38
Speaker
Yeah. I don't know. and I'm not going to do it this year because I want to buy a house this year but I was looking at going back to law school. I'm looking to go into the trades, man. Get it. Good for you guys.
00:45:49
Speaker
I'm going operators, man. Possibly. Nice. But I think that's what and intellectual courage is. right Don't let your life get more. No. Always be learning.
00:46:00
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I don't want to be the guy that's 65 years old, retired from the same thing. want to retire at 51 years old and do something else. But also, don't be afraid to ask for help learning something new too. If you don't know something, admit it.
00:46:13
Speaker
Yeah. It's okay to be the dummy in the room. It's gotten me really far. Be humble, gentlemen. I would like some help playing the the Jew harp. That's not that's awesome.
00:46:29
Speaker
It's going to be a different instrument every time, man. am ordering one of those on Amazon and I'm just going to sit at the firehouse and play that shit. baggger' go They're going to bust your balls.
00:46:40
Speaker
Literally. They're going to smash them with a hammer. play we got Next. We're through intellectual. Let's go. Spiritual courage, facing pain or hardships with dignity or faith.
00:46:53
Speaker
Often involving a sense of purpose or meaning. No, I think you're looking at it wrong. Maybe. ah I think I'm going to reread it. I want you to listen to it. And I know it's spiritual, but I don't think we're getting into religion here.
00:47:08
Speaker
Spiritual courage, facing pain or hardship with dignity or faith, often involving a sense of purpose or meaning. So I don't think that's yeah just religious.
00:47:22
Speaker
I think that's facing what you're scared of, facing the pain. But doing it with some confidence yeah and not just willowing up in the fucking fetal position on the floor with tears running down your eyes.
00:47:36
Speaker
And I think it's it's having that faith that it's going to come out like, I'm doing this for a reason. I think that's what it is. That's how I took out of it. Having your own faith. Well, see, I mean, with myself, like, I would put certain things as of late, recently, you know, I would, I would honestly put some of my things on God, too, you know, I would put my faith in him that he would help see me through certain aspects, you know, that.
00:48:00
Speaker
Yeah. Through spiritual courage. Now, don't get me wrong. I believe that you guys are also correcting your, your opinion and definition on that as well. But for me, it'd be like, hey, i'm I'm really struggling through this. I'd pray about it, you know, or maybe look to scripture to find someone in the past who has maybe gone through.
00:48:16
Speaker
Yeah, that's you're facing it with dignity, right? You have the faith. Say, let's use you leaving the club, for example. You had faith that it was going to work out the way it needed to work out.
00:48:30
Speaker
And you stood on your own two feet and you did it with some dignity. You didn't whimper. You didn't no call, no show. You didn't just ignore the guys. You went in and you faced them and you told them this is what I got
Creative Courage: Personal Stories and Achievements
00:48:44
Speaker
to do.
00:48:44
Speaker
Yeah. And I think that's what spiritual courage is getting at. Like standing on your feet and being a man, having faith that I got to do what I got to do because in the end, this is what needs to be done.
00:48:55
Speaker
And just standing on it. And doing it for my faith. Yeah. Yeah. So I'm with Tyler on this one. I'm not overly religious. I'm not overly spiritual in that world.
00:49:06
Speaker
But that didn't that one didn't cross me as a religion fact. For me, it it resonates with me on a level of, it makes me think of getting into filmmaking and how my family kind of treated it as a joke because they didn't understand it.
00:49:23
Speaker
Probably all treated as a joke. Like, when I was making the hunt... I don't treat it as a joke more. When I was making the hunt... Not anymore. When I was making the hunt, my family had no fucking clue, one, how i was going to raise the money, two, really what the hell I was doing. Like, my dad was, like, thought I was playing with fucking G.I. Joes in the yard, like, or fucking picking up sticks and playing soldier, like...
00:49:46
Speaker
When he saw, so he he helped me did ah build the set a little bit, like design it you know, ah once once the trench was dug, we he helped me like fill sandbags and hang stuff up and make the trench look like a a trench. But when he first saw the trailer, tears came out of his eyes. Like he was crying in shock and like pride, I think, to to realize like, holy shit, like i I doubted him, but he did something incredible. Like,
00:50:15
Speaker
This is, this is a real thing. This is legitimate. And to be able to prove a lot of people, including like my family wrong, Really, for me, it was like, this is who I was this whole time. Like, I need to let this this person out of me. Like, I am i am an artist through and through.
00:50:33
Speaker
and I don't get to express myself in the way that I want all this time. And, you know, I have these passion projects that I'm trying to churn out. And it's like, i I need to stick up for myself and not let the rest of my life get in the way of who I truly am.
00:50:52
Speaker
proud man. yeah Thanks, man. That's spiritual courage. Dude, i share I share your movies with everybody. Be proud of me when my next one comes out because that's what I need to get out, this fucking feature film.
00:51:04
Speaker
Dude, you need to get more to me so I can read more. Okay. um We did Buster Balls a lot. Yeah. and or for i school we We did. We did. But i work with I worked as a grip there for a little while this last week.
00:51:18
Speaker
And, man, I tell you what. That was some work, dude. If you need help, guess what? I'll come out New York and help you. Alright. Because I know how to set some stuff up, man.
00:51:29
Speaker
Grip work's fun, dude. It is. I can turn the camera on. ah You can do grip work, dude. It's not bad. it's like ah It's like a fucking handyman. You're fucking problem solving. I can do that.
00:51:42
Speaker
Alright. What do we next? Jesus. There's like more than those original six. This is a long list. Alright, but... ah We don't have to do them all.
00:51:53
Speaker
We're at our hour. No, yeah we got three left, so I'm just going to read them off and you can go off on them The last couple are creative courage, everyday courage, and disciplined courage.
00:52:05
Speaker
Creative courage is the courage to take risk and explore new ideas often associated with innovation and artistic endeavors, which we just covered. I do it with annoying instruments.
00:52:18
Speaker
Everyday courage, facing challenges in daily life with resilience, including moral, intellectual, discipline, and empathetic courage. Ooh, empathetic courage. We didn't go over that, but that that's not easy.
00:52:29
Speaker
And disciplined courage. The ability to preserve despite difficulties and maintain focus goals. difficulties and maintain focus on goals That's probably where I succeed the most.
00:52:43
Speaker
I'd be like that when we first started talking that that morbidly obese person taking that discipline and that urge to go to the gym every day. got And it doesn't even have to be morbidly obese. You can just be that out of shape person or that Or the poor kid that's got to work 40 hours a week and got to put yourself through college. like Like that takes discipline, courage. You got to get up and go to work and then you got to study and you got to run on three hours of sleep at night or less or no sleep.
00:53:09
Speaker
That's discipline. And I think that's, that is discipline, courage leads to success. You wreck a dish. So I think. I think that was good. I think everybody, I think we face all those different courage every day.
Inspiration from Others and Personal Reflections
00:53:24
Speaker
i think we fail at some of them. Oh, yeah. Probably some more than others. think we can all admit that we are emotional courage we fucking suck at. um empathetic courage we probably aren't great at but there were some there's some that we do really well in every day and that was the dismal courage that's physical courage that's unrememberable i'll tell you what though man um in what i lack in courage depending on what it is like i when i look to others and see the ways that they display courage it
00:53:59
Speaker
really does motivate me and inspire me in so many different ways for like how people express courage. And it, it really is like, I look so highly at those people who are able to have that conviction and be able to express that strength because it's not easy.
00:54:18
Speaker
No, it's not. It's not. It never will be. It never will be. Anybody got a quirky closeout since the swamp is not here I actually thought of one while we were sitting here, you know. Wow. Send it.
00:54:32
Speaker
Send it. So over the past few weeks, I've been entertaining myself with ah random instruments, a.k.a. the harmonica and now the jaw harp.
00:54:45
Speaker
What is an instrument that you gentlemen would like to learn how to play, whether it be annoying, pretty cool, anything like that? During the pandemic, I was teaching myself piano and I was doing decent at it. I still can't read um notes, but I was just like teaching myself based on the keys and like learning songs that I like.
00:55:08
Speaker
And I would love to pick that up again. yeah i am going to be honest. I have no desire to learn how to play. a instrument I'm just not musically interested I like it I love the idea of my daughter is in band and I love it I think it's awesome it's into like for brain it's fantastic and I encourage people who enjoy music to do it but it's not my thing ah if I had to learn though I like keep it simple just like a basic acoustic guitar okay
00:55:41
Speaker
Very simple. I really want to learn the bagpipes. It's such an obnoxious fucking instrument too. and And in six six months, you'll learn how to do... I can't listen to bagpipes, man.
00:55:57
Speaker
Too many to my funerals. No, I get it. yeah but i just always I've always liked them. Yeah, they're cool, but I've heard the dueling doing bagpipes too many times now.
00:56:08
Speaker
Oh, for sure. But On that note, it's good episode, gentlemen. Yeah. Hope you guys enjoyed it and hope to churn out this other one here coming up. So hope you guys stick with us.
00:56:23
Speaker
Sorry. Sorry. It's been very hard to get all of us in one place. It's like herding cats, man. Yeah. But we'll We'll see you the next time. Later, gents. Later, guys.
00:56:33
Speaker
Later.
00:56:41
Speaker
Good morning, Jeff.