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19- Protest...The Follow Up
15 Plays8 days ago
We’re back, wearing new and still fabulous protest shirts, to talk about our protest homework. We talk about the various ways we’ve been protesting and what we’ve seen other people doing.
Patti has been photographing the forms of protest she sees out and about in St. Louis. She’s also signed up with her local Indivisible group and helping out another local org that supports immigrants.
We talk about the scary changes we’re seeing in the United States, and what can be done to address these changes. Such as...nokings.org
Charlotte has been watching an Indivisible series of trainings on nonviolent resistance. She also read Fahrenheit 451 for the first time (how did she make it this far without reading it? Who knows, she might have only pretended to read it when it was assigned in school). She talks about DOGE being the cause of the end of her creative writing summer camp, and how this will fuel her rage for decades to come.
Margot also took it upon herself to do some homework—to bring the hope instead of the boom. Will she be successful? You tell us, after you listen to our newest episode!
Logo design: Marielle Martin
Song: Upbeat Drums with Stomps and Claps by music_for_video
BlueSky: @canweinterestyouin.bsky.social
Email us your interests! CanWeInterestYouIn@gmail.com
Website: CanWeInterestYouIn.com
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Transcript
Introduction: Unusual Hobbies and Interests
00:00:00
Speaker
You know that thing you love that your friends and family don't want to hear about anymore? Tell it to us, Patty and Charlotte. We want to learn all about your weird and wild obsessions or your perfectly normal hobbies that you've taken just a little too far.
00:00:15
Speaker
We want to dabble in your curious interests. Can we interest you in today's episode?
Passion for Protest with Margot Holmes
00:00:37
Speaker
Hi, Charlotte. Hi, Patty. Hey, everybody. Margot. We've got back with us today Margot Holmes, who was with us last time for our episode about protest, where Margot told us all about her history with protest and why she's so interested in it. My favorite thing, you guys, let me talk about it. and My family is really tired of it, so I really appreciate the opportunity. Thank you.
00:01:07
Speaker
Thank you for sharing. That's literally our pitch is like, are the people time? feel like that really actually works very well with this. i family is of grief. to find a whole new audience. So hopefully you did. And definitely with the two of us.
Protest Messages through Apparel and Gifts
00:01:29
Speaker
And I love that you guys are back in the library and also back wearing
00:01:35
Speaker
shirts So tell us what your shirts say, because I can't totally see them behind the microphones. So mine says, in fear for our democracy, I dissent, which is Sonia Sotomayor's dissent of the like legislation that went into place or the ruling that went into place that allows for Donald Trump to, I believe...
00:02:05
Speaker
not have consequences for January 6th stuff, I think is what it was. I could be wrong, but I think that's the one that's when she said that. i' We'll look it up. oh you want eyes for do Do you want to tell us about your pin too that you have on your yeah pants? So I have rainbow fuck Trump.
00:02:30
Speaker
it's It's in rainbow. It doesn't say rainbow. fuck It just says fuck Trump in rainbows.
00:02:39
Speaker
All right. ah so Pretty simple today. that i really love yours. Yours is very creative and I've never seen it before, which is wild. This one was given to me by my friend Rachel.
00:02:52
Speaker
And she she thinks of me whenever she sees cat things because I used to have two cats. And this one says purr-cist, you know, P-U-R-R. And it's got like a cat dressed like Rosie the Riveter with the, you know, the arm up pumps, you know. yeah a oh that's adorable.
00:03:16
Speaker
Yeah, it's pretty cute. So it's really good for any sort of ah you know protest. It doesn't even matter the content. Just persist. i It's even just like motivation.
00:03:28
Speaker
right right? I've not gotten it in the mail yet, but Jennifer will have swag as well at some point. She will be wearing a kerchief that says, I don't roll over for fascists.
00:03:41
Speaker
o Oh, that is good. That's right. i Forgot to mention Jennifer.
Documenting and Sharing Protest Experiences
00:03:48
Speaker
Jennifer has joined us also today, but she is she is laying down, taking a little nap.
00:03:54
Speaker
Excellent. Oh, also on my my water bottle, I have a sticker that says, reading is resistance. Oh, nice. Yeah.
00:04:06
Speaker
And then on the other side, it says, this is my emotional support water bottle. That's awesome, too So interested to see what you guys did. Come on, don't keep me waiting any longer. I want to know how do it. Homework time.
00:04:23
Speaker
Yeah. You want to go first, Patty? Sure, i can. So one of the first things I've just been trying to take note of, and I mentioned this to Charlotte, and you'll see it on our social media as well. Listeners, if you if you follow us on Blue Sky or Instagram, is I've just been trying to take note of forms of protest around me. So for existence, for example, existence is like a combination of example and instance.
00:04:52
Speaker
Okay. So for example, on the route that we take most mornings for our walk with my dog, there is a house that on their steps, on their, you know, cement steps, they have in chalk, none of this is normal.
00:05:10
Speaker
Resist.
Missouri's Abortion Ban Controversy
00:05:12
Speaker
Um, and so, and they just like, you know, it's always there. So I don't know if they have to like reapply or whatever.
00:05:21
Speaker
And then I've been noticing like stickers on mailboxes that I've been taking pictures of and also different signs that are going around. Cause in, m in the state of Missouri, they put, on on the ballot that we could vote last time.
00:05:41
Speaker
whether or not we wanted to ban a, sorry, if we wanted to repeal an abortion ban in the state of Missouri. And it was voted largely despite Missouri being very red, very conservative, very Christian, and a lot of propaganda going around that this was really about sex trafficking.
00:06:04
Speaker
So despite all of that, it passed and it was repealed, this ban on abortion. that's fantastic. Yeah. Amazing. However, they have now said, you know what?
00:06:17
Speaker
We don't think that people understood what this this amendment was. And so we're going to have to say, we know better.
00:06:27
Speaker
And no, it didn't. There is still a ban on abortion. So though voters voted, whoa And how often...
00:06:40
Speaker
Do people go back to say, you know what, that thing passed. Did they understand what it meant? mean. Actually, yes. In the state of Colorado, it actually did happen.
00:06:51
Speaker
Did it? What was that? been um but with That is how we became the hate state
Women’s Rights and Neighborhood Activism
00:06:57
Speaker
is because of the legislation that was written in around gay rights. And I'm not sure exactly what the, but if you look it up, it's in like early nineties,
00:07:09
Speaker
we started being called the aid state because of the fact that this legislation was written like yes was opposite of what it was supposed to be. Yes, actually, but and no meant yes.
00:07:20
Speaker
ah ah huh And they did actually go back and repeal it the next But that's because it was, it sounds like that's because it was purposefully misleading. It was. Yeah. Whereas in this case, it sounds like an authoritarian state regime.
00:07:37
Speaker
well Right. It wasn't like people were like, wait a second. I didn't understand. Shoot. I meant to, you know, whatever. So it's basically rejecting and an election. It's not allowing for an election answer to stand in your state. You know, that is scary. It's scary.
00:08:01
Speaker
Yeah. So there have been a lot of signs up, which I've been really happy to see. that there is clearly some action that's happening about that. Like, so like official signs around the neighborhood.
00:08:16
Speaker
So that's something that I'm like interested in looking more into because, you know, body autonomy and women's rights are something that I feel really strongly about, especially since it's like, when you want to get something done, women are usually the ones who are going to do it.
00:08:32
Speaker
And so when you start taking away our rights, you know, it's just a slippery slope. but So, that was something that's just been fun to see around because unfortunately one of my neighbors right across the street, he did put his Trump 2024 flag back up.
Community Engagement and Political Signage
00:08:47
Speaker
It's the same size as his American flag.
00:08:50
Speaker
And I'm not totally sure why the timing or whatever. He also has a really mean dog, but that just tells me something about him, you know? And so, so it's been fun to just kind of see around the neighborhood and around the city, like different,
00:09:06
Speaker
forms of protest and be aware of it. I did sign up for my local indivisible group. So I'm just waiting for, yeah to start getting the emails for those to see kind of how I can get involved.
00:09:19
Speaker
And I think I mentioned like my mom is, my mom and dad are involved in their indivisible group. And I was telling my mom, I'm like, you should have like little cards made or something because she's basically like the going around like recruiting.
00:09:35
Speaker
seems like she's like in ah in a cult. you know like But she's gotten quite a few of her friends to sign up. And then also just like she goes to the Y to work out and she's been telling people there or like at her local Starbucks.
00:09:47
Speaker
Nice. So it's pretty cool. Yeah. And then i also have been, i signed up to volunteer for an organization that is distributing funds.
00:10:00
Speaker
It's a group that they set up emergency funds for immigrants in need. And so there's a new distribution of those funds that are going out. So I've been volunteering with my sister because my sister is bilingual.
00:10:15
Speaker
We've been largely doing, a helping out immigrants that are from Spanish speaking countries. And so we spent the day yesterday distributing those funds to the people who received the the, I guess it's kind of like a grant in a way, like a mini, I don't know actually if it's a grant, but um Because now that I'm thinking about it, I'm like, well, you but anyways, you know, you just, they basically, anyone can apply and then they pick.
00:10:46
Speaker
In this case, it was a couple of hundred individuals that they were able to give money to. And so we met up with people at a local library and distributed that for most of the day yesterday and then a couple this morning. So that's been good.
00:11:03
Speaker
And then the last one that I did already is there is ah group that supports wi women's right to
Supporting Women’s Right to Choose
00:11:16
Speaker
choose. And so they were in need of umbrellas to that their escorts use when bringing them to and from.
00:11:24
Speaker
So they're rainbow umbrellas.
00:11:28
Speaker
Unfortunately, they're through Amazon is how you have to order them. Right. And so I was like, I get it. It's currently the easiest way that people can like, you know, register for things and then you can buy them. So I did go against my Amazon band to help them out with getting some umbrellas.
00:11:48
Speaker
And I had said I would volunteer to be an escort, but you have to do a training first. And so they were doing a training and they said, really what we need right now is individuals to attend this training who have availability during the day.
00:12:04
Speaker
And so because i I don't always, I was like, okay, I'll hold off on doing that for now, because they were limited spots. And then I'll just see how I can get involved later on.
00:12:17
Speaker
Nice. And then I continue to thank you. And then I continue to not shop at Target. So I was happy to see their recent report where they were, you know,
00:12:30
Speaker
it reporting losses in, in their revenue and things like that. So that made me really happy. And, um, I was speaking with someone who about that and she's like, well, but you know, and she is a woman of color and she was like, well, I ah i like that they support businesses that are, you know, oh my gosh.
00:12:50
Speaker
Black owned businesses. Yes. Thank you. I'm sorry, guys. My brain.
00:12:58
Speaker
but we So I was speaking to a woman and she's like, well, but they, you know, support black owned businesses. And I was like, yes. And I appreciate that. And if I ever needed something, you know, like I would go directly to that business. So like, that's what I've been trying to do when I know, for example, there's ah interior, like a housing, like decor group that they,
00:13:26
Speaker
represent there or that they sell there. And I was like, oh, well, I'm interested. I wanted to look at some wall wallpaper and so I'll just look directly at their website instead of the Target website.
00:13:39
Speaker
So been trying to do that. just bought Method cleaning products, which I used to always get at Target. And I was like, well, I guess I'll get them from Method. And they came like in a box that was destroyed.
00:13:50
Speaker
But I was like, oh, well, at least they're there i'm not man I don't need the box. so but That's great.
00:14:01
Speaker
And their CEO stepped down because they were doing so poorly. I like that just happened. I'm pretty sure. Yeah. Oh, that's great. Because you just can't backpedal on a thing that you stood up for. And that to me, I think that is a lot of what we're, we're seeing right now is that, that the,
00:14:21
Speaker
Talking about those things and really like watching as it's happening and bringing it up when we see it happening is
Post-COVID Community Support Shifts
00:14:30
Speaker
important too. That's protest, right? I mean, I i can say that, you know, seeing it in different circles, whether it's at church or it's in your, you know, organization that you're working for or working with or volunteering with and you're watching those things.
00:14:50
Speaker
focuses change, definitely talking about the focus change is an important thing, right? you When you notice it, because all the things that we work towards, if we backpedal and become a windsock, then that's just what we are. We're going with the prevailing breeze, right?
00:15:07
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Happens so much. It's really ah disheartening, I think. It is. Yeah. But it's just been good to like be focused on you know, the fact that, as you said, Margot, like there are so many ways to protest. And so thinking about that has been really a great way to kind of expand my vision and thoughts about it to incorporate it into like different parts of my life. And so, and it's fun to have that as my focus, like when I'm out and about or like, you know, driving, I'm like, Ooh, what, what does that say? Or what are they doing? Or, you know, like,
00:15:49
Speaker
yeah kind of just being more aware of it. very yeah Yeah. And you're in a state where it's so important. I mean, it's important everywhere, but like Missouri, come on.
00:16:01
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, especially the immigration stuff, really, it hits my sister's community largely, but it hits our family as well. you Effects of this administration in ways that are really scary and, um,
00:16:17
Speaker
and life changing. So it's like, it, it hits home and, and is very real. And so that also is a way to kind of be able to help, but also share that information with people who are thinking that this is still, Oh, no, don't worry. It's just that it's just the hard criminals that they're going after. You know, if people are still thinking that lie was true, it's like, Oh, okay.
00:16:43
Speaker
You know, here's some information for you. And I feel like it's wild how we're glossing over, like, our president got caught on a hot mic saying, and I'm going to eventually go after the
Political Rhetoric and Authoritarianism Fears
00:16:58
Speaker
homegrowns too. Like, this is not, this very intentional. it's very It's very clear. And it's, I don't think it's ever not been clear. And that's what's really scary about this, is that he is saying things that 100% go towards
00:17:15
Speaker
authoritarianism and concentration camps and all the things that made World War II a horrible, terrible thing.
00:17:27
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. That we said we'd never repeat, but. I mean, so much so as far as like, even as recently as the last like couple of days, they're starting to talk about, you know,
00:17:40
Speaker
all immigrants, including Japanese people living here in the United States and all of that. So it's scary because we're we're just going to continue to move on to the next group and the next group and the next group.
00:17:57
Speaker
Right. And you make it more palatable.
Immigrant Communities' Challenges
00:18:01
Speaker
And he can he can always say, and he's right. I've said this from the beginning. No, I've been clear.
00:18:10
Speaker
We're going to go after who we need to go after. and it's true. I think it's us who have a hard time like being like, he didn't really mean that. like Nobody would really do that, right? I think we have a hard time with it in our country. And we should have a hard time with it. But it doesn't mean that we shouldn't listen and and believe him when he speaks the truth.
00:18:36
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah, my mom was talking about, because you know she's She's Chinese and she's a citizen, but she's got friends who volunteer for like a Taiwanese Buddhist organization in California.
00:18:53
Speaker
And they, you know, they have to adjust what they're doing so that they like, they have to... And not not just them. I mean, I think this is anybody who is not white having to like make sure that they have their passport or their IDs like either on them or like photographed in their phones, not just hanging around outside somewhere, like being inside if they need to wait somewhere.
00:19:24
Speaker
Just things that you Like in that particular scenario, they're trying to volunteer to help people. yeah the and it And then they're like, okay, but I got to worry about am I going to get picked up even though I'm a citizen or I you know i have legal status here.
00:19:44
Speaker
And that it's racial profiling. Like it clear like it's always been, right, the driving danger of driving while brown or, you know, like driving while black.
00:19:54
Speaker
know. You know, like... and i One thing I'm realizing in in my but you know, like my regular role is to like talk with lots and lots of people, you know, and therapy sessions and all that.
00:20:12
Speaker
And so like I hear what people are thinking and lot of people are really concerned, but they don't know like all the things that are going on to fight it because some of those things are being suppressed too. So I think that that's another thing So I'll talk about my homework.
Nonviolent Protest Training Insights
00:20:30
Speaker
Yeah, please.
00:20:31
Speaker
and One of the things I did was i started watching this Indivisible series of trainings that they did relatively recently. looking at, I believe it was just the general theme was nonviolent protest. Yeah. Resistance. and um And then, so talking about different kinds of difference.
00:20:56
Speaker
first one is protest and persuasion, which we hear a lot about, talk a lot about and seeing. Second is building alternatives. So that's going to be things like, you know,
00:21:09
Speaker
local democratic economy, like ideas of like visions for the future, mutual aid, that kind of thing. And then the third one is non-cooperation.
00:21:20
Speaker
And yeah, I think that any ICE agents who feel maybe like non-cooperating, that would be great. And I think some already maybe have and are having that feeling.
00:21:38
Speaker
I just read Fahrenheit 451 for the first time. I've never read it before. you all read it Yeah, that's a good one. In former school, yeah. and Which is a good one for the idea of writing as resistance because that's really powerful.
00:21:57
Speaker
it um yeah So for anybody who hasn't read it, I might be the only one who hasn't read it because I feel like a lot of people read it in school or, you know,
00:22:08
Speaker
But a great one to read again, because you'll have a different appreciation of Because, yeah, when we were coming up in grade school, we weren't having any of these things happening at the time, like in the way they are
Literature and Written Protest Efforts
00:22:20
Speaker
now.
00:22:20
Speaker
Right. Yeah. So it's it's about you know a society where they're the ban books are banned. <unk> basically like these firefighters who will go and burn the books if you're, you know, you're found with them. And then a firefighter who starts to question it.
00:22:37
Speaker
So any ICE firefighters who want to start questioning things, go for it. But, and then also one thing I did tell this to Patty, but thinking about like writing for protest, I haven't and done much because it takes a little bit longer to write, but,
00:22:56
Speaker
but One thing that did happen since the last time we talked that has made me so mad, so mad is, i don't know if you remember me talking about the Iowa Summer Writing Festival, which is like my adult camp that i summer camp that I go to that I love. It's like for writing and you go there and you hang out in Iowa City and you take classes And then you like ride my friend's bike that she loans me.
00:23:28
Speaker
And there's like ah all these bookstores because it's kind of like the Mecca for writing. And Patty was the one who introduced me to it because of your dad. He like who was the one who had the catalog. And we went the first year together.
00:23:44
Speaker
here They just one day, like I went this year, right? Yeah. And then just like a week or two ago, their Facebook page, and then they like sent out an email just saying like, oh, we don't have the money for it. And so it's ending like, post your happy memories.
00:24:04
Speaker
And yeah, and then people were so mad. And ah it turns out it seems like has something to do with the federal funding maybe, or like, oh, DOGE somehow. However, this is a program that is funded by the people who go there.
00:24:26
Speaker
Like, you pay to go there. so it's very questionable as to why it would be ended. I mean, it's an arts program, so maybe that's part of it.
00:24:38
Speaker
It's something that can be cut to show like, oh, we're cutting waste, even though it's something that I am sure it requires very little funding.
Fostering Hope in Protest Movements
00:24:49
Speaker
So i wrote oh i wrote a strongly worded email to the dean. That was my written protest. That was a a long way of saying... I wrote an email. I think that's fantastic. Okay.
00:25:01
Speaker
Yeah. Op-ed is not the same as it always has been, right? It comes in very many different forms. Fair enough, you guys. I am impressed with your activism this week. I have also thought a little bit about things, you guys, and I've thought about the fact that in in our last conversation, we talked about some people bringing the boom and some people bringing the hope.
00:25:27
Speaker
And I'm like, okay, your homework in all of this is to bring the right? Is to try to figure out how what would you set up and how would you do it and get people involved to to bring the hope instead of the boom, just for once. Like, here that's how would you do it? Just to give it a try. Yeah.
00:25:47
Speaker
So, and then also just talking a little bit about Tabor Day. Adam wants to come to Tabor Day. Excellent. Excellent, because we are actually going to do it. I think it's going to be a neighborhood barbecue instead of a protest.
00:26:05
Speaker
Yeah, that's what you're talking about. So we're going to do mutual Like, we're going to have barbecue and hamburgers and hot dogs. We're going to talk to some neighbors, old and hopefully put up some flyers of some kind. That may be where I need help more than anything. But yeah, we have a...
00:26:24
Speaker
rec center a block away. so we got lots of people coming in, going from there, hoping to get you know, folks to come over and talk about the Tabor Amendment. Cool.
Community Engagement through Tabor Day
00:26:35
Speaker
Oh, that's great. eat hot dogs and hamburgers and vegetarian something or other that we will have for you. Yes, good. you guys i want you there what When's it going to be? think that it Yeah, will it be like a Labor Day Tabor Day? oh yeah. Oh, it's on the board. Yeah.
00:26:53
Speaker
Of September. Okay. So it'll be Monday the 1st September. Because there is that protest then is good that's going to be that day. oh it's on the same day. Yeah, it's on that same day. i don't know what time. realized that that was on on Labor day per Day. I thought it was going to be on um Saturday.
00:27:12
Speaker
That Saturday before Labor Day. I think it's Labor Day. I'm going to have to check. But also, before I even knew that, I planned to have a Harry Potter second book book club with my nieces and nephew. And then because we did a book club for the first one.
00:27:30
Speaker
And yeah, because my niece is obsessed with Harry Potter. And now everybody adorable. door a ball yeah And I'm trying to inject a little bit of a broader context for the themes of the books in like a way that's appropriate for like a five, seven and nine year old.
00:27:53
Speaker
That's awesome. Oh, that's great. Like what kind of things are you – because, I mean, yeah you're obviously not being like – and maybe the author is like a transphobe, horrible person?
00:28:05
Speaker
No, that's going to come later. No, like the separation of like the art and the artist, right? like Yeah, and we're trying to read – we're buying like used copies or like library copies or borrowing each other's copies to – Oh, okay. might need – to just like sort of not give her more money, but sure.
00:28:28
Speaker
But, you know, themes at some point of authoritarianism, the, the, you know, the ways that we can be brave and fight for what we believe in.
Bravery and Resistance in Literature
00:28:44
Speaker
that's awesome. Yeah. That's great. So that we're having that on that day on, on yeah. On Labor Day. But, Depending on the time.
00:28:54
Speaker
Yeah. let come If there is a big protest downtown, then I will not be missing the big protest to sit in my neighborhood. We're going to do it on Saturday and call it day-per-day. Good idea.
00:29:05
Speaker
It's a protest. I love it. We haven't had a big one for a month or two. been a while. so yeah stand up again And one other thing that I have been working on with a friend who's also a social worker is kind of like a pop-up stand type thing where we sell curated consignment goods.
00:29:30
Speaker
So clothes and books. And then i'm going to try to start up a poetry aspect of it where you could come and get a poem.
00:29:41
Speaker
And then maybe at some point I have like a little bundle of things that helps you with whatever mood you want to be. If you're like, I'm in a mood where I'm mad at the government. Here's this little bundle. Or you're like, i just got divorced. Like, here's this bundle for you.
00:30:02
Speaker
that not that It's not to that point yet. This is just sort of like an opening idea that we're going try out at this artisan market in my neighborhood on, the i think it's September 13th. It's a Saturday.
00:30:16
Speaker
So if you're interested in that, And I want for us to have signs that that say things like, if we had employees, we would totally want them to unionize.
00:30:28
Speaker
And we would never use our profits for our million-dollar wedding in Venice. And I personally wanted ah us our slogan to be social work hoes before tech bros.
00:30:44
Speaker
But my... but my Jennifer, the the person I'm doing it with, was noting that there will be children there because it is the middle of the day, a neighborhood event. So yes, that's it's going to be for another type of event. I'm loving that.
00:31:04
Speaker
I'm loving that. When is this thing again? I think it's September thirteenth oh ah ah Let me check. And it's...
00:31:14
Speaker
Yep. The 13th, it's an artisan market in Russell Park in Westminster. Nice. Yeah.
00:31:23
Speaker
What a cool idea yeah idea. And I like the idea of having like the mood poetry, like different boxes and I'm thinking like in terms of, have you guys ever heard of the books Griffin and Sabine?
00:31:37
Speaker
So they have, they're so artistic. You should look them up. You would love them. Okay. um But, but, they they have like letters back and forth to each other and that's the premise of the books, right? And and so they have like envelopes and art and these letters that are, some of them are written, some of them are typed, some of them are, and it's just very like cool. And I wonder if you could do that, like something like that where it's like every poem is something that you open separately and it's very like possibly artistic and possibly like,
00:32:15
Speaker
has symbolism to it in some way. That's a cool
Creative Protest Forms: Poetry and Consignment
00:32:20
Speaker
idea. yeah Well, ah I think for our first one, we're going to have something like a survey that people can take for ideas for what would make shopping just more enjoyable, more connected, more like what they would like out of it. And that, that would be like a fun and surprising thing to get out of shopping.
00:32:40
Speaker
So, and that's part of, part of it. And yeah,
00:32:47
Speaker
Oh, and there's, I don't know if you guys heard have heard of the, there's this shop in England that's called like the Poetry Pharmacy.
00:32:58
Speaker
And you can go there and get like a little bottle with poems in it for like a broken heart or, you know. I love that.
00:33:11
Speaker
Nice. Yeah. wow so So something along those lines, you know, where it's, it's kind of fun, but it's also literary and reminds you it.
00:33:29
Speaker
Oh, just reminds me about being alive rather than o bots. Oh, the other one, the other slogan I was thinking of, it's a work in progress, is hots before bots.
00:33:41
Speaker
But hots is not not the right word.
00:33:46
Speaker
Oh, so it's like a reference to the AI, right? Like taking that out of it kind of. Well, I guess in the writing and then maybe also in like delivery of product and goods. Oh, interesting, Charlotte. I love that.
00:33:58
Speaker
The Eris Brewery or Cidery in Chicago, they have, and sadly the poet just passed, but she would write poetry, put them in little containers that then were in a gumball machine there.
00:34:13
Speaker
So you could buy your gumball of poetry and it would come down and, you know, but less bespoke, you know, less curated. Mm-hmm. But I love that where you're connecting with the people. It's like, I'm creating this product for you and what you need, or you're purchasing a product based on an actual need or something like that. Yeah. That's really cool. Charlotte.
00:34:34
Speaker
Yeah. It's, it's part experiment, part business, part community building. Yeah. Because think people were always having to learn new ways to connect to people. I think, I think the older ways are not, are not as,
00:34:53
Speaker
either that or we're re-upping them, right? So I think it's a little of both. And I think, don't know, i think that's going to be some part the way that we heal some of the stuff that's happening is that we are we're getting really inquisitive about about different ways to connect, right?
COVID's Impact on Social Interactions
00:35:15
Speaker
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And build community and identifying new ways to heal too Because i think after COVID again, i think COVID really changed the way that people not only interact, but the way they, they think about dealing with things that are bothering them.
00:35:37
Speaker
i think what used to be, you know, you get together with your friends and you hang out and you support each other has, you know, changed a little bit because we were so many folks were so isolated.
00:35:53
Speaker
in that time. And I think, so I think we kind of, the way that healing is happening now can be a pretty intensely isolated ah reaction. We react in a way that is retreating instead of going to people to get support, I think.
00:36:15
Speaker
And I could be wrong about that. That's just what I've noticed in, in being a therapist for the last five years, you know, and you covid all the way through to now, I think I've, I and don't think I've ever really seen as much isolation in the way that I'm, that we see it today.
00:36:38
Speaker
People just feeling disconnected. Yeah. so I think that's fantastic. And there is what you're doing. Yeah. There is such like, yeah, separations, even just, you know, but like I've been seeing so many people who are like,
00:36:53
Speaker
I lost 5,000 followers in a day because I wore a mask in a photo, you know? So even things like that, where it's like, there's so much more, maybe not more, but there is so much reaction to even things that are coming out of the way that we approached COVID and, and continue to kind of approach the idea of health and choice and all of that stuff. Um,
00:37:15
Speaker
The polarization where it's like, okay, even if you're just wearing a mask, then I i know you're you're not you're not with me or we we have different views.
00:37:27
Speaker
like right or I'm like reading so much into what that means. I have a cold or I'm not feeling well today or anything. Like it has been political at this point, which is wild. right
00:37:41
Speaker
You guys, I am just loving Gavin Newsom's hundred for Social media like team right now and the fact that it is ah ah Latina like that's running it and that he is just being trolled to
Gavin Newsom's Political Strategies
00:37:58
Speaker
no end. it's like It's brilliant. It was like you really like tapped into what are all of his like insecurities.
00:38:07
Speaker
And it's just it's just brilliant. i'm loving I'm loving it. Like, thank you for your attention to this matter. He ends every tweet with that. And I am very surprised at the fact that we...
00:38:23
Speaker
We didn't think of these things before that just picking on him and making fun of him. And that's how you get rid of a bully. I mean, no, no people.
00:38:34
Speaker
No, I got disagree. People have been making fun of him for a long time and it enrages him and he gets worse and worse. But the hope that I have is that people will then start to be like, I'm he's not, he's not who I thought he was. Like he's, but yeah, but maybe that, that people with more political power start to troll him.
00:38:55
Speaker
That's maybe, that's new for sure. i think yeah you so You know, and I know, yes, we all called him, so what did we say? We called weird, weird. ah right They were, they hated that when they were being called weird.
00:39:10
Speaker
Totally. But I, and I think, I don't know. just seeing this stuff that Gavin Newsom is doing. I'm like, so basically you're just, you are doing the things that smearing it back to fully on the playground, right? You're standing up to him specifically and challenging like, no, I'm not going to let you do that.
00:39:33
Speaker
Right. And that to me is like, I don't think anybody has done it in that way before. Yeah, yeah. I think you're right. yeah Just really straightforward, like it's me and you type thing. I think they've done it in a formal way with the debate. They've done it in a formal way with campaigning.
00:39:54
Speaker
But I don't think they've done it in this sort of like, you're just a dotty old man, bro. Like, i'm go to I'm going to talk as crazy as you do. I'm going to use your exact language back at you. Like the most beautiful maps you've ever seen. The biggest bill and all this. ah It's just hilarious. I love it.
00:40:14
Speaker
And just caricature, basically. Yeah. right yeah And i all and like he's like, and me, like and also because it's not him writing his own you know posts, it's even better because they'll be like, me, Gavin C. Newsome, the most handsome person governor. And it's just so great. And I also, and I mean, you know, it's so hard for any of us to see nuance in anything, but I'm liking that people are like, yes, I don't support, I'm not going to vote for Gavin Newsom to be president. I don't think he's without fault. I don't think he's the most wonderful person, but right now he's doing exactly what we need. And we need more people to like jump in line, like, come on, like get with it, get, be this person too. You know, we don't have to like,
00:40:58
Speaker
but thank ah you you know, just like, like with all of the people that, that any, any individual, we don't need a perfect, what is that?
Realistic Political Support and Ideologies
00:41:10
Speaker
Oh my God. leader We can see gray.
00:41:13
Speaker
Somebody doesn't. Yes. Somebody doesn't have to be all perfect in order to be somebody we support or to be doing good, you know? so And just because they're good in this way does not mean they, they are,
00:41:26
Speaker
That we're saying that just because we support them in this way doesn't mean they need to be president in five minutes. Yeah. That's not. Yeah. You're not. This is a long-term commitment. Okay, guys. And this is where I bring it back in true believer because.
00:41:41
Speaker
Really, The True Believer, that book is an amazing book because it talks about both ends of, you know, we got fascism and we've got anarchy.
00:41:54
Speaker
and What book is this? Who wrote it? The True Believer by Eric Hoffer. Eric Hoffer. Okay. Written in the 30s by a guy who worked on the loading docks. not Not a rich person, not a super educated person.
00:42:08
Speaker
Like very, that book is probably, I've read it ah bazillion times and it just speaks to me and it's something worth looking at because the replacement for whichever end of the spectrum you go on is the other end of the spectrum. We've got to bring it a little bit.
00:42:26
Speaker
Right. And nobody wants yeah one of those ends. Yeah. So how do we, how do we keep it? How do we work for it to become more dynamic than just two total dynamics?
00:42:41
Speaker
Well, also if we are only settling for somebody who's absolutely perfect for our president, then we get ourselves into a situation where whoever we choose, we then have to somehow justify all of their faults, which, you know,
00:42:57
Speaker
is something that we're seeing where, okay, I cannot admit that this person has any sort of faults or that I might've been wrong. And I really respect people who have more recently been like, I regret my vote or I, you know, I didn't, I didn't Yeah, I am just not yeah completely eating the, what do you call it? Okay, no, I'm going to cut this part. I'm not drinking the Kool-Aid anymore. Yes, I respect the ability to be able to say that because I think we need it and we need it on all sides. When I've come into many rooms at in the last two weeks, I come in with one thing to say, and that is I don't think, I think most people didn't vote for this.
00:43:47
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. And then I listen as they tell me you're right. I can't believe this is happening. Like, you'd be surprised at how how much actually comes out if you if you begin with that.
00:43:59
Speaker
People are like, yeah, you're right. do to do to do to do do do Like really, really conservative people. Well, because it's essentially like admitting that you were scammed and nobody, you know, that's why like stats on that are so low or like they're reported so little because Who wants to admit that they were scammed?
00:44:20
Speaker
You feel foolish. You feel like you're not smart or, you know, and it's like, yeah. So if you're just saying like, oh like this happens to everybody, you know, this could happen to anybody. don't think anybody voted for authoritarianism, concentration camps being built and like all this crap. And then you just, you start listing too. Nobody did.
00:44:43
Speaker
Nobody did. We voted, you made a vote for Trump. I doesn't mean you're voting for this. Yeah. It doesn't mean you have to go along with That's right. Should we talk accessibility for protest?
00:44:57
Speaker
Yes. Let's do it. I mean, I think we've been talking about it all along. So I think that. i know. Yeah. It's kind of like. The score is high. It's very accessible.
00:45:10
Speaker
Come as you are Bring your skills that you have and just do it. Yeah. Somehow get connected because think the people who are feeling, i mean, many of us are feeling like, you know, discouraged or scared, but people who are feeling hopeless are probably not really connected to the things that are being done.
00:45:36
Speaker
to counter what's happening and don't know about those things and don't know that they have power too. um But it, but that the power lies with connecting with other people as well. So think that.
00:45:53
Speaker
And I think so many of those groups really want that. They want ever all of the inclusivity. They want to hit, hit the community in all kinds of different ways right we can do a phone bank we can do a an email chain everybody's sick to death of getting text
Large-Scale Protest Participation
00:46:14
Speaker
messages what can we do differently with those how can right can we put out posters can we put out the i do believe that most organizations are all about wanting more options of ways to get to people than just knocking doors and protesting and direct action.
00:46:34
Speaker
And there's there's strength in numbers. And then there's that whole statistic that any country has never like fallen to an authoritarian regime if 3.5% of their population is involved regularly in civil like protest or resistance. Oh, I know that stat. I love that stat. that comes from who, what book is that?
00:47:00
Speaker
I don't know. I've heard it multiple times, but I most recently heard it in the Indivisible training, which we can link to because that's a pretty good one. But I think in the United States, they said it's about 10 million people.
00:47:12
Speaker
And there's definitely, I mean, it's a big number, but there's definitely that many people, at least who who are like, what the hell is happening? It's just a matter of getting everybody involved.
00:47:25
Speaker
Right. um Right. Taking that next step. Yeah. Yeah.
00:47:32
Speaker
Hmm. Hmm. And wondering with that, how many people did protest? How many people have protested in the last four big protests?
00:47:45
Speaker
Yeah, I don't know. We'll have to figure that out. I mean, I think they were trying to estimate and it was a good number of people. And it makes, I, again, the authoritarians are not the ones that are going to counting. They'll be like, oh, it's tiny.
00:48:01
Speaker
My election? Huge. The biggest thing in the world. but Those protests. There were like five people. Nobody showed up. We just send guns out to those like. They were the size of my hands. Right.
00:48:13
Speaker
Mm hmm.
00:48:18
Speaker
So I think, and and January 6th was not at all
Civic Engagement and Accountability
00:48:23
Speaker
a riot. It wasn't at all an insurrection. Peaceful. was peaceful. It was a peaceful protest. here We don't have eyes or ears.
00:48:32
Speaker
So I think that it's not going to be them that's counting. No. So how do we know when we've reached that January? I heard, i mean i mean, I think that the people who are organizing the protests have been like trying to estimate those things so that they can give accurate numbers.
00:48:49
Speaker
So I'm sure that it's somewhere. just have to find it. here Yeah, I know they estimated like the No Kings March in Chicago shortly after, and they were able to do that largely by aerial footage, you know, of like looking at, okay, if there are this many people in a square foot, then...
00:49:08
Speaker
and it's this is all covered.
00:49:12
Speaker
But again, yeah, it's, you want that information to be done by an unbiased party so that people actually trust the information and that, yeah, go ahead.
00:49:26
Speaker
Yeah. And I think it doesn't change the fact that we still like, i think legislatively, we do not have the representation that we need to be having. We need, if that's really true, then our people need to be going to their Republican people and saying, no you need to go back in there and you need to, Marjorie Taylor Greene, you need to go talk to, you know, Susan Collins from May.
00:49:53
Speaker
You need to go freaking vote a certain way because this is not okay. Right. Or get out. Yeah. Or get out. And I think, and and it's that going back to that sitting and knitting and so who's he flew his office and saying, hi' Susan Collins, you're not doing your job. So we're here.
00:50:15
Speaker
but so sounds like you need some help. We're here to help you stay focused and do your job. You're on a plan. We put you on a performance plan and we'll be here every day to help you on that. Okay.
00:50:29
Speaker
And so I think because I think it's one thing to get up and protest on a Saturday, I think it's entirely another thing for us to truly hold our legislators accountable. I, you know, calling Diana to get actually was really great. I left a message. I, you know, asked a question about five new detention centers. You know, is this the way that we're going to not have to give up Tabor? Is that the plan now? Is that we're going to pay for things through having, queed you know, five detention centers in Colorado.
00:51:03
Speaker
Yeah, I think, but I think then they sometimes, at least in, in districts where the like in my district, they just say like, oh, well, that's just the Democrats, you know, that, and that's, you know, not who I'm supporting. And representing. Yeah. So basically, i don't know. I think that depending on the particular representative, they may find a way to discount it. So there need to be so many people of all parties and all different groups so that there cannot be any question of like what the majority of your constituents want.
00:51:46
Speaker
Well, I think that, but I do think it's still saying like, I'm watching you. i know what you're doing. There's someone here paying attention, whether they are or not. And then like being that squeaky wheel. And I think it makes, at least here in Colorado, it's making us really think about how beholden we are as a state to whatever the federal whim is, because at the end of the day, we are, we don't have, we don't,
00:52:15
Speaker
collect tax money to, for a rainy day, for a time where we're not going to have federal funding, for a time where people are being austere and not helping in a federal
Federal Funding and State Autonomy
00:52:25
Speaker
way.
00:52:25
Speaker
Right. And so I, that's the part that I worry about. I know, i know that you're, you're not with us here in Colorado, but, and so I'm probably boring the heck out of you, Patty, but no it's scary to think that Colorado as a whole really doesn't have a voice in Congress because we're pretty much beholden to whatever the feds want because we can't survive here without federal funding.
00:52:54
Speaker
a
00:52:58
Speaker
So we're pretty castrated, which doesn't feel good, right? It doesn't feel good to know that we really don't have a voice in Congress here in the state of Colorado.
00:53:10
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's Because the more we speak up, the more Donald Trump wants to shut us out. Right. And he really does throw a little tantrum about it, too. He's threatened us. I don't know how many times.
00:53:25
Speaker
Colorado. a milk Tons.
00:53:31
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, i guess I don't know about all that. like as whole the in much depth as you do. So I'm going research that. We're supposedly one of the sanctuary cities. Yeah. he's He's threatening all the sanctuaries. Oh yeah.
Humor in Protests and Tabor Day Plans
00:53:50
Speaker
I think that going forward, what I would like to do is really put a little more emphasis on the trolling and humor and ridiculing side of things because... humor To bring humor. I mean, it also, and then, and to pay attention to where that's happening too, because like one, it's so fun. It's a point of connection. a way of like not cooperating with like, oh, we are all bowing to what you say and we're agreeing. It's non-cooperation, but in a way that's, that invites people in and i it can involve writing. And I just think it's, I just think it's fun.
00:54:34
Speaker
Absolutely. And clearly with, with right at this time, like responding with strictly facts in a serious way, like that's important and that's one way to do it.
00:54:45
Speaker
And also it's not, it's not, yeah, there needs to be a different way. So day that's very fun. I'm going to throw up beach balls and pass out hot dogs.
00:54:58
Speaker
Something. yeah Or veggie dogs, as the case may be. I would go anywhere for a veggie dog. They don't have those that many places. They don't. You know, do they have them at Rockies games? Because they have them at White Sox games. and there It's just always so fun to have a ah veggie dog at a baseball game.
00:55:17
Speaker
baseball game Because you walk in and you smell the like the onions and i'm always in like the sausages. And I'm always like, oh this is what i want. you know, a hot dog.
00:55:28
Speaker
And so it's like great to have one there. They do. They do. it It's, it'll be like one or a couple stands maybe in the whole place. yeah yeah fla yeah know But it is great because usually it's like go to those kinds of things and don't have any options. And so I'm always happy to have an option.
00:55:48
Speaker
yeah nice i gotta to have love nachos I mean, I wouldn't say they're good, but if you put enough toppings on condiments. yeah yeah I only ever liked hot dogs as a vehicle for condiments anyway, so it works. yeah yes Agreed.
00:56:06
Speaker
never yeah Maybe we'll take some pictures from Taber Day and and post them. Taber Day, yeah. yeah yeah Absolutely. um Well,
00:56:17
Speaker
We should continue on with our forms of protest. I'm really impressed with you guys. You've done great homework and I really, thanks for, thanks for protesting with me.
Conclusion: Reflections and Gratitude
00:56:30
Speaker
Appreciate you.
00:56:32
Speaker
Thank you. Thank you for all that you're doing and sharing with us. And I think we did good. Yeah. Thank you. fun Good perspectives to you guys. You have, I, you make me think too, right?
00:56:45
Speaker
Yeah. I think levity matters we need to talk more about these things. Yeah. yeah Yeah. Bring people in it. Cause your kids don't want to hear anymore. So if anybody else does connect you up with them, yes let's build a community where we can talk about these things.
00:57:04
Speaker
Love it. All right. Well, Everybody share with your friends. Join us next time when we'll be talking about something totally new, but probably still has some protest in it.
00:57:17
Speaker
Yeah, as always. All right. yeah Thank you, Margot and Jennifer and Charlotte. Yes. Thanks, Patty. Stay interesting.
00:57:30
Speaker
And stay interested.
00:57:35
Speaker
Thanks for listening to today's episode. Please subscribe, comment, and like the podcast. Follow us on Blue Sky Social at CanWeInterestYouIn. Send us an email at CanWeInterestYouIn at gmail.com.
00:57:46
Speaker
And join us next time.