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How to Talk to Your Teen About Unhealthy Friendships Without Them Shutting Down
33 Plays14 days ago
Is your teenager choosing friends or dating partners who treat them poorly? It is one of the most painful experiences for a mother to witness, yet traditional parenting often leads to the one thing we fear most: our child pulling away.
In this episode of The Positively Healthy Mom, host Laura Ollinger sits down with pediatrician and parenting expert Kristen Cook, MD, to provide a roadmap for navigating toxic teen relationships. Whether you are dealing with a "mean girl" friendship dynamic or a red-flag romantic relationship, this conversation offers the neurological and tactical tools you need to maintain connection.
In this episode, Laura Ollinger and Dr. Kristen Cook discuss:
- The Neuroscience of Social Rewards: Understand why the teen brain is biologically wired to prioritize peer approval over parental logic. Dr. Cook explains the role of the nucleus accumbens (an area of the brain that is connected to motivation and action) and why "bad" relationships often feel rewarding to a developing brain.
- From Criticism to Curiosity: Learn the tactical "how-to" of intervening in unhealthy relationships. We discuss the power of the family meeting from a lens of prevention and how to ask open-ended questions that allow your teen to discover the truth for themselves without feeling controlled.
- The Mirror Effect & Parental Self-Worth: We explore the deep connection between a mother's self-confidence and her child’s relationship choices. Discover why working on your own inner self-worth is often the most effective way to help your teen build their own.
- Identifying Serious Red Flags: Dr. Cook outlines the physical and psychological signs of domestic abuse in teens and provides clear steps for when a parent needs to escalate the situation for safety.
Connect with our guest: Visit Kristen Cook, MD, at kristencookmd.com to find her book, Parenting Redefined, and listen to her podcast, Mom Doc Talk. Or follow her on Instagram at @momdoctalk_kcmd
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Transcript
Parenting Approach: Accountability vs. Friendship
00:00:00
Speaker
So it's challenging because the way I was raised was the parent was always right and the kid was always wrong. And a lot of parents have that mentality still that they know better because they're the adults.
00:00:14
Speaker
But don't shove that down your kid's throat. You know, that's not going to help them develop, grow, learn how to manage life on their own. The other big mistake that parents make is they try to be their kid's friend. Your child doesn't need a friend. They need someone who's going to hold them accountable for their behavior.
Introduction to Dr. Kristen Cook and Parenting Strategies
00:00:39
Speaker
Hello and welcome to today's episode of the Positively Healthy Mom. I'm your host, Laura Olinger, teen and parent wellbeing coach and founder of Positively Healthy Coaching. And today I'm super excited to introduce you to Dr. Kristen Cook, who is a pediatrician with over 15 years of clinical experience. She's an author, a podcast host, and a mom of two very strong-willed kids,
00:01:01
Speaker
And she helps create more peaceful and effective parenting journeys by encouraging them to parent the children that they have. She assists parents in understanding their unique child or children on a deeper level, creating connection, positive discipline strategies, and more joyful homes. So Dr. Kristen Cook, welcome to the podcast.
00:01:21
Speaker
Thank you so much for having me. I'm thrilled to be here. Yeah, yeah. Do you have anything else to add to that introduction? You know, you captured it perfectly, but I do want to just mention that my children right now are 13 and 10, so I'm right in the thick of the teenager preteen era, and I can appreciate what parents are going through.
00:01:40
Speaker
I love that you said that because you have the in-home experience, which is so crucial to understand that it's really like not just, you know, parenting out of a book or a theory or anything, but it's like that real-life application.
Understanding Teen Relationships
00:01:52
Speaker
You cannot replace that. so Not at all.
00:01:55
Speaker
Amazing. So today I'm really excited to focus on teen relationships, whether that's teen friendships or dating relationships, romantic-type relationships. And this is a whole ball of whack, so I can't wait to get started. So What is your kind of like knowledge or philosophy on this topic just as a whole?
00:02:17
Speaker
It's a topic that's really kind of misunderstood. And teenagers don't have the capability to approach relationships the same way that adults do because their brains aren't fully developed. So a teenager will interpret a relationship with friends or a significant other very differently than their parent will interpret that relationship. So it's so important for parents to try to take the perspective of their teen when it comes to relationships and dating. Right.
00:02:44
Speaker
Yes, yes. To really kind of use their empathy. Those mirror neurons kind of like get put themselves in their teenager's body for a minute and just try to imagine like, what does this feel like? And so with what you do as a pediatrician and giving all this amazing parenting knowledge,
00:03:01
Speaker
What are some things that you feel like would be helpful for the moms today to understand, not just, um you know, that they need to get inside and understand what their teenagers are feeling, but like, what are the big stressors that teens are dealing with as far as relationships these days? Yeah.
00:03:17
Speaker
So teens are highly, highly motivated by social cues. And so they're trying to figure out where they fit into the world. And they're really highly motivated by rewards.
00:03:30
Speaker
So if something is rewarding to them, they will want to do it more, which is one of the things that sometimes parents struggle with because, my gosh, this person is treating you so terribly. Why do you still want to be their friend? They're getting some type of reward out of it.
00:03:44
Speaker
Hmm. I'm so glad you said that because yes, it can be so confusing and frustrating. And I've seen moms kind of like pulling their hair out. Like, why are you so friends with this girl? Why are you not breaking up with this boy? Like what is happening? And so can you go like a little bit deeper into that? Like when you say rewards, can you explain that a little more clearly?
Approaching Teen Relationships with Curiosity
00:04:05
Speaker
Yeah. So let's let's go through an example. So let's say you've got a teenage daughter and she goes out driving with friends. And one of the friends decided that they wanted to use marijuana. And now they're encouraging your child to use marijuana.
00:04:20
Speaker
Let's say she knows how bad that stuff is. But the in the moment, the peer pressure and the approval that she perceives that she will be getting from her peers far outweighs any of the negative aspects of engaging in that behavior and then coming home and having to tell mom and dad about it.
00:04:38
Speaker
Yeah. Yeah. So, so many times um parents think, oh, but my child knew better. We talked about this. Like, what happened? And they kind of like, whoa. And so kind of really understanding, because I've heard people say, oh, there's no such thing as peer pressure. You decide what you do for yourself.
00:04:57
Speaker
And... right You make your own decisions and putting yourself in your child's shoes, like understanding the social benefit or the social gain that they'll get from that acceptance.
00:05:08
Speaker
Right. And so that kind of explains that behavior. So right um can you get into it, that romantic relationship, right? Like what is happening? Like you don't even like your boyfriend or he treats you not very nicely or he ignores you or he's talking to other girls. Like, why are you still doing this? like Right. Like, does that apply with that as well?
00:05:28
Speaker
Absolutely. Absolutely. And again, the teenager is not viewing the relationship the same way as the parent. The parent can see all the red flags, but maybe the child is dating the most popular kid in school and that has suddenly given her a bunch of street cred, you know, so trying to understand Why our kids are engaging in these relationships is important.
00:05:53
Speaker
And, you know, if they're at the age now, you can gently ask them. One of the biggest mistakes that i I see parents make when it comes to their teenagers' relationships is they get
Family Meetings for Open Communication
00:06:05
Speaker
into the overly critical They want to, you know, tell their kids what's right.
00:06:11
Speaker
It's really, really important to take a step back and listen to your teen and what your teen has to say about these relationships. Yeah, I'm so glad you, that was kind of my next question is like, now that we have kind of the why, or we can kind of put ourselves in their shoes, kind of understand what are these rewards, even if it's in a negative situation. And so that was the next question is, well, what's next? And instead of criticizing them, it's kind of like that get curious, like finding out, like, What is the important to you about this? And like, how is this making you feel? And so what are some other ways to do that? Like whether it's like phrasing of a certain question or what is like the energy that you bring to this conversation? How do you approach it?
00:06:51
Speaker
So I love approaching it from the sense of we need to have a family meeting because then that gives teenagers time. You're not blindsiding them, right? Like you don't want to force a conversation if it's not the right time or place. But you're also letting your teen know, hey, i'm I'm a little worried and i want to understand where you are coming from. So I think this meeting is really, really important.
00:07:14
Speaker
Okay. Okay. So then what would happen next? They come to the meeting, yeah sit down. Like, what happens? How does that conversation go? Yeah. You know, and then maybe just very briefly, hey, how did how did you meet this person? Let's say let's say it's a ah ah dating relationship. Where'd you meet this person?
00:07:30
Speaker
What do you like about this person? What kind of things do you like to do together? So attempt to get to know before the judgments start. Right.
00:07:42
Speaker
Because if you approach it from the standpoint of this boy is so mean to you, you're always planning the dates. Why he hasn't he asked you to homecoming yet? Your kid will shut down.
00:07:52
Speaker
And that's exactly what we don't want when it comes to teen relationships. Right. Mm-hmm. We want the opposite. Yes. If we want to steer one way or the other, we want the overshare a child, right? We want the undershare. want the overshare. Right. um Great. And so then how, like, then do you kind of influence them? Or how do you allow them to see your perspective? Or how do you allow them to see your concerns without it becoming this kind of, Mom, you're controlling me. Mom, you're telling me what to do. Or, Mom, you don't understand.
Learning from Mistakes: Guidance over Control
00:08:25
Speaker
Like, how do you...
00:08:26
Speaker
Keep the conversation open so it doesn't shut down. Yeah, so I think it's about focusing on what is important to your child. You know, let's say they're in ah an unhealthy relationship and their significant other is trying to isolate them from family and friends. So bringing up, hey I noticed you haven't been to cheer practice in a while. Can you tell me what's going on with that?
00:08:50
Speaker
Do you not like cheer anymore? Because if not, that's okay. But I'd like to understand things from your perspective. So coming it from the approach of I would like to understand rather than I want to tell you what to do.
00:09:04
Speaker
Okay. And so say they, you know, they share. um Well, Tommy has been wanting to go to the lake after school and he likes to fish and he wants me to go with him. So I'm going fishing after school. I'm not going to cheer.
00:09:20
Speaker
Whatever. Like what what happens then? Like how do you get to that next step? Are you having fun at the lake? Do you enjoy it? Do you miss cheer? And then you just keep the conversation going based on the child's response.
00:09:36
Speaker
And then i I would love to chime in here with my thoughts on this type of conversation as well, which is a lot of times parents feel like they need the solution to happen immediately. Like we're having a family meeting, this needs to get resolved. deaddadada And if it is a matter of danger, safety, by all means, get it resolved then.
00:09:57
Speaker
But sometimes these things need to unfold a little bit longer, right? It's not going to just one little meeting, we're done, right? It's going to, it might need to, they might need to experience for themselves that they, oh, I do miss my cheer friends or, oh, I'm feeling really isolated, for right? Like, Allowing them to discover that from themselves. So what are your thoughts about that?
00:10:17
Speaker
A hundred percent. Absolutely. Trying to tell your teenager what to do is going to backfire. Now, the one exception is, as you mentioned, if it's a dangerous situation. So if it's an abusive relationship, it needs to end and needs to end immediately.
00:10:32
Speaker
But if it's just someone you don't think is a good fit for your kid, trust your child. They'll see they'll see the truth about who that person is eventually. And I think that's such a great learning moment and learning opportunity for both moms and teens because teens need to learn life on their own terms, right? Like at so many moms these days, we tend to be helicopter moms and snowplow moms and making life real easy. We don't want our child to feel any pain. We want them to learn from us and not from experience. But when in reality, they do need to have their own experiences. They do need to know what it feels like to feel sad or pain or left out or confused or allow them to like go through that thought process. Because if we just circumvent that or cut that learning off, they'll never actually learn. And then this might happen down the road. So better than kind of like go through it now in the safety of your own environment where you can be guiding them. And so what would you say to moms who...
00:11:31
Speaker
kind of just struggling with that, like struggling with wanting to fix it or struggling with wanting to control it because they just can't help it. Like it's like they just have this impulse to like protect their child.
00:11:44
Speaker
Right. Yeah. And that's first of all, acknowledging that impulse, I think, is very, very important. But also understanding that if you try to shield your child from the hardships of the world,
00:11:56
Speaker
you're doing them more harm than good because those hardships aren't going to magically disappear when they're an adult. They're going to be there and they need the tools and the skills to learn how to deal with it before they're out on their own.
00:12:07
Speaker
Yeah, yeah. I'm so glad that's the perfect way to say it. So next, kind of shifting over to this other topic, which I am very passionate about neurobiology and kind of developmental psychology, but within the um context of the physical brain.
Teen Brain Development and Decision-Making
00:12:22
Speaker
Tell us about that. Like, what do you have to share for the mom so that they can understand like, oh, why is my teen acting this way? or Or why can't they not do this? Or, you know, kind of explain to us your view on that.
00:12:34
Speaker
So what I always tell the parents in my medical practice is the human brain does not fully develop until a person is in their mid-20s. A teenager can't think like an adult, which is why they don't act like an adult. And we need to understand that their brain is still developing. They don't have the same critical thinking skills that we have. Mm-hmm.
00:12:53
Speaker
The teenage brain is very highly influenced by a structure of the brain called the nucleus accumbens, which is in the limbic system. Now, the o limbic system is not, it's really mostly in the subconscious. And so one of the things that we can help our teens do is if they engage in some type of behavior that we as parents are like, what were you thinking?
00:13:15
Speaker
Walk them through it. And it may not change their behavior immediately, but that is building the the stage for them to create their own critical thinking skills. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm.
00:13:26
Speaker
Yes. Yes. I love that. i've I've said before that sometimes, you know, moms, they need to play the role of that prefrontal cortex for their teenagers. because If they're not being able to make those decisions on their own, then sometimes we do have to step in a little bit and more than maybe we'd want to or what that we think is necessary. A lot of times, especially I see it with big teenage boys, right? They're big. They're in big bodies. They look like men, but they're not. They're like, it's still a child in a very big body.
00:13:52
Speaker
Right. Right. And so like having to like have parents understand like how like how our role is shifting, you know, our role is shifting a lot from elementary school. Then it shifts to middle school, and shifts to high school. And so how do you see like those roles changing in parents as far as stepping in, stepping back, finding the right balance?
00:14:13
Speaker
So it's challenging because the way I was raised was the parent was always right and the kid was always wrong. And a lot of parents have that mentality still that they know better because they're the adults.
00:14:27
Speaker
But don't shove that down your kid's throat. You know, that's not going to help them develop, grow, learn how to manage life on
Modeling Healthy Relationship Behaviors
00:14:33
Speaker
their own. The other big mistake that parents make is they try to be their kid's friend. Your child doesn't need a friend. They need someone who's going to hold them accountable for their behavior.
00:14:44
Speaker
Hmm. Yes. Yes. As far as just like this relationships and kind of like having a family meeting, having a conversation, understanding that how their brain is, you know, not fully developed and they're a child. What else can we do or say or model as far as just like teaching them healthy relationships, healthy friendships, positive friendships, and But at the same time, allowing them to experience it on their own. But we still are, after all, the parent, right? We still have to help in some way. So what else are some of those other things that moms can do?
00:15:19
Speaker
As much as you can, model healthy relationship behavior. Now, this can be challenging if there's a single mom and they don't get along with their ex or, you know, parents that fight all the time.
00:15:33
Speaker
You really have to kind of pay attention to your own behavior and make sure that you are demonstrating the behaviors that you would like your child to demonstrate in the future. Yes, yes, yes.
00:15:45
Speaker
I always say the apple doesn't fall far from the tree. And I say that with love and compassion, um because look no further than, you know, um in the mirror, then you might find a reason for why something is happening with your child. And so that's something that I do talk a lot about too. And especially even when it comes to Because a lot of this like middle school and and you know high school stuff, it's very much related to um self-worth and self-talk and how we view ourselves as individuals and and and how we can project confidence in the world, right? So classically, I get,
Impact of Parental Self-Worth on Children
00:16:17
Speaker
I mean, this is my kind of bread and butter is a client who is a teenage girl who's not feeling very confident. They come to me, they ask for help.
00:16:25
Speaker
And along the way, what I discover almost every time is it's usually the mother that is lacking her own self-worth and lacking her own self-confidence. And so that's kind of like my big um public service announcement for today is if you're wanting your child to have better relationships, feel better about themselves, do you know these healthy things, then it might be time to work on yourself. Like, you know, get some help, get a coach, get a therapist, get a counselor, get a friend, just somebody to like talk through things with to Find out like how you can build these so that way you can be the healthiest model for your child. um Have you seen that a lot in your practice as all the time, all the time? Absolutely. And and it's kind of a gentle pulling the parent aside and saying, look, your kid hears what you say about yourself and they're going to start to believe that about themselves. Right.
00:17:18
Speaker
And I would love to get you resources for you to work on your negative thoughts if that's something you would like to do. But at a minimum, please try not to say that in front of your kids. Yeah. And how does that usually land with them?
00:17:31
Speaker
It depends on the parent. um I've been doing this long enough where i've I've established really good relationships with most of my patients and their families. And so a lot of them will will take it to heart.
00:17:44
Speaker
Some of them will ask for resources. other just Others just kind of are ah more contemplative and kind of take it in. yeah Yeah. So important. Well, I mean, that is why we're here today, right? To kind of like, and again, I say it with, you know, gentle lovingness, but for kind of the care of yourself and your child, that if you're wanting things to change, that you might need to um kind of do some investigative thinking about yourself or kind of some inner work, things like that. Okay. Yeah. um What other, you know, all along this line of friendships and dating and kind of keeping in mind that kind of relationship and connection with your teenager, what else can you share with us or things that you've seen in your own practice that might have been a trouble that you've been able to help resolve?
Recognizing and Addressing Teen Domestic Abuse
00:18:29
Speaker
It's really important for parents to be aware of the signs of domestic abuse because domestic abuse is not limited to adults. Teenagers also can get in in a situation where they are being abused either emotionally, physically, sexually. So it's really important for parents to be on the wear for any potential red flags. If your child's significant other is severely isolating them from other people, If your child doesn't seem interested in things that used to interest them, if your child all of a sudden has a huge change in their appetite or sleep patterns, those are all really, really concerning.
00:19:07
Speaker
Certainly, you know, physical signs like bruises or wearing long sleeves to cover up their arms. Those are things we want to look be on the lookout for, too. But again, it's so important that parents know that kids are not immune to dangerous relationships.
00:19:26
Speaker
What do you feel like is the age that parents need to start looking for this or kind of being aware of this? You know, I think if you can. So preteens tend to do a lot of group interactions, right? Like it's like ah almost like a group dating scene.
00:19:43
Speaker
Yeah. Start paying attention then. And don't say anything to the kids. But just kind of pay attention to those interactions. And then as they become teenagers and kind of start doing the the single relationship thing with the dating, that's really when, you know, like 15, 16, that's when you need to to start looking for that stuff.
00:20:07
Speaker
And um do you find that it's kind of like and the emotional or um like the psychological abuse is more prevalent than the physical? Or do you have like a yeah statistic on that? and What is that? I i don't have any sta statistics on that. From personal experience, I can say that the emotional abuse happens more frequently than the physical abuse. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
00:20:33
Speaker
And so getting into that conversation, we kind of talked about that already. Like, what else can or should a parent do if they're noticing these signs? So then it's time nes maybe to get a mental health provider or a pediatrician involved.
00:20:49
Speaker
Mm-hmm. um You know, if a patient of mine is being physically assaulted, I tend to want to do some labs to make sure there's no internal damage. um If a patient is being sexually assaulted, then we need to talk about screening for sexually transmitted infections and those kind of things.
00:21:07
Speaker
So and if parents are feeling overwhelmed, there are always resources out there to help guide them. Okay. So kind of like doing that initial screening with you and then getting some additional support for the parents.
00:21:22
Speaker
um Has there ever been a time where you just struggled to get through with a teenager who like, did they just not listen to you and it got even worse? Like, like where, what else can you do?
00:21:36
Speaker
Yeah. You do the best you can. You know, as a parent, as a clinician, you do the best you can. um You can't necessarily force a teenager to do anything. I have recommended at times to families to get the local police department involved, sometimes social services, depending on the situation. So there is always a way to escalate if they get significant pushback from the teenager.
00:22:04
Speaker
Hmm. Okay. Okay. I mean, I, I know I I've seen, uh, I've seen people in this situation and it's hard because the thing is, we all know that teenagers can find a way,
00:22:15
Speaker
They can always find a way. They can always find a way to communicate. They can always find a way to have contacts. They can always find a way, um, you know, where there's a will, there's a way with these kids. And so, um, you know, like kind of what you're saying is if we have to escalate, we will, we Hopefully we catch it more early, like you were saying at the beginning of the conversation where we sit down, have a family meeting, tell me about this person. Like, where did you you know get that curious thing so it doesn't keep going um and hoping you can kind of make that impact or sooner than later.
00:22:47
Speaker
OK, this has been great. What any last tips you want to share um for the moms today? Don't take your child's behavior personally. Even teenagers are not necessarily behaving in attempts to upset you.
00:23:03
Speaker
You know, a lot of their behavior is very much biologically driven. And if we can understand that behavior, then we can better address it to help our kids learn how to do better in the future.
00:23:16
Speaker
That's great. That's great. um Okay. So Dr. Cook, how can people find you? I know you have a book. Can you share the name of Yeah, absolutely. So the title of my book is called Parenting Redefined, a guide to understanding and nurturing your child's behavior to help them thrive. And the premise of the book really is what you mentioned in in my introduction is this book will help you learn how to parent the child you have, not the one that you want.
00:23:39
Speaker
um I have a weekly podcast called MomDocTalk with Dr.
Resources for Parenting: Dr. Cook's Book and Podcast
00:23:43
Speaker
Kristen Cook. It's a parenting podcast. And people can find me on social media. My handle is usually momdoctalk underscore KCMD.
00:23:52
Speaker
And I'd love to connect and ask me a million questions. I love connecting with parents and, you know, helping them navigate the crazy life of being a mom or a dad. yeah Yes. Okay. Well, that, thank you so much, Kristen. We so appreciate your time, your great knowledge. And I'm looking forward to having people connect with you.
00:24:14
Speaker
Wonderful. Thank you so much. Thank you.